h1-discussion

[molten parrot]

what is forced overtime?

[signal aspen]

makes enemies faster

and it makes them spawn faster

[molten parrot]

ooooh

i see

[half zephyr]

Don’t think so no
Only time will tell, but I believe you’ll just be friends from now on

[signal aspen]

you cant change it

[half zephyr]

This is wrong

[keen marsh]

Hello!!

[signal aspen]

hello

[keen marsh]

Just wanted to pop in and make myself present lol. Attempting more bow runs

[signal aspen]

alright

good luck on your bow runs

[high island]

TD3 is fine, it just doesn't really like FO2. But that's not an issue below like 40 Heat.

Generally, all aspects can do TD3 comfortably.

It also doesn't like DC, of course.

[half zephyr]

Not all players though

[signal aspen]

i cant do td3

[half zephyr]

Have to get used to being fast first

I still take too long with TD2

[high island]

Indeed, but that's more the players than the aspects.

[warm egret]

:c

[rotund lava]

Oh wow

[half zephyr]

[rotund lava]

I got to the 2nd area last night and thought it would send me there after death

[half zephyr]

this is a roguelite

you start from the beginning

[rotund lava]

You have to keep running through the first part?

[half zephyr]

each time

[rotund lava]

Sheesh

[half zephyr]

that's a roguelike/lite

[signal aspen]

yeah

[high island]

You'll get better at it, and faster.

[signal aspen]

you will collect things that make you stronger

[half zephyr]

mhmm

only "permanent" things are mirror upgrades, weapon upgrades (not hammers) & your skill

[rotund lava]

Not sure if I missed anything but at the beginning they didn’t really explain much, like who I am and what am I trying to do

Or did I miss that

[half zephyr]

and the first can be disabled & the last can be forgotten

[rotund lava]

Thanks

[half zephyr]

keep playing the game & you'll find out

interact with everyone you can

the story will be revealed

also, if you don't want spoilers you should head over to #h1-for-new-players
this is a very spoilery channel

[rotund lava]

Gotcha ty

[signal aspen]

||aquaman drowns in hades||

[half zephyr]

[half zephyr]

[rotund lava]

Wait

Bosses respawn?

[half zephyr]

yes..

after each run

[signal aspen]

its a roguelite

[half zephyr]

it's a roguelite

[rotund lava]

Ahh man 💀

They don’t respawn in returnal

[half zephyr]

well, normally in roguelikes & roguelites, bosses respawn

you do the same game over & over

what changes is your build

and the layouts

[rotund lava]

Yea I gotta play smarter then if bosses respawn

[half zephyr]

sometimes also the bosses you encounter

[rotund lava]

So you legit have to beat the entire game in one run?

[brisk trail]

yuh

[half zephyr]

that's not possible

but

you have to clear it in 1 run

beating it is a different thing

it'll get easier as you get more used to enemy patterns & the boons & hammers you get offered + your mirror talents & weapons

[rotund lava]

I see

[half zephyr]

you'll want to unlock all weapons

[signal aspen]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/659820450297282585/851456131007774810/Screenshot_304.png

yay

[half zephyr]

sad

I hate it when I'm 1 obol from affording a boon
so annoying

[signal aspen]

i usually fight charon if he gives me bad stuff in elysium mid shop

today i got bad stuff in the elysium mid shop but there was no money bag

charon scared to fight me

[glad leaf]

what are the odds of the charon fight appearing

are there requirements to trigger it?

[signal aspen]

i think its like 20% of the time

you need to kill hades for it to appear

and it only appears in a midshop

[glad leaf]

midshop?

so not tartarus or styx

[signal aspen]

midshop

like the first shop in each biome

[glad leaf]

i see

[half zephyr]

the not-right-before-boss shop

[signal aspen]

in the middle

[half zephyr]

thus the mid shop

[robust scaffold]

the first shop

[signal aspen]

also yeah it cant show up in styx

[brisk trail]

Okay, lemme clear up some misconceptions.

After beating Hades the first time, there is a 22% chance per run that Charon's Mario Party Bag will appear in one mid-biome shop.

[half zephyr]

mhm

[brisk trail]

This can be in Tartarus, Asphodel, or Elysium.

It will only spawn in that one shop.

If you see it in Tartarus, it will not appear in Asphodel or Elysium.

[robust scaffold]

nice

[half zephyr]

I wish I could pick it up

[signal aspen]

nice

[half zephyr]

It's appeared so many times for me by now, but I can't do it on baby file yet

[robust scaffold]

i also havent beaten it yet lol

[half zephyr]

beating normally is easy

[robust scaffold]

i should do some low heat runs to try beat him sometime

[half zephyr]

but baby file is on 32 heat

can't even survive Lernie

[robust scaffold]

oof

[half zephyr]

can't survive meg either

[signal aspen]

you just bad

[half zephyr]

her sisters are easy tho

[half zephyr]

yes I am

[robust scaffold]

use ur companion

helps a lot with first boss

[half zephyr]

I can't

battie can't be used in first boss lol

[robust scaffold]

use a different one then lol

[signal aspen]

baby file

[half zephyr]

I only have battie

it's a baby file

[robust scaffold]

hmm

no choice then

[half zephyr]

and Than refuses to unlock his heart

on the plus side I will be able to get Fidi next time I see Dusa

but Than is being too slow!

[unreal atlas]

Does this mean there's a 7.3% chance of it appearing in any particular shop, and if you don't go to that shop you don't see the bag in either of the other?

[brisk trail]

I suppose.

[unreal atlas]

It spawns in the Tartarus shop even if you don't go to it. I guess.

[brisk trail]

Yes.

[robust scaffold]

how do i change the boon screen that i get when winning a run?

[signal aspen]

buy everything in the work orders section

and i think you have to get bonds with certain characters

[robust scaffold]

i mean

after getting it

how do i choose which one i want to use

[signal aspen]

if you buy it it will automatically be applied

[robust scaffold]

wait what

[signal aspen]

and you can go to the work orders section to change it

[robust scaffold]

oh okay

ill check that then

nice

thanks

[signal aspen]

np

[signal aspen]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/659820450297282585/851489702146080848/pp2.png

i got pp to 100 wins

[half zephyr]

[quartz garden]

Is there a condition or rule when mid-shops appear? For example tartarus has 14 chambers iirc, will the mid-shop always be in chamber 7 or can it appear in chamber 6-8?

[brisk trail]

No.

When we say "mid-biome" we don't mean it's always going to be at the halfway point of a biome, just that it appears somewhere during the biome, before the final break-before-the-boss room.

[quartz garden]

so in theory you can get a mid-biome shop in tartarus’ chamber 12 and a regular shop in chamber 13?

[half zephyr]

I've had it appear 2-3 rooms before boss shop

[brisk trail]

I'm not sure about immediately before the break room, but I've gotten shops two rooms prior to the break room in every biome before.

It's great, grabbing a boon, then seeing Patty, then grabbing another.

[half zephyr]

so sad when it happens cuz I tend to be out of money for the boss shop

[half zephyr]

I love it more when patty comes in for the final rescue & it's patty>shop>boss

cuz if I spend money before patty I'll likely have no money for after patty

[brisk trail]

So a shop earlier in Elysium, then?

[half zephyr]

ye

early shop, battles, patty, shop, boss

perfect setup for me

exception being if I get charon

then I'd love to get shop>patty>shop>boss

ofc, that won't happen

think you got to have something between charon & patty

not sure

[quartz garden]

ending up in patty‘s room after a charon fight happened to me before. That felt good

[signal aspen]

i dont really care what happens after the charon fight in elysium

because i get the satisfaction of beating up charon for giving me bad shop items

[half zephyr]

[stark salmon]

hey guys, just got the game, playing on pc with xbox gamepad. Does anybody have any suggestions for control changes? thanks

[pure heart]

i just finish the epilogue of hades

[pure heart]

i use keyboard and mouse...

[stoic flame]

hidden aspect of shield or fists

which to unlock first

[signal aspen]

shield

[stoic flame]

alright

[manic bobcat]

Default control is fine.
Later on when you unlock a weapon called the Adamant Rail, it's advisable to switch your Reload button to LB and the Codex to something else. But if you are just getting started, the default scheme will do just fine.
Arguably there are some more "advanced" schemes such as putting cast on LB for certain "advanced" weapons. But those schemes are highly personal.
TLDR: No need to change anything until you know your way in and out of the game.

[covert juniper]

My button setup is everything the same but summon is lb, reload is lt, and codex is r stick

with shield do passion flare w/ ares attack and get the duo boon and it big damage

[rotund lava]

Man the 2nd level is really killing my framerate Jesus

First part of hell runs fine tho

[half zephyr]

Underworld

[stoic flame]

will i ever be entering that gate in the corner

[signal aspen]

nether

[half zephyr]

This isn’t Minecraft

[crude surge]

prove it

[signal aspen]

next to the lounge?

[stoic flame]

no

like next to that area with all those showcase pots and stuff

[half zephyr]

I can’t craft

And I can’t mine

[crude surge]

I can

git gud

[stoic flame]

noob

[half zephyr]

I can only fish

And fight

[signal aspen]

yeah

[stoic flame]

w h e n

[signal aspen]

you can break pillars and pots

10 clears

[half zephyr]

That’s not mining

[signal aspen]

yes it is

[stoic flame]

ah

[half zephyr]

You mine with a pickaxe

[stoic flame]

it is

no

u can mine with hands

as well

[half zephyr]

Don’t even have a pickaxe

[half zephyr]

Not if I want drops

[signal aspen]

you mine with your hands

[stoic flame]

???

mine dirt with hands

[half zephyr]

That’s called digging

[stoic flame]

so what

mining dirt

[crude surge]

mining is mining

[stoic flame]

is digging

key word here is ```mining````

[half zephyr]

Either way this isn’t Minecraft

[crude surge]

We outnumber you four to one

It's over Anakin

[half zephyr]

Ah, but I don’t care about that - I rule supreme

[half zephyr]

Ew

[stoic flame]

star wars fans have arrived

[signal aspen]

if its the underworld then i think of terraria

[half zephyr]

I don’t like Star Wars

It’s too boring

Anyways, it’s underworld

[stoic flame]

my man

terraria is mmmm

[half zephyr]

Never played

[stoic flame]

star wars kinda cringe tho

[half zephyr]

Never will

And this is now so far beyond hades discussion

[uncut dagger]

😔

[stoic flame]

true

[uncut dagger]

that's kinda right

[stoic flame]

sad reality

ive watched erry movie

the mandalorian was fire tho

[uncut dagger]

should we move to #tv-and-movies

[half zephyr]

Shut

[signal aspen]

who is star and why does he have so many wars?

[half zephyr]

He likes to blow up

with passion

[uncut dagger]

there are so many wars because they two stars fight over grapefruits

it's all based on a true story

[stoic flame]

yes

[signal aspen]

nice

[manic bobcat]

don't let me tell you about starcraft

spoiler, you don't craft any star in the series

[crude surge]

scam

[manic bobcat]

you can't play as Hades in Hades also

[half zephyr]

would you really want to though?
you'd have to do paperwork, listen to shades & then every now & then go to the surface to fight your son

[manic bobcat]

but i get to make snide comments all day long and no one dares to oppose me, maybe except my up-for-no-good son

[crude surge]

Papers Please but with an underworld theme

[half zephyr]

denied

[manic bobcat]

imagine human controlled hades vesus human controlled zagreus

[half zephyr]

fun

and scary

[manic bobcat]

who would win

[half zephyr]

the human

[manic bobcat]

smart

[half zephyr]

[torpid axle]

alright so I just reached hades for the first time

got rekt cuz he summons minions(of course he does)

went onto the wiki

[half zephyr]

uhhuh

[torpid axle]

read that he regenarates all his health once you get em down the first time.....

[half zephyr]

uhhuh

[torpid axle]

straight bull

[half zephyr]

why

[manic bobcat]

that would be Asterius

[half zephyr]

it's not that unusual is it?

[manic bobcat]

not Hades

[half zephyr]

[half zephyr]

why wouldn't Hades be able to do this?

[torpid axle]

cuz the last 2 bossfights have complete asinine amounts of HP

[half zephyr]

and?

[torpid axle]

it's really taking the fun of out of the game for me

[half zephyr]

wow

[modern garnet]

How do you think the bosses feel when you death defy them

[unborn remnant]

its not that bad if you have a good build

[half zephyr]

you would really not enjoy EM4 then

[brisk trail]

Hades' toolkit is supposed to be a reflection of Zagreus'.

[modern garnet]

It's true that the last 2 bosses have more health, it's because the game expects you to have a functional build by then

[pulsar ridge]

If you can defy death why can't your dad

[torpid axle]

because I kill him in about 300 hits and he kills me in 3

[modern garnet]

Which is to say, either your damage is high, or you can survive for a long time

[torpid axle]

that's why

[half zephyr]

then don't get hit

[torpid axle]

thanks Hypnos

[half zephyr]

follow the advice of Hypnos

[pulsar ridge]

You're also like twice as fast as him

[manic bobcat]

someone send him the 5s Champion fight

[pulsar ridge]

and you can completely nullify damage with some boons

[modern garnet]

Final bosses are allowed to be hard

[torpid axle]

speed ain't saving me if his sweep covers half the damn arena

[half zephyr]

if you find that you're struggling a lot, you can turn on god mode to help you until you don't need it anymore

[half zephyr]

dash

you have iframes

hades does not

afaik

I like to use max zag fist + max rank plume + ruthless reflex on my baby file

[torpid axle]

I did get to Hades in just 10 attempts I guess

[half zephyr]

so much dodge chance I rarely get hit

[pulsar ridge]

Yeah Hades is the hardest part of low heat runs by far

[manic bobcat]

then you are ahead of the curve

keep going you will be fine

[half zephyr]

tart charon?

[pulsar ridge]

Lemme rephrase it, hardest mandatory part

[modern garnet]

Learning to be ok with dying (to unfair stuff sometimes) is part of the game

[half zephyr]

[crude surge]

I love that they did this so much

[half zephyr]

shouldn't it be the other way though

since zag is the kid

[manic bobcat]

^

[brisk trail]

I suppose.

[torpid axle]

I'm the one complaining here but I still wouldn't call it unfair, just annoying. EtG challenge mode is unfair difficulty, this is just damage sponge bosses

[half zephyr]

but

they die so fast

[manic bobcat]

but yeah, they both have cast, dash attack, special, attack combo, etc

[pulsar ridge]

They're not damage sponges

[modern garnet]

Imagine looking in the mirror one day and realizing you've turned into your dad

[half zephyr]

heroes die in like 40 seconds

[manic bobcat]

hell on EM4 Hades even has a freaking Summon

[pulsar ridge]

Your builds just bad, probably

[half zephyr]

hades in maybe a minute or so

possibly 2

[brisk trail]

But you encounter Zagreus' kit way before Hades' so purely from a technical perspective Hades' kit is a reflection of Zag's.

[modern garnet]

Looking at the health numbers on the wiki doesn't really tell you much, because you're so much stronger by the time you're in elysium

[pulsar ridge]

If I don't kill EM3 Heroes in 15s I consider my build weak

[manic bobcat]

they are 10 runs in. i doubt they know what builds are good. but getting to hades in 10 runs is decent

[half zephyr]

I can't control my build beyond plume

[crude surge]

they are not at all damage sponges

[pulsar ridge]

I got to him on my 5th run thanks to cursed slash

[torpid axle]

Forgive me for not knowing the most optimal builds with less than 10h in the game

[brisk trail]

Yes, it's leaning into Like Father, Like Son, but from the player's perspective you learn about Hades' boss moveset from prior encounters with enemies and from Zag's moveset.

[half zephyr]

cursed slash \0/

[crude surge]

I've seen a beowolf bull rush knock out an entire phase of a boss

[half zephyr]

fun

still don't like beo

[pulsar ridge]

I'm not saying it's your fault, you'll get better

[modern garnet]

You will improve at the game and you will pick better boons and deal more damage and the health bars will stop feeling so large

[pulsar ridge]

My builds weren't much good either when I first started

[crude surge]

a big part of the game is learning how to make optimal builds

[half zephyr]

I don't think I ever thought the health bars were too big

they die so fast

unless I focused too much on my own hp - then it took forever

[torpid axle]

most broken thing I've done so far is fists+artemis/aphrodite

[half zephyr]

but that's on me for not building enough dmg

[torpid axle]

it's what got me to hades

[half zephyr]

do zeus atk

on fists

or the ME combo

[manic bobcat]

i already said that you are in 10 runs in. getting to hades means that you are ahead of a lot of people i see here in term of progress.
but
on the flip side, 10 runs and seeing Hades for the first time doesn't warrant calling something "damage sponge" or complete bull.

just my 2cent. with a decent build you can obliterate the game in no time. Speedrun record (no glitch) is like 6 minute.

[half zephyr]

some like dem too

[modern garnet]

Artemis and aphro are really strong on certain weapons.... but they're not the best on fists

[stoic flame]

artemis call tho

[half zephyr]

you want something like zeus which bounces or dem who leaves status

[torpid axle]

my usual approach is complain until I beat something then say how good it is aight?

[stoic flame]

literally 1/6th of hp gone on the final boss

[half zephyr]

and then you got ares for that doom for ME

[modern garnet]

Well that makes you difficult to be around, alright?

[stoic flame]

doom is okayish unless the stacking boon

[crude surge]

Arty on special is good on dem tho

[half zephyr]

but that's not what we be thinking of when it's not good for fists

[stoic flame]

true

for fists i generally go for hangover or zeus attack

[torpid axle]

wouldn't be the first time I've heard that lol, fair enough

you mean like lightning spam

[half zephyr]

ye, hangover also good, but zeus!!

I need the bounce

[stoic flame]

b o u n c e

yeah fair enoug

h

[half zephyr]

when I got zeus atk it's much faster

[crude surge]

ME go brrrrrrrrr

[half zephyr]

and I need speed for plume

[stoic flame]

me?

[stoic flame]

ah

[half zephyr]

ME - it's a duo

merciful end

[stoic flame]

whos

[half zephyr]

ares/athena

[stoic flame]

okay

[half zephyr]

your deflect triggers doom instantly

popular on fists

[torpid axle]

I can't make a good build even if I want to, the fates choose what I take not me

[crude surge]

divine dash ares attack

[half zephyr]

keepsakes

[stoic flame]

this is faxx

[modern garnet]

ME is too good... I would feel bad if my first win was with ME

[stoic flame]

even with the god keepsakes

[manic bobcat]

Lightning Strike + Deadly Flourish + Demeter + Breaching Cross + Kinetic Launcher/Explosive Upper = Happy Me.

[stoic flame]

i get the stuff i dont want

[torpid axle]

me?

[crude surge]

keepsakes makes getting a good build way more consistant

[stoic flame]

zeus dash

nobody wants that

[half zephyr]

I do

sometimes

[stoic flame]

no

u dont

[half zephyr]

yes

[manic bobcat]

Merciful End, a Duo boon between Ares and Athena

[half zephyr]

cuz I like lightning

[stoic flame]

https://tenor.com/view/pokemon-hypno-hypnotize-hypnosis-hypnotic-gif-5634751

u dont

[half zephyr]

you need another divine to get ME tho

[crude surge]

My first win was almost with Stubborn Roots stall. I got stuck on a rock trying to dash behind cover during lazers and took 80 damage in a seccond. Looking back kinda glad it wasn't m first win

[manic bobcat]

ME is just another high build

[crude surge]

true

[half zephyr]

you can only get it with divine strike or flourish

[manic bobcat]

it's good but not op just because it's inconsistent

[half zephyr]

so annoying

I have had ME once

and that was enough

[manic bobcat]

revert your game back to pre release then

[half zephyr]

mostly cuz of the fact I have to seek out athena

[half zephyr]

I didn't even know of the game then

[manic bobcat]

I for one want to revert back to Night Night update

[stoic flame]

athena boons mid

hella

just the dash and cast

and call

are good

and that trap one

[half zephyr]

attack is better then dash imo

if I'm gonna take deflect at all

[crude surge]

Athena great

[half zephyr]

but I just don't want deflect

[stoic flame]

but if u use stuff like gun or bow its not that good

[crude surge]

Last stand is amazing though

[half zephyr]

the only time I want athena is on my 32 attempt!!

[crude surge]

especially with stubborn

[half zephyr]

cuz I want that chance for DD with SD

BUT NO

[torpid axle]

deflect would be great if any of the bosses actually had projectiles besides the witches

[half zephyr]

SHE WON'T GIVE LAST STAND!!

[stoic flame]

witches are so cringe

[half zephyr]

she gives everything else

[brisk trail]

All of the bosses have projectiles.

[half zephyr]

but not the DD boons

[manic bobcat]

you can deflect melee, too

[crude surge]

BP2 witches make having deflect really nice though

[manic bobcat]

and all bosses have projectiles

[half zephyr]

unless I didn't lose my sd

[stoic flame]

that witch circle in asphodel is the bane to my existence

[half zephyr]

then she offers it

[torpid axle]

ok yeah but most are dismissable

[crude surge]

always lose SD before taking an Athena boon

just purposely do it

[half zephyr]

you think I didn't TRY

I had 3 hp left

[crude surge]

riiiiiiiiiiiip

[half zephyr]

and the guy stepped IN LAVA

[manic bobcat]

also divine dash gives you "more" i frames.
well technically not "more", but effectively it's easier to time your iframes with divine dash.

[crude surge]

well then you should have stepped in lava

[brisk trail]

Okay, so if there was magma, why didn't you step in it?

[torpid axle]

how soon are you supposed to get the 2nd death defiance upgrade on average?

[half zephyr]

I was going to, but I had automatic response to seeing a boon

[brisk trail]

Fair.

[half zephyr]

it was my 2nd 32 attempt

[stoic flame]

tell me a good boon to make the rails damage acceptable

[manic bobcat]

nice. did you make 16?

[stoic flame]

because it does such teeny weeny damage

per hit

[half zephyr]

ofc

32 is being a female dog though

[torpid axle]

does it only cancel out dmg or give some form of reposte dmg?

[half zephyr]

zeus

[manic bobcat]

both. "reposte" damage can happen if you are close enough

[stoic flame]

classic

[modern garnet]

Put any boon with flat damage on it, like Zeus or dionysus

[half zephyr]

legit, that's the one most reccomend

see

[manic bobcat]

good luck! #h1-high-heat-strategies has some good tips, too

[half zephyr]

the bonus w zeus is bounce

[torpid axle]

ok so what you're saying is deflect on fists and I win the game, 👍

[stoic flame]

it got that b o u n c e

but u dont

[half zephyr]

I know, but I'm using the heat from the legend himself

[modern garnet]

Put flat damage on weak attacks and percent damage on strong attacks

[manic bobcat]

sure, that's a decent build. divine strike on fists is quite good.

[half zephyr]

maybe

[torpid axle]

I'm boutta cheese the hell out of Hades

[stoic flame]

with divine strike?

[half zephyr]

aaaahg but I'm wanting to do a run now

see if I can beat Lernie

[manic bobcat]

who?

[half zephyr]

see if I can make it to lernie

[stoic flame]

istg that hades spin attack is inescapable unless you have extra dash or that boon which makes u faster after a dash

[manic bobcat]

iframe it 😎

[stoic flame]

imagine

[half zephyr]

powerpuff pressure points man

[stoic flame]

we bad at the game 😎

[torpid axle]

this might be the first game where iframes are too quick for me to time them lmao

[manic bobcat]

now i am curious what them pacts look like o.o

[half zephyr]

aaaah

gimme sec

[manic bobcat]

you might be "losing" iframes. if you use dash attack, the moment you input attack, you lose iframes compared to an empty dash.
divine dash "preserves" your iframe even if you attack, that's part of why it's good.
also if you are not using greater reflex, you should.

[half zephyr]

HL5+LC4+EM2+BP2+MM+UC+FO2+DC2+TD2

[stoic flame]

what language is this

[half zephyr]

pact of punishment

heats

[stoic flame]

how do u even remember the names

[half zephyr]

you use them a lot

[stoic flame]

memorising yes

[half zephyr]

eventually you won't remember what they mean

only the short names

[manic bobcat]

I would consider that more"advanced" strats, but if it's working for you then good luck.

[half zephyr]

and you'll know what they are

[half zephyr]

I can't get past lernie!

[stoic flame]

i only know em

[manic bobcat]

lmao

[half zephyr]

can't beat meg

but tis & alecto die easily

[stoic flame]

alecto beyblades are annoying

[half zephyr]

pssh

easy

[stoic flame]

the flex

[half zephyr]

meg on fist with hl5 & fo2 however

not easy

[crude surge]

pinned in #h1-high-heat-strategies

[half zephyr]

just out of curiosity, what about it is "advanced"?

[manic bobcat]

HL5 and LC4

It's very punishing if you aren't used to it

[half zephyr]

LC4 is in the 1st pin in high heat strategy
as part of the easiest 32 setup

HL5 is something from the legend himself instead of using em3 & cf2

[crude surge]

am I the only one who likes EM3

[half zephyr]

I love EM3

much easier fight

plus I get to hear Theseus laugh

[manic bobcat]

Well here's the thing, I was there when that comment was made.
At the time, some people (myself included) didn't think that recommending LC4 is good.
But we didn't write that up. The person who wrote that guide did, so it gets pinned.

[signal aspen]

That guy sucks, don't listen to him

[manic bobcat]

Let me see if I can devise one without HL5 and LC4

[half zephyr]

[brisk trail]

Theseus being eternally wrecked every time you break the Macedonian is my favorite vocal performance(s) in the whole game.

"Noooooooo!"

[half zephyr]

just remember that I don't have to worry about daddy dearest!

[manic bobcat]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/802615525141643265/851575054701559818/unknown.png

the last 2 points can either be DC (depending on weapon) or whatever else

[half zephyr]

can't do TD3

I can barely do TD2

[manic bobcat]

then probably get 1 or 2 points in LC, crank HL a bit more, pick DC2

or even AP1 isn't bad

all of which can be good substitute for TD3, if not TD1.

[half zephyr]

what does AP do again?

[manic bobcat]

limit your option by 1

it's not that bad

[brisk trail]

makes the player want to put down Hades

[half zephyr]

no

just no

I don't have access to my fated dice yet

[brisk trail]

Randomly strikes an option per level from Hammers, boons, and Poms.

[crude surge]

AP2 ME new meta

[half zephyr]

I can't change what I'm offered shudder

[brisk trail]

Far and away the most punishing Pact Option.

[manic bobcat]

oh then just pick RI1 then

if you don't have all the dice, might as well go without

[crude surge]

Not RI?

[half zephyr]

I don't have RI

[brisk trail]

No, AP.

[half zephyr]

I don't have a full mirror yet

[modern garnet]

JS is bad because it makes TD harder, right? Wouldn’t it be better to run JS instead of TD?

[manic bobcat]

you just need to unlock all the tiers i think

[brisk trail]

Routine Inspection raises the difficulty floor, but it doesn't RNG the player out of wins like AP does.

[half zephyr]

I'm still working my way towards 30 keys

[manic bobcat]

haha

then your options are a bit limited.

[half zephyr]

yup yup yup

[vernal mulch]

i love zag’s death dialogue

[brisk trail]

And really, the whole "We're gonna show you all the options, then strike out what you don't get," is the worst part.

[half zephyr]

I wouldn't even notice RI1 at this point

[manic bobcat]

i would suggest sticking with pp man pact (it's not bad, just a bit punishing imo)
or
farm up keys for RI and use the above pact
or
hurry the heck up and swallow the TD3 pill

[half zephyr]

I stick to option 1

[manic bobcat]

that works too :D

[half zephyr]

while doing option 1 I'm working on option 2 cuz I keep dying anyways

and TD3 is too hard - I spend 5 minutes as it is beating tart

on 32

I can't do asphodel on just 5

I'm ded

I got meg

[manic bobcat]

oh worry not, Tartarus is longer than Asphodel

[half zephyr]

[manic bobcat]

Asphodel has fewer chambers

[half zephyr]

no, I mean

[brisk trail]

Yeah, Asphodel's definitely the shortest biome.

[half zephyr]

I spend less time in tartarus

normally

the fact that I'm spending longer in tartarus now means I'll take longer in asphodel

[brisk trail]

Unless you get wrecked with enemy spawns on a bunch of big rooms (you ever run around the donut only to find ALL the enemies have been spawning in the exact opposite direction? I have), Asphodel will almost always be the shortest part of a run.

[half zephyr]

I normally only take around 3-4 mins in tart

I typically spend 4-5 mins in asphodel

[manic bobcat]

i think you will do just fine, with or without TD3

that said, give TD3 a shot (without LC and HL so you don't die as quickly playing reckless) and see how far you can go.

[half zephyr]

I BEAT MEG

for the first time on 32

[manic bobcat]

<3

[half zephyr]

woo

thank you crush shot & hangover dash

[manic bobcat]

3rd time is the charm

[half zephyr]

considering my fastest run ever is 16:45

[manic bobcat]

bruh that's like way below TD3 threshold o.o

[half zephyr]

and that was on extra low heat with everything going for me

I normally spend around 19-21 mins

too long

too close

not good enough

[manic bobcat]

well don't let me pressure you into taking TD3 but you are a dummy if you don't

[half zephyr]

that was on my main file, with full mirror & low heat if I even had heat on

my fastest on baby is around 17 mins

17:30 or smth

[manic bobcat]

it's a joke

[half zephyr]

this is mean

I have to choose

eurydice or hermes

[brisk trail]

Try some sub-32 runs without Tight Deadline.

Eurydice.

[manic bobcat]

eurydice

[half zephyr]

I can't

[brisk trail]

Always take NPC rooms.

You can't turn the Pact below 32 Heat?

[pulsar ridge]

My fastest is 16:00, with incomplete mirror and only EM3, but that was a really good run

[half zephyr]

it's my 10th clear

I'm doing 32 cuz I won't face Hades

[pulsar ridge]

🧠

[manic bobcat]

fresh file 32 heat speedrun

[brisk trail]

Well, you're shaving several minutes off your time as is, then.

[half zephyr]

[brisk trail]

You don't need all 20 minutes in Styx.

[half zephyr]

I'm not even thinking about styx

[brisk trail]

If you make it out with the Satyr Sack at 20:02, you'll still be fine.

[half zephyr]

I'm thinking about elysium

I spend the most time in elysium out of all the regions

styx I just breeze through

[manic bobcat]

that's the normal time split imo

[brisk trail]

So the issue is that you're unable to clear Elysium in 15 minutes, then?

[half zephyr]

no, I normally make it through in around 13

I can't make it past Lernie cuz I keep dying

I'm trying to first survive that

[manic bobcat]

have you tried not dying at lernie?

[half zephyr]

so many times

[manic bobcat]

how about this run?

[pulsar ridge]

Just don't get hit by Lernie

[half zephyr]

it's actually mostly the lava

EM2 is not the best when you're using fists

[pulsar ridge]

Heightened security?

[half zephyr]

no

just LC4

[pulsar ridge]

oof

[half zephyr]

I'm sad

all of asphodel & not one hermes boon since the one I rejected for eurydice

well

Lernie time

[crude surge]

sad

[half zephyr]

I'm gonna die

I have 32hp + my sd, but my max is only 185

[pulsar ridge]

gl

[half zephyr]

[crude surge]

pop stubborn before going in then

[half zephyr]

ded

[crude surge]

rip

[half zephyr]

twas lava

I got the lava spitter head

my meagre amount of flooring turned into nil

[crude surge]

lava sucks on EM2

[manic bobcat]

🇫

[signal aspen]

Put on em3 and use hl2

[half zephyr]

[manic bobcat]

Em3 is 3 heat so you can knock another one down too

[signal aspen]

For some reason you think em3 is easier

[half zephyr]

[crude surge]

I wouldn't say its easier

But its a lesser jump then EM2 imo

[pulsar ridge]

em3 is easier than em2 imo

[half zephyr]

no

[pulsar ridge]

I much prefer Chariot Theseus over constantly worrying when he's gonna throw the spear at me

[half zephyr]

if I use em3 & hl2 then it's 32

[alpine fiber]

He's really hard to chase down though

[crude surge]

I think the best thing is that theres a much larger tell for the landmines than the spear throw

[pulsar ridge]

He is hard to chase down, but at least he isn't hurting me while I do so

[bright comet]

say, ive never been able to reroll into kiss of styx, is that even possible?

dd replenish in the shop

[half zephyr]

need to have lost a dd

[bright comet]

yea i do

[whole ocean]

What exactly does High Voltage do? It says it increases the area of bolt attacks, but as far as I can tell it's not an area attack to begin with, so does it become one, or...what's going on there?

[signal aspen]

I think so

[half zephyr]

I've done it I think

[pulsar ridge]

I've done it

It's definitely possible

[whole ocean]

Because it feels like you just get thick bolts and that's it.

[half zephyr]

your bolts can hit in a wider area around you

[signal aspen]

Yeah that's it

It makes them bigger

That's why d strike is way better

[manic bobcat]

Wait is em3 really not 3 heat?

[whole ocean]

So they will do area damage now?

[brisk trail]

It is.

[manic bobcat]

Oh wait HL

Not LC

Nevermind

[half zephyr]

yes

[manic bobcat]

I'm stupid

[half zephyr]

[signal aspen]

Yeah

[signal aspen]

Good job

[brisk trail]

You only can get High Voltage off Thunder Flourish, Thunder Dash, and Zeus' Aid.

[manic bobcat]

Thank you

[brisk trail]

Those three abilities all have AoE by default, it's just a not-huge AoE.

[whole ocean]

Yeah, I know that, but I've never seen any effective difference from it.

[manic bobcat]

Same tbh

I just don't take it

[half zephyr]

maybe this will be the run I get a DD!!

[signal aspen]

Nah you should take it, it gives you a chance at the legendary boon

[brisk trail]

I don't take HV very often, it's definitely the weaker of the two between it and Double Strike, but it does make the area bigger.

[half zephyr]

I got forced athena

[signal aspen]

But don't take it if d strike is available

[whole ocean]

Probably because typically I want that off of like Rama or Zeus shield, so it's just such a mess of damage numbers how can I tell.

[brisk trail]

That being said, yeah, if you've got the opportunity to open up Splitting Bolt you should absolutely do that.

[whole ocean]

Yeah, I'd never choose it over DS.

[manic bobcat]

Fair. Though I usually find something better than it anyway. Now I'm curious how many times I picked it up

Hmm

[half zephyr]

it's so unfair

I get offered deathless stand in the shop

I hate you athena

at least I got the flourish - maybe this is the run I'll try ME

[signal aspen]

Yes

It's what I used for my 40 heat clear

[half zephyr]

even better is actually that it replaced my other boon

so I got an epic flourish with +104%

[crude surge]

nice

[manic bobcat]

It's hotter than Asphodel irl :(

Summer why

[crude surge]

pain

[half zephyr]

https://tenor.com/view/the-sun-is-a-deadly-lazer-gif-8691250

OH COME ON

[manic bobcat]

Premptive F

[half zephyr]

This time I do lose the sd & now she won't offer the replenish boons!

ATHENA!!!!

[manic bobcat]

She isn't so wise for the god of wisdom huh

[half zephyr]

https://tenor.com/view/mulan-mushu-dishonor-cow-family-gif-12128639

I got 50hp + my SD

time for Lernie

ooh and Lernie has actually become Lernie now!

[brisk trail]

Lernard.

[half zephyr]

HAHAH

https://tenor.com/view/mulan-disney-mushu-eddie-murphy-vengeance-gif-3560204

[manic bobcat]

I actually read SD as Sword Dance

[half zephyr]

sorry I'm riding a high right now

Battie came in & saved me

[manic bobcat]

God speed

[spark hornet]

That's a really sad sorty ;/

sorry to hear that

stroy*

STORY

[manic bobcat]

Story to hear that?

[half zephyr]

I also got really lucky & had wave spitter head

when I had athena dash & special

ME

[spark hornet]

That's a really sad story; sorry to hear that*

THERE lol

[half zephyr]

patty~

ok

Heroes time

[manic bobcat]

Easy win

[half zephyr]

I have 27 hp + my SD

just don't get caught by asterius

[pulsar ridge]

did you not use up your SD for heals

[half zephyr]

I tried

[pulsar ridge]

Or did you use it and still get down to 27

[half zephyr]

but then the guy died to trap

my luck be like that

[pulsar ridge]

you can use the traps after death if there's the eggs

[half zephyr]

there was no eggs

[pulsar ridge]

😔

At least you got patty

you've got this

[half zephyr]

hoooo

no SD left

but asterius is down

only Theseus left

I've got 42 hp

[pulsar ridge]

oof

[half zephyr]

I DID IT

he's so easy

[pulsar ridge]

🥳

[brisk trail]

GGs!

[half zephyr]

15 hp left

[brisk trail]

Don't choke in the tunnels now.

[half zephyr]

now to just take over styx

hooo

I have 12 left on my patty boon

[brisk trail]

Don't even need it if you play it right, right?

[spark hornet]

So i was having a really slow run with my heart bow and realized i only had 39 secs to beat tisiphone so i just bruted her with seeking casts and power shot and i couldn't believe i actually did it

[brisk trail]

At least, don't need it to last past the Satyr Sack.

[half zephyr]

let's see

my plume is at 25.2%
greater evasion 15%
zag fist 15%

not too bad dodge chance

[brisk trail]

I think you should burn an SD in literally the first Chamber to get the Touch of Styx heal, then play normally.

[half zephyr]

plus ruthless

ooooh

[brisk trail]

Don't mess with getting to a miniboss/end chamber on low health and then using the heal.

[half zephyr]

I got a non skull athena tunnel

Maybe this is my dd

I just wanna have one to say I've had one at this point

[brisk trail]

Just start yourself with high health.

[half zephyr]

ye

got 172hp now

and 13 minutes to spend in styx

[manic bobcat]

Easy picking

[half zephyr]

YES

Last stand!

there

[crude surge]

pog

[half zephyr]

I can now say I've had a dd + sd

and

I got 2 tunnel sack

I did it

[pulsar ridge]

grats on 32 heat 🥳

[half zephyr]

32 heat 10th clear

[crude surge]

nice

[pulsar ridge]

less impressive but still congrats

[half zephyr]

I'm a baby when it comes to heat

the fact I managed to make to Hades is incredible enough to me

but now I can see a use for ME

[manic bobcat]

Nice!

[half zephyr]

it was very nice to have on 32

[manic bobcat]

You don't need to do Hades either right.?

[half zephyr]

nope

that's why I wanted to do 32

[unborn remnant]

Dusa

[manic bobcat]

Smart strats xD

[half zephyr]

and I get a greece fishing spot?

what is this luck

I beat meg, got my dd, made it to hades, found a fishing spot - only thing missing is Than, but he's being a stubborn donkey so can't have everything

well, now I know what works for me for 32

In the Blood

[bright comet]

are there any traps during hades fight?

[half zephyr]

yes

lots of them

he summons them

[bright comet]

okay i just got epic trap res

with no reroll

[half zephyr]

he also likes to break them himself

[bright comet]

about to fight em4 with spear

[brisk trail]

Oh, wow, that's an S+ tier boon for EM4.

[half zephyr]

as in one second he summons them the next he breaks them

[bright comet]

185/200 and all dds intact

[brisk trail]

Good luck!

[half zephyr]

[bright comet]

well im gonna use the fountain now so full hp huh

[half zephyr]

I'm kinda wishing the credits would move a bit faster

cuz I wanna go sleep

at the same time I love the song

[bright comet]

weak doom chill and athena stuff

[brisk trail]

It's a very good song.

[half zephyr]

mhmm

it's my fave sung song

fave instrumental is the unseen ones

[bright comet]

i think its myrmidons theme playing in elysium

that i underappreciated

until the fight takes awhile and i hear the beautiful solo

[half zephyr]

I want the music you're gonna hear

[brisk trail]

The solo bass version of that track, though.

[half zephyr]

so I'm gonna have to do EM4 on baby one day too

[bright comet]

oh the unseen ones yea its good

[half zephyr]

the best

[bright comet]

ive already beaten em4 with blade and fists

so i decided spear to do next

[half zephyr]

could still be heavier tho

[bright comet]

i tried with guan yu but explosive special is too good

[brisk trail]

Oh, man, someone found the file and uploaded it to YouTube a few months ago.

God, the bass tone, and it's so low.

[half zephyr]

all the hades ost is on yt

[brisk trail]

But not the stripped tracks, officially.

[bright comet]

well the bass bits in between lvls arent there

[half zephyr]

I forgot how long this whole post credits thing lasted

[bright comet]

and i wish we had access to lyre tunes

[half zephyr]

FIDI

mompom

and I got 30 keys

[manic bobcat]

32 with Hades?

[half zephyr]

maybe

I have my persuasion back

and my legacy

AND I GOT THE FINAL STATUE!

eh

I liked the 2nd more

ofc, now I can RI1

hmmm

I can turn on RI1 & turn off 2 lvls of LC

then again, I don't need to do 32 again

but it would be nice to have done it once with Hades too I guess

but I'd prolly die

either way it'd have to be some other time

[manic bobcat]

night

[bright comet]

aw man

that was intense

i got to phase three without dying

then spent two dds and won

[manic bobcat]

nice!! grats!

is that first em4 win?

[bright comet]

third

first with spear

im not doing too tryhardy stuff, for now my goal is to get em4 done with all weapons

[signal aspen]

Wow that was really cool

[spark hornet]

yeah that's awesome

[pulsar ridge]

i bought the thing to let orpheus go to asphodel like 5 runs ago and i haven't seen her all that time

just got the door this run

worth it

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/683011883284168725/851602802488115211/unknown.png

[spark hornet]

ah, that's a spoiler for me... but cool anyway

lol

[pulsar ridge]

the channel description says spoilers are okay, but i'm still sorry

[spark hornet]

ah yes right at the top where it says all spoilers welcome lol

all good

;]

[wheat anvil]

Woah they reunite??

How cute

[pulsar ridge]

They do, and they sing good riddance together as well

[wheat anvil]

Well...

What a good song

[signal aspen]

Nice

[uncut dagger]

||I like it more when they sing In The Blood||

[pulsar ridge]

Oh they can sing that too? 👀

[uncut dagger]

yeah sometimes they will

and they'll mention how it was a hit of theirs

[spark hornet]

first time i heard my guy sing upon returning to the house

[bright comet]

tfw all dds gone in tartarus because i fought charon

worthwhile investment

[modern garnet]

The earlier you lose em the more chances you have to get them back

It's only 600 gold

[pulsar ridge]

🧠

[bright comet]

oh yea i rerolled into kiss of styx for the first time

[signal aspen]

Hopefully patty shows up

[bright comet]

my boons are more potent

[buoyant valley]

I don’t see why you would ever want to borrow money from charon

[signal aspen]

I only do it if he gives me bad shop items in elysium

[pulsar ridge]

because Charons an easy fight once you git gud and it's free money 🤷

[buoyant valley]

time to get gud ig

[pulsar ridge]

Only reason I wouldn't borrow from him is if I had tight deadline

[manic bobcat]

it's just a fun thing to do

[buoyant valley]

What happens when you run out of time with tight deadline, do you just die

[manic bobcat]

sometimes you just say why not

[pulsar ridge]

you take damage over time

It's like 5 a second I think?

[buoyant valley]

even worse

[manic bobcat]

5damage/s

until you die or clear the level

[signal aspen]

Yeah

[bright comet]

ooofff do i take aphrodite for a chance of beams centered on me or kiss of styx premium

i have 1/3

[pulsar ridge]

styx premium

[bright comet]

its mostly for the discount further

[pulsar ridge]

beams centred on you isn't really that amazing imo

[spark hornet]

yis every time.

[pulsar ridge]

I'd rather better beams from artemis

[bright comet]

ah well i took athena in shop but i can take aphrodite as 5th

[modern garnet]

beams centered on you isn't BAD but it's hard to use optimally

[bright comet]

didnt look at doors beforehand

[modern garnet]

it's like poseidon call in a way, you always feel like you're using it wrong

[bright comet]

well ive never tried it

[pulsar ridge]

Optimal Poseidon call usage is using it to destroy dad's urns 🧠

Only time I feel it was worth using it

[modern garnet]

you could use any invuln call for that... and not end up dealing any damage

[pulsar ridge]

I never said it was the best at that job, but it is the best job for it I find

[brisk trail]

Any advice on making a cohesive build? I’ve done like 50 runs on switch basically just winging it lol, I don’t understand how to properly pair certain boons

[pulsar ridge]

Flat damage go on the ooga booga fast stuff, % go on the strong stuff, everything from there I more or less wing it

[modern garnet]

yeah that is the number one rule

other than that, look at the list of duo boons and imagine a build that would work with it, and play trying to get that duo

even if you don't get the duo, your build still has a theme

once you do that enough times, you can start imagining builds without using the duo list

[buoyant valley]

ry you make me feel bad because I’ve had this game longer than you and you already know way more than I do

[spark hornet]

maybe plays more than you?

[buoyant valley]

oh yeah

[pulsar ridge]

oh I definitely play more than you

I've got no school for 3 months, and no work has been sent home for me to be busy with

[buoyant valley]

I saw you played like 12 hours yesterday

[pulsar ridge]

So it's either play Hades or be bored to death

[buoyant valley]

no life

[pulsar ridge]

😔

[spark hornet]

you got no other games?

o.O

[pulsar ridge]

I do, but I usually fixate on one when I get it

[buoyant valley]

I can maybe do one or two runs a day