People complain about Speeder + Puller BP2 combos, and that's a banned combo you can't actually encounter. 
#h1-builds-and-combat
cunning urchin
Oh look. I just searched for "seeker speeder" and lo and behold.
cunning urchin
At this point Seeker Speeder ashen witch is not scary anymore
I found this wonderful quote from @gleaming current.
It is a banned combo.
random hull
Entropy has been used in many different contexts, meaning entirely different things. What's certain is that it's not thermodynamics.
solid hazel
That's okay entropy is old news
cunning urchin
Just yesterday, @gleaming current shared their experience with a banned combo.
Hax.
gleaming current
To be fair, I didn't state I encountered one. It's a theoretical observation of difficulty
But ye, the quote is beautiful
solid hazel
We're now trying to harvest synergy from the sun 😋
cunning urchin
Speeder + Puller and Speeder + Seeker are both banned (thankfully).
gleaming current
Why not just ban speeder tbh, or rework it to not stack catastrophically with fo2
Not that I am in dire need of it, but that would be appreciated
cunning urchin
Speeder in general is okay.
lol
At some point, you just end up asking them to remove BP altogether.
gleaming current
Eh, I have completely fine relationship with Bruiser, Slugger, teleporting witches
Magma and eyeballs too
cunning urchin
Yes. Because they nerfed Bruiser in the Blood Price Update lol.
But Bruiser on Greatshields is still a nightmare.
solid hazel
Wait are we talking about Hades?
gleaming current
Well if it did not get a nerf I'd have likely complained, but now it's fine 
cunning urchin
We're talking about perks from Benefits Package.
solid hazel
I thought you were talking about poe until you said blood price update
cunning urchin
solid hazel
Yeah that benefit seems like a bad difficulty per heat level
I'm not that high in heat, but once I fulfilled the proph I stopped taking it
cunning urchin
I think it's fine for the most part tbh.
gleaming current
"surrounded by a field that pulls you in"
Does it actually.. pull you? Not just slow down walks and ddashes?
cunning urchin
It's only once you add things like JS3 and DC2 that things get really bad lol.
I have no idea, actually. I haven't stood still inside to find out. 
solid hazel
From a programming perspective benefits package must be a nightmare
They like put in what 10 different enemy features for one pact
gleaming current
It likely was
But at least they ended up with one of the most interesting pacts to play with
solid hazel
It likely is*
I bet they're still debugging it
Off topic, but I submitted a bug report about what happens when you kill hades at the same time he kills you
It was.. Confusing haha
random hull
I had a confusing moment when I lost a defiance the same moment doom hit on three enemies in the last fight. Those swords kept hitting.
Only during the animation, not for damage, unfortunately.
solid hazel
I'm impressed you have the attention to see animations on enemies
I'm like too focused on not getting hit to be watching them
random hull
It's rather a problem for me, getting distracted by that.
The huge sword from Merciful End just transfixes my gaze. That has cost me dearly before.
cunning urchin
I mean, looking for enemy animations is how you don't get hit.
Or Epic Greatest Reflex.
Mostly Epic Greatest Reflex.
solid hazel
Yeah that's why I love dodge so much
I can't user error rng
Or entropy or whatever
turbid plume
anyone knows how tempest florish with sword double nova interacts ? knock back or no knockback?
cunning urchin
You get the knockback from the boon.
raw violet
@earnest quartz yeah, it's dash-attacks into a dash-attack-upper; you can perform a dash attack and dash upper in a single dash
earnest quartz
oh i had no idea, thanks dude
cunning urchin
@vast peak Hades becomes invincible at 66% and 33% in phase 1, and then again at 50% in phase 2. You can time your burst damage accordingly.
During phase 1, after he comes out invisibility, he'll remain visible for at minimum 3–4 actions before he can go invisible again. So directly after he comes out invisibility can be a great time to apply any burst damage like a call (assuming he's not close to the above-mentioned HP thresholds).
unkempt pagoda
50% in phase 1?
cunning urchin
Er.
66% and 33%, yeah.
I knew something was off but couldn't put my finger on it lol.
Not sure exactly if it's 3 or 4 attacks at minimum before he can go invisible again. But it's plenty of time for any DOT damage or whatever to fully hit him.
gusty elm
came here to say this lol
would be nice of course if boss health bars had little notches indicating where they become invincible and/or some transformation happens, but that's been suggested and highly-upvoted before
worn sand
With the Chiron aspect (bow special locks on Attack target) + Zeus special, do enemies get hit by the zeus special bolt multiple times, or just once?
would relentless volley do an additional 4x special damage
for example
unkempt pagoda
thunder flourish has an internal cooldown of .3 seconds, meaning that each chiron special will only hit once bc of how fast it is
gleaming current
.2 seconds iirc but yeah, chiron only will hit once-twice at best
worn sand
i have explosive shot + heartbreak strike
would one of the attack hammers be better then?
unkempt pagoda
relentless might net you more bolts, if it takes longer to hit all the arrows
worn sand
oh right i forgot i had the +special chaos dmg
what if you aim the special in a weird direction
gusty elm
i don't think i'd go for triple shot, since that would probably make it harder to choose which enemy you want to target with your special
worn sand
like partly to the side, so some arrows hit first
gleaming current
Weird aiming helps, but lets be honest, this aint gonna work every single time
unkempt pagoda
then i'd take point blank (if you want to focus down the attack)
you don't absolutely need to power shot, or full charge
unkempt pagoda
not entirely sure if it interacts with thunder flourish’s cool down, but i’m inclined to say that it does work
main osprey
I think it's separate, because it's not triggered in the same way
Maybe record it and see what happens
quick vigil
If you have the pierced butterfly and switch your keepsake do you keep the bonus damage?
unkempt pagoda
nope, needs to stay on
quiet valve
What builds are y'all using with Chiron aspect? I can't seem to make this aspect feel good : (
quick vigil
Thanks
main osprey
@quiet valve stacking boons (Dio, Demeter) are good on special
Demeter's special + the boon that makes 10 chill explode is good
unkempt pagoda
pick up relentless or concentrated volley, or both if possible
quiet valve
👍 Thank you!
worn sand
i also like going hangover-focused builds with it
dio special + aphrodite attack + duo boon for 8x hangover with one combo
throw in Ares + dio duo for even more dps
clear dome
how to play Rama?
unkempt pagoda
spam thunder flourish
or, go for the meaty shotgun build (triple/twin shot + point blank)
clear dome
is chain shot ok on Rama?
dire wedge
Oh yes. Very much so. Especially when you abuse it with Shared Suffering
gusty dagger
I just came across some very strong upgrade for Exagryph. I have the Zag aspect combined with the Spread Fire hammer+Athena upgrade on the attack for some very high base damage
Zag aspect means way higher dps uptime compared to when just getting the spread fire hammer upgrade alone
Plus i can just facetank most of the attacks, even by bosses
barren otter
Hangover damage on Eris rail is so dang strong. Had lvl 8 Epic hangover attack (14 damage per stack), it ended up doing 115 damage per tick with all 5 stacks.
And occasional 145 with Ruthless reflex.
gray moon
do you guys use Forced Overtime? I find that it makes some fights downright unfair. Asterius is probably the worst offender, with some of his attacks simply lacking telegraphs.
static jacinth
I use FO 2.
It's hard at first, but once you adjust, you're better off in the long run I feel.
And you can turn it off and feel like all the enemies are moving in super slow motion.
Which is fun.
gray moon
the thing is, i find that FO either makes no difference, or turns some fights into a mess
With Fists, its very risky to get near Asterius of Hades
barren otter
I used to avoid forced overtime, but now I enable it on most runs. It's something you need to get used to.
Though I have done only one run with FO2, final boss was especially hard.
static jacinth
It forces you to learn their patterns better.
They still have clear windows where you can hit them.
It's harder, but that's the point after all.
I think it's important to learn it, if you're going to climb up heats.
barren otter
Yeah, it's worth the 3 heat
gleaming current
6 heat since you'd likely go all the way for FO2
clear dome
no i always turn on FO1 but never FO2
cunning urchin
FO just really depends on how confident you are in your reactions.
And how much you enjoy twitch-reaction gameplay.
dry ember
FO2 really depends on how much you can tolerate 0 wind up attack animation on vermins, large and small.
cunning urchin
There's actually some wind-up. Unless they have Speeder lol.
hearty elbow
It's an investment. Learning FO2 takes a long time (and BP2 kind of ensures that you'll never totally learn it), so if you intent is to climb up in heat it's something you should ease yourself into early. Don't stick on FO1 for too long though or you may learn bad timings.
dry ember
But I'm a God Gamer and never fail my timings
cunning urchin
*at fishing
gleaming current
Fishing affected by FO2 when
narrow rampart
why would you ever propose that
cunning urchin
Fish with BP perks when.
narrow rampart
puller: pulls u into the river styx, instantly killing u
gleaming current
I caught a Cloner Shifter Chlam!
(except it's forbidden and exploded in my lying face)
narrow rampart
oh god im now imagining having to fill the codex entry of every fish with every bp combination
the true end game
gleaming current
Especially with common chaos fish
cunning urchin
Cloner Shifter isn't banned.
narrow rampart
and also rama
dry ember
Charged Flight
dry ember
Or Poseidon cast
narrow rampart
Yeah I tried posi cast
with curse of drowning, too
was nice
wanna try out the freezing shot duo
see how that one vibes
dry ember
You can't get curse of drowning with Beo tho
gleaming current
Cloner Shifter isn't banned.
Yeah, but Cloner in Elysium isn't a thing
narrow rampart
maybe they patched it later?
cunning urchin
Oh right. Chlam. Sorry, I don't know about common fish, I catch too fast. 
dry ember
Yeah it was patched out later I think
narrow rampart
perfect catching is WAY easier on a controller with vibration turned on
dry ember
Right now that's no longer feasible, sadly
narrow rampart
Yeah it was patched out later I think
das lame
It was a nice combo
hmm just went through the patch notes, only boon i saw being altered with respect to Beo was hunting blades not being offered
narrow rampart
i won't tho :>
static jacinth
@kind cloud You're misunderstanding the curse logic. The curse says that you cannot earn gold for the next three encounters. Meaning that until 3 encounters have passed, you can't earn gold. The idea is that so long as you see the curse, you can't earn gold.
It's the same reason you can't Attack when you have a chaos curse that says no attacking without damage, even if you're not in an encounter at the time.
kind cloud
@static jacinth
Hmmm. Ok, I've read and considered what you've typed.
But that leads me to ask: why make a distinction between "encounter" and "chamber" in the game?
In my mind, I see them as distinct.
For instance, ignited ichor gives increased move speed for a set amount of encounters. That isn't used up when a player goes from secret hallway to that first chamber in asphodel.
This varies from hydralite which refills 10% HP per chamber regardless of whether Zag encounters enemies.
static jacinth
Yeah, that's the distinction. Chambers are when you enter a new room, and encounters are specifically combat rooms.
It's consistent.
kind cloud
Then I'm not understanding your point. I didn't encounter an enemy when I saw sisyphus which is specifically not a combat room. So based on wording of chaos curse, I should've gotten 100+ gold from sisyphus.
static jacinth
No, because the curse was still going.
cunning urchin
The curse lasts until you've cleared n amount of encounters with it (trove encounters don't count).
static jacinth
The curse doesn't say "you can't earn gold during encounters"
It says you can't earn gold for the next 3 encounters.
For the duration of 3 encounters, you can't earn gold.
So until 3 encounters pass, however long that might take, you can't get gold.
I believe you can even get that curse, clear a boss, go into the between zones hallway, and be unable to earn gold in there.
It's exactly like the curses that say you can't attack/cast/special for X encounters. So long as you have the curse, you get the penalty, even if you're not specifically in an encounter.
cunning urchin
Yeah, if you take that curse before a boss chamber and have Underworld Customs on, you'll get no money for selling a boon.
kind cloud
I see what you're saying. @cunning urchin's explanation clicked. (I didn't know the bit about not getting money from underworld customs if chaos papuer's curse is active.)
I wish the boon explanation would've clearer.
static jacinth
The logic is consistent, even if it might trip you up the first time, because you don't think about it.
But that happens. You learn. It's the kind of game where you're always learning.
kind cloud
If I was SGG, I would amend the caption to read "Cannot earn gold until 3 enemy counters completed" or something like that.
¯_(ツ)_/¯
static jacinth
I feel like that wording is just a lot less elegant.
It's very clear that you still have the curse until it's gone. It shows up in your boon bar and everything.
kind cloud
It's no biggie. I just don't want someone else to make the mistake I made.
static jacinth
No other curse stops working until it's gone.
narrow rampart
bruhhhhhhh
first time reaching the surface with Rama, AND first time using FO
holy heck that was probably my hardest run so far
used 7 DDs lmfao
but damn had like a 135% increase in damage from Chaos, level 3 Heartbreak Strike, and had Artemis, Dio and Aphro's duo boons
gleaming current
Now that sounds like a lot of dmg
pseudo stream
FO suuucks until you get used to it
all your muscle memory and great timings are suddenly wrong haha
gleaming current
The only thing worse than FO0 to FO2 is FO2 to FO0
All of sudden all attacks are so slow they catch you after you did a reactive dash
charred pilot
The Punishing Sweep Should be a status curse right?
unkempt pagoda
nope
"status curse" is a specific term, and status effects that are curses are named as such in their tooltip (and can only be from a god's boon)
charred pilot
Good to know, I noted that the charm s not a status curse and I put that in the bug feedback
unkempt pagoda
they are things like weak, doom, and exposed
charm isn't a status curse but just a status effect, plus it'd be going against the point of privileged status if it were a curse
unkempt pagoda
👍
pseudo stream
with Rama, do I want to be getting power shots? I have point blank shot if that chagnes anything
unkempt pagoda
you don't need to, rama has plenty of strength behind its shots already
especially in melee range, you don't have the time to wait for the power shot
(unless you manage to get like, attack speed and perfect shot, or something)
last panther
pseudo stream
okay perfect
thanks
I think getting more flexible is making me much better with the weapon
pseudo stream
that hasn't felt like it's maximized dps
pseudo stream
omg. with hermes special and a good special? yeah, it does a LOT of damage haha
static jacinth
Like I said. Easy life.
last panther
https://i.imgur.com/uOLiaIz.png tfw, again
unkempt pagoda
sorry, cos! guess your little side hustle didn't work out this time. oh well, be seeing you!
halcyon snow
Does triple bomb proc Aspect of eris rail 3 times?
turbid needle
Eris does not stack.
dry ember
the bonus does not stack but the special does boost itself
so your first special will be 100% damage, your next one can be 160%
turbid needle
The boost applies kinda-sorta-not-really retroactively. The first blast you stand in will be empowered.
clear dome
Sharanga with relentless volley , demeter and arctic blast is actually good
somehow in the run main damage is special and zeus dash with jolt
worn sand
you just know it's because you walked past that 1 gold urn back in tartarus
didnt see it until you just started entering the next room
rose pawn
Hi peeps, got a quick question about heat, I reached heat 8 and I want to try something more challenging like heat 16 :
If I skip straight to heat 16, will I get all of the previous rewards (9-15) too ?
And if not, can I still go back to these lower levels to get them ?
Just asking because I don't want to doom my resources I still need those rewards 
errant narwhal
the rewards only go up one level at a time, so if you beat heat 16 after 8 youll only get the rewards for 9, and after that for 10, and so on. you wont permanently miss any rewards
rose pawn
Sounds good, thanks 😌
analog sail
Are the defiance Athena boons worth it with Stubborn? I don't feel like they have enough of an impact.
cunning urchin
Yes. If you lose your Stubborn Defiance in the room before picking up her Defiance boons, she'll give you a free DD.
And your Stubborn Defiance will still replenish in the next chamber.
static jacinth
I wonder if it's a strat to lose your SD intentionally.
cunning urchin
It is.
static jacinth
Hey Nyaanyaa, how good do you find Heavy Knuckle?
cunning urchin
I think it's decent. I haven't had a chance to try it a lot of times, but it's generally pretty good.
Not my first choice of hammer, though, and it's not what you want on Demeter Aspect.
static jacinth
...
Why are you mentioning demeter specifically?
Nyaanyaa are you psychic? DO YOU SEE MY RUN
spice lichen
Hi there~ Not a particular question, just an observation - I'm assuming all players in high heat do not run on God Mode and like. I just feel that I'm so bad at the game 😅
I'm mostly here for the story, but heat runs help a lot with gathering materials for a completionist... being at the maximum amount of decreased damage (I assumed it's capped at 80%?) and here my eyeballs are sore from using Forced Overtime and Benefits Package and god knows what. I felt blinded in Elysium when the enemies split and split and split... how on earth do you guys avoid those ouchies with all of the heat pacts applied?? I'm already starting to struggle at heat 10! 😂
static jacinth
Forced Overtime is one of the harder ones.
Have you tried Extreme Measures? Other than 3, it's one of the easier, less run impacting pact levels.
spice lichen
Yes! Extreme Measures is my favourite go to for each run~
Ah but that makes sense. I'll try to avoid Forced Overtime for now, then
Thanks for the tip 🙏
cunning urchin
@static jacinth because Demeter Aspect wants to attack fast to charge up the Special lol.
cunning urchin
Probably the same thing then because you want to build up Chill stacks fast.
static jacinth
Oh yeah. This was before I got it.
It was my first hammer. I went with the flying kick because it's fun. (first room hammer)
waxen otter
you know i always wondered how enhancing the fists would make it so you now have an attack with your foot
isn't zag actually barefoot? wouldn't it hurt him just as much as the enemies?
random hull
He is barefoot, but the damage would still be greater on the receiving side. Martial art kicks work. Plus, his feet are on fire, so there is an additional source of pain there. But I totally understand your query - I was wondering about that myself. I never got Rush Kick before, so once I do, I'll try to have a look if something additional materializes on his feet.
waxen otter
i guess it's true, he DID burn his father's hands when he was born. Yep, makes sense.
static jacinth
Giving him a good kick to the face is very satisfying.
waxen otter
i'd say beating him to death is also satisfying
(but not as much as beating that smug grin off of Theseus)
warped kernel
Acorn or spearpoint?
cunning urchin
Acorn.
warped kernel
I mainly use the acorn for theseus, but i was wondering if i should switch to spearpoint and save the acorn for the final boss?
then again the spearpoint has more utility overall and might help me more in styx
static jacinth
Acorn is my jam.
waxen otter
ha! you should be stronger than to take actually useful keepsakes!
static jacinth
I don't like the spearpoint much, to be honest.
waxen otter
take dyonisus with excalibur!
gleaming current
Spear is definitely viable against poison so if you feel it will save you then use that
waxen otter
take distant memory with fists!
static jacinth
The only multi hits I take usually are poison ticks or the snake stone tickles.
static jacinth
Acorn probably saves more damage with two charges.
waxen otter
chaos egg just for giggles!
gleaming current
Myrmidon bracer to show back to enemies smh
cunning urchin
Distant Memory on Malphon is actually a good idea. I use it pretty often.
gleaming current
Skull earring on high confidence build
waxen otter
oh, and lambent plume in styx
cunning urchin
Yeah, I start off with Lucky Tooth in Tartarus, Skull Earring in Asphodel, switch to Distant Memory in Elysium, and then Lambent Plume in the Temple of Styx.
That's like my go-to strategy for melee.
Lucky Tooth helps a lot in Tartarus when you only have 3 DDs.
gleaming current
Yeah, one witch room pops like 2 of them, so you need more grace here
random hull
Once you have earned another DD from Chaos, you're free to drop the Tooth. Easy.
gleaming current
Lambent plume has the potential to stack like mad in styx, there are like 20-25 encounters
although I always clean the rooms too slowly and get only 4 charges
cough
cunning urchin
My favorite speedrun strategy is to take Lambent Plume in the Temple of Styx, and do all the tunnels.
Just, all of them.
It'll make you faster.
gleaming current
And will let you dodge final boss attacks
waxen otter
yeah, and if you kill Hades in time, you can die even quicker!
hermes would be proud
gleaming current
"Hermes would be jealous"
cunning urchin
I also like to take the Pauper's curse and then go for obol chambers.
waxen otter
it's al il secret, but actually all obols you miss while under that curse go directly to your damage percentage
cunning urchin
It's faster because you don't have to stop at wells and shops if you have no money.
gleaming current
Tbh all that talk heavily signifies we NEED twitch mod for this game
cunning urchin
And coins are heavy.
gleaming current
Just imagine all the great strats viewers will enforce on players
cunning urchin
It would just slow you down to carry so much stuff around.
gleaming current
Can confirm btw, gathered 4.3k gold with hoarding blade on arthur, daddy kept slapping me hard for that
waxen otter
did you know that if you manage to get to negative dash distance with chaos curses, you actually just dash trough the whole underworld and get the secret true ending?
in which you and hermes together tear-open a portal in time the space-time continuum and teleport into a different universe where persephone never left
random hull
The forbidden backwards long jump technique
cunning urchin
Dash so short it tears through space-time and creates a worm-hole that takes you to Persephone.
gleaming current
Time travelling with negative length dashes
(that being said, has anyone tried to stack those chaos boons?)
random hull
No one with a sane mind would do that, but looks like we have a few volunteers gathered already.
cunning urchin
I was en-route for sub-15 bow, but the sack was in tunnel 4 instead of 2. 
gleaming current
Sucks to sack
gusty dagger
Anyone know what electric flare is?
I just saw it on the wiki but I cannot find what it is
gleaming current
Beowulf shield renames all cast "shots" into "flares"
cunning urchin
Lord Zeus's Cast when you use the hidden shield aspect.
gusty dagger
I see. Thanks!
slate tulip
When fighting Charon, is it expected behavior that his wave and projectile attacks aren't deflected by athena's dash boon? I definitely just got steamrolled expecting to be able to dash through everything, especially with a deflect but instead I'm back in the house
random hull
With the right timing, they can be dashed through, as with a normal dash. With sloppy timing, you will get hit. Only the melee attack can be deflected.
main osprey
which is slightly unintuitive
random hull
I definitely only found that out on accident.
eternal quartz
EDIT: We're taking a break from the challenges. We need to rest, regenerate and reorganise thoughts to come up with some fresh ideas. Stay tuned!
Here's info about the most recent challenge:
It's time for The Punishment - Hades Weekly Challenge #10 is here!
https://www.hades-fansite.com/hades-weekly-challenges/HWC10
As Zagreus returns from his latest escape attempt, Hades' booming voice cuts through the noise of the Hall of the Dead: 'Hmph, I hear you've been wasting everyone's time with meaningless challenges. Arrogant child, you have no idea of what true hardship is. Fine, if you want to be challenged, so be it. I'm more than happy to oblige.'
Conditions:
- Spear with Aspect of Hades
Mirror:
- Whatever helps you
Heat:
- One of each condition (yup, 23 Heat)
Challenge brought to you by the HWC Committee (Tiank, Firespirit, Tatz)
also, we were thinking to make it 2 weeks instead of 1, what do you think, guys?
gleaming current
Kinda feeling like 1 week is perfectly fresh, but some people may have time issues so if it goes biweekly I could understand
pseudo stream
.. woo! got Heat 16 (second highest was 8)... first try... no DD used... should I be skipping to32 next? haha
pseudo stream
I went from 8 to 16, so clearly doubling is what we do now!
main osprey
Oh dang, I was the only Lucifer clear for last week
gleaming current
Poor lucy
void fjord
Pls make it biweekly atleast for this one
Cause with my tests going on rn, the time i have to play hades has reduced by a lot
gleaming current
Dangit, i got so close run with weekly but the build was too yikes and i grew tilted to it
Probably equipping pierced butterfly was horrendous idea
pseudo stream
is buying yarn of ariadne... worth it ? I so can' tell, and it's mostly a math question
main osprey
I usually get it
pseudo stream
I bounce back and forth
does increasing rarity increase the chance of seeing legendary/duo?
narrow rampart
imma try this week's challenge
lucy super soaker leggo
never used routine inspection before 
unkempt pagoda
new challenge 👀
pseudo stream
... 32 heat is a wee bit harder than 16
hybrid frost
As it turns out, using Charged Flight with Beo shield throw is secretly awesome.
[img]https://i.ibb.co/0Cj8SBW/Hades-1199.png[/img]
unkempt pagoda
secret?
proper yarrow
Yeah, it's honestly amazing. If you do it again, I would try it with aphro throw, It can get crazy
hybrid frost
I can imagine
gleaming current
Definitely not a secret since there is 53 heat run with it, but quite underestimated 
hybrid frost
It was a secret from ME, ok?
hybrid frost
Another secret:
I Give Up if I'm about to lose.
It only happens rarely, but I do.
gleaming current
Ah, well.
hybrid frost
That's only until the game launches though.
Once 1.0 hits I'm taking whatever the game throws at me.
hybrid frost
Of course, I can only afford to Give Up at all now, because I've bought everything the game has to offer and don't need the resources.
Yes and it is awesome.
dry ember
it is
hybrid frost
Now, if there were only a way to ensure Charged Flight every run....
narrow rampart
Hollup
How do I let you guys know that I did the challenge
Like I can show you then victory screen obvs but how will I confirm that I've done all the tunnels?
gleaming current
Yeah, it has been changed a few hours ago
gleaming current
(either way, the way to confirm would be a second screenshot for tunnels)
at least that's what i did
main osprey
that's what most people did lol
gleaming current
narrow rampart
OH
WELL
oh wow new one is 23 heat
abort
IMMA FINISH THIS ONE THO
Do Dusa proud
lunar salmon
Reminds me, I haven't played Beo with Infernal Soul cause I kept forgetting to switch to it before the start of every run
pseudo stream
also forced overtime 2 is a big jump,. last boss is fairly hard with it
narrow rampart
bruh couldn't do the last boss with just FO1
Can't imagine how much harder it'd be with FO2
hearty elbow
A lot
The faster he gets the closer to the window of human reaction time a lot of his animations get
It's still learnable though, but it's pretty advisable to keep a save at Hades to practice mechanics against
narrow rampart
ooo never considered doing that
keeping a save for practice, i mean
Kinda starting to gravitate more towards Aphro attack/special rather than Arty's
Damage is way more consistent and comes with a built in curse
Arty's I feel needs duo boons and/or chaos damage increases to really get ahead
I could probably do the math to figure that out but im lazy
pseudo stream
I consider Artemis attack fairly bad if you’re running privileged status
Unless you’ve already got 3+ easy to apply ones (or already have weak)
narrow rampart
usually when planning on going with Arty I try to grab both Aphro and Athena for their duo boons
And get expose from Athena, netting me the privileged status
But now I sometimes forego Athena for Dio and get his duo instead, and easier access to Privileged Status to boot
Arty pops off with enough duos I feel, but Aphro is more consistent and easier to use, and not as RNG dependant
pseudo stream
I don't find counting on expose is worth it, doesn't work against single targets
unkempt pagoda
authority v persuasion is very much a player preference, there's not much of an objective one-over-the-other
gusty dagger
I guess I'll give it a few runs. I have 90+ keys anyway
unkempt pagoda
i've seen high heat runs where, on the first chamber, a common heartbreak strike gets slashed out due to approval process. one persuasion later and the player gets an epic one
main osprey
I definitely prefer Persuasion, since I'm generally not very reliant on getting lots of boons
gusty dagger
Oh so it changes rarity as well?
unkempt pagoda
it rerolls the whole thing, so yes
imo i use authority bc i like having control over what boons i'm getting, rather than relying on what the rng gives me
gusty dagger
In the end it is still RNG, much like authority but it does make it seem better than what it thought it was
unkempt pagoda
but, at the end of the day, an epic strike does insanely more work over a common one (especially if you get a good seed that already gives you the gods you want)
gusty dagger
Am I correct in saying that even if I get lots of boons from different gods (since Im gonna try Persuasion), Privileged Status>>>>Family Favorite?
unkempt pagoda
eh
privileged status relies on getting specific boons, many of which are tier 2
PS is easy if you have something a build based around something like aphro/dio
but zeus/artemis, not so much
FF is easier and more flexible, in exchange for a significant damage loss (40% on PS vs an average of 25%)
pseudo stream
approval process feels like an expensive Heat, is it taken often? (I tried 32 heat and AP2 made life kinda hellish)
unkempt pagoda
at around 40+ heat most people take AP2, but really you don't have to
pseudo stream
are FF/PS % of base damage, or mulitplicative?
unkempt pagoda
not sure, always thought it was additive but never confirmed it
turbid needle
Additive, but universal.
gleaming current
AP is either extremely painful or lowkey free, depends on how willing you are to run the same thing hundreds of times to get good rng
Definitely not my favorite tbh
too many times it crosses out epic attacks and duos
gusty dagger
Anyone got a good build for the Bow Zag aspect?
unkempt pagoda
go heartbreak strike instead
triple + chain is great crowd control, twin + anything is better single target and a better boss killer
cunning urchin
Heartbreak Strike > Zeus' Aid > Smoldering Air, and pick up either Divine Dash or Hunter Dash along the way. 
unkempt pagoda
distant, point-blank, and perfect shot are personal preference and i usually only recommend them if you don’t have any of the above
explosive is strong and (especially with point blank) you do not need to wait for the power shot
cunning urchin
Key is to just spam Dash-Strike.
unkempt pagoda
you generally want to keep dash striking, so you generally want chaos lunges and/or hunter dash
only use the regular shot in safe positions, like when first entering a room or waiting for spawns
special is generally worthless, unless you have like, doom in it lol
even then your main gameplay loop is dash -> attack
cunning urchin
special is generally worthless
unless you have like, doom in it lol
FTFY.
pseudo stream
ugh on FO2, I find a lot of moves have too much ending lag (uppercut, specifically)
how good is curse of drowning?
wait... how does it even work? I have a level 2 flood shot as well as it, does the level 2 matter?
gusty dagger
how do u dash strike with the bow anyway?
dry ember
you dash then you attack
cunning urchin
Hold attack after a dash. It will charge faster but do less damage.
But since you can buff it with things like Hunter Dash, it ends up doing more.
dire wedge
how good is curse of drowning?
It's very strong for melee builds
dry ember
daddy too fast please nerf
pseudo stream
I mean it doesn’t need to be nerfed, it’s just hard to relearn
Standard last boss has so many fairly safe openings
pseudo stream
Yeah I definitely need to learn to be a lot more patient for him
How does one use Demeter cast in a way that isn’t flaming garbage?
dry ember
You kinda need the duos
So look for Crystal Clarity or Cold Embrace
You can use Achilles Spear and Reload Cast. Just Special in amd drop your cast.
static jacinth
Just drop it and it'll do good damage?
If you get Glacial Glare it becomes amazing.
The duos help, but it's not required if you aim it properly.
dry ember
You pick Reload cast so you don't have to bother picking up after yourself
The duos help, but it's not required if you aim it properly.
Yeah but that's a big if imo. Most enemies are so fast that you either miss them or they move out of the way. Agree on Glacial Glare though.
Basically you can't just pick C Beam and nothing else. You need support boons/aspects.
static jacinth
Well, most casts aren't going to do insane things without support.
But if you want to make it your main damage source, yeah, you need a little more effort.
dry ember
Speak for yourself, my Slicing Shot works just fine by itself. /s
pseudo stream
I mean... most casts at worst home in and give +50% damage
That’s insane, I’d rather a 0 damage cast than a poorly aimed crystal beam
I tend to play kinda panicky and very mobile though, and so I have no idea how to aim it... I’m missing the Artemis duo boom though, which is why I want it in the first place, so that might help
dire wedge
The way I see it, there are casts the can stand by themselves or have to build around, and Crystal Beam is the latter.
void fjord
yea in my experience for crystal beam, you need the arty duo and longer duration boon to make it really tear through enemies
but in regards to that, how does the demeter cast act like when used with 4th shield aspect
main osprey
I believe it becomes || an AoE chill/damage, Icy Flare ||
errant narwhal
**EDIT:** *We're taking a break from the challenges. We need to rest, regenerate...
Whew I’m late
<@&737365219982049411> check the pins for the new challenge!
void fjord
lol would be funny if the pin kept showing the previous weeks challenge
static jacinth
Most of the casts end up pretty straightforward. A big AoE effect with the Deity's signature effect.
The only really weird one is Ares, which still briefly creates a big spinny beyblade.
errant narwhal
I don’t want to clutter the pins with All the challenges, but that’s what the site is for I guess - it basically has everything that is in the messages
Oh wait, I just realized what you were saying. lmao disregard that
random hull
"wasting everyone's time with meaningless challenges"
main osprey
Oh! @random hull ! I started testing Elysium enemies respawning with BP, didn't finish but so far:
Unarmored -> BP weapon: no armor or BP
BP -> unarmored weapon: armor, no BP
random hull
That's fascinating, and the second observation could be a bug.
main osprey
Could be. Gonna test all combinations, then if one of them seems out of place I'll report it
It was also a Popper Elite, which could've messed with it
green plover
23 heat with spear which I've ever used. Hmmm~ this is going to be torture if I try this I think.
eternal quartz
23 heat with spear which I've ever used. Hmmm~ this is going to be torture if I try this I think.
@green ploverThat's the pointIt's not gonna be **that ** bad! (Just worse)
green plover
Well, I'll have to basically learn how to use the spear, since I can't. Nothing else.
cunning urchin
@mighty ermine have you submitted your 50-heat run for the weekly challenge yet?
barren otter
third time I'm getting 5 sack in Styx with tight deadline 
no idea how are people doing it with TD2
cunning urchin
Just luck lol.
static jacinth
The trick is to not get a 5 sack.
cunning urchin
Well, on lower heats you can do all tunnels with TD2 if you have good DPS.
You could watch some speedruns for what they do—with whatever aspect you're trying.
gleaming current
1 minute per tunnel, 2 on hades
iirc at least
hearty elbow
2 on hades is bold
barren otter
well, I just beat Hades with 2 minutes remaining (TD1) with only 15 seconds to spare.
hearty elbow
Though I guess if you can consistently do the normal rooms in 1 minute you might have the dps to do that? There is so much phase transition in the last fight though
It's possible I've lost perspective. At some x heat you're prepared to nickel and dime Dad to death.
gleaming current
5th tunnel will also be a tad shorter since fountain room, so realistically it's like 2:20 on hades
But yeah, 2 minutes is pretty compressed for 4 transitions fight
Also 20k hp. Twice
gleaming current
cp1
pseudo stream
does anyone have any advice for FO2? especially the last boss
cunning urchin
See if that helps.
Ultimately, it's just gonna be practice, practice, practice.
gleaming current
Don't play with slow weapons on FO2 in tartarus versus Speeder Savior Numbskulls
That's all i have 
cunning urchin
Have you tried using multi-hit attacks?
gleaming current
If they have sturdy then yes 
pseudo stream
I understand the fight pretty well OFF FO2, but with it on all my openings and instincts are wrong
when does one engage?
cunning urchin
He has a lot of recovery after spin attacks.
He also has a bit of recovery after thrusts and skull throws.
pseudo stream
the skull throws absolutely obliterated me, they come out soooo fast...
dry ember
Also if you don't have HL on, and is tight on time, facetanking is not a bad strat. Not recommended on high heat, but at lower heat, just facetank, you will get through. Don't blame me for any bad habit you get though.
the skull throws absolutely obliterated me, they come out soooo fast...
Hades has a little animation when he is about to throw the skulls.
tulip cloud
What are the best boons for the Aspect of ||Lucifer||? The one run I've had with it felt pretty miserable but I want to clear the quest for it, at least.
dry ember
Lightning Strike
Beeline for Splitting Bolt
Cold Fusion is nice if you can manage
Mostly ignore your special. Your attack should do most pf the damage.
Faster Ramp and Triple Beam Hammer are good.
tulip cloud
Cool, thanks!
Yeah, the special seems hard to use since it’s so slow to get aim and get off.
dry ember
Yeah Special build can work. But Attack build is just easier to execute and, therefore, more reliable
steady hatch
i kinda liked deflect on special when i last played with it
mighty ermine
@cunning urchin oh I hadn't seen it until now. Perfect
pseudo stream
does anyone have any good videos of FO2 last boss? I beat him, but I went in at full health with full DD and ended with half health and 0 DD
the rest of the run was a joke, but he obliterated me haha
steady hatch
idk if there's a guide but at least there's a spreadsheet with links to high heat clears (pretty sure most 45+ runs have FO2 turned on)
dry ember
You can watch Healian 51 (?) Heat fight with Hades that lasts 5 minutes. Using Chaos Shield but still, fwiw.
steady hatch
there's also a few that don't take damage (with acorn)
dry ember
Yeah just look at the database, it's good resource.
pseudo stream
where... is the database? haha
cunning urchin
It's pinned in #h1-high-heat-strategies.
pseudo stream
ahh, it hid in with the other spreadsheet as game info, thanks ❤️
cunning urchin
Just gotta keep in mind that basically all the people with clears that high have practiced the fight a whole lot.
pseudo stream
yeah, just wanna see what a good fight LOOKS like, cuz atm it's pure chaos
dry ember
I died at Hades 8 times before clearing 42 heat o.o
pseudo stream
spoiler that
cunning urchin
Like, I literally practiced the fight for hours every day at one point.
dry ember
spoiler what?
I am assuming you mean the Hades mention. It's ok to refer to him with name here in this channel.
errant narwhal
yep, such spoilers are allowed in this channel
pseudo stream
hmm... okay, that's fair! but... why? builds and combat are things that even newbies wanna learn about
tulip cloud
It's weird that fighting Hades is considered a spoiler to me. Like who did you think the last boss was going to be?
pseudo stream
honestly? Cerberus 😛
tulip cloud
I don't think @undone bone is that mean lol.
mighty ermine
before the styx update came out there were plenty of people suspecting it was going to be a sad fight against cerberus, yeah
pseudo stream
I kinda figured Cerberus would be the last boss and Hades would be a secret last boss like the Heart in Slay the Spire or the REDACTED in Dead Cells
mighty ermine
there are some lines while giving him the sack that kind of make fun of this
cunning urchin
I love all the lines when you defeat Cerberus.
mighty ermine
i cry every time zag defeats cerberus||' appetite||
pseudo stream
oh yeah I totally love what happens
but it was a nice surprise the first time it happened and I don't wanna cheat people out of that 😛
tulip cloud
Oh man, I just looked at the wiki page and Cerberus is voiced by a developer's dog lmao.
I hope he got properly compensated.
gleaming current
Probably got the triple treat
cunning urchin
Satyr Sack.
pseudo stream
is 32 heat a... sane goal for someone who doesn't want to pour hundreds of hours in?
cunning urchin
I dunno your skill level lol. Just try it.
pseudo stream
oh I mean I tried it once and it went terribly, died in Asphodel and unlocked some new voice lines for it 😛
but I mean is it reachable?
gleaming current
I got it in 25 hours, so it's def sane 
cunning urchin
Well, if you made it to Asphodel on your first try, that's pretty good. Should be able to make it farther with some practice and maybe adjusting your strategy.
pseudo stream
25 hours from when?
gleaming current
25 hours of steam playtime
pseudo stream
yeah, I decided to try to get FO2 down so I can get rid of some of the annoying boon limiting options... I prefer fun boons and harder
woah. what. well done 😛 maybe I should have skipped a lot of the early heat stuff, it's kinda a slow burn
tulip cloud
It's going to take me forever to get to 32 since I just go up one at a time for the rewards.
gleaming current
May be a slow burn but also a decent practice
pseudo stream
yeah that's what I did, did 9 then skipped to 16
16 was fairly easy, so I tried 32... nope haha
so I've been doing more of the slow stuff, only have 3 prophecies left before I have them all 😛 (I think I'm missing some favours too)
gleaming current
Eh, you def can get 32 after 16,just need a bit more luck
cunning urchin
32 I feel like is often just a matter of finding the pacts that work best for you.
Plus some practice.
pseudo stream
huh. maybe I'll keep messing with it
tulip cloud
Have you tried not getting hit? That way you can't die.
gleaming current
Only need to get concerned after said 32 as you start picking up pacts that are the most hurtful
pseudo stream
I did! and ran out of time and died anyway 😢
gleaming current
Have you tried not getting hit? That way you can't die.
TD2
pseudo stream
(that was a lie)
mighty ermine
yeah, pretty much as nyaa said, pact choice at 32 is honestly pretty flexible
more than you'd initially think anyway
pseudo stream
oh? CrabBar, which do you think are the most hurtful?
gleaming current
Hard Labor in combination with Lasting Consequences (sometimes Routine Inspection 2); Jury Summons/Calisthenics Program/Damage Control in larger capacities with Tight Deadline 2
Heightened Security can be tricky by itself
mighty ermine
Approval Process 2 on top of those as well 😔
gleaming current
That too, really increases amount of time you need to spend for decent run going
pseudo stream
I haaate Security, I'm quite bad at it
dry ember
is 32 heat a... sane goal for someone who doesn't want to pour hundreds of hours in?
I got it like 40 hours, then I 32x6 like 50 hours in, so yeah
dry ember
move at your own pace. but it's doable.
gleaming current
^
pseudo stream
the slow heat burn is a bit annoying, I don't love the Slay the Spire style approach and would have preferred closer to Monster Train
dry ember
also I jumped from 5 to 32 heat
so playtime should not be a good indicator
just... do it 😄
gleaming current
It's a lot more important to enjoy the game in the process, and pacing is one of most sensible ways to ruin the joy
pseudo stream
yeah, it's not a 1:1
static jacinth
Also, monster train also has you slowly climb, doesn't it? And also forces you to win right off the bat.
Probably jsut cheat engine away the grind if you don't like it too much.
turbid needle
Anyone wanna fire up Lucy with Lightning Strike for me and let me know if your lightning is comboing?
unkempt pagoda
comboing?
turbid needle
The on-screen damage value will keep increasing if damage of a certain type (non-elemental/weapon damage, as well as one for every Olympian) is applied rapidly enough.
gleaming current
It should, at least it did on zag rail
unkempt pagoda
@turbid needle it does
hearty elbow
does Breaching Slash affect dash strikes?
gleaming current
Yes iirc
serene phoenix
What heat options to use for 32?
steady hatch
avoid the ones you struggle with
serene phoenix
Is it a legitimate strategy to not take any TD and just take your time
steady hatch
i would personally go for one in TD
gleaming current
TD can be avoided entirely, but TD1 is usually not too bad
(unless you try to unironically use chiron)
hearty elbow
minus Approval Process and Routine Inspection I assume.
valid locust
Is Aspect of Rama a melee weapon pretending to be a ranged one?
gusty dagger
Which weapon/aspect would go well with utilizing zeus' legendary? Need to get it for the prophecy list
static jacinth
Your dash :3
But also I suppose Chaos Shield with Lightning Flourish is good too.
dry ember
Which weapon/aspect would go well with utilizing zeus' legendary? Need to get it for the prophecy list
Chaos Shield
Zeus Shield
Any Rail but Hestia
Any Fists
pseudo stream
Monster Train only has 1 "Heat Gauge" equivalent, you go up in all the clans at once
25 runs to get to the top instead of... 120 😛
pseudo stream
yeah, but you're not doing the same difficulty over and over again, so it feels less grindy
static jacinth
I find the weapons different enough that it doesn't bother me.
Also shiny new titan's bloods.
dry ember
yeah if there is anything I would complain about Hades, it's that the game is a bit grindy and some UI elements are ... unintuitive.
dry ember
yeah luckily the game loop is fun. so the grind is just more playing of a good game.
but in the end of the day, there are a lot of things to do to 100% the game.
pseudo stream
is... keyboard and mouse... better? watching a 40~ heat fists run and he's dashing and pushing in all sorts of directions
static jacinth
I think so, yeah.
worn sand
dry ember
either pad or mkb is fine.
worn sand
right before Lernie
dry ember
in fact gamepads are more popular
main osprey
I prefer KBM, but I know several very skilled players use pads
pseudo stream
I suppose... I feel like aiming in a different direction from where you move is suuuuper valuable
is Ares attack for fists popular? why?
dry ember
one reason really, merc end
Doom on fists offers decent damage
since it's easy to apply widely and consistently
pseudo stream
yeah, that makes a lot of sense, it's very mobile
dry ember
but what distinguishes it is merciful end
pseudo stream
I've been skipping it for hoping for demeter/dionysis, but I should try that
dry ember
Nyaa did some math and Dio actually yields fairly low damage
Demeter is OK if you can find Artic Blast,
static jacinth
Even without arctic blast, it's at least very -safe-.
And the damage mod is good.
dry ember
most of the time on fists people build Divine Strike, Lightning Strike, or Curse of Agony
mighty ermine
with the whole thing about moving away while aiming an attack in the opposite direction, gamepad can still do this with well-timed inputs i.e. facing dash-strikes where you were while dashing away
static jacinth
Divine Strike is probably lesser DPS, but usually safer.
dry ember
but again, that's the popular build, if you can make something that works for you then go for it 😄
pseudo stream
meh no reason to explore when others have already planted their flags :p
I find the timing on divine strike too scary haha
bronze sorrel
Tempest strike is pretty scary if you can get Sea Storm. Inconsistent though.
gleaming current
Probably easier to build through zeus into splitting bolt, because that way you aren't left with weak +knockback attack if you don't get the duo
turbid needle
Hello everyone! there was a pinned comment with guide for the final boss and some good builds/strategies?
Was it outdated? or something?
main osprey
Huh, that's weird
Lemme find it, gimme a couple minutes
@turbid needle
https://docs.google.com/document/d/137Vqe-8fvStMJ_HMlBKWwq3SVdoOED0lOpBBSmgGwtQ/edit?usp=sharing
This what you're looking for?
turbid needle
@main osprey Thank you ❤️
main osprey
o7 sure thing!
true bramble
Are the required boons for "Freezing Vortex" correct on the wiki? https://hades.gamepedia.com/Duo_Boons
I just finished a run where I had the required boons after Tartarus and even a few rerolls on both Ares and Demeter. Never was offered it. Instead, ended up with Hunting Blades. Maybe Hunting Blades excludes Freezing Vortex?
oh i'm an idiot. "Cannot be combined with Hunting Blades" https://hades.gamepedia.com/Demeter
random hull
The shown prerequisite is mostly correct. Slicing Shot + a chill-inducing boon.
Should also work with Slicing Flare.
What's weird is why Crystal Beam is there on the list. That shouldn't be.
true bramble
Thanks, just edited the Wiki
cunning urchin
Crystal Beam is on the list because the requirements were added automatically from the game files, and Crystal Beam is listed as a requirement in the game files.
Even though it makes no sense lol.
random hull
Oh right, the info came from datamining.
Now what to do? Have a wiki that makes sense, or one that is true to the files?
cunning urchin
Nah, the edit is fine.
It's impossible for Crystal Beam to work as a requirement, for obvious reasons.
pseudo stream
any Shield of Chaos advice, Nyaanyaa?
it seems fun but I have no idea if I'm playing it right haha
(including boons and especially hammers, got the 80 damage shot hammer)
pseudo stream
yeah it seems amazing haha
got basic +% stuff on attack and special, no real synergies or combos here
main osprey
Any specific aspect?
main osprey
Alright, I'll be able to help in maybe half an hour or so
main osprey
@pseudo stream
Alright, Chaos Aspect!
There're a few ways to build it, but I'll cover a couple general things. I'll cover a Charged Shot build second. Keep in mind, these won't be perfect or complete builds, and it might not hold up consistently at higher heats. This is all just from my experience
Attack: Lady Demeter and Lady Aphrodite are both solid. You're going to be ramming into things a lot with your Bull Rush, so applying Debuffs is useful
Special: This is the core of your build. You want something with good area coverage: Lords Zeus, Dionysus, and Ares, and Ladies Athena and Demeter.
If you're trying to shotgun the special (getting in someone's face at the right angle for all of the shields to fly together), you want Lord Dionysus or Lord Ares (with Dire Misfortune).
Dash: Dash boon doesn't matter much, though I don't recommend Lord Poseidon. Main thing here is strategy: Your high-damage combo is Bull Rush -> Special -> Dash Back or Through -> Repeat
Cast: Almost never use it, other than boosting damage against bosses, and hitting as I run up to enemies. Lady Aphrodite would be good because you can weave that into your combo, and Lord Ares/Lady Demeter are good because you can just drop them and forget
Call: Lady Athena if you want to be even harder to hit, Lord Poseidon if your damage is struggling. Greater Call when you can, since you don't usually need the i-frames from Lesser Calls
Hammers: Dashing Flight is great. Quick Rush is also good.
Swan's Classic Minotaur Shot™️ :
Hammers: Charged Shot, Minotaur Rush
Attack: Lady Artemis
Special: Lady Athena
Dash: Literally anything (probably Lady Athena)
Cast: Lord Poseidon
Call: Doesn't really matter
Strategy: Just sit back and spam Shot, use your Special when you're getting overrun
pseudo stream
woah. so the 50% from the cast isn't that important?
pseudo stream
the mirror talent, I suck at names
pseudo stream
what did you mean by "almost never use it"?
main osprey
For bosses/minibosses, I usually throw one at the start of the fight, and then another whenever that one drops. Just weave it in when I have a chance in most other rooms
pseudo stream
yeah, that's sorta my plan
main osprey
On a cast build, I'll be spamming that thing as frequently as I can
pseudo stream
except I tend to just spam it early when I'm far away haha
hearty elbow
Good stuff, though, I've had a lot of success with Curse of Agony with Dio special too (Particularly good with Charged Shot)
pseudo stream
Yeah! I kinda wanted basic strategy, tactically I just spam around
It uses less dash strikes than I’m used to
main osprey
Yup
Lots of dashing, but rarely dash-strike
And yeah, I could see that working @ ledgerdamayn
My strategy depends heavily on whether or not I have Charged Shot xD
hearty elbow
I like Aphro a lot more when I don't, obv because you're charging into enemies. But the extra damage from Doom is really welcome if you can play from ranged
main osprey
Definitely
pseudo stream
Why dio special with charged shot?
Oh I got flying cutter or whatever it’s called, it seemed good
hearty elbow
The fist hammer?
pseudo stream
nope, sorry, the dash special one
main osprey
Dio special is just good on Chaos Aspect, regardless of hammers. And you mean Dashing Flight?
pseudo stream
that's the one!
hearty elbow
Chaos just doesn't need hammers. Sudden Rush, Ferocious Guard, Charged Shot, are "fine" but super unnecessary. Charged Shot just changes your gameplay the most and gives you a second damage source for the exchange of no longer being able to shotgun enemies as efficiently and losing some mobility
pseudo stream
how does Minotaur rush work? a well timed charge up does way more damage?
oh also
is there an angle where all the shields hit? that sounds hard to find but valuable
main osprey
Yes, right in their face xD
hearty elbow
If you're right next to them lol
main osprey
Shotgunning is tricky, but hitting the first person with all is easy
hearty elbow
For Thunder Flourish, the return shields are way more important, since they're a lot more likely to be staggered by >0.2s
main osprey
The reason I have Lady Artemis for my Minotaur Shot build is because crits get crazy, especially with a couple Chaos Attack boons
hearty elbow
The reason Charged Shot is so nice with Dio is because you don't have to continue DPS'ing for 5 seconds after you've applied Hangover, so you can focus on repositioning. That's a lot easier when you're not in the opponent's face. Charged Shots also give you a meaningful way to continue applying damage while Hangover is ticking.
Ares special and Thunder Flourish don't have that downside so you really should be focusing on using the special as often as possible
warped kernel
What duo boons do yall recommend?
main osprey
For any particular Aspect/Weapon?
warped kernel
Im just finishing them up for the list, wanted to know if therr were any favorites
I dont often use my cast if that helps
main osprey
Mm, Dio/Poseidon is good, so is Pos/Aphro
Those go with anything
Pos/Zeus is one of the best if you have a build that works with it
Zeus/Aphro and Zeus/Ares can be good
warped kernel
A good start, I'll check out the Pos ones first and go for the Zeus ones after
Now that i think of it, Hera bow and Dio cast sounds fun
warped kernel
wait, dio/art only gives a max 7.5% (12% with dio/aphro) bonus crit chance?
that seems a bit low?
main osprey
global crit chance
worn sand
4th chaos room, first room in Asphodel
also got a +96% special dmg in a guan yu special run
lots of damage will be had
warped kernel
Dio/Zeus and Dio/Demeter boons work well together
dire wedge
there was a time when you could do dio/zeus, dio/demeter and the old dio/athena (fog blocks projectiles)
I kinda miss that duo
pseudo stream
any quick demeter aspect advice? 😇
unkempt pagoda
use damage modifier gods on special
cunning urchin
Punch a lot.
unkempt pagoda
any of the special hammers are fun on demfists, but explosive upper is the agreed-upon Best Hammer™️
(i like the one that turns your special into a ranged attack )
long knuckle or breaching cross can make it easier to build up hits
a good build is heartbreak strike, deadly flourish, and heart rend
cunning urchin
Hmmm. I dunno about that one.
pseudo stream
deadly is the critical one, what's heart rend? bonus damage against weak?
unkempt pagoda
4.5x crit damage on weak foes (instead of 3x regularly)
cunning urchin
You basically build Demeter Aspect much the same way you'd build Zagreus Aspect.
That typically means Divine Strike + Hunter Dash or Lightning Strike, Curse of Agony, or Divine Strike + Divine Dash.
With ideally either Heartbreak Flourish or Deadly Flourish on Special.
pseudo stream
oh neat haha, I have divine strike and Heartbreak Flourish atm... also trying to get Demeter's legendary for my prophecy list
cunning urchin
The key for Malphon in general is really Deflect on Attack or Dash because that just helps so much with everything.
pseudo stream
yeah, dewflect on dash seems like the best boon in the game
I find punching deflecting too scary, though I have it this game haha
how does one choose between Eurydice's blessings?
worn sand
how many build-defining boons do you have? What rarity/pom level are they currently? How do they scale?
unkempt pagoda
choose ambrosia if you have few boons or have already leveled up a ton, choose poms if you have a lot of boons or have barely leveled at all, choose nectar if you like what you have already or are depending on/hoping for future boons
cunning urchin
If you meet the requirements for a legendary or a duo that you want, take her Nectar because it increases the odds to see one a lot.
pseudo stream
oh does it? I didn't great a straight answer before, that's great to know. should have taken it then! need Demeter's boon haha
cunning urchin
Some boons can't be leveled up and only improve through higher rarity, so if you want to buff any of those, Ambrosia can be a good choice. But you'll have to gauge how likely it is to hit the particular boons you want to improve.
Higher rarity also generally gives a greater bonus than +1 level, and pom levels give diminishing returns, so from Lv.4 to Lv.5 is much less than from Lv.1 to Lv.2.
Pom Porridge, of course, can level up many things at once and has a higher chance to hit any boons you want to level up. And if there are boons that can't be leveled up from poms and that you don't care for, the Ambrosia might hit those instead, so Pom Porridge can be a better choice in that case to only hit the boons you actually care for.
worn sand
if you have a decent build all-around, then poms is pretty much always a "solid" choice. Best value on average IIRC
cunning urchin
The Yarn of Ariadne and miniboss chambers also increase your odds for a duo or legendary. So if you can combine any of those three and meet the requirements, your chances are really good!
worn sand
wont be anything gamebreaking, but will smooth out some weakspots in your current build
cunning urchin
Sometimes "best value on average" isn't good enough.
If you have Greatest Reflex at all, Ambrosia is always worthy of consideration just for the simple fact that you have a chance of getting +1 dash, no matter how small the chance.
barren otter
that feel when you take Epic Strong Drink near the end of Tartarus, then Common Rare Crop hits it out of 3 options and you end up with 20% bonus damage (no mid-biome fountains) no matter if it was epic or heroic.
pseudo stream
is there a reason not to use dash upper with Demeter aspect, or do you still get all the extra hits at the same damage bonus?
yeah, that makes sense, thanks guys!
cunning urchin
Dash-Uppers with extra hits do more damage than regular Uppercuts with extra hits.
pseudo stream
... that... okay, fair enough haha
thanks 😄 I always dash upper out of habit anyway
barren otter
dash strike upgrades affect the dash uppers, right?
cunning urchin
Dash-Strike boons, yes. Dash-Strike hammer upgrades, no.
barren otter
so Artemis dash and Chaos' dash strike boons
cunning urchin
Correct.
cunning urchin
Why? lol
pseudo stream
chaos boon for +dash damage would have been rad haha
cunning urchin
Oh.
lunar salmon
Coincidentally I'm playing on Demeter now
pseudo stream
I really want this stupid demeter legendary, but it's so hard
lunar salmon
So that's new to me because I never saw the extra hits with Dash-Upper
tulip cloud
Hmm, do I need to do something to be able to post an image here?
I don't see the + like on other servers
worn sand
upload picture to imgur or something and post the url, it'll auto embed
tulip cloud
Guess that works lol.
All I did was cast with this lol
It was like 500 dmg per cast
pseudo stream
which sword aspect do you guys find most fun? I wanna max one, but only one haha
worn sand
4th one because big number = big fun
hearty elbow
Yeah, Arthur definitely feels the most fun for me too
pseudo stream
does the improving it do anything other than increase the damage reduction of the aura? I don't fight in the aura all the time
hearty elbow
Nope it's pretty decent at low heat without blood
Though the blood definitely helps if you get Greater Consecration, which is awesome on that aspect
(the hammer is still good without blood investment if for nothing else that it trivializes Chariot/Flamewheel rooms)
I"m not sure of the exact qualifier they have that does it, but for whatever reason they basically just stop moving when they enter the aura.
cunning urchin
It's good at any heat.
I think I use Excalibur and Nemesis the most.
I've had a lot of fun with Poseidon Aspect, though. That's how I got my first TD2 wins.
pseudo stream
I had a ton of fun with Poseidon1, 5 sounds like it'd be rad
lunar salmon
Finally got Rama
pseudo stream
Rama is soooo fun
... woah. Lambent Plume seems rad? haha
at 22% at the end of Elysium, with a level 1 one
barren otter
I just found out you can use Hestia rail in the house. I F10ed that, just sharing it here too because it's pretty funny.
https://imgur.com/a/CpsLPFt
Interestingly enough, dad is the only one who reacts to getting shot and he gets a forcefield
https://imgur.com/a/aWFyoRI
gleaming current
Damn, zagreus really went too far with this one
weak rivet
![https://i.ibb.co/0Cj8SBW/Hades-1199.png[/img]](https://i.ibb.co/0Cj8SBW/Hades-1199.png%5B/img%5D){kind=link}
pseudo stream
Anything special to know about Hades aspect? Hammers-wise (I find hammers seem to be the most unique things)
dire wedge
Massive and Quick Spin synergize well with its unique trait. Well, Massive Spin if you want a spin that covers the entire screen
narrow rampart
Hades aspect I feel is quite versatile with how you can build it. I like going with both the spin charge up speed and spin size hammers, to maximize on its innate spin size
others take either serrated edge or explosive launcher (or both, I suppose) to capitalize on the increased attack/special damage against enemies hit with the spin attack
I prefer the former most
pseudo stream
Explosive launcher is the only prophecy thing left that I’m missing atm, so that synergizing would be ideal haha
pseudo stream
same! after that I think I start spamming 32 heat haha
static jacinth
Explosive launcher is just generally pretty amazing.
hearty elbow
Serrated Point and Explosive Launcher both work really well with Hades
static jacinth
*with every spear
hearty elbow
fair enough
static jacinth
Zag spear loves getting explosive launcher.
rare kayak
sonicden found the secret ending
zagreus just goes into the house and starts blasting
pseudo stream
serrated point seems like the best upgrade haha
pseudo stream
and Guan Yu?
narrow rampart
charged spear, imo
pseudo stream
charged skewer?
hearty elbow
Yeah
Quick + Massive Spin has "more potential" because of how easy it is to recover health, but the damage output is pretty lacking the higher in heat you go
pseudo stream
yeah, I believe that
okay! done all 50 prophecies. now I need to pick a weapon or two and try to get 32 heat... maybe also get the last few favours done haha
valid locust
Need to try Talos with Demeter cast.
charred pilot
The Lunge on Stigiyus is absolute hell to use... I don't even know how anyone can use it to any real potential
valid locust
The lunge?
charred pilot
yeah the lunge upgrade from the hammer
hearty elbow
You mean the third standing attack I guess?
charred pilot
The Q upgrade from the hammer
dry ember
Snap Nova xD
hearty elbow
I love it 🙂
valid locust
Snap Nova is fun
dry ember
Ew
valid locust
I love killing myself
charred pilot
it's like death when you take it
hearty elbow
I use it with Nemesis as a free dash to get behind people. I don't use the recall but I know @cunning urchin likes that part of it too
valid locust
Same with Cursed Slash
charred pilot
Cursed Slash I'm a fan of
valid locust
Took it, knew it was a mistake
But my choices were cursed slash or snap nova
😂 😂 😂
charred pilot
Cursed anyday 🤣
cunning urchin
Snap Nova? I think the person who could tell you the most about that hammer is @neon bramble, but I haven't seen them around in awhile.
dry ember
Just throw the sword 4head
charred pilot
Also does anyone know how to use Blitz Disk properly?
valid locust
Blitz disk?
cunning urchin
Doom on Attack or Special.
dry ember
Yes
cunning urchin
Deflect on Attack, Special, or Dash.
dry ember
Yes
valid locust
Put Aphros on it
cunning urchin
That's just one one build for it, anyway.
valid locust
And watch the fat damage fly
turbid needle
I ran crit Aspect of Zeus and it was kinda funny.
valid locust
Or Zeus boons
dry ember
Merc End build is the speedrun build
cunning urchin
I've only done one run with it, looks like there's quite a learning curve in making it work as well as or better than other shield aspects.
valid locust
There is
dry ember
Zeus on Zeus Shield is the more reliable build
cunning urchin
But I'm also bad with Chaos Aspect lol.
charred pilot
I am a massive fan of going full EGG
I love Chaos Boons so freaking much
but thanks for the build recommendations I'll go Merc End next time
hearty elbow
Poseidon aspect is pretty straightforward
dry ember
While Doom on Attack is fine, I still highly recommend Doom on Special, Deflect on Attack or Dash.
hearty elbow
Or attack and dash
turbid needle
And Dash.
Also, spawning into Pulverizing Blow is the biggest gift you'll ever give yourself when using Zeus.
hearty elbow
I love that Zeus aspect exists but it's definitely bottom 3 favorite aspects for me
dry ember
It kinda grows on me.
But honestly shield aspects are overshadowed by Chaos tbh
Beowulf made some splash but that's due to Charged Flight, not the cast gimmick.
cunning urchin
Dragon Rush is really good.
dry ember
It is, but the Charged Flight side is more widely discussed here.
cunning urchin
Well, ain't nobody using it on high heat right now except me anyway lol.
dry ember
I mean you don't know that