cyaneko wrote the code, but got an anime protagonist-induced amnesia and now finds the way back to the lost memories
#pvp
leaden sequoia
vague token
sounds like a bad kingdom hearts game
waaaaaaait
global cooldown timer probably
xD
or w/e that thing
jk
what context is it used in
cyaneko rn
vague token
i mean that's technically worse for suicide boats i guess
since usually you want to detect them and shoot at them as they move forward
but i guess it works all right in pvp
once her barrage gets fixed
xD
clearly we need to meme with the great russia CL gun
with 90 range
watch it shoot all over and miss all the vanguard
xD
shy hazel
shy hazel
not much mod activity here anyways just put the datamined data here
be independent like huawei on data
vague token
i mean data is relevant to pvp composition
im sure it's fineeee
it's fine go sleep
we got hiryuu to scare away the foxes anyways xD
vague token
just trying to read and autopilot
rip
it's fine though
im a one time top ten on the busted patch season
shell heron
hoooo boy, I got distracted again and almost lost 3 matches 
vague token
xD
stark raft
ignorance is bliss
vague token
xD
serene knot
so... my frontline is belfap + aurora + jintsuu
i have only 2 gold triple 155mm which are on jintsuu and belfap
which leaves aurora... should i just put a tbtsk on her? or would a purple 155mm be better for pvp?
ionic magnet
tbh purple 155 should still be better but i wont recommend upgrading that one so might as well use tbtsk til you get a gold 155
serene knot
alright... that makes sense
ionic magnet
frontline main gun dmg are just a small part of your overall dmg anyways so difference is minimal
serene knot
haha yeah, true.. specially with the soon to be nagakaga
buoyant parrot
@serene knot you may also want to refer to this guide for your questions about equipments and lineup
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BglmSOaD1ec8zc6bKwiItf2OcQueoRNxF3UGzlQnHBU/edit?usp=sharing
serene knot
@buoyant parrot oh. That's new, isn't it? i really don't remember seeing that before. Thanks a lot.
buoyant parrot
its pinned post 
vague token
buoyant parrot
updated added Saint Louis and Monarch on Ship list and on Ship Analysis
vague token
well, even those i took a loss last reset
im at +5 this one so far with 3 matches
so that's nice i guess
coral wren
For some fucking reason it took 7 resets for my hms to beat sara/amagi/big e. Hood is a one random bitch i’m telling you
stark raft
What is your hms team?
coral wren
Hood/amagi/qe, jesus/bel/sheff
stark raft
Ahhh the daxam fleet
coral wren
In many instances backline somehow couldn’t reach enemy vanguard with secondaries, but the main problem was that my vang was dying too fast and hood could;t land her barrage properly to kill big e
vague token
could be beaver e
coral wren
It curb stomps foxes and has a good wr against namahiryu, but that one particularly went rough
versed atlas
modern tree
Huh?
charred sable
current "main" HMS fleet I assume would be QE/Warspite/Hood, with Monarch posed to replace one of the 3 once people start getting her more maxed out
I want to try running Warspite/KGV/Hood or Warspite/KGV/QE but I don't know if it'll work numbers-wise
raw osprey
HMS PvP 
coral wren
For me ws's barrage feels very underwhelming
ionic magnet
more like hms is very underwhelming
modern tree
There's a chance that low dev Monarch is better than pretty much any HMS boat that's not QE and Hood.
coral wren
Well, hood does tons of dmg, but in general you want a second nuker and ws doesn't contribute that much rn 😦 with all those amagis, but i wonder if kgv will contribute more than ws with her 24 sec barrage
modern tree
And Warspite is fucking great compared to doy and kgv
weary nacelle
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/516951413411020819/583108496774660110/unknown.png
highest rank i achieved this season
sooo close yet soo far
lament lichen
weary nacelle
i like how the rankings only have a 10 point diference from rank 1 to 156
hot creek
My underleveled Monarch is already making quite a splash in pvp. granted its mid season and I haven't fought any tryhard fleets but still. she can take out 110 Enterprises 
coral wren
With 24 secs timer for kgv barrage, i wonder if she can fire more than two times
hot creek
with Neptune stall goddess, anything is possible
lament lichen
Yeptune best
coral wren
Yeah, and also, with her it seems unlikely to nuke any target if there is a jesus
hot creek
you can cancel classes and they'll give you the proportional XP
modern tree
I am not trying to dash anyone's hopes regarding KGV, but she's a bad boat
Doing math was quite eye opening
ionic magnet
doesnt really matter if her competition is just as bad
hot creek
she need FS position for her barrage to be effective right
weary nacelle
well most barrage ships do tho
hot creek
not in pvp
weary nacelle
why would you even use kgv in pvp
modern tree
KGV is what you would get if you played pow with couple of uss ships more or less. Her barrage and fast shot might as well not be there
weary nacelle
nope lol i already came across like 4 110 kgvs in pvp
kgv would be better if ussed in PvE rather than pvp
imo
because she's a semi PR ship
my lil sandy looks lit
modern tree
Look, I am a person that pushes Warspite as a good ship. The math on KGV just doesn't work out. Yes shes tankier than average boat, but quads damage is so low that if you miss one mgm shot out of the one that reloads 75% faster, you are already losing so much dps that just using 406 would be better. The barrage is slow and 69% chance to trigger just kills it. She's not much better than just running a vanilla shelling boat and you already run one, it's QE
weary nacelle
and you almost allways miss one shot from the quads
maybe if she had a skill that reduces spread and enhances aim, just maybe
modern tree
I will be trying her, she's getting to 110 slowly, I am just crunching in game industry so it's slow. I will give y'all hard data later, but pure math just doesn't end up in her favour
weary nacelle
now time to see if i should raise li'l sandy 
yo
li'l sandy
her skills looks lit
and i just realize that i'm chatting on pvp instead of general
holy fuck im drunk
modern tree
I like her star barrage, but she looks about as useless as she becomes when grown up, before kai
charred sable
@modern tree but pure math just doesn't end up in her favour
That was actually the part Im most worried about :/
Still want to max her out anyway for PvE. The spread of that barrage I feel is pretty nice for mob clearing
lean phoenix
But tbh tirpitz is still better, slap a 406 on her and she can clear the screen or nuke out one target consistently
KGV is an alternative to DoY imo
For a good RN-comp BB
charred sable
Kinpatsuuuu
modern tree
KGV has nothing on doy both in pvp and pve. That's already considering that doy is pretty trash in pvp
KGV is just stats and stats alone won't carry a ship in pvp unless it's in the vanguard, maybe, not very often, basically only back in the day when lvl 100 Cleveland was considerable just cuz she was fat
finite valve
tfw 4chan is the voice of reason with a solid tier list
may be i am living in a dream
coral wren
I guess kms is actually dead
finite valve
kms was never alive in the first place
coral wren
There was a hope bis might change things for the better
ionic magnet
its not like we still dont know everything that guy posted
coral wren
Buut yeah, it's dunzo
finite valve
but as far as performance wise i say he hit quite close to home
useless barrage and crt buff is just meh at best
so does FdG barrage benefit more as flag
i am amaze they still put her at 0.5
coral wren
I guess so, would be interesting to see actual numbers
finite valve
oh pls i say just dump her to tn
ionic magnet
finite valve
mob fleet got so many competition that a pity tier is not even worth it
a meme 180% gun boat ain't going to cut it
coral wren
Ye, you can prolly use whatever you want
ionic magnet
tell that to him kek
ionic magnet
bisko still has potential atleast
if they release good carriers
and fix her barrage
finite valve
pray to god that yamato is not going to be such a failure as bisko
heck who am i kidding more JP bias
yamato going to be another power creep ship i am sure
coral wren
you can't fix what is not broken
working as intended
This. Devs prolly don't give a single fuck. Ppl still are buying skins so why would you even care if something isn't working in the way they want
coral wren
Broken? Nah baka gaijin, it is working as intended 
finite valve
coral wren
Unique feature, x shape changes into v. Only here, only today
finite valve
i am going to LMFAO if that is the same with bisko when enemies bisko barrage is more OP than allies bisko
gilded atlas
wicked rivet
"Doy is pretty trash for pvp"
Can someone tell mine that, I dont think she got the memo
^ vs namaryuu w/ jesus/yuki/I think bel
coral wren
Good rng?
wicked rivet
she sniped hiryuu
went from like 2/3 hp after amagi barrage to proccing final counter
went from like 2/3 hp after amagi barrage to proccing final counter
i didnt even see what happened I just saw hiryuu's health vanish
coral wren
all bis?
coral wren
Aah, i wanted cent to come before pr just to see how is hms with cv doing
I guess making her procs timing match that one of hood might be tricky, but it doesn't matter anymore. 2 squirters with a qe buff all the way..
wicked rivet
squirters??? 
hold up
coral wren
wicked rivet
modern tree
I beat bis namaryuu with QE Hood Amagi, just slapping a bad boat on Namagi, getting a lucky roll and trying to sell it as good is dumb
This was your public service announcement
Doy sucks no matter what the damage at the end of a winning game says because at the end of ones you lost you can't see her doing fuckall
finite valve
tl;dr fuck tier list and use whatever as long as you can win
hot creek
win rates are still a thing, you know. shit ships arent gonna have that lul
modern tree
As long as you have Amagi, you can probably force 50% win rate with any backline
It's the world we live in
hot creek
man i really wanted to do this comm again but who the fuck has a bunch of those blueprints just sitting around after you've done one before
hot creek
just use Amagi/Enty/Hood. best backline 
wicked rivet
tru
also same @ that comm message
I did it once but now I dont even have half of what I need for another
half iron
I'm having trouble reading this sandbag chart
I'm 6/10, 1019 score atm, how far into this chart am I supposed to be reading?
like when does a day begin, is it at daily reset at 9am CET?
wicked rivet
the beginning of that day is at the daily reset, midnight PST
so if you're at 6/10 your score is for 14/15 on the previous day
wicked rivet
and apparently even after missing 2 exercises im only 1 point behind the "max sandbagging" section 
elder crane
Yeah, cause it only assumes +1 per match at max sandbag
which early-season, you can get a looooot more
coral wren
Ahh, i'm starting to think it's better to reset the lobby if noone moves during 2 hours...
wicked rivet
2 hours is a long time to wait yea
someone using fully oathed namaryuu and chinagirls 
okay nvm chinagirls slow af and easy targets
and true blue thats a little weird 
"some sandbagging" has a way higher first bonus thats more like what you actually get
elder crane
+2 or more average on the first few days is pretty much expected
shell heron
We need a larger dataset to get an average if you want it to be more accurate
but 33 is most likely the lowest points you can get on your first match
if someone moved that is
wicked rivet
Yeah i usually get 30+ for at least 1 or 2 matches at the start
elder crane
Also looking through the datamine, the "speed" stat has decimal places on many ships 
Update to the wiki needed?
vague token
so close, 20/25 on washing machine
shell heron
the last few will feel like forever
elder crane
I've been 17/25 for almost a week now 
It used to be my highest bp count PR equip
now it's among the lowest
shell heron
I've been at 24/25 for the 203 MLE for the last few days. Made the proto 152 and can make a confetti cannon before I'm getting that last bp
elder crane
huh, so that's why the proto 152 is so good
aside from having +3 targeting range over the other CL guns (68 over 65)
it has 70 range on its ammo instead of the 55 of everyone else
now that I think about it, that ammo range difference is much more important 
cause all the other guns just have ammo fizzle most of the time even when they shoot
vague token
the nepgun?
elder crane
Yep
vague token
that's a big difference o.O
elder crane
time to pull up CN to see what the PR2 152 is like
shell heron
It's numbers look good, and that spread might be really tight
elder crane
I mean on the gun targeting range and ammo range
hot creek
that nepgun is my highest at 20/25. I am considering farming 10-1 to gather purple blueprints in case I come across that commision again.
elder crane
to see if there's something stupid hidden like on the nepgun
shell heron
HE gun with 68 targeting and 70 ammo. sounds fun
vague token
man all these visible values be lying to us
elder crane
"15" HE vs "22" AP
vague token
xD
elder crane
idk how those values translate into actual speed though
wicked rivet
figuring out which guns Im almost able to make would be a lot easier IF THE NAMES SCROLLED
elder crane
since iirc we know speed formulae are screwy or somrthing
modern tree
Are the ranges coded through projectile speed x projectile lifetime or just flat range?
elder crane
Yeah, there's a "display statistics" which i use to find the gun, a "gun statistics" that lists the actual gun stats, then a "ammo statistic" that list the bullet stats
wicked rivet
wait im at 24/25 on one of the guns
elder crane
the second two have names but they're in chinese
So I have to use ID codes to match stuff up
wicked rivet
no idea which one it is tho, I think its a AP CA gun
elder crane
Also the PR2 guns are in our client for the second two pages but not the first
they just c+p'd CN/JP code I suppose
then only modified the pages that displays in client
wicked rivet
that makes sense if its just code copy/pasting
the only thing missing would be the translations
elder crane
all of the backend stuff is kept around mostly
also the circular autopilot pattern has not, in fact, been removed from the client, just disabled
there seems to be multiple autopilot pattern codes though, idk what's up with that
wicked rivet
i mean there are multiple autobattle patterns
elder crane
oooooh man
there's a fair chance that autopilot behaviour is different for different ships
Each ship has a "personality" type, one of something like 10(? I forgot, I found the file for it earlier) or so, which has a "front rate" and "rear rate" among other stats
And I see those two stats being called in in some of the autopilot code
Not sure if it actually takes effect though, I suspect a lot of what I'm seeing is deprecated/testing/incomplete
also it's the "leader" ship personality that matters ofc
wicked rivet
that actually
makes a lot of sense
that the lead VG ship would determine the autopilot type and different botes have different personalities so they'd move differently 
cause yuki always has the same general pattern when she's alone
yeah fr
elder crane
there's code that takes effect when the ship is not friendly too, that inverts the two values
makes sense
elder crane
so looks like this code is used for player ships, and likely PvE elites/bosses and PvP
oh man, I just realized where the circling code comes from then
the "spin to win" bosses
steep fog
do I run nep gun as aux if I have it
elder crane
if you can spare it, yes
that explains why the circling code isn't removed
it's used for the boss pattern for some bosses
and the KizAI thingy just borrowed that code
sadly that means the different autopilot movement pattern codes are likely just different elite/boss patterns
vague token
oh lol
wicked rivet
well rip
sharp wing
And kizu gear had diamond shaped pattern, not circular, like bosses. So that makes at least 2 patterns exist and being used
vague token
xD
coral wren
Did they fix the Akagi Chan Bug?
I just faced a 110 Oathed akagi chan and my game didnt get stuck
leaden sequoia
iirc fixed for a while, then reintroduced it before UI patch
coral wren
ah thank god. ty
leaden sequoia
hmm, so they fixed it again now 
coral wren
how does it activate?
cus my amagi killed it before any other backline ship were below 20% hp
leaden sequoia
vg on the same team must be dead for the bug to trigger
leaden sequoia
I see conflicting reports about own fleet though
coral wren
his 10% hp YKK was alive xD
leaden sequoia
I see conflicting reports about own fleet though
for enemy fleet it's confirmed
and lol
coral wren
I am just using normal namaryuu
leaden sequoia
nanoda saves the day yet again
coral wren
just surprised to see someone using Nagato Amagi Akachan
leaden sequoia
no, I mean whether the bug triggers for own Akagi-chan and dead own vg
coral wren
ah ok
modern tree
I am pretty sure it was never fixed, but the condition for it is more complex than "have her airstrike with no VG" since I can only ever reproduce it when fighting the chibi that has any inventory beyond default
coral wren
maybe he is into loli or maybe he is just trying to be a disgusting bug abuser
imo maybe its a legit comp
modern tree
so it either has something to do with airstrike timing, her other skill being active, her planes doing something, or other
if he was a bug abuser then his VG would be like lvl 70ish so it doesnt get wiped by guns, but dies to torps
coral wren
oh I see I guess he is just into lolis
modern tree
IJN sor of struggles for solo CVs so eeh, I can accept some people legit considering her
elder crane
BTW the autopilot strategies I've found are called,
Brownian
Circle
Move
Moveto
Relative Brownian
Stay
the more I look, the more I think those ones are enemies-only
and the other set of autopilot code is what your fleet uses
which means the inversion-for-enemies code portion must be for PvP then
And ofc that explains why the autopilot seems to be different for your and the enemy team, maybe
take personality "冒失"
front_rate = 0.1,
rear_rate = 0.3
the code then inverts as 1-X, so, inverted rate (which is used for friendly ships) is:
front_rate = 0.9,
rear_rate = 0.7
which is diff from just swapping them
sharp wing
mail it from yr friends PC to get him IP banned
modern tree
Ip banned for a phone game, yea
modern tree
data is so cheap that I could afford not using a wired connection in my third world country
sharp wing
Doesn't remove the fact
leaden sequoia
well, tbf, that's because AL doesn't transfer a lot of data itself, so even 3G works
modern tree
and emails dont log your ip
leaden sequoia
not sure about 2G
leaden sequoia
that's good
sharp wing
work wi-fi
sharp wing
leaden sequoia
yeah
sharp wing
Are you murican?
leaden sequoia
what I'm saying is that I have much higher chances to play AL than watch youtube
or something like that
sharp wing
modern tree
maybe I should stop calling my country a third world country if you dont even have wifi on a train
sharp wing
Well, old trains dun have any wi-fi
leaden sequoia
elder crane
We only just got wifi on our subway station platforms
still no wifi on the subway cars themselves
And ofc no wifi on any of the buses
At least the commuter trains have wifi
fringe plover
Did anyone try to use kirishima? Ive just read her barrage dmg and it seems pretty op
wicked rivet
its not
fringe plover
I mean 50% burn chance and 3x burn dmg multiplier
wicked rivet
if her barrage were good the 3rd year gun would also be good
it does a little damage and burns but she's not good enough and the barrage kinda sucks anyways
do you have kiri?
I assume not
she's decent but nowhere near pvp worthy
fringe plover
😞
wicked rivet
(i mean i guess at 110 she might do fine but there are better options)
modern tree
She probably works with Namagi (but what doesnt)
wicked rivet
everything works with namagi
lament lichen
akashi
elder crane
So, BB guns have minimum range of 50
It seems also some skills have a minimum range too, but the desc is all chinese and I can't find where the weapon ID code matches to skills
Anyone know which skill uses 召唤地狱火专用武器?
elder crane
I'm just browsing weapon stats to see if I can find anything interesting
I'm in weapon_property
elder crane
that's what I tried, but the ID doesn't match anything in the skill files I found
wicked rivet
is it a bote not in EN yet?
elder crane
[61000] is the weapon ID
elder crane
oh nice, weapon properties tells us when barrages upgrade
oh nice, weapon properties tells us when barrages upgrade in shot count/pattern
Yeah, I just wish it wasn't in %@*)&% chinese
makes it hard to match up to ships
leaden sequoia
october 2018
sharp wing
I mean there Yamato, Iowa, Alaska etc. weapons leaked like back in 2018 in game files
So they won't match anything
elder crane
and there was a fuss around Yamagun iirc
leaden sequoia
elder crane
how the stats were pretty shite
sharp wing
Also yamato gun was rainbow
sharp wing
leaden sequoia
aka use only numbers
sharp wing
Universal language
elder crane
huh, Georgia small barrage in PvP aims at vanguard distances
that seems... kinda bad tbh
coral wren
bismarck's influence?
elder crane
iirc, Bisko current barrage in PvP falls short of main fleet?
coral wren
Uhh, still not sure
leaden sequoia
120 max aimed distance for Bisko's barrage
meanwhile for bullet distance there are 3 values
75, 120 and 200
coral wren
Gotta level mine first, but from what i saw it reaches enemy vang and rarely touches backline
Ah
elder crane
The range mods on her PvP-version are at normal PvP main-targeting ranges, so it's likely an issue with the barrage shape itself
it has the longest listed target range for PvP of all barrage skills, at 120 (shared with a few other ships, usual range is 115)
Her barrage base location in PvE is aimed about 5-15 units farther back than almost every other ship too, at 95 units
iirc she has issues PvE as well, so defs a barrage shape issue then
leaden sequoia
oh
so effective range becomes 105-115 because of starting a bit in the back
could be that they wanted to tweak barrage animation, but forgot to adjust related values
elder crane
huh, the barrage ID numbers are different for 2/3 components, which is interesting
so PvE and PvP bisko barrage shot shapes (probably how close/far it is) are different
leaden sequoia
wait, how do you determine what goes to PvE and PvP?
or is that an indirect conclusion based on code in other places
leaden sequoia
ohhhh
welp, never browsed weapon_property on its own and it's now biting me in the ass
so I never really look at names when looking for barrage stats
I'll need to be more careful with that
shell heron
and you will never get that last one, just like my last 203 MLE bp
elder crane
22 min range on aimed TBs it seems
lament lichen
meanwhile i already made a confetti gun
shell heron
same 26/25 confetti gun bps in fact. I'm not making that garbage
elder crane
heh, 30/25 here
lament lichen
i just scraped it for a plate
shell heron
Who's gonna use the washing machine in pvp anyways. beaver is also too good to swap out because of speed buff
elder crane
Rudder/SG is probably best on all most BB/BCs
also an option for CVs over gold cata
also what you put on CAs
coral wren
When shell comes, will it be rudder/shell?
lament lichen
yes or rudder/hfrc
lament lichen
im pretty sure ite rudder/hfrc
elder crane
or at least shells optional, placed only on the hardest hitters/where there's other skills involved
e.g. WSkai uses a shell
lament lichen
i think they have 2 hfcr
lament lichen
ws kai is shell/rudder for sure
elder crane
shell/HFCR is the rec I see right now
since WSkai is your explosive damage dealer, who's also usually in a "safe" spot (not targeted by barrages)
modern tree
warspites barrage is unaffected by shell btw
elder crane
the skill portion?
the stats should always be in effect
modern tree
Well, yeah she gets the acc and stuff, but you cant boost the auto crit barrage with crit damage
elder crane
I don't think it much changes it
I think it's cause what I said above, what sort of incoming damage you expect WSkai to take and what sort of damage you expect her to deal
I think HFCR/SG is probably not much diff overall though
well, it seems all speeds are squared when entering "velocity" from the "speed" stat, through the "Convert[Ship/Aircraft/Bullet]Speed" function
leaden sequoia
yep
elder crane
so basically small +spd changes have doubled %-effect on velocity
e.g. 55 speed ends up being about 20% faster than 50 speed
leaden sequoia
more precisely, same speed changes have little effect for slow ships/planes/shells
on the contrary, for fast ships/planes/shells it has enormous effect
not in the ratio sense, btw
as in new velocity / old velocity
that one should decrease
but new velocity - old velocity increases
elder crane
It seems like that's how it works
would you say that AP ammo is about twice as fast as HE ammo, or 1.5X?
22 speed stat on AP ammo, 15 on HE, most of the time
so, this explanation and your subjective feeling match up
Yeah, I see what people mean now, when they say many stats on the CV itself doesn't affect the planes
SetAircraftAttFromMother only takes in airpower stat
and I explicitly see a slot2.luck = 50 in SetAirFighterAttr
leaden sequoia
floating point shenanigans?
leaden sequoia
ah, I see now
vague token
o.o
tough vapor
Whats better, amagi kaga akagi, or nagato kaga akagi
leaden sequoia
@balmy torrent yeah, I found that out after I wrote about floating point issues
leaden sequoia
@tough vapor with foxes you pretty much always want fast enemy wipes, so Nagato is more useful here as a +20% flat damage buffer, while Amagi only debuffs enemy's offensive stats without helping to decrease their HP faster in any way
leaden sequoia
more PvP scoring system data points:
587pts vs 663pts, 76pts diff -> 15 base + 3 bonus
820pts vs 885pts, 65pts diff -> 15 base + 2 bonus
888pts vs 948pts, 60pts diff -> 12 base + 2 bonus
1000pts vs 1024pts, 24pts diff -> 12 base + 1 bonus
1013pts vs 1080pts, 67pts diff -> 12 base + 2 bonus
1027pts vs 1081pts, 54pts diff -> 12 base + 2 bonus
nice
leaden sequoia
assuming bonus points gain is linear from point difference and that same point difference applies for ranks with same base points gain, for +1 we need:
22-25pts diff at 15 base
23-24pts diff at 12 base
sharp wing
So you actually can get +1 with less 30 diff
leaden sequoia
which should mean either of:
22-24/15 and 24/12;
22-23/15 and 23-24/12
assuming that point difference strictly increases with rank/base points decrease
coral wren
Those 70% sometimes feels like 25%, there is something fishy about rng in this game
elder crane
Nah, just confirmation bias and the fact one always remembers surprising outcomes and not the normal ones
wicked rivet
Its called rng
Nothing fishy about it if the percentages are there
If u collected a ton of data im sure it would show the % is accurate but for small samples you could "prove" whatever bias you wanted to show
coral wren
Well, i know i've gotten the worst luck in this game, but sometimes it's not even funny
modern tree
heh
finite valve
gambling is not meant to be fun
leaden sequoia
I see people get a thrill when they gamble, so I dunno
vague token
gambling targets pleasure signals sooo
finite valve
so too does RNG making you proc 3 nagato barrages in a row while their amagi and nagato never proc once
so
leaden sequoia
I'm pretty sure if enemy nagato never procs, she should be dead by your 2nd nagato proc 
finite valve
modern tree
Nagato barrage doesnt actuallydo much of anything vs heavy armour
vague token
being +2 big seven is pretty much auto win though
xD
i dont think it's possible to lose if you're +3 big seven
unless beaver hiryuu dodged all the lasers or something
hot creek
time to use triple CA front
shell heron
oh damn my list is dead this reset. Nobody moved at all
shell heron
ah well. If I can get a +1 I'm happy
leaden sequoia
them being in one big blob could actually be beneficial to experiment with barrages
imagine Purifier's laser combined with something else 
wicked rivet
Laser tentacles?
leaden sequoia
shell heron
wicked rivet
vague token
hot creek
this is the good gun right?
shy hazel
shell heron
203 MLE yes
shy hazel
my physician said i should sleep earlier more
i guess im skipping out top 10 this season
maybe next season too
shell heron
still missing 1 bp to make it. just 1
odd schooner
@shy hazel i skipped this season and is watching godzilla every single day since release from our theater 
Also i could finally use my beaver badge
10 seasons stuck on pvp ships
shy hazel
dunno i just slept whole aft ytd
normall after work i stay like 6 hrs
i just slept this time
chronic fatigue physician said
so gotta sleep more
i just did all pvp rounds
no sandbag
vague token
na, it's cool, it'll be good to get more rest.
just sandbag later when pr is ready ;)
shy hazel
tbh i dont think its stil lworth it
assuming dev 30 monarch nep
itll be equal to current ijn
unless ws kai is released
vague token
odd schooner
vague token
lets just all take the next few seasons off until we get a new meta breaker
odd schooner
Don't forget San Decade Kai first
odd schooner
We need better rewards
vague token
bps in merit store ;)
elder crane
Add T4 boxes, and drop the T3s too
shell heron
350k merits
you got more than me now
and it's official. my first dead reset of the season
elder crane
I'm just buying all the shite, so not even 20k here
elder crane
LBing everything with the bulin/purins
sharp wing
Well, I tend to lb everything i get my hands on and i used to buy purins regularly from merit shop. But i stopped like 2 seasons now. 115k merits, though i buy cubes and t3 boxes.
25 purins at dock. Don't even want to count bulins.
The fact, that exchange also tends to have purin like once a week or 2 (and i tend to grab it as soon, as i see) doesn't help with preserving space dock space,
shy hazel
im not competing in fleet power rankings wtv anyways
sharp wing
Me neither
sharp wing
I only have 1 copy of ships
and some for LB fodder
Rs/Normals drop only
400 docks only
I'm still 233 in fleet power w/ such casual approach
Tho i also lack all x-4 and 9-3 boss only drop ships, aside foxes
trim horizon
Well, now I can join the"I lost 1 match cause I wasn't paying attention to mine and enemies Hiryuu health" club
shell heron
Hiryuu is fun to face
vague token
oof
midnight heron
tfw my first pr weapon completed (and the only one with >20 bp) is 100mm aa gun lmao
idk if its even gud
shell heron
well it's a gold AA at least
wicked rivet
its basically an upgraded skc
shell heron
could be worse. your first could have been the confetti cannon
vague token
i mean, you gotta celebrate somehow
midnight heron
well i actually got like 10+ confetti bp
vague token
as a former top 10, i believe in you
;)
owo someone on my list pushed to 55
good, i have to make up for losing
xD
shell heron
This hurts, I need at least a top 6 for +1 right now
vague token
rip
lament lichen
top 6
vague token
xD
shell heron
then again I did do 3 matches already
lament lichen
hm i need top 2 for another +1
vague token
gl with that lol
shell heron
when we sandbagged so hard, it becomes hard to get more than +2 per reset
buoyant parrot
who ever added "Hirakaga" on the EN Tierlist guide, I've fix borders etc...
hot creek
I have him added actually.
and together we spam Headnods in the chat
and preach the good word of Neptune
vague token
lament lichen
headnods for days
trim horizon
1142 10/10
hot creek
if only you didn't lose a match
oh fuck. forgot to buy rainbow dildo from the shop before reset
coral wren
3 salvos and not a single barrage proc from hood
odd schooner
Lmao
coral wren
This bong hates me
coral wren
Do you even need more than 2 type 93?
vague token
2 for each sub
coral wren
ah
odd schooner
vague token
but id rather wait for the gold ones
since they're cheaper
only got like 200 aux plates
or w/e
odd schooner
I mean we can scum since no shells
coral wren
min/max is love min/max is life
vague token
gotta believeeee we'll get them
ill use purple too though
xD
i dont want to upgrade anymore rainbow to 10 =(
cause pr gear is gonna eat aux
shy hazel
leaden sequoia
is there a CN/JP madman who got this many oxys
coral wren
I just wanted to nap a little longer, but reset says fuck you
Anyone from aurora who can post top 4 atm?
lament lichen
1225,1224,1223,1221
coral wren
Ah, ok. Seems like 2 missed attempts is a fuck up afterall even for wash
sharp wing
Come to Sandy, embrace the stagnation.
On a side note, Wishing Well makes miracles. After 800+ cubes in light and no Aurora, 2 cubes in wishing made the trick.
modest elbow
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/535525565436788747/573190490854391828/image0.png @leaden sequoia 
leaden sequoia
ok, remember how I called you a madman before
modest elbow
it's not mine lol, it's from a dildo champ i know
modest elbow
sharp wing
2 dildos per day...
modest elbow
old ss
modern tree
I cant believe nobody has went out of their way to datamine Southampton skills, I know shes prolly just another trash log-in rare, but I am curious
modest elbow
Yeah
modern tree
I have no clue why would they delay putting her in the client
sour oasis
@modest elbow Gold 🏆 of dildo...
Semi-related, any reason to not spend on torps from core shop? Inventory hasn't cycled anything new.
Is there a suggested limit on dildos?
hot creek
everyone getting PR equips, meanwhile my highest is only 20/25 
trim horizon
23/25 for STAAG
hot creek
oh well. I probably have the most ship BP.
https://puu.sh/DAcd3/0e00d85cd4.png and 45 general BP left
I actually didnt do them much before the UI update
modern tree
the power of neet
Also, Nep at dev25 should be more or less at her full capacity, since she gets her last ~600 HP from it
hot creek
before the UI update I think I luckered out on the focused nep/monarch 2.5hr/3k gold ones.
somehow I feel after the UI update the rate of focus comms appearing is less now.
but they keep giving me the 1hour/3cube comms now which have insane BP output, just unfocused.
I only do those for a quick refresh if all the other comms are trash
oh wait the 30min T3 plate ones. Yeah I rarely get those actually.
I think I did it some of those and they just gave me a ton of non exclusive weapon BP
need more data on those ones I guess
odd schooner
I kept on getting rigging analysis and basic research nowadays
modern tree
I've updated the tier list with new HMS comp, Monarch description and gear recommendations
I didnt put in the tier because it's still moderately unuseable
hot creek
trying to make HMS work in the age of yukikaze/amagi is depressing.
trying to make anything work that isn't IJN actually.
modern tree
It's okay, because I will be there for HMS, even if no one else is.
coral wren
I think it's actually breddy gud if you manage to win a 70% coin flip with hood and monarch. Was able to win some games with dev lvl 20 mon/hood/qe against namaryu
modern tree
The comp is really good and dev20 monarch already has FP almost as high as Hood, she is just missing a lot of her HP and mgm
it will definetly be an option on offense, dont know how much of a threat on defense tho
probably none because gimped damage vs amagi evasion is sad
hot creek
meh. I was testing against namagiryuus earlier and results really weren't that promising. There's just too many problems and too much bullshit you're going against when you face that comp
modern tree
I have nobody to test against, otherwise I would
but when I was playing garbage boats with Amagi, it didnt seem very problematic. You'd just dump Hoods damage on Hiryuu and be fine because she gets procc'd on like second shot and then you keep the reload
hot creek
first you have to proc all your barrages, and even if you're lucky enough to do that you have yukikaze and amagi defensive passives which massievely dampen thier effectiveness. Also yukikaze herself is dumb because she's tanky af and her speed will make all your VG targeted shelling miss. Then there's Junuea who's there just to erase all your progess your barrages did on the enemy even if you do get lucky on barrages and manage to do decent damage. meanwhile your VG is nearly dead at this point thanks to airstrikes, Amagis bullshit barrage and Nagato's 100% rate Big 7 IJN proc™. Backline has taken too much plane touchdown damage from Hiryuu and you haven't even managed to proc her bullshit skill yet.
coral wren
Yeah, getting those 70% to proc and your vang to survive are 2 key win conditions
ionic magnet
also kgv is nowhere near being a trash
anyone who says otherwise either havent tried her yet or just straight up lying
its very good for hitting vg
for backline not so much
coral wren
Eeh, i tried her a few times, and 1 of 4 sheels is actually landing between backline and vang
ionic magnet
but other guns has exactly the same problem
coral wren
Which is fucking retarded
modern tree
I never said KGV is trash, shes just not better than Warspite and whatever conclusion you draw after that is up to you
coral wren
what are min/max numbers for namaryu rn?
ionic magnet
ws is not better by any means
coral wren
Met another one, but 13k+14k doesn't seem right
ionic magnet
modern tree
Are you telling me that a boat that has a bit lower stats but a 100% reliable, targetable, barrage every 15 seconds without being gimped by a meme gun is worse than a boat forced into a meme gun, with a 70% chance barrage every 24 seconds?
because I do not see it
modern tree
I mean, sure she can deal damage with the barrage, but by the time she fires it, Warspite is already loading another one, and you can always just miss the 70% chance while Warspite will just shoot
ionic magnet
that same meme gun has better chance to burn VGs
also ws barrage is notorious for missing anyway
fringe plover
70% of the time it works every time 🤔
modern tree
burn damage is based on base damage of the gun so the fire is very weak compared to 410 or 406
ionic magnet
very weak is a lie
modern tree
and if Warspite will be dodged then KGV will be dodged
hot creek
WS is dope, yo. I was using her in FS position with Monarch/Hood flank and they were sniping backlines like it was 2018, granted enemy Juneau doesn't pop.
sharp wing
If u dun sue QE, might as well go for Amagi instead one of those tbh
hot creek
Amagi FS position will get fuckin rekt by Nagato barrage
also she's not that great without IJN cooldown bonus imo
modern tree
Fire damage per tick with identical stats is 442.4 on quad and 668.4 on 410/406
fire ticks 5 times
tell me again its not that big of a difference
modern tree
I did generic 400FP
ionic magnet
doy with 406 ticks for 700 for reference
sharp wing
356 fire damage would be much lower, than 406/410 in any case
ionic magnet
i dont think thats what you call very weak either way
sharp wing
Again, fire damage depends on initial shell damage, so gotta take all damage calculation for initial shot in account
modern tree
quad has to hit most of its shells on the 75% faster shot to even begin catching up to the damage 406 deals
elder crane
Is fleet tech is still affecting fleet power in PvP? (no combat effect ofc)
hot creek
why even worry about fire damage, none of your shelling is going to hit the VG anyways
elder crane
Except 406/356 actually has a decent chance to hit?
modern tree
I am just saying that "not that big of a difference" if fire damage from 410/406 is aqctually 50% bigger is just a dumb statement
elder crane
I mean, why do we run FE on ykkz then
381 has a decent chance to do so too
it's just 410s that have lots of trouble hitting speed vanguards
hot creek
tell that to my QE and her 406
sharp wing
410 kinda have more coverage so better chance to hit
elder crane
356 super wide dispersion on the other hand is actually good-ish for hitting speed VG
sharp wing
I feel like 356 shells have less aoe tho
elder crane
kinda like why super tight dispersion CL guns are worse vs suicide ships
plus, with high VG evasion, the number of shells actually matters for fires and such
on main, they're getting hit anyways, and with high fire chance, more lower-damage shells is worse than fewer higher damage ones for fires
sharp wing
Well accounting for coverage and hit/miss mechanics, 356 actually should be good vs vg
elder crane
on VG, that's less of an issue since you really don't land more than 1 shell at once usually, especially once you account for evasion chance
sharp wing
Well, as for PVE tho, KGV is super consistent tho
I like her timings
elder crane
yeah, damage timing is better than wash or boosted amagi, for the best in-game I'd say
Amagi's other skills though probably still tips the scales in her favour most of the time, even without her accel
and ofc Wash still has her super high AA
sharp wing
Amagi has her evasion and def skill vs med armor in pve, so that's also a gamble
Tho most stuff, aside ch10 3* bbs wouldn't matter much
modern tree
The problem is that vs hard pve content, a lot of the things that you REALLY want to die does not spawn until much later, and by this time you are either waiting for your quad to recharge or hitting it with quad. She's not bad by any means, but HMS is not struggling to find good flagships to run
elder crane
her Fire reduction means even with med she's still probably better vs BBHE
sharp wing
maybe
modern tree
and in pvp she is likewise probably not bad, but also not super remarkable
and if you are doing well with her, you are probably going to do the same with Warspite or DoY
sharp wing
I mean, med armor just takes bigger initial hits, so even reduced ticks, might result in more damage, compared to full tick heavy armor
But most likely they are even
elder crane
with FE, it's 2 ticks for something like 1.5X base shell damage total? (pre-FE reduction, since amagi skill stacks additively)
Heavy vs med, takes, what, 20% less damage?
Amagi gives 15% fire dred
but fires aren't 100%
sharp wing
Wasn't armor damage reduction like 50% from previous tigher
elder crane
so overall it seems Heavy is a teeny bit better
110% vs 90% for BBHE on Med/Heavy, a bit less than 20% relative reduction
ionic magnet
exactly
warspite doy kgv qe are p much all on the same tier
so i hate it when someone trashes one while praise the other
sharp wing
PVE enmies use exactly same calculations tho?
elder crane
but then amagi also has 9% stat reduction and 10% evasion, the latter mattering a lot in PvE since your evasion rates are super high there
yes, afaik they use the same formulae and have their own stats
sharp wing
Well, then
modern tree
Still, out of the 3 Warspite will always be the most consistent one because her barrage is always there, always shooting what you want it to, and always hitting targets that are taking the most damage from AP
ionic magnet
maybe, maybe not
sharp wing
BTW, WS skill barrage has multipliers of regular AP BB shell?
ionic magnet
theres really no significant difference in winrates whether its ws/kgv/doy
elder crane
Dork is the most RNG of the three by far, what with no useful barrage and her boosted first main gun round being when VG is still around
also anyone want to bother confirming fires still work differently from before?
(4 base, 2 with FE, vs 5 base, 3 with FE)
ionic magnet
also ws barrage is most prone to hitting a procced hiryuu
while kgv hits all 3 backliners so you get full value everytime
elder crane
you get partial value still when one is dead/immune, you mean
and less focused damage is worse when all are damagable
ionic magnet
debateable but you get my point
sharp wing
I think, in the end everyone will stick to whatever they like (or waifu). So debating is pretty pointless
elder crane
focusing damage is always better than having it evenly distributed if the total damage output is comparable, that isn't debatable at all...
assuming you're not not targeting someone super squishy ofc as well
but no main fleet in PvP matches that last criteria
ionic magnet
you know how random BB shots are right?
sharp wing
My pvp fleet got too prone to waifu factor
ionic magnet
focusing on 1 target can backfire hard especially if your chosen target is hiryuu
elder crane
why would you target Hiryuu with a super heavy focus team
And that falls under, "not comparable damage output" since immunity = 0 damage
ionic magnet
idek what your point is anymore
elder crane
"focusing damage is always better than having it evenly distributed if the total damage output is comparable"
From literally a few comments up
ionic magnet
and why would you not want to proc hiryuu early
elder crane
with light focus, sure, that's the strat
but with super-heavy focus, that's not the strat anymore
WSkai teams kill Amagi->Nagato->Hiryuu as by far the best option
ionic magnet
theres no super heavy focus strat cos of all rng components
nothing is guaranteed
until ws kai atleast
elder crane
and how much focusing is possible right now still has nothing to do with my first point on focusing being undebatable a good thing
sharp wing
Just run Namakaga, focus EVERYTHING
elder crane
"focusing damage is always better than having it evenly distributed if the total damage output is comparable"
are you trolling me?
ionic magnet
well we have a different approach i guess
i want to spread a part of my barrage dmg cos BB shots are so random that they can end up overkilling or not hitting any targets at all
if i focus all my barrage on someone but that target didnt die (cos no other BB shots hit) then thats a loss imo
elder crane
and how is that helped by spreading out damage and not killing anyone
You have the highest chance to kill something when barrage is focused and not spread, when the total amount of damage focusing possible is not high
main gun damage dist is roughly gaussian-random on each main fleet target, so a more-focused damage barrage dist gives higher chance of killing one than a more spread-out dist of comparable total damage when your total damage output is not super high.
Therefore, in this scenario, 1:0:0 is the best dist you can have on barrage damage
coral wren
Alright I need help making an IJN PvP fleet so I can kick my boyfriend's butt so what should I do? I thought it was better to come in here than to ask help.
elder crane
killing one fast is always better than spreading out unless you super-gimp your damage doing so
ionic magnet
lets just leave it at that kek
elder crane
that's basic team-fight math
trim horizon
@coral wren https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BglmSOaD1ec8zc6bKwiItf2OcQueoRNxF3UGzlQnHBU/edit?usp=sharing pinned msg
elder crane
Too much details on comp to give a good tl:dr
that doc, reading only the parts relevant to a specific team composition, is as short as it gets really, for the info you need to make the team effectively
@ionic magnet
google "importance of focus fire"
there's tons of vids on that in every team-fight-type game
ionic magnet
nagato-amagi-hiryuu-belfast/sheffield-juneau-yukikaze is annoying as it can get
again, its situational blue
there are all kinds of strats out there
elder crane
under the general scenario we laid out, it's not at all
no super squishy charas in main, not ridiculous damage output, not super-gimping your total damage output by focus firing
in that scenario, focus fire is always better
coral wren
Doesn't jesus negate your spray and pray tactic completely?
elder crane
of those three conditions,
- is fulfilled pretty much always in AL PvP (nothing super squishy)
- is fulfilled by most teams, maybe not Nakaga or WSkai teams (you're hard-pressed in most teams to sink anyone in main in the first, and usually first two, salvos)
- This one can be somewhat important in AL PvP (ships with more focus tend to do less total, and AL focus is often fixed-focus so once the ship is sunk, damage starts getting wasted)
ionic magnet
idk if you just forgot but again, its all cos of the rng BB shots
elder crane
Except the math works out to focus being better there still
"main gun damage dist is roughly gaussian-random on each main fleet target, so a more-focused damage barrage dist gives higher chance of killing one than a more spread-out dist of comparable total damage when your total damage output is not super high.
Therefore, in this scenario, 1:0:0 is the best dist you can have on barrage damage"
elder crane
aka focusing your barrage/other controlled-targeting gives the highest chance that the rando-targeting BB shots sinks something
elder crane
and what I say is that killing one fast is pretty much always optimal in the relevant scenarios for AL PvP
ionic magnet
i want to kill 1 target a little longer while still dealing dmg to the other targets. so in case my BB shots hit the other targets, then i have a higher chance of killing them.
does that make more sense
elder crane
Yes, but the math works out to that being less optimal
the extra chance you get on killing other targets is lower than the chance you lose from not focusing one
ionic magnet
alright i'll admit i didnt do any maths on that one
fringe plover
Explain me WS barrage mechanic pls. It is supposed to hit the furthest target, so when you use her as flagship, will she use barrage on top or bottom ship?
fringe plover
By the way you dont even need to do math for these focus fire things, just admit that if you dont kill certain ship fast enough it has additional time to use some stuff that can rekt your entire fleet
modern tree
after top sinks she targets bottom when shes flag, which is actually pretty nifty in this meta
since Nagato just sort of just sits there tossing 381 shots at you that do nothing 60% of the time
elder crane
ionic magnet
thats how it is remi usually but im cosidering worst case here. and thats hiryuu and BB shots not hitting that same target hence not killing hiryuu anyway
also we are talking about some 2000 dmg here that should go to focus or spread
i have seen too many amagis/nagatos that died before hiryuu procs
elder crane
yep, but by targeting those cases, the chance you gain on sinking them is much lower than the chance you lose on not procing Hiryuu, which is what that math is showing
and if you think chance of sinking them is worth more than chance of procing Hiryuu, then you shouldn't be focusing Hiryuu in the first place...
it's on average better, so ofc there will still be outliers, of rarer specific cases where it is worse
ionic magnet
yea proccing hiryuu early is still better from my experience
especially when im using hiryuu myself
elder crane
the conclusion doesn't start shifting until you can focus enough damage output to super-high values (WSkai probably, and maybe Nakaga)
you need to be able to output burst targeted damage to 2X the amount of targeted damage needed for 50/50 on killing the ship before it starts being optimal to shift some of the focus away
analog hare
Zeppy or Graf to pair with Bismarck Tirpitz ??
elder crane
Graf for that 15% dred almost for sure
red nexus
I'd say graf for more Wall
elder crane
Zeppy barrage in PvP is pretty meh with the spread anyways, I think
fringe plover
Did devs fix bisko`s barrage or it still penetrates water?
trim horizon
high chance it's not even bugged
elder crane
and her strike output is only a tiny bit better than big Graf's if you don't mount an aux gun and are in a full-KMS fleet
modern tree
Just accept Bisquit for what she is, which is gimmicky QE
analog hare
Fine then
elder crane
Bisko barrage, looking at the code, has no obvious mistakes
So unless devs adjust barrage shape (unlikely I think), what you see is what you get
white granite
in pvp does Bismarck’s main shots in the barrages hit the backline (like Washington’s)
fringe plover
Where do u guys check your wr?
coral wren
just play 20+ games vs certain match ups, if you see you will lose in a moment just restart
modern tree
someone dropped here recently with sick tech of just playing on emulator and killing your internet connection, so you can play out the game till the end, the results wont send, and then you just restart it
vague token
that's some sorcery
burn that person
jk
also if you wanted to keep it
couldnt you reconnect
and al would find the connection again xD
split socket
I remember trying that when I first started the game but recalled the battles would be either automatically paused or canceled 🤔