Triple dash attack???
#h1-builds-and-combat
neon bramble
hybrid galleon
then i can spank my ||dad|| with a broom
neon bramble
Lol
civic barn
serrated edge
neon bramble
No
hybrid galleon
fug
livid comet
so spear feels clunky to aim since thrusts are inherently harder to play with than sweeping attacks
hybrid galleon
make that happen or else
neon bramble
When you get the hammer, you'll understand why
hybrid galleon
when i play this patch, i will understand why
neon bramble
It looks like a giant claw when you attack
hybrid galleon
but the only way to play spear is to not spin unless you are guan yu
and dash strike 100% of the time
Fork into Broom
livid comet
right, most of other moveset doesn't feel viable
either due to lack of damage, slowness or difficulty with aiming
neon bramble
I'm gonna try a Beverly Hills ninja build on the spear right now
livid comet
(I'm basically trying to nail down what feels off about the spear)
hybrid galleon
true
its unfair when its hurtbox is so small
its unforgiving imo
and it deals okish damage when the cheese wheel known as chaos shield can just haha press q
but i enjoy spear regardless
i think my highest heat is still spears
livid comet
hmm
hybrid galleon
ok but spear pierces greatshield
livid comet
does it?
hybrid galleon
at laest it will have a role and is true to its weapon
however, there arent many enemies comes with shields
inner patrol
It tries to be about 4 different things at once. It tries to be a charge move user, but it's difficult to accomplish & dangerous to pull off reliably. It tries to be a quick attacker, but without Rapid Jab it's a pain. It tries to be a special using weapon, but without some of the options from Daedalus it's equally as much of a pain as rapidly attacking
hybrid galleon
so it might also turn out being too niche
livid comet
I legitimately felt like spear was the worst weapon in the game until Guan Yu came along
hybrid galleon
@inner patrol i think it just tries to be sword but has better hammer back then
now it just feels terrible when sword now gets so many good hammer and buffs
hybrid galleon
sword had reaally terrible hammers
inner patrol
I didn't get into Hades until the Nighty Night update, so I can't really say too much about how it was before that
hybrid galleon
before this patch, idk about this patch
like the only good sword hammer would be uh
backstab a lot of damage
and boi its mega cheese
inner patrol
Cursed Slash on Arthur is amazing
hybrid galleon
you could make 5 pizzas out of it
livid comet
I mean, the only sword I like playing is Excalibur as well
hybrid galleon
I play memesis
neon bramble
There's lots of good sword builds, and I don't even like the sword
hybrid galleon
as my heat climbing sword
neon bramble
Nemesis is my favourite
livid comet
oh and poseidon isn't too bad
inner patrol
Overhead Chop isn't terrible, I enjoy it, but it's not always the best
inner patrol
Zag's is good if you can get that new Hermes boon
tawdry vine
I legitimately felt like spear was the worst weapon in the game until Guan Yu came along
@livid comet That little bit of range can`t possibly compensate for that rather ineffective special
hybrid galleon
@neon bramble that one hermes boon might capitalize on that
the more movement more damage
neon bramble
There's better ways
livid comet
how do you mean? @tawdry vine
turbid needle
Smoldering Air+Second Wind.
neon bramble
That too
inner patrol
I mean that Hermes boon that buffs your damage the more bonus speed you have feels like it's built specifically for Lambent Plume
hybrid galleon
Dambent 🅱️lume
inner patrol
It's like 3 here & my brain trips over itself trying to get the words out
hybrid galleon
#buffspearandloveshotgunthx
naive tusk
@regal nimbus Hello! You should submit your feedback via the bug reporter 
Bug
It is currently unable to egt the Aphrodite/Demeter duo boon via Demeter, you need to get Aphrodite in order to get it, i've tried it a lot of times and Demeter will just keep offering upgrades to already existing attack/special/dash boons etc., where as APhrodite would give the duo immedeatly
#hades-feedback is not meant for bugs nor technical issues :)
P.S. nice avatar!
humble jackal
To Crit Final Boss for 5500 is really satisfying
inner patrol
Zag & Achilles are okay, but I hate Hades' aspect
tawdry vine
@livid comet Sorry I meant the Spin Attack.
livid comet
Hmm, I feel like you, too underestimate the GY
Its true power lies not in the spin, but in the special
GY hands down had the best special in the game pre-blood price
turbid needle
Eris.
inner patrol
I dunno, getting quick spin on it puts it on par with Cursed Slash Arthur in terms of survivability
livid comet
and now it's... still viable, but less fun
naw, I find aiming the spins to hit with a small hitbox is too hard
(i.e. you need both quick spin and massive spin for spin to be viable)
and in high heat runs spins simply aren't viable
because of the large number of enemies as well as their high speed
inner patrol
I usually find myself in enough of a target rich environment to be able to get it to work often enough
hybrid galleon
spins are just not a move if you played spear more than an hour
turbid needle
Only because they nerfed spin so hard that you can't break projectiles with it.
But Quick Spin Guan Yu with Divine Strike carried 32 Heat runs.
sacred idol
How's the new drop rate on the duo boons?
hybrid galleon
did they made it unable to break projectiles anymore?
turbid needle
Last I checked.
hybrid galleon
excuse me
livid comet
Oh sure, but athena on attack on most weapons will carry you through high heat runs
raw violet
That’s reverted
turbid needle
Oh, cool.
hybrid galleon
@livid comet Athena carries game
inner patrol
Oh yeah & they nerfed the Frost Blade again. Now the launched spin doesn't block attacks unless they've changed it back
turbid needle
Nevermind, Guan Yu spin is still fantastic.
hybrid galleon
and das fact
raw violet
Anyone who didn’t play tech beta, don’t need to worry about anything
inner patrol
Okay that's good that they reverted it
livid comet
Nevermind the spin, the GY's best asset was its special
hybrid galleon
@raw violet im monkaS ok im a fork main and i will protect my fork
hybrid galleon
@sacred idol the killer queen fork
sacred idol
seriously though, how's the new reduced duo boon rate?
hybrid galleon
special build guanyu
heady zephyr
it didn't block projectiles as of last patch i thought
livid comet
the spin?
sacred idol
Parting Shot (Athena x Aphrodite): new! Your {$Keywords.Cast} deals backstab damage and gains related bonuses
what
heady zephyr
yeah, pretty sure
heady zephyr
@sacred idol wonder how that works with hera/beowulf...
inner patrol
It's not terrible if you have the mirror upgrade that gives you a higher chance of legendaries & duos
random hull
I expect Parting Shot to work well with Achilles, but I haven't got the time to test it yet.
inner patrol
Gonna miss Spent Spirit, NGL
livid comet
??
turbid needle
Spent Spirit still exists, it's just a Duo with Athena and Dionysus.
random hull
Spent Spirit was rolled into Calculated Risk.
inner patrol
waitwat
livid comet
exposed was always fine to use for me tho...
crystal wing
anyone know which gods you need to talk to get the remaining aspects?
twilit stag
What did spent spirit do
inner patrol
Dio & Athena is Smoke Screen
heady zephyr
athena attack and dodge on fists makes you basically untouchable
sacred idol
@livid comet I have never had consistent success hitting the backs of enemies. Especially since some enemies don't have backs, or have very small bodies.
crystal wing
I only got the Zeus one so far
sacred idol
Stubborn Roots (Athena x Demeter): new! While you have no Death Defiance, your health regenerates
ah yes, the boon made for me!
because I'm bad at videogames.
turbid needle
Slows projectiles by 30%, Calculated Risk slows projectiles by 40%.
sacred idol
granny coming in clutch once again
heady zephyr
i had a build with those and draining cutter and i reached the final boss at full health without ever having gone below 50%
turbid needle
Smoke Screen was nuked from orbit.
hybrid galleon
what does smoke screen do?
naive tusk
@crystal wing check pin in #h1-story-discussion
inner patrol
@twilit stag it made projectiles 30% slower
naive tusk
Also, DEATH!
inner patrol
Makes Festive Fog smaller but blocks projectiles
hybrid galleon
why does that sound like Dio's timestop in jojo oh no
crystal wing
much thanks
also 
sacred idol
blood frenzy is lowkey also made for me because I'm Bad at Videogames.
twilit stag
Oh, glad that's gone, it always made me mistime my skull dodges during the Hades fight tbh
sacred idol
whatever smoke screen is, I literally was not around for it
okay so. is Cold Embrace good
inner patrol
Blood Frenzy & Stubborn Roots with Athena call is crazy fun
hybrid galleon
Idea: Grandma Demeter instead of using fists she uses bare hands to slap the s out of ||your dad||
random hull
She would if presented the chance
hybrid galleon
Demeter: I don't need the gloves anymore
sacred idol
Seriously, is that one good? It was apparently cool enough to be shown off in the trailer.
But I'm not sure how useful it is to have three straight lines centered on you
Unless you triple cast in one spot and just... you know... run opposite of a boss
turbid needle
They added a boon to increase its range.
hybrid galleon
you will always be my fav 12 gauge
livid comet
@sacred idol Ah, you and I, we use Exposed very differently.
inner patrol
Cold Embrace I'm not a big fan of. Too much positioning. I wish I could've gotten it when Love Triangle was a thing
sacred idol
imagine Ambush stacking with Exposed and the new duo boon.
Like, a full Chaos stack of backstab damage, and that
livid comet
I use exposed purely for Privileged Status
hybrid galleon
@turbid needle tho im more of a fan getting it buffed rather than a new thing that shoudlve been a buff onto it instead
livid comet
oh yeah no screw that
regal nimbus
@naive tusk Ok! sorry 🙂 Thanks 
turbid needle
It can hit multiple targets for really big damage and it's very fast. I'm okay with it having a weakness that can be patched by an additional boon.
hybrid galleon
do note that multiple is an asterisk as its current form
because the range is just... applicable for one foe 90% of the time
heady zephyr
cold embrace seems like it would be good against asterius and the final boss
hybrid galleon
the rectangle at least can hit like 2-3 grouped up enemies and even then they are packed like sandwiches
heady zephyr
since you can kite them pretty effectively
inner patrol
Love Triangle made it so that the crystal shot 3 beams instead of one, akin to triple shot on Coronacht or the new Exagryph aspect
heady zephyr
you can already do the kite-damage strategy with zeus shield kinda
hybrid galleon
also what is love triangle
livid comet
I think I've managed to figure out what it is about the spear that irks me so... the spin attack is its primary feature that differentiates it from the sword, and the spin is inherently risky/not viable in combat
its attack combo is slower than the sword and deals less damage
the dash-strike is faster but also deals much less damage
so you lack the damage output of any of the other weapons save for the fist, but also lack the inherent safety of the bow, gun or shield, and have no speed to compensate
inner patrol
It was the Aphro/Dem duo boon before Cold Embrace
hybrid galleon
Damn.. I missed out on one of the most Op move in this game?
you said it can fire 3 lasers with crystal clarity that can be mega nutty imo
inner patrol
Which is probably why it got RIP'd
livid comet
not anymore
hybrid galleon
because for now it could be hard to remember which boon is which
livid comet
😛
hybrid galleon
when they said they will add "several" i was expecting 3-4
didnt expect like 20 of them jfc
naive tusk
I'm working on updating my boon trees and duo charts but won't be uploading them yet 
hybrid galleon
@naive tusk i wanna help too
naive tusk
I already got everything I need but thanks for offering 
hybrid galleon
im graphic designer maybe i can help you to cook up a more optimized chart
inner patrol
Honestly the amount of duo boons available now makes hunting them down kinda difficult without abusing keepsakes because even if you don't have what makes the duo boon the god that they use still shows up
sacred idol
Wait, what, the Demeter cast was good?
Maybe I missed too much
But I played the first week of the night update and kind of just disappeared after.
turbid needle
Added a Boon that adds back Chill per tick.
sacred idol
And I vaguely remember that triple shot boon with an old name
But I remember it not being good
hybrid galleon
adds back chil per tick?
sacred idol
Not by itself, anyway
turbid needle
Arctic Blast got a bat to the ankles in response, but it might come back up now that Love Triangle is gone.
sacred idol
Is Demeter's cast worth taking if you aren't running dedicated caster?
turbid needle
When Demeter launched Crystal Beam placed a stack of Chill per damage tick.
sacred idol
Back in the Nyx update, it was not.
inner patrol
Eh, with more options to get chill I doubt it's ever going to come all the way back up
hybrid galleon
I mean with one chill source arctic blast was nutty af back then
sacred idol
Seriously, I was playing at a time when Demeter cast wasn't even remotely good without the tracking duo and extra buffs on top
turbid needle
Especially now that Demeter's got a Revenge boon that slaps down ten stacks instantly.
sacred idol
Was it buffed at some point?
Oh, right, back on release there were plenty of complaints about the fists... how are they now?
hybrid galleon
Local grandma destroys everything
inner patrol
Not inherently, no. It's still got the base damage, and IMO the Aphro duo just doesn't help. You're better off just going Crystal Clarity. The option to give it chill on tic helps it get a damage buff thanks to Arctic Blast, but it still takes plenty of work to get it online
sacred idol
Damn.
inner patrol
I haven't noticed much difference on them. They're still fun & the new hammer upgrades help to mix up the play style
hybrid galleon
and judging from the new cold embrace it feels like eh
@sacred idol Guan Yu gets shot
and being incinerated
sacred idol
how badly, though
since that reflect thing isn't a thing
as long as it can still yeet projectiles it seems fine
although I do think nerfing its hitbox is just... not great from a usability perspective?
inner patrol
Not the biggest fan of Talos or Zeus still, but that's always been a personal preference of mine
sacred idol
not for the power, just the idea of it being...
hybrid galleon
its gimping you
sacred idol
man, that thing was already hard to hit with without massive spin.
turbid needle
Zeus is very scary with the 4th Rail Aspect.
sacred idol
it's bad for bad players like me
hybrid galleon
and it punishes you very hard for every miss with guan yu normal attack
sacred idol
Zeus aspect, not zeus boon
turbid needle
And Smoldering Air can make almost any Call super strong, but especially Zeus and Dionysus.
sacred idol
So at base, spear spins are still kind of bad, I gather?
hybrid galleon
yes
sacred idol
eesh
inner patrol
Yeah... yeah...
hybrid galleon
im sad
livid comet
GY Special got slightly harder to use and a little weaker
hybrid galleon
i wanna play fork man
sacred idol
seriously, spin should at least be viable without quick spin
livid comet
other than that it's unchanged
sacred idol
it's annoying that quick spin feels mandatory for the special
turbid needle
You were throwing a tree trunk, it needed that hitbox change.
livid comet
spin was never a viable part of the spear toolset to me
turbid needle
Has always been and likely always will.
sacred idol
Wait, WHICH part got nerfed on GY
livid comet
it requires too much investment in terms of hammers
hybrid galleon
Spear spin never exist
turbid needle
It's not easy, but it works.
livid comet
Special.
sacred idol
The spin throw, or the firework cannon of doom?
livid comet
The best part of GY: the special
hybrid galleon
the tree trunk
livid comet
it's hitbox got nerfed
sacred idol
guys, actual answer
livid comet
and the base damage is lower
livid comet
I am giving you the actual answer dude.
hybrid galleon
its the special
livid comet
have been giving it for like 30+ mins
sacred idol
well yeah, I can't remember which is which because it has two throws.
c'mon.
also because my terminology is rusty
hybrid galleon
Not the one that throws spin
livid comet
fair
livid comet
the spin was always terrible
sacred idol
that was a nightmare to hit with without quick
sacred idol
nah, I liked it, but it needs QS to feel usable, like all spear spin
but if skewer got its hitbox nerfed
livid comet
ok no it was less terrible when it didn't bounce off walls
livid comet
yep
livid comet
so it's terrible
sacred idol
so yeah basically unusable on any speed heat without quickspin
sacred idol
but even then, that sounds too vulnerable to be worth it
livid comet
you need both quick and massive for it to be viable
sacred idol
oh, how are the new aspects?
livid comet
haven't unlocked them yet
hushed ledge
so uhh thoughts on ||rama|| with zeus special?
livid comet
I think I just got the new shield unlock?
the keyphrase for it anyay
but I also have 1 blood so rip me
sacred idol
...also, was Arthur ever nerfed or buffed
sacred idol
on launch there was also a lot of arguing over whether it was any good
hushed ledge
arthur got buffed in this patch
sacred idol
well yeah, slow weapons will always be slow weapons
livid comet
it got a new hammer?
hushed ledge
i don't think it was touched between release and now?
also just got straight up buffs iirc
livid comet
wait really
sacred idol
but is it viable as of late
livid comet
base damage boost?
hushed ledge
tiny buff
livid comet
I mean I've gotten to 3 heat with it lol
hushed ledge
"improved hitbox on second swing"
livid comet
oh good
livid comet
spear cast build
sacred idol
Kinetic Launcher (Fists): new! Your Cutter special becomes a charged ranged attack
lmao wait is this just Rayman now
hushed ledge
kinetic launcher is soo close to being good
hybrid galleon
@sacred idol tfw 4th aspects arent slow weapon it just feels so good
livid comet
LMAO
inner patrol
The third & fourth swing feels like it has a LOT more range than it used to
hybrid galleon
rail and bow
sacred idol
tbf, Achilles Spear is basically a cast buff too
hushed ledge
but the hitbox on the projectile is so small it just straight up goes through enemies
livid comet
that's the best insult I've ever heard @hushed ledge
sacred idol
@hybrid galleon no, I meant arthur specifically
sacred idol
Sounds like a feedback thing, ask for a bigger hitbox
sacred idol
Clunky but rewarding is fine.
hybrid galleon
Yeah give me my 8000 crit BAYBEE
random hull
I have never insulted people by with "your hitbox is small", but I will try it out next time. All because you people give me ideas.
inner patrol
and Kinetic Launcher is one of my favorite buffs. Use it with Demeter & Giga Cutter your way to victory with a cascade of blasts
hushed ledge
this is like "visually goes through enemies without hitting them" small
sacred idol
That's like "bugged" small
livid comet
@random hull that seems like a viable insult for certain things.
hybrid galleon
its not even to the ISO standard
sacred idol
@inner patrol sounds like a Mega Man build tbh
livid comet
hmmmm
inner patrol
It really is. More Zero if you have Artemis on it
sacred idol
Hoarding Slash good, or a meme?
livid comet
it's like people are forgetting that we're sacrificing a ton of HP for Guan Yu
sacred idol
• Concentrated Volley (Bow): new! Your Special deals bonus damage for each consecutive hit to a foe
• Point-Blank Shot (Bow): Added back to the game; your Attack deals bonus damage to nearby foes
Do these stack
turbid needle
Because it has a built-in heal.
sacred idol
Because this just sounds like "lol bow shotgun"
inner patrol
Like anybody remember when you're first introduced to Zero in Megaman X? It feels like that
livid comet
and they nerfed the healing mechanism to the point of not making it very usable in combat.
turbid needle
God, Zero is so cool.
sacred idol
Because life steal works a lot less well when enemies can kill you in far too few hits
oh, damn, right, Attack
is the triple shot attack hammer relevant yet :^)
livid comet
so what more do you want to take away to make GY unusable?
hushed ledge
triple shot was relevant enough on release people wanted it to be nerfed
hybrid galleon
@livid comet until the spear is F tier weapon
sacred idol
what
inner patrol
Concentrated Volley seems like it's specifically for Chiron's aspect
sacred idol
really?
hushed ledge
yes
sacred idol
that angle felt unusable when I took it
hushed ledge
one shotting hydra
turbid needle
Oh.
hushed ledge
you dash in, point blank it
sacred idol
which update was that
neon bramble
Anyone wanna see this spear but not really spear build? It's only 12 heat, I can't play higher right now because of the performance issues. Game is literally 20fps for me
hushed ledge
and then one shot hydra
turbid needle
I know what I'm using tomorrow.
hushed ledge
release
livid comet
oof
hushed ledge
game
sacred idol
because I don't know when the triple shot hammer came out
hybrid galleon
cant wait to play the game back home and then cry about my fork
sacred idol
ah.
sacred idol
see, I bought it on steam.
livid comet
@neon bramble is it a cast build?
sacred idol
so I have zero idea
hushed ledge
ah fair
neon bramble
Yep
hushed ledge
I bought it minute 1
inner patrol
I... how do you get that much damage with triple shot?
neon bramble
turbid needle
Chain Shot.
neon bramble
It's like... Yeah... I can do that with any weapon
hushed ledge
and there was a bunch of multi stuff
hybrid galleon
exploding launcher and massive spin
hushed ledge
and so on
so you'd get triple shot, aphro attack, sweet surrender or whatever it is, which was like 80% bonus damage then (multiplicative as well)
sacred idol
• Consecutive Fire (Rail): cut from game
• Concentrated Fire (Rail): new! Successive shots against the same foe deal more damage
Uhhh... what?
hybrid galleon
the only 2 spear boon that are good
turbid needle
Flurry Jab and Serrated Point are great.
inner patrol
Isn't that what Consecutive Fire did already?
hybrid galleon
sometimes it destroys everything sometimes it doenst
sacred idol
Wasn't Concentrated Fire the old one?
Like, that hammer was around since the Nyx update or the Long Winter one...
Did they rename it to Consecutive, delete it, and replace it with a variation of the same thing with the old name?
inner patrol
Maybe? That just seems like a lot of effort to say "hey we renamed this upgrade"
hybrid galleon
@sacred idol i think they mean it by the damage has increased more than 1
because increased by 1 damage is nothing
but idk whats the reason to rename it
sacred idol
well, the thing is... does it still reset the MOMENT you stop firing
hybrid galleon
you have to get all shots in to capitalize it
sacred idol
because that was kind of wtf
inner patrol
It's great with the Zag aspect because you get so many more shots before having to reload
hybrid galleon
yeah
hushed ledge
but it's like 78 damage over a clip of 12
sacred idol
if it had a rampdown time, it would be good, but
random hull
Isn't it a buff because "uninterrupted hit" is very difficult to obtain against some foes?
sacred idol
if missing at all resets it?
ah
so it's not uninterrupted anymore?
so that's a buff
hybrid galleon
yeah
sacred idol
it may be actually good now
esp for bosses
if it has some kinda reasonable time period before resetting, like at least a second, then that might actually be worth
hybrid galleon
@sacred idol lets microwave some ||hades ||tonight : )
sacred idol
wha
sacred idol
ah
hybrid galleon
you could get like
sacred idol
...I don't get the logic of nerfing duo boon drop chance with more duo boons
like, won't that just make them harder to get
neon bramble
They still drop like crazy
inner patrol
They're harder to get but there's more of them, so it balances out
neon bramble
I also got sweet nectar on that run I posted above, but it came late so I sold it
Bought a bunch of poms
inner patrol
Of course I found out tonight apparently you don't need a doom boon to get Curse of Nausea, just an Ares boon
sacred idol
how does it balance out if the chance of getting any is lower?
do they show up more often as a whole?
turbid needle
Yeah, Curse of Nausea's awesome.
sacred idol
LMAO Flame Wheels Release
neon bramble
Most of the new duos are pretty good
inner patrol
They show up more often by virtue of there being more of them. Granted it means Aphrodite shows up more than she's welcome, but whatevs
random hull
The idea was probably to prevent Duo/Legendary boons taken 2 or even 3 slots in Styx.
sacred idol
the fact that their response to flamewheel salt was just to sell an item to delete them from the game, that's amazing
sacred idol
lmao they nerfed forced overtime at last
turbid needle
I always throw away a bunch in the last fight.
sacred idol
@neon bramble because I'm bad and tend to die more times in one boss
inner patrol
Especially with Deep Roots being a thing now. It makes Stubborn Defiance busted
turbid needle
I can somehow keep two or three all the way through Styx and then I try to face-tank.
hybrid galleon
so i assume all duos between each combination of gods are completed?
sacred idol
I often do runs with zero deaths, but end up with no defiance in Hades alone
inner patrol
With the currently available gods, yes
turbid needle
Yes, and no other Olympians are currently planned to make the game.
sacred idol
god list is complete
hybrid galleon
i remembered when they said they dotn wanna get all duos for all combinations Im like "hell nawh lmfao"
neon bramble
Ok @sacred idol but consider this...
You can Regen for 80% with touch of Styx dark, so it's like having 2 DD
Then you can get two more revives off Athena if you know how to work the system
So, you'll have 6 DD equivalent by end of game
inner patrol
I thought I read that there was another god being introduced
neon bramble
Assuming RNG is on your side in Styx for the sack
turbid needle
There is one more character to be introduced.
sacred idol
I like how Chaos' new fate prophecy is literally just "go trinketless through the entirety of Styx for a laugh"
Touch of Styx Dark? What was that again
turbid needle
But that's story territory, it won't be a gameplay Olympian.
inner patrol
I could be misremembering and they're talking about Charon, but...
neon bramble
Increase SD Regen by 50%
turbid needle
||Probably Persephone.||
neon bramble
You get it from pattycakes
inner patrol
Touch of Styx Dark is the one from Pat
Like the Hydralite Select & Exclusive Cyclops Jerky
hushed ledge
the reason I take DD is that there's actually only a few spots you can really die to and like I'd rather have the bonus health for those than the consistent health
sacred idol
Yeah, yeah... the thing is, I don't get Patroclus much
no, for me it's just those goddamn elysian warriors in the worst flavors
neon bramble
Anyone else hear Rick Moranis saying " I see your Schwartz is as big as mine" when they fight || Charon || with Arthur aspect?
It can't be undone for me.
inner patrol
The regular Touch of Styx still still increases Stubborn Defiance's health restoration by 50%
inner patrol
It's... weird
sacred idol
What do all 3 do
hybrid galleon
So anyone knows how to use Cold Embrace
sacred idol
like, Rama is what exactly
hybrid galleon
how to build around cold embrace
heady zephyr
rama is reverse chiron basically
hybrid galleon
Chiron 2 electro boogaloo
neon bramble
Beowulf delivers the most damage through its special, ironically
If you get the right hammers
heady zephyr
special marks targets, primary is a big energy wave and damage is shared across all shared targets
hybrid galleon
Chaos 2?
neon bramble
You can chunk for 6k with Beowulf special
turbid needle
With the Dash-Special Hammer and crits?
brave dune
Is it just me or does Beowulf not block?
heady zephyr
it blocks behind you while charging
turbid needle
The angle is a little messed up right now, yeah.
inner patrol
Yeah Beowulf seems like it's a bit of a red herring in that a lot of its damage comes from just beating the everloving hell out of everything with its basic attack moves
heady zephyr
it blocks behind while charging up the dash and like normal mid-dash
brave dune
Is it a bug or a feature?
heady zephyr
seems like a feature, you can see in the charge up animation zag has the shield slung behind his shoulder
turbid needle
If I had to pick one, bug, but no need to F10 it.
hybrid galleon
@inner patrol sounds like playing chaos shield anyway
neon bramble
I did an Ares attack Athena cast ME run with Beowulf... It worked well
But the special damage is where it's at
inner patrol
Eh, less charge & throw and more just throwing. Especially if you have Charged Throw
turbid needle
You get Swift Flourish on that build?
inner patrol
that 400% damage increase on your special is ridiculous
neon bramble
I think so
heady zephyr
imo the +15% damage received is probably unnecessary on it...the slow speed and lack of block already make it trickier to use than other shields
hybrid galleon
Also how do you play Cold Embrace again, or is it just really terrible
because compared to love triangle its mega doodoo lol
inner patrol
It's just terrible
hybrid galleon
feels really half assed
neon bramble
Drop crystals, dash behind and backstab @hybrid galleon
That's how I use cold embrace
turbid needle
Beowulf's Special feels really slow to me, and I'm not a fan of the fact that it doesn't bounce without Dread Flight.
heady zephyr
or drop crystals and kite i imagine
with a ranged weapon
what does love triangle do though?
hybrid galleon
Triple short laser
inner patrol
Given the amount of damage it does I don't mind it not bouncing without an upgrade
hybrid galleon
stupid as fug when you have crystal clarity
heady zephyr
hm, in one direction?
hybrid galleon
thats just level 3 symm beam
inner patrol
Love Triangle is what Cold Embrace used to be
hybrid galleon
also i took the not backstab boon
hushed ledge
rama seems like the best zeus weapon by far
inner patrol
It makes the crystal shoot like Lucy or Coronacht with Triple shot
hybrid galleon
I kinda wish backstab and the other i forgot what it is 2 months havent play this game sorry
heady zephyr
rama with zeus? you mean on the special?
hybrid galleon
wasnt exclusive
hushed ledge
yes
turbid needle
Not Malphon or ||Lucifer||?
hushed ledge
it's kinda busted
heady zephyr
ah, makes sense
hushed ledge
you get special damage
heady zephyr
lucifer with zeus is also kinda nuts
hushed ledge
on what is basically rail attack
neon bramble
They nerfed it
neon bramble
You shoulda seen what Zeus could do on special before
inner patrol
Yeah infinite coil is great with Zeus
hybrid galleon
Do you guys pick Shadman Pressence or Fiery Pressence
if you dont have a build in your mind
neon bramble
And Aphrodite can charm lock with it
heady zephyr
with malphon i honestly prefer athena attack
turbid needle
Shadow Presence.
inner patrol
Fiery. Backstabs are too finnicky for me
neon bramble
Shadow
hybrid galleon
i pick fiery as well
i cant backstab and most of tehm are just accidents
rather than something i deliberately do
heady zephyr
i can only reliably backstab with fists
hybrid galleon
i kinda wish they arent mutually exclusive though :/
random hull
Depends. I use Fiery for Bow and Hestia Rail, and Shadow for everything else.
neon bramble
I pick shadow presence solely because of greatshields
heady zephyr
you can get charon items that give you their buffs
neon bramble
Kill those dudes asap
inner patrol
I've tried so many times to get backstabs with exposed it's stupid
heady zephyr
actually charon builds in general seem....really good now
heady zephyr
no i mean using the charon item
turbid needle
As well as Chaos boons and the Shawl Keepsake.
heady zephyr
and relying on the wells to shore up your weaknesses
fossil wing
@neon bramble if you have a moment, please reply to my DM. I was hoping to follow up on the technical issues you reported.
hybrid galleon
Maximum priviledge 
inner patrol
Dude's getting called by the principle
hybrid galleon
and get 3 candies
i forgot how that story goes
lol
also i ignore mirror of night too much to the point that i just start playing with possibly the worst talent
turbid needle
High Confidence?
inner patrol
That is probably the worst one
hybrid galleon
yes because last round was arthur
heady zephyr
high confidence with guandao only
hybrid galleon
and then when i switch to new weapon i forgot to change it back
heady zephyr
that literally gives you like 15 health right?
heady zephyr
lol
inner patrol
I think the only thing I ever change is the bloodstones
turbid needle
70 at minimum level, max level Guan Yu is only -50%.
heady zephyr
well it makes sense kinda cause you'll either have the damage buff or you're dead
random hull
I mean, run preparation really is tedious at times. I check what weapon currently has Darker Thirst, run to the keepsakes cupboard, run back to the mirror for adjustments, return to the courtyard.
hybrid galleon
^
heady zephyr
i don't bother with dark thirst honestly
but yeah messing with the mirror, then weapon aspects, then the pact is a pain
hybrid galleon
I would say i wanna move the mirror to the courtyard
but that place doesnt seemed to be looking fine with a mirror
inner patrol
Having finished what's available with the contractor I just play what I want
heady zephyr
or let us configure the pact from the bedroom
hybrid galleon
and the bedroom will be just so empty withou tit
random hull
It would be more convenient, but clash esthetically.
hybrid galleon
^^^
heady zephyr
like we used to be able to
heady zephyr
like mirror/pact, and then weapon/trinket isn't so bad
hybrid galleon
it feels like the two rooms should have been one room
instead needing to load the other
inner patrol
Having the pact in the bedroom would make more sense. Almost like there's a desk already in there
hybrid galleon
theres the fated list tho
heady zephyr
kinda, yeah. they probably didn't want to let you use your weapon in non combat zones though
hybrid galleon
its my bedroom wth hades
hades be installing those cctvs in my bedroom
so i cant do anything stupid in my own personal private room
inner patrol
Can make them two different tabs. It'd let you see if there's a prophecy you need to fulfill before picking your heat
errant narwhal
the pact used to be in the bedroom, but it moved to make room for the fated list
hybrid galleon
so yeah i just keep forgetting to switch to better talent for the weapon im gonna use
inner patrol
I mean I know Zag isn't exactly the greatest at organization, but...
inner patrol
same
hybrid galleon
also bedroom doesnt have much aside from story missions
hence i always skipped over
if bedroom has more significance in gameplay, mirror would be more noticed
since you will stay in bedroom more
inner patrol
Kinda wish there was a use for the chaise & the weights
hybrid galleon
bedroom is in that limbo of not being important in gameplay but crucial because mirror is there, and its story heavy, but its not so much in some ways
heady zephyr
the game ends with zagreus sitting down
hybrid galleon
you know what im saying
heady zephyr
yeah, i mean no single place is super consistently story important in hades is it?
hybrid galleon
well.. the court is p story important
theres the npc
but there isnt a single gameplay element (companions excluded/fish) in court
and you can totally skip past without hindering your gameplay progress
inner patrol
Most of the story does happen in the house proper. Mostly because that's where 95% of the NPCs are, but still
hybrid galleon
yeah, but bedroom is like the middle ground of this
inner patrol
It's the only place we get flashbacks (kinda wish we got more of those)
hybrid galleon
like for example when the game reaaally doesnt have anything to offer in terms of story and you wanna speed through, sees a thirsty weapon, picked up, take heat, go
mirror is so important in this but its not there, its kinda not streamlined to your favor
yeah aside from flashbacks thats... kinda it. and that hasnt stopped me from not tryna go to check mirror passively or conciously unless i remember to
the trinket sometimes does this too(ie doesnt have a direction to tell you to needing to change stuff unless a you remember to do so, b this is your first time interact with it), but i digress.
but in courtyard, choosing weapon is very concious, weapon can get bonus and they show, making it easy on you for picking weapons. and the dummy immediately spawns jsut for you to test it
you dont get the situation of "i chose the wrong weapon woops"
but you get a lot of "damn it i forgot to switch this trinket/talent"
inner patrol
Like I said, I have it set up to where I want it to be most of the time. The only time I ever really change it now is if I'm playing Beowulf & want to load it up with a bunch of casts before diving headlong into a group of enemies
hybrid galleon
thats how i do it too
sacred idol
Man, I really wish we could bind right stick tilt to actual commands
Like, attack in x direction
it'd be godlike for the rail and neat to have elsewhere
inner patrol
It'd be redundant since your movement does that while you hold down the attack button
The amount of times I've just spun around waiting for things to spawn in has probably led me to getting hurt more than a couple times
sacred idol
Well, the thing is, you can't strafe on controller
And that matters
I'd like twinstick controls as an option is all
Because moving while shooting in the direction you move is wildly different from shooting in the opposite direction
inner patrol
Eh, personally I'm fine with dodging. If all the weapons were guns it might be different, but when it's one of 6 different weapons that all function fairly differently from each other, and the aim lock helps for when you're moving backwards unless they're only just within your attack radius.
But eh, different strokes for different folks
sacred idol
Well, I mean, tilting to quick attack in a direction would be nice for melee even
I'd use it for quick spear pokes and the like
Huh. Family Favorite is now capped at... 10% with Hermes?
oh wait, per rank, so 20%
neon bramble
Can someone tell me req for || curse of drowning || ?
Do I need || Ares or Pos || cast to make it happen?
naive tusk
@neon bramble You need:
||Flood Shot|| + ||Curse of Agony, Curse of Pain, Rift Dash or Ares' Aid||
neon bramble
Ah. I have it backwards.
Huntings blades it is then, lol
brave dune
Hey so how do you best utilize Beowulf?
hybrid galleon
@neon bramble ares smoothie shop opens once more
Ares Smoothie Shop, since 800 BC
neon bramble
There's a few good ways
Cast build with charged shot hammer is good
Athena cast with Ares attack hoping for merciful end is good
Or just take the dash special and charged special hammers and lay waste to the field with huge Crits.
hybrid galleon
modern ares is just a smoothie shop owner that is unhealthily obsessed with blender blades
neon bramble
Ha
hybrid galleon
"Turn up the turbo it needs to hack the fruits in finer shape"
neon bramble
But... For Beowulf, here are the casts I would use, and ONLY These:
Athena
Zeus
Demeter
Artemis
Maaaaaybe Ares.
brave dune
Hm I don't use Cast builds much, the only thing I think I've used is Hunting Blades
oh
neon bramble
Casts on Beowulf are AOE
brave dune
Ohhh
neon bramble
They are very different from normal casts
hybrid galleon
what was changed on Beowulf Love Shotugn
brave dune
I was wondering why Demeter did an explosion now, I thought they got rid of the laser in the update..
rip
hybrid galleon
i wish they got rid of laser in the update 
neon bramble
For example... No blade rift on beo. It gets a swirling doom vortex
hybrid galleon
its not a good cast anyways
brave dune
whut no I love the laser
neon bramble
No crystal beam... It's an ice Nuke
hybrid galleon
Ice CUBE
neon bramble
No chain lightning with Zeus.. big Lightning bolt AOE
hybrid galleon
what about artemis
neon bramble
Artemis is an AOE
hybrid galleon
idk why they change blade rift tho
neon bramble
Artemis goes BOOM. It's good
hybrid galleon
isnt blade rift an aoe
brave dune
oof
hybrid galleon
a garbage one without hunting blender
neon bramble
Yeah, the Ares one is meh. Low doom damage too
brave dune
I think it's because Beo increases the aoe radius, and the blade rift with that big an aoe needs a couple of boons
hybrid galleon
I want a giant blender
brave dune
Beo + Blade Rift would equal Blade Rift cast + 2 other boons
hybrid galleon
whos stopping me from getting the giant blender
neon bramble
Demeter is my fave with beo
neon bramble
The AOE is HUUUGE
brave dune
Yeahhh
Also you can get giant blender, the Ares tree gets it pretty big
Although you prob know that
brave dune
Okay so I noticed now that Beowulf Bull Rush does not cover zag's front
even from the animation
hybrid galleon
yeah its an odd one
but i never blocc with shields
shield is like sword to me
RUSH B BAYBEEE
brave dune
lmao
hybrid galleon
I have a beyblade on my hand and no one is gonna stop me
brave dune
Okay I did some basic testing
Beo does block on the right?
But not a typical block, it doesn't give the same feedback..
This is why I wish Skelly could hit back..
sacred idol
Amir says it's a touch busted
Dammit. I just got destroyed on a heat 1 fists run. I'm that out of practice.
main osprey
Oof
sacred idol
And I'd just gotten my boons in the right order too... Zeus/Artemis trading places.
Started out with Zeus special Artemis attack on Malphon (lmao), upgraded to legendary through swaps
main osprey
Nice!
sacred idol
DD'd on Artemis Trial (those circles have very weird dodge timing to me) and on Alecto (my least favorite fury)
Are the zag fists worth it?
hushed ledge
they're great imo
sacred idol
Huh. That base aspect buff is worth on them?
sacred idol
huh, okay, I'm used to not thinking much of zags
main osprey
I think they're probably the best Zag aspect, though I haven't played with all of them at max rank
sacred idol
but I always liked the demeters, so I'm trying again with a rank 2, gotta keep enough blood to instamax Lucy
Draining Cutter. This should end... differently.
main osprey
go Hazard Bomb
random hull
Why not? It's fun with L.
random hull
Same here
main osprey
Ares Special did a surprisingly high amount of damage
And 4 Divine dashes meant I could blow stuff up without getting hit
sacred idol
Wow. Wretched Sneak is actually threatening when you haven't got a lot of boons
main osprey
Yee
sacred idol
oh, lmao, this is potentially nutty
Zeus/Poseidon/Aphro with Poseidon special, I feel like if I get Zeus attack and Sea Storm it'll be silly
Huh. Athena attack. Guess I'll be punching projectiles and dashing lightning, not the other way...
This is wild though. Poseidon special on the fists feels pretty great.
If I had a maxed Demeter, it'd be absolutely insane
clear dome
so, how to beat wretched sneak? I lost 1 dd to it every time with bow
sacred idol
Oof. It's not... a fun encounter for slow stuff like bow
clear dome
i was using frickin Rama bow, which means even slower stuff
sacred idol
holy crap, Wave Pounding got a buff
clear dome
what is it?
sacred idol
it's 20% at rare tier, so it's a LOT stronger than back when I last played, I think
knockback boons do extra boss damage, which used to be some kinda piddling amount like 5%
so Poseidon used to just kinda suck, but he seems pretty awesome now.
clear dome
maybe the 5% was like really long ago but you dont build posi
sacred idol
If they buffed Poseidon Attack's attack bonus any, then he seems to be in a very solid place
It WAS long ago
like, nyx launch was my last played
but I mean, the special has one of the higher attack scales in the game
Aphro>Poseidon>rest, if I remember right
🤔 Meme build with all backstab bonuses and the Nyx keepsake viable?
Including the auto-backstab thinger
clear dome
what is the auto-backstab thing?
sacred idol
er, my bad, the cast backstab one.
Cast buffing aspect, Nyx shawl, all Backstab bonuses and Expose
clear dome
its a duo tho
sacred idol
Yeah
But you can still build for it, like a Hunting Blades build.
Would it be worth stacking backstabs (and a chaos backstab boon or two) for an ungodly cast hit
clear dome
maybe? rngesus must smile on you tho
sacred idol
Also, I have Sea Storm on a Poseidon special fist (lmao), and it's currently deleting everything in Elysium... 1 heat though, but it's fun
Question is
Kinetic Launcher, Rush Kick, or Rolling Knuckle?
clear dome
rushlick
sacred idol
The last one seems least-useful since I just have Athena attack
Rush Kick with Demeter... wonder how many times that hits
clear dome
no, if you have a thena attk, you should get knuckle
sacred idol
huh, really, even if it's a common athena and my main DPS is punching the everloving crap out of stuff with my special?
clear dome
well, it provide unending deflection
sacred idol
true, but it lowkey already does
wait, does it cover the downtime of the normal combo, or something?
clear dome
kinetic launcher decrease dps for stupid range
and it does cover downtime of normal combo
sacred idol
Just wondering which one would have better Sea Storm shenanigans
neon bramble
If you throw kinetic launcher at point blank, it'll still Crit
clear dome
krit?
sacred idol
er, built in crit? wha?
neon bramble
Oh, I assume everyone uses Artemis on special 🤣
sacred idol
Oh. No. I have Poseidon
neon bramble
And uses Demeter aspect 🤣
sacred idol
smh, what are you, some kinda metaslave
yeetfist is now life
ideally, yeetfist with thunderfist on attack, but RNG memed on me
small stirrup
Artemis is bae whatchu on aboot
sacred idol
as much as I like artemis, assuming everyone only plays one way...
plsno
but for Poseidon special with both statuses and Sea Storm, common Athena attack that's basically just defense+special charge... Kinetic, Rush Kick, Rolling Knuckle
clear dome
arty is good, but do you get her every run?
small stirrup
Yeah
neon bramble
Yea
sacred idol
lmao keepsake abuse
small stirrup
YUP
clear dome
monotonous
clear dome
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet
sacred idol
...and which of the other two hammers yeet hardest
neon bramble
I like my 3k charged special boss chunking
clear dome
uh, you want range or yeetin power
sacred idol
...probably the latter
small stirrup
Yeet is all we pray for
sacred idol
since this is a memes run anyway
clear dome
rush kik
sacred idol
welp, time to go from water shoryuken to... that other spinny kick thing
small stirrup
I've been using Poseidon much more often so thats a good sign
sacred idol
slower than I expected though
small stirrup
Water Canon is hilarious
sacred idol
like, that's a long-ass animation
neon bramble
And then flip kick into Elysium guard statues. It's also fun
sacred idol
I saw someone do Poseidon attack on Lucy, which is hilarious
the irony of going water cannon on a flaming aspect
small stirrup
I feel like blastoise lmao
clear dome
i zeused Lucy and it turns into holy ray
neon bramble
Water cannon + seastorm is almost as good
sacred idol
How's Demeter on that thing? I always loved using Demeter in general
also, lul, Crush Shot feels like just having an extra fist on Malphon
clear dome
demeter on that is kinda good
neon bramble
Ehhhhh... Demeter on special is better for Lucy than on attack, imo
You need arctic blast as well for it to be good in attack
sacred idol
oh yeah, arctic got nerfed
clear dome
sad cold noises
small stirrup
I haven't tried the full update yet, but is Rama's attack tolerable now?
mossy breach
Water cannon sea storm is the oficial "begone" build
clear dome
not really, its still slow
small stirrup
Oof
clear dome
i like it tho
small stirrup
Do you still flinch while charging beowulf?
clear dome
but mostly i had to spam special on cloner rooms
mossy breach
yeah its slow but its fun pushing enemies back like you have a powerful hose
neon bramble
Just get into the habit of dashing into a bullrush
sacred idol
Man. Technically, Draining Cutter is a REALLY low value... but it's fun literally kicking the life out of people.
neon bramble
And it'll be better
small stirrup
Yeah thats what I used to do during the beta
But that flinch is a run killer in high heat asphodel
clear dome
what flinch? (i dont have nuff blood)
neon bramble
The slow attack before the bullrush
small stirrup
So there is a frame of hitting before the bullrush
Its much faster on the other shields but its slower on beowulf
clear dome
beowulf is hera's shield basically tbh
small stirrup
If enemies hit you during that frame, you flinch and cancel the charge
It is painful at times
sacred idol
pff, this build is stupid fun just in general. I'm definitely going to be using Poseidon on the fists more often.
sacred idol
On the special?
clear dome
yes
sacred idol
nice
clear dome
its stoopid fun, push pull push pull
sacred idol
oh yeah, now I remember that!
heady zephyr
the nice thing about beowulf rush is that the bulk of the damage doesn't come from the rush itself, so you can short-charge it fine
small stirrup
True
clear dome
what does the damge come from tho?
small stirrup
That is nice
heady zephyr
also it turns out charm is really pretty good against bosses since it interrupts their attacks looks like
@clear dome the loaded spells
clear dome
yea, hera vibes
small stirrup
I mean hera has that range
heady zephyr
better than hera in that you'll always pick your casts up right away though
clear dome
i always forget to load my cast so the same
small stirrup
Unless your enemy dies in one shot and ur cast then chases someone else
heady zephyr
does the cast chase? i thought they changed it so they were just AoEs
small stirrup
Arty's still chases right?
heady zephyr
i only tried it with arti and her cast is just an explosion at the enemy that's hit
small stirrup
I haven't tried the new update just yet so im speaking from the beta
heady zephyr
after which it immediately leaves them
small stirrup
I mean as in if you put in 3 bloodstones for a numbskull is overkill
So the overused stones home onto the next enemy
heady zephyr
nope, they leave the enemy as bloodstones, not casts
small stirrup
damn so I guess that nice
clear dome
so its changed i see
heady zephyr
for beowulf at least, i feel like they should make hera work the same way imo
since having a cast 'miss' when the arrow hits is quite annoying
small stirrup
What do you use for beowulf?
heady zephyr
i only tried it once and i really need to git gud with it
like i lost 2 DDs to the furies....that +15% damage taken is rough
small stirrup
Damn are you on heat or base?