history

[tough quail]

Judaism was made up to defame the Reich smh

My favorite are the ones that argue

[manic latch]

How come undef is always awake

[ivory ridge]

im not real

[tough quail]

Weeeeell you didn't take them when we tried to deport them

[desert agate]

whats wrong with them

[tough quail]

so it's fine to kill them

[desert agate]

[ivory ridge]

something something woke

[tough quail]

army cringe

navy good

[manic latch]

Do you prefer Original star wars or Disney?

[tough quail]

alright kremlin I think I'm good at deciphering you but I'm totally lost

[maiden citrus]

prequels

[ivory ridge]

can i post the ukranian army shovel ad

that was cool

[tough quail]

based

[manic latch]

[desert agate]

the original trilogy

the sequels are alright

[ivory ridge]

anyway talking about being awake

[manic latch]

As do I

[ivory ridge]

time to not be

[desert agate]

prequels are cool

[ivory ridge]

[desert agate]

but OT is superior

gn unde

[ivory ridge]

it's 6 am but still

[tough quail]

I like the prequels because I'm actually into weird logistical bullshit because I'm a nerd

[manic latch]

It's 6 am in Italy

[desert agate]

but im not sure how that relates to recruitment ads

[manic latch]

It was the safest way I can learn about

[desert agate]

https://fxtwitter.com/Australian_Navy/status/1637348316311699457?s=20

heres a fucking recruitment ad

[tough quail]

is Italy all one timezone

[desert agate]

most of europe is

[tough quail]

fair shout

[shrewd pecan]

👁️ dear god the amount of cope in the army ad comments

[manic latch]

It's a tall country but thin so should be

[tough quail]

It does kinda turn into a T so I was wondering if someone small chunk wasn't

[shrewd pecan]

https://youtu.be/swnCndIH35A

[manic latch]

Bug

[shrewd pecan]

ok what the fuck is the airforce doing for their new commercials

[manic latch]

Most effective recruitment ad was the Topgun

[shrewd pecan]

https://youtu.be/LbNP0FUItjI

you pair all of this good jet footage to the most lame openning

[frigid karma]

Germany won ww2 because they got over represented in video games and history media

Lives are temporary

[tough quail]

huh that feels way wider than us time zones but i guess that makes sense

also

[manic latch]

+Anime

[tough quail]

military recruitment ads are whatever

what confuses me is like

[frigid karma]

The words of Rommel_69420 on wot forums will be eternal

[ivory ridge]

Oh right tomorrow time changes here

[tough quail]

hardware and ordinance ads in regular main stream stuff

[ivory ridge]

Going from cet to cest

[frigid karma]

Europeans have daylight savings?

[ivory ridge]

Yes

[frigid karma]

Oh right

Ww1

[tough quail]

i swear to god i've had an ad on the fucking arknights wiki

try to sell me ATGMs

like

??????????

[shrewd pecan]

finest MILAN ATGM

[frigid karma]

Pull up those tato ads he keeps posting

[ivory ridge]

Game resets one hour later

[ivory ridge]

Frankly some ads just dont make sense

[manic latch]

So will undef wake up in more sunny morning or worse?

It will be worse isn't it

[shrewd pecan]

those are usually in industry publications

[frigid karma]

Yes

[ivory ridge]

Like I was browsing brazilian military media during the contest they did for their wheeled tank

[tough quail]

yeah i mean ones that end up on just regular ass websites or emails

[ivory ridge]

And the ad scrolling was just

[frigid karma]

Arknights is a defense industry

[tough quail]

thats just bizarre as fuck

[frigid karma]

A

[ivory ridge]

A centauro 2 ad

Like

[frigid karma]

TOWER defense industry

[tough quail]

true

[ivory ridge]

Who are you advertising to

[frigid karma]

Brazilians

Duh

[ivory ridge]

I even have it saved as a gif brb

[tough quail]

like do they expect some dude in eastern europe or syria fucking around on their phone to go

guys guys look at this pzh ad

[ivory ridge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/684722676371423267/1040024036866003034/IMG_1445.gif

[tough quail]

this thing looks sick

we should go ask for one

[ivory ridge]

the framerate is the same

it wasnt changed for the gif

that was the ad

[desert agate]

undefined is oto melaras strongest customer

[ivory ridge]

[shrewd pecan]

he has alone 1,000 Centauros in his basement

[tough quail]

recreational otomagic in the back yard

[ivory ridge]

also literal F-35 ads

like lmfao

[desert agate]

tbh theyre probably recruitment ads looking for people to work on them rather than buy them

[tough quail]

that'd make more sense

[manic latch]

Took me 10 seconds

[desert agate]

militaries sell their hardware at trade shows and the like

not by spamming government and military officials with ads

if they did id hate to see chief of defence's spam folder

HOT IFVS IN YOUR AREA

YOU'LL NEVER GUESS WHERE THIS ASHM GOES

TOO SMALL? TRY OUR 120MM APFSDS SUPPLEMENTS

[dapper parcel]

As noncredible it might be, public perception can sometimes influence procurement to lean in one way or another

Proceed to laugh in SAAB

[manic latch]

KF-51, now with even larger 130mm for better penetration

[tough quail]

her face when she realizes it's a sabot

[desert agate]

NOT LASTING LONG ENOUGH IN BED? TRY OUR NEW ENHANCED LOGISTICS PLATFORM

[ivory ridge]

but yeah i think this ad is looking for workers

not buyers

[manic latch]

Accept it

[ivory ridge]

[tough quail]

fuck off lockheed im not messing with your weird engines

[shrewd pecan]

lockheed martin military industrial complex

MY FAVORITE!

[ivory ridge]

i mean would love to find a job in the mic whenever im fucking done with uni but lmao

[desert agate]

i get recruitment ads for shipbuilding quite often

osborne is busy these days

[manic latch]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_bribery_scandals

[shrewd pecan]

👍

LOCKHEED MARTIN'S FINEST WORK!

funny honestly

[ivory ridge]

i find it insane how the only voice under italy is for the C-130

and not the whole

F-104 thing

[shrewd pecan]

Boeing buys out its largest competitor and inherits McDonald Douglas's worse aspects

[desert agate]

i like how we literally have a suburb in this city called naval base

like

[tough quail]

i actually stole all of the money poured into the DIVAD program

[desert agate]

a whole part of the city

[shrewd pecan]

then allows Lockheed to pull ahead almost completely

[tough quail]

thats why i live near a sergeant york

[desert agate]

it doesnt even contain a naval base

[ivory ridge]

not yet

[shrewd pecan]

if only

[desert agate]

[shrewd pecan]

the stupid American Abrams with ADAT missiles and dual 35 bushmasters

had a prototype made

[tough quail]

yeah seriously

that thing is so fucking dope

[shrewd pecan]

just so

[maiden citrus]

people see ads?

[shrewd pecan]

we can have it featured in more places

ah

I forgot this existed

[tough quail]

what the hell

[ivory ridge]

Oh right i even have adblock on, i think that F35 ad is

[manic latch]

Creatura

[tough quail]

what lore is this

[shrewd pecan]

BRADLY RAPIER!

[ivory ridge]

Literally wrote into the site

[desert agate]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Marine_Complex

[dapper parcel]

McDD buys Boeing with Boeing's money
I mean, looking at the board members after mergers, how is that not what was actually happened?

[desert agate]

these guys are constantly advertising to me

[ivory ridge]

In a better world

[shrewd pecan]

CENTAURO ADATS?!

[ivory ridge]

Planned but not made yeah

[ivory ridge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/684721152739770371/1088041774221631528/IMG_1487.png

Totally real

Look

[shrewd pecan]

real

[ivory ridge]

Anyway the radar was made by Italy or smth

For some reason

Contraves Italia, which was under Oerlikon

[manic latch]

Don't forget Liberty

[shrewd pecan]

I don't accept the existence of that thing

for a reason

[manic latch]

[tough quail]

hey what gives thats not a ferrari

[manic latch]

It has US air force amblem
Likely landed on wrong carrier

[dapper parcel]

Nah, red car no fast

[ivory ridge]

Famous airforce F35Bs

[tough quail]

[manic latch]

True

[shrewd pecan]

who's gonna be the one brave enough to leak enough materials for there to be a DCS F-35

[tough quail]

it concerns me that i can name all of these

[ivory ridge]

Not Ferrari but still red

[manic latch]

Vendetto

No

Ven smh

Veneno

[tough quail]

oh i didnt even know they made open top venenos tbh

rad tho

[manic latch]

China will grow larger

[tough quail]

speedrunning every flavor of jet

[ivory ridge]

While we wait for her in VB

[tough quail]

[manic latch]

Fever dream

[shrewd pecan]

the centurion staring at the freak

[tough quail]

the fuck is this shit

[frigid karma]

lady and gentlemen, i have an idea

variable time fuze shotgun shells

any questions

[dapper parcel]

that's just grenade launcher with extra steps

[frigid karma]

grenade launchers are fairly risky in CQB and can only hold six shots

not to mention, you can pull a ww1 doughboy moment and act as a human trophy system against enemy grenades

[shrewd pecan]

I mean...

if your brave enough

[strong plank]

The new Marine ad is pretty good tho

[frigid karma]

isn't that just a mortar

[strong plank]

same with the Navy ones

[frigid karma]

but full auto

[shrewd pecan]

I mean you can use it for indirect

[strong plank]

oh it’s the mk uhhhhh

what the fuck’s the designation

[shrewd pecan]

mk-19

[frigid karma]

the idea for vt fuze shotgun shells is to give shotguns strong stopping power at all ranges

[shrewd pecan]

you'd need a big shotgun for that

[frigid karma]

while working with any regular 12 gauge

it stuffs a hell of a lot of electronics in one 12-gauge shell but

it'll be cool

[shrewd pecan]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KS-23

better off just using a KS-23 at that point

[strong plank]

The ATF doesn’t want you to know this but the saggers at the gun show are legal, you can take them home with you. I have 38 sagger atgms

[tough quail]

ks-23s solve numerous problems

[shrewd pecan]

ATF doesn't know I have at least, my lawyer has advised me not to finish this statement

[tough quail]

also god sagger really sounds like a slur

[frigid karma]

sagger

[shrewd pecan]

I meant replace the r with a T

and you kinda have one

[frigid karma]

googles it
ah

[shrewd pecan]

yeah my buddy working as a school janitor keeps getting called that by the high schoolers apparently

[shrewd pecan]

bathtime

[fathom gorge]

Have a nice rest

[unborn canopy]

Got curious about Edinburghs lines about gold

What’s up with her and gold?

[fathom gorge]

So it seems to have been sunk, and Edinburgh was transporting gold

And it seems there is still 60 kg of gold left there

[manic latch]

She was carrying Soviet gold before she was sunk

[fathom gorge]

Not only that, there seemed to be British

If I remember correctly, gold was the payment for lend-lease

[manic latch]

Yep

[autumn sorrel]

What was the disadvantage of the Island being on the Carrier port side?

[thorn trail]

People are right handed and tend to pull to the left if trying to ditch

also propeller meant there was a tendency for the plane to swing to port

[manic latch]

single-engine piston engined aircraft naturally swing to the left (port). Most engines, then and now, rotate the propeller clockwise from the pilot's perspective. The torque effect makes the body of the plane twist to port.

[spring briar]

This thing is just evil

[hallow roost]

btw, is agir made by wg as something along the line of "what if an o-class ship had a smaller 12 in main gun"?

[ivory ridge]

Yes

[sullen canyon]

So, the insides of certain types of shotgun shells?

[shut wren]

what the A-4 doin?

[slow raft]

Looks like a Mirage2k

[manic latch]

O class with
Smaller 12 in guns
And a turtleback the original design didn't had irrc

[eternal veldt]

Also, it generally messed with training of pilots who are used to a starboard island

As proven with a Soryu pilot crashing on Hiryu while attempting to land due to unfamiliarity

[delicate beacon]

IIRC: Optimal Island placement in theory was starboard because in panic when pilots throttled to full from a missed landing; the engine torque meant they'd veer off portside.
The Japanese tested having paired carriers, one with port- and one starboard islands, so that the landing approaches didn't intersect when the carriers were side by side. However this turned out more trouble than it's worth.

[autumn sorrel]

Nice ammo selection

[manic latch]

"FdG is not just from wargaming, it's German history and the time-honoured tradition of naming ships the same as former ones. Ulrich and Berlichingen aren't even close to the importance that name holds"

Worthy pasta for here

[delicate beacon]

[fathom gorge]

It seems to be a foantsuz samahodka or artelleria

I remember in childhood I was a fan of assembling military equipment

[thorn trail]

Lmao isn't this talking about like the class of BB UvH is

[shut wren]

what if

we build a tank out of ERA

[manic latch]

Era loses its effect on thin armor as I know

[tough quail]

they did that its called a tiger 2

[shut wren]

ok ok

[tough quail]

heres your era

[shut wren]

bruh

does that actually work tho?

[tough quail]

sure, it just also atomizes your crew

pros and cons

[shut wren]

[manic latch]

....

What if

You put blow out panel doors for side ammunition as well

So while you can store ammo on sides it will also be safe

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1639702315656421381

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

Happy Maryland Day! The battleship USS Maryland (BB-46) served from 1921 to 1947. The Maryland survived being bombed at Pearl Harbor as well as a torpedo hit and multiple kamikaze strikes during WWII. This is a rare color image of "Old Mary" in 1945.
#MarylandDay

Twitter · Mar 25, 2023, 6:54 PM

[shrewd pecan]

what German ammo storage does to a motherfucker

[subtle prawn]

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2023/03/brazil-lays-the-keel-of-the-first-tamandare-class-frigate/

[manic latch]

Me

[sullen canyon]

Sometimes truth is stranger than fiction at times

[shut wren]

Rip F-16AJ

Or F-2?

[shrewd pecan]

F-16AJ was never made

F-2 that overran the runway

[shut wren]

I played too much w ar thunder and that was the first name that came to mind

Sorry

[unborn canopy]

As someone who plays top tier warthunder, NO

[shut wren]

As someone who plays top tier,YES

[unborn canopy]

Ew Russia

[shut wren]

USSR and china

snail bluff is helpful

[unborn canopy]

Can ERA even stop APFSDS? (Irl)

[shut wren]

add extra layer

idk

[unborn canopy]

Also where spall

How does m829a2 non-pen kontakt

[shrewd pecan]

yes

tho uhhh war thunder makes ERA like kontakt 1

far more effective than it really should be against KE rounds

[unborn canopy]

Thought as much

I know kontakt 5 is effective

But all ERA? I doubt

[shrewd pecan]

probably doesn't help that there still using the export armor scheme for the DU abrams

[unborn canopy]

Also I’m pretty sure ERA doesn’t prevent spall?

[shrewd pecan]

oh for no reason like half of the Russian top tier tanks just don't produce spall

[unborn canopy]

Waiting for leopard 2a7 with ERA

[shrewd pecan]

its not going to help you

[unborn canopy]

I can cope

[shrewd pecan]

unless you get the literal

AMAP equipped leopard 2s

idk if you want to have a leopard 2 on par with the Russian horse shit just play Sweden

[unborn canopy]

I’ve been playing type 10s

Much more fun

[shrewd pecan]

Strv-122s actually fun to play compared to my merkava's and my M1A2s

[unborn canopy]

Rapid fire dm53 (slightly worse) and 3 gen

And I can bend over

[round moth]

You forgot to tell the KS-23 barrel is make from experimental 23mm AA guns

[shrewd pecan]

its almost like

everyone knows it is

[unborn canopy]

Did the type 83 use belt fed or ready rack ammo?

[round moth]

But still, it's not really important

[shut wren]

How is the naming system different from western to eastern tanks?

[shrewd pecan]

every nation has their own naming system

[shut wren]

US compared with russia

[round moth]

:/

[unborn canopy]

Japan is type

Russia is usually T (number)

America is M1 (something) abrams

Uk is usually challenger (something)

Germany is leopard (1 or 2) followed by something

At least for modern MBTs

[shrewd pecan]

for the Germans and the Brits

only reason why there doing the leopard 1/2 or the Chally 1/2 is due to the tanks being somewhat related to each other

[unborn canopy]

An improved variant

[shut wren]

I know china is Type + number

[unborn canopy]

China is ZTZ isn’t it?

[shrewd pecan]

I wouldn't call it a improved variant

since there fundamentally new tanks

tho they can follow their lineage to the older tanks

[shut wren]

ZTZ is what western people name in

[unborn canopy]

Type or ZTZ both work

[shut wren]

in china we say type

[unborn canopy]

Lol

Japan type 10 moment

[delicate beacon]

"And how many subs do we have of the about 2500 the Germans made during WW2?
The Regia Marina was a lot larger than the Kriegsmarine, true, but it was comparatively as effective as Leipzig, which is not very."

[unborn canopy]

I’m waiting for the Chinese navy

[shrewd pecan]

never going to happen

[unborn canopy]

Still waiting for Bismarck

[shrewd pecan]

literally nothing but copy and paste for China navy

[unborn canopy]

Idk if carriers are ever going to be added

Also annoyed that battleships can fighter jets

[shut wren]

Until they decide to add modern shit

like DDGs

[shrewd pecan]

so

never

[shut wren]

what he said

[unborn canopy]

Fuso doesn’t have a plane

[shrewd pecan]

literal 6 decades worth of ships to add before China gets something more original than a shitty 80s frigate

[unborn canopy]

But her catapult is modelled

[delicate beacon]

Waiting for a Dutch TT

[shrewd pecan]

your highlight until they add VLS destroyers? Taiwanese OHPs and Kidd class destroyers

[shut wren]

everything else until top tier is copy paste in the other TTs anyways soo

[shrewd pecan]

that doesn't change the fact the entire Chinese naval tree

is just copypaste until you get to late 90s China (besides their domestic frigates that aren't too interesting)

and modern Taiwan

[unborn canopy]

They haven’t even added radar for top tier BBs

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1639789427756089347

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1945, Winston Churchill crossed the Rhine into the heartland of Germany on a U.S. Navy landing craft. The American coxswain reported that the prime minister did not say anything notable on the journey. Churchill only took his cigar out of his mouth to spit in the Rhine.

Twitter · Mar 26, 2023, 12:40 AM

[shut wren]

Tbf we were poor asf until the 90s

[frigid karma]

just dont be stock kek

[shut wren]

Not gonna help in top tier

[unborn canopy]

Russian tanks stock are so annoying

[frigid karma]

also doesn't like

[unborn canopy]

You have an auto loader and armour

[frigid karma]

wt low tier naval have modern ships

tiny ass modern ones

[unborn canopy]

Yeah

[shut wren]

da

[unborn canopy]

Japan as a hydrofoil with APDS

[slow raft]

I just wish naval had a playerbase.

[shut wren]

hard when it takes 3 minutes to kill a boat

[unborn canopy]

1 second if you’re lucky

Either you spend the whole match on one guy, one tap 30 guys or get one tapped out of spawn

[shut wren]

aim below waterline

heard that helps

[orchid notch]

Fighting Russian tanks stock is worse

[shut wren]

GAIJIN GIB TU-14T FOR CHINA

[desert agate]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1639756593133649924?t=MBu_2FW4ZnZZr0L1Uani3Q&s=33

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#SeaStorySaturday

This story was told by Rear Admiral Robert McNitt for the U.S. Naval Institute Oral History Program.

Likes

325

Twitter · Mar 25, 2023, 10:30 PM

[glass trail]

average bri ish invasion plan

imagine the panic though, thinking that new mines were being placed every few hours and none of them were getting destroyed

[autumn sorrel]

What was the Red army evaluation of Lend Lease Bazooka in combat?

[manic latch]

Not good

About 3,000 Bazooka's were supplied to the Soviets as part of lend-lease with around 5,000 rockets, but after testing the Soviets decided they didn't like the weapon and so declined further deliveries

They considered the warhead to be not very effective, extremely short ranged, and they disliked the large rocket blast from the rear of the tube.

However they liked the concept and combined with captured Panzerfaust etc, it eventually lead to RPG-1 project

[autumn sorrel]

The blast exposed the operators position?

[delicate beacon]

I get they wanted more punch. But what did they expect from a man portable AT. Did they want to pen the front of a Panther from a KM?

[autumn sorrel]

I think they would want that

[delicate beacon]

He's talking about the recoil blast. When firing recoilless weapons you shoot out all the hot gases from the other end.

[manic latch]

The back can make unexpected damage to allies yeah

[delicate beacon]

Which generally means you cant use it from an enclosed position or with people behind you.

[autumn sorrel]

Maybe doctrines dif, maybe they prefer using mass tank formation than individual AT portable weapon to deal with enemy armors

[manic latch]

Soviets used PTRD-41 usually

[autumn sorrel]

Ah, I remember this

Didn’t their uses later war tend to be anti material more than AT? I remember some manual said aim for the track and view port but that kinda hard with iron sight

[manic latch]

It can penetrate an armour plate up to 40 mm thick at a distance of 100 meters.

Not very good but if you flank the tank or smh

[autumn sorrel]

Hmm, AT rifle and AT grenade iirc

RGD-6 or something

Was that the one with the small parachute deploy mid air or that one was cold war era AT grenade?

[manic latch]

Rpg-6

[manic latch]

I think that's RKG-3

Replaced the RPG-6

[autumn sorrel]

I remember seeing some wacky video of Iraqi insurgent throwing some sort of AT grenade on an Abram once.

[spring briar]

My favourite anti-personel weapon

[shut wren]

my favorite AA weapon

[delicate beacon]

my favourite ASW weapon

[desert agate]

My favourite CQB weapon

[tough quail]

fellow enlisted enjoyers

[shut wren]

My favorite sniper

[dusty kraken]

it is definitely appropriate to use a 14.5mm round meant to penetrate tanks on a man

[shut wren]

who cares

we use 12.7 for anti infantry soo

[tough quail]

also the bazooka thing is twofold

one part is that they got the kind of shitty early ones

[shut wren]

I just run people ovr

[tough quail]

but its mostly a doctrinal thing

they wanted something you could use relatively safely from a trench or foxhole which means a rocket launcher that has a seizure over 100m out with significant backblast just

did not work

so they just stuck with shooting out optics and tracks until a t-34 showed up to properly kill the thing

[shut wren]

so

they were using this shit to kill panzers or

[tough quail]

until armor got too thick (which took longer than you'd think because german side armor was laughably trash), then ptrds were used to cripple them until bigger guns could properly hole them

[shut wren]

I see

[frigid karma]

well, it would actually be more effective at 1km

if you could hit it

bc it's coming at more of a downward angle

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1640063538067648513

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

When the Battle of Okinawa began #OTD in 1945, six sailors who had died during Commodore Perry's 1853 expedition were the only Americans buried on the island. By the time the battle ended three months later, Okinawa cemeteries would contain the graves of 10,243 U.S. servicemen.

Twitter · Mar 26, 2023, 6:49 PM

[frigid karma]

excellent against open topped vehicles, gives the crew long term cancer

[manic latch]

Why shell weight gone

[maiden citrus]

classified

[frigid karma]

Shell weight is clearly reddish orange

[spring briar]

[maiden citrus]

richie saw the word shell

[spring briar]

[spring briar]

Shell

Looks Italian

But he has a Canadian badge

[ivory ridge]

shell looks too small for the 76

so it's likely the 57

[subtle prawn]

It is

[ivory ridge]

cringe

[subtle prawn]

The next new frigates are going to have the Leonardo 127mm guns though

[ivory ridge]

much better

[spring briar]

@maiden citrus

[maiden citrus]

look at the cuties

[spring briar]

[maiden citrus]

[spring briar]

Smol WW1 cuties

Now that is a well protected waterline

[maiden citrus]

[spring briar]

Brennus rollin up on the block with smokeless powder rifles

[rapid junco]

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2023/03/brazil-lays-the-keel-of-the-first-tamandare-class-frigate/

[dapper parcel]

Sea Girrafe huh? I thought they're moving to local component

Oh, that's TRS-4D

[jagged monolith]

A day late, alas!

With a great shout “КОРЕЯ УРА!”, Lt. Colonel Ahn ‘Thomas’ Jung-Grun struck the enemy Ito Hirobumi.

Though he even inspired his own Japanese prison guards to speak in his defence, his Japanese lawyer spoke well in his favor, even his prosecutor was against his death. It was no use. When the (Japanese) Judge tried to grant him a few month’s stay in execution to finish his book, Tokyo demanded that Thomas Ahn must die, and quickly.

[strong plank]

Oh god oh fuck he has broken free

[shut wren]

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1640180824061403136

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1942, the light cruiser HMS Penelope was damaged in an air attack. Over the next several days, subsequent air attacks put so many holes in the ship that she was nicknamed "HMS Pepperpot". After the holes were plugged with long pieces of wood, she became "HMS Porcupine".

Twitter · Mar 27, 2023, 2:35 AM

[weak spoke]

Taihou yup thats me youre probably wondering how i ended up in this situation

[shrewd pecan]

https://twitter.com/A10DemoTeam/status/1640201290566496256?s=20

A-10C Thunderbolt II Demonstration Team (@A10DemoTeam)

Tucson, we’ll see you next time🐗

Twitter · Mar 27, 2023, 3:57 AM

[desert agate]

@ivory ridge Mb.326H equipped with improved avionics
One of the last aircraft ever built by CAC

[ivory ridge]

[thorn trail]

Why does Furious have a slight slope in her flight deck

[serene latch]

https://twitter.com/SgmNaval/status/1640042592703242243

Historia Naval 2GM (@SgmNaval)

Reporte del hundimiento del portaaviones USS Lexington.

Likes

106

▶ Play video

Twitter · Mar 26, 2023, 5:26 PM

[eternal veldt]

To help with plane landing IIRC.

[manic latch]

it sloped upwards about three-quarters of the way from the stern to help slow down landing aircraft, which had no brakes at that time. The fore-and-aft 320-foot (97.5 m) arresting gear was not intended to stop landing aircraft—the landing speeds of the time were low enough that this was unnecessary given a good headwind—but rather to prevent aircraft from veering off to one side and potentially falling off the flight deck

[thorn trail]

was that actually useful

like did it work as intended or nah

[ebon pendant]

Bought the last one available rn on amazon

[autumn sorrel]

Why the Royal Navy never adopt the triple 15inch layout?

[slow raft]

My guess is that they saw how the triple 16" guns really offered no advantage for what they were trying to do and just left the 15s as twins. No need to ruin a good thing

[manic latch]

various alternatives for what became the King George V class battleships. One of these, designated 15C, was for a design with nine 15"/45 (38.1 cm) guns in three triple turrets. This design was considered to be one of the best proposals for these ships, but Treaty restrictions prevented the use of guns larger than 14" (35.6 cm). For this reason, work on designs with 15 and 16 inch (38.1 and 40.6 cm) guns was discontinued and only 14 inch (35.6 cm) designs were pursued.

[delicate beacon]

Because basically, they never got around to doing so.

[autumn sorrel]

So they can but the treaty restriction force their hand

[manic latch]

Yup

There is also some discussion that 6th QE class could have get triple 15 inch

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSEUJScPyyc

[shrewd pecan]

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/common-rifles-firing-same-ammo-to-arm-finnish-swedish-forces
I didn't realize Sako made such nice looking ARs

[tough quail]

oh wow that looks way better than standard ARs

[spring briar]

What’s a standard AR nowadays

[strong plank]

Something like this

[tough quail]

yeah

visually (i know they actually arent) they just look kind of flimsy and weirdly round

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/BAES_Maritime/status/1639915195479867392

BAE Systems Maritime (@BAES_Maritime)

The stern block of HMS Cardiff, Second in Class, Type 26 made the short and controlled move round to meet the aft section this week. A significant milestone in readiness for roll out onto our hardstand in Glasgow later in the year. Well done teams! #26on26 #Type26

Likes

251

▶ Play video

Twitter · Mar 26, 2023, 9:00 AM

[spring briar]

That’s a fossil

[strong plank]

that's an M&P 15

your average civilian AR these days either has that 90s style handguard or mlok

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1640441374641119232

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1794, Congress authorized the first 6 ships of the U.S. Navy. The ship names were to be inspired by the Constitution but the SECNAV arbitrarily named one USS Chesapeake. It was the first in the long history of U.S. Navy ship naming controversies. https://t.co/9aQMPWFlUh

Twitter · Mar 27, 2023, 7:51 PM

[spring briar]

@delicate beacon

[delicate beacon]

[spring briar]

@delicate beacon

Guess the ship

[delicate beacon]

Schorpioen?

[dapper parcel]

Looks way too stubby

[ivory ridge]

https://mobile.twitter.com/3d_int/status/1640313119460171776

MODEL 3D INT (@3d_int)

4 more NG to follow, already requested by the Navy. The program says:
2 CVL
1 LHD
3 LPD
4 DDX
2 DDGH MLU (Horizon)
16 FREMM
7 PPA (5 in "Full" layout if not all 7)
8 EPC
10 SSK
@Ghpainting4 @D__Mitch

Twitter · Mar 27, 2023, 11:21 AM

[shrewd pecan]

just needs nuclear attack subs

[ivory ridge]

in our dreams kekw

[subtle prawn]

https://news.usni.org/2023/03/27/u-s-navy-officials-heading-to-scotland-to-investigate-r-v-petrel-dry-dock-incident

[jagged monolith]

There is much to be done.

Boramae continues.

[frigid karma]

but how did indonesia get involved with that particular plane?

i'm not very knowledgable on SEA relations so do indonesia and sk frequently work together on miltary projects?

[jagged monolith]

Our history is rocky.

[frigid karma]

it's asia, that's a prerequisite

but i'm more interested in the history of this plane

[jagged monolith]

KFX was supposed to be a joint project; KR and ID pays out in a 4:1 ratio.

[shrewd pecan]

Indonesians bring money alongside a guaranteed export customer

[jagged monolith]

Unfortunately as it stands that ratio is much closer to 20:1. Indonesia is laggard on payments and what payments they do make are insufficient even to compensate for inflation.

[frigid karma]

thanks for the info

[jagged monolith]

Indonesia was supposed to receive technology transfer for fighter systems development and the manufacture of a quality airframe.

With their current nonparticipation in the “co-development” scheme, Indonesia is not receiving much of anything.

[shrewd pecan]

didn't the US veto the technology transfers

[jagged monolith]

Some, not all.

More specifically.
4 vital technologies were denied transfer to South Korea.
5 others were denied to Indonesia but not South Korea.
The rest are a mixed bag where South Korea and Indonesia have negotiated significantly.

It must be said, that the denial of transfer to South Korea of the 4 vital technologies was from the perspective of the ADD and DAPA effectively guaranteed. They knew this would happen and they pushed forward anyway, with the goal of making it better than anything that would have been transferred.

The public at the time did not understand this, and the estimation of our own capacity in that time was low. It nearly tanked the project. But it went ahead with the crucial support of Indonesia and the 4 relevant technologies were developed with flying colors.

The AESA Radar, the IRST, the EOTGP, and the EW Suite were the relevant technologies. The AESA is fantastic, the IRST is good, the EOTGP is also good, and the EW suite is passable. Okay, to be level with yall, there is much fuss in DAPA propaganda about “4.5th Generation Fighter” but it’s all bad cope.

[strong plank]

It’s actually quite simple Unde

Italy just needs to convince the US that they‘ll need their support in the pacific

[frigid karma]

for what

[strong plank]

though that would be a weird lineup

[frigid karma]

drinking polynesian coconut juice?

that's the most that's going on in the pacific

[jagged monolith]

That is why KFX was never intended to just be a 4.5th. That airframe is and has always been meant for conversion. There is much to be done.

[frigid karma]

maybe we can get a pacific opsi copium

[ivory ridge]

fwiw this is the italian navy zone of operation

[strong plank]

honestly that does make sense

[ivory ridge]

and this gonna happen this year
https://decode39.com/6143/cavour-carrier-indo-pacific-italy/

[jagged monolith]

Hopefully we can sell it as a discount 5th gen lol
“Here ye gather all those who can’t get F-35 for one reason or another”

[ivory ridge]

also to be fair the tweet above is already a wishful list

the only new thing actually confirmed are the new fremm currently being built

that replaced the 2 sold to egypt

[chilly osprey]

https://twitter.com/phoenix_jz/status/1636437731004825617

Phoenix_jz (@phoenix_jz)

Tongue-in-cheek, of course... but the enlarged Mediterranean certainly keeps getting bigger and bigger.

It seems il Mediterraneo allargato has now swallowed the Indo-Pacific! Next stop, Low-Earth orbit?

Twitter · Mar 16, 2023, 6:42 PM

TO THE MOON

Also, sorry, didn't mean to leave ping on

[ivory ridge]

do we count Cavour's voyage to the US for F-35 certification for even more

[chilly osprey]

lol

But, yeah, that list seems to be fully embracing the chart Credendino was showing off

[ivory ridge]

open tweet to like it

good job past me

[chilly osprey]

Which was really reflecting operational priorities for new units, not procurement priorities

Ex, another carrier would be great to have but definitely isn't happening

[ivory ridge]

frankly i mostly just hope the DDX are more than 2

[chilly osprey]

All we know we have confirmed at this point is that the two PPA Light will be converted into PPA Full, that we're getting two new FREMM - and three PPX with the first coming in 2026

Mmm

4 DDX would be wonderful

Though, tbh, I'm of the opinion that just one more would be good

And then when the Orizzonte are replaced, procure three of those

That way each class can have the 3:1 rule maintenance cycle

And for the sake of more regular procurement, long term

But I definitely think that the MMI needs 6x DDGs overall

Personally

I'm curious to see if another pair of submarines gets procured

Because technically they could fit another pair between the second batch of NFS and the first batch of NGS

As they just started going through the motions to initiate that program, with the first batch intended to replace the first Todaro/212A between 2035 and 2040.

While the second batch of U-212 NFS should see the boats delivered in 2030 and 2031

[ivory ridge]

anyway

werent the new LPD supposed to be 2 as well

and not 3

[frigid karma]

Aside from the elephant in the room, though, what would this new fleet be expected to go against?

[ivory ridge]

turkey

[chilly osprey]

Plan is for three LXD

[frigid karma]

like

undie, you're not greek

so turkey is out

[ivory ridge]

i thought it was Trieste replacing one and then the other 2 being replaced by the LXD

[frigid karma]

iran? they have like 3 attack subs and a bunch of corvettes

so not really relevant

[ivory ridge]

also im not gonna lie

i hate all these Xs

[frigid karma]

india, mayhaps?

[chilly osprey]

No, the plan is four Trieste and the four LPDs ('LXD')

[chilly osprey]

Yeah, it's a pain in the butt, but, you always see this for programs when they're not yet officially procured

Man I miss project numbers lol

[chilly osprey]

Actually, yeah, Turkey is the major one, after Russia

They've increasingly become a concern over the past decade, given how aggressive they are in asseting what they believe is in their national interests across the Med and, ofc, in the Aegean

And it's gotten to the point where the US effectively asked the Italians to take point on containing them should things really break down.

That said

With how much the Mediterranean is re-arming or up-arming, the MMI's resources are pretty stretched, particulary for ASW assets

When you have to play "run around and keep tabs on all the Russian Kilo's fucking around in the Med 24/7", and then also have to monitor the SSK fleets of countries like Algeria, or Egypt, etc - the workload is seriously intense

And then beyond that, we're also in an era when non-state actors can throw anti-ship missile salvos of significant volume

[frigid karma]

i would think so too, but with erdogan likely being forced out (or having his political position weakened, due to the quake) in may, i'm not so sure about the future continuity of turkish foreign policy

[chilly osprey]

Keep in mind, back in 2016 the Houthi's threw an anti-ship missile salvo at a ship a US DDG was escorting, that was larger than any anti-ship missile salvo the Argentines threw at the British during the Falklands

[chilly osprey]

This kind of becomes a chain of;

a) Does Erdogan get voted out?

b) Does he give up power if he is voted out?

c) If he's out of power... does the successor government actually cut down their foreign policy ambitions?

That latter one is particulary relevant, because 'blue homeland' is a bipartisan strategic view, and one that is not going away any time soon (https://warontherocks.com/2020/06/blue-homeland-the-heated-politics-behind-turkeys-new-maritime-strategy/). We can home that Turkish politics might become more moderate if Erdogan goes, but, at the same time, the current trajectory makes it more likely they will stay, and under a leader who's weird ideas about how economics works won't be hobbling the country as much.

Turkey is going through a major program of naval modernization, so even if its fleet is not formidable currently, it more than likely will be by the mid-2030s. And the NATO navies that would be opposing any potential Turkish antics (namely, the MMI & MN, probably defending the Greeks) will need to be more robust by that point in time to keep that under control while also having to worry about the Russians - at the same time as keeping up commitments outside of the Med (the Indo-Pacific being the big one).

[shut wren]

How many factories would a country need to quickly replenish spent missiles such as ICBMs and such?

[ivory ridge]

im worried about B lol

[chilly osprey]

'

[ivory ridge]

rip to the Through-Deck design

[chilly osprey]

Mmm

Once upon a time, the plan was for three smaller LHDs along with Trieste

[frigid karma]

well, if b) is a no, then turkey has bigger problems ensuing besides foreign naval policy

[chilly osprey]

And I think that's the era in which potentially only two of the LXD were going to be procured

[ivory ridge]

Nato intervention against Erdogan forces

[manic latch]

Nato against Nato

Interesting

[manic latch]

I don't think Turkey will change since it's a dickrace with Greece

And when you get bigger navy you get more confident

So this is the TB-3

Ones Anadolu will operate

Folding wings

[shrewd pecan]

If ICBMs are being flung there will be no factories left to produce new ones

[shut wren]

Bad wording my bad

like

cruise missile

like short range ones

[shrewd pecan]

in 2022 the US Navy purchase 70 new built tomahawk cruise missiles

In terms of maximum theoretical yearly production rates who knows

additionally number of factories doesn’t really matter since theoretically one big factory can produce as many missiles as many small ones

[shut wren]

one factory can produce as many missile as one factory

big brain

[shrewd pecan]

my bad

anyways it just boils down to how much capital your throwing at missile production

[shut wren]

I see

so

more monies

= more missile

[shrewd pecan]

Alongside how long it takes to get production going at a higher rate

[shut wren]

So

once they start production effectiveness goes up?

[shrewd pecan]

basically just gets down to the theoretical mass production rate of a facility and getting said facility to said rate

[shut wren]

[shrewd pecan]

Then factoring in expansions or other facilities being built to expand it

Throw in your inputs such as microchips, rocket motors so on and so on

Just turns into supply change management and getting the production line going

[shut wren]

ok ok

also manpower and skill workers?

[shrewd pecan]

For decades the US and NATO due to well low intensity conflicts and a abundance of Cold War era stockpiles basically slowed down their rates of production to where a lot of the production capacity degraded

[shut wren]

I can see that

[shrewd pecan]

It’s why the US and NATO are scrambling to supply Ukraine with enough shells without overly depleting their own stockpiles

And since this capacity has been off for decades it’s taking longer to reactive it

[shut wren]

so basically

a sword gets dull if you dont use it

same logic

[shrewd pecan]

If you don’t maintain your defense industry it degrades

If your industry is only used to producing some 100k shells per year and suddenly has to ramp up production or a million or more a year

It takes time to reactivate old production lines or expand existing ones to higher volume

Throw in doing that for the entire supply chain and you see where the problems start

[shut wren]

I see

so like

uhh

wait brb

[shrewd pecan]

It just turns into a supply and demand issue is a easiest way to sum it up

[shut wren]

I see

[ivory ridge]

It would be NATO against a non recognized power

So technically fine

[shut wren]

So like

yall know how China names big ships after provinces n shit?

how does the USN name its big ships

[manic latch]

Look at their names

[shrewd pecan]

Presidents, admirals, notable sailors

So on and so on

time to time named after older ships like enterprise

Or locations of famous battles like Saratoga and Lexington

[shut wren]

ok ok

[subtle prawn]

Carl Vinson and John C. Stennis don't meet any of those requirements

[dapper parcel]

It isn't presidents, it's more like politicians that have significant contribution to the navy or had served in the navy. Preferably both

[shrewd pecan]

that as well

[dapper parcel]

Tho sometimes weird shit happens, like LCS-10

[thorn trail]

3rd Saratoga CV pls

[dapper parcel]

Next Saratoga probably will be DDG(X), or LHA at best

[shut wren]

During flight,can a pilot detach a AAM as a makeshift bomb?

[thorn trail]

pretty sure AAMs barely have any explosives in them

[shrewd pecan]

Doesn’t have the explosive mass to be effective

[shut wren]

^ what he said

[shrewd pecan]

Anyway you ever just

[shut wren]

mf got all the tank features

[manic latch]

Reminds me those French car thingies

Steel wheels on middle

[jagged monolith]

[manic latch]

Real reason

[maiden citrus]

[shrewd pecan]

yeah your facing off against the total defense communist state we all know

[manic latch]

1990 was death of Military Industrial complex since Cold war was over
2000 had some stable awakening since Middle east thingies
2010s were idle but Asia was being seen more as a threat so projects were slowly awakening
Then 2020s we get proxy war

2030s could be most important

[tough quail]

lets goooooooooo

[jagged monolith]

2,400 155mm barrels of Moon Jae-In. Towed gun? What’s that?

Even if the enemy is the DPRK, the number and quality of our 155mm barrels is simply unrivaled. Nah, we just really, really, like making things go boom.

The ROKA may be broken institutionally and filled with apathetic conscripts that have no business firing a gun, much less fighting wars, but in artillery it suffers no rival.

[shrewd pecan]

I mean every conscript army is usually just full of apathetic conscripts who hate life

since national service is just a national trauma unless you know

your fighting for your nations survival

[jagged monolith]

I can’t tell if the conscripts would bolt and run or go insane and start doing berserker charges

neither is good

[shrewd pecan]

I mean it boils down to just keeping them motivated when the true fight comes

[jagged monolith]

ROKA is particulalry bad.

Our rates mean we don’t just conscript cowards, everyone conscripts cowards, we conscript the physically and mentally ill.

[manic latch]

Wait

Is that a good thing

[jagged monolith]

As long as the recruiter can cover it up, that is.

[shrewd pecan]

no

[jagged monolith]

do you think

[manic latch]

But why...

[jagged monolith]

a genuinely mentally stunted

[shrewd pecan]

recruiters get bonuses the more they recruit

[jagged monolith]

and I mean in the medical sense

[shrewd pecan]

and uhhhhhhh

[jagged monolith]

dude

wielding a fucking gun

is a good idea

[manic latch]

Sparta but reverse

[jagged monolith]

Scraping the barrel can be done but at some point the conscripts are about as helpful as actively introducing enemy saboteurs.

[jagged monolith]

in our case it’s just the examiners

but I am genuinely forced to question if some of the people they press into service have any utility

Even as cannon fodder.

[tough quail]

north korea basically strangling the south by just existing

and making them do crazy shit like this

[autumn sorrel]

I mean, it can't be that bad, you have to maintain a certain readiness in more specialized unit like Artilery, mechanized and armour, unless you staff those units with conscript as well

[jagged monolith]

We are one people and the oneness continues to being insufferable to each other.

[jagged monolith]

The border is the problem.

Unless we mine every inch of the DMZ, which is not an option, we need to be able to keep them out somehow or otherwise have a deterrent so powerful it can keep them contained.

[manic latch]

Does US minimize the involvement of foot soldiers?

Since from what I see they try to do everything by vehicles mostly. Especially air force and naval missiles

[strong plank]

depends on the situation

[jagged monolith]

With only perhaps 200,000 and less to draw from, we may have to give up completely on border defense.

[autumn sorrel]

Their BCT from what I read is heavily mechanized, smaller squad but with greater emphasize on fire support

[strong plank]

in Kosovo NATO wanted to avoid putting troops on the ground

hence the bombing campaign

[manic latch]

Iraq is also air force heavy Carry no?

[strong plank]

Iraq was everyone

[autumn sorrel]

On the first few months but the Army have to get in and involve in some of the heaviest fight

You need boots on the ground at the end of the day, you can't secure a nation through air power alone

[manic latch]

[strong plank]

pretty sure Army troops crossed into Iraq on day 2

unless you mean Desert Storm

[autumn sorrel]

200k in fully staffed units or ROKA maintain skeleton divisions, ready to be fill with reservist when war happened?

[jagged monolith]

No I mean 200,000 manpower pool total

[autumn sorrel]

The Invasion, I mean

[jagged monolith]

Of which maybe 70-80% is usable

[autumn sorrel]

That low?

[jagged monolith]

with the lax aforementioned standards

[jagged monolith]

boi

it gets lower

We are in freefall.

[frigid karma]

*painfully existing

[jagged monolith]

Sooner or later we’ll hit rock bottom, then we’ll see what we can do from there.

[autumn sorrel]

Holy, PAVN have like 5 mil reservist, the quality is bad but we still able to maintain that pool, how did it got so bad? No people want to fight?

[strong plank]

but yeah no there were troops on the ground even on day 1

[jagged monolith]

No babies

[autumn sorrel]

Ah, the birth rate

[strong plank]

like you had royal marines landing at Al Faw on day 1

[autumn sorrel]

I imagine the Iraqi army was really shocked at the time

[jagged monolith]

We might have to develop nukes just to keep DPRK away while we figure out something, that’s how bad this is.

[strong plank]

sorry not the marines, the 16 Air Assault Brigade

the brits landed on the peninsula, while the Marines, SEALS, and Polish GROM took the platforms

[autumn sorrel]

So the north can throw men at a problem when the South can only throw shells at it. Very Cold war classic!

[strong plank]

and the Aussies provided naval gunfire support

and thus five inch friday was immortalized into history

[manic latch]

I thought that was Black Friday

[autumn sorrel]

Instead of Shopping, Aussie lop shells at Iraqi

[jagged monolith]

If we don’t figure this out we won’t have a country to defend.

So yeah, either we figure something out, or we let DPRK roll into Seoul.

[manic latch]

Goddamn Kizilelma is big, not Glob level but it's there

[autumn sorrel]

Not to be a downer but you at least have American on your side

[jagged monolith]

That doesn’t matter if South Korea no longer exists.

[manic latch]

America would need to bomb South Korea if it's taken I think

[autumn sorrel]

Well, depend on the Administration but SK existance is importance enough for American to throw their soldier at

[jagged monolith]

Honestly if nobody’s living in Seoul anymore and DPRK strolls in

good

They win. Better than letting the land and everything go to waste.

[manic latch]

Well it worked for Moscow. French did take it but when it burned it backfired to them

[autumn sorrel]

Unless the next admin is isolationist that they completely retreat from asian and left china uncheked

[jagged monolith]

I don’t think you understand.

[manic latch]

Scorched Earth comrade

[jagged monolith]

It is a distinct possibility Seoul will be populated by only ghosts within the century.

[jagged monolith]

Why?

[autumn sorrel]

SK people really fall down that hard?

[jagged monolith]

We are one people, though time has created some superficial differences.

Even that, healing now.

[manic latch]

But if North Korea takes South. Would America just let it go?

Doubt

[jagged monolith]

If they want to rebuild Korea, let them try where we failed.

[jagged monolith]

We figure something out or we’re fucked, I told you.

[autumn sorrel]

I don't think Kim or anyone in NK is the guy to do it. They are nutjob even by Communist standard. Best case you get is a slowly gradually open country in like decades, bad case you get a even bigger hermit kingdom.

[jagged monolith]

What are they gonna do, fight for a massively oversized old people’s home?

[jagged monolith]

The DPRK system is currently on a time bomb, one that’s just as threatening as low birth rates. Nobody believes in it anymore. Even moreso, the people in it have somewhere to point to.

No one in DPRK born after 2000 believes in the system and really only obeys because they want to climb the ranks. Not even fear anymore, North Korea’s police apparatus is a shell of its former self.

The bosses pretend to give orders, and everyone pretends to obey.

[autumn sorrel]

Well, you still have a good few year before everything go to shit, better enjoy the present than overthink too much

You keep thinking about it and it will get even more depressing

[manic latch]

Realistic

Nihilism is based sometimes

[jagged monolith]

We’ll figure something out.

[manic latch]

Another Great Depression coming bois

[autumn sorrel]

And it is American who started it, again

[strong plank]

nah

[manic latch]

[strong plank]

the second NK declares war it'll be like

either the US provides arms like [current event] but x10

[manic latch]

This is significantly harder since

[jagged monolith]

declare war?

[manic latch]

They aren't land connected

[jagged monolith]

they’ll just march in

[manic latch]

US navy has to deliver weapons and air force

No trains

[strong plank]

or the marines get to do Inchon 2 electric boogaloo

[maiden citrus]

probably easier

[jagged monolith]

how can you declare war if the South Korean Government no longer exists

[autumn sorrel]

I don't US can't reliably send men, they are slowly becoming anti war with aversion to foreign intervantion

[strong plank]

you say that like that's not something the US does any time we go to war

[maiden citrus]

instead of shipping overseas then over land you just put it in the south korea port

[jagged monolith]

Who’s gonna fight

these 70 year olds?

[manic latch]

Yes when US does. But will she join or keep it proxy?

[strong plank]

now our sealift capabilities have deteriorated, and it would be nice if the gov could kindly unfuck our shipbuilding industry to fix it

[autumn sorrel]

Conscript everyone, and maybe add the commissar system as well

[jagged monolith]

conscript these old men great idea

can we just let the DPRK win?

[manic latch]

Conscript Kpop

[autumn sorrel]

Isn't that require a lot of book need to be clear and restart the industry again?

[autumn sorrel]

No, Commie cannot allow to win

[jagged monolith]

That sounds less painful than trying to fight a war with a population consisting almost entirely of fossils.

[strong plank]

we fucked over our industry by adding requirements

iirc its like

[autumn sorrel]

Blame Congress for that

[manic latch]

America is really afraid of communism, they won't allow even if South Korea gives up in my personal opinion

[strong plank]

any shipbuilding company that builds for the Navy cannot also build for the commercial industry

[autumn sorrel]

It not even Commie at this point, mostly China

[jagged monolith]

good luck trying to sell a war to defend a nation that doesn’t even exist

[manic latch]

Afghanistan flopped because government escaped right

[strong plank]

Afghanistan was mission creep

[autumn sorrel]

The "National" gov don't even have grass root support

[strong plank]

went in without a clear plan, and then more and more kept being added to the mission

[manic latch]

Damn

[autumn sorrel]

FFS, just hunt down and kill the Taliban, don't do the "Nation building" BS

[jagged monolith]

Trying to sell a war to defend what is for all intents and purposes an uninhabited wasteland is stupid.

[jagged monolith]

problem is they’ll come back

[strong plank]

"we aren't here to build a nation"
"ok we might do some rebuilding but not long-term"
"ok we might be working here long-term but"

[jagged monolith]

“Get in get out”
Oh noes the taliban came back and are plotting more terrorist attacks

repeat ad infinitum

[strong plank]

not even about communism anymore

more that the DPRK is a rogue state

[autumn sorrel]

They could have just left Afghan alone and the Taliban will self implode itself

[strong plank]

you don't really want to turn a blind eye if a country like that decides to roll onto its neighbor

[manic latch]

Omg is that a mofo Topgun reference

[jagged monolith]

good thing the neighbor no longer exists then

[autumn sorrel]

No, it is a standard description

[autumn sorrel]

There's Japan

[strong plank]

South Korea will still exist, I'm sure of it

[jagged monolith]

they’re not rolling into japan in this hypothetical scenario I’m sure

[strong plank]

there's always immigration to ease demographic trends

[jagged monolith]

if we fucking die

I say let them have the peninsula

we’re one people anyway

[manic latch]

[autumn sorrel]

Oh, it is not good to propose immigration in East Asia

[strong plank]

that's not to say reunification is like

easy at all

[autumn sorrel]

It isn't America where everyone can immigrate to

[strong plank]

like if we thought german reunification in the 1990s was rough

[jagged monolith]

If South Korea exists then we will presumably have found a solution and the discussion of “should we just let the DPRK have the lands that used to be ROK” is redundant.

Because the ROK will exist.

[jagged monolith]

I have faith it will happen. We can’t keep going like this.

[strong plank]

at least the east germans wanted to get out

[manic latch]

Leaders matter alot on that ye

Gorbachev vs Stalin would have significant difference on their handling of Germany unification

[strong plank]

I'm more talking like

economic costs

[manic latch]

Ah

[autumn sorrel]

North Vietnam and South Vietnam was separated for like 30 yrs and we still find it hard to integrated with each other, hell some even hate outright. I have doubt on whether NK and SK can actually find a mutual voice

[strong plank]

sorting out government

the sheer undertaking that would have to happen

[jagged monolith]

It would be a multigenerational labor.

[strong plank]

at least the east germans wanted to break free

[jagged monolith]

But it has to be done because we can’t keep going like this.

[strong plank]

I don't even want to think about how deep the indoctrination goes in the dprk

[jagged monolith]

Nobody believes in it anymore.

[autumn sorrel]

But they don't know any system other than it

[strong plank]

I'm not talking officials

the average citizen

[autumn sorrel]

They can hate it but the possibility of unknown is even scarier

[jagged monolith]

If one good thing has happened between the Koreas these past few years with the rise of the internet, it is that information has become freer than ever even in that dark place.

[autumn sorrel]

NK army at that point in time was actually more battle hardened and well equip than the south

[jagged monolith]

The Regime is suppressing the use of the Seoul dialect.

Why do you think that is?

[autumn sorrel]

Too many people watch K-drama?

[jagged monolith]

More importantly why would that even be a problem?

Why would the Seoul dialect, South Korean words, South Korean media, why would it even be a problem?

[autumn sorrel]

Bc if you don't control even the smallest aspect of your citizen life, they will have rebellious thought

[jagged monolith]

They can’t contain this anymore.

Too many inflows of information contrary to the regime’s thought.

[autumn sorrel]

That's I kinda agree, the amount of info flow through back channel are enough to at least affect the people

[jagged monolith]

Chinese media couldn’t do this. English media couldn’t do this. Japanese media couldn’t do this.

[autumn sorrel]

So solution is more Kpop and K-drama?

[jagged monolith]

Only Korean media can reach out to North Koreans. Flowing through balloons, smugglers, gifts.

[autumn sorrel]

No offense but K-drama starting to get a bit stale nowaday. The plot keep repeating and rarely any new thing.

[jagged monolith]

Along with other media.

Literature. Holy Texts.

Do you know what the DPRK fears and hates more than anything? What the regime is more afraid of and will punish harsher than anything else?

[autumn sorrel]

Heh, I don't think I can say I am a fan of the Korean Christian brand, no offense but it is weird.

[jagged monolith]

The DPRK fears Christianity.

All religion is persecuted but Christianity doubly so.

[autumn sorrel]

So people have someone to worship other than Kim?

[jagged monolith]

But that’s off topic.
Not just K-Dramas.

[autumn sorrel]

Same for every Commie States, people can't have religion so the Communist will become the new spiritual guidance

[jagged monolith]

Food gifts through smuggling channels. Flags. Dictionaries. Compilations of photos. Goods. Compilations of poems.

[manic latch]

Communism and religion can't co exist yeah

[jagged monolith]

It can’t just be K-Dramas, it has to be everything about us, and eventually everything about the outside World, too. Through hidden channels and secret ways.

[autumn sorrel]

Tell me about it, my grandpa was a devout Buddhist but he nearly got persecuted when Vietnam have our own little version of "Cultural revolution". Thanksfully it was short and small scale.

[autumn sorrel]

Well, bootleg dvd and film actually a good way to infiltrate and undermine the regime

People crave entertainment, and when you show them a world outside of what the Regime told them, seeds of doubt are sown

[jagged monolith]

If you believe in a religion you will be sent to a labor camp for many years.

If you believe in Christianity you will at best be sent to a concentration camp for life or executed publically.

[manic latch]

Love how removing something brings another problem no matter what

[autumn sorrel]

I don't known what to feel about that one, why Jesus get harsher treatment than Buddha?

[jagged monolith]

I’m not sure.

It might be personal.

[manic latch]

Because Buddha is more Asian origin?

[jagged monolith]

Kim Il Sung’s father and mother were devout Christians.

[autumn sorrel]

I remember some NK defector said the DPRK teaching is copy from the bible

[jagged monolith]

Many of NK’s idiosyncracies date back all the way to Kim Il Sung’s time. His friends, his family, his battles.

[autumn sorrel]

Maybe Buddhism is more peaceful? Funny when Buddha was literally a Warlord before he see the way

[manic latch]

There is something similar as
Christian communism. 

[jagged monolith]

The brutal persecution of Christianity might be one of them.

[jagged monolith]

No, I think it’s complicated.

Christianity was the first thing Kim Il Sung destroyed when he got to power. Before anything else he murdered as many church leaders and destroyed as many of their institutions as he possibly could.

[autumn sorrel]

Why does read like some political party in Germany

[manic latch]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_communism

[autumn sorrel]

It even sound more braindead than normal socialist

[manic latch]

There is also Budhist socialism ye

[autumn sorrel]

Fucking hell, Commie can't leave anything be can't they

[jagged monolith]

Pyeongyang was called Jerusalem of the East. Christianity thrived in the Northern parts of Korea, and it served as a constant thorn in the side of Japan.

[autumn sorrel]

I thought Joseon dynasty banned Christianity?

[jagged monolith]

Kim Il Sung, if I venture to guess, hated and feared Christianity because it served as a constant reminder that he did not liberate Korea (alone, at any rate; Kim definitely helped) and an alternative to he himself. It was the only thing that could have opposed him.

[jagged monolith]

They tried.

It worked, for a time.

But they couldn’t keep it down indefinitely, and the best of men and women came to Korea and loved it more than themselves.

So many missionaries died in Korea not only because they wanted to spread the gospel but because they loved Korea more than Koreans.

They loved us more than they loved themselves, and they loved us more than we loved ourselves.

[manic latch]

Koreaphiles

[jagged monolith]

The most famous example is one Mr. Homer Hulbert. He saw Hangul and thought to make it more beautiful, and added spacing. He wrote newspapers in Hangul and helped us publish our voice in our own language in our own way of writing.

When Koreans left Hangul to rot, a foreigner loved it and cared for it.

[manic latch]

We cope about Aliens in same way

That they may love earth more than us and help with technology and development

[autumn sorrel]

Heh, I can def see American love Kr more than America

[manic latch]

Americans usually don't know the luck they have

Desire smh better