#A quick explanation Georgia guns vs triple AP
idle bloom
great, i was curious about it
pearl ferry
The first point holds in the Arbiter, but not the META fight (provided your RLD is sufficient in both cases, incidentally), and there do exist many other buff/debuff effects that tend to be more conducive to a triple gun firing cycle (for example, it is not particularly fun getting Agir's torpedoes to go on the Georgia gun cycle - granted, the problem is less these days thanks to Bismarck)
Secondly, triple AP gun setups allow you to finesse timings in a way that you can't if everyone carries the same gun (something I've found very useful lately in forcing e.g. Soyuz to load before Bismarck)
On the other hand, it IS true that, for instance, the 5-salvo Georgia gun setup has a higher ceiling than 4-salvo triple gun, see e.g. below (comparing with Champagne gun)
After taking into account 5 barrages vs 4 it is, of course, no contest
idle bloom
well most, if not all URs rely on barrages, right? except uvh i guess
pearl ferry
Not entirely
idle bloom
that's why i asked if it's better to use a better stat stick over longer reload and 3 more shells per salvo
i mean, soyuz, bisko2, musashi, bani, they all rely on the barrage as their main source of damage, not the shelling
their barrages are stronger than the shelling overall, or rather that's how i see it
pearl ferry
You see, when I was starting out, I also had that idea, that ships with barrage "rely" on their barrages for damage
Because it seemed right
And to some degree, you could argue it is not entirely false for one key reason
Namely that their barrages are (in almost all cases) aimed at the boss
Whereas their salvos 2 and 3 from each rotation are completely randomly aimed and can sometimes be wasted on random stuff like suicide boats
But when you actually calculate the true numbers, you get something like this:
Blue row is her shelling DPS
Yellow rows are her barrage DPS
idle bloom
wait blue means all 3 parts of the salvo hitting?
pearl ferry
Yep
idle bloom
but soyuz's barrage is concentric, some parts will miss, right?
it spawns like a hexagon over the enemy
will all of the parts of the iceberg deal damage?
pearl ferry
Physically miss, nearly impossible, because of how wide the AoE is
All parts of the iceberg do damage, yes
pearl ferry
No, because some parts will likely miss due to evasion
Oh actually I should
Check
Do you know what I mean by "physical/geometric accuracy"?
idle bloom
the part of the barrage that hits the actual hitbox of the enemy?
pearl ferry
Yep
Alright, that's good
So yes
In general, due to its massive AoE, all seven parts of Soyuz's barrage will physically hit the target it is aimed at
But whether it actually hits after the evasion rate roll is another story altogether
idle bloom
i know about eva, i was wondering if the actual barrage damages the enemy with all its shards per se
pearl ferry
So, in practice, it won't do 100% of the theoretical maximum damage, that is true
It does in nearly all cases
Because it is instant and massive
idle bloom
is it technically the best BB barrage we got this far?
pearl ferry
A tiny bit hesitant to unequivocally say "best", but definitely a strong competitor for the best, yes
I would say its pattern is the best we currently have, but if we take everything into account together, I would say it isn't quite so clear
idle bloom
also is it worth to +13 hsfcr in case we will sooner or later get afct?
pearl ferry
Do you have one AFCT at +13 already?
pearl ferry
Ah, OK
idle bloom
got plenty of white/black shells at +13 if anything
i used to use 20s setup with champyguns but switched to twin 457s
i still need to do my 3rd at +13, +12 atm and 2 +13s
but i seem to do better vs arbiters with it
pearl ferry
I would get two HSFCRs to +13
And wait for the AFCT (should be no later than JP anniversary)
pearl ferry
but i seem to do better vs arbiters with it
Haha... in honesty, I do too, but it's kind of a sacrilegious opinion to have in gph 👀
But that's partly because I don't like using Helena if I can avoid it
idle bloom
i use helena more with CVs tbh
pearl ferry
SG Helena + Radars BB is competitive with five rotation Georgia gun setup, and cheaper, so I suppose that is why it is the "usual" option
idle bloom
doesn't it also wiff due to BBs not being able to maintain a close to 15s load?
what reload can a BB have with hsfcr oath and max reload tech
i doubt it can reach 15-16s
pearl ferry
Definitely not exactly 15s
I once experimented with Howe to see whether her timed buff could help everyone keep the timing better but uh... no dice (that and sacrificing a UR BB slot for Howe is, well, not ideal)
idle bloom
i guess only vanguard can hit 15s consistently due to 20% rld?
pearl ferry
Essentially
Max RLD (cats and tech) oathed 200 Vanguard hits 15.46s according to Traneptora
And others fall behind 16s in practice due to jamming
idle bloom
why are cats taken in account when you can only use them in opsi and campaign
they can't be used in meta after all
pearl ferry
Five salvo Georgia gun only applies to Arbiter, so that's what I was calculating for
META is a very different field
idle bloom
well vs bosses like scharnhorst or gneisenau or stuff as such the same principle applies
pearl ferry
And there the Georgia gun is harder to justify because you usually can squeeze out four rotations with triple AP guns there, and THEN the Georgia gun loses out
Because 4 salvos triple vs 4 salvos twin is won by the triples, even if you must sacrifice your auxes a bit (e.g. Autoloaders on Musashi)
(Actually, that's a bad example bc Georgia gun Musashi is uh... well, it's not completely meritless when you do the maths, actually, but... it is a bit weird at least lol)
idle bloom
alright, thanks a lot for the explanations
also until i get musashi and vanguard
what's the best general use BB fleet i can make
i got all except these 2
i guess something like bisko2 soyuz alsace/nj/uvh?
pearl ferry
I'm not yet done testing Alsace as much as I'd like, but my feeling is that she takes that third slot without question because her debuff capabilities are at least comparable with Vanguard
I should note, by the way, that what I mentioned at the start about timing finesses apply with full force to Bismarck/Soyuz/Alsace
Because if they all carry the same gun, then they fire in exactly that order unless you put Autoloaders on
Which is a bit unfortunate, since you do want to try to make Bismarck go last if you can, so that she can benefit from both their debuff effects in totality, boosting her own damage (since she has the highest damage/rotation of the lot, and therefore should be flag with Plymouth in vanguard)
Now, maybe I am a bit too prejudiced against Autoloaders, but... it is still worth keeping in mind, imo