not really?
#h1-story-discussion
livid kiln
only odysseus can bring order and prosperity to his kingdom
thus only he can draw back the bow
the reason he left it behind was for his son to use if the island was in danger too iirc
digital crag
it wasn't exactly prosperity to Kill Everyone
rapid zinc
Maybe not but it was certainly satisfying
livid kiln
getting rid of those that seek to usurp power is prosperity
in a way
what else would he have done?
digital crag
ok ok moving to off topic
bleak osprey
guys, #off-topic-discussion, this isn't really hades discussion so much as it's just, y'know, greek myth
thank
stark tulip
||moo surprise||
normal talon
do you think heracles and asterius spent eternity just generating statements for challengers
because part of me feels like heracles is that big of a nerd
neat crow
Theseus for sure, but he no doubt started before he even arrived in the Underworld
bleak osprey
bold of you to think theseus doesn't spend the time between each fight pacing back and forth practicing his lines
asterius just watches him while shaking his head
neat crow
But a delightful one
solar depot
he'll be delightful when i finally wipe the floor with him
bleak osprey
mood
stark tulip
I want a dialogue wher if you’ve heard a Theseus line before asterius has a chance to say “they’ve heard that one already...” or something
neat crow
That would be delightful
mental marsh
am i crazy i feel like zag and than are siblings, or atleast raised as siblings
im fairly sure in my last run it was said outright
neat crow
They're more like adoptive siblings
Thanatos is the son of Nyx, and Zagreus was meant to believe that he was also the son of Nyx
visual laurel
they are implied to have been raised as siblings, yeah
but they aren't blood related
there are a couple of remembrances where hades calls hypnos and thanatos zag's brothers and/or compares him to them, and achilles says something to that effect too
neat crow
Mhmmm, it's definitely mentioned in-game. The context of the remembrances are past-tense, of course
atomic forge
It's kind of like the opposite of when you realize your boyfriend is your brother
mental marsh
regardless imo zag than shipping is super uncomfortable to me
atomic forge
I don't want to ship Thanatos with Zag. I want to ship him with me. ;_;
visual laurel
also a mood
mental marsh
wasnt calling you out was a statement at large dw
visual laurel
jen zee looked through my tumblr from 2013 and then attacked me personally with than's design
mental marsh
than is suuuper hot so i get it
visual laurel
but yeah you're not like...obligated to be comfortable with it
dw
it's a very weird fence to have to be sitting on and i'd rather it not be here at all but there ya go 😄
neat crow
I would be perfectly content with an aro narrative (broadly speaking)
visual laurel
same tbh
digital crag
than is a knockoff sephiroth cosplay
marsh prawn
Meg did canoncially date Zag and Zag asks Nyx outright if she’s her daughter
Nyx told him that It’s Complicated but that basically she, as Zag, is her adoptive daughter
Lotsa sibling trouble going on
Canoncially, sure. Canonically
merry sorrel
Nyx is the type of goddess to adopt stray souls huh
marsh prawn
Basically if it’s in the house of hades and needs parenting nyx seems to take over
The only ones stated as her children are Than and Hypnos
And Hypnos also talks about wanting to date Meg
Which im not thrilled about let meg be please im begging you
digital crag
i forcibly throw respect women juice into hypnos's weird giant mouth
digital crag
it's also extra weird that he just says that to zag's face
is he just completely oblivious that they're practically exes actually yeah it's hypnos he probably slept through all of it
marsh prawn
He has no idea
digital crag
zag's a saint for not saying anything
marsh prawn
I mean they’re over Meg can do whatever she wants
Which is
Slam dunking hypnos in a trash can
Valid
I do like that Zag’s like honey you’ve got a big storm coming but just leave meg alone let her be
digital crag
be blissfully free of this game
you're free now meg. go, fly where you heart takes you,
marsh prawn
getting good at fighting meg so i dont have to deal with painfully het man hypnos
fly away meg become an entrepreneur
digital crag
tamegtha
marsh prawn
Megdusa 👏🏼
cunning needle
i wouldn’t count on hypnos being completely het. he probably has a crush on asterius too
lunar kiln
He sleeps with asterius' autograph
digital crag
sorry hypnos but asterius and theseus are already dating
glad lion
I was bout to say why not poly but I dont think the world or underworld for that matter could handle hypnos x theseus
(And I would pray for asterius's sanity)
digital crag
glad lion
Oh no
marsh prawn
Hypnos and Theseus would outannoy each other
Put Hermes into the game so I personally can find peace
digital crag
what would they even see in each other hypnos is all chill and theseus is no chill
digital crag
it's like a blender of insufferability
glad lion
They secretly (and not so secretly) take joy in the suffering they create that's why they stay together
As simple as that
digital crag
arrrrrgh
cunning needle
i enjoy talking to hypnos. his quips are the highlight of when i might ever unfortunately die during a run
marsh prawn
He gives good advice
cunning needle
“oh you got stomped on by the hydra, huh? have you tried....not doing that?”
glad lion
Same here I love hypnos quips, he is one of the best bois
There was only one time where it kind of pissed me off and that was with the elysian archer dudes lol
cunning needle
hypnos, who never goes outside the house and is asleep for most of the time: “haha git gud scrub”
spring scaffold
I don't get why Meg doesn't take his advice to heart. She might not get stomped so hard by Zag if she did.
snow brook
He just doesn't have too much social experience on account of not leaving the house, so he tries to cheer you up but it comes out poorly.
marsh prawn
he tries his best
weary ravine
I usually flip Hypnos when he tells me to "just ont do that" XD
solar depot
hyptherius sounds like diphtheria so there's that
this last run i finally beat asterius but he killed me at almost the exact same time
i did appreciate that all hypnos wanted to talk about was how cool the minotaur is
digital crag
boy time
harsh sleet
AAAAA
bleak osprey
BOY TIME
harsh sleet
AAAAAA
harsh sleet
aaaaaaAAA
digital crag
is that just talking about fixing the portrait in the codex that looks like orpheus or what
chrome carbon
it's the full design, you can check it real quick in the codex! it's actually perfect
bleak osprey
OH
OH HE IS SO PRETTY AND SO SAD
achilles if you don't kiss your boyfriend i'm gonna do it for you
livid kiln
i haven't managed to beat any of the furies
bleak osprey
here's the boy from codex image
livid kiln
dammmn
bleak osprey
i'll have the actual thing ripped once i finish this run
livid kiln
he's good
harsh sleet
oh ,, lord
amber canyon
Clean shaven Achilles vs Scruffy Beard fallen Warrior
digital crag
Oh bless jen
amber canyon
So good
bleak osprey
ok i lied i'm doing it now
digital crag
Free laurels for everyone in elysium huh
bleak osprey
Oh No He's Hot
bleak osprey
listen
amber canyon
Apparently the underworld makes everyone attractive
bleak osprey
amber canyon
Well, except Tisiphone
bleak osprey
i haven't given a single ripped portrait a sensible filename yet and i don't intend to start now
you take that back
@runic terrace come defend your wife
digital crag
No tisi is a babe
lunar kiln
OH NO HE NEEDS A HUG
bleak osprey
if any of y'all need me i'm just gonna be over there, in the corner, crying because patroclus is hotter than expected
he needs a hug and then many smooches to the face
amber canyon
I mean, he is Achilles former boyfriend
Why would you expect him to be less attractive
Really the only travesty is that he is wearing a shirt
runic terrace
WHO SAID SOMETHING BPUT TISI
bleak osprey
no no i had expectations for a certain level of hotness
digital crag
"Former boyfriend "
bleak osprey
and then they were exceeded
runic terrace
ah........
digital crag
Achilles: this is my former boyfriend
Patroclus: I told you to stop calling me that
Patroclus: we're married
amber canyon
Alecto cant compare to Meg either, but at least she doesnt look like Voldemort after a particularly bad day
amber canyon
Long-distance Husband
Really the whole issue could be resolved if we just had mobile phones
bleak osprey
patroclus portrait is now on his wiki page
digital crag
Excuse you Alecto is a babe too
frozen jolt
tisiphone IS attractive.... just not to u.............
amber canyon
Or laptops with webcams
runic terrace
well, everyones got diff tastes, i guess,
amber canyon
Alecto looks good but she is way too crazy
lunar kiln
wigged
maiden wharf
every day is a good day to shower than with gifts
frozen jolt
i think i played so much in the past few days that it started to hurt my arm
bleak osprey
hey
hey guys
guys hey
i think patroclus might be wearing the other myrmidon bracer
maiden wharf
aaaaaaa
digital crag
Oh blood oh darkness
frozen jolt
maiden wharf
my heart....
digital crag
Considering that (iliad spoilers) he died wearing achilles's armour...... oof
cunning needle
“iliad spoilers” just made me laugh so hard
maiden wharf
(iliad spoilers)
digital crag
Thanks 
lunar kiln
one of the new achilles convos ||explains how the codex works||
it only took you 7 bottles but you're finally starting to understand!!!! ||https://i.imgur.com/Ct3e2kN.jpg||
maiden wharf
than 
digital crag
Than is a grumpy cat but easily bribed with catnip
lunar kiln
SISYPHUS HAS NEW DIALOGUE
harsh sleet
aaaAAAAAAAAAA
harsh sleet
i got A PATROCLUS ROOM WOOO
lunar kiln
shades b gossiping (ghost sipping) ||https://i.imgur.com/8IBAeUd.jpg||
bleak osprey
MY BOY REALLY LOVES ME, showed up right away after patch ;3;
digital crag
I can't believe all the shades in tartarus gossip about zag's love life
lunar kiln
BEHOLD A MAN https://i.imgur.com/VbDKiIy.jpg
digital crag
Me while being flayed and set on fire for eternity: did u hear.... prince zagreus gave thanatos an ambrosia
lunar kiln
HM???
maiden wharf
I SCREAMED
bleak osprey
maiden wharf
I NEED MORE THAN INTERACTIONS 😭
maiden wharf
i wanna know what's next for than and zag after this convo aaaaaaaaa
harsh sleet
next update: the update of love
runic terrace
next update is june right? which of course is pride month so it better be, you know, very good and gay
neat crow
There's always a date
neat crow
June 11th
amber canyon
I mean, them being brothers wouldnt have been a problem given that its greek myth
maiden wharf
omg the day before me birthday 😩 actually since im in asia it's probably already the 12th for me when it drops
harsh sleet
omg
maiden wharf
yee haw
harsh sleet
please let me h*ld thans hand
amber canyon
You gotta do it like this \*
bleak osprey
hypnos, sweetie, i literally jsut got back from killing them
maiden wharf
silly hypnos
bleak osprey
drinks with than ;3;
stark tulip
aaaaaaa Patroclus..... good....
cunning needle
i need to start losing intentionally so i can advance that autograph quest
bleak osprey
you can!
marsh prawn
Nice
bleak osprey
zagreus won't even try to get it until hypnos has mentioned it a few times, though: once you get a line from hypnos saying did you by any chance happen to ask his big bull buddy for an autograph for me, you should be able to get the autograph the next time you solo-fight asterius
or.... at some point, when you solo-fight him. might not come up right away
marsh prawn
Cool
ember goblet
can i finally have mergra say something if i fight her without the mirror?
like should i even try?
neat crow
There's still no dialog about it as far as I know
cunning needle
yeah i just completed a run with no mirror. admittedly it was also my first time running into her that save so even if there was dialogue it would probably not come up
neat crow
If there were dialog, you'd probably have to first encounter her taunt about the mirror, yeah
frozen jolt
ah the myrmidon bracer conversation
bleak osprey
strange cipher
Just beat Theseus and the Minotaur for the first time. (First time playing the patch.)
That was hecka fun.
Can't wait to confront Aphrodite about the whole hey-you-helped-my-opponent thing.
maiden wharf
i havent ever seen zag talk to the gods about them helping theseus
i wonder if he ever asks about it
neat crow
Might be something that comes up later and they just haven't implemented it yet
bleak osprey
quoi
drifting citrus
(his model turned into theseus for a bit)
north remnant
So ive never gotten an event after the go to sleep to try to sneak into fathers room. Am I missing others or are they just not implemented yet?
somber gull
there are no other sleep events yet
visual laurel
mmm let's not, maybe
shy glade
👀 does anyone know whats the song playing in patroclus' chamber?
visual laurel
"From Olympus"
shy glade
thank u!!
crude spade
@cunning needle omg are they loverssssss
autumn void
they extremely are
crude spade
omg yes
mossy agate
who are?
cunning needle
basically husbands
cunning needle
achilles and patroclus
crude spade
Achilles is the sweetest man
mossy agate
I mean
autumn void
it's so beautifully non-subtle too
mossy agate
achilles and patroclus were almost explicitly stated to be lovers in the illiad
mossy agate
his death is what made achilles hulk out and then sulk in his tent
mossy agate
cough it's not like sgg made them gay for each other
just sayin'
crude spade
still, they chose to include it and not be afraid to write it in
autumn void
SG's choice to feature their relationship with such prominence is what's good okay
autumn void
exactly
cunning needle
achilles has been straight-washed in so many things and it’s nice to see something different for a change
crude spade
LGBT Erasure is pretty standard in this industry
and whenever some company tries to not the edgy Kotaku crowd flips
mossy agate
?
crude spade
I'm sure im preaching to the Choir though
cunning needle
and what i also love is how invested zag is in their relationship and trying to get them back together and happy again
autumn void
oh totally
mossy agate
I don't mean to get political but
kotaku seems pretty liberal to me
their readers/writers seem like the last to get offended over some gay dudes
unless i misunderstood what you meant
zag is the best wingman
best boi
ships fiercely with meg
crude spade
shorthand for Kotakuinaction
its a general community of gamer bros who are generally sexist, homophobic, racist, misogynistic, and what have you
mossy agate
bruh
rapid zinc
(Not to intrude but if this conversation continues pleas take it either to #off-topic-discussion or to DMs)
crude spade
you right sorry lol
mossy agate
jesus man lmao
going straight for the throat
whatevs imma just go back to grinding
cunning needle
i like how even though zag has such a sassy side with people he doesn’t like, he is also incredibly soft and gentle
and the whole gameplay mechanic of giving people gifts. it’s perfect
autumn void
he's so sweet towards most of the people you interact with, yeah
mossy agate
he's a snarky boi
autumn void
hades earned that sass
mossy agate
MMMMMUURDERRRR?
rapid zinc
Zag: I hope it's Tisiphone
Me: Gods, me too buddy
crude spade
Me: Maybe it'll be Dusa this time
mossy agate
god I hate tisiphone
neat crow
I'm still sad that we can't gift Alecto and Tisiphone
rapid zinc
She's green (I like green), she's pretty, and I find her the easiest to fight
neat crow
And Asterius, too. Don't care about gifting Theseus, though 
mossy agate
I hate tisiphone cause her fight is too janky
Her hurtbox is bigger than her visuals, half the time her fireballs don't have graphics
rapid zinc
Not liking Tisiphone? What's it like having bad taste >:( (I'm just joking no hard feelings being thrown here)
cunning needle
i wish i could give asterius a gift. he’s a good honorable boi even if he keeps calling zag short
mossy agate
the hurtbox for her spin attack is a good 25% bigger than the visual
neat crow
Meg's is the same, though
crude spade
I feel that Alecto is the easiest fight for me
its the only one i can regularly get through with no hits
mossy agate
I've never had that issue with meg
neat crow
Easiest of all three? Or just of the two later ones?
neat crow
I've definitely been hit by Meg's spin attack outside of the visual range
autumn void
tangentially related: blocking meg's whip aoe with bull rush sends you FLYING backwards and i hope that never changes
neat crow
Meg feels the easiest to me, but that could also because I've fought her so many more times than the others
autumn void
rather, the stationary shield hold part of bull rush
mossy agate
alecto is easy cause she doesn't summon nearly as many mooks as meg
and she neither shrinks the arena or has janky attacks like tisi
crude spade
I always mistime at least one or two of meg's dashes
mossy agate
honestly alecto is too easy
rapid zinc
It gives the same feel as in Dark Souls when you block a huge attack and get thrown tumbling backwards.
And it feels GREAT
autumn void
i used to dread alecto but she's kinda tame now
all three are fairly consistent for me i think
mossy agate
meg herself is easy
it's why she summons so many mooks
honestly like
throwing mooks into the fight is just the laziest way to make a fight challenging
crude spade
Meg: The ultimate middle manager of hell
mossy agate
As much as I hate Tisiphone for her janky and buggy design, she has the best designed fight
She doesn't need to throw random mooks at you to distract you
Which lets you focus 100% on her
autumn void
buggy? dunno about that
mossy agate
It is bugged
crude spade
Mook is a fun word
mossy agate
Some of her fireballs don't display the graphic
only the shadow
I've been trying to get a good screenshot of it but, y'know
autumn void
i see; haven't experienced that before
mossy agate
it's kind of hard to do it mid-fight
neat crow
I also haven't experience phantom fireballs from her
You can record the fight and examine it after, for what it's worth
That's what I do when I'm trying to analyze something funny in combat
mossy agate
I'll try that later
but those fireballs hurt when you're running 300% damage
from heat
neat crow
Usually if I get caught in them, it's 'cause she dashes right beside me and I don't have time to dodge because the fireball spawns inside of my body
crude spade
ouchie
neat crow
Night
autumn void
gnight
lunar kiln
Hey everyone, did you know that despite being the god who wants to distance themselves from her relatives and generally dislikes them the most, artemis has the highest amount of duo boons combinations (3), rivaled only by zeus (the king of olympus) and beating dionysus (the literal embodiment of partying)
visual laurel
awwww...
bleak osprey
she wants friends :(
digital crag
:(
neat crow
Artemis is life
digital crag
artemis/dio duo boon when
lunar kiln
Additionally
Athena, who is supposed to act as the voice of reason between the olympians, only has one duo boon
digital crag
seems about right
being the lawful arbiter doesn't make you the most likable one but someone has to do it
lunar kiln
She took the bullet for the team and theyre trashing her for it
digital crag
she sure did 😔
ivory spire
Don't worry, she has deflect powers, she took no damage.
digital crag
athena's heart is protected on all sides by a phalanx
lunar kiln
this is so funny to me https://i.imgur.com/gH8NWmH.jpg
zag my boy
to go to the lounge you have to go past cerberus, hypnos, hades, nyx, dusa, orpheus and the broker wretch
there's absolutely going to be one of them who will see you two together
and achilles as well
meg wasnt here but it wouldve been funnier
visual laurel
than can poof
runic terrace
jhfhjfj they poof like glimmer from shera
visual laurel
the broker wretch doesn't talk it's fine
runic terrace
[holds hands] [pof together]
visual laurel
dusa knows to mind her business
runic terrace
ghfcghdcghdghdgh
visual laurel
c o n s o r t i n g
lunar kiln
oh my god they were c o n s o r t i n g . . .
runic terrace
hjgvhjvhjgfvhjfhj
lunar kiln
fghgn hypnos shouldve asked to join but they both refuse
like that one powerpuff applebees comic
hollow apex
I'm allowed to throw a spoilery screenshot in this channel, right?
lunar kiln
ye
hollow apex
when did they add this model???
Pretty sure there was placeholder art my first few times through Elysium
visual laurel
Just today!
hollow apex
AMAZING
visual laurel
ISNT HE
hollow apex
SO VERY AMAZING
shy glade
talking about patroclus...does anyone know/recorded whatever he was saying when we entered his room?
shy glade
👀
shy glade
👀 !!
visual laurel
Short lines:
||"to think he could've... known of this? didn't have to be..."
"he was always- you were always such a stubborn fool..."
"why was i brought here, to be left alone...? where did you go, what did you do?"
"you're wallowing away somewhere, same as I, but where? and why not here?"
"so then i'll just keep waiting here, i guess. no time to lose, heheh..."
"but you must hate me so, to have abandoned me among these noble champions, and kings..."
"truly must the gods despise us, each in turn, to have divided us like this"
"what we were once.....i wonder if it's but a falsely ringing memory of mine."||
Long lines:
||"When we were both alive, I...I thought you were invincible. I knew of no one, nothing stronger, other than the love we shared....was i deceived in thinking this of you, of us?"
"Is this how you decided to repay me? Why, you must think that I abandoned you in life, when I went off to war without you, is that it? You think that I had a choice??"
"You made the choice, not me, and you prolonged that war when you knew just as well as anyone you could've ended it, but you refused, and now I'm here, and you? you're somewhere else." (this is big angry)
"why does the soul remain, after the body bleeds, and dies, and turns to ash? is this the final cruelty of the gods? or evidence, perhaps, that we have some immortal stuff in us, ourselves?"
"it makes no difference to me either way. i spent so much of my short life alone but now, what is this lingering and meaningless experience, where for eternity all i have to think on is a few bright glimpses that i spent with him, not by myself?"
"is clinging to a memory what keeps the soul from fading? why, then? would that i could simply leave that glimmer of my past behind, for there is nothing for me here."
"what qualifies a man to this eternity in so-called 'paradise'? even in death there is no justice - i knew so many peaceful, decent men, but none, of course, are here. instead, it is the warriors, the kings, the slayers - great men? the standard for greatness is low indeed."
"i ought to have been cast into the meadows of sprawling asphodel, not here, not with these kings and braggarts. what am i doing here? waiting, lingering, transfixed on something that was never mine, something i never had. then, what am i to do...?||
runic terrace
😭 😭 😭
runic terrace
HHHHHHHHHHHHH 😭
shy glade
thank u @visual laurel for the pain 
visual laurel
you are SO welcome
hollow apex
visual laurel
i was upset there were no subtitles
hollow apex
Want to share my bugged build, but didn't want to spoil anyone since this was on the final fight with Theseus and Asterius
It was SO much fun
I made everything explode, which is probably why it locked up, haha
lunar kiln
there's another super secret line from patroclus that you can hear by fulfilling specific requirements
||if two guys were on elysium, and one hit the other with a rock, would that be messed up or what?||
shy glade
sdjkakjdaksljd
lunar kiln
||i am joking by the way||
visual laurel
requirement: be holding a rock
visual laurel
at least i'm distinguishable from the other cow mods now
but what to do about my username
runic terrace
thigh so sterius
shy glade
asthighrius
visual laurel
good
cunning needle
aaaaaa those patroclus lines make me cry
we need to get him back together with achilles
runic terrace
YEAHHH ;;;
maiden wharf
im gonna yeet achilles into elysium or yeet patroclus into the house either way
runic terrace
STEP ONE wear nyx's shawl STEP TWO achilles hides under it
STEP THREE BATTLE YOUR WAY TO BF!!!!
maiden wharf
YES!!!!
simple sparrow
"I'm not so sure about this, lad."
"Don't worry, sir, I've done this hundreds of times. Just let me know if you see any beetles around."
maiden wharf
oh no hahahahaha
harsh sleet
if i give patroclus enough ambrosia it’ll heal him eventually
lunar kiln
moominotaur
digital crag
!!!!!
maiden wharf
but then i'd never wanna hurt him ):
polar root
I think it's interesting that Patroclus is depicted as a melancholy pacifist, stuck in Elysium against his will. I think like every other depiction of him is that he begs Achilles to fight, he won't, so he begs to do it in his stead to beat back the Trojans. He starts kicking ass everywhere, to the point that people honestly believe he's Achilles (and because he's wearing Achilles' armor), but he gets a little too bloodlusty and Hector puts him down.
But I guess the brooding and jilted lover is fun drama fodder haha
bleak osprey
i mean, that was before he died and got separated from achilles and has had to spend who knows how long sitting by the river lethe with nothing to do because he's so jaded about literally everybody else in elysium
polar root
That's when he shows up as a ghost and tells Achilles to burn his body because he's stuck, right?
Oh nvm, I see, you're talking about in the context of the game Hades
bleak osprey
well, yes,
polar root
That's what I think is interesting though: he should end up in Elysium anyway because he was a battle hero in life. Well, in the usual depiction
They haven't completely explained what happened in life, or I haven't done enough runs, so I'm looking forward to how they depict Patroclus and Achilles' separation in life
digital crag
you could say that because he was wearing achilles's armour his accomplishments didn't count as his own
being a regular warrior without having especially kickass accomplishment doesn't qualify you for elysium it seems
onyx spoke
I got an interaction between poseidon and zeus, and right after it offered a duo boon for those two
which is neat
visual laurel
Patroclus had one (1) good run in which he was helped by wearing Achilles' armor - probably a lot easier to stab people who are running from you. Other than that I don't really think the impression is that he was a particularly noteworthy warrior, although he was well-liked by the other myrmidons, and "Patroclus is the better person while Achilles is the better warrior" is kind of an underlying running theme
Elysium is for big shots, not for rank and file soldiers who have one good day
digital crag
accomplishments: went feral one time
visual laurel
Also he wasn't like...begging to fight because he wanted to kill dudes lol he was begging to fight because Achilles was being a stubborn ass and letting all their comrades be slaughtered
digital crag
also, and this is my observation about greek myth in general. is that literally all heroes are kings or princes.
marsh prawn
||patroclus is in elysium because achilles made a pact tho in the context of the game||
In any case in classic literature fighting wasn’t a bad thing
visual laurel
Yeah we're discussing why he didn't go there originally
digital crag
there's definitely a bias towards "being born a prince means you're inherently a cool hero"
marsh prawn
Only one i remember not really wanting to fight is hector
visual laurel
Our friend busty said Pat should have ended up in Elysium because he was a warrior and killed some important dudes, I'm just pointing out that Pat didn't necessarily do that much
And that he wasn't (initially) fighting out of bloodlust but out of a desire to help the other Achaeans
marsh prawn
Ah i misread
visual laurel
It seems like they're going with, Pat and Achilles each think the other is mad with him about the one particular confrontation in which Achilles refused to fight even as the Greek ships were being burned and Pat insisted on going out in his stead
Tho Achilles hasn't said as much, uhh, it does seem like behavior one would be ashamed of with a little hindsight
especially since Pat died as a result of it. lol
digital crag
two good war boys who sacrificed themselves for the drama
bleak osprey
"Patroclus, however, I... fear he's gone to me, forever. Although his shade might yet reside within this realm, we left on terms I'd not forgive if I were him."
digital crag
when the rage is gone that's when the guilt sets in
dark mural
frozen jolt
just making sure, did you update your game?
because their health got reduced in the latest patch
visual laurel
@fleet wind it took until patroclus for zag to realize that gifting alcohol to extremely depressed people maybe wasn't a great strategy lmao
fleet wind
I mean, they're Greeks; of course they're depressed
Maybe this is a gameplay question, but is there any relationship between the boon suite you bring to Theseus and the god powers that Theseus brings to bear? I haven't done that encounter enough times to grok a pattern
visual laurel
I think he tends to go for gods whose boons you don't have
fleet wind
Feels like a good opportunity for some quips/banter. Especially if he's rocking stuff from a god you snubbed in a trial room
elder needle
I also think that his god is the one I'm not related at all
So I never met Athena or Artemis so far
hollow apex
First time I thought I was able to afford one of these things, but it was still locked despite having the requisite amount of heat https://imgur.com/a/9v7rwiu
Am I missing something?
hollow apex
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
visual laurel
It's not something you "spend" heat on
visual laurel
Yeah, so you have to be actually running a 25 heat run to use that gate
hollow apex
got it - risk vs reward
hollow apex
onion rooms?!
runic terrace
OHOHO....YOULL FIND OUT
visual laurel
yep
they used to spring them on us by ~surprise~
like survival rooms
now you have to like, try to get them gdfkjgfd
hollow apex
hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
lunar kiln
elysium heat gates are Hell
neat crow
Why do you say that?
lunar kiln
they spawn sooo many enemies it's ridiculous
though it's probably bc i had shared misery
neat crow
Yeah, that would certainly affect it
That said, they're still only Tartarus enemies... If they were Elysium enemies I don't think I'd ever take an Elysium Infernal Gate
median edge
I used to reliably clear on 80 heat but I haven't been able to clear on even 30 this patch, much less do elysium erebus rooms. 😭
maiden wharf
sdgfsg sdfg where's that edit where hades hands you an onion
that made me cry laugh
visual laurel
runic terrace
AH
maiden wharf
thank u......i owe u my life......
elder needle
Infernal rooms still feel like low risk high return rooms for me
Tartarus enemies are much less threatening than the exalted ones
Even when I fail I preserve much more HP
I don't mind too much about missing a room reward at that point
drifting citrus
if hermès is the next olympian he should give us triple dash back
waxen dagger
and flying kicks-jutsu
lunar kiln
+ Added another new conversation branch with the Fallen Warrior
are you sure
i met him in elysium again and he just said one line telling me to go die or whatever
oh. oh wait
fair light
The semi-simple explanation for this is, there a lot more conversations with him if, by the time you meet him, you do not yet know who he is via Achilles conversations. This new branch makes it so some of those conversations still occur with him later.
Players who've been playing Hades for a while are likely to have had those Achilles conversations already. But newer players I think are fairly likely to meet ||Patroclus|| before learning about him from Achilles, and there are branches to support either path (as well as some others).
lunar kiln
i see
bleak osprey
i noticed i ran out of conversations with him (rather than the simpler one-liners) really quickly, as in, i got maybe two conversations with him before he was just like "eh hi whatever" and i'm sad :( i'd have held off on telling achilles about him if i'd thought it might get me more of that juicy content
it's been a while since he's decided to show up in a run though so maybe he'll have more stuff to say to me now
fair light
Yeah, in theory this change should do that! It should have definitely been more than 2 conversations at a minimum, though it might need for you to check with Achilles to move it forward.
bleak osprey
that's the thing! i went back and talked to achilles each time
fair light
There were some other fixes along the way. Certainly F10 it if something feels like it was missing or out of sequence. You could F10 it anyway with a note for me and I can check to make sure the correct events played. In either case hopefully he will have new stuff to say next time you see him.
neat crow
Url contains cuss 
neat crow
The sad Cerberus 
in the blog post is killing me! https://www.supergiantgames.com/blog/hades-pricing-and-the-epic-mega-sale/
digital crag
ohno
hollow garden
Sad Cerberus makes me sad too
merry sorrel
does anyone know what is the thing about Ares' heart not beating?
digital crag
bhuh?
merry sorrel
I'll screencap if I see it again, but there was a line about Ares' heart not beating and it was merely mentioned
merry sorrel
himself, but luckily it's also referred in the codex: '...Although my heart has long since stopped, it yet holds love in it for all the gods, save one, the one who made and ruined me as well.
digital crag
that's referring to achilles
neat crow
That's Achilles, yeah
digital crag
i don't see anything searching heart in ares's subtitles file
merry sorrel
I probably misremembered then
so Achilles is resentful of Ares because Achilles embodied his Craft?
it was Achilles' own choice though
digital crag
he was young and stupid
he would have been like.... around 16? when he chose to join the war
hollow garden
yeah cause it took them about 10 years to get to troy itself
digital crag
nnnno?
hollow garden
did it not?
digital crag
odysseus took 10 years to get home but he was exceptionally unlucky
also spent 7 of those years trapped on an island
old frost
Wasn't the war itself 10 years long?
hollow garden
sounds like im misremembering my Iliad hard
merry sorrel
I thought the time for travel was figurative and everything went at plot speed
digital crag
the distance between aulis(where they set off) and troy is only uh......300km
says google
old frost
Well before they set off I think there was a thing where they made Artemis mad, so there were no winds
hollow garden
war itself was 10 years yeah. Presumably though it took a couple years for them to sail over, and I mean... they were taking their sweet time. Iliad makes it fairly clear that they were basically pillaging every city they could find on the way over. Achilles would have probably been around 17-18 when the war first started.
They kinda also made Apollo upset by taking his priest and priestesses
which slowed em down a tad
digital crag
i'd give a timeline of 1-2 years to get to troy
the entire main story part of the iliad takes place over like, a week
merry sorrel
I'm trying to look for it, we all assume that Homer's Iliad is the canon and the other five tales are not, right? for simplicity's sake, even though orphic lores did get alluded in Hades
hollow garden
regardless, by the time Achilles died he would have been in his mid twenties, and fighting for a solid 8-10 years
digital crag
there is no canon in greek myth
only an endless rabbit hole of variations and contradictions
merry sorrel
no canon in greek myth but sort of for hades
hollow garden
Achilles was a hot head though, and the Iliad makes that pretty clear. His dead shade shows that distinct difference and character growth he only really obtained through death.
digital crag
the iphigenia event wasn't written by homer, it was written by euripides
so that's dubious canon by that count
the dipped in styx and achilles heel thing also isn't from homer
hollow garden
Which is a nice touch, tbh. Its one of the reasons im pretty interested to see the Patroclus (Patroclos?) storyline given the relationship between the 2 characters in the Iliad
digital crag
besides the iliad the other big source on achilles is statius's achilleid
merry sorrel
I said this because the travel path and travel time vary very wildly between authors
digital crag
which came waaaay later, late enough to have picked up a bunch of extended myths that was not in homer and also the dude died before finishing it
hollow garden
Its really hard to consider anything in traditional greek myth is "canon" for the game likely because Supergiant is simply taking the more modern perceptions of these characters and using them to create their own story based off them. Everything contradicts everything in Greek myth. So unless Supergiant specifically tells us what they consider "traditional canon" its likely best to just assume its meant to be player interpreted.
merry sorrel
homer also wrote a very romanticized version instead of accurate version of the war, we know that, I'm just wondering which one we decide to be out point of reference here
hollow garden
I think we can consider "broad strokes" canon (like Achilles still fought in the Trojan War, Orpheus still lost his wife, etc etc) but anything specific? probably not
hollow garden
tbf its very romanticized and also in old greek fashion contains content which would be awkward to reference for a relatively colorful and vibrant game more light hearted game :p (see the first chapter of the Iliad and what Achilles and Agamemnon are fighting over)
digital crag
does he have a heel weak spot? was he raised by a centaur? did he meet heracles? did he live as a girl through his teen years? does he have a war criminal ginger son? who even knows
you might even say it's. Up To Interpretation
merry sorrel
who doesn't have a tendon as weak spot though
especially that one
it's like, stabbing a vampire in the heart or behead it will kill it, but so will almost any animal
mammal, anyhow
I was trying to find a point of reference, not The Truth
so if we go by broad stroke, then
digital crag
troy 2004 had a dumb interpretation though
merry sorrel
Achilles was 15-16, fought for ten years, regretted it after death
digital crag
yeah when has a 16 year old ever made a good life decision
merry sorrel
yet in his speech he still described Ares almost with admiration, comparing him to the heavens and the sea
and to be fair, he got a decent deal in the war for himself, he went there as a commander, he killed everyone in his path except Paris who killed him, and Aenea (sp?) escaped to continue the line
he got fame and power, the ones who got worse deal were Patroclus, Priam (sp? the father of the princes), Hector, all the trojans, etc.
Agamemnon started powerful, but people respected him less and less and he ended up getting murdered in his sleep
digital crag
oh? i read the codex entry less like admiration and more like fear
merry sorrel
isn't it a bit of the same thing sometimes?
you admire because they are better than you at something, and sometimes this thing also means they can kill you or ruin you easier
glad lion
A healthy level of respect and understanding lol
Cause he compares ares to weather and a force of nature right?
digital crag
"War, much like the heavens and the sea, can be considered as a force of nature. It keeps men down; they will never grow too plentiful, this way, or near as mighty as the gods." is basically saying uh oh don't get too hubristic mortals
hollow garden
I mean Achilles still has some respect for the power Ares holds.
digital crag
in that context i don't see how he thinks it's admirable anymore than like, a plague that wipes out half the population is admirable
hollow garden
That being said, he doesn't have to like Ares at all, and its understandable why he wouldn't.
digital crag
he explicitly says he loves all the gods except ares
merry sorrel
admiration of power and love are not the same
digital crag
i just don't see anything like an admiring tone in the codex entry
but to each their own
merry sorrel
plague is still kind of worshiped, Erra, the near East equivalent of Ares, was thus
merry sorrel
similar feeling here ^
hollow garden
which feels about right for Achilles considering Ares is responsible for the thing that got him killed in the first place
digital crag
okay i just think the word admire has connotation of liking but i get what you're saying
hollow garden
I kinda agree, admire wouldnt be my first choice of word, but eh english is weird and it works enough :p
merry sorrel
because awe would be too intense and blind, so admire seemed like a better word because it is based on an implicit understanding
respect could work but he is describing as the anti-force to civilization, so it wasn't my choice
now I really want Eros in the game as well
digital crag
:3c
merry sorrel
both Eros and Ares are nature-like forces, but Ares could not lift Eros' Javelin
if we can have both Athena and Ares, no reason to not have both Aphrodite and Eros too
digital crag
i mean, athena and ares are both members of the big twelve olympians
merry sorrel
fair, but Eros was a primordial (According to some)
digital crag
there are too many things i want to say but can't say safely
visual laurel
hahahaha
i just got out of my last class for the day, y'all gotta watch yourselves now lol
merry sorrel
can't say because it's ad hominem or not family friendly because like, I know I am basically shaking a can of worms like Eris' apple here so
saying, regarding Eros, do try to not let the mind fall into the gutter
visual laurel
Eros as a primordial force is an interesting concept tbh
digital crag
romans did eros dirty by taking away his super interesting genealogy and also turning him from a hot guy to a baby
well okay baby cupid was a bit later but i love blaming romans for things
merry sorrel
I really did mean Eros as in Eros and Psyche kind of Eros, but maybe also take the primordial part
also the javelin hurling full grown
digital crag
plato's symposium is neat for all the musings about eros as primordial force
also the many other things too hilarious to talk about here
merry sorrel
bunch of intellectuals got drunk and an outsider recorded it, it can only go well
digital crag
see i see it more like, ancient greek RPF
merry sorrel
this makes plato looks significantly more questionable
visual laurel
was plato ever not questionable
merry sorrel
significantly more so
visual laurel
heheheh
merry sorrel
I try to imagine this guy with broad shoulders and wrestling victories writing about morality but also writing fanfics of questionable morality due to ummm are you really describing them correctly is this your badship and are those real life people and if somebody objects he just stares at them and flexes his muscles
digital crag
socrates/alcibiades is obviously his otp
merry sorrel
but socrates was his teacher and alcibiades was slightly younger than himself
even oscar wilde didn't go that far
digital crag
there were no callout posts back then so here we are doing it two thousand years later
visual laurel
i was calling out ovid the other day
merry sorrel
I kind of want to callout ovid too but that's starting to be a long list of callout
visual laurel
anyways re: some of the earlier discussion, SGG is definitely mixing and matching to fit the story they wanna tell and like, that's valid, while there are more and less widely accepted canons that doesn't make any one of them more right, and you may as well mess with it
one of the things i admittedly like less is that they're rolling with the way christianity has imprinted its imagery on greek myth
with olympus being aligned with "heaven" and the underworld with "hell", down to giving hades and zag fire feet
simple sparrow
Okay, but Ovid is, like, really easy to call out vis-a-vis the art of love
glad lion
Yeah not crazy about theseus calling zag hell-spawn all the time lol
simple sparrow
In fairness, that's the only thing I've read from him, as, like, part of a humanities class, so I don't know about the rest of his stuff.
visual laurel
he did the metamorphoses which is controversial in its own very many ways
but yeah theseus is another good example
with the hell-spawn, demon, fiend stuff all the time
persephone's letter explicitly calling it "heaven and hell"
simple sparrow
Mm.
visual laurel
and fire like isn't even an association with the greek chthonics, that's ENTIRELY christian hell stuff
(tho i am glad they went hard on hades being the god of wealth, which is something that's often left out)
glad lion
They rest doesn't both me as much though I wish there was a little less of the forced the underworld sucks going on
But theseus feels the most out of place and a bit tooo Christian in his taunts
merry sorrel
dust was associated with hades though, I think?
when zag was chocking on what looked like charcoal smoke in asphodel I was like "almost correct"
dust, death, jewels, and to some extend plants was the greek hades scenery, right?
visual laurel
plants only in association with persephone, i'd think
merry sorrel
the table plus bench that trapped theseus' friend was stone yet behaved a bit like a plant
visual laurel
hades and persephone together being something something death and rebirth
rooster was also associated with persephone&hades as a unit, representative of awakening into new life and rebirth; bundle of grain, pomegranates...
glad lion
Zag also being the God of rebirth correct?
simple sparrow
Speaking of, I'm waiting for that orchard to open up.
merry sorrel
Zagreus was a Dionysus equivalent, so kind of...
visual laurel
There isn't much on Zagreus outside of orphic myth
and that's like
one line
from a fragment
merry sorrel
^
digital crag
i thought hades being a god of wealth was a later roman syncretism of pluto with plutus
visual laurel
he's basically a nobody
oh, was it?
i thought it was a "riches of the earth" thing
digital crag
"ehh these two gods have the same name let's just make them the same god" -romans, probably
merry sorrel
I also thought it was a riches of the earth thing, but I was remembering the last-born first-born thing
no, it was syncretism
or equivalent of
merry sorrel
the political action of fusing religious elements for sake of uniting rites
digital crag
if you want accurate insults for theseus i'm sure there are plenty in the theogony
hesiod loved to call the chthonics mean names
merry sorrel
chthonics were looked down because they were boring or something too?
digital crag
he called than and hypnos "awful gods"
this is so sad alexa react with thannypensive
glad lion
merry sorrel
I can see why with Thanatos, since he was not just death, but the urge to go towards death
the inverted torch thing
digital crag
the upside down torch would have been sick
a little sad hades thanny doesn't have it
merry sorrel
he is still hot enough for the "urge to towards"
visual laurel
layering on the christian stuff again tho he did get a massive scythe,
digital crag
yeah the grim reaper is totally in the bible
visual laurel
i mean
digital crag
jk i don't know where the classic grim reaper image comes from but ur right it's not ancient greek
visual laurel
i guess it's probably a pagan thing but so are christmas trees
merry sorrel
yeah it was syncretism again
visual laurel
part of the vast complex of weird things that got absorbed into the (infinite scarequotes) """western""" view of death
merry sorrel
but bible did have a lot of harvest imagery
digital crag
if you google grim reaper the google infobox helpfully informs you that he is portrayed by brad pitt
visual laurel
hahahaha
merry sorrel
so yeah... I wish Thanatos would get another image update and get the upside down torch
visual laurel
idk, the torch would be sick but i do quite like him as he is
merry sorrel
if not I'll draw him with an upside down battery-powered torch
visual laurel
pffffff please do
digital crag
it does sound goth as hell
visual laurel
it's just not as flashy as a scythe 😔
merry sorrel
dark grey hoodie, ripped black jeans, $30 sneakers, battery-powered torch in one hand an d hand-crank radio in the other
visual laurel
god
merry sorrel
probably watches hypnos smoke weed in the little woods behind the university
digital crag
hypnos only smokes....naps
merry sorrel
ok, maybe hypnos drinking nyquil
digital crag
noooo
visual laurel
quil (all the time all the time)
simple sparrow
This sounds like... Percy Jackson.
digital crag
hhhhh
simple sparrow
You know, in that sort of, the gods update themselves for modern times automatically
digital crag
percy jackson thanatos looks like crap
visual laurel
hahahahaha
are we gonna have another go at the wildly varying art for percy jackson stuff
simple sparrow
I mean... The narration refers to him as, like, beautiful enough that if he told you to die, you might just do it.
digital crag
don't even compare my good death boy to rick riordan's flaming barrel
simple sparrow
But if you're just having a dig at the series as a whole, that's cool too.
visual laurel
i only ever read the first book so idk, i just saw some illustrations at one point?? idk from where
digital crag
from me ripping the series in soup probably
visual laurel
yeah.
digital crag
but i won't go that feral again dw
simple sparrow
Didn't like them, or just didn't read on?
visual laurel
I was like, 11 and read it for english class
digital crag
i'm still annoyed that percy jackson is clearly named after perseus but thematically he's supposed to be theseus
he should be theodore jackson
merry sorrel
I-
simple sparrow
Percy was supposed to be because apparently Perseus got a comparatively good ending?
neat crow
Welcome to PJ Talk, caller, you're on the line!
simple sparrow
As for thematically being Theseus... Well, my mythology knowledge has suffered since I listened to those books on tape as a kid. 😅
merry sorrel
Theseus was less moral than Percy I guess?
digital crag
this is so off topic
merry sorrel
ok, let's continue the god talk in off topic
in-game though, I hope we might be able to date Than
visual laurel
it sorta seems like it could be drifting that way
merry sorrel
we do get to talk to him and he does show affection in a vaguely tsundere way
visual laurel
have you seen all his convos?
digital crag
where's the dere
merry sorrel
the thantsun? since no visible dere yet
tsunthan
I mean, the dere is there if you use your imagination and love, a lot of love
digital crag
i mean he does literally give you a heart after your contests
visual laurel
he wouldn't be so personally offended if he didn't care pretty deeply
meg's anger is about zag being irresponsible and selfish and upsetting the house but than's like "how could you do this to me, personally, and to the others who care about you"
(i mean meg probably also has some personal anger in there too but she doesn't talk about it.)
harsh sleet
please let me date thanatos i love him@
digital crag
blaming the kid for the behaviour of his dad 😔
visual laurel
yeah well...the kid's more likely to change
merry sorrel
or is it more of "is this family not good enough for you"?
visual laurel
it is but that implies the anger of being discarded
merry sorrel
than tsuning...
digital crag
the whole deal with meg is really sad because she's like "if you weren't trying to escape this lowkey abusive household then hades wouldn't be mad and making life miserable for everyone"
visual laurel
yeah :/
digital crag
but like ofc she can't speak out against hades
merry sorrel
but meg also implies that hades was the one being unreasonable
visual laurel
hades is a force nobody can do anything about so meg lashes out along lower ranks
digital crag
so it's just sad
visual laurel
tries desperately not to recommend lindsey ellis' video on guardians of the galaxy 2 again
sick grove
Sometimes I think about ways to try and make everyone happy narrative-wise, and I keep coming back to 'delete the dad and everybody wins'
merry sorrel
hades is also tsundere... implied tsundere... in a way...
visual laurel
meg's strict adherence to duty is probably as much a defensive mechanism as it is a sense of responsibility (meg is the responsible one, she keeps the house together - she and nyx have convos like this and it wouldn't shock me if nyx was largely responsible for instilling that sense)
they're allied in their feeling that they keep everybody else out of trouble
they feel most responsible for regulating hades' moods
and sometimes that means being harsh or cruel to others in the house
something something women doing emotional labor this isn't a discourse i can fully have yet bc the narrative ain't done BUT
merry sorrel
I feel like hades is the one who needed to get out of the house more
if he changed his behaviours, the house might be better
visual laurel
oh absolutely, he's the focus of the dysfunction
sick grove
Change the dad, beat the game
digital crag
yeah it's just that everyone else in the house is so under his control nobody has the power to call him out on it
merry sorrel
zag being a young man, the temptation of seeing the outside world must be intense, he would still try to reach it if the dad was more functional, but instead of putting everybody through hell like this it would be a lot more relaxed
visual laurel
except thanatos possibly but he's too strongly tied to nyx to even dream of upsetting the status quo and endangering her and hypnos imo
merry sorrel
thanatos still has to go outside for his job, now and then
digital crag
hades made than the golden child
merry sorrel
zag could even go and be his buddy- not cop but coworker I guess
visual laurel
yeah
sick grove
I love the line about Zag thinking the outside world might just be a lie. I love love LOVE it.
merry sorrel
thanatos is all goth and stuff, but the butterfly he gives you is so pastel
merry sorrel
thanatos is pastel goth dressing as emo goth
visual laurel
possibly punishing shades in tartarus
harsh sleet
thanatos is a sweet pure boy hidden under all that eyeliner and hot topic
digital crag
zag's standing right there and hades is like "take a break thanatos you're doing a great job you perfect hardworking boy"
visual laurel
than has no peers and no emotional outlet and is under a huge amount of pressure
sick grove
Zag would make a lovely bartender. He's a great listener, and loves shoving drink onto people.
digital crag
hypnos also standing right there
visual laurel
and zag who seems to be the closest thing than does have to a friend/peer/what have you, decides to leave out of the blue with the express intent of not coming back
sick grove
I was so excited when Than first popped up into my games. And the first handful of lines he gives Zag are some of the sharpest and most cutting in the entire game. Zag really, really hurt Than. It's so sad.
visual laurel
yeah he really did, and zag's clearly not entirely sure what to do with that anger either - tho it also sounds like it's not the first time he's upset than
digital crag
brb drawing pastel goth than
visual laurel
oh extremely good
bleak osprey
thanatos’s anger hurts because it’s so much more personal than meg’s, yeah
visual laurel
it also hurts because zag acknowledges it in a way he doesn't acknowledge meg's
visual laurel
like with meg he's like "haha classic meg, she's mad at me? nothing new"
harsh sleet
on top of thanatos being angry he’s also then confused like a few days later when he finds out they’re not even brothers
sick grove
Meg has a 'let's keep this professional' vibe about her that I really respect. But I feel like there's a boiling point that hasn't been reached yet. Than, on the other hand, hit his boiling point in the first darn dialogue, and every point after that has been a gentle simmering.
bleak osprey
whereas he seems to have gotten on well enough with than before that him being so bitter and angry is like. big oof
harsh sleet
which probably didn’t help at all 
visual laurel
yeah than panicked and he's been cooling off ever since gkjdfgd
bleak osprey
whomst
simple sparrow
Thanatos got that 'I've got .5 friends, and all of them are leaving.'
merry sorrel
meg and zag did still flirt in their pre-battle quotes
bleak osprey
than: [hears about zag trying to escape]
than: i have to go right now immediately
than: ZAG COME BAAAAAACK
merry sorrel
"tell me, how do you want this done" "long and painful please" "man after my own heart"
visual laurel
zag's Soft™ voice that he only ever uses with Thanatos (and a tiny handful of other lines) kills me every damn time
bleak osprey
mood
harsh sleet
mood
bleak osprey
Soft Voice Zag is most painful zag
sick grove
Than: I need to convince him not to leave! This is incredibly important!
Than: [proceeds to rip into his one and only friend]
harsh sleet
thanatos is emotionally constipated can we please be nice to him
digital crag
Gen tle.......
harsh sleet
zagreus wearing that shirt that says “please be nice to me” on the front and “or i WILL cry” on the back
visual laurel
zag: if i'm just gentle enough for long enough than will like me again
(it works so like)
digital crag
he gives me stuff, i give him stuff
bleak osprey
my boys........ 
digital crag
it's a sustainable relationship
visual laurel
gdkjghdf sustainable
sick grove
Will murrrrder ever break her running gag for an amazing moment? Will Than ever learn how to use words?
visual laurel
eco-friendly
harsh sleet
thanatos: im so mad at you for trying to leave
thanatos: but also let me help you
also thanatos: god why am@i helping you i’m gonna get fired
zagreus: 
bleak osprey
mmmmmurderer
can you say literally anything else
.......yes
WHAT
and nobody will ever believe you.
visual laurel
than is a complicated young man gkdfjgdf
side note: thematic implications of zag literally dating death?? wild
merry sorrel
I mean... who doesn't at some point...
sick grove
Theory on who Zag has murdered to implicit her wrath: The list is constantly growing, as boons and Daedalus upgrades continue to hit the cutting room floor.
She's just mad about builds dying.
harsh sleet
we all want to date death
bleak osprey
mood
digital crag
than: listen to me i want you to come home
zag: no i can't
Death Defied!
harsh sleet
LMAO
bleak osprey
okay but the implications of death defy
visual laurel
i like to imagine he just scrapes you off the floor and drags you home lol
harsh sleet
sparrow is getting out their galaxy brain
visual laurel
that's their secret
sparrow is always galaxy brain
harsh sleet
bleak osprey
i don’t know if that’s a compliment or not ven gdhgkfkdj
but yeah if you death defy when than’s around it makes it sound like he’s the one making sure you don’t die, which gives me feelings
and of course there’s “let’s go home, zag” if you die For Real
visual laurel
he has a number of lines if you die for real and they range from vaguely disappointed to mildly amused
Oh, Zag... is a good one gkjgfd
simple sparrow
Guys, you're making me want to do another Thanatophile run...
bleak osprey
sounds like a regular run to me
harsh sleet
same
simple sparrow
Which is the one where you go grim inevitability and try to get a pierced butterfly as high as possible
bleak osprey
bc i’m always love the boy
merry sorrel
technically, considering a god like zag's weird mortality/immortality, than can come collect him as many times as they want
digital crag
so when athena gives you an extra dd she's just telling thanatos to go easy on you
visual laurel
bring down a local psychopomp's dangerously high blood pressure by making an effort not to get brutally killed this time
bleak osprey
god. i love that thanatos is trying to encourage you not to die
merry sorrel
where is the option to give than a hug...
harsh sleet
i rlly wanna hear the voice lines outside of the game but im dummy thicc and dunno how to do it 
so i’ll live
visual laurel
right next to the mythical "pet cerberus" button
harsh sleet
can you pet the dog more like can you hug the than
bleak osprey
“look, this will make you better at fighting if YOU DONT GET HIT. please. please stop getting hit.”
simple sparrow
That's why Thanatos is really behind on his work. He keeps having to backtrack into the underworld, like, 'Seriously, Zag? Again?'
merry sorrel
does than have high blood pressure or low, some people (e.g. myself) gets dangerously low blood pressure when emotional or stress
visual laurel
does thanatos have blood
merry sorrel
it would be funny for a workaholic like than to see zag, gets emotional, and then pass out on the floor
ok, maybe ichor, but you get my point
harsh sleet
low ichor pressure