skirt them
#h1-discussion
maiden narwhal
even if i don't die in the chamber i'll die to td3
at 50 heat getting in their face was fine
but now if i enter a mob i do not leave
rustic vale
Just do spreadfire zagrail 
latent moon
idk i haven't played any eris heat so idrk how that plays
so like go ahead and see if that works lol
maiden narwhal
haha i guess
latent moon
i just feel like if you're in their face with delta then you'd just be inherently safer bc of the iframes
maiden narwhal
too much armour
too little hp
i think 54 need a whole new playstyle
and a lot of skill
i think you can be bad and finish 50
with a broken aspect
latent moon
but also without delta you'd have to actually let go of the attack button for iframes on dashes
which is also a drop in dps compared to delta
latent moon
true i guess
maiden narwhal
i never empty my whole clip anyway
latent moon
idk we'll see how that goes lmao
maiden narwhal
because then the game will reload for me
latent moon
just feels in theory rocket start is way less safe for marginally more damage lmao
rustic vale
i think you can be bad and finish 50
Eh as someone who’s like
Barely got 40 down on a few aspects
latent moon
i think you can be bad and finish 50
that's the jazz speaking lol
latent moon
have you considered that your'e not bad
rustic vale
i'm bad and finished 50
And I’m bad and I haven’t so
opal hemlock
does taking sunken treasure take a boon "slot"
latent moon
no
rustic vale
It’s uh
rustic vale
Pretty clear which ones do
Take a slot
They all end with the same words that match up with what they do
If it’s a “dash” boon it take sthe dash slot etc. etc
opal hemlock
i mean pool sorry
opal hemlock
not slot like when you press B slot
rustic vale
Secondary boons add gods to your pool
latent moon
yeah he'll be in the god pool
opal hemlock
:(
rustic vale
If you ended up in a room with them and taking a boon from then
Theh are now inyour pool
opal hemlock
that sucks, i just got forced to take him
opal hemlock
i think i got a good hand but i took special knockaway instead of aid or dash
latent moon
kinda need charged skewer
opal hemlock
is that a hammer upgrade
opal hemlock
i took breaching skewer for armor
rustic vale
breaching also good
opal hemlock
i dont think i saw charge
rustic vale
you won’t necessarily always see hammers there are just good & bad options
And charged skewer is one of the best for guan-yu
rustic vale
dash
opal hemlock
im sure it has nuance, but does rarity usually matter?
like should i usually take higher rarity stuff over lower
or is it just a case by case thing like boons and everything else
opal hemlock
ah okay
latent moon
boon > rarity every time
rustic vale
like artemis strike or pressure points rarity does not matter
opal hemlock
i fear a lot of things are gonna be like that in this game, but i sort of like it
maiden narwhal
it depends on your build is the answer
rustic vale
You don’t gun purely for rarity
maiden narwhal
go with what is good for your build, not what has highest rarity
take common over epic if you need it more
rustic vale
but decisions you make might be based on rarity
If it comes down to it
like chaos is a good example
latent moon
the only time i take rarity is if i plan on selling it later since higher rarity sells for more money
rustic vale
a same rarity dash strike boon from chaos will always be more than a same rarity strike boon
opal hemlock
the only time i take rarity is if i plan on selling it later since higher rarity...
oooh thats a good idea
rustic vale
but a higher rarity strike boon may be more value then a dstrike
& so rarity would influence your decision there
opal hemlock
not decisive strike from dbd
rustic vale
Or like
latent moon
oooh thats a good idea
that's not really a practical idea most of the time unless you have like 4 boons leaving tartarus
that's like the only time that's relevant
rustic vale
Hyper sprint vs epic greatest reflex
compared to hypersprint vs common greatest reflex
opal hemlock
that's not really a practical idea most of the time unless you have like 4 boons...
does selling a boon remove that god from your pool?
rustic vale
does selling a boon remove that god from your pool?
No
Once they’re in your pool they stay
no matter what you do
latent moon
Hyper sprint vs epic greatest reflex
i mean when picking up hermes, you're looking for either of those boons, never really one over the other
rustic vale
when it’s both though
latent moon
yeah then the general rule is rarity from what i've seen lmao
rustic vale
and like
ME zeus shield
Which doom you take
if it’s epic double strike vs common jolted early in run
I take double strike with hopes of better jolted later
A lot of the time the answer is just take the boon but sometimes boon value is kind of murky
Talking abour Hades makes me want to play Hades crap
opal hemlock
what happens if my pool is full but i bring a trinket to give me another god
does it not add the new one to the pool
rustic vale
what happens if my pool is full but i bring a trinket to give me another god
It adds them in
opal hemlock
so 5 can appear?
rustic vale
You can have more then 4 it just requires specific circumstances
Yeah
There are multiple cases where you can end with all 8 gods in your pool
opal hemlock
wow that sounds cool
opal hemlock
surely its a little fun
rustic vale
I’ven’t tried yet
I just know the multiple theoretical ways you could have it happen
funnily enough the only circumstance where you can’t get to 8 is when you have 4 gods in pool by the time you leave tartarus
rustic vale
why have i never got 5 gods
Eh the only ways to get there are either walk into a shop with 3, get 1 from a boon & a different one from the next room
Or have 4 and force in a 5th
maiden narwhal
but 5 gods sounds horrible
rustic vale
Or walk into styx shop w< 4 in pool
maiden narwhal
is ff really worth that?
rustic vale
no it isn’t
maiden narwhal
good
rustic vale
It’s be for if you have 4 gods in pool but need the 5th for your buikd
maiden narwhal
ori got too hard so i went back to hades but now i'm going back to ori lol
maybe i'll just stick to tetris
rustic vale
maybe i'll just stick to tetris
Nah go to flappy bird
maiden narwhal
flappy bird was just a rip off of the helicopter game
that's been around since 1987
which is when i first played it, anyway
maiden narwhal
poks
real bough
Just pray to purge it or exchange
no
Its
end game
the satyr tunnels
bro was the only boon
left
wicked sage
https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Section-of-railway-known-as-‘Bleeding-Wolf’-near-Altrincham-1024x555.jpg hey does anyone have a build for this weapon?
opal hemlock
train tracks
steep condor
just did a nemesis run and it took me until lernie to notice i took zag sword instead
re: being bad at the game
wicked sage
just did a nemesis run and it took me until lernie to notice i took zag sword in...
full on blindness effect
maiden narwhal
when i switched from rail back to shield, i was in asphodel before i realised i had aim at cursor off
i thought it felt weird because i was relearning
wicked sage
when i switched from rail back to shield, i was in asphodel before i realised i ...
you dont do rail with aim at cursor on?
maiden narwhal
no!
it's a whole new game
once you turn it off
you just need to be facing in the general direction, and autoaim will pick it up
and lock on
chilly zephyr
Duo skills. Or like I like to call 80% of them, free 405 gold
chilly zephyr
Awww you can't fish at last area after 10 clears?! Booo
void vigil
you can
maiden narwhal
there's a pool in the dad room
nova loom
fish can still spawn where he's facing as well as the little area at the bottom of the map
but I do miss the garden 😔
void vigil
no you cant go there again, but you can still fish surface fish
barren bridge
tepid light
every time i see stubborn defiance, i flinch
mint coral
Sd comfy tho (joke joke I already know)
rustic vale
bro was the only boon
How did you end up in styx with no strike boon on arthur
stone ermine
hera bow or eris rail
chilly zephyr
God I HECKING hate the 1v1 minotaur fight
real bough
How did you end up in styx with no strike boon on arthur
Excalibruh is just that weapon
steep condor
when you don't have personal liability / hell mode, does the broken spear point add time to the auto defense?
i never use that keepsake
next sundial
Aww man was so close to killing hades
stiff obsidian
bad game
steep condor
you'll get him next time
polar summit
upgraded hades is just a pain on phase 2 
next sundial
I hope so I can clear everything with ease without using my death defiance but Hades ;-;
I always try to do the hug your dad move but fail and take damage because I don't know when he does that ;-;
polar summit
u gotta pay close attention on its animation and make a split second decision lol
next sundial
Ye will try next just wanna kill Hades and then move on to dead cells and when will be bored come back to Hades to complete all the additional stuff
polar summit
me when all my weapon aspect max out.
also me: what now?
next sundial
Haha lol
tepid light
me when all my weapon aspect max out.
also me: what now?
HEAT CLIMB TIME
void vigil
I completed most of everything in the game
next sundial
me when all my weapon aspect max out.
also me: what now?
You must have tons of hours in the game but it's understandable because it's super fun
polar summit
its only 178 hours
tepid light
I completed most of everything in the game
have you completed hitless 64 heat boonless gilgamesh
void vigil
Now sporadically filling my mirror back up after getting the unseen one rank
next sundial
its only 178 hours
Hmm "only" haha
void vigil
have you completed hitless 64 heat boonless gilgamesh
Wouldn’t you like to know 
tepid light
Wouldn’t you like to know <:zageyes:1012805269715161108>
damn
stiff obsidian
me when all my weapon aspect max out.
also me: what now?
nice you can start playing the game now
next sundial
I rarely get time to play games so I have been having holidays after the exam so gaming now
void vigil
I have no interest in climbing heat or speedrunning
stiff obsidian
boo
void vigil
Is it really time… to play something other than hades… 🥲
stiff obsidian
hades 2 
lavish sorrel
I have no interest in climbing heat or speedrunning
may I interest you in challenge-running 
tepid light
Is it really time… to play something other than hades… 🥲
join me in darkest dungeon
polar summit
What is left is farming gems with chiron and dio special then all the rest is pom keepsake. purge all others.
void vigil
idk if I’m in the mood for such a game
also I need to finish many games before I get it
polar summit
also ||dusa best girl||
void vigil
Over 300 games will take me a while
tepid light
jesus
stiff obsidian
i have hades in my game backlog
upper wolf
I'm in the DD discord and I don't know you
tepid light
I'm in the DD discord and I don't know you <:zageyes:1012805269715161108>
because you are irrelevant
steep condor
have you completed hitless 64 heat boonless gilgamesh
you forgot to say in under 3 minutes
tepid light
you forgot to say in under 3 minutes
with one hand
rustic vale
Excalibruh is just that weapon
You have to like actively avoid taking boons to not see a +% strike boon by styx
real bough
You have to like actively avoid taking boons to not see a +% strike boon by styx
Ares boons 💀💀💀
Demeters
upper wolf
demeter is a +% boon 
rustic vale
got her cast
Over a strike boon?
real bough
he-he-hell yea
rustic vale
real bough
yk I was hoping for an Athena strike
rustic vale
That’s on you tbh
real bough
ay cant stop gambling
rustic vale
Who was in your pool?
real bough
holdon I thinkI got the whole family in
rustic vale
you shouldn’t be able to unless you were actively trying for it
Also then you would have had 5 gods that could have given you a +% strike
and yet not taken one by styx
real bough
I beat the old geezers anyways
stone ermine
do i upgrade fountains urns or troves first
mint coral
Throw a coin
Joke aside, maybe troves?
Idk I barely used them cuz I just cheated in resources the first time lmao
opal hemlock
if i select the dionysis trinket, does it continue to work every realm? i feel like i didnt notice it in elysium this last time
mint coral
if i select the dionysis trinket, does it continue to work every realm? i feel l...
Force effect is once only
You keep the rarity buff
opal hemlock
ah okay good to know, i wish it told me that on the trinket itself
like the coin purse
once per run is it not?
mint coral
There's a one under the keepsake when the force effect is active
opal hemlock
i guess they want to avoid the confusion with the rarity?
that little Retry looking symbol w a number?
mint coral
Yup
opal hemlock
is cursed bad?
real bough
bruh
opal hemlock
its helped me win a ton of fights
opal hemlock
just avoid it
tbh idk what level 4 hades means
but i just healed off him if i took damage
opal hemlock
he does different things?
mint coral
A lot
opal hemlock
oh its like the new "tactic" lol
mint coral
But also just in general
opal hemlock
i saw that but i think i only turned it on for tartarus
mint coral
Cursed slash is bad
Sword is cool in the sense that you have
"Double edge"
"Whatever hammers"
"Actively harmful"
Someone save this weapon
opal hemlock
wait i thought i understood why but now im confused
mint coral
So you end up with a free hp cut
mint coral
And cursed doesn't proc on those
(and the standard combo is pretty bad)
And flurry slash means you do a standing attack after each dash strike
mint coral
No matter how much you short you press the attack
mint coral
and it was really fun
Can't tell you what is fun so I'll leave it at that
But yeah sword hammers kinda stinky
opal hemlock
i was healing hella when i played it, but i can imagine if the game got harder, it would probably be easier to get less value out of
opal hemlock
im just now playing with heat and only doing it like 1 heat a time for eat weapon
real bough
im just now playing with heat and only doing it like 1 heat a time for eat weapo...
quadripple it and give it to boss moveset
mint coral
and this game gave me cursed clash
Also out of curiosity
Wad this anvil
Or approval process
real bough
hell yea brother
real bough
RUTHLESS
mint coral
When taking anvil is pretty much "can it get worse?
If the answer is yes, don't bother
Or bother too much and learn rng manip
opal hemlock
When taking anvil is pretty much "can it get worse?
omg i did it one time because i didnt even understand what it meant at first and i got a terrible one
and it was the last time i ever did it
the first time i ever got to styx too
stone ermine
i havent seen zeus boons at all in my last few runs
mint coral
Do you have his keepsake
waxen umbra
do double strike and high voltage affect zeus' call?
mint coral
Ye
real bough
hella spoilers: ||after argueing with Nyx abt the decision of her firing Medusa. I went on to like, use the key to remove the mirror stats as a fact of defiance. What I didnt expect was bro saying "I can do anything". I think Zagreus is tripping fr||
maiden narwhal
remember when hades was fun
tepid light
remember when you were a good gamer
real bough
ooooh
maiden narwhal
i'm actually thinking of removing ri2 and going em4
real bough
ye
maiden narwhal
ri2 is a nightmare
tepid light
i'm actually thinking of removing ri2 and going em4
WELCOME TO THE CLUB, COMRADE
real bough
hey bois another Hades rant
||you know, Omni-man beat his son into unconsciousness, he was hospitalized and had to be spoonfed. And that made Omni man realize he may be tripping. But Hades fr goes all out on Zagreus. He aint whooping the boy either he out here seeking blood, he treating his son like hes a 5 star GTA character||
tepid light
Raising a child is very different when one rules over the literal underworld and death is a minor inconvenience
maiden narwhal
omniman is an alien
hades is a god
stiff obsidian
theyre the same picture
maiden narwhal
that's why i've always found it so dumb that marvel has gods in
why do thor and hercules have to be superheros in their comic books idgi
waxen umbra
||you know, Omni-man beat his son into unconsciousness, he was hospitalized and ...
and then he has the nerve to act like some kind of victim when you successfully retaliate
"you strike at your own father. what choice does that leave me?"
as if he didn't make the effort to gear up, leave the house and go all the way to the entrance of the underworld just to fight you
mint coral
Dad just tp's to the arena
real bough
Dad just tp's to the arena
he probably use the House's elevator or something
real bough
Raising a child is very different when one rules over the literal underworld and...
but still the ferocity and brutality of this man is something
keen mortar
why doesn't hades just take away the weapons outside the front door
sour fog
there is a convo about it, basically the weapons have a will of their own and he's not going to stand in their way
real bough
why doesn't hades just take away the weapons outside the front door
you mean the courtyard?
I'm not the expert of maps here
keen mortar
there is a convo about it, basically the weapons have a will of their own and he...
ah ok lol, theres dialogue explanation about everything
i once thought 'why don't I take charon's boat up' and then zag asks charon to do it in the next room
real bough
Someone should use AI to make the characters say the LowTierGod speech, especially with Zagreus and Hades. Those 2 sounds surprisingly sadistic at times
tepid light
why doesn't hades just take away the weapons outside the front door
also i think the reasoning is that hades wants zagreus to come to the realization that "there is no escape" on his own, so he's basically allowing zagreus to keep on trying to break out rather than just lock the door/take away the weapons in the hopes that zagreus will eventually just give up willingly
stiff obsidian
why doesn't hades just take away the weapons outside the front door
because thats not how the developers designed it
tepid light
ENGAGE WITH THE UNIVERSE, FALSE
fervent radish
Because then there would be no game
Meta would be crush shot or trippy
Or maybe sea storm
keen mortar
Because then there would be no game
the game is just that one paperwork scene forever
polar summit
Those funny things like so rare that he stepped on toxic fungus and he died instantly. 
or a chariot that smacked his ass that is too graphic to describe
polar summit
He tried to copy kobe brian (and 1) but failed brutally.
literally destroyed his ankles
timid quiver
that poor boy can’t catch a break, can he?
timid quiver
STEPPING ON A RAKE
polar summit
the wood slapped on his face so hard that his head exploded.
timid quiver
ssg were so creative making those deaths like damn
nocturne kelp
STEPPING ON A RAKE
Getting killed by a goat too
mint coral
My favs are the animal related ones
timid quiver
didn’t he die from a pollen allergy once
mint coral
Goat/bear/beetle/snake(I think)
polar summit
LOL BEETLE
mint coral
But my fav is death by being polite
timid quiver
that’s a thing?
nocturne kelp
Yeah
mint coral
But my fav is death by being polite
I don't have the line but is basically "hey could you jump into this shady hole for me?" "Sure!"
timid quiver
zag being zag i guess
steep condor
that's bananas
nocturne kelp
Bananas,
Rotate!!
steep condor
relevant, when he talks to than about mortals and death, zag at one point notes how if he was a mortal he'd be "a lot more careful"
waxen umbra
also i think the reasoning is that hades wants zagreus to come to the realizatio...
he already has to intervene directly to stop zagreus escaping, so why not just lock him up?
or spawnkill him for a couple weeks
stiff obsidian
thats a bad game design idea
fervent radish
Because then we wouldn’t have boss fight
upper wolf
I think Hades doesn't want to lock up zag because he promised to never get into his chambers. Hades seems very strict about honesty, I doubt he would break a promise.
waxen umbra
you wouldn't have any game at all
waxen umbra
I think Hades doesn't want to lock up zag because he promised to never get into ...
hades also enjoys tricking people who don't think carefully about what he says. what would stop him from putting a big jail cell over the pool of styx?
upper wolf
I guess he could just hit him with a steel chair when he gets out, but I think that can easily be explained by hubris
waxen umbra
maybe it's something to do with the presence of nyx and thanatos in the game
upper wolf
It might also be more time consuming for him. Hades can't fight Zagreus all the time, he needs to do his job.
waxen umbra
they're also quite powerful so they might beat hades up if he tries something like that
upper wolf
Thanatos no, nyx yes
fervent radish
hades also enjoys tricking people who don't think carefully about what he says. ...
That would be funny
upper wolf
Ofc the real reason is that it needs to be like this for the game, but I think it's not too hard to hand wave in universe
nocturne kelp
I guess he could just hit him with a steel chair when he gets out, but I think t...
Woah!...
chilly zephyr
I do say I wish the choices of path were more like in Cult of Lamb, where you could see what was coming in a sense and plan ahead
Because it's just not fun going halfway into a run and then getting complete dogOFFAL luck
upper wolf
Wdym ?
upper wolf
If it's about sack, play modded 
chilly zephyr
Cult of Lamb still has luck, you don't know exactly what you'll get etc.
fervent radish
^
Well like what do you envision that as being for hades and how does that make the game better
chilly zephyr
Just as boons are still random, but you could see "Oh I'll get the choices of these"
fervent radish
Because you can pause buffer when you enter a room
nocturne kelp
Cult of Lamb still has luck, you don't know exactly what you'll get etc.
Woas! Cult of lamb mentioned
fervent radish
Just as boons are still random, but you could see "Oh I'll get the choices of th...
How does that help?
chilly zephyr
How does that help?
It wouldn't feel as random. For example the last area with the Satyrs lets you choose inbetween 5 and plan accordingly with the shop. That's a perfect example
*Good example
latent moon
i mean that would be nice but also considering how many branching pathways there are or can be, it'd get kinda messy
waxen umbra
Just as boons are still random, but you could see "Oh I'll get the choices of th...
if it's any help, there will always be 2 shops per area except styx, there will always be 2 hammers and once you get boons from 4 different gods (excluding hermes and chaos), no more other gods show up (excluding hermes and chaos).
latent moon
well you can sometimes miss midshop lmao
chilly zephyr
Whilst I have to say I've come to hate area 2 and 3 at times because sometimes you just get hot garbage and not even any choice in the matter
upper wolf
How does that help?
More opportunities to get angry when the boon choice is bad (you can see the bad boon choice in other rooms !) and you can also mald when the boons are good but you must take story room or shop
waxen umbra
on the bright side, you'll be less likely to stumble into the butterfly room
latent moon
isn't butterfly 50/50
fervent radish
And by aspho and ely, I know what gods I want anyways and I’m not going to not take those gods
stiff obsidian
butterfly good
latent moon
it's easy if you have the summon
fervent radish
But modded
latent moon
otherwise it's harder than bull
stiff obsidian
its like the check of if you know how to build your aspect right or not
latent moon
or at least way more annoying
waxen umbra
I found the butterfly room gets easier if you focus on killing souls the moment they spawn
chilly zephyr
i mean that would be nice but also considering how many branching pathways there...
Not saying we need 5 choices every time. But the spirit of having some information of what you're going to go through and plan accordingly.
Atm I don't feel like there's much planning unless you use the auto-spawn keepsakes but that literally starts to go against the whole "Gamble/random" part as well
waxen umbra
even if it means doing less damage to the butterfly ball
fervent radish
Not saying we need 5 choices every time. But the spirit of having some informati...
The keepsakes are a minimal amount of control you have on the run. If someone doesn’t like that control, they can start shackle idk
And boons are pretty easy to plan out if you know what you’re aiming for
latent moon
Not saying we need 5 choices every time. But the spirit of having some informati...
i mean using god keepsakes are part of the game and it's what lets you not have garbage builds in ely, which is what you mentioned about not having any control over lol
stone rune
Sub2 tart pace into trickle Xtrap
i mean tart pace should never be set until you're in the endshop
chilly zephyr
Like half my clears is with the same boons because they're so reliable+keepsakes.
Infact I feel like the way the randomization goes now makes me less inclined to experiment with other builds because unless the stars align it's just so much worse than going with the same thing
waxen umbra
i mean that would be nice but also considering how many branching pathways there...
this is a good point. you might accidentally nuke your pc if you get a bunch of 3-exit rooms in the future and the computer has to work out a ton of different possibilities.
latent moon
there's only 1 3 exit room and that's in aspho afaik
but there's a good chunk of 2 exits
and all of ely is 2 exit iirc
stone rune
therse 1 1 exit
chilly zephyr
i mean using god keepsakes are part of the game and it's what lets you not have ...
So you're agreeing with me that the argument of "yay random gamble!" is false since we already have a way to circumvent it
waxen umbra
I think ely has some 1 exit
waxen umbra
asterius is a 1 exit
stone rune
kinda looks like a banana
latent moon
oh i think i know what you're talking about
it's the one with the big ass cliff at the bottom right
stone rune
latent moon
yeah
stone rune
the squares are well spots
latent moon
im pretty sure that's the big ass cliff one
waxen umbra
are the wells 2 exit?
stone rune
wat
latent moon
So you're agreeing with me that the argument of "yay random gamble!" is false si...
i mean yeah i guess?
fervent radish
So you're agreeing with me that the argument of "yay random gamble!" is false si...
It’s not circumventing the gamble. There’s still loads of the game that’s random. But if you want a certain build, it’s just one way to start there
latent moon
yeah i was gonna sya lmao
stone rune
if you want randomness play shackle nem
fervent radish
That’s what I said
stone rune
even the weapon is random
latent moon
you can guarantee 2 gods in your pool, and then after that it's still rng
your'e just more likely to get a good build
chilly zephyr
if you want randomness play shackle nem
I don't, it's everyone else who at first disagreed with me saying we should have a say in planning ahead
I'm just pointing out the fallacy of that argument
latent moon
you do have a way to plan ahead, that's just god keepsakes
waxen umbra
you can guarantee 2 gods in your pool, and then after that it's still rng
usually you can skip the rooms of unwanted gods or use fated authority to change them
stone rune
its a video game
fervent radish
You can plan ahead with the keepsake, but anything past that the game makes random
stone rune
well
i think whats really nice about hades is how much control u can get over the game
latent moon
usually you can skip the rooms of unwanted gods or use fated authority to change...
yeah you can skip but most people dont use authority lol
waxen umbra
you do have a way to plan ahead, that's just god keepsakes
you can also improve your planning by being adaptable and knowing your alternatives
chilly zephyr
You can plan ahead with the keepsake, but anything past that the game makes rand...
Yeah and that goes against the argument that we shouldn't just be able to do that without using a keepsake for it
It adds nothing
latent moon
you can also improve your planning by being adaptable and knowing your alternati...
depends what goal you're trying to achieve but for general clearing that holds pretty true yeah
chilly zephyr
Just makes us more inclined to use what we already know works most of the time
fervent radish
No the keepsake has opportunity cost lol
chilly zephyr
Sure people who've already maxed everything don't care about resources but especially early on you want to keep getting deeper and so aren't incentivized to experiment. Instead just go with the keepsake-gods you know work etc.
fervent radish
The game throws random god pools at you so you have to experiment
stone rune
why would you want to experiment
fervent radish
Most people’s first clears are cursed as f for that reason
latent moon
i mean you are incentivized to experiment when starting out
if you dont know the meta, you just have to throw stuff together and figure out what works the best
for you at least
waxen umbra
Sure people who've already maxed everything don't care about resources but espec...
I think there is incentive to experiment early on because once you start reaching hades the rest of the game starts to feel comparatively easy
stiff obsidian
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1028112977100017666/1220787891794345994/i...
wow that emote sucks
latent moon
lmao
fervent radish
Sure people who've already maxed everything don't care about resources but espec...
And the keepsake doesn’t control the build nearly as much as your suggesting.
waxen umbra
there's also dark thirst and minor prophecies to encourage players to try new things for more rewards
stiff obsidian
you know what would be really fun, a random boon run where i dont get to choose what boon i get
surely
latent moon
ap2 :croven:
fervent radish
AP2
latent moon
throw in ri1 for funsies :)
stone rune
i dont understand why consistency is bad
fervent radish
Oh god this guy would perish if he had to play with AP2
stone rune
i am happy with the same build every run
fervent radish
No one is saying that
fervent radish
i am happy with the same build every run
We know that
fervent radish
Based off of the daily sheet(s) you post
latent moon
lmfao
fervent radish
Other people play this genre for variability
chilly zephyr
I think there is incentive to experiment early on because once you start reachin...
Yeah and that's what makes me a bit sad that I feel that magic goes away fast. Maybe it's how Cult of Lamb changes weapons/spells so often in longer runs but after my 15th clear I'm starting to get annoyed whenever a weapon isn't getting the "standard" drops like say a chaos 50%+.
Whilst if there was an element of more planning perhaps one could try a "special" etc. build, but that also requires equal luck in rolls so might as well just do the ordinary one.
Given I am still experimenting I just feel kind of railroaded at times
fervent radish
Different goals exist
chilly zephyr
tldr
waxen umbra
i dont understand why consistency is bad
for some it can get stale doing the same thing every time, but I guess even if you use the same builds every time the combat will still be different
stiff obsidian
i like getting the same build evry time too but i cannnot because i use ap2 so i ragequit
stone rune
rare+ chaos is definitely not a standard boon
fervent radish
Yeah and that's what makes me a bit sad that I feel that magic goes away fast. M...
You might be served better by the speedrunning mod pack if initial boon is that much of an issue
chilly zephyr
I really hope they add more procedural elements of levels in Hades2, as well as an forever mode
latent moon
a "special" build vs an "attack" build doesnt necessarily require equal luck
some builds are more needy than others
stone rune
oh boy do i have the mod for you
except i dont have it becuase its not in my search bar
does anyone know where zyru incremental is
fervent radish
Speedrunning server
latent moon
pinned in speedcord iirc
stone rune
new one?
latent moon
yeah
fervent radish
Yeah
latent moon
it's like the first message or something
fervent radish
some builds are more needy than others
Also if you want a special build, you can literally just have the special and be fine
latent moon
well it's not the first message but it is pinned lol
fervent radish
Whatever accessory boons can be random asf
latent moon
i dont see it what channel
the mods one
fervent radish
Guan yu special build
waxen umbra
I *really* hope they add more procedural elements of levels in Hades2, as well a...
Hades 2 lore: chronos wanted to save time (it is his passion, after all), so instead of fighing you himself he gets an AI-generated final boss to do it for him.
latent moon
extra mods
fervent radish
Zeus shield aphro special
latent moon
do you know hwo many mods channels there are
isnt there only 1
oh are you in the dev update ones
fervent radish
Hestia speedrunning meta is literally starting tdash and do whatever shows up for attack
stone rune
"mods and tools"
latent moon
ah i dont have those channels
waxen umbra
Whatever accessory boons can be random asf
there are a couple of exceptions, though. fast weapons wont do much with doom and slow weapons wont do much with hangover.
stone rune
i dont like this selecting channels business
oh yeah fast weapons famously are bad at using doom
latent moon
you can opt out of them from channels and roles at the top
fervent radish
there are a couple of exceptions, though. fast weapons wont do much with doom an...
Yeah point is that as long as you have your core, you’ll be fine
latent moon
meme builds exist all the time, it's just whether or not if you want to do them lmao
waxen umbra
tbh I rarely start games with one of the god keepsakes
I prefer using hypnos' keepsake with golden touch for lots of free money later on
fervent radish
Repeated doom applications dont do anything unless you’re using ME
latent moon
tbf doom kinda sucks all around unless you get ME yeah lmao
it's like solid damage i guess
stone rune
yeah but why are you not getting ME
waxen umbra
luck
fervent radish
Skissue
I don’t enjoy playing ME builds simply because the build is dead in the water if I don’t get it
latent moon
just get explosive upper on fists on your 2nd hammer
aspect of explosive upper goes hard
waxen umbra
true
fervent radish
Reason why my Gilga 32 was tdash
stone rune
i dont like playing fists because fists are useless garbage
latent moon
have you tried not going fast on them
waxen umbra
how are they garbage? they're one of the fastest weapons in the game and provide minimal penalties to your movement while using
latent moon
how are they garbage? they're one of the fastest weapons in the game and provide...
funnily enough, they are not the fastest weapon in the game
waxen umbra
how are they garbage? they're one of the fastest weapons in the game and provide...
compare that to things like bow and spear that can halt your movement for long periods of time
latent moon
they just feel fast bc of the high punch rate lol
jagged hamlet
They're not very good for speedruns, unfortunately
waxen umbra
funnily enough, they are not the fastest weapon in the game
the fastest one would be the gun, right?
fervent radish
compare that to things like bow and spear that can halt your movement for long p...
Have you played Gilgamesh
As a whole yeah
jagged hamlet
Bow is super hecking mobile though: dash-strikes all day every day
waxen umbra
Have you played Gilgamesh
I haven't unlocked it yet
fervent radish
ROWO is the fastest owo
latent moon
the fastest one would be the gun, right?
technically speaking i guess lol
does have 2 of the faster aspects
fervent radish
Bow is super hecking mobile though: dash-strikes all day every day
You’re stuck while charging though
latent moon
zag rail and luci are still solid
waxen umbra
I think i might get gilgamesh soon because I already have guan yu, sharanga and beowulf
latent moon
but fists is notoriously not fast lol
dem fists are still like good
but like it's like slightly above average or something
waxen umbra
demeter fists are especially good if you get an uppercut hammer
jagged hamlet
You’re stuck while charging though
You say "stuck", I say "standing exactly where I wanna be momentarily"! 
latent moon
demeter fists are especially good if you get an uppercut hammer
yeah that's helpful but that still makes it slightly above average lmao
stiff obsidian
im ngl i like fists
stiff obsidian
they were my first weapon for all aspects sub8
latent moon
how'd you do gilga before other things
stiff obsidian
gilga was my first fist sub8
waxen umbra
what does gilgamesh do?
latent moon
you get like an extra dash or two, but they're shorter
jagged hamlet
It applies a pseudo-doom too, but said pseudo-doom lets enemies hit you super hard
waxen umbra
could be good if you get thunder dash + every single dash-supporting and thunder-supporting boon in the game
latent moon
your standing attack has a pretty high base damage and is a swipe but your dash strike does like 20, and the dash strikes are a bit delayed
latent moon
could be good if you get thunder dash + every single dash-supporting and thunder...
dash only uses tidal dash but yeah lol
mint coral
Gilga "can't kill a numbskull" mesh
latent moon
tidal dash is kinda the defacto choice for dash if you want damage
waxen umbra
dash only uses tidal dash but yeah lol
oh right, you could use tidal dash with the zeus/poseidon duo boon
mint coral
Sea storm is a luxury
latent moon
sea storm is surprisingly low on the priority list for dash only lmao
mint coral
Lightning reflexes works great
stone rune
yeah u want lr and stuff
waxen umbra
sea storm is surprisingly low on the priority list for dash only lmao
that's surprising considering how many support boons lightning strikes have
latent moon
lightning reflexes is sea storm at home but by god is it much easier and practical to get
mint coral
Tidal dash doesn't open sea storm is the thing
latent moon
yeah
mint coral
You need another pos core
latent moon
so you're forced to take another pos boon and another zeus boon
if you're not doing dash only that's not like horrible
but for dash only that's 2 wasted boons to get sea storm, at which you could've already gotten better stuff from pos and zeus
mint coral
Tidal dash doesn't open sea storm is the thing
(it used to, but you can figure out why it no longer does)
latent moon
razor shoals and lightning reflexes provide more immediate value and does just as much or more than sea storm
waxen umbra
so you're forced to take another pos boon and another zeus boon
that would further become an issue when you consider that using poseidon stuff on fists will put your enemies exactly where you don't want them to be: far away from you!
latent moon
i mean eh
it doesnt send them that far
another dash should put you where they land
or if not there's other enemies nearby that you didn't hit yet
but tdash just does a lot more damage for more aoe than any other dash
and lighting reflexes is pretty similar to thunder dash anyways
so you can kinda get 2 dashes in 1 slot but for way more damage
dug this up, dont have a recording but it was pretty good damage lmao
used summons so not true dash only but it was nice
warm hedge
do you lose your gained hearts if you switch from Old Spiked Collar to another keepsake?
stone rune
yes
warm hedge
ty
so the only one with instant benefits that doesnt lose them when switched to another one is the Cthonic Coin Purse?
upper wolf
Oh, now that I think about it, I never checked: you keep the 50 "actual" HP, right ? If you are 100/150, you get down to 100/100 and not 50/100?
I wouldn't say hourglass is "instant", but that's a detail
warm hedge
so you get the keep the buff icon even if you ditch the hourglass?
not even sure if hourglass adds buff icon like boons tbh
jagged hamlet
The hourglass extends the duration of any limited buffs you buy from the Well of Charon. You keep the extended duration
jagged hamlet
Papa Reaper
stone rune
rama 64 done
void vigil
huh
stone rune
void vigil
modded?
mint coral
Banger
stone rune
the zeus rama gy 3wep 64 is real
stone rune
he hasn’t posted it but i can’t imagine it won’t be
void vigil
makes sense
jaunty sparrow
Papa Reaper
?
chilly zephyr
Huh died to a bug
Last boss fight and one of those skulls aoe didn't show the green line, just the snow effect
Didn't realize it was the wave affect until I dodged into it twice for 20dmgx2
jaunty sparrow
"Im never gonna be dad"
\- Reaper
Oh
upper wolf
I think I heard about that bug before
never had it myself
RIP though, it sucks to die like that
warm hedge
i just finished the game. cant wait for the next one.
stiff obsidian
🤔 🤔 🤔
stiff obsidian
game starts at epilogue
warm hedge
im kinda bad at this, things got scary once heat mode unlocked
upper wolf
it do be like that sometimes
feel free to toggle god mode if you think you'll enjoy the game more like that
warm hedge
credits are rolling, idk what content is left to see
upper wolf
a lot tbh
stiff obsidian
theres loads left
upper wolf
it's like
50% ?
I'm pulling the number out of my delicate posterior
but that's just to give you an idea
warm hedge
lol ive just realized i havent used any tequila bottles, theres gotta be more stuff i need to unlock
upper wolf
tequila bottle
proper tusk
tequila bottles 😭
stiff obsidian
my friend reached credits with barely 1 aspect maxed
void vigil
ive seen people call it juice, tequila is a new one
fervent radish
game starts at epilogue
Game starts at 50 heat
stiff obsidian
you do 50 before epilogue
upper wolf
idr if I have a 50 win yet
stiff obsidian
@coarse jackal will you do 50 before epilogue?
upper wolf
I think my highest is 45
warm hedge
im sure ill never play at high heat, i'm button mashing at 3 heat
stiff obsidian
im button mashing at 50 heat
upper wolf
we all did this at some point
stiff obsidian
we still do this
upper wolf
oh yeah, and we still do, true
warm hedge
the voice acting and dialogue is sooo good, probably my favorite thing about the game
upper wolf
It's crazy how much mashing I did at 32 specifically. Playing arthur and 45 makes your realize how much more thinking you're supposed to do... Which I still don't do, but that's not the point
sour fog
nothing will reveal button mashing more than having just one dash
upper wolf
the voice acting and dialogue is sooo good, probably my favorite thing about the...
Same ! And that's despite every other aspect also being goated
sour fog
I did 32 and am absolutely useless when I don't have two dashes
coarse jackal
<@759317118847156234> will you do 50 before epilogue?
when is epilogue
stiff obsidian
no
coarse jackal
sour fog
epilogue is when you trigger it basically, once you unlock the prophecy you can do it whenever
or just not do it at all
steep condor
i only noticed like last week that when i button mash dash and attack too quickly i don't actually dash strike on sword
fervent radish
I played a bit
It’s eh
But that’s in comparison to pc. I’m sure if it’s just hades, someone with a better hang of controls would be fine
waxen umbra
the voice acting and dialogue is sooo good, probably my favorite thing about the...
Apparently the script for hades contians something like 200,000 words
gentle venture
i plan on trying it later today, but i might try using my backbone controller for it to make it easier
steep condor
You lose an attack after dash strikes end
yes. one day, after only like 300 hours of game play i wondered "why is zag doing these jumps when i dash-stri... oh"
fervent radish
Heh
jaunty sparrow
W
next sundial
Aww man was soo close killing hades again. i hate his stupid fire ball thingys ;-;
next sundial
Oh I see
next sundial
I got hit like 3 times by one of it because I was dashing away and it hit me 3 times
long tree
What's up my hades guys
jaunty sparrow
I got hit like 3 times by one of it because I was dashing away and it hit me 3 t...
Yea thats the problem
next sundial
Yea thats the problem
Ye thanks for the tip!
next sundial
I see I see
next sundial
I try to but sometimes some explode
next sundial
Theyre quite weak so only 1-2 hits if you’re using a good build
I use the chiron aspect just unlocked it having fun with it
next sundial
Bow sorry haha
next sundial
Firstly unlocked Hera but it wasn't fun
next sundial
Is chiron the one that marks
Yep
long tree
Its a great bow
jaunty sparrow
I almost beat hades with it aswell
long tree
Love it
jaunty sparrow
Im using gy spear now tho
long tree
Haven't been able to play for a while pc broke but I got it on switch now
Have to restart lol
void vigil
hera very fun
long tree
Hera is op with the right boons
jaunty sparrow
Wish I hadn't wasted my Titan blood on aspect of Hera
In the end it doesn’t really matter
proper tusk
Wish I hadn't wasted my Titan blood on aspect of Hera
waste more its good
jaunty sparrow
You’ll eventually just get all aspects max
void vigil
it has like one build but its a good one
next sundial
Haha okey lol
proper tusk
crush shot
proper tusk
and pom it a lot
long tree
It destroys all
next sundial
It do big boom?
long tree
Big big boom
proper tusk
and if youre on controller i recommend using a trigger for cast instead of the default bind
next sundial
Big big boom kill?
proper tusk
makes it much less awkward to load the casts
long tree
Kill boom big
next sundial
and if youre on controller i recommend using a trigger for cast instead of the d...
I am on m&k 😭
next sundial
Kill boom big
Ok good good
proper tusk
ah alright then nvm lol
jaunty sparrow
What does hera do
long tree
Uses casts
next sundial
You can load casts in the bow
proper tusk
crush shot is really good bc its weakness is low range in exchange for high damage
and hera removes the range weakness because you can launch it wherever
next sundial
Then pom is
What's pom?
proper tusk
pom of power
next sundial
The fruit?
long tree
Gn
proper tusk
cast damage increases a ton with poms
gentle venture
i used to have a hard time getting behind the concept of the bow, i think it’s the last weapon i beat the game with
proper tusk
so its really important to get lots of them
proper tusk
i used to have a hard time getting behind the concept of the bow, i think it’s t...
its v good once you get used to dash striking and getting into the rhythm of power shots
if you dont do that its pretty awkward
long tree
The annoying part for me is I automatically load 3 casts in when I'm fighting normal mobs
Hate to have to pick them up lol
gentle venture
its v good once you get used to dash striking and getting into the rhythm of pow...
yeah, thats what i used to struggle with
long tree
I like ranged I can't do melee well
gentle venture
I use rama a lot now so i got into the power shot rhythm
proper tusk
i love rama
gentle venture
it is pretty great yeah
being forced to actually use the charge attack made me better with the bow overall
I still can’t get behind Hera though
i don’t love it
chilly zephyr
I think I heard about that bug before
I think it has something to do with if there's too many skulls exploding, had 6 of em at once.
Tbh wasn't that salty because the build sucked so didn't have my heart in the fight
Still kinda arse way to die tho :d
steep condor
met eurydice and orpheus in asphodel and... they're singing in the blood. this hasn't happened to me before ever
gentle venture
i think it’s either a one time thing, or just generally rare
I think i’ve only had it happen once
I wish the acoustic version they play in asphodel was on the soundtrack
gentle venture
Something ive thought about for a while now
Because its obvious that Hades and Zag’s movesets are meant to be parallels to each other, I think it would be cool if you got something similar to his shockwave ability if you made it to his boss fight with the Hades aspect spear and the Sigil of the dead equipped
Or in general, it would be cool if there were a way to have that move in our arsenal, regardless of if it were boss fight exclusive or not
upper wolf
A boon or something that gives Zag a big shockwave on death defiance would be epic
"I die ? No, you die !"
wave of blood
very edgy too, perfect for him
gentle venture
I think it would be able to be worked in as part of the spear’s aspect buffs
The spear doesnt have a cast based aspect, i think they could add it to the hades aspect
Make it so if you dont pick up your casts for a few seconds It creates a shockwave
Then, to finish it out, add the exploding casts from Hera and Beowulf
upper wolf
I think it would be able to be worked in as part of the spear’s aspect buffs
The...
achilles is right there
the only reason achilles is not the best cast aspect is because beo and hera are OP beyond belief
latent moon
Achilles is also like the third best aspect in the game overall lmao
upper wolf
speaking of, I was under the impression for a long time that Eris was the best aspect in the game. Like, 3 years ago or so. Was I uninformed or it's just that the meta developped ?
keen mortar
eris is just like good i dunno, around the same as hestia
i'm new so that's my recent impression of community opinion
last veldt
Eris with a chunky special (Rocket Bomb if you're lucky, or even Clockets) is great
keen mortar
question, does zeus trigger on every hit of demeter fists, ik theres an internal cooldown which makes chiron not great with zeus but is demeter fist hits as affected?
fervent radish
question, does zeus trigger on every hit of demeter fists, ik theres an internal...
The internal cooldown doesn’t apply to chain lightning I think
That’s why luci works
mint coral
The internal cooldown doesn’t apply to chain lightning I think
0.15s
mint coral
question, does zeus trigger on every hit of demeter fists, ik theres an internal...
With every hit do you mean the charged upper
keen mortar
yeah i mean the charged upper's multi-hit
mint coral
Runs into cooldown pretty sure
keen mortar
it's so fast I can barely see the different numbers so i doubt it
keen mortar
yeah i was just wondering lol
Also if I did the math properly if you have x% crit on something it's equivant to having 2x% the damage normally
e.g. if you take 20% more crit on attack, then it's the equviant of 40% more damage
(not including clean kill)
Pressure Points gives 2% more crit meaning it's basically 4% more DPS, but wouldn't that be simply worse than Urge to Kill which is 10% to everything?
stone rune
no
because urge to krill is not 10% to everything
urge to krill doesnt benefit from marked
keen mortar
ah
right
the math bit is correct right
just trying to measure out how much crit chance is worth taking
keen mortar
fair yeah marked and clean affect it
wait when pressure points says everything is it like
actually everything
such as hangover for example
keen mortar
yeah ik just saying it affects it a little
true oak
Also yk it's multiplicativee
gentle venture
wait wait wait, hold on
pressure points counts for damage that comes from debuffs too?
thats kinda nuts
keen mortar
*takes critical alcohol poisoning*
true oak
yeah its only global damage
if its applied by e.g. attack, then attack buffs won't affect that
but global will
gentle venture
so that means there is a chance, however slim, that all of my hangover stacks crit separately
thats a bit broken, innit?
gentle venture
i kinda agree
gentle venture
but yeah imo crits are inconsistent and a bit overrated
like other than heehee big number, i’d rather have other stuff on a lot of my slots
stone rune
i mean it strongly depends
arty atk is best in slot on achilles
it is not so good on eris
gentle venture
Unless i’m planning for a crazy specific build, i tend to only like having crit on my cast
stone rune
true shot sucks
gentle venture
I feel like crit could be nuts on lucifer with eternal chamber though
i have yet to try that
upper wolf
Eternal chamber is not what you want if playing %dmg lucifer attack
The ramp is pretty strong, if very clunky
true oak
is ramping +% or base
upper wolf
Base
gentle venture
I was mainly considering that the likelyhood of crits would be super high if you’re constantly attacking
Maximum power green beam
like
and i know this sounds bad
crit on gilgmesh attack
more attack means more crit
keen mortar
yeah but crit is always 300%
doesn't matter how much u crit
if u do 1 dmg and you crit its still only 3 dmg
gentle venture
Well yeah
but if hypothetically
crit chance is 5% and i attack 50 times, which is easier on a weapon you can press and hold,
you crit at LEAST once
true oak
i think that is a valid point, because more hmark
and tripling your dps is the same for all
upper wolf
Why is it important to crit at least once
stone rune
you crit at least once for 7 damage
gentle venture
Why is it important to crit at least once
well, those crits add up, especially when you get to the point of doing a hundred or so damage without the crit
then you do 300 with it
upper wolf
What
stone rune
i dont think thats how math works
if you hit an enemy 700 times with 1 damage pellet it will add up
to 700
gentle venture
crit is 3 times damage, right?
meaning a normal hit that does 100 damage would do 300 if it crit, yeah?
upper wolf
Yes. So one of the pellets will do 3 damage. Bumping the total to 702. Yay ?
upper wolf
meaning a normal hit that does 100 damage would do 300 if it crit, yeah?
You're talking damage, not rate of fire, so I don't understand your point ?
keen mortar
the way I think about it is if you have 5% crit with Arthur blade it's not gonna be very useful for regular encounters because you often overkill the enemies you crit, but bosses don't have that downside because you hit them so much.
However, if you have 5% crit with rail then it's as useful on regular enemies too because the crits don't overkill as often and are more reliable.
upper wolf
Well yeah, but "as useful" might still mean "not useful at all"
keen mortar
lots of hits with crit isn't better because it does more raw damage or anything, but it's good because it's more reliable in doing the damage it can do
upper wolf
Big agree on Arthur crits though. It's funny, until you struggle against normal mobs
gentle venture
You're talking damage, not rate of fire, so I don't understand your point ?
I think my original point was that because eternal chamber would allow you to attack more often, it would mean that even with a sort of low crit chance, you’d still crit very often overall
stone rune
meanwhile lightning strike
keen mortar
nah obviously don't take arti on rail that was just making a point
gentle venture
I think my original point was that because eternal chamber would allow you to at...
unless i’m misunderstanding the mechanic
or the weapon itself
upper wolf
I think my original point was that because eternal chamber would allow you to at...
And my point is that we don't care about critting often if it's for no damage
keen mortar
unless i’m misunderstanding the mechanic
the issue with "still crit very often overall" is that the crits dont do enough damage on their own anyways
mint coral
How much is luci base atk anyways
gentle venture
oh so THATS why
upper wolf
10 iirc