How is Aya actually | Azur Lane Official | Page 1

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:22 AM

#

Discuss this here plz

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:22 AM

#

EN players can't understand support skills

#

thread closed

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

Shima > Naga/Marie > Aya

#

case closed

#

lets go home

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

To be fair

#

Y'all did sleep hard on naga

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

i didnt wdym

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

For quite a while

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

i dont have her so i cant say much

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

i have been shilling naga since release

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

i probably did but i don't anymore so it's irrelevant

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

i knew she was good

#

but i get outvoted every time

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:23 AM

#

i should have known that you dont have her

#

since you think she is worse than aya

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

I was also one of the few to say she was good

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

Didnt everyone start using her when she get her retrofit

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

its just the rest who didnt use naga will disagree

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

perspectives can change i don't see how it's relevant what people thought before

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

everything makes sense now

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

cuz you gotta use her

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

Till the point I left the game

#

No one actually unironically recommended naga

#

That was Richy event

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

naganami doesnt have retrofit

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:24 AM

#

oh you think it's just sunken cost fallacy torva

#

people paid out coin for ayanami so she has to be good

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

digital steppe Didnt everyone start using her when she get her retrofit

elite into elite retro

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

Why did no one recommend Naga?
Simply cos noshiro stole the spotlight

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

what

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

tfw you haven't used naga so you do the smart thing and don't say shit like "I'd take aya over naga"

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

🙂

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

i dont care about cost

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

i know you don't

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

#

im talking about this

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

silly folks shilling aya in 2021 tho

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

kek

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

PortDoll

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

aya is still a solid bosser

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:25 AM

#

Oh no retro

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

sure, jsut not as solid as these other torpers tho

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

if naga got a retro with how broken she is atm

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

To digress a little

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

Lets say

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

those other torpers fall off on bosses

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

no one would give a shit before aya

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

Anyone still use tanikaze

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

Aya T0 is definitely way too high regardless

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

Tanikaze is actual dog

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

the thing is

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

As a debuffer for torp fleet?

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

Even pre shima

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

naganami will reach the boss way faster than aya

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

I haven't use any torp nukers for a really long time

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

ehh...

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

I only used Aya to stat pad

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

she's aya inconsistency put onto a support ship you have to main tank with

#

fucking nope

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:26 AM

#

thats more dictated towards the backline

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

And tbh

#

I just mained kawakaze

#

BuckyPride

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

people jerk off hardcore to Ibuki's double preload but then shrug off Naganami having the same thing but better

#

wild

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

?

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

Wut

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

You know a lot of the time people like ibuki because of her double preload right?

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:27 AM

#

Lightning Strikes twice launches at 10s guaranteed

#

so Naganami has an offset double preload lmao

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:28 AM

#

naga can do more than double

#

and shes guaranteed double

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:28 AM

#

i leveled kiyonami purely because of lightning strikes twice YEP

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:28 AM

#

way higher stat line as well, and isnt stupid selfish

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:29 AM

#

there's just like, such blatant logical gaps when it comes to torpmeme i don't understand

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:29 AM

#

Eh

#

Not sure if you really should consider higher statline here

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:29 AM

#

people that still dont believe how bs lst amazes me MurmWat

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:30 AM

#

i mean i have a calc for Naga v Ibuki v shimakaze already lol. Naga wins

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:30 AM

#

wild ridge i leveled kiyonami purely because of lightning strikes twice <:YEP:6893152666933...

This tbh

#

I was already talking about the skill since kiyonami

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:30 AM

#

Keep in mind

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:31 AM

#

Then the skunk arrived and literally blew the kiyo away with its fragrance

#

WarZoom

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:31 AM

#

Just make sure you have an open mind if the question is "is XXX good" or "is XXX better than YYY"

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:31 AM

#

SR lst when

regal granite Sep 17, 2021, 7:31 AM

#

The fck

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:31 AM

#

and 10% crit rate, which is usually ~20% damage buff too

#

Naganami is just so much fucking better

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:31 AM

#

better skin too

regal granite Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

Aya is fine if yall want bigger dick damage at the cost of rng

#

Case closed

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

10% crit rate is 5%

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

why play with rng

regal granite Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

time to get fucking back to hug my Naga daki

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

when shima does it with none

#

and higher

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

Is it really 5%? Base crit dmg is 50% pretty sure

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:32 AM

#

latent cloak SR lst when

There's a possibility
Since there's a lot of yuugumo class DDs not in game yet

regal granite Sep 17, 2021, 7:33 AM

#

And yes Shima now just knocks Aya out of the water

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:33 AM

#

Though a lot already are

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:33 AM

#

and the torp meme class is so niche

#

why use aya

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:33 AM

#

50% * 10% = 5%

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:33 AM

#

gray gull 10% crit rate is 5%

that's not how that works lol

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:33 AM

#

Shima is the only one that directly knocks Aya out of the water on the pure nuke ability niche
Since the rest are better on account of not being niche

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:34 AM

#

23.65% gives you 17.2243
13.65% gives you 15.8313
divide the numbers.
I def. overestimated but it's a solid 9% buff.

#

only real question to me is, since Shimakaze should be tankier than Jintsuu, would she replace Jintsuu

#

'cause amping Shimakaze with Naganami and Noshiro sounds fucking funny

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:35 AM

#

eww

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:35 AM

#

Ah yeah that's a fair question

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:35 AM

#

less crit dmg 🚮
why even bother bringing crt rate

#

might as well run tani instead

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

??? Why dont you just make a spread sheet then

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

i mean you could consider dropping Noshiro instead

#

AkachanSmug

#

he doesn't know

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

id rather have jintsuu than noshiro

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

You can easily tell if crit rate or crit dmg will do better

hollow yoke Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

Jintsuu has better buffs but frailer

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

jintsuu gives rate and dmg tho

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 7:36 AM

#

jint is easily better than noshi in buff

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:37 AM

#

Noshi stability is just really attractive to me

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:37 AM

#

idk how youre calcing your crit but sure

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:37 AM

#

but it's totally fine to consider that move

#

i just explained it

#

read

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:37 AM

#

Rice, isnt he just mean %difference instead of the %boost

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:37 AM

#

you 3headed it yeah

#

you measure the difference

#

not just the change

digital steppe Sep 17, 2021, 7:38 AM

#

Like 300% is 100% higher than 200%
But 400% is also 100% higher than 200%

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:38 AM

#

compare Naganami with no crit rate buff to Naganami with

#

moreover different ships will have different crit rates because Hit and Luck can vary so drastically

#

so you can't just blanket apply the 5% figure

#

10% will mean more to less accurate ships

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:42 AM

#

yea no idea how youre getting your numbers

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:42 AM

#

idk how else to help you

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:42 AM

#

your crit mods look way off

#

like how does a 10% crit rate buff give you 9% increase when the crit dmg is 1.5x

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:47 AM

#

high coral compare Naganami with no crit rate buff to Naganami with

.

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:47 AM

#

gray gull like how does a 10% crit rate buff give you 9% increase when the crit dmg is 1.5...

.

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:48 AM

#

high coral idk how else to help you

.

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:48 AM

#

im guessing

#

0% crit rate vs base crit rate and extra 10%

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:48 AM

#

that would just be a wrong calc to begin with

high coral Sep 17, 2021, 7:49 AM

#

phrased another way, Take Shimakaze's 15% or whatever and add the 10% to it.

#

run through the calcs and then compare the two figures

#

it's gonna be more than 5%

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 7:50 AM

#

1.075 base
1.125 buffed
1.125/1.075 = 1.0465

#

it mathematically cant be more than 5% cuz the crit dmg is 50% and theres diminishing returns on crit rate

#

if going from 0% crit rate to 10% crit rate is a 5% increase how can going from 90% to 100% be more than 5%

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 7:58 AM

#

increasing critical rate should be the same no matter what the critical rate is

#

unless you hit cap

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 7:59 AM

#

that reminds me of a fun thing

#

bombber have you played warframe

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 7:59 AM

#

if the critical rate is R then then your average damage is R * (CritDamage) + (1 - R) * NoncritDamage

#

if you increase R by a certain delta, say D

#

then you have (R + D) * CritDamage + (1 - R - D) * NoncritDamage

#

which you can then distribute

#

and you get R * CritDamge + D * CritDamage + (1 - R) * NonCritDamage - D * NonCritDamage

#

and you end up with R * CritDamage + (1 - R) * NoncritDamage + D * (CritDamage - NonCritDamage)

#

whatever R happened to be in this case, adding D to the critical rate has the same effect

#

of increasing average damage by D * (CritDamage - NoncritDamage)

#

so because of that it should be fairly simple to calculate the effect of a torp critrate increase

#

since it adds the same amount of damage regardless of the original critical rate

#

also I'm not sure why this even controversial, I thought everyone was on the same page that naganami is better than ayanami when you consider the extra damage that she provides the whole team

#

but if you look only at her own damage, ayanami wins

#

I thought we all understood that?

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:04 AM

#

PagChomp my man

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:04 AM

#

like Noshiro + Naganami + Jintsuu is gonna outperform Noshiro + Aya + Jintsuu as one example

#

but if you were to run something like, idk, Phoenix, Naganami, Seattle, than ayanami would just be better

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 8:05 AM

#

bomb have you noticed they made souryuu planes tankier

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:05 AM

#

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 8:05 AM

#

after they toned the dmg down

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:05 AM

#

its because of this

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:05 AM

#

but I just find it odd that people are like "naga always better"
I mean not always, just in a team full of torpbotes
which is usually when you run her

#

but it's pretty common to run ayanami as some extra VG damage in places where naga just wouldn't work

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

idk id rather run 2x gun boat with naga than with aya

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

I mean you might "rather" do so but aya will outdamage naga in that scenario

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

yes

#

but actually no

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

?

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

she is like JB

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

wild ridge bombber have you played warframe

Red and orange crits YEEEHAW

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:06 AM

#

just going to overkill the fuck out of prod ship

#

and boom mvp

#

but not really

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:07 AM

#

in mobs, sure

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:07 AM

#

in bosses naga would reach the boss faster

#

in LTS we trust

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 8:07 AM

#

LST

#

MurmWat

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:07 AM

#

ayanami's torps hit so much harder than naga's on her own it generally won't matter

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:07 AM

#

lighting trikes swice

latent cloak Sep 17, 2021, 8:07 AM

#

pausechamp

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

it's very hard for naganami to compete with 60% TRP buff on her own

#

but naganami's buffs are teamwide

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

but its not really 60%

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

it really is 60%

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

more like 30%

#

if you think about the uptime

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

her uptime is high

#

I've explained this to you in the past

#

and explained why and you ignored me

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

it was around 50%

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:08 AM

#

so there's no tmuch else I can say about it

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:10 AM

#

More importantly

#

Are you really going to put shima on EX

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:11 AM

#

I don't make that decision

#

but if I have my vote, no

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:12 AM

#

She doesn't seem like ex

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:12 AM

#

agreed

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:12 AM

#

But you can't put her on same tier as aya

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:12 AM

#

why not? we have some variation within tiers

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:12 AM

#

Thats illegal

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:13 AM

#

I mean if you want my honest opinion, I think ayanami should be downtiered for consistency, since the kind of comp she's T0 levels of good IMO is relatively specific

#

since we have DoY and Ark at T1, I do think she should be lower

#

but it's not my decision

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:13 AM

#

based

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:13 AM

#

anyway, have you played warframe

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:14 AM

#

no

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:14 AM

#

all that crit talk reminded me of

#

this funny interaction with status chance in that game

#

its same as crit except that instead of dmg it does status effect

#

and for shotguns, the status chance is divided between all the pellets

#

so 10x pellet with 90% chance is 9% / pellet

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:14 AM

#

but if the status doesn't stack that should work just life swiftsure

#

oh you mean they actually

#

divide it

#

so 100% chance to apply a debuff on a shotgun is not actually 100%

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

but when you hit 100%, it suddenly turns into 100% / pellet

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

oh

#

haha

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

so its super fucking op

#

and 99% is useless

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

Didn't they change that?

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

lol i rmbr that stupid mech

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

they actually did? lol

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

why didn't they just pick X per pellet to make it equal the total 🧠

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:15 AM

#

i guess it makes sense but it was fun when i was playing the game years ago

#

either you go for the 100% or dont invest in it at all

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:16 AM

#

i rmbr stacking 4x hybrid mods just for the 100%

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:16 AM

#

if the total rate is r and p is the chance per pellet and n is the number of pellets then r = 1 - (1 - p)^n would work

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:16 AM

#

It used to be chance per pellet=1-(1-listed status chance)^(1/pellet count) So 100% was the only thing worth getting on shotguns

#

Cuz that just made chance per pellet=1

#

99% just meant around 37% per pellet
Which was dumb as shit

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:18 AM

#

if r is the listed pellet chance and n is the pellet count, then they could have done p = 1 - (1 - r)^(1/n)

#

which would have made the aggregate equal the target

#

and since these are weapon properties it's not like this would be computationally expensive

#

cause you wouldn't have to recalc it like every frame

#

but in this case this case, this is not how AL works

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:20 AM

#

narrow moss if `r` is the listed pellet chance and `n` is the pellet count, then they could ...

So the listed thing was just "total chance" and chance per pellet was calculated with r=total chance.
It was hilariously broken
Now they just changed it to listed chance=chance per pellet

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:20 AM

#

I mean, I'm pointing out that they could have determined the ideal chance per pellet fairly simply

#

which when aggregated would create the listed chance

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:21 AM

#

So 99% gives each pellet a 99% chance to proc an effect, which didn't fix much, but made hybrid builds much stronger

narrow moss Sep 17, 2021, 8:21 AM

#

using the same formula we use for gacha rates

#

but in reverse

#

it would have been easy to do it. although clearly they did not do it this way

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:21 AM

#

wait arent status weapons just stupid strong now?

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:23 AM

#

Yeah, haven't played much but iirc they allowed most status effects to stack on top of themselves or some shit instead of just slash

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:24 AM

#

i rmbr just going viral/slash and deleting everything in the game

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:24 AM

#

So viral can stack to debuff at a 325% bonus damage done to health

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:24 AM

#

oh they changed it

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:25 AM

#

yeah, viral used to halve HP. Now they changed it to double HP damage taken which ends up being the same.
But let it stack now

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:26 AM

#

i thought it stacked before

#

or am i thinking about corrosive

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:27 AM

#

corrosive aura stacking YEP

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:27 AM

#

i just used to run nezha and solo the game not giving a fuck about anything

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:28 AM

#

nezha didnt even have prime when i was playing

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:28 AM

#

yeah, corrosive stacked
and corrosive aura stacked
Tho you never wanted to remove all the armor since it changed enemy mods

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:28 AM

#

same

#

i rmbr running full corrosive and deleting everything with slash weapons

lean viper Sep 17, 2021, 8:29 AM

#

I was lazy, I just ran inaros with the jat kitt mod that made things explode after they died

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:29 AM

#

i was using oberon prime a lot and making everyone immortal

#

it was just stupid that i had to carry that one key everywhere

#

for the lower shield

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:31 AM

#

is saryn still a 1 button delete map

wild ridge Sep 17, 2021, 8:31 AM

#

i stopped playing when they started to nerf all aoe nukers to the ground

#

so idk

gray gull Sep 17, 2021, 8:31 AM

#

i rmbr that nerf

#

then they buffed saryn to give her map wide lingering aoe for 1 energy

#How is Aya actually