pvp

[idle python]

he's just spamming 3:3 with his pvp fleet to get banked exp

[zenith tundra]

is 3:3 even worth it tho... if u 1:1 u get more exp but takes more

[hot creek]

I will wait til w11 release to burn my excess fuel

[zenith tundra]

even with 1mil exp before tomorrow u can still only awaken ships by timegates

[real notch]

yea it is not very worth it

because u make more use of MVP exp

but fucc it dudee

i'm very close to exp cap for my amakaga fleet

[zenith tundra]

i'm at 650k on akaga and already done with amagi

[real notch]

my goal is to just rush 110 when mental units come in

[hot creek]

you get 150 mental units a day right

[zenith tundra]

it's still a 4 day x sr ship time gate

to 110

[hot creek]

or is it only 50

[zenith tundra]

50 x battle 3 times

u need 600 for 110 for sr ships

[modern tree]

You get units for 3* w11

It's like 700 total

[hot creek]

wew. that might be a challenge for lvl 100 fleets

[zenith tundra]

700 but can u even 3* 11-4 with 2-3 ships lvl 105?

[modern tree]

Probably won't be, 11-4 is just 107 and by then you should have some ships awakened

[zenith tundra]

450+150=600=3 sr ships to 105

[ionic magnet]

you prolly can with some sick manual plays

[zenith tundra]

this is what u get in 1 day for 11-1to 3 + daily

[idle python]

you also get mental chips for 3 starring w7 hardmode

[ionic magnet]

mm 3 starring hard modes will be a pain

[idle python]

if you do leave and come back strat you can

fairly quickly but still a few days for all of them to 100%

[sharp obsidian]

Does Sirius have a place with Amakaga? I am wondering who to replace in the FL with Jintsuu, Belfast, Aurora 😦

[real notch]

not really

[ionic magnet]

belfast if you want but it wont be better

[real notch]

jintsuu belfast aurora works better than sirius mixed in with them

[ionic magnet]

also, jesus >>> belfast

[zenith tundra]

for now no. might be a choice with nanoda and sendai

[split socket]

I'm using sirius and haven't had to reset a single time this season 🤔

[sharp obsidian]

How about Sendai then? Her flare could maybe replace Aurora?

@split socket , what does your FL look like?

[split socket]

bel sir jin

[real notch]

sendai aurora jintsuu

juneau goes out

[zenith tundra]

nanoda sirius aurora

[split socket]

everything maxed with bis gears except for sirius, not at 200 affection yet

[zenith tundra]

i don't like maids so no ring for sirius

[split socket]

[sharp obsidian]

So will the meta be to 110 the ships asap after March 14

[ionic magnet]

ofc cos you'll be at a big disadvantage if you dont

[zenith tundra]

u can choose to care about pvp or just get lvl 110 on pve ships

[sharp obsidian]

Hmm... Tough call. 😂

Seems like I'll have to delay farming for Sendai

[modern tree]

Or play HMS and do both

[sharp obsidian]

So that I can get my PVP Ship to 110

[hot creek]

if you're gonna be 3:3 'ing anyways I don't see why amakagas can't be used for pve

[hybrid tendon]

would sendai be a counter to amakaga i wonder?

[sharp obsidian]

Is 3:3 needed for C11 once you have Safe Level?

[zenith tundra]

akaga is pve meta as much as jesus is

[sharp obsidian]

I think 2:1 might still work out

[hybrid tendon]

2 - 1

really now

[sharp obsidian]

You get 20% on C11 for safety already no?

[hybrid tendon]

oh wait w got 110

[ionic magnet]

its not like amagi and jintsuu cant carry in pve

[hybrid tendon]

so

[sharp obsidian]

Yeah, 110 PVE Farmer + 20% Safety should allow 2-1

[split socket]

ppl are going to try to get sendai on 1st day though

that'll be the real challenge :p

[hybrid tendon]

I've heard ppl saying sendai would be a counter

for amakaga

[zenith tundra]

sendai doesn't change much in amakaga

[ionic magnet]

i can already see the flexing

[hybrid tendon]

I'd smash her

[sharp obsidian]

Sendai would need 2 weeks still though to get her skills to L10

[ionic magnet]

[hybrid tendon]

would sendai survive the initial barrage

tho

::lul

[idle python]

well the flare skill doesn't need to be leveled up to do work

[ionic magnet]

well you cant level her skills if you dont have her

[idle python]

because leveling up the flare skill only affects the % chance after the guaranteed flare

[zenith tundra]

what a trash skill

[modern tree]

I am not sure how would this "counter" work. She torps flares and sinks, then you either win or lose. It's the same as always

[split socket]

her flare skill are after retro

[vague token]

flare skill is completely front loaded lol

it does everything it needs to with 0 ranks

[hot creek]

das op

[zenith tundra]

so u get like 10% evasion chance or something. what does it actually change?

as opponent ships

[split socket]

"10 seconds after battle begins, and 20% (40%) chance to activate every 20s after that: deploys a flare for 10 seconds. Enemy's ships within the flare have their evasion rate decreased by 25%."

seems pretty lackluster tbh

[vague token]

main perk is it works on CA

when we get to 120

unlike aurora

[real notch]

bruh

25% EVA deduction is fukin busted lol

aurora was only 20% and she invalidated DDs

[hybrid tendon]

hmm

[split socket]

her stats are tofu af

[real notch]

now take aurora and 2x it

[sharp obsidian]

Aurora + Sendai might be overkill? 😂

[real notch]

include CAs as well

[hybrid tendon]

sendai has KAI

[zenith tundra]

do u think akaga can oneshoot 3 ships with aurora sirius and sendai in 1 airstrike?

[hybrid tendon]

so her stats would be high

[split socket]

yea, I'm looking at sendais kai stats

they are tofu

[hybrid tendon]

most certainly

what

really

[split socket]

2483 hp

[real notch]

sendai aurora will fuck up almost every VG

[vague token]

she is the same class

as jintsuu

same base stats

[split socket]

torp ok at 363

[vague token]

give or take

[hybrid tendon]

just field your prinz

[real notch]

stats aren't important lol

[split socket]

jintsuus retro skill helps her survivability

[vague token]

xD

[hybrid tendon]

who cares about eva

[real notch]

for sendai, you just flare

[vague token]

yeah

[split socket]

sendai doesn't have any survivability at all

[real notch]

and shit on everythnig

[lament lichen]

sendai just needs to live for 10 secs

[zenith tundra]

it won't change akaga dmg since u don't really miss much unless u face belfast

[split socket]

I'm going to stick with sirius lul, more dmg

[sharp obsidian]

Sendai Aurora Sirius?

[real notch]

that's fine lmao u can stick with prinz and still win

[vague token]

im using sirius too, mostly because hiryuu appreciates the aviation boost xD

[sharp obsidian]

Pure reliance on Akaga

But not sure if that is optimal

[zenith tundra]

sendai only amazing thing she has is that it can make jintsuu useless

[real notch]

but strictly in terms of ship quality

sendai is better

[subtle whale]

world 7 hard mode

[real notch]

unarguably

[lament lichen]

using sendai and aurora you're already focused on akaga doing all the damage

[sharp obsidian]

So adding Sirius should not matter much anymore?

[split socket]

Nakaga + sirius aurora sendai for optimal airstrikes

[zenith tundra]

tbh i'd pick sirius with sendai and aurora over jintsuu

[sharp obsidian]

You give up the first torp salvo power though

[modern tree]

Sendai can time with Amagi shot which matters.

[ionic magnet]

sendai and aurora might kill any vg but you guys are forgetting they can die to any vg aswell with those HPs

[modern tree]

And running 3 debuffs is redundant

[zenith tundra]

or even sendai aurora jesus

[split socket]

amagi shoots too fast for sendai, u'll have to go with a slower gun

[real notch]

ye

406 or 410

we did calcs sometime earlier last week

[zenith tundra]

410 is too fast with optimal

[split socket]

anyone got video of the flare anyway?

[vague token]

406 is definitely what you want with sendai xD

pretty sure

[sharp obsidian]

So which VG should we put in with Sendai coming in?

[real notch]

the flare's been around for a year lol u can probably just google it

[split socket]

theres still the requirement of enemy ships being inside the flare radius

[sharp obsidian]

Against Mirror Sendai Amakaga

[idle python]

the flare is most of the time pretty accurate

[vague token]

but honestly unless you see people with port kai

why bother

just use aurora

or sirius

xD

[ionic magnet]

flare has p good range but it can get ugly with bad rng

[split socket]

tbh I don't think sendai will affect meta much

[zenith tundra]

sounds good to go with sendai jintsuu aurora torp memes

[split socket]

shes just another eva debuff ship

[zenith tundra]

rng over rng

[real notch]

on CN/JP for at least a full 6 months

sendai aurora jintsuu dominated meta

[zenith tundra]

because no wasd

[split socket]

wasd is trash man

[real notch]

no, even with wasd

lol

[zenith tundra]

or amagi

[real notch]

nakaga destroyed wasd fleets

lol

[vague token]

nakaga shows the difference in dps

invuln wont save you from the damage output

[real notch]

some wasd fleets had like a sub 50% winrate even with 20% attacker bonus

[zenith tundra]

ofc they did ur supposed to win on offense

[real notch]

that's how fucking broken nakaga was

[split socket]

I wonder how wasda performs against nakaga though

[real notch]

people who think otherwise just don't know how groundbreaking nakaga fleets was in other servers

lmao

[split socket]

if ppl are even going to bother with nakaga 🤔

[real notch]

they just haven't watched the replays or did the research

also, there is no overkill in terms of EVA debuffing

[hybrid tendon]

nakaga vs amakaga

[real notch]

20% EVA reduction is not enough

[hybrid tendon]

🤔

[zenith tundra]

now i wonder what kind of monster namagi is

[hybrid tendon]

which lineup would win

[split socket]

more like nakaga vs namagi + wildstar

[real notch]

probably amakaga given EVA buff

but that doesn't matter because amakaga fleets would field aurora jintsuu sendai anyways lmfao

[hybrid tendon]

shame that naka has no retrofit

otherwise we could have fielded 6 foxes

6

6!!!!!!!!!!!!

[vague token]

eww

[real notch]

the only thing AFAIK that can compete with that VG is

saint louis, neptune, YKKZ

all VG that we don't have

[split socket]

just bring fubuki instead of naka for absolute torp meme

[hybrid tendon]

everytime people mentioned yukikaz

[real notch]

so it's my belief that until those 3 ships arrive, the IJN VG meme will dumpster everyone

[hybrid tendon]

I thought of that

[zenith tundra]

research is soon enough and vdir should be next event lol

[hybrid tendon]

vdir again?

yikes

[idle python]

wouldn't really say nakaga dominated wasd, I was still able to get ~75% win rate vs eva debuff nakaga using a good chunk of non 120s with wasd

[split socket]

vdir won't be next event lol

[real notch]

75% is hella low lol

[hybrid tendon]

I'd take the french event

[real notch]

given 20% attacker boost

[idle python]

win rate felt about the same the other way around too

[split socket]

@zenith tundra https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dz140t5U8AEfOhf.jpg:large

[ionic magnet]

what other events are left anyway

[zenith tundra]

if the alternative is coin flip mirror might as well take it

[real notch]

and it's possibleto achieve higher if you itemize against strictly nakaga

[zenith tundra]

the no rerun post is it?

[real notch]

but if you itemize against nakaga then you lose to other wasd

[idle python]

I wasn't itemizing though

[real notch]

so there's no objectively better way to run a good wasd fleet

[idle python]

wasd centaur juneau aurora portkai

[zenith tundra]

i don't believe it 1 second so no thanks

[idle python]

I didn't have saint louis ready at the time

[real notch]

like i said 75% is quite low lol

[idle python]

my main problem with it was that the way I was winning with wasd felt like hms could just do it better and faster

[split socket]

🤔 that's an official post tho

[real notch]

i track reset tests

and i consider 75% a failure fleet

[zenith tundra]

vdir is not a new event tho

we never got wc

and we got rerun straight

that is what i think the post means

[real notch]

but, from other CN/JP players the winrates for wasd vs nakaga was much lower

sub 50%

[split socket]

maybe, but it won't make much sense since we still need to catch up to other servers

[idle python]

aristya claims wasd is best for cn before namagi ofc

[zenith tundra]

they just announced w13

[split socket]

releasing a rerun of an event we already had when we are still behind in other seems just dumb

[hot creek]

p sure wasd is a hard counter to nakaga if played correctly using a "suicide" VG.

[zenith tundra]

we wont catch up soon

[real notch]

i'm not 100% sure what the optimal fleet now is

[idle python]

and iriya started getting good results with it when he used his suicide front

[real notch]

due to ws kai, amagi, and hiryuu

[idle python]

while me and arsitya just went with "standard"

[real notch]

and i don't have the resources to test as an EN player

it it wasd ws kai

or wasd hiryuu

from what i know, defensive frontlines are coming back

(maybe)

[ionic magnet]

vdir rerun just doesn't make sense if we have other unreleased events left

[zenith tundra]

also that whole post about no reruns puts en 1 year behind in full event content for every new one we miss

[hybrid tendon]

I'd love to have no reruns

[zenith tundra]

it was released at the end of the month in jp too and jp started 1 year earlier

[hybrid tendon]

but

[split socket]

well lets just wait and see

[hybrid tendon]

Vdir and DC is gonna get a rerun

FW is not

[split socket]

nothing seems certain anymore lol

[hybrid tendon]

wc is not

[real notch]

i think overall yostar is trying to slowdown the PVP meta

given ws kai and hiryuu additions

[hybrid tendon]

i could run yukikaze and jesus

[real notch]

so perhaps suicide VG (aurora jintsuu sendai) may not be as strong as before

[vague token]

wut, ws kai doesnt slow down anything though

[hybrid tendon]

for a defensive frontline

[ionic magnet]

theyll prolly sync the reruns so jp cn en gets the same ships including new ones

[modern tree]

Slow down pvp meta lol

[zenith tundra]

just released ws kai that insta wins -> slowdown

[vague token]

ws speeds it up

[hybrid tendon]

• belfast

[zenith tundra]

i think they want def fleet to be a non issue

so ws kai makes sense

[real notch]

but then again they did release amagi

[split socket]

it'd be nice if def fleets actually meant something

[zenith tundra]

and ws that 1 shoot her 1 month after

[real notch]

well ws fires at 10 sec which is fast but her main shells still fire at normal BB speed

and it gives shikikans options other than just foxes

if they want to compete

[zenith tundra]

i don't think we'll get stuck in nakaga meta thanks to amagi

[vague token]

defense will matter when they remove attacker 20% and defense positioning

[real notch]

yea amakaga sohuld more or less replace nakaga

but

it's my own personal prediction, but i think that sendai release will invalidate a lot of offense fleets

[zenith tundra]

now i'm curious about namagi vs amakaga

[real notch]

because even if you are an attacker, you can't reduce enemy dmg

[zenith tundra]

amagi can tho

[real notch]

and if you don't kill sendai by 10sec, you'll likely eat a 45% EVA debuffed 2x fox airstrike + amagi

so 20% dmg bonus is kind of useless

[split socket]

killing tofu ships in 10 secs are pretty easy with amagi + torp front

[real notch]

when your vanguard is dead

[vague token]

which is why port kai will be needed with 110 boosts

[real notch]

and you don't have the save EVA debuff as opponent

[zenith tundra]

the problem to ur logic is that u can beat amakaga already with wasda

[idle python]

killing sendai in 10 seconds rarely happens unless you manage to shotgun her with torps

[real notch]

one shotting any ship at 10 secs is not a reliable strategy lol

[idle python]

even if she's in the front

[real notch]

just because it occured and you saw it doesn't mean you can rely on it as a legitimate strat that invalidates sendai

[split socket]

I'm not really convinced u can do much with both aurora and sendai tbh

they are both extremely squishy

[real notch]

also, idk about wasda beating amakaga

[modern tree]

You can kill a fox before second strike with HMS even now, losing vg when your backline is at 110 3v2 is w/e

[split socket]

just cause their airstrikes can do a lot of dmg, u can also do the same thing back, even without eva debuff stacking

simply because they are squishy af

[real notch]

but i am continuing the testing zack

according to your results, unless if you field juneau and ryuusei

the winrates are kind of lacklustre

[idle python]

if your vanguard is alive it also means it attracts more bb shells/airstrikes to them and away from your backline

[zenith tundra]

what did u try against?

[real notch]

tobi are u talking about this from just looking at their wiki page

[lament lichen]

wasd doesnt do good if both fronts are alive

[split socket]

lol no

[real notch]

because we are all looking at the wiki page, it's not a discovery

legit nakaga has dominated meta for over half a year

with jintsuu aurora sendai

[split socket]

ur forgetting amagi exists

[real notch]

empirically speaking

[zenith tundra]

amagi can kill a fox by herself tho

[real notch]

from evidence

[split socket]

cn/jp meta isn't the same as EN

[idle python]

amagiakaga runs the same way as nakaga does

[real notch]

dude

[idle python]

you're still trying to kill vg asap

[real notch]

we just explained that oneshotting anyone with amagi barrage is not a viable strat

also, EN follows JP/CN closely

[split socket]

amagi alone shifted the meta hard, it's not even clear yet if nakaga will be meta

[zenith tundra]

i don't think amakaga and nakaga are that close. amakaga can last a lot more but does less damage then nakaga

[split socket]

we still have namagi to try out

[lament lichen]

killing the VG with opening torps isnt viable as well

[real notch]

amagi didn't shift the meta hard

[split socket]

EN stopped following cn/jp meta the moment amagi released dude

[real notch]

amagi just replaced nagato

lol

you mean for EN or for CN/JP

[idle python]

we aren't really saying nakaga is meta, we're saying akaga amagi will use sendai for EN (for the time being)

[split socket]

I'm talking about EN meta

[idle python]

ofc when nagato is out it'll change

[split socket]

u can't apply everything from CN/JP and assume it'll be the same in EN because we already have different ships available at different times

[shy hazel]

way too many different factors that can change pvp

hard to assume which will be best

[split socket]

namagi in EN will for example be weaker cause we won't have hiryuu kai

[idle python]

well I've already explained how amagi akaga literally plays to the same style nakaga does

[real notch]

no, but that also doesn't mean u ignore the precedent that JP/CN sets

[zenith tundra]

i would agree with tobi tbh no reason to assume jp applies to en

[shy hazel]

shells lvl 120 which major event

[real notch]

like there is a reason why that VG is bread and butter lol

[modern tree]

The "nakaga dominated shit" has to be stated with distinction between jp and cn considering jp didn't have FW until we did. You can't just be like half a year of terror on jp and compare it to en

[split socket]

I'm not ignoring it, I'm telling u why u shouldn't take it as the absolute truth just because it was that way in cn / jp

[real notch]

amagi shifts the meta but will not invalidate that VG

[modern tree]

Cuz we have more shit

[real notch]

like, you will have to be a bit more specific

what part exactly of amagi

will make you believe sendai is too squishy

[lament lichen]

dude if sendai is squishy for you

then dont bother with sirius lul

[real notch]

because the hard cutoff is very clear

[split socket]

Sirius is tankier than sendai, what are u smoking

[real notch]

if amagi doesn't 1shot sendai at 10 secs, then sendai will do her job

lol

if you have confidence that sendai will consistently die to amagi before she flares

then ok u might have an idea there

but you will have to clarify your position

[idle python]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/520242433049755662/533543303115964416/Screenshot_20190111-230955.jpg

wow amagi sure dented sendai with that barrage!

[lament lichen]

dunno why he still thinks sendai is squishy

[idle python]

she is squishy

ut not enough to die in 10 seconds

[real notch]

she IS, but that's not the argument

[zenith tundra]

1st is not amagi mid 2nd it's lvl 120

[lament lichen]

doesnt die to amagi in 10 secs thou

[real notch]

he is saying "sendai is too squishy to remain in meta"

but sendai's literally her sole job is to flare at 10 secs

[modern tree]

Regardless wether it's effective or not, showing a ss with Amagi top as evidence that Sendai lives is silly

[real notch]

because the flare lasts 10 fucking seconds

[split socket]

I'm talking about EN, and that screenshot u got isn't even the comp I was talking about

[real notch]

the VG is usually melted

that is the difference here

yes, sendai is squishy
no, sendai is not so squishy that she will drop out of top tier meta

[split socket]

Aurora + Sendai IS squishy af. U can already comfortably sink tankier ships with amagi + torp front

[idle python]

assuming your torps even hit

[real notch]

lol

[split socket]

saying 2 tofu ships on def is not squishy is just stupid

[idle python]

and a lot of them have to

[real notch]

i think u are arguing the wrong point here

[zenith tundra]

all of this discussion tbh is not based on any testing so pls stop it already

[modern tree]

Furious battle of imaginary pvp

[idle python]

the amagi not being center is fair though

[real notch]

ok sure, they are squishy - so what?

do they die at 10 secs reliably?

[split socket]

Imaginary PVP is all we have

[real notch]

even if your point is made, the real question is not answered

[zenith tundra]

well let's wait for actual pvp

[real notch]

if they don't die at 10 secs, then they remain in meta

they do their job, as "suicide VG"

[split socket]

even if they survive and do their job as u said

they'll die off just as quick as they kill ur vg

[idle python]

that's fine if that happens

they're still baiting bb shells and airstrikes away from your back

[real notch]

alright

[split socket]

and in mirrors, u pretty much never lose if both vg dies same time

[real notch]

so your logic is

if i run, a NOT squishy ship

like cleveland, edinburgh, and prinz

[vague token]

prinz wouldnt die any slower or faster because of sendai though xD

[real notch]

they will die, to suicide VG

[split socket]

🤦 I think I'm done discussing cause ur not even trying to understand my point at all

[real notch]

but suicide VG will die at the same time?

lol

you are stressing this "squishy vs non squishy" idea

so you are saying, trading in the skills of sendai for a tankier VG is what you would do

[split socket]

I'm responding to what u said that Aurora Sendai Jintsuu will be the absolute meta VG

[real notch]

and most importantly, you are saying this is the new meta

[idle python]

are you using aurora in your fleet rn tobi

[split socket]

nop, missing aurora

[idle python]

and how often does she die in <10 seconds

[real notch]

i think that is the problem

lol

[idle python]

the answer would be almost never unless face torp

sendai is like 80 hp lower

[ionic magnet]

only ship that is absolute is jesus

[real notch]

u just need to watch

some replays

[split socket]

I'm discussing about sirrequiem claim about Aurora Sendai on def

[real notch]

or read up on some CN/JP meta fleets

lol

[split socket]

That they will be absolutely busted and u cant kill them with any other front

[real notch]

do some more research

[shy hazel]

[vague token]

go back to the labs kid

[shy hazel]

the only meta now is ws kai

[split socket]

U can already kill tankier front with amakaga + torp front

[real notch]

you denied saying you are working off of the wiki page but you don't even have the ships to test your own empirical evidence

[split socket]

within 10 secs

[real notch]

from what it looks like to me, you googled sendai azurlane, saw the 2.5k hp, and concluded "yup this ship is too weak to last in the meta"

[ionic magnet]

whats the argument again im lost help

[vague token]

wait i dont think anyone said that

[split socket]

sirrequiem is making up arguments for me that I haven't even said

[vague token]

lol

[lament lichen]

sendai too squishy for pvp ...

[real notch]

that is what it looks like to me

[zenith tundra]

i think sirrequiem problem is trying to put sendai as god on defense which is not true for anything yet and tobi pointing out a low chance to actually kill stuff early

[real notch]

unless if you have evidence saying you have tested either aurora or sendai

or saw actual PVP results of the two ships

[lament lichen]

2 extrems

[vague token]

im pretty sure im the only one who said there's no reason to run sendai when you have aurora xD

[zenith tundra]

if u want to continue pls do some testing. if u cannot then just wait

[vague token]

unless people start running port kai or something

[real notch]

like romance said, aurora is 2.5k hp

[split socket]

So heres the thing, your claim: Aurora + sendai are gonna be busted af if they survive first 10 secs and u can't kill them that fast.
What I said to that: You can with amagi + torp front.
Theres not much more to it

[real notch]

and she rarely rarely dies

CURRENTLY

[split socket]

U can already reliably do it against other tankier fronts

Sendai and aurora are as tofu as ships goes. It is not hard to kill them in first 10 secs ESPECIALLY when ur on offense and got 20% dmg boost

[real notch]

ah, so you are using indirect evidence

[split socket]

ah, ur finally reading

[real notch]

i think ur confidence in indirect evidence is kind of scary

when you can literally google aurora/sendai right now

and get direct evidence

[idle python]

Those must be some god torps you have if you can reliably kill Tanky vg in <10s

[real notch]

in pvp games

[vague token]

i dont think ive ever had port kai die purely to torps lol

[zenith tundra]

so it's yours that sendai will make everything implode against amagi tbh @real notch

[real notch]

my firm point is

sendai is meta

hands down

[ionic magnet]

i mean you can kill them in 10s but its too rng-ish depending on torp hits

[real notch]

there is no discussion

[split socket]

keep in mind I'm arguing for torp fleet OFFENSE vs aurora sendai DEFENSE

not the other way around

[real notch]

sirius will not replace sendai

portkai will not replace sendai

[split socket]

20% dmg buff is huge when it comes to killing ships in the first 10 secs

[real notch]

sendai is not replaceable in amakaga fleets as of right now

[zenith tundra]

sendai is what she is and useless for any comps without akaga

[real notch]

sendai si top of the line, unmatched VG choice

[split socket]

well we'll see

[idle python]

Torp fleet offense vs Sendai defense will probably end up as a both vg die

[vague token]

i mean, sendai is useless for anyone attacking close or post 20

like i cant use sendai

and i use side amagi

[idle python]

But but torp vs tank and Sendai vs tank or the other way around

[vague token]

so 0 benefit

[real notch]

however, my PREDICTION is that sendai will create a hard pvp wall

[split socket]

The thing is, it's not even 100% sure meta will shift to Nakaga

that's the thing

[idle python]

It's much more favorable to sendai

[real notch]

the hard PVP wall being

[split socket]

We'll still have to find out what performs better nakaga vs namagi

and sendai won't be as effective in namagi fleet as she was in nakaga

[zenith tundra]

all u need is to kill vgs even if ur dies and bb>akaga

[real notch]

anyone who overly relied on 20% attacker boost to win fights with un-optimal, shitty fleets will come across sendai + aurora + jintsuu

and get slapped

because (this is my prediction) no amount of 20% dmg boost

[idle python]

^this is true from my experience

[real notch]

will save you from

a 45% EVA debuffed enemy fleet

[idle python]

More so that you can't run a "random" vg

[split socket]

no one is talking about running random vg

this pvp channel for the past few weeks has been going nonstop about different vg setups

[idle python]

I assume by hard wall he means, must go close to meta or bust

[real notch]

yeah

sendai will weed out the shitty VG fleets

[split socket]

because there so far has been no consensus of whats the best. Aurora Sendai jintsuu doesn't look so busted to me that they'll become a pvp hard wall as sirrequiem claims

[idle python]

Sendai does the best at creating the wall

You can get by with stuff

[real notch]

people who incessantly complain and convince others that "oh prinz is actually good"

for example

they will shut up when they fight enough sendais

[vague token]

lol

[idle python]

But a worse vg will do worse vs Aurora Sendai than vs torp

[split socket]

no one is complainig and trying to convince other that prinz is good, quit your bs

[vague token]

ill probably just rotate port kai to lead to soak more shots

instead of the CLs

[split socket]

the talk here has been about the front meta and u know it

[real notch]

but there are people that complain prinz is good

[vague token]

wat

really?

[real notch]

yea

lmao

[vague token]

where at lol

[real notch]

i've heard it many months ago

right here in this discord

[split socket]

like what, 1st month of this game

[vague token]

this channel? or the help lol

[real notch]

no, in october/november

[ionic magnet]

im sticking to jintsuu jesus aurora/sendai. i value the extra fox hp over another eva debuff but we'll see.

[real notch]

well

ok

that was just an example

but maybe if i change the example it will help you understand

anyone who incessantly complains that sirius is a meta VG will shut up once they fight enough sendais

(since personally, i don't think sirius is good)

[zenith tundra]

why not run both

[ionic magnet]

sirius was never a meta ship tho

[split socket]

tbf I really don't got time for this. We'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm out of discussion for real now anyway

[vague token]

sirius is literally only good for not amakaga lol

[zenith tundra]

if u win with akaga why even bother with jintsuu?

[real notch]

well

the definition of "meta fleet" was never "a fleet that wins"

[zenith tundra]

if akaga will win by default u don't need jintsuu anyway

[real notch]

it was rather "the fleet that has the highest statistical probability winrate %"

[zenith tundra]

like if ur goal is to kill vg just overkill with sendai aurora sirius

[real notch]

while i will concede that the 20% dmg boost throws a wrench in everything

[zenith tundra]

100% guaranteed kill

[real notch]

my goal ever since 7 months ago was always "the perfect fleet"

[zenith tundra]

there is not even 1 thing remotely close to that

always counters

[real notch]

yes, i am that minmaxer and yes, i will spend hours researching on a tiny ship mechanic just to find out if it's 1% better than another

well in AL PVP the perfect fleet = the fleet that has the highest statistical probability winrate %

(for me)

[vague token]

a hard counter doesnt mess up your average win rate against most matchups

[real notch]

yea ^

[vague token]

a 9:1 where the 1 is a 100% loss is still a better pick usually

[zenith tundra]

so why use an rng ship that buffs rng stuff vs a sure buff for the most anti rng comp

[vague token]

compared to a 7:3 or w/e

[real notch]

because sometimes, the skill is OP even if it's RNG

like during FW days when everyone was wasde

i hated using E but if you didn't you'd just get stomped

[zenith tundra]

because there was no real alternative

not because e is a god

[hot creek]

HMS was viable as fuck during those days

[vague token]

ark royal

[real notch]

well. there were alternatives

[vague token]

fun times back then

[real notch]

but yea it's not like we had centaur or hiryuu kai or some shit lol

the point is RNG ships sometimes still crawl their way into meta

very much like sendai flare will

[zenith tundra]

hms was a huge time eating process to reach that point

[real notch]

in the coming months

[zenith tundra]

i still don't get what kind of persons tries for maximum % win rate with rngs

[vague token]

well

he's just interested in aggregate

[real notch]

such is the life of a perfectionist

[vague token]

over time the rng should normalize

[real notch]

people don't understand why u do things

and yet when i go for job interviews

[vague token]

requiem is just crazy ;)))

[real notch]

and i say i'm a perfectionist

[vague token]

[real notch]

they still be thinking "oh, what a cliche answer"

[zenith tundra]

u can lose vg in 1 secs if really unlucky cool u lost gg bye bye

[real notch]

yea that's fine

[zenith tundra]

win rate to shit because of rng

[real notch]

i mean that's kind of

a large majority of high competitive games

sometimes you just die to RNG

[vague token]

reminds me of instant death on my top main fleet

[real notch]

that doesn't mean you just keel over and accept that u suck

[vague token]

cause of bad torps

[real notch]

because like kiro said

in aggregate, the RNG losses will normalize

and the better players will still rise out on top

[shy hazel]

what

[zenith tundra]

current pvp anyone can be top really

[shy hazel]

requiem has 100%?

[zenith tundra]

won't change that sendai

[real notch]

do u know how many times i kept getting rekt by RNG in hearthstone

hearthstone is the most disgusting RNG game i've ever played

[shy hazel]

donald trump is also 100% on both

btw

[vague token]

100% what?

[shy hazel]

pve pvp

[vague token]

xD

he built the wall

[shy hazel]

mad lad

[real notch]

nani

[zenith tundra]

i'd rather believe someone with 99.99% then 100%

[shy hazel]

i dont even care about pve winrate

LOL

[real notch]

lmao

my pvp winrate is like

98

[vague token]

i mean, you'd have to baby your pve to not lose a game still

[real notch]

i htink

it's hella low

[shy hazel]

i regularly blow losses when memeing out dailies

[vague token]

xD

oh yeah, ive lost torp daily cause i forgot to go top left

i just started it

and left it

lol

[shy hazel]

like using 3 cvs and one vg on jihadships

[elder crane]

I regularly take losses while trying out various farming setups

[shy hazel]

[zenith tundra]

99.6% pve and 98.6% pvp

[vague token]

life is loss jk

[split socket]

I think dailies don't count towards the pve %

[shy hazel]

it is?

[vague token]

o.o

[split socket]

I've fcked up quite many times but it never seemed to affect my winrate :/

It's what I think though, I haven't tested it or anything

[elder crane]

99.4 97.7 for me

I'm probs one of the lower ones here

[shy hazel]

zack can u check mine

[split socket]

if ur in guild u can check it urself

[shy hazel]

we frens right

[vague token]

99.5 pve, 98.2 pvp, oh boi it shows me sleeping at the wheel xD

[shy hazel]

domoty

[vague token]

nothing like doing pvp match thinking it's a win cause it's late

[shy hazel]

i need to raise up my pvp winrate

but its hard to raise up

[real notch]

FW

[lime rivet]

Spend a season farming wins, easy.

[split socket]

just dont lose

[real notch]

has eternally fuked up my winrate

fukin

[shy hazel]

@ionic magnet has incredible winrate

[vague token]

i mean, the more games you have, the harder it is to get 1 percentage point

[shy hazel]

20% winrate

[vague token]

oof

[real notch]

3v1 wasde vs E and you go take a piss

come back

and you see "ANNIHILATED"

[vague token]

lol yeah

[real notch]

like fuk off man

[shy hazel]

cos he farmed pvp for half the points when he started

thought it was gonna reset after a season

[real notch]

back when PVP was just whoever OWARIDA'ed more

[zenith tundra]

who really cares about that tho

[real notch]

i'm so glad that shits over with

[shy hazel]

heeey

i like my winrate higg

high

for ocd

[lime rivet]

Mfw i HMS'd from day 1

[vague token]

how we gonna impress anyone if our stats arent perfection

[lime rivet]

Owarida can get fucked

[vague token]

lol

[modern tree]

FW was easy cuz nobody put any skill book in Aegis so HMS auto won

[zenith tundra]

idk maybe u only need to have fun playing al

[split socket]

I hms'd from day 1 and I got owaridad so many times I gave up on it to cuddle with my foxies

[lime rivet]

Oh yeah, but then people started leveling aegis

[shy hazel]

is someone frends with donaldtrump

can we get his winrate ss here

lol

[lime rivet]

So i just straight out skipped wasde comps in disgust

[vague token]

oof

[shy hazel]

someone said last time its 100% for both

[idle python]

You can just search his name

[vague token]

what a god

[lament lichen]

71% collection

[zenith tundra]

71% collection

[vague token]

wait what

[lime rivet]

How?

[vague token]

how, does he farm literally only 1 map?

xD

[lament lichen]

no retrofit probably

[lime rivet]

Never rolled gacha?

Even with no retrofit he should be in the 80s

[lament lichen]

needs to save money for that wall

[hot creek]

a true pvp'er. salutes

[vague token]

except not

40k attacks

[shy hazel]

Hes a God

God Emperor of Usa

[vague token]

xD

[zenith tundra]

40k 1-1 won't give u any new ships

[real notch]

lmfao

i'm at 83.7%

pretty low

[shy hazel]

imagine him having 100% collection

[lime rivet]

Affection farming, i guess?

[shy hazel]

hes ultimate god

when that happens

[ionic magnet]

who cares about winrates

[split socket]

hes also lvl 106, u kinda need to farm higher worlds to be able to lvl up too

[zenith tundra]

i'm pretty sure he must have missed some event ships with that low %

[shy hazel]

maybe

juat maybe

hes using hax tools

[zenith tundra]

[ionic magnet]

im happy with my 85% wr now considering i intentionally lost my first 200 or so matches

[vague token]

and that's what's important, being happy =D

[solar pike]

in a jintsuu - aurora - sirius setup, who would u put pearls tear on between jintsuu and aurora?

[hot creek]

must've listened to those casuals who said "pvp is free xp"

[idle python]

As a new player you pretty much lose 80% of your PvP attempts when you start

[zenith tundra]

aurora

[idle python]

Aurora pearl

[shy hazel]

pls

id rather not pvp

[solar pike]

[hot creek]

I just quit pvp for a season while raising my HMS

[modern tree]

Just get Enterprise on your first gacha roll when starting out. Easy

[vague token]

she was my 8th ship

or so

so i started pvp early

[modern tree]

T1 red books to level lucky e was an experience

[ionic magnet]

idea is to get as much exp as you can cos you cant beat anyone anyways but yea its bad if you care about winrates

[split socket]

not a problem if u started on a new server

[solar pike]

Did anyone say Belfast counters akaga? everytime i play mirror their belfast gets 1shot because of my sirius

[shy hazel]

was pvp even a day one feature

[ionic magnet]

my first ssr is hood

[shy hazel]

[modern tree]

Anegdotal evidence, here we go again

[split socket]

I grinded like mad and got a max lvled fleet and could enjoy pvp an entire season against fleets still at lvl 70-90

[zenith tundra]

1st sr for me as it should be sandy

[modern tree]

Lvl 95 ish pve ships duking it out in pvp was the shit

[ionic magnet]

lol must be fun

[zenith tundra]

sounds more fun then now

[modern tree]

Step aside Rodney Enterprise with Indie Port front is coming through

[ionic magnet]

no meta is best meta

[real notch]

yea it was more fun when there was more variety

rip the unicorn backlines

[vague token]

we just need indy retro

with an actual nuke skill

[split socket]

"Cause 90% dmg to all enemy ships when sunk"

maybe friendly dmg too

[modern tree]

Got my first aotn back in October, was wondering why people make such a big deal out of it. Was using pure trash still. Heard legends of HMS cancer but never seen it

Now it's just everyone fox lol

[shy hazel]

rodney nelson refit when

[split socket]

I looked through pvp rankings quite a lot at that time, there were barely ppl running maxed hms, it was always a bunch of random mix

[zenith tundra]

can't really blame people for using at least good ships instead of meme comps

[shy hazel]

big seven era is coming

[vague token]

just buff all the non-sakura big seven plz

[zenith tundra]

finally found one after so much time

[vague token]

also buff illustrious armored carrier to get the damage reduction taihou has

;)))

[zenith tundra]

i can finally test against max bis amakaga

[real notch]

that looks BIS

except for the VG... it looks around 100 higher than it should be

[modern tree]

Illu does not need a buff shes still t0 tits

[zenith tundra]

maybe using oxy on vg

[real notch]

but should be decent enough for testing

i think it's maybe an SG

idk

cus i have oxytorp and i'm like 12600

[zenith tundra]

that's an oath jesus tho

[split socket]

rainbow torp rainbow torp aux?

[real notch]

oh ya

2x rainbow torp

is totally possible now

[split socket]

or not, he won't be at 12897 if hes not using 381 (unless 380)

can't get both 381 and 2x rainbow torp yet 🤔

[zenith tundra]

way too close but won vg 1st try

[vague token]

[shy hazel]

iremember

the dankies pvp enemy i foguht was this person

who uses monitors with rodney

and all procced in same time

[vague token]

big lasers

[shy hazel]

the shiny assault

i was new at pvp at that time

so i bailed out

[vague token]

xD

[shy hazel]

scary lasers

pls

[zenith tundra]

maybe try and get sakura big 7?

by combining the 2 barrages together

[shy hazel]

all those lasers are really scary lol

when u dont know it does shit dmg

inpvp

[zenith tundra]

finally lvl 95 so i can waste my money on auditorium

[hot creek]

having level advantage for a couple days over the casuals is going to be fun.

[zenith tundra]

we might actually see some casuals due to bugs

but otherwise i wouldn't see any

[hot creek]

now the question is. level five ships to 105 or two ships 105 and one at 110 on day 2

[zenith tundra]

if i struggle too much in w11 i might end up awakening to 110 both amagi and doy

[vague token]

that's actually a good question o.O

[hot creek]

i think im going to go with latter

I wonder how much is the margin of error gonig to be for S ranks on the daily raid

[zenith tundra]

it's 1 min time

for s rank

more then that u don't get it

but if it takes increased damage from x source it should be fine as long as u have good ships

[hot creek]

i assume you can retreat without penalty along with the other raids so experimenting for optimal comps should be no problem

[zenith tundra]

i would assume u can like other daily raids

i'm a bit worried about cv one more then anything. u can manual torp and bb are good

way too close also that comp seems kind of week tbh

5-0 against this with wasda. idk why but feels really not a good defense comp

[shy hazel]

do you know what ill do

[ionic magnet]

hmm 12.8k for that vanguard is a little high

hes prolly using something off

[zenith tundra]

maybe yeah

i would say jesus dies too early as tank position also i won vg battle 2/5 time lol

[shy hazel]

ill wait for you people to test the best composition and copy it

[zenith tundra]

i really wanted to try belfast vs aurora in vg

just tried with belfast and it was way worse

still won but closer game

i would say with aurora u can kill jesus so much faster and also vg fight doesn't last 30+secs

[solar pike]

Ya Aurora is too good in a lc only meta

Imagine the poor people who still dont have Aurora in this meta, linbot play despacito

[modern tree]

I am doing more than fine without her. She's far from necessary to do pvp

[shy hazel]

i can forego any ships but not aurora

for vg

[modern tree]

And when it comes to leveling shit, I will put my whole fleet at 105 to make pve easy, then just slowly rise them to 110 whenever

Will probably have to level other stuff than my pvp to actually farm efficently

[shy hazel]

logical

you get less level disadvantage gap at 105

fighting 110

er how to explain

its like

u got 4 lvl 105 in pvp while your oppo got two lvl 110

kind of thing

id prefer having four 105s

[hot creek]

yeah but all the damage comes from backliners and having a 110 backliner will fuck shit up

[shy hazel]

mmm

[hot creek]

but idk. maybe 105 frontliners can mitigate enough damage

[shy hazel]

im only planning to max amagi for now

im not rly motivated to farm xp for foxes

[hybrid tendon]

I'm focusing on getting my foxes to 110

atm

🤔

amagi is already 110

while akaga is only ........ 103 or so

[shy hazel]

foxes dont gain as big as bbs at 110

👀

[hot creek]

is anyone here rushing levels for fw?

[hybrid tendon]

you dont need anyone on 110 on day 1

coz you cant anyway

[shy hazel]

after my pvp fleet

fw fleet

[hot creek]

you can get one 110 on day one

[shy hazel]

cos its convenient to pve with wash

[hybrid tendon]

that would be amagi then

[hot creek]

no. 700 chips from 3 starring w11 and 150 from daily

[hybrid tendon]

so

but 3 starring w11 cost a lot of oil

like LOTS

do you have enough oil

for 1 day rush

[shy hazel]

30k oil

[hybrid tendon]

do you even grind

[shy hazel]

its in mail

[hybrid tendon]

I open all my mail

[hot creek]

it wont take that much oil unless you constantly retry and fail

[hybrid tendon]

and my oil never goes over 10k

ever

and I never buy food

did quite a few 1.2 k oil commish for cubes tho

constantly

its like the best source for cubes

the only source outside daily

[hot creek]

best source of cubes is being a lucker in contruction.

[vale juniper]

#pvp

Is this good..??

[heady anvil]

ye

[shy hazel]

its meta

so yea

the gear on amakaga

isnt bis though

[vale juniper]

Yokatta~

BTW I never reach rank 1 😂

[heady anvil]

i defeat all of Amakaga meta

[shy hazel]

anyone can

[heady anvil]

that's why i'm #1 on Washington

[shy hazel]

defense is worthless in pvp

[heady anvil]

because most of people

is using amakaga

[shy hazel]

[heady anvil]

and i'm like the only one who still use

hood and enty

[meager dawn]

i would use amakaga if i had amagi

[shy hazel]

anyone can defeat anything

just reset

[vale juniper]

I play on Sandy's Server

[heady anvil]

because pvp is rng

[shy hazel]

the fleet you use doesnt matter

[heady anvil]

[shy hazel]

[heady anvil]

[meager dawn]

i can't defeat 4 guys who have the same fleet tho

[shy hazel]

amakaga if properly done you wont even need to count on rng

just click start exercise

then go pee or something

youll win with no resets

and the hardcore ppl here dont care about non season end top 1

only season end top 1 matters

[vale juniper]

Then I just waiting for Ibuki for change to Aya Aya

Idk why I just care with PvP in this game.. Hehe

[shy hazel]

we have no timeline for pr ships

so dunno

dont worry

[vale juniper]

Maybe next year..??

[shy hazel]

just be one of us

professional tryhard sandbaggers

[meager dawn]

I just want to get purins or cubes/gold boxes in the shop

[shy hazel]

we always aim for top 10 every season end

because we can

[buoyant parrot]

[shy hazel]

[vale juniper]

@shy hazel What the hell with that name..?? Haha

[shy hazel]

where is the new event?

[meager dawn]

where? not today

[vale juniper]

I never reach Admiral of The Navy yet..

[buoyant parrot]

If you want to display your true power look into the FLEET Power ranking instead

[split socket]

[vale juniper]

@buoyant parrot Nope.. I've ever Power Fleet is higher than anyone but always lose because that Defensive Fleet

[split socket]

whats the fleet power on top 3 in avrora?

[buoyant parrot]

that's a bit of contradiction there

[jovial sedge]

About jintsuu ive wrote short story would like to post it but its around 600 words

[buoyant parrot]

your fleet power displays your gear collection and Ship Lv at min-max

[vale juniper]

@buoyant parrot Yeah

[buoyant parrot]

so its off on your case how so.

[jovial sedge]

Thats what jintsuu do to people... she makes em write stories about her when you wont get her

[vale juniper]

All Jintsuu Fleet lose with my Fleet.. Hehe

[shy hazel]

i mean

[jovial sedge]

Ye if you reset ye np

[shy hazel]

@meager dawn @vale juniper 好き

[meager dawn]

wat?

[shy hazel]

thats the japanese in my name

[heady anvil]

I feel Amakaga is overrated and too mainstream

[shy hazel]

Where is the new event?

[heady anvil]

so I use

Enterprise Hood and Amagi Instead

why not

[shy hazel]

atarashii ibento ha doko deshouka

[heady anvil]

[shy hazel]

[split socket]

it isn't atarashii

[jovial sedge]

[split socket]

新しい <-- this is

[shy hazel]

my name will be too long

if i make it