whenever I say "take x" into tartarus or asphodel I mean forcing them via keepsake
#h1-builds-and-combat
plain river
onyx girder
it does, ill write this down and try it a few times, really trying to get an escape faster than 9 mins
plain river
it does, ill write this down and try it a few times, really trying to get an esc...
that's far easier with a build centered around what you can actively do
compared to trying with revenge boons
onyx girder
compared to trying with revenge boons
i dont nessasarily rely on the revenge boons, i tend to think it helps in boss fights for fast clears, but rarely use them outside of them, i feel like my problem is either i suck as a player or i need better builds because the chambers leading up to the bosses are what take me forever, ive tried every weopan but it seems to get me nowhere
plain river
even with boss fights it's negligible extra damage
tight basin
If things take forever, most of the time it's just build
After a certain point it becomes a more mechanical problem
plain river
honestly
tight basin
And then you accidentally start speedrunning
plain river
if you're already sub10
you don't suck as a player
so builds are like the easiest next step
onyx girder
so builds are like the easiest next step
i struggle with builds an incredible amount, especially on every weapon but fists and spear, not only that but i kinda just give up kinda easy, like if im not comfortable with a boon and it seems like it sucks more than what i normally use i just sell it and go back
pos is almost always in my builds
plain river
I mean selling is a normal part of higher level play
you don't need every boon you find
and it gets in the way of properly putting poms on your other boons
or your duo odds
pos is good but not for their strike or special
tight basin
cast and call good-ness is a bit dubious but his dash is great lmao
eager flint
If you're on PC and you wanna, you can install mods to help. The speedrunning modpack is awesome to make the grind for PB less painful, and the DPS meter mod is great to see what boons are over or underperforming
eager flint
pos is good but not for their strike or special
I learned recently that pos special actually has a good %dmg. That still doesn't make everything, but hey
plain river
see
I know pos special is the second highest
it just shoots itself in the foot with knockback
eager flint
Yeah
onyx girder
If you're on PC and you wanna, you can install mods to help. The speedrunning mo...
i play on switch unfortunatley
plain river
also a switch gamer
eager flint
F
plain river
I don't use modded, but it certainly would be welcome help if I didn't need to jailbreak my switch to do so
onyx girder
this helped a lot, ill go start on testing this stuff
plain river
this helped a lot, ill go start on testing this stuff
btw
have you already gotten help with your mirror?
since having one tailored for speedrunning should help
same thing with making sure you run extreme measures 2 and forced overtime 2
onyx girder
have you already gotten help with your mirror?
do you have any suggestions ?
plain river
do you have any suggestions ?
just swap the orange marked one for the green opposing upgrade
slow mirage
What does everyone think of ice wine? I’m trying to get all the duos and want to set myself up for success
proper furnace
fun on achilles
plain river
it's all the same issues that dio cast normally has
but with a damage bonus and chill
eager flint
nah
untold iris
dio cast is good because I don't have any ranks in boiling blood :^)
eager flint
it gets rid of the delay between casting and hitting
that's a big issue of dio cast being resolved right there
plain river
doesn't it still have delay before fully popping up
maybe it's been so long since I've used it
proper furnace
the delay is really only on the beo and hera
where flare is faster
on trippy shot is significantly faster
tight basin
it's all the same issues that dio cast normally has
dio cast normally is pretty eh because of the travel time, but ice wine is pretty instant
proper furnace
I wish 
sullen crystal
i mean tbf i was stockpiling hp the whole time so even with the debuff i still had 120 hp but like. i love it
also had hermes attack speed+ boon so that made it even better
proper furnace
The worst thing about cursed is the fact that sword best tool are dash strikes
And cursed doesn't work on those
proper furnace
Yup
proper furnace
The worst thing about cursed is the fact that sword best tool are dash strikes
(and well, y'know, a 60% hp cut)
Sgg hates healing confirmed 
sullen crystal
LMFAO
i got cursed pretty early so i just grabbed (almost) every centaur heart i could find and equipped the dog collar at the end
blammo. 120 hp
rocky arrow
I have a Chaos Gate, Erebus Gate to a Pom, and a Daedalus Hammer to choose from. Running an Achilles Spear Crystal Beam build. I just need help deciding lmao
south sonnet
I have a Chaos Gate, Erebus Gate to a Pom, and a Daedalus Hammer to choose from....
chaos
proper furnace
gate for +1 cast/cast dmg
gilded scaffold
how do i use my titan blood
south sonnet
#h1-for-new-players pins
gilded scaffold
oh dang
i just found the second side to the mirror
do i want to use any of them
or should i just stick to the original options
proper furnace
olympian favor to dark foresight, priv status to fam favs and authorithy to persuasion mainly
proper furnace
<#725021347968712724> pins
mirror guide also here
plain river
I have a Chaos Gate, Erebus Gate to a Pom, and a Daedalus Hammer to choose from....
Chaos > Hammer or Hermes > regular room rewards > erebus reward unless you really want an erebus reward
And shop is pretty important too
rocky arrow
Chaos > Hammer or Hermes > regular room rewards > erebus reward unless you **re...
This helps a lot tysm
tight basin
Regular room reward if it's an important god > chaos/free room if it's c4 or lower
sinful dew
Hello I was wondering if it's possible to get a death defiance refill from the fateful twist mystery? I've bought it a decent amount, but haven't gotten it before. I was wondering if it's super rare and at a low chance or if it's not in the item pool for fateful twist.
plain river
Hello I was wondering if it's possible to get a death defiance refill from the f...
I don’t think the pool is weighted in any specific direction
I never buy fateful twists nor run death defiance so am unsure
tight basin
It's either not in the pool at all or has the same odds lmao
Fateful twists have the same odds as any other non healing item to show up
And those things just pick whatever consumable you can buy I'd assume
sacred pulsar
what can chaos offer for a beo build other than +1 bloodstone ?
more damage casts right ?
sacred pulsar
yeah, i guess thats what is missing the most on my beo builds
i usually get mirage shot before / beginning of aspho and i manage to pom the cast a lot
but i dont get Cshot often, and barely never have chaos gates
proper furnace
Use your rolls on wells if possible
sacred pulsar
to buy the chaos gate thing ?
proper furnace
Charon keepsake is goated
proper furnace
to buy the chaos gate thing ?
There's also cast dmg and +1 cast there
They are mad cheap
+50% dmg for 20 coins, +1 cast for 50
sacred pulsar
wait theres cast damage in the well too ??? i thought it was only +1 cast
so lets see
proper furnace
Yeah wells are goated for cast builds
sacred pulsar
after elysium, i could have 4 casts, +40% cast damage from chaos, +50% from well, and put on charon keepsake ?
proper furnace
I think if you buy in like c28-30 of elysium it can last to dad with 2 sack (and short tunnel)
proper furnace
after elysium, i could have 4 casts, +40% cast damage from chaos, +50% from well...
Use Charon's keepsake in ely
That way you get to buy the well before styx then swap
sacred pulsar
the small roooms in styx count as encounters right ?
proper furnace
Yeah
sacred pulsar
yeah right
alright, i might play for 2-3-4 hours tonight with only beo, ill get sub 10 im due
proper furnace
Are you going with the speedrun pact
sacred pulsar
honestly im taking heat 1 by 1 to get as many rewards as i can
i usually go fo2 with 1 td since im at 8 heat now
proper furnace
Fair
proper furnace
Em2 is 3 heat total
Em1 is 1, em2 is 2, em3 is 3 (6 total) and em4 is 4 for a total of 10 at max
sacred pulsar
i could do em2 fo2 td1 for 10 heat then, no ?
proper furnace
Yeah
But also tbh I'd play on fo1 if this is unmodded
No cshot aspho is roughhhhh
sacred pulsar
But also tbh I'd play on fo1 if this is unmodded
unmodded indeed, im waiting to 100% achievements before modding
sacred pulsar
No cshot aspho is roughhhhh
yeah, i had a 12:30 without cshot... i had a great build too
its pretty dependent on it
the bull rush is so slow to charge
sacred pulsar
yeah i know but sometimes the witches are far away
sacred pulsar
im not but now that its mentioned it makes a lot more sense for cast builds
proper furnace
Fiery is preferred for like 90% of builds
For beo specifically I think you need fiery + high confidence to one shot witches
I don't remember the breakpoint
sacred pulsar
i dont think high confidence is my jam yet
i dont understand patterns 100% of the time, ill just get double taxed by lernie
eager flint
Don't take TD if you want to speedrun IGT, it removes the survival rooms in tartarus
And survival rooms don't advance the timer, so they're basically a free room
sacred pulsar
isnt the clear time what matters ?
proper furnace
isnt the clear time what matters ?
The in game timer pauses at a lot of moments
sacred pulsar
the "survive for 45s" aren't adding the 45s to the time ?
proper furnace
Nope
sacred pulsar
damn
sacred pulsar
i thought opposite, i thought only than stopped timer
proper furnace
(but Than can still cost you time if no menu reward)
sacred pulsar
can you only get these survival rooms in tart of also in aspho / ely ?
proper furnace
Only in tart
sacred pulsar
sounds good then, dream tart would be chaos mid shop survival sissyphus then
i guess that makes a sub 2 tart way more viable
proper furnace
Also fountain
sacred pulsar
okay, getting chaos before the first room isnt the best then, since early encounters are easier
proper furnace
And you know the drill with styx
proper furnace
They always spawn facing right so take advantage of that
That said, guess what does cshot also solve regarding shields
viral geode
It seems I have been killed during poseidon's aid, by the big stone head
Is this another beowulf bug?
proper furnace
Were you in the middle of the call or was it like right at the end
But also there's that bug where the skull crushers dmg goes even through acorn so wouldn't surprise me
viral geode
i'm pretty sure it was during
valid dagger
Whats more impressive is the skullcrusher managed to hit you
viral geode
it's hard to move in poseidon aid
in fact i was trying to hit it, just didnt' think it could hit me back
analog mauve
lmfao
plain river
it's hard to move in poseidon aid
Fair but at the same time you’re going so fast, I’m surprised it even dropped in the first place
@zenith fractal decided to move here before anyone got on my case in victories, how exactly does 1 dash change sword gameplay
zenith fractal
the combo changes a bit, not having multiple dashes changes the rhythm.
instead of special -> dashstrike times X where X is your amount of dashes, you have special -> dashstrike -> attack or any variation of this, rotated (loops around, so you can start with any of the three)
also, "empty-dashing" (attack -> dash) becomes more significant than it is on 2+dash sword, as a safe way to finish off enemies or just deal damage to one without locking oneself into an animation. standing strikes are rapid to perform.
tight basin
there's a fresh file guide somewhere
zenith fractal
thrusts also see more of a use
zenith fractal
there's a fresh file guide somewhere
by sophie, yes
should go fetch it
got it 
plain river
Thnx
viral geode
Fair but at the same time you’re going so fast, I’m surprised it even dropped in...
Oh sorry I'm talking about the power couple not the small ones
Does that drop faster? Idk
plain river
Oh sorry I'm talking about the power couple not the small ones
I was specifically thinking about power couple at that point
viral geode
Don't you go underneath the shadow to cause it to drop, so you can actually hit it
untold iris
what's best for hera if I'm on a new file? (rank 1 hera bow)
do i just get dio cast and attempt to high roll with artemis/poseidon next?
or is there something else that is also good/consistent
dapper harness
crush shot is best for hera at any rank
untold iris
ive been a bit scared to use lodging casts since i dont have the reduced drop time from rank 5
dapper harness
eh the drop time isn't big of an issue since you mostly one-shot enemies
untold iris
but vs bosses i stick them with my stones and then just kind of run around and hit them with attack for 10 seconds?
dapper harness
yea
or there is bug which allow you to use cast but they don't lodge
wall bug, where you lead an enemy towards a wall/pillar/obstacle and shoot
untold iris
ok so aphro first, then ideally i look for artemis/poseidon/demeter?
dapper harness
but(if you're lucky and did it correctly) the casts will do dmg but not lodge
dapper harness
ok so aphro first, then ideally i look for artemis/poseidon/demeter?
demeter for snow burst and ravenous will then artemis for attk then hunter's mark
that's usually the gist of the build
and the usual hermes boons; hyper sprint, rush delivery, +dashes, quick reload can also work for hera
eager flint
ive been a bit scared to use lodging casts since i dont have the reduced drop ti...
it's weaker than at max rank, but still incredibly stronger than other options
zenith fractal
Athena cast has some high heat potential on hera. Usually unused in anyheat though.
analog mauve
😭
untold iris
Athena cast has some high heat potential on hera. Usually unused in anyheat thou...
whats the theory behind this?
is it just deflect being good?
I'm not too interested in speedrunning
just being consistent with heat on
eager flint
it deals big damage
nothing more to it. Like yeah it deflects, but you don't need to deflect foes you cleared
untold iris
it deals big damage
but then why use it over aphro cast?
that cast has bigger damage
analog mauve
only reason would be lightning phalanx ig
its just a 2ndary option
if you dont want to use crush shot every time phalanx is a nice 2ndary option
eager flint
hm, ackshually 🤓 I just checked it, but athena cast has more damage than aphro except at common rarity
Now I need to check the pom scaling. If I find it.
hm, aphro has slightly better scaling too
but yeah overall damage numbers are similar
zenith fractal
it deals big damage
Opens defiance refills while supplying damage 
eager flint
Opens defiance refills while supplying damage <:SeemsGood:537081490203475968>
divine dash looking at you like
round umbra
What epic dash should I use for a gilg run?
proper furnace
Wet dash as always
round umbra
They don't fly away too fast? I was thinking blades or hangover for this particular one
round umbra
This is just me trying to clear all 32. Here we go with spdash
round umbra
The dashes aren't too fast for big Z?
proper furnace
Not really sure actually 
round umbra
I am really bad at this
proper furnace
You can also do surprise surprise
ME
tight basin
Yeah
Dash only 32 on gilga is doable
Esp if you allow summons
Look for shoals and lightning reflexes
And jolted after that
Sea storm is kinda last priority and you only go for it if you get cucked by Zeus and pos boons
Or just get way too many of them
vital night
Is there a sheet somewhere for damage numbers for each weapon
tight basin
No hit the wiki has it at least
untold iris
i was linked this website at some point
its pretty good
damage numbers for weapons/boons
also has rarity and pom scaling
tight basin
Oh i forgot they existed
vital night
Does chiron change the special base damage
tight basin
Technically yes
It shoots 8 arrows, normal bows shoot 9
But the base damage of each arrow stay 10
You're never hitting all 9 arrows on normal bows tho
vital night
https://cpecific.github.io/hades-wiki/
also this site doesn't have concentrated volley?
tight basin
the icon is there but the text is wrong lol
untold iris
weird
tight basin
Yeah the name is wrong but the caption is accurate
tight basin
No it's 3
vital night
huh, i guess it is
untold iris
You're never hitting all 9 arrows on normal bows tho
you can technically get right next to a big enemy, but it's kind of unsafe due to the special being somewhat laggy
vital night
Also I heard that double strike makes every chiron special arrow trigger a bolt. is that true?
vagrant crane
no
vital night
ait
plain river
Also I think it's +5, not +3
It’s +3
plain river
Also I heard that double strike makes every chiron special arrow trigger a bolt....
❌ double volt doesn’t change the internal cooldown for bolts
It’s still .2 seconds
vital night
unfortunate
plain river
So you’re get 1-2 and maybe 3-4 w/double strike
vital night
this means chiron still feels unplayable
vital night
how should i use chiron
I've tried zeus and artemis on special and the damage just falls off late game
even with heart rend
plain river
Hangover or if first hammer is concentrated you can do +%
vital night
I'm modded so can get concentrated
vital night
hm i c
plain river
And you can just source special +% from chiron and hermes
vital night
i c
plain river
Note that aside from hyper sprint/rush delivery and greater reflex, swift flourish is actually a good choice on chiron
Since the special is stupid slow, and if swift flourish is purple, you hit fast enough for concentrated volley to keep stacking
vital night
oh that's funny
plain river
Every rarity of swift flourish will let you get 4 volley in before the chiron targetting wears off
vital night
cool
plain river
relentless is good, piercing volley is good although it does mess with how the special fundementally works
It’s like a shortened range or smthing iirc
plain river
Eh close enough for it to be noticable 
Cuz I had issues with both
And honestly if you don’t see the special hammers you just prioritse it like it’s regular bow
flurry is a bit helpful for faster target applying
rocky arrow
Is mirage shot still bugged on Beowulf?
proper furnace
yeah
rocky arrow
Let's go
cerulean salmon
I read that using Stubborn Defiance is the way to go if you're trying to get better at the game.
And boy do I suck, apparently.
proper furnace
I read that using Stubborn Defiance is the way to go if you're trying to get bet...
stubborn is only better at high heat where no healing is in effect
so idk what context you heard that
proper furnace
the only other reason for stubborn earlier would be if you are dying way too much at normal encounters
untold iris
if you're really bad and dying to regular encounters a lot stubborn defiance is a good safety net for you to learn those encounters
cerulean salmon
I mean... Elysium is where I was getting dropped. Up until then; it's a breeze.
untold iris
if you're okay at normal rooms already the big bottleneck for you is probably a boss
in which case having 3 death defiances going into the boss is a big deal since its a lot of mistakes you can make and still win
proper furnace
elysium is an usual barrier
but tbh more than practice it could also be build issue
untold iris
then later on when you turn the heat really high you have 0 healing and stubborn defiance becomes good again
you just have to accept that you can make less mistakes into a boss due to only one defiance
cerulean salmon
Funny enough. I think I take more damage at hydra and Elysium rooms than I do with Theseus/Asterius.
untold iris
because you need stubborn defiance ot heal
cerulean salmon
The longspears and strongbows' especially.
proper furnace
you just have to accept that you can make less mistakes into a boss due to only ...
at least you can do the funny athena thing
cerulean salmon
Athena is my gal. Her and Artemis. Best boons imo.
proper furnace
if you get patty + the 2 athena dds is like more hp than the 3 dds
but is kinda asking a lot instead of just dumping darkness into the mirror lol
untold iris
tbh i crutched a bit on the athena bug for my high heat clears
untold iris
hades is still kind of hard for me to do without making mistakes since his HP pool is so big
proper furnace
There's a bug?
taking deathless or last stand while the stubborn slot is empty will give you a defiance
then you regain stubborn next room
untold iris
its a bug with athena + stubborn defiance specifically
you dont need to worry about it too much if you're not on high heat + stubborn defiance
cerulean salmon
Interesting
Probably something very competitive people have found. I've mostly been going through to complete the story (after bringing mum back).
proper furnace
that + stubborn defiance's patty item is a lot of heal
normally just either of these options is enough, if you have both kinda overkill
cerulean salmon
Probably something very competitive people have found. I've mostly been going t...
But I lowkey race myself. My best time was 28:21 for about 30 runs.
Then I randomly got 20:50 with the spear (Achilles) lol.
What's interesting is my prior record was with no additional heat. But the 20-minute time was with x9 heat. 😆
eager flint
9 heat is the recommended speedrunning pact lol
Funny coincidence you had a similar heat
tight basin
Fun fact, if your cores are Athena and Demeter since you're going for stubborn roots, then your build is likely gonna suck lmao
plain river
Fun fact, if your cores are Athena and Demeter since you're going for stubborn r...
Gunning for defensive boons when trying for speed is
tight basin
gaming
plain river
I was about to say “I guess I take egg for rarity” but
I have EA
Oh I have a prior dumb ss but I’m not sending it till I finish this run
plain river
Real
Gotta save my rerolls for rd
I mean
Hopefully I get rd
I used so many rerolls on hermes 2 and hermes 3 last run to end up with 280% movespeed and no rd
plain river
I had so much flat damage soup and no rd
tight basin
yesterday i had 4 bad rama runs but i did get rd once lmao
plain river
Actually Imm going to send the ss now
analog mauve
yesterday i had 4 bad rama runs but i did get rd once lmao
i got my rama sub9 😌
tight basin
im trying for sub8 lmao
plain river
Thank goodness vengeance can’t open curs eof drowning
Urge to kill isn’t pommable right
analog mauve
it is
plain river
bruh
I mean it’s either urge to kill or battle rage hmmm
Moment of truth 2nd hermes
RD
Triple is the ideal achilles 2nd hammer right?
After flurry
analog mauve
Yea
tight basin
Extending isn't bad either
plain river
Extending isn't bad either
I was choosing between both when I asked
ivory turtle
Say that you have deadly reversal. Would it be better to stick with pos dash for the regular old DPS or sell it off and go for Athena dash? I'm playing guan yu with divine attack
tight basin
if you have quick spin and can actually pull it off well then the atk should be enough
depends on if you were seeing a lot of deflects pop up
untold iris
if you already have charged skewer and deadly reversal i would personally try for athena dash + artemis special
ivory turtle
Too much bonk, not enough skill 🥲
lucid oar
@glacial sonnet this is good
glacial sonnet
how's the hidden fist aspect do on lvl1-2?
maim sounds fun with some dodging
or for that matter the hidden bow
i already have it lvl 1 but not tried it yet
ok nvm im gna try lvl 2 gilgamesh
vital night
how's the hidden fist aspect do on lvl1-2?
It’s fine. I don’t really use the maim damage in practice
Might help for room clear speed in tart
You could try tidal dash+poseidon secondaries as a build that doesn’t really rely on maim damage
vagrant crane
how's the hidden fist aspect do on lvl1-2?
it sucks
at every levle
its the worst aspect in the game
eager flint
And hidden bow is high/top tier
You can make it work at lvl 1 but it does get significantly stronger with levels
analog mauve
rama suxxx
eager flint
But imo rama lvl1 is better than quite a few lvl5 aspects
eager flint
rama suxxx
You got false in your name, your opinion is invalid
dapper harness
But imo rama lvl1 is better than quite a few lvl5 aspects
the aspect immediately above it:
dapper harness
I thought you were talking abt hera lol
glacial sonnet
idk i feel good going brr with dio attack rn
plain river
how's the hidden fist aspect do on lvl1-2?
Honestly levels don’t really improve gilga that much. An ideal build is only getting it as minor chunk damage on bosses and even then it’s at tradeoff of your hp. Shorter dashes, slower dash strikes and longer dash cooldown make it a way less safe and effective aspect of fists
glacial sonnet
does hermes boon on attack speed improve the speed bows charge up and hit the sweetspot?
vagrant crane
does hermes boon on attack speed improve the speed bows charge up and hit the sw...
only on standing strike
so its useless
plain river
only on standing strike
Even at 30% it’s still slightly slower than dstrike and you have to be standing around
kindred ether
what boons do I need for a aspect of zeus shield doom tick build?
merciful end for sure
kindred ether
ight
vagrant crane
u want to pom the spec
kindred ether
and diving dash probably?
vagrant crane
dont need it
kindred ether
oh cool
kindred ether
then you just throw your shield and hit enemies
vagrant crane
yeah
kindred ether
thansk
vagrant crane
this build was garbage
but i have the main cmoponents
of athena atk doom spec and ME
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKRpCbjGrIU this was a good build
kindred ether
alright tysm for the help! excited to try it
rocky arrow
What are some fun builds for ppl like me who like melting bosses' health bars?
south sonnet
What are some fun builds for ppl like me who like melting bosses' health bars?
beo
flood flare/trippy flare+mirage shot
dont get ice wine as that breaks a funny mirage shot bug
rocky arrow
Oh that's why one of my beo runs felt underpowered. I got ice wine early and felt like trash once I got mirage shot since I was expecting so much more damage lol
round umbra
Do things that make enemies take % more add or multiply with other damage buffs?
vagrant crane
Do things that make enemies take % more add or multiply with other damage buffs?
add
but those will also increase trap and summon damage
sweet surredner targeting system maim
maybe other stuff
proper furnace
those are the only three
round umbra
Cool cool
vagrant crane
Priviledged status is additive too but doesn’t affect summon/trap damage
it says you deal more damage irght
like boiling blood
plain river
like boiling blood
Wdym by
vagrant crane
like its inflicted on enemy but it still says u deal more damage to them
not that they take more damage
plain river
like its inflicted on enemy but it still says u deal more damage to them
Is blackout just hangover damage
Or is it universal too
round umbra
Ooh yeah looks like a 4th, says they take bonus damage
Least according to the wiki
How does Chaos legendary work with stubborn?
vagrant crane
How does Chaos legendary work with stubborn?
u get another dd
used after sd
fun fact
chaos legendary is not affected by any rarity modifiers
and has a base chance of like 5% or something
round umbra
So you can have 1 skelly tooth for 100 hp, 3 dds giving 50% health, and 1 sd for 30% health all at once?
proper furnace
2 from athena
vagrant crane
6yea
round umbra
wait can you get multiple chaos dds?
vagrant crane
yea
round umbra
weird
Is there a max number of chaos gates you can get? Like, is every other chamber technically possible?
vagrant crane
they r rare
plain river
So you can have 1 skelly tooth for 100 hp, 3 dds giving 50% health, and 1 sd for...
Ok yeah but you could have all this and then just replace skelly with acorn for more hp
round umbra
If you have 15 chaos defiances there might be better keepsakes than even the acorn lol
proper furnace
collar gaming
plain river
If you have 15 chaos defiances there might be better keepsakes than even the aco...
Yeah like hourglass or dad call
Get your damage from somewhere
gleaming hearth
On the shield which aspects should I focus on
proper furnace
Zeus or beo
gleaming hearth
Thanks, ill do zeus since i dont think i have that beo one yet
south sonnet
If you have 15 chaos defiances there might be better keepsakes than even the aco...
pots still say no
750 damage blocked by acorn
that would be 29 dds
round umbra
Why are you taking damage solely from pots?
Also are we comparing items to items or acorn to chaos defiances?
Collar is 12.5 HP+other stuff so that'd take even longer to get to 750.
south sonnet
Collar is 12.5 HP+other stuff so that'd take even longer to get to 750.
collar is +50 hp, and dds heal 50% of your health, so its a total of 25 health per dd added by collar(plus the initial 50)
round umbra
Oh right 50 whoops
gleaming hearth
If I do unlock the final aspect for the shield then does it take away the extra shield from the special
valid dagger
If I do unlock the final aspect for the shield then does it take away the extra ...
the extra shield on special comes from another aspect so yes. But you can select it back whenever you want. You can only have one aspect selected at a time
gleaming hearth
Ah ok thank you
plain river
If I do unlock the final aspect for the shield then does it take away the extra ...
unlocking beowulf itself won’t do that
Changing your selected aspect from Chaos to Beowolf will
dawn gale
do i choose doulbe edge or cruel thrust on nemesis i think i may choose double edge
proper furnace
Double edge is the best hammer by far yeah
vital night
do i choose doulbe edge or cruel thrust on nemesis i think i may choose double e...
Cruel thrust doesn’t apply to dstrike
south sonnet
do i choose doulbe edge or cruel thrust on nemesis i think i may choose double e...
cruel thrust is garbage as well
vital night
Even though it’s a thrust…
south sonnet
NEVER use standing strikes on sword unless its hidden
dawn gale
oh
south sonnet
or flurry, which is also bad(its a meme)
proper furnace
You can unironically rank sword hammers like
"Is dedge"
"Is not dedge"
dawn gale
i see isee
analog mauve
there are 3 teirs
vital night
Unless shadow slash with hidden
analog mauve
dedge
neutral
runkiller
south sonnet
You can unironically rank sword hammers like
"Is dedge"
"Is not dedge"
@ shackle
proper furnace
You can unironically rank sword hammers like
"Is dedge"
"Is not dedge"
(there's actually more nuance but is funnier like this)
Some hammers are legit harmful
dawn gale
can i play lil risky and go with hunter dash on nemesis
or just divine dash
divine dash is boring
proper furnace
Hunter works
dawn gale
yaaya okioki thankksss
worthy jasper
I've not played this in forever. If I'm taking a fully leveled zag bow I guess I should take something like Aphrodite for the base damage?
tight basin
yeah
proper furnace
aphro or artemis work
tight basin
or arty if you want more crits
i'd only do arty if you can get triple or twin shot tho
or maybe flurry
worthy jasper
If I take artemis I do crit more but if I'm out of practice I should probably pick it the other way around.
If weak is on the base attack then I don't need to add in a second attack for consistency.
The damage bonus from blood gems doesn't stack right?
tight basin
no
plain river
Even though it’s a thrust…
Honestly if it did affect dash strikes it would be broken though
Well
“Broken”
Is a word I would use more lightly if i wasn’t tired
proper furnace
triple/twin first is always ideal
worthy jasper
Does each hit from triple have its own chance to crit?
proper furnace
yeah
worthy jasper
Wasn't there a boon out there that gave you a buff every time you call?
worthy jasper
Billowing?
proper furnace
billowing is from zeus
global dmg buff after call
second wind is dodge + movement speed after call
from hermes
worthy jasper
Ty
rocky arrow
Are hunting blades builds really that fun?
I've seen mixed reviews of them and I wanna try one lol
tight basin
what are the negatives you've seen lmao
i've never seen anything negative about them
worthy jasper
Man I never get through lernie without using a defiance.
proper furnace
just call it the lernie tax and move on
worthy jasper
plain river
I've seen mixed reviews of them and I wanna try one lol
Never heard any bad reviews of it ever
tight basin
happens to the best of us
worthy jasper
My cat did not like that word Lernie tax. Gave it a big fat zero.
tight basin
the only thing i can think of hunting blades being bad is that if you dont get the duo, you might've put in too many resources into the cast and the cast is gonna suck without the duo
worthy jasper
I also keep forgetting I have summons.
gleaming hearth
What would be the best companion for the shield
plain river
What would be the best companion for the shield
Companions don’t change regardless of the weapon
Battie (Megaera) is universally the best
Great damage, aoe, at a usable amount of speed
gleaming hearth
Thank you, as I dont have any yet and I wanted one i could focus on
worthy jasper
I like Bouldy for the healing and money
Whew, I actually got the Charon twice in a row achievement
With only a sliver of health left and no defiances tho.
plain river
I like Bouldy for the healing and money
I mean… he certainly does give you those things
rocky arrow
Charons easy with the right build personally
worthy jasper
Yeah but you can't really guarantee you're fighting him with "The right build"
plain river
The biggest issue with facing him isn’t your build
It’s the lack of experience with the fight
Since you never see him
If you just take bag every time you see it you’ll get there
worthy jasper
Well you have to understand it may have been over a year since I last played this.
plain river
I predominantly take bag in tart over every other biome since I have the least to lose and the most to gain
worthy jasper
So I was actually very excited that I was able to beat him. And get that achievement to boot.
tight basin
It’s the lack of experience with the fight
i'm gonna take a charon fight in ely with beo out of spite
plain river
I just wanted to say that it hopefully shouldn’t seem so daunting w/ practice
rocky arrow
Stygian or Infernal for hunting blades?
proper furnace
infernal
worthy jasper
Man, Plume runs are fun.
pure lynx
wish i could stack it with other items
fervent root
Guys I need SO MUCH HELP on Guan Yu…
untold iris
can play it as a cheesy bow
just spam special and be super safe
only charge spin attack when enemies are spawning and you're not threatened
fervent root
I appreciate the tips!
worthy jasper
Running Guan Yu as if it were an exploding launcher build is legit.
The healing spin is a bit of a trap.
glacial sonnet
scintillating feast or splitting bolt
dapper harness
what aspect and build
valid dagger
yeah nvm its jank <:kekhands:1112850519199850527>
Needs Ice Wine
glacial sonnet
does dashing flight mean my special flies faster while i am in the middle of dash or is it like dash + special move?
proper furnace
Dash + special pretty sure
viral geode
The healing spin is a bit of a trap.
would disagree, i tried the spin out and it can be very effective
quick spin makes it easier of course
proper furnace
Quick vs not having it is a world of difference
W/o it at most you should use it before enemies spawns
viral geode
i do often get away with spins even on fo2, if i anticipate the enemy's attacks right
that being said, sometimes it does make you get hit
worthy jasper
I mean everything you said might be true but that's not really mutually exclusive to it being a bit of a trap.
Like, people can see the healing spin and think it allows for reckless play. At best it lets you make up for some mistakes if used right.
proper furnace
There's a gy 60 with massive spin divine strike lol
So not wrong
But also Cskewer comfy
eager flint
gy 60 sounds so painful
Although spin build + Athena makes it so much safer it's crazy
analog mauve
Yea they got rush delivery in that
eager flint
Yeah, I was thinking "does it have enough DPS?"
analog mauve
And still went over a minute overtime iirc
eager flint
JS CP TD kinda harsh
eager flint
And still went over a minute overtime iirc
Well I guess that's a way to solve that issue
viral geode
ap2 rush delivery must be really rare
eager flint
True
I kinda dislike how RNG the game gets at very high difficulty
Be it top speedrunning or very high heat
proper furnace
do you have the link
analog mauve
I mean, thats half of what makes it difficult
analog mauve
Fair
eager flint
I'm here to play a game, not coinflips
errant narwhal
guan yu 60 
eager flint
Like I don't mind AP2 being "you have to make do with what you can find" but the thing is, you kinda need things like hyper delivery. It's not a high roll, it's a min roll to be doable. And it's far from guaranteed, so most runs go to the gutter just based on RNG
Though some would say it's an issue of balance
Hyper delivery is just so good it eclipses other builds
viral geode
sometimes i think the game is just not designed to be played at such high levels, it's just stuff like rd that makes it possible
analog mauve
I don't think hyperdelivery is a min roll for anything heat related
proper furnace
sometimes i think the game is just not designed to be played at such high levels...
You aren't wrong tbh
viral geode
i've calculated it to be 0.83% no rolls, 1.6% with 1 roll
analog mauve
for ap2 standards thats quite high idk
thrice every 150 runs i have a chance to get rush delivery
analog mauve
thats even better
viral geode
thrice every 150 runs i have a chance to get rush delivery
is this just 1 in 50?
viral geode
it's ok i'm probably over-analysing this
worthy jasper
Do priv status and merciful end have synergy or anti synergy?
proper furnace
It works like usual but you want gam favs anyways
ME is already a needy build
Don't wanna add extra stuff
worthy jasper
Tried EM Dad for the first time.
Did not go well.
I did make it to phase 3 but I lost a lot of hp getting there.
Maybe I should have brought he spear point instead of the nut?
proper furnace
Acron still works better but depends largely on summons
I rather take tooth than spearpoint if I'm honest too
worthy jasper
For the defiance?
I knew a little bit about how there would be minibosses instead of regular armored enemies. And that there would be third phase. There were a few things that I didn't expect though. The darkness makes the whole thing a bit more claustrophobic. Makes it harder to see where the skulls are.
proper furnace
Turn up the brightness setting
rocky arrow
How would a build with zag spear, flurry and triple jab, aphro on special, arty on attack, then hyper delivery and heart rend fair?
Would require RN-Jesus to bless your game but theoretically I think it would be op af
plain river
How would a build with zag spear, flurry and triple jab, aphro on special, arty ...
It would just be like… well why not do this on achilles
Free +150% attack damage and better rng for your hammers
rocky arrow
Oh yeah I was just thinking about the attack speed bonus from zag but forgot about the free damage on Achilles lol
Oh no zag is spec speed not attack whoops
eager flint
yeah, I was confused for a moment xD
zagspear is just exploding launcher + charged skewer if you want to build it up to its "strength"
or you just do ME and/or flurry jab
glacial sonnet
do i need to have lost a death defiance charge to trigger chaos offering their defiance boon? on top of having onther one of their boons beforehand
proper furnace
Nah
Chaos legendary is just rare
Iirc none of the bonuses for Legends apply to it
untold iris
About 15% odds you see it on your 2nd+ chaos for the run
Each slot is 5% odds to be legendary and the chance is unaffected by rarity bonuses
worthy jasper
How is Ares for flat damage if I take the boon that increases the damage for each hit?
eager flint
ares is kinda weird
rule of thumb is "it's ok but not optimal"
dire misfortune is usually not that great. It's also in the "ok but not optimal" category
worthy jasper
I just think I'll go for the usual priv status fists
worthy jasper
It is what I usually go for
eager flint
fair enough x)
worthy jasper
I like priv status fists
vital night
fist is often either ME or zapfist
Both for priv status 🧠
worthy jasper
So... What started out as an attempt at a good Hestia run (I am bad with Hestia it's kinda clunky), ended up becoming some kind of weird Call based Spash Dash run instead. With me sometimes unloading a Hestia shot.
eager flint
based
untold iris
The issue I have with priv status is that a lot of builds need to go out of their way to apply 2 status
Especially since half the gods don't have status on their core and need a secondary
eager flint
That's not an issue only you have x)
Most people agree that family favorite is better
Well, most people who are nerds about the game. Casually ofc anything works.
untold iris
A big problem is actually just pressing your second button enough to constantly have a second status on
Tbh if you play with priv status it makes status dashes better I think
Since dashing a lot is really common but you don't always press two different attacks frequently
I've been doing random runs without forcing gods while leveling stuff and I've grown to appreciate random other dashes besides divine + splash dash
Something like passion dash is cool because it's easy permanent status for stuff like heart rend or priv status
worthy jasper
I mean, the point is I'm running a build that uses priv status, therefore it has two status curses I can inflict. Otherwise I would not be choosing priv status.
eager flint
Hmm sword uses both attack and special, achilles spear do too, hades too I guess, as well as chiron and rama for bows, and hera has attack + cast, then fist often uses attack on top of special, and rail uses both all the time
eager flint
You make big spin to give the mark, then you throw exploding launcher/charged skewers at the enemy
untold iris
Oh with launcher
tight basin
you'd ideally have exploding launcher, and you do special -> 2x dash strikes
or whatever like that
untold iris
If you're not forcing the hammer though the special is so bad 😦
eager flint
yeah
tight basin
Hmm sword uses both attack and special, achilles spear do too, hades too I guess...
the issue with those builds is like
you dont want any of the gods that naturally have curses
eager flint
It's crazy to me that exploding launcher (or a nerfed version) is not baseline. Or even just the achilles special.
tight basin
except chiron
worthy jasper
What are you talking about?
tight basin
pstatus being cringe
worthy jasper
Guan Yu has such a special
worthy jasper
Yes?
untold iris
With regular spear special is terrible unless you get the right hammers
eager flint
I mean, special builds are good on zagspect and hades too... if you get exploding/charged
untold iris
So spear has big issues producing pstatus unless you get a status on your dash
worthy jasper
I thought achilles was more for casts.
tight basin
oh that too
eager flint
I mean, even without the boost the special in itself is a lot more fun/easy to play than the others
worthy jasper
In which case the special doesn't need anything fancy.
tight basin
So spear has big issues producing pstatus unless you get a status on your dash
that's the majority of aspects
unless you do like dem and aphro
worthy jasper
I mean... The point is... I'm using a build that uses two status curses, therefore I use priv status.
Otherwise I would not use priv status.
untold iris
It's possible maybe that pstatus is better for endgame bosses if you focus on it?
worthy jasper
Not that hard to understand is it?
untold iris
Even on bad aspects for it
tight basin
I mean... The point is... I'm using a build that uses two status curses, therefo...
i mean i frankly did not know what this convo started from lmao so that's fine
tight basin
It's possible maybe that pstatus is better for endgame bosses if you focus on it...
pstatus is only good in the late game basically
but that's assuming the build you end up with is like
good
and not jank to get pstatus going
untold iris
I'm just thinking, 40% after two hits matters a lot more vs hades
Than vs random enemy
tight basin
yeah it's good for bosses and tanky ely enemies
worthy jasper
Well it's like, if you're using drunken strike / passion dash....
tight basin
is this fists?
tight basin
i mean ideally yeah
tight basin
i mean frankly pstatus only really benefits hangover builds because your hits dont really matter
untold iris
Zeus is overall stronger but I appreciate dio as well now
Does FF also benefit hangover?
proper furnace
Does FF also benefit hangover?
yeah
untold iris
I guess the argument is that the first two actual attacks aren't meaningful
worthy jasper
I mean it depends on how many gods you take past the fourth one.
tight basin
Does FF also benefit hangover?
yeah but the point is that the issue of pstatus needing 2 hits doesn't matter for hangover
untold iris
So the +25 on the 2 hits doesn't matter
tight basin
yeah exactly
worthy jasper
If the second hit comes from the dash it's fine. If something awkward happens, dash upper isn't actually a bad move.
untold iris
So 40 vs 25
worthy jasper
I thought the god pool went up to 4 unless you take trinkets?
proper furnace
hermes
untold iris
4 gods + hermes
worthy jasper
Oh he counts? Then yeah 25 I guess.
eager flint
yep, hermes is an olympian despite being outside the god pool
worthy jasper
In my priv status run priv status was actually online in tart already because I got exposed on special.
eager flint
In a somewhat similar way, Hades still gives you the "no boons from olympians" special dialogue if you have boons from Chaos, because they're not olympians.
proper furnace
acshually is bc you can't sell their boons
the dialogue is for not having sellable boons
worthy jasper
Oh right, I guess you cannot reach Hades with zero boons unless you sell all your boons. And don't get unlucky with styx
eager flint
none then
untold iris
So pstatus is mostly good if you have two of demeter aphro dio on your buttons
worthy jasper
Can with with dire misfortune and the usual global damage modifiers.
untold iris
I don't think doom is reliable since it forces you to press secondary every 1 second
tight basin
How many weapons use doom as primary damage? None?
ares attack on passion beo because of ap2
untold iris
The other curses last long enough that it works though
eager flint
zeus is also there for jolted tbh
worthy jasper
Secondary curse can come from dash
eager flint
jolted kinda good
honestly poseidon rupture kinda good too, but much less than jolted. It lasts longer though.
worthy jasper
What you really want is thunderstorm or whatever that thing is called.
untold iris
Zeus/Poseidon/Athena can also work but requires a secondary boon
worthy jasper
Makes poseidon boons cast lightning and therefore jolted.
tight basin
sea storm
worthy jasper
I hear Super Soaker actually gets good with Sea Storm.
untold iris
What's wrong with exposed?
worthy jasper
Exposed isn't bad. If it's offered, you'll take it.
eager flint
it becomes bootleg zeus lucifer, which is good, so yes
proper furnace
I hear Super Soaker actually gets good with Sea Storm.
"good" as in same as just taking zeus attack
eager flint
Exposed isn't bad. If it's offered, you'll take it.
not over DD refills
And most cores I'd say
untold iris
Taking exposed makes DD more likely!
proper furnace
I'd take exposed purely bc of the priority
eager flint
or proud bearing
worthy jasper
?? Why would you refill what you haven't lost?
tight basin
I hear Super Soaker actually gets good with Sea Storm.
super soaker needs sea storm to be good
which at that point is just the normal luci build but with extra steps
proper furnace
is a good UC boon anyways
eager flint
bold of you to assume I haven't lost DDs
especially in high heat with stubborn defiance
untold iris
Can also do SD cheese
worthy jasper
super soaker needs sea storm to be good
which at that point is just the normal l...
Yes but it's fun. Remember fun?
proper furnace
soaker kinda miserable ngl
untold iris
Which is pretty big priority on high heat
eager flint
fun's subjective
tight basin
i mean yeah but i'm just saying an objective point lmao
i never said super soaker was bad
eager flint
and even if it's bad doesn't mean it's not fun
if only good things were fun we'd all be jazz :p
untold iris
What builds do you think are worth forcing and make you want to take p-status?
worthy jasper
Jazz?
untold iris
Just dio?
worthy jasper
Drunken Strike
tight basin
passion beo meta is pstatus
worthy jasper
Demeter builds if you're into that stuff.
untold iris
Ok I can buy beo
tight basin
other than that uh
untold iris
So mostly dio builds and cast stuff
tight basin
:)
i wouldnt say "cast stuff" it's more like specifically beo
maybe hera kinda but thats a bit more sus
worthy jasper
Passion Beo? Wait what goes on the attack then? Demeter?
untold iris
Is it not good on like hera?
tight basin
Passion Beo? Wait what goes on the attack then? Demeter?
yeah
or snow burst
snow burst is generally better but frost strike works fine
tight basin
Is it not good on like hera?
hera cast doesnt go boom
it can work ofc
but like you'd get much less bang for your buck
worthy jasper
Snow burst pops when you hit the cast button right?
tight basin
because it's just a lot less aoe you're working with
tight basin
Snow burst pops when you hit the cast button right?
yes
fervent root
Guys, I have current build of Aphrodite on Attack and Zeus on Special with the Aspect Of Rama.
fervent root
In the final encounter/boss of Elysium. Any tips for The Champions?
eager flint
do you have the companion for meg ?
untold iris
Are you newish?
proper furnace
they have skelly I think
fervent root
do you have the companion for meg ?
Yeah I finally do have her’s now.
untold iris
If you're less experienced with the fight it's easiest to focus asterius first
And save full call for second phase theseus
tight basin
if you have twin/triple shot and a good second hammer with acorn you can just unga bunga it
eager flint
Yeah I finally do have her’s now.
then, to hit both you need to move up first, at the very start of the fight
untold iris
If you're experienced you can just kill them both at the same time
worthy jasper
If it's normal champions, I'd also focus asterius.
plain river
saving a full call is only for select calls
tight basin
make sure to have shared suffering on both
fervent root
then, to hit both you need to move up first, at the very start of the fight
Got it.
worthy jasper
In EM champions I usually focus down theseus instead.
plain river
Like artemis and aphrodite and aside from that you just use minor calls asap
proper furnace
you also kinda need juiced up zeus to full charge call on rama tbh
untold iris
Basically kite asterius so that he's far enough away from theseus
proper furnace
or like rod
untold iris
Either dash when needed to dodge spears or make sure you're behind a pillar
fervent root
you also kinda need juiced up zeus to full charge call on rama tbh
Have been pomming it up on Thunder Flourish.
untold iris
Other than that just fight asterius as normal
worthy jasper
Although recently I just kinda yolo and burst both of them down and somehow survive.
I'm not sure how I'm doing it tbh.
proper furnace
Have been pomming it up on Thunder Flourish.
juiced up as in double strike/jolted/splitting bolt
plain river
Have been pomming it up on Thunder Flourish.
You really pom up static jolted
untold iris
Bursting both is what you do once you're better at that fight, and probably have companion
plain river
Not flourish
worthy jasper
Like I barely even bother avoiding his spin to win move anymore. I just kinda tank it?
plain river
Which doesn’t exactly work great at higher heat
fervent root
Wait was it flourish? I’m trying to remember…
proper furnace
for dealing with theseus once bull is down you can either just dodge the spear throws or stand next to him to bait spin attack
dash through it and shoot at his back
plain river
Wait was it flourish? I’m trying to remember…
Flourish = special
proper furnace
repeat until death
worthy jasper
I will obviously adjust my strategies for when circumstance schance.
plain river
I have to check once I get back to the run.
If it’s zeus on special it’s flourish 100%
worthy jasper
Oddly enough in any Zeus focused build I always get static discharge somehow.
untold iris
It's priority
fervent root
Bro, me too…
proper furnace
if the god has it's curse as secondary is a 50% to show up
worthy jasper
Well it's just, I never don't get it.
untold iris
50% odds to show up
plain river
Oddly enough in any Zeus focused build I always get static discharge somehow.
Status curses = priority in boons
like cores
untold iris
So it's very very likely you see it at some point
worthy jasper
I didn't know boons were weighted.
plain river
the game doesn’t tell you it’s weighted
worthy jasper
Do you mean you 100% get one core boon?
worthy jasper
Is this 100% core boon always one you don't have?
untold iris
No
plain river
Do you mean you 100% get one core boon?
Yeah so it messes up your duo odds to have an open core
fervent root
BTW, I’m referencing from this glorious website right here for Aspect Of Rama. https://www.leereamsnyder.com/hades-build-guide
untold iris
10% chance you get offered a core replacement
proper furnace
regarding the core priority, were duos rolled before this or nah
fervent root
Hence why I have Zeus on special.
proper furnace
never remember
untold iris
If not and you have an empty core you will get offered that core
worthy jasper
Oh is that why replacement boons appear in the top slot more often than other slots?
fervent root
What’s a core? Oh wait, isn’t that like attack and special?
proper furnace
yeah
fervent root
Dash, cast, and call?
untold iris
Attack special cast dash
proper furnace
also while call is on the cores
plain river
Dash, cast, and call?
Not call
worthy jasper
Core boon is any of the five slots that's always visible.
proper furnace
it doesn't have priority
worthy jasper
Attack/Special/Cast/Dash/Call