h2-builds-and-combat

[tardy adder]

blitz + romantic spark goes pretty hard on supay

thermal dynamics as well

[crystal holly]

okay im gonna try the ares hex thing now. 32f Rival 4 O.O

[keen vapor]

Im assuming thats zeus + aphrodite and hestia? I dont know boons names by heart haha

[crystal holly]

same here ;P

[keen vapor]

Good luck!

[crystal holly]

Thanks bud, may the moonlight guide you too

[tardy adder]

yeah, and thermal dynamics is zeus + hestia

[keen vapor]

Ohh interesting, Ill try that build. Hestia keepsake to start off for sprint?

[tardy adder]

yup

[keen vapor]

Got it, lesgo

[wintry pasture]

Quick question, I have done a single run of Eos aspect multiple patches ago and decided I wasn't a fan but wanna try it again, what's the general go to in terms of starting gods?

[tardy adder]

poseidon/hestia works well on special. Ares on the attack lets you get heinous affront and arterial spray duos. I did some 32 fear runs with it and my favored god pool was poseidon/hestia, ares, zeus, apollo

basically you wanna try for heinous affront (with divine vengeance and light smite), arterial spray, and maybe king tide if you're lucky

[wintry pasture]

interesting, thanks!

[crystal holly]

ugh . does anyone else gets tilted sometimes? :/

[civic ocean]

used to! It can be frustrating

[tall notch]

Hera attack

[spiral wadi]

as someone who has been dying consistently at 55f, surprisingly not really, i have fun playing around w/ different boon combos just to see how far i can get

[keen vapor]

Can you only get duo boons by taking attack/special/cast boons or are others included like sprint?

[wintry pasture]

i've been listening to a bunch of Johnny Cash recently while I play (game is all but muted) and it makes me cry too much to get tilted, hope this helps /hj

in all seriousness though its gonna sound simple but for me staying hydrated and occasionally getting up and taking a brief walk around my house or even just standing up in my room and stretching rq helps me regain my mental super quick, used to use the same tricks when i grinded the hell out of overwatch like 5-6 years back. Just simple things to take care of yourself and check in make sure you're doing alright.

[spiral wadi]

u can see what duo boons require in the book of shadows

[wintry pasture]

it depends on the duo, they each have different requirements, some more broad than others

the book is helpful and if you have the incantation that basically lets you bookmark certain boons it'll tell you what you need while in the boon selection menu

[keen vapor]

Oh I was looking online on the website and it gave false information, thanks for the book of shadows tip

[tardy adder]

Turns out lance of ares is actually kinda awesome. just finished a 32 fear surface run with selene coat, and skyfall ended up doing 170K damage in the final stats. Probably the most overall damage I've ever seen a hex do

[barren badger]

I can't seem to complete runs on my steam deck without godmode/assist. Are the difficulty curves different than hades 1?

[glass shell]

yes/no. The game is fundamentally different in its execution as zag was more dash heavy unga bunga while mel has less dashes and base hp.

Surface is intended to be harder if you're doing that path, though underworld has a similar difficulty curve as h1 if not easier with how arachne is designed to take the load off tbh

[willow phoenix]

Probably just takes some time to adjust to the mechanic from H1, it's not the same after all

Personally I found it easier than H1 since I like the mechanic here more

[glass shell]

remember to use cast, its an incredibly useful tool unlike zags cast in h1 saving you a lot of hp

[barren badger]

I only defeated the surface a few times, and only because i lucked out on really broken boon combinations.

[tardy adder]

I just got 2 back to back 32 fear wins on Selene coat with a lance of Ares build. Today I learned that artemis has a boon that gives your hexes a flat 30% crit chance like wtf 😭

[glass prism]

Does anyone know if air quality calculates before or after % boons?like extended family for example

[civic ocean]

very end of calc

[glass prism]

that's sad

i guess it could be kinda of op if it came before

[civic salmon]

Is born gain like more rare now?

I feel like I used to get it almost by default with Hera but now I’m fighting to find it

[glass shell]

nothing code wise afaik

[keen vapor]

To complete the fate, do I need to do chaos above or below twice in a row? Because it says so online but my below CURRENT streak is still at 1 even tho I just completed a chaos above run

[willow phoenix]

It's either 2 chaos below win without losing or 2 chaos above win without losing

[keen vapor]

I see, the current streak part isnt clear and I think it should say zero since I just did the other chaos run imo. Good to know tho, thanks

[willow phoenix]

It doesn't need to be consecutive I think, only without losing

[keen vapor]

Oh! In that case Im good, thank god because theres no way I can beat typhon with any random weapon yet lol

[empty harness]

Just to double check, ares godsent wounds has a separate cooldown to attack/special wounds right?

[willow phoenix]

It's not really separate and more that ares godsent will always trigger wound regardless of cd

So if you have say wounds on your attack it won't trigger after the hex since the enemy still has wound

[empty harness]

OH ok, so each beam will have +50 base power then?

[willow phoenix]

Yep

[empty harness]

Does the wounds stack with the sublime upgrade that increases damage by 50% per hit or no?

[willow phoenix]

Yes, it's one of the best ways to actually increase the damage. It's also not sublime but bright so pretty cheap as an upgrade

[empty harness]

Oh mb, but will the wounds also increase by 25 base power due to the increase or is it applied afterwards?

[willow phoenix]

Yeah since wounds is base power

[empty harness]

Ah of course yeah

[willow phoenix]

So say Skyfall has base 50 power(I don't actually remember), having Ares Godsent will increase that to 100. If you have other power upgrades say +40 it's now 140

With Ferocity, it deals +50% damage after every hit
So first hit will be 140, then 210, then 280, and so on. Then you also need to count all the other global damage buff you have like from Strength, Furies, and so on. If you have like a total of 200% damage buff from that then that's +280 damage on every skyfall hit. So it'll be like 420, 490, 560 and so on

Honestly with how high the damage numbers can go I feel like there's something off with how Ferocity interacts with Prism lol. I've seen it hit 2k without grievous or crit. When I last tried it with just cascade the damage was only so so

[empty harness]

Thanks man ur the goat fr

[glass bone]

I disagree with this feedback, and figured to respond here (rather than cloud up the feedback channel) and also to give advice (as someone who defeated Rivals Scylla with Anubis for their first 32F clear). Anubis’s strategy does not change from regular encounters. It does a hit and run style by hitting Attack, then cast if you use Furies, then running and dodging by spamming specials.
For Attack, Hestia or Hera I believe are the two strongest (yes, even after the Scorch nerf). The big AoE is nice to apply these two curses.
For Special, Apollo or Aphrodite are the two strongest (Aphrodite deals more damage than Apollo at the cost of not being able to do all that damage from far away).
In the example provided, you can place your attack on a tentacle or Roxy, place down the cast, then start running, hitting specials on anyone.

[brave dove]

anubis is the best high fear aspect aside from maybe TK Pan for good reason, yeah

[willow phoenix]

What's TK?

[brave dove]

Trick Knives

[willow phoenix]

Oh makes sense

[glass bone]

The neat part with that fight specifically, is you could hit like 3-5 targets near the start, and stack huge amounts of damage if you’re quick enough (since the 3 main members are grouped up near 2 tentacles at the very beginning).

[glass shell]

personally i wish that staff leaned more into the lone shades cause they feel like an afterthought, which is why i followed up that with my own suggestion.

I wish they either automatically launched upon being summoned or had some other benefit, it feels like toula all over again

[tall notch]

You can lean into the shades more but its very hammer dependent

[olive tusk]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1216700686079885332/1394671998160080957/image.png?ex=6877a904&is=68765784&hm=1468cad4658a916c889006412bc8f01dc677b25421a595742e6c3aa9c62988be&

unbelievably powerful artemis boon i just got

trivialized rivals underworld

[brave dove]

which hex were you running?

[olive tusk]

darkside aphrodite

[brave dove]

yeah dark side's pretty nice with it, godsent lunar ray and skyfall go super nuts

[olive tusk]

lunar ray must be in 3000s with this

[brave dove]

shine of apollo with trinity and this can kamehameha away chronos's oneshot

it does 12000 damage before he finishes and forces him to phase

[olive tusk]

also, what are some good gods to go with anubis? since hestia's now gone

[brave dove]

hestia's still fine

[olive tusk]

I've been really trying to get 32h to work with morrigan's but it is too slow

that or im still a noob

[brave dove]

what vows are you running?

[willow phoenix]

lol the rarity scaling is still broken, it's also 30% at common

[brave dove]

speed shouldn't be a huge issue at 32 unless you're taking some pretty awful vows

[olive tusk]

frenzy pain grit wards rivals etc

im mainly trying to get good at frenzy 2 rivals, chronos still completely destroys me

ive been able to get through typhon a few times, purely by luck

[olive tusk]

does success rate hit this?

[willow phoenix]

Probably? I guess you can check on the book if it's a requirement for success rate

You can see on the book of shadows that it's 30% at base

[olive tusk]

also ironically, I struggle way more on f2 rivals prom than typhon

run relies on me not melting all my hp away on prom

[brave dove]

those are some pretty rough vows for 32

pain and grit in particular have no business being active if you're running rivals 4 at 32

and wards is all-round kind of awful

time 3, f2, rivals 4 already puts you at 24, you can take menace 2, scars 1, denial and shadow for the rest

[tropic sinew]

During my game going on surface, i encountered Athena and took her boon in world 3. After beating boss Prometheus, I was left with 0 Death Defiances, and wanted to take her Keepsake so I can get boon that replenishes my death defiances. BUT, her keepsake was crossed, and I couldn't take it. WHY?

[brave dove]

if you're a big zeus fan you can take hubris 2 or hubris 1/scars 2 instead of denial

scars 1 is barely noticeable, scars 2 is quite noticeable, though

[olive tusk]

got it 🫡 I'll give that a try

hubris feels so uncomfortable, but people find it easier as a vow

[brave dove]

those are UW vows, mind

surface... I'd still probably run something like that but for a first 32 clear I'd probably look at substituting some of them with forfeit, which is a lot less painful on the surface if you're not overly attached to region 2 god keepsake

[willow phoenix]

They changed it so Athena can only appear once in a run

[tropic sinew]

oh thanks! in last update or?

[willow phoenix]

Maybe unseen? Not sure

[tropic sinew]

thanks bruh :))))))))))))))))

🤝

[topaz meteor]

Quick question, aspect of Mel on the skull, if you put Aphro on the attack, and you fire from far away, does it count as close up dmg or not?

[uneven palm]

If you just fire from far away, no. If you fire then get close before impact somehow, yes.

[civic ocean]

My advice as someone who is in the mid 40s fear climbing this

It’s easier to learn the fights if they don’t deal double damage to you, so turn off at least pain

[tall notch]

wait @civic ocean do you mean 40s fear or are you actually in your mid fourties

[civic ocean]

Im 35

[willow phoenix]

I think Prism can actually hit Typhon multiple times, probably cerberus too.
I recorded and compared my Lance of Ares damage output vs solo Heracles and solo Typhon and the one on Typhon is significantly higher with the only upgrade difference being +10 power and some shine upgrade

like on Heracles it was 280 on first hit with Orig, but on Typhon it was already 585

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwUfOMrBcIk
the damage was all over the place with jumping from 500 to 1k+ and back down
I don't think it's like the damage text adding things up too

[tardy adder]

is it an insane take to say pan daggers is the worst aspect in the game or am i overreacting? I legit had an easier time with most mel aspects on 32 fear rivals 4 than pan

[brave dove]

only aspect with a 67 fear clear so far, so

[glass shell]

probably yes

It absolutely fell from a top contender IMO with the unseen patch nerfs, but like flower vendor says its literally the only aspect that has a (seeded) max fear clear though it may as well be "trick knives" not pan

[tardy adder]

trick knives does feel very good with it but its so bad without it

defo needs a buff

[willow phoenix]

or just a rework so it's not Chiron 2.0 lol

[glass shell]

genuinely they just need to delete the posiedon ICD changes and its "fine" again.

Still clunky as absolute hell with the self stun it has now but "fine" and knock on fixes other complaints

[glass shell]

issue is tons of casual players like me loved chiron so it was an obvious reprint to make

[tardy adder]

my issue with reprints is that H1 still exists and I can play it if I want to experience those aspects again. I'd rather they add new stuff but I know a lot of people want fanservice so maybe I'm the minority

[heavy panther]

I've had amazing results with zeus on anubis
you need static shock and air quality for it to get fully online, but once it is you really coast through everything

I hear scorch is still good, but I prefer hitch and blitz now

[olive tusk]

I've been wanting to do a king's ransom build

but it's beginning to feel like queen's ransom is stronger

[heavy panther]

isn't it weapon dependent? I know morrigan goes really good with zeus

[olive tusk]

it should be amazing with charon zorophet or supay cause you can just absolutely spam that omega

it's kind of so and so for morrigan

unless I get a really good rarity high level one, then its pretty great on morrigan too

[heavy panther]

ngl supay is bonkers with anything

[olive tusk]

blinding rush reaction to that information

well I mean, you can still get a great build going witht hat

[heavy panther]

does it make blinding rush faster?

[olive tusk]

yes

[willow phoenix]

Ok another interesting thing I found

If you have Ares attack on a non Godsent Skyfall, you actually get Ares Godsent effect lol

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1334746789882105900/1394728844367499406/image.png?ex=6877ddf5&is=68768c75&hm=7c211c1adb848b27360be9ea6bd4addb723a650474af4d42fed4abcb7de218b3&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1522&height=856

The damage increased, but it doesn't count as wound, and I think it can proc grievous?

[willow phoenix]

Pretty abusable I think, like you get free godsent that has no use limit and no path of stars needed lol

So I guess we're freed from starting Ares keepsake first lol

[tardy adder]

that's probably unintetional, no?

[willow phoenix]

well yes it's a bug lol

[tardy adder]

Ive been loving selene coat so much with lance of ares recently. did a 32 fear run yesterday where skyfall ended up doing 170K damage it was epic

task force OP

[willow phoenix]

honestly I've been doing a bunch of runs to compare godsent vs non godsent Skyfall and I'm not convinced the godsent actually makes that much of a difference lol. Probably like 30% total skyfall damage increase most of the time which is something but not that gamechanging for you to be starting Ares Keepsake first

[willow phoenix]

Oh you can use this one with cascade too unlike normal lance of ares lol

[tardy adder]

it does make a difference, The ares voice lines are a buff

"Violence and Destruction"

[willow phoenix]

"Let There Be War"

[analog ether]

Is Flood Gain currently bugged?

Or is it just bad?

[willow phoenix]

Flood gain is good imo, but can be kinda rarity dependant since on epic it's so much better than common

[analog ether]

For the last two phases of Rivals Chronos, I was stuck at 20 magic.

[willow phoenix]

You can still trigger Flood Gain even at 0 magick

[analog ether]

It wasn't primed that low. It just didn't go above 20.

[willow phoenix]

Well yeah that's how Flood Gain works

Flood gain refunds any magick used during the duration including the omega that triggers it. It can be triggered even at 0 magick, which at that point it will give you magick back since you technically used X magick to trigger even though it was free

[analog ether]

Still didn't feel good, since it felt like I was locked out of two of my omegas.

[willow phoenix]

Uhh no? You can try it on the first room, flood gain doesn't lock out anything

Unless you're using it during its cd

[analog ether]

No, I mean it felt like I was locked out of two of my omegas, because I didn't have enough magic to use them.

[willow phoenix]

If you don't have enough magick but flood gain was active it would still work and refund it

[analog ether]

I was stuck at 20, Omega Attack cost 25, and Omega Cast was 35.

Still felt weird overall.

[sage flame]

flood gain should be allow you to use an omega even if you don't currently have enough magick currently, as long as it's off cooldown

[analog ether]

Definitely regret trading Tranquil Gain for it, even if was Heroic.

[uneven palm]

Flood Gain’s pretty good when your omega use is clumped together like maybe Artemis on Riposte or Skulls with Possessed Array. Just free magick for a while.

[civic ocean]

Yeah I take it sometimes with huntress mel skull and its just like hey free explosions for like 4 seconds

[willow phoenix]

it's a pretty nice alternative to Born Gain that doesn't have any priming out risk imo
Like most omega heavy builds would still work well with Flood Gain

[tall notch]

flood gain is good if your build can afford to potentially play without magick during the flood cooldown

[civic ocean]

I didn’t actually know that it lets you use omegas if you’re OOM

[barren galleon]

hey guys any help on staff build? whats the go to and best aspect etc

[glass bone]

All the staff builds I’d argue are different, though there is some overlap between Anubis and Mel Staff. Most people say that Anubis is strongest. If you choose that, you can go for Hestia or Hera attack, along with Apollo or Aphrodite Special.

[barren galleon]

how about momus

[glass bone]

Actually, maybe there is overlap with all the staves… I feel like Apollo or Aphrodite Special could work. Though it’s been a long time since I’ve used Momus tbh

[analog ether]

I tend to really enjoy Thermal Dynamics Anubis.

Blitz Attack + Smolder Ring to get the duo. Arc Flash and Pyro Tech are nice add-ons but aren't wholly necessary, and then whatever else you want to throw in.

When you can get somebody lined up in the sweet spot overlap of your Attack and Omega Attack, the damage ramps up pretty quick.

[keen vapor]

I dont get how to complete Unrivaled Prowess fate, is it already possible to do? Ive only beaten Hecate so far

[analog ether]

To unlock the next Vow rank, you need to beat both bosses, and then it becomes an incantation.

So you'd need to also beat Polyphemus.

[keen vapor]

Oh I see, Im trying to complete my remaining 6 fates so I was about to start this one

[analog ether]

Good news is, to finish it off you don't actually need to defeat Unrivaled Chronos and Typhon. Just reach them with the Vow.

[keen vapor]

Thats good to know

Maybe I should do the path of the stars one first, but I dunno any good build with hexes

[analog ether]

You don't really "build" with Hexes. They're more like an additional tool to have.

If you think you're already going to be spending a lot of magic, then it doesn't hurt to grab a Hex if it appears.

[keen vapor]

Nono Im saying I wanna complete the quest/fate thing that asks us to get each gods path of the star thing. And I would probably have an easier time doing that by building around the hex needed

[sterile portal]

about to start a madea run and idk what core boons to go for for attack/special any recs

zeus it is

[analog ether]

Oh, the Godsent upgrades.

Yeah, you still can't really "build" for those. It's essentially kind of random.

Every God is tied to a specific Hex. IF you have a boon from them or currently hold their keepsake, and IF Selene offers you the corresponding Hex, there is a CHANCE that it will have the Godsent upgrade. Then you have to actually work through the Path of Stars to actually select the upgrade.

Basically, pick a God, always start with their Keepsake, pick Selene the first chance you get. If she gives you the Godsent, take her Keepsake in the next region.

If she doesn't, try again (since you can't reroll Hex options).

[keen vapor]

Would you recommend doing that in the underworld or upstairs? Im assuming I just gotta use it once and I can die to complete the other god hexes

Currently doing a run with skyfall/ares

[analog ether]

Surface. Mostly because it's a little faster to find out if Selene offers you the right Hex.

Skyfall is easiest, since you already have the Hex.

[west thunder]

What’s the standard build for Mel staff now? Maybe something like Aphro on specials and fill in curses on attack and cast for origination?

[glass bone]

Exactly. Though to add more to this, you can use the regular special hammers to add more damage (Dual Moonshot I believe is the best because it’s another huge hitter).

If I had to guess as to what is best for the curses… Hera could fit on either Attack or Cast. If you chose Attack Hera, Poseidon cast could work well, due to the Duo Boon with Aphrodite (not getting the Dual Moonshot means you can instead deal your max damage from further away).
If you choose Cast Hera, Zeus could perhaps work if you have a combo of Attack followed then by Special, but Hestia could also be good for a hit and run style.

[brave dove]

Unless this has been hotfixed very recently, if you get the appropriate hex with the appropriate god in your pool it will always be godsent.

[analog ether]

That part I was a bit uncertain about.

[nova pivot]

what are some good boons to look for for supay?

[analog ether]

Hestia's great in general.

[keen vapor]

I dont understand aspect of supay, is my special and attack always active? I have no idea what kinda boon to go for

[west thunder]

Seeing this late thank you for writing all this

[analog ether]

Yes. Your Omega's basically just increase the fire rate.

[keen vapor]

Gotcha

[analog ether]

You kinda want to rely on your Special and the buffed Dash boom to be dealing damage.

The aiming for the auto-firing attack is... wonky.

[uneven palm]

You have one special out all the time, and you'll occasionally shoot attacks at nearby enemies or gold pots or what-have-you. This requires no input from you.

Omega special adds more orbiting doodads, Omega attack increases the rate of fire for attacks for a while.

Currently most folks start with a good rush boon (Hestia, Poseidon) then flesh out Origination with attack/special. Hestia, Zeus, Poseidon, Hera, Ares all pretty good there.

[keen vapor]

What does Origination mean? I get everything else tho, thanks

[uneven palm]

The Arcana where two applying two curses gives a damage boost

[keen vapor]

Ahh I should put it back again, good to know

[dim kelp]

The o-attack basically increases the fire rate. The o-special gives you a second orb, and the orbit radius becomes much larger. If you’re running a rush boon that requires you be right on top of enemies to get the damage, the o-special can be a bit awkward. It’s better for situations where you can’t/don’t want to get so close

[molten crescent]

Alright, I give up. I've tried several times and I cannot beat Prometheus with the Vow of Rivals in effect. What are some good tips that I can try next time so I don't get squashed flat? I'm doing great against the upgraded Polyphemus, and getting better against Eris, but that flaming jerk and his ||traitorous buddy|| are kicking my butt.

I'll say my strategy so far has been "kill the other guy first", sort of like the Theseus fight in Hades 1. My best so far is that I've gotten the aforementioned ||traitor|| to half health and Prometheus somewhere around a quarter.

Without Vow of Rivals, I usually do pretty well against Prometheus... maybe end up losing a DD every other run, but I haven't died to him alone in a while.

[willow phoenix]

Hitch works great, and usually they both stay away from each other so you can focus one until they converge again

You can focus on Herc or Prom first. If you focus on Prom first, you can even keep hitting Heracles during the flame waves for more dps. Personally though I like going for Heracles first since Prometheus is less annoying in the first phase

[civic ocean]

Huh maybe ill try that

I have just kinda autopiloted prometheus first

[uneven palm]

If you’ve got time I think focusing down Heracles is the play. Prom increases his nonsense in later phases.

[tardy adder]

why is possessed array still cracked af? Just got the most brain turned off win on 32 fear with it 😭

[barren hinge]

hi,what is the flashing star next to my mana bar?

[willow phoenix]

Maybe sgg thought the only wrong thing with possessed is Righteous Pike and hex interaction since that's all they nerfed about it lol

Heartthrobs too ig

[willow phoenix]

What aspect are you using? It's usually tied to the aspect's gimmick

[tardy adder]

it also procs stuff like fine line without actually increasing the cost it's crazy

[willow phoenix]

Yeah only the "triggers effect after spending magick" stuff no longer works

All the omega related one still works like Apollo legendary too

[tardy adder]

they leave possessed array and medea basically untouched and nerf pan to the ground. Someone on the dev team really likes the skull

[barren hinge]

true 😄 so what is it ?

[willow phoenix]

Well tbf a lot of players don't like the skull from the beginning which is probably why they're not nerfing it that much lol

[willow phoenix]

Well what are you using

[barren hinge]

iam using artermis

[tardy adder]

they don't? I thought at least medea would have some crazy pick rates. it's been so good for so long

[willow phoenix]

Oh that's the recharge for your parry thing

[barren hinge]

thank you

[tardy adder]

also the persephone vroom vroom is fun af. now with gambling attached

[willow phoenix]

In higher fears yes but 'casual' players have long complained about the skulls which led to the huge changes in Warsong

Even then a lot of feedbacks still complained about the Skull so dunno maybe they're just iffy about nerfing the op skull build lol

[tardy adder]

the "meta" for casual vs hardcore players is so different it's probably impossible to balance all aspects for both

like, godsent hexes definitely feel overtuned right now, but I still see a lot of people saying that they dont like using hexes because it's too much work

[willow phoenix]

I remember them still buffing mel skull after warsong since people still complained about the skull being weak lol

Then mel skull was like the most broken aspect in the game by far for like a day until hotfix lol

[willow phoenix]

True

I do think the people that complained about skulls just don't know how to play it lol. Which is a valid opinion in itself of how it's apparently not intuitive how to play it lol

[tardy adder]

yeah, I suppose. it's also the same with morrigan and anubis. both of them can take some practice to get the hang of. Some folks say that they dont feel strong even though they're among the most powerful aspects in the game

btw, what's the setup for the pan flick knives build? is it just poseidon special and go from there?

[willow phoenix]

I think a %damage special might be better damage wise? Not sure, I haven't really checked high fear trick knives run

[desert shell]

Wait what's the busted Medea build?

[analog ether]

Zeus Special, probably Ares Attack for the extra power.

Or Aphro Attack, and then something else to proc Origination before slamming into somebody.

Cuz the damage order is Special, then Attack.

[finite sail]

Can someone recommend a build for coming back to the game after stopping for awhile. I just cannot seem to win anymore and was on quite a streak. I need an OP kick everything’s ass thing.

[cerulean panther]

Skull, Aspect of Medea, Thunder Flourish, get something for Origination on your Attack.

[glass shell]

braindead build is basically medea post pan execution like he mentions above

You can also just play charon, thats fairly easy as well if you know how to play it from before. Poseidon cast, apollo mana cast> o spec win

Pan can still work, but its weaker and more clunky. Poseidon special and win

mel torch with born gain + fine line + any additional mana on omega moves for more damage like ares/poseidon etc is good as well

[elfin forge]

I think it depends on fear level

[analog ether]

Circe + Geyser Spout + whatever else you want to set up Origination on your cast + Frinos

Double Geyser Spouts 😁

[finite sail]

Thanks everyone! I am excited to be back in it after the new update but couldn’t figure out what I was doing wrong. So just need some confidence builders to get back into the groove. Appreciate the help.

[elfin forge]

my braindead omega-carried build is just using Medea, Zeus keepsake, Strength and then I pick up Divine Dash either 2nd or 3rd zone.

Something like Ares Attack, Zeus special, Apollo Dash, Demeter Cast, Aphro gain, something like that(obviously you'll be missing some stuff but if you get good attack and special you can freestyle the rest)

[elfin forge]

1. Rivals is tough and takes a bit of studying
2. Strength got bonked with a bit of a nerf. 50% resist to 40%
3. Hestia is still really strong, but did get nerfed

[finite sail]

Oh the rivals have been fun but tough as well… hell

[glass shell]

to be fair hestia got buffed in this major patch THEN nerfed

so if he was used to pre patch.... unless he was extremely based hes used to hestia not being amazing

[analog ether]

I actually prefer Poseidon cast with Arctic Gale, to try and get Killer Current.

[elfin forge]

I barely consider Duos or legendaries with my builds lol

[analog ether]

It's one of those "nice to haves" 😊

[elfin forge]

I mostly just play to get good cores and secondaries, try to get all the curses since they're pretty nice and origination

[analog ether]

If/when you get the new Skull aspect, try it with Poseidon Attack and whatever you need to get the Ares duo.

Blood Tide is 😊

[elfin forge]

Daze + Weak + Blitz + Freeze + Wounds is just so much value

[analog ether]

Though it also just works well with Hestia in general.

[elfin forge]

what's the worst curse in the game rn, Heph glow?

[analog ether]

I'd actually kinda tie Glow with Weak.

[elfin forge]

I just enjoy weak because DR is pretty cracked

[analog ether]

Glow is dependent on how good you can get your main Heph boons.

Weak... Once you're pretty decent at the game, it's basically only good for Origination.

[elfin forge]

if you are using it for origination isn't that just a bigger bonus then glow though

[analog ether]

Glow by itself is a good curse, it's problem is just keeping it up.

[elfin forge]

I guess you can use glow to achieve origination as well, but heph cores are so bad that it's almost never worth it

[glass shell]

the funny thing about this is that its literally slip from posiedon, just on blast instead of splash

and everyone thought slip was ass

[elfin forge]

yeah they literally just took slip and grafted it onto heph

at least the numbers are better now

[analog ether]

I always felt Slip was good, because it was a straight damage increase to whatever it was on.

[elfin forge]

it was a secondary boon to get a very small damage boost

[civic ocean]

It’s a pretty good boost on the heph blasts

[glass shell]

issue with that is it was tied to splash applying it and splashes are a low damage on hit effect(doesn't benefit from % much and you wouldn't use it just to get slip)

unlike slip, heph blasts have fairly high damage and are quite literally DESIGNED to just randomly be tossed out

[civic ocean]

Once every two seconds baybee

[glass shell]

playing daggers and tossing out a special to do a 400 damage AOE blast is great even at 0 poms

[elfin forge]

I mean Slip was 5% at common
Glow is 15%

[civic ocean]

Yeah I was gonna say Glow is like discount origination on pers

[willow phoenix]

Glow doesn't give bonus damage to the blast that applies it though

It's only subsequent damage

[civic ocean]

Yeah that’s whatever

[proven edge]

I need weak for rivals 4 typhon im afraid </3

[spiral wadi]

does glow boost scorch stacking

[glass shell]

nothing except scorch specific stuff boosts the stacking

but it should boost the consumption

[spiral wadi]

rad

[empty spindle]

What’s a good Hephaestus build? I find I never take his boons and don’t know the best way to utilize him.

[willow phoenix]

Use Persephone, reroll for 2-4 sec blast cd, most likely on attack, get Apollo then Back Burner

Then get all the possible blast related duos. With Chain Reaction you get double blast, with Room Temperature you get Perma Freeze, with Rude Awakening you get more blast damage, with Love Handles you get free big damage heartthrobs that can be increased with Sunny Dispo

Personally my ideal blast build god pool is probably Heph, Apollo, Hestia, Demeter/Aphro

Blast will backstab with backburner and that's a huge damage buff and why it's a huge priority

[spiral wadi]

if ur running blast on atk/special you basically want to make sure it's as high of rarity as possible and as many poms as possible to get to 2sec blast
alternatively invest into anvil ring, i'm not sure how it is outside of circe, but circe with anvil ring slaps hard, you can just hammer hammer, even more with hermes' winner's circle

[empty spindle]

Ty all I’ll give him a shot!

[glossy rivet]

can blood triad crit?

[willow phoenix]

No it can't be affected by any damage modifier. You can only increase its damage through hammers and aspect levels

[olive tusk]

rivals chronos 32f with frenzy 2 completed yippee

never going tryhard ever again

[glossy rivet]

how does hestia legendary apply scorch? does it make the cast apply 400 scorch? or only gives 400 scorch whenever it intercepts a projectile?

[glass shell]

projectile

[glossy rivet]

is it actually even good/working, because it doesnt seem like it works on chronos' goldthrobs like the old hestia sprint used to do

[glass shell]

haven't personally used it since the rework but it was never gonna be good with how its written and a 999 scorch cap

[willow phoenix]

There's a 3second cd for it

So every 3 second, if you delete a projectile, the enemy that sends that projectile will get 400 scorch

[glossy rivet]

dang, ok so it's not the super firewall from before
btw what boons souhld i get for morrigan? or are they not as important as setting up triads

[willow phoenix]

Imo it's bad lol

Not a lot of enemies have projectiles especially in later biomes and the ones that do usually have projectiles that can't be deleted like Typhon

[glossy rivet]

hestia suffers

[willow phoenix]

You can put hestia or apollo on attack, zeus on special is good. Static shock is good too

Honestly it's pretty boon agnostic for an aspect since it's good with a lot of things

[glossy rivet]

i notice morrigan attack is 3 rapid hits, i guess they can all trigger scroch or static shock chain lightning?

[willow phoenix]

Yep

[glossy rivet]

is sinister pinion (100% faster special damage) good for morrigan? or should i take sweeping ambush instead to apply omega more easily?

[glass shell]

its trash

sweeping ambush is good though

[willow phoenix]

It's only really useful for easier triad chaining with specials hitting twice and for using O specials on Typhon

[brave dove]

it has substantially better numbers

[cerulean panther]

I'm on Frenzy 2, why is Heracles able to track me through the end of his fastest attack?

[sly plaza]

On Frenzy 2 he can Kara cancel his tracking 😤

[cerulean panther]

The Computer is a Cheating Blackguard, indeed.

[willow phoenix]

Oh so this bug is actually tied to the new Ambition upgrade probably still having some leftover code from old Zenith. If you have Ambition + Ares attack, you get free Godsent without needing the upgrade lol

If you start Moon Beam you should be able to get like Ambition + Prism/Ferocity and the bug Godsent in biome 1

[cerulean panther]

Zenith was "applies Attack to Skyfall," correct? Does that override Wounds internal cooldown the way Lance of Ares does?

[willow phoenix]

It didn't work like that no, it followed the wounds cd

I think they did some workaround for Zenith and wound and maybe that got leftover

[willow phoenix]

But the bug 'godsent' in a way override wound cd. In fact, it doesn't actually inflict wound but still gives the +50 power lol

And I think it can proc grievous too

[cerulean panther]

Oh, that's kinda nasty.

[eternal sparrow]

I hope this is the right channel for this. I tried a fresh file run but died because of boosted Damage from Eris blessing. Is a fresh run just a hitless run after erebus? +20% Damage from enemies per encounter is a lot.

[willow phoenix]

You can avoid it if you're on low health afaik. But generally eris is meant to stop you from beating UW too early

[brave dove]

you do health manipulation to stop her from appearing

[olive tusk]

yeah hestia legendary is really undertuned unfortunately

maybe a 1 second cd instead would be viable

[willow phoenix]

projectile deletion as a mechanic is just very situational that you can't really put it as legendary unless you're going to make it more general imo

[hoary quiver]

Did they remove Nasty Comeback?

[brave dove]

Yup

[sage flame]

leave the region at 30% hp or lower so you end up getting to eris after the fountain at 50% or less

[pure grove]

I would say a “fun” way to practice is vow of pain 2/3 no arcana no keepsake mel staff only, but yeah that doesn’t sound very fun to begin with

[eternal sparrow]

I didn’t know about Eris blessing yet. I didn’t trigger it in my main save. So I thought you could just beat the game on a first run like in Hades 1.

[sage flame]

yeah she stops showing up after like 10 runs or something silly?

maybe less I don't remember

[brave dove]

the last night she appears is either 8 or 9, I think

[brave dove]

You can, fresh file is still a speedrun category, it's just finickier.

[glass bone]

Well, it seems like I’m the one now seeking advice. Just tried two runs to push my Fear limit (40) with Medea. Failed twice, with the second getting to Phase 3 Chronos on Frenzy 2. Any advice on that Rival Chronos with Medea specifically / in general with any weapon?

[brave dove]

save rolls for deep dissent

unseen ire is an okay second pick

but deep dissent eliminates the miniboss phase entirely

[dapper elbow]

What are the new high fear aspects for each weapon in the unseen update

And which aspects haven’t been dethroned

[glass bone]

The one I went for was the unseen ire. Cut him down to about half health, avoided the ridiculous triple scythe attack, but died to one of the clock spinners.

[sage flame]

honestly most of the hidden aspects lol medea is still good tho

[brave dove]

anyway I guess review vods is the main thing?

there's like, specific answers to certain moves - like p3 opening run up and go clockwise around the border

but it's hard to give general advice that isn't better given just watching a vod and seeing what other people did to not get hit and gauging how finicky it is

[glass bone]

Oh shoot… well I shouldn’t have deleted that video. Oops

[brave dove]

well I mean more other people's vods

[glass bone]

I think the thing I’m noticing with my own gameplay is I have gotten reckless with Medea. “Can’t kill it if it kill’s you first”. I took a lot of unnecessary damage, and though it didn’t matter when I got to Chronos (got to Chronos with full HP), I think I only had an attitude shift during P3 with about 25% or less health left.

[brave dove]

https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ tick 'require video'

[glass bone]

The only other thing I could probably say is the data I had in both runs.
Fear: 40
Rivals 4, Frenzy 2, Timer 2 (I was able to defeat Cerberus I believe at Minute 11 in the run, but I’ve struggled to get sub 5 each region with most weapons at 32), Scars 1, Menace 2, Wards 2, Denial, Hubris 2, Debt 2, Fangs 2, and Shadow
Arcana; Top Left 2x2 (Sorceress, Wayward Son, Furies, Persistence), Bottom Left (Enchantress, Boatman, Fates, Champions), Centaur, Origination, Artificer, Strength, and iirc, this also gives Queen
Familiar and Keepsakes;
Frinos, Cloud Bangle, Gorgon Amulet, Experimental Hammer, Knuckle Bones

[lunar kiln]

is anubis o special build just better than mel staff o special build

[sage flame]

probably

the grouping is very good just by itself

[willow phoenix]

I find mel staff better for just normal special, O special without Anubis' vacuum is kinda hard to use lol

[civic ocean]

Do you have to fight UR Chronos for your 40 fear clear?

Like it would be much much easier to do time 3 rivals 3 and like 1 fear somewhere else

[glass bone]

I guess not. I just figured that my goal is to get to 50, and I may prefer Chronos over something else… what that would be I’m not sure.

Now that you mention it, Time 3 Rivals 3 Pain 1 could work as a replacement for Rivals 4

[long pollen]

I'm currently on an Aspect of Nergal run that is doing the most DPS i've ever managed on the surface

it's mainly Flutter Strike, Giga Cleaver, Psychic Whirlwind and Racing Thoughts + Night arcana

[civic ocean]

Why stop at 50?

[glass bone]

I don’t know if I’ll stop at 50. But it’s considered a milestone for most. The main goal is 32, and I’ve done it. All that’s left beyond that is 58, 62, 67, and the Chaos Trials.

All I know is I don’t want to stop playing till I can get 50 or so Fear down.

[runic crescent]

whats a good aspect of circe build? is there a familiar thats better than the rest to use with it or does it not really matter?

[tall notch]

Raki and storm ring/anvil ring

[civic ocean]

I am climbing fear with circe right now I am at 48 underworld with it

The strategy is to start Zeus and aim for Air Quality, combining it with Arctic Gale, Support Fire, Static Shock, Passion or Thunder Rush and either Arctic Ring, Storm Ring or Rapture Ring

Start any of Heaven Strike, Flourish, or Storm Ring if they are purple for early damage and then build into those things. The leash between you and your familiar also gets its damage buffed by AQ but mostly just try and keep enemies in cast and whack them alternating between 2 attacks and a special.

Frinos is good for this build.

[runic crescent]

the consensus seems to be storm ring so i'll go for it, thanks for the breakdown

[civic ocean]

Generally for Circe just think about what makes casts good and then realize that Circe makes them twice as strong

[runic crescent]

Yea when I saw they reworked the aspect i had a feeling it was gonna be pretty great

[civic ocean]

Is raki like the best one to get the cast stacked on top of one another

Frinos is fine (better odds of the air element and I like the HP and the hecate fight solve) but he is absolutely infuriating in the cerberus fight and in general for mobs

Ironically he’s kinda good against UR chronos because he randomly catches a tp

[runic crescent]

I dont use him all that much but thats good to know honestly

[willow phoenix]

Probably, since raki actively gets on top of enemies

[tall notch]

Raki-- yeah what chicken soup said, Raki is very aggro

[civic ocean]

As pets go my thoughts are

Hecuba is best for any build that spams omegas

Raki is best for damage output

Frinos is best for general bulk

Gale is very good when you are very good at avoiding damage

Toula has specific use cases involving death defiance manipulation

I am wondering about the viability of using Toula + Athena for spinless Nergal and saving 3 rerolls for Hades to give me Last Gasp

It seems inconsistent but also interesting and fun

[sage flame]

common toula W being interesting and shi 🔥

[magic moss]

eris only spawns if you're current hp when entering the next region is >50%, so if you look at fresh file runs they always try to leave the region with <=30% hp since fountain heals 20% of max hp

[civic ocean]

I think Toula can be like really good if you're goated at movement and can take adv of the DD

[severe swift]

pretty sure it's the 10th

[brave dove]

just scrolled back and my first clear on this file was night 9 with no blessing, it's possible I accidentally hp maniped but I don't... think so I've never had serious trouble with cerb

[tardy adder]

what god does pan want on the special with the trick knives build?

[elfin forge]

Hestia or Zeus prolly?

that's what chinese highfear players are using

[tardy adder]

gotcha

[brave dove]

cn high fear players have an addiction to zeus tbf, but hestia special zeus attack sounds super legit on pan tbh

[mild idol]

Hi, anyone know of a good writeup around good god synergies and what arms work best with what god combos etc?

[elfin forge]

this is a really funny sentence to read lol

[brave dove]

they use so much zeus

and like yeah zeus is good but zeus attack over hestia attack on anubis last patch?

[elfin forge]

maybe cuz static shock? idk

[brave dove]

oh I ran zeus anubis myself to test it and genuinely it was pretty good but that all the clears were using that rather than hestia when you could do the air fryer/froth/steam combos was crazy

[tardy adder]

wtf is air fryer? 😭

[elfin forge]

scorch after every blitz, I think

oh wait no that's the duo

[civic ocean]

Air fryer was the fan term I made up for Air Quality + Scorch

[sage flame]

which no longer exists lol

[civic ocean]

https://youtu.be/Dx4Hyw99q0k?si=3jfXL7JoQ1v6I9uo this was from a year ago

[sage flame]

rip air fryer

[elfin forge]

at least air quality still good on other stuff

[civic ocean]

goddamn that is a good thumbnail

[sage flame]

is that h1 zeus

[civic ocean]

Probably lol

[sage flame]

thats awesome but yes awesome thumbnail

[tardy adder]

chronos cooking in the air fryer lol

[civic ocean]

I remember just downloading them off the wiki

but the zeus one wouldn't work for some reason

[elfin forge]

it works better, since h1 zeus is looking to the right

[tardy adder]

now we need a term for air quality and support fire the goat combo

support fire is good guys I swear

[civic ocean]

The new term is Air Conditioning for Air Quality + Gales

[sage flame]

whats p.flare air quality?

[civic ocean]

bad

[tardy adder]

lol

[civic ocean]

jk its probably good I just play manaless because of denial

[sage flame]

??? p flare is still like 20 damage or something a tick or something less than 50

oh lol

you can use magick nowadays its not early patches anymore

tho speaking of not using magick related things

wtf is glorious disaster doing still unchanged

[civic ocean]

I think GD is a lot of dmg right

[sage flame]

its okay for what it is kind of

[civic ocean]

Its uhh really expensive to cast

[sage flame]

but the secondary charge is so slow for no reason

[civic ocean]

They should revert the Charon change trust

[brave dove]

gd is funny but not like, good, yes

[civic ocean]

I used to play it on Persephone

Because you could afford to have it take so long without being able to be casted again because you had to drive the care

Now that you can spam it, it is probably insane on Circe

Winner's Circle Eternity GD

with Tidal ring? wait that sounds based

[brave dove]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJRftMZK4CE I have a bossfight vod of specifically this

it's still not really worth but the instant ocast trait on dark side counts so there's that

[civic ocean]

dang I have no idea what dark side does anymore

[sage flame]

makes me think that the time slow on charging omegas is almost worth it

[civic ocean]

This is no WC right

[brave dove]

I've been using it a bunch for nergal and circe recently over lovers

[sage flame]

big

i still need to try going fast with the nerg this week

[neat halo]

Any builds for sister blades?

[tardy adder]

holy sh*t trick knives pan is so fun. Can we make that the base aspect please?

Like, its probably the worst aspect in the game without it, and one of the most fun with it

[mild idol]

What the mechanic that sometimes makes your omega skills cost much less magica? charge icon also becomes green when it activates?=

[uneven palm]

Some hammers and a chaos boon can reduce costs. The green-while charging is probably Born Gain (you’re out and about to refill/prime) or I think Flood Gain does that now too.

[modern egret]

what keepsakes should i use in an charon axe run? right now im using purse > aro phial > moon beam > luckier tooth but im thinking of using the embryo instead of the purse

[willow phoenix]

Start with Apollo then whatever you need

Both Apollo gain and Apollo special are very good with Charon

[modern egret]

True, then I'll just replace the purse for Apollo** ty

[solemn loom]

Will resume adding entries, but will only add core and hammers for now.

[tough pasture]

What do the crystals around raki indicate? How much longer the psychic leash will last?

[willow phoenix]

Yeah it's the effect for the leash

[glossy rivet]

Are triad hammers always the best for morrigan?

[glass shell]

not realy

[glossy rivet]

especially the double triad one

[glass shell]

best hammers are final slice or the one that increases omega attack damage

triads are fine options though, especially with success rate

wouldn't call them the best though even optimally with like heroic sr

[glossy rivet]

Oooh does success rate affect double triad chance what's the base chance

[glass shell]

whatever the hammer says, iirc its 33%?

[glossy rivet]

oh right i havent seen it i guess

[glass shell]

so like common would add another 9% to that, 18% for heroic so basically 50% chance to double

[glossy rivet]

gonna try sr + premium service + triad hammers

Probably overkill for anything not a boss though

Apollo atk increases application area for triad right?

[glass shell]

correct

which is also why final slice is good plus the damage bonus

[glossy rivet]

Does sweeping ambush stack with apollo too?

[solemn loom]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1272385014150991875/1395315272528695326/IMG_20250717_160419.jpg?ex=687a001c&is=6878ae9c&hm=3ea3fd0d090aff659a91f2b7f9a8e8a8e086878044338a3cd1c2de256c5a8929&

Added Arcana if available.

[tall notch]

Can't you do better than Apollo for the spec though? Like hera for hitch or zeus for blitz damage

[willow phoenix]

Well yes generally, but I think dps wise Apollo might still be better if you can consistently get the double hits and have no problem with orig

[topaz meteor]

Playing without frenzy is crazy, it's like a permanently slowed down omega arcana lol

[crystal holly]

Thankyou! thats cool!

[crystal holly]

Well i failed my run 24f top ugh. any tips? im just too focused on the hex im sure theres more to synergise with it no?

[tall notch]

Oh my Charon setup can't fit orig

[lunar kiln]

does WC work well with the apollo-zeus duo? i can't tell where the lightning bolts are coming from - is it during the time the cast is active or is it during the prom flare?

[civic ocean]

It’s after the cast expires so in theory WC does help I think

[sage flame]

it's during the prominence flare portion after the cast goes off

used to be a lot harder to see with the old p flare visuals

[tall notch]

What is WC? I am assuming you don't mean Water Closet 😭

[tall notch]

make sure you clicked the night arcana and get used to cycling between oatk and ospec on selene coat

lance of ares is at the end of the day a selene build so to do well with it you have to be comfortable with selene as an aspect

[dim kelp]

I think it must be Winner’s Circle

My first thought was World Collider, but I don’t think they were talking about coat

[dim kelp]

I would say that Glorious Disaster is nigh-unusable without Winner’s Circle or some other means of getting the Ω cast off quickly, like Charon, a big Chaos channel speed buff, or a hex upgrade (Dark Side has one… can’t remember of any others do).

I wanna say Moon Water has a sublime upgrade that detonates the Ω cast on hex use, but that one isn’t spammable usually

[willow phoenix]

I don't think Charon works with it though lol

[dim kelp]

Really? I could swear it did

[willow phoenix]

Don't remember if the Dark Side one works with it but I'm gonna guess no

[willow phoenix]

They patched that out like very early in the EA. I tried it again in Unseen but still didn't work

[dim kelp]

Oh, I see. I did take like a year away from the game, so maybe that’s just old knowledge that stuck in my memory

In that case, I amend my statement to say that you need either winner’s circle or a lot of global channel speed to get the extended cast channel off safely.

Maybe Hostile Environment could work too? Start the channel from range for safety and then move in once it’s going? That would be a lot to line up though

On a completely different topic, does anyone know how Frosty Veneer works for instances of damage in the 10-20 and 20-30 ranges?

The most literal interpretation of the text suggests that 19 damage would not be reduced but 21 damage would be reduced to 11. And, since Frosty Veneer comes last in the calculation, that would mean that adding damage resistance/reduction to Frosty Veneer could result in more damage rather than less

[willow phoenix]

Would help a little I guess, but Prominence Flare doesn't follow you like Meat Grinder though

[willow phoenix]

That's right, if you add a lot of damage resistance you can instead get more damage which happens a lot if you use strength

It's a weird infusion tbh

[dim kelp]

What was Frosty Veneer’s ceiling before the change? 10, right?

[topaz meteor]

Guys, how are you supposed to fight Eris rivals? I've tried staying near the edges, in the middle, baiting bombs on other bombs, I still take massive hits during that fight

[dim kelp]

It seems like the way that Frosty Veneer should work is that <10 damage is unchanged and damage in the 10-20 range is reduced to 10, just like when it had a strict ceiling. Damage above 20 would get the flat -10

[dim kelp]

Are there certain attacks you’re having trouble with?

[willow phoenix]

I think 20?

[dim kelp]

They changed the “tracking” laser attack to a predictable rotation while dashing, and I think she always rotates to the right? It might be that there is some other pattern to it that I don’t consciously know, but my brain has picked up on enough for it to be predictable

[willow phoenix]

I think the biggest thing in Rivals Eris is bomb management and the ability to pop the bombs safely

You can manipulate where she shoots her bombs as she tracks where you're standing. Then you can clear them safely with a ranged attack or cast. Ideally a chain explosion would clear all of the bombs

Worst case scenario if you have no ways to pop the bomb then use O cast imo

Or just wait until Eris pops them herself

[lunar kiln]

TIL u can pop the bombs

[willow phoenix]

Any damage will pop the bomb

[uneven palm]

Circe pet leash is the, uh, bomb for that

Also a niche use for O specials on like Mel or Than axe

[tall notch]

I wish Demeter got a more interesting water infusion

Like idk, let it freeze enemies when they touch Mel or something like that

[dim kelp]

Ah, you’re right, I found an old screenshot. I suppose asking for it to be floored at 20 for damage between 20-30 would make it worse, then, even if it was more consistent

[tall notch]

its requirement is harder to meet than air quality and AQ is like way better

[willow phoenix]

I feel like Frosty can just be snow queen and Snow Queen can then be a revenge boon

I've always felt like Snow Queen has weird way of scaling

[dim kelp]

Yeah, I think 4 or 5 would be more reasonable. Water is slightly harder to accumulate than air, because there are fewer water boons that are not core boons and not dependent on a specific god’s cores

Also, of the non-main Olympians, only Hermes can give you more than one boon, and he only has 1 water option

Dio gives water too, but he’s limited to the one route

[dim kelp]

Yeah, Snow Queen basically doesn’t scale. I think you’re right that the functionality would make more sense as an Infusion (or other non-scaling boon type)

I think it’s okay to have boons where scaling isn’t as important and the main benefit is the base utility, but Snow Queen is rather extreme in the negligibility of its scaling

[uneven palm]

It’s actually worse with Hubris because the reduced priming doesn’t offset the hubris penalty haha

[dim kelp]

Born Gain has a superficially similar scaling scheme, and it’s certainly not a boon to prioritize for rarifying or Pomming, but since the priming action can happen many times in a location, knocking off 1-2 primed magick per activation does make a noticeable difference, if a rather small one

[willow phoenix]

Born Gain with only priming 5 magick goes kinda insane

[dim kelp]

I hadn’t considered that! I do usually try to get poorly-scaling boons at common if I can with Hubris, but I’d never thought about the directness of the cost tradeoff with Snow Queen

[willow phoenix]

I wonder how they chose 5 as the limit and why not 1 lol

[dim kelp]

Yeah, the issue with Born Gain scaling is that it becomes much more valuable with many levels invested. So like, if you Bridal Glow it and get a few levels, it’s probably worth Pomming it, but if you pick up a common or rare, then don’t bother

[uneven palm]

I think you could get it down to 1 or 2 in earlier early access? Either way there’s a point loooong before that where you have effectively unlimited magick

[dim kelp]

You have to invest quite a lot for the prime reduction to increase your total effective magick pool more than getting another mana pot would

[dim kelp]

Yeah, that’s the other piece of it. You want to get to sufficient magick for long multi-phase boss fights, so in the vast majority of fights, you won’t feel the effect of a Pom. Pomming almost anything else will help you more

[pure grove]

It used to have a base of 10 and went down incrementally by one every rarity. It was truly busted before

[dim kelp]

I did some math on this recently, though. Even if you had a Heroic Born Gain (14 per) and 300 unprimed max magick, you would still get more total effective magick by getting another 30-mana pot than by pomming it to 12 magick primed per activation

And after the first pom, it’s only -1 magick per level

It’s a small difference. 3366 to 3900 vs 4056. And having more activations of a slightly smaller bar does give you more chances for “free” magick when you use an Ω move to actually activate Born Gain, so if you have expensive Ωs, then maybe the Pom would get the edge in practice

[willow phoenix]

Interesting, I guess the poms are really negligible

Unless you're doing like ransom

[pure grove]

I think a lot of it would be whether your magic bar is divisible by 60, which actually isn’t guaranteed with persistence. Basically, what I’m saying is that because 60 seems to be the most common LCM between the O moves, you’re more likely to hit 0 magick exactly and get the “free” move more consistently

[dim kelp]

Yeah. Since the Pom levels are subtractive, they get proportionally better the more you get (after the first, which is 2X the other levels). Max magick is additive, so the flat 30 pickup is proportionally a lot early on and then drops off the more than you get. But eventually you’ll hit functionally infinite magick anyway

[dim kelp]

You still get “free” magick even if your bar hasn’t hit 0 exactly, you just don’t maximize it in that case

[pure grove]

True. Factor of 60 though seems to be the closest you can get to maximizing the amount of magick you can get for free, although realistically the most you’d get out of it is something like 45 magick (Shiva special)?

[modern egret]

do the death defiances you get from echo count towards ur total amount of death defiances used?

[pure grove]

I know 45 isn’t a multiple of 60, but I was just going off of max magick cost at base :P

[civic ocean]

Yes

So does Stalwart Stand, Toula, and Tooth, but NOT Engraved Pin

[dim kelp]

Also, even when you get to the point where Poms and mana pots are a similar value in increasing the effective magick pool, there’s also the fact that magick can have additional utility added to it with boons. I suppose ransoms do the same for levels though, kinda

[civic ocean]

Gasp gaming on Nergal has got me to like 170% damage from last gasp

[pure grove]

You reminded me, the opportunity cost of taking a pom for born gain isn’t great because there’s very few places where you’re forced to choose between mana pot and pom, and you may as well use the pom for something else

[civic ocean]

This is a reasonably common choice isn’t it? Aren’t they different shop slots and also a common major find door choice

[pure grove]

Not really. Shopping doesn’t count since you can easily get both and the door choices in my experience usually don’t have those two together

[civic ocean]

Damn u rich

[dim kelp]

Well, given how Shiva works, you probably want to go for Apollo Leg, especially if you don’t get Counter Supreme, so that bumps it to 65. And if you’re running it as a hex/incandescent aura machine, then you’d want to add whatever other magick you can to omegas

[civic ocean]

I am playing with Debt on and often do have to choose lol

[dim kelp]

TBH, I usually go for Flood Gain over Born Gain for Shiva, just because it’s so easy for the magick spend to ramp up to ridiculous levels. Flood Gain just needs a couple levels of rarity/Pom to become functionally infinite, uncapped magick regen

[pure grove]

Ah, lol. Debt was one of the ones I told myself I’d never play with again because everything was so damn expensive

[dim kelp]

Yeah. Like, if you’re straining your magick in regular encounters and don’t have the option to get a mana pot, then sure, Pom Born Gain. But if you’re doing fine in regular encounters and are just concerned that you might not have enough magick for the next Guardian, you have the luxury to wait for a mana pot and can Pom something that will help you reach the next Guardian

You also always have the option of just trying to play magick-lean through the guardian fight and then pick up Silver Wheel, which is a massive boost to your total effective magick with Born Gain. Enough so that you probably don’t have to worry about it at all anymore

[dim kelp]

I gotta try this sometime

[civic ocean]

It’s pretty fun!

[dim kelp]

I do enjoy Nergal quite a bit. I’m not usually a heavy-weapons kinda girl, so it’s nice to have an option that works for me

Also, I have been feeling inspired by your advocacy of Excellence to try playing with that more. I’ve done so in specific circumstances where I wanted to focus on stuff with good rarity-scaling (or that only scales on rarity), but it’s just overall more fun to get the shiny pretty colors and big numbers, even if Origination is generally better damage

It’s also kinda nice to be freed from always wanting to find two easy-to-apply curses

[civic ocean]

Yeah idk I just kept playing Nergal and getting flutter strike and then having a brutal time putting together two other curses so yeah

[dim kelp]

Yeah, on other axe aspects you can put a curse on special and weave that in pretty easily, but frequently interrupting nergal’s hit sequence is more painful since you start with the big hangtime

I will say that Nergal is one of the few weapons where Passion Rush still feels good to me, after Weak was reduced to 1s

I’ve usually been taking Apollo attack for a little more safety, and then I can get Dazzling Display. Since the aspect incentivizes building up more attack speed or attack hits, you can set Daze with it fairly consistently

[civic ocean]

I dunno I enjoy aph attack because number big

[dim kelp]

Yeah, I get you. The big number is very appealing

I’ve just found the range increase to make certain enemies a lot easier to deal with

That reminds me of another thing I’m unsure on—do multi-hits with Nergal count as just a single strike for Berserk?

[topaz meteor]

The bombs on the arena, I can easily dodge the lasers

[dim kelp]

You are probably already aware that you can clear them yourself by damaging them from outside of their range, yes?

I believe they take damage from casts too, so you can try to get the bombs clustered and leave one behind to burst them, if you don’t have the range to do so with your weapon

You may also be able to manipulate Eris’s positioning and attacks to get her to destroy them, but I couldn’t explain how

[topaz meteor]

WHAT no I didn't

Okay that changes everything

[agile owl]

what's the best hidden aspect in y'alls opinion

[dim kelp]

Ah. Well, I’m glad I double-checked then!

[dim kelp]

The Morrigan

[agile owl]

I don't understand why everyone likes anubis so much I find it annoying

[topaz meteor]

I love Supay so comfy

[agile owl]

SAME it's so satisfying to use

[agile owl]

great choice

I dislike anubis and nergal, and am neutral about Hel

[dim kelp]

The Ω special is surprisingly strong on Anubis, more damage than Mel’s. It’s kinda unintuitive, but making significant use of it makes the weapon feel a lot better to me

[glass bone]

I think the reason as to why people like Anubis is because of it being multifaceted. It has AoE and single target, it has fun gimmicky builds (The one repeatable shade hammer with Success Rate), most gods can work with Anubis (Hera, Zeus, and Hestia can work on Attack, Aphrodite and Apollo can work on Special, and the remaining 3 can be supports with stuff like Sea Star, or Security System).

[agile owl]

doesn't the aspect make casts practically useless ;-;

[dim kelp]

Definitely not. Casts keep enemies in your damage field, and it’s really good with Tidal Ring, procs Froth like crazy

[agile owl]

okay fair it's just me

[glass bone]

No. In fact, I’d argue the opposite. Cast can be used to keep enemies in the attack area. And it’s an additive damage bonus with Furies

[agile owl]

sigh I'll need to try harder

needa finish all testaments first then I'll focus on anubis

[dim kelp]

I mean, you’re not required to like it just because other people do

[glass bone]

It’s okay. Strategy I’d recommend for Anubis is to drop Attack, then cast, then run and use OSpecials to deal with multiple enemy groups. Or use OSpecials to bring the enemies into the attack waves.

[agile owl]

I just have this thing where I have to "give all the weapons love equally" 😭

[agile owl]

thank you!

[glass bone]

Also, you probably will want to start with one of the God Keepsakes, possibly even have 2nd Area be a God Keepsake. Focus on Attack or OSpecial, then build to the other. Attack is better for regular encounters and Scylla 3rd phase, but OSpecial is better for the Boss and Guardian encounters.

[agile owl]

scylla 3rd phase as in when she summons the fish thingies right

[glass bone]

Yes. Especially Rivals. That stuff is a nightmare for a lot of weapons if there’s no Static Shock or Flash Fry, but not really for Anubis.

[agile owl]

I have rivals permanently on I just can't bring myself to play without it lol

but yeah I usually always start with a god keepsake, for anubis I like hera attack since it's easy to inflict hitch

[glass bone]

Rivals Scylla is actually great to fight with Anubis, because if you’re quick, you could dash forward, place down an attack, and damage multiple targets at once at the very start. Though I haven’t done the testing to see if it’s worth doing with Frenzy, or if a hit or two occurs by trying that.

[civic ocean]

The alleyway behind Roxy is so funny sometimes

[eternal sparrow]

Do you have suggestions for a moorigan build? I am trying to think of one but besides aphro attack and special I can't think of much. Also do you need the morrigan specific hammers for the aspect to be good?

[brazen ore]

none of the morrigan specific hammers are particularly amazing. final slice and wicked onslaught probably the best ones for it

apollo attack is also nice on morrigan to help clear out rooms. ares special is nice to unlock grievous blow.

[dim kelp]

You don’t need the Morrigan hammers, but the one that gives a chance for a second triad hit does get boosted by success rate, so that can be a really good pickup if you have some other probabilistic boons

I like Aphro cast for easier multi-hits with the special

Same with the Reaper Knives hammer, if I don’t get one of the good attack ones offered

Sweeping Ambush is also good I think

[eternal sparrow]

I like to use Morrigan but i have trouble applaying my special when there are too many enemies to safely charge omega attack or omega special. Do you have any tips on how to get more consisten with procking it even in non boss fights?

[dim kelp]

Are you having trouble applying the weapon’s secondary move that throws out a knife and pulls it back? Or the aspect’s Blood Triad mark that detonates when you’ve tagged an enemy with attack, special, and one of the Ωs?

[eternal sparrow]

I mean the blood triad. the normal special is fine to hit. its just the omega special and attacks take long to charge and I end up getting hit all the time when i try to use it to proc blood triad.

[dim kelp]

So, looking for Ω channel speed is always gonna be useful on The Morrigan, but you should also be making use of the movement capability of the Ω attack for safe charging when needed

I think the ideal combo for a fast Blood Triad is to dash in, special, and then press and hold attack so that you get the regular attack hit and charge the Ω. But, if you aren’t gonna be safe charging it, you can also dash away and do the dash-strike (on air if needed) into the Ω charge, which I think is a little faster than the regular standing attack

I do generally recommend the Ω attack over the Ω special, because it hits 3 times and targets each hit, whereas the triple special may not hit multiple targets. I’ve seen some say that the Ω special can be good if it’s the last proc you need on a target that won’t die to the triad, since the return flight will satisfy the Ω requirement for the next one

[dim kelp]

There’s also the fact that the Ω attack should put you behind enemies (though sometimes it doesn’t, and I’m not sure why), so if you time it properly, you can use the movement to dodge incoming damage

[barren galleon]

i got ares - is he better on atk or special with numbral flames?

[uneven palm]

Attack definitely on Moros, tossup on all the others.

Maybe better on special on Eos, actually

[tall notch]

Yeah i would never click an attack that isn't Hera on Eos

[uneven palm]

Apollo’s solid, but hard to beat Hera

[tall notch]

Ohh i guess apollo works without wards

[sage flame]

with how fast specials orbit now I can see it maybe working out even with wards maybe

except you can't get the +1 special hammer on eos

[lunar kiln]

whats busted on pan post poseidon nerf? is it just reaper knives + apollo legend as the upper limit

[cerulean panther]

Trick Knives is now unambiguously best Hammer for Pan.

[uneven palm]

Peak would be Trick Knives, Reaper Knives, Aphro special, Island Getaway

[solemn loom]

Made changes to the submission form to include an input for Arcana & Oath links.

If you do not have a gameplay video available; you can use submit with a Discord link reference to your victory screen and including your Arcana + Oath setup.

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1272385014150991875/1395534418638147604/Screenshot_2025-07-17_at_6.35.13_PM.png?ex=687acc35&is=68797ab5&hm=adb9825097f1cfe6e52b2e0513105e4eb93a0bd28e60c9f12b3fd11db5b260d7&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=2270&height=1224

[stable lichen]

https://imgur.com/a/Vl3vMx2

just booted up the game after a long break, what did they do to eos in the last patch

https://imgur.com/a/lffq8Lr

i think exceptional talent is somehow borked with eos

maybe sudden burst also has something to do with it?

seemed to be channeling like 3 daybreakers in one omega but only one seemed to be copying my specials

(f10'ed)

[sage flame]

yeah visual bug

[stable lichen]

oh ok ty

makes sense why grandpa didn't instantly evaporate

wait hold on

surely it would make sense for two daybreakers (the two from exceptional talent) to both copy your specials instead of just one being there

does the exceptional talent daybreaker deal damage by itself and not copy your specials

thats weird

[glass shell]

exception talent is bugged yes

it spawns infinite daybreakers that don't do anything

[magic axle]

how are you like supposed to play anubis

[glass shell]

get hestia attack > win

[magic axle]

ok

[glass shell]

place the attack, start omega attack channeling > dash away and put your cursor on the enemy so the omega attcck palceso n them

the dash distance puts you basically perfect distance away where the o-attack lands

[magic axle]

ook

[stable lichen]

i just like spamming the ever loving crap out of the omegaspesh

[shy quail]

getting white antler in the final chaos trials should be illegal

[tall notch]

Agreed, that much crit makes it too easy

[shy quail]

that would be true if i got it in the final zone, no, i got it in the second zone, with nearly zero boons, no protection, literally just magick 😭 i didn't die from it but still

[last cape]

What's the best rocket hammer, I got offered all 3 of ripper shimmering and furious rockets

[lunar kiln]

depends on the build

[last cape]

Poseidon special and mel coat

Probably shimmering then

[lunar kiln]

i wanna say furious and shimmering are probably neck in neck - shimmering probably /feels/ better tho

[willow phoenix]

#h2-feedback message
@gleaming ice
It already does damage to boss by default now

Twilight Curse will apply Morph debuff to bosses, some enemies can resist the transformation but they're all affected. So since Morph now deals damage upon application, all bosses receive damage from Twilight Curse by default

This also means any upgrade from Morph effect like bonus damage to morph targets also apply to bosses.

If you upgrade it, it can deal like 1k+ damage to bosses while also applying what's basically another origination debuff on the boss

[glossy rivet]

oh hell naw winners circles doesnt make the clangs go faster now

[livid surge]

Reckless Abandon and Airquality boons do not actually work together.. is this a bug or intended ?

And also Twilight Curse projectile gets destroyed by my summons and morphs them 😦 such a bad run

[glass shell]

yes, but now it lasts longer than the cast

its disconnected from the cast iself so you don't lose value like the other casts at least

[glossy rivet]

does winner circle just straight up nerfs other casts? it used to make certain other casts tick faster at least, like dem cast. does it nerf all the dot casts now?

[glass shell]

It never made anything except heph cast better

every other cast is nefed

[brave dove]

geyser spout, apollo

[civic ocean]

It has always been a pretty bug buff to one off casts - sword/tidal/solar etc

[glass shell]

ok let me rephrase -it has never made any duration based casts better

zeus demeter hestia aphro etc

(except for heph)

[civic ocean]

It used to make arctic ring faster too

[glossy rivet]

whats the best pet for circe staff? is heph still overall the best cast for cast build?

[glass shell]

did it? cause i recall it specifically nerfing them all

[brave dove]

best cast for circe really depends on like, fear

[tall notch]

raki/gale

[brave dove]

for 0 fear it's tidal ring tho

[civic ocean]

I use Frinos

Usually for 40+ I go Air Quality so the cast itself tends to bounce around between dem/aph/zeus (I really like aph) while demeter’s gales are where it’s at

Usually storm ring + raki is solid

Tidal ring + gales sounds incredible too

Is there an ICD on froth

[glossy rivet]

demeter gales actually strong? should i go for high rarity/poms on it

or is it strong bc air quality

[glass shell]

just aq

[uneven palm]

Air Quality or triggering froth or both

Also slowing down projectiles and enemies is actually busted

[civic ocean]

Its also strongish early on in runs, strips wards, applies half of origination, etc

[cursive raft]

Do you guys have any suggested arcana loadouts for the Thanatos Axe

I'm trying to use it but i still can't get the hang of it

[formal pulsar]

were heph blasts really that strong that sgg felt like they need to nerf chain reaction?

[west thunder]

What is it at high fear? Hestia/Demeter/Zeus?

[tall notch]

it's got to be heph

[brave dove]

personally I like zeus because he scales well and you have easy access to lightning lance

[west thunder]

Thought that got nerfed for some reason. Winner’s circle doesn’t work with it anymore does it? Or it got weaker?

Referring to Heph btw not Zeus

[civic ocean]

Heph just deals bonkers damage and circle doubles it

[civic ocean]

If you are not doing air quality or gales I think Storm Ring and Anvil Ring are very good

[formal pulsar]

i havent played circe too much this patch but why zeus over poseidon for cast? I feel like poseidon cast and geyser spout would both be good with circe, no?

[brave dove]

because poseidon doesn't guarantee a ranged cast option

also tidal ring is bad against wards

you should definitely try to get geyser spout, mind

but you can live without it

[glossy rivet]

how good is zeus cast considering if i read the boon correctly lightning only strikes one at a time? Does it compete with air quality dem or aphro cast of heph clang

[tall notch]

do you need a ranged cast? you still do have a staff, you can just like play in melee

ranged cast seems like a nice to have more than a must for circe

[brave dove]

you don't but being stuck with a melee cast against r4 chronos or typhon or cerb is just kinda painful

scylla and hecate too honestly?

in general the range advantage is huge against vow of rivals because you don't have to necessarily cross space that is probably full of pain

casts suck against unrivaled strife full stop but they're useful against poly too

[tall notch]

idk about r4 Chronos or Typhon but vs Cerb it does just fine I think

[brave dove]

the other thing is that zeus comes with built-in multiple axes of scaling via double strike and potentially gale + AQ

tidal ring basically just has poms

[glossy rivet]

Does zeus cast have more single target damage overall than a heph cast?

[civic ocean]

I play on controller and I think the ranged casts are so bad on that except howling

[tall notch]

Also even though Circe is a cast aspect it doesn't want to be just casting. You probably want to melee enemies anyway, you can simply plop down a cast when you're doing your attack combo

[brave dove]

I think heph cast is very viable but you really want a) winner's circle and b) geyser spout

winner's circle doesn't speed up the clangs any more but it lets you have multiple clangs going at once

[tall notch]

but circe doesn't need to omega, you can just regular cast and play a close/midrange staff

[brave dove]

and the poseidon/heph duo is Big Damage

[civic ocean]

Both of these sound like good ways to play tbh

[brave dove]

you could! fundamentally harder to execute on though

[tall notch]

yay build variety

[brave dove]

that's why I don't rec it, my build stuff for really high fear is basically about generating margins

also r4 typhon and chronos are just

really hard to melee with in general, cerb isn't friendly to it either

[civic ocean]

Is Circe generally considered to be one of the better aspects? I don’t keep up with any of that stuff but I do get my fear climb wins with it more easily than other weapons

[brave dove]

circe is really good ye

[tall notch]

For high fear I like simple build paths the most. "click Heph cast and then just build a good staff" is a fundamentally easier build path than going for a specific hermes boon + geyser spout + duos

[brave dove]

this is why zeus cast is great

it's really straightforward and scales nicely without you having to futz about with other gods

special, cast, double strike, lightning lance

[tall notch]

Zeus vs Heph is something I still haven't decided on, Zeus scales better but Heph starts much stronger and will make Erebus easier

[brave dove]

hmm

[civic ocean]

I often deny storm ring out by taking heaven strike so I don’t have as much exp with it

[tall notch]

how do you get all that with denial

[brave dove]

do you not use rerolls for gaming denial?

double strike and lightning lance can't appear first anyway

[tall notch]

I do but that's so many boons, to get all that and game denial I'd run out of rerolls before midboss

[brave dove]

and special isn't really necessary it's just nice

[tall notch]

there's also static which I would want on every Zeus build and that is really easy to get denial'd

getting all of special + double strike + ranged cast + cast + static without denial screwing you over takes good rng

[brave dove]

I don't rate static super high unless I'm running hecuba

[civic ocean]

I guess I would take zeus special too

[brave dove]

it's most useful exceptionally early but that's also when priming the mana can really screw you over

[tall notch]

Circe with Zeus/Heph cast doesn't want to omega, static is free damage and ward bypass

and no wards aren't free for this build, storm ring is single target

if you aren't taking static you need something else for wards

[brave dove]

ye I mean in an ideal world you get hera or hestia attack

though I will say for wards the leash can actually clear them

group enemies up in a cast, run in an arc back and forth once, it's a lil bit time consuming in comparison to static but it's still faster than knocking them off manually

[tall notch]

from my experience, it is some wards but not all of them. in a fish room I am not aiming that thing at every fish

[brave dove]

fish rooms are just

😩

[tall notch]

the Heph path is chilling vs fish rooms because anvil ring is aoe, which is another thing I like about it

Both Zeus and Heph are probably viable

[civic ocean]

Aph cast is where its at trust

[tall notch]

or just play boonless, boonless circe 67f when

[civic ocean]

Oh I am like not joking I do really like rap ring on circe

[tall notch]

if you try hard enough you could probably make every cast work

I mean we were clearing 50f with aspectless staff

[sage flame]

yeah it's the best single target dps cast afaik

heph cast is good too just cause it's more flexible and gives you better wards clear

[formal pulsar]

so with heph cast, since winner circle doesnt speed up the clangs anymore is there a cutoff where high rarity winner circle decrease your dps by removing a clang that would have went with a lower rarirty winner circle?

[tall notch]

I don't know the answer to this, but I'll suggest just not clicking winner circle with heph cast. you only get a limited amount of hermes per run, just get something that doesn't have anti-synergy with your build

[formal pulsar]

that's true but there is still utility in the ability to reposition your casts faster even with the current lack of synergy. Mobs/Guardians move fast and moving the cast is still good imo.

[willow phoenix]

Does it remove the clangs though? Doesn't the hammer just stay after the cast end even if you cast another one?

[brave dove]

the clangs stick around after the cast disappears yeah

[spiral wadi]

the hammers continue on so you can just put more hammers, same with gust etc.

4 gust froth (circe)

[dense marten]

What keepsakes do you all use after you've gotten all of (or most of) the boons you want and the Olympian keepsakes are mostly useless?
Whenever I'm doing a build focused on Ω moves I take blackened fleece but idk what to take when I'm not using Ω moves

(I'm kinda new to the game and I don't know what's good)

[tall notch]

it really depends on the build and how the run is going. offensively i'll take experimental hammer/droplet/lion's fang/white antler, athena if I am out of DDs, maybe something like moros' pin or lucky tooth depending on the situation

[dense marten]

In the past I've just used whatever keepsake I want to level up but all the ones I frequently use are maxed out now

[tall notch]

https://www.youtube.com/@coldshade8186 you can take a look at my channel and the high fear runs there, I usually pick non-olympian keepsakes as early as oceanus

[dense marten]

Oki I might take a look at that later

[tall notch]

it's so situational I could tell you "most of them" when asked the question

[dense marten]

Currently I'm at the fountain room right after Eris, doing a 16 fear surface run with sister blades, focusing on building scorch stacks and then getting big damage pops from freezer burn

That's what I've been playing a lot recently while just trying to get all the testaments done, I think it's a lot of fun

[glass bone]

Which aspect is it, and also what hammer(s) do you have?

[dense marten]

Aspect of mel, and the only hammer I have is the rank 2 attack speed one

[glass bone]

Third region is typically the one where you’d want to consider Experimental Hammer, because the hammer at max rank will always last through till Chronos / Typhon. And for the non-Morrigan Blades, Trick Knives is one you can never go wrong with (so getting another chance at grabbing it is nice.) Some people probably would argue it’s the strongest hammer in the whole game, since it gives extra backstabbing damage with Mel, it interacts with Pan’s cast, and it can help proc Origination if you have a curse inflicting boon on Attack and Special.

[dense marten]

I've never really seen much value in trick knives, but as I already mentioned I'm new and don't know what's good lol

[dense marten]

Oh I never thought of how it could proc origination
Thanks for enlightening me 👍

[glass bone]

The other main keepsake to look out for at this point for assists is Gorgon Amulet if you’re using Strength over Death, or are out of Death Defiances. It clears a room out (though it also technically adds more enemies to the room she appears in; just start running and dodging around if you see the “DIVINE INTERVENTION” pop up), and Athena’s boons are really nice to have. Though of course it’s less valuable on Surface because she can appear with or without it.

[stable herald]

I almost universally pick Hammer on region 3, a random hammer is good to great

Region 1 I usually pick something generically good like Chaos Egg or Gorgon Amulet, region 2 I'll pick something to direct my build like Phial, Moon Beam, or an Olympian keepsake. Always hammer on region 3. Then region 4 is any final touches to prepare for the boss

[dense marten]

Ngl I've been taking knuckle bones for surface region 3 recently, purely because I suck at VoR Prometheus

[stable herald]

That's where Knuckle Bones has the most value, for sure

[dense marten]

In the future I'm probably going to save it for summit because I've heard that VoR Typhon is difficult but I don't have VoR 4 unlocked yet

[civic ocean]

Keepsakes I have taken in underworld fear climbing:

gorgon amulet
Aromatic phial
Fig leaf
Engraved pin
Metallic droplet
Luckier tooth
Experimental hammer
Silken sash
White antler

Non god keepsakes ofc

[glass bone]

Other than those two for Region 3…. It’s like what Nyx said. Most keepsakes are situationally strong. What I would say is there are some keepsakes in 3 and 4 you don’t want to take. Fig Leaf, Discordant Bell, Ghost Onion, Crystal Figurine, and Evil Eye are… certainly choices, but I’d not recommend them.

1. Better to take Fig Leaf in Region 2 than 3 if you’re going for it. Not to say Fig Leaf is bad, but imo, it’s better to take it in Region 2 than 3, since the one room difference could matter.
2. Discordant Bell even after Patch 10 is not great on its own, but if you’re using Discordant Bell, you want to take it Region 1 than 3 or 4
3. Ghost Onion from what I have heard is just not that strong. It can work ig, but like… meh.
4. Same with Evil Eye. Though I guess you could do something good if you have a really specific setup for Rivals 4 ig?
5. Crystal Figurine would be stronger to take in Region 1, because the main nice bit is to roll Judgement.

[civic ocean]

I have definitely taken fig leaf in olympus

[stable herald]

I've been messing with Crystal Piggy and really like it for region 1. It depends on how your arcana is set up though, since you can low- or high-roll pretty hard

[glass bone]

Actually… yeah. That’s my fault. Fig Leaf can still be strong in Olympus. Though to my understanding, Fig Leaf is not as strong in Mourning Fields

Or do I just not use Fig Leaf enough? Because my understanding atm is Fig Leaf clears just 1 of the collectible reward encounters in Mourning Fields.

[stable herald]

Yeah Fig Leaf won't clear an entire location, just one encounter in Fields

I don't use Fig Leaf since I think it's boring, but three free rooms is huge. Problem is it can go an entire region without activating and you don't always get full value

[tall notch]

not getting a keepsake in Erebus to maybe get a payoff in Oceanus doesn't seem like the sort of gamble that can even help a whole lot

even if I could open the arcana book and choose the card I don't think there's a world where I'd click it

[civic ocean]

Unless I could pick judgement and have it activate immediately

[tall notch]

but even then you have to clear a region without a keepsake

[civic ocean]

Yeah I think I might like maybe do that in oceanus like 1 out of 100 runs

Where atm I don't even think my crystal figurine is maxed out at like 800 hours of gameplay

[brave dove]

Moon Beam, Chaos Egg, Hammer, Gorgon Amulet, Fig Leaf - things that give boosts for the rest of the run - in regions 2 and 3 and then something like droplet, knucklebones, antler, fang or pin for region 4 - combat keepsakes

[tall notch]

make it out of 1000, I would sooner click experimental hammer or moon beam and the latter is a niche pick as is

[civic ocean]

Shoutouts to silken sash for white antler builds

[brave dove]

moon beam is fantastic

like you can grab it even before you get your hex and it'll store the moonglow

[tall notch]

I am not even always picking up hexes, so why not instead take something that will 100% positively affect me the moment i click it

[civic ocean]

I somehow managed to go 6 no magic builds for underworld so I will experiment more with moonbeam on surface

[tall notch]

i only take moonbeam if i have a hex i badly want to upgrade

[brave dove]

counterpoint: hell splitter

also dancing knives

[tall notch]

getting hell splittered on axe is funny so i still think thats a positive

[civic ocean]

I am usually taking Athena or Pin into fields anyways

[brave dove]

pin in fields is a pick, huh

[civic ocean]

Gift gift gift baby

[brave dove]

oh are you fishing for antler + pin

[civic ocean]

Usually its droplet and pin or tooth and pin

On the flames its antler and pin

[brave dove]

ehhh idk that that's worth losing the earlier keepsake slot but I guess if r4 is really rough for you

[civic ocean]

Well I also get good use out of the pin for Cerberus

[brave dove]

ah, point

[tall notch]

I can see the rationale in setting up keepsake combos for tart, these rooms can get surprisingly nasty sometimes

[civic ocean]

I dont think pin is v good vs chronos anyways since he has so many goddamn phase transitions

But maybe as I improve at the game it will get better

[tall notch]

have they changed pin interactions vs chronos? it used to be like if you used pin at the end of p1, you would get resurrected in p2 to pin value without losing a dd

[civic ocean]

The biggest difference for me with r4 chronos is that he uses many more time bubbles. He has a combobreaker, lots of invulnerability, and is generally hard to make good use of the 10s against

[spiral wadi]

they prob fixed it then

[indigo viper]

Is there any good build which make hell split useful/good?

[civic ocean]

Intuitively, what do you think would be good things to do with Hell Splitter?

[indigo viper]

Apollo for bigger coverage?

[civic ocean]

Not a bad idea, for sure

[tall notch]

thanatos + stacking attack speed

[civic ocean]

You also want to get as much speed as you can

[obtuse cape]

Aprodite attack and Ares doubling are the best for raw dmg

[brave dove]

if you can save it to p3 that 10 secs of invuln can make it really downhill

[civic ocean]

I am aiming to do that on the antler flames build but I mostly cannot do it

[brave dove]

and some setups do have a pretty easy p2 so you just need to play a clean p1

[civic ocean]

I am pretty bad at the fight overall

[modern egret]

does engraved pin proc before death defiance??

[spiral wadi]

ye

[spiral wadi]

huh, only now just realized that cast gust is considered water and not air

[civic ocean]

Demeter can only be water or earth

Quick guide to the elements:

zeus is wind
Ares is earth
Hestia is fire
Poseidon is water
Hera is all

Apollo size increases are wind
Apollo dazed is fire

Aph conditionals are water
Aph weak applicators and unconditional passives are wind

Demeter gales and freeze are water
Everything else is earth

Heph blasts and molten are fire
Everything else is earth

[uneven palm]

Athena’s all fire
Dio’s all water
Artemis is a mix of wind and earth
Hermes has a mix

[loud moat]

Yo, random thought, what if Tranquil Gain was more interactive? I was playing Mortal Gain recently and it got me thinking.

At the moment, Tranquil Gain simply regens your magicka while you stand still. Common to Heroic I think it scales 50/75/100/150. It has decent Pom scaling as well.

What if instead of recharging your magic based on percent, it instead did it in sections of your magicka bar? Then it regens those bars individually but instantly when standing still over a certain time?

Each bar filled by Tranquil gain stacks a buff of some sort (attack speed, some sort of damage bonus, charge speed etc. . .) Similar to Mortal Gain with plasma. It would give you more interactivity between the player and what the reward for "standing still" is. Regenning magicka is kinda "ehhhh" in comparison to the other regens out there. This way it has a weird niche of Melinoe having to be still mid battle, but still getting to get a minor buff on top of regenning my magick.
I'm thinking the buff might dissapate after X number of seconds perhaps? That way its a "use it or lose it" sorta buff? And rewards spending your magicka somehow instead of just priming it all.

Not sure on the buff or how it'd scale, but I am curious of what people think about this.

[dreamy thicket]

Can somebody please hit me with an invite to the speedrun discord?

[uneven palm]

https://discord.gg/BRX93CAh

[visual verge]

Do yall like Hestia? I dont use her like ever

[stable herald]

Hestia's one of the best since the Unseen update

[visual verge]

Ah, in havent tried her in ages. Hot a weapons suggestion?

[stable herald]

anything fast; daggers, coat (especially the dash strike + Exhaust Riser), torches, hidden aspect staff

[lunar kiln]

freezer burn on morrigan is pretty fun

[stable herald]

Freezer Burn rocks

[uneven palm]

Niche use is hestia attack on Thanatos because a flaming whirlwind axe is rad as heck

[knotty summit]

Do y'all ever conceptualize weapon aspects? Was really hoping for a Finnish mythology aspect from Hades II, but with that out of possibility, I'm looking to conceptualize one

[spiral wadi]

just discovered a neat way to deal w/ rivals scylla phase 1, the bottom left tentacle always attacks first with a "ranged" shot, easy to dodge, then scylla should be relatively isolated to deal with right after

[raven ivy]

Chat rq what gives crit that isn't Artemis?

Is it just torches raki and the night card, or am i forgetting anything?

[tall notch]

Some weapon aspects

[tall notch]

Than axe

[raven ivy]

ah good point actually

-# wow that makes mel torches even lamer, somehow

[sly plaza]

I really thought we were getting Ukonvasara as the hidden axe aspect because it’s depicted as both a hammer and an axe but Nergal’s rock lion mace was cool too

Also all the hidden aspects were gods of death or adjacent in function so I see why they kept the theme going

[tall notch]

Mel torches are lame ever since regular attack doesn't pierce. 5% crit isn't going to make me play it over Moros which pierces with its reg attack... and you know, actually does some incredible damage with the explosion gimmick

[forest oxide]

Have you guys ever struggled with VoR sirens and Medea? I never used to struggle with them but Medea + VoR is dogwalking me

[knotty summit]

If we're going by that, then for Finnish mythology there could be the aspect of Tuoni. It'd be for the skull most likely

[uneven palm]

Also some path of stars upgrades, like Precision on Phase Shift

[thin cloud]

I'm struggling to get all the boons I need early in underworld runs, should I be burning fate dice to try to get boons on major room rewards?

[uneven palm]

Regular major rewards no, miniboss rooms yes

[drowsy turtle]

I have a doubt is it intented for Chronos to change attacks if hit too hard? Because i was fighting him on nightmare and hit him with a 3k attack and he stopped doing his 3 one shots to do another attack and then resumed the other 2 oneshots it happened again with the clock counting oneshot where there are 2 circles i hit him with a 4.5k attack and he stopped the oneshot attack

[glass shell]

not really

I only use rerolls to force miniboss doors, or if both doors have absolutely garbo rewards like pom / mana 2 door exit

if i get a boon out of it then yay. if not who cares its better than that trash

[uneven palm]

There’s too many major rewards possible and you’re getting random gods early on so turning regular doors you’re fighting the odds. But minibosses can only be gods so you don’t like the one you’re seeing try for another. But don’t burn like 10 rolls on it. If you must have a specific god and they don’t show up that’s what Oceanus and a keepsake are for

[uneven palm]

I’ve seen that. Rivals bosses have mechanics where they’ll cancel out of things or do specific moves if you damage them enough in a short time

[glass shell]

yes, there is a combo breaker mechanic that activates at specifically 3000 damage

actually its 2k

[drowsy turtle]

is it one instance of 3k damage or combined 3k before the attack goes off?

[glass shell]

Some Rivals bosses have a "ComboBreaker" which is a move they are cannot chose to use, but are forced to do it if they take a bunch of burst damage. Chronos' P3 ComboBreaker triggers when he takes at least 2000 damage in 1 second, and causes him to go invulnerable, teleport, summon 3 concentric rings of balls, then become vulnerable. His P3 combobreaker is limited to being triggered once in P3.1 and once in P3.2, this is what makes it look like he has phase transitions at roughly 25%/75%. The only way to avoid this is playing slow (

[civic ocean]

His p2 combo breaker is time bubble + boomerang

[stable lichen]

have i not played for too long or did they nerf pan poseidon

the wave damage seems less than i remember but i havent played in a while

[civic ocean]

it has an icd yeah

[empty harness]

(Not me cooking up hidden aspects for weapons that shall never see the light of day.)

Hidden aspects have 2 parts: moveset change and a gimmick. This can be seen in Anubis (dmg fields/drag + shades), The Morrigan (triple atk/multi hit specials + blood triad) etc etc. This is pretty fun to play around with, especially if you already have a deity/hero/figure/etc in mind (eg Joseph’s coat of arms thousand colours, istg this should have been Xinth’s hidden) because you can limit yourself via theme (this would add bonus cast damage for each element you had)

Idk why I’m yapping like I’m an expert I have no idea what I’m talking abt

[stable lichen]

damn

i assume its still the best in slot on pan though

[civic ocean]

Pan has kinda changed a lot at high fear but under like 40 poseidon works fine

(Trick Knives is about two tiers higher than any other thing you can do with blades, so it's best to play around it on pan)

[stable lichen]

wait would hel with poseidon be pretty bad due to the icd then

somehow still feels better than pan

[civic ocean]

No, because Poseidon's ICD isn't universal, and one of the things that it doesn't apply a hefty one to is Hel

[stable lichen]

wait wat

[civic ocean]

Welcome to Hades 2

[stable lichen]

blatant favourism lol

also any tips for shiva? its the only hidden aspect i basically cannot get the hang of

the omegaspecial feels extremely clunky

it feels like temu H1 eris rail since the buff lasts for one singular omega attack

[lunar kiln]

getting the hammer that gives you destruction on blocks feels pretty good

[stable lichen]

doesnt help that the block just inexplicably doesnt work at specific angles half the time

[forest sphinx]

I play it with apollo Legendary and gain. Plus Winner's Circle

bunch of investment but charging it up is less painful

[stable lichen]

ive been throwing born gain on it since thats basically infinite magic

[tall notch]

That's probably the best thing shiva can do right now, kinda sucks to be so hammer dependent but oh well

[stable lichen]

also wtf happened to the torch attacks

im very late to the party but i had to go through exam hell

[forest sphinx]

It feels better than on release in my opinion

[stable lichen]

i started olympic update

RIP fine line spam i guess?

[forest sphinx]

projectile goes out faster, feels less floaty

[sage flame]

scorch pan sweep >>>

[forest sphinx]

still works, it takes 2-3 hits before the omega appears

[tall notch]

Stack channel speed, you can still omega every other attack if you have enough

[stable lichen]

that feels like a huge nerf though since its basically 1/3 or 1/2 the fine lines of before

[tall notch]

Moros is a much better torch rn btw, mel regular attack doesn't even pierce enemies so good luck in rooms

[stable lichen]

damn

the new torches seem very funny though

[stable lichen]

werent moros always the superior torches in general

[sage flame]

yeah sorta

[tall notch]

They were stronger, but collision between attack projectiles made them awkward unless you had an ospecial up to immediately blow them up. That got fixed and Moros can actually be used as an attack oriented torch now

[forest sphinx]

I've been struggling with Artemis Knives. The 15s parry reset time feels pretty bad. Any good builds for this aspect?

[sage flame]

trick knives lol

[tall notch]

Freezer burn works on all blades, for arty because parrying gives crit on attack I like Hera

[forest sphinx]

(That uses the weapon's innate haha)

[stable lichen]

wait, moros doesnt require you to throw out omegaspeshes constantly anymore? that feels very wrong

[sage flame]

but also hoping for the omega attack hammer or final slice with scorch attack or hera attack (hera mostly if you get final)

[stable herald]

yeah each Trick Knives dash-strike only uses one of Artemis's crit charges, but gives the crit chance to all the hits

[tall notch]

It feels much smoother to play, old Moros didn't function when you couldn't ospecial

[stable lichen]

before last patch i liked slapping ares and grievous on artemis for the juicy crit stacks but grievous got nerfed so idk how good that is now

[sage flame]

blitz or ares special with knives are always good

[forest sphinx]

got it

[stable lichen]

heinous affront somehow stayed unnerfed

[sage flame]

I mostly use parry in bosses most of the time unless it's a particularly thicc chamber of enemies or I need to get a second of iframes

[stable lichen]

i like parrying even when i dont need it because monke brain see big number

[sage flame]

real tbh

[tall notch]

I liked it vs minibosses too

[stable lichen]

i do like sweeping ambush with arty blades too

[stable lichen]

parrying hecate's first circular wave and then instantly critting her for like 1.5k hits different

[sage flame]

yeah I mean bosses just with any non standard room enemy mb

[tall notch]

Ah no worries, in my head bosses = guardians only

[sage flame]

fair

[lunar kiln]

are heph blasts good on morrigan? thematically the damage bursts sound appealing

[tall notch]

My arty run was so cursed. Anyone remember old strength? Before the "no dds" thing we have now

[sage flame]

sorta, blasts are kinda mid on most builds

[stable lichen]

are blasts good on persephone

[sage flame]

yeah it was so based to run tbh

[sage flame]

if you're lucky

[tall notch]

Tell that to Foolish 😭

[sage flame]

foolish a hater

[stable lichen]

mum is helping mel develop a gambling addiction lol

[tall notch]

Persephone is the best aspect to make use of blasts but I still don't think they're particularly good. I'd rather just build scorch/poseidon atk hera special if I'm held at gunpoint and told to play Persephone

[stable lichen]

is winners circle anvil ring still good for persephone too

[sage flame]

I don't remember the ehp calculations on old old strength tho rip

[sage flame]

anvil ring doesn't speed up anymore :/

[stable lichen]

NOOOOOOOO

i thought that was intended

[tall notch]

I just remembered that low hp = good, so play like a maniac until strength is on and take a chill pill after

[sage flame]

yeah it was uhh below what 30% or something? then you get how much resist?

[stable lichen]

im honestly surprised out of all the nerfs, born gain somehow stayed intact

[sage flame]

born gain is pretty okay tbh it's not absurdly broken imo

[stable lichen]

its just so much better vs every other gain

[sage flame]

you can get away with most gains nowadays they're all pretty useful enough in their own ways

[stable lichen]

is tranquil gain actually good now

[sage flame]

it's still tranquil but it's 0.5 seconds of standing still

so it's better

but still my least favorite probably

[stable lichen]

poseidon seems weird i dont really get what it does icl

maybe im being stupid

[stable herald]

Born Gain is more magick than you can hope to spend most of the time, but it's overkill for most builds

[stable lichen]

true

i suppose old torches being gone is big for born gain

[sage flame]

flood gain is interesting and I think I misunderstood how it worked at first let me check the text

[stable herald]

Poseidon's is weird but it's basically free magick as long as you're not on cooldown. Can reach a point where you're out of magick and forced to wait for the cooldown before you can spend more

[sage flame]

you restore any magick you use during it's duration over time, it's kinda slow but good for mid magick usage builds

I thought at first when you use a magick regen you would constantly restore magick for the duration but that was incorrect lol

[stable herald]

ofc if it isn't on cooldown and you're out of magick, it'll still let you cast your omega attacks and activate off them.

it's like Born Gain where your charge meter turns green if you're out of magick but can still cast

[stable lichen]

huh

thats ok i guess

[lunar kiln]

TIL hekate's blue projectiles follow you

[sage flame]

it's neat and better than old fluid gain (which is now grisly gain on ares which sucks rip old gain)

[lunar kiln]

im over a 1000 runs into this game...

[stable lichen]

oh the small blue orbs?

[lunar kiln]

yeah

[stable herald]

Grisly Gain sucks for regenerating magick, and rocks if you're going all in on Plasma

[stable lichen]

i guess it's good if you have the legendary?

[lunar kiln]

i had frenzy on for the first time in a while and they target your ass

[stable lichen]

also why did they randomly change blood into plasma

[civic ocean]

they're okayish mostly just because you have to use attack special to get numbers

[sage flame]

yeah and need other plasma drops too

[stable herald]

visual clarity I think

[civic ocean]

yeah they made it yellowish

[sage flame]

yeah it's a lot easier to see now

[stable lichen]

oh

blood was cooler though

felt like a shark just eating up all the blood

[wild pine]

Plasma means blood, in a medical context

[civic ocean]

WHAT!?

[glass shell]

blood is made of plasma, yes.

https://www.hematology.org/-/media/hematology/images/patients/blood-composition.png?la=en&h=501&w=872&hash=04A91A7CB1617CEB0595141AA9C10955

that being said, its almost assuredly a ratings thing to just remove mentions of blood