(C/K)onqueror's Guild Live Beta Discussion

[magic lion]

Now if other metrics are added that's fine. But as they sit, they're going to be more unobtainable in a couple years than the old leaderboards were.

[winged carbon]

The system should be based on colony reputation rather than guild level

Reputations can change, which means that rankings can evolve more than guild levels, which can only increase

[magic lion]

Yeah. The thing is we're basically back to the old leaderboards at that point, so why were they even changed at all lol

[winged carbon]

No idea 🤷🏻‍♂️

[frozen wasp]

Future-proofing for any additional guilds not yet implemented, along with potentially allowing for future modifications to be made easier.

[magic lion]

Fair enough. Is it that complicated for modifications to the old vs the new though? If the old is still around for everyone with the exception of PvP lb being removed for new world. Unless the plan is to remove all of the old leaderboards entirely at some point

I don't have any coding experience so genuine question lol. I know sometimes a clean slate can be easier

[pliant needle]

But we were told clean slate wouldn't happen. So no, clean slate shouldn't happen.

[frozen wasp]

Clean Slate for the code, but not the leaderboard mayhaps
I don't know the inner workings either, nor what future plans have been drafted or planned or whatever

I'm just here to help ground ourselves a bit, and not go into a downward spiral.

[winged carbon]

The current system is not yet the final product, so we'll have to wait and see if there are any changes. Hence the purpose of this thread (sounds like I work in marketing)

It's almost horrible

[swift flame]

I am curious about the density, partially due to the goal that true players at their current tier can overtake T11s othersouls. I keep having people throw around the number of crowns they have as compared to territories. Which I understand is comparable when someone controls all 5 crowns of each settlement. But if the goal is to have people at tier have an easier time vs othersouls then this leaves T11 players with only 1/5 of the crowns everyone is bragging about as they get whittled down to just the emperor of each settlement. Right? Or else everyone starts making alts for the T3 through T9 tiers? Which to me kinda ruins it? What is everyone's thoughts on this?

[pliant needle]

Those alts will not have any better gear than the other players though right? It may be even worse because they are not regularly played accounts like the ones that players main. The idea of using alts doesn't seem logical to me. It seems to me like the other souls would have a better chance at top gear than an alt.

[cursive solar]

The problem you end up with on alts is keeping their exp low so you still lose out on accessories and head slot.

[glossy surge]

excuse me?

34 proof of crownships!!?

did they change the softcap or you massively invested only on corwnships?

People complaining about not having access to the beta has no place in chats about figuring out if the beta is working correctly. You are just derailing conversation and making our desire to share the outcomes we are finding, less desired

I am starting to think Beta channel access should be restricted

[cursive solar]

My t6 alt gets around 40 exp from taking a settlement while wearing a ring of restraint and great mimics head.

[glossy surge]

if you need help with that, you could poke Exp-Less

but that seems to track with how he has to wear every single exp reducing items to get his numbers down

[cursive solar]

I could lower it with another ring of restraint but I like having ring of day

[winged carbon]

I don't know anything about this limit which, like the materials, seems to be rising by 1 a day.

[glossy surge]

yeah looking at your other screenshots, you were above 20 for a while

[winged carbon]

Indeed

[frozen wasp]

Even if you got to Lv. 149 with 0 exp over the requirement, and then exclusively did the crownship fights (never any quest, monster, boss, raid, etc.) you could do 995k Player Kills, with that exact exp gained.

not an issue imo

[glossy surge]

that is nice to know the crownship are not too hardcaped

it means someone can get.... 2 scrolls a day...... or an heart of change a month!

the store really does not have much to offer if/when you don,t need to unlock things, this guild is all about the ownership rewards

[winged carbon]

The objects obtained are rather redundant

[glossy surge]

could be cool if you could use crownship tokens to buy materials focusers, to say, set the material rewards to something specific for x days

[tepid zodiac]

✅

[winged carbon]

I haven't bought anything yet

[magic lion]

Maybe the additional rewards we're seeing are the, 'the longer you hold the settlement, the better the rewards'?

[glossy surge]

so instead of a rotating list of materials you buy, it is a rotating list of material focusers you can buy and then use before opening your daily reward

[glossy surge]

that would be somewhat insane

nothing in how the guild work tells you that owning for the long term would net you more, at least in the UI the UX and the text

[magic lion]

Why though? If it's only increasing by 1 a day per stack. Eventually settlements will also stop giving rewards if thered no interaction

[glossy surge]

same, i am at 37 days (at current rates) from getting what I want

[glossy surge]

pretty much

[magic lion]

It was discussed long ago. Odie had said there was a benefit the longer you held them

Given, that could have changed

[glossy surge]

there is no visibility on that scaling bonus one way of the other

still waiting to see how long it takes before a settlement deactivate

[magic lion]

I'm curious as well. There are a few other players around me that interact with the settlements though. Does that keep the NPC's off you if they're close to your OT? I haven't gotten any NPC notifications

[glossy surge]

i am still getting the full reward from my roadtrip last weekend

will see how long that last

next roadtrip is next weekend

[magic lion]

Prior territory control was about a month. I would assume this is similar

[glossy surge]

that would be cool

would allow me to coast untill I hit 800 tokens, just need to hit lvl 20 with the guild

In my checklist of things that needs to happen in the beta

• NPC taking over my crownship to confirm behavior and notification
• Crownship decay (if it is a month then for the sake of other players, we don,t need to wait that long)
• still not happy with how the game does not tell you that there is no point in mass selecting the item and crownguard choices as you will only get 1 max

[cursive solar]

Yeah, 40 to 52 exp isn't so bad. I was just pointing out that you're not really gaining both accessory slots by playing alts.

[magic lion]

Othersouls are 100% getting removed from settlements without notification.

Along the entire stretch of freeway to work, I hold the emperor spot only and all othersoul slots I occupied have been removed and the spots unoccupied. Every single settlement I've taken has two crownguards occupied minimum with almost all of them being fully occupied

[pliant needle]

I have seen this also. No notifications.

[glossy surge]

when did you take them?

and when did they vanish?

because i know at the start of the week, Odie made a big reshuffeling round to reduce conventration

[tepid zodiac]

Um no

Why old school rename cost new school proofs?

I don't like it.

[opal vector]

OH MY GOSH. I LOVE THIS. But only if both are an option. Both should be an option.

[tepid zodiac]

The Empire of Lady Jennifer must grow. Aptalon will expand.

Please odie.

[opal vector]

Wait, no, I hate this. Doesn't that mean I don't have to control the area to rename it? Or was that always the case?

[tepid zodiac]

You have to own it.

It's the old area control.

I renamed the hotels or places I stay usually.

[opal vector]

This was a concern I had that I forgot about. How does this work, if new players can't take territory?

[tepid zodiac]

It doesn't. They don't see it.

It's for the elderly players

[opal vector]

I'm gonna rename the entirety of downtown Ceri Tonio Throne of the Empress.

Oh no no no I hate this. I very hate this. This is what I like about territory vs settlements. The concept that I rule an area, and that I fought others to take their land.

Settlements don't give me that same feeling.

[magic lion]

They vanished in the past 7 hours. I can tell there was a small poi shift in the area, but that doesn't change the fact I know I owned all or a minimum of at least 2 crownguards on every settlement in the area that I've seen

[opal vector]

I don't want to take their cities. Their cities were weak, because they lost to me. I want to burn their cities down, and rebuild them anew. Stronger than before. Better. And filled with the love of their Empress.

[magic lion]

Pretty sure the poi shifts are somehow dropping crownguards and making the space unoccupied. This is the only time I'm seeing this happen

[opal vector]

I think it's both.

I took every single top crown in San Antonio the night CG came out. I drive the grid. I did not miss a settlement. After the several POI shifts, there were a good number of new ones I didn't own. And I rarely come across old ones that were outside of my zone of capture that I nonetheless own.

[magic lion]

I hate that the response we get is that the messages are pre set so there's 100% going to be a notification instead of looking into the problem so many players are reporting..

[opal vector]

That said, I don't care very much, as looking as there's no reset.

I still haven't recieved a single NPC capture notification. Unless I don't know how the mechanics work, this should be impossible.

I do get plenty of player capture notifications.

(And after day 3 ish, I haven't purchased any ramparts)

[magic lion]

If you tap the settlement all of your health will be restored fyi. Like how it used to be a long time ago

[opal vector]

That coooouuuuld be why? I tap my rps as often as possible. But unless the OT capture radius is tiny, I simply cannot be that thorough. My conquests are random, because of Uber.

[magic lion]

I'm thinking interaction keeps the NPCs from attacking? I can't remember if that was supposed to be the case or it didn't matter around your OT

[opal vector]

My OT is currently at a Target, and I NEVER get trips past that Target. I drove down there to take the settlements, and haven't been down there since.

[magic lion]

Someone else may be interacting with them? But I honestly have no idea because I haven't gotten an npc notification either

[opal vector]

Without specific numbers for NPC attack timing, radius of attacks around your OT, and how these mechanics generally work, it's impossible for us to say necessarily what is happening. We can only provide our experiences, and let Odie draw conclusions from it.

[magic lion]

Yep. I was just about to say that lol. Impossible for us to know what's intentional and what's not. Maybe the decision is still being made on what's intended and what's not 😆

Damn I don't have the meme anymore someone save the day

[opal vector]

I support it if that's his goal. I like things having to be discovered. But it makes it harder for us to provide the best feedback as well.

Oh, I came here to with in on the leaderboard discussion. I forgot.

I like the Guild leaderboard being all about experience. Isn't that the point of Guild leaderboards?

However, it takes away from the war feel. I personally like the idea of a separate "war" leaderboard, where the primary factor is how many Crowns you currently hold, with some minor factors potentially including higher weight for proximity near your OT, higher weight for holding entire settlements, higher weight for holding the top crown, and some variation based on how "hot" you are. Taking more recently or losing more recently. It gives me a reason to get stronger. Cause right now, I don't have much reason. Losing Crowns means I can retake them, leading to more exp.

[primal oar]

Haven't seen an npc message yet, but a bunch of settlements got shuffled around, some added

[magic lion]

I think people wanted the leaderboards updated. IE mainly global and having towers, fishing, etc most of the new additions count towards it. Guild leaderboards were brought up instead of revamping the old, but I don't think players really anticipated it to be based off xp in every single guild. I would expect the fishing guild to be fish caught included, towers how many towers you have completed, conq guild based off settlements etc. Solely xp encourages macroing WAY more than the old leaderboards imo. And macro detection outside of spoofing is abysmal at best, left up to player discovery/non-existent at worst. XP leaderboards are also going to be damn near impossible for any new player to catch in 1 or 2 years time. The old leaderboards are still very obtainable even years later

[rapid fossil]

Wait, is it not possible to get T3 arena gear as a T10?!

[magic lion]

Nope :/

[little sentinel]

Interesting…someone needs a serious chocolate correction

[glossy surge]

No clue what you are implying there

English only language people thinking everyone only lives in England and Murrica wasting everyone else's time

[sacred spade]

That's a weird amount of hostility for no reason

[spark glade]

slow blinks

[glossy surge]

I just have no clue what he meant and he decided to laught emogi tag my request for clarification, so yeah

C'est pas la marde du pape que je demande sti. google translate existe pas pour les jeu de mots

[rapid fossil]

I... Seriously? My account is, I suspect, older than some of that gear, so I have none of it. Those of us that fall into that category have an extreme disadvantage in our T2/T3 Othersoul. I'm going to start a suggestion thread, but ... Please don't lock us out of that gear anymore, NF. I humbly ask of you!

[glossy surge]

yah I was supprised when i was reminded of that gear, I remember how strong some of it was for me at low tier 2 years ago

[rapid fossil]

It's very strange. I was wondering why my alts had ten ornates but my main had none.

[spark glade]

If I were to wager a guess... I guess maybe the thought is you'd feel better after enjoying a piece of chocolate? As in, if the sugar cravings are so bad you end up snippy and it'd be solved with a bit of chocolate. "Hungry? Have a Snickers" in a different format

Just a guess though

[glossy surge]

yeah, I guess the only cultural thing that would had made me understand is the snicker bar commercial

Don,t really have a "eat chocolate to make you less cranky" type thing

but i heard that stupid comercial tons of time

[spark glade]

I know when my sugar cravings are at their worst they're really hard to ignore and I have to do something to either get past it or satisfy it. Usually it's me caving and I go get ice cream

[glossy surge]

I guess that is a thing

[spark glade]

Yup @3@

[glossy surge]

but yeah, people complaining they can,t play the beta because of IOS have been plaging every conversation i've seen in the last weeks and it is not helping the devs in any way at making sure the beta is done

Not our fault, and not the dev's fault IOS is shit at being developper friendly

Great device, great ecosystem, shit at rapid iteration of third party software

[acoustic steppe]

Aren't they obtainable same as old ones? Your dung/quest/bosses/monster count doesnt drop either. It just show who is active where. 🤷‍♂️

I would also leave conq guild lb as it is. It is only exp for guild lb. But the need for proper competitive one is obvious, one that reflect current area strenght/reputation like before.

All of that come down to "how much time do you want to invest in the game".

[opal vector]

I like Guild LBs being based on exp. To me, it makes sense. I don't personally think it's a problem that it's a longevity reward.

I think the other leaderboards should reflect current playtime and rewards. They matter more imo, from a prestige standpoint. And they're visible in a person's character card.

I'd just add a world pvp leaderboard that tracks current settlements/ areas, and the others are great~

But that's just me.

[lucid ermine]

It would be nice if we also got a regional guild ranking tab

it is unlikely that most players will ever be top 100 in global guild rankings, so seeing their name on regional leaderboard would be cool

also checking how other players in their region have progressed

[crisp condor]

It would be nice if the game would cook me some food

[opal vector]

I think what Seb is trying to say is that at some point, aren't there too many leaderboards? Wouldn't that be like a participation trophy?

[crisp condor]

Yes

Too much stuff is too much

If we have a leaderboard for everything, then what's the point

[grand plover]

Does OS have are considered as same Faction as player or not aligned?

[magic lion]

The thing is ppl wanted leaderboards that are obtainable. Biggest cry about pvp is they couldn't get on the board, too low to compete, or couldn't get a million boss kills, etc. Xp based is less of a chance as time goes on. Pretty sure the goal is to kill the old leaderboards in full at some point. Assuming based on odie saying the "classic badges" and all we have right now is a legacy pvp badge being the only classic badge we know of, but that's a plural statement. Also, #1275487953480712324 message where he mentions reducing the amount of leaderboards needed. Andddd it's already been mentioned that odie has acknowledged the new leaderboards are likely going to need/get more metrics aside from being solely xp based 🤷. I don't think the goal is to keep them the way they are and they are in place to remove the old boards in full over time

Either way it's irrelevant for the time being and we probably should open a discussion thread on it like goudine said. Or there's probably threads existing already pertaining to leaderboards albeit not necessarily about the new system, haven't looked in a while

Any way for NF to refresh the almighty compass with these poi shifts? It doesn't point to a single correct settlement that's taken

[lean hearth]

Has anyone else ever gotten 250,000 areas taken?

[rapid fossil]

MobileWonder did

Oh wait

else

My bad

[lean hearth]

“He that breaks a thing to find out what it is has left the path of wisdom.” ― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Fellowship of the Ring

[magic lion]

Mobile did and 53 will, other than that nope. The amount of area needed to obtain it is just insane. The fact 53 has done it while not being a trucker like mobile is way more impressive to me. And he would have hit it long ago if he stayed active like he was prior to territory being changed from the #1 factor in global

Mobile was a lot of fun to fight though. King of cheese lol. Went at it for 8+ hours straight with him a couple years ago. Didn't like he had to resort to GS cheese when it was beyond stupidly broken to knock me off territories. Still the most fun I've ever had in territory. 53 isn't great on defense, he just goes the roads untraveled

[lucid ermine]

Then why is there regional leaderboard

To compare yourself to other people at your region

To the people that you actually compete with

Just saying that it would be cool to also have regional guild leaderboards at some point, if it doesnt take too much time away from heretic buff development

[swift flame]

I feel like it's the situation where we need the POIs to quit shifting for us to prove to the devs that there is an issue?

Maybe even better idea. Get rid of the scrolling back and forth for the tier of battle. Just give us 5 circles roughly in the olympic circles pattern. That way there is no scrolling. Just quickly go into the battles you want. Just put the picture/name of who owns it underneath each circle. Make the circles the different tier colors. I don't need to see a picture of MY othersoul that I made and gave the appearance to before every time I use them.

[severe valve]

Spent a few hours in public transport in Paris, and I feel the PoI issues seems close to be fully solved as I didn't meet huge clusters today. It felt nice !

[severe valve]

I also think it would be more convinient to have everything (including the othersouls/messages/rewards menu) on a single screen

And the mini game being a single selection tap (if you select sword for exemple, you have a screen with the result appearing, when there are draws it automatically say "draw / draw / draw (...)" until you win or lose)

[swift flame]

Maybe the draw screen could have the 3 buttons at the bottom with the x underneath? That way you keep playing from that same screen till you win/lose/quit?

[pliant needle]

Right. Have it keep drawing your selection until a win or lose. I like it. I somehow get 14 draws in a row quite often.

[white tusk]

How many crownships do you need to get more than 16 proofs or is it tied to guild level

[magic lion]

Do you happen to pick shield? I feel like that happens to me and I always choose shield out of convenience lol

[swift flame]

it's the closest to your right thumb! Your next 50 tries should be axe!

[rapid fossil]

I cheesed him back with Assassin + Lacunus/Amadan's Staff to freeze him and his summons until he died (x

[pliant needle]

100% of the time shield.

[rapid fossil]

So, correct me if I'm wrong: The number of settlements in each 100km² didn't change. The lack of settlements outside of heavy POI clusters was improved. Does this mean some of the POI settlements were removed and redistributed elsewhere?

[swift flame]

He's confirmed that there are 150settlements per 10km^2. And yes, that settlements were moved around. I think it was lamp lighter who went somewhere they've never been before and found one of their moved settlements there and already claimed by them.

[wary pulsar]

The same thing has happened to me, so I can confirm that's the case

[rapid fossil]

I also found some old ones in a new area I'd never been and vice versa. The part I'm confused about is does that mean there are fewer POI settlements now and if so were certain POIs prioritized over others?

[wary pulsar]

There are fewer POI-associated settlements now

Nobody knows the answer to that second question. Those POIs that now don't have settlements can still have Monuments or Towers show up on them

[primal oar]

There were a lot of country roads that didn't have territories around me, it was fun going out at night and just watching them get created.

I'm seeing more settlements being created over the last few days, it is interesting. Like landmark locations are getting vetted.

[rapid fossil]

I'm sure zoos don't have every single enclosure marked anymore (x

[magic lion]

Hey, it seemed to work for a while lol

[magic lion]

I hated that build. 95% chance for summons to take the hit or whatever the % was lol. Thankfully I only ran into it once and it was when I was coming to an end of his territories lol

Haha. When he made his most recent appearance.

Always going 45 - 50 😂. Idk how many times I mathed that out when it was 3AM getting phone blasted by notifications

[magic lion]

You must live very close to me, sorry lol

[rapid fossil]

You shoulda seen me sitting at a burger shop mathing out your speed for my big prank that one time 😅

Also he goes 50? I don't slow down for aaaaaanybody.

[glossy surge]

crazy orna players driving 50 and playing orna at the same time

I got a bf for that purpose

[pliant needle]

Sword Axe Shield. It feels like statistically it is better to chose one of the three and stick to it forever rather than random chicken pecking. With enough samples you should end up with 33% victories and 50% of draws. In a perfect world. If RnGesus didn't have it out to smite me.

[wary pulsar]

In my completely anecdotal testing it feels I am much less likely to get repeat draws if I switch my choice

[pliant needle]

I noticed that also

[wary pulsar]

In a little over an hour on the road today I only got one double draw by going Axe -> Shield every time

[pliant needle]

Also, if I keep clicking the same draw over and over I have been 90% more likely to end in defeat.

[wary pulsar]

Now, I would expect it to be random. But at the same time I kind of want to figure out if it's not

Odie never promised it was random

Maybe there's an increased chance the opponent sticks with their original choice instead of 33% for each? Who knows

[pliant needle]

I'm sure it's a seed like every other design of the game. I look forward to the Orna Legends RPS cheat sheet in January 2025.

[wary pulsar]

When most of the beta testers all said to remove RPS, and the negative feedback when it was hyped, Odie still kept it

Maybe it's deeper than just pure RPS 😆

Or this is all nonsense and it's actually random and this is all confirmation bias and normal human brain needing to see patterns

[opal vector]

In my observations, the statistics match random. I would explain away "patterns" as the fact that over large sample sizes, you'll start to notice the things you think you notice.

That said, there are some very capable RPS AIs out there.

Oh that's what Knight said. <_<

Basically

[wary pulsar]

Don't worry, I'm perfectly self aware that there's likely no real pattern

Just like Realmstrikes has a higher miss chance than 15%, but only when you're not recording it

[pliant needle]

So back to there is likely no pattern.. It feels like statistically it is better to chose one of the three and stick to it forever rather than random chicken pecking.

[wary pulsar]

If it is truly random, then it won't matter

Each instance is individually separate from each other with a 33% chance for each outcome

[pliant needle]

Ahhhhhh

So you're saying in a truly random coin toss could turn out 100 flips - 100% heads.

[wary pulsar]

Yes

[pliant needle]

Gross

[opal vector]

I actually kept track for a little bit, because I started to suspect an AI because of repeat draws. <_< And my observations over half a day, around 100-200 settlements, put it all in line with random. The only statistical outlier I have is that my draw record is either 9 or 10. Which is a 1 in 19,000 or 1 in 60,000 chance.

[swift flame]

What's everyone's win streak record?

[wary pulsar]

And getting 5 heads in a row does not make a 6th heads any less likely, as those 5 heads already occurred and you are only taking the probability for a singular coin flip.

[swift flame]

Actually, that would be a kinda fun(ny) leaderboard to have!

[opal vector]

The chances of hitting 50 heads in a row is 1 in 562,949,953,421,312

=B

[wary pulsar]

The fact that draws are able to get as high as that is the only reason I kind of want to believe the AI is weighted to keep their original choice

My personal draw streak is 8

[opal vector]

I was suspicious because of the drawing chances. But one or two draw streaks are the only outliers I've seen.

....

[pliant needle]

I have counted to 14 at least 5 times

[opal vector]

Tism is bad kids, I now have to find it what it is to 100.

[wary pulsar]

This could also be a case of Orna's RNG occasionally being 'sticky' though when done in rapid succession. Which according to Odie shouldn't be able to happen, but does actively seem to occur even when recording results.

ie, when spamming attacks you more frequently miss after already missing once.

Edit: I assume it balances out because hits would be similarly 'sticky'

[pliant needle]

Tomorrow I will not pick the same choice back to back at all and see if it feels different.

[opal vector]

1 in 120000000000000000000000000000. Ish.

[pliant needle]

Is that all?

[opal vector]

A nonillion!

(Actual name if a number with 30 zeroes)

Of*

[pliant needle]

For all we know the Victory Draw Defeat is preset upon opening the settlement and your choice has no bearing on the outcome.

Nope, don't like that

I really hope real stats are in play here.

[wary pulsar]

If that was true, the odds would still be the same

Which is why I suggested just replacing RPS with a single button that gives you either nothing, 1 exp, or a proof and just bypasses all the nonsense

In a game of pure RNG and no skill like (digital) RPS, there is literally no way for you to influence the outcome

[pliant needle]

After a full week of the nonsense I think that is a great idea.

[wary pulsar]

(In non-digital RPS you can play mind games I guess)

[pliant needle]

I enjoyed it for the first few days. Now I almost want to skip it altogether.

[wary pulsar]

I enjoyed it more today because I somehow managed to only get a single double draw. Was that because I figured something out or because of pure luck? Idk

Only time will tell

[pliant needle]

My wife will always go rock out the gate so I always go paper. The she follows up with scissors so I go rock. Then I get punched. But it never changes. There is something about knowing your opponent.

[frozen wasp]

I still consider myself lucky with my Draw Record still only at 4.

[opal vector]

https://rockpaperscissors-ai.vercel.app/

Go and truly test your RPS mettle.

(Get fucking smoked by a robot)

[primal oar]

A draw is just another chance to lose 👌

[magic lion]

I even stopped 😆. That was brutal lol

[swift flame]

I love this idea... it's like.... knock knock!

[glossy surge]

I wish the rock paper scissor was a single screen, pressing it and then x untill it is on cooldown is annoying

I don't really need to know the outcome, as i only care of the macro results of my global exp gain over time

[white tusk]

Yeah I'm to the west of ya I think, but work in down town so a nice 40 mile commute

[crisp condor]

Pet stat gear or any +% like faction or assasin work on OS?

[pliant needle]

They do not appear to. Not passives.

[crisp condor]

😦

[magic lion]

I'm going to assume parapet on cliffside cuirass doesn't work either

[swift flame]

I wonder if that will be fixed? It just seems weird for the passives to not work.

[remote onyx]

Any updates regarding a potential end of beta date?

[glossy surge]

Not the channel for that, this is a feedback channel

[sacred spade]

Not the place for you to pretend to be a mod either. Asking questions about release dates is fine.

It's also the "discussion" thread, so yeah.

[winged carbon]

6467

[magic lion]

4629. Mat gains are capped the same. So I guess it just starts taking A LOT of proof of crownship/material reward options to get them to raise once you hit the initial cap. I changed a ton of them to proof of crownship as well as change any new settlements taken to that when it's an option and only saw it go up by 3

This one was with 4k

[winged carbon]

That's exactly it

[silk grotto]

The t9 spec in that guild is very expensive

[magic lion]

What determines your stats on settlements?? It almost seems like they have influence and that makes no sense with them being randomized. I've challenged my main with an alt multiple times and not once is my ward what it's supposed to be. Lower every single time. These are on settlements where I own every crownship as well

[primal oar]

Ward start on my havel sword works at least

[glossy surge]

Alright then, feel free to talk about halloween content, release dates, december event expectations and maybe when the next dragon event is going to be about, you are right, I am no mod, so might as well pretend every channel is what ever you wish it to be until we have mods have to personnaly remind every single person to keep discussion channels focused, because clearly, the fact that they had to do it multiple times already does not mean Carl.

[glossy surge]

Not clue, apparently, there is a decay bar, since you can "refresh" your settlements, but there is no visibility on said decay, unless it is visible for other players when looking to attack you

[glossy surge]

really not going much higher for mats, almost feel the 6 extra total mats being a fluke of an hard cap, than a softcap being breached

did some driving today in my local town, and the redistribution seems to have moved a lot of settlements i owned, making the drives i do with my partner, be free realestate again. which will be nice next time he drives.

I am curious if the redistribution is mostly finished in terms of expected spacing and such?

i havent seen any concentrated settlements but i havent gone to any of the big parks of my city due to health

[pliant needle]

Well that is an interesting development

[glossy surge]

yeah i saw that. hopefully an "easy" fix

[glossy surge]

would suck for this to cause ton more delays for this new content

[swift flame]

Woot! I figured it was a bug!

[primal oar]

Oh no, not longer to collect my daily awards uncontested. That would be terrible 😥😋

[swift flame]

I wish I had a better android device to test on.

[glossy surge]

I mean yeah. I am 1000% more then happy to get my blade of finesse uncontested

But we also need to agree that it sucks for everyone else

[swift flame]

I just realized I was getting settler's crownguards as items in my inventory? Any other conqueror items in other peoples inventories?

[glossy surge]

pretty much it i think

[swift flame]

I had about a 1.5 mile strip of road that had 10 settlements along it when there were just 2 little city parks to pull them all there. :/ Like the parks were only about the size of a couple of house lots. Granted there was a city block or two between each settlement. I wonder if we could not pull so many settlements to little POIs?

[primal oar]

Same

[magic lion]

Yeah, the stat decay is extremely aggressive... and those are settlements I interact with every single day so I don't think they should be decaying. At least not like that

Me taking a fresh settlement and then hitting it with my alt just now

Ward hasn't decayed. The fact it has on those other 3 so drastically is crazy... this is literally set up to make you lose which is a bit asinine for pvp imo

Guess I'm going to a 1 mil ward build 🥴

[opal vector]

As someone who is ONLY rewarded by this decay, being a T10 surrounded by giants, I still don't like it. I have no interest in easy victories. And I'm not sure how I feel about the fact that I'm second on the leaderboard based solely on playing the system a lot.

[somber field]

wait so it is intended to use CD and Avidity on OS

We need Dualwielding !
I want to do some crazy build

[magic lion]

I wish more players had this mindset. PvP isn't meant to be super easy and everyone should strive to get better, not necessarily make it way easier. With that being said, I don't mind the stat decay overtime within reason. But those settlements were fresh due to poi shifts so that means one of them had a 70k ward decay after a weeks time. That's a bit overkill. That's like 28% - 30% decay in a week span? And if that's applied to def/res as well, yikes. I really hate that we don't know what is intentional and what's not and we're not getting many responses back. I guess we have to report every little thing in beta bugs until we get a response there

I am a little shocked on the potential lb stance change lol

[rapid fossil]

This decay is ridiculous when territory battles are easier to win because of your opponent's predictability. Combine that with the thus far difficult-to-acquire Crownguards that only let you at least reach the stats the Influence meter did if you use all 3 at once ... and you're toast.

[primal oar]

Going up against difficult territory fights pushed me to improve, otherwise I'd have gotten too stagnant and stopped bothering to play.
The way I see it, those with the time put in to get those stats should be able to hold spots til someone is able to fairly take it from them.

[acoustic steppe]

Yea, decay taking that long in old system was fine. Also influence made sense, when I visites some town for few days, I tried to make solid network of my areas without gaps, so I had full influ and those 25% bonus stats.

[opal vector]

I also think decay is a good idea. I don't think rapid decay is.

[cursive solar]

I was taking all my stuff back from the Othersouls. I don't see a way to remove follower without trading a follower.

[primal oar]

Oh I didn't even notice crownguards were a consumable

Cool

[acoustic steppe]

Also what currently reset the decay? Just passing near settlement? Or actually open it? Or even play the game? Or only by buying ramparts.....? 🤔

[cursive solar]

I tried rebuying the followers I traded to the Othersouls, but the bestiary says I have them already even though they aren't showing in my Castle Follower Storage.

[magic lion]

Had no idea it took all 3 to reach the equivalent of a full influence bar. That is crazy.. especially given the prices, how temporary they are, and like you said, crownguards being difficult to acquire currently

[magic lion]

Ramparts only it appears. Those 3 settlements are very near my work and I interact with them every day

Ramparts aren't even worth it with decay being that rapid

[remote onyx]

With that amount of decay I wouldn’t call this territory defense, that looks more like territory ping pong

I agree with the sentiment portrayed above, I fully disagree with making PvP absurdly easy. The lower tiers already exist to let players with less play time compete, the Emperor tier should be where competition is allowed to thrive

[opal vector]

Territory ping pong sums up the current balance situation, but I guess that's why we're in beta.

We've got the multiple tiers as well as the item that temporarily removes ALs for balance. I also agree with influence decay eventually.

Defensively, ramparts and crownguards are nearly unusable due to cost/ reward. Ramparts cost me over 1,000 Proofs each. Crownguards are maybe fine, if the intention is to give yourself a boost when someone is attacking you heavily. But if influence is going to decay that rapidly, they're a drop in the bucket, they won't change anything.

Also, I still have yet to recieve a single notification for NPCs taking back settlements. As before, I can't say that any settlement has been taken, but I can say I still haven't used any Ramparts.

Also, I've gotten a MAJOR decline in rewards?

5434

[acoustic steppe]

Huh, I got my rewards 3 hours ago and I was still at max.

[opal vector]

Yeah, not sure what this is. I've lost about 50 Crowns to people around me, but that's the only change I'm aware of. 🤷‍♀️ Still no NPCs notifications, or any settlements that I've lost (to NPCs) that I can see.

[wary pulsar]

Could be our first sign of the decay

[swift flame]

I'm kinda intrigued by a faster decay rate for settlements. I'm curious how this would affect when this comes out of beta. Is decay still stopped by travelling back through territory? So you wouldn't have decay near your OT, but you would have random NPCs retaking crowns. I'm not sure what number I would be happy with, but I always felt one month before decay set in was too long.

[opal vector]

That's way too quick for decay. I really hope that's not how that's going to work. <_<

My goal is to hold everything in my city, and I'm not contested in the entire southern half, so what do I do about decay? I check my settlements to roll RPS constantly. I'm fully active, second on the leaderboard. I've been a bit slow the past two days, but I've still captured probably 1-2k settlements in the past 7 days. If decay is that harsh, you're gonna push people out of the system because it'll feel as rewardless as the old system. (Not me, I capture for fun so I'm not worried about it myself)

[swift flame]

What if it's designed to decay faster if someone is constantly attacking it?

But it's been brought up here and there that it seems that part of the goal in this new PVP is to constantly have to retake settlements, including increased rewards for this happening? Not to be holding onto vast swathes like we've been doing?

[opal vector]

Yeah, but that's too much, too fast. We souls be able to fight each other. If people are decaying that much that fast, there's no fight to be had unless it's your neighbor.

[tepid zodiac]

When beating your wife pays off

[rapid fossil]

We tested it out and I think it's the case. The total boost of all 3 seems to be about 60% if ward calculation is reliable. I think Influence was 40%. If the Emperor Crownguard provides the largest boost of them all, then it is likely more than a 20% boost, meaning you need it to reach the original boost. You could probably reach the boost without the Settler's Crownguard, but if you have the two best Crownguards, you likely have a ton of Settler's Crownguards.

[rapid fossil]

At the very least, it's not when resetting it costs 1k proofs.

[acoustic steppe]

Influence was 25% max.

[remote onyx]

That’s a shocking drop!

[opal vector]

I don't understand why it's so bad. :d

[magic lion]

But people aren't constantly attacking it lol. I interact with the rock paper scissors. Occasionally hit it with an OS or alt just to see stuff. You get a notification up top that your hp is restored when you click a settlement if it's been attacked and damage done

[magic lion]

I think knight nailed it. Reward decay is likely already happening on all of those settlements you've taken on your longer trips

And no one is interacting with them to keep the rewards coming

[wary pulsar]

@opal vector were your first big claiming sessions on day 1 of the beta?

We could be looking at maybe 12-13 days for rewards to stop? Or if the claiming sessions were a bit later it could be 10 days

[opal vector]

Yeah, but I've taken around 2k in the past 7 days. :d

[magic lion]

You also had a much longer, more recent trip haven't you?

Probably in those past 7 days lol

So reward decay is pretty aggressive as well

[zenith scarab]

Gotta keep dat grind going

[opal vector]

My big trip was a couple days after the launch. I drove from SA to Coldspring and back Thursday, about a 4 hour drive one way.

[severe valve]

https://discord.com/channels/448527960056791051/1300808287008329839
⬆️ Thread to focus on PvP ranking / badges

[rapid fossil]

Has anyone tried to use chargeable moves like Nekrosis on Othersouls? I have Nekrosis at max and it's doing 1 damage with my OS.

[opal vector]

Othersouls can't use them.

[wary pulsar]

Unfortunately your othersoul has not killed hundreds of monsters/dragons/whatever

[rapid fossil]

It should certainly carry over from your main in my humble opinion.

[wary pulsar]

Do those skills work for your main on defense, even on old territory?

[glossy surge]

very good question

I think the anwser is "unlikely"

I doupt your passives and consumables (pet potions) are loaded in the pvp system when it copies your loadouts to start the npc match. but with BoF that could have had changed

did it work for BoF?

[wary pulsar]

If I'm using a two turn spell in BoF it ain't going to be one of those 😆

I don't see any reason it wouldn't work though

[glossy surge]

It's a efficiency and coding thing, since they are turning your loadout into an npc. shortcuts could have been taken to make things faster

just like they don't need to load your item inventory since you are not using items

I can only speculate as I have no visibility on how Orna is coded

[wary pulsar]

BoF isn't an NPC, it's just yourself minus ascensions. It includes everything, even monument shrine buffs

I do understand why it won't work Othersouls/Conq defense though

[glossy surge]

which is why i think BoF might have changed this

for the Main character as defence

really a question of "did Odie create two seperate character loader for pvp, or it is the same for BoF and Arena/pvp Defence" now

Othersoul indicate there is at least 2 different character loaders, since we know othersouls load only gear and skills and nothing else

Bugs in how it was not loading gear passives correctly for othersouls , which supprised Odie, tells me that loading passives SHOULD be working (for the main characters)

[rapid fossil]

Yep

It used to be my main move on territory offense

I would also get walloped by it on someone else's defense

[rapid fossil]

It's a fine assumption, but it doesn't work that way. It just doesn't work on the Othersoul. It takes a bit of fun and variability out of the Othersoul unfortunately.

[magic lion]

Can we not see a rollout very soon before these concerns about decay, broken passives, etc are fixed or addressed....

[serene dirge]

have you opened a bug report for any broken passives? i'm not currently aware of any

[glossy surge]

#1275487953480712324 message

it seems unintended to be not working

sucks to see people complaining about issues and not reporting them when asked to report them in a proper format

[serene dirge]

Agreed - it's a beta, so there is an expectation that issues are reported to us as they are uncovered.

If that's not something you have time for - that's okay. Just please remember to let your beta spot go so that someone else can help out

[opal vector]

People aren't necessarily aware of what's a bug or intended. If I have enough gold, I'll readorn some passives to show them when I wake up later. I know follower act rate isn't working, but haven't personally tried any others.

Or well, follower act rate through Lungs of Selene. I haven't tested Skadoosh or any other methods.

[serene dirge]

there was a bug with follower stats, yes. it should be fixed in the current maintenance.

for equipment passives - yes, of course they should work. let's ensure we open bug reports if we find any that are currently not working correctly

[opal vector]

Will test and report later. Thanks for fixing followers!

[sacred spade]

Can we just get some basic info on what is and is not supposed to function for othersouls?

They can't dual wield, and obviously class based passives like avidity won't work for them.

Are there any other restrictions? Will Sorrow take main characters charge level? Will pet action rate work? Etc

[serene dirge]

Equipment should function no different than it would on a player.

Sorrow, etc, will currently not take your character's charge, but that could be a good #💡│suggestions

[sacred spade]

I don't have a settlement visible from OT, so I can't video for the bug report but if anybody else wants to for me:

• 90% confident blackened eyes aren't increasing pet action rate
• manticore eyes don't seem to reduce follower or summoner damage at all

[magic lion]

Is the aggressive decay intentional or not? Like ceri said, we have no way of knowing what's intentional and what's not. I can go report every little thing if you'd like, but this is the discussion for it and other things have been answered here 🤷‍♂️

[serene dirge]

stat decay is 1% a day for 50 days. I believe that to be more than fair - Ramparts are there to reset it

[magic lion]

Ok, so a rough 28% in a week isn't right and it's a bug

I'll go post it

[serene dirge]

many fixes and adjustments did go out today - please ensure to retest before posting

[wary pulsar]

For rewards decay, can we have some information for what constitutes "Activity" to prevent rewards decay, and how long it should take to stop receiving rewards?

Edit: Please?

[magic lion]

🫡

[rapid fossil]

Done. Please vote y'all!

[glossy surge]

To help make sure we need to report things, is there a shareable intent list/document for various undocumented things like
-Conquest Rewards

• Crownship reward stacking for item and crownguard, are they really only supposed to give the bottom tier one no matter how many you selected?
• same thing for item reward?
• Decay rates
• NPC retake rates, so we can let you know if things seems to match what you intended
• any other things we are not made aware but could have drastic results because we just doN,t know if they are intended or not?

just noticed ramparts shop now has an cap on cost!
300 proof of conquering, instead of crownship Cost + something

Very nice

[remote onyx]

I’d argue that Mat Equalization should be the most expensive of the 3, not the other way around

[wary pulsar]

On the other hand, 150 proofs is a lot. You absolutely can't earn 150 proofs from taking ascended peoples' territory in the 30 minutes

It's not self sustaining for the people who need it once they have a decent amount of crownships

[glossy surge]

you need 150 'victories" to be able to buy one

theses are not proof of attempts

[remote onyx]

RPS is a thing though, you don’t need to win 150 settlements. And you can farm them in the lower 4 tiers where ALs don’t matter anyway

[wary pulsar]

The cost for equalization is the number of crownships you own divided by 2, capped at 150

(The others are just straight the number you own)

[remote onyx]

You can still farm 5 proofs per settlement without interacting with the emperor spot

[wary pulsar]

For reference, RPS is like a 25% chance for a single proof.

And it's true you can farm the other spots, but if someone is farming the other spots then again they don't need equalization and it's not helping them much.

[remote onyx]

Anyway, my point is more about it being the cheapest when compared to the other two. The actual number is harder for me to comment on since I haven’t been able to interact with the system on a large scale

[glossy surge]

It encourage taking new territory over being able to defend your territory, which means more flips and more contested settlements

[wary pulsar]

There's been a semi consistent pattern of people with high ascensions over valuing Equalization. It's not very helpful in the grand scheme of things, and it's price reflects that.

[glossy surge]

nothing wrong with keeping the content moving

[remote onyx]

Which is probably why I disagree. I don’t see why offense should be prioritized over defense, when defending is already notoriously harder (AI dependent, stat decay from day 1, etc). Players that invest into PvP shouldn’t be penalized for being efficient at defending their territories imo

[glossy surge]

Because it means everyone constantly has a chance, an oportunity to take land, instead of someone sitting over 1000+ crownland they only visit once a month

Heck rewards are boosted if a settlement is hotly contested

A lot of the design decisions are centered around "take as much as you can before someone else comes over and contest you"
intead of "be the strongest forever"

[remote onyx]

Why should everyone have the same chance when one player invested 1000+ hours and the other just hit 225? Should the first player not have an advantage and be able to semi consistently defend his territories?

[glossy surge]

I am not here to argue what is right or wrong, I am just expressing what i see in the design decisions this system seems to express

[glossy surge]

they don't, since they need to use the 150 tokens for a 30 min equaliser, that still wont equalise their gear

meanwhile you can just use your tokens to refresh your spots

they can,t afford to refresh their spots

[wary pulsar]

Ascension is a crutch, gear is the real difference maker

[remote onyx]

Sure, I get that. I’m just saying I’ve always disagreed and will continue to disagree with the philosophy of “let everyone take territory equally”. Players that invest more into PvP should be able to sustain territories for longer

[glossy surge]

a 225 player will have SHIIIIIIITTTTT gear compared to a fully 195+ all godforged t11

[remote onyx]

You have to pay double to refresh them, and they start decaying again the next day

[glossy surge]

again you can

you have tokens only for refresh while they need to spend them to have a chance to take anything

they are not your equals by default

this is not BoF

[wary pulsar]

Players that invest more into PvP should be able to sustain territories for longer

They can. This system does not change that, and despite it giving slightly more options to players who are not optimized for PvP they are absolutely not equals.

The player who's OT got swept through by an AL 100 player can now pay for equalization and try to take maybe 10-15 territories with a higher chance of getting them, but for most of those territories they'll still fail at doing it.

Edit: Unless the AL 100 player was dumb and doesn't have an actual good PvP build.

[glossy surge]

and they still have

• Not gear anywhere equal to you
• do not have all the skills from leveling and celestial classes
• Not the best pet combos
• need to spent a ton of victory tokens to buy a 30min "equaliser" that you don't need to even think exists

[buoyant falcon]

I'm still not fond of the implementation of material equalization, some classes are way more dependent on AL than others. Would prefer if it buffed the attacker tbh, but I know there's issues with that as well.

[wary pulsar]

If "AL Dependent" is a reference to spiked shield, that's what the next patch is addressing 😅

[glossy surge]

we will have to trust Odie has a nice Grafana Dashboard with tons of metrics that he will be able to use to track how things develop live and see if they match his intent.

[severe valve]

Damn it seems you summoned him

[buoyant falcon]

That's one concern sure, and remains a concern even after balance. It's also my experience summoners and beo are much stronger in 0 AL vs AI

[wary pulsar]

I'd argue RS is one of the most powerful AL 0 in AI PvP, along with Gilga Ursa if it pretends to be RS

[glossy surge]

yeah, but lvla 100 AL player, do they just stop playing pvp?

[glossy surge]

with base or with celestial class penetration skills?

[wary pulsar]

Yes

[glossy surge]

I play RS, I am not going to argue that armor penetration is a huge counter to AL. but man I just don,t want to bother fighting a 100+ AL tak with 800k ward LOL

i am not anywhere near geared/AL boosted to compete

[serene dirge]

yes, all things are subject to further tweaks as we transition out of beta.

at its core, the Conqueror's Guild does favour contestation/turnover. Although defense could be difficult against over T11s, I do think the old Area Control overinvested in defensive options, which did make the content prohibitive for a lot of players. Things like Ramparts are meant to make defense an "active" task, to keep the whole experience competitive

Material equalization allows some burst offense, but it is expensive for those who are in the cohort of players that may need it often. but regardless - i think we should be inviting the local competition

[severe valve]

(While you are here Odie, not sure you saw my message about it, but there are still some "ghosts" characters in LB wich create a shift in ranking)

[glossy surge]

AL focused player demanding the whole cake summonned him

[wary pulsar]

Sorry, should've been clear this is on offense, not defense

I assumed Geppu also meant offense since I've never seen a summoner that's good at defense. AL 0 or AL whatever

[glossy surge]

On the rare chance that their summon defence thing proc, they don't die turn 1

[wary pulsar]

Nope, they die turn 2 👌

[severe valve]

I get it's a joke, but better to avoid this kind of comments IMO to keep this channel welcoming for everyone. It's normal for everyone (high AL and no/low AL players) to hope for a good content 🥖

[glossy surge]

I've had plenty of abuse received during the BoF beta regarding how horrible I was for wanting an AL free pvp environement, without anyone defending me for that opinion, to care about their feelings back. But you are right, I need to be better then that and not stoop to theses people's level

[severe valve]

I like something dynamic for this content, but I also understand highly invested players may want to see their "effort" rewarded with an edge on this content. It seems it's the goal and I think the updates went in this way. Can this be better ? Most likely, and that's one of the reason why it's still beta and there still could be improvement after the beta so it's all good

[buoyant falcon]

I just think there are better options than 0 AL each.

What if it averaged out? AL player isn't robbed and weaker player gets to feel power.

If it's 0 AL, I would prefer a notification so I have opportunity to shift builds.

[wary pulsar]

I can agree with the territory notification having a note that someone took it with Equalization

[severe valve]

Regardless of your opinions on a content, it shouldn't be something creating hate from other people 👍

[buoyant falcon]

I know Spiked shield is an outlier and will be getting nerfed. But there are phases of gilga where it is not worth to use over something like guarding strikes. I have no idea what my 0 AL ward is.

[glossy surge]

I like dynamism over teritory graveyards, where there is no point trying to contest "why would I give that player a contest buff to his loot when I know there is zero chance of winning"

Having an expensive "I'm going to try" is going to be good for settlements being active

a person local to an area should have an activity edge over someone driving through once a month

[wary pulsar]

You can test that in BoF, at least.

I have tried to suggest in the past adding a toggle in the Altar of Ascension to temporarily disable your AL, which could also help for buildcrafting here.

(And it helps us help lower AL players with their builds in help channels, etc. Please 😅 )

[glossy surge]

what? your AL0 lvl 225 arrowstorm dungeon farm build does not work?

lol

[sacred spade]

Controversial take:

Ascension equalizer is a bad mechanic that makes both sides unhappy.

Removing what feels like hard work for ALs sucks for that crowd
And for the crowd without them, it's an expensive purchase that last a whole 30 minutes and they are still going to get smacked around.

Better solution? Get rid of the current jank ascension system that won't ever be balanced and give us ascension 2.0 like tomorrow

[glossy surge]

Oh boy, I mean yeah, for sure, Ascension 2.0, which we can only speculate the breath of, will hopefully fix everything (tm)

Ascension cap? Ascension decay just like stat decay?

[wary pulsar]

Ascension 2.0, which isn't even on the roadmap. When Anguish 2.0 was on the roadmap for September

[glossy surge]

Hm, lose 1 AL per day of owning a settlement, same thing as the stat decay

[buoyant falcon]

I support AL giving points in a massive class specific skill tree. where each point is worth less than 1% of stats but provides more creativity and things impactful to specific classes

[wary pulsar]

We should probably not go too far down this tangent though, not in this thread.

[glossy surge]

makes for an upfront advantage for people with lots of AL, and double their gain from active maintenance of their settlements

[sacred spade]

I'd gladly see every single thing currently in or planned for development delayed if it meant we could move on from the current ascension system and the problems it brings

The conq guild beta is just more proof that it's a problem that can't be solved without everybody being unhappy because it's fundamentally flawed

I'll shut up now though, cause your right, not the thread

[remote onyx]

I don’t see where I was rude or insulted you to warrant this kind of response but you do you I guess

[glossy surge]

I am heavely tainted by pass interactions with people

It is not something that is an excuse of a justification other then a defensive mecanism

Lots of individual abuse by a group of people with the same opinion results in a generalised response

Same thing as to why most girls don,t want to be catcalled on the street. It's not you specifictly, it's "everyone"

[serene dirge]

do we have any examples of the second crowd?

[wary pulsar]

I don't think we have many low level, low AL players in the beta

[remote onyx]

Girls don’t want to be catcalled because that’s straight up harassment. Me expressing a different opinion isn’t harassment, it’s just a normal conversation, so I don’t appreciate the comparison

[wary pulsar]

Given it's semi-restricted nature

[glossy surge]

I feel like that second crowd speculation is going to tether towards the t10 without AL and t10 with AL suggestion we were hearing before the beta

[sacred spade]

On this discord? Probably somewhere but I haven't paid much attention

Seen it in my kingdom chat for sure though

[wary pulsar]

I think that equalization does more good than bad in it's current form. You definitely could argue the defensive options are too expensive, but Odie did just reduce and cap the costs so it'll be good to let this iteration breathe a bit

Right now the defensive options are much more farmable and usable than they were before today

[glossy surge]

English not my first language, so I probably did not use the proper term for what i wanted to say. Getting random compliments by some guy we never meet, most of us don't like it. Anyway I don,t want to argue with you over something i am trying to express and you just taking the worse possible interpretation instead of trying to understand what i am clearly expressing with a lack of lingistic skill a english native speaker would

[severe valve]

To me the answer to have everyone happy enough with this feature is around here. Having the ability for no/low AL to have a chance to compete for the emperor crown while having an opportunity for higher AL player to counter it, creating something fun and dynamic (IMO)

[sacred spade]

It's also just a basic logic thought.

You are a fresh T10 that has to potentially fight me. I've got 200k+ EHP turn 1, and if you don't kill me I'm hitting you for at least 130k immediately. More if you redline me.

You go "what the hell, this ain't happening". You buy equalizer. You take, maybe 20 territories in that time assuming you are able to 1 shot me at 0AL (unlikely given the probably gear of this person). Not 1 shotting? You aren't taking much.

Equalizer ends. You now have a 2 hour wait before you can really play the system again, and may or may not have enough conq proofs to buy another. You also can't spend those proofs on other rewards because you need the equalizer.

You now stop participating because the grind is worth ~nothing

[remote onyx]

You expressed yourself perfectly. What you described is harassment, simple as that. Now, you don’t get to go around claiming “defense mechanism” to justify treating everyone that disagrees with your points with rude, sarcastic comments. No one was rude to you, you simply decided to make a bad taste comment because people disagreed with you

[serene dirge]

Can we replay this with the current system to ensure we are heading in a good direction?

[sacred spade]

Oh, you mean area?

[spark glade]

People interpret the words given to them, intended meaning or not. Nuance through text on the internet is very easily lost

[serene dirge]

area control, not cg

[glossy surge]

yeah

I am out though, this is getting ridiculous, and not worth me tyring to give my opinion to get the game to be better from a different perspective

[glossy surge]

Alright you win, go collect your internet medal

[sacred spade]

I'd say it's the same, just without a 30 minute interval of hope. Which I get is better, but only marginally.

The same people who stopped participating before aren't going to magically participate now because they can briefly have a period where they win 1/10 fights instead of 1/50

[severe valve]

I don't fully agree with it.
You still can run this feature with OS + if you really have gear issues to compete with someone on a 0 AL fight in wich you always have first turn, then playing the game farming for better gear is something that allow players in this case to understand they will be able to benefit from the equalizer quite quickly

[serene dirge]

from what we've seen, here is the current system in this example:

"You are a fresh T10 that has to potentially fight me. I've got 200k+ EHP turn 1, and if you don't kill me I'm hitting you for at least 130k immediately. More if you redline me.

You go "what the heck, this ain't happening"."

[remote onyx]

In the current system you can’t regen HP though, so you can whittle down those territories every hour if you’re persistent. In CG the defender can restore their HP to max and perpetuate the cycle

[wary pulsar]

There are now 4 other slots and the rock paper scissors that they can do while going from territory to territory, so I'd argue that they will start participating.

They can try for that main crownship, or go for a lower othersoul crownship. There's no downside in them trying for the top spot if it's a quick death and they're already going for the lower ones

[serene dirge]

granted, there are some folk - especially here - that are up for the challenge. but we have not seen this be the majority of players thus far. Equalization does give some chipping availability that influence, etc, did not

[sacred spade]

People in this discord are largely the exception and not the rule, as we all know.

I'm not arguing it isn't marginally better than the current system. Just that it makes everybody unhappy and there is probably a better way to encourage participation.

To me, the equalizer feels like a half measure implemented so we can all say "look! You can participate. Just buy this thing" rather than just... letting people participate?

[wary pulsar]

rather than just... letting people participate?
That is everything I just listed

[sacred spade]

I also get that othersouls exists, but after testing with my alts, the othersouls pretty comfortably handle low tier characters right now

[wary pulsar]

If it's a half measure, then it lets people participate in 4.5/5 of the system instead of 4/5 of the system. And that last 0.5 is the 'top spot' and makes people happiest to hold it, and is what gives increased rewards if it's contested.

It's good for everyone if lower AL players are incentivized to try

[sacred spade]

We are back to giving way to much credit to the othersoul potential of people.

If they just hit T10/T11, their othersouls arent taking territory from an AL100 player either

[wary pulsar]

Sleep dart, miasma, stun dart, exploit, VSS pet

It's pretty easy to neuter an opposing Othersoul. And very difficult to defend against it

And believe me, I'm well aware you can have a lot of status immunities on an othersoul if you work to gear them right. But without accessories you'll never have perfect status immunity (and very, very few people are going to gear their OSs with BiS immunity stuff)

[sacred spade]

What's the ven diagram between ultra high AL and the BiS immunity stuff though?

Cause I'm guessing it is close to a circle

[wary pulsar]

Judging by how many high AL people dismantle their ornates I doubt it 😆

[zenith scarab]

I am still on team "Take ascension out of all pvp content' and if we want to have an alternate power progression based on seasonal temporary play, I'd be ok with that

[sacred spade]

We will know for sure once this goes live, but I will absolutely be back with the "hey look, I was right" if complaints start rolling in that people feel disenfranchised from the content because of their AL

[zenith scarab]

Are you saying I am not on that Team Knight? 😄

[wary pulsar]

I'm voting against that team, because I think both sides of the discussion me and Bwubble are having want AL to stay in some PvP like territory overall

[sacred spade]

Yeah, I don't want it outright removed (unless we conpletely pull it from the game altogether), I just want the current hurdle removed.

Balance it so that people can participate out the gate, not on a weird consumable timer or using ghost alts (othersouls)

[spark glade]

Being matched with an opponent in a kingdom war that is nearly 100 ALs over you is pure agony though, let's be real...

(But territory control is a bit different in terms of how I feel in regards to ALs being included)

[severe valve]

Yes, so let's not summon this topic in this thread ^^

[spark glade]

Just following up Strahd's comment is all

[severe valve]

No worries

[zenith scarab]

I simply don't like AL's being included because AL's come from grinding totally unrelated content and are permanent. You don't play actively for 2 years, you still have the same power you did

[wary pulsar]

"Luckily" because of rampant AL inflation the past two years that's not true 😂

But that is besides the point of this thread, ofc.

[severe valve]

I don't totally disagree but on the other hand grinding some AL is also duable

[buoyant falcon]

Idea: give orn/mat/etc piles for taking on opponents with higher AL than you. Would incentivize lower AL and could act as that catch up mechanic people have been asking for.

Definitely concerns about trading/boosting abuse but there could be safeguards in place

[zenith scarab]

I may be thinking optimistically but I am hoping we are past that

[severe valve]

It's too risky IMHO

[wary pulsar]

sounds like an excellent way to fuel alts

[sacred spade]

That reward pile could be 10x base fight rewards and it would still be worthless 😅

[runic stirrup]

There was a point made with the zeroing AL item that I want to bring up again.

PvP at 0AL is very different from PvP with 50AL to 100+AL. From my experience, the meta is so completely different that you'll need a different loadout to fight effectively.

So it's almost impossible to be on the defensive side and have an effective loadout for both. If two people happen to take your crownships at the same time, and one uses the zero item while the other does not, then that's a rough scenario for the defender.

[buoyant falcon]

Not perfect and would need some safeguards, but I would much rather incentivize lower players than disincentivize higher level players from investing in AL

[wary pulsar]

Except for specifically Spiked Shield builds, I would tend to disagree.

When the PvP is PvAI instead of live PvP the builds actually end up being pretty similar, and good builds can work for both. The only thing high AL players can do more easily is use low M1 skills as damage dealers, but they wouldn't typically do that because those low M1 skills are still bad against other high AL players.

High AL PvP (outside of SS) is still a slew of skills like Verse 4, Rend/Epee, HS3, AV2, or other high penetration stuff.

AL doesn't increase crit rate or damage multipliers that are utilized for either type of build.

[runic stirrup]

For an example, on Dorado I need status immunities at 0AL because my dex isn't high enough to reliable ignore sleep, stun, or miasma. But at AL50, I don't need the immunities since my dex is now pumped up and I can run trev charms instead.

[magic lion]

#1275487953480712324 message

[runic stirrup]

I've also found that it's easier to one shot at 0AL, because everyone has significantly less health and wards. So you don't need to invest as highly in damage increases and can instead utilize other gear for surivability.

I'm not saying that the meta or gear needs to change. Just that these differences mean that an attacker using the equalizer item can now exploit holes in the loadout designed for upper AL combat.

[magic lion]

Haven't read much, so if this has been answered ignore. But ceri gave her input and she's lower than a lot of us

Let the arena be peoples safe space for pvp if they don't want strong competition and need to work on their builds to get better against players who put in more time than them

It's literally the description so idk why we dumb down the rest of PvP if they haven't tried out builds against monster players and a variety of players

Arena = practice/farming.
BoF for the no AL competitveplayers/ live enjoyers
Conq guild for the AL players and people who try to learn the AI to get the most out of it.
While I suck at bof for various reasons it doesn't require much to learn it. Old territory was the most competitive/ difficult imo because it's controlled by AI and you need to learn the mechanics behind it.

@rapid fossil you're pretty low AL, what's your take on the equalizer? (Still haven't read and caught up so you may have responded) but you are hands down one of the best territory defense players I have stumbled across without cheesing any/much. Mobile was great too, just a lot of cheese. I'd like to think I used to be good but now I suck lol. Maybe when I return to my roots

S2ivi as well, mid AL

[wary pulsar]

I'd be curious how 53 feels about it, or if he cares.

The Comp leaderboard is a wild mix of high, low, and mid ALs

[rapid fossil]

Oh geez, that's a high compliment coming from you. I'm not saying that to make myself look better or to kiss up or something. I guess I just assumed you steamroll me without a second thought. I do have some thoughts on it because we had a loooooooottttt of discussion on that back in private beta. I have to drive home though, so I'll get back to you on that.

[magic lion]

Sounds good. And nah, last time I rolled through you were a headache 😆. I am good at clearing entire areas fast, but you zeroed me out several times and I would have to tweak builds

[magic lion]

Good luck getting that man to talk 😂. 3 years in his kingdom and I've seen him speak on discord 1 time and dm me once in game regarding territories I had up there. You may have to visit him at the casino lol

[wary pulsar]

I'm going to at least send him a DM to congratulate him when he reaches 250k

If he ever can be bothered. He's taken exactly one territory from me per day for the past week 😐

[magic lion]

😂. He is pretty active right now. I've been waiting soooo long to see him hit 250k lol. If he doesn't respond you could try reaching out to JF to see if he can reach him if he cares to share any opinions

[wary pulsar]

I don't feel like having a convo in in-game chat tbh. I'm not a fan of the chat system

[severe valve]

Clutch move would be to stop at 249 999

[magic lion]

I'm kind of wondering if he's stalling getting it lol. He only needs 100 some odd more which isn't difficult by any means

[wary pulsar]

Every day I get more tempted to DM him that I'll just take off my good territory defense setup if that's what's stopping him 😂

I still own most of Nashua, it's not a stretch for him to just... take it back

[spark glade]

I wonder if it's a feeling of "If I finally get 250k... then what?" and not wanting to have to work an answer to that

[magic lion]

Lmao. That would be crazy if that's the reason he hasn't hit it

[spark glade]

I know that was me after I was about to hit lvl 250

I'd spent so long in T10 that the idea of being 250 was like "oh god now what do I do"

[wary pulsar]

It's probably just a coincidence, but when I started using this setup is also when he stopped taking so much of my stuff.

I assume it's just a coincidence

But the only time he takes huge swathes of my territory anymore is when I leave my amity hunting loadout (BeoH instead of RS) on overnight or something.

I'm visiting his city on Saturday and I'll take a bunch of his territory then. Maybe that'll incentivize him.

[spark glade]

I assume you've tried to mirror fight your RS loadout to see if maybe there is something to the way it fights that could be creating a feeling of it not being worth the effort on their end?

(Me against Grand Summoner Augira cough)

[wary pulsar]

Yes, it uses a beguiled katar for dex and immunities

And the AI likes to play dirty with the offhand skill it grants...

|| (Counterattack II) ||

[spark glade]

Ahaaahhh, the skill I have heard so much about...

[wary pulsar]

And I can imagine that a Dorado with 3k dex that you have trouble hitting in the first place, and when you do hit might be using Counterattack, may be a little annoying

[spark glade]

Annoying enough to not even try the attempt to begin with perhaps

[magic lion]

Maybe it's a mix of you being difficult and essentially completing the game for him. CA is definitely annoying as everyone knows with the heretic spam of it in the past (interesting to learn that rs does it). But it is pretty easy to get around when you know it's coming

[wary pulsar]

It would be nice if there was a way to let people play against your defense loadout

Anyway, the loadout is very good except against Spiked Shield, which it will die to with barely any resistance. But idk, I don't think it would be good enough to actually stop someone trying.

53's motivations are a mystery, they always have been ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[magic lion]

The leaderboards were his motivation initially from what I've heard. Then there was the change to it

Now, idk lol. Just a goal still I guess

[wary pulsar]

He's still rank 1 comp and Mingus and Gilia aren't even close, so maybe he doesn't have motivation to push higher atm

[magic lion]

That may be it. He did get active again when mobile finally passed him up, but then dropped off again. Maybe because mobile got such a big lead on him

Kind of hard to compete with a trucker lol

[wary pulsar]

Multiple people have said this, but as far as I know nobody has posted it where Odie will see it in https://discord.com/channels/448527960056791051/1275477292725960735

[severe valve]

Thanks, I will post it there then

[serene dirge]

hmm...that comment seems to be about stat decay, not Material Equalization

[magic lion]

Yes but she is level 237 with no ALs. She is saying she doesn't want easy wins against high AL players surrounding her so I feel the sentiment would be the same. However, I won't assume and she can give a straight opinion on it if she'd like

She found a weakness and took a few territories from me and I have 136 AL. I don't think it's improbable for other players to do the same. Especially if they are other classes aside from gilga. That's a rough one with no AL and she manages

Maybe a percentage knocked off ALs or some other form of degrading it instead of just straight zero would be better? That way players don't feel like their AL investments are pointless

Like someone 20 AL vs 100 AL. Knock off 50% and it's 10 AL vs 50 AL. It closes the gap without entirely negating al. If they are below a certain AL their AL isn't reduced at all that way if someone is 2 AL vs 100 they don't even lose AL while the other player loses 50 🤷‍♂️.. Or if they're really low AL an even higher percentage is taken off someone with extremely high AL. Maybe it's complicated to implement, idk. Just throwing something out there

[serene dirge]

I think the difference is the stat decay is forced, while equalization is an optional tool. Those wanting the additional challenge can opt not to use the tool - no?

To me, in good competitive PvP, counters are needed. Currently, ascension does not have a counter, and thus I would consider it anti-competitive

[magic lion]

I hope this means g.ursas auto counterattack will be removed/ drastically reduced damage 😆. Fair enough though, just a difference in opinion on what we see as competitive

[serene dirge]

Well, it is at the top of the balance thread 🙂

[magic lion]

Thanks for the addition of the current competitive badge rank. A lot of new badges added 🎉

[silk grotto]

Nice curriculum

[severe valve]

Definitely need a badge for the number of badges we have

[opal vector]

As someone who attends to benefit from Mat Equalization more than almost anyone, I still agree.

[sacred spade]

Out of pure curiosity.

If settlements got divided randomly so that half had ALs enabled, and the other half had them disabled

Would the community like that more or less than the equalizer?

(Equalizer dissapears in this scenario)

[opal vector]

My issue isn't that there's anything wrong with Equalization. My issue is purely the valuation, compared to Ramparts.

[pliant needle]

I would hate that I think. My BoF builds is vastly different from my AL build. How do I defend?

[remote onyx]

Stop making the patch be delayed

(But I’d prefer that)

[opal vector]

I think Equalization is a good mechanic. I like it. 30 minutes is a quick jaunt, not the conquest of a city.

[sacred spade]

Personally, I think I'd be more interested in the pick your poison defense than current one size fits all

[opal vector]

But it's worth far more than Ramparts are in my opinion.

[wary pulsar]

I don't hate the idea, but I also don't see how it solves the issue people have with equalization or the issue equalization is trying to help with.

[pliant needle]

As long as CA exists there IS a one size fits all.

[remote onyx]

That should probably be addressed in the coming balance patch

[swift flame]

At this point I just want it released so we can all see what it does. All this discussion may be a moot point about equalization. And things can ALWAYS be changed later.

[pliant needle]

Let a summoner equalize just one time. They won't do it again. 😂

[opal vector]

I'm literally getting ready for my day off to pop an Equalization to take back a chunk of territory from Zettai. =D No one tell him.

Also, I'm never a fan of hard caps on anything. I like soft caps, and these costs are the same. I'm a big believer in soft caps always.

They should keep scaling, or you harshly punish the fella sitting at 300-500 crowns total, who can't ever afford a Rampart at max cost.

[magic lion]

The issue I see with the equalization is it's stacking with stat decay. So you set both players to 0 AL but now the defender has a potential max of 50% stat decay which makes it extremely easy for the offense to take territory - and fast. I think faster than people realize. 150 crownguards in 30 minutes is veryyyyy doable

Now ramparts aren't that expensive, but the equalizer should have the highest cost

Or make them all 300 across the board

[opal vector]

I think it's two separate problems though. Decay, if it's still happening at the rate you showed us, needs to chill out.

150 crowns in 30 minutes is very doable for you and I. The majority of people who would benefit from Equalization don't have 5000 Proofs. And you could cause those spent Proofs to be worth nothing by driving the same route the next day, or by dropping Crownguards.

Again, this doesn't include decay. I consider it a separate problem that needs to be considered in a separate way.

Agree about highest cost. It's the highest value. I might change my mind if I ever see NPC capture matter.

[magic lion]

Odie said stat decay is 1% per day up to 50 days. So it should have been fixed today. I used a rampart to refresh all my settlements and I'll be checking them over the next few days to see if it aligns.

Short sighted, yeah they don't have a lot of proofs of conquering yet. As time goes on though everyone will end up with a nice chunk of proofs even if they just do RPS or other souls

I guess in a few months we'll have a better idea and things can be adjusted if it's a problem. Like mentioned earlier, a notice if it's taken by someone using equalization would be nice so it can be tracked

[opal vector]

I can see both sides on the notice. I like the informational warfare side of World PvP when it comes to local combat, but it'd also be nice if it's just a stranger passing through. I can see it both ways.

If I hadn't told you how I beat you, it's interesting to think how you might have responded, and how I might have responded in kind. Tossing Equalization into the mix would have made that an interesting exchange. Even with it, I'd have little chance, but it might have put a few questions in your mind.

Again, this ^ is only meaningful between local rivals, and means nothing when it's an out of towner or a one off player.

[pliant needle]

I agree it shouldn't be the cheapest.

[serene dirge]

If the cost is not prohibitive enough for those who will be needing it, such that it is overused, then it can be adjusted. We simply don’t have the data to determine that yet

[opal vector]

I agree, and I'll start using them myself, but my situation is rare and not indicative of most people, since I have bookoodles of Proofs, while not being 250, or even really competitive beyond creative builds and immense stubbornness.

I'll hit Zettai in the coming days with a few and see the feel.

Also, my point is more about comparitive cost than the number amount. I just think they have a higher value than Ramparts. What those number amounts are, I dunno. I just think Equalization should be higher.

[swift flame]

Leaving out the RPS game, that's taking all 5 crowns in a settlement per minute for 30minutes? No matter how fast you are, the random game crashing/reconnecting will prevent you from doing this. ;p 1 random miss may prevent this from happening. And we're talking taking them from someone with more AL than you... so they prob have decent defense. Maybe all 5 crowns in 20 settlements in 30m. Worse if their builds are designed to just slow you down.

[swift flame]

Maybe that should be another badge? Being able to accomplish the 150crown gain in 30m?

[opal vector]

Upon doing the math for it, I realised a different thing. It isn't 150 Crowns in 30 minutes, it'd have to be 150 TOP Crowns in 30 minutes, which is less doable.

But yes I feel pretty confident I can do a settlement a minute. I made 1600 Crowns in a day on a really long drive when me and my OSs weren't built to one shot. I'm a lot quicker on the draw than I was then.

[opal vector]

Well, I think I can comfortably take 150 Crowns within the duration of Equalization. <_<

I'll just uh. Do a bug report on that.

[dire raven]

on one hand , conqueror guild is supposed to revamp GPS content interest in a significant way and i understand how that can be really important in orna. On the other hand, this stuff has been discussed/tested for months now and it is delaying everything else in the game to the point people have been waiting since June for anguish 2.0 and possible nerfs to crucial skills everyone in endgame is using, removing the idea of farming toward some permanent progress in endgame since then. I am from HoA so conq guild is less relevant around here but can we please wrap it up in any way and go back to changing the endgame in som epermanent direction so people can actually fully play the game again? i have friends who are stockpiling thousands of raids since june just because anguish raids have been said to be a thing since then. I have 5x of every broken augment because augments are supposedly being re-tooled so some of them might be BIS at broken after a patch , and i'd like to get rid of all of them if possible.

[rapid fossil]

So, being mid-40s puts me in a weird spot. I'm guaranteed to regularly be in situations both where I will have it used against me and greatly benefit from using it on others. I would like to think that gives me a less biased stance, but I'm sure everyone wants to think that about themselves, so... Oh well.

It seems to be mostly viable for near-your-OT use. 30 minute timer, 2 hour cooldown. Depending how widespread its use becomes, it may heavily discourage off-highway engagement with the guild. If someone mostly plays local, you take a ton of their spots, and now they're sitting on lots of guild currency to spend on the equalizer that you so kindly reduced the cost of for them (because the cost scales with owned Crownships), that means they can activate it every two hours with a large supply of proofs to fund it. Though, that situation may be a bit too specific to present as an argument.

Personally, I think the presence of other Crowns makes it entirely unnecessary. (I do not mean pointless, or bad, I do simply mean that it is not necessary.) Players can engage with the other Crowns while striving to get stronger for their current one. I believe that is more in the "spirit of things". I was under the impression that was why these Crownships were here to begin with.

If it ends up becoming very widespread, you'll see fresher t10s saving their proofs and activating it every two hours on the highway. Hypothetically one person doing that isn't bad, but factor in heavy player traffic and it may remove the incentive to engage with the guild outside of your regularly traveled areas. A guild that thrives on competition shouldn't discourage any activity.

[rapid fossil]

On the flipside, I know too well that lots of players hide behind their ascension levels in lieu of better defending. The equalizer encourages more interesting and skillful defensive strategies when taking settlements outside of your usual routes. The cost does keep someone from using it regularly if you live nearby and will just take them back anyway.

Realistically, I think it needs tweaking.

1. With the equalizer cost now lower (it dropped to 150. I thought 500 was very fair),
2. With rampart maintenance still too high a cost for regular use with proofs increasingly more difficult to get when you conqured your immediate surroundings (in my opinion, maintenance buys need to be cheaper than the equalizer),
3. With proofs inconsistently acquired on SAS which makes regular maintenance at the current cost difficult to do
4. With getting the needed crownguards (to reach the needed stat boost to successfully defend even with ascension levels) VERY difficult with the current Proof of Conquering acquisition rate and horrible Crownguard Chance rewards...
   ...with all four of those things, I believe the equalizer tips the odds too far into the attacker's favor. It's not a miracle worker or anything, you do have to have decent offensive capability to even make use of it. However, if the system stays the way it is, I don't think it's fair. It would be, in my opinion, with cheaper maintenance, better Crownguard rewards, Settler's Crownguard lasting longer, and POQ acquisition, Again, that's coming from someone who could very much benefit using it on players much more invested in AL than I am. I would like to see it balanced and implemented properly, though, because it would make for some very interesting play. I think my reasoning is sound, though.

[opal vector]

I agree that it needs tweaking. I think Ramparts and Equalization both need a soft cap, rather than a hard one. If you just increase the cost of everything, the people who actually need Equalization the most won't be able to use it. That being fairly strong people who don't intend to item thousands of settlements.

You push these people into simply not participating in CG after Wrecked takes their entire neighborhood for the 5th time, and they don't have Proof income to make it not worth his while.

[rapid fossil]

I think those people, if the content really interests them, would end up focusing on his OS more

How do you envision a soft cap?

[crisp condor]

I can see that

I doubt we are getting anguish 2.0, this year

[opal vector]

At a certain number of crowns, rather than just not going up anymore as it does now, it would go up still but slower and slower, to make sense with the general proof income of the player. Like for someone with 1000 crowns, it might cost 150 proofs, but for me with nearly 6000 Crowns, it might be 300.

This makes it so that it's expensive but semi-sustainable for normal people, and also not stupid cheap for strange people like me that have thousands of crowns.

[acoustic steppe]

Looking at the new PvP lb, I'm in odd space. I guess it takes old areas (13700) + crowns (3660) to put me in that plac. Similar to Gamblor couple spots above me.

That should probably be based only by reputation? (whatever is higher area or settlements)

[severe valve]

It is this + the Jorm kills without oFSC

Jokes aside, just opened the stat menu from players around you in LB and #54 has 17k rep with 7k players kills. It means 10k area taken on places where there were no players ?

[acoustic steppe]

New generated areas, tbh 1/2 of mine are those too. At least those I'm still holding.

[severe valve]

Ok

[swift flame]

If you turn on the equalizer while someone is steamrolling your territories, do they lose there ALs also, or is it only the attacker? When I first read about it, I was thinking it was more for defense against high AL attackers.

[primal oar]

Would be nice if that 2x exp/orn effect you get was a consumable like the crown guards so I could save them up 😳

[primal oar]

I believe it's both of you

[pliant needle]

You can't pick who you equalize. It's going to affect you and everyone that you attack. Otherwise players would use alts to equalize you while they remain unequalized and go wipe you out.

So it affects the equalizer and the emperors defense they attack.

Oh I see what you're saying anyone that goes into battle with you even if they are attacking. Anyone. Never mind that makes sense.

[opal vector]

If I get attacked, I'll all Zettai or Kazar if it equalized them. (That's who attacks me)

Since I'm currently experiencing a bug where Equalization lasts for just a little bit longer than intended. Not sure if that applies to everyone.

[acoustic steppe]

Time to buy all 40 of them, use them and have 50 days of nonstop zero AL?

[opal vector]

That made me check what happens if I buy it a second time, or if I even can.

Yes I can buy it, and no nothing happens.

[warm wigeon]

So no incentive to really take more?

Once you have that many may as well do legacy

[acoustic steppe]

I was at max mat at around 2600 crowns, heavily focused on mat gain.

[frozen wasp]

I didn't grab a screenshot of getting it, but I got a Conqueror's Crownguard (T4) from [Collect Rewards]

[umbral mango]

Noticing that now that some players and I are taking settlements back and forth my rewards are improving overall even as I have less places owned

[clever scroll]

Thats the point of conquerors which is better IMO

[swift flame]

But the places you take must be maintained... I feel like the incentive to take more is from the ones you lose and/or stop making mats for you.

[rapid fossil]

I'm interested in hearing counterpoints. For those against OS being able to use chargeable moves, what's your reasoning? Hoping to open friendly debate.

[serene dirge]

imo, they are easier to keep charged for endgame players than midgame players, due to the clearing options available to endgame. thus, they are an avenue of advantage for out-of-league players. the goal of the leagues and othersouls is to ensure the player always ends up with the advantage

[vagrant pulsar]

Oh is this new? I only saw the basic crow guards so far

[severe valve]

It seems indeed

[wary pulsar]

Might've been a bugfix with yesterday's server update

[vital bolt]

apparently carving stones have been added to the rewards 👀

[swift flame]

I like that!

[vital bolt]

I love that!

[severe valve]

We'll be able to share so much love with those messages

[swift flame]

Do you gotta click on the messages tab to see them?

[wary pulsar]

Yes, but you can tell there's a message because it gets marked on the ground

[vital bolt]

Yeah but settlements that players have left a message to will also have a visual surrounding them

[silk grotto]

Finally carving stone without runeshop! My suggestion was good

[serene dirge]

?

[vital bolt]

2:05
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMyq-1sZU4o

[serene dirge]

ah, that would not be conq guild rewards

[severe valve]

This is the day everyone will remember as the day we discovered Odie is just a nominee

[clever scroll]

Odie is the one that gets all the complains

[silk grotto]

You have to be more specific

[clever scroll]

Just to mention, but I hope there will be more conqueror sprites (in the future, there are more important things right now), the current sprites look like villagers

[rough fox]

this sent me down a rabit hole leading to finding Forsofia studio and "the gauntlet"

[karmic nymph]

I'd love to see the higher level OS sprites become a sprite pack

[wary pulsar]

Fun fact: Those are the Adventurer's Guild sprites. (from Aethric)

They are a sprite pack, just one that's inaccessible to us

[karmic nymph]

Sadge

[rapid fossil]

Back when I used to use charged moves (it may have changed since then?) it became harder to charge as your stat ceiling increased. For example, I eventually gave up on Sorrow III because it took almost an hour to charge (before beast dens were implemented). Considering that, would the OS, with its lesser stats, end up being charged faster even though your main wouldn't be fully charged yet? If it goes off your main's charge %, I'd think it would justifiably take a while to charge your OS.

[lean hearth]

** Added players badges to player profiles to highlight special achievements in the game **
** -- High ranking area control players will now receive exclusive badges when opting in to the Conqueror's Guild **

I have a question that I haven't seen addressed in the forums yet with regard to Badges.
I am currently ranked 5th on the leaderboards and have over 46,000 reputation.
If I built a Conq Guild Hall right now, my understanding is that I'd have a Legacy Duke Badge for 5th and a 45K Reputation badge.
If I chose Legacy when building the hall, and then manage to pass 50K reputation, will my badge change to 50K, or will that badge be stuck at 45K from the moment I built the guild hall? (Same question for a case where I move into 4th place or drop to 6th place after building the hall.)

[white galleon]

It locks in when you opt in to the guild. So you would have a #5 "classic competitor" badge, and a 25k "classic duke" badge, because there is no badge between 25k and 50k territories. With a recent update, additional badges were added to reflect current leaderboards, so as your ranking changes moving forward, you would have a separate badge reflecting your current leaderboard standing, but your classic badges will remain the same as they were when you opted in.

[lean hearth]

Thanks for the prompt answer. I'm disappointed by the 25K to 50K window for reputation. There's a huge difference between holding 25K territories and holding 45K territories. This means I can't enjoy the new content until I grind out 4,000 more territories, if I want that classic 50K badge.

[opal vector]

I'm generally very conservative about dropping accusations, but I expressed curiosity about how the CG #1 is farming exp so rapidly, and apparently he's a well known alt user in Coliseum. I have no idea if this is true and if that's how he's getting 1k+ exp a day, but the possibility rubs me the wrong, ngl.

I was under the impression there was a significant delay on getting exp from the same settlement twice. I have no issue with being beaten to heck by someone legitimately, but that possibility, true or not, is annoying.

[severe valve]

#💡│suggestions message

Here s the suggestion I talked about

[opal vector]

And I'll be very clear, I have gotten well over 1k exp in a day twice, so I dunno if that's what's being done or not. It's the fact it might be possible I don't like~

I upvoted. c:

[severe valve]

Alting is not seen as cheating, so if someone use it to skyrocket the guild LB as expected, it's not against the TOS, but it's unfortunate and I understand your frustration about it. That's why I made this suggestion some time ago during the beta, just wanted to limit this kind of things.

[opal vector]

I'm an altoholic but I don't like how often alts can completely change gameplay in general.

I personally like the idea of having a long cooldown on taking exp from a settlement conquer. The emphasis on taking and not holding Crowns is going to cause this type of thing. Experience per day for settlements held also night help here.

Work work~

[severe valve]

I may be wrong, but the main way to avoid this kind of issue would be to "work" on the new PvP LB. (Sadly,) CG LB will have this kind of issue.

[severe valve]

Unless settlement exp becomes available only one time/settlements

[magic lion]

Sorry wasn't trying to ignore this, it's a great thorough response and I agree with many points. After thinking about it a little more and considering your input, I'm not entirely against the equalizer because it means I can swap back to heretic and have my good skilled defense builds that I know work lol. If I know the player is using an equalizer at least. They probably still will not stand a chance against a GS or rend epee though.

[magic lion]

I noticed that as well.. he seemed to launch up there out of nowhere. With 2 hour cooldowns between takings, is that even feasible to do with alts? Unless you have an insane amount of settlements in your area. Haven't mathed it out yet, but it's obviously possible since he has the xp. Just comes down to if it's realistically feasible for a human since we can't see the other data

You're looking at 4 hours of cooldown before taking it with your main again if it's a constant rotation

[magic lion]

How do settlements get dispersed on smaller islands? Is it the same as everywhere else? Guess that's a plausible scenario if it's competitive and small enough to be plastered with settlements

[opal vector]

I can't speak on their particular situation. It was simply brought up because apparently it's an alt of Happy, which I guess is someone a lot of people know because he alts Coliseum. He could be doing this completely legitimately, though. I did around 1600 in 24 hours.

I bring it up more as a mention of possibility, rather than a complaint on the person themselves. I didn't know there was a hard cooldown on retaking crowns, so maybe or maybe not.

[severe valve]

Is it one exp for each tier ?

[magic lion]

That's like 6k+ crownships in less than 48 hours

[severe valve]

Are you sure about this number ?

[magic lion]

Well to hit his rank you need more than that lol

[severe valve]

The 48h*

[magic lion]

He wasn't on the lb that I recall. And he shot up there yesterday?

Yesterday/today

[severe valve]

I don't know

[magic lion]

I won't guarantee it 100% but I've skimmed through the lb a lot and don't recall seeing him until yesterday

[severe valve]

Is the CD the same for all tier ?

Meaning when you take othersouls or emperor

[magic lion]

Yeah, 2 hour cd

[severe valve]

And it's always 1 exp/crown taken no matter the tier ?

[opal vector]

I estimate at least 4k in 48 hours.

[magic lion]

1 xp/crown taken. Let me double check something on the timer

[opal vector]

And I would say around 2k in 12 hours, from when I checked before I went to bed until I checked after waking up.

[magic lion]

Yeah the timer is 2 hours and can be staggered depending when they're hit. The timer doesn't reset

[opal vector]

I think this it's probably doable, but it'd take intense focus.

[magic lion]

That's where the humanly feasible comes into play without us seeing all the raw data odie can lol

[opal vector]

I couldn't even one-shot when I did the 1600ish in a day. The majority of those were only my T10 and occasionally my T9.

[hard minnow]

Are ascension levels considered in the duel?

[opal vector]

But so far, it's 2 or 3 days in a row at an intense pace. I commend them if it's legit.

[magic lion]

Not for othersouls but on your actual tier yes

[magic lion]

^

[opal vector]

But there's also an item that negates them for 30 minutes.

Or perhaps longer. <_<

[hard minnow]

wow

what a shame

[opal vector]

Why?

[hard minnow]

because I thought that the ascension levels were active in the battles to conquer the territories

I haven't been able to see the beta properly yet, I'm an iPhone user 😓

[opal vector]

They are.

[hard minnow]

Oh yes, very good, because it would be a farm thrown in the trash

[severe valve]

But when someone else take a Crown from you, you have a 2h CD to take it back ?

[opal vector]

For your character at T10/11, Ascension levels matter. You can use characters called Othersouls to fight for lower level Crowns, where Ascension doesn't come in to play.

[hard minnow]

I understood

[severe valve]

Someone know what is the CD after someone take a crown from you?

[hard minnow]

When do you think it will be available for iPhones?

[magic lion]

Also 2 hours

[magic lion]

The update is rolling out slowly so within the next few days.
#game-announcements message

[primal oar]

That's nice cuz i can't really see wanting to buy them enough to leave a ";)" message

[rapid fossil]

No worries, I didn't take it as ignoring!
Ohh, so you're saying your Gilgamesh build wouldn't work without Ascensions?

[zenith scarab]

In my experience, successful Gilgamesh defense builds with no ascensions is very difficult. Ursa kind of bridged that gap with Counterattack builds adding a frustrating aspect for the besieger. I won't expect that to stay around in it's current form though with the amount of people who chimed in on the balance thread.

[magic lion]

Very unlikely they would lol. My g.ursa builds are pretty trash. Not having all ornate gear and mainly just not having the year's of knowledge and tweaking builds like I have with heretic is a big reason. I just got sooo sick of constantly getting auto countered turn 1 and rend epee'd it was easier to join the easy mode class rather than deal with the frustration of that. And I turned off notifications n haven't played much the past 4-5 months until recently so it made sense to sit on the class that takes the least amount of effort or thought to stall people lol

There is supposed to be counters to everything, but so far rend epee doesn't have a reliable counter in AI based pvp outside of g.ursa auto countering it imo. I mean I push 20k def/res on some builds pre buffs and can't slow it down. Maybe it's just me being bad in that respect and not keeping up on all of the newer gear. Someone did the math on the heretic OL channel and told me I would need 60k def (pretty sure that was before buffs, but don't quote me on that part because I didn't check it) that just isn't happening before you're killed off

[zenith scarab]

A rend/epee user could probably tell you the best way to defend against it, I am guessing Beo Pet Kektus build with enough tankiness to survive 2 rounds is probably decent as they probably aren't running much defense. But I don't have BoF to use rend/epee to know yet.

[wary pulsar]

The only way to defend against it is to have enough ward to not get oneshot and still be able to oneshot in return

Which is not easy

[magic lion]

I figured a very high AL beo is probably the best, but I'm more clueless on that class than gilga even though I used to play around on it a long time ago lol

Yeah that with auto ca from g.ursa was the most reliable I found. 75% chance to turn 1 db and then hope for an auto ca in there if I can't ss 😂

[zenith scarab]

One reason I am against Ascensions in pvp, really puts a hamper on changing classes to defend unless you are an over achiever

I've switched my stance on that greatly in the last year

[magic lion]

I can see that, but GS and beo would need to be toned down a ton to allow other classes to compete at 0 AL. Those are the 2 main classes that can shred me at 136 AL and them having 20 or less AL. Even if I stack manticore. Usually GSH. A lot of ppl think it sucks, but if you know what you're doing it makes easy work out of high AL players

[dawn veldt]

Summon damage is trash against high AL players, not enough damage and not enough dex for them to hit, but it's true with the GSH, the high M1 in the BP shreds people even if they have +100AL

Although dex is usually a problem

[opal vector]

Summoners also have the benefit that AI can't reliably exploit their weakness of punching them directly in the face.

I've learned quickly that the only good defense build is one that irritates the opponent enough that they don't want to keep fighting you.

[acoustic steppe]

500k+ ward and 120k+ ward regen is good start. 👌

[wary pulsar]

This is the classic territory defense strategy

It's not about winning, it's about losing as slowly as possible

[opal vector]

There's no way you have that much ward without a major sacrifice to defense and probably status immunities. And boy oh boy, ask Wrecked and Zettai, I effing love status effects.

But yeah, it's probably slow and annoying to fight. <_<

[crisp condor]

I love it when my AI crits the summoner first turn

[opal vector]

I wish it was an AI option to tell it to hit the summoner.

[acoustic steppe]

Yea, only 10-11k def/res and 85k HP and 4k dex + all of that on Warden. Missing lot of immunity, but doggo will do the WoO and you can probably interrupt some regen with statuses. So doable ...

[crisp condor]

Sadly my AOE options are not strong enough 80% of the time to kill the summoner in 1-2 turns

[acoustic steppe]

I run either that or 16k def/res with 350k ward regen Warden.

[magic lion]

I've thrown up 1m ward builds just for fun against them and they are less reliable than keeping some stats and a mid level ward from my experience. Yeah ceri knows my g.ursa's main weakness, but it's also the first thing I shoot to cover to see if it helps lol

[crisp condor]

Someone has to try a windtamer shield build

Unequip every spell so the AI spams that

[magic lion]

It spams attack. Maybe dorado doesn't since I learned it still spams counterattack on the katar

[wary pulsar]

Yeah I'm not sure why Dorado spams counterattack so much

I feel guilty for using a Katar, lol

[crisp condor]

Mine spams the offhand ability

[magic lion]

What's your inclination set to? I guess that's the main thing I probably haven't changed in my testing of what could spam the offhand

[crisp condor]

The debuffer

Or whatever is called

[magic lion]

Like defender is wayyy better than saboteur if you're running a status build lol

Defender. Interesting that's what I tend to use

[crisp condor]

It is but saboteur is more aggressive

I use saboteur

[magic lion]

Saboteur spams sleep when they're immune 😭

I'll have to try it our

[wary pulsar]

I'm on default for my counterattack spam

[magic lion]

Out*

[opal vector]

I haven't delved into the world of defense. I'm way too outclassed by my rivals to bother.

[crisp condor]

It's mainly for niche things like spamming offhand abilities

[magic lion]

I'll try it out in a bit and see how it goes

[opal vector]

I'm pretty sure everyone I currently trade territory with can T1 me. I think.

[crisp condor]

How much hp do you have?

[opal vector]

Pvp, about 24k? I'm 237 at AL 5. xD

[crisp condor]

I've only encountered people that crit for 180k first turn, in settelments

[acoustic steppe]

hybrid full ward SS can T1 anybody

[crisp condor]

Bread for BeoH

[crisp condor]

I AM NOT GOING THAT DEVIL ROUTE

[acoustic steppe]

300k+ dmg in my face through 20k+ def like nothing ...when i stay 1 HP and 80% passive, adding golem? still 250k

[crisp condor]

I am just waiting to see what changes are they going to do to these spells

Main reason why I didn't even try to get a spiked shield

[opal vector]

I recently switched over to Bestla because I got tired of the fact that I had a full set of Ornate Fey Gerd and yet had never gotten a single Ornate for Galia. So I haven't gotten Auriga or Hydrus or even a Celestial Lute yet for that matter.

[crisp condor]

Fey gerd armor is so fricking good lol

[wary pulsar]

Balance patch can't come soon enough. Even though idk if it'll even help with that

[crisp condor]

Bis for beoB and A, in my opinion

[opal vector]

Not to mention, two of my Fey Gerds are elemental.

[magic lion]

I'd like to see an all around reduction in damage in PvP. The power creep just became too much

[opal vector]

^^^^^^^^^^^

^^^^^^^^

Pls

[crisp condor]

"But my ALs"

[opal vector]

It's a nuke-a-thon out there.

[crisp condor]

https://tenor.com/view/crying-sad-emoji-gif-22168442

[magic lion]

I have a lot of ALs and am for it. AL will still matter

[crisp condor]

"Why would we work on ALs then??!"

https://tenor.com/view/cry-sad-crying-sobbing-ugly-gif-25812720

[acoustic steppe]

area control is only thing that matters to me, I do AL only for this purpose

[crisp condor]

ALs were a mistake

[opal vector]

No one should be able to one shot any peer, without MASSIVE drawbacks in the build.

[magic lion]

^ heretic is pretty much the only class currently where you have to make big deciding factors on what you want to run

[acoustic steppe]

this one is not about AL, but rathet about possible builds, skills and some classes

[opal vector]

I don't blame ALs for anything.

[crisp condor]

Yeah just have 400k ward and ward regen so you can run other builds
Oh wait you are stuck on that spiked shield now

[acoustic steppe]

nah, my favourite def build is BoF 😛

[crisp condor]

Bof is funny

[wary pulsar]

The issue is the highway nature of Settlements. Most people expect to be able to take settlements while moving at highway speeds

[acoustic steppe]

150k ward, 80k HP, ward activated, HP throught crit regen, 40% crit dmg ...and few more ...couple of 100% crit dmg skills pew pew

[crisp condor]

Is the amity "15% more stats while defending a territory" working for settelments, btw?

[wary pulsar]

Wrecked, Ceriath, wouldn't it be a little inconvenient if it took a minute or two for each settlement battle? 😅

[rough fox]

that is exactly what I was thinking about the above.

[magic lion]

Against NPC or players lol

[wary pulsar]

Think about you guys taking settlements, not about defending settlements you already own

Players obviously

[crisp condor]

2 mins would be fine imo

[opal vector]

Uh. It already takes me minutes. I love it. <_<

[crisp condor]

I just open it, press verse 4, and close it

[wary pulsar]

But in a world where every settlement was owned by a player and you weren't just taking unowned stuff in the middle of nowhere

(How territory is atm in 99% of areas)

[rough fox]

not to mention if you think about it as a plot and you reduce "all damage" now you have a Tier 2 battle taking a full 15 minutes. If you instead reduce "high tier" damage you are now efectively canceling out AL.

[crisp condor]

sometimes second chance comes around

[crisp condor]

I still think that ALs are bad for the health of the game

[opal vector]

I have been actively fighting Wrecked, Brewmaster, Zettai, Kazar, Sleep-chan, and others for nearly a year. I absolutely love it.

[magic lion]

Currently I would say yes just because I'm very fast at it. When I first got into it, it likely did take me that or longer per territory. Then I'd run across mobile and his gilga at 250k ward 💀. Those were insane numbers back then but it pushed me to get better

[opal vector]

Once you learn a player's weaknesses, you can tweak your builds and fight then quicker. And then they'll make changes that slow you back down.

[crisp condor]

Now every deity has 300k+ ward

[crisp condor]

Give me a replay so I can see what you changed from the last time

[opal vector]

Territory shouldn't be one tapping. Territory should be sustained battles of strategy and attrition.

<_< Are you someone on a different name?

[rough fox]

I dont think the Idea of AL is unhealthy just that the scaling can be Insane and the people who have farmed it (fishing, running 100 refineries) make it hard on people not "bending" intended play.

[crisp condor]

I have many names

[opal vector]

ALs are fine now with the Equalization. They give you a significant advantage, but not an insurmountable one. :3

[rough fox]

I wish I could see a recap of the battles too. is there a way?

[opal vector]

Nope.

[crisp condor]

No

Unless they add it later down the line

[opal vector]

I think a battle log if you travel to the settlement might be cool.

[crisp condor]

Most recaps now would be you getting oneshot'ed anyway

[rough fox]

always has been

[magic lion]

Not always

[opal vector]

I disagreed, but understood the complaints on the old system.

[crisp condor]

Hear me out
New arena mode
You can only equip items that you get from the arena, after you die you lose all of them. No Als, no reflect bullshit

[rough fox]

maybe not for you guys. 🙂 I play casually. I have one refinary and I play between rendering jobs at work Or for 20 mins while I walk the dog.

[magic lion]

But did you play 3 years ago? Lol

[rough fox]

been playing for 5 years almost and that is the way Territory has always been

[crisp condor]

Pure strategy of making whatever RNG laidy gives you

[rough fox]

sounds good to me

[magic lion]

Idk I definitely didn't get and couldn't 1 shot everyone back then. Mobile resorted to going 50 on interstates to take me out and even then it took him 4 passes to clear the area of me lol

[crisp condor]

Rogue-fy the game

[opal vector]

I think it sounds fun. But I'd rather they focus on cleaning up class n system balance right now instead of adding new things. That's just my opinion.

[rough fox]

lol.

[opal vector]

(Replying to Seb)

[wary pulsar]

Related, during one of the few times I streamed Orna I started with an empty inventory and had to gather gear from scratch to win in Arena fights with an hour time limit. It was a lot of fun

[magic lion]

Then GS came along 😒 cheesed me off everything lol

[opal vector]

That does sound fun.

[rough fox]

I think a decent portion of it comes down to the fact that I am still not T11. its a long slog when you play casually. I didnt even start doing the discord thing until a few months ago. I have learned a ton of things that would have made life easier and leveling faster 😄

[opal vector]

Why am I still awake? Oof.

Bedtime!

Was a nice chat. Join the Unfelled Battle Club, our 3v3 league starts at the end of November!

<_<

[rough fox]

that does sound like a great time. sounds like a great Competition as well.

really similar to how I play MTG now. I will only play draft. none of this "I have 500$ to dump on the perfect deck" BS. random cards, and your skill are all that matter.

[zenith scarab]

Sounds liek a great BoF tourney

[wary pulsar]

It's hard to enfornce in a BoF tourney

Could be something to do among friends (or several streamers/people streaming) though

[zenith scarab]

You have 4 hours to create a new character for BoF, go!

[crisp condor]

Oh yeah, I just hope they do it next year

[rough fox]

you teach me how to stream and Ill play that tourney with you. 😄

[wary pulsar]

Good luck gathering the arena tokens to do that 😆

[crisp condor]

I would make an arena only account but we need tokens ree

[rough fox]

$$

😄

[crisp condor]

I am only paying for my dwarf skins

[rough fox]

lol.

[wary pulsar]

I might buy the November sprite pack for some of my Othersouls

[crisp condor]

Next month skins also look cool

[wary pulsar]

(To keep this on topic)

[rough fox]

for my PVP engagement metric... I have 14113 arena tokens. 😄

[crisp condor]

Not me spending all of my tokens to buy 300 avalon ore

Bof fights

[wary pulsar]

Don't spend any BoF proofs on materials until the guild shop re-balance

Which may eventually happen maybe

[rough fox]

I have 37 bof tokens.

[crisp condor]

Yeah in 2 years probably

[rough fox]

so. anyone else go 5-8 draws in a row all the time on settlement?

[wary pulsar]

Yep

The absolute worst part of settlements

[rough fox]

think we could get a buff... 3 draws = 2x rewards lol. clicking button and waiting, then closing, then re-clicking is time consuming when you are out hunting dungeons or towers.

or maybe make it 5 options to reduce chance of draw? rock-paper-scissors-lizard-spock style? 😄

[sacred spade]

Should just be a collect taxes button at this point. Let the citizens of orna finally contribute to our murder spree

[rough fox]

or do they pay us to kill eachother instead of them?

[pliant needle]

My highest is 14 draws.

[rough fox]

never thought to keep track. lol. I know there was one where I actually left without a win because it kept going so long lol

[opal sandal]

There were so many I left without a win because it went for so long

[zenith scarab]

My new strategy is if I get a draw, I pick the counter to that draw, seems to be working ok so far.

[rough fox]

lol. its straight luck, 33%. (unless they have a modifier on their random number generator for it. 😄 )

[silk grotto]

I just usually spam the sword

Until i win

Or defeat

[zenith scarab]

I was doing that (though I changed every day between them) but just too many dang draws

[rough fox]

since we desire an end (be it win or loose) adding more options reduces the chance of a draw. for example if there were 5 options that's a 40% chance of a win, 40% chance of a loss, and a 20% chance of a tie. helping reduce "spaming sword" (or in my case axe :D)

[wary pulsar]

You know what reduces chance of a draw even more?

Just a single button

[rough fox]

so is it a win or a loose button?

[wary pulsar]

Button has 50% chance of nothing, 25% chance of proof, 25% chance of exp. Exactly the same outcome as the current system with zero pain.

[rough fox]

removing the illusion of control from the player though...

[wary pulsar]

There is no skill in the current system, it's just RNG that can RNG you into being delayed from your win or loss

The illusion of control doesn't provide any value

[rough fox]

how a bout just change draw to "super win" 33% chance of nothing, 33% chance of (50% prof, 50%exp) and 33% chance of both a proof AND an exp... keep the 3 buttons.

remove annoyance and maintain illusion of control and who doesn't love extra rewards.

[wary pulsar]

who doesn't love extra rewards.
Odie

[rough fox]

um. not even sure why the extra blues would matter... once you have acquired 900 of them they are basically useless (beyond 40 per day if you are perfect)

[wary pulsar]

It's not 40 per day, if you wanted to fully maintain perfectly it would cost 600 (plus 300 to refill HP if you wanted to do that)

Proof costs are based on how many crownships you own, capped at 300 (or 150 for Equalization)

[rough fox]

oops. .. forgot the ramparts tab.

🤣

I dont know how you guys do it. I have used most of my spare time since conq dropped running around capturing settlements (to try and get proofs to unlock BoF) and leaderboard shows Level 29, I am level 7.

[zenith scarab]

I'm just slowmoding my way through crown proofs for BoF

[rough fox]

HEY!!! i must be doing something similar to you 😄

[magic lion]

If you're not taking the OS spots too, that's likely the reason lol

[rough fox]

yeah. one whole day was a 12 hour car trip so there was no taking the OS spots on that one lol.

[magic lion]

The top guy is real questionable right now tbh lol

Launched up there

He quit legacy at rank #54 and he's jumped to rank #15 competitive.

That means he's not alting those ranks because he'd lose crownships keeping the competitive rank down and also not participating in any/ much rps

Butttt I'm probably teetering on the edge of witch hunting so I'll shut up. Hopefully it's looked into

[rough fox]

see... you lost me when you started saying how an alt can keep the level down while boosting the rank but im guessing it has somethign to do with capturing the same location back and forth with an alt. 😄

[wary pulsar]

Doing that boosts your XP and gives proofs, but doesn't gain you any reputation

[rough fox]

alt is something I have played with to complete low level quests * cough thronemaker bandits and keeping my base clear of un-needed bestiaries 😄

[wary pulsar]

The PvP leaderbaord is based on Reputation

[rough fox]

Rep = 401 for me 😄

so... I should use my t1 alt and the settlement I can see from home to boost my proofs you say...

unlock BoF sooner. got it.

I understand what you are saying now.

[magic lion]

PvP is based on all pvp stats per odie

Even coliseum

[wary pulsar]

Sorry, I should've worded that better

[rough fox]

so thats a fat 0 for me 😄

[wary pulsar]

The PvP leaderboard uses Reputation as a metric, so if you didn't gain any it would hurt your rank

[rough fox]

im not worried about PVP rankings at all honestly. I only care about using the proofs for mats and unlocking everything.

so i need about 2000 crownships for the pets, summons, and sprite packs then i will never come back. 😄

[wary pulsar]

Unfortunately the only realistic way to rack up significant coliseum wins is through alt coliseums

[rough fox]

i kind of want 1 coliseum win so im all ears... what is "alt coliseum"?

[clever scroll]

Use alts

[rough fox]

T1 alt starts col and join with T10 to stomp?

[wary pulsar]

Start the coliseum on the alt as a party

[rough fox]

yep. ok.

[magic lion]

Slightly lost on what you mean knight. You can still go up in rank without reputation. Yatsoya was a prime example at being rank #5 with 2m player kills

[clever scroll]

Orna The Alt RPG Game

[magic lion]

He had rep too, but half of what I had

[magic lion]

Still was above me just because he ran arena a tonnnnn

[wary pulsar]

Yeah Yatsoya is a big alt coliseum guy, lol.

[magic lion]

So even if he loses the crownships he's going to keep going up on the competitive board?

[wary pulsar]

Idk man that was a screenshot of what you said

I thought you were saying he wasn't trading with alts because it wouldn't gain him as many competitive ranks as he gained

[magic lion]

Yeah, if he was trading with alts I don't think he'd hit rank #15. I'm pretty sure losing it would still count against you, it's just not the displayed number of rep unless I misunderstood it when odie spoke on it. I thought the displayed reputation is just whatever is higher. Your old rep or your crownship holdings

Traveling rigger should have passed me when he had 600 more rep than I did because he has passed me prior by just exceeding my number by 200. The only reason I could imagine why he didn't is because I also have 5k crownships

[remote onyx]

Anyone on iOS got the update or ar we still in App Store review hell?

[magic lion]

Are poi shifts still happening? I was just on this stretch of freeway near my house 45 mins ago and I know everything was occupied by me since I'm on it everyday. There were 2 completely vacant settlements along it just now. If poi shifts are complete then I'm going to confidently say that NPC notifications do not work

[swift flame]

Imagine if shifts never stop? You go to Australia and find one of your territories there?

[marsh marlin]

Sounds like it’s slooooooooow roll out hell vs App Store review hell.

[opal vector]

I drive Uber full time n I also travel for fun a lot. I got an Uber ride to Mississippi a few days after CG launched, which catapulted me way into the lead at the time. 1600ish exp in 24 hours.

[rough fox]

yeah. I dont think anyone is cheating. I just don't have a lifestyle that is conducive to territory control. I work from home (way too many hours) and am in a more rural-ish area than say east or west coast. I travel for fun when I can but there are not things close like there would be on the coast so its always an airplane trip.

again no complaints from me. I love this game. even if some aspect are dificult.

[pliant needle]

Three more levels today.

It's fascinating.

[opal vector]

Yeah. I stress it everytime I comment on it, it's -perfectly- doable. But I can't imagine what this person is doing to get so far. Trucking, road trip, or on work vacation.

I had to drive to Mississippi to get that pace.

[primal oar]

What I've observed is if you're not equipped with the best very specific gear and have lots of AL, you're a bad gilga, and replica selene go brrrrr. And they both tend to laugh at summoners and their predictable animal companions.

Another strategy I've seen is "I don't need to win, I just need you to give up".

Like, what do you even do about a solid turtle build? There's no way to remove/dispell permanent buffs from an opponent like in some other games. You can't chip them down because they heal it back passively.

[silk grotto]

Do i need to leave beta program to get the latest update?

[crisp condor]

I doubt it

[magic lion]

Rend epee, GSH, beo. Also stats degrade as the battle goes on so eventually you will damage them

[serene dirge]

Nope - it will overwrite the beta version when it rolls out to you

[swift flame]

Dot, freeze/stun/stasis, temper and then just divine bastion till they die. The worse thing about the turtle builds is they usually don't hit back. So if you're patient you can take them down. Eventually you too will reach the point where you can one shot people.

And it looks like stats degrade faster than they used to, so it should be easier to take them down sooner.

Like the main man says, there is always a counter!

[acoustic steppe]

I like what I can hold/do. I have only that many time to play, or do control...yet I do. No stress. And as years pass, there is less and less time....so 🤷. I used to translate, no time to do that anymore. I used to bike 5000km+/year (and taking areas), no time to do that anymore. Etc...

[tepid zodiac]

Biking and settlements sorta work well together