h1-high-heat-strategies

[gaunt fiber]

https://imgur.com/IZpM58K

Look at this

** S P I N**

[mossy zinc]

@gaunt fiber are you just trying random builds at 40+ now or what's the plan?

[gaunt fiber]

well

I'm trying to win at 40 with what I can get

Sometimes it's stupid

But it's fun

[mossy zinc]

What are you starting with?

[gaunt fiber]

Divine dash

[toxic token]

from 20 to 32 should I be using Chiron or Hera?

[mossy zinc]

So you've gone over to the dark side.

Chiron and Hera are both good. Just pick your personal favorite.

[gaunt fiber]

Don't get me wrong

Eternal rose is my favorite start

But then the runs are quite similar

And I want to be able to win regardless of the hammer. Divine dash being always good, I get to encounter more random builds

[toxic token]

alright then Hera is more fun so ill just do Hera

[gaunt fiber]

But it's acorn asphodel so not really

[mossy zinc]

Yes, really. Using the techniques I've taught you, but for dark purposes.

[gaunt fiber]

Ok, fine!

I'll keep eternal rose

but it will be crush shot only start

[mossy zinc]

Nice.

Crush Shot is the best cast.

[gaunt fiber]

My winrate is going to decrease

I doubted it was possible

[rain sedge]

heres a general advice for chiron

#h1-high-heat-strategies message

[gaunt fiber]

Maybe AP2 is the way to git gud

[true fable]

i cant figure out which spear is the most tolerable

i think i might just take signet on zag spear and reset for flurry jab lol

[gaunt fiber]

Might as well do that for GY and charged skewer

way more powerful

[true fable]

doubt

[gaunt fiber]

Not kidding

[toxic token]

@rain sedge thank you so much

[true fable]

i think that weapon just doesnt jive with me

[toxic token]

even though I wouldnt like to follow a full guide and I would like to do it myself

[true fable]

someone thanking schad

[gaunt fiber]

https://imgur.com/6YWoC0p

crush shot doing work

[rain sedge]

achilles zeus cast is fun until 32

[rain sedge]

r00d

I'm a very helpful casual ok

[sly remnant]

i think achilles zeus cast can go up to 40 but after that it does really struggle

[rain sedge]

yeah. I remember that achilles zeus 40

it can go to 40. Whether it's fun or not is a different story

like it's not as bad as the shield and sword run but still unfun

[sly remnant]

mmm

with CF0 tech i think its fine

[rain sedge]

it might be that I am bad thop

[sly remnant]

and i think you can actually take TD3 on achilles spear

[true fable]

@rain sedge i did achilles already

[rain sedge]

bright .

[true fable]

just trying to figure out the rest of the spears

[rain sedge]

are you doing 40 all weapons .

cus, I'm just doing 32 all weapons and I'd feel bad .

[true fable]

40 all aspects just missing spears

[rain sedge]

goddamn what a chad

[true fable]

:^) sorry schad time for a casual player to do 40 heat all aspects

[rain sedge]

no. I remembered my 40 clears.

I'm not good enough to play 40 for some of the worse aspects

[true fable]

doesnt feel half as bad now

[rain sedge]

like I dont even wanna think about hwo I'm gonna do zag sword and nemesis 32

I might reroll until I get double edge tbh

[true fable]

the nice thing about nem is i think it can do TD3 pretty well regardless of many other modifiers

[sly remnant]

i'm pretty sure almost any aspect is fine with TD3 at 32 heat

just take the speedrunning pact

[true fable]

oh i mean up to like mid 40s i think it would still be fine

[sly remnant]

on nemesis? i think yea

nemesis also has the issue of....not having many pacts it likes past 40 heat

so you gotta TD3

[gaunt fiber]

why

rooms do not end in Elysium

it was 5 waves

[true fable]

@rain sedge i honestly think someone will get 60 heat before i get GY 40

[sly remnant]

mmmm. with nemesis if you get to elysium you probably have damage out the butt

[true fable]

thats my thought too

ive started to really rate hunters mark

[sly remnant]

WHAT

[rain sedge]

GY 40 was pretty free for me

just roll for charged skewer

[rain sedge]

this is a weirdchamp

[true fable]

helps a lot of weapons that cannot do TD3 do TD3 very easily

[sly remnant]

did you edit

[true fable]

room clear speed probably decreases about 10-20s per room if youre abusing it correctly

no

[sly remnant]

i coulda swore i saw hate

then we agree

hunter's mark is insane

i just misread it

yea i try to always fit mark in

[true fable]

its gotten to the point where if im starting deadly strike i'll roll second artemis for it

[sly remnant]

same

[rain sedge]

wtf

[sly remnant]

what if i told you could have a guaranteed crit almost every other hit

[rain sedge]

I guess none of the 32 so far worked with hunters mark

[gaunt fiber]

oh it's allowed

[true fable]

what is

[gaunt fiber]

Proxy allows it I mean

[true fable]

oh gotcha

[rain sedge]

the zeus shield run is quite fun

I see why baj loves this shield now

[rain sedge]

damn the baj shield is so good

might be the easiest shield clear out of them all

astaos stop

[toxic token]

baj shield?

[sly remnant]

zeus shield

but baj plays it a lot/is the best at it

[toxic token]

so you just call it baj shield for the meme or is it a build?

[sly remnant]

meme

[fathom cloud]

I'm not sold on GY yet. Fat crits on Deadly Flourish are nice, but I'm still slow with it overall, I probably need to watch some runs to learn the rotations.

[gaunt fiber]

I've got some spicy 40 heat mirrorless if you want

[fathom cloud]

Checking it out, thanks

[gaunt fiber]

It's not fast but the run is ok gameplay wise

If anything just ask

[fathom cloud]

I tried a similar build for my previous run, but with Artemis instead of Aprhodite, and no charged skewer because RNG. When do you prioritize spins? Also, is Athena attack something you aimed for, or just had to pick up?

[gaunt fiber]

Artemis special is really good, but given the setup I value weak more than damage (and Aphro is still ahead if you don't have T2 boons from Artemis or their duo). Athena is really nice because it makes your spin deflect. I don't really aim for it tho. I like Deadly strike, Frost strike, Divine strike in general

or Heartbreak strike with Deadly flourish of course

but that's a charged skewer setup I'd say

[fathom cloud]

Do you always go in with a special build + charged skewer in mind?

[gaunt fiber]

I spin when I can basically. Like melee enemies that don't jump around, or between waves spawn

Not at all, it's not realistic

Spin hammers are also really good, so is serrated point

[fathom cloud]

Yeah because I was stuck with breaching skewer which wasn't terrible but... eh

[gaunt fiber]

It's just that charged skewer + one special boon can clear any run

Breaching is good when combined with charged skewer but otherwise not really yeah

[fathom cloud]

Not sure if I'm forcing things too much if I wait till mid Asphodel to even get an attack boon

[gaunt fiber]

It can work

[dapper quiver]

If I don't get an epic attack boon after a couple of chances I usually take a rare one

[true fable]

i think i dont use special as much as i should

or i dash strike more than i should

[gaunt fiber]

Special -> dash strike -> dash strike

[true fable]

cat7 rolling for rarity is a fool's errabd

[gaunt fiber]

Most dps combo

[true fable]

i do that but get hit too much

[gaunt fiber]

better with divine dash since it's risky

[fathom cloud]

Yeah but I avoided Poseidon, Dio etc. attack no matter the rarity. I'm not sure if I have the wrong approach here.

[true fable]

need to play safer i think and just special sometimes

dio attack is not bad

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah you should avoid poseidon, but dio can be decent actually

[fathom cloud]

Any other "avoids"? I'm quite happy with Ares / Athena / Aprho / Arty, but have been generally avoiding the others (will try Demeter going forward)

[dapper quiver]

I don't reroll for rarity, I save my rolls for Chaos

[gaunt fiber]

GY basic attack is also really strong.

[fathom cloud]

Hence why I've been avoiding Dio and Zeus

[gaunt fiber]

I'd just say serrated point is kinda risky at high heat (Hades fight mostly)

[fathom cloud]

and Poseidon

[gaunt fiber]

I like Poseidon call a lot

[true fable]

you save rerolls for UC if youre running Uc

[gaunt fiber]

Starting owl pendant with ME in mind is also ok. Ares attack is always good and you can go for charged skewer after that. Or whatever hammer

Learning to spin is quite important I'd say, it deals a lot of damage

when your build is lacking boons

[fathom cloud]

Wait did damage also change after 1.0? I'm on Switch

[lusty mirage]

in that way it kinda seems like nemesis

[gaunt fiber]

actually yeah lol

[gaunt fiber]

Nah, it's just powerful as it is

[lusty mirage]

Zeus GY can be decent

[fathom cloud]

That... doesn't sound right to me intuitively, due to the slow attacks. Enlighten me?

[gaunt fiber]

I like Zeus aid but that's it

I tried Zeus attack, it was not that much fun lol

[lusty mirage]

well opens up a lot of utility and duos

[gaunt fiber]

Since Aphrodite is incredible you can fish for smoldering air too yeah

[lusty mirage]

zeus cast is fine too

[gaunt fiber]

sometimes a call will just carry you if you're not confident in your hammers

[fathom cloud]

As an aside: your insta-room clear in Tartarus on that 40 mirrorless GY is hilarious

[lusty mirage]

i'd probably view zeus kinda like ares through the GY lens. good utility

[gaunt fiber]

I loved it too lmao

I see some yellow thing, insta special boom

[fathom cloud]

Hmm but Ares is really nice for weaving into your special-dash-dash rotation

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah it's good

[fathom cloud]

whereas that would get you two instances of Zeus

[lusty mirage]

i have been playing AP2 with GY to get practice with various style

[gaunt fiber]

I don't like it very much

When I want to practice I just don't pick charged skewer or serrated

[lusty mirage]

hehe fair. i'm kinda weird in liking AP2 style (adapt)

[gaunt fiber]

Today I faced lernie with mistral dash and crush shot

I like the ida tho

but sometimes you get nothing lol

[fathom cloud]

Today Lernie crushed my 32 attempts with consecutive 26 damage head slams

[gaunt fiber]

I hate that attack

[dapper quiver]

I`d rather take anything other than AP2

[gaunt fiber]

Also, if you start with owl pendant, you can consider going acorn for asphodel

(thanks Nyaanyaa)

[fathom cloud]

I am hating Lernie more and more these days, there's so little room to dodge and those head slams are the worst

[rain sedge]

tbh, one of the biggest things I've learned about high heat is when to back off and wait instead of trying to DPS

[honest kernel]

I've been going tooth in Aspho

[rain sedge]

I died at lernie a LOT during my 50 attempts. Then I kinda learned to watch his animation, and literally just afk util he's done head slamming

[gaunt fiber]

Lernie is a good boss to spin on btw

[fathom cloud]

That's good advice, especially now that I've turned off TD3. How the hell do people do this with TD3.

[gaunt fiber]

I used to run TD3

[rain sedge]

GY isnt the best TD3 weapon

same advice goes for dad btw

[gaunt fiber]

but it's not good for the heart and if you don't get serrated or skewer your run is dead

[rain sedge]

know when you can go in and dps, and when you should dodge literally to the other side of the screen

stop this TD3 hate

all my 32 aspects so far still use TD3 iirc

[gaunt fiber]

I like it

but with GY you better be ready to time out

depends on the heat ofc

I cleared 40 with it but it was charged skewer so

[rain sedge]

Im not talking about 40

some aspects are just not TD3 save at 40

but at 32 there's no reason you shouldn't save 3 heat from TD3

even if you have to take chaos gate/skip trials/skip shops to it

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah I agree

[rain sedge]

that 3 heat is so good

[dapper quiver]

I lost a run cause I took TD2 and EM4

Maybe I just don`t have the speedrun strats

[gaunt fiber]

EM4 is hard

I would not take it even at 45

[dapper quiver]

Yeah Ive started to realize it`s a run killer

[gaunt fiber]

there are a lot of EM3 50 clears too

[lusty mirage]

heh AP2 EM4 is a tough challenge at only 15 heat

[dapper quiver]

I really like the EM4 fight though, it`s fun and challenging

[lusty mirage]

but yeah best to have TD one notch easier than you're used to if doing EM4

[honest kernel]

I've been attempting 45 chiron and I keep timing out again

in Elysium

[gaunt fiber]

Have you seen that korean guy run?

[honest kernel]

Yeah, I asked about it just yesterday

with the doom

maybe I should try that out

I haven't taken DC for chiron before

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah DC seemed bad ngl

[honest kernel]

Is RI still a no no at 45?

[gaunt fiber]

I would not take it

it hurts consistency a lot

I'd take AP1 before for sure

[honest kernel]

yeah I got AP1

it hurts

[gaunt fiber]

it hurts but you still have rolls and dark foresight

[honest kernel]

that's fair

[true fable]

the korean guy is so good

his stream was very interesting to say the least

[gaunt fiber]

I want to be good

[rain sedge]

me too buddy

[wild fiber]

real

[lusty mirage]

just because nyaa rags on you doesn't mean you aren't good

[daring hedge]

mirrorless 40 GY is very good what are you talking about

[gaunt fiber]

Nah, Nyaanyaa is a huge help

You guys are so nice

[gaunt fiber]

I guess I just always want more then. Still making stupid mistakes and stuff

[lusty mirage]

keep it up and work on specific things, deliberate practice

[rain sedge]

what's your goal anyway astaos

[gaunt fiber]

No matter what I do I come back to Guan Yu

[gaunt fiber]

No idea

[sly remnant]

getting better is a perfectly acceptable goal

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah I'll stick to that lol

[lusty mirage]

nobody can scoop it from you heh

[sly remnant]

but yes you don't need a 50 heat clear, a speed record or anything

you are a goo dplayer

and if someone is learning guan yu

they should absolutely watch your vods

[gaunt fiber]

I'll do 50 for sure

[sly remnant]

if you want it do it

[gaunt fiber]

It's a pretty number

But there's a thing I don't have really that bothers me

Something like "game sense"

[sly remnant]

wdym

[gaunt fiber]

Mostly about builds, how to adapt, to foresee things

Having a plan

[lusty mirage]

watch bablo a lot heh

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah I do

He's amazing

[lusty mirage]

i learn something every time i tune in

[true fable]

i have a game plan with terrible execution

combined we could probably do at least 3 heat astaos

[mossy zinc]

Dat's bars.

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah I know

[true fable]

i dont think my choices are bad but my gameplay is quite lacking

especially on spears

[gaunt fiber]

I'm a poet

Lemme dream Bright

Btw streaming to record runs is the best choice I've made

[mossy zinc]

Are you talking about intuition or strategy? Very different things.

[gaunt fiber]

It hurts to see me clowning but it's nice to improve

[true fable]

streaming is good

watching your own recordings is always good

so you can cringe

[gaunt fiber]

This

[true fable]

the moment in my 9:02 beowulf when i go into styx shop

[gaunt fiber]

Different indeed but I lack both lmao

[true fable]

biggest mistake of my hades playing experience thus far

what do you mean by intuition nyaanyaa?

[gaunt fiber]

I need to watch that

[true fable]

i would have sub 9 if i werent a coward

alas i am a coward

[sly remnant]

ye i watched your 32 heat vod bright

why were you worried about hades

[true fable]

good q

[sly remnant]

dude was never gonna be able to stand up

[true fable]

all good questions lol

i dont have a good answer

[sly remnant]

lmao

well

[true fable]

there is time to be saved fosho

[rain sedge]

achilles 32 done

just zag spear now

time for flurry jab

and reroll until I get it

[gaunt fiber]

Gj buddy

[rain sedge]

this 32 all aspects thing is going well

[mossy zinc]

Intuition comes from practice and experience. Strategy comes from studying the meta, hypothesis testing, and just going into uncharted territory to see how things will work out.

And sometimes just brainstorming ideas.

[gaunt fiber]

Like crush shot start?

[mossy zinc]

That's not brainstorming. I mean discussing ideas that pop into your mind.

[gaunt fiber]

(ikr)

[mossy zinc]

Actually taking it on Guan Yu would be somewhat uncharted territory.

[lusty mirage]

i've tried crush shot, can be mixed in after dash strikes that take you past enemies

[gaunt fiber]

At first I was trolling

But it's really strong

[mossy zinc]

It would help you a lot in AP runs to really study where you can go from there.

Crush Shot is great.

[gaunt fiber]

I had the demeter Boon too (Can't recall the name)

Would have been an ez PS

[lusty mirage]

nyaanyaa do you have some math worked up on GY specials? or should i just look at the pom scaling spreadsheet and puzzle it out

[gaunt fiber]

Snow burst that's it

[true fable]

snow burst is absurd

[lusty mirage]

more controversial than crush shot gy, how about trippy shot gy

[gaunt fiber]

I take it every time I see it

[gaunt fiber]

I feel like I really need infernal blood

[mossy zinc]

Terrible. That's not even a Lady Aphrodite boon.

[lusty mirage]

one thing i noticed about it is easier to get in spins

[rain sedge]

the spear hammer that gives richochet on special to 7 enemies is awful

damn

[sly remnant]

you mean you don't like having your weapon fly around the room like a spaz for 10 seconds while enemies beat on you?

[rain sedge]

yeah, didn't realise that's gonna be what's happened

[lusty mirage]

does it work with explosive launcher? i forget because GY can't have explosive

[mossy zinc]

@rain sedge have you tried Heartbreak Strike with Curse of Pain or vice versa with that hammer?

[mossy zinc]

No.

[rain sedge]

I'm already back at the house, so no

[rich pagoda]

does anyone know if chiron or rama is better for 32 heat?

[rain sedge]

my plan is another heart rend run

[rain sedge]

your first 32?

[rich pagoda]

ive tried with fists but ive only gotten past meg

[true fable]

chirons probably easier to use but if youre comfortable with rama it makes high heat very easy

[rich pagoda]

so im thinking of using rama cuz its my second best

idek why i tried using fists i just got demolished in asphodel lol

[true fable]

give it a shot

[gaunt fiber]

Can you imagine

[rich pagoda]

alrighty ty

[true fable]

rama is quite good

[gaunt fiber]

Charged Chain GY skewer

[true fable]

krey

the world would be a better place

imagine flurry jab GY

[gaunt fiber]

for sure

[gaunt fiber]

I want that

but that would be op

[true fable]

flurry jab GY would be the best weapon in the game lol

[lusty mirage]

well if flurry slash arthur was a thing it might be better

[gaunt fiber]

wait it's not possible

we're not brainstorming, get productive guys

[rain sedge]

flurry slash arthur with the speed of the normal flurry slash?

that'd be so broken

[upper edge]

Doesnt Flurry Slash set your damage to 25 anyways?

[gaunt fiber]

yeah actually

[rain sedge]

not chad then

[upper edge]

Honestly it might still be worth it if you got double edge and want to reliably dash attack

[true fable]

flurry slash and world splitter both mess with dash attack combos

[dire steppe]

you know

the description for Middle Management says “Each mini-boss encounter has +1 armored foe (or some other problem)”

but the first clause applies to literally not a single one of the minibosses

inferno bombers is +2 armored foes, most of the bosses just get more hp and stuff

[honest kernel]

also sneak maybe?

[dire steppe]

is the regular sneak not armored

i haven’t played a game with mm off ever

[honest kernel]

the regular doesnt summon ringers right

cmiiw

[dire steppe]

oh maybe but that’s not +1

[honest kernel]

ah

[dire steppe]

it can summon multiple

[true fable]

regular sneak is armored

[honest kernel]

what about the styx minibosses

aren't they normally just one

[dire steppe]

hmm i don’t remember styx minibosses stuff

maybe it is true for them

[lusty mirage]

yeah i think styx might just be 1 extra armored

[true fable]

styx get 1 more random armored

[gaunt fiber]

You get wringers for Sneak but they're not armored

[dire steppe]

If i had my way the sneak’s projectiles would work like hades skulls and they spawn wringers when lifespan expires

[true fable]

good thing you dont have your way

[dire steppe]

can’t forget the new chaos curse: Slain enemies toss an Inferno Bomber at you

[rain sedge]

nemesis 32 build is just a typical heart rend stuff right?

[true fable]

sure

or DR

[rain sedge]

I thought DR requires you to actually deflect an attack?

[true fable]

it does

it's still good

I went DR for both my 32 and 40 heat nem clears

[rain sedge]

my dash strikes is hard to control

I think I'm kinda bad with sword

what's the tip bright? dash strike and just use controller to move around enemies?

[true fable]

using controller LUL

um

yeah i think so?

from what ive heard

kbm you can aim the strikes

controller i believe you just hope it autotargets

iirc you can dash strike directly north south to make things easier for you

[thorny coral]

Yeah, Nem on controller you wanna go back and forth on them to keep hitting

It can be rough, takes work to really get down

[rain sedge]

yeah, this has been the experience so far

thanks friends

it's been good so far, I feel like a retrash

[north dove]

sooooo... as it turns out CP2 is not the right play https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/599449585710006288/788533006712438824/unknown.png

[rain sedge]

talking about playing nemesis

[north dove]

maybe I should try shackle start CF1 JS2 CP1 with TD3

cause JS3 CP2 makes TD2 feel like the wrong choice

[rain sedge]

did you time out?

[north dove]

almost but not quite

but bosses took so much longer to kill

[sly remnant]

ye

how bad is DC on nemesis? i've never played it at high heat

[north dove]

not bad at all

[sly remnant]

damn its a shame you cant drop CP entirely

[north dove]

Yup, hell mode is not feeling like an upside right now

[sly remnant]

you could try dropping AP2 for TD3 and trying to get a good build going

but....that has other risks

[somber leaf]

woah. SD is DIFFERENT! died in Tartarus

[rain sedge]

here we go with the heart rend denial again

[somber leaf]

that never happens haha

[rain sedge]

my streak was 17

not sure if I wanna count this run, already 3 denial

but sure, offer me crystal clarity for the meme beam that I was gonna sell

[sly remnant]

get glacial glare and afk your way to victory

[rain sedge]

it's a common lv1 meme beam in a nemesis run

[sly remnant]

sounds like quitter talk to me

[true fable]

@north dove have you considered resetting for dedge or is that just too miserable

[north dove]

too miserable

[sly remnant]

resetting for AP2 dedge is gonna be...an experience

[true fable]

ive been liking nem a lot lately so i want to try it on 45+

[north dove]

but I reset if I get cursed slash/flurry slash or dash nova

[true fable]

just not sure when the usual deadly strike build begins to falm off

gotcha

[rain sedge]

piercing wave, cursed slash, or cruel thrust on nemesis?

already ahve double edge

[north dove]

piercing

[rain sedge]

thanks senpai

[sly remnant]

what about just doing

JS1 CP1

i think you are good enough to move through biomes without the help of gold

[north dove]

yeah I guess so

[sly remnant]

but you are way better than me

you know what it feels like

[north dove]

a few of my 45 heat runs got under the deadline with random builds on JS1 CP1 but I'm not sure how much Routine Inspection will affect my overall strength

[honest kernel]

no Dark Foresight, no Rolls

At RI2, no extra health or gold

[sly remnant]

you're gonna have a bad time

idk

playing sword at that heat is rough

[honest kernel]

RI3, no dash/casts aren't really investable

[sly remnant]

but if anyone is gonna figure it out its probably you

[rain sedge]

the prospect of having a 57 heat clear on sword is quite scary

alright, that's 20 heart rend rolls I've missed in a row with god's legacy

that's pretty impressive

[true fable]

piercing wave, breaching slash, and dedge are the only actual nemesis hammers

RI3 nemesis sounds like high hell

do not want

:^(

[sly remnant]

yea playing nemesis with one dash sounds....not fun

[true fable]

title: i get tricked into playing first run

[rain sedge]

I have a big brain zag spear strat

zeus attack and special

[true fable]

hit me

ok

what next

[rain sedge]

because right now it's like

[somber leaf]

woah yeah I suck at SD so hard haha

[rain sedge]

if I dont get flurry jab it's super annoying

[true fable]

paulg it takes some getting used to

how's shield

[somber leaf]

aphrodite cast is fun!

[rain sedge]

do you know the suicide strat

[somber leaf]

that build was nice but I died horribly to Meg haha

where you make sure to die to go back to 30%?

[rain sedge]

yea do it before every room if you need it

do you know about the athena extra DD

[gaunt fiber]

I tried PS on GY with Aphro/ Athena curse

[somber leaf]

I assume Athena doesn't do anything? or do you get 1 DD for your first death?

[rain sedge]

no no

[gaunt fiber]

It's huge damage and easy to apply but you have to get blinding flash. It was nice on skewer but then you don't count on heart rend anymore

[rain sedge]

that's the way we do high heat

we get spare DD

[somber leaf]

and it gets spent before SD, right?

[rain sedge]

no

ok so

you die, you lose SD right

and then you get one of the 2 athena boons that refill DD

and now you get a DD

the next room, the SD comes back

and if you die, the SD gets spent

[true fable]

^

[rain sedge]

most people at high heat basically specifically aim for that

[true fable]

so you can effectively have 1 SD and 2 DDs in one run

[rain sedge]

just dont forget to die before taking athena boon

also it's tier 2, you need 1 of her boon to get the DD boon

also bright zeus special on zag shield is definitely the way to go

[true fable]

you specifically need one of her priority boons

[rain sedge]

I got chain skewer hammer too, this is basically zag shield cosplay

[true fable]

call wont unlock DDs

[rain sedge]

I didnt know this

I thought it's any boon

[true fable]

nope

has to be strike flourish cast or dash

[rain sedge]

are you sure

[true fable]

yes

[rain sedge]

I remember haelian saying in stream sure footing triggers it

[true fable]

hmm i know for sure call does not

i can check sure footing when i get home

[rain sedge]

what do you mean "for sure"

[somber leaf]

!? woah

so I just need a good Tartarus and then can be invincible haha

[rain sedge]

if I can get cucked out of heart rend 20 times you can get cucked of DD after getting call

[true fable]

but id be very surprised if sure footing counted

by sure i mean the codex lists it

[sly remnant]

i'm almost certain

[true fable]

athenas aid does not count for DDs last time i checked codex

[sly remnant]

its only attack special cast dash

i'm like

99.99% certain

[rain sedge]

I have codex open right now and it says no requirement

but we know that's wrong

ok, so if I throw this run to test that

[sly remnant]

check the other DD

[rain sedge]

what do I get

both say no requirement

switch tho, might be outdated

[sly remnant]

OH WAIT

YOU ON SWITCH

[rain sedge]

yep

[sly remnant]

sec let me boot up hades

[rain sedge]

lemme change my name actually

for the extra salt

[somber leaf]

oh. next purple weapon is spear, any advice for a relatively smooth 32 heat spear run? Hades is my strongest

[rain sedge]

get serrated edge if you're a chad

get explosive launcher and press special for 20 minutes if you're a simp

[gaunt fiber]

be careful when spinning

do short spins

Deadly strike and you're set

[sly remnant]

yep

you can only get athena DD's

from attack special cast dash

[rain sedge]

@gaunt fiber ur making me look bad for giving troll answers

[true fable]

i beat zag shield by abusing pulverizing + mino

didnt need zeus special

just went DR

[gaunt fiber]

well you were right

Serrated is not easy

[somber leaf]

I find serrated deals me al ot of damage, it does a lot but at high heat I don't trust it

[rain sedge]

and this is always has been, yea

so it's not like it's different in switch

[true fable]

serrated is really good but yeah will get you killed

ive died twice in a row now to dad with serrated

you kind of have to take it if you arent offered exploding launcher though imo

[rain sedge]

it's 32, big boy can take it

[true fable]

otherwise your damage will be quite poor

[sly remnant]

yea i am pretty sure its just wrong

sorry :/

[rain sedge]

@somber leaf with serrated, the artemis bonus attack on dash strike and your attack boon stacks

[rain sedge]

it's fine thanks for info

[true fable]

id still want athena dash on 32 if im running serrated

a bad BP2 room will end your run

chaos dash strike is good though

[rain sedge]

as I said, chad strategy

full offensive

ah tis got me good

she was at 10% HP, I was arrogant thinking I could get the attack before her

[gaunt fiber]

dying in tartarus weirdch

jk happened the run before

still a dangerous place

[sly remnant]

95% of my 50+ runs

end in tartarus

and another 3%

end in first room of asphodel

[gaunt fiber]

interesting

[rain sedge]

toxic D:

[sly remnant]

TD3 does this to you

[gaunt fiber]

Elysium is my usual grave

[rain sedge]

I wish there's a stat that shows where you die

[gaunt fiber]

More like

[somber leaf]

yaeh, Elysium and Redacted 😛

[rain sedge]

I think mine is tartarus for sure

[gaunt fiber]

I feel like the more stress in Elysium

[rain sedge]

all those high heat grinds

[gaunt fiber]

I'm just afraid of those exalted

[sly remnant]

elysium gets me every now and then but its normally timer in elysium

[rain sedge]

tartarus, lernie, TD3 sac, dad, then heroes

[gaunt fiber]

who mindlessly jump at your throat

[rain sedge]

that sounds pretty right in terms of distribution tbh

[sly remnant]

once you turn on heightened security

lernie is a legit nightmare blocker

[rain sedge]

yea that 50 run at lernie

this is why delta chamber is so good

you can just watch the lava

no memes btw

[sly remnant]

if i make it out of asphodel

all i have to do is not lose to timer

[gaunt fiber]

so you remain a TD3 gamer?

[sly remnant]

i'm gonna switch soon

i just need to figure out the build

i'm doing TD3 runs right now with high confidence to get used to 50 hp

but TD2 is in fact op

[gaunt fiber]

Get used to 50 hp

[sly remnant]

but if i practice this way and happen to get a win i can be a chad who did high confidence 52 heat

[gaunt fiber]

well you can try

[north dove]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/599449585710006288/788544627942621184/unknown.png alright time to throw

[true fable]

pog

[rain sedge]

retrash

[true fable]

what the

[rain sedge]

this is the run

this is the one

[true fable]

retrash this is illegal

[sly remnant]

retrash you can do this

[rain sedge]

now all you need to do is to pray to get double edge

[sly remnant]

you have plenty of time

just focus on each room

[true fable]

retrash: thats my secret captain, i always have plenty of time

[north dove]

hoarding slash is my hammer

at least it's not detrimental

[sly remnant]

GOLDS USELESS ANYWAYS

DON'T SPEND IT

[rain sedge]

I can see it

[sly remnant]

UC is actually a buff

[rain sedge]

4k gold at styc

[sly remnant]

this is the run

[true fable]

time to get the styx side hustle

[rain sedge]

and you flex it on buying blood that you don't need

let's go retrash let's gooooo

[true fable]

actually wait

[north dove]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/599449585710006288/788545206537420860/unknown.png bruh

[true fable]

LOL cant get side hustle anymore huh

[sly remnant]

POOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

[true fable]

LETS GO

[rain sedge]

EASY

[true fable]

PURPLE BOON

[rain sedge]

LET'S GOOOOO

[gaunt fiber]

be careful not to share too much

the curse may be upon you

[sly remnant]

astaos i'm invested

this is better than "next week on yugioh"

[gaunt fiber]

ikr

[north dove]

nope died to witch circle

[sly remnant]

f

[gaunt fiber]

but it's for Retrash's sake

...

[rain sedge]

retrash noooo

[gaunt fiber]

Damn

[rain sedge]

ok

back to bright rule

[gaunt fiber]

told ya

Never

[rain sedge]

if you have a good run

dont share it here

[gaunt fiber]

Never talk about it here indeed

[rain sedge]

this channel is cursed

remember the time I got the perfect run and got 5 sacced and died with dad at 10% hp?

cus I do

that was the time bright told me never to share

[gaunt fiber]

I shared a 45 AP2 GY crush shot start earlier

[rain sedge]

what's up with the crush shot meme man

[gaunt fiber]

Charged skewer deadly strike heatbreak flourish

run died

[gaunt fiber]

apparently owl pendant start is joining the dark side

[sly remnant]

i do think we overrate athena....but she is still very good

[gaunt fiber]

Because I wanted to try something else than Eternal rose

But then if I do the runs would be the same

[true fable]

i dont think shes overrated

[gaunt fiber]

except if crush shot start

[true fable]

shes just way too good

[sly remnant]

oh she's OP for sure

[true fable]

i do think athena call is overrated though

especially with the nerf

[sly remnant]

i'm not saying she's OP

*she's not OP

she is def OP

but i think sometimes we deviate out of our way too much for her

i remember i used to take effin owl into elysium sometimes

that was incorrect

[true fable]

yeah that feels wrong

but why not just take owl into asphodel?

[gaunt fiber]

Aspho is Acorn

welcome to the real world

[true fable]

i still think owl pendant start is the most accurate for GY just SO you can take aspho corn

[gaunt fiber]

well

[true fable]

since you die to lernie in 2 hits otherwise

[gaunt fiber]

yeah lmao

[sly remnant]

and i don't think you should ever take owl into tartarus unless you are streaking

[gaunt fiber]

But I think Acorn at Lernie makes me worse at the fight

and I was pretty good

But I died

[true fable]

i dont think it's a bad idea for GY

[gaunt fiber]

and now I don't

[sly remnant]

rules are different for GY

[gaunt fiber]

same game but not really

[sly remnant]

there's like two sides of the spectrum in hades

and GY and beo are on opposite ends

[true fable]

agreed

[sly remnant]

and neither one of them can even see each other

[true fable]

cannot wrap my head around this cursed weapon

i dont get why yall think it's the best spear

[sly remnant]

its legit baffling to me

but yall make it work

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah Beo is cursed

[true fable]

😠

[rain sedge]

GY's entire thing is literally that it's cursed, that you have half HP

[gaunt fiber]

no

The weapon is so heavy

that Zag wastes some vital strenght wielding it

[sly remnant]

😠

[gaunt fiber]

"but then why Arthur blabla"

Because Excalibur is blessed

[rain sedge]

+hp = blessed

[sly remnant]

sword of promised victory

[rain sedge]

-hp = ???

not cursed according to astaos

[gaunt fiber]

that reasoning is biased

Look

GY can prolly reach higher heats than Arthur won't you say?

[sly remnant]

i....think i agree with that

[gaunt fiber]

not cursed

[sly remnant]

seeded it definitely can

unseeded.....idk

[true fable]

this is

uh

https://imgur.com/1M5GIjJ

interesting

to say the least

[gaunt fiber]

cursed

rip

[north dove]

wow too bad it's not the other way around

[true fable]

[rain sedge]

im also on zag spear run

my build does not work looks like

[true fable]

hmm

[rain sedge]

got flurry jab but

it's only a lv1 artemis attack

and lacking damage

the other one is special with exploding launcher with zeus

and no other complementary boon

might time out tbh

[sly remnant]

oof

[gaunt fiber]

exploding thunder pog

[sly remnant]

TD3 is weird. its like....super good from 32-40....and then just plummets off a cliff not long after 40 and at 40 for some weapons

[rain sedge]

im only at 32 heat

it's fine, this run is especially unlucky

the other runs have been fine

[true fable]

this is just GY but better different

[sly remnant]

i think my next project is

all weapons at 40 heat with EM4

to make me better at the fight

[gaunt fiber]

That's

a good idea

[sly remnant]

note: thats all weapons not all aspects

i ain't doin no 40 heat GY EM4

[gaunt fiber]

ah

yeah

[shy plinth]

I wanted to see hera bow

[rain sedge]

my project is

[sly remnant]

hera bow is v good at the fight

[rain sedge]

32 all aspects then I retire

that's it

I'm super close

[gaunt fiber]

you won't retire

you're here forever

[sly remnant]

ye i be tyou won't either

"There is no escape"

[shy plinth]

Woah hera bow is good at EM4?

TIL

[solemn pulsar]

I said that for 32 heat for all weapons

Then for sub 10 for all weapons

Then for 40 heat for all weapons

[gaunt fiber]

I'll try sub 10 GY I think

[sly remnant]

hera has good burst damage and decent range. why wouldn't it be decent at the EM4 fight?

its no beowulf

but its solid

[daring hedge]

good burst provided you get a decent cast

and not lv. 2 true shot like i did

[sly remnant]

sure but its 40 heat

casts are still fine at that heat

[rain sedge]

"fine" is a strong word

[sly remnant]

?

don't take CF or AP

[rain sedge]

like

my cast runs at 40 was some of the most miserable times I've had

beowulf doesnt count btw

also this zag spear run might be saved, got splitting bolt at the end of elysium

[sly remnant]

Pog

but i mean

with no CF and i probably won't run UC either

i shouldn't have issues getting a good cast

i'm not streaking i just want to practice EM4 more

[rain sedge]

hmmm

[daring hedge]

and like you mentioned too, AP can just make high heat cast-centric runs feel like a slog in general

[rain sedge]

if you are running EM4 you do have more leeway in terms of heat

[daring hedge]

poor cast core choice, poor supplementary choice

poor scaling

[sly remnant]

ye

i'm p sure with CF0 no UC and no AP

casts are fine at 40 heat

CF0 was a big discovery for me

thanks @misty hamlet

[misty hamlet]

Buy everything

[daring hedge]

buy everything regret nothing

[rain sedge]

what are the cast weapons?

hera, poseidon, achilles, beo

what am I missing

[sly remnant]

talos

eris "technically"

[rain sedge]

hilarious

[daring hedge]

maim gilgamesh

[sly remnant]

gilgamesh "technically" 🦊

[rain sedge]

well we know beo easily does 40, poseidon is possible if a bit hard since even I almost did it

achilles, we also know it's doable, if pretty damn painful and requiring quick reload

hera, I don't even think it'll be that hard remembering my 32 run with it

so yeah I guess it's doable

[sly remnant]

hera's a very good weapon up through 40

i'm not doing only cast weapons

[rain sedge]

poseidon/achilles might be rough with EM4 though

you basically need quick reload for achilles

[daring hedge]

or do infernal crystal beam

[sly remnant]

just get flurry jab

honestly

meme beam is a good idea with TD2

[rain sedge]

I genuinely dont think it's a good hammer on achilles

[daring hedge]

why not

[rain sedge]

so

only 1 question

on KBM, can you adjust where exactly you throw the spear

like how far or close it is

[sly remnant]

kind of

[solemn pulsar]

that should be time held down right?

[daring hedge]

i believe it would still be based on how long you hold it down, no?

[sly remnant]

^yes

[solemn pulsar]

longer charge = farther throw

[gaunt fiber]

Auto aim on pad is hilarious

with spear throw

[solemn pulsar]

auto aim is the only reason i'm still playing this damn game

[sly remnant]

yea idk how you play achilles on pad

it seems like it would be an awful experience

[solemn pulsar]

why?

[daring hedge]

it's fine

[rain sedge]

nevermind then it might be good on KBM

[solemn pulsar]

you get full 360 on the stick

[rain sedge]

anyway it's not good for me because the special throws you far away

and you can only hit 4 times

and it's too much downtime for the DPS

AND the throw doesnt refresh the 4 hit charges

[sly remnant]

^when i learned that

my whole world changed

i used to just spam it constantly

[rain sedge]

alright cool, that's all the 32 spears done

it's arthur, zag sword, and the other 3 rails left

[true fable]

F

timed out with tempest flourish sea storm

[rain sedge]

that's a yikes

how

[true fable]

it was good until 0 free room elysium

^

thats how

idk

[rain sedge]

still tho

[true fable]

it's still zag spear lol

tempest flourish + sea storm is about 160 per chuck

[gaunt fiber]

you get special damage right

[true fable]

?

[gaunt fiber]

with Zag spear I mean

[true fable]

yeah +25

[gaunt fiber]

huge

[rain sedge]

no

[gaunt fiber]

exploding launcher charged skewer

[rain sedge]

25%

not 25 damage

[true fable]

sorry i meant +25% yeah

my second hammer was also kind of useless

since it was a spin hammer

[rain sedge]

yea that'd do it

I'm gonna do 32 with HS

since I'm doing arthur

anything I'm missing here? It disables every trap right

just dont get urned?

[gaunt fiber]

+25 would be better than GY lmao

[true fable]

nah 32 arthur's pretty braindead

[sly remnant]

yea arthur is still very much ownage at that heat

[rain sedge]

HS here I come

[sly remnant]

i think HS is important to turn on

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah

I dashed in a green thing last run idk what it was

HS reminded me

[rain sedge]

this weapon is SO slow

[true fable]

anyone else kinda wish SD restored to 40 and patty was +30-40 instead of how it is rn?

[rain sedge]

not really

SD to 40 would be far too strong

[gaunt fiber]

SD is already not that worth

on GY

I mean it's good

but it could be better with more hp you know

[rain sedge]

ther'es like 23 other aspects

[gaunt fiber]

lmao

It's fine that Pat is a huge buff

to me

if SD was 40, DD would be sad

[rain sedge]

30% attack speed from hermes on excalibur

boo yah

here we gooo

[true fable]

i just think pat's too make or break

[rain sedge]

at high heat a lot of things are make or break

divine dash, pat, sac, extra DD

[true fable]

and i wasnt about to ask for just a pat nerf

[gaunt fiber]

nah

[true fable]

both divine dash and DDs are in your control

sac and pat are not

[gaunt fiber]

Pat is already sad in mirrorless

[rain sedge]

if we're being real here

I dont think the game was ever designed with this level of heat in mind

or balanced as such

[gaunt fiber]

yeah

we're looping here

but that's true

[true fable]

true but just expressing what i think would be better balance wise

[spring kettle]

If only the last Pat option buffed attack/special/cast instead of only attack

[gaunt fiber]

oh man

2k special GY

[rain sedge]

yea I've always found that to be really weird

[spring kettle]

The other options, very good, can pull it back from the brink, but the last option kinda sucks if you're not running an attack focused build

and if you have high hp and all DDs

[gaunt fiber]

lol

Pat is a low heat crutch I'd say

or meant to be

[true fable]

tbh it's a very automatic choice for me on high heat

oh great touch of styx dark room

very cool

[gaunt fiber]

I had a run today

I picked jerky

[true fable]

feeling daring are we

[gaunt fiber]

It was the spin build that died vs Hades

jerky is huge for GY spin

deals a lot

[true fable]

that's fair

[gaunt fiber]

if I were better at Hades tho

I only died because I suck

I felt protected for no reason while hiding behind a rock

the sweep got through. 80 hp was more than I had

It's really easy to feel bad at dying with GY since you can tank 2 hits outside of acorn

[true fable]

zag spear done with serrated

think im coming around to serrated point

[rain sedge]

nice

40 heat serrated?

damn son

[gaunt fiber]

ez

[true fable]

i finished 40 heat zag aspects before 40 heat GY 💀

i dont get it

[sly remnant]

man hera is fun

[gaunt fiber]

You just fear the aspect

GY is good really

[sly remnant]

playing other aspects is cool

i should do it more

[gaunt fiber]

that's what I'm telling myself too

[rain sedge]

yea hera was really fun

I might do it more

[sly remnant]

i mean i'm warming up a bit on hera with 32 EM4

so the weapons problems are very not apparent to me

[gaunt fiber]

I already posted it but this is me playing other aspect than GY

https://imgur.com/FldS0xQ

Punishing sweep is awesome

[true fable]

i've been saying this hera is so similar to beo

[rain sedge]

yep, it's like beo, but fun

[true fable]

obviously very different in some important respects

hmm

is bad taste a switch thing

[gaunt fiber]

lmao

[true fable]

maybe they added taste in later patch

[rain sedge]

GOT URNED

I forgot it still activates the urn damn

[true fable]

according to pony you can only get charged -> explosive in that order btw astaos

[rain sedge]

and that's hate speech bright

[true fable]

what you have is a very very unique build

[rain sedge]

32 excalibur done

even with 30% attack speed, this weapon is miserable as all hell

I even prefer nemesis to this

just zag sword and 3 rails

[gaunt fiber]

I totally picked charged skewer first lol

[rain sedge]

not looking forward for 32 zag sword

[true fable]

just go ME

start owl pendant

[rain sedge]

is that the advice

[true fable]

yes

[rain sedge]

hmm

unironically might be a good idea

[true fable]

owl pendant start is very versatile for zag sword

[gaunt fiber]

he's right

[true fable]

you can either do ME or DR depending on your tartarus boons

[rain sedge]

so athena special, ares attack, roll for ME?

[proud jay]

owl pendant start is very versatile for any aspecct

[true fable]

truth

[proud jay]

athena best girl

[gaunt fiber]

hot take

[rain sedge]

I can hear nya running to her keyboard to fight you

[true fable]

bablo i'm realizing something just now