h1-builds-and-combat

[plain river]

no

It’s not strike +% and not using your special as passive turrets

There’s a difference

[jaunty jackal]

wait you can use them as passive turrets?

aint they just bomb who await explosion?

[plain river]

what did I just say about how you use them

You don’t

They pulse out waves over time and explode when they take any damag

and otherwise wait until they expire to explode

The optimal way to use the bombs is to ignore the passive pulsing and just explode them asap

so you have to damage your own bombs, typically aided by a damaging dash (like tidal dash) and chain lightning from zeus strike for that

and you really do want the special +% here

This is also peak effectiveness at the highest level of lucifer since it’s the explosion damage that scales with level

If you find triple bomb (and since lucifer has so few hammers, you’re likely to find it) you’re kinda set

Does that make sense?

I don’t have a clip for this

Hmm

[jaunty jackal]

yes Ig

by level you mean the level of damage?

[plain river]

I mean the literally level of the aspect

[jaunty jackal]

well something sure I hate this aspect Im going back to my good old fist

[jaunty jackal]

ah

[plain river]

It’s a difference of double the explosion damage and given the explosions are a pretty big part of your dps

It’s a bit important

[jaunty jackal]

so if I understood correctly the most powerful way to use lucifer is to first lvl it up?

[plain river]

well

The most powerful way to use lucifer

Double’s it effectiveness

At max level

Compared to level 0

You can use the strat at any level

It’s just that doubling your base damage is doubling your base damage

So it can seem a little underwhelming at first level

Not that you can’t just use zeus strike and rock out anyways

you want a +% goddess on special, and while I’d typically recommend aphrodite so you can do some smouldering air shenanigans, any +% goddess should be effective

[jaunty jackal]

if one day I decide to touch it again I might as well try this strat Ig

[plain river]

👍

Just pulled a clip from the current Luci WR

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/795659377755422742/1262945805124501524/RPReplay_Final1721180094.MOV?ex=66987170&is=66971ff0&hm=2e0c09ea37c20f2b1bcedc6ba3e67bcc8a467ce0689423b2c194736f884b131c&

This is kinda what Imm getting at

“Modded game” in the top right indicates its the speedrun modpack, used to deal with rng so runners are just relying on skill rather than who has the time to grind out runs

[trim canopy]

i'm following this ME demeter fists guide and it doesn't say anything (that i can find) about poming anything other than ares boons. is it safe to say that they don't recommend pomming any others? https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CPvQPqeeFE--dGgK62iVHx6Gwy7c8trb75RkEd9uK0I/edit#heading=h.dxx7obprcrrf

[jolly chasm]

Yes

[worn solar]

Your damage is like almost purely from doom so yeah

[tight basin]

yeah there's no reason to pom anything else besides doom and impending doom'

maybe if your doom is only giving like +5 or something at that point then maybe you can consider a pom or 2 in the special on demeter

but like otherwise you're not getting more damage anywhere else

i guess technically speaking at some point ddash poms will do more damage than doom poms

but that doesnt happen often lmao

[lucid oar]

If you end up with Zeus call it could be worth chucking a pom on it

[dense spear]

Do attack boons include benefits to your dash attack too? If you take Artemis dash attack boon and an attack boon, do they add together damage bonuses?

[analog mauve]

yes

[dense spear]

Ohh neat

[trim canopy]

good morning i love you.

Is it correct that if you are not offered Flurry Jab on first hammer, it will not be offered on subsequent hammers?

[analog mauve]

it can

[trim canopy]

Huh. This Achilles Spear guide says "RESET" if you take a hammer and it isn't Flurry Jab. Oh crap duh I need to keep reminding myself that these are speedrun guides lol. I'm just using them as build guides. I'm only on attempt 90. Still building the story! 🙂

[trim canopy]

How is your run saved even if you give up? If you give up, say 12 chambers in, without dying, and then restart, will all rooms be same up to the point you quit? Will all rewards? Right when I thought my theory was correct, rewards for one of the set hammers changed....but only after giving up for a third time....

[proper furnace]

Give up does keep the same seed

But if you want the same 12 results of your example, you need to play exactly the same

A bunch of stuff can change the seed

Voice lines, destroying urns, pillars, etc

[trim canopy]

And "seed" is the.....how do I say.....the..."offering"? Or door boon...or.....whatever

[timber heath]

i couldnt beat em4 hades with rama bow no matter what even with 500 hp, 3 death defiances and skelly's lucky tooth, I tried beowulf shield beat him first try lol

the shield is really too op

[trim canopy]

i feel like buff on shield hasnt popped for me in at least 10 runs. very odd.

some stuff really doesn't seem random at times.

[plain river]

“Seed” is the run’s rng counter

so if you start from the same rng, and play exactly the same, it should be pretty similiar, up to a point

It’s kind of incredibly hard to play for an extended period without deviating from a previous run but it shouldn’t be too hard to make the first few chambers the same

[lean mango]

so if you're early early in a run and want to grab a bad fated choice, you can just restart

is fish in first room maintained by the seed? could you just fish that spot infinitely by restarting?

[mint jewel]

good builds for lucifer?

[proper furnace]

Zeus attack + jolted, good % special (arty or aphro) and tidal dash

Pom jolted and dash, best hammer is triple bomb

[analog mauve]

I think if you give up any progress you made in that run would not count

So yes you can infinitely fish the same spot

But when you hit give up you lose it

[sterile whale]

how does impending doom work with dire misfortunes? does the +0.5s happen every time you apply a stack of doom? or just the initial stack

[tiny ledge]

Good build aspect of Achilles cast build?

[proper furnace]

Just initial

[sterile whale]

i did one with blade rifts, ares art duo, and ares legendary and it was really good. i did it on pos sword tho but i’m sure it’s the same if you just special to get cast damage

[vital night]

Hunting blades is probably the best yeah

Lightning phalanx and ice wine are also good

[tiny ledge]

What about mirage shot?

[vital night]

It’s good

Usually Achilles starts tidal dash and looks for Artemis attack

[tiny ledge]

And what are other option if didn't get flurry job

[vital night]

It’s…fine

Flurry is really fun

And obv optimal for speedrunning

Shouldn’t matter a whole lot either a cast build ig

[tiny ledge]

Yea it's fun but i ain't gonna get everytime

[vital night]

Yeah

[tiny ledge]

Other option?

I picked vicious skewers

[worn solar]

The other options exist thats it

[vital night]

Vicious is probably one of the most useless since you don’t want to be recalling your special

[tiny ledge]

So extending spear?

[vital night]

Yeah that’s ones fine

[tiny ledge]

I got posiden strike heroic should i replace Artemis attk epic?

[worn solar]

No

[vital night]

Tidal dash still best offer from Poseidon

[barren ledge]

For Achilles do you use Infernal or Stygian

[vital night]

Infernal except for trippy/ice wine

[barren ledge]

Interesting, what’s different about trippy shot

[tight basin]

That cast stays on the ground for 5 seconds

So you'd rather regen after 3

[barren ledge]

Compared to blades or crystal

Ah

[tight basin]

Crystal you'd take stygian soul too actually

Blades is 4 seconds so it's like fine

It's also actually doing good damage those whole 4 seconds compared to the other two

[vital night]

Yeah

[tiny ledge]

Whose special should i go?

[vital night]

And the damage is really good in tart with 3 vs 1

Doesn’t really matter

Whatever opens the duos you want

[tiny ledge]

I opened mirage shot boon

[vital night]

Poseidon you might want to stay away from bc it’ll knock enemies away

[tight basin]

Also would like to note that on Achilles, infernal for ice wine is still fine if you have tidal dash start

Bc you'd at least have other things you can do for DPS

[vital night]

Most consistent way to play Achilles is tidal dash start and just get whatever cast shows up

[tight basin]

Speedruns start with tdash and just branch to whatever cast build is convenient, and infernal for the burst is generally more useful

But if you're doing it for fun, stygian with more casts can be funny for ice wine or meme beam

[tight basin]

Ngl that's not consistent that's just strongest lmao

[vital night]

I mean more consistent in damage throughout the run

[tight basin]

Yeah

[vital night]

As compared to a cast start atleast

[tight basin]

Problem is that Poseidon doesn't have any good cast builds so you need 2 other gods

Which granted is like any other god lmao

[vital night]

Yeah

[tight basin]

But also game can rng you so that could suck

[vital night]

It’s not terrible just playing for fun tbf

Bossing just won’t be as good

[tight basin]

We don't talk about Achilles bossing unless it's furies and you have phalanx shot lmao

Or lighting phalanx on heroes with big juice

[vital night]

True

But hunting blades kinda fixes all bossing imo

Just land it on top and the boss melts

Bonus with RD

[tiny ledge]

Btw what is use of ambrosia?

Is it for trade ?

[vital night]

It’s like super nectar you can gift to people to complete/progress relationships

[tiny ledge]

After i maxed gift then i can gift them?

[vital night]

I think so

[proper furnace]

You max nectar till the heart reaches a lock > do a favor for them (side quest) > lock opens and ambrosia can be gifted

[potent tree]

Ambrosia is also used to upgrade a certain type of equipment called Companions

🧸

[lean mango]

i thought you kept meta stuff when you died in a run?

[proper furnace]

When you die yes

Give up is an option in the pause menu

[lean mango]

oh, so giving up keeps the seed, dying keeps your stuff but gets a new seed

[proper furnace]

Yeah

[lean mango]

so you could exploit give up to get multiple tries at a rare fish, but not to farm lots of fish

[analog mauve]

pretty much

[vital night]

But you wouldn’t be guaranteed a fish the next run

[plain river]

You can exploit rng manipulation

for that instead

way easier and quicker

[viscid dagger]

What's typically the go to cast for hidden shield?

[potent tree]

Flood Shot 🌊with the goal of getting Mirror Shot 🪞

[vital night]

Passion flare doesn’t need mirage shot and trippy flare is bigger number

Alternatives^

[trim canopy]

if i have choice between charon shop and a god room and pick shop, is same god room guaranteed somewhere after?

[proper furnace]

Nope

[vital night]

Unless you have keepsake for that god and it’s the first time you’re seeing the god right?

[clever mason]

Does mirage shot work for trippy? And is it broken like flood?

[vital night]

Yes and yes

[plain river]

Yep

[trim canopy]

if i'm concerned about survivability going into styx (1 death defiance left and 44/155 health) -- would y'all recommend tooth or acorn? i'm really not used to this eris rail build and all the coordination it takes hah. only on my 95th attempt, haven't finished the story or unlocked a single companion, so i'm probably worry more than i should.

[proper furnace]

How good you are at styx

Also how much money/do you have athena

[trim canopy]

i have some grasp on the timing of "i need to launch my bomb, then dash into it and shoot!" and that's about the limit of my strat comprehension at this point lol. haven't started to absorb when i should be dashing INTO enemies w/ tidal dash w/ this build, just kind of blindly following the guides.

i have ~450 obols, zeus/posedion/artemis/demeter (took halting strike) (w/ zeus call)

how good? pfff, uhhh, well....i still pretty much button-mash panic. i hide when he disappears, and sometimes i can avoid his laser blast attacks.

i've had...4 clears i think.

noobsauce

[vital night]

generally acorn since dad usually hits for more than 20 damage

[trim canopy]

oof. took tooth....we shall see.

don't have a good feeling lol. only on 2 heat 🤷 if he dies, he dies.

here goes. leeeeroy jeeeennnkkinnnnnn

got rolled. panicked, don't know when i should've been using my calls, seemed like none of my bombs were targeting onto hades. i forgot all my training. fffuuu

i swear it's like the aim-assist turned off or reset to target anything but hades. i took seeking fire, but that shouldn't affect aim?

probably just need to get more familiar w/ how the auto-aim works and experiment w/ dead-zone settings.

[proper furnace]

Is this kbm or controller

[lean mango]

is smoldering air considered really really good?

[proper furnace]

Yeah

[plain river]

If you are using it with good calls

then yes

It’s excellent

If you have like ares aid then you’re kinda coping

[lean mango]

i had it with dio and it was basically always on

[plain river]

tbh ares and artemis aid isare probably the only bad aids for smair

dio and zeus are the highest dps aids and dio charges itself back up with the hangover ticks so you practically have full uptime

[proper furnace]

Dio wants smair less cuz hangover itself already charges it a bunch but still nice

[clever mason]

Focus on dodging hades. The best advice I got regarding fighting hades is that the fight is a marathon not a sprint.

I take the time to fight and kill all the skulls and summons. I didn’t at first and it would bite me in the buttocks eventually.

[plain river]

Fair enough but with smair you have pretty much 100% uptime on the hangover, and can benefit from the low tolerance that aphrodite opens as a side effect of opening smair

[lean mango]

i was thinking if i had smair on pos I would be invulnberable most of the time

[plain river]

Yeah but you’re also losing your main dps for most of the time

[lean mango]

not if my main dps is blitz disc

[proper furnace]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/896859166453428264/2021101017375900-C7D8C4153CC9802713604F54C53304E0.jpg it can be funny

[plain river]

Where’s hellfire bot when you want to see pos aid ps

oh wait cpecific has leveling as well

[trim canopy]

@clever mason thanks for the advice. i'll try that next time. i do get in a hurry because i'm afraid he's going to keep evolving stronger and we all know what happens when you get into a hurry -- you panic and make mistakes.

[proper furnace]

Also for calls pretty much always use them the moment you get a bar filled

Or use them for iframes (all calls give some iframes on activation)

[lean mango]

yeah i did a hades fight with gloves and had pos call, i was mostly using it to stay in melee with him constantly and proc it when he is about to use his big swing

[proper furnace]

I don't mean the invulnerability calls

Any call, like zeus or dio will give you iframes when you activate them

[lean mango]

oh, other calls give iframes? nice

[dense spear]

I'd also advise turning the music off if you feel panicked, the music makes it much more hype and intense sometimes. can turn it back on when you get better. also roll for Hermes extra dashes boon, really helps

[trim canopy]

Aside from optimizing my build and clearing w/ next heat level each run -- I should probably have another goal in mind, like start knocking out stuff on The Fated List.

[proper furnace]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1229078264811618305/1251747791982821466/CallIframe.mp4?ex=666fb479&is=666e62f9&hm=4513451b890bc6e15f9f40dfd2cac1b49085fea5c739f994e53fc1aa6ed492f8&

[trim canopy]

@dense spear lol yep also super good info, i need to do that, especially because at the moment i'm running w/ just the crappy TV speakers so it blasts up the music during fights and ramps up the anxiety level. no audio normalization.

@proper furnace more good info. i always save the calls up for boss fights for some reason. and TBH; i can never remember what button to push to use them so i literally just panic and push everything.

[lean mango]

I'd also advise turning the music off
ban plz /s

[trim canopy]

maybe turn screen-shake off lol

[proper furnace]

Calls are so much better once you realize using them as minor calls is a lot better

You remember what button you use too

[lean mango]

yeah i think i've started getting stressed when my call fills up to 4 bars because if the 5th fills it loses utility

[proper furnace]

calls have 4 bars

[lean mango]

oh right

[proper furnace]

Only arty's has 5

[lean mango]

sorry i had artimes last run

but replace with 3 and same point

[trim canopy]

Let's see, what weapon is up next run. Shield! Only have Zeus aspect unlocked. Sitting on 9 Titan Blood so maybe I should expand my horizons and try Chaos or something.

[lean mango]

i sometimes save up to full against theseus though, ot use right when he starts his phase 2

(non em)

[proper furnace]

I would save for theseus but I just want the bull dead anyways

[lean mango]

of the enemies i've faced i think theseus has the biggest difficulty drop once you learn his patterns

even more than hades

haven't face em for either yet

[proper furnace]

Theseus is a nuisance at most

[trim canopy]

What's y'alls fave shield aspect?

[proper furnace]

Beo/zeus

I like zag shield but only with the speedrunning modpack

[lean mango]

zeus is super fun
put zeus boon on special and it's a ton of fun

hades is the best beyblade videogame

[vital night]

zeus by far

[tiny ledge]

Ahh I can't beat hades

[rich storm]

Are some weapons objectively better than others or is it just personal preference?

[tiny ledge]

Should i go Aphro or Zeus attk?

In eris build

[tiny ledge]

Personal pref

[proper furnace]

For most content just do what you want

[potent tree]

Yes. Nemesis, Achilles + Guan Yu, Zeus + Beowulf, Demeter, every bow other than Chiron, and Eris + Hestia (maybe also Lucifer) are better than their siblings

[proper furnace]

Zeus

Your 10 dmg pellets don't want a % boon

[rich storm]

Content meaning what?

[tiny ledge]

Abut special ares or other?

[proper furnace]

Casual runs or mid heat

[proper furnace]

For special you do want a % boon lol

[rich storm]

Okay, thanks

[proper furnace]

Ideally arty/aphro but others with rarity also work

[tiny ledge]

Wait aphro special do % dmg

[proper furnace]

Yeah

Highest % in fact

[tiny ledge]

Dash drunk god and cast ?

And call

[proper furnace]

Take his call

[tiny ledge]

Dash and cast?

[vital night]

Not dash

Cast is good

[proper furnace]

His dash is bad

Cast is ok but if call is there just take that

[tiny ledge]

Then whose dash?

[proper furnace]

Poseidon's

[tiny ledge]

Any other synergy boon?

Like duo

[proper furnace]

Not really

You want static discharge

[vital night]

Ice wine and scintillating feast

[proper furnace]

And focus poms on that and dash

[analog mauve]

i always turn music off

its been off for months

[proper furnace]

That's why you don't see jolted clearly

[analog mauve]

😭

[trim canopy]

uhhhh i just accidentally gave a nectar to bouldy.....why is that a thing you can do....

[analog mauve]

it isnt, its actually a bug

[worn solar]

Are we trolling rn

[analog mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/foekoe-foekoe-gaming-the-greenscreen-room-cats-kitty-gif-21035271

[worn solar]

Bouldy gives you super awesome op boons frfr https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1164101586138710037/1263281655150546956/Screenshot_20240717_164951_Discord.jpg?ex=6699aa39&is=669858b9&hm=d8b746af0a417ef498c012cc218a9c5d9e9f9ae4b264a36ae715f6da526ab7c6&

[potent tree]

The reason is sorta ambiguous

[plain river]

…because end game players have infinite gifts and bouldy is uber rad and deserves them all

He also gives you a buff for doing it

[vital night]

The eris route 10% move speed in question

[pallid trellis]

I know Demeter is bad, but what about Cold Fusion? Jolted is OP, so is it worth it to go for that Duo?

[tight basin]

Depends on your source of jolted

[pallid trellis]

he WHAT?!

[tight basin]

Most Zeus/jolted builds apply it so often that it's pretty useless

[jolly chasm]

Usually it's not worth

[pallid trellis]

wait what's the Bouldy buff??

[tight basin]

But if you have cold fusion but your only source is like heavens vengeance or electric shot then it's pretty decent

Has a niche use case but more often than not it's not useful

[blazing briar]

So far my favorite weapon is the spear I think I’m going to use it for most of my runs

[plain river]

He gives you Heart of Stone, a boon with variable impact

It can give you 1-10% move speed, damage reduction, attack damage, special damage, cast damage, obols, or 2% ambiguity

Movespeed is typically the most useful one

[worn solar]

Ambiguity buff pretty good

[tiny ledge]

im keep losing to hades

which build should i use to beat hades first time

[plain river]

Any build that works well normally on your aspect of choice should do well for your first win

so

what aspects do you like using?

[worn solar]

I mean they prob dont have a lot of blood

[plain river]

Either way

Weapon at least matters

[worn solar]

Ye

use rail

[tiny ledge]

using but he bull and shield guy beating me if im able to win i alrdy lose my 1-2 life and then hades beat me

[worn solar]

Using lightning strike and static discharge?

[tiny ledge]

i picked zeus attk but didt get again zeus boon

[worn solar]

Yeah thats pretty unlucky, static discharge is like half to most of your damage

[potent tree]

Had I never joined this Discord, I mightn't've appreciated Static Discharge as much as I now do

[clever mason]

For your keepsake on elysium choose acorn, and level it up to max. That should give you 10 free hits from thesus/ the mino and hades.

I like to focus down the bull first , just hide/dodge away when the pink target is on you.
When fighting thesus, don’t bother attacking his shield, just wait until he attacks then counter attack after when he is open. I.e. spear throw always gives you a chance to hit him in the back after he throws it.

[viscid dagger]

Ruthless reflex increases the damage you deal with dashes right?

[clever mason]

+50% damage & dodge chance for 2 Sec if you dodge the hit

[viscid dagger]

Yeah I know but I mean if it increases the damage that dash boons deal when you succesfully dodge

[plain river]

It increases all your damage sources

Aside from traps, maim, and companions

It’s like rush delivery or family favourites

[viscid dagger]

Ah I see, nice, so say if you wanted to do something silly, such as a tidal dash build with Gilgamesh aspect, would ruthless be worth it?

[plain river]

Yes

Gilgamesh is one of the very very few cases where ruthless reflex is a viable option

The other cases are even more niche

[viscid dagger]

Alright I'm gonna try out and see what happens

[viscid dagger]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/564704477219651587/1263401064917368832/1145360_1419.jpg?ex=669a196e&is=6698c7ee&hm=802336ada19fbba93c6d4205bcdb309bb83e794ec61bb20b1fd67d46c83ca6b7&=&format=webp&width=1202&height=676 Something did happen

[trim canopy]

buying the lyre from contractor eventually leads to rewards like nectar/ambrosia?

[minor hare]

Not really
At least I don't think so

[trim canopy]

if you DON'T PICK a boon and give it, will it reset next run at that point? i mean the options that are presented. i'm still trying to figure out what resets and what doesn't when you give up

[dense spear]

I think it depends on how deep into the run you were. The further into the seed the more discrepancy occurs

[plain river]

As long as you do everything the same up to that point, you should have the option to take it

Although sometimes pot breaks and pillar breaks are out of your hands

So rng will be shifted off

[trim canopy]

@plain river Is there a caveat with Chaos boons? I went up to point where boon was offered, didn't take one, gave up, went back, everything same except different Chaos boons offered

....I think

[worn solar]

Doing like anything can change the seed unless its like room 1 chaos its unlikely for you to not progress the rng in any way

You probably just kept the seed the same until the pre chaos room fight

[unkempt scroll]

I don't like that setup. I think I used like, 6 DDs, or something 😅

[trim canopy]

Is it ever worth it to give Bouldy nectar? I just accidentally did it for a second time and can't quite put my finger on what it does. (Using my Google Fu now). Someone in the chat earlier told me, I believe mistakenly, that the ability to give Bouldy nectar was a bug and it does nothing.

[proper furnace]

The bug was a joke

[trim canopy]

:_)

[proper furnace]

It gives you a 1%-10% buff to a random stat like atk/speed/coins/etc

Check your current boons for heart of stone

[trim canopy]

oh duh

now i see the boon

[proper furnace]

Or 2% ambiguity

Is basically a nectar dump once you can't do anything else with it

[trim canopy]

i started elysium w/ athena keepsake. first two room rewards; dio and gold room. i'm confused. why no athena?

[minor hare]

uh, that is weird, but I think it happens every now and again

even tho you start a biome with the keepsake of a god, sometimes they're too stubborn to still appear first, even tho that's not what the keepsake sells

(Hermes of course bypasses all this, he doesn't count, but he wasn't the one you saw, so that is weird)

[proper furnace]

Did you swap into athena's keepsake for elysium? Or did you have it from aspho

[trim canopy]

during boss fights my heart rate goes up to the point that my smart watch detects that i'm in a workout. i wonder if that's good or no.

[vital night]

It’s technically optimal to gift bouldy before talking to Sisyphus btw

Bc bouldy can give gold bonus

[viscid dagger]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/564704477219651587/1263895823536750653/20240719132817_1.jpg?ex=669be636&is=669a94b6&hm=515e4b02be958c69356616fcf1dbefd81097a93423612a796f48203535fa3c7b&=&format=webp&width=1202&height=676 This build is extremely funny you just throw your shield and slap enemies repeteadly with attack for constant doom procs

[proper furnace]

ME moment

[vital night]

That is the ME

[viscid dagger]

It is the what

Oh merciful end nevermind

[lean mango]

for the bow/shield that load casts into an attack
does it just apply the cast separately to the target?
i.e. if you have +100% attack damage, that will just apply to the 'attack' portion of the attack, and the 3 casts are simply using whatever buff syou have to casts?

[jolly chasm]

Yes, cast buffs only affect casts and attack buffs only affect attack

[lean mango]

so the shield isn't combining them, it's just storing cast and applying it to whoever the attack taps

[jolly chasm]

Whenever the bull rush ends, but ye

[lunar lynx]

Hey for the chaos shield

What’s the best boons

And what a good keepsake for asphodel?

[lean mango]

a high damage cast boon, like pos or aph
and the pos/art dual boon (mirage shot) makes it absolutely busted

[vital night]

That’s Beowulf

[plain river]

When u say chaos shield

Do you just mean the regular shield, or the chaos aspect of the shield

It doesn’t really matter either way because the chaos aspect of the shield may as well be the base shield

[analog mauve]

Did you have it on in aspho

[lunar lynx]

Chaos aspect with multi shield throw

[tight basin]

You're better off ignoring the special and building the attack

[lunar lynx]

I agree

I kind of regret investing in the chaos shield

It kind of sucks

Even if I go up to an enemy and press special the multi shield doesn’t stack a lot of damage

I wish it got buffed

[tight basin]

unfortunately the game doesn't get any balances lmao

[potent tree]

Chaos and Chiron are truly done and dusted

And Beowulf busted

[lean mango]

Roguelikes aren't supposed to be balanced

Each weapon is like a different game

[unreal escarp]

..

[lean mango]

There's so many and no shame in not playing the ones you don't like

[lean mango]

1. when you have a dash-attack damage +% buff (artemis dash, chaos boon) and a attack damage +% buff, do they stack additively?
2. when you have a weapon with an attack combo, that can be chained with dashes in betwee, does each attack in the combo benefit from the dash-attack damage buff? (e.g. the 3rd big swing with excalibur?)

[analog mauve]

1. Yes
2. If it's an attack combo like Arthurs they don't get buffed by dashstrike buffs

[trim canopy]

if you have all 4 of your gods, then it doesn't matter what order you take support boons in, does it? like if i have hydraulic might but really want more aphrodite support boons, i'll still be offered them so long as i have available boon slots -- is that correct? purging hydraulic might wouldn't somehow be adventageous and result in me being offered more aphrodite support boons.

[vital night]

That probably is the case yeah

Idk how boon offering works exactly

[analog mauve]

theres no cap on boons

[trim canopy]

once core are filled, i didn't know if there was any rhyme or reason to the way the remaining open slots are populated or if taking them one way will change how others are offered (i understand duos and pre-reqs of course, but i mean everything else). i'm sure i can google it.

[analog mauve]

boons from one god cant lock out boons from other gods

with the exception of duo boons and core slots

[trim canopy]

e.g. - if i really want an epic support boon from aphrodite, but i'm offered one from poseidon and take it, that doesn't somehow limit the odds of me getting an epic support boon from aphrodite

[analog mauve]

yeah that wont happen

[trim canopy]

k

[analog mauve]

taking a bunch of boons clogs your pom pool tho

[trim canopy]

lol i'm too used to looking at like, diablo, path of exile skill trees and that's condtioned me.

there any visual indicators on a pom before you take it that tell whether it's pommable or not? or just something you memorize.

[analog mauve]

You kind of just remember it

There are few unpommables so it's easy to remember

Also some are easy to identify

For example rare crop

[trim canopy]

running rama bow for first time ever. dio on special, aphro on attack, no idea what hermes to aim for. have epic greatest reflex, and rare quick favor and greater evasino available. my impression is that grest reflex is always good because more dash.

[analog mauve]

more dashes is good but not really needed for rama

whats on your call

quick favour is quite good

[vital night]

hypersprint and rush delivery is ideal for damage

dashes is mostly if you're taking a lot of hits

[analog mauve]

personally dashes on rama just throw me off

[trim canopy]

lol i can sell it!

[tight basin]

once your cores are filled, the game will have like a 50/50 chance of offering a status condition (jolted, shoals, marked, or exposed). after that, it'll roll for legendary/duo odds on each slot

after that it's just like

whatever lmao

some rarity stuff going on or whatever but that's not too important generally

[jolly chasm]

This channel (and category) is for discussing the first Hades game. Please go to ⁠h2-discussion to talk about Hades II.

[trim canopy]

you can still get flurry jab if it isn't offered as your first hammer -- correct? assuming you don't take a hammer that removes it from the pool.

[tight basin]

Yes

I think only the spin hammers remove it from the pool

And hades spear and guan Yu

[trim canopy]

i need to always keep in mind that i'm only on attempt 101, am not even close to completing the core story line, and these guides i'm following are intended for people speedrunning to break world records. i'm making the assumption that if they're geared toward that intensity, surely they're more than optimal for my needs. 😐

@tight basin thanks.

wondering why none of the guides are ever like "hey, you know, greater evasion ain't bad if all else fails. dodging hits is a good thing!" lol.

[tight basin]

If you're following Speedrun guides then yeah no one's gonna mention those lmao

[trim canopy]

Well I started here, which is absolutely amazing -- https://www.leereamsnyder.com/hades-build-guide

But I'm having trouble finding a middle ground between there and hardcore speedrun guides.

I want to get into a bit more detailed info than is available on Lee's site. Granted, I haven't done a ton of searching.

[plain river]

Yeah

It’s

awkward because the Lee website is very general and honestly a teeny bit shallow

but most of the speedrun guides are pretty deep

although

Honestly I haven’t looked at Bananas 32 heat guide in a bit but it should do

a good job at highlighting some things that Lee’s doesn’t hit as harr

[potent tree]

Lee's guides are superb starting points

[plain river]

Oh you do have to scroll so far down to get to the builds section of the guide

And he ain’t wrong, it is barebones

I will say though I do think

I’m not even sure

I still feel like it does have valuable information but deep info on builds in a guide is

~

[lean mango]

can't post images of builds in this thread?

[tight basin]

Yeah I just like briefly talk about how to play the weapon/aspect and what good hammers are

But like after that in the actual boon part I don't really elaborate lmao

[lean mango]

for rama bow i've collected aphrodite attack, artemis dash, chaos dashstrike, +3 dashes, and triple shot hammer, is that the right approach?

[lucid oar]

Yup

[lean mango]

also, picked up 'point blank' instead of 'repulse shot' for 2nd hammer

[lucid oar]

That’s a good build

[lean mango]

can triple shot hit a single target with all 3 shots? i'm guessing no

[lucid oar]

It can

[plain river]

It can

you just have to be uber close

[turbid needle]

whats the best build for grinding items?

[potent tree]

Maybe Hestia. Takes like one single boon to really get going and isn't very reliant on hammers

[turbid needle]

really? thought zag n lucifer were the only decent gun aspects

will try out tho thx

[potent tree]

Hestia and Eris are the stronger rails

[tight basin]

if anything those two are the weaker rail aspects lmao

they're all still strong but eris and hestia are much stronger by comparison

[turbid needle]

lol oops

A dont like the other ones

A just use zag cuz more shooty when u get the shotgun boon

[tight basin]

spread fire zag rail is incredibly based tbf

[turbid needle]

hades devs are based for adding a effin gun to the game

[tight basin]

hestia's strong bc reloading every shot for a base 150 damage shot is incredibly powerful

you can effectively be doing nearly 300 damage at the start of the run without any boons because of fiery presence

[turbid needle]

it didnt feel that useful in day to day fighting but lemme try again

[tight basin]

whatever 75% of 150 is at least lmao

slap aphrodite attack on it and you'll be doing a lot of damage

eris is strong because the damage buff it gives is a global damage boost

slap zeus attack on that and get poseidon's dash and you'll delete a lot of things

[clever mason]

Do bosses count as enemies with armor? I.e do you get breaching cross 900% bonus with Meg, lernie, hades ?

[worn solar]

No but lernie extra head spawns and most adds have armor

[clever mason]

That’s what I thought, but wanted to check.

[plain river]

Armour only refers to the yellow health bar you’ll see on some enemies

Breaching cross is the best fist hammer because it pretty much just removes armour for the rest of the run

[clever mason]

Last time I was pleasantly surprised by rush kick and quake cutter combo. The rush kick has a way long range than I expected. The instant snap to enemies was nice. Too bad it was a failed ME build.

[jolly chasm]

Sadly, BC is too goated to not take

[lean mango]

my face when i reroll 3 common bad hermes boons into +3 dash

[smoky creek]

I ain't active here but I love Hades. Question for the folks: anyone know if Hades (the boss) has been beaten on a fresh save file? That is, first try, no upgrades or anything? I been trying to on and off for a while.

[lucid oar]

it has, it’s even a speedrun category

[smoky creek]

NICE. That's super cool. Is there a good place to discuss it?

[lucid oar]

The speedrun server is pinned in #self-promotion , not sure if there’s any other better place for discussing just a clear except in this server

[smoky creek]

Yee, thank you for your aid.

[turbid needle]

there are no bad hermes boons

[proper furnace]

true, every bad hermes becomes uc fodder

[turbid needle]

theyr all good but some are just outshined cuz he isnt a damage god

[proper furnace]

nah most of his boons are just bleh

his top boons do increase your dps a lot too lol

[turbid needle]

yeah

hes a movey n hurry uppey god

[proper furnace]

the dodge stuff is fine but they simply just are not +dashes or hyper delivery

[turbid needle]

demeter/ares/posideon are the ones A focus on

[turbid needle]

yeah no bad ones tho

[proper furnace]

I call them bad cuz they might as well do nothing

[turbid needle]

A feel like aphrodite and the wine god guy suck

[proper furnace]

swift flourish has the one niche in chiron at least

[vital night]

The dodge one is actually kinda nice

Aphro is super strong

[lunar lynx]

I like Aphrodite’s boons

Makes my attacks a pretty pink

[vital night]

Dio call and heavily pommed hangover with some globalist also strong

[turbid needle]

appolo n zues n athena are decent but noot as good imo

[proper furnace]

yeah aphro has the highest %

[turbid needle]

chaos is always great if A can spare hp

[lunar lynx]

Which call do you think is best overall?

[proper furnace]

dem/ares are prob some of the worst tbh?

[turbid needle]

really?

[proper furnace]

outside of like 2 of their boons or one entire build carried by athena

[turbid needle]

theyr doin me great

lots of dmg

killing lasers

[lunar lynx]

I’m surprised Ares would have the worst when he is the god of war

[turbid needle]

melts hades

[lunar lynx]

And well you’re fighting

[proper furnace]

ares worst is prob an exxageration

or that one meme of "ME is an exception and shouldn't be counted"

[turbid needle]

his call n blade dash are must

[vital night]

My ranking rn is probably dio>zeus>>athena=poseidon>>>everything else

[turbid needle]

dionysus that was his name

[vital night]

Ares is kinda worst or second worst

[proper furnace]

ares has a call?

[turbid needle]

its a spinny red blade

its great

[vital night]

I would rather have no call than ares call

[turbid needle]

but u can melt the boss n not get hit

[vital night]

Might seem good early on but it prevents you from doing other damage and doesn’t do that much damage by itself

[turbid needle]

maybe

[proper furnace]

ares call in general just kills your dps

[turbid needle]

yeah but no gettin hit

[lunar lynx]

“Hello! Welcome back to Binging with Babish! Today we’ll be preparing cosmic egg omelette, Zagreus’s gyro with fries, and embrosia for dessert!”

[vital night]

Poseidon is better

[lunar lynx]

https://tenor.com/view/salt-salty-binging-with-babish-babish-andrew-rea-gif-21760996

[proper furnace]

all calls give iframes on activation too

[vital night]

And every call gives iframes

[turbid needle]

poesidon is goated

he gives me gifts

[lunar lynx]

https://tenor.com/view/the-shell-has-spoken-magic-gif-19450862

Poseidon keepsake

[turbid needle]

yeah

it took 200 hrs for me to realise u can swap keepsakes

[pallid trellis]

what's the better special for Rama: Dionysus or Zeus? Or is there a third one that's better?

[analog mauve]

dio is straightforward for zeus ud want to get more zeus stuff and poms on that stuff for it to be worth it over dio imo

zeus can be better but requires investment dio can just work on its own, maybe 1 pom

[pallid trellis]

thanks

[tight basin]

Zeus is more immediate damage than dio

And jolted is also more damage

Dio is just consistent

I'd be happy naturally finding either in a run but id rather start with Zeus in a run

[analog mauve]

zeus stinky

past like aspho zeus will stop being noticable imo

while dio will do significant work in bosses

[worn solar]

Cold fusion jolted

[jolly chasm]

I disagree, because jolted exists

[analog mauve]

thats literally what i said

[wooden elk]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/936359276119736443/1266157100019744940/image.png?ex=66a42030&is=66a2ceb0&hm=fb4a537e2ca8b2b2d7370f1847fddbf89b54fa54a15ba3624439daff5b46d6b7&whats a good button to rebind Reload to on controller?

[jolly chasm]

Lb

[worn solar]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1226642940764487690/1266164303661240350/Hades_0.png?ex=66a426e6&is=66a2d566&hm=9560243116226078195232e3c1fa8f90479f01819b5d8c9aa86c800fa396af84& real gamer binds >>>

[jolly chasm]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1240373379073052733/1266165528498667550/Screenshot_7_25_2024_5_48_50_PM.png?ex=66a4280a&is=66a2d68a&hm=ebaff3b8a7a3e0ce6b973b884086ff7d2706cfec50ff093f80039d357f0dc08d&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=550&height=309

An example of slightly more normal binds

[worn solar]

Smh you definitely dont play zeus

[jolly chasm]

I do speedrun Zeus, we use charged shot

[worn solar]

figures

[wooden elk]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/936359276119736443/1266169973806596136/image.png?ex=66a42c2e&is=66a2daae&hm=5804c2022d67cf98c95d65e64557ad1d698bfb5b942aa2a764bc674c3bc05241& @jolly chasm @worn solar Here's my rebound button setup lol. My R/L Triggers arent bad per se, but theyre not the most reliable so they got relegated to Summon/Call

[jolly chasm]

Whatever works for you 👍

[lean mango]

merciful end has divine strike or divine flourish

as requirements

so does it just do nothing i you have divine flourish and another boon for attack?

oh is the tooltip for merciful end just wrong?

it says attack but maybe it works with any athena deflect

[lucid oar]

Unless you have doom on the other thing then yes

[lean mango]

i meant more because the tooltip says deflect must be on your attack

does it work with deflect dash?

[lucid oar]

Yeah

That’s what actually makes it op

Most of the time you want doom on attack and deflect on special and dash

Then you can proc doom really quickly by spamming dash strikes

[proper furnace]

The reason it only has strike/flourish as pre req is bc of a pre reqs nerf

You could open ME with dash before

[lean mango]

they should do an update just to fix tooltips, no balance changes

[proper furnace]

Doesn't the tooltip say your deflect abilities

[lean mango]

Your attacks that can Deflect immediately activate Doom effects.

mb the wiki is out of date

[proper furnace]

Wiki moment

[trim canopy]

are charon satyr sacks worth it?

[vital night]

Rarely

[barren ledge]

What is a Charon satyr sack

[analog mauve]

i think they mean the money bag

[clever mason]

The mystery boon bag?

[analog mauve]

no his money bag

[shadow geyser]

Which god keepsake should I pick going into Asphodel?

Using Zeus shield; so far have Zeus special, divine dash and trippy shot.

[vital night]

Arty is a good one

Dio is super good to have in pool for his call or attack

If you have your build but it’s low damage and pace isn’t good, you can take earring

If you have a good build and you’re scared of lernie/lava, you can take tooth

Other option is Athena for DDs/lightning phalanx/call/holy shield

[shadow geyser]

Artemis it is. 👍

[lean mango]

1. does lasting consequences affect quick recoery?
2. if you have lasting consequences 4 and nourished soul (30%), do you heal 30% or 0%?

[proper furnace]

No, 0%

Nourished soul is one of the worst boons you can get cuz is truly useless and can't sell

[shadow geyser]

Eh, I wouldn't say it's useless. It's saved me in a pinch a few times.

[proper furnace]

The context is no healing so

[shadow geyser]

but yeah, there are better choices.

[analog mauve]

Not everyone is playing sd lc4

[trim canopy]

ideal ME -- what do you start pomming after curse of agony is ~6/7? athena dash?

[proper furnace]

Impending doom

[analog mauve]

Your call if you have one

[trim canopy]

k thanks i love you

for achilles spear if you dont get offered flurry first what's a good backup? flaring, triple jab, or breaching -- thinking of going breaching

[proper furnace]

I'd reset

[analog mauve]

Triple

[lunar lynx]

I wrecked ||Hades with the Beowulf shield||

Totally obliterated him

Pummeled him

Ruined his whole career

[jolly chasm]

Can I see build

[trim canopy]

I'm trying to clear a Hades run with the adamant rail for the first time. What's the most powerful aspect to use for this? I have them all unlocked, but had only really been using Eris.

[jolly chasm]

Eris and Hestia re best if you have them both leveled up

Hestia really needs the levels

[analog mauve]

eris

[trim canopy]

i have eris lvl 2, hestia lvl 1 (just unlocked - have never used), and 3 titan blood available (but can buy more)

[analog mauve]

eris then

id not use hestia unmaxed

[trim canopy]

word. you think eris lvl 3 is a reasonable place to start or take it to 4?

[analog mauve]

eris is usable even at 1

at 3 its buff should be well noticable

[trim canopy]

nice. i've been using this eris guide, even though it's only like my 106th attempt and i only just now unlocked my first companion and don't even know how to use them yet. tl;dr -- i still have a lot of the story left.

oohops, this guide -- https://web.archive.org/web/20221206080755/https://www.hades-guides.ovh/index.php/eris-rail-guide/

hoping it's not so "speedrun" focused that isn't optimized for regular players.

[analog mauve]

they do tend to focus on the best dps builds so if ur into that it works

but personally i used the guide in the pins of this channel to help me understand builds

[trim canopy]

I'm having issues where the special for Eris is targeting stuff further away than the closest enemy. Do I just need more practice or should I try fiddling with deadzone adjustment or something?

[analog mauve]

no idea i dont use controller sorry

[trim canopy]

Ok. I'll check through guides in the pins. So far only seeing challenges haha.

[analog mauve]

https://www.leereamsnyder.com/blog/hades-build-guide

this one

[trim canopy]

man....had the build going awesome then straight up died from a damn witch in damn aspohdel....so whack

ugh

my special w/ eris rhythm is off.

and my overall tendency to panic haha.

[proper furnace]

Mood

I prob have like 60% uptime on the buff

[trim canopy]

Mood? And which buff?

I should proooobably figure out how to utilize my companion also.

[proper furnace]

1. relatable
2. the eris buff

I either forget to special or miss the explosion

[trim canopy]

ahh yes

ughh, next weapon up, shield....haven't found an aspect i like w/ it really either. the fact that i have them all at lvl 1 could be the problem here. i understand the concept of using zeus aspect as a yo-yo, but similar to the rail, my timing is off. it's a lot to coordinate.

maybe i need to level one of the aspects up and try that way.

[proper furnace]

For simpler zeus gameplay you always could play tag with it

Recall it and guide it around enemies

[vital night]

Or get ER

[trim canopy]

like launch the blitz disc w/ zeus and then run around so it follows you hitting mobs instead of trying to launch it so it lands on them perfectly?

[proper furnace]

Yeah

Can just dash through enemies

[trim canopy]

yup -- just what i was thinking, because i tried that once and i was kind of getting into a pattern.

another thing that makes it tough is switching your weapon every run for the buff -- but i feel like in the long run for replayability that is intended and keeps things fresh, even though when you're new it makes it hard to reinforce your learning w/ any one weapon.

[analog mauve]

the first two kind of suck without cshot

and 4th tbh

[trim canopy]

cshot?

[proper furnace]

Charged shot, hammer

[trim canopy]

guess i'll just use lee's general guide for shield w/ zeus guidance. don't know of a really detailed guide.

not sure how to set up mirror

whoops

[proper furnace]

For mirror check #h1-for-new-players pins

[trim canopy]

and really i should probably stick w/ thick skins lol as a rookie

[analog mauve]

high confidence is only used for speedruns

almost never needed

[trim canopy]

alright, here goes gonna either start w/ zeus on special or should i yolo it and try for ME? haha

[proper furnace]

Zeus ME is an option

But yeah if you want the consistency just put zeus

[lean mango]

I spent all my ambrosia at the wretched broker
then passed through bouldy's chamber and didn't have an offering for him
can i just delete my save file, or do i have to physically destroy my computer?

[proper furnace]

Bouldy doesn't take ambrosia

[analog mauve]

yes he does, you clearly havent unlocked it yet

[lean mango]

the other stuff

im not a greek mythology studier person

[proper furnace]

[plain river]

Sisyphus

Forced to eternally push bouldy up a hill but he’ll never reach the top

[lean mango]

i was going to study greek mythology but it seemed a sisyphian task

[plain river]

It’s really darn interesting tbh

I absorbed a bunch of it when I was a kid because there were some books about it lying around our house

[lean mango]

one of the interesting things about greek mythology

is it makes you look at things like fanfic and marvel cinematic universe

and think 'this isn't a new trend'

they're the same picture

[analog mauve]

i mean they do literally have a pantheon of gods in the mcu, including greek gods

[lean mango]

yeah, but i meant more the aspect that everything is retold 500 times and there's no official source

like how there's 500 different spider mans and they're all 'canon', and there's so many different conflicting stories about each greek god and they're all canon
some of the well known and often cited stories today were probably considered tripe or fanfiction when they were written

the game even makes fun of it with the whole zag/dio thing

[analog mauve]

yeah

[torpid onyx]

i have been stuck on the final boss for a while now and i have tried all kinds of builds with aphro+dio, athena, dodge and all the popular ones with spear, shield and fists but i just can;t killl him

[jolly chasm]

Have you tried cshot?

[torpid onyx]

whats that

[jolly chasm]

Hammer on shield

[torpid onyx]

nah

[jolly chasm]

Try it

[torpid onyx]

what does cshot do exactly?

[jolly chasm]

Makes your bull rush into a ranged attack that does 80 base damage

[torpid onyx]

yeah i thought that was bad

casue no invincibility from bull rush right

i thought it wasn;t worth it

[jolly chasm]

Yes, but 80 damage is like a lot of damage for a base number

It's still very safe because you can still block

[torpid onyx]

wait you can block with cshot aswell??

[jolly chasm]

When charging it you can

[torpid onyx]

ohh okay i was confused on how it worked

will try

i usually use the zeus shield

and boons that work well with it

[jolly chasm]

Zeus prefers ER

But cshot is still great

[trim canopy]

time for a styius run! haven't done one in forever! what's y'alls fave aspect? nemesis?

[plain river]

👍

[trim canopy]

i picked nemesis and read up on that i should progress toward unlocking arthur.

wait...am i impervious toward dashing? .....has every guide i've read been trying to tell me this?

If you have a duo boon pre-req and then purge it, is the Duo Boon still unlocked?

...asked every noob ever

crap! sorry

i meant, "crap" -- apparently not if you haven't unlocked the duo yet.

[lucid oar]

No, need to currently have the prereqs for it to be offered

[trim canopy]

When the limited time offer from broker is an indirect trade (which all offer at least 50% savings) -- do y'all pretty much always take it?

[hallow plank]

Pretty much, yeah. Unless it's something like nectar for keys where I don't have any use for it

So for the Rail, how does the aspect of hestia mix with spread fire? I'm guessing it doesn't give each shot from that the Hestia bonus damage?

[vital night]

unfortunately you don't get 600 damage in an empowered spread shot

first empowered shot is normal and every other bullet in the clip is spread

[hallow plank]

I figured as much, but I was hoping, lol. How about explosive shot?

Does explosive shot do the Hestia damage in a larger area, or does it have its own base damage?

[vital night]

i'm pretty sure it does but i'm not certain

best hammers for hestia are rocket bomb+cluster bomb, ricochet, piercing, and targeting

my personal favorite is ricochet

[hallow plank]

Ooh, can't wait to see what that one's like. I only just started using Hestia's aspect

[trim canopy]

if you're going for a duo (ME in this case) -- is there any variable that would make getting boons from either god more likely to give you ME than the other? like any reason to go for one over the other or equal chance of either god droppin the duo

[analog mauve]

both gods have an equal chance of giving you the duo

but theres also some stuff regarding boon menus prioritizing core boons and status/secondary boons or smth which i dont rly understand someone else would have to explain that

[trim canopy]

ugh, what's least crappy 4th boon on a zeus shield run w/ ME if you can't get artiemis and your options are demeter or zeus? 😦

[analog mauve]

zeus forcall

[trim canopy]

heyyyyy, thanks, an epic call dropped 🙂

i really need a W w/ this zeus aspect shield situation, it's....making me ....hate the game lol. i need to find a yo-yo rhythm

[analog mauve]

nice

i hate zeus shield too

i just play it like chaos / zag shield

i dont use the special at all

[trim canopy]

crap!

[analog mauve]

you dont use the special on chaos either

[trim canopy]

ooofta.

think im playing it wrong. saying not to use special on zeus shield?

[analog mauve]

no im just saying i didnt like using the special because i couldnt bother learning how to use it

[trim canopy]

oh nvm i think you mean w/ zag/chaos you don't use special

[analog mauve]

yeah that too

[trim canopy]

lol so how in the heck do you run zeus aspect shield? straight up don't?

[analog mauve]

for those you just pray for charged shot and then win

[trim canopy]

i had charged shot drop....and then picked explosive return instead because lee guide mentioned it above CS.

[analog mauve]

yeah charged shot kinda bad if you are using the special

charged shot is for when you are using the attack only

[trim canopy]

for ME, what would you pom after curse of agony is 6/7 or not an option? divine flourish? zeus aid?

[analog mauve]

do you have impending doom

[trim canopy]

tbh, at least 75% of the time, i straight up forget that i have a shield...

[analog mauve]

that with 3-4 poms doubles your damage

[turbid needle]

Zeus shield is actually really good especially with zeus special, it just requires using it right

[trim canopy]

no impending ATM -- it seems a rare drop for me.

[turbid needle]

(It's what beat 64 heat)

[trim canopy]

hrm, i have ME, dio, and zeus....wonder wot keepsake to take into elysium....meh...ares or athena because i could use divine dash

or ares and hope for impending.

hah CS just dropped....grab it i guess!

and realized i'm runnin' around w/o any cast.....which isn't ideal. oooft. of the gods i mentioned w/ my ME what would y'all recommend? i suppose anything better than nothing.

[vital night]

Meh only if you need more boons

Base cast is fine and cast boons eat poms that could go into doom or impending

[plain river]

Or just

learn how to use the special

Like the special is the main reason zeus shield is so good

[turbid needle]

^

[pallid trellis]

how good is Spreadfire on Hestia?

[analog mauve]

it doesnt affect the first shot so it doesnt do anything rly

[lean mango]

can 'rare crop' select your heroic boons when you take it?

[analog mauve]

i think not

like 90% sure it cant

[tender cave]

in the pins there are 5 aspects of chaos builds
which is the best ? ( to beat hades for the 1st time)

[analog mauve]

https://www.leereamsnyder.com/blog/hades-build-guide this one?

[jolly chasm]

Prob Cshot spam or Dio special

[tender cave]

ye

[analog mauve]

aspect of chaos kinda sucks

id use aspect of zagreus shield

[tender cave]

o
with what build ?

[jolly chasm]

Charged shot

[tender cave]

and what boons ?

[vital night]

Aphrodite attack

[tender cave]

Dio special aphro att and Athena dash ig ?

[analog mauve]

dont use the special it sucks

[tender cave]

Then just bull rush spam ?

[analog mauve]

yeah

ideally you get charged shot, it makes it a better bow

[tender cave]

So I should also get the Athena boon which makes a reflect into a status effect?

[vital night]

Don’t run pstatus

Athena dash is good for this build but you probably wont have another status effect in the build

[tender cave]

Oh

I use the other talent then ?

[vital night]

Yeah

And just make sure to fill your god pool

[tender cave]

Also what keepsake should I use

[vital night]

Start Aphrodite attack

Or Artemis

You can also start tidal dash and try the same build

[tender cave]

Poms worth on anything other than aphro att?

[proper furnace]

If you find zeus you could take his call and pom that too

You then go for snair or rod depending which attack you took

[vital night]

Call, jolted if you get it

Tidal dash if you get it

But I once reached hades with nothing but a lvl 9 aphro attack and some other additive

Threw it but it was completely winnable

Anything past the attack is just your preferred extras

[sharp patrol]

Hades is hard to beat with the shield

It's been 3 times in a row that he beats me in his phase 2

[jolly chasm]

Shield is usually the safest weapon

[hot tundra]

What is it that gives double special for sword? I thought it was the hammer, but I haven't seen it again

[jolly chasm]

Hammer

[primal brook]

If you have a screenshot of the build you use or a video you want some feedback on feel free to post it asking for help

but otherwise I generally suggest just play defensively during phase 2 and focus on blocking/iframing Hades' attacks

[sharp patrol]

to be honest, I'm a "new" player (70 attempts under my belt), I managed to escape with the spear, the cannon, the bow and the fists, but the shield is a real pain to use from the elysée

i escaped four times, one times with each weapons

but the shield... i've been crushed 5-6 times in a row by Hades lol

[somber burrow]

I don't know if you've gotten it yet, but for my money ||the Sun/yellow shield and Daedulus enchantment that lets you hold the light attack button for rapid light attacks are were really helpful. That and the Athena Light Attack and Dash Boons are helpful in just about any build||

[jolly chasm]

Both are Explosive return and Charged shot are better hammers on Zeus, and while ddash is helpful, the special boon matters much more

[worn solar]

Shield doesnt have a hold to spam attack hammer

[jolly chasm]

I think they are talking about Pulv blow?

I know it’s not holdable, but maybe?

[worn solar]

Flurry blow when tho

[analog mauve]

It would lock out cshot and bullrushing in general

And blocking

[mossy elk]

Anyone know any good spear builds for someone that's very heavy on dash attacks?

[vital night]

Achilles tdash start

With flurry jab

[mossy elk]

Flurry Jab is a Daedalus buff, right?

[vital night]

Yeah

[sharp patrol]

i've done it !

[lusty cobalt]

ok so how would you approach it then beating it once like your strat

i just wanna do it for the sake of doing it with a shield

bcz i have done with once with the rest of em

1 heat

[sharp patrol]

I finished Hades with all weapons

[deft wing]

what are the best weapon upgrades for the twin fists

i do not currently have any aspects on them

[jolly chasm]

Demeter

[analog mauve]

zagreus

[jolly chasm]

Lmao

[analog mauve]

what

[barren ledge]

Do you mean weapon aspects or Daedalus Hammers?

For hammers I think Breaching Cross is usually considered best right?
Because it lets you just melt through armor

[vital night]

yeah breaching best

[deft wing]

@barren ledge the weapon aspects

[barren ledge]

I think Demeter is the best (better as you upgrade it) but all are pretty fun

[deft wing]

@barren ledge thanks

[tiny night]

Easier weapon to beat the game?

Jesus

[sharp patrol]

Adamant Rail

Definitly

[tiny night]

Dedalo hammer obligated

[proper furnace]

Bow/rail/shield due to range or block being funny (really powerful)

But you can win with any weapon w/o issue

[worn solar]

Hammerless shield is kinda suck

[tiny night]

Block is op

[quartz crane]

i just ran the most fun chiron run with poseidon special, 2 chaos special boons, relentless volley, razor shoals and wave pounding

chiron is acc the best thing to ever exist

[jolly chasm]

If only that was true

[potent tree]

I stinking love newer players' enthusiasm for Chiron. It's so nostalgic

[jolly chasm]

Chiron just makes me sad

It could have been so much cooler and stronger

[analog mauve]

i really dont understand it 😭 like i can understand some people liking it but it being the unanimous favorite while being one of the worst is crazy

[potent tree]

FFXIV taught me a valuable lesson: most players have no stinking clue what's good or bad

[analog mauve]

yeah thats fair, but its weird how everybody loves it instead

like, everyone

[quartz crane]

Why is it one of the worst

[quartz crane]

And yeah i just got the game this summer sale 💀

[potent tree]

Welcome, welcome

Chiron either does relatively little damage kinda slowly while forcing huge animation lock or takes forever and a lot of luck to do decent damage halfway through a run, leaving you with like nothing for the first half

[jolly chasm]

Also really struggles with aoe

[tight basin]

slow special animation and damage rotation, the damage is alright but is pretty slow
also has basically no aoe capabilities so it can struggle to clear rooms with a lot of enemies or cramped rooms

chiron is very beginner friendly bc it's super easy to use

but at higher level play, chiron is pretty bad

[quartz crane]

So what would you suggest for the best higher level bow aspect

I have all including rama

[analog mauve]

hera and rama

[jolly chasm]

Hera for speed, Rama for heat

Zag bow is also pretty good overall

[tight basin]

yeah the answer is kinda just "not chiron" lmao

unfortunately

[vital night]

Chiron is fine for heat

(Timothy did a 60 on it)

[jolly chasm]

That's more of a player thing than a weapon thing ngl

[tight basin]

i mean just bc it's doable doesn't mean it's good tbh lmao

like achilles has done 60? heat or something

62?

[jolly chasm]

Tim is just kinda cracked

[tight basin]

it's not great for heat lmao

yeah timothy is just good

nem just got 60, doesnt mean it's good at heat lmao

sword just sucks at heat in general even tho the damage is pretty respectable

[analog mauve]

nem damage is actually cracked

[worn solar]

Only problem is elysium sword and shield bros smacking you in the face is more cracked

[mossy elk]

Something more appropriate for this channel (as I realized my last post was unintentional bragging):

My recommended Varatha build:
Any Aspect
Hunter's Dash
Flurry Jab
Hangover on attack
Deflect on dash
Anything on special (forgot to use special...)
Call of Zeus
Lightning Strike on attack as well, if you can swing it
Jolted
Doom on revenge
Any Duo Boons you can get your infernal hands on
Any Dionysus boons, the dude makes you an absolute powerhouse
Edit: Ice Beam on cast, if possible! Broken as all Tartarus!

Now you're ready to get out there and stir up some trouble in the Underworld.

[lean mango]

hera bow w aprhodite cast build
#fan-works message

[tight basin]

you can't have dio and zeus atk at the same time lmao

unless by "swing it" you mean swap but at that point why would you do that lmao just start zeus

[mossy elk]

Oof, maybe I was mixing up two runs
I was operating purely on memory

[tight basin]

also to note it kinda just looks like your build is zeus atk + jolted

and demeter cast kinda sucks

[mossy elk]

The Demeter cast only really shines if you get the "10 chill stacks to blast the enemy" boon.
I can now confidently say the Hangover attack was from my Bow run, having reviewed the records.

[tight basin]

dem cast only shines if you have the duo with artemis so it can actually track lmao

and get glacial glare that makes it last longer

and more casts from chaos since you'd ideally run stygian soul to make glacial glare good

also im pretty sure dem cast doesnt inflict chill without glacial glare

yeah it doesnt lmao

so you'd need crystal clarity, glacial glare, and arctic blast for it to "shine"

at which point would underperform hunting blades which only needs the duo lmao

[tender cave]

so im using aspect of zag with artemis att and its pretty hard to go past the 3rd boss
idk if im playing it wrong or somin

[barren ledge]

Which Aspect of Zag?
I'm assuming the sword

[tender cave]

shield

thats what i got reccomended

[turbid needle]

Aspect of Zeus and the hidden aspect for shield are both stronger than the Zag shield in my personal opinion (as well as the majority of the player base from what i've noticed). Zeus is the easy-cheesy method. The hidden aspect has a small learning curve but can be a force to be reckoned with once you get used to it.

(And maybe you already know this by now but for clarity's sake) if you mean that's what the GAME recommended you use (i.e. it's got the dark purple glow around it) that means you can use any aspect of the shield for the bonus, but it has to be a shield aspect is all. Does not necessarily need to be the one thats displayed at the moment you walk into the room.

[tender cave]

ah
by reccomended i meant what people here reccomended me
how to get more titan blood and how to unlock the hidden aspect ?

[turbid needle]

(paraphrased a bit from the wiki) —

• First - Reveal the Aspect of Guan Yu (the hidden spear aspect. Note that it does not need to be unlocked further with Titan Blood, just needs to be revealed in the spear aspect list)
• Have a total of 5 Titan Blood or more invested into Shield aspects
• If you have not previously received the following dialogue from Chaos, talk to Chaos with the Shield (any aspect) equipped until you do:
“You come to my domain bearing an all-seeing artifact that sprang from me after the dawn of time. It is considered a defensive instrument, I do believe. Though, I suspect you have discovered, or soon shall discover, it is nothing of the sort"

• finally, find and talk to Chaos (with any weapon equipped, doesnt matter) until Chaos states the phrase you need to unlock the hidden shield aspect (He says "I see you stand your ground against the serpent's flame")

[tender cave]

uhhh i dont think i have enough titan blood to do that
ig aspect of zeus it is
do i just super and then hold my shield thing ?

[turbid needle]

well if you want a 5 hour drag then sure, but its such a fun aspect to use!! I mean sure you could also just hold shield if you're in a stiicky siituation but i tend to have the most fun dashing around wailing on things with my giant fan of a hitbox out there annihilating things. makes me feel safe and cozy :3 (just get zeus on your special for starters before more elaborate stuff like the Ares+Atherna duo or something)

[tender cave]

also is there somthing where like
i can choose the boons i want
ik the keepsakes but istg i cant get a athena boon
and when i get one it isnt dash

[turbid needle]

Titan blood gets easy to farm on just Meg using all your different weapons to beat her 1 time so 6 titan blood for beating her once with all 6 weapons (aspects still count as beating with that weapon so pick ur fav/what available aspect you have of each weapon before u do the run). so technically thats 6 Tblood, then rinse and repeat for all weapons again by boosting the pact of punishment up 1 number. rinse and repeat until you have enough. jsut focus on beating meg. even if you die after that, atleast u have 1 Tblood for your trouble that way.

🔴not sure if you have unlocked it already but the pact only opens up for use after u beat the final boss at least 1 time btw. so if you havent done so yet, that would be what you should focus on. mirror upgrades are what u need to focus on cause it really helps a lot with first win.

[turbid needle]

have you unlocked the final tier of the mirror upgrades yet? if you havent yet, there is one upgrade towards the end of the list that helps considerably with boon choices. I'll leave it at that so as not to spoil it too much for you.

[tender cave]

ight ig i got a grind to do

[tender cave]

ah
ill try to beat hades with aspect of zues then go and trying to unlock the hidden aspect
thanks for your help

[tender cave]

finally beat hades
ig tis time for the pacts thing

which ones are the eaiest modifers to do ?

[vital night]

There’s a guide pinned in #h1-high-heat-strategies

[unborn ibex]

Hi guys, i'm finishing my heat 32 all weapon challenge, and i was looking for a database with the different %dmg of boons depending on weapon/god/rarity/lvl. Can't find it anywhere, you guys know where ?

[proper furnace]

https://cpecific.github.io/hades-wiki/ you can change the lvl/rarity here

(levels is pc only tho)

[unborn ibex]

OMG thank you so much !!!

[tight basin]

The issue with zag shield is that you need a good attack hammer for it to actually be good, so mainly charged shot

Pulv blow is a good alternative

Dashing wallop is eh but fine

Other than those 3 then zag shield will feel like a slog

Otherwise if you have it the Zeus shield is better bc it's not inherently hammer reliant

If you do zeus^2 at least

[tender cave]

eh
im going for the hidden aspect now

[tight basin]

Fair lmao

[tender cave]

also for the 5 titan blood
if i put 1 in zag aspect its fine right ?

[tight basin]

For unlocking hidden shield or spear

[tender cave]

shield / spear

[tight basin]

Well those are different reqs

Spear is unlocking 5 nonzag aspects iirc

But all the other weapons is just 5 blood invested into any aspect

[tender cave]

ah ok

[trim canopy]

can't figure out what's blocking my unlock of arthur aspect. invested 5 bloods in non-zag sword aspects, still nothing...

[proper furnace]

do you have guan yu revealed I assume?

[plain river]

“Non-zag” doesn’t matter for unlocking it, or any other hidden aspects post guan-yu

I can’t remember if guan-yu itself cares

[proper furnace]

guan yu is the one that cares yeah

unlock 5 non zag aspects across all weapons

[lean mango]

so i am willing to accept that dio/zeus call are better than poseidon

but is any call better than poseidon with riptide?

[vital night]

Yeah

Zeus and dio

[lean mango]

1 bar = ~3s of invuln and usually 1.5-2k damage

[vital night]

Yeah it’s fine

[tight basin]

pos call is the call you'd use if you need invulnerability and damage bc your aspect doesn't have much defensive capability lmao

[vital night]

But Zeus and dio allow you to do your other damage

Yeah

Goes hard on eris

[lean mango]

are they very dependent on build and poms?

[tight basin]

athena call is also good bc you're just invuln so that's generally preferred

but also yeah pos call eris is pretty fat

[tight basin]

dio yes sorta but you can get away with only 1 pom tbh

[lean mango]

i've had games where the zeus call just deleted final boss's health bar, like unbelievably fast, never managed that with dio

[tight basin]

zeus 1 pom is nice but most of your damage is coming from jolted not the call really

a bit of both tho

raw zeus call is still strong

[tight basin]

well dio is damage over time lmao

so that might be why

but dio call likes poms a lot

hangover in general at least

[lean mango]

well yeah, with dio i try to get it up to 5 stacks, then move to safety
with zeus just stand in melee and mb take some damage but deal so much more

[tight basin]

they're roughly considered about equal in terms of strength

dio has a larger damage radius so it's preferred for heat

and also only needs poms to be good

zeus call is preferred for speedrunning bc it's immediate damage

[lean mango]

mb i should try to use my calls more clearing rooms

[tight basin]

yeah probably lmao

small calls good

except for like artemis

and aphrodite depending what you wanna do

[analog mauve]

for heat pos call is great

i would take it over zeus / dio

especially with riptide or whatever that boon is called it can solo an entire ely wave

[tender cave]

On aspect of beowulf
Do I use stygian soul or the +2 stones one

[lean mango]

stones

[trim canopy]

@proper furnace i have guan yu revealed

[proper furnace]

Then is just bad rng sadly