#h1-high-heat-strategies | Supergiant Games | Page 341

honest kernel May 17, 2021, 9:46 PM

#

that first run was too high roll for me

#

2 hammers is harder than 1

#

but not tonight

#

im exhausted

mossy zinc May 17, 2021, 9:48 PM

#

Just Quick Spin or Massive Spin or any of the other good ones should be good enough.

honest kernel May 17, 2021, 9:49 PM

#

the thing is, i got quick spin in both of the subsequent runs, i just didnt feel like i did enough damage without either massive spin or splitting

#

i ought to try out achilles at least

#

see if its more bearable

#

in my last run i tried using death defiances, which wouldve been great if i had gotten patrocles

#

unfortunately i didnt, and died to tunnel 1 tiny vermin

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 2:46 AM

#

FWIW my GY clear was with HL2 LC4 CF2 JS3 EM3 BP2 MM UC FO1 TD2 (ended up clearing under 20 anyway). Went all-in on special. I definitely die more when HL>2. I get hit too often.

halcyon flame May 18, 2021, 4:05 AM

#

have you tried turning off js

#

js3 is pretty rough, and not just for time

shy plinth May 18, 2021, 4:07 AM

#

#h1-high-heat-strategies message

#

I continue to recommend this one 🙂

#

And yeah I despise JS3

halcyon flame May 18, 2021, 4:12 AM

#

hl5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> js3

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 4:27 AM

#

My experience is HL5+JS0=die but HL2+JS3=survive (unless I’m slow with the aspect), but I know it’s not the preferred option

#

11 of my aspects at 32 heat used JS2, 2 were JS3 🤷 @shy plinth I used a similar pact to your link for the other 11, but one point in CF instead of HL. With some aspects either FO2 or TD3 were harder for me, so I added to CF and JS.

#

I’ll have to learn HL5 to do 40+ heat though

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 4:38 AM

#

HL5+FO2 is the vital thing to learn

#

going fast also

shy plinth May 18, 2021, 4:40 AM

#

Going fast very important

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 4:41 AM

#

I did a first 40 heat today with Gilgamesh Tidal Dash cheese - other weapons will be harder 🙂

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 4:41 AM

#

you can still cheese a lot on 40 tbh

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 4:44 AM

#

Cheese that doesn’t require good rng?

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 4:45 AM

#

I dont think building around call or cast requires insane rng no

next acorn May 18, 2021, 4:47 AM

#

What makes JS3 so bad compared to 2

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 4:47 AM

#

elysium i'd say

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 4:48 AM

#

honest kernel I dont think building around call or cast requires insane rng no

True, I’m thinking of doing Beowulf and Poseidon next, but I figure that build-around cast is playing the aspect as intended rather than cheese

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 4:49 AM

#

youre playing as intended then yea

#

I mean a W is a W you'll just ignore the aspect

#

40 is always a feat

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 4:54 AM

#

honest kernel elysium i'd say

I once took a 78% more foes Chaos boon at the end of Asphodel 😬. Lesson learned.

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 5:01 AM

#

lmao yeah

#

these tend to kill you

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 12:34 PM

#

still struggling with spear 32

#

got hades down to half health 2nd phase again but i just didnt have enough time damage or health

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 2:12 PM

#

dunno what to say spear feels very straightforward to me on all aspects

#

what build?

viscid fractal May 18, 2021, 2:13 PM

#

For my 32 spear i went achilles, started artemis attack and planned on picking demeter/ares throw if they showed up to aim for duo. Demeter showed up and had it not i would have picked her keepsake after tartarus

#

It went smoothly tbh

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 2:14 PM

#

thats a good build yeah

spice lava May 18, 2021, 2:33 PM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/807672625739858000/844220842522836992/IMG_20210518_163202.jpg

#

The perks of having no idea how to do 32 heat properly 😂

pseudo kernel May 18, 2021, 2:34 PM

#

what the hell

spice lava May 18, 2021, 2:35 PM

#

I only started to look for 50 heat clues on Discord once I cleared 40 with Hestia, my early clears were all like this

#

Other 32 clears were Chaos special only with Zeus and Rama Dio special

#

Hestia pact and build were almost normal

eager vortex May 18, 2021, 2:52 PM

#

tried to give it a try after a long time

#

game didn't waste any time reminding me why I felt burned out

#

back to casul games

spice lava May 18, 2021, 3:23 PM

#

You tried 50 again?

narrow carbon May 18, 2021, 3:32 PM

#

viscid fractal For my 32 spear i went achilles, started artemis attack and planned on picking d...

My first 32 Achilles was Hunting Blades with 2 +1 cast boons and a +80% cast damage boon (oh, and sweet surrender on heartbreak flourish)

eager vortex May 18, 2021, 3:42 PM

#

spice lava You tried 50 again?

yep

#

taking a 1+ month break and trying 50 the first time you play with the aspect you're worst at isn't a good idea, it seems

spice lava May 18, 2021, 3:51 PM

#

Which aspect? 👀

eager vortex May 18, 2021, 4:41 PM

#

rama

#

managed to do something else at least, even if not that spectacular

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 5:24 PM

#

man im still struggling with 32 spear

#

it is soooo hard

#

if i play GY i lose to hades cause i dont have enough damage without charged skewer, and when i get charged skewer im not regening enough so i lose in elysium

#

if i play achilles i just am bad and dont win

#

:(

#

its just practicing then

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 6:41 PM

#

@honest kernel are you doing FO0 with Guan Yu?

unique zephyr May 18, 2021, 6:55 PM

#

For GY are you doing special into 2 dash strikes as your attack combo

#

You can add more dash strikes if Hermes gives you more dashes

#

Spear is hard though, you have to be aware that the spear probably has more range than you think

true fable May 18, 2021, 7:03 PM

#

reposting this here for visibility

#

mirage shot is a duo boon that adds a second projectile that does 30% damage

#

on beowulf, however, this second projectile does 100% damage

#

make of this what you will

jaunty falcon May 18, 2021, 7:04 PM

#

Shhh

#

Don't tell amir

true fable May 18, 2021, 7:04 PM

#

tbh i dont see balance changes coming anywhere in the future

#

and its useful for high heat players

#

think forcing mirage takes priority over anything else on beowulf

clever otter May 18, 2021, 7:05 PM

#

👁️ 👁️

jaunty falcon May 18, 2021, 7:05 PM

#

How long has it been like this? Was it like this before Dio beo nerf

true fable May 18, 2021, 7:05 PM

#

apparently has always been like this

unique zephyr May 18, 2021, 7:05 PM

#

true fable on beowulf, however, this second projectile does 100% damage

Wait I did not know this

jaunty falcon May 18, 2021, 7:06 PM

#

It was found out pretty recently

unique zephyr May 18, 2021, 7:06 PM

#

That explains how i got my first sub 15 clear with beo

#

And why everything was dying so fast

jaunty falcon May 18, 2021, 7:07 PM

#

Also: this may be more well known but if you have rockets and cluster bomb, the -30% doesn't exist

unique zephyr May 18, 2021, 7:07 PM

#

Whaaat

devout quiver May 18, 2021, 7:35 PM

#

wut

hot reef May 18, 2021, 7:39 PM

#

Update on my fresh file thing, I’ve decided I won’t be able to finish the whole thing in one run and thus have decided to just try to win in as few runs as possible

Also you guys you correct, I am doing a whole lot better with Dionysus than stuff with percentages on my main attack

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:03 PM

#

mossy zinc <@456226577798135808> are you doing FO0 with Guan Yu?

no i usually go fo2

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 8:03 PM

#

Well, do FO0 instead. squirtnya

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:03 PM

#

true fable on beowulf, however, this second projectile does 100% damage

yeah i saw this in the other server, i used it in my 32 shield run

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:03 PM

#

mossy zinc Well, do FO0 instead. <:squirtnya:472124054644457472>

what other heat should i take instead?

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 8:04 PM

#

Let me give you my in-depth guide.

#

Nyaanyaa's 32 Heat Guide
HL5 LC4 CF2 EM3 BP2 MM UC TD3
Stubborn Defiance
Eternal Rose > Owl Pendant > Lucky Tooth/Acorn > Acorn

#

That should do the trick.

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:04 PM

#

ill give it a try, thanks

#

eternal rose and owl pendant, is that just in general or specifically for GY?

#

In general.

#

i watched your 40 heat GY video and you had artemis special in that

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 8:07 PM

#

Well.

#

Heartbreak Flourish is ideal.

#

You get easy access to high damage, Weak, and Life Affirmation.

#

Also Smoldering Air.

#

I don't even remember which of my Guan Yu runs I actually uploaded. I did way more than one. dusa

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:10 PM

#

so what happened was you got charged skewer chamber 1 and then went deadly flourish, aphro attack and the rest is history

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 8:11 PM

#

Ah.

true fable May 18, 2021, 8:11 PM

#

i still like DF a lot with fiery presence but both can work pretty well

unique zephyr May 18, 2021, 8:11 PM

#

I like artemis for Rama more

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 8:11 PM

#

I'd take Heartbreak Flourish + Deadly Strike over that.

unique zephyr May 18, 2021, 8:11 PM

#

Since you mainly need the boon for boss damage anyway

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:12 PM

#

ok i started a run, got daedalus chamber 1, no charged skewer -_-

true fable May 18, 2021, 8:13 PM

#

well

#

it is not necessary

#

time to learn the weapon

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:13 PM

#

):

gaunt fiber May 18, 2021, 8:13 PM

#

You have no idea how heart warming it is to see Bright typing these words

gaunt fiber May 18, 2021, 8:14 PM

#

honest kernel so what happened was you got charged skewer chamber 1 and then went deadly flour...

yup that's quite optimal

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:15 PM

#

sounds like it

gaunt fiber May 18, 2021, 8:15 PM

#

deadly flourish with hunter's mark is extremely fun to play

true fable May 18, 2021, 8:15 PM

#

why is it heart warming my little pogchamp

gaunt fiber May 18, 2021, 8:17 PM

#

goaPepeFlushed

#

Because you left the path of hate of Guan Yu and you came to like it

true fable May 18, 2021, 8:19 PM

#

aspect of poggeez

pseudo kernel May 18, 2021, 8:19 PM

#

gaunt fiber <:goaPepeFlushed:792799688200814662>

What is this emoji

gaunt fiber May 18, 2021, 8:19 PM

#

I typed "flushed" and picked one I liked

pseudo kernel May 18, 2021, 8:20 PM

#

I like it too

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:42 PM

#

ok so i died on theseus due to time

#

i never got charged skewer and all i had was a common heartbreak flourish

#

i did 0 damage

jaunty falcon May 18, 2021, 8:44 PM

#

If you don't get charged skewer after second hammer I would have suicided

#

Build didn't even look good anyway

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 8:45 PM

#

well i didnt have to suicide

#

time killed me ofr me

#

for*

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 9:37 PM

#

if you arent getting skewer then look out for spin upgrades tbh

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 9:53 PM

#

thats what ive been doing

#

im doing an achilles run now cause i checked for flurry jab chamber 1 and got it

#

I would have had a new spear PB with that start if I hadn't been 5-sacked.

#

Entered Styx with 8:49 on the clock.

#

i did it boys

#

finally

#

it took me like 30 hours

#

about 10 of which i was playing hades

#

but i did it

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 10:24 PM

#

special thanks to nyaa for her heat setup and bright for just being generally pog

mossy zinc May 18, 2021, 10:28 PM

#

Nice! dusa

#

Glad to see the guide coming through yet again.

gaunt fiber May 18, 2021, 11:53 PM

#

honest kernel special thanks to nyaa for her heat setup and bright for just being generally po...

There's a deep guide pinned if you want

#

with detailed pacts conditions and stuff

honest kernel May 18, 2021, 11:58 PM

#

Well now that I’ve done spear hopefully I won’t need that

#

Just fists left for 32, after that I begin my adventure into 9 heat speedruns

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 4:49 AM

#

nice 👍

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 6:15 AM

#

is ME viable for 32 heat fists?

#

im debating between an ME zag fist build and a demeter build

#

i feel like ill struggle a lot before i actually get ME

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 6:26 AM

#

Yeah, sure.

#

Demeter Aspect is just Zag Fists with way better DPS.

celest grail May 19, 2021, 6:31 AM

#

dem is way better before ME than zag

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:24 AM

#

I’m leaning towards doing zag fists for the main reason that since fists are such low range, having dodge chance may end up being my saving grace

#

And if I do end up going ME, then hopefully I won’t need the Demeter dps

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:25 AM

#

celest grail dem is way better before ME than zag

But this is why I’m thinking Demeter might work better

celest grail May 19, 2021, 9:26 AM

#

the zag fists dodge chance isnt big enough for you to consider it over demeter

#

if enemies are dead, they cant hurt you. and dem makes sure theyre dead

#

dem fist's dps also is great after you get ME

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:26 AM

#

That makes sense

celest grail May 19, 2021, 9:26 AM

#

for bosses and armored enemies

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 9:26 AM

#

yeah Demeter is just superior, but Zag fists like ME too. Ares start and hope for a natural Athena

#

if you don't see Athena in tart gathering ME pieces will be tedious

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:27 AM

#

Yeah, after how much resetting I had to do for spear I’m not above a few resets for Athena in tart

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 9:28 AM

#

yo can also try zeus tbh

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:28 AM

#

Good thing is I’ve done a number of ME builds for sword so I know the gist of the process

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 9:28 AM

#

It's not as good as ME for sure but you can clear easily

#

I love Lightning strike builds with support fire

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:28 AM

#

gaunt fiber yo can also try zeus tbh

The problem with Zeus for me is that in my experience it isn’t quite as utterly crushing and ME is

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 9:28 AM

#

It is not indeed, ME dps is way above

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:29 AM

#

As ME is*

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 9:29 AM

#

but if you just want a clear without resetting

#

Zeus will do the trick

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:29 AM

#

But you’re right, Zeus with support fire is super fun

next acorn May 19, 2021, 3:47 PM

#

Does it matter if you grab Ares or Athena first?

#

Bc I’ve been doing Athena first but should I not be?

quartz mantle May 19, 2021, 3:51 PM

#

Doom helps you more than special or dash does in Tart

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 3:58 PM

#

typically youll go for ares first because its usually better to get the damaging part of a duo before the other part

#

and honestly divine dash is just as important as impending doom imo

pseudo kernel May 19, 2021, 3:58 PM

#

when you are going for a merciful end build you should go ares keepsake -> athena keepsake -> acorn/ tooth -> acorn

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 3:59 PM

#

it increases your dps by about the same amount

next acorn May 19, 2021, 4:00 PM

#

ok

devout quiver May 19, 2021, 4:45 PM

#

pseudo kernel when you are going for a merciful end build you should go ares keepsake -> athen...

the real strat is to just reset until you get both in tart dance

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 5:18 PM

#

thats a given

#

you likely still take athena keepsake in asphodel

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:03 PM

#

I usually athena first so I can get special in room one

#

We need 2 athena boons to get ME actually functional so the chance to see her again in Tart is too much to pass up

halcyon flame May 19, 2021, 6:05 PM

#

trying to get sub 10 fists taught me to never do athena start

#

getting ME? no problem

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:05 PM

#

Oh well speedrun strat is different

halcyon flame May 19, 2021, 6:05 PM

#

getting dash? very yes problem

next acorn May 19, 2021, 6:06 PM

#

So the general consensus is that there is no general consensus

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:06 PM

#

If you're doing speedrun strats you need damage first

#

I don't do speedrun strats and I play ME a lot and it's always athena first for me, don't know if that's optimal

#

If you ask Nyaanyaa she'll say not to bother with ME and just take eternal rose

next acorn May 19, 2021, 6:08 PM

#

lol

celest grail May 19, 2021, 6:08 PM

#

curse of longing is ME

#

But better

#

Obviously

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:08 PM

#

Define "better"

celest grail May 19, 2021, 6:09 PM

#

well, just how gilgamesh is a better aspect than the other fists

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:09 PM

#

Ah

#

So you mean "worse"

celest grail May 19, 2021, 6:09 PM

#

have you seen the insane amount of dmg maim puts out???

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:09 PM

#

Yes

#

Sluggers do an insane amount of maim damage to me

celest grail May 19, 2021, 6:09 PM

#

gilgamesh + demeter boons just wrecks

true fable May 19, 2021, 6:09 PM

#

starting athena usually means your doom is supremely underpommed though

#

which is a problem on most nonGY ME weapons

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:10 PM

#

That's true

#

Is it not asking a lot to get two specific athena boons and the duos in Asphodel and Elysium?

#

Feels like it places a ton of pressure on your athena hits

#

Though I guess it also makes a whiff way less likely if you need 3 things from her

true fable May 19, 2021, 6:13 PM

#

it is asking a lot

#

that's ME for ya baby

halcyon flame May 19, 2021, 6:13 PM

#

who runs ME on gy though

true fable May 19, 2021, 6:13 PM

#

LOL

#

um

#

every single GY speedrun up to 40 heat

halcyon flame May 19, 2021, 6:13 PM

#

?????????????????//

#

just run lightning phalanx lol!!

true fable May 19, 2021, 6:13 PM

#

ME is the guan yu speedrun strat

pseudo kernel May 19, 2021, 6:14 PM

#

ye

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:14 PM

#

What's that guy's name, Magnil?

#

"luvcrimson"

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 6:14 PM

#

true fable every single GY speedrun up to 40 heat

PES_Salute

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:14 PM

#

I think he had a sub 8 Arthur ME looool

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 6:14 PM

#

Yeah Magnil is crazy

true fable May 19, 2021, 6:14 PM

#

but if you think you have something faster than ME on GY

#

be my guest

#

it is a treat to run

shy plinth May 19, 2021, 6:15 PM

#

Clearly the strat on GY is the Jesus build

#

Gotta get that level 1 save file

gaunt fiber May 19, 2021, 6:19 PM

#

I'm looking at the 40 heat leaderboard on src

#

Frenchies are playing Guan Yu, Talos and Lucifer

#

that's glorious

next acorn May 19, 2021, 6:25 PM

#

hehe water gun go brrrrr

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 7:32 PM

#

https://gyazo.com/1d00c7618899e2d34bf079c85114455c :/

Gyazo

▶ Play video

devout quiver May 19, 2021, 7:47 PM

#

halcyon flame ?????????????????//

ME is secretly optimal on every aspect dance

devout quiver May 19, 2021, 7:48 PM

#

honest kernel https://gyazo.com/1d00c7618899e2d34bf079c85114455c :/

oof. right in the face

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 7:58 PM

#

true fable every single GY speedrun up to 40 heat

Nope. squirtnya

true fable May 19, 2021, 7:58 PM

#

well

#

ok

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 8:06 PM

#

Honest people start their Guan Yu speedruns with the Eternal Rose.

true fable May 19, 2021, 8:07 PM

#

interesting

#

have you found any?

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 8:07 PM

#

Yes.

viscid fractal May 19, 2021, 8:10 PM

#

what about poseidon aspect for sword (ik not related at all)

#

i tend to pick zeus cast because it cleans rooms so well

#

but which cast do you guys tend to prefer for high heat poseidon

#

poseidon is cool too

pseudo kernel May 19, 2021, 8:11 PM

#

Probably lightning phalanx

#

It's the same thing as zeus cast but with more damage

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 8:12 PM

#

I don't know what the guys do, but I like Crush Shot a lot. squirtnya

pseudo kernel May 19, 2021, 8:13 PM

#

Gross

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 8:13 PM

#

https://tenor.com/view/angry-anime-girl-angry-funny-anime-faces-kaede-johan-nouvelle-assault-lily-bouquet-gif-20416942

Tenor

true fable May 19, 2021, 8:16 PM

#

i like phalanx shot quite a lot

waxen relic May 19, 2021, 8:28 PM

#

Passion flare is quite nice

honest kernel May 19, 2021, 9:41 PM

#

ah yes, passion flare for poseidon

devout quiver May 19, 2021, 10:30 PM

#

doesn't seem unplayable, since you're usually close for Special dislodging

#

or to pick up your casts

#

prolly really want blown kiss tho

narrow carbon May 19, 2021, 10:35 PM

#

honest kernel I’m leaning towards doing zag fists for the main reason that since fists are suc...

Dodge cheese with Zag fists at 32 is fairly consistent (Zag Fists, Lambent Plume, Greater Evasion, Second Wind = over 100% dodge after Call, not counting Ruthless Reflex). But Demeter is probably more fun.

#

With Demeter I went for ME, didn’t get it, but Explosive Upper and Concentrated Knuckle were good enough

mossy zinc May 19, 2021, 11:29 PM

#

devout quiver doesn't seem unplayable, since you're usually close for Special dislodging

You don't need to dislodge anything with Crush Shot unless you're fighting bosses.

#

And you don't really need Blown Kiss. But Blown Kiss is great.

#

It just does massive damage and kills everything.

solar maple May 20, 2021, 3:33 AM

#

Athena cast is my preference but lots of them can work

#

Lp really isn't needed imo

true fable May 20, 2021, 3:34 AM

#

i forgot idid 50 with crush lol

dire steppe May 21, 2021, 3:12 AM

#

i should pick up hades again sometime

narrow belfry May 22, 2021, 11:45 AM

#

Anybody got any idea, how to beat 32 Heat with sword? I got all the others, but struggle with several sword builds...

true fable May 22, 2021, 11:46 AM

#

sword is hard

#

arthur is kind of easy brain off

#

you can just run aphro attack and stack damage reduction

#

otherwise poseidon with phalanx shot is an option

#

as is nemesis with double edge and artemis/aphrodite attack

#

athena special is good if you choose a non-arthur sword

#

what have you been trying so far?

narrow belfry May 22, 2021, 11:48 AM

#

Nearly every build... Arthur + Aphro was ok for me, as was Arthur + spearpoint, but it's sooo slow

#

hm, athena special could work

true fable May 22, 2021, 11:48 AM

#

arthur + spearpoint is rough

#

how are you scaling your damage

#

usually with aphrodite attack forcing smoldering air can be worth it

#

athena special builds go for either deadly reversal or merciful end

#

sword is very much a sort of hit and run kind of weapon

#

you want to weave in and out of boss attacks

#

can kind of go ham in rooms though

#

if you feel like arthurs a bit slow, try hitting more enemies at once with the cleave

mossy zinc May 22, 2021, 1:05 PM

#

Yeah, Smoldering Air and try to get any out of Greatest Reflex, Hyper Sprint, Second Wind, and Greater Evasion from Lord Hermes.

narrow belfry May 22, 2021, 1:05 PM

#

hmhmhm sounds about right. I usually struggle in Elysium or with the time limits. Any suggestions for a good Heat build for Arthur Aphro?

mossy zinc May 22, 2021, 1:06 PM

#

Nyaanyaa's 32 Heat Guide
HL5 LC4 CF2 EM3 BP2 MM UC TD3
Stubborn Defiance
Eternal Rose > Owl Pendant > Lucky Tooth/Acorn > Acorn

#

That should work.

#

FO0 should be easy enough to avoid most damage and give you time for big swings.

honest kernel May 22, 2021, 1:17 PM

#

nyaa, ive had a few attempts at 40 heat and have struggled a bit with what heat to add on

#

ive been losing on time a lot, or just dying to furies if i make the enemies too hard in tartarus and get unlcuky with boons

mossy zinc May 22, 2021, 1:23 PM

#

Just do that, and subtract 11 Heat at random. https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/836223465702817792/Hades_2400.png?width=786&height=442

#

This is what I did for most aspects at 40. https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/831159289061834802/Hades_2159.png?width=786&height=442

#

I guess you could swap AP1 for CF2, but I find CF2 AP0 more consistent.

honest kernel May 22, 2021, 1:55 PM

#

aight thanks

mossy zinc May 22, 2021, 1:57 PM

#

40 is kind of the point where you can't get around learning enemy behavior anymore

#

Most of the time, anyway.

opaque oxide May 22, 2021, 7:57 PM

#

Which companion is best for high heat?

pseudo kernel May 22, 2021, 8:06 PM

#

Battie

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 1:08 AM

#

And if Furies are an issue: Antos

pseudo kernel May 23, 2021, 1:43 AM

#

narrow carbon And if Furies are an issue: Antos

What why

viscid fractal May 23, 2021, 1:45 AM

#

antos is cool because you dont have to bother targeting

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 1:45 AM

#

Antos is pretty good overall, and you can summon them on the Furies. You can't summon Meg on the Furies.

viscid fractal May 23, 2021, 1:46 AM

#

battie/antos should be your main choices, shady is great too depending on how much LC you put

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 1:47 AM

#

Well, LC4 is meta at high heat for a reason, so Shady is not very good.

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 3:50 AM

#

pseudo kernel What why

Bablo used Antos on all his all aspects 40 heat streak - in case his boons were bad in Tartarus, he can use the summon on the Furies

true fable May 23, 2021, 4:25 AM

#

yeah that makes sense

#

i used meg in my streak attempts because thats what im comfy with

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 2:02 PM

#

i know this isnt actually a very high heat at all, but what are some good settings for a 16 heat run?

#

the 32 heat guide should still work bc it tells you generally easy pacts

#

you dont need to do the lc4 strat

#

ok thanks

#

pick ur fav weapon and there you go

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:25 PM

#

I’m trying for all weapons 40. With HL5 I die to Furies a lot - furthest I got with HL5 was to Hades on Beo, but Hades hits hard. I’ve avoided it by taking AP2 and using Shackle on Hestia & Zag Bow (Twin Shot), Gilga AP1 JS3 Conch (Tidal Dash), and Beo AP1 RI1 JS1 Owl. For sword and spear I got to Hades with Arthur (Shackle & Dedge) and Hades (Shackle & Serrated), but not sure that this adds up to enough damage. For a boon build, I’ll need AP0 or 1, which I figure means HL3 or 5… Any other ideas?

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 9:38 PM

#

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/624635342116618243/834170945979547708/unknown.png?width=1202&height=676

#

my 40 heat builds are always some variation of these

#

HL5 is well....gonna force you to learn enemy patterns well

#

but its worth it

#

ap2 is kinda awful

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:40 PM

#

Yeah, AP2 is only okay with Shackle and an aspect with good base damage like Hestia, or with a lucky good first hammer like Twin Shot

solar maple May 23, 2021, 9:42 PM

#

Acorn goes a long way toward making hl5 bosses doable

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 9:45 PM

#

My advice might not sound very exciting, but just practice a lot.

solar maple May 23, 2021, 9:45 PM

#

Pretty much haha

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:46 PM

#

Yeah, I thought that might be it. I think I need to get to Furies without losing an SD. I don’t think I know the Brimstone pattern. Otherwise busy rooms (witches, clones) are where I lose an SD usually. In small numbers the patterns are ok.

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 9:46 PM

#

uh that sounds like DDs and not SDs

solar maple May 23, 2021, 9:46 PM

#

Losing sds in tartaus is fine

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 9:46 PM

#

because yeah losing SDs doesnt rly matter

solar maple May 23, 2021, 9:47 PM

#

You do have to play safe in furies

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:47 PM

#

I find I don’t have enough health for Furies - but yeah with practice I guess low health will be fine

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 9:47 PM

#

that could be an issue

#

focus on picking up hearts if you dont already do

#

but yeah like nya said practice the bosses

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 9:48 PM

#

If you lose SD before Furies, you're going in with only 30%, so I see the concern. I kinda agree you wanna try to no-hit all of Tartarus as best you can, but you should still be able to beat the Furies at least most of the time with only low HP going into the fight.

solar maple May 23, 2021, 9:48 PM

#

Yeah a heart just before the boss goes a long way

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 9:49 PM

#

not losing sd is ideal but I rarley achive that with BP2 witches existing x(

#

its there to catch you if you get hard rooms after all

solar maple May 23, 2021, 9:49 PM

#

And I agree keeping high health is good, but should not be necessary

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:52 PM

#

Thanks for the tips! I’m on Switch so it’s longer to practice bosses, but it’ll be good to practice regular rooms anyway

viscid fractal May 23, 2021, 9:52 PM

#

you can also use antos instead of battie

#

to skip 3rd phase of the furries

honest kernel May 23, 2021, 9:53 PM

#

Vivi?

viscid fractal May 23, 2021, 9:53 PM

#

battie mb

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 9:53 PM

#

I actually used to use Antos a lot for that.

viscid fractal May 23, 2021, 9:54 PM

#

i tend to get to the furies at 30% so i mostly use antos

#

3rd phase you summon it and that's it

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 9:54 PM

#

If you want some low-pressure mechanics practice, do speedruns with EM2 FO2 TD3.

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:55 PM

#

viscid fractal 3rd phase you summon it and that's it

Ah, hadn’t thought of using in 3rd phase, thanks!

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:56 PM

#

mossy zinc If you want some low-pressure mechanics practice, do speedruns with EM2 FO2 TD3.

And HL5? I find I can play pretty sloppy otherwise

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 9:58 PM

#

You can't really play sloppy if you want a good time.

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 9:59 PM

#

Right - I haven’t really tried for speed yet. What’s a decent target time if I’m just working on mechanics (not trying to set a WR)?

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 10:01 PM

#

What's your PB?

bright mango May 23, 2021, 10:20 PM

#

I’d say sub 10 is a really reasonable goal

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 10:20 PM

#

I didn't have a sub 10 until well after I did 52 Heat.

#

Just getting somewhat consistent 15m times should be decent enough.

bright mango May 23, 2021, 10:21 PM

#

Did you actually dedicate your time to get a good time?

#

I think if you put in some work sub 10 is a really good goal to try and achieve

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 10:22 PM

#

No, but you don't need to decidate yourself to get a good time if high heat is the goal.

bright mango May 23, 2021, 10:22 PM

#

Oh they said mechanics

#

I thought they wanted to try speedrunning

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 10:22 PM

#

I suggested EM2 FO2 TD3 speedruns to practice mechanics, yes.

solar maple May 23, 2021, 10:24 PM

#

When I started speedrunning my first goal was sub 12

#

To make Hermes jealous lol

mossy zinc May 23, 2021, 10:26 PM

#

I think your goal should just always kinda be to lower your PBs when you're going for speed.

#

And from there you just keep improving.

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 11:02 PM

#

Aha, yeah, my PBs on sword and spear could definitely improve - though somehow my 32 run with Zag sword where I just gave up and ran Tidal Dash was 14min, lol

narrow carbon May 23, 2021, 11:32 PM

#

So if I can get sub 12 while actually using the aspect that’d be good

honest kernel May 24, 2021, 3:41 AM

#

https://gyazo.com/b0185a5a8093f99c23aeb52dc540a73a

Gyazo

#

Another vermin bites the dust

#

For those curious, the run didn't make it.

halcyon flame May 24, 2021, 5:17 AM

#

back on the grind already?

#

good luck with that nectar

devout quiver May 24, 2021, 5:29 AM

#

you'll get there.

#

Someone has to duel tail at swordpoint

#

Shieldpoint? Spearpoint? idk

honest kernel May 24, 2021, 7:05 AM

#

rip

narrow belfry May 24, 2021, 1:29 PM

#

true fable how are you scaling your damage

Finally! The last 32 Heat Run with Arthur! Thanks for your input.

solemn pulsar May 24, 2021, 5:22 PM

#

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1XnsANvLc6PxjfIVNc-HaL1ybA_x7cl0uq0vjxQJqsgY/

"frame" data for hades/EM4

FO not included
but also a full listing of attacks
and how they're different when chained vs on their own

Google Docs

Hades Attack Data

Vanilla Hades

Weapon Name,Description,PreAttackDuration,FireDuration,PostAttackDuration,PostAttackCooldownMin,PostAttackCooldownMax,MinAttacksBetweenUse,MaxConsecutiveUses,Notes
Default
HadesInvisibility,Darkness!,0.4,4
HadesBidentStrike,Single spear thrust,0.35 / 0.275,0.2,0.8
HadesBidentSpin,S...

#

obviously enemy AI is very complex and may not always adhere to rules defined here, this is just a first pass based off of game data

honest kernel May 24, 2021, 5:30 PM

#

this is cool thanks

true fable May 24, 2021, 5:35 PM

#

narrow belfry Finally! The last 32 Heat Run with Arthur! Thanks for your input.

congrats

honest kernel May 24, 2021, 6:23 PM

#

I tried em4 on 45 without practice and got super destroyed damn

#

dad shmovin

unique zephyr May 24, 2021, 6:43 PM

#

50 heat is a bit demoralizing right now, trying 50 heat rama

#

turns out RI1 hurts your build way more than AP1

shy plinth May 24, 2021, 6:44 PM

#

Routine inspection is devastating

honest kernel May 24, 2021, 6:51 PM

#

it hurts but hard to get around at this point

#

unless you wanna do em4 ;p

mossy zinc May 24, 2021, 6:52 PM

#

Just do EM4 and hope for +2 or +3 dashes.

unique zephyr May 24, 2021, 6:53 PM

#

I was just venting, my main problem is still that I'm not good enough at this game yet 😛

#

that and I'm rusty after over a week of break

#

but my mechanics need...a lot of work lol

solemn pulsar May 24, 2021, 6:53 PM

#

RI0 is possible without EM4, just need AP2

#

and most everything else maxed,

#

everything on HM p sure

unique zephyr May 24, 2021, 7:04 PM

#

CP2 + TD3 = no thanks for me, I was mainly venting I do need to get a LOT better mechanics wise

quartz mantle May 24, 2021, 7:04 PM

#

I was running EM4 AP2 RI0 for my 50 heat Rama runs

#

granted I have not won but they've been doing ok

solemn pulsar May 24, 2021, 7:12 PM

#

AP2 and EM4 gives a lot of flexibility elsewhere in the pact

bright mango May 24, 2021, 7:39 PM

#

^

#

its mega stonky until you inevitable die at em4

true fable May 24, 2021, 8:25 PM

#

yeah

devout quiver May 24, 2021, 9:49 PM

#

EM4 = EMFun

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:09 PM

#

How do you do EM4 anyway

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 2:22 PM

#

you just...do it

#

like you do normal hades

#

get a good build, learn his patterns

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:30 PM

#

It feels like so much more of a difficulty spike compared to the original than Champions or Lernie.

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:40 PM

#

the main part of the difficulty spike is that it's 80% longer on HP alone

mossy zinc May 25, 2021, 2:40 PM

#

It is. I still don't like the fight at all.

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:41 PM

#

🍪

mossy zinc May 25, 2021, 2:41 PM

#

My strategy is to just get +3 dashes.

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:41 PM

#

I can't even get through ONE health bar of EM4 (yet)

#

Could just be that I'm an idiot tho

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:43 PM

#

I think an important thing to notice is in non EM4 hades fights, are you still taking a lot of hits?

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:43 PM

#

solemn pulsar I think an important thing to notice is in non EM4 hades fights, are you still t...

Fair

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:43 PM

#

since EM4 does more damage and lasts longer, if your strategy in Hades fights is just tanking hits, then EM4 will murder you every time

#

since it does more damage, has a more mobile hades (harder to deal damage to), and has 80% more HP in all

#

also the spear throw on FO2 is brutal

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:44 PM

#

So just don't get hit. Yes.

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:44 PM

#

i mean not "just" don't get hit

#

taking time to learn timings and strategies in the fight is how you train yourself not to get hit

#

it's a fight that you can't DPS and damage tank your way through

#

it's also brutal on the timer at 40+ heat

#

since it's extending your hades fight by at least a minute, usually more at those heats

#

it's difficulty is also radically different across weapons. shields/ranged weapons have a much easier time dealing with it than sword/fists/spear

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:46 PM

#

Yeah

#

Just don't get close, I guess

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:46 PM

#

and that's when he hits you with a spear throw from DOWNTOWN

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:47 PM

#

Also, don't stand still even for a second

#

Pretty much

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:47 PM

#

actually standing still can be useful sometimes

#

at least, not dashing

#

a lot of damage you take in EM4/in general can usually be ascribed to being caught without a dash available

#

or dash striking when it should have been an empty dash

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:48 PM

#

Since of course, dashing without striking (or specialling) ignores all attacks

#

While striking removes that

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:50 PM

#

I think that most hades players (myself included), as they learn OP builds and boon combinations, tend to forget about the actually mechanics of dodging and avoiding damage instead of just unleashing a wall of damage against the enemy to win

#

if you think back to your early wins before you knew anything about boons/aspects/hammers

#

it was all about dodging enemy attacks and poking in some damage here and there

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:50 PM

#

tbh I haven't even learned OP builds and I'm not going to

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:50 PM

#

bringing that awareness + dodging back in is imperative to succeeding an ultra-high heat

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:51 PM

#

Yeah

#

The focus shifts back to Don't Get Hit, after you get used to that not mattering as much

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:52 PM

#

honestly some good EM4 practice would be to get there on FO2, then spend the entire fight until the timer runs out (or you get bored) just dodging

#

dont even worry about damage unless you want to advance the phase

#

go in at FO2, but with HL0 so he's not doing quite so much damage

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:52 PM

#

"Timer?" You can turn TD off you know

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 2:53 PM

#

survival rooms boring

past moss May 25, 2021, 2:54 PM

#

You said yourself, a big part of EM4 is that it's harder to deal damage, much less avoid it

#

Just focus on avoiding blunders I guess.

#

he said while his discord tag makes fun of his habit of crashing into spikes

mossy zinc May 25, 2021, 2:59 PM

#

At high heat, you wouldn't take EM4 before TD, so you'd always have a timer.

#

Bit if you're only doing EM4 and nothing else, obviously you'll have an easier time.

#

But timer or not, you can either DPS through his healing in phase 3 or you have the rate of attack to clear all the urns and prevent him from healing.

past moss May 25, 2021, 3:01 PM

#

There's a phase 3.

#

Really now.

mossy zinc May 25, 2021, 3:01 PM

#

Yes.

next acorn May 25, 2021, 3:19 PM

#

Can’t he also heal phase two?

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 3:21 PM

#

He does heal in phase 2

#

In fact, it's mandatory after the first half

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 3:41 PM

#

honest kernel In fact, it's mandatory after the first half

More than that, it has a property that I missed when compiling data yesterday called "ForceUseIfReady"

#

the heal will always be forced if it is eligible to go off

#

which is every 15 attacks

#

@honest kernel have you seen any limitations on # of heals per phase? can he do more than one?

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 4:00 PM

#

personally em4 makes the fight way too long agreed

#

I wish it would just be harder than just twice as long

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 4:21 PM

#

solemn pulsar <@456226577798135808> have you seen any limitations on # of heals per phase? can...

If you break the urns fast enough, I think 3 was the max ?

#

2 is the more likely outcome

#

And I've seen some 1s, if the urns doesn't spawn fast enough to have an eligible target

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 4:40 PM

#

Don't think it ever was 3

#

Retrash likely has a better insight into this matter.

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 5:26 PM

#

honest kernel If you break the urns fast enough, I think 3 was the max ?

hmm there's a line in the code that says it should only be used once

#

makes me wonder if other stuff is busted

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 5:32 PM

#

He definitely can do 2.

#

I wonder if he can only successfully heal once

#

But if you break the urn he was about to heal off of once, he can try again

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 6:05 PM

#

he should be able to get up to 3 heals

#

per cycle

#

there's a tag on the healing attack itself that says MaxUses=1

#

i was thinking 1 per phase, but that can't be it

#

it's also the only attack in the game that has the MaxUses field, so it's possible it just doesn't work properly

#

@honest kernel aha, found it. When moving from phase 2 to 3 the game specifically allows 4 heals

#

so it's 1 heal max in phase 2, 4 in phase 3.

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 6:23 PM

#

That'll do it

unique zephyr May 25, 2021, 8:02 PM

#

honest kernel personally em4 makes the fight way too long agreed

Now I feel less bad about deciding EM4 just lasts way too long for my sanity plus a health condition

#

I physically cannot concentrate that intently for that long

#

You can only take a few hits from super dad before you die

#

For the entire fight

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 8:37 PM

#

yeah

#

feels that way

cerulean gale May 25, 2021, 9:33 PM

#

Hey, hi, have I misunderstood how heat works? Aren't you supposed to get new rewards whenever you increase heat past the previous level for a weapon?

pseudo kernel May 25, 2021, 9:35 PM

#

cerulean gale Hey, hi, have I misunderstood how heat works? Aren't you supposed to get new rew...

You have to beat hades at 0 heat to get access to the 1 heat bounties, and you need to beat hades at 1 heat to get access to the 2 heat bounties, and so on

#

Each weapon is counted separately

cerulean gale May 25, 2021, 9:35 PM

#

pseudo kernel You have to beat hades at 0 heat to get access to the 1 heat bounties, and you ...

Okay then I'm doing something wrong

honest kernel May 25, 2021, 9:42 PM

#

huh

#

huh

next acorn May 25, 2021, 10:10 PM

#

huh

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 10:11 PM

#

pseudo kernel You have to beat hades at 0 heat to get access to the 1 heat bounties, and you ...

@cerulean gale I believe this is incorrect, and the bounties for 0 heat are stored separately to the heat bounties. So if you beat up to Elysium on 0 heat, you will get Titans Blood/Diamond/Ambrosia, and then if you do a full clear on 1 heat you will receive Bloodx2/Diamond/Ambrosia, then you have to return to 0 heat to get Darkness/Darkness/Darkness/Titans Blood

#

When you're dealing with the heat bounties themselves, what pp man said applies, as no matter how high you raise the heat, you will only get the most recent bounties

pseudo kernel May 25, 2021, 10:11 PM

#

Ohh ok

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 10:11 PM

#

so if you clear tartarus on 5 heat and receive Titans Blood

#

and then jack it up to 50 heat and clear Tartarus, you will still receive Darkness, since the game is still on your 1 heat bounty

#

however you can clear 20 times in a row on 20 heat on a weapon and receive all of the bounties

cerulean gale May 25, 2021, 10:12 PM

#

so basically i need to do a full clear every heat i get it

solemn pulsar May 25, 2021, 10:12 PM

#

yep

past moss May 25, 2021, 11:12 PM

#

It can feel a bit tedious I guess

spice lava May 26, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/807672625739858000/815508396769542164/unknown.png

#

@past moss being overtime works sometimes 😄

true fable May 26, 2021, 8:41 AM

#

OI

#

nice

#

let's go yagg

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 8:50 AM

#

dem dash lol

#

nice friendly

spice lava May 26, 2021, 9:05 AM

#

It's an old pb, now I'm working on zag sword 32 heat lvl 1 aspect no summon 👀

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 9:06 AM

#

baited

spice lava May 26, 2021, 9:06 AM

#

Died against Hades P2 last night, melee ain't my thing

#

Using dash strike too much to deal dmg so my defense has weakened 👀

spice lava May 26, 2021, 9:28 AM

#

I wanted a fresh save with all aspects low lvl but it looks like it's impossible to unlock the hidden aspects this way except GY

#

Unless I call cgull's help

#

All this farm time I could have spent on Luci /Chiron 50 instead... Sadge

waxen relic May 26, 2021, 9:36 AM

#

spice lava I wanted a fresh save with all aspects low lvl but it looks like it's impossible...

Or you do multiple saves ig

spice lava May 26, 2021, 9:38 AM

#

Yeah but having all of the clears lvl 1 aspect on the same save is impossible

#

That means doing first the normal aspects then having to lvl them up to unlock the 3 hidden aspects left

solemn pulsar May 26, 2021, 11:39 AM

#

spice lava Unless I call cgull's help

Pony qol mod offers Titans blood refunding I think

#

Could use that

spice lava May 26, 2021, 11:41 AM

#

Alright, thx

slow cairn May 26, 2021, 3:02 PM

#

Starting to really believe in an Achilles Poseidon cast build. Seems to be working out for me at higher heats than a lot of others.

spice lava May 26, 2021, 3:04 PM

#

It can make sense: flood flare on cast and Artemis on atk so you can have the mirage shot duo

#

Or zeus atk to get sea storm

slow cairn May 26, 2021, 3:05 PM

#

Sea storm has definitely helped me out a few times.

spice lava May 26, 2021, 3:05 PM

#

But arty atk can result with more DPS with the +150%

slow cairn May 26, 2021, 3:06 PM

#

Yeah, but I ended up getting Zeus on dash in that build because that's how it worked out.

#

But with wave pounding and sea storm, I ended up doing good dps to bosses, and clearing rooms quickly and easily.

#

And Demeter's duo, can deal insane damage if you line it up right.

slender elbow May 26, 2021, 3:38 PM

#

any tips for beating 32 heat with Chiron Bow ?

#

Heat setup/boon builds etc

pseudo kernel May 26, 2021, 3:40 PM

#

you should try this

#h1-high-heat-strategies message

#

its a good 32 heat guide

gaunt fiber May 26, 2021, 3:55 PM

#

you also have a nice pact chart if you want to custom your 32 pact

#

in pinned messages

#

For chiron, I'd go heart rend. Aphrodite start for the attack, DC0. Clear tartarus with the attack and get deadly flourish

#

Pretty much every hammer is good on chiron and that feels super great. Of course you'll want relentless and concentrated volley but anything is good beside sniper shot and point blank shot (the latter being ok with explosive shot)

slender elbow May 26, 2021, 4:17 PM

#

thanks for the guide
and what is DC0 if i may ask ?

pseudo kernel May 26, 2021, 4:17 PM

#

damage control 0

gaunt fiber May 26, 2021, 4:18 PM

#

It's also in the pinned messages

pseudo kernel May 26, 2021, 4:18 PM

#

pseudo kernel you should try this https://discord.com/channels/456889434672201729/7250214484...

ye thats what this is

gaunt fiber May 26, 2021, 4:20 PM

#

oh there's a typo, it's HL not HC

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 5:20 PM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/847162296177655808/unknown.png

#

turns out I do like artemis aid but only when it has heartrend on it

next acorn May 26, 2021, 5:21 PM

#

Why do you not like it without?

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 5:21 PM

#

its really bad without imo

#

even with full call you need it to do good crits to do good dmg

#

not gonna even mention that its unusable outside of bosses

next acorn May 26, 2021, 5:22 PM

#

what makes it unusable?

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 5:23 PM

#

1 arrow?

#

its terrible

next acorn May 26, 2021, 5:23 PM

#

ic

mossy zinc May 26, 2021, 5:36 PM

#

It can be really good burst damage with poms on it.

mossy zinc May 26, 2021, 5:36 PM

#

honest kernel https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/847162296177655808/unk...

Congratulations! 💕 dusa

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 5:38 PM

#

thanks friendly

narrow carbon May 26, 2021, 8:31 PM

#

narrow carbon I’m trying for all weapons 40. With HL5 I die to Furies a lot - furthest I got w...

The tips helped! (Practicing via speedruns at lower heat, using Antos in last phase of Furies). I got my first 40 Spear with Achilles and Hunting Blades. My challenge with Sword is that even with Poseidon I need to get close to Hades to extract the casts, and I often take a ton of damage - it’s like learning the fight again.

mossy zinc May 26, 2021, 9:16 PM

#

Congratulations! dusa

honest kernel May 26, 2021, 9:16 PM

#

good job!

mossy zinc May 26, 2021, 9:17 PM

#

narrow carbon The tips helped! (Practicing via speedruns at lower heat, using Antos in last ph...

After his spin, it's always safe to dislodge your Casts.

#

Also very important for melee: if you strafe him (just running), his spear thrust will never hit you.

#

Like just run perpendicular to his line of sight. That way, you'll only have to worry about skull casts and spins that you need to evade with empty dashes.

magic pier May 26, 2021, 10:23 PM

#

mossy zinc Like just run perpendicular to his line of sight. That way, you'll only have to ...

Thanks so much! I had not processed that at all!

narrow carbon May 26, 2021, 10:45 PM

#

mossy zinc After his spin, it's always safe to dislodge your Casts.

Thanks, again! I’ll practice those movements

past moss May 27, 2021, 3:22 AM

#

why can you still get Strong Drink, Nourished Soul, etc. with LC4

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 3:25 AM

#

Strictly speaking, Strong Drink still has an effect, the damage bonus from drinking from a fountain.

past moss May 27, 2021, 3:25 AM

#

I guess?

celest grail May 27, 2021, 3:39 AM

#

Also its a good boon to sell

#

Not sure why nourished soul is still available lol

mossy zinc May 27, 2021, 3:51 AM

#

Because that's what you sign up for when you take LC4.

#

It doesn't say "makes healing items and boons disappear."

#

So why would you think it does.

unique zephyr May 27, 2021, 6:29 AM

#

Grinding 50 heat, it’s really hard

#

I only got to elysium once so far, only left Tartarus like 3 times

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 6:32 AM

#

bc game is mean

unique zephyr May 27, 2021, 6:33 AM

#

I need to git gud, too

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 6:40 AM

#

yeeah

true fable May 27, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

game is mean

slender elbow May 27, 2021, 9:01 AM

#

I just finished my first ever 32 Heat run with Chiron Low Tolerance Aphro/Dio
Thanks for your tips about Heat Setups it helped a ton

devout quiver May 27, 2021, 9:02 AM

#

Nice

#

what was your pact?

slender elbow May 27, 2021, 1:40 PM

#

HL5 LC4 CF2 EM2 BP2 MM UC FO1 TD3

#

that's what i found myself comfortable with because i can't play well against EM3

junior mountain May 27, 2021, 1:41 PM

#

EM3 sucks yea

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 3:24 PM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/847495364676288582/unknown.png

#

I wanted to do like special only rama but then aphro took over which is ok

pseudo kernel May 27, 2021, 3:25 PM

#

nice

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 3:25 PM

#

special only rama kinda too slow

junior mountain May 27, 2021, 3:25 PM

#

nice

#

Rama is good but Im so horrible at it

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 3:55 PM

#

almost got my no attack rama run but then teleporting chariots got me aaarg

bright mango May 27, 2021, 5:09 PM

#

unique zephyr Grinding 50 heat, it’s really hard

you'll get it squirtyay

#

50 heat is tilting dw

solemn pulsar May 27, 2021, 5:49 PM

#

@unique zephyr just remind yourself that probably only a few dozen people have ever cleared 50 heat with rama, if that

bright mango May 27, 2021, 7:19 PM

#

oh wut ur doing it with rama

#

gl

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 7:27 PM

#

chads play rama

unique zephyr May 27, 2021, 9:39 PM

#

Bow gang rise up

#

Doing 40 heat nemesis sword, melee weapons hard

#

After 40 heat sword I’ll have 6 x 40

mossy zinc May 27, 2021, 9:50 PM

#

Bow gang rise up
Doing 40 heat nemesis sword

#

thanthink

unique zephyr May 27, 2021, 10:04 PM

#

Look I want all 6 numbers on my heat record clear screen to be 40 or above

#

This is a diversion from me grinding Rama 50 lol, finishing up 6 x 40

wraith imp May 27, 2021, 11:03 PM

#

Question: Is quick recovery (boon that returns health if you dash immediately after taking damage) affected by maximum lasting consequences? I've never had that combo but a friend just asked and I wasn't sure.

pseudo kernel May 27, 2021, 11:03 PM

#

No

wraith imp May 27, 2021, 11:04 PM

#

Oh? I'm surprised.

I fully expected the game to screw someone over with LC4 + AP2 + dash recovery.

Thanks for the reply.

pseudo kernel May 27, 2021, 11:05 PM

#

Np

unique zephyr May 27, 2021, 11:07 PM

#

Sword stinky

narrow carbon May 27, 2021, 11:09 PM

#

unique zephyr Sword stinky

Why Nemesis? I find Poseidon is safer for a first 40 (still working on it though)

unique zephyr May 27, 2021, 11:11 PM

#

Not sure how much I like how poseidon plays, but I'll try that instead

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 11:11 PM

#

Reject Sticc

#

Return to Arthur

next acorn May 27, 2021, 11:16 PM

#

Arthur=Big Number

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 11:16 PM

#

Arthur is legit at high heat

#

Up to a certain point

next acorn May 27, 2021, 11:17 PM

#

What makes it bad at a certain point

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 11:20 PM

#

Damage Control 2, Extreme Measures 4, Tight Deadline 3

#

Arthur has a hard time dealing with those

#

As you turn on the other modifiers

next acorn May 27, 2021, 11:21 PM

#

Is it just that every melee struggles with EM4?

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 11:21 PM

#

Arguably so

#

You want your dashes to approach Hades

#

but thanks to Forced Overtime 2

#

That leaves you vulnerable to counter-attacks when hades is not vulnerable

#

Against the non EM version of Hades, it's not as big a deal

#

But against EM4 Hades, his openings are a lot shorter

#

And less frequent

#

That leaves any melee aspect wanting some sort of extra defense, since tanking hits is pretty much mandatory

#

Be it in the form of Hermes, Athena Death Defiances, Stacking Damage Reduction, Keepsakes ...

#

And the more you invest in defense, the less you can invest in offence

#

Getting a good middle-ground is difficult

#

Granted, it's possible to do the EM4 fight well, but it's hard

#

Your dash timings need to be on point, or you are either eating a spear or a swing to the face

next acorn May 27, 2021, 11:25 PM

#

Ic

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 11:25 PM

#

If you want to see an EM4 fight done well, take a look at pretty much any of Retrash's runs, and see when he dashes

#

His method is universal across all aspects

#

Despite all this, he'll still be tanking hits a lot

#

That's just part of the nature of the fight being so long

next acorn May 27, 2021, 11:27 PM

#

Is it ever a good idea to take EM4 though

honest kernel May 27, 2021, 11:27 PM

#

Depends on your goal with heat

#

if it's anything around the 40 range, you won't need it

#

at around the 50 range, it can be a consideration. Wouldn't be required still

#

It's the higher you go that it becomes more and more of a necessity

#

55+ you'd be hard pressed to not turn it on

#

The best you could really push is 58 heat, on shield, with RI3, EM3, everything else maxed

#

Which hey is what I did, but on 57 heat because no hellmode

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 4:56 AM

#

I wonder if it's normal to wonder if you're even capable of doing 50 heat before you actually clear

shy plinth May 28, 2021, 4:59 AM

#

It is for you 🙂

#

You wonder about literal every heat level you've tried before you clear it

#

Would guess it's pretty typical

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 5:04 AM

#

Huh, that is true haha, I forgot but that is true

#

A specific question: for numbskull rooms how many skulls should be tagged before I attack? All of them? Assuming no special boon

#

A Rama question

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 5:10 AM

#

Depending on what you have on Special, you can just kill them with your Special alone.

#

Or your Dash even.

#

Oh wait, you said assuming no Special boon lol.

#

Just whatever you're comfortable with. You don't have to set speedrun records.

#

Clearing half a wave of them to make it easier to deal with the other half is fine.

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:31 AM

#

There's no precise answer to that. Some months ago we advised you to play more because you were asking too much questions. This is kinda why: With experience and muscle memory, instinct and habits should be enough to take care of some rooms like BP2 skulls

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 5:32 AM

#

Ah ok. I do have somewhat limited time but I'll try to make the most of it, but even with playing I still am not sure where to start with approaching things

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:32 AM

#

Some rooms are probably still difficult because you have this habit to "calculate" what to do but some rooms won't let you do it

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 5:33 AM

#

Yeah that's basically it

#

mainly really cramped rooms

#

or cloners

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:33 AM

#

And you take free dmg

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 5:33 AM

#

Is the solution to just play until it becomes instinct?

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:34 AM

#

For me yes

#

Experience and instinct support your play when you don't have time to think

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 5:35 AM

#

just gotta practice

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:39 AM

#

Imagine that high heat players are mostly predators: We know with time and practice how to take down enemies, and we always adapt ourselves to the seed for the hunt

#

The moments we calculate for real are mostly when we choose our rooms

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 5:44 AM

#

you keep saying you got limited time but I'm pretty sure you play the game more than me. don't drag yourself down bc you need more breaks than people who play like 5h in one session

#

everyone plays differently

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 5:44 AM

#

I wish I could play 5h in one session haha

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:45 AM

#

Still haven't cleared any 50 run since February 😔

#

one day this will change

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 5:45 AM

#

washed up 😔

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:49 AM

#

I'll rephrase my advice for you Bacchus then: you don't need to play more, you just need to play more with your hands than your brain

#

You want to reach enough experience to be able to clear some rooms without this calculation

#

You see an enemy but your hands know that because it's armored you expect an attack that you want to dodge

#

When facing Lernie I want space with Rama to be comfortable so if Lernie's heads are too agressive to be all marked, just killing one at the beginning is enough to create a safe spot to breathe until I see an opening to mark them all

#

This kind of ideas can be decided in a very short amount of time because your hands know it, your gameplay knows it

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 5:56 AM

#

Oh that makes more sense then

#

I currently have 90 tries on 50 heat, Im not sure how much my hands have learned from that :/

#

I'm not sure how I can play "more" with my hands

spice lava May 28, 2021, 5:59 AM

#

Maybe you don't feel or aren't ready for 50 but 45 isn't an easy goal for most people

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 6:00 AM

#

I do feel proud of my 45 PB

#

I wonder if I'm improving even if I don't feel it lol

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 6:00 AM

#

you prob are

#

and you're good at the game or else you wouldn't clear 45

spice lava May 28, 2021, 6:03 AM

#

I don't feel proud being only "good" with Hestia despite my 53 😂

#

But i'd say one of the common mistakes here is to see only progression through clears: Your skills are improving even if you didn't clear 50 yet

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 6:05 AM

#

Well, I don’t feel like my 45 is enough lol

spice lava May 28, 2021, 6:05 AM

#

Yes I'm guilty as charged on that one

#

But my main issue isn't time, it's the job parasiting my motivation, too complicated to be good at both work and High heat Hades atm so results have become slow

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 6:17 AM

#

When you die, back up your save, and practice that room until you've figured out how to clear it.

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 6:35 AM

#

Clear it efficiently you mean (seeing how little time I can clear it)?

#

How long is an acceptable time to spend on Tartarus Erebus gates, like 30 seconds?

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 6:40 AM

#

You're not speedrunning are you? Just make sure not to waste time and not to die depending in the room.

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 6:45 AM

#

unique zephyr I wish I could play 5h in one session haha

From a health perspective i could but it's neither good for the stuff still to do in RL nor effective for clearing/learning high heat. I generally stop at 2hr the latest. Then again i haven't seriously tried for 50 in a good weapon yet. Just some memes bouldy

spice lava May 28, 2021, 7:11 AM

#

I don't think or wonder how much time I'm supposed to clear an Erebus Gate, I just clear and see how the run goes

#

I'm really not the calculating type of performer on this game

shy plinth May 28, 2021, 7:12 AM

#

The reflex of asking these questions is to soothe anxiety anyway

#

The improvement in gameplay always comes from experience

#

But it's a common coping mechanism to attempt to gather information to attempt to mitigate the fear of failure

#

If anyone sticks with it and shows the kind of dedication that's clearly already here in this case, a clear is inevitable

#

Just a matter of time

viscid fractal May 28, 2021, 7:57 AM

#

Everything in this game is so dependant on your playstyle and preferences anyway

#

Just try stuff out and do what feels best

ashen garnet May 28, 2021, 9:51 AM

#

spice lava I don't think or wonder how much time I'm supposed to clear an Erebus Gate, I ju...

TD3 wants to know your chamber location squirtnya

#

At some point of doing repetitively the same room clears or biomes, you acquire muscle memory and habits in decision making. Still, I never paused in a game as much as in Hades during 50heat attempts because it is good to always be critical about your choices and it really helps to figure where things went wrong in your run afterwards

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:30 AM

#

Hey Scratch, because you're currently working on your first clear 50, what do you think about it? I mean, maybe telling the way you see and feel your runs may give some clues to Bacchus 👀

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:32 AM

#

I am curious too

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:34 AM

#

dio start and skulls are no problem anymore 😏

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:36 AM

#

@ashen garnet

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:37 AM

#

honest kernel dio start and skulls are no problem anymore 😏

I’d need to download a hell mode save to do a TD2 pact

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:38 AM

#

do it

#

tbh my time was good enough for it to be td3

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:39 AM

#

I did try but I couldn’t get to work, I have the file

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:39 AM

#

I just pussied out

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:39 AM

#

I’ll try dio start

ashen garnet May 28, 2021, 10:39 AM

#

spice lava Hey Scratch, because you're currently working on your first clear 50, what do yo...

Honestly, the more I play 50, the more I think there are weapon and aspect-specific strategies. Plus I don't think I can be of any help to clear anything outside Malphon shadeembarassed

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:39 AM

#

Do I just pick up something decent on attack or what

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:39 AM

#

aphro or artemis ye

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:40 AM

#

You did fists for your 50? Brave

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:40 AM

#

brave

#

I will say this dio start is def reset city

#

because if you dont gets special its gonna suck

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:40 AM

#

I like that arty start is fewer resets at least

#

Dash or attack works, and like 4 hammers

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:41 AM

#

it is yeah

#

rama is the hammer champ anywy tbh

#

almost impossible to get bad ones

#

on ap1

#

ap0 you always get good ones

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:45 AM

#

almost impossible to get bad ones
@honest kernel Lucifer 👀

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:45 AM

#

true

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:48 AM

#

When I tryhard 50 it's Luci/Chiron mood atm 👀

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:49 AM

#

what luci build r you doing on 50

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:50 AM

#

I never got out of Tartarus yet but depending of the mood it's Zeus or Shackle starter

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:51 AM

#

yeah zeus seems consistent

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:51 AM

#

Shackle on lucifer? Is it good?

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:51 AM

#

prob because of the ramping dmg

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:51 AM

#

Not having Zeus doesn't seem to be an issue because the dmg ramps

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:52 AM

#

I was thinking about if artemis luci is worth but I never tried it

#

on attack i mean

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 10:52 AM

#

You do need a boon in attack i think

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:53 AM

#

If you launch your 20 charges on an enemy it's 390 because of the dmg ramp, so adding shackle seems okay for a start

#

It's just that in order to stay longer on the same target to deal dmg you dash while holding the atk

#

So the way you move is different

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:57 AM

#

I’ll try to keep in mind that if I play enough with the right intention that strategising won’t be conscious anymore

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:57 AM

#

return to monke

#

pure instinct gameplay

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:58 AM

#

Ultra Instinct Zagreus

spice lava May 28, 2021, 10:59 AM

#

Part of your answer to clear 50 will come from your brain but the biggest part left will come from instinct and experience 👀

#

Schemes against Hades have no point if you don't dodge his dmg patterns 👀 ✨

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 11:01 AM

#

I’ve choked against dad more times than I care to admit in 32 and 40 runs

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 11:18 AM

#

unique zephyr Clear it efficiently you mean (seeing how little time I can clear it)?

No, I mean clear it.

#

You're too focused on efficiency, I think.

#

Before you worry about efficiency, worry about not dying.

true fable May 28, 2021, 11:28 AM

#

tbh i only had to tailor my approach to 50 for very specific aspects

#

bows, cast weapons mostly

#

everything else is kind of flexible

#

spears dont like DC

#

swords dont really like DC

spice lava May 28, 2021, 11:43 AM

#

Because of Fiery presence?

true fable May 28, 2021, 11:44 AM

#

because of the fire rate i think

#

spears it can be ok if you have flurry jab

#

but thats still two flurry jab hits that didnt land

#

or one with zeus attack

edgy arrow May 28, 2021, 12:13 PM

#

yo been a while

#

anything cool happen while i've been gone

pseudo kernel May 28, 2021, 12:14 PM

#

no

edgy arrow May 28, 2021, 12:14 PM

#

nice

pseudo kernel May 28, 2021, 12:17 PM

#

indeed

bright mango May 28, 2021, 1:54 PM

#

spice lava This kind of ideas can be decided in a very short amount of time because your ha...

^^^^^ ALL OF THIS

devout quiver May 28, 2021, 2:17 PM

#

game hard pepehands

round pilot May 28, 2021, 2:20 PM

#

What's the best sword aspect for high heat? I have a feeling it might be Zag

devout quiver May 28, 2021, 2:21 PM

#

round pilot What's the best sword aspect for high heat? I have a feeling it might be Zag

Whichever one you're most comfortable with

pseudo kernel May 28, 2021, 2:21 PM

#

yeah

#

imo its poseidon or nem

devout quiver May 28, 2021, 2:21 PM

#

I see it said Nem most often

#

but that's only really, super high heat

edgy arrow May 28, 2021, 2:21 PM

#

its poseidon if you're bad at swords and nem if you're good at swords basically

pseudo kernel May 28, 2021, 2:22 PM

#

arthur can be good but i feel like its too slow

devout quiver May 28, 2021, 2:22 PM

#

if you're just looking at like 32-40 whatever then just use whatever you're most comfortable with

edgy arrow May 28, 2021, 2:22 PM

#

^

#

although probs not zag lol

#

unless you really wanna

#

don't let me tell you what to do

devout quiver May 28, 2021, 2:23 PM

#

if my first 32 can be Gilgamesh, anything is possible

edgy arrow May 28, 2021, 2:23 PM

#

lmao nice

#

for sure tho

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 2:34 PM

#

arthur ez

quartz mantle May 28, 2021, 2:37 PM

#

The game is really balanced at 32 heat, every aspect is viable

#

Once you start to push past ~45 heat and get some of the harder pacts in there are less viable aspects

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 3:43 PM

#

How does Arthur handle FO2

#

FO1 at 40 requires AP1

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 3:54 PM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/847865360689397810/unknown.png

#

I got 4-sacked im so mad aaaaaaaaa

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 3:54 PM

#

It's about the player handling Arthur with FO2

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 3:55 PM

#

honest kernel https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/847865360689397810/unk...

that's not ME is it

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 3:55 PM

#

yeah I didnt get me

#

very sad

#

I got athena and ares in tart

#

but somehow no me

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 3:55 PM

#

oh em4 well that's over then

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 3:56 PM

#

yeah it was over

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 4:40 PM

#

unique zephyr How does Arthur handle FO2

Play better is how you handle it. squirtnya

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 5:55 PM

#

honest kernel https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/847865360689397810/unk...

You were gonna try EM4 with Malphon? shadefear

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 5:59 PM

#

Fear is for the weak.

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 6:39 PM

#

indeed

#

I was thinkin like: wouldn't it be funny if I dodge cheesed em4

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 7:18 PM

#

@honest kernel I think if you wanna do that, you should try CF0 and maybe even take off UC to get more boons and HP, and then aim for Smoldering Air + Second Wind and Greater Evasion or Hyper Sprint to get your eHP multiplier up.

#

And with Smoldering Air, you'll also have Weak.

#

Ruthless Reflex would also make Greatest Reflex a stronger pick.

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 7:22 PM

#

I'd like to but I also wanted to do a plume run

#

well I'll see next try

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 7:23 PM

#

Oh right, you were going with Lambent Plume.

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 7:23 PM

#

plume doesnt even add that much dodge tbh

#

compared to how easily you get boon dodge numbers

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 7:23 PM

#

That somehow didn't enter my brain that you just naturally got Lady Athena and Lord Area. dusa

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 7:23 PM

#

lmao

#

I thought I was so lucky

#

but then not... shadegrief

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 8:19 PM

#

@honest kernel no God's Legacy and taking Zeus' Aid really hurt your chances at ME, especially with no god keepsakes.

#

Pride is still probably better for a Dodge build. But you can't really unlock more than one Duo Boon if you want to get that specific one and you're not running Legacy + god keepsakes.

#

And CF0 will let you buy Yarns easily, too.

#

You might also want to consider Abyssal Blood for even more eHP, I was just thinking.

#

Although maybe you'll be lacking DPS that way.

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 8:25 PM

#

I see

#

I figured filling up my core slots would help

#

but I did get lightning phalanx then

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 8:26 PM

#

It helps you get any Duo Boon, but it hurts your chances to get one specific Duo Boon by a lot.

#

And Call isn't priority.

#

So you don't actually need to fill it at all.

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 8:30 PM

#

thx for thd tip

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 8:43 PM

#

So I have a hell mode file but can’t get it to work by renaming it

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 8:59 PM

#

unique zephyr So I have a hell mode file but can’t get it to work by renaming it

Do you have Windows on showing the full filenames ( including .exe etc.)?

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 9:00 PM

#

waxen relic Do you have Windows on showing the full filenames ( including .exe etc.)?

I think so, if not how do I change it

waxen relic May 28, 2021, 9:00 PM

#

Dunno ask google how

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 9:07 PM

#

Ah ok. I wonder how I can get better at TD3 for 50 since I could do a TD2 pact but I do need to learn to not time out eventually

#

Seems like a lot to get better at both not dying and not dying fast

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 9:46 PM

#

Just keep practicing, I guess.

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 9:49 PM

#

I guess I’ll just use the same pact to practice, yeah

#

That sounds more appealing than trying to figure out save file stuff

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 9:50 PM

#

I guess you could turn off things like CF EM AP for practice.

#

UC.

#

Things like that.

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:05 PM

#

shy plinth The reflex of asking these questions is to soothe anxiety anyway

Yeah this is basically it

#

I think I’ll take a break for just a bit, just for my own sanity and health, I think I’ll be back though

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 10:50 PM

#

Got Hell Mode to work, yay

honest kernel May 28, 2021, 10:54 PM

#

So, more 61 heat attempts later

#

I'm really going to need a savefile for EM4. Taking too many dumb hits

#

https://gyazo.com/6949adb2dea515bbd5ffdffe6563a68e Also funny AP2 moment

Gyazo

#

3-sacked, didn't have the time after that

pseudo kernel May 28, 2021, 11:03 PM

#

Epic

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 11:12 PM

#

@unique zephyr there's nothing wrong with recognizing "this is too hard for me right now" and doing other things in the game if you want to keep playing but get frustrated with 50 Heat.

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 11:14 PM

#

mossy zinc <@266732686838595606> there's nothing wrong with recognizing "this is too hard f...

Yeah, I still have 24 x 32 and 6 x 40 (sword is left though, I am having a rough time with 40 heat sword but not as rough as 50 heat)

#

and maybe I could try speedrunning for fun

#

i've never tested how fast I can go in an any heat context

#

I'm not sure how people are able to be so fast in terms of room clears

#

I know all the pact stuff and "speedrun tech" but not the actual speedrunning rooms and bosses part, do I learn just by diving in?

mossy zinc May 28, 2021, 11:15 PM

#

Start with just getting your PBs lower little by little.

unique zephyr May 28, 2021, 11:54 PM

#

Ah ok. How much does speedrunning skill transfer into high heat skill?

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 12:06 AM

#

67%.

#

I dunno lol.

#

It will help.

#

You'll get better at killing every enemy type fast and without taking damage.

#

And you'll better understand how get strong builds more consistently.

pseudo kernel May 29, 2021, 12:13 AM

#

mossy zinc 67%.

2% away from 69% smh

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 12:14 AM

#

There's a margin of error of +-2%. dusa

pseudo kernel May 29, 2021, 12:17 AM

#

Lmao

bright mango May 29, 2021, 12:22 AM

#

unique zephyr Ah ok. How much does speedrunning skill transfer into high heat skill?

Honestly as much as you want to implement it

#

You could probably speedrun for like 100’s of hours and still not use any of that for high heat

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 1:09 AM

#

I don't think you could.

#

Fundamentals are fundamentals.

bright mango May 29, 2021, 2:35 AM

#

Speedrunning doesn’t give you much knowledge about enemy movements or dodging. What it does do is give you knowledge of weapon mechanics etc. you can choose not to implement those in high heat. I’m not saying that a lot of people do it, but it is possible

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 2:50 AM

#

I don’t think I’ll go past 40 heat right now, any higher just isn’t fun to me

#

My friend noticed my pain increasing above 40 heat

#

Routine Inspection sucks, pseudo was right about RI2

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:00 AM

#

bright mango Speedrunning doesn’t give you much knowledge about enemy movements or dodging. W...

Nah it definitely gives you knowledge of that if you want to get any good times. I don't really know why you would say it doesn't.

#

There's a reason all the top speedrunners can very quickly pick up on very high heats. They know the enemies and they know their weapons.

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:01 AM

#

I think I have the most fun at 32-40 right now and I’ll see how fun any heat is

#

That’s interesting about speed runners

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:01 AM

#

For me, any heat is fun until you get to the point where you have to reset over and over to beat any of your PBs.

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:01 AM

#

I know a speed runner who only took a day to get 50 heat

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:01 AM

#

Exactly.

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:02 AM

#

He said it was partly because he was lucky but he also said speed running Beowulf for hundreds of hours helped him get 50 heat quickly

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:03 AM

#

Enemy behavior doesn't change at high heat.

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:03 AM

#

He did first run too (before 50 I think)

#

I wonder if that helped him and how much

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:03 AM

#

You'd only have to adjust to Speeders, really, and that's a quick adjustment to make tbh.

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:04 AM

#

Do speedrunners always use FO2

#

Or sometimes FO1

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:04 AM

#

Sometimes FO1 like for Beowulf typically.

#

Mostly FO2.

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:05 AM

#

Why beo?

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:05 AM

#

Just easier to group them up for your Dragon Rush, I guess.

bright mango May 29, 2021, 3:09 AM

#

I’m not saying that speedrunning doesn’t help for heat. Its just that you have to use the knowledge you learned in speedrunning to be successful in high heat. No speedrunner can go into high heat with no care for dodging enemies etc because they will die

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:26 AM

#

Isn’t getting hit a time loss?

#

Especially with high confidence

#

Popping death defiance is an RTA time loss too right (not sure if in game time)

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:29 AM

#

It's an IGT loss, too, because it interrupts you and stuff.

#

And yeah, you don't really want to get hit to keep up High Confidence.

#

Some minor damage is fine, though.

bright mango May 29, 2021, 3:44 AM

#

Yeah but you don’t go out of your way to not get hit lol

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 3:56 AM

#

I mean you kinda do though. thanthink

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 4:08 AM

#

I'm not saying I'd throw away a really good offensive set-up to avoid damage, but I'd definitely delay a damage cycle 3 or 4 seconds to avoid eating big damage.

#

You let Asterius spin, don't you?

shy plinth May 29, 2021, 4:09 AM

#

We're talking speedrun?

#

Unless you're doing 32 speedruns asterius doesn't spin

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 4:10 AM

#

Yeah, I only speedrun 32 Heat, and extremely casually at that.

#

But the broader point is that there's absolutely times even in speedruns where you wait for something to finish its animation because trying to facetank it just isn't worth it.

#

We all look out for Hades' spins, don't we?

true fable May 29, 2021, 4:16 AM

#

if you watch 185 in or tounisus runs theyll often bait enemies into groups to finish them more efficiently

#

you cant do that without an understanding of enemy behavior

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 4:20 AM

#

Though I think last time I ran I was using Mew's 32 Heat setup which doesn't use EM3.

solar maple May 29, 2021, 7:14 AM

#

I remember duunk0 being asked what someone new to speedrunning should do to improve

#

The thing he emphasized the most is learning all the enemy patterns

#

Though tbf some patterns are high heat exclusive, which speedrunning won't help with, like em3, various bp garbage, etc

#

Also lol ill keep dpsing asterius during spin in beo 50 heat speedies sometimes

true fable May 29, 2021, 7:20 AM

#

i do that lol

#

just rush in its fine

#

you eat one swing at most

#

🙂

solar maple May 29, 2021, 7:20 AM

#

Yeh

#

Especially with patty

#

The fight is usually super fast anyway, and if you have a meg you might as well

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 7:43 AM

#

solar maple Though tbf some patterns are high heat exclusive, which speedrunning won't help ...

BP enemy behavior is exactly the same, just Speeders are much faster.

#

But their behavior isn't any different.

solar maple May 29, 2021, 7:44 AM

#

to an extent. You still have to learn things like how cloners work and when to expect shifters to teleport

#

but mostly yeah

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 7:49 AM

#

Shifters don't even know when they themselves teleport. BP perks are just passives they completely ignore in their behavior.

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 8:03 AM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/848109104781852702/unknown.png

#

guess who got 5-sacked this time

#

its ok i realized how stupid em4 with fists is

#

no more em4

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 8:53 AM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/848121924160978954/unknown.png

#

easy 🙂

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 9:10 AM

#

@honest kernel congratulations! 💕 dusa

#

Now you know why I dislike the fight so much. squirtooh

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 9:10 AM

#

thanks friendly

#

em4 is very hateable for a few reasons tbh

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 9:12 AM

#

Honestly, I don't even like EM4 with HL0 FO0 etc.

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 9:12 AM

#

same I played through it once when it came out and that was it

#

never wanted to touch that battle again

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 9:13 AM

#

Yeah.

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 9:16 AM

#

on low heat its just very long+boring

#

on high heat its just too hard for me

#

no inbetween

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 9:19 AM

#

It's so absurdly anti melee, too.

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 9:20 AM

#

I'd argue that the game tends to dunk on melee anyway esp with heat

#

but this is a huge cherry on top yea

mossy zinc May 29, 2021, 9:21 AM

#

If that's the cherry, it's way larger than the cake lol.

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 9:25 AM

#

🍒

halcyon flame May 29, 2021, 10:08 AM

#

🧁

#

it is way larger

edgy arrow May 29, 2021, 12:02 PM

#

lmao been a while since i played the game, decided to give nem 40 another shot and got it first try

#

the secret to success is not practising at all for ages apparently

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 12:04 PM

#

👌

honest kernel May 29, 2021, 12:54 PM

#

solar maple Though tbf some patterns are high heat exclusive, which speedrunning won't help ...

A bit late to the conversation here, but I'll give in some input. I've had the opportunity to guide an anyheat runner for their first few 32 heat runs, as well as being able to see how well they'd do in their first few attempts. They were already doing pretty well when it came to being fast and dodging enemies. Didn't matter if they chunked you for a billion damage, he was already aware of what they'd do. It's the moment that high heat exclusive things like EM3 and BP came along that he started to get his butt handed to him. A few runs later, and he manages pretty well, and he gets monster times. BigPTheGoat, or BigP for short, is the name of that player, whom, as far as I know, has a 7:41 IGT PB on 32 heat.

#

It's no 50 heat or anything, but I'd say going from no experience with anything heat related to being a beast at 32 heat in relatively no time does mean there's a good chunk of game knowledge being transferred over

#

That's without saying things about players like Ananke or Dunnk0 who are known for being top anyheat runners, yet do pretty darn well in high heat too, to name a few others

true fable May 29, 2021, 1:12 PM

#

tounis also managed 50 heat beo and hestia without too much issue

solemn pulsar May 29, 2021, 3:51 PM

#

lili also popped out that 52 heat hestia for the barrel roll

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:52 PM

#

I hope my high heat play experience will be at least slightly helpful for any heat speedrunning

#

I do know I have a LOT to learn though

solemn pulsar May 29, 2021, 3:52 PM

#

just remember to pause once the doors unlock

#

so you dont spend game time making a choice

#

if you dont do that already

unique zephyr May 29, 2021, 3:53 PM

#

Oh I do that

#

With TD3

bright mango May 29, 2021, 4:08 PM

#

Don’t overthink it bacchus and just have fun playing the game squirtyay

narrow carbon May 30, 2021, 4:54 AM

#

Finished 6x40! Now trying 45 heat. Had Twin Shot start with Zag bow, but AP2 pulled out all the stops to brick the run (replaced Divine Dash with Passion Dash and forced Rare Crop, in Styx) shadedisgruntled

true fable May 30, 2021, 5:04 AM

#

good ish

#

zag bow hard

#

AP2 isnt super necessary imo

narrow carbon May 30, 2021, 5:34 AM

#

Yeah, I’m going back to AP1/0 and trying a different aspect. I can only do Zag bow at high heat if I have a Twin Shot start

shy plinth May 30, 2021, 5:51 AM

#

Zag bow+explosive is pretty great too

narrow carbon May 30, 2021, 5:52 AM

#

I actually got Explosive in Elysium that run (no Patty though)

true fable May 30, 2021, 6:06 AM

#

triple is also good

#

so is flurry

narrow carbon May 30, 2021, 6:26 AM

#

Yeah, I just find Twin Shot >>> others, but I also have more practice with Twin (I don’t have good positioning with Triple yet)