ooh first legendary boon
#h1-builds-and-combat
plush cloud
ooh love gungeon
strong hornet
isac, wizzard of legend, rogue legacy to mention a few
ivory dragon
+1
strong hornet
guess ftl aswell
ivory dragon
and yeah gungeon is too good @plush cloud - still a final update to be released iirc but thats more for off-topic than anything else
hades update in what 9/10 days?
glossy slate
yeah
strong hornet
not long atleast. this game seems quite promissing
plush cloud
dead cells is a good rogue like too
glossy slate
I'm sad, I'm not going to be able to play the update for a fair while
glossy slate
moving in 3 days, won't have my computer until about the 23rd
worn dawn
Died to the final round of hydra heads >.>
stray radish
rip
vapid mauve
😬
ivory dragon
ill send you screenshots of my runs via postcard @glossy slate
glossy slate
❤
strong hornet
so many thing to play but usually stuck with WoW as i do mythic raiding there like 2 days a week and need to keep my character maintained. Nice to get time to play thing i enjoy outside of that aswell like this.
vapid mauve
"wish you were here" -> posing in front of dead hydra
ivory dragon
^^^^^
glossy slate
Dabbing Zag when
ivory dragon
unless they add another floor ofc 🤔
stray radish
omg
plush cloud
yeah, risu try getting an aphro boon for your next run, weakening the hydra can help you out until you figure out the patterns and the crazyness
manic goblet
Wish I was there as well
stray radish
i didnt get to hydra yet, like at all xD
ivory dragon
all in good time
stray radish
my record is 22 floors
plush cloud
omb i meant ran-dusa
stray radish
improved from 20 @_@
glossy slate
try my run
stray radish
thats also fair
worn dawn
I had aphro boon ;_;
glossy slate
damage resistance and health,
ivory dragon
remember the golden rules to roguelites -
- understand enemy animations and attacks
- understand floor layouts
- understand your attacks and evasion options
worn dawn
I’m just bad with bow
ivory dragon
you can learn this game fastest by just walking around for awhile without trying to attack anything
ivory dragon
hahaha
strong hornet
rip so long for legendary boon :P aphrodite buffed bloodless swarmed me down
glossy slate
- Skill is unnecessary, just get enormous damage
ivory dragon
when i realized that 99% of attacks can be dodge by just walking, the entire game opened up to me
stray radish
shield is hit or miss to me. i like spear's special but i do better with shield
wat do
ivory dragon
the knockback on shield probably keeps you safer when dealing damage
if i had to blind guess
tracking spear toss splits your attention
glossy slate
okay
worn dawn
I’m gonna do a sword run to feel better about myself
glossy slate
start shield, start with poseidon's keepsake
plush cloud
yeah spear special is bad
glossy slate
Tempest Strike, play pinball
plush cloud
use spin or just regular attack
stray radish
i mean, if i lose track of it i can just resummon it whenever and try again
manic goblet
spin-dash is honestly borderline to being overpowered
ivory dragon
ive done a few spear throw runs, they aren't too bad. more of a personal challenge than equally viable game style imo
@manic goblet well my last spin dash run was doing over 1k damage
manic goblet
the dmg output from that is just crazy
stray radish
thats a shame
ivory dragon
but you can go much higher
stray radish
i like the spear throw xD
stray radish
yeah i got it once. never again
ivory dragon
makes it so that the spear stops in front of enemies instead of piercing, so it just ruins literally everything from aoe damage to backstap setup
stray radish
i can't do bow without the rapid shot, i just cant xD
ivory dragon
get in the habit of dashing immediately into a bow charge
dashing will cut the charge rate down substantially
stray radish
eh
ivory dragon
errr...charge time requirement?
glossy slate
less than a second to power shot after dash
ivory dragon
^
stray radish
it goes off weirdly sometimes, i tried it on Skelly
glossy slate
I have a bit of advice for using bow with MKB
stray radish
one portion changes direction on its own idk
glossy slate
ivory dragon
you might be getting thrown off by the dislocation of the camera from dashing
stray radish
THANKS THATS HELPFUL
glossy slate
np man, anytime
ivory dragon
LOL
glossy slate
stray radish
im pretty sure it happens because of the direction of the dash
ivory dragon
i didnt realize gudtouch could be so savage
ah so like, you dash past where your cursor is, and so even though your cursor was in x direction, its now in y direction?
stray radish
basically
ivory dragon
Maybe there was some crossover from twitch shooters that helped me there
stray radish
i tried to shoot counter-dash and it still went same direction as previously
so idk, its just weird
graceful bough
I get legendary boons so infrequently I usually forget that they exist.
ivory dragon
it'll always go to the cursor, but yeah with cam in takes some adjustment
graceful bough
I encountered a room with two boons... and they both had legendaries.
ivory dragon
i may end up just modding my cursor tbh, it melts into the red background of asphodel
graceful bough
Kinda wish I was recording. That seems so rare I'm not sure if anyone else would've experienced that yet.
stray radish
the cursor shouldnt move so much and in entirely different direction, like if i dash in a straight line but down
ivory dragon
well the cursor never really moves
ivory dragon
its just the offset from the camera and dashing can really play with your mind
pastel jolt
check your settings? you can turn on and off the "dash to cursor" thing afaik
stray radish
yeah its off
pastel jolt
imagine using mouse and keyboard to play hades
posted by the controller gang
stray radish
i played with it for a while but decided i hate it xD
ivory dragon
get outta here mkb life
stray radish
WELL TOO BAD
graceful bough
Not everyone has a controller.
vapid mauve
laughs in mouse+keyboard
graceful bough
But for those who do... man it feels good.
stray radish
lowkey main reason i gave up on hollow knight and just watched other people play it for me xD
graceful bough
Controller feels really, really good for this game.
ivory dragon
it looks like it would
strong hornet
testing mkb now but was nice using controller :P
vapid mauve
I haven't tried it, but I can't see the appeal
ivory dragon
ive just never been a fan of the methods to make controller accuracy decent
like the aim assists etc which are required
stray radish
usually if the devs recommend you play with a controller, they'd know better what works for their game xD
ivory dragon
depends on the person i think
graceful bough
The aim assist feels like the game mechanics.
Just feels like how the game functions.
ivory dragon
it looks like its well designed for controller use for sure.
but you'll never catch me on one
stray radish
yeah
graceful bough
@stray radish Then you have Team Meat.
vapid mauve
devs are casuals 
graceful bough
Who mock keyboard users.
Even though keyboard is definitely better for Super Meat Boy.
ivory dragon
honestly you guys just need to get on my level and play with a nintendo power glove like those of us that have ascended
graceful bough
@ivory dragon I use a USB steering wheel.
ivory dragon
@graceful bough PLEASE tell me the pedals are for dashing
glossy slate
so if you play that way, is the power of the gods literally in your hand?
ivory dragon
@glossy slate i dont want to get ahead of myself or oversell it, but yes. absolutely.
graceful bough
I think I used keyboard and mouse for all my playthroughs of Bastion, but a controller for Transistor and now Hades.
ivory dragon
i think i used controller for dead cells last
vapid mauve
I could probably finish my boonless + mirrorless challenge if I upgraded to powerglove...
graceful bough
Supergiant's games I think function really well for either control scheme.
graceful bough
I definitely used a controller for Dead Cells.
And that was intentional past tense.
Because I really hope I never go back to that game.
graceful bough
that isn't a gift from the greek gods themselves
graceful bough
You told me to.
ivory dragon
touche 🤔
stray radish
changing the topic a bit, i had a weird thought earlier. what happens if you enter the blood gate while on exactly the amount of hp it asks to take from you? can you even do that? do you instantly die, and what Hypnos has to say about it? does it trigger death defy, or instantly heals you for +1/2/3 if you have it? @_@
ivory dragon
I want to say it doesn't let you. I vaguely remember trying
though I may have just dreamed it
graceful bough
There used to be a glitch, which was thankfully patched out in about a day.
ivory dragon
hah hypnos would be awesome after that
stray radish
Hypnos just humming dumb ways to die with Orpheus
graceful bough
That the Ares boon that deals additional damage after a hit would hit YOU when you caught your shield or spear.
While the glitch was active I died by it.
vapid mauve
sick
ivory dragon
well that sounds fun
graceful bough
Was really disappointed Hypnos didn't say anything.
stray radish
aw
graceful bough
Oh it was game-breaking.
ivory dragon
maybe zag just didnt know how to catch
I jumped on in the current patch cycle
so everything else is egyptian to me
i hear fables about how shield was broken
stray radish
well now im just disappointed xD
ivory dragon
why are you disa @stray radish
stray radish
cuz the blood gate thing isnt a thing
graceful bough
Shield wasn't broken.
It was the only weapon that was any good.
Then they buffed everything else and all was right with the world.
ivory dragon
didnt it have built-in deflect or something
glossy slate
glossy slate
yes it did
stray radish
it did
glossy slate
plus a hammer upgrade that made deflections deal 5x damage
stray radish
geez
graceful bough
But it was the only weapon that didn't feel underpowered so it was the only one I used.
stray radish
not for the shield users
graceful bough
Shield is still great, what are you talking about.
ivory dragon
shield is aight
stray radish
i mean, nerfs always hurt
ivory dragon
the built-in knockback has some utility on armored units
graceful bough
I mean I've killed the hydra with it only 3 times, and done it 4 times with everything else.
stray radish
even if the thing is still fine after them
graceful bough
But it's still really fun and definitely competent.
ivory dragon
ahhh i see what you mean @stray radish
vapid mauve
I've still got 0 kills on shield, mostly from lack of trying though
ivory dragon
thats a real thing too. even if something is insanely powerful it's going to make a subset of people angry to be brought down
graceful bough
Apparently the Ares art was patched in at some point, but I don't ever remember the game without it.
vapid mauve
he had art already, they just updated it a bit
graceful bough
It could've been in the game's first 3 days or so before I got it, or I just didn't notice when it was changed.
stray radish
i remember
graceful bough
Ah
graceful bough
Also, I hear the hydra used to be much harder.
ivory dragon
hmmm, any specific?
graceful bough
But I only got to it like 2 times before the patch where it was nerfed, and it utterly destroyed my the first several times I got to it afterward, so I couldn't say for sure.
ivory dragon
atm the only "difficult" thing about hydra is in how you manage the heads from their second phase onward i think
graceful bough
I distinctly remember thinking it was utterly impossible.
ivory dragon
once you understand the patterns, i mean
graceful bough
But I thought that for a while after it was nerfed regardless.
ivory dragon
ill admit hydra is quite a jump up from meg
graceful bough
And Meg was pretty hard for a long while too.
First couple times I got to the hydra I was still low enough skill and tier that it wasn't even certain if I'd get past Meg the next run.
ivory dragon
meg is what made me take a step back and let enemies dictate the pace. charging in gung-ho is suicide
took a few runs to learn that lesson
vapid mauve
I still don't know how to get past the final hydra heads phase without taking hits, that's my last barrier
ivory dragon
i can get by mostly unscathed, but i usually build up enough to allow for a few hits
graceful bough
Meg is so much fun. I'm sad I ran out of interactions with her a long time ago (in and out of runs).
glossy slate
I usually tank hits until skull earring activates
pastel jolt
focus on one set of heads, prioritising whichever one spawns bloodless OR dumps bad on the floor, if either of them are up
ivory dragon
only thing i dont like about meg is the invuln phases. as for the heads yeah i just carve out a safe space to stand
vapid mauve
if I have all my dashes or dps I do ok on hydra heads, without either of those it's a struggle
pastel jolt
sometimes i get lucky and it spawns all stompy heads so i can take my time
but honestly the most useful thing i do when fighting the hydra is pause the game to breathe :'D
graceful bough
Sad I need to leave for 20 minutes or so because I'm enjoying these discussions. Maybe talk to y'all in a bit.
ivory dragon
i do love when meg does the pink aoe circles or is running to the upper center of the room, since you get a lot of free damage in those phases
@graceful bough no worries, we live here 😃
ivory dragon
"what projectiles"
pastel jolt
bullet hell is usually when i clear out adds
ivory dragon
sometimes that invuln pop up will push me backwards into a witch projectile
thats when i cry
pastel jolt
the worst part of fighting meg is if you're in the lower right of the arena and she's dashing bc you can't really see so well down there
ivory dragon
hahaha thats when you enter escape velocity and dash into the stars
alright im going to pass out. i may be around tomorrow
see you hades soldiers later ❤
autumn tapir
I still haven't seen a legendary, it brings me sadness
worn dawn
Takes some planning
severe orchid
are you supposed to be able to do like ~15% of hydras hp with bow special? Had a bunch of stacking upgrades but is more damage than I've ever been able to put out before
forest marsh
Yes, point blank bow special is a valid build
And can be quite effective, as you've seen
severe orchid
yeah it was ridiculous
calm sable
I feel like 99% of #hades-feedback posts don't consider the fact that the game isn't over
like how the special button can feel worthless if you don't put boons into it
but we don't have a full actual run of Hades to collect a series of boons
where you'll finish up your setup for dashing and attacking, and then have a new avenue of benefits you can throw onto that button you're not using
errant narwhal
i actually do agree that most specials feel useless even with boons, sword excluded
rigid trout
I... I just got through the bomb twins with no death defiance and two health @_@
forest marsh
Sword special is definitely the best of them, in my opinion
calm sable
it's not actually that bad 
rigid trout
calm sable
I've had a successful special Bow run
forest marsh
Congrats (?) Vella!
forest marsh
Honestly, the longer you play, the more the Skeletwins stop being a problem at all
rigid trout
sorry, what language?
errant narwhal
the hydra has not yet stopped being a problem for me, or the boat. lol
forest marsh
So you're on the right track, Vella!
errant narwhal
ahahah reread your last couple of messages again
severe orchid
I have nothing but hatred for the skull spawners+shielders
forest marsh
Consult the red x 😉
stray radish
yeah i was wondering if that counts xDD
rigid trout
i'm not one to poke at rules usually but...
that ones gonna cause me some problems if stuff like that's considered too
anyway<
errant narwhal
i guess technically its allowed...? we havent rlly talked about it that ive seen. but its also technically circumventing the swear filter
which shouldnt be encouraged
stray radish
we gotta learn to go 'wth' here xD
forest marsh
I don't know much about Proxy as a bot in particular, but bots in general you can adjust the filter. Maybe add it to the filtered word list?
rigid trout
i feel like if it becomes super problematic with someone regularly using it to skirt around, yes... but casual use that's just people talking??? idk... i'll try, i'm not saying i'm gonna just go "ah forget your rules"
i'm just a little... dubious about the ruling.
that's all
carry on
not gonna sit here and argue, it's not my place
forest marsh
But my suggestion is probably a question to be discussed in #mod-chat and not here, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
rigid trout
how's everyone else's h...eck escapes coming on...
forest marsh
I'm currently watching Youtube videos and talking with you lovely people, so my escapes are going... well?
errant narwhal
everything in the games is a-okay
rigid trout
that...
errant narwhal
but i dont recall zagreus saying the f word
irt language that is
murder is illegal
forest marsh
Escaping my own personal hell of reality via the internet 
stray radish
father
forest marsh
I would argue that regardless of the game, hell is not a swear
stray radish
i guess if ur religious it'd count?
rigid trout
part of my mental issues, and i won't try to bring it here
or rather i'll try not to bring it here
proper english folks, changes sentence meanings
errant narwhal
you can refrain from saying hell if youd like, nothings stopping you
its just that this is a game about escaping hell so id say that word is allowed
also, i am not a native english speaker, so sorry for any phrasing mistakes i make?
stray radish
it better be xD
rigid trout
oh no, not you. i meant... ok i'm gonna go ahead and bury myself in the hole i've dug
stray radish
eh Vella, it happened. just remember not to slip up again
i actually did that once but edited it to wth cause i wasnt sure xD
rigid trout
it's hurting my head now because i'm trying to think of something i though i heard in the game
but i'm not sure i heard it now so i'm ugh
unf, died to louts again
i hate themmm
forest marsh
You'll just have to die louts and louts of times, and eventually you'll get better
rigid trout
....
that joke was bad
and you should feel bad
almost up to 100 attempts
just to lay out how terrible i am at this game
forest marsh
I am an unrepuntant word criminal
rigid trout
... that needs to be your official title
forest marsh
I think it is something like that on my Twitter description... Or maybe it was a twitch command for Nightbot on the channel I moderate... I can't remember which
Hmmm, the Nightbot command is close, but it says unapologetic, not unrepuntant. I should update that
forest marsh
Crossing what? The river Styx?
shy hill
how come you get damaged when crossing on the pads in the lava zone?
forest marsh
You only get damaged if you stand too close, which the game considers to be in/on the edge of the lava
shy hill
k
forest marsh
You can stand further back and press the button, or else press it faster when you get to the ferry and you won't take damage in either case. There's a slight delay before you start taking damage from lava
There is feedback about this problem though, as you shouldn't really take damage from trying to get close to the ferries. Consider searching through the #hades-feedback channel and giving it a 👍
shy hill
k
forest marsh
If you search for ferry or ferries in the feedback channel, it will come up as the only result
split flicker
how much mirror progression do yall think hydra is balanced around?
plucky oxide
Having artemis boon, three dashes, and dash attack damage maxed., in my opinion. Coin, health recovery, and backstab are good run secure-ers.
Having the death defies is nice, but using spear or bow to eliminate threats with the above boon, dash, damage is what I find essential.
I find hydra balanced around, at most, having dabbled darkness in almost everything except the bottom-most boon rarity perks.
little grotto
i dont use the backstab mechanic at all unfortunately
some enemies turn so fast especially the bloodless in asphodel that they attack faster than i can hit them sometimes
ivory dragon
at minimum double dash alone is enough to safely navigate the majority of it
merry nymph
Hm
I just killed Megaera yet she killed me as well. Like... Technically we both died, and Meg said two phrases at the same time and somehow I survived with 6HP
I mean... She said two phrases atst as if she won and lost at the same time. That was weird Oo
pastel jolt
don't think about it too hard
manic goblet
The Witch
olive abyss
@ all god boons: stop trying to force me a Special Lance build >_>
manic goblet
Why are SO many of them for the Special 
olive abyss
i keep getting special boons except when i play shield ://///
sad life
also is it me or did they nerf a bit the frequency of god boons?
manic goblet
it's just random, sometimes I'm overloaded on god boons, sometimes I get like 2-3
hard holly
I mean, you want to get special boons specifically when not playing shield
Spear Special is the only special thats reliably good
raw ice
is it intended to be able to press special sword attack very lightly to just slightly zoom the camera in and stop your movement and not actually attack
hollow totem
Why get specisl boons when you can build normals just fine with more damagr
rose pawn
When you equip the trinket that gives you 25 hp and unequip it heals you for 25 hp if you were not full hp. I think you should also lose 25 hp when you unequip the trinket
worn dawn
Because sword special is fun~~
Especially if you double the size
Then shenanigans start
rose pawn
I need more practice with the sword for sure
hard holly
Because Spear special is safer than regular attacks
While not losing damage if you get the right hammer upgrade
worn dawn
Double size sword special with deflect is so funny
rose pawn
I like the shield special
worn dawn
Anything even considering attacking gets hit
rose pawn
At least in the first area
raw ice
@rose pawn there's no winning, because now you get free heal, but if it would remove that 25 hp it would probably be possible to kill yourself by unequiping it if you're at 25 hp or less
probably better than free heal though lol
rose pawn
It wouldnt kill you since it gives + 25 hp to begin with
raw ice
I mean
equip it at the begining of the run, after Meg you have less than 25 hp, you change the keepsake
it would kill in this scenario
rose pawn
If you have 1 hp equiping it would give you 26 hp
But unequiping it doesnt remove the hp gain
raw ice
I don't know if you understand
you can get hurt in between equiping and unequiping it
raw ice
not sure if being able to die like that would be a big problem, since there's a fountain right next to the place you change keepsakes
maybe there could be a warning "hey you have low hp, are you sure you want to remove the thing that keeps you alive"
rose pawn
Also if you equip it before healing at the foutain you get a bigger heal but I dont think it’s much of a problem
raw ice
or it could only increase max hp and not heal or damage at all?
there's probably some good way to implement it
plush blaze
I know the shop is locked next to the fountain until you use the fountain, don't know about the keepsake closet
rose pawn
Yea I guess that could work too but I dunno if anyone would pick it over the other ones
Keepsake closet is open
I tried it
pastel jolt
spiked collar is a good crutch until you're more comfortable with the combat sustem
plush blaze
I'll try and see
worn dawn
I think it’s prob fine to just let it heal
A bit of help before the madness of asphodel
pastel jolt
no, an exploit was back when you could repeatedly equip and unequip the collar to heal back to full
rose pawn
It does feel sorta like an exploit still
pastel jolt
how
raw ice
that's what I understood actually, but even if it's a 25 heal for nothing it's an exploit
exploit as in using an unintentional interaction for some kind of benefit
rose pawn
I think removing the hp would be fine since you are near the foutain anyway
raw ice
I mean yeah, it doesn't remove health right now
Thou was talking that you can equip it for a free heal because of that
plush blaze
@raw ice https://imgur.com/a/QlSHiNh
Was just checking this
Since I hadn't thought of that possibility before, I assumed it wouldn't kill you
But wanted to check 🙂
pastel jolt
i mean it doesn't remove health right now so of course it wouldn't kill you
plush blaze
Yes... I know that now sparrow
raw ice
ah alright
lesson for today: context is kind of important
tawdry sleet
hmm what's the best hammer upgrade for spear? 🤔
would you go Massive Spin (+200% area on spin) or Untouchable Thrust (+130% farther attack)
plush blaze
I usually go massive spin since I use the spin attack more
Never felt I needed the extra range on poking
ivory dragon
i find the extra range is more fun, but realistically the spin is probably flat out more often useful
raw ice
best upgrade is 500% dmg to armor because armor is literally everywhere
manic goblet
useless against bosses though :>
rose pawn
I like the one that increase your special dmg up to 200% depending on distance
ivory dragon
massive spin lets you get free hydra damage by charge dashing over the walls if you have to play it super safe
hard holly
Massive spin, fast spin, 200% damage on special and crit on special are generally the best
tawdry sleet
Kind of annoying that World Splitter on sword is ignored after a dash
rain axle
If you learn to move right while you chop you won't need dash that much
hard holly
You just dash and do 2 attacks
raw ice
doesn't change the fact that it is kind of annoying
manic goblet
I mean... otherwise we'd get 160 hits just because we'd pick World Splitter, that would be kind of over the top
ivory dragon
i wouldnt mind being able to initiate the world splitter animation fresh out of a dash
but thats more to just speed up clearing a bit instead of playing the "wait a few frames before attacking" game
raw ice
it feels really bad to deal 12 damage instead of over 100 for pushing the attack button too quickly
ivory dragon
it is a bit counter intuitive on expectations
not a huge thing, but a small gripe with value
manic goblet
technically it's the same for every weapon, aside from the bow
only the bow can really take advantage of dash+attack upgrade (e.g. triple shot)
hollow totem
?
raw ice
yeah but other weapons don't have a 400% damage hits
manic goblet
honestly, triple shot might even be a bit overtuned xd
manic goblet
a "tiny" bit
ivory dragon
so far ive been able to one shot the hydra phases with spin and bow
just crazy how high you can push everything
ive seen some almost 2k damage attacks floating around
manic goblet
Same, it's the one weapon I really don't like playing with
raw sonnet
Shields the only one Im not big on
I look forward to see if we will get more weapons. Kinda want a flail, a whip, and maybe some knuckles
raw sonnet
That'd be pretty cool too
olive abyss
Just found out that dashing while during a bullrush will allow you to extend it.
so for example you can do a 90degree angle turn that damages
or hit the same enemy twice by dashing behind you right after hitting them
don't rly know where to report this or if it's intended :/
it's kidna fun honestly
manic goblet
probably intended, same with the spin-dash
olive abyss
also sometimes the bullrush registers as a backstab? even though you hit the ennemy from the front
raw sonnet
You can get that with the overhead slash of the sword sometimes too
If you dash 'behind' a guy, but wind up still mostly in front of them. You can then swing 1 (miss) swing 2 (backstab) and then thrust (miss)
frosty pier
Gods, how I love these rooms there you locked with Skull-dens and Blue bastards and it is that small as dorm-room type of map.
ivory dragon
ham is the only answer
frosty pier
Ham as in "Go fight them you sissy!", or "Dont forget the ham for that Godling sandwich"?
frosty pier
Heh I may be cooked, but atleast I understand Sword a bit more
olive abyss
i haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate that you can't reflect the hydra's sharp projectiles
there's no indication that yo uaren't able to do it the first time you encouter it either
and i don't think your attacks destroy them? it's litterally just avoid them
until they run into a wall
still pewter
yeah, definitely needs to read better
someone suggested undeflectable stuff having a distinct color
it's a bit lame that hydra invalidates 2 god keywords, namely deflect (on projectiles) and knockback
harsh bay
i always find the problem with fighting the hydra is i get stunlocked
manic goblet
until you find out... the cheese 
harsh bay
idk like i haven't found a problem with the bit, for me it is stunlock and the ground smash going thru walls
the cheese
xD
manic goblet
hydra darts can be cheesed so damn hard
harsh bay
which ones tho
harsh bay
i feel like i've done the cheese when i first beat the hydra now i just don't know anything about it
still pewter
they sure can, but ideally you don't want very cheesable designs
harsh bay
starting to get fully back into it so i am ready for the update
still pewter
although what you're saying isn't even cheese, I think it's more like, manipulation that requires knowledge and skill
because you need to know when hydra is about to do bolts and you need to time your dash
bites just feel unfair. not too strong, but unfair. there is minimal indication and they happen almost instantly
same with melee bloodless in asphodel kind of
manic goblet
bloodless can be kited though
ivory dragon
even if you didnt want to side to side dash cheese the spines/darts/whatever, you could utilize the walls and just dash over them as spike 3 lands (you'll have a clear opening to attack a bit as the last 2 will go to your sides)
the slow spikes you can casually walk between
if you really wanted
harsh bay
yeah
ivory dragon
I do agree that the bite attacks dont have much tell to them - always get snipped at least once
(small heads)
still pewter
I don't think so
harsh bay
huh maybe i missed them when i played it on release
frozen locust
guys do you get anything for regifting the npc's or is it just lore?
I have 40 gifts stored but I don't wana waste them, thinking of saving them for future keepsakes
tacit flax
Just lore, and special interactions with Orpheus and Achilles once you max them (to the current number on non-locked hearts)
frozen locust
damn.. would have been nice if they unlocked improved versions of current keepsakes
harsh bay
Maybe that’s planned for
tacit flax
I have a feeling that's something they'll add down the line, yeah
finite grail
It’d be fun if there was a hammer weapon so you could upgrade it with the hammer
Also just in general
pastel jolt
hold on i'm about to go to way too much effort for a dumb joke
@finite grail you mean like this
worn dawn
Wow, you weren’t kidding. Effort was worth!
pastel jolt
the boon icon is too far over but whatever fhjgkjhdlf
worn dawn
It looks awesome
finite grail
charon just sold me a bunch of duct tape with this hammer... I know what to do
primal folio
uhhh here's a question
would there be a reason why i have dark thirst active in between runs?
otherwise i might've found a bug
ive never picked up this ability but playing through i just
Have It Now
frosty pier
looks like purple swirls on a weapon
tender zephyr
Maybe I've yet to discover it, but is there a upgrade to decrease the cooldown for Sword's AoE Special? Because the main problem I have with it is that it just leaves you to vulnerable especially with how the knockback is reduced with armored units. I did have a great run with it due to Athena giving it some much needed defensive value though the lag between using it would still end up with me getting hit.
As an aside, what do you guys think of the enemy's tracking? Because sometimes I feel like I dodge out of the way only for an enemy to somehow turn and hit me right where I dashed away too.
Also, is there any point to getting the Rare/Epic mirror upgrades? Because 1% is incredibly low though I have to take into account that I don't know the base rate that a Boon can be Rare or Epic.
frosty pier
Recovery on sword special is one of those things that feel like you hit a brick wall.
Those bomb throwers I swear to god they hard-reading me.
Point exists... Just after you got everything else.
plush blaze
The tracking is mostly fine but sometimes the brutes will do a last frame or two snap onto you once they've charged
It's been reported
rare/epic mirror upgrades are just a moneysink
tender zephyr
Nice to know I wasn't the only one hit by them though lately it's those blasted zombies that are nailing me.
Also, one do you mean by "hit a brick wall"?
It could be problematic because it becomes too spammy, but at the same time, there more than enough units who can straight up resist the special that it shouldn't be considered moot.
glossy slate
I've figured out why wall slams are so inconsistent in Asphodel
the little ash piles you can step on count as terrain and stop the enemies that get knocked into them, but they're not counted as walls so you don't get any damage off of it
frosty pier
If that is so... I'm sp mad
glossy slate
which is making shield runs a bit of a pain because those little bastards are everywhere
tender zephyr
Huh, that's...kinda annoying.
glossy slate
I didn't notice until I tried to punt an inferno bomber into the lava and he kept bouncing off the ash
frosty pier
So ash piles? NOt invisible wall of "No-swimming-in-lava-for-skeletons"?
forest marsh
Yeah, the ash piles not causing wall slam damage has been reported, but I think it was in the old feedback
worn fulcrum
forest marsh
Regarding the +rare/+epic% mirror upgrade, it goes up to +50% and +25% respectively, so it's worth it in the end
tender zephyr
...How much darkness would that take? Because it I remember correctly, it's 1% per rank.
Money sink indeed.
forest marsh
2500 each
The cost doesn't increase on it like the other mirror upgrades, so it's still 50/100 per percent increase
glossy slate
it's very worth it to max out rare at least
pastel jolt
i'm at like..... 10% or so on the rare one 💔
glossy slate
I haven't seen a common boon in ages
frosty pier
Hm good. I'm like 24% in
forest marsh
I started with Epic personally
glossy slate
another thing I've noticed on this run
some gods have a "passive" boon type that disappears if you take the same type from another god
like taking the basic damage increase boon from Ares removes Different League and Ocean's Bounty
forest marsh
Interesting... Can you say for certain that they're removed, and not just bad RNG?
glossy slate
yeah, I got ares special and passive, along with Artemis dash and Athena cast
all that was left in Poseidon's selection was wall slam stun and Sunken Treasure
forest marsh
Maybe in the code they occupy "slots" like the basic attack/cast/dash/special ¯_(ツ)_/¯
glossy slate
probably
frosty pier
Most likely
manic goblet
definitely, you won't get 2 dash upgrades in the same run either
pastel jolt
attack/cast/dash/special/passive as slots, maybe?
glossy slate
I usually use that to force the boons I do want to appear later, but now I'm going to have to be a bit more careful about what I pick
I'm wondering how it would interact with Athena and Artemis, I know they have multiple "passives" available
forest marsh
Some experimentation is needed, I suspect
I feel like it's hard to test fully, since you have to have a run with enough boons in the first place to start cancelling others out of the pool
And I've definitely had a large number of runs light on boons
glossy slate
I'm sure some enterprising hackers researchers will tell us for certain sometime down the road
forest marsh
Yeah, scouring the code is probably easier (or at least more reliable)
graceful ivy
I would like to know how good is Ares blade rift? I'm not even sure what to pick between 3 rare
glossy slate
the dash one?
graceful ivy
yeah
forest marsh
I've had fun with it before, but you have to be intentional with your dashes
glossy slate
it's an alright amount of incidental damage, but in order to make it really useful you have to go hard on stacking boons from Ares to upgrade it
forest marsh
That is, making sure you're leading enemies into the rifts or else surrounding them with them
glossy slate
his higher tier upgrades double the size and add a vacuum effect
forest marsh
And yeah, as the Doc says, lots of boons to make it be more effective
graceful ivy
and for the Cast version?
forest marsh
I'm not a fan of it, personally, but your mileage may vary
glossy slate
I've only gotten decent damage from the cast while using it on brimstones and skull piles
everything else just walks out
Ares adds a lot of flat damage that's incredibly useful when you're just starting out, but he falls off hard
graceful ivy
yeah at the moment I have Artemis and Ares
forest marsh
Ares abilities rely on hit-and-run tactics mostly — it actually seems a bit counterintuitive for Ares 😆
glossy slate
Artemis is love
she'll carry you
hunter's dash is easily one of the strongest abilities in the game right now
frosty pier
Ares is a madman, I love him, but Gods that line then you near death...
grand patrol
which line?
frosty pier
Well I cant really remember it perfectly but there was a Real facination with soon-to-be-death-experience of Zag in his voice.
grand patrol
oh sounds about right
graceful ivy
Curiosity when you have to choose between two boons/blessing is it better to choose the better one before or after. Just want to know if it change something in the chance you get rare/epic upgrade.
glossy slate
usually just grab whichever you need at that moment
forest marsh
I don't think it changes the rarity chance, but which one you choose will affect the bonus that the summoned enemies get
glossy slate
no guarantee of finding that god again
OH THE TRIALS
yeah grab whichever god you don't want to fight
forest marsh
All I'll say is never shun Athena
glossy slate
or Aphrodite
graceful ivy
have to choose between Ares or Artemis
glossy slate
pick artemis, fight ares
forest marsh
Eh, I haven't had a problem with 
glossy slate
Artemis makes the enemies start an attack from far away and blink to melee
Ares just spawns a tiny blade rift when the enemies pop in
it's actually his cast ability, which is a testament to how weak that thing is
graceful ivy
why me. have to choose between Hunter Dash (Normal) , Pressure points (Rare) and Clean Kill (Rare). I already have a 50% to crit with my normal attack.
Clean Kill look so appealing with 72% increase crit damage but Hunter Dash.
forest marsh
What weapon are you using?
graceful ivy
spear
glossy slate
oof
forest marsh
Are you using spin-dash, or normal attacks more?
If you're doing spin-dash, then Hunter Dash no question
glossy slate
It’s usually better to avoid Artemis’ basic crit chance boons
graceful ivy
I'm not use to do spin-dash but I should I also have massive spin XD
glossy slate
At least if you’re trying to min-max
Taking hunter’s dash and pairing it with an attack boost from Athena or Poseidon massively increases your damage
forest marsh
If you aren't using spin-dash, then I'd say Clean Kill. But I love me Hunter Dash so much
glossy slate
Yeah clean kill, and Hide Breaker after if you get the chance
graceful ivy
will go clean kill for the moment and try to get hunter dash later that is not normal if I can.
forest marsh
Honestly, basic Hunter Dash is all you really need most of the time ¯_(ツ)_/¯
forest marsh
I'd say the only time I'd want more than basic would be if I was using it with a sword build
glossy slate
if you have Massive Spin, you can charge up the attack out of range of enemies
and then dash towards them to reposition and instantly attack
your range becomes a bit more binary
"Are they on my screen?"
If yes, you can hit them!
graceful ivy
for real you can dash after to reposition the spin?!
forest marsh
That's how spin-dash works 😉
forest marsh
Just hold the charge and don't let go until after pressing dash, it will auto-release at the end of the dash
tender zephyr
I hate boat. I really, really hate boat.
forest marsh
I like boat, what's wrong with boat? 😆
frosty pier
Boat can float away >_> to Chaos preferably
forest marsh
Aside from the death, of course
tender zephyr
What isn't wrong with it is the better question.
forest marsh
Murderboat is one of those areas that the only real advice, as terrible as it is, is to git gud
tender zephyr
Also get lucky with your boons
forest marsh
You can get through it with pretty much any boon loadout as long as you have good control of your dashes and carefully watch the attack animations of the enemies
tender zephyr
Because if you don't have enough damage to take out the voidstones quick enough, you end up just hoping one of the zombies or bombs don't take you out.
glossy slate
I thought the same just a few days ago my man
you can honestly avoid everything by walking in a circle around the boat
tender zephyr
Everytime I try to take it slow and circle around is when a zombie chomps my face off.
glossy slate
and paying close attention to the small bloodless
frosty pier
I just want enemies to stop attacking out of spawn
glossy slate
seriously, do not let those little bastards out of your sight
tender zephyr
Bloodless pirahanas they are.
glossy slate
bombers can be basically ignored, but the bloodless will attack as soon as you walk or dash within range
bait out their attack by walking up and immediately dashing away
this will clear some range for you to deal with the voidstones
once you learn that they'll attack the moment you get close, you can abuse that
tender zephyr
So just bait them out.
Also, I always hear that Shield + Athena is a great combo, but I'm not seeing it. Shield can't spam its attack enough to benefit from the deflection.
Maybe it's because I don't use bullrush as much as I should, but that's because half of the time, I try to defend with the shield, it doesn't registers and leaves me to eat a hit to the face.
glossy slate
blocking melee attacks with shield is tricky, yeah
but bullrush + Athena basically means total damage immunity
tender zephyr
Ok, I think I should stop badmouthing Ares. Lucked out with an Epic Curse attack Boon, and just kept on upgrading it to the point it did about 180 damage per hit. I ended up farther than ever getting to the Hydra's third phase and dying to it. That many heads should not be allowed.
upbeat falcon
Not sure if anyone has run into the problem but the last 2 times I have used world splitter, my game crashes randomly in asphodel. I think both times there were quite a few entities on the screen too.
forest marsh
Ares curse can be great, you just gotta optimize your hit-and-run
tender zephyr
Report that to tech support/f10 in game
forest marsh
Yeah, definitely report with F10 in game if you haven't already
upbeat falcon
Will do. Was just wondering if anyone else had ran into that problem
forest marsh
Can't say I've heard anyone mention that problem
ivory dragon
just hopping in, so sorry (catching up) but yeah boat is probably the most skill reliant encounter in-game atm. With enough skill you can flawless it on any loadout with proper herding of the skeletons and slow walking around them to bait charges and create free space for you to take out the crystals.
also, run-on sentences for the win
rugged finch
I just started a new escape and this is the first time that I'm seeing an actual dash flourish for Artemis's dash boon rather than just a green color replacement for the regular dash animation
ivory dragon
and @forest marsh i love ares on shield, because the knockback with curse damage gives you so much safety and enough damage to clear. wont be winning any timed competitions, but its so safe!
frosty pier
Gods that's A LOT of Darkness
ivory dragon
eventually you run out of things to spend it on 😄
frosty pier
Yes, but if I counted correctly... That's all of my runs worth of darkness just in bank
ivory dragon
I actually wonder how that's going to workout with new updates
Wonder how much I'll care that new unlocks will only be a click away
rain axle
I've been playing since day 1
frosty pier
Hat's off to You good sir
ivory dragon
shows supergiant did something good!
forest marsh
I plan to keep my original save file throughout (if possible), but I want to also start a fresh save at each major update
ivory dragon
thats not a bad idea either. i think im just torn between not wanting handouts but also not wanting to start the pace over
im just being difficult though, im sure ill be happy with whatever haha
rain axle
we'll find out in 9 days
forest marsh
I feel like when they add in more characters and lore stuff, it'll be nicer to experience it in the regular flow instead of after you've already done everything, if that makes sense
ivory dragon
perfect sense 😃
rain axle
this run's buffs were awesome though
forest marsh
They looked pretty insane!
rain axle
It lagged my comp because there was so much damage going on
oh and the dash's blades did not pull them
might only work with cast
forest marsh
I think it's intended to only work with cast? I could be wrong though
frosty pier
It says cast and surge...
forest marsh
Yeah, just checked the wording myself
frosty pier
But we have no surges now
rain axle
it is suppose to work with both
frosty pier
It supposed but broken for now
rain axle
but it could be that the dash creates them too close together where they are both pulling
frosty pier
I think it's just broken after they deleted surges, and boons are not linked together properly. Like I remember that surge boon made it so you could not double-dash. Dead chunk of code haunts us like a ghost of communism?
forest marsh
@worthy vapor Please post feedback as an individual message for each item 
worthy vapor
Ack yeah saw that ty
that's gonna take a long time at 2 minutes per message lol
I guess I can just leave less feedback
forest marsh
It's probably fine if you write it out and just press send after each point? ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Though that doesn't help much after it's already written
cedar musk
i dont think so, bc the bot responds to it
so every msg would have a vote after it instead of the whole piece of feedback
worthy vapor
I have 13 points of feedback over my first 5 hours, I feel like that would be spamming the channel
forest marsh
I don't think it's spam if they're all your own feedback, and aren't duplicating existing feedback
south comet
Maybe try to group them up into points that are similar then or overlap slightly. Also please make sure you look thru the channel to see if the feedback you have was already provided
worthy vapor
I will do this, although I feel like this setup is going to reduce the amount of actionable feedback the team gets.
Maybe that's the intent though given the number of people, would be unusable if there was too much
glossy slate
they clear the feedback channel after each major update, but they do read through it all
worthy vapor
oh yeah, i just mean additional burden (read the entire channel to make sure you don't duplicate) may just turn players off from leaving feedback at all
pastel jolt
the search button is right there
forest marsh
Well, reading it is mostly to see what you do and don't agree on. For your own feedback, it may be easier to search with Ctrl+F
long herald
you should be able to switch keys for darkness because after you unlock everything you kinda just collect them
forest marsh
That only changes the problem to having too much darkness
Eventually you run out of things to spend with darkness as well 😆
worthy vapor
@pastel jolt Totally, I'm just saying if the point is the team wants feedback, asking people to do a bunch of work before leaving feedback hurts that goal
I'm willing to do the work but many will not be
cedar musk
im assuming there arent things to spend darkness/keys on during a run? bc that might help w/ that problem
errant narwhal
searching to see if your feedback has been submitted before is not a bunch of work, imo
forest marsh
Not at present, though I think that's been suggested at least a couple times re: spending keys/darkness mid-run
errant narwhal
the point of this system is not only to get feedback, but to see which feedback is the most common with the voting system
common is not the right word, but you know what i mean i hope
worthy vapor
Yeah makes sense. Alternatively deduplication could be handled by someone (a mod) before being read by the team. But having the users themselves do it also works
forest marsh
The feedback with the most support, perhaps?
glossy slate
I wouldn't mind being able to spend a chunk of darkness at the start of a run for a 1 time boost of some kind
ivory dragon
I'd like to spend darkness on challenge runs akin to gungeon challenge mode with higher rewards than standard runs
Balanced just enough that if you win more than fail you can sustain challenge mode
shower thoughts
forest marsh
I've had similar thoughts in the past
ivory dragon
Whoa that's kind of crazy. Usually I'm off in a corner professing to padded sound proof walls as people cross by my window for entertainment.
grand patrol
what do you mean?
forest marsh
I think they mean that their ideas aren't usually shared by others, and possibly could be mistaken for the ramblings of a madman
forest marsh
@worthy vapor RE: Sisyphus healing option, if you mouseover or select with cursor on controller, a dialog pops up with your current HP
ivory dragon
I doubt they see why kids love the taste of cinnamon toast crunch tbh
worthy vapor
ohhh I didnt know that
the fact that I didnt realize that is noteworthy though, i think
grand patrol
eye aesthetic is good but i wont get too off tangent here
yeah it does! FUN FACT IT DOESNT UPDATE IN SANDWICH BUG MODE
if you eat one and he gives you a second secret sandwich it keeps the original health count
forest marsh
I've never experienced the bug with Sisy, how do you even?
loud reef
i never pick the heal because i never need it that much where $ and souls gets more value then 17 hp
grand patrol
you gotta kam click ™
seriously its apparently very hard to get and ive just gotten continuously lucky
forest marsh
Or maybe it's only with the heal option, I guess? I never pick heal with Sisy, so that could be it
grand patrol
no its with coin as well. ive never tried darkness at all so idk that one
you can get sandwich+coin
but generally i spam heal
pastel jolt
fun fact i tried to replicate it using an autoclicker and it didn't work so the kam click™ really MUST be special
grand patrol
:3 morgan was able to get it if you click right after gifting but ive done it w/o gifting so 🤷
omg. an autoclicker couldnt do it
ivory dragon
Could probably rig something up in autohotkey to click in multiple places at the same time, unless you've done that.
Of course my discord is slow again so it just popped up that you tried autoclicker rip
cedar musk
also the feedback abt the skeleton miniboss is interesting, ive never rly had a problem w/ the size of their bombs? granted i kinda play like a huge coward and stay rly far away from everything and throw my spear but still
pastel jolt
my issue with them is that there's absolutely no range indicator on them
forest marsh
It's entirely possible to deal with them with only a single (or no) dash, you just have to be in tune with their animations
pastel jolt
unlike, say, the lava spouts in asphodel, or the bombs the pests lay
worthy vapor
i just noticed that i died to them frequently right up until i got second dash, then i never got hit again
cedar musk
yeah range indicators are always nice
pastel jolt
if the slamdancers had them too then it would be so much easier to judge where i need to be to be safe
forest marsh
Every boss (and mini-boss) represents a spike in difficulty, though
pastel jolt
which is important when panic-dashing to the other end of the room is just a waste of your time
worthy vapor
do people like the 4th wall stuff, or am I just missing something with the narrative
forest marsh
I like it, personally
cedar musk
i didnt rly mind it
i just like hearing everything zag says fksdfds his voice is so nice
when r we getting a podcast of him reading me mythology and bedtime stories so i can sleep
forest marsh
Keep in mind that the 👍 and 👎 don't mean your feedback is more or less valid, as it's still your experience. It's just whether others agree or not
ivory dragon
You can walk out of bombs once you know what to expect. Eventually you will know exactly what every enemy will do before they have a chance to do it
forest marsh
The narrator interaction is kind of a hallmark of Supergiant's games, I think
pastel jolt
and also that the bot automatically puts one of each on your feedback to allow others to vote, so it's not jsut one really determined but indecisive person ;P
ivory dragon
You will be able to literally call out "x attack in 1 sec"
grand patrol
i would die for narrators and doubledie for logan cunningham narrators
cedar musk
who voices zagreus? is it logan cunningham again?
grand patrol
darren korb!
cedar musk
oh wow!!! darren korb rly snapped on this game
forest marsh
Yeah, Darren does 
and "other voices" or some such
manic goblet
it's kind of funny like that, that the VA's are having conversations with themselves :D
ivory dragon
Some voice actors are quite compelling in just how many characters they can fill. It's always a "no way really?" moment when you find out
cedar musk
oh yeah 100%
austere pebble
darren is a master of all trades
cedar musk
i never wouldve guessed skelly and zag had the same voice actor, let alone that they were darren fkjlsdfsd
pastel jolt
see also: logan voicing hades, the narrator, achilles, and poseidon
forest marsh
There's a list of all the VA credits (so far) in the pinned messages in #h1-story-discussion if you want to look
I'm sure they exist elsewhere too
cedar musk
oh nice, thank u!
manic goblet
"Charon"
aka *Horrrrrh"
I actually really like that they chose to pick Logan for both the Storyteller and Lord Hades
and that Zag reacts to it
pastel jolt
shut up old man i'm trying to be sneaky >:c
cedar musk
dskjfdsklfdsl that line was so cute
manic goblet
100% agree xD
true dock
Don't know if this is really gameplay related conversation, but I find the 4th wall breaking kind of weird.
pastel jolt
personally i love it
true dock
And I did justify the fact that Zag comes to the realization who his mother is thanks to a narrator slip up as some kind of abstraction of him just figuring it out himself
but it's, uh, strange
Part of it may be that I don't really know who the narrator is supposed to be
worthy vapor
that point where the narrator tells him who his mom is was when I was very confused and taken out of it
true dock
I'm fine if it ends up being more of an addressed point, but yeah, exactly @worthy vapor . It was really distracting and weird
Like he finds out because of a disembodied narrator in a flashback
So my brain got twisted in a pretzel trying to rationalize how a character's motivation in the present day was influenced by a narrator accidentally letting something slip in a flashback
that happened after the character had already been doing things motivated by that slip
like a grandfather paradox for motivation
grand patrol
ok ok i LOVE the idea that theres a mysteryvoice followinh zag around and others may be able to hear him, but we arent sure! zag is worried he'll wake ppl up, but what if he just assumd!
pastel jolt
i mean, the flashback is a memory
true dock
But the memory is being narrated as though it's being told in the present day by the narrator with all the past tense on everything
worthy vapor
its a memory narrated as though it was a flashback that the character in the memory replies to as though it was a narration in real tim though
exactly
true dock
It's as if the narrator is saying, "This is a memory where Zag did this thing in the past. In the past, he snuck out, creeped over there, and discovered this thing"
"Wait, thing!?" Zag cries
"Uhh, yeah, sorry. My mistake. I shouldn't have revealed that."
"I can't believe thing is real..." Zag muses
grand patrol
yes. and its perfect!
true dock
So it's a cheeky thing in the same vein as something like A Bard's Tale, but it may undercut any serious dramatic tension
since the game's tone is pretty silly in general, especially for a SGG game
pastel jolt
he..... in the flashback the narrator is speaking in present tense
true dock
Do you have a video? I'm at work, so I can't really check in-game
pastel jolt
no, but i have the actual lines right here in front of me
glossy slate
the Narrator might be Chronos, which would explain the apparent omniscience
errant narwhal
i feel like transistor is the only game that isnt somewhat silly or lighthearted in tone
and even then it doesnt just bury you in a pile of sad, it has its light moments
glossy slate
who is currently in Elysium, at least in "canon"
grand patrol
i think hades has to be a funny game bc life is funny tbqh
the emotion hits harder when it feels like real life and real life means laughing when you can
pastel jolt
sorry to still be hung up on this but the memory is being narrated as though it's being told in the present day by the narrator with all the past tense on everything it literally is not
cedar musk
i dont think pyre was super lighthearted?
i also havent played it in like. a year but
worthy vapor
It's odd that bustynuts and I had the same misconception
I believe you though since you have the lines in front of you
errant narwhal
pyre had like, a grim situation but it never felt grim and hopeless, because you were surrounded by friends and everything is very colorful and bright
true dock
Could you paste the lines?
Because I do think it's weird that I and crowtaro had the same misconception.
pastel jolt
It is the dead of night, or the approximation of it in the realm of Hades. Prince of the Underworld Zagreus rises from a fitful slumber, with much mischief on his mind.
true dock
Point conceded then.
pastel jolt
He ventures toward the stately throne of his Lord Father...
i'm not posting the entire flashback, but. they're all in present tense
true dock
Still hope it doesn't undercut any serious tension later on because it's a very jokey thing when you break the 4th wall that much, so I don't like it
but I'll concede that it's not a brainteaser anymore for the narrative
I feel like Pyre was pretty miserable most of the time
since everyone constantly buried themselves in some kind of guilt or shame for being exiled and whined about how horrible the Downside was (despite it just being a gorgeous landscape with fun people)
Actually, my biggest issue with the game's story is that all the characters act like they're constantly miserable, except for the knight and the snake lady, but it never feels miserable because everything is bright and colorful and jaunty
Because I heard that there were Oregon Trail-style resource and time management systems cut from the game
pastel jolt
awesome but this is a hades channel
true dock
Right right right, we were talking about the tone of the game in general, so it was a brief digression
So to dovetail back, because Hades is pretty lighthearted and comedic about everyone being an immortal and Zag dies constantly, I hope it doesn't move towards some super serious dramatic bits, but still have the same narrator that Zag constantly picks on
cedar musk
i hope it doesnt try to be dramatic bc i cant take anyone with a british accent seriously
tender zephyr
YES! I finally managed to beat that freaking Hyrdra!
forest marsh
Congrats!
tender zephyr
Granted I managed to get maximum cheese build but still
cedar musk
grats!!
forest marsh
Hey, sometimes you gotta get a win no matter what
cedar musk
what build did u have?
tender zephyr
Triple shot bow with level 6 Athena and Hunter's Dash with Crit boost
And 29% damage reduction from Athena and Aphrodite
forest marsh
Bow is EZ Mode
tender zephyr
It's the strongest weapon
forest marsh
That sounds like a mean build Arcadian!
tender zephyr
Honestly, I'm just glad I salvaged it.
I forgot to switch out my Keepsake from Skully's to Artemis
tender zephyr
So throughout Tartarus I didn't have any of Artemis' Blessings
But Athena went Yandere for me and kept. On. Showing. Up.
I even went to Charon's shop, but there she was waiting for me.
I had to grab Artemis' Keepsake to guarantee getting Hunter's Dash instead of Skull Earrings for extra damage
But it was worth it in the end
Also, that build is absurdly powerful.
manic goblet
Skull Earrings are so crazy
tender zephyr
Skull Earrings = Red Eye Tearstone Ring
manic goblet
Honestly one of the top Keepsake's
tender zephyr
Reminds me of one shotting bosses in Dark Souls
glossy slate
I'm almost certain the earring buff is multiplicative, the damage amp is insane
tender zephyr
On the topic of Keepsakes, how crazy do you think the final ones are going to be?
They should give out one once their Bond is completely maxed.
forest marsh
I think maybe crazy isn't the right word, but I suspect they'll be a lot more niche than the current batch
tender zephyr
more niche than Sisyphus
you wot?
brisk cove
it looks like we technically have half of them
maybe the second half is for when we max
tender zephyr
I think they might directly upgrade them
cedar musk
i honestly kinda hope the spike collar doesnt make it into the final game bc it seems. rly op
tender zephyr
eh?
glossy slate
nah
tender zephyr
It's just 25 extra hp
forest marsh
I think Spike Collar is a great starter keepsake to help you learn the game
glossy slate
it's a crutch for new players and it fills that role nicely
tawdry sleet
Is it just me or does the boon you pick up in the very first little room never give an attack buff?
brisk cove
theres also already fanart of zag with the collar on lmao cant take it out now
tender zephyr
Just you.
pastel jolt
you're just unlucky, i've gotten attack boons out of it before
tender zephyr
That's just you getting unlucky
forest marsh
You can get anything except Obol in the first room (since 
was patched out of it)
And no Darkness either, I think?
tawdry sleet
If I give up and restart, will it reset the seed or am I always stuck with this?
tender zephyr
Wait, if Zag's wearing the collar, then is he the dog and Cerberus the master?
tawdry sleet
I've had special / special / cast 3 times now
tender zephyr
It'll reset
manic goblet
3 times isn't a big sample size
glossy slate
it's bad luck, sure
tender zephyr
I just reset after not getting Hunter's Dash and ended up with an hammer and Triple Shot
forest marsh
If you use Give Up you keep the seed
glossy slate
but there's only 4 or 5 possible buffs you can get from the first boon
manic goblet
Triple Shot, more like ez mode
forest marsh
You have to die to reset the seed or else finish
manic goblet
seriously, you roflstomp everything with triple shot xd
tender zephyr
Instead of just running away, you can actually fight back.
manic goblet
what do people think of the "survive x seconds" rooms btw?
tender zephyr
Bad
forest marsh
They need work, Serchiot
There's feedback about it, if you haven't already looked for it
manic goblet
they were fun and surprising, the first time but afterwards it's just "sigh, another minute of running away"
didn't look at it yet too much, no
brisk cove
its like i know theyre coming but im not ready
tender zephyr
The experience also varies depending on what room they're in.
Large room: boring
Small room: hell
pallid laurel
I think the survive x seconds needs a reward of some kind based off the number you kill
manic goblet
oh god, they're terrible in small rooms 
tender zephyr
All rooms: annoying
manic goblet
alright, so there's feedback about it and people agree with my experience
that's what I wanted to know, thanks everyone :D
brisk cove
i mostly play spear (i dont know how or why) and the survival rooms are like a hack and slash
glossy slate
Armored Skullomats are the bane of my existence
forest marsh
Or maybe you're talking about Bloodless ¯_(ツ)_/¯
tender zephyr
The skull stacks that spawn all the other skulls
forest marsh
Ah, ok. Skullomats 👍
manic goblet
that name... xD
glossy slate
if it was a bit more apparent when a numbskull actually spawns from one of those things it would be better but