Rodney META Timing

[hollow raft]

Could someone help me with rodney meta timing? I tried figuring it out based on the image in the pins but it doesnt seem to be working
This is what I have + my max tech, I tried lowering the CV tech to 28 with this setup and how I calculated it it should work but I still got dimensional shift on the 2nd rotation

[glad olive]

You have maxed RLD tech and everyone at oath 200 is it?

[hollow raft]

maxed for nagato, 30 for cvs

everyone oath 200 yes

[glad olive]

Alright, give me just a sec

The JP rec I translated the graphic from already had one mistake with Nagato's RLD so it's honestly not beyond the pale for there to be an error with the CVs as well
Could you tell me who is triggering Dimensional Transcendence on 2nd rotation? Is Nagato conflicting with Haku, or is it Haku conflicting with Shina?

[hollow raft]

nagato with haku

[glad olive]

Oh, that is problematic since the gun you're using on Nagato is faster than the Mk7

Ugh, this is what we get for copying JP when JP themselves evidently didn't test these in the field lol

[hollow raft]

I also tried slowing haku down, but everything I tried so far to slow her down would end up conflicting with shina

And slowing shina down makes her miss her first due to movement (sadly my kirov isnt maxed yet)

[glad olive]

Ah, ah I see... it seems that CVLoadingDifference 10 setup actually gets Haku into a timing that is faster than 17.9s which is covered by the note to Nagato's entry

That is one possible solution, but I'm gonna take a quick look at the calculator and see if you might still be able to salvage this by shuffling Haku's planes a little bit

How is your Shinano right now? Is she managing to get her entire load off before Rodney starts moving or does Rodney start moving before all the converging torpedoes hit?

[hollow raft]

Rodney starts moving just a tad before impact, most still hit

[glad olive]

OK, then I really don't want to mess with that right now... we can revisit this again when you get KirovM up later, but for the moment I'd rather Shina be as fast as she currently is so that her torpedoes actually hit
It's better to sacrifice Nagato's gun instead...

Eh, they still don't have Mk 6 Kai on the calculator website huh...

OK, keep your CVs as they are and try this setup for Nagato:

[hollow raft]

so like this yes?

[glad olive]

It's unfortunately quite inelegant, but Nagato is going to have pretty bad damage anyway, so it's better to sacrifice her than to mess with your CVs... if you get Kirov META up later, we can revisit the setup to try and optimise, but I think this is the best solution for now
Have you got any of your own Rodney META fights left today? If you do and you're OK with using up a little oil, it would be good to test this to the end of the fight first just to make sure it 100% works - unfortunately, we learned earlier that the calculator can be wrong for reasons we still haven't quite worked out, so the only thing that can sort out all the kinks is a practical test

[hollow raft]

Yeah have 1 attempt left for today

[glad olive]

OK give it a go... if Dimensional Transcendence activates at any time, please pause and shut the game down to save that attempt and give me a chance to try and figure out a solution
Based on the calculator, there may be an issue on rotation 4 but I'm hoping against hope it won't 🤞

[hollow raft]

rotation 1, nagato and shinano

[hollow raft]

did you add 17 bb rld tech to this?

Mine shows a different number for nagato

[glad olive]

Nah, I'm using the traneptora calculator
I didn't even know Ren's fleet tool had a fleet tech function lol

[hollow raft]

Ah

[glad olive]

Gotta use the traneptora calculator bc you gotta factor in Nagato's RLD buff too

[hollow raft]

Ah right

[glad olive]

Oh I see what I did wrong, I somehow managed to read 20.96 as 19.96 in my head...
OK, pure desperation time...

Do you have a +13 Monarch gun? Or a +13 Georgia gun?

[hollow raft]

Triple 381mm and Twin 457mm? Or am I thinking of the wrong guns?

[glad olive]

Yep those are the ones

[hollow raft]

Twin 457 yup, triple 381 only at +10

Could make the other one +13

[glad olive]

Nah, it's arguably not worth it, since again Nagato is going to be doing pretty laughable damage this fight
Better to save your plates for better things
According to stig, the Twin 457 at +13 is supposed to be better than the Triple 381 at +10, so put that on Nagato and give it a go...
The calculator says that Nagato rotation 4 and Shinano rotation 3 might be a little bit closer than I like (more than 1.6 seconds, but the calculator has shown 2 seconds' difference before and still somehow triggered Dimensional Transcendence), but I'm hoping that the Twin 457 works bc otherwise we really have to choose the most desperate option

Oh wait a second

Make it Georgia gun + white shell, not Autoloader
I had Autoloader on and that made it close but without should work out
Technically you will trigger Dimensional Transcendence with Nagato's rotation 5/Shinano's rotation 4 but it doesn't matter at that point because at 79s the fight is all over

[hollow raft]

so like this?

[glad olive]

Yep

Also, I should note by the way that you're not going to be able to one shot (as far as we can tell, it's impossible on auto without Helena), but if all goes well this should be a stable two shot

[hollow raft]

Helena is in here, or do you mean Kirov?

[glad olive]

Oh my God, I'm going blind lol
Fsr my brain managed to autocorrect slot 3 Helena into Kazagumo...

Losing my marbles I am lol

Well, in either event, please let me know if this setup works because I'm really hoping not to have to do something more desperate if it is at all avoidable...

[hollow raft]

not a oneshot, but I didnt see any transcendence trigger

Might oneshot once I get my kirov up so shinano hits everything

[glad olive]

Jeez how many Big 7s did you get 👀
I've never seen any Nagato do that much before...

[glad olive]

Ye it's a really hard fight unfortunately... even the best comp we currently have (maxed everything) can only manage a 30% kill rate... it's depressing if I may be honest with you

[hollow raft]

I think I got them on every barrage

Also nagato didnt miss a single barrage it seemed like, even her follow up shots kept hitting

[hollow raft]

Thanks for helping though, really appreciate it ^^

[glad olive]

You might be able to try for a few more optimisations that might help... my thought would be Quad Mag or Mk 35s on Shima and Unzen... depending on your luck, you might be able to ditch the rudder for an oxytorp on Unzen and the fire extinguisher for a second oxytorp on Shima...

I did a bit of early testing and my vanguard with no defensive auxes but 1 beaver badge on Unzen did fine, but anecdotal evidence from others suggested their vanguards were suffering more... I'm not sure how more offensive auxes will work for you, but it is worth testing them out at least

[hollow raft]

My unzen right here had like 1hp left, though maybe beaver makes the difference

shina can probs get a 2nd oxytorp though yeah

[hollow raft]

quad mag better than quint mag?

[glad olive]

No, don't use the Beaver, I didn't remove it bc I was lazy but the faster vanguard can make hitting your torpedoes harder on auto

[glad olive]

It's a little bit RNG-dependent but the advantages are twofold: firstly, the faster timing is better for trying to aim in Helena's window, and secondly the narrower firing angle is supposed to increase the proportion of torpedoes that hit the boss in a fight like this, while also reducing the number of torpedoes going off to hit the projections (which you don't want)
The generally accepted wisdom is that, in boss fights, the quad mags are better than quints, for these reasons

[hollow raft]

Alright, good to know, so general mobbing quint mag usually better, bosses quad usually better but still RNG-dependent?

I'll try with the quads and a 2nd oxy on shima tomorrow and let you know how it goes

[glad olive]

Sure, best of luck

[gentle spindle]

Eh that unzen is weak although maybe compounded by unzen tank. American acoustic is the way to go

[glad olive]

Ye that was my thought too
The Mk35s were doing pretty well in the tests I ran, and I would recommend them as first choice if you have any +13 ones

[hollow raft]

Maybe going from quint mags to quad mags will make a decent difference, else I'll see about the mk35s

Dont have any +13 mk35s though, only +10, could make some

[glad olive]

Ye the various options are worth testing, but +13 quad mags I think will probably outdo +10 Mk 35s, and unless you have the resources to spare I don't know if bringing the Mk 35s to +13 is really worth it over just using the quad mags

[hollow raft]

Currently sitting on about ~900 torpedo plates

But was planning to use them for some +13 type 95 kai sub torps

[glad olive]

Trying out more offensive auxes on the two torp users is probably gonna make a bigger difference than any torpedo choice, incidentally, so trying out offensive auxes should be first order of business
It's fine if Unzen dies near the end, you really only need to worry if she dies before around Shinano's third airstrike imo

[hollow raft]

What're the chances that 1 or 2 more CV RLD tech would mess this all up?

[glad olive]

Assuming the calculator's numbers for the Georgia gun are trustworthy enough, 1 or 2 more CV RLD should be fine
In absolute worst-case scenario you can try to swap it for the FDG gun

[hollow raft]

First attempt with +13 quads instead of quints and a 2nd oxy on shima, no oxy on unzen

This was +13 mk35s and oxy on unzen as well, reset about 10 times and this was the best I got so far with this setup, did not manage to beat my normal quad mags

Might be able to oneshot with a couple big 7s and good torpedo luck but seems difficult for now

[gentle spindle]

sounds like pure rng

there's no way quad mag is better. you just need to watch it to know that

[hollow raft]

What should I be looking for? Amount of torp hits?

Also what is so different about mk35 that makes them better? Just the raw damage?

[gentle spindle]

shimakaze is already the proof. nothing changed on shimakaze but she did 10% more overall damage

[gentle spindle]

all the torps will hit

[hollow raft]

Yeah, and my cvs did 10% less for some reason probably helena

[gentle spindle]

it's impossible for a quad mag to hit all torps

well if you're not timing unzen right then of course mk35 is worse

unzen needs to fire into the stop timers just like the carriers do

[hollow raft]

I indeed did not touch timings whatsoever

I'll try and see if I can fiddle around with that tomorrow then

[gentle spindle]

probably at least 224. you want to 4 cycle unzen also. remember she gets rld buff from nagato

[glad olive]

Ye the Mk 35s' pattern is such that you can count on the entire load hitting, something that cannot be said for quad mags
The downside is that if fired in the wrong position the entire load can miss... but on average, from what I noticed in my own runs, this doesn't happen often enough to lose sleep over, and for that reason I do reckon the Mk 35s superior

[gentle spindle]

it's got a decent targeting arc. best of all torps actually

[glad olive]

In future, if you can get KirM up, it seems to be appreciated now that her slow effect also benefits Unzen's second rotation torpedoes, plus if she takes the tank slot, she fires her torpedoes first, allowing Unzen the chance to fire both her first rotation torpedoes only after RodM spawns, with corresponding chance for both loads to hit, rather than how I imagine it is now where one load is fired at blank water

[gentle spindle]

if mk35 isn't going to aim at something then mags definitely won't

[glad olive]

Mhm, it's a pretty amazing torp, although I typically only use it in PvP tbh

[hollow raft]

My shima inted

[glad olive]

Inevitably gonna happen eventually on auto lol

If you want Shima to really shine, you gotta manual

[hollow raft]

Okay, so far I've noticed normal quad mags are more consistent but dont have as high a damage cap as the mk35, mk35 on the other hand can go from 80k damage to 240k damage seemingly at random while on auto, quads mags have a consistent ~150k

Also I pretty much need all 4 procs from helena to be able to beat it with decent torp luck

So just a matter of getting lucky and I can probably clear it, feels like a 5%ish chance for me to oneshot it atm

[glad olive]

If/when you ever get KirovM up that is supposed to help matters, at least supposedly

[tiny raptor]

Mk35 probably doesn't average more than ib quad mag on a main tank

[glad olive]

Is that because of the lost first load or are there other reasons?

[tiny raptor]

Main tank moves more and therefore whiffs mk35 more

[glad olive]

[hollow raft]

Took long enough

[gentle spindle]

13% helena was bound to happen