h2-builds-and-combat

[frozen prairie]

is aphro the best fir nergal

[glass shell]

generally speaking apollo.

[last cape]

Aphro is an option. Apollo legendary is probably the strongest thing you can do on it though

[glass shell]

Its preferred to use omega attack over the regular and the omega attack hits the entire room most of the time

[last cape]

Also the range apollo gives you is crazy in general

[glass shell]

so apollo>aphro for general use but aphro is takable yeah

[frozen prairie]

makes sense actully thx

[glass shell]

Demeter is also a shoutout for safety + weed killer

[last cape]

Self healing and daze are also really strong with how face tanky it can be

[woeful moth]

Can anyone suggest good build for skulls?

But not medea build

[glass shell]

Which one?

[elfin forge]

which skulls

[woeful moth]

Doesnt matter, mel and hel are good

[last cape]

Persephone and Hel both are good at olympian damage builds

Mel is also really solid

[glass shell]

Mel skull i personally have distaste for, but if you had to play it just spamming apollo or hera attack is good

Perspephone is great with literally any god that is offensive for the most part. Heph being a standout but you really gotta hunt for duos playing heph

Hel is pick posiedon or hestia and spam attack.

If they just buffed the power to like 15 or 20 and fixed the bug/interaction on mel skull with wide grin i'd be a mel skull enjoyer again

[last cape]

i was thinking either demeter for gale + local climate maybe

Or just go fig leaf or pin

actually chaos has a lot of good rolls on charon builds. Surely

[median anvil]

mel skull i take apollo to profit off of its massive oattack

[uneven palm]

Fig Leaf and skip some fights? Moon Beam and power up a hex? Coin Purse for some money?

[void cargo]

I'm really discovering that Mel daggers can carry me better than I thought. I almost died at basically every boss but 32 fear Mel daggers was a success

Apollo/Hera/Ares on the attack, spec, cast. Sun Worshipper helped a huuuuge amount in the VoR Chronos fight

[civic ocean]

Its really good if you want to use the regular attack combo

[civic ocean]

Mel blades rn I don’t even bother starting a god keepsake it’s so good with anything

[void cargo]

Mel blades are ok. I struggle with 2 weps high fear. Daggers and Axe

[civic ocean]

Wheel is never a bad shout since there’s a lot of primo stuff on charon that makes your stuff cost more

[civic ocean]

Blades are kinda universal now for the three aspects that aren the morrigan

Like they’re all very well rounded weapons without too much specialization

[void cargo]

Poor Pan

[civic ocean]

Oh trust me Pan is doing juuuust fine

Really strong aspect

[last cape]

I just took chaos and hammer and died to prometheus

i hate thinkiiiing about keepsakes god I need to switch back to strength

[void cargo]

Daggers aren't my fav wep but they're serviceable

Torches are my personal strongest weapon. And after that the staff

[lunar anvil]

lunar ray maxed is funny

[edgy nacelle]

what full build were you using? I haven't actually done a lunar ray run since godsent hexes were updated to be easier to get, hm

[last cape]

All the godsent hexes feel really strong

Even night bloom surprised me

[edgy nacelle]

I love night bloom lmao, especially with the "servants persist until you leave the location" upgrade
night bloom + both hera duos for 3 allies at once is so funny. I kinda want to do a run with Toula and Anubis (for lost shade damage) and go all in on indirect ally damage

[brazen ore]

godsent night bloom is so funny. i don't know if it's good but it's definitely funny

[edgy nacelle]

idk what the bar for "good" is really.
ik I've gotten ~125k damage from allies at the end of a run, which felt pretty impactful? probably could have pushed it further too.
it also makes menace fun—if I'm remembering the name of that vow right—since you can summon one of the olympus robots in the rift and let it plow through enemies

[brazen ore]

true. i mean good for my goals, which are to try and get better at pushing fear. you're right that "good" in general is not a helpful descriptor lol

[edgy nacelle]

hm, idk how it would be at particularly high fear. potentially good since it can speed up room clear very safely, having your summon deal with one half of the room/aggressive melee enemies while you clear the other. but it's also competing with other hexes which are likely a lot better for that

lmk if you try a hera godsent run while pushing fear, I'm genuinely curious how it'd feel. I haven't used it past the low 40s, personally

[willow phoenix]

Lunar Ray Godsent can reach 15k+ damage which is fun for bursting bosses

[edgy nacelle]

oh, speaking of godsent hexes, I believe air quality affects demeter's? I've only had AQ and the right hex one time, but I want to mess with it again, it felt nice and I want to test how strong it actually feels when I'm intentionally building towards it early instead of getting it by accident near the end of a run

[willow phoenix]

It does, it can deal 1k+ damage with it

Now that Phase Shift windup doesn't take forever it's pretty decent imo. Damage wise Hestia Godsent is still better though

[civic ocean]

Night Bloom is really good in most of the bosses yeah

Like you can drop the Yargonaut on Typhon and its super funny

[willow phoenix]

Needing to wait for the egg to hatch is a bit of a pain though lol

I haven't seen how much damage the Mega Dracon can do but so far Yargonaut seems better than boar for night bloom

[civic ocean]

Yeah thats the catch you also need prometheus to summon a guy

Personally I like Phase Shift and Lunar Ray the most for typhon

[willow phoenix]

Dark Side is also very strong

With sunny dispo you can get 10k+ damage from Heartthrobs alone

Skyfall used to be very good vs Typhon but I think they fixed Prism being able to multi hit Typhon lol

Meanwhile Hand of Hephaestus is losing to normal blast in terms of damage lol, since it doesn't work with chain reaction and backstab

[formal pulsar]

I am playing a lot of Supay lately, any build better than romantic spark ransom blitz?

[uneven palm]

That’s hard to top honestly. If you wanna mix things up, I did a fun Aphro dash start into Burning Desire + Freezer Burn run earlier today but that’s like even more duos. Or could do Heph blasts somewhere he’s got good duos with Hestia or Poseidon who you’d like on attack/special anyway

[formal pulsar]

i am gonna try freezer burn if i can get a 55f with rom spark. I always love freezer burn builds

Also I am really respecting hitch sprint on supay. It is way better than I thought. Very underrated imo

[uneven palm]

Ya know I haven’t tried that… Aphro Rush is fine-ish but Supay runs always just become flat damage soup runs it feels like the rush boon doesn’t matter much

[edgy nacelle]

it's kind of insane without wards, plowing through non-armored enemies
obviously not great for bossing with the delay on how often you can do damage, but it feels really good for room clear

[sage flame]

what breaker rush used to be 🙏

[woeful moth]

Guys is that bug? I play circe with raki but when I cast there is only 1 cast

I have zeus cast rn, don't know if it is with other cast

[sage flame]

he should fly around the ground at some point for a while to get double casts

like consistently afaik

[formal pulsar]

I love it for three reasons. You already want to sprint with supay more than any other aspects so more hitch than usual. It opens up ransom plays unlike hitch attack. And if you are playing rom sparks, spreading hitch shares the love.

[uneven palm]

It takes a beat for familiars to enter the fight, might be that?

[woeful moth]

Nope, I tried this after clearing room. Still one cast even when raki is chilling on the ground

[uneven palm]

If you’re like never getting a cast, f10 that

[woeful moth]

got it

I was playing momus 🤦‍♂️

[uneven palm]

Yeah that’ll do it

[woeful moth]

Man, phase 3 crono is hard :( The stupid scythe attack feels like undogeble

[civic ocean]

Rn im doing dem sprint AQ and its pretty good so far

[edgy nacelle]

does Supay do much for that set up? iirc the damage% bonus applies before AQ, so if AQ is triggering then the bonus to rush boon damage isn't doing anything (and vice versa)

it does sound fun tho, since you sprint around so much

[near moth]

strategies for vow of rival polyphemus? I already had a generally hard time against him without the vow, but the poison on top is unbearable.

[spiral wadi]

it's easier to just run away from chronos when he does it, otherwise i think a good way to dodge it is to dash into his first (middle) scythe, then immediately sprint back

[glass shell]

When medea does the aoe poision its always in one of two ways, either the vertical lines or the pentagram

When she does random attacks the area will blink before she comes in about a second beforehand, pay attention

Be ready to jump to a fountain at any point in time.

Try to avoid kiting polyphemus into poison, cause that makes his stuff way more annyoing to get chunked + poisoned

Otherwise its the same old same old poly fight

[polar ravine]

so with possessed array you cant decrease the cost with the chaos boon?

i guess the trade off is that other things dont increase the cost

[near moth]

side note, aspect of thanatos, how do i get mortality to trigger/how do i know i have it?

[polar ravine]

mortality resets upon getting hit by the enemies and there is a small gauge next to your health/mana that glows when filled up

unless i missed some change with it

[edgy nacelle]

I’d also say it’s easier to get used to with a ranged weapon or a cast build! doing a run or two where you can watch his movements from a safe distance is nice. the poison patterns are all pretty predictable, but failing to dodge them is punishing.

[rocky pier]

Can someone explain why Charon wants to build around special rather than ocast damage?

[cerulean panther]

Omega Cast boosts are rarer, there's a lost of instances where you're basically using your Cast to instantly proc Lucid Gain for infinite Magick and ranged damage.

Geyser Spout is still probably your #1 pick whenever it's available.

[polar ravine]

geyser spout, prominance flare, meat grinder, arctic gale (demeters cast gust) are all great with it

since using your omega special procs all of those at once

[glass shell]

Almost nothing in the game actually benefits your omega cast damage wise, as most things are weapon damage not global\

There are exceptions you look for along the way like the posiedon boon, or any global damage amps

But for the most part you its easier faster and just comparible to focus on o-spec and getting cast damage cause it kills stuff anyway

[spiral wadi]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051942150025269309/1399909526077050931/Screenshot_2025-07-29_at_5.19.28_PM.png so scorch cast is bugged, it applies 90 scorch when it should only be applying 60 at rare

[uneven palm]

there are some oddball things that apply more scorch… like I think Medea does?

[glass shell]

You sure you just don't have medea equipped?

[spiral wadi]

there are two casts (it's circe)

[glass shell]

ah

[spiral wadi]

gonna try to get it on normal staff ig

[uneven palm]

#1218621088049659930 message in the speedcord Hippo listed Medea, Snuffed Candle, Heart Appetite, Mean Streak all doing weird smolder ring stuff ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[spiral wadi]

i see, ye i just got it on mel staff and it only procs 60 so could also be a weird circe thing

[uneven palm]

I'm seeing the same thing on Circe

[glass shell]

Wonder if circe is using some like old boon logic? Didn't smolder ring get nerfed or something?

[spiral wadi]

smolder ring's only note was in patch 3 that "increased scorch damage"

[uneven palm]

I'm asking in the speedcord haha

[rocky pier]

Any tips for dealing with frenzy Eris with axe? I’ve been finding she really punishes charging your omegas on that weapon (using Charon mostly)

[glass shell]

Phase her faster

With charon if you aren't literally deleting the boss i have questions

[rocky pier]

I am not because I did not get geyser ring sadly

Or a good cast, got stuck with Demeter

[civic ocean]

You take what you’re given and sometimes you get offered special stuff and sometimes you get offered cast stuff

[uneven palm]

Non-rivals? Wait for gattling/shotgun/bomb launching. she sits still mostly during those

If you can bait her near the edges you can also get her right after doing the flying-v dash if she's nearby

[formal pulsar]

Demeter is top tier cast with Charon. Freeze = safety while doing o special and Demeter has local climate.

[uneven palm]

Here’s like a run from Warsong I did but I don’t think she’s changed. You basically wait to cast until you know she’s gonna sit still for a bit, otherwise she’s gonna dash or fly away and you’re busted since you can’t move the cast https://youtu.be/F_e9KfGemWM?si=R35EPBMv44SmT25S

But like also don’t listen to me I took hazard boom like a genius

[finite narwhal]

what's the opinion around dark side? it's my second fav hex, but im afraid that others dont share this opinion

[analog ether]

As a concept? I love it.

In execution? It's always felt a little lackluster to me.

[brazen ore]

it always feels like taking a huge DPS drop with how weak the dark side attack/specials are

it also usually breaks up the flow of my attack/dodging in a way that is tough for me to deal with. Like, i usually fall into a rhythm with most weapons where I know what my attack combo is, dark side interrupts that for me. I like it a lot in theory....

[analog ether]

It's one of those that you really want to be better than it actually is.

Getting the Godsent on it helps, but...

[civic ocean]

Dark side is weird because you want Aphrodite for the godsent but her stuff does nothing for the form itself

Dark side isn't that bad like its pretty hard to be bad when you can be invulnerable for a few seconds

[analog ether]

Problem is, is that it then feels like the invulnerability is the one redeeming feature of it.

[elfin forge]

it basically is at this point I think

[analog ether]

To me, I think what really holds it back is the fact that your boons don't interact with your Attack and Special. That those are purple upgrades instead of baseline.

And the damage of your Attack and Special doesn't feel like enough for that to be a fair trade.

They feel like you're removing a downgrade, instead of getting an upgrade.

Which is a shame, because the third purple does feel like an upgrade.

[elfin forge]

why does hecate get such a cracked dark side

I think I'd personally prefer a more expensive dark side that has more base power to it, that might be enough

[formal pulsar]

Dark side would prob be better if you could exit earlier from the form

[past salmon]

idk imo darkside is fine

the "be invulnerable" hex should not be highly damaging

And the godsent version of it is highly damaging lmao

[willow phoenix]

Dark Side Godsent damage is very high

Imo the only problem with Dark Side is that the 2 sublimes basically don't work with a lot of boons which is highly misleading and can be a downgrade

[slate trench]

dark side is extremely good lol dps drop yes but you can compensate for it by not having to waste time dodging attacks and it literally makes you invincible

plus you can still drop omega casts so its really good for something like aspect of circe with winners circle, and I think it even has cast damage buffs on the hex tree

i mean obviously its gonna slow you down on low fear but if you are playing 40+ its a nice safety net

[solemn loom]

Crossroads updated with all current P11 32+ fear victories.

[jade raptor]

Speaking of fear, I like how fear actually does something in comparison to heat! You can get items in H1 depending on how high the heat was previously, and I haven't really used the incantation that makes fear useful, but yeah...

Idk did that sound rude? Im not trying to say the fear/heat is useless at all, it gives a good challenge and stuff, but I felt like it wasnt as worth it because you could work up to it? Idk how to word this

Oh! Also, im going to try using the twin flames again! I got one of the aspects now, so might as well

[willow phoenix]

tbf you can also get Nightmares in H2 without doing Fear

[jade raptor]

Oh thats what you get at the thing?

I havent actually gotten the incantation yet, but it says you get stuff(wait did I say that already?)

[glass shell]

if its the "Get stuff at higher fears in later regions" one then yeah.

its randomly selected between pet treats/moondust/nightmare

[willow phoenix]

wait what thing

you can get Nightmares from the broker, charon card delivery thing, and sometimes at Charon shops

[glass shell]

Maybe something else im forgetting but i know those 3 can spawn it

[jade raptor]

Yeah thqt one

My brain is struggling hard

[uneven palm]

I got most of my nightmare way back from the Charon deliveries. You don't need to push fear if you don't wanna

[glass shell]

like 2/3 of the nightmare is required from non testaments so yeah

[uneven palm]

oh boy they finally kinda fixed Eos + Apollo's legendary. Daybreaker just pulses twice now

[willow phoenix]

th O special is broken with it now though lol

sometimes the daybreaker just has both O special while mel has 0

or sometimes it's 3 to 1

[uneven palm]

I was seeing the 3-to-1 sometimes yeah lol

I'll still take double daybreaker pulses

also somehow a common level 1 flood gain was powering this thing i've severely underrated this boon

[willow phoenix]

flood gain is very good yeah

[uneven palm]

turns out unlimited free magick sometimes is cracked

[willow phoenix]

Currently the only omega that doesn't work with Apollo Legendary is Skull O Special and Torch O special I think. Skull O Special seems bugged because it's not like torch where it's unlisted. Coat O special technically works but only fires 2 more rockets somehow lol

Hel O special works now with Apollo leg too, fires 2 skulls which is fun

Shiva O attack also seems bugged because it hits twice but as far as I can tell the 2nd hit only does like 100 damage lol

[uneven palm]

I was noticing that with Shiva. Seems like the second hit is like a zero-charge or something

[glass shell]

Can we count nergal too cause its inconsistent with the other axes as of the latest balance patch?

theoretically momus too if we want to say it should double the momus repeats

[willow phoenix]

I don't think it's 0 charge because my 0 charge was doing more damage lol

[uneven palm]

Is nergal like double duration like the other axes used to be?

[glass shell]

yes

[uneven palm]

i mean that's… ok but for sure the other axes are way cooler now

[civic ocean]

Unseen Flood Gain yesterday I was pumping out over 100 mana every 3 seconds and cycling it with Wolf Howl and never running out of mana crazy stuff

[jade raptor]

Thats good to know! Thank you guys for telling me! Im only ready to push fear with the skulls because I can kick ass with the skulls and the skulls alone

[last cape]

How does flood gain actually work? I still don't entirely know what's going on when I'm using it

[civic ocean]

When you use an omega move and flood gain is off cooldown, flood gain activates. For the stated duration in the boon, every Omega move is able to be used, even if you are out of magick, and the magick you spend (or would have spent) is restored to you over time in increased regeneration.

When the duration ends, Flood Gain goes on an 8 second (6 second with the Pos/Heph duo) cooldown.

[last cape]

so not quite a replacement for born gain then

[willow phoenix]

it's better in some scenarios tbh, since you can't actually prime out with flood gain

[median anvil]

tldr it's infinite magick on an 8 second cooldown

goes hard with possessed array

[glass shell]

Its honestly close to 2nd place underneath it if not on par

8 second downtime can be rough, but for 99% of rooms you will either clear the room with the 6-10 seconds of infinite mana + your basic mana + another 6-10 seconds of ininite mana.

And for the boss fights you will probably have 8 seconds of downtime where you need to run like chronos lasers for instance where you need to reposition

Like you have to be absolutely dumping mana out the ass for flood gain to not keep up where born gain would

and even then with born gain your prob gonna prime out REALLY fast in similar amounts of time

[slate trench]

I feel like something like lucid gain is a lot better is most scenarios, especially with the buff

no cooldown and if you play in your casts its almost infinite mana

[glass shell]

Lucid gain isn't the best because you need to be inside the cast which is usually where you don't want to be

For instacnce olympic spinners ignore your cast or the enemies have the range to hit you isnide of it unless its like heroic apollo increased size

Cast is for ccing units, and you CAN fight inside it a lot of the time. But bosses tend to be way too mobile and the requirement of "MUST" be insdie your cast is incredibly restrictive in the times you NEED mana

[slate trench]

I feel like I almost always want to be in the cast because its still debuffing even if it doesn't always hold, but yea it depends on the build/situation

[glass shell]

Flood gain works without any thought. Born gain wokrs without any thought. Apollo needs you to sit in the cast when cerberus is stomping in a massive aoe including the cast etc

[slate trench]

flood gain is definitely good but 8 seconds is a long time

[glass shell]

Unless you have winners circle, or are playing charon/circe apollo gain is usually "Wrong"

[olive sphinx]

yeah I rly dislike it... it disrupts everything, suddenly I have to play a whole different playstyle for 8 seconds because I can't sustain my omegas 😔

[glass shell]

Like i agree in theory, but like i said in almost every fight you have downtime where you need to reposition or can't attack etc

Eris for instance, she flies away and summons enemies etc before coming back down

You are basically only holding attack down 24/7 vs typhon - and even he has immune phases

[slate trench]

sure and then you can stand in your cast which expires in like 3 seconds (without winners circle) and regen all of your mana

[olive sphinx]

Yeah thats true but how often does it line up though?
it happens too often where I start spending my magick and then I have to spend the next 5 seconds dodging while the Pos thing is active.. and then the boss lets me hit them and then there is the 8 second cooldown...

like you cant predict it... it's down to luck 😔

[slate trench]

you dont even have to chill in the cast you can just dash through as it expires

[olive sphinx]

if I could control when the 8 second cooldown starts then maybe it would be more strategic and manageable.. but you cant control it really

[glass shell]

False equivalency.

You CAN regen the mana w apollo in that time - except you had to run to the chronos instakill and BG/FG instantly refilled you

You CAN regen with apollo during that downtime, but flood gain/borngain regenned you 3 times before you got that one free apollo regen

[civic ocean]

Flood Gain is pretty good but yeah I would put flood gain just under Tranquil and Ionic for "generic gain strength" though you usually want to match your gain to your build and available other things the god can do for you

Esp if you're playing Unseen most gains can work

[glass shell]

Its more thought and micromanaging for something "worse". Apollo gain can and has sustained me when i don't have the S tier ones, but its not as free.

[slate trench]

im not talking about born gain, obviously thats the best if you have a big enough mana pool

[olive sphinx]

even with tranquil gain you can just chill for 2 seconds and get all your mana back... not 8 whole seconds 😔

[glass shell]

Yeah and im stating that fg is literally the same as bg

Slightly worse, bg punishes long fights and fg rewards longer ones

But its probably #2 on my list

[civic ocean]

Flood gain is much worse than born gain if you spend a lot of mana without downtime

[olive sphinx]

Pronto you havent replied to my other messages above smh

[civic ocean]

Flood gain approaches its strength if you have a hex or something to mix in

[slate trench]

it comes down to playstyle I guess, I never ever ever bottom out with lucid gain, I often bottom out for 8 seconds with flood gain

[civic ocean]

Yes Lucid Gain is better if you are good at being in your cast

[glass shell]

it should always line up though

Like realistic fight scenario

You start the fight > 5 seconds of infinite mana > 8 seconds of downtime that you still have a 100% mana pool for since you didnt spend ANY mana in that first engagement > 8 seconds is up you have another 5 seconds of infinite mana

[civic ocean]

Everything is contextual and applies to your build and playstyle at the time

[glass shell]

Like its only horrible if you are dropping like 50 mana per torch attack and at that pace literally nothing is gonna keep up with it except high mana pool born gain

[olive sphinx]

no like... lets say Chronos phase 2.. he's at 55% health. My mana is at 0, the cooldown on poseidon is off... what do I do? if my main damage source is omegas, I have to use an omega, which makes the gain active but then with just one attack I get chronos to 50% and he goes into his bubble and sits there until the cooldown starts... and then I just have nothing to do for 8 seconds as he reappears out of the bubble right when the cooldown starts

[glass shell]

You attack, popping his phase and then spam attack to regen back up to like 70~ cause it stacks the mana regen if you use the consumption below the amount

The iframe phase is like 4~ seconds so you still get like 2 seconds off of damage with enough attack speed thats a lot of fine lines and stuff

[olive sphinx]

70 is like nothing 😭

idk... this doesnt seem to work out for me. maybe im just bad, but like it's extremely unintuitive.. plus I dont want to constantly be staring at the boon cooldown...

at the end of the day its just not a fun boon for me

[slate trench]

When i first read flood gains description I thought the 8 second cool down would start while you were regenerating, then it actually would be really good because you would only have like 2 seconds of downtime with high rarity

[glass shell]

I never look at flood gain cd tbh

[olive sphinx]

yes I agree!!! and it would give you more motivation to pom it and stuff

[glass shell]

I just attack and either im omega'ing or im not, usually the answer is "im omega'ing"

[olive sphinx]

because right now pomming flood gain feels super "meh"... like.. I guess.....

[glass shell]

That would quite literally be infinite mana 😭

8 second cooldown on a 8 second duration is literally like epic rarity or 2 poms

[slate trench]

yea if I have a pom'd heroic gain i should have infinite mana

[olive sphinx]

well they could balance it out to make the cooldown a bit longer to make you work a bit harder for it

[glass shell]

https://tenor.com/view/shocked-shocked-face-black-guy-shocked-eta-gif-22820582

[civic ocean]

I think if Chronos is at 50% and you are at 0 mana with flood gain your run was probably doomed to begin with? Like think about that in practical terms - in order for Flood gain to be at 0 you would have to burn through, if you had 150 max mana, something like 400 mana

[glass shell]

mf born gain is not the goal for mana gains, that is the epitome of gains and that alone prob warrants another nerf to start at like 25 mana primed

[civic ocean]

Ionic and Tranquil are functionally infinite mana idk

[slate trench]

but even something like hestias gain in certain builds is infinite mana

[civic ocean]

Yeah I think making Flood Gain pommable into infinite mana is fine

that would be the cost

[olive sphinx]

I completely agree

[glass shell]

maybe at like heph levels of poms

Like a 12 second cooldown and then you gotta get it up to that to match

but as is now? way too strong if that was the case

[slate trench]

12 second oof

[sage flame]

ionic and tranquil are my top picks this patch so far 🙏 if I need magick, otherwise it's glamour

[civic ocean]

Way too strong for what? There already are like 3 gains that basically give you infinite mana and like 4-5 that are functionally infinite for certain builds, and none of those are Flood Gain!

[slate trench]

ionic is good until its not and it suddenly gets you killed, but I would still probably take it over flood lmao

[glass shell]

flood gain is literally infinite mana though? If you're comparing flood gains cooldown ionic is literally worse 😭

[slate trench]

except you can get the mana when you need it, not on a timer

[glass shell]

Alternatively you could make poms reduce the cooldown to restore the mana and just make flood gain like 6 seconds of mana, minimum cooldown 2 seconds like ionic

[civic ocean]

Flood Gain is demonstrably not infinite mana and also requires you to have an entire duration of uptime where you are casting that isn't realistic for top-end bosses

[slate trench]

yea that would be fine if rarity/poms reduced cooldown

[glass shell]

Infinite mana = never runs out. Flood gain never caps you out like born gain - ergo infinite

[civic ocean]

That's so silly, Flood Gain can very obviously leave you at a point where you have 0 mana and cannot cast an omega, this happens pretty regularly on omega spamming builds

[glass shell]

like ionic makes you run and find the bubble - infinite but downtime flood gain is better

glamour is infinite, but makes you be next to the enemy(Barring duo) and is low charge rate, flood gain is better

Demeter apparently is the goat now but no experience this patch so il lhold my comment on her

Ares mana is a joke

Heph mana isn't for mana regen

Hera is born gain, the epitome of gains

Idk man like all but one hes better than unless demeter is that cracked

[civic ocean]

Ares mana isn't a joke wtf lmao

[olive sphinx]

I'd rather play with the Unseen card than Flood gain 😤

[sage flame]

I think people overestimate the downtime of ionic, but also it'd be cool if it had an aoe that does damage when you pick it up or something for a small little buff

[pseudo sequoia]

idk if it's just me but i've never a single time felt the effects of ionic gain downtime, aside from literally having to run to it to recharge

[civic ocean]

Same

[olive sphinx]

ssame

I love ionic gain 🌩️

[pseudo sequoia]

it might just be a crazy consistent coincidence but no matter what rarity it's always there whenever i run out so the "cooldown" isn't really a factor

[civic ocean]

Whereas I have definitely felt the effect of flood gain because you can never ever get back the mana you spend outside of its active state

[olive sphinx]

Yeah same

It's very easy to feel the lack of mana with flood gain during boss fights imo

But it's not nearly as bothersome or noticeable with some other gains

[civic ocean]

Tranquil gain is also extremely based on Charon because it's a Hostile Environment requirement that solves your mana issues as well so I personally have it way above Lucid on Charon

[forest hinge]

and Local Climate for the cast buff right?

[sage flame]

the cooldown starts ticking down right as the ball spawns, even while it just sits there, so if you don't need the magick right away it'll probably be off cool down by the time you grab it, so the next one spawns really quick after

[civic ocean]

yeah it's normally

Ares for Sword Ring Cut Above Mutual Destruction
Demeter for Tranquil Gain and Local Climate

Then any two of Poseidon (geyser spout), Apollo (blades duo) and Heph (blades duo)

Just depends what the run shows you

[forest hinge]

is Ares really that good in a Charon build? I've only just started taking Sword Ring on runs cuz it qualifies Hostile Environment while leaving stuff like promflare and geyserspout open

[civic ocean]

Main reasons Ares is good on Charon:

-Sword Ring gets stronger with faster Cast pop speed (more swords)

-Hostile Environment is an insane buff to cast damage

-Mutual Destruction/Grievous Blow on Special also scales cast damage incredibly

-Plasma can help get the combo out faster

Also FYI I don't believe Meat Grinder, Geyser Spout and Prominence Flare cancel each other out anymore.

[forest hinge]

WOAH, the cast bonuses not clashing could be BIG

[civic ocean]

I know they dont because I regularly get prominence flare and geyser spout together

[civic ocean]

Do bear in mind though that if you take Meat Grinder and Hostile Environment for some reason the blade spawns over you and not the omega cast, unlike geyser spout and prominence flare

[snow portal]

Completed a pretty scuffed Supay run, got Beach Ball but ended up barely using the dash, what do you think is a good way to use Supay? I still don't really understand it

[formal pulsar]

about the flood gain thing, it is not like you have 0 magick during the 8sec downtime

you just have to depend on your normal magick bar

and if you have any sort of decent magick amount of lets say 150~200, unless you are doing some possessed array stuff or spamming fine line cut above ocean swell, it is very diffuct to consume all your magick and then have signicifant downtime while using flood gain

[willow phoenix]

Sprint a lot, let the auto attacks do their thing. So boons that apply effects like scorch or blitz are very strong with it. Ideally you want a sprint boon that deals damage like Hestia sprint, Ares sprint, etc

The new O attack is pretty good too imo, so you can use it then go back to sprinting

[formal pulsar]

epic nitro boost is incredible. people swoon over success rate but that boon has got to be the biggest factor in making a high fear run feel like a walk in the park

[brazen ore]

i love epic nitro boost more than my family

[civic ocean]

I don’t know about that - it’s my understanding that with Flood Gain it is impossible to regain any mana spent while flood gain is inactive. So specifically it is kind of like a Born Gain situation where if you have high cost low pool you can get to 0 quickly if you do not wait

Fwiw I think Flood Gain pairs really well with Hexes and Unseen for that reason since the mana spent while inactive can still regenerate

[civic ocean]

Fwiw I don’t really understand it either but my general feeling is that Nitro Boost is a must have, otherwise I like going Demeter Sprint + Arctic Gale + Tidal Ring + Static Shock + Air Quality

[formal pulsar]

I see your point.

[willow phoenix]

you can regain it somewhat if your magick cost is higher than your current magick

So if you're at 0 magick, using Flood Gain with a move that costs 40 magick would regen back 40 magick

[civic ocean]

Yeah but then it goes back to 0 when it runs out right

[willow phoenix]

uhh no, it's still there. If you use it without Flood Gain it'd be consumed ofc

[sage flame]

how much does supay buff up dem sprint?

[formal pulsar]

yeah you end the flood gain period with 40 magick and then if you use that o move again you lose it

[civic ocean]

Yeah exactly

[formal pulsar]

it buffs all srpints the same amount 30%

[sage flame]

yeah im asking for the damage per tick number, if anyone knows it idk cyclone rarity scaling off the dome

[civic ocean]

Not a lot like - it’s enough for some stuff early game but the idea is that you use it to get origination+froth/blitz going as you build to AQ

Supay is weird because people look only at the glowing green number but it really buries the lede on what makes Supay good it could give 0% rush damage and still be an insane aspect

Like I unironically think Blinding Sprint might be good on Supay

[sage flame]

like if you're going for AQ anyway, and get cyclone on cast for orig, why not just pick a different sprint

[formal pulsar]

my favorite build for supay atm, is blitz attack/special with hera sprint and aphro gain. it opens up romantic spark and king ransom. plus hera sprint is actually incredible with supay. high base damage with a curse and you dont need to stop sprinting.

[civic ocean]

1. it’s always up basically

2. it slows projectiles

[sage flame]

I guess that's pretty nice, kinda forget about cyclones slowing projectiles lol

[civic ocean]

It does so so so much dmg with aq too

IIRC its a different dmg source than arctic gale

[sage flame]

it is yeah, i just was questioning if it's worth it or if it's diminishing returns with stacking both, I mean im not gonna scoff at 100 damage per tick with both cyclones hitting an enemy tbf

[civic ocean]

Both are rapid fire for froth too

[formal pulsar]

doesnt froth have an icd?

[civic ocean]

Yeah but this is just a way to get as close as possible and as early as possible more or less

[sage flame]

yeah it's either same as blitz (0.6 sec) or slightly worse, I can't remember

[civic ocean]

You could probably do a diff sprint start tbh but I like how safe frigid is and I also never get to use it so

[sage flame]

im a tropical cyclone lover and dem sprint let's u get best uptime for it 🙏

[civic ocean]

I have done that yeah apollo can give wind for aq too

[forest hinge]

is tropic that good just because of the gale effect and not neccesarily the dmg?

[sage flame]

tropical cyclone is awesome because it rocks

wish I could have dem sprint and also get beach ball

id be so happy but I have to settle with arctic gale

[civic ocean]

You can but it requires stuff

[sage flame]

it requires silly behavior

[forest hinge]

Frigid Sprint makes the best use of AQ now right since Heat Rush doesn't last as long now?

[glass shell]

@willow phoenix hearty appetite isn't even 50 health, its bugged to be the pre patch 100 :^)

[willow phoenix]

it scales with every single health you gain

[glass shell]

Yes, and its still set to 100hp, not 50

[heavy rock]

what should i try to get on anubis? particularly what i should get on primary and secondary fire and a duo boon i should aim for

[sage flame]

hestia attack and aphro or zeus special are the common picks but id just try out whatever sounds like it could work well

[glass shell]

Posiedon/Hestia attack, some players swear by blitz + static shock though

Special honestly just pick apollo and call it a day, anything that has % on it is fine

[heavy rock]

huh

tyty ill try those out then

[civic ocean]

Heat rush works too ig idk

Frigid Rush has decent defensive value, triggers origination (though I am of the mind that Origination is too costly on Supay now, since Boatman and Excellence are almost must-haves)

[formal pulsar]

Blitz attack Anubis is legit. Trust

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1233146305308528650/1399477185370390528/Hades_II_7_28_2025_3_40_36_PM.png?ex=688bc732&is=688a75b2&hm=ad624d111da9e6ba0bf49d93b29d6f1b6267622e1f258d76802afd9ae3c999e5&

[civic ocean]

Yeah I think Blitz attack is just like kind of crazy good on a lot of different things

Similar to heph

[wild swan]

Oh, huh, TIL Natural Selection can pom Tough Gain. Its version of pomming, at least

[formal pulsar]

tough gain can be "pommed" if you get it as a sacrifice boon. My guess is that they just slapped a flag on it to exclude from pom selection screen but otherwise it is functionally the same as last patch

[glass shell]

they actually have gone pretty far to prevent it from being pommed, adding flags to not make it pommable and removing the data, so the fact it still happens is funny. I can only imagine its some deep deep file that we can't open that still has tough gain values somewhere

[formal pulsar]

it is weird how much they really hated tough gain being pommed. it was just a meme build to stack. it is not like it was breaking the game. it is probably getting reworked in 1.0 since it is the only core boon not pommable. just weird how much they wanted to prevent it

[glass shell]

i doubt it

[formal pulsar]

you think they will keep a non pommable core boon?

that's a first in either games

[glass shell]

Yes

I still don't think it deserved to get nuked, but i doubt we're getting a heph boon rework when they just did all of this, if they wanted to change it they would've did it in the last patch

[wild swan]

Yeah I wish they'd change it back, it was fine as pommable given the amount of work you had to put into it, but I kinda gave up hope after Patch 11

[civic ocean]

Another reason to run Excellence hell yeah

[formal pulsar]

they might revert back to olympus tough gain with fixed DR and pommable magick gain

but i see that it stuck for 3 patch, it might be here to stay

[desert shell]

How do you deal with UR chronos teleporting constantly if your build is close up like supay?

[civic ocean]

There’s a pattern to the teleporting and the moves - basically it looks like hot nonsense when you first fight him but becomes easier to suss out when it’s your turn to hit him

[formal pulsar]

the shiva ball thing with blitz on o special feels cracked.

just started playing it tho

[civic ocean]

I might switch to shiva instead of my weirdo ass selene build

[sly plaza]

I’m gonna be real. Zeus still feels like the overall best god even after all the changes to his scaling

Like Blitz is just so easy to work with

[formal pulsar]

as long as the player starts with like 100% global damage, blitz will always be goated

but i did switch to using blitz attack more this patch because of the scaling changes

[brazen ore]

i love me some static shock on a fast hitting weapon

blitz amazing static shock amazing. everything's coming up zeus

[polar ravine]

so whats the best boons for using possessed array?

[formal pulsar]

start hera keep sake, born gain, fine line (must haves) and then hera attack is nice. demeter for weed killer, poseidon for ocean swell and ripple effect duo with hera. fourth god is more open and depends on whether mel or medea

[polar ravine]

not apollo?

the legendary does work with it

[formal pulsar]

it does but building for legendary is way more difficult and you are not guaranteed to get it.

[polar ravine]

you know even when i get all of those i still lose to unrivaled typhon

i need to work on dodging during the 3rd phase

[glass shell]

just facetank chronos and dodge the lasers

his hits do like 10, typhon does like 70

[polar ravine]

.....well that would be much better I assumed he would do 30+

[glass shell]

obviously don't TRY and get hit by chronos, but if you had to choose between tracking chronos golden rotating orbs or typhon laser - its the god damn laser

Its probably more like 20 tbh, but its nothing compared to typhon

also reminder you can literally just leave the circle 4head

[polar ravine]

The time I got to that phase before typhoon kept spamming the triple shot attack

[glass shell]

I use it to bait typhon into his chin slam for like 5 free seconds of circle time

by standing under him

unlike the Asphodel anomaly the circle doesn't decay

[edgy nacelle]

I'm still struggling to enjoy reworked Mel staff... I think I just don't like how the current non-omega special feels compared to previous versions tbh. altho maybe I'm using it wrong, I've seen people weave it in rather than spam it I haven't looked into staff combos that much.
anyone have a build they like? do you recommend focusing on o-specs or normal specials?
ik most Mel aspects are somewhat bland, but I had a lot of fun with the old channel speed version and ik some people have success with the rework 🤷

[glass shell]

Mel staff was one of my favorite staffs at 60 power, but at 40 power i just find it to be objectively worse anubis.

If you dash attack you can special at the same time to get some more damage off, same for the 2nd attack in the 3 hit combo i believe

but overall i just don't see a reason to play it even with post nerf anubis ospecial, cause its just better

when it was +60 it was a railgun and popped off though

[edgy nacelle]

hmmm yeah that makes sense. sad I didn't play it more pre-nerf, I tried it maybe one time total

[civic ocean]

Try using it as part of the staff combo with dash attack and regular attack, it's a really cool and fun like huntress combo weapon that way

[edgy nacelle]

I will try this tho! I rarely play huntress builds (I don't dislike them I just like magick spam lol)
any hammers/gods to look out for when playing it that sort of way?

[civic ocean]

The thing gives you power so good % scaling is good so what I like to do is go ares on one of attack or special and look for Grievous + mutual with high hp. Then like aph or hera on the other attack/special

[analog ether]

Had a really weird Shiva run. First half was fine. Second half, it started feeling really unresponsive.

[junior trail]

so the only build that is capable of maximizing fine line (+ripple effect) (i mean like old torch o.atk spam) is possessed?

does skull has splash icd thing

[glass shell]

Literally torch exists homie

[edgy nacelle]

you can get enough channel speed on torches for every attack to be an omega attack
and even without that torches are very good for it

[glass shell]

Any attack or charge speed gets every attack to be omega yeah

[edgy nacelle]

but hammer for channel speed + chaos/hermes channel speed already makes it very very fast

[glass shell]

• sorceress anyway

Theoretically hel omega attack, if they make it faster would go hard with ripple effect

that hammer makes it fire 3 times, 3 ripples doubling

[edgy nacelle]

also for reference the first time I tried to do this in underworld I got 100% omega attacks by the end of erebus lol, if you get the right hammer and reroll chaos/hermes one or two times you're pretty much there.
it feels worse that you need upgrades to get there compared to old torches, but it's quite fast to get online tbh

[atomic ibex]

Can someone convince me on Artemis Blades? I always feel so disappointed when I use them.

[glass bone]

You can parry all but 2 attacks. One of which being the Chronos instakills. That’s something

I forget which two they are… I think it’s the Hecate transformation ball, and the Chronos time bubble. I think Polyphemus grab ||and the Chronos p3 hand’s grabs|| can be parried, but I’m not fully certain

[glass shell]

Unless it changed recently, you can absolutely parry chronos instakills

its how i got my first win

[glass bone]

Sorry. That was worded badly

All but 2 attacks can be parried, with one of the attacks that can be parried is Chronos Instakill

Much better worded now

[glass shell]

probably should just cut the "with one of" entirely

"All but 2 attacks can be parried, including chronos instakill"

[uneven palm]

Poly’s grab can be parried now. Iirc you couldn’t a few patches back.

Just uhhhh watch the cooldown for parryingChronos instakills. I haven’t uhh thrown a perfectly winnable 55f because I didn’t realize I had parried a clock hand and was off cooldown and tried to parry an instakill no way not me

[polar ravine]

didnt realize the clock hands remain even when he is charging up the insta-kill.

then again im more embarassed by me throwing a run because i ran into a enemy and it stalled me long enough to keep me in the insta-kill

[uneven palm]

That happens to us all haha. Or the ol “oops I killed an hourglass and got stuck” death

[polar ravine]

also i finally managed to beat unrivaled typhon.

with mel skulls- possessed array+wide grin+fine line+hera attack+born gain

its also my fastest surface time at 14:00

[analog scarab]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/810812561065902080/1400299223215378452/image.png?ex=688c21c7&is=688ad047&hm=677b503857bab2c3a695ae8f0ec8b278c0571f7488b141c58be40c90a976e724&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=2279&height=1262
Does this boon even work? Has anyone tested it? I have 880 HP, which according to the description should give me 170% global damage, but I'm nowhere near seeing that effect. For example, Hephaestus' dash was just hitting for 290 damage per hit when its base is 200.

[civic ocean]

it's bugged and not updated to the new patch it's using old patch values

[polar ravine]

also............how do you have 880 hp?

[analog scarab]

Nah, this just straight up doesn't work. I just boosted my HP to 970 and Hephaestus' Blast still only hits for 290

[civic ocean]

Might be only weapon dmg yeah

[analog scarab]

heroic sea star success rate and 3 double hp rooms in Ephyra

I was looking for Artemis but found 300 health

[analog scarab]

My staff attacks are dealing 60+ base damage - Looks like you were right

[fallen elk]

Please remove mana, its a massive turn off. Weapons doesn't work right without this thing, its very slow or very limited. I think you guys can work better at this system or maybe can place more mana-states between two or three rooms/sections. Thank you. Again, I'm very down, sad and hoping for the best. ALSO, her boost speed can be encreased, guys. Come on. She feels very slow, or the map have so much assets that are unnecessary. This can be worked too.

🙂

[thin ridge]

You really need to learn ways of using it cause it is certainly not slow

Mel is also pretty fast

[glass shell]

It does, but not how you want it to

Its currently bugged to still be .1% damage per 1hp instead of .2. They only changed the visual indicator on accident, presumably.

The damage bonus, just like several other boons like mean streak, is set to weapondata which is only attack/special/omega cast

Heph attack isn't your attack, its a blast after the attack so yeah no benefit

[junior trail]

bro casually asking for removing the fundamental part of mel's toolkit

[glass shell]

yeah that aint happening chief magick is perfeclty fine and if you dislike it, feel free to just not use the system. I have had multiple runs of ignoring the omega system entirely

[edgy nacelle]

the mana system works very well as-is tbh, every god in the game has a boon that restores mana and most of them are very good. there’s no real need to put mana restoration spots in rooms when you can just take “tranquil gain” or “ionic gain” from demeter/zeus and restore your mana to full as often as you need.
you can also use most weapons without mana, it’s not really required. if you don’t like worrying about mana and don’t have a mana restoration boon yet, just spam normal attacks and specials, it works fine.
removing magick would be Bad for a lot of reasons since half the game is designed around it, but regardless, I think you’d enjoy it a lot better if you try 1) taking boons that restore magick and 2) just not using magick builds if you don’t like them.

[thin ridge]

I think there is a sizable amount of people who just want to make Mel into Zagreus again

Because they refuse to learn the new mechanics

[edgy nacelle]

I’ve also seen some ppl early in lets plays both 1) feel like they need to constantly use omega moves, but also 2) undervalue gain boons and take them late or not at all which uh. is a choice

[analog scarab]

no—I just tested it again. Only the base damage of Attack, Special, Omega Attack, and Omega Special scales with HP. Boon damage like Poseidon's Waves doesn't increase at all. And I strongly suspect it's always been this way. Because even in older patches, I tried making high-HP builds with this boon multiple times, and it always felt underwhelming.

[formal pulsar]

Please remove Mel and give zword back. Thanks 🙏🙏🙏

[glass shell]

Once again, read what i said

Its currently set to weapondata

That means only attacks, specials and omega cast scales

[analog scarab]

ok

[glass shell]

Its not global damage the boon lies to you

same with mean streak and a few others

but it IS also bugged to visually say 50, when its still set to .1hp per dmg increase

Stuff like splashes, heph blasts, etc is all olympian damage which isn't your attack

[analog scarab]

Classic Supergiant. It still annoys me that global damage not boost attack-scaling boons.

By the way, ran into some nasty jank yesterday - if you're using a fully charged Omega Special with Persephone Aspect and Kronos decides to do his oneshot attack at that exact moment, you're basically dead. There's no way to stop in the right spot unless you get insanely lucky

[rocky pier]

Nergal with psychic whirlwind goes crazy but man is it bad with Glamour Gain. 10/10 would not recommend (it was forced on me basically either that or ares or Apollo)

[junior trail]

does nergal with psychic stack like any axe? kinda tempted to make a build with exceptional

[tough pasture]

What is this about "unlit" torches? Saw haelian mention it because one of his followers said it in chat.

[tough pasture]

Yes, iirc.

[uneven palm]

In previous patches with Unrivaled Hecate, the real Hecate had a visual glitch where the ends of her torches didn’t have flames on them. Made it exceedingly obvious which one was real. This has been fixed this patch.

[tough pasture]

I see. Thanks.

[willow phoenix]

No it just repeats after the first one ends

[analog ether]

Been having so much problems with Unrivaled Chronos lately. Can't seem to dodge any of his attacks, and while I'm okay in the first couple phases, the third one it feels like I can't find an opening to hit him.

[civic ocean]

It's hard to explain yeah

[willow phoenix]

A lot of the 3rd phase is waiting for your turn tbh

[formal pulsar]

Deep dissent removes the clone so save rolls for that but yeah p3 is rough

[ocean ibex]

WHAT DO YOU MEAN DEEP DISSENT REMOVES THE CLONE

[formal pulsar]

It is probably bugged but yeah deep dissent removes chronos clone in p3 for some reason

[west thunder]

I knew it removed the miniboss in phase 1 but it removes the clone too? My lord this is basically a mandatory boon for rivaled Chronos at high fear

[past salmon]

I wouldn't say mandatory lol but it's very good yeh
Honestly clonos isn't really dangerous he just makes it so you can't get damage in until he's gone kinda

[ocean ibex]

i still dont understand the vor chronos fight

ive beaten him i think 3 times? where i have dozens of rivasl4 surface wins

dozens being exactly 2 dozen

[crystal holly]

yo what are your best build(s) for eos so far? 32f rival4 underground

[surreal hazel]

There's a few things you kinda need to get to do it well

one of the first things: The roman numerals on the tiles on the ground are the order he does the first attack in with the yellow rays

so you can sneak in a cheeky hit here and there early on since his teleports are completely fixed

[ocean ibex]

the numerals are where he teleports to?

[past salmon]

WHAT

[surreal hazel]

Yes, and in that order

[surreal hazel]

Seems obvious in retrospect, no?

[past salmon]

Idk I just treat that move like a cutscene

[spiral wadi]

that sounds extremely wrong i swore he changed it up every time, ig i have to check now

[median anvil]

did y'all not know about this despite winning 62 runs 😂

[spiral wadi]

OH the roman numerals on the ground change every time

[past salmon]

Like I said I just treat it like a cutscene smh

[broken lichen]

Is there a list somewhere of the current enemy attacks that are unblockable by the coat?
Can't seem to find it in the wiki :/

[surreal hazel]

Okay, so "Completely fixed" might have been a bit misleading of me to say

but yeah, also I think the slow radial explosions that happen also go in that same sequence, but they're entirely reactable so eh

[spiral wadi]

honestly the problem is that their "tell" before the explosion disappears for a brief moment before it actually explodes, so it kinda sucks when ur just sprinting and the dial that was off screen suddenly decides to radial explode you

[ocean ibex]

dodging chronos is never the issue (i mean a lot of the off-screen attacks are bs but i can semi-reliably dodge those), finding where to get in hits is what sucks

[surreal hazel]

Unrelatedly, just thinking of all of the boons and effects that benefit from the new heph/posideon duo that lowers recharge times. So far I've sen all blast boons, Posideon and Zeus gains

[ocean ibex]

athena's boons

[surreal hazel]

Maybe also Heinous Affront?

[ocean ibex]

probably harm for the afflicted

[surreal hazel]

Ahh, all of athena, of course

Unseen Ire?

[ocean ibex]

i bet

[surreal hazel]

at first I thought it was just the blast boons, but now I'm seeing it's got a bit more depth to it. It's like Success rate for occasional triggers

[ocean ibex]

yeah it has some pretty cool applications

[surreal hazel]

I kinda miss the elegance of being able to have a blast boon on cast, but it was always a bit janky and surplus to requirement

Anyone seen if you can get blast boons to recharge in less than 2 seconds or is that still the hard cap?

[ocean ibex]

okay the full list is

Death Warrant, Defensive Posture, Phalanx Shot, Bottomless Drink, Happy Haze, Volcanic Strike, Volcanic Flourish, Smithy Rush, Flood Gain, Ionic Gain

oh...

[surreal hazel]

Interesting how many NPC boons are in there

[ocean ibex]

so i guess you wanna go surface with this duo

[surreal hazel]

Seems so, although you get artemis more commonly underground and you can invoke Athena

[ocean ibex]

thats true

sucks that unseen ire doesnt get hastened

[surreal hazel]

But hey at least this duo can actually benefit both sides of the deal, a lot of Duos seem like it's a boon for one god only

[ocean ibex]

yeah

whats the number of reduction?

35%, right?

[surreal hazel]

I could almost make a grid of who each duo actually benefits

Oddly enough, Zeus ends up being the supporting god more often than you'd guess

[ocean ibex]

is the cooldown reduced BY 35% or reduced TO 35%?

[surreal hazel]

by 35%

[ocean ibex]

so unseen ire would go to 26 seconds

[surreal hazel]

And can be force triggered by Heinous Affront, amusingly

[ocean ibex]

common death warrant goes to 13, which is cool i guess

wai unseen ire is an after you take damage effect??

[surreal hazel]

actually, wait, it was

didn't it get changed?

no wait, still seems the same, yeah, you go dark if you get damaged

definitely procced that with Heinous Affront

and yes it was disgusting

[ocean ibex]

i actually have no clue where the logic that calls for which boons to trigger is so i literally cant check

[surreal hazel]

I've done it, so I'd be surprised if it was removed if Unseen Ire still triggers on taking damage

it isn't an acceptable pre-req for getting the duo to appear, however, you still need one of the other three revenge boons

(FYI, light smite is just incredible with it)

[ocean ibex]

im actually really curious where this logic is supposed to be, ill ping @glass shell to see if they know

[surreal hazel]

It's gotta be a fairly loose event such that Retribution and Henious Affront can still work properly

Maybe this is why we lost Nasty Comeback, since I have no idea how that'd work with affront.

it'd either do like, 10x the damage of your own hit and inflict hitch, or do no damage and inflict hitch

either way is kinda busted

(Also why can't it proc Tough Gain for literal infinite ma- awwww, dangit)

[junior trail]

does seismic servo work with heinous affront

[surreal hazel]

it should reduce the gap between triggering it on the same enemy, yes

but you're still hard capped at wounds lasting 3 seconds

[surreal hazel]

Turning to a Simple Form doesn't benefit either? Awwww (Circe's Morph boon)

[uneven palm]

It does not

Servo is worded uhh let’s say poorly imo it says 35% reduction but what they actually do is cooldown/1.35. For example, takes a 2s Heph blast to roughly 1.5s. It’s more like a roughly 25% reduction from the full recharge of the boons it effects

[surreal hazel]

Does it not reduce the cooldown each afflicted enemy has? I guess it won't because it's stored on the enemy not Mel

And ughhhh, SSG's tooltips need to get a unified way to describe timing changes because it kills me how inconsistent it is

[median anvil]

wounds and freeze are related to the curse expiring on the enemies so no seismic doesn't affect them

[surreal hazel]

Which I guess follows if we assume there's a hidden "Heinous affront cooldown" curse that it inflicts on enemies to track the cooldown-per-enemy effect

I assume that's how it's managed

[glass shell]

correct, HA reduces your cooldowns, while HA wounds is a "Debuff" on the enemy

[sterile portal]

what boons should i look for if i wanna do an anvil ring build

i wanna join the clang gang

[surreal hazel]

WINNER'S CIRCLE

also some other stuff I guess idk. it's cast damage

[stable herald]

unfortunately Anvil Ring doesn't have any ways to scale up the clangs the way Heph's blast boons do, so it really is just Anvil Ring + Winner's Circle and any cast damage buffs you can get your hands on

[sterile portal]

does winners circle make the hammers hit faster? i assumed it didnt

[surreal hazel]

it did originally, I forget if it still does post-patch

[stable herald]

It used to, but not any more. Now you can just summon a new set of hammers before the first three finish

[sage flame]

it does not speed it up but it lets you place more areas that hammers will be hitting since they still do the 3 hits

[sterile portal]

ohh ok, i didnt know the hammers were separate, cool

[sage flame]

so it's still worth to get winner circle

[sterile portal]

using it with circe right now so ill try to get that

[stable herald]

oh yeah Winner's Circle rules

[glass bone]

Was just about to say “Circe is best for this”

[stable herald]

best build for Winner's Circle tho is Tidal Ring + Geyser Spout, although Sword Ring with all the sword duos is pretty strong too if you can build it up

[surreal hazel]

Heph also just has great support boons so you just get nice stuff appearing on the run

[night lotus]

s

[rotund totem]

what do you guys think about romantic spark

[sterile portal]

really fun

[night lotus]

im a big zeus hater ngl

[stable herald]

Hera IRL

[surreal hazel]

Was so busted to begin with that it got nerfed hard and is still good

[night lotus]

:3

[rotund totem]

I dont like blitz mechanic in general I didnt like ares in the first game too

[night lotus]

you know it

[rotund totem]

only cool boon is static shock I guess

[night lotus]

Whatd be a good boon for the sister blades? i just always go Aphrodite

[rotund totem]

you could try poseidon attack

[surreal hazel]

Missing out I feel, but it depends on what weapons you like

Blitz is an effect which is kinda pants early on, especially at low fear, but starts to really pull its weight later

the trick is to try getting it on whatever attack can hit lots of enemies

[rotund totem]

oh

[willow phoenix]

Which aspect

[surreal hazel]

Zeus also has some pretty awesome duos

and in case it's not entirely obvious (because it isn't) double strike does effect Blitz

[night lotus]

Artmeis

[surreal hazel]

Dancing daggers opens up a lot of boon choices for blade secondary

in fact, nah, it just enhances them

basically secondary on blades is good at spreading on-hit effects, loves some good blitz, hitch, scorch, freeze etc...

[willow phoenix]

Artemis blades big thing is the crit chance and the faster O attack, so you want an attack boon with a lot of % damage and other boons that can buff and support a lot of O attacks

So Aphro and Apollo are very strong on attack, then you can get something like Weed Killer to get higher O attack damage. If you get Apollo legendary and sweeping ambush the O attack spam becomes very strong

[surreal hazel]

attack is... kinda wonky in that basic attack is good multihitting, but the final strike and Oattacks are BIG hits that like +%damage

[night lotus]

yeahh was thinkin the same ,i dont even know what the apollo legendary is lol ill try that
i dont even have the artifact from Aphrodite,i never gave her a nectar 🥹

[surreal hazel]

Wanna know?

[night lotus]

ill let myself be suprised!

[surreal hazel]

sure

[night lotus]

id love to see him try to flirt with Mel again

[surreal hazel]

Polarising, and kinda awkward requirements on it too, but potentially amazing

[night lotus]

for the legendary of a God dont you just need a lot of their boons?

[willow phoenix]

Very fun legendary albeit some are still buggy with it

[willow phoenix]

There's certain specific boon requirements, you need at least 3 boons of that god

[surreal hazel]

loosely, yes, but it's actually thee boons, each from a small set each

[night lotus]

im going on my lil hunt to get the secret aspects

[surreal hazel]

Apollo needs one of the top two cores, one of the bottom three, and one of 4 support boons (supernova, extradose, prominence flare or backburner)

[willow phoenix]

For Apollo you need to get

• attack/special
• cast/sprint/gain
• prom flare/extra dose/super nova/back burner

You can check it in the book of shadows

[surreal hazel]

he's one of the annoying ones that need two cores

(Honestly Apollo might be the fussiest god for duo prereqs too)

[willow phoenix]

It's fairly simple tbh, since most of the time you do want apollo on one of the attack/special if you're going for his legendary

I think I had a streak of 19/20 runs having Apollo Legendary lol

Without even using Excellence

[surreal hazel]

lol

yeah if he turns up early, but he has a habit of locking out other legendaries and duos

[night lotus]

i dont think ive unlocked that?

[willow phoenix]

There's an incantation for it iirc

[night lotus]

last time i played you needed an incantation to see the requirements for duo boons and such

yeah i havent unlocked it hahahah

i began a new safe file cause last got deleted

[willow phoenix]

The fussiest legendary requirement is Hestia and it's not even good lol

[night lotus]

I HATE HER
i hate her attitude! same as her dumb husband!

[willow phoenix]

I think you mean Hera lol

[night lotus]

...i cant say that?

[night lotus]

yeah! Hestia is just a silly granny

[willow phoenix]

Pyromaniac auntie

[night lotus]

i miss the times when Eris was the only boss available for the surface..

[willow phoenix]

Ah good times when Eris was actually a challenge lol

Ngl I think they overnerfed base Eris lol. Her fight is probably like the easiest boss for me now, at least top 2

[night lotus]

she feels the same to me kinda ngl
the last stage of her fight keeps you on edge

you wont realize how dissapointment i felt when they removed the block from the Axe

[willow phoenix]

I like the new special tbh, never really liked block mechanic even from H1

[night lotus]

the Axe was just the perfect gamestyle for me,the block was super nice but ig i can live without it..NOW THAT I GOT THE MOON MECHA SUIT

[nova ice]

It’s a good change, if you can consistently block almost every attack I feel that you become a bit over reliant on it

[night lotus]

but you like eating wieners so why should we listen to u?

[nova ice]

Honestly I have no idea how to respond to this

[night lotus]

[civic ocean]

I get why its cast based but holy moly

[formal pulsar]

hestia bad but hera close second. it is like they went out of their way to exclude her higher tier boons from the lego. no born gain, extended family, or dying wish

[ocean ibex]

does anybody else's tummy hurt or is that just me

[civic ocean]

Yeah that seems like a holdover from back when BG was giga broken that it wasn’t a requirement for a bunch of stuff

[surreal hazel]

The lack of dying wish confuses me. It's a hitch support boon. That should be in the requirement with hereditary bane, but rousing reception is there?

[civic ocean]

Which boon replaced Nasty Comeback? That might be why it’s not there

[brazen ore]

i think new supay is a reallyyy good candidate for the heinous affront/light smite situation. which is kinda weapon agnostic, admittedly, but you do so many little hits with the weapon and are up so close that daze feels amazing

i used to be very into hestia for supay but now i'm very into zeus and whenever ares shows up as well it's a party

[formal pulsar]

I think extended family?

[civic ocean]

That one aint in the leg right

[spiral wadi]

how do yall deal with satyr champion, max frenzy + shadow servant

it feels like my brain can't comprehend anything that happens in that fight

[elfin forge]

idk lol sometimes he just dies and sometimes he slowly bleeds to death slightly faster than me

[spiral wadi]

lol nice

[civic ocean]

This is the one in ephyra right

On staff I usually try to keep a pillar between me and him because I think your casts and moves hit him through it but he can’t hit you but won’t move

[spiral wadi]

ah interesting

[glass shell]

servant spawns in like 4~ seconds after him for some reason so i try to bumrush him and break the pillar ASAP so all the hits go into the miniboss instead of the sahdow

make sure the shield isn't facing the ghosts though u dont wanna lose all that free damage

[surreal hazel]

Extended family

[civic ocean]

Rousing reception used to be something else too right

Since engagement ring used to come with that built in

[surreal hazel]

Family trade

[glass shell]

family trade yeah

force a sacrifice with extra poms

[surreal hazel]

Sacrificial hymn in boon form. Because uhhhh

[glass shell]

sacrificial hymn didn't exist until that was removed

[civic ocean]

I wonder if those were legendary requirements before

[surreal hazel]

I forget what her old legendary was

[civic ocean]

Brave face

[surreal hazel]

Oh yeah

[civic ocean]

The old duo with heph was danaid dagger

[glass shell]

according to old screenshots, no

[ocean ibex]

ngl i kinda wish danaid was a permanent effect in some way

[surreal hazel]

Because spiteful strength as a duo was such bad design

[glass shell]

https://images.steamusercontent.com/ugc/2515900604546557114/DD48D519C7BE3177D093771ECE8726D862738098/

[surreal hazel]

Oh yeah, keen intuition

[civic ocean]

So dying wish was actually removed

[ocean ibex]

dying wish is flash fry

[civic ocean]

Interesting

[ocean ibex]

(sorta)

[surreal hazel]

Dying wish is dying wish

[civic ocean]

Dying wish exists it was removed as a leg requirement

[ocean ibex]

dying wish is flash fry

[surreal hazel]

Ea1 nexus rush and dying wish was such a nuke

[ocean ibex]

whatever patches had engagment ring inflicting hitch on entire rooms

[surreal hazel]

That too

Hitch was way too easy to spread early on

[civic ocean]

That was how og max fear clear was done iirc

I remember getting a 50 with Lion Fang start back then just hit Ering and like Ice Strike

[past salmon]

it was not
broken ER was Patch 3 the first max fear clear was Patch 4

[civic ocean]

Oh sick

[spiral wadi]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/773298528310001716/1400637952194904177/Hades_II_-_2025-07-31_5-34-12_PM.mp4

[blazing remnant]

Vow of Fangs moment

That is terrifying though

[spiral wadi]

very terrifying

equally silly tho

[rocky pier]

Hestia attack on Anubis still best?

[blazing remnant]

yah I say its pretty good

Freezer burn build on it is the go-to

[rocky pier]

With special? Sounds good to me. Although it would be nice to fit in wounds for grievous blow

[blazing remnant]

I had it happen with the Anchor men and I actualy couldnt move anywhere because of it

[blazing remnant]

I like Demiter on cast and wounds on special

bonus if you can get gust or blade rift added onto cast

super nova is good support too, makes the cast as big as the Anubis attack

[spiral wadi]

oh yea big anchor is actually insanely stupid to deal with, covers 70% of the arena

[blazing remnant]

its especialy sucks when theres multiple

[spiral wadi]

ye, kinda just means u gotta either have freeze, a good cast, or some third option

[vapid mountain]

dog with rabies

[blazing remnant]

Phase Shift hex

[spiral wadi]

ur right maybe i should start using omegas on staff

(i say as i won't /j)

[blazing remnant]

But that dps thoughhhh

[spiral wadi]

who needs dps when you can https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051942150025269309/1400291899587297280/clip_1753925947744.mp4

[blazing remnant]

you know what

your right

[spiral wadi]

btw is it just me or is it random what song plays during the prom fight, sometimes i get olympus aflame other times i think i'm getting wrath of the heavens or smth

[blazing remnant]

so it depends on a few things from what ive seen

1. What song plays first on your first few encounters
2. If you encounter a guardian (the music changes after beatting said guardian and moving to the next location) or Dio

so you get OA at the start and fight prom to WOH

and vice versa

[spiral wadi]

ah, interesting

[blazing remnant]

and this applies for most surface locations

the same cannot be said in the Underword

[blazing remnant]

you either get Sightless Shepard or the alt music (forgor the name)

and that is what plays in the Boss fight isntead of changing

You can also tell what song Scylla will play by what she sings through out Oceanus

[spiral wadi]

ye i only caught the scylla thing after playing rivals lol, all interesting tho

[blazing remnant]

mhm

its fun to call out the Scylla songs that I will fight to whenever I land in oceanus

like "Rock in a hard place!" or "Coral Crown?"

[spiral wadi]

me playing 62f like "please let the run that wins be 'rock in a hard place'"

[blazing remnant]

REALLL

Dude I sing along as I fight just to get into the grove of it all

its so fun

[spiral wadi]

hades 2 karaoke minigame when

[blazing remnant]

oh that would be funny

[civic ocean]

Iirc this is the same as hades 1 for at least biome 1 and 3

Err or the opposite

It switches at the midboss in that game too

[blazing remnant]

ye

[sterile portal]

why use blood triad when you can just make your attack blood triad
https://imgur.com/a/TI1Ox2p

[analog ether]

Sheesh, am I really so bad at Unrivaled Chronos? Started the fight with over 300 health, and ended it with 48. And that was with over half the Hades heal boon still available.

[blazing remnant]

Unrivaled is a tough fight haha

Is anyone else having a hard time on Unrivaled Prom btw?

They just hit so hard...

[elfin forge]

it's a big time sink, but they usually split apart so it's more manageable

I prefer to fight prometheus first

[terse hemlock]

yea... stupid medea. move 1 inch and you're poisoned

[elfin forge]

that's unrivaled poly

[terse hemlock]

ohh damn yea

confused me

I find eris more time sink tbh.. move a feet closer and she flies away fast

[blazing remnant]

Poly is manageable once you fight them enough times

[blazing remnant]

that part is annoying, especialy at the end

[elfin forge]

Eris: easy but runs away a ton
Prom: Hard, tanky, but not undodgeable
Typhon: I don't know how you do this hitless tbh

[terse hemlock]

yea.. having a hard time keeping her inside the cast ring

[blazing remnant]

I give up on cast ringing her, moves way to often

also Blood Triad resets when she flys away

[elfin forge]

and scorch

[blazing remnant]

which extra sucks

The best you do is freeze or Phase shift her

[brazen ore]

eris makes me so annoyed trying to fight her on half the weapons in the game

it's such a slow fight. it's not particularly hard but it's just so slow with how often she skedaddles

[blazing remnant]

not difficult, just annoying
feels intentional

[elfin forge]

her being annoying as hell is canon

[brazen ore]

it is lore accurate but i hate it

[blazing remnant]

I least she cant camp the fire anymore

like in previous patches

[brazen ore]

she sure still tries lol

[blazing remnant]

very true

Sometimes I get worried about complaining about Unrivaled fights because idk if its a skill issue or if its just because its difficult

My difficulty order (so far) is
Poly: easiest
Eris: second easiest
Prom: hardest
Typh: second hardest

[elfin forge]

so it's basically the same as before rivals

[blazing remnant]

mhm

hah Typh is actualy easier before rivals

because of Eris damage buffs

[zinc dirge]

Eris stomps me, there are some times I just do not get into a good rhythm and just get blasted without realizing when or why

[brazen ore]

my biggest issue with pushing fear at this point tbh is just that i run out of time before i reach prom bc olympus is such a strugglebus for me

or like i run out of time midway through prom's fight

[blazing remnant]

I actualy did and was left on 5 hp because of it one time

[brazen ore]

i do like when i survive past the time vow and just tank the damage

[blazing remnant]

ye it jsut sucks that allll that health disapears

and extra time for Typhon

[brazen ore]

feels like i'm telling the vow no! I say when we're done

[blazing remnant]

"class dismises when I say so!"

[brazen ore]

https://tenor.com/view/were-done-when-i-say-were-done-walter-white-threat-breaking-bad-get-it-right-gif-5547771

[blazing remnant]

HAHA yah

Time cannot stop me watch this! tanks Vow of time damage

Chaos is more leathal than you shall ever be Nyx! and I get shot

[restive jolt]

What combination would be good with Ares, using Aspect of Eos?

[civic ocean]

Eris is currently blocking my 51f Momus run because she takes minimum 2:30 to kill with any omega move focused weapon

I think there is something I'm not seeing but honestly it's just "get winner's circle or rapid thrasher or get to her with 3 minutes left

[brazen ore]

she takes SO LONG i swear. it's part of why i hate doing omega based weapons

[civic ocean]

I just have to get better at the fight I think

[spiral wadi]

blitz dash duo

[wheat thistle]

its probably a skill issue on my part but using anubis staff is a pain with Eris 🫠

[brazen ore]

there are definitely parts where i feel like "ok i could have done this better/laid down more damage when i could/waited for her to commit to a move before i committed to my oattack" but there are also a lot of parts where i'm like "there's literally nothing i could have done differently to make this go faster other than get luckier"

i think the main issue i have is that i don't have a good sense of when she stands around long enough to apply odamage vs when she stands there for .01 seconds before flying away again. I don't know if there's a pattern?

[spiral wadi]

i believe she has a tell of where she will land before she actually shows up to land, ig u'd have to time charge ur omega to where the tell is and when she lands

[brazen ore]

oh interesting

[spiral wadi]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/773298528310001716/1400736926126051449/hertell.mp4 yea it's relatively faint but it's the lil dust ring

[brazen ore]

i watched that like five times before i saw it but bet. That might be gamechanging if I can unskill-issue my way into taking advantage of it

[median anvil]

doesn't work consistently because if she lands too close to you she will stun you and cancel your channeling

[indigo viper]

I feel like there are some huge imbalance between the coat block vs Skull Inv Special Attack.
Both of them took similar mana to perform but I feel like skull is better cause there so many unblockable moves. Where inv can you move freely (Vs kinda lock on in one place/face) and pass even though insta kill moves.

[glass bone]

So I know generally how to defeat Rivals 3 Surface (focus on one, I believe usually Prometheus first? Then focus the other inbetween but not too low to get 2 Phase 2 bosses). Question I have is… how can I beat them with Timer 3? Thus far I’ve only tried Timer 3 Rivals 3 with a suboptimal Persephone build (the blast was on Special with Demeter Attack), so I don’t know if it’s a skill issue that I didn’t beat them faster, or if it’s the build.

[median anvil]

@glass bone bacon is still studying the fight but so far he believes if you're on low on time you should focus on whoever is in support mode

[glass bone]

Does one of them always start as aggressive? Or is it randomized? And also is it the same for each seed?

[frozen prairie]

whats the best moros build

[median anvil]

the fight always starts with prom aggressive

[glass bone]

As much as I have loved the idea of Persephone Skull, I think I’ll try the battle again with a different build (either Zeus Anubis or Demeter Nergal)

[tall notch]

The difference is, coat oattack actually deals damage

At least on Selene/Shiva

[formal pulsar]

Persephone ospecial with hitch is no joke for room clearing.

[tall notch]

Oh yeah i guess Persephone ospec does something, though it does require far more setup than coat oattack

The ospecial on mel/medea, I don't think I ever use

[civic ocean]

I have bad news for you

I have a sense of how long it takes

And on Frenzy 2 it’s basically not enough time to charge almost every omega without a speed up or eternity

You have to start charging while she is doing her attack or pray that her AI just decides to fire a bomb instead of moving

[brazen ore]

Rip

I thought people were clearing 62 with momus tho what do they know that we dont

[median anvil]

right now the most common 62er is circe

last patch it was anubis

[formal pulsar]

Was Circe buffed? Why Circe this patch? And what cast people are running?

[brazen ore]

i know it's not common esp with the nerf but i did think people were doing it. perhaps i erred

[sage flame]

I've seen storm ring the most I think which did get buffed a small bit

anvil ring too

[civic ocean]

Couple reasons

Toula big buffs ended up being good for Circe

Also it just has the fascination of a few high level players

[sage flame]

also one person did arctic ring which is kinda based

[civic ocean]

I do tidal lol

[formal pulsar]

Tidal is actually kinda good but wards really screws with it

[sage flame]

yeah at 62 u better pray for winners circle ig

[civic ocean]

Ye the goal is to go tidal + gales + AQ

So usually theres static shock or smth for wards

[brazen ore]

something that has a really unique playstyle draws people's attention

nojoke, since i've seen people say that they wish anubis had a passive effect that was different than "omegas are better", i kinda would love to see anubis actually go all in on lost shades and say "allies are better"

[civic ocean]

Momus surface has been v sad

[formal pulsar]

AQ gonna be hard when u need 2 gods with no air (Poseidon and Demeter)

[civic ocean]

Ppl been telling me aq gonna be hard my whole life

[brazen ore]

pray for a good thessaly 🙏

[formal pulsar]

Thessaly encounters with Icarus are kinda nuts

[brazen ore]

especially on surface i think the hardest thing about hitting aq is not hitting the amount of air so much as not bricking yourself with vow of denial before u can get it

[sage flame]

zeus cast with cyclones and static for aq feels more natural to me anyway

[civic ocean]

Circe is my Uwu staff Momus is my surface staff

[formal pulsar]

And that’s after they nerfed his encounters

[sage flame]

just hit chaos creation for +3 elements anyway

[formal pulsar]

Is hostile env still bugged with Circe?

[civic ocean]

No idea all I know is it works on Charon

[glass shell]

Not a bug

Intentional nerf to circe/clarity change after multiple people complained it "wasn't working" when they just didn't realize both casts stacked on top of eachother around mel

[brazen ore]

So, I often use supay with Huntress, but I'm not sure if that's extremely optimal. Do we think furies better?

like i don't generally play supay with omega spam but since the rush boon nerf i've been finding myself not taking hestia rush and taking zeus instead so i can ensure i get blitz or static shock, and at that point I wonder if I should just use furies and omega spam.

[tall notch]

can't you fit both into your arcana?

[brazen ore]

Not if I am also wanting to take persistence and queen

[civic ocean]

I play AQ froth supay so I couldn’t tell you

[tall notch]

I feel like on supay I'd have furies over huntress if I can only have one. the damage on supay's reg attack/special comes from the status effect you apply more than the move itself anyway

[civic ocean]

Yeah I feel like for the attack and special it’s ideal to have like…blitz and scorch?

And like support fire static shock - maybe waves?

[brazen ore]

i've actually really been enjoying blitz and wounds so i can get grievous blow (and ideally the duo)

but i shall try with furies instead and then get mad at myself for playing suboptimally all the time i was doing huntress

[civic ocean]

Huntress is really good with Zeus Ares so I get why you want to run it. Is Heinous Affront so core that you don’t want to give up Queen?

[tall notch]

i like % based boons on attack but thats more because oattack is good now, not for the reg one

[civic ocean]

What does oattack do

Never clicked that button lmao

[tall notch]

it fires off these really big, pretty high damage projectiles for a few seconds

[brazen ore]

Nah, but most of Zeus's duos with anybody else I would want to have on supay are really good so I like hitting the duos

[tall notch]

courtesy to patch 11 rework

[civic ocean]

Maybe go no persistence then idk

[brazen ore]

Y'know I might actually try that. Persistence has been like a mainstay for so long but let's see

[civic ocean]

Yeah I doubt its correct but like try it and see

[brazen ore]

this isn't a fear run anyway and i've been hella practicing white antler tartarus so if I can survive out of erebus with it, I'm probably pretty goood

[tall notch]

persistence off is double bad because it also reduces your starting magick

I would only consider it in omegaless builds

[civic ocean]

Yeah I think its kinda good on everything but I haven’t really poked at that

[brazen ore]

the way I like to play supay is by ignoring my omegas most of the time so that's not necessarily an issue

i value being up close and personal for as many hits as I can get, vs giving myself enough distance to safely channel

[civic ocean]

I just hold down the run button and go in circles around stuff and it dies

[brazen ore]

Yeah basically lol

I do think it's gotten me better at dodging up close, but it's made me measurably worse at knowing when/where is safe to channel, so it's sort of a double-edge sword

[civic ocean]

Ik what its like having habits on weps

I am trying to convince myself it is worth it to use the Momus special but I just cant do it lol

[brazen ore]

do you play with night on for momus/are you cycling the attack and cast, or are you just not doing night on it

(the only times I've run builds that care about omegas enough to use night, I've been absolute dogwater at remembering what my last move was and waste time accidentally repeating moves lol)

[tall notch]

i enjoy alternating oatk and ospec for night on supay rn. idk if its necessarily good enough to be a meta player but its fun

[civic ocean]

Attack and cast with Winner’s Circle

Demeter for Arctic Ring Weed Killer Local Climate

Poseidon for Flood Gain + Unseen infinite mana combo and Geyser Spout

Then any % based god on Strike (Ares is my fave rn)

Made it to p4 typhon once last night at a hard 51f (wards and forefit which I think are two worst vows for Momus) but am going to tweak arcana (Strength in for death, maybe cut rerolls completely for Eternity and reset runs more) but I think its pretty strong

Its super interesting because I think Momus is the worst aspect in the game vs Eris but the best aspect in the game vs Typhon

[brazen ore]

do you cycle between attack and cast and take the night arcana card? And yeah eris vs typhon require different builds sort of. I'd almost rather build for Eris bc if my build is good enough to reach Typhon through eris/prom/heracles and all of the summit minibosses, Typhon isn't much of a problem

[cosmic shadow]

How are we supposed to dodge the bullet spam Charybdis attack

[civic ocean]

In the miniboss fight on surface?

[cosmic shadow]

Yea

[civic ocean]

Yes my Divinity line is from Furies to Night

[civic ocean]

What I do is once the camera pans up to Charibdys, I run to the northermost point on the ship that I can stand on, then right when the first ball is about to hit me, dash into a sprint and go all the way around to the rightmost point. By then, most of the projectiles will have expired, so I just have to dash backwards once and Im relatively safe. The last part takes practice though

[cosmic shadow]

I'll try this thank you

I don't wait long enough for the balls to get close, maybe that's where I'm going wrong

[civic ocean]

I usually wait until the first big projectile gets close to me up top and then wait at the other end until the first small projectile is about to hit me to dash through if that makes sense

The downside of this is you are giving up about 3-8 seconds or so of time where Charibdys is technically able to be hit but will be too far away, but I think this is an acceptable tradeoff

[glass bone]

I finally got my first 40 Fear Surface clear using Geyser Spout + Toula Circe.

Still suck at defeating the burly men though.

[glass bone]

Also, Denial both helped and hurt me in this run. I didn’t check Apollo’s boons, and it replaced my Poseidon cast. Turns out it helped me in the end though, because my skill then fell off of a cliff, and Daze I think saved me from dying at the summit. Such a mixed vow, but I guess a win is a win.

[civic ocean]

One improvement for denial might be to allow the sacrifice boon to be trackable in the Book of Shadows, so that you would know prior to taking a boon if it would be oops only sacrifices or not

You can reverse engineer this ofc but it would be useful

[glass bone]

I’d still prefer for the option of Shared Wealth if all that’s left is Sacrifice Boons.

[civic ocean]

Well the Vow is supposed to punish you in SOME way right

Though I wonder if Denial and Scars are really fulfilling their true purpose anymore. They haven’t been revisited in some time and Scars in particular is in like a super hokey spot atm

[glass bone]

True. A revision of some vows could come, but now that you mention it, there’s higher priorities than changing Denial.

Scars, arguably void, the arcana, many weapons, Medea, possibly Circe?, and a few other things.

All I hope for broadly, is that 1.0 won’t be the final balance patch.

[formal pulsar]

Okay incandescent aura is kinda incredible on fine line spam builds. It does create pressure with denial because now you want Hera attack, gain and fine line. But you get so much room clear and boss dmg.

Also anyone else feel like righteous pike is really mediocre now? Like it didn’t crack top 5 dmg sources in the 4 runs I did. And I spamming omegas like there is no tomorrow

I am thinking Hera Poseidon hestia and Demeter for fine line spam builds on Mel torch.

[civic ocean]

I am a bit low on Mel Torch omega spam mostly because it doesn’t get the crit chance but that sounds good

I haven’t tried Incan spam on a magick weapon before maybe ill give it a shot on Momus if I get shown Hera Hestia in ephyra

[civic ocean]

Did Pike change?

[formal pulsar]

Supposedly not that’s why I am asking. Because it feels way worse. And SGG loves undocumented changes

[civic ocean]

I am swapping to strength today on Momus and intend to take Pike when offered so will report back

[sacred python]

how does the god pool work in hades 2?

[glass bone]

You have a limitation of 4 gods typically, though you can increase the pool through god keepsakes, and other circumstances if you are at 3 gods and have a chance to earn 2 different god boons.

[raven harness]

can snyone offer advice on rivals hecate, I literally cannot beat her no matter what I do, I even had apollo's legendary and died, she spams way too many attacks it doesnt make sense how you can dodge

[glass bone]

Which attacks or phases do you need help with? And also what weapons?

Actually, I guess I could just give some general feedback for as much as I can think of…
The start of the fight is always the same. Around 1-2 seconds or so into the fight, Hecate triggers her Dark Side hex. Just like the nonrival Dark Side special, you can dash through the Rival Dark side special. To my understanding, she always uses the special once, then fires some of the attacks. Getting some hits in during the special is possible, but you’ll want to run a bit from the attacks.
Detecting the real Hecate is harder in Patch 11, but is still “possible”. Putting a curse on the real Hecate can help you find her. The real Hecate often is the furthest away compared to the two clones, so you could check each one once just in case, then spam some attacks at the real one.
For the Twilight Curse, you generally can dash through the ball, though you have to do more dodging for the split balls. Or you can equip Frinos to immediately block it.
For the many waves attack, you’ll want to do a half-circle loop around Hecate if you can, then attack her from behind.

[ocean ibex]

the real hecate usually speaks and has a little voice bubble above her when she does

[brazen ore]

I tried it once and it felt not very impactful, but the build I had was also a lot rougher than the other builds I've been doing, it didn't really come together very well. I think I will try again next time torches come up for grave thirst

[raven harness]

all of the clones have voice bubbles too
I just Identify the real hecate by who's running at me with a torch

[ocean ibex]

i don’t believe that’s true

[spiral wadi]

yea all the clones have bubbles when she speaks

after her "interphase" her teleport animation effect is more distinct than the other two

alternatively the two fake hecates will usually be together, meaning the real hecate is far from the other hecates

so if u see two hecates in close proximity, the real hecate's typically not them

this only applies to after her interphase iirc

[ocean ibex]

wtf

[raven harness]

I found my solution to hecate
supay
dont need to find opening if the game does it for me

[glass shell]

headphones is the true counter to hecate

[raven harness]

telling the clones isnt my problem, dodging touhou is

[olive sphinx]

I thought they fixed it and that there is no way to tell which one's the real one anymore

[sage flame]

magick spam isn't as fast anymore tbh, even with tons of attack speed on torches with all the use +magick boons it feels like pikes are always an awkward threshold to hit for a dps cycle

[sage flame]

audio still works afaik but sometimes she doesn't say anything when tripling

[olive sphinx]

ahh I see

this is really funny boss design

[edgy nacelle]

for later tonight:
anyone here passionate about using Mel blades lol?
it's next on my rotation of 40 fear attempts, and I died last night to Prom and Heracles.
I've barely touched Mel blades so idk how to best abuse them — back burner + secret crush for power? scroch/splash? reroll until I get trick knives (at which point idk what boons are actually recommended for a trick knives run tbh)?
any advice appreciated, ig for artemis blades too since I never use anything other than Pan and Morrigan (but artemis blades won't happen until after I'm done with all Mel aspects)

[glass shell]

That was never a bug

The bug was that the torches turned off when she went dark side

Sound has always been a intended tell ever since EA version 1 unless its just been scuffed this whole time

which i mean..... ICD was 'bugged' to not work this whole time so 🤷‍♂️

[willow phoenix]

I mostly just use scorch with mel blades tbh since you already have a lot of %damage from the backstab

Then it's just standard scorch build with freezer burn or pyro or both lol

[glass bone]

I know this is strong with Morrigan, but I’m wondering if Mel Aspect is an Omega Attack user. Like… get Sweeping Ambush, take Secret Crush and Weed Killer, then start spamming the OAttack.

Such a thing can’t be used against Typhon, so some other strategy has to be used for Surface, but maybe this’ll work in Underworld?

[willow phoenix]

That sounds like an Artemis build lol

It should work with mel blades too but the spamming won't be as good as with Artemis near instant O attack imo

[glass bone]

And yet Weed Killer works as a strat for all the non-Charon axes.

Oh wait… isnt Scylla also immune to backstabs?

[willow phoenix]

Yes but somehow blast with back burner can piece that iirc lol

[glass bone]

So then clearly the optimal strategy for Mel Blades is Heph attack + Weed Killer + Back Burner /j

[unkempt sleet]

they just fixed that in the latest patch rip

[glass bone]

Oh wait, yeah. Oops.

[willow phoenix]

Nope still worked lol

[glass bone]

Regardless, I want to try out an OAttack setup for the blades now (Mel, Artemis, and Morrigan)… or at-least next time I play the game. I’ll try it out at 32 Fear to start, since I’m not the best at 40 yet.

[willow phoenix]

They 'attempted' to fix it

[civic ocean]

Does she cleanse long statuses too? I recall froth and freeze sticking to her when she splits

[glass shell]

they said that, but they didn't actually

[uneven palm]

I play a decent amount of Mel Blades. If you're struggling at higher Fear, probably what's missing is use your specials more. A lot more. It's one of the best basekit moves in the game: pierces, hitstuns, hits twice, backstabs. Work it in as much as you can.

Best hammers are Trick Knives, Wicked Onslaught, Reaper Knives, Melting Sickle probably in that order.

One way to build is starting Zeus special, add like honestly anything on attack Zeus has good duos with Hestia/Poseidon/Aphrodite/Hera/Ares, Static Shock is in the pool… Or Aphro/Apollo attack start and just try to get as much +Power and on-hit as you can (Secret Crush, Wicked Onslaught, Slow Cooker, Static Shock)

[edgy nacelle]

(whoops pressed enter too soon, editing)
I was using special a decent amount, but I also ended up with an epic Heph blast on it and proceeded to get no poms. But I like the dagger special a lot! Zeus to start sounds like a good move, and I may opt for Apollo attack if I roll into it since I struggle with the short range and AoE a bit (my go-to weapons are generally all long range lol). ty for the advice!

[sage flame]

I haven't tracked recently but I swear she used to carry scorch and she clears it now but also I haven't paid attention recently, freeze my stick with her, I can't remember if the triad visual sticks with her too

[spiral wadi]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051942150025269309/1401023822752125141/clip_1754100462846.mp4 where's athena when u need her

[civic salmon]

do the hidden aspects unlock in a set order?

[willow phoenix]

No they unlock depending on whether you've reached the requirements for each weapon and whether you've talked to each respective unseen aspect bearer

[civic salmon]

and what's the requirement to get the ability to look at boons from gods and their requiremnets?

[uneven palm]

Have the book of shadows and gift 1+ nectar to each god (including Artemis, Hermes, Chaos)

[glass shell]

and dio and athena

[willow phoenix]

<@&456908176877551658> ^

[sacred python]

I have my Hephaestus attack lvl 4 and echo is offering to double it

Will my blast effects recharge faster? Or is 2 seconds the limit

[sacred python]

Why are you snitching? Spoilers are allowed in this channel lmao 🤣

[glass shell]

out of context reply, there was spam and mods forgot to delete the ping

[sacred python]

ah ok

[glass shell]

And no, 2 seconds is the limit, 1.4~ with the duo bonn but you can't pom it past 2 seconds

[sacred python]

So echo doubling my boon doesn't do anything?

[glass shell]

It increases the number, but functionally will do nothing if you're at 2 seconds already correct

[sacred python]

Ah ok got it, I am

[glass shell]

I have no idea if it will skip to a boon that does do something or not though

Most likely won't though

[sacred python]

I'll just pop it for science

Okay it went to my level 3 boon instead

Good to know

[empty musk]

Yeah I think the only way to pom blast over the level cap is Icarus, but it still has no effect on cooldown after cap

[glass shell]

Bridal glow can too, but you' would have to have a capped heph strike on a non heroic

and rng hitting it

[glass bone]

Just did an OAttack Artemis build at 38 Fear, and it felt sooo good**. Two asterisks though.

1. The few moments where a Crit was used on a weapon that hit no one.
2. When I got the build online (Secret Crush + Weed Killer + Sweeping Ambush), I didn’t have nearly enough magic to support it, such that I had a harder time with regular Chronos than Rivals Cerberus.
   To the latter, I’m wondering what magic gain is best (god boon, or perhaps Hecuba or Unseen weapon?). I went for Aphrodite due to going for Aphro Attack and Secret Crush, but the Island Getaway never hit, and even when I was right in the faces of enemies, the few ticks of Weak gains did not support the cost of 40 Magic per OAttack.

[glass shell]

when in doubt born gain is your answer

[glass bone]

I guess I’ll try it next time. Was debating between Aphro, Apollo, and Demeter gain. Aphro and Demeter because it’s less keepsakes, rerolls, and/or luck I’d have to get to get everything I want, and Apollo because of the burst option.

[glass shell]

Demeter at higher rarity refills you near instantly if you stand still and aren't charging the omega parry

[pseudo sequoia]

demeter is definitely the best out of the three, secret crush, weed killer and sweeping ambush all at once is a bit too much magick consumption for glamour and lucid gain to keep up with

unless you get chaos talent but that's more luck dependent

[rain wagon]

There is one major issue with Demeter gain though; it feels horrible to stand still.

[glass bone]

Hmm… is it even worth it to go for Weed Killer?

I’d want Secret Crush for the base damage increase, and Sweeping Ambush is a 400% increase, while Weed Killer at even Epic Rarity iirc is 1/4x the damage for 1/2 the magic increase.

[pseudo sequoia]

it's less worth it than the rest of them but extra damage is extra damage

all depends on whether or not you think the magick cost is worth it really

[glass bone]

I need to play around with this more. I started with Frinos for Rival Hecate (which failed somehow) and more survivability, so I’ll continue practicing this Omega Attack quest. Hopefully soon I can find the perfect combo for Artemis blades (or at-least discover it for myself).

Also because big number go up (highest I believe I saw in 1 Omega Attack was around a 3000 damage crit.

[tough pasture]

SgG shouldn't eliminate the 90% damage increase in the cast. Just codify it by changing the caption.

medea is already the best aspect in the game. Just give this to us.

AMMMMIIIIIIIIRRRRRR,
Don't nerf it like you nerfed charged flight from 400% to 200% in hades 1). (Yes, I'm still annoyed about that.)

[glass shell]

Nah that gotta go chief i hate to say it

What i don't want howover is to remove the cast damage AND nuke the bonus like i fear will happen

I already foresee 40% medea damage amp and cast bug fixed

[brave dove]

secret crush does basically nothing in omega builds

it adds as much to the oattack pre-multipliers like sweeping ambush and weed killer as it does to the basic attack

omega moves aren't innately a multiplier (anubis aside), they're just a higher base power, so +power doesn't work intuitively on them

anyway if you wanna sustain through sweeping ambush zeus is probably the best applicable gain

(I will additionally say that weed killer gets devalued by sweeping ambush, changing +300% to +380% or whatever doesn't do that much, I'd only go for it if I had a low multiplier on my regular attack boon, like using dem attack)

[tough pasture]

https://tenor.com/view/pernalonga-meme-pernalonga-no-no-não-nao-gif-27211143

[tough pasture]

Yeah, I'm concerned about the possibility of this too...

[glass shell]

then again its survived this long so long live the king

on the other other hand, pan got nuked out of nowhere with a triple nerf in unseen

my main issue is that they have already discovered what causes the bug in speedcord so they know what to fix and while they are there they will balance medea xdd

[tough pasture]

Yeah, I was playing pan the other night and I was FLABBERGASTED at how weak it felt. Then I saw someone's vod and he explained what happened. I was sad...

[empty musk]

Pan's gotten targeted just bc the devs hated how ppl only ran Poseidon, hence ICD + lag

Which ig mission accomplished bc now we just run trick knives Hera 💀

Medea doesn't really have that problem w build diversity hence why it's been mostly untouched by nerfs so far

[glass shell]

why are people running on hit on my rapid hitting weapon????

[civic ocean]

Did they say that?

I thought the ICD was just always in the game but not implemented and so they fixed the bug in Unseen

[brave dove]

my genuine belief is that they just flat out did not think about what the ICD would do to Pan when combined with the actual Pan endlag nerf

they just thought 'oh that's bugged and not applying, let's fix it'

[empty musk]

I mean when the ICD is being reverted on everything but Pan (and coat special for some reason) it's kinda obvious

Plus they tried to reduce on hit and buff power instead

[brave dove]

I'm guessing the idea of the endlag is that it doesn't really impact low fear clears because stuff just isn't fast enough to punish you that much, but it pushes pan out of high tier for high fear

not sure how successful that was, I haven't played frenzy 0 for Some Time, but I think that was the idea

[civic ocean]

Does it? Isn’t the regular special like really really good on Pan esp with trick knives

[brave dove]

trick knives is its own thing

[glass shell]

im half convinced they don't consider hammers when they balance

[brave dove]

why should they? genuine question

if knives were balanced around trick knives all three would be in the gutter without it

[glass shell]

eh im of two minds

I personally think all hammers should be as run defining as trick knives/ PA

[brave dove]

that's crazy

when everything is equally good everything is equally mid, things exist in context