Huh. I'mma have to try that
#h1-builds-and-combat
polar sinew
novel prawn
hmm
I just tested all of the railgun aspects in the courtyard
apparently, Zag stops for half a second for every aspect, except the one that absorbs the explosion (Eris)
not sure, but maybe it's coded so that the explosion hurts you (but with 0 damage), then when you get the daedalus upgrade for the friendly fire bomb, it becomes 10 (or whatever value) damage instead of 0
polar sinew
I never stood in the middle of the explosion on my run with the base rail LOL
So maybe that's why I'm surprised
novel prawn
yeah. it just happened by chance to me too, and it got me curious
narrow halo
I think the railgun is the most op weapon other than guan yu with stacked max hp
If you get the duo that allow you to stack hangovers to 8 you literally just finished the game
shrewd brook
ExaGryph and Malphon are the most fun weapons in the game for me. I'm not feeling the Coronacht and Veratha, though. They feel too boon dependent. I'm most likely just not using them right.
viscid vale
i think its a matter of personal taste most of the time, altho bow does seem a little underpowered / slow
shrewd brook
Chiron aspect is pretty dope actually. The least likely to get screwed by rng
true pilot
Chiron does need to be maxed out to be fun, though. A burst of 7 is already lower than the standard, a just-unlocked burst of 3 is just plain sad.
cunning urchin
If you get the duo that allow you to stack hangovers to 8 you literally just finished the game
I don't think Drunken Strike is very good on Exagryph. It's poor on Malphon, so I'd expect it to perform similarly on Exagryph.
For reference, Drunken Strike has lower DPS on Malphon than Curse of Agony or Lightning Strike even with Low Tolerance.
turbid arch
Chiron Aspect is probably the most overrated aspect in the game.
I'd go and say that it is probably one of the worst actually.
shrewd brook
why do you not like it?
cunning urchin
Attack > 3x Special > repeat with Chiron Aspect does much better DPS than chaining Power Shots with Zagreus Aspect.
turbid arch
Plenty of reasons.
cunning urchin
Most mobs die before 3 or even 2 Volleys, though, so the crit from Zagreus Aspect comes into play more often over a run.
turbid arch
Some of the more prominent would be that Chiron Aspect is the worst when it comes to multi-target damage
That a lot of synergies feel mediocre on it
That it is super bad unless you have it maxed out.
That there are only two hammer upgrades that make it better. Wait, no, it is only one now I think?
The most notable reason though is just how very slow it is.
You stand still forever while you channel the arrow shots.
Longer so with the hammer upgrade.
cunning urchin
Not having access to Charged Volley is a buff, in my opinion.
turbid arch
Depends on the Line-Up you are going for.
I had a few nice charged volley runs with Chiron in the past. If it works, it's nice.
But yeah, you have a point there.
Not seeing Charged Volley and Piercing Volley because you take Chiron Aspect might make for a compelling argument to use it.
Just so you have a better chance of getting the good attack related boons out of it.
cunning urchin
Yep. Then slap Heartbreak Flourish on it for extra DPS against tankier enemies.
proven robin
...I like the Hammer mod that adds more arrows to the Special.
cunning urchin
I don't think you really miss out going from 9 to 7 arrows for Chiron. You probably won't hit all 9 arrows most of the time anyway.
true pilot
The biggest downside on that front is there until you max it. Chiron is basically unplayable until you get to the 7-shot volley, and that's a decent amount of blood investment to even get started.
Heartbreak Flourish with Unhealthy Fixation is unethical on it, though. Just saying.
cunning urchin
Made a couple quick recordings with the bow to get some DPS numbers later. It's nice that Calisthenics Program and Damage Control work on Skelly, too. 
umbral lagoon
@cunning urchin do you have the dps stats written down somewhere?
if you do, mind sharing?
it’s hard to keep track of which boons are best for dps
:3
i had no idea heartbreak flourish was base +80% damage to special
cunning urchin
I have this sheet for damage per Special: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RhgbgEQ2PvrBskk7tw6RXsR8hzRQuG89W9moUruf-fA/edit?usp=sharing
cunning urchin
Thanks! I hope it's useful.
I also have a few numbers for Malphon but nothing that rigorous (yet).
umbral lagoon
i’m facepalming hard right now
fiery light
?
umbral lagoon
cause i used chiron aspect so much
cunning urchin
About?
umbral lagoon
and i avoided dionysus and aphrodite for some reason
fiery light
Aphro is great
umbral lagoon
over artemis and ares
and the irony is that my highest heat runs for chiron included aphrodite on special kek
fiery light
just a questions @cunning urchin What calculations are these assumeing btw
Like are you factoring full ticks of Dion and assuming crit rate?
umbral lagoon
artemis is ok if you have crit tho
fiery light
(for art)
umbral lagoon
just disclaimer
cunning urchin
Dionysus's numbers on Chiron are misleading. It's a lot of damage on an initial Special, but follow-up specials do a lot less damage because you've already capped your stacks.
It's averaged for crits on attacks/boons that can crit.
umbral lagoon
aphrodite and poseidon seem consistent for damage, except weak >>> pushback
so at least avoiding poseidon wasn’t a bad call haha
fiery light
Aphro generally has one of the higher damage consistants from my exp
umbral lagoon
i still have to learn so much ugh
fiery light
Poseidon has great synergy picks though so its not -always- an avoid imo
also has some hilarious builds
depending on weapon he can be really solid
cunning urchin
On Chiron it's really only between Heartbreak Flourish and Deadly Flourish.
umbral lagoon
yeah only considering for chiron special atm
cunning urchin
But Heartbreak Flourish wins in damage unless you get some +% boons from Chaos.
umbral lagoon
yeah i feel like my excalibur runs are taking all my crit luck away from chiron recently
or maybe cause i never got the upgraded special shots for the previous runs
bad rng
fiery light
praise sword :^)
umbral lagoon
i hate sword
umbral lagoon
maybe i need to fully upgrade nemesis
umbral lagoon
it’s lvl 2 rn i think
fiery light
and now its easily my fav weapon
cunning urchin
Well, only 1 out 8 hammer upgrades buffs Chiron's Special.
fiery light
The trick is to never use the combo LOL
umbral lagoon
Probability of not getting chiron special assuming 2 hammers is 75%
imagine if fated persuasion could re-roll hammers
umbral lagoon
then the 8 basically changes to 5
if i do low iq math
assuming no choice-penalty heat
yeah i’m mainly a shield, bow, and fist player
i think i can learn spear but i want to upgrade achilles first - guan yu is okay....
umbral lagoon
thonk okay
cunning urchin
Actually, all the Attack upgrades on Coronacht prevent 1~2 Attack upgrades from being offered by the next Daedalus Hammer.
umbral lagoon
oh yeah so the chances are even better
wait what is the division of upgrades for hammer?
attack and special only right
cunning urchin
You can improve your odds for seeing it on the second Hammer by not picking Perfect Shot, Triple Shot, or Chain Shot because those only lock out 1 other upgrade, respectively.
Yes, 7 Attack upgrades and 1 Special upgrade for Chiron.
umbral lagoon
wait that’s weird
what do those first three have to do with spread?
i mean special
ah whatever
how do you know this haha
cunning urchin
umbral lagoon
I meant those specific hammer upgrades improving your chances
cunning urchin
No, you're supposed to not take them to improve your chances of getting Relentless Volley. Perfect Shot, Triple Shot, or Chain Shot all only eliminate one additional Attack upgrade from the pool; the other Attack upgrades all eliminate 2.
umbral lagoon
That’s exactly what I meant. “Why do avoiding those improve your chances?”
cunning urchin
70% chance of getting Relentless Volley in a run if you never pick those 3 on the first hammer.
cunning urchin
Oh.
Check the notes on the Upgrades.
E.g., for Twin Shot: "Cannot be combined with Triple Shot or Sniper Shot."
cunning urchin
Oh, Sniper Shot only eliminates 1, too.
umbral lagoon
Yeah, also some of the upgrades are imo awful.
I hate twin shot so much.
I can work with explosive tho.
Flurry and Piercing are great!
and they both elim 2 i think
cunning urchin
Woops, my odds calculation is definitely off. You can ignore that "70%".
Anyway, yeah. That's how you can improve your odds of getting it.
umbral lagoon
yeah there’s tons of combinations
you don’t need the exact percent though
i’ll do the math later and dm you actually
cunning urchin
Not necessary. I can do that, I'm just lazy right now.
spare owl
Anyone know what combo is needed for speedy crystal beams?
I got it once but havent ever seen it again
cunning urchin
Crystal Beam + any core boon from Lady Artemis.
I.e., attack, special, dash, or call.
umbral lagoon
kill theseus and asterius as fast as possible
loool
preferably both at the same time
try not to lose death defiance while overtime clock deletes your HP
get armor-breaking skills
don't waste time chasing the souls and instead make them attack you - only chase when cleaning up and focus on big mobs
definitely chase the eyeballs tho
young gorge
i never get enough time for theseus and asterius and i hate the archers that are 50 miles appart
umbral lagoon
(i don't know their names)
archers come a bit closer if you get too far
so kill one and the other will approach while you are doing that
cause they greedy jerks who wanna get a shot at you while you are busy
fiery light
high dps builds tbh
cunning urchin
Dash a lot.
Charon's shop saves time.
Chaos Gates can save time, too.
Patroclus's chamber.
young gorge
I've been getting unlucky rooms in elysium honestly that feel like they have infinite spawning enemies
fiery light
@young gorge i assume you know miniboss rooms are typically faster
stoic thicket
There is very little more sad in this game then going for Hunting Blades and not getting it. Good lord is Slicing shot awkward to use without that.
fiery light
elysium has asterius who can take awhile if you dont have good dps
young gorge
yeah i keep bumping into asterius instead of big butterfly
cunning urchin
If your DPS is good, you can take down the butterfly miniboss before the adds spawn or kill adds as they spawn and quickly take down the miniboss inbetween. Letting the little thingies become big thingies takes more time, but if you can't kill them quickly it's better to focus on Ms. Butterfly.
But you're probably lacking DPS for TD2 if that one doesn't go down fast.
Asterius should go down fast, too.
You can deflect practically all of his attacks, you can deflect or dash through him just as he would ram you when he does that run move.
young gorge
i guess it's also that i get sloppy when i had td2 on lmao
timers stress me so bad oh god
cunning urchin
Or dash through one of the pillars if he runs at you.
young gorge
FO makes that real annoying for sure
cunning urchin
With Malphon and Divine Strike, I deflect his run like 95% of the time.
If you have good AOE damage, don't single out Asterius first when you fight both. Just keep hitting both.
young gorge
athena dash/attack when in doubt 😌
yeah i got used to luring asterius away
big mistake
cunning urchin
Also EM3 is a lot slower, so don't use that if you have difficulty with Elysium.
open knoll
hi, can someone tell me what it does when you click on your abilities/boons and they get a little marker on them in the inventory?
lament coral
nothing, it just highlights the selected item
open knoll
oh, well good to know either way lol. I thought they activated them or something so it was bothering me
turbid needle
Does anyone else find it frustrating when you find a boon that will replace an other one? The game says X will replace Y without saying what Y does. And I can't hover over it to see what it does.
raw violet
I’ve played enough at this point that I don’t even think about it
true pilot
Only basic boons (attack, special, etc) can get replaced. It's a minor issue that it doesn't tell you, but there are few enough of those and they're simple enough that you just get used to it.
raw violet
But that’s probably good feedback in the early game for newer players
fiery light
yeah, theres no reason why it shouldn't tell you
telling people "you should know better" on their 2nd or 3rd run
is kinda troll tbh
raw violet
It may be possible to pull up your boon menu to check at that time though, so I’m not discounting that there’s already a solution in-game
I just don’t know
naive tusk
@turbid needle You can open your boon list while making a selection. In there, you can hover over the boon that would be replaced and read its effect 
cunning urchin
Yeah, you can actually open the boon menu. It's just counterintuitive because you can't open it in shops. So if you try in shops, you wouldn't try again when choosing boons. It's also put in the background and covered by the artwork when choosing boons, so the intuition is that everything in the background is inaccessible for the moment.
Not sure about Daedalus Hammers.
dry ember
Boon UI can get some love. It's not the most intuitive thing out there.
smoky wolf
Man I did not know you could open boon list while choosing? You just press select?
cunning urchin
Yep.
cunning urchin
I only know because I asked for that option in #hades-feedback, and somebody told me it's possible.
But that feedback only got upvotes.
So apparently nobody knows.
fiery light
yeah, that sorta feedback is still valuble
because it proves how few people were aware
cunning urchin
Yep!
fiery light
I'm currently trying to phrase a cursed slash feedback
but im not sure how to go about it
because I want to ask for more clarity around tooltips
cunning urchin
Well.
dry ember
Like not a balance feedback?
cunning urchin
Phrasing it like that works.
fiery light
its not -exactly- balance
but basically cursed slash doesn't activate on dash attack
despite that not really being written anywhere (that I've seen)
cunning urchin
You could more or less copy-paste what you just wrote.
fiery light
mhm, I'm just looking into other issues before I write it out
Piercing wave's internal cooldown for example
cunning urchin
Well, one piece of feedback at a time, anyway, so people can vote on individual feedback.
fiery light
yeah, but thats kinda what I mean by vague tooltips
raw violet
which patch introduced the internal zeus cooldown?
cunning urchin
That cooldown makes Lightning Flourish pretty poor on everything but Zeus Aspect and Varatha.
turbid needle
can someone explain to me how dashstrikes with the bow are supposed to work? whenever I dash and press attack afterwards it just seems like it works sometimes and sometimes not
pliant palm
It takes less time to get a perfect shot when you dash-strike @turbid needle
But beside that, there is nothing special
turbid needle
oh so basicially you are still supposed to hold atk down
pliant palm
You just have to dash then shoot
lament coral
the shot charges faster and does a fixed amount of damage regardless of the charge amount
I don't remember the number
dry ember
Yeah. Also animation wise, Zag leans forward for a normal attack, leans backward if you are dash striking.
A minor detail but it's there.
wide plover
so how viable is the oneshot gun?
raw violet
@spare owl the purpose of kiss of styx isn't to reload your stubborn defiance, it's to make your stubborn defiance more powerful by healing more hp on death
fiery light
the one that requires you to reload?
wide plover
yes
fiery light
I think all weapons are fairly viable
In what context are you talking
1st clear? 32 heat?
wide plover
I only beat game once with hera bow hunting blades build
fiery light
Ah
wide plover
so now thinking what to invest titan's blood in
raw violet
hestia is my personaly least favorite rail aspect
pliant palm
Defo not hestia aspect imo
wide plover
ranged weapons seem easier because you don't have to wade into enemies
pliant palm
So annoying to use
fiery light
yeah its a playstyle thing
I love manual reloading
personally
(its not optimal if thats what youre asking)
pliant palm
Bow is super strong, it's just boring to use for me
raw violet
but some people love it so ultimately, it's up to you to find out
raw violet
eris is probably the most flexible of the rail aspects
fiery light
I hope we get a sniper rifle as a final aspect :^)
raw violet
can get a good attack or special build with whatever boons
stoic thicket
Zag Aspect is also pretty decent on the rail.
pliant palm
Kiss of Styx with Stubborn just give more HP when reviving, right ?
pliant palm
Yeah okey
wide plover
its very easy to get more blood
how? just repeatedly turning up heat and beating tartarus 100 times?
fiery light
@wide plover yeah, each "clear" of the game gives you 2 blood
per weapon
that means just clearing heat 1 on each weapon alone nets you 12 blood
raw violet
"very easy" is relative
pliant palm
2 blood per win at higher heat + what you could get in Styx (if you save your money) + a lot of blood from the prophecies
wide plover
considering that I only cleared final boss once with a build that kills enemies almost without my input, I don't consider beating game easy currently
fiery light
Gotta keep ranking up your darkness and such then @wide plover
also always check out the trader
he sometimes has the blood on special
raw violet
there's always progress to be made, experimenting with weapons to see what you like, darkness/gem/pom/key farming
fiery light
^
raw violet
the bloods will come
dry ember
Keep an eye out on the Wretched Broker too
naive tusk
@spare owl @floral maple Kiss of Styx (replenishes 1 Death Defiance) is replaced by Touch of Styx (Stubborn Defiance heals more) when you pick the Stubborn Defiance perk.
raw violet
if you want bloods really bad, level up chaos aspect for consistent clears
nova prairie
Darkness farming: Chaos -> +1xx% darkness -> profit.
Gem/Pom/Key farming: ?
raw violet
thank you heart, i always mix up kiss vs touch
naive tusk
Gem farming = fishing in Styx 💎
floral maple
Yeah, i had a lapse of memory, sorry
dry ember
Grab a Poseidon boon too for lol and giggles.
fiery light
What is your guys best gem farming route? I have only have gem goals left sadly
just play? D:
raw violet
fish tartarus, fish styx
nova prairie
Fishing is random? No way to find more spots, right? Maybe I'm just missing them. I get 1 per run at most.
naive tusk
@nova prairie there's a 80% chance of a fishing spot in Styx appearing. You will always bump into one while in Styx
dry ember
Yeah 2 to 3 per run for me
fiery light
listen for the audio que imo
naive tusk
Stonewhals will give you 140 gems per catch 🎣
raw violet
something about tartarus and styx that makes the likelihood of a fish spot really high for me
dry ember
A lot of caveats apply
But a rule of thumb is that there is a fish in each biome
And about 12 stages away from each other
naive tusk
@floral maple No worries! It happens even to me sometimes 👍
raw violet
i managed three runs in a row with stonewhal
so i've used up my rng for the next week or so
umbral lagoon
Oh jeez
I just realized that you can increase the speed of your bow's charging
but to be honest I'm not sure how to make it work
it seems like if I dash and aim it aims a ton faster
but I'm more interested in why sometimes the aim is slow
umbral lagoon
yeah i've been playing with slow charge forever
i need to get used to aiming after dash
faster faster faster
naive tusk
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/710856989416226886/714190505574924408/Fully_Loaded_with_no_cast.png
Feels good, man
Now to find a cast for once lol
umbral lagoon
Finally got companion Shady and immediately spent 9 Ambrosia on it to max it out lol
finally some health recovery
but i need to get used to using companions
i keep forgetting i have them
primal sigil
when Hades hits you with the skull, you have a status effect on you. What exactly does it do?
mighty ermine
doubles the damage you take
naive tusk
@turbid needle The dream lives on~
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/710856989416226886/714194190145290281/Dream_lives_on.png
main osprey
@turbid arch Re: your feedback, I've done that before and it gives the correct amount of buff, even though it just displays "level 2." Did yours not have the correct combined value?
graceful smelt
what's the best build for the talos fists
what keepsake to take first and then second
naive tusk
I couldn't say. I don't play Talos much 😅
fiery light
I'd say it depends on your personal combat pattern
main osprey
I'd mess around a bit with the different gods, see which boons fit your playstyle with Talos
graceful smelt
i like to smash
fiery light
Generally speaking I think dps is king, so I tend to prefer very high dps boons
main osprey
Zeus is good for that imo
fiery light
So Art, Aphro, Athena are all some of my favs
raw violet
Poseidon yank and yeet. As someone described it
fiery light
LOL
graceful smelt
hm ok will try
fiery light
that sounds lit
raw violet
Fun? Yes. Effective? Questionable.
main osprey
Yank — pull hard
Yeet — throw hard
sudden dagger
I didn't know posidon could pull at all, whoa
main osprey
He doesn't, the fists do
sudden dagger
That's the part I didn't know then
I did find a cool style on my last run with the fists
If you get the kick
You can kick through an enemy and hit them from behind for great backstab damage
main osprey
Hahaha
narrow halo
How can i get past the locked and timed ❤️ option with olympics ?
dry ember
I don't think you can with some of them. The story line isn't fleshed out yet so you probably have to wait for launch.
true pilot
If the heart has a lock, it means you need to trigger some event. Zeus, Artemis, and Aphrodite can open up the option to give them Ambrosia, but I don't know what are the conditions. The ones that have a clock symbol are not in the game yet and you can only wait for future patches to add them in.
sudden dagger
I was thinking about whether or not every God has a chance to make an appearance during every run
And I have a theory that the chance to get a repeat god is slightly higher than getting another god
heady kindle
I'm trying to beat the game on 16 heat but I'm struggling. So far I've managed to do it twice out of 4 attempts, but some conditions just feel harsh. I wanna try hunting blades, is it a good enough build ? And what should my weapon aspect be?
main osprey
You are correct, Patrick, at least as far as I understand
(which could be wrong, admittedly)
sudden dagger
That's definitely how it seems. But I wonder if all the weapons give an equal chance to get all Gods, or if they have a preference for certain arms
main osprey
I've heard great things about Hunting Blades, Fazy, though I haven't gotten it myself. Personally I find the shield to be easiest, but if you're doing the timed run that may not be fast enough
Patrick: I haven't noticed any preference for certain weapons, but I definitely haven't played enough with all the weapons to be sure of that
heady kindle
I did succeed with zag shield and Arthur blade
I got destroyed by improved theseus mino though, maybe I'll skip that condition
dry ember
Which pacts are you running?
sudden dagger
Are there any gods that appear less often to avoid gods you've already taken boons from
main osprey
Imgur
sudden dagger
It doesn't seem like it, but for instance I can't remember ever having Zeus and dyonisis on the same room
mighty ermine
there's not really a method to it, any gods can be in your frequent appearance run pool
main osprey
I've definitely seen those two
mighty ermine
and similarly any god that you pretty much haven't seen is one that theseus will summon for aid
fiery light
I've 100% had to do that before
the only gods who cant squabble are are Chaos and Hermes
from my understanding
heady kindle
Yeah, but I tend to go to Erebus and 7 minutes feels low
main osprey
Damage Control is also basically free heat imo
dry ember
Elysium is the TD bottle neck
But I think TD is still too beneficial to drop
TD2 and FO2 go hand in hand also
heady kindle
FO2?
oh overtime
FO seemed to hit HUnting Blades hard, thing srunning away from the rifts
junior siren
is there any other upgrade for life steal on Malos besides uppercut finisher?
livid fractal
so i have died two times now trying to escape (just started) is it part of the story or what? meg killed me
tepid ridge
Yea it’s part of the rogue-lite formula and story progression. Talk to people around the hub when you are sent back via that big blood pool.
delicate nimbus
What is TD?
main osprey
|| Tight Deadline ||
livid fractal
so is me escaping the end of the story? i just bought the game i know nothing about it
delicate nimbus
The first TD is almost free. The second one is actually pretty challenging.
@livid fractal no there is no real end to the story yet. There's a dev note when you "escape"
livid fractal
yes i saw that.
delicate nimbus
There's a purpose to beating the game though. There's real progression it's not like the game just stops
livid fractal
but is escaping like the beginning or the whole game is about escaping the underworld
delicate nimbus
The latter
livid fractal
hmm
tepid ridge
@livid fractal Yes and no. The game has a set number of levels and bosses you go through on every run. The story has not been completed since the game is in early access. But the gameplay loop can be completed and gives rewards. The whole game so far takes place in the underworld.
livid fractal
okay thanks
delicate nimbus
Have you played binding of issac or dead cells?
livid fractal
nope if you are asking me
delicate nimbus
Yeah
main osprey
Or enter the gungeon, also
delicate nimbus
Uh it's like
You escape the underworld as "the run"
And every run is similar but they have variations to them
Getting better at running the game IS the game.
dreamy raven
for artemis legendary I need both exit wounds and dual shot or just one of em?
delicate nimbus
Just one
dreamy raven
I guess I'm just unlucly
mighty ermine
both actually
delicate nimbus
Are you sure?
mighty ermine
it was patched to be like this yeah
dreamy raven
I know for Zeus you just need one
mighty ermine
didn't use to be that strict
main osprey
According to the image on the wiki, you need both
mighty ermine
- Fully Loaded (Artemis): increased prerequisites (it should not be offered as early in a run)
from a minipatch following the Nighty Night update
dreamy raven
ah guess I'm just never getting it
delicate nimbus
You guys are right you need both
here's the code snippet that confirms it
{
OneFromEachSet =
{
{ "ArtemisAmmoExitTrait" },
{ "ArtemisBonusProjectileTrait" },
},
},```you need both "ammoexittrait" which is exit wounds, and "bonus projectile trait" which is dual shot
fiery light
That being said, some of the code isn't proper right now (namely Hermes)
smoky wolf
Seems pretty clear-cut
fiery light
so if you somehow did it without, its possible it was bugged
tepid ridge
Or just before/without the most recent update
smoky wolf
Or before the patch
fiery light
yeah thats true
naive tusk
I personally went through each boon's code to make my boon tress, even going as far as checking conditions and restrictions 
smoky wolf
Are the ones on the wiki up to date?
naive tusk
In Hermes' case, I decided to write it in the way that most people would understand it better at a glance. Technically speaking, his boons function depending on which Mirror perk is DEACTIVATED, not activated.
So if you have both "Souls" deactivated, you can technically get all of Hermes' boons.
mighty ermine
oh wow, that's interesting
main osprey
Huh
smoky wolf
Makes sense from a coding perspective, if Stygian soul is disabled, make it possible to auto-recover crystals
Then if there's ever a third option, it will work with that by default
untold quiver
Thanks for the advice gang......Hera bow + Trippy Shot is doing nice
proven robin
Yay!
dry ember
There is the legend of the Scintillating Feast Ice Wine Cold Fusion Hera Bow run
I hope you get to see it one day.
untold quiver
I mean....you could do it....Ive got all three of those gods before I'm out of Tartarus.....and I already have feast
dry ember
nice!
you should try to force some gods for those duos
they are real nice
Splitting Bolt Fists is muah
main osprey
Ohh, that looks good :D
mighty ermine
zeus fists in general even without splitting bolt is [chef kiss]
my fastest fists run was like that and yes i'm a little bit annoyed that i didn't get splitting bolt
but it was still very fast
untold quiver
I've gotten cold fusion with the shield..and ice wine on my last bow clear
proven robin
I have recently verified just how hilarious and hilariously strong Aphrodite's Legendary Boon is against Hades.
mighty ermine
his giggle is so good
dreamy raven
as long as it's fast hitting yeah
proven robin
(Also, I had Aspect of Arthur juiced with, in addition to Aphrodite's boost, Hermes boosting speed by 30%.)
smoky wolf
Yeah, I didn't like Hera bow until I discovered the heady joys of the 'triple trippy'
Scintillating feast and ice wine just make it obscene
proven robin
While it isn't perfect, it would also work fine with Lightning Phalanx.
untold quiver
Yeah.....just got ice wine....so feast + ice wine and still in Asphodel
proven robin
And Hunting Blades.
dry ember
get jolted
smoky wolf
I'm guessing it doesn't work with crystal beam? Or does it?
dry ember
and you should be able to find Cold Fusion too
proven robin
It would, but power would be limited.
Even with Crystal Clarity, it'd just be...there on top of them.
dry ember
C beam is not great synergy with Hera
smoky wolf
Yeah
dry ember
it can be done, but why
untold quiver
I use to like hunting blades with Posidon blade....then I started using it on Achilles Spear......still looking for a new Posidon build. Maybe straight Artimis for exit wounds
smoky wolf
Yeah, just sounds awkward
proven robin
I mean, it's fine if that's what you got.
But it does kind of cancel out Crystal Clarity's advantage in the first place.
dry ember
real talk I have never gotten a Hunting Blade run
smoky wolf
Yeah I tend to go for straight Artemis (lol the irony) at first with Poseidon aspect
dry ember
just kinda lazy to try it lol
should I grab like Achilles spear for that?
or which weapon?
Achilles spear seems to be the one to go it seems
proven robin
But unlike the whole Ice Wine Duo stack, Hunting Blades is best with Ares's boons that buff the rifts.
Especially the one that makes it last longer and vacuum foes in.
And of course his legendary.
dry ember
It just buff damage in general
I heard that the combo is to rush in
and use cast point labnk
smoky wolf
Then yeah, guess it would work.
dry ember
alright, time to google the requirements for Hunting Blades lol
my guess is the Ares cast and hunter dash
hey I was right lol
untold quiver
Achilles Spear buffs the next two casts or attacks after you do the dash retrieve
proven robin
I think Achilles is more useful for a caster build than synergizing with the Spin Attack.
untold quiver
So you throw dash special.....then launch double damage buzzsaws......and if you don't get it it works pretty good with just the blade rifts
proven robin
Mostly since you have to "waste" a spear jab charging the spin.
untold quiver
Oh yeah I like blade rifts and tripple hit dash attacks
smoky wolf
Spin attack is garbage tbh on everything except Guan Yu
untold quiver
I never or hardly ever use the spin attack
smoky wolf
I used Hades aspect once to see the dialogue with... well, Hades. And then shelved it.
Wasn't even that exciting. Was kinda hoping he'd be pissed.
untold quiver
I almost have everything maxed out so I will get it but probably last....either that or the Hestia Rail
dry ember
everything maxed out as in weapons upgrades?
untold quiver
Yeah
smoky wolf
Yeah, I've nearly got all the current aspects maxed. I think Hades and Hestia are at 4 and the rest at 5.
dry ember
Do you need to clear up to 20 heat for that?
umbral lagoon
Completely shameless plug.
What a legendary way to pass Hell Mode 16 heat kek
Beat Theseus/Asterius in less than 30 seconds. Tiny Vermin down in less than 10 seconds.
smoky wolf
No, I've got every weapon in the 13-17 region. Although had a few specials from the broker, a few from Charon in Styx and 3 chaos fish
umbral lagoon
just play hell mode thonk
smoky wolf
So you have to start a new file for hell mode?
dry ember
yeah but the grind though
I really don't want to go through that
i'm fine clearing high heat
farming darkness again is zzz
dry ember
you got the trinity?
untold quiver
Yup....I backed out to fire obs up I'll post the Hades fight :)
219 dmg jolts and 271 damage trippyshots
Wow.....that was a breezr
And the feast was my last duo so 8 ambrosia
untold quiver
@dry ember - No way, my top heat is ......10? Trade up materials, complete prophecies, farm runs (0 heat runs maxing gold for the diamond/Titanblood at the end.)
untold quiver
oh wait I should post that in Spoilers cause it has the final boss
raw violet
@narrow halo once demeter's special is charged, no additional hits will give you another charge
untold quiver
About farming bloods?
main osprey
how does Kiss of Styx work if you haven't used up any DDs?
mossy breach
it doesnt let you buy it iirc
main osprey
as in, if I click on it it'll say "sorry, you can't buy this"?
mossy breach
nothing happens when you click it
main osprey
aight
yup!
thanks ^.^"
are you normally unable to give Eurydice Nectar after talking to her?
umbral lagoon
lol mediocre 21 heat run just to see if i could do it
i did it first try
shield op
narrow halo
@raw violet thanks
main osprey
I'd go to #h1-story-discussion to ask that, probably
main osprey
you want to get an early start on a specific god
noble folio
I suppose
neon fiber
Aye pretty much
main osprey
it's also not that overpowered
neon fiber
You can also switch to the purse in asphodel since that area doesn’t really have anything so hazardous you’d have to emergency switch to anything else
noble folio
I always end up dashing into the lava
Because I actually have no brain
Or dashing onto spike traps
neon fiber
It’s alright, after enough lava deaths the bit in your brain that takes care of you not walking into burning rivers ends developing
Trust me i’m talking from experience
noble folio
I did once roll a bunch of Ares buffs
neon fiber
In all seriousness now, asphodel is a good test on how well you actually handle your dashes
noble folio
And basically made killer queen
neon fiber
And a good way on training to not overshoot it with em
main osprey
as opposed to just spamming the dash button? :3
neon fiber
Yeah pretty much
Asphodel makes you think about where you’re dashing instead of just going “haha zagreus goes nyoom”
Extra dash boons from Hermes help too
noble folio
Dionysus and Hermes are lads
Imagine having a God dedicated specifically to getting drunk
This post brought to you by Greco-Roman gang
main osprey
getting drunk properly
noble folio
There's a proper way?
neon fiber
Yes
If you didn’t water down your wine in ancient greece you were a heathen and a barbarian
neon fiber
That and the orphic mysteries
noble folio
Holy Diver
Youve been down too long in the midnight sea
My favourite part is getting animated next
turbid needle
@turbid needle You were fed incorrect information about Coronacht's Dash-Strike earlier today. The Dash-Strike does still have scaling damage depending on charge, but it's 30 max damage (+10 for a Power Shot, same as standing).
noble folio
Coronacht is the bow right
turbid needle
Yes.
noble folio
Boons of Chaos sounds like some 40k stuff ngl
turbid needle
Peach, you better come off DND soon, I gotta yell at you about that screenshot.
noble folio
I'd play more DnD if I knew more people who actually cared about it
main osprey
I mean, y'all see my status :P
mighty swan
chaos 😌 too powerful
raw violet
where are you?
turbid needle
(you met all the biome NPCs)
raw violet
does anyone know if the chaos boons that cause you to take extra damage from traps applies to enemies too or is that exclusive?
main osprey
should be just you
cunning urchin
PB?
turbid needle
Personal Best.
sudden dagger
@raw violet it was the empty shop right before bone hydra
Also I am still so bad against theseus
raw violet
i dunno why i had asked, it's not like i could've helped point it out
i've only personally seen it at the bottom near where the rafts/boats dock
sudden dagger
My guess is that it was supposed to spawn but didn't
raw violet
are you sure it was the right bell noise?
cause sometimes I pick up a hammer and mistake the hammer bell for the fish bell
normal orbit
||So I feel like I'm missing something...
- I've given Skelly a lot of Nectar, and the next heart icon is locked, and I'm not able to give him any more
- I've got the sword Zagreus aspect up to 5
- Equipping that, I slay Skelly
- I go out, I die, I come back. I'm not presented with the opportunity to talk to him
Shouldn't I be able to gift him Ambrosia?||
turbid needle
This works here.
normal orbit
Apologies.
raw violet
you get dialogue after killing skelly?
raw violet
and he told you to kill him with the maxed level zagreus sword aspect?
normal orbit
No, I've just read about it on the wiki. How do I trigger that conversation?
Just luck?
raw violet
probably, if it's locked then eventually after a few runs skelly should ask you for a favor
unkempt pagoda
you got ahead of yourself lol
normal orbit
Ah, I thought once I gave enough Nectar, I unlocked the Favor stage. Alas.
dry ember
Merciful end gets nerfed
@fiery light what do you propose? like a cool down of some sort?
fiery light
WHO DARES SUMMON M-
dry ember
raise hand
fiery light
make it so you have to actually deflect something to activate it
instead of being able to mash athena dash + doom trigger
fiery light
yeah
doesnt need to deflect anything
which means dash attack + dash instantly procs it
assuming Ares attack + athena dash
dry ember
yeah and the deflect keep you safe too.
but most things with dash involved won't get nerfed imo, like how many people actually know about this
i just recently knew this like 5 days ago, and I play a ton
know about abusing merciful end that is
raw violet
if it only proced on deflect, it would become a pointless duo
raw violet
that would probably be more reasonable
fiery light
pointless duo?
raw violet
yes
dry ember
look at Athena Aphro
raw violet
i'm only talking about merciful end
if you wanted to talk about duos by comparison
that's a different conversation
fiery light
well balance is inherantly a comparative discussion no?
fiery light
I didnt make an arguement did I? 😮
my apologies if i did
because my arguement would be
raw violet
is unlikely to gain much benefit from early procs by deflect
fiery light
it should get nerfed or other duos should be buffed
raw violet
i agree with that
raw violet
i'm saying that your suggestion would make it a pointless duo
fiery light
aphro Ares is just in a sad state
Well It wouldnt -just- be that
I think it would get some other facet
like making the doom deal more damage
or reapply
or something
raw violet
i was only addressing what you suggested
dry ember
I mean Lightning Rod also exists
raw violet
there's a lot of duos that just need to be buffed to at least be usable
dry ember
and Spent Spirit
fiery light
that being said
raw violet
i think merciful end is hard to abuse on all weapons
dry ember
meanwhile Fully Loaded is a myth
fiery light
I do think pointless is exaggerating a bit
raw violet
probably best on sword and fist
dry ember
shield can use it pretty well too no?
raw violet
shield does but shield is not outputting damage nearly as fast, i don't think
raw violet
shield feels sort of how merciful end was designed for
fiery light
agree
raw violet
assuming that was the design choice
fiery light
Its dash attack abuse with sword and fist that have led it to to how it currently is
raw violet
for all we know, the devs knew what it could do on fist and sword
fiery light
I do think Ares is bound for a rework
dry ember
We are pretty close to launch
cunning urchin
Merciful End dash-strike spam on Malphon is busted.
dry ember
I do wonder how radical changes are going to play out
fiery light
people are having a great deal of dissonance with his kit
fiery light
yeah i believe so
So i think hoping for buffs
is the best case scenario
Or at least making things more consistent
dry ember
a lot of things on Malphon seem to be busted
raw violet
considering how many comments and threads about people hating ares, it seems like the merciful end abuse is in the minority
dry ember
#buffares
fiery light
I dont think ares needsa buff -perse-
cunning urchin
It's probably a few people abusing Merciful End or Hunting Blades, and the rest trying other combos that don't really work all that well?
raw violet
i view ares as a bad solo boon
fiery light
yeah exactly
raw violet
but amazing with specific friends
fiery light
the issue I have is that some match him in synergy AND are better in solo
raw violet
which would make sense based on the philosophy that the devs want op builds to require some work over the course of a game
raw violet
merciful end does also require that you specifically have athena dash
and ares attack to work
fiery light
I mean
unkempt pagoda
no?
fiery light
other forms -also- work
raw violet
for fist and sword abuse
raw violet
please take that in context
raw violet
thanks, friends
fiery light
But I will contest that multiple abilities in the game dont follow that philosophy yet
turbid needle
You can get away with Attack->Special with World Splitter for Merciful End.
fiery light
And I hope they do because I genuinely believe it'll be healthier for the game like that
unkempt pagoda
i mean, i just came into the conversation like a minute ago lol
fiery light
then its on you to read context before jumping in no?
turbid needle
I'm super in the minority and I think Ares's kit is mostly fine.
fiery light
ye
turbid needle
Dire Misfortune needs tuning, but that's it.
fiery light
I just wish it had more internal synergy
just feels like the more ares things you pick up
the worse your build is
turbid needle
I find both Doom and Blade Rifts to be powerful but really hard to use.
dry ember
ares dash is big no no for me
fiery light
and their main potential comes from synergies
raw violet
i think it's okay that to make ares really powerful, that it requires specific synergies
turbid needle
I will say that Blade Dash requires both Engulfing Vortex and Vicious Cycle to be a threatening offensive option.
It will at least chip away Damage Control hearts.
raw violet
and the synergies actually get more and more powerful as you pick up more boons
dry ember
that's 3 boons too many
turbid needle
You can get all three by themselves.
dry ember
with those 3 boons I can get a much better combo with something else
turbid needle
Ah.
raw violet
yeah, i think there are outliers of combos that require way fewer boons
turbid needle
That's three boons.
That all proc the next spawn.
You can get this combo in Tartarus, and suddenly any Blade Rift you spawn for the rest of the game is a world ender.
raw violet
i think that's the right argument
there's a fair number of things that can occur with 3 pick ups
fiery light
when im speaking of lack of internal synergy im speaking of the 2 very different types of ares builds
turbid needle
I know.
fiery light
doom and blades feel like thye need a cross over boon
it doesnt need to be optimal
or even amazing
raw violet
i can think of maybe 2 things off the top of my head that only require 2 boons/hammers that can take you to hades town in a ferry
fiery light
but something to build that bridge would be welcome for those times where you get parts of each build
cunning urchin
Bladerifts proc and reapply Doom instantly on hit.
dry ember
Thing is
fiery light
LOL @cunning urchin
raw violet
lol, i thought they nerfed hunting blades once already
cunning urchin
But you have to actually apply Doom first.
dry ember
I feel like Artemis has the same problem with Ares
fiery light
Really?
dry ember
you either go crit or cast
turbid needle
If I lose Vicious Cycle to a crossover boon that's unnecessary besides flavor reasons (which are insanely subjective) I'm gonna lose my cool.
fiery light
but casts - can crit tho
turbid needle
She also has Pressure Points and boosts any Cast build.
dry ember
ares has urge to kill
turbid needle
They did, they shaved 1.1 seconds off Hunting Blades' duration.
raw violet
we have what? 8 gods? i think one can require external synergies
require is a strong word, but you know
turbid needle
Battle Rage is one of the single-best boons you can get with the Rail.
dry ember
Hestia Battle Rage is nutty
cunning urchin
Pressure Points has synergy with literally everything. Urge to Kill does not.
fiery light
I feel you, but its clear that the generic public has a sort of issue with his usual playpatterns
turbid needle
Yes, Urge to Kill does.
raw violet
battle rage i think is even better on guan yu
turbid needle
It will always boost at least Cast damage.
I don't see an issue with one of the Olympians being the hard mode option, either.
raw violet
since i've been doing more guan yu runs, i've really felt like charged skewer falls into or close to the spreadfire bucket
dry ember
so it's ok for some options to be easy mode also?
turbid needle
His kit is clearly competent, not every god has to have an Ice Wine (though Hunting Blades and Vicious Cycle is the game's strongest Cast combo).
In terms of ease to use.
cunning urchin
Attack and Cast are objectively not everything. Pressure Points applies to all damage.
cunning urchin
Funny that you point that out. Pressure Points has better synergy with Doom than Urge to Kill.
fiery light
yep :^)
raw violet
sorry, we moved quickly, but i don't think artemis is like ares since she can stand tall alone
fiery light
Art is genuinely imo the best god in the game for most players purposes
turbid needle
She's the best Olympian in the game objectively, I think.
dry ember
she is O negative confirmed
turbid needle
The best player in the world, someone just picking up Hades for the first time, she has the best options.
raw violet
yeah, both rail and guan yu can clear the game pretty easily with a single hammer and a single artemis boon
turbid needle
don'tfriggin'nerfher
dry ember
ok, in term of call, who takes the cake?
fiery light
im fine honestly with her not getting nerfed
dry ember
I vote Athena
turbid needle
Athena, Zeus, or Dionysus.
raw violet
i like demeter sometimes too
fiery light
turn in to a bayblade
dry ember
Ares call is DPS drop
unkempt pagoda
okay but who has the best call lines
fiery light
ares call is a meme
dry ember
unless you build for it
unkempt pagoda
the answers are: demeter
turbid needle
Probably Demeter, yeah.
dry ember
what does she say?
raw violet
can't beat passive-aggressive grandma who hates everyone and only tolerates her grandson
cunning urchin
Lady Aphrodite has the best call and best lines, obviously. Every single line of her is best. 
dry ember
Stop fangirling over Aphro
fiery light
speaking of which, genuinely surprised me how high base damage Aphro is
raw violet
yeah, well she's bugged for me so two can play hard-to-get
cunning urchin
Never!
dry ember
Arte > Aphro
unkempt pagoda
if the wiki editors have time, i think adding in call lines would be a great addition
cunning urchin
You can add them in.
dry ember
I think someone is already on that?
I think just wait for launch and do some data mining
is faster than writing the quotes down.
dry ember
mainly since we don't know if SSG is adding anything
cunning urchin
If you want something done, don't wait for somebody else to do it. Do it yourself.
stoic thicket
They are? I thought gods were done now.
turbid needle
They're not adding any more Olympians.
dry ember
I think he kids
fiery light
I wish
dry ember
it's Jesus isn't it
fiery light
DD synergy charater
cunning urchin
No, we only have cool gods.
raw violet
our lord and savior
dry ember
I'm down for st. patty
cunning urchin
It's me.
dry ember
yeah keep dreaming
cunning urchin
Me as Lady Aphrodite's girlfriend?
cunning urchin
I'm sorry. I'm gonna go now.
dry ember
afaik it's not bed time yet Nyaa
fiery light
Apollo
dry ember
stop dreaming
raw violet
cause how do you have an rpg without the fire element?
dry ember
he seems insignificant
turbid needle
I'm a little surprised there's no fire option.
fiery light
insignificant?
cunning urchin
They should add Venus.
turbid needle
No Roman crossover.
dry ember
Very funny
raw violet
i would also accept haphaestus
dry ember
but we already have Deadelus
dry ember
or however you spell his name
fiery light
exactly
turbid needle
Okay, fever/pipe dream: Hephaestus Hammer added to Styx.
cunning urchin
I want a Ladies Aphrodite/Venus Duo Boon.
turbid needle
It offers 3 set Aspect-specific super options.