i lucked out and got epic attack a second ago so all good but i hadnt thought about that thanks for the tip
#h1-builds-and-combat
ebon tinsel
bronze sorrel
I didn't beat the boss until my 134th run. Though the final boss room didn't exist until my 132nd run if I recall correctly, so ya....
bronze sorrel
Depends on the weapon
fair plinth
mind explaining a tad more?
bronze sorrel
If a duo boon is gonna be core to your build, get legacy, otherwise pride
What weapon are you on?
fair plinth
isn't duo = epic quality anyway?
bronze sorrel
No
fair plinth
hrmm
fair plinth
well i'm still doing it on a rotation currently, whichever has the night bonus
bronze sorrel
Same with legendary boons
fair plinth
I don't think I will specialize until I'm pushing high heats
bronze sorrel
Do you have aspects unlocked?
bronze sorrel
Any blood on the zag aspects?
bronze sorrel
Which ones?
fair plinth
shield/sword/talon/bow
fair plinth
(fist)
magic dagger
ah, gotcha
cunning urchin
If a duo boon is gonna be core to your build, get legacy, otherwise pride
I'd still take Pride, either way.
bronze sorrel
I'd still take Pride, either way.
@cunning urchin really?
cunning urchin
Yes.
silk anvil
@cunning urchin really?
@bronze sorrel they know how to RNG manip
magic dagger
Yes.
@cunning urchin are you sure
cunning urchin
Yes.
bronze sorrel
@cunning urchin are you sure
@magic dagger the troll must be sprayed again
silk anvil
Epic tier stuffs are pretty gud
cunning urchin
RNG manipulation? I don't route if that's what you're talking about.
bronze sorrel
Idk, I've heard Wrist say he prefers legacy, but Nyaanyaa knows her stuff.
magic dagger
duo boons are pretty common once you have the prereqs anyways, and minibosses, yarn, and eurydice's nectar give increased boon rarity
cunning urchin
Wriste13 also knows his stuff.
bronze sorrel
This was also 1.0 prepatch. Did they change the odds?
cunning urchin
They buffed Dark Foresight.
fair plinth
for stygius, would you prefer shadow presence or fiery presence
cunning urchin
Shadow Presence.
bronze sorrel
Ah, so maybe you want God's pride because you aren't taking olympian favor?
worn citrus
Going for a cast build using aspect of poseidon. What would be the best cast to aim for if I could have any?
magic dagger
shadow presence for pretty much anything, because fiery presence just procs so much less often than shadow presence
cunning urchin
I kinda like Fiery Presence on Hestia.
worn citrus
It'd have to be a cast that can actually lodge in enemies, I'd assume
worn citrus
Ok, true
bronze sorrel
Getting exit wounds on Poseidon is really fun though
worn citrus
But I felt that it might increase DPS if I can do more casts. I realise now that that might not necessarily be the case though. Exit wounds look lit tho
fair plinth
after unlocking all mirror of night, are cthonic keys pretty much useless except to trade for nectar?
waxen onyx
I am trying Varatha, Hades aspect.
What boons?
What daedulus?
cunning urchin
So I like to keep enough around to take those deals.
cunning urchin
Trying to have answered all of the questions in this channel is truly a Sisyphean task.
leaden prism
and chill dash maybe
cunning urchin
I need sleep lol. Good night, and good luck! 
final scaffold
how does crystal beam work with hera bow?
since the crystal themselves don't deal damage when they come out, does the hera bow shot deal no damage initially?
waxen onyx
I will try that @leaden prism
robust geyser
Uhm, is Guan Yu worth even trying?
The penalty is massive, and only becomes at least somewhat bearable at level 5, which is an investment of 12 titan blood.
The healing gimmick doesn't really work, because it's way too slow to charge.
The special damage is good, at least, but... is that worth the trouble?
@final scaffold the bow shot works as normal, and the cast pops out... I think from where you stand?
limber pine
Guan Yu works fine, you don't have to charge it fully
unkempt pagoda
unless it’s cold embrace, crystal beam is quite bad on hera
robust geyser
It only heals 1hp per enemy hit without full charge.
unkempt pagoda
crystal beam pops at where the arrow hits, like all the other casts
limber pine
and 1hp for each hit works fine when it's multiple and you can spam it
limber pine
get Demeter or Athena attack on Guan Yu for more safety
final scaffold
on non-hera run
robust geyser
Hera won't change that feeling.
limber pine
get fast charge, bigger special AOE or the Guan Yu hammer upgrade
robust geyser
Oh, I should probably mention that I always play with forced overtime.
Which doesn't mean I'm good enough to always play with forced overtime, but I do it anyway.
limber pine
it's still doable
robust geyser
Interesting.
I suppose I'll keep trying.
Though I don't want to invest blood into it yet, which... is kind of a vicious cycle of lack of investment?
solid cairn
is maim damage affected by special damage increases
robust geyser
Unrelated question: are Ares's attack and special good on anything now?...
I remember liking the attack on the bow right when early access started, but now everything is much, much faster.
unkempt pagoda
they’re good on merciful end
limber pine
doom effects activate immediately with a deflect attack
leaden prism
is beam strongest cast on achillies? or dio bomb
robust geyser
I confess that I never tried making a duo build intentionally.
Could be interesting.
Especially considering that I recently realised that dark foresight is really good?
It seems possible to get an entire run without getting keys, darkness, or gems from a chamber.
Only goodies for the run itself.
limber pine
yeah Dark Foresight's really good if you aren't farming for darkness and stuff
ebon tinsel
Do all spear spin attacks heal?
ebon tinsel
Thought so thanks
acoustic venture
I’m struggling with || EM4 || regardless of what weapon I’m using, anyone have some specific tips or tricks for the fight?
drifting vale
@fair plinth yes and the pull in works too
@acoustic venture im just starting to get the hang out of now myself so maybe some else will have better advice
Currently || ive found its most of the time not worth focusing on ads unless theyre wringers which demand a lot of attention or kill them
During the summon either dodge towards cerebrus or top left corner of the left side the extra space or bottom side extra corner although ive found that side less consistent
During the bell toll phase either just burst him down since hes not fighting back at least lower the amount you gotta fight through
Or run around and break the pots he'll heal less
Personally i find the first option better
And lastly the dark phase is a lot of quick reaction and learning sound que's||
static jacinth
EM4 is pretty rough. No other heat levels active?
fair plinth
ooooooh
managed to snag ares aid + engulfing vortex + legendary vicious cycle
time for some big aid damage
oof
athena room for divine dash or hermes room for more dash
zag stygian + hermes boon for 30% increased attack speed + athena's divine attack
drifting vale
Hermes
If you can get ares dash too
fair plinth
I feel like deadpool from the wolverine movie
drifting vale
Just double up on vicious cycle
fair plinth
okay what the hell, I'm at elysium chamber 28 now and STILL zero hammers
drifting vale
F
magic dagger
happens
drifting vale
Its all rng
magic dagger
it sucks
acoustic venture
I’m just getting clipped by spin timing when usually I have that down, not sure if it’s an off day or what
drifting vale
Unfornate yeah i cant really help you with that
If it helps im still not good at the bomb aoe that he does but thats not EM4 specific
orchid rapids
uneven gale
Not really sure where to ask this but if you give hades nectar before beating the game, how do you get his keep sake?
drifting vale
Yeah guan yu is rough until you max it
vague ledge
Am I the only one that thinks that guan yu needs a serious buff? Its probably the worst final aspect and one of the weakest weapons overall
drifting vale
@uneven gale just keep playing and beating youll get the opportunity to give more
primal hazel
I'd prefer the heal to be on the special
Or rather the spear throw
dry ember
you sacrifice health for not only healing
primal hazel
Having to charge it makes it hella clunky
fair plinth
holy moley
uneven gale
Ok ty
primal hazel
Even arthur is more mobile
vague ledge
that base damage increase is not worth it
dry ember
drifting vale
Compared to other 4th honestly i think fists is the worst
dry ember
well idk, this says otherwise
fair plinth
one greater ares ult with the vicious cycle killed asterius from 50% hp
primal hazel
Imo it's a bit to much that it's always -50% if all health you gain
fair plinth
wow
dry ember
that's just with a single deadly strike
drifting vale
Skill makes up for it really as you get better it's strengths show
magic dagger
GY is good
drifting vale
Personally shield 4th is underwhelming but not bad
And fists 4th is just too slow to be worth it and the very mild damage increase is meh
magic dagger
just kill stuff quickly with that huge base damage and better special, and don't get hit
primal hazel
4th is slow???
I mean every weapon is good if I don't get hit
Thanks for the advice
magic dagger
well, sure
drifting vale
Yep and that's perfectly alright i don't like gun at all none of them appeal to me
primal hazel
I make sure to get hit less when playing gy
magic dagger
but it's easier to not get hit with GY than with most other weapons
dry ember
People who think a certain aspect is bad just haven't had a good run with it.
primal hazel
Well I can't disagree with you on that
median oar
I don't know if I'm just super accustomed or crutched to having two dodges but I'm trying to do a run with the one dodge green talent for the achievement and it is completely decimating me
this is utterly miserable
robust anchor
takingg me a while to max out all aspects good golly
drifting vale
Also yeah fists 4th? 4 seconds for the gimmick is pointless when i kill them in under 2
primal hazel
@magic dagger how exactly is it easier to not get hit with gy?
dry ember
use it for bosses, minibosses, and armored unit
magic dagger
the special is huge damage, with a huge hitbox, and fast
drifting vale
I mean yeah but then i'm barely using it so i'll just stick with demeter
dry ember
how exactly is it easier to not get hit with gy?
I would assume it's the same way that it's easier to dodge with Hestia
primal hazel
You mean the rocket?
magic dagger
just special from range, sort of kind of line up enemies, and you will hit and quite possibly kill all of them without ever risking yourself
primal hazel
To be fair I used gy on level 1
-70% is p punishing
magic dagger
arti/aphro flourish with charged skewer is insane
drifting vale
Yeah gy lvl 1 is painful
primal hazel
Huh I've been trying to manly use the charge attack
Yeah I got charged skewer
That one was fune
vague ledge
im using Gy max vl and im barely getting past elysium with 0 dd
primal hazel
I'll try it out
magic dagger
spin builds are, despite the healing, not only slower than but riskier than special builds
primal hazel
Well seems I was building wrong
dry ember
If powershotting with Rama on FO2 is doable, spinning with Spear should also be doable
drifting vale
Good point
magic dagger
sure it's possible
drifting vale
Just takes practice
magic dagger
it's just not as safe or fast as some other builds
drifting vale
At least GY spin is range i don't get people that like hades spin
primal hazel
Spin to lose
drifting vale
The damage boost is decent but not worth standing still
magic dagger
you can hit entire tartarus rooms
robust anchor
ballet zag
magic dagger
with one attack
drifting vale
I mean i guess? You have to full charge though and i'm too impatient
primal hazel
Why no go fast
drifting vale
?
primal hazel
I only do go fast
drifting vale
Yeah thats why i don't like hades spear the aoe charge up takes too long also standing still
queen latch
Even with hammer upgrade?
magic dagger
quik spin makes it almost instant
limber pine
normal charge is 3 pulses, hammer makes it 1 for GY
wanton night
Anyone got tips for Aspect of Arthur
primal hazel
Artemis attack
wanton night
The damage is higher but im used to spamming back attacks and the play style is really different
Just go with big bursting damage?
primal hazel
You can dash during the second and third slash and still attack
A lot of your attacks can be interrupted by faster enemies though
dark quail
What's a good nemesis build?
primal hazel
So be careful a kit your placement
wanton night
Mmm
queen latch
Just place aura down first so enemies are slowed
limber pine
Aphro attack for nemesis
primal hazel
Aura also slows projectiles
fair plinth
so how does aspect of archilles work? Special -> rush -> hit 4x ->repeat?
primal hazel
Take the aura upgrade from hammet
dark quail
@limber pine what do you usually put on special?
limber pine
anything should work for special, Artemis dash and support fire would be nice considering how much you dash attack
lyric bloom
wow I just got merciful end and not even with a weapon that's particularly good for it
wow
that's
a lot of damage
queen latch
How does merciful end work? It activates with deflected attacks, or also with attacks that can deflect?
Like dash
stoic thicket
Attacks that can deflect.
dark quail
I always used artemis on attack for nemesis, aphrodite is better?
limber pine
nemesis already has like 30% crit, aphro has a high multiplier
queen latch
Ill need to try it out
stoic thicket
Note: Dash alone isn't enough to actually get Merciful End now.
Merciful End requires Ares Attack or Special and Athena Attack or Special. Dash can still trigger ME, but it's not a qualifier to actually get the boon.
queen latch
Ill check the boon list (what a quality of life) when i do my next run
hexed dust
tf charged shot and sudden rush is so cheesy 
does artemis crit stack with the special stack from nemesis?
robust anchor
yes
smoky atlas
man, i wish other gods have such good battle cries like demeter
you can barely hear them say anything when you call them, except for demeter's screams
onyx parcel
How do I upgrade companions?
Meg’s specifically. So that I could use it against redacted
stoic thicket
Oh, that. You need to wait until after the credits, Redacted should give you permission at some point.
minor osprey
So any tips for dealing with Hades? 19 hours into the game and it's the only thing I can't get past, getting to him is generally not a problem but his fight just drains me of all death defiances etc.
stoic thicket
He telegraphs his attacks fairly well, it's mostly just about either crazily outdamaging him or learning his patterns. In the beginning it's likely #2.
The spin attack hurts like hell, if you have the choice between eating a skull explosion or the spin, pick the skull.
onyx parcel
Oh, that. You need to wait until after the credits, Redacted should give you permission at some point.
@stoic thicket so talk to redacted basically?
stoic thicket
You can actually stand in his large 360° laser in phase 2 without being hurt as long as you are standing on him.
primal hazel
Since your dash has I-Frames you can time it to not get hurt by the spin
Even if you don't dash out of it
minor osprey
I feel like my main issue might be not having enough movement boons that help me get out of the spin attack's reach in time
primal hazel
Take the hermes boon that gives you multiple dashes
stoic thicket
The timing on that can be quite tight though.
minor osprey
Guess I should try and get more hermes boons
stoic thicket
Athena dash is always helpful.
smoky atlas
you wait for the white circle to complete the spin, then dash in any direction
primal hazel
Athena dash and hermes additional dashes are run changing
onyx parcel
Athena dash best dash
primal hazel
Almost enough to win on their own imo
stoic thicket
Lately I'm quite partial to Water Uncle's dash but for defensive purposes nothing beats Athena.
jaunty locust
how much larger is the I-frame window on the athena dash?
onyx parcel
how much larger is the I-frame window on the athena dash?
@jaunty locust the same if you are just dashing. But the thing is you get the same amount of i frames when ur dash striking
That’s the most important thing
smoky atlas
5x tidal dash with some poseidon rupture/splash/sea storm is nuts
jaunty locust
oh, so if I dash-strike I don't cancel the I-frames?
jaunty locust
Ohhhhhhh okay okay. How many frames is it?
primal hazel
You a frame kinda guy?
onyx parcel
Pretty damn forgiving
primal hazel
It's incredible
minor osprey
I've heard about athena dash giving more invulnerability frames as well, so that's just a myth then?
jaunty locust
I'm not going to be able to count frames, but I could do frames or I could do seconds
smoky atlas
youre invincible for almost the entire duration of the dash (athena isnt required)
onyx parcel
I've heard about athena dash giving more invulnerability frames as well, so that's just a myth then?
@minor osprey not sure about that
jaunty locust
oh, ok, ENTIRE DURATION. If I cancel the dash into another dash do I have a vulnerability moment or do I remain invincible?
jaunty locust
okay, so getting hit by Hades' spin attack is just FULLY a result of poor timing, since a double-chained dash is like at least a quarter second and that spin does nto last TH AT long
smoky atlas
if you chain multiple dashes, and dont dash-strike (unless athena), youre in godmode for the entire chain
can test it yourself. just dash spam inside theseus' circles
jaunty locust
question: what do you lose in terms of progression etc. etc. if you do turn on god-mode? I don't think I want to use it right now but I could see playing around with it and don't want it to mess up my game
worn citrus
What cast would be the best for || The dragon rush with hidden aspect of shield||? I'm guessing Dio?
jaunty locust
bold of you to think I have pride
primal hazel
I find dio pretty bothersome cause you have to wait for the clouds to disappear to get your stones back
jaunty locust
I am glad that I can, say, toggle it on and off without it doing anything other than meaning I can sort of space out a bi tmore or w/e
jaunty locust
also: the casts like dio's and Ares' and Demeter's... that eliminates the damage-if-enemy-has-stone ability right?
hasty garnet
So apparently the bounce shot upgrade works with Aspect of Rama. So this huge wave just bounces around hitting a bunch of enemies.
good stuff
hasty garnet
it also ahs knockback while I ahve Sea Storm, so it just zips around throwing everyone around and then zapping them.
primal hazel
Also makes it unable for poseidon aspect to dislodge
I have to try that
You actually fire waves lol
Let's go surfing
jaunty locust
playing around with cast is something I haven't really done that much of. It's probably worth a shot to experiment with some of those
hasty garnet
My last run had a decent cast build. Zeus' cast with a Zeus/Artemis Duo that made lightning strike around collectable shards. Shame there isn't more stuff like that iot was really fun.
jaunty locust
caste empowering weapons?
primal hazel
Have you unlocked aspects yet?
jaunty locust
hey is it just me or is.... or is the zeus aspect of the shield pretty... pretty spicy
yes! I have
primal hazel
Hella spicy
jaunty locust
anything that I can throw out as like a sort of stationary area control AOE thing is incredibly fun
primal hazel
Hera bow, 4th shield aspect, poseidon sword and achilles spear are awesome with casts
jaunty locust
will also make it super easy to stack two status effects for the extra juice too
I'll have to give those a try. I'm still switching to whatever weapon is thirstiest because I want to keep good playstyle plasticity (Also, first victory was with the gun which I never woulda picked intentionally) and I want more darkness
hasty garnet
Aspect of Hera is my favorite bow aspect. My last run with it had an Epic level Festive Fog and a lot of crit. Good stuff.
I was just knocking back nuclear bombs at enemies like it was nothing.
primal hazel
Still have to unlock that
Spend my blood on maxing chaos
jaunty locust
at least I'm done with keys so I can save them for blood at the shop
limber pine
there's a ||200 keys|| unlock at Broker
jaunty locust
well, maybe I'd better start saving
jade rover
Ending up with a 24% buff off of strong drink is pretty tight I gotta say
limber pine
yeah strong drink's pretty sweet if you get it early
jade rover
Speaking of our man Dionysus, how do people feel about drunken strike? Am I rating it too low?
digital pebble
is guan yus spear actually good? It seems really bad but maybe it's me
magic dagger
drunken strike is good with curse of nausea and splitting headache
GY is amazing. the special has an enormous hitbox and is faster than the base spear's special
ornate remnant
@bronze sorrel sorry i had to stop my run and go to work, yeah i got the requirements
even got the nectar buffs for 3 boons but i had ares vs athena trial of gods so i wasted it
jade rover
the healing on GY means that, if you got time, you can play patient and live forever
ornate remnant
not knowing i can't get it there
digital pebble
ok i need a video, having 15 HP feels terrible
magic dagger
and the increased base damage means that it's great for dash-strike builds (especially with serrated point)
digital pebble
ty i'll start looking around
limber pine
you need hammer upgrade on it
magic dagger
spin builds are possible but slow and boring imo
limber pine
max it out before using it is also a better experience
magic dagger
15 hp feels terrible, so you do want to use the Thick Skin mirror upgrade.
if you don't have it, get it.
gaunt bridge
how d'ya avoid the aoe rings from the amped big head (+ gorgon) fight?
magic dagger
walk under the shadow, and dash away when you hear the grunting sound effect
and don't get hit by gorgon projectiles.
gaunt bridge
aye, but when amped up he does a damage ring that shoots outwards I can't avoid
magic dagger
by amped do you mean Middle Management?
you have to dash away and then back in
gaunt bridge
some pact condition. semi bosses stronger I guess
magic dagger
just dash through yeah
icy parrot
Bro
Hermes call dodge build is hilarious
I stood in front of redacted's big lasers and just punched him and dodged everything for like six seconds
This is amazing
outer jasper
Hermes has a call?
turbid needle
No, but he has a boon that you can only get when you have a Call.
outer jasper
Ahhhh
turbid needle
Speed up and dodge chance for 6(?) seconds after pressing the button.
drifting vale
Should i go for a 100% dodge chance build
bold salmon
Oooo the bow is ||Rama||
queen latch
||rama|| bow is fun
bold salmon
It looks like it now that im reading the effects
icy parrot
Oh dude I went on a room like that once
How does it even work?? Why do they keep gaining more blue life
red junco
its one of the benefits package effects
tidal edge
with demeter aspect, does most of my damage come from attack or special?
primal hazel
Rare crop actually seems to count the little rooms in styx as encounter
Makes it awesome
Easy heroics
230% tempest flourish
Me likey
Quick question: how does the poseidon legendary interact with bosses?
stark ore
Man I'm so pissed off. Got a 100% dodge chance build but ||dad let me go||
drifting vale
Rupture doesnt stack
primal hazel
Oof
So any benefits in taking the legendary in styx?
Cause otherwise I could choose wave pounding
primal hazel
Only razor shoals
drifting vale
Then wave pounding probably best
primal hazel
Oh yeah how does the barrier think work on bosses?
primal hazel
Yup
drifting vale
Still slam damage is really strong so i could make a case for either
I think the legendary would be more damage then
drifting vale
Also it only works if hes already standing next a wall but it procs regardless him being unable to knocked away
primal hazel
Oh ok so barrier effects just proc when someone
Even a boss is next to a wall
Sucks against lernie ig
drifting vale
If not em2 then you have the pillars
primal hazel
Em2
drifting vale
Unfortunate but yeah basically useless during that fight
primal hazel
Well it's not like it's that difficult after all xD
But for redacted those barrier boons could work
drifting vale
True more annoying than difficult
primal hazel
Next to a pillar f.e.
drifting vale
Yeah or if you can get him trapped in the top cubby area
primal hazel
Nice
Yo massive thanks for your help man
I was a bit confused about poseidon cause I rarely used him
drifting vale
I had a nutty blizzard shot run where i got him stuck in that area and just pelted him
primal hazel
Ooof
drifting vale
Np hes good situational though
primal hazel
Yeah I was aiming for blizzard shot but granny doesn't wanna
drifting vale
Yeah sounds right
primal hazel
Yup
I was just annoyed by knockaway technically not working against bosses
Unless you have a boon for it
drifting vale
Its strange but it still works in a sense
primal hazel
Yep though hampered as far as I'm seeing it
red junco
is spread fire just a troll if ur using hestia?
primal hazel
Speaking of the devil
Just got blizzard
Hestia actually fires a normal ranged shot
Even with slreadfire
wise aspen
can the bomb hammer upgrades be gotten on the secret rail aspect? wiki doesnt say
red junco
it doesnt do any more damage tho right cuz it alters the base damage, not adds
primal hazel
Dunno if intended tho
The hestia damage overwrites
From my experience
It seems it gets counted as its own shot
leaden prism
Can someone tell me what casts to use with achillies spear and how to use demeter fists
primal hazel
@wise aspen some of them yes
I'm not sure if all of them
Triple fire and the target definitely
wise aspen
hmm okay
primal hazel
Good question I'd like to know that too
outer jasper
Anyone else find the Rail gun very lack luster?
primal hazel
Nope
red junco
no. i find it very op
outer jasper
Aight then what am i missing on
wise aspen
cluster bomb is the only hammer upgrade i have left for prophecy so im just wondering if i should use the secret aspect or not
drifting vale
I find rail gun lack luster but i also know it doesnt fit my playstyle
leaden prism
The only hammers I’d take with hestia is explosive/pierce/bouncy shots, or stuff that enhances your special
Like cluster/triple/big bomb and rocket
primal hazel
I mean you can still do a secret run and if it doesn't show up another just for the bomb
You'll have to finish multiple runs with the gun either way
drifting vale
@wise aspen phy
Achilles either posiedan, demeter, zeus personally
And demeter fists can be played quite a few different ways
leaden prism
But poseidon and zeus cast stick
You want casts that don’t stick right
Unless you are using stygian soul
outer jasper
any builds or gods I should be on the lookout for the rail gun? I use the orpheus trinket got tons of artemis and a chaos damage boost but it still feels very lack luster in terms of damage
red junco
@outer jasper it depends on the aspect
leaden prism
Pray you get good special hammers and rush hestia lvl5
Default exagryph attack is a joke
drifting vale
I only use stygian so theres a bias there
outer jasper
Ah yep im using default
red junco
yeah that is the issue
leaden prism
Don’t your dps suck with stygian
red junco
Eris and hestia are much better
outer jasper
whats hestia 5
onyx parcel
any builds or gods I should be on the lookout for the rail gun? I use the orpheus trinket got tons of artemis and a chaos damage boost but it still feels very lack luster in terms of damage
@outer jasper Zeus attack
drifting vale
Depends how you use it
drifting vale
?
leaden prism
You gotta bank hard for hermes quick reload or chaos extra casts
drifting vale
I think youre missing the purpose of stygian
leaden prism
How
primal hazel
Zeus attack is always a good option on gun
Less so for hestia
More so for Lucifer
red junco
i always go for zeus attack on eris
outer jasper
Oh ya just wondering besides from trading do the keys do anything once ya unlock the full mirror?
leaden prism
respec
primal hazel
Guess I like poseidon now
Had a nutty chaos shield+tempest flourish run
Yup
You'll find out in time
It's post game stuff
leaden prism
Poseidon is the most powerful god outside of boss rooms
outer jasper
ah ok cool
leaden prism
I was thinking of chaos with hangover special
jaunty locust
because of Poseidon's ability to shove enemies around?
primal hazel
Can confirm that fun
leaden prism
Wall splat damage is nuts dude
primal hazel
Yeah shove damage does regular enemies in
leaden prism
Makes styx a joke
drifting vale
To start with you dont have to pick them back up so its safer
Secondly the bonus damage applies to attack too and thats mainly where your damage will come from
The cast is used to give you lodge bonuses and some extra damage
jaunty locust
I don't actually know how the wall damage is calculated
but yeah, throwing enemies around to clear them out is v. handy
leaden prism
But spear attack does ass damage
drifting vale
If youre wanting a cast build just go posiedan sword or other cast ascepts
leaden prism
Why not just go full cast
leaden prism
With dio/demeterp
jaunty locust
I actually got my first (And so far only) clear thanks to the rail, with an aphrodite + hazard bomb, because it can arc over obstacles
leaden prism
What makes no sense
drifting vale
Same that was how i got my first clear
Spear does no damage
That doesnt make sense
leaden prism
+150% damage to next 4 cast is way more powerful than +150% damage to your next 4 spear pokes
drifting vale
If thats how you wanna play it its there for you but i have no problems in the damage department doing it that way
jaunty locust
spear's standard attack dealing about 30-45 a poke is pretty respectable
tidal edge
I've got the reqs for merciful end on demeter fists but I just got the option to replace doom attack with heroic hangover attack
thoughts? 
jaunty locust
alas, I'm not familiar enough to give an opinion
turbid needle
So what are the best gods to go with the spear ? 2 times loosing on final boss idk what i am doing wrong
Builds seem nice until I get to hades
jaunty locust
I remember ages ago people suggested Ares attack because of the distance you can get, but idk if that's actually useful anymore
idk what the current meta is
turbid needle
I think my last run was a zeus/poseidon mix but idk it was underwhelming
jaunty locust
Poseidon from what I've heard with the pushing and wall slam boosts is really good for clearing out mobs and rooms, but loses that power against bosses because they aren't pushable
so you want something else to make up for the fact that an enormous part of Poseidon's output just doesn't work against them
hard holly
Damn, Hermes refuses to drop his other legendary for me
glass rapids
how does spread fire work with hestia
bronze sorrel
Poseidon from what I've heard with the pushing and wall slam boosts is really good for clearing out mobs and rooms, but loses that power against bosses because they aren't pushable
@jaunty locust You can push them, just not as much, and they're sturdy, kinda like how Armored enemies are. Getting a wall slam vs a boss is nearly impossible though, and it also doesn't really work in Elysium or Asphodel, so wall slam isnt really worth building for.
Sea Storm, Razor Shoals, Wave Pounding and Second Wave can all be decent picks though, in my experience, since they don't rely on wall slam. Its really just Breaking Wave and Typhoon's Fury.
jaunty locust
Right right. I guess pick 'em up if you get'em. Asphodel doesn't have walls really but elysium feels like it has enough here and there, and the final area absolutely does
bronze sorrel
Wall slam is great in Styx but I don't have much trouble clearing styx, idk about you
jaunty locust
I think it depends on general weapon setup tbh.
bronze sorrel
Elysium is easily the toughest zone
jaunty locust
I feel like when I've had the spear, it's done very well aganst the weapon enemies
but a lot of mroe short range weapons i can get a bit more diced up
bronze sorrel
Right but when you start turning on Benefits Package, Forced Overtime and Tight Deadline it gets alot harder
Also, greatshields are just my bane. I hate them.
jaunty locust
oh boy. Zeus aegis with zeus special boon? Oh boy
it DID 8 a hit, now it does 8+38 a hit, that's.... quite an increase
unkempt pagoda
wait until you max it out and start doing 30+38 on a hit
(and now your play is to keeping stacking zeus)
jaunty locust
oh yeah, absolutely. Okay I got too enamored with playing around with that to actually pay attention and I took WAY too much tartarus dmage for having the shield
let's run this again
jaunty locust
Pressure points -- does it work for like, extra damage like zeus lightning bolts, or only your attacks
lament creek
all damage is all damage
dreamy vale
New here, so is stubborn defiance just strictly better than death defiance or?
lament creek
no
dreamy vale
Cool, when would you take one over the other?
lament creek
death defiance is good when bosses wreck you
stubborn defiance is better on higher heat levels where everything wrecks you but you have bosses figured out
if you don't know what heat is don't worry about it
dreamy vale
Hmm I see, I see
lyric bloom
DD also heals more than SD
jaunty locust
yeah, becuase death defiance can fire multiple times per boss chamber
dreamy vale
Makes sense. I guess I just see SD as more "noob friendly" I suppose
Though I did make it to the last boss (at least I assume) with 1 DD earlier with 2 points in it
jaunty locust
SD is probably better for if you find you're in trouble a lot during tiers. If you're only getting walled at bosses, then
hey, is there a special technique for keeping me playing normally when I have teh zeus aegis up because i mostly jus tspend all my time fooling around with it and getting beat up
jaunty solar
does using multiple DD in the same encounter stack Blood Frenzy buff?
left dirge
If presented with the option, do you guys usually take the -1 +2 hammer in Styx?
daring cargo
So I just got 15 bloods from a prophecy....what weapons are more blood upgrade dependent? My thoughts are ||Chiron, the combo gloves, and maybe Arthur||?
left dirge
Given that you don’t have some crazy build which depends heavily on your current hammer choices
spiral tree
How do I get guan yu?
and you can get 15 bloods from an the minor prophecy table all at once? @left dirge damn
untold vortex
check the pinned messages in #h1-story-discussion
hard holly
Arthur doesnt really care about blood upgrades
spiral tree
ok
outer oar
what do people recommend for optimizing cluster bomb? i have a lot of fun with bouncing the nades off of walls and stuff to stack 5 hits on things, curious if people have any specific builds they like with it
hard holly
Theyre ok, but not that important, at least without lasting consequences
Definitely Demeter, definitely Chiron
And Hestia
unkempt pagoda
cluster bomb optimizes with rocket bomb
outer oar
thanks
spiral tree
first time using gloves
heavy knuckle/breaching cross/or concentrated knuckle?
just started this run
untold vortex
breaching cross
unkempt pagoda
heavy knuckle lets you use damage modifier gods easier
gusty parcel
Breaching cross is my preference. Just being able to deal with armour more effectively is chef's kiss.
Especially if you have the heat turned up with perks on armoured foes.
untold vortex
yes, it used to be 1000% at one point
gusty parcel
Yup. It's really nice to have.
hard holly
Breaching Cross or Concentrated knuckle
spiral tree
just unlocked talos aspect
hard holly
Heavy Knuckle seems to just be a significantly worse version of ||Gilgamesh|| attack
spiral tree
this magnetic pull move seems really good
hmm it seems to even interrupt enemy attacks!
curse of pain/blade dash/ares aid
hmmm leaning towards aid
especially since its epic
hard holly
Ares aid is pretty good
bold salmon
Does Ricochet mix with zues base attack?
stray holly
How does one deal with Asterius' charge with FO1?
gusty parcel
You can dash past him to buy you time. Other then that it's just experience so you recognize when he's prepping to charge
spiral tree
I just dash through him
stray holly
I do that but he just turns around too fast lol
spiral tree
stagger your double dash then like dash once through them and when he turns around dash through him again and then run till you can dash again
smoky atlas
@main osprey thats a really funny build
main osprey
my ares dash?
main osprey
keep in mind, that build was from several patches ago, and might not work quite as well (I just don't know)
probably still good though
even better with Malphon's 4th
stray holly
Exagryph 4 is funny
smoky atlas
ive heard ppl say hermes extra dash still spawns with gilgamesh
but so far ive rerolled many of his boon choices and havent seen it
mighty ermine
it does indeed spawn with gilgamesh
no hermes boons are off the table while using gil
smoky atlas
youre not making me feel better 
smoky atlas
i wont stop until i achieve 8 dashes
stray holly
What do the main halls themes change?
I don't see a difference when swapping between them
stray holly
mighty ermine
you might be thinking of the in-run boon/victory menu styles
yep
those aren't for the house, they're for you
stray holly
what
That is so unclear lmao
mighty ermine
but yeah you can swap between them and they're just a little extra aesthetic touch for your menus
mighty ermine
lol
quartz remnant
I just unlocked the hidden spear aspect. What boons are good for it?
I'm thinking Athena to make it safer?
random light
Athena yeah
If you're good at not getting hit, take the High Confidence mirror talent
random light
If you want to do an attack damage based build, hidden spear relies very heavily on Rapid Spin hammer
honestly if you have that Hammer and you can work with the max HP cut, the hidden spear aspect is extremely flexible in potential build paths
daring cargo
What would some potential builds be for that
I need to get to the surface with 4th spear yet and the style is not clicking
unkempt pagoda
artemis charged skewer
don't need quick spin if your main source of damage is extremely safe and extremely powerful
daring cargo
Ty
mild bone
Just won my first game! I'm curious about how others with more experience think about regular attack vs dash-attack, anything I may be missing in my thinking. It's nice and quick and with spear and shield has a wider arc. Artemis has a bonus for dash-attack specifically (which stacks on top of other bonuses you might have for regular attack, right?) and I've seen a hammer bonuses for dash-attacks counting double, but in general I consider it the same as a regular attack unless I'm zooming around and have a chance to use it. Thoughts about using it more intentionally?
daring cargo
Your normal attCk boon will stack with your dash attack iirc
Like if you have an Aphrodite on normal
unkempt pagoda
for sword, dash attack spam is the meta precisely because of that double-dash-attack hammer (but also because it's faster than going through the combo)
for bow, dash attack should be your only source of damage (for an attack build). while it might do less damage, the faster charging time and mobility outweighs the damage loss (which you can patch up with artemis or chaos)
for spear, dash attack is okay until you get serrated point (spear's best hammer imo). from then it becomes a monster, in exchange for some unsafety in a smaller dash range, which is why i don't recommend it until you start getting better with dash positioning
mild bone
I'm a little confused as to how to aim the bow dash-attack on a controller. It generally shoots the thing you dash toward right? But it also will hit some things to the side if nothing is there. Bow is my least used and just one my game with claw (somehow, I thought claw was my worst 🙂 )
unkempt pagoda
i won't talk about shield because i don't use it often, but dashing wallop should be the way to go
mild bone
Thanks @daring cargo
smoky atlas
dash in a direction of your choice, then quickly nudge the stick towards the general direction of an enemy
i will snap to the target
unkempt pagoda
rail's dash attack is kinda boring, but at least hunter dash works for it
mild bone
Yeah agreed on rail. Thanks @smoky atlas.
unkempt pagoda
fists' dash attack is quite useful in that you'll be holding down attack anyways. breaching cross is especially useful as well
one important thing to note is that while dashes have i-frames, performing a dash attack will get rid of those i-frames, so they can be unsafe in the wrong situations
mild bone
Ah, so you're holding down attack, and if you dash away from danger you'll be slamming and hitting into something else because you're holding it down. Haven't thought of that mechanic.
unkempt pagoda
you need to think about fists' dash attack in the sense of, should i dash here or should i dash attack here?
cause if you dash attack into an enemy's attack, you're gonna eat damage
mild bone
Ah ha! Thank you @unkempt pagoda . I think that explains a few of the times I was surprised that I took damage.
unkempt pagoda
mild bone
Does anyone really use Ruthless Reflex instead of the extra dash in Greater Reflex? It seems hard for me to take advantage of because I'm usually trying to avoid damage, and if I take a hit I'm usually panicking to get away from the bullet hell. But I can imagine trading a bullet hit for the extra damage vs a boss.
livid comet
Yes
Ruthless is great with certain weapons that give extra dashes
that's supposed to be spoilered friend
solid cairn
Aka one weapon
livid comet
👍
solid cairn
||Gilgamesh||
livid comet
yeah it's great with ||gilgamesh||, and a lot of high heat runners stand by it
since they're used to one dash
unkempt pagoda
greater reflex wins out over ruthless 9 out of 10 times
livid comet
crap
unkempt pagoda
dodge chance + damage can't beat out the extra dash's safety
solid cairn
Dashes are invaluable
mild bone
I see. Right that's how I feel about dashes being invaluable. Getting a rare Hermes +2-dash = good
daring cargo
\
mild bone
Thanks for your thoughts guys.
glad plaza
livid comet
But Ruthless + Extra Dashes is pog
has anyone ever managed to fill out all the boon slots??
magic dagger
no, you just get more columns if you get close to filling them
livid comet
oh :(
brittle wind
I managed to fill them only to realize it adds another
livid comet
oh well, worth asking ig
also, would anyone be interested in critiquing some gameplay footage if I were to chuck it up here?
dry ember
i would take a quick peek
livid comet
okay, I'll see if I can record some of my NG attempts then
I think I'm doing that special weaving thing properly but not sure
magic dagger
the real trick to first-runs is not getting the tiny vermin
I just had that guy end two consecutive runs
2
first-runs
rapid storm
there is a tier list of keepsakes?
magic dagger
no.
drifting vale
They all have their uses
magic dagger
god keepsakes are good in the first 2 or three biomes, acorn helps with the final boss
drifting vale
There are more than that but yeah even spiked collar is really good for new players that need the help
dry ember
tier list won't make sense if people don't know how to use them
drifting vale
And there hourglass can be super strong if you play towards it
dry ember
for example Beowulf used to be S tier weapon
drifting vale
^ what fox said
dry ember
but if you go in with cast build, you are not using the best thing about Beo
that said, 1.0 kinda killed it
magic dagger
charged flight got a nerf
dry ember
nothing
magic dagger
they didn't change the weapon at all
dry ember
they changed charged flight, which is something beowulf needed to reach godhood
indirect nerf, but significant
dry ember
what are you chasing?
magic dagger
First run still
I haven't cleared it once since 1.0 hit
the ME nerf hit me pretty hard ig
livid comet
the real trick to first-runs is not getting the tiny vermin
@magic dagger
oof, here I am dying to meg and Lernie
magic dagger
it happens
drifting vale
ME?
drifting vale
Ah
dry ember
@magic dagger Hell Mode or?
magic dagger
normal
you still can't submit hellmode runs iirc
"God or Hell mode is not allowed"
livid comet
First run still
I haven't cleared it once since 1.0 hit
@magic dagger
this makes me feel better
dry ember
dude be writing a novel
torpid wren
(was typing a post between doing other things, lol. anyway!!!!!)
Did alot of runs with different weapons today and tried shields after putting them down. Piercing Shot is so spammable and pleasing. There's so many fights where i just stay in one place and just tank n shoot.
Also Hades spear is real neat. I'm not used to the cooldown on the spear moveset, but spears feel nice to play with. I want to see if there is a more defensive way to play with them though.
hasty oracle
Hey which boons are good for the Hestia rail?
bronze geyser
anything with big flat percent damage increase
dry ember
or Tempest Strike if you dare
magic dagger
well, you don't really want to play defensively
it's a good way to get your first few clears, but then you have to unlearn all your habits if you want to be fast or play on higher difficulties
for the spear, you should ignore the special unless you get exploding launcher, and mostly use dash-strikes
try to get flurry jab or serrated point
torpid wren
I play pretty aggressively with spear. it's just real obvious when I eat a ton of damage due to being stuck in cooldown animation, lol
there's sometimes options to cover weaknesses like that
magic dagger
welll
spins are where you get cooldowns, so don't do that unless you are pretty safe
dash-strikes pretty much don't have cooldowns at all, and exploding launcher is really nice
torpid wren
I'll give the dash strike approach a try
hasty oracle
Which rail aspect do you guys like the most? My first ever clear run was with that weapon so it's special lol
unkempt pagoda
currently eris
anything that makes my boy dio slap even harder gets an A+ in my book
ornate remnant
does chaos egg increase chance of chaos gates increasing has a hidden passive or something
rapid storm
i clear mi first run with rail too
does chaos egg increase chance of chaos gates increasing has a hidden passive or something
@ornate remnant nop, only no damage when you enter and better boons
lethal chasm
eris is prob one of my overall favs nice to get huge jolts or doom ticks w it
empty veldt
Eris is busted honestly
ebon tinsel
eris increases all damage right so that includes dio hangover?
empty veldt
It should yeah
ebon tinsel
hehay
potent ember
tips on how to use demeter fists?
livid comet
it shouldn't, but I'm happy for you.
@magic dagger
I meant in the sense that it makes me feel better about failing so early in the run because this is legitimately difficult to do, not that I'm happy someone else is failing as well. My bad
I was worried that I just sucked at the game despite having 150 hours on it
pseudo stream
is... ||Hades' keepsake|| any good? ||just got it to 3 stars and it hasn't impressed me||
rare kayak
i personally dont think it is
pseudo stream
30% and damage goes 50-75-100%
rare kayak
plus it takes up a slot you could use for like poseidon or something
pseudo stream
||the 4 bar use is solid, but the 1 bar|| seems garbage?
uneven scarab
Wait what?!? || Hades has a keepsake?! ||
Is that post ending?
mighty ermine
general consensus, including my own take, seems to be that it's overall underwhelming paul
even at rank 3
it's a shame
pseudo stream
if it were as good as a normal one, that's TWO full boons from one slot, which is an excellent deal!
rare kayak
the buff doesnt disappear on dashes though so i had this idea for a meme build based around pos dash lol
pseudo stream
but I find the ||call itself (extra letters so the spoiler is less obvious)|| to be... meh?
rare kayak
i gotta say
considering you alreadys said 4 bar its pretty obvious
but yeah gimme a pos/dio any time instead
hell, zeus or aphro too
woeful saffron
@uneven scarab ||i think|| ||i forgot how I got it now|| hhaaha
pseudo stream
whoops! removed that comment, i didn't notice
rare kayak
@uneven scarab ||just pass a nectar to hades post ending, its the same as any other keepsake||
uneven scarab
|| but like post real ending? After clearing it multiple times right?||
pseudo stream
||uhm, first time he gives you the opportunity, took me 3-4 runs after credits||
ebon tinsel
does underworld customs let you choose which boon to purge or is it rng
turbid needle
Yes and no.
It will give you a choice of 3 randomly selected boons, usually your primary kit.
ebon tinsel
thanks
unique vigil
I usually use aspect of eris but I'm trying out lucifer and it's pretty fun
I haven't upgraded it at all so the special isn't great but I like the laser beam
livid comet
one dash is pain
tidal edge
does upgraded zag shield feel meaningfully stronger? it's fun zooming around with it but the damage is kinda sad, at least unupgraded
uneven scarab
Do y'all use the recharging cast or the dropping one?
uneven scarab
Really, I prefer that one
lyric bloom
I prefer stygian soul bc I like to not have to think about rocks
unique vigil
maybe it's just because I'm used to them dropping idk
lyric bloom
But infernal definitely has its benefits with the right builds
I find it easier to manage a 3 second cooldown for spells because I just hit the spell button every once in a while
uneven scarab
Because that's one of the few green talents which I use
I may be wrong but I feel like overall the purple talents are better than the green ones
uneven scarab
Oh yeah, dark regen is so good
Haven't tried out fated persuasion, I'll have to look into it
mighty ermine
dark foresight is also just incredibly good now
definitely on the green mirror good boy list
light linden
speaking of the good old green mirror talents, shoutouts to jawless paul for convincing me to git gud with ruthless reflex
i feel like greater reflex is a bit of a crutch in the beginning before u learn ur iframes
uneven scarab
Ruthless reflex seems good with weapons like the shord and the fists
light linden
for sure the fists
uneven scarab
I personally prefer the extra 50 health padding
Oh wait nvm, I got confused
I like having as mnay dashes as possible
light linden
tbh i do too, that's why i have a terminal addiction to hermes boons
but it really depends on the weapon
uneven scarab
Hermes is my homie
Along with Dionysus
uneven scarab
Deflect absolutely wrecks
uneven scarab
I personally think that aspect is too strong
Fun as hell tho, gimme that 50%+ crit chance
light linden
||if dad is gonna drag the family dog into his extreme measures fight ||then im gonna be as unfair as i WANT
uneven scarab
I'm personally a bow man myself, aspect of Hera is super fun and facilitates my favourite builds which are cast builds
|| Dammit dad, I told you not to bring the dog into this! ||
livid comet
that's a spoiler aye
turbid needle
Any idea why shields aspect of chaos isnt affected by chaos + special damage?
livid comet
maybe it only affects one of your thrown shields
turbid needle
i think i was throwing non buffed shield throws to make sure
but i think those also did 30 damage
will confirm in a later run i guess
livid comet
omfg 14 mins of footage is 1 GB
magic dagger
@livid comet yep, videos are big
cunning urchin
Bitrate is what you need to lower.
fair plinth
man spear aspect of archilles takes some getting used to
I find myself using the special in place of dash
but it ends up punishing me sometimes
since I don't actually dodge stuff when casting it
dark quail
Do you use artemis or aphrodite on attack for nemesis?
livid comet
lmao
I usually find achilles gets me into trouble since the I've thrown the spear at enemies
and then I dash to them so they can punch me in the face
3 minutes left to upload ooga
magic dagger
youtube?
livid comet
windows builtin capture app
dark quail
What do you usually use as keepsakes?
livid comet
Might use OBS instead lol
dry ember
May I recommend OBS for capturing purposes?
cunning urchin
god > god > coin purse > acorn at lower heats.
dry ember
It's quite easy to pick up. I'm happy to help if you want.
cunning urchin
Maybe god > god > hourglass > acorn.
magic dagger
@dark quail you should force gods that are important to your build
other than that, whatever helps or looks fun
cunning urchin
Sometimes god > coin purse > hourglass > acorn.
dry ember
Recently I have been doing Shackle Purse Glass Spearpoint
lapis matrix
I've been running the ||pom|| recently
livid comet
how good is shackle anyway?
fair plinth
question about demeter fists - if you crit on an shoryuken, does every hit crit or is each hit counted separately
dry ember
Each crit separately
fair plinth
hrm
dry ember
At least per my gameplay exper
livid comet
||pom|| is aight, not good for high heat imo
fair plinth
so crit is kinda ass on it
lapis matrix
What is considered high heat?
livid comet
no?
magic dagger
You have brought swears from the bowels of hell.
turbid needle
32+.
mighty ermine
deadly flourish is one of demeter aspect's best options
magic dagger
This is not their place. 🪓
livid comet
separate hits are better for crit I would have thought
lapis matrix
Or fast hitting weapons
dry ember
What is considered high heat?
The technical rule is that high heat is any heat that you struggle/can't beat consistently. But in convo it's usually considered at least 32, usually 40+.
lapis matrix
Hmm, I still need to get past the second hump then
magic dagger
The technical rule is that high heat is any heat that you struggle/can't beat consistently. But in convo it's usually considered at least 32, usually 40+.
zero 😢
dry ember
Don't mean to gatekeep anything, just that the conversation usually has that implied
magic dagger
but 32 is fine
lapis matrix
I was just curious
magic dagger
by these standards, 0 is high heat for me
and 32 is not
dry ember
For sake of clarity, just say what heat you are playing
magic dagger
these standards seem wrong somehow
livid comet
well
lapis matrix
I mean it makes sense
livid comet
technically, we're operating at at least 16 heat
dry ember
0 heat fresh file is above 20 heat at least
mighty ermine
livid comet
no mirror = one of the pacts at Nth rank?
dry ember
Cause RI4 is 8
magic dagger
what no
dry ember
No keepsake
magic dagger
RI4 is 8
dry ember
No companion
magic dagger
no wells of charon (except in area transition)
dry ember
God boons are limited
magic dagger
no hammers
mighty ermine
it's still funny how for all the extreme trouble that RI4 makes you go through, it's only 8 heat
livid comet
No wells, no hammers, NO HERMES, no keepsakes, weapon lock-in, no mirror
magic dagger
limited boons are negative heat
you get handed ME, deadly reversal, divine protection, hunting blades, curse of nausea, and splitting headache (pick 2) handed to you on a silver platter
livid comet
"handed"
In 12-13 attempts, I've never managed to get ME
or even just Ares
it's all RNG
magic dagger
ME got nerfed recently
livid comet
at least on normal runs you can manipulate it some
lapis matrix
ME?
livid comet
merciful end
magic dagger
the others are pretty easy though
livid comet
what's the nerf?
magic dagger
the merciful end nerf: divine dash is no longer a prereq
means you need more boons to get it
makes it extremely rare in tartarus
@livid comet where's your video? I want to criticize critique your gameplay
fair plinth
question about concentrated knuckle - does it "continue" if you also have rolling knuckle?
magic dagger
nope
cunning urchin
It's decent.
fair plinth
was tempted to try it out with demeter fists
since i presume it works off the multi-hit special?
cunning urchin
It only affects the regular 5-hit Attack combo.
turbid needle
I have a question I read in the chat that dashes are getting nerfed? What is the nerf exactly
cunning urchin
It's decent, I'm telling you.
livid comet
well, it's finished uploading, here's my bad gameplay 
@magic dagger @dry ember https://youtu.be/Ui9K-piSwGU
cunning urchin
50 base damage is quite a lot.
rare kayak
yeah but im illiterate unfortunately
dry ember
@turbid needle only Divine Dash got "nerfed". Not in the sense that it is weaker, but that it used to satisfy requirement for Merciful End, but no longer.
rare kayak
but it still triggers merciful right
dry ember
So unless you are an ME addict, Divine Dash and other dashes are exactly the same
mighty ermine
yes
rare kayak
coo
cunning urchin
It also no longer unlocks Deadly Reversal.
magic dagger
@livid comet so I'm seeing some problems in the first room
livid comet
I figured
magic dagger
a witch is one special and one dash-strike, not necessarily in that order. every time.
you can substitute a cast for a special if you want, but two specials is horrifically slow
livid comet
yeah I missed on the dash-strike
magic dagger
thugs have 160 hp, exactly twice that of a witch
livid comet
yup, I haven't gotten the weaving down pat huh
magic dagger
so that's special - dash-strike - cast - dash-strike
not necessarily in that order
and if you can chain your combos across multiple enemies, killing or at least damaging several at once, that's ideal
livid comet
mhm
magic dagger
but looks like it's mostly just practice. know enemy hp, what attacks you need to kill everything and how boons affect that, and then hit enemies without being hit
you should watch Vorime's first-run if you want to see what a run with a perfect build looks like
and I can put one up if you want to see what a run with a crappy build looks like lol
dry ember
from what I can see, it's just a matter of getting used to the combo. I think you have the idea down. Just that sometimes you have tiny hiccup.
although, you can also use cast more to stagger enemies
damage is nice but that's not the point, staggering a lout out of charging animation is
magic dagger
oh, and in the tartarus shop - always buy that artemis; try for deadly reversal. Not having health is scary, but if you don't get the DPS you need because you bought a sandwich, you are dead anyways.