I have wiki-editing phobia 
#h1-builds-and-combat
naive tusk
dry ember
Morning folks
neon fiber
huh, covering the fishing spot with my finger worked, i just got my first legendary styx fish
still ocean
Stonewhal?
wide plover
covering the fishing spot with my finger worked
what?
wide plover
yes. I'm asking what's the idea behind covering the spot with the finger
how do you know when it's time to pull it out
neon fiber
it amusingly enough helps you with the timing
since you just need to look out for the white glow when the bait sinks
tepid ridge
Covering the bobber is said to help with seeing the higher flash that shows up above the water when the perfect catch window is active
neon fiber
yeah, that's basically it
wide plover
interesting
dry ember
Yeah that's how I did it
Now I'm used to it and can do without
Just take a bit of practice
wide plover
what's the algorithm for replacement boons? I often choose zeus attack on rail, then get blessed with spread fire and never manage to find artemis' or aphrodite's attack boon despite trying
tepid ridge
They’re fairly rare since you can only have one boon in each of your “slots,” which means only one boon that directly affects your attack. Gods will occasionally offer a higher rarity replacement but it’s not something I find I can rely on or manipulate during runs. Sometimes I’ll take a boon I don’t like and sell it between floors so gods I wan in my build more are more likely to offer their version.
wide plover
so selling is the only reliable way to replace boons
narrow halo
yes
But when you sell it you also sell all the lvls you acquired so the next boon will go back to lvl 1 @wide plover
wide plover
what do people go for on rail beside zeus, btw?
narrow halo
Get drunken strike
wide plover
special damage and hope for a fitting hammer?
edgy sparrow
also with selling the boon, you won't get the automatically higher rarity boon
tepid ridge
Yea Dionysus or Demeter also work on rail and special hammers are solid usually. Not as solid as spread fire, but nothing’s perfect haha
wide plover
I'm asking about rail builds, not zeus builds @dry ember
edgy sparrow
if you have an epic attack boon, they will offer you at least heroic to replace it. If you sell the epic boon, they can offer any rarity
dry ember
I use Deadly Strike or Heartbreak Strike on Hestia Rail.
edgy sparrow
deadly strike is pretty nice, with the high fire rate comes high chance to crit
narrow halo
@wide plover you can get Artires crit attack if you manage to get chaios attack buffs and few hammer upgrades
edgy sparrow
but, then again, the crits don't add that much with the low base dmg
dry ember
That is why you use Hestia
Just imagine it's a more mobile bow
Reload Dash Strike only
Don't spend the whole magazine
narrow halo
@edgy sparrow if you upgrade aspect of zergarus you can keep firing and it will be as if you get extra shots along the way because crits is basically double attack
edgy sparrow
you know, one thing I found with the rail to be super fun was that one artemis boon that launches an arrow with every hit
dry ember
Support Fire is good too yeah
edgy sparrow
that is also basically double attack
narrow halo
yeah
edgy sparrow
I found it once with pressure point, it was super funny
just filling the screen with needles
narrow halo
artemis boons are weak alone but can be powerful if you combine then with her other boons
edgy sparrow
I just love crit builds in games in general XD
narrow halo
Yeah they are usually meant for higher damage
stoic thicket
Speaking of, what exactly happens on a dash attack when I have both Artemis attack and dash? Do the effects stack?
dry ember
Yes
edgy sparrow
Yup!
dash attack is considered both a normal attack, and a dash attack
square vs. rectangle kinda deal
naive tusk
OMG Bananaconda is here 🍑 ❤️ 🍌
stoic thicket
Finally got that Demeter Legendary. That took a while, sheesh.
naive tusk
@turbid needle Stygius (Zag Aspect), +40% Forced Overtime and +60% Jury Summons. Which door do you choose?
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/608403611151761438/714884096421134397/HADES.png
turbid needle
If I couldn't see those rerolls, I'd say take the Erebus gate.
naive tusk
Nope, Fated Persuasion at play here 
turbid needle
Yeah, Erebus.
primal sigil
does Dash-Attack with Coronacht seem underwhelming to anyone else?
proven robin
I thought so too, but the increase to charging speed is actually really helpful.
If you're getting hounded by a lot of enemies, just repeatedly dash-shooting can be a good way to gain ground and thin them out at the same time.
stoic thicket
And there's my first Disciple run. Uncle P of all things.
naive tusk
Please send help. My Crush Shot and Deadly Strike keep leveling up and I can't find moar boons D:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/710856989416226886/714891949949190155/HADES.png
Chamber 28 with only 2 olympian boons. Feels bad man
proven robin
o_o ...I feel like you could probably still make good use of that.
The run wants you to be a one-trick pony? Run those tricks as hard as you can.
naive tusk
I'm trying. We will see how it goes :S
sudden dagger
Ok so I'm dying to thesius too often, whether I try killing him first or second. I can't figure out how to avoid his attacks, especially his aoe
proven robin
The spin?
Personally? My strat is to stay away from him until after he throws his spear at you.
When he recalls it, he turns and walks away to a new position, giving you time to just get a few hits in.
Other option, aim an explosive/AoE attack behind him.
That will get past his shield.
Since technically it's hitting him from behind.
sudden dagger
I do pretty well until he gets stronger
And then starts covering the map in explosions
proven robin
Ahh. For the start of that, I run in a huge circle around the edges, then depending on which god it is, I take their pattern into account while still waiting for Theseus to make the same mistake of turning his back on me.
sudden dagger
Does he ever stop invoking the god? Or do you have to deal with it until he's dead
proven robin
The latter, but after that initial call it follows a predetermined pattern rather than just chasing you.
...I think Zeus's pattern is random, but either way.
stoic thicket
Hmmm, does anyone have a suggestion on what else works well with the chaos shield other than Ares special? Zeus maybe?
proven robin
Zeus has gotten a lot of support.
I would say Dionysus is probably pretty good too.
sudden dagger
Ok I will try to decipher the god patterns better
naive tusk
Divine Flourish
proven robin
Aphrodite as well, mostly for the Weak.
And the damage boost, but yeah.
Poseidon also seems like it'd be a lot of fun on Chaos Special.
Good luck, @sudden dagger !
naive cobalt
It's not as good as Ares imo, but Poseidon can be good.
naive tusk
You can also try to go for Frost Flourish + Killing Freeze 
Artic Blast with the extra shields would work too, I guess. I haven't tried it out myself but sounds good in theory.
proven robin
Ah, yes.
Oh, and Poseidon with his...was it Rupture? extra boon would be good.
Make them try and chase you and take damage all the while.
sudden dagger
Thanks Syd#7018. I had kind of a fun thing going on that round: rail rockets with aphodite, festive fog, demeter attack, the status damage boost, and Zeus dash. it was doing damage but kind of crazy to look at.
proven robin
Nice!
sudden dagger
Also festive fog is so slow :(
proven robin
It is, though it's good to control a zone.
stoic thicket
I guess I'll run big Uncle P again.
sudden dagger
I never though of using it that way
proven robin
A lot of people take the Duo boon with Dionysus and Demeter to turn it into a faster Cast that stuns and inflicts Chill.
If you see Ice Wine pop up in your boons list (you need Trippy Shot and a Chill boon from Demeter before it'll show), it's a good pick.
dry ember
Peach you got another boon yet?
Also is there any way to manipulate Hades stealth moves?
As in make him not to use it.
raw violet
hopes and prayers
proven robin
As far as his stealth? Nah, haven't found one, but honestly it's pretty easy to deal with (unless you've got the...speed Pact activated).
dry ember
I'm not worried about taking hits
I can dodge it pretty ok even with FO2
I want to be able to hit him
proven robin
Yeah, then, sorry, no clue.
dry ember
Hades says "you are just stalling boy"
Look at who is hiding behind stealth
And take literally 15s ish to get up
Old man
Smh my head
main osprey
it's not like you can't see where he is
dry ember
Yeah but you can't hit him
main osprey
If you aim at his invisible body with, say, the bow, the aimbox will shorten as though there's a hitbox in front of it
dry ember
Can you swing at him with say Excalibur?
I should test this out
The arc is pretty wide. If he does have a hitbox
This should confirm it.
main osprey
Haven't tried, I've only done one run with exca and I was spamming special
dry ember
Yeah special should hurt him too. Alright I'll do an Excalibur super nova something later today
To confirm this.
main osprey
GL
Though, I don't think you can actually damage him
I think it's just that he still has a hitbox
main osprey
Definitely!
tepid ridge
Casts seem to bounce off him during the transition to invis, implying he can’t be damaged during it. Looking forward to seeing what you folks come up with
mossy breach
he is invul while invisible, figured out because i used demeter call and he went poof and received no damage
dry ember
I thinking more of when you see footsteps
But the steps might not have a hitbox
Coding wise it makes more sense to make the steps
And not include a hit box till reveal
main osprey
I think the steps are just based on his hitbox over random intervals, if that's what you mean. Or he's swapped out with a hitbox for just the feet.
Actually, I've never paid attention—does he normally leave footsteps when walking?
naive tusk
I didn't make it
I mean, why am I not playing Hell mode if Hades will do a 72 damage sweep and then a 102 thrust and the mythical shield won't appear at all?
I only had Deadly Strike, Heartbreak Flourish, Crush Shot, Pressure Points and Heart Rend for boons. Nice dps but game sure is trolling me 
main osprey
did you happen to notice if he had footprints normally?
naive tusk
Yes he does
main osprey
thanks
naive tusk
And with that rage quit, I will go take a shower and play Halo. I send all my good luck to everyone playing Hades today because I clearly didn't have it
dreamy raven
Speaking of Hell mode. Does it also make it impossible to farm any darkness since you're forced to always up your heat?
wide plover
you're not forced to up it if you don't beat the final boss. So don't do that and you can farm all you want
naive tusk
Is it the Steam version?
@dry ember yes! It was gifted to me recently so I got to put some practice in order to not be dead weight once I play online
dreamy raven
Ah makes sense. Not the worst then
naive tusk
Speaking of farming by upping the heat, I always played as if I were in Hell Mode and my Darkness gathering wasn’t bad. I always picked the weapon with Dark Thirst on too.
main osprey
Re @indigo raft 's feedback, that's actually what I expected it would be, one key to reset one talent. I haven't used it yet, so didn't know that
I've figured out a decent strat
indigo raft
Nah resets the whole thing
main osprey
Focus the wave heads, then the spawn heads
indigo raft
Unless I missed an option somewhere
main osprey
:3
In fact, I do say
I mean yeah, I meant there's 4 different types of heads it can spawn
Two of them don't matter if you position well
naive tusk
They meant to take out the heads that send out purple waves before taking out the lava spitting heads.
indigo raft
Athena dash boon makes Lernie bullet hell not bad at all
sudden dagger
If I get a few points in pieced butterfly and switch to a different boon, do I lose those damage buffs?
main osprey
Yup
naive tusk
Or focus the red heads (wave heads) before the others, overall.
main osprey
Yeah
Waves, then the ones that spawn bloodless, then the lava pools, then the slams
Definitely
Most of my early deaths were to it
:3
Once I figured out how to fight it, it got a lot less annoying
Wait what was that emote. That looked like Groot with a rainbow??
naive tusk
Volfred thinking emoji 
naive tusk
A character from Pyre 🔥
naive tusk
Ah sweet! Welcome to the SGG experience
main osprey
Yeah!! I'm seriously considering checking out some of their other games
naive tusk
@noble folio #off-topic-discussion to discuss other matters unrelated to Hades gameplay.
main osprey
I don't think there's a way to farm blood until you get up to high heat
naive tusk
You could buy some from Charon’s shop in Styx, or exchange for some with the Broker.
novel sapphire
Once you reach the ability to add heat to your run, you'll be able to get titan blood from the fury sisters again with every weapon
magic dagger
Practice. Get better. you'll probably be clearing pretty soon if you keep trying.
neon fiber
It’s less blind luck more knowing how to make the most of what you get
dry ember
Adding heat is another story
neon fiber
Learning to recognize enemy patterns also plays a big part on it
dry ember
You can see that people here have some crazy streak going
So not all RNG
Ok. It do be like that sometimes
He just leave
If you win you get a Centaur Heart
If not you get nothing
You win ties though
raw violet
You get internal shame for losing to Thanatos
dry ember
The dude summons too many enemies
And kill too few of them
Almost as if he's not even trying
raw violet
I'm pretty sure Thanatos is just a big troll at this point
hurhur let's "race". Summons a million adds and watches.
dry ember
I have a screenshot shot of his smug face saying there is business here that requires his attention.
No, Than, there really is not.
You are just messing with my PB anyhow. Meet me in Elysium and save me from TD, or don't show up at all.
Ok maybe I'm too mean to him.
primal sigil
Speaking of Than, do you take damage if you're in his circle when it goes off?
raw violet
no
main osprey
Hahaha
naive tusk
It would be really awkward if Than killed you 😂
naive tusk
Only
dry ember
No biggie
magic dagger
ever have than show up because you took a chaos gate?
wide plover
if I have tempest flourish + hazard bomb, is the bonus damage from them multiplicative or additive?
naive tusk
Additive as far as I know
wide plover
I see, so upgrading flourish will be a pretty small increase in dps when I already have a huge bonus
stoic thicket
And thus the streak comes to an end. First ever try at FO2, my goodness is the big boss quick there.
naive tusk
Well, it will still receive an increase! Plus, splashes everywhere! 🌊
wide plover
I was debating what to upgrade - dio hangover attack (zag rail), arty support arrow or poseidon special (hazard bomb). In the end decided on arrow because it went from 14 to 18, whereas hangover is limited to 5 stacks
hydra and everything before it melted to this stuff (heat 2 currently)
sudden dagger
Can you unlock blood again by defeating a fate with a new aspect of a weapon?
wide plover
no
dry ember
Each weapon is tracked separately though
magic dagger
streak of 13 now
It is really hard to see when alecto is permaraged and tisiphone spawns fog
Is one of alecto's buzzsaws on top of me? I can't tell!
cunning urchin
Alecto EM1 is the hardest for me. 
cunning urchin
I find the solution is to just bloody murder her before she bloody murders me.
dry ember
As good of a plan as any
cunning urchin
"I'm not dealing with this, have this uppercut, let's throw Bouldy on her, too."
dry ember
Using companion on Tartarus boss
cunning urchin
Sure.
magic dagger
I should try that
polar sinew
another weird q from me:
how do ya'll feel about the hitboxes in this game?
I'm not complaining, mind
I'm just curious if ya'll have found like anomalies or weird interactions
dry ember
Yes but in favor of me
dry ember
A couple of times boss attacks should hit
magic dagger
I never notice them, so they're pretty much on top of corresponding images
polar sinew
YEAH
cunning urchin
I can hit an enemy that's behind me and looking at me with Excalibur, and it will be a backstab.
dry ember
Although the biggest offender hit box wise is the Theseus fight with the spear clipping a pillar
But I think that's more of me
Than the game
cunning urchin
I've never actually experienced attacks clipping through pillars like people keep complaining about. Pillars always work for me, and when I get hit it's my fault for not getting behind the pillar right.
gaunt tundra
zeus be damned you try to hit someone on the other side of a square though
dry ember
I think it's not a hitbox issue bit a visual one
Some projectiles can go through certain walls
While others can't
For example I remember the witch projectiles can't go through a low or broken wall
But my arrow can
main osprey
Also attacks that can bounce can frequently bounce through walls
cunning urchin
Excalibur will often not hit enemies because of pillars or walls, though. I think of the weapons, Excalibur is the most buggy one still. But it's the newest, too, and the only one with such a wide, massive hitbox.
main osprey
Like chain shot, or chain skewer
cunning urchin
Like 99% of your swing can be in the open, 1% of your arc is blocked by a pillar, and the enemy that's 99% in your arc and 1% behind the pillar won't be hit lol.
dry ember
Just dash to the other side 5head
cunning urchin
That's how it feels like sometimes, anyway.
flint osprey
im still kinda early game, only just recently discovered duos and dont even know how they're ACTUally obtained but
is it me or are calls/summons a little useless?
like with how slow they seem to charge, i kinda forget they're there
dry ember
Some are sub optimal
cunning urchin
They both can be lifesavers.
cunning urchin
All of them help. Any Call is way better than no Call.
flint osprey
Zeus's seems like it'd be good, but i still ain't had the chance to actually use it more than once
gaunt tundra
^
dry ember
Yeah so with calls, I rarely use them for hallway fights
gaunt tundra
it requires you to be a bit too close to anything to do it
flint osprey
I got zeus' ring on at the start of all my runs since i love his boons so much tbh
gaunt tundra
and often it's not safe to be forever so close
dry ember
With bosses though
cunning urchin
(Except Ares' Aid and Poseidon's Aid.)
polar sinew
Poseidon's Aid is p solid
dry ember
Yeah so don't expect to use call everyfight
cunning urchin
Poseidon's Aid is pretty bugged.
flint osprey
ah okay
dry ember
Think of them as boss fight skills
polar sinew
^
flint osprey
that makes sense
gaunt tundra
you mean athena dash?
dry ember
I thought Athena call was stupid
polar sinew
well, RNG lol
dry ember
Who cares about deflect
gaunt tundra
Athena's call is silly broken
dry ember
But then I learned my way.
cunning urchin
Yeah so don't expect to use call everyfight
Why wouldn't you use Calls pretty much every fight? They make everything faster or safer.
dry ember
You need to charge them up
Unless you have other boons that speed it up
By the time you have call
The fight is usually over
raw violet
it really depends on the weapon
neon fiber
And the cast
raw violet
rail and fist are really easy to build call
dry ember
Ok if you have call use it.
flint osprey
i love fists so much
dry ember
Don't go in a room with the expectation that you will "have" to use the call
cunning urchin
I guess there was no disagreement there, then.
dry ember
Have you heard of the fist crutch?
flint osprey
the what what
cunning urchin
...
raw violet
attack bow and special spear probably build call the slowest
cunning urchin
I sometimes mash RT during fights without paying attention to the gauge because mindlessly calling is better than never calling lol.
Gotta retweet those Olympian tweets.
dry ember
I use Athena call when I'm too lazy to move out of the way when a boss attacks
What tweet?
neon fiber
the tweet
cunning urchin
The one I'm RTing.
dry ember
Oh it's a call joke that I didn't get
neon fiber
it’s a joke, RT->right trigger but also retweet
cunning urchin
Some foxes are smarter than others.
dry ember
This one is self aware, k?
cunning urchin
Have you heard of the fist crutch?
You should probably explain that if you bring it up lol. Don't leave them hanging.
magic dagger
self-aware foxes👀
raw violet
if you build for it, lightning rod is not terrible
neon fiber
It is also not good either
neon fiber
you’re an all-star
dry ember
Hey hexenfree you still here
cunning urchin
It's free, not feee.
dry ember
Yeah that's what I said
cunning urchin
Your lies won't deceive me, blackguard. Now draw your weapon! 🔫 
dry ember
You know how this usually ends right?
cunning urchin
(With you dying to TD. )
dry ember
Not before I send Theseus and his silly chariot back to the junkyard.
Anyhow, Hexen, if you are reading this, a good combo for fist is combining it with Divine Strike
With decent damage and safety.
You can ask the person above me for more info. She is decent at using it.
neon fiber
Another good combo for fists is artemis attack athena dash
That one works pretty well for me
cunning urchin
Deadly Strike is fairly weak on Malphon without a bunch of other buffs to it.
Divine Strike + Divine Dash + Deadly Flourish or Heartbreak Flourish is my preferred build at the moment (with Demeter Aspect).
neon fiber
I usually combo it with chaos boons and the chain attack hammer
cunning urchin
But on lower heat, I'd just run Divine Strike + Hunter Dash and aim for Deadly Reversal.
neon fiber
But yeah
I am on moderately low heat runs too so take that with a grain of salt
cunning urchin
It's better with Chaos Boons, but the attack doesn't apply any status. Might as well go Heartbreak Strike for about the same damage but also Weak.
Divine Strike is really just close to permanent invincibility to most things, though. It's very strong.
raw violet
not just chaos boons but clean kill, family fav, pressure points, hunters mark
there's lots of ways to quickly make deadly strike better damage over the course of a run
deadly reversal
cunning urchin
Yeah, those help, too. I think you're better off with something else that quickly deflects or applies some status, though, and just do massive damage with your uppercut instead.
neon fiber
Yeah, the overall strat i have is to attack fast and hard to stack crits 4 days
raw violet
you're not wrong
raw violet
i just think discussing boons in isolation is just a tiny bit disingenuous to the nature of a full run
not that having a boon in isolation isn't uncommon
cunning urchin
If you're selling boons on high heat, needing more boons to make Deadly Strike stronger just requires more maintenance.
raw violet
it really only requires, what, 50ish percent to start overtaking?
additional percent damage?
but i agree, the utility of different status effects can really help
with consistency
cunning urchin
+49~65% for Epic DS to overtake Epic HBS, but the damage is still comparable for quite a while.
raw violet
also chaos boons can't be sold as far as i can tell
turbid needle
They cannot.
cunning urchin
Yeah, I was referring to crit boons for that. You don't always get lucky with Chaos, either.
raw violet
so deadly strike on certain builds could be your solo sellable boon for an entire run but be buffed by chaos the entire time
very true
cunning urchin
Especially with Approval Process.
Pact choices factor in, too, I guess.
I like how very diverse high heat runs can be.
raw violet
SF rail 32 run was basically getting lucky with one core boon, one chaos boon, one hammer and then picking up additional boons to sell/family favorite
wide plover
I was steamrolling the game with dio attack on zag rail, arty support arrows and hazard bomb, but still got killed by hades despite having 3 death defiances. Is it just the question of learning his attacks and how to dodge them, or just sitting there and pouring damage, since he'll hit me no matter how carefully I'll play?
cunning urchin
I think Drunken Strike is probably fairly low DPS on Exagryph. Support Fire helps, though.
The longer the fight takes, the less room you have for errors.
dry ember
Vorpal, idk what you have in term of level and boons, but usually with 3DDs you can face tanked Hades
Just don't eat the skull and get your blood boil
Also how much hp do you have?
raw violet
3DDs and a build with enough dps, actually
wide plover
~230
sudden dagger
With chain shot, where the arrow bounces up to 3 times, dealing +15% for each, does that mean the 3rd bounce is the most powerful?
dry ember
Yes
cunning urchin
Hangover in most cases works best on relatively slow attacks that hit multiple times or attacks that hit multiple times that you would space out and only use to reapply Hangover.
raw violet
the hades fight really boils down to, how much dps can hades do vs how much dps can zag do
dry ember
Ok bad fights happens. Hangover damage on Hades is a bit underwhelming to me.
raw violet
to determine how much you have to not get hit
dry ember
Nowadays I almost always equip acorn or spearpoint for styx
turbid needle
Hangover really wants some serious damage-ups, like Low Tolerance and Privileged Status, for the final boss.
wide plover
I see. Would demeter build be better?
raw violet
priv status is so good for hangover-centric builds
low tolerence is what? effectively a 60% damage boost?
if you can reliably hit 8 stacks?
is my math right?
math is hard
cunning urchin
On Exagryph? Frost Strike to apply Chill and Deadly Flourish for damage, perhaps? I could see that working, but I haven't tried it.
dry ember
Hangover on shield without buff made me grappled with Hades for more than 3 mins and die to TD.
I'm very underwhelmed by the status
naive tusk
@cunning urchin Try that but also with Inescapable Blast + more stuff to buff the Special
They won't move lol
cunning urchin
That sounds fun lol.
wide plover
inescapable blast works on bosses?
dry ember
@wide plover try Zeus on Zag rail
naive tusk
Yes, it works
dry ember
Or Deadly Strike on Hestia
raw violet
maybe demeter attack and zeus special?
wide plover
alright, though I don't have blood to max hestia yet
dry ember
Ok. Then Zeus Lightning Strike and aim for the Legendary is solid.
raw violet
play keepaway pretty easily
dry ember
If you have Zeus legendary you can basically put everything else on defense
cunning urchin
low tolerence is what? effectively a 60% damage boost?
if you can reliably hit 8 stacks?
It still takes awhile to apply the 8 stacks initially, and Hades is invincible a lot of times, so stacks would run out, and you'd have to apply from 0 again. For the first 1~2 seconds of applying Hangover, the damage with Low Tolerance is pretty much no better because you're at 0~5 stacks either way.
wide plover
you learn something new with every death I guess
raw violet
i've never tried it with rail so i'm not sure how fast you can apply it
edgy sparrow
Whenever hades goes invisible, he clears debuffs, doesn't he?
dry ember
Yes! Live Die and learn
raw violet
i suspect the speed is highly dependent on if you have flurry fire and how many dashes
i suppose
edgy sparrow
If at first you do not succeed, die, die, die again!
cunning urchin
Actually not sure if he clears them, but they'd wear off before he's visible again either way.
edgy sparrow
Touché
Sometimes he appears really quickly for me, and he still doesnt have any debuffs I applied, so I just assumed
cunning urchin
Zag Aspect Malphon hits about 4.75 times a second. I suspect Exagryph is pretty similar?
wide plover
feels a bit slower
raw violet
not sure, dash attacks significantly speed up the attack
but i can't tell by how much
but that's obviously tied to your available dashes
cunning urchin
4.75 times with 2 dash-strikes after every 3-hit combo.
edgy sparrow
Last run I ended up with 5 consecutive dashes 😂
raw violet
i think with enough it is faster in the short-term
but maybe not over an extended period
edgy sparrow
You can't get hurt if you're invincible half the time
Hades winds up an attack
Zag dashes 5 times in a row to the other side of the room before the attack is even out
cunning urchin
That makes me think. Exagryph dash-strike is two hits, right? Do you apply two stacks if two hits connect at the exact same time (or within x msec) or just one?
raw violet
it's a good question that i don't have the answer to
i don't see why it wouldn't
hangover doesn't have any cooldown time as far as i know
my only experience is with chaos aspect and you can definitely go from 0 to 1-5 pending on shield hits
cunning urchin
I'm not a programmer, but I've seen enough games where weird things like that happen.
raw violet
i guess the follow up question is, does aspect of demeter special apply more than one stack of hangover?
cunning urchin
Could be something as simple as both attacks checking if there is a stack in "slot 1"; there isn't one, so both attacks apply it to slot 1.
magic dagger
Normal special deals two
raw violet
so maybe?
cunning urchin
And because both apply it to slot 1, only 1 is effective applied.
magic dagger
dem special should be more, but I've never tried it out
raw violet
i really wish skelly could give you boon/hammer options to play around with
magic dagger
thank you, lord JaviNº6
raw violet
i followed. that's good to know
mossy breach
what i'd like to test is demeter special with zeus
cunning urchin
I know Chill was applied more than 2 times when I tried it, but it seemed a bit funky and apply less than expected sometimes. Though maybe that was just me messing up and miscounting for the buffed uppercut.
raw violet
maybe a low tolerance fist build is something for me to try at some point
it seems like demeter chills stacks are a little wonky
works really well on chiron
but on some other stuff it seems less consistent
magic dagger
works really well on chiron
@raw violet what? chiron isn't in this game, wym
cunning urchin
Low Tolerance on Malphon? With Drunken Flourish?
raw violet
it's all good, there's a lot of lingo in the game
mossy breach
im going to test demeter aspect with zeus... it shouldnt work but maybe it does
cunning urchin
I personally expect the only good Low Tolerance build on Malphon would be with Dionysus' Aid. That Call is pretty good.
raw violet
i didn't say it was going to be good
also i guess now that i think about it, low tolerance wouldn't matter that much since demeter is 5 hits
raw violet
maybe? i've never actually counted the hits
cunning urchin
Would be awful if Lv.1 turned your uppercut into 1 hit instead of 2 lol.
Must be 7 hits.
mossy breach
aaand it doesnt work. just as chiron special, only one lightning bolt would hit if you use demeter aspect special
raw violet
i mostly dash upper so you're probably right, i'll have to take a look
magic dagger
Rip zeus flourish fans
cunning urchin
Is dash-upper only 1 hit instead of 2? Oh, it is.
cunning urchin
I don't have any numbers for Dash-Upper in my spreadsheet. I should add that tomorrow or sometime.
Maybe that's why applying Chill was funky sometimes.
raw violet
maybe
cunning urchin
I'm never even sure which one I'm using. They kind of blend together for me lol.
raw violet
i was watching a mistral dash-only run and they were having trouble getting stacks of chill sometimes
so i still think it's a little wonky
cunning urchin
I think about where I want to be, not if I want to dash-upper or regular upper.
cunning urchin
So how does Demeter Aspect interact with Dash-Upper.
Huh.
Gonna have to hit Skelly a few more times tomorrow.
magic dagger
dash upper hits slightly harder than a single upper hit, though, and if you get explosive hammer boon the damage is identical
peak iron
Maybe somebody here can answer this question for me, but I've noticed that sometimes when I'm using Chaos Shield, when I hold down main attack to take a swing and start charging my next rush it just doesn't attack and I'll stand there looking like an idiot until I click again
What is the trigger there?
raw violet
demeter mixes really well with dash upper
magic dagger
the problem is that your special hasn't come back yet
peak iron
No, that's not it, because you can throw your special and hold down your attack and when you catch it you'll automatically take another swing and start charging
Sometimes it just doesn't happen
raw violet
oh, are you saying you're actually charging and it just doesn't rush?
oh no, you just can't attack at all
magic dagger
the inconsistency is why you would avoid that tactic
peak iron
More like, I throw my special, immediately hold down attack so that the second I catch the special I take a swing and start charging another rush, but when I catch the special nothing happens
Nine times out of ten it works, but sometimes I catch the special and nothing happens. IDK if that's a bug, or if there's a specific trigger for it
magic dagger
just release and input again as quickly as possible, that's the easiest solution
raw violet
maybe, that sounds like something worth reporting
cunning urchin
demeter mixes really well with dash upper
Yes, but I need the actual damage numbers for the extra hits. So Skelly will be punched tomorrow.
wintry plume
grim loom
do extra death defies from chaos take precedence over stubborn defiance or vice versa?
mossy breach
@cunning urchin demeter dash upper works, it does 5 explosions lol
cunning urchin
Yes, I know that. That's not what I . . . you know what, nevermind. I'll lab it out tomorrow anyway.
dry ember
Exactly. Don't do today what you can put off for tomorrow.
idle pasture
@magic dagger were you mainly using your special or attacking with that one or both I guess. I've found that most of the weopons besides the sword I kind of do one or the other. I had a run with the shield where I was just throwing it over and over, almost beat hades. I was so mad
dry ember
Chaos shield so both
magic dagger
@idle pasture when using aspect of chaos, you bull rush then special
more shields that way
sudden dagger
Here's a question: is it better early game to upgrade zag's weapons or to unlock aspects? I've heard you all say things like chaos shield isn't good until higher levels, so I'm wondering if I'm better off upgrading something good of zag's
dry ember
Hey I can give you some recommendations if you want
idle pasture
I would say go hard on the mirror
@magic dagger ok cool. Yea I only have the first sword apsect upgraded
sudden dagger
I just want to avoid wasting bloods since the only way I can get them is from the trader
dry ember
Yeah. So aspects that work right off the gate (without much investment to be good) is all Sword Aspects except Zagreus.
sudden dagger
Like I could unlock Hera's bow right now, but that might be at the cost of giving a zag upgrade that would make a real difference
dry ember
Spear is a bit meh imo
Same for shield
They do require a decent amount of blood
Hera bow just unlock level 1
Zag Bow is solid to max
Chiron needs upgrades
magic dagger
fists and shield you can also max
dry ember
Zag Fists are good to max
magic dagger
sword you will need to max for a quest later on anyways
dry ember
The other two fists require some upgrades, though not bad by themselves.
Zag Rail is good. Other 2 need upgrades.
magic dagger
but basically just find something you like and dump all of your blood into it. once you start clearing you will have a** lot** of blood
dry ember
How comfortable are you with bow?
magic dagger
and you'll clear sooner if your best weapon is upgraded
sudden dagger
Sounds like Hera and the swords are worth unlocking. Otherwise, choose one out of zag rail, fists, or bow
I like the bow, but I can't figure out the best way to scale damage
Artemis attack is fun because of the crits
It's also good trying to stack status effects
pliant palm
With Zag aspect, prob just aphro
dry ember
Yeah. Honestly this build got memed to death but unlock Hera Bow, equip Dio keepsake and look for Trippy Shot
pliant palm
For big numbers
magic dagger
with unupgraded bow I found it easiest to just doom everything and kite with dash strikes
pliant palm
And aim for as much chaos as possible
sudden dagger
Sounds worthwhile. I'm already doing 2 out of 3 now naturally just without hera lol
dry ember
Hey if you go with Crit bow
It's more difficult to apply Privi Status
Not impossible, just harder
sudden dagger
Yeah, I had to use the special and the cast
dry ember
Maybe just use family fav instead?
sudden dagger
I'm going to unlock Hera's bow and give it a shot :)
magic dagger
also?
dry ember
Unlock Hera
Do not run back to mirror
Just unlock it and go
If you don't like it, give up
The game save point is when you enter the courtyard from the bedroom
So you can change your mind and put blood on something else if you don't like Hera
Giving up also does not mess up your win streak
Literally save scumming
But if you kill Hades or die then the game will be saved, ofc.
cunning urchin
I wouldn't really sweat over it, you'll be getting plenty of Titan Blood soon enough.
dry ember
Agreed. But at first the idea of climbing heat can be intimidating.
I'm just trying to alleviate some of that pressure.
cunning urchin
(Until you pick something like Poseidon Sword and realize mashing True Shot is the same on any heat.)
dry ember
Never seen Fully Loaded
cunning urchin
Shoulda just played before the patch. Smh.
dry ember
Well thanks to the Steam sale for bringing me to this game and this server.
To be bullied by you.
Smh my head.
mossy breach
just realized that guan yu spin can reach further if you use dash to release it
mossy breach
its just a bit but yeah
raw violet
a charged demeter dash-special does 240 vs 210 for standing-special
i can't tell the number of hits
dry ember
We have a Lightning Rod fan
cunning urchin
That's 6 hits at 40 damage each. Thank you!
dry ember
Hurah
lethal tangle
That one and the demeter buff where you have an AOE on use of cast. so you can slow everyone in a group, dash out and watch the flashing lights
hopefully somewhere along the way you got the zeus legenday buff and you just demolish them
Hera bow and demeter fists have been my grinding weapons
so much fun and have TONS of DAMGE behind them
oh also the shield aspect which makes more projectiles once you get up to like 3 its just so much fun
inner heath
Finally did one of those runs. + Pressure points + greater recall + aspect of Eris. If only Chaos was nicer to me
(only on 5 heat because I'm just farming darkness right now and want to be able to jump into Erebus a bit)
inner heath
Yup! Doesn't quite beat out hunting blades or just artemis casin terms of raw damage, but it's just an insanely fun build
Maybe it would've if I ever got a second cast though... IDK I haven't ran the numbers but it seemed slower
cunning urchin
FO2 would speed up farming.
inner heath
That makes sense. In all my 16 heat runs I used FO2. It's actually one of my favorite pacts. I just like the boss fights more and didn't want anything that would make me have to work at winning
Maybe I'll swap it in if I continue to farm a bit though
cunning urchin
EM2 FO2 I believe is generally the fastest option.
inner heath
I can see why FO2 would be faster, but why EM2?
I feel like that would extend the boss fights
turbid needle
Smaller arena for the Hydra fight.
raw violet
em2 is questionably faster, because the hydra heads group up
inner heath
Ahhh
Good to know. I'll think about it. I've been lazy farming (AKA just doing a run for darkness whenever I wanna play the game, stalling until the next update), so I'm in no rush to really speed up the process
Most of my mirror is filled out too, it's just the last few fated ones
So nothing vital anyway
raw violet
but your results may vary based on how well you can crowd control vs stay alive
inner heath
Makes sense
dry ember
What's the reward for runs pass 20?
raw violet
self satisfaction
dry ember
magic dagger
hera bow with ice wine honestly sucks compared to just ice wine
sudden dagger
Ok here's a question: I have two room choices: both boons, but one is sparkly and shows a mini boss. Will that one have higher rarity?
turbid needle
Miniboss.
sudden dagger
Will the mini boss give higher rarity of boons?
neon fiber
yes, minibosses always give higher rarities iirc
magic dagger
Hera bow with ice wine and three extra chaos casts actually is good though
consistent 1,332 +40 damage per shot
lulz
proven robin
Oof, strong.
mossy breach
wait till you try blizzard shot
proven robin
Does that synergize with Aspect of Hera as well>
I mean, obviously it does, but how well does it synergize?
Never got a chance to try it with Hera.
I got Ice Wine, but not Hunting Blades, Lightning Phalanx, or Blizzard Shot yet.
I get the feeling Hunting Blades would be rad as heck.
raw violet
i'm not a fan of blizzard shot on hera, just cause of the way the cast works
it's not bad, i just like it more on other cast-centric weapons
proven robin
::nodnod::
raw violet
i do like trippy shot builds on hera though
proven robin
I mean, yeah
proven robin
I've managed Phalanx Shot, which was good, especially firing into a group, so I imagine Lightning Phalanx would be even more of the same.
turbid needle
Greg, pls.
I've never used Hera with Hunting Blades before.
Only ever used Hunting Blades with Poseidon, Achilles, Talos, and Eris.
raw violet
it's not bad, drop the blades right on top of enemies, no need to wait
slicing shot, on the other hand
feels terrible on hera
turbid needle
Yeah, you want Talos with naked Slicing Shot.
proven robin
Yeah, Slicing Shot wouldn't be great unless it had that Vortex boon where it pulled enemies in.
Then they'd just be swept along for the ride.
proven robin
o_o
raw violet
- DC2
turbid needle
raw violet
just end my run, right now
turbid needle
I'd rather have DC and Saviors, I'm on Zag Malphon with Rare Crop'd Lightning Strike and level 2 Static Discharge (the both of them are RC'd, I mean).
raw violet
oh, that's not too bad
i would think
i had vanilla rail, no boon
the DC probably didn't matter that much in retrospect
turbid needle
But Bruiser Cloner Numbskulls...
raw violet
but it couldn't keep up with the clones and the hp/armor
civic barn
teleporting is a massive pain for malphon when you don't have rush kick or more dashes 😰
unkempt pagoda
fast, mobile, don't need to aim
civic barn
functionally, once you're within a certain range of an enemy, your special autoaims at them
unkempt pagoda
feels powerful and feels hella cool to use, which is a plus in my book
civic barn
i almost always get it yeah; it just gives a lot more mobility to the fists and reduce kill time
proven robin
Ahhh
Probably not a perfect fit with Talos, since Talos's pull already helps with range problems.
mossy breach
iirc its not offered with talos
magic dagger
the game just said "happy 100th escape attempt! here's a room with 50 armored flamewheels and 6 brightswords!"
I'm really glad I'm not using TD right now
proven robin
Oh boy
magic dagger
arti call, so no good there
magic dagger
100th attempt cleared, I'm on a streak of 16 now.
also, if you'll look at the acorn in the bottom left corner, you'll notice that there are 5 charges left hehe
turbid needle
Blood and darkness, Aspect of Chaos Thunder Flourish is tearing Alecto up.
(it also might be level 2 Epic Static Discharge)
magic dagger
nice
neon fiber
Six lightning bolts per special will do that to ya
Imagine if you could get his other lightning related boons and demeter/zeus
Slap double strike and splitting bolt into that bad boy and you’ve got lightning for days
mighty ermine
at the risk of sounding like a broken record because i mentioned this recently in another context: aspect of chaos with thunder flourish and all those extra goods you mentioned really is just bonkers
my second fastest clear overall was with that setup
west totem
cheat?
mighty ermine
i mean, if you know how to use aspect of chaos well enough, which isn't hard, sure
that run was nearly sub 11
you could probably do sub 15 without too much trouble with it i'd bet
raw violet
it seems like thunder flourish is definitely the way to go for shield speed
more so if you can manage to ge tthe T2+ boons
something else to help trigger priv status too
fast wolf
Would like to post my first finish here. Are there any requirements to post pictures?
dry ember
This server doesn't allow image upload.
You can still send imgur links though
Or gyazo or basically any image hosting service.
We will be able to see it just fine. Just a small hassle.
fast wolf
Oh how did Lyzol post his though? Link had discordapp in it
dry ember
Also congrats on the first win!
Post in another server that allows image upload, copy link.
fast wolf
Smart. BRB.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/636959404142362649/715009998773551104/20200527025740_1.jpg
Spamming poison with Aegis' fastened special and also having the cast crystals to AoE was amazing. Kept dashing around and shieldboomeranging Hades for the whole fight and didn't even bother to charge or pummel him.
Also didn't even unlock any aspects or companions yet and didnt get to upgrade any weapons before my clear.
dry ember
Good job! There is a sudden influx of Lightning Rod builds today. I love it.
First of Many! Now you have even more options to play the game.
fast wolf
The loading screen says it took me 15 escape attempts btw.
No idea what the average attempts on the first clear is.
proven robin
That's way less than it took me!
sudden dagger
I'm pushing 50 attempts, only gotten to the surface twice, still haven't beaten the final boss
But you guys, I got really close this time
dry ember
45 for me.
But play at your own pace!
The first clear is the hardest
After that it's like a mental block just gone.
sudden dagger
I had Achilles's spear and festive fog, and I was doing pretty good damage. Hades is just brutal
dry ember
The whole ordeal seems less scary.
Hey Achilles spear is really good for cast builds too!
sudden dagger
Yeah!
magic dagger
My first escape was run 25
sudden dagger
I am liking the bonus cast twice in a row
magic dagger
nice one Kain Morgen
fast wolf
So, how do I upgrade the weapons? I just unlocked a sixth weapon, some kind of rifle. And I got several of these titan bloods etc
dry ember
Dual cast right?
You need to enable heat from the Pact of Punishment
After the first clear you will see it when you leave
fast wolf
Yeah I see a pact at the exit but I can't upgrade before leaving again?
sudden dagger
I think festive fog is more useful than artemis's cast because the crowd control is so good
dry ember
At each heat level higher than the previous one for each weapons, you will earn more blood as reward when you clear stages
If you have enough.blood you can upgrade before leaving
Hit RT near the weapon
Also Patrick did you check out Hera bow?
sudden dagger
@fast wolf might be mistaken what you're asking, but you can interact with the shadow the weapon leaves when you pick it up
dry ember
Yeah that
dry ember
Do you have every weapons unlocked?
sudden dagger
@dry ember yeah I did but I didn't make good use of the boons I got. Also I had the bloodstone Regen when I think I would have preferred the drop mode
fast wolf
sword, spear, shield, bow, fists, rifle
sudden dagger
@fast wolf maybe you have to do more runs and progress in some other way
dry ember
Ok I'll a screenshot of what it should look like
unkempt pagoda
have you done a run since unlocking the last weapon
sudden dagger
I'm not familiar with what dependencies they have
dry ember
If you don't see it then you probably will need more runs
fast wolf
@unkempt pagoda nope, i tried exiting to the main menu and reloading though
unkempt pagoda
generally, if you have the prerequisites for unlocking something, you're gonna have to do a run first
dry ember
Patrick you are not using Stygian Soul right?
unkempt pagoda
win or die, doesn't matter
sudden dagger
I forget the names @dry ember
There's the Regen cast ammo and the multiple cast ammo
@dry ember yeah lol I realized that immediately, but still made it pretty far. My next attempt I used the spear because it had the darkness buff
sudden dagger
Thanks. The discussion in this channel has helped so much
How do you do spoiler tags again? Pins doesn't have it
!test!
sudden dagger
Thanks. I also just got to the point where ||Nyx will talk to Chaos again, provided I collect 8888 darkness. So that's a number lol.||
fast wolf
What is 'damageControl'? Do enemies get one full extra health bar / life or do they just ignore the first poke?
fast wolf
seems the easiest option then i guess
compared to +15/20/25% dmg, life, more enemies, etc
unkempt pagoda
if this is your first heat, i'd go extreme measures
fast wolf
reason behind that?
unkempt pagoda
it adds a lot more besides difficulty
content, story, dialogue, and a different gameplay experience
EM heats aren't minor changes, basically, and if you're going up the heat levels, you're gonna want to practice these fights now
fast wolf
Okay I got scared at first when I saw Meg, Tisi and Alec next to each other but they were just assisting and I didnt have to kill all three at once.
proven robin
Oh, yeah, that would be terrifying.
dry ember
There will be a mod that lets you fight all 3
Just you wait
This build makes me so whelmed.
not underwhelmed or overwhelmed, just a perfect amount of whelmed.
pale fulcrum
I love those runs 😸
fast wolf
Is the Satyr Sack always behind one of the gates with an elite indicator?
fast wolf
Alright, Extreme Measures Hades here we go. Wish me luck.
Or is one level of EM only Meg and sisters?
unkempt pagoda
each level of EM is per boss
so EM 2 would be furies and hydra
there's currently no EM 4 for hades right now, but i expect there to be soon
fast wolf
2 in a row.
pretty close
Tried a crit build with shield special. Was a bit disappointed to find out there is no Artemis/Dionysus Duo
dry ember
Good job! Keep climbing those heat!
Since weapons are tracked separately you can try clearing the game with other weapons too
proven robin
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2110338564 Ohhh, this one was fun!
Layering a storm of punches with blade rift dashes to pile on extra damage felt cool.
Also, had Divine Protection and Athena's Aid, which really helped me just wade in.
cunning urchin
I haven't tried Blade Dash with Malphon yet. It might be pretty good, though.
proven robin
I can confirm, it's pretty good!
proven robin
Also, Breaching Cross helped me ignore those pesky greatshields.
dry ember
Breaching Cross almost gets the SF status for fists to me
You see it you take it
Almost no exception
proven robin
It's very good indeed, but Extended Jab is another favorite.
And I wouldn't say no to Rolling Knuckle.
Like, Breaching Cross for me can be skipped if I already have a way to bypass shields, like Artemis's Cast or whatever.
cunning urchin
Long Knuckle might be better because hitting more enemies at once means getting 12 hits for Demeter Aspect faster.
dry ember
Idk, to me fist power lies in the ability to stagger foes
proven robin
It does also depend on what you've juiced your Attack with.
dry ember
And breaching Cross solve the weakness of armor
Take BC, perma stun enemy
???
Profit
cunning urchin
And breaching Cross solve the weakness of armor
So do Demeter Aspect Uppercuts.
cunning urchin
It's the aspect that gives your uppercut +5 hits.
After hitting enemies 12x with attacks.
dry ember
Oh that
cunning urchin
Makes your uppercut delete enemies.
dry ember
I totally forgot Demeter has an aspect.
proven robin
The Gardening Claws.
cunning urchin
Lambent Plume doesn't give you DPS.
dry ember
Yeah don't take TD
mighty ermine
fists already has such a strong evasive game at base
the extra dodge is far from game changing
dry ember
If it takes an hour it takes an hour
mighty ermine
also demeter aspect for life
dry ember
I'm very whelmed by Demeter
proven robin
cunning urchin
Why take an hour though if I can take 20 or less? That's not an improvement.
dry ember
Not under or overwhelmed
mighty ermine
real footage of demeter wielding the twin fists
mighty ermine
not really but go on
dry ember
Nvm. I thought that that looks like the ones in the kid show.
proven robin
I did like Lambent Plume with the Zag fists!
So my other boons could just be all damage all the time.
Extra survivability means you can devote more mental energy to the attack.
cunning urchin
Lambent Plume doesn't help you with speed nor survivability as well as other keepsakes.
mighty ermine
yeah i gotta agree with nyaa here
proven robin
::shrug!:: I haven't been able to use it much in higher Heats because I can't kill them fast enough, so maybe I'm overvaluing it.
Either way, I had fond memories of the combo.
raw violet
that sounds like case in point
cunning urchin
Basically, the biggest obstacle to clearing speed is DPS.
mighty ermine
and demeter aspect's relatively easy access to huge burst potential alongside the fists' already solid playstyle? bang
icy grandma knows best
cunning urchin
I think Lambent Plume would be more interesting if it gave attack speed.
mighty ermine
definitely
and would much better lend itself towards increasing its own stats via quick chamber clears
proven robin
If so? It might actually work better with Arthur and Guan Yu.
cunning urchin
Excalibur can clear pretty fast, I think? I haven't brought it to high heat, yet.
raw violet
arthur yeah, guan yu, probably not too much
mighty ermine
the full combo on guan yu is very seldom used
proven robin
Ahhh.
raw violet
if it increased special speed, i'd probably run it, even if just for the last few biomes
dry ember
Excalibur is just really difficult to use on high heat.
proven robin
...Dang, now I want the devs to put in like an ultra-rare dialogue thing where if Demeter sees you with her Aspect, she basically quotes that video back to you.
dry ember
Sure you have the damage but Nemesis can clear faster
proven robin
And Zag's just "i...uh....okay....?"
raw violet
i think arthur is specifically difficult with FO2
dry ember
I tried Excalibur on FO2 and things just feel clunky.
raw violet
needs more super armor
mighty ermine
especially once you get used to dash-strike spam and special cancel with nemesis, excalibur just feels less efficient overall in terms of clear time and general ease
raw violet
arthur is especially bad if you're trying to use it like nemesis though
dry ember
Yeah maybe turn off FO2 and turn on +HP heat?
Usually you do overkill damage with Excalibur anyway
Should be OK trade off.
raw violet
i have no desire to use arthur on high heat
mighty ermine
i do think it's kind of odd that sword's 4th aspect doesn't fare super well at higher heat due to a big source of that heat potentially being FO
contrasts awkwardly with its more "endgame" status as the out-of-time final for stygius
dry ember
FO2 gives 5 heat right?
raw violet
i do like that it's a completely different playstyle though
dry ember
Or 4?
mighty ermine
i think the concept for it is very solid; it's a good aspect idea all around
raw violet
i also like that it has a whole new mechanic that other weapons don't have
cunning urchin
@dry ember 6.
mighty ermine
would be cool if something like bow took inspiration from it i.e. chaining power shots in a row increases their power, etc.
obviously not strictly that but
some sort of combo carry-over idea
dry ember
I really like that actually
turbid arch
In theory, Lambent Plumes Effect would make more sense on Thanatos. Reward for not getting hit is getting dodge chance which makes getting hit harder
other way around, cleaning out a room fast gives extra damage which makes it faster to clean out rooms in the future.
cunning urchin
Hmm. I like that idea.
narrow halo
Cyclops attacks buff stacks right ?
naive tusk
Yes, it does.
naive tusk
Good job, Aggy! 🙂
untold vortex
thanks Peach 
cunning urchin
Congratulations!
untold vortex
Thanks Nyaan 
glad island
untold vortex
indeed 
wide plover
got easy triple rocket win just now. Really seems like with rail lucky hammers = free win
torpid abyss
Which special boon?
earnest ravine
Yes to both!
opal bay
I forgot
what is the current subjectively good pick for the cast upgrade.
the faster reload or 2 more casts.
earnest ravine
A lot of people prefer the regenerating shot right now over the more stones, since it's less busy work.
unborn trellis
depends if you want to spam or fire&forget
fire and forget is better with the demeter boon that rewards having no casts
cunning urchin
Infernal Soul means more casts/time if your cast lodges and kills (so you can pick it up right away). Stygian Soul means more casts/time if it doesn't lodge—or lodges but doesn't kill.
Presuming you cast as much as possible.
Infernal Soul also gives you more burst damage on bosses and tanky mobs.
turbid arch
2 Extra Casts for burst, 1 regenerating cast for sustained DPS.
1 regenerating cast becomes infinitely better than the extra cast stones as soon as you get an extra cast stone from Chaos, Artemis or a Well of Charon
restive solar
Regenerating also means you don’t have the cost in time, planning, and positioning to retrieve casts
Which is why I infinitely prefer it
mossy breach
is it true that rewards end at 20 heat?
true pilot
That said, 3 Casts is far more reliable if you want to use them for combat encounters.
Regenerating 1 feels the worst if you can't find Chaos.
(Fully Loaded is a myth. :P)
And getting casts from the Wells is only reliable if you run Hourglass. And even then, Sack RNG can screw you over in Styx and make you run out of time on that before the boss.
mossy breach
can you get enough blood to max all aspects at 20 heat?
true pilot
No.
Well, yes, right now.
Because we only have 2 weapons with 4 aspects.
A theoretical 6x4 aspects would cots slightly more than all of the bounty blood.
But you can get blood for cheap on the exchanger in the Lounge.
I wouldn't pay Ambrosia for it, but if you check in after every run, it's not uncommon to be offered blood for Keys. And keys become far less useful after you're done unlocking the mirror.
cunning urchin
That said, 3 Casts is far more reliable if you want to use them for combat encounters.
I don't agree with that.