#Realm Celestials

593 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

frank saddle
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Would love some debate around realm celestials

Current context: as a realm main (31 asc), I haven’t touched realm celestials because I just don’t see the point in them.

Go to gilga chat and it’s obvious, get gilga Hercules, it’s good for xyz. For heretic it’s get Ara, it’s good for xyz. Same for deity.

For realms it’s… well i guess you can get Corvus and it’s literally only good for other realms and being slightly faster on raids or you can get dorado and be just as slow as base realm but it’s slightly safer.

I get celestials are meant to be sidegrades but compared to gilga / heretic / deity sidegrades where it’s “here’s a celestial class with a niche use case but not superior across the board” - id argue most realms look at Corvus and dorado and ask uhhhh what’s this one for again?

Suggestions:

  1. Corvus crits persisting across floors
  2. Realm getting some sort of a melee aoe that’s usable for endgame content (see other thread)
void hull
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give dorito an AOE like ara vesta

atomic geyser
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Corvus is legitimately worse than base realm because no recharge therefore you chug mana pots like crazy.
It's skills are niche tho.
Dorito has quad edge which a beo skill (can't change my mind) and that's it. Maybe it'd be good with the ward AoE skill?

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Heretic corvus is literally broken tho.

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Full utilization of ultimastrikes.
I'm assuming it gets the 2,5x crit?
On top of positive stat duration passive
On top of wielding realm gear?

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And doesn't need to redline with all that

unkempt kiln
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Dorito has been working very well for me but the 46 ALs help out tremendously. Honestly, I don’t think there’s much that it does that gilga can’t do better for example. The change id like to see come to Dorado is gilga skills (chained shield, spiked shield) not being reduced on it and maybe second chance. High tenacity would be cool but probably too unbalanced imo

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Corvus is just super underwhelming. Did RS2 really need an increased mana cost? Realm was already destroying raids super fast, Corvus doesn’t really add anything new. Crit persisting through dungeon floors would definitely be the welcome addition for it imo

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Some dorito pvp defense feedback as well: not being able to use the gilga skills effectively lands it in a weird spot. If you’re trying to defend territory than you can stack tons of ward and just stall out people with things like axe of gilga. That doesn’t help in war defense though, since you’ll end up with such a low attack stat that you’ll be zero’d out easily. Leaning towards attack instantly cuts into your ward/defenses, meaning you’re just sort of in the middle and not really excelling at anything

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As much as horde is concerned, zwei Dorito definitely works, 2 quad edges is enough to clear most dungeons with an adequate build without much headache. Your damage numbers are still absurdly lower than mage’s but it’s definitely doable

frank saddle
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But plz pitch in comments on melee aoe 🥰

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Would love your thoughts on it

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Actually would be curious to see a run with Dorito doing horde boss t11 with boost gear and 2 quad edges

unkempt kiln
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Definitely not in boost gear. But I think the fact that mages can do that without much difficulty is more a sign of how strong their AoE options are

unkempt kiln
frank saddle
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Plz I did one on base and died on 19

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Glad I recorded it

unkempt kiln
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Im honestly still not convinced that Dorito zwei is better than raider+base realm with bricrius

frank saddle
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Was super cringe

frail sparrow
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Dorito was my latest celestial class unlock - I'm having a hard time figuring out what it's used for outside of maximum view distance.

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Only ascension 23, but have decent gear to play with.

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I don't have much in terms of suggestions, just wanted to share my view on the class (Best Dungeon spotter)

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-suggest Have a chance at performing skills twice based on your dexterity stat

winter glade
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I have one of the best RS gears and amities and 40 ascensions.

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And dorito is really slow.

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Safer than normal RS but sloooow

unkempt kiln
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Slow in what?

desert zodiac
atomic geyser
desert zodiac
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Heretic classes are actually pretty well done. Each has its up and downs. Skills are what’s strong about them. But the classes are actual sidegrades. They each have a penalty and advantages and disadvantages for different content. But thread is about realms.

unkempt kiln
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Let’s not derail the conversation please

desert zodiac
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There is none. Try to make sure that what you guys feel is lacking is at the top, easy to read, instead of comparing to other classes. So your problems can be addressed ❤️

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Btw, I’m all for a 2 target hit skill. Realms do need an easier times doing towers. It’s a very uncomfortable spot. Having to use a lower AL class to do it (except GS 🤮) when you kinda need high ALs to compete in tower content. And would also help against the GS match up, which is atrocious for realm

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That’s all I gotta say about that. Hope y’all get it. ❤️ And only that 🤡😂

winter glade
oak dirge
frail sparrow
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Realm Dorado feels like old school realm - pre HT but better weapons.

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Anyone else play around as Dorito-Swash?

desert zodiac
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That’s actually the first thing I thought about when I first saw dorito

atomic geyser
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Full warrior gear and swash?

winter glade
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People don't really think this through some times

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Where can that be used?

desert zodiac
winter glade
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What are the uses of it?

desert zodiac
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I honestly think it would be hella dope for all non horde content.

frail sparrow
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Great weapons

desert zodiac
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On paper at least

winter glade
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Like?

desert zodiac
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All. Non. Horde. Content. Lol. Raids, pvp, endless.

winter glade
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Towers? Not at all, you will die to many hordes there

desert zodiac
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Non horde

winter glade
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PvP? maybe

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Raids? No you will die to zerks

desert zodiac
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It’ll be real easy to get into passive. With ward. Can’t one shot? You’re dead.

winter glade
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Endless? Really?

desert zodiac
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Use ashen rubies or something

winter glade
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And lose 100% stat bonus?

desert zodiac
desert zodiac
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No need to 1 hp redline with swash

frail sparrow
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Max crit swash

winter glade
desert zodiac
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I stand by raids too

winter glade
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Lower tier raids only.

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As you won't get the damage from it even with swash

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He has 9.8k damage with swash

frail sparrow
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Here's a sword and board swash variant -

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Not the worse for swash

winter glade
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I get almost 7k without it and I get to stay on 1 hp

frail sparrow
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You can dedline with this ^

winter glade
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And with shield it's around 9k.

frail sparrow
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Redline* lol

desert zodiac
winter glade
desert zodiac
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Look at the ward😂 that’s nuts

frail sparrow
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Auto ward pants keep you alive without needing to stop ?

desert zodiac
winter glade
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If you get 2x stats at 1hp

desert zodiac
winter glade
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Can't compare against this.

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Safe and can redline at 1hp

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Any raid except Amorri in 1min with full safety.

desert zodiac
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Seems like realm is OP 🥸

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Nefr

winter glade
frail sparrow
winter glade
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We need new skills for Endless too

frail sparrow
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Easy to get tons of ward for redline doritio

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Jsut bad dex

winter glade
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Not easy.

frail sparrow
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Lmao wut

desert zodiac
winter glade
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I am just saying being able to do every raid in under a minute is possible

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But with this gear

frail sparrow
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Easy with Trev charms

desert zodiac
frail sparrow
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Crits not healing health is nice?

winter glade
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With corvus it will be good

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You can do low raids like lightning

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Whoosh

frail sparrow
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I really like this class in concept

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These*

winter glade
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Yeah they were okay

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But practically they don't have much uses

valid roost
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Corvus is Not necessary. Base rs is more confortable we can already destroy raids . Rs2 ok allow US to keep One achlys. Dorito seems what the hell are WE doing with .

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I dont Wana spend shards on it because base realm is enough . So no(compared to other celestial classes ) big improvements

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Im only al 22 and lvl 242 and i dont need corvus or dorito that the point compared to other classes

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Persistant crits on floor will be nice . And dorito One aoe Skill (WE need it at realm )

outer timber
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IMO there is one way way to make more interesting RS corvus, make it almost a mirror of heretic corvus: change the magical realmstrikes for a pseudo ara vesta 2 and make this and all the other skills ( with a name change so you can differentiate them) do magical damage using phisical attack, this way you resolve two problems, the incapacity of dealing magical damage to cerus and make it somewhat unique

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And let RS corvus use wizard equipment

winter glade
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And let all the attacks be based on attack and of magic type?

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Well that be a different style of play.

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Heretic at 1 hp

spring mirage
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red and blue line heretic xD

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would be funny

oak dirge
spring mirage
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nah, boring, healthless heretic would be cool
the best with an invered swash on res gear

thorny herald
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I like the idea of second chance for dorrito and no spike/chain penalties. That would give it a good niche.

frank saddle
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Like major said earlier tying ward skills to bastille and not gilga would be amazing and logically sensible

hollow thorn
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I havent quite been able to unlock either yet, but part of me wonders if Id just be better off unlocking other classes to supplement the skills for base RS. For example unlocking Call of Byrnhild 2 for endless or unlocking Guarding Strikes 4 for general use. Apologies if this has been discussed already.

thorny herald
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I think, generally, all celestial unlocks for realm are basically to unlock a skill.

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So going for the skill that suits you is the only real option for realm.

hollow thorn
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Yea thats kind of how I feel at this point. Someone mentioned above that Corvus and Dorado are quite attractive for particular elements of game play but lack appeal in general terms. I definitely agree with that sentiment.

sharp crypt
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Got bored, wrote a wall of text

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lul, too long to post all at once in discord. Sections it is

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See below for a rant/thoughts of Dorado

frank saddle
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tease

sharp crypt
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Dexterity is often overvalued on gear, reducing or outright removing other stats required for endgame content. This has been a topic of conversation off and on for years, but the way dex is valued on gear needs to be reworked. There is no reason that adding dexterity to gear should tank the defense/resistance/ward values

Want an example? Look no further than Hel's boots, a thief only piece of gear with a decent amount of dex but no ward.

This problem does have exceptions that prove dexterity doesn't need to be valued as high as it is. Hel's chest has passable def/res, good ward, high dex, and passive immunities to blind/stunned. The result? Hel's chest is one of the best chest options in the game, but still has competition with Riftguard/fey yeti/bulwark/Askr.

There is also a lot of thief gear that doesn't have dex at all, or has super low values. Ymir Brilliant Feathers = 0 dex; Hel's Feathers = 0 dex; A godforged beguiled chest has a whopping 63 dex

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Part 2:

We can equip warrior gear, but what is the point? To my knowledge, there isn't a single piece of warrior gear in the game that has dexterity on it. No dex means no dorado passive, and the base levels of the passive are nowhere near enough to be worth using even at ascension 43. Warrior gear only serves to make you a status pinata.

Use immunity gear? Sure, but now I'm just cosplaying as a significantly worse version of base realm/gilga.

But spiked/chained shield! Nope. 250k ward and chained shield hits for ~60k damage against the cactus dummy. And that is with a 30% dragon damage amity equipped and a dragon enchanted weapon. And a 199% fey yeti coat. And a 198% gilga axe. And 193% riftguard boots. And a 194% arisen shield. And (only) a 149% ONC. Give me another few years of grinding and I might be able to squeeze out another 5k damage.

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part 3:

Dex doesn't scale with quality. I'm less concerned about this on gear than I am adornments. The only two dex adornments that could be realistically utilized by dorado right now are Turul feathers (22 dex, 1% crit) and Jewel of Pale (13 dex, 1% ward). Having both of these scale with quality would make them significantly more appealing to use.

44 dex and 1% crit chance for a max Turul feather could almost outweigh the loss of dex for using pure warrior gear

26 dex and 2% ward for a max Jewel of Pale would be a respectable option and fits the niche of dorado being the "tanky" variant

yes, JoCs exist, but I don't expect them to be nerfed or anything to be buffed to their level

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Part 4:

Speaking of dorado being the tank variant - it isn't. The only place Dorado is tankier than base realm is at high health when not utilizing resurgence. This makes dorado preferable for towers because redlining in towers is inefficient and dangerous, and for low tier horde content, but that is it.

The 70% mystic feather chance on base realm is better than any dodge chance I've been able to get out of dorado with the max dex I have available

My def/res values on base realm are higher than dorado thanks to proper utilization of zerk buffs

But the status resistance! Nah, see my next point

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Part 5:

The "chance to resist" and "chance to clear" statuses with dorado are, again, only preferable when I'm at high health and not utilizing resurgence.

If I take myself down to <500HP on dorado while raiding/clearing a dungeon/doing anything, it doesn't matter if the status clears two turns faster. If I let it damage me a single time, I die.

Sure, I can go balls to the wall with dex and the first 2 or 3 miasmas from Morrigan may not proc, but the fourth one will. And guess what? If I let it damage me, I die.

"well leave yourself a health buffer then!". Sure, I guess, but this feels terrible. Here is a stat passive that you can't maximize because the nature of the other passive the class is designed around doesn't allow you to.

If I'm playing dorado and I plan on utilizing resurgence at all, I'm better off running immunity gear than I am utilizing the passive the class was designed around. And if I'm running immunity gear, I might as well just play base realm.

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Part 6:

Why does the literal dex class have less dex than base realm and all three versions of deity?

That's it. That's the whole part.

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Solutions:

Really, I just have two. Let dex on adornments scale with quality, and change the stat passive. I don't want high tenacity added as that will likely be too powerful and results in the exact same gameplay as base realm. I honestly don't want anything that even resembles redlining.

Give me a passive that rewards staying at high health and/or high ward by maximizing my dexterity so that I dodge attacks and resist statuses. It fits the theme of the class, acts as a completely different playstyle, and removes the reliance on using zerks to get respectable damage out of realm. There were several good ideas toss around during the beta, and I've seen several more in the suggestions channel since.

The other issues are either large game altering changes (adjusting dex on every piece of thief gear feels unrealistic) or can be solved over time as new gear is introduced (warrior gear with dex please, more balanced thief gear).

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TL;DR

Resurgence on Dorado sucks. Please fix.

vagrant thistle
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Well said

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I too thought it was odd to give the class variant a dex based passive and then let it wear gear that doesn't have dex lol

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I almost feel like dorado and corvus got their abilities swapped

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dorado could turtle up behind ward and build into crit chains, where corvus could lean into dex for different playstyle and gear

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I'm hesitant to buy either right now because I just don't see the use case and they don't bring good enough skills to the table to warrant the cost

frank saddle
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i'm saving shards with 0 realm celestial bought

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despite "maining" realm as a sad boi

sharp crypt
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Might need to write another wall just for that

frank saddle
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yeah your post isn't about dorado

vagrant thistle
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I just don't understand skills like hexacut

frank saddle
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your post is literally... dex

vagrant thistle
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like why even spend the time to code what is effectively quadcut that no one will ever use

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Quadedge is useful and has been needed for a long time

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what is even the difference between sortie 1 and 2?

sharp crypt
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1.8 vs 1.9 M1 and double the mana cost

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iirc

vagrant thistle
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kinda what I thought

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so basically nothing

sharp crypt
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Yeah, might as well not exist

vagrant thistle
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I like the idea of using it for a double hit aoe

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the crit chain thing not continuing between floors is absurd

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so basically it's just for gimmick raiding

sharp crypt
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And intentional

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Which is... annoying

vagrant thistle
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what's even the point?

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the celestials are supposed to open up new playstyles, but this doesn't

frank saddle
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90 mins a month for other realms, duh

sharp crypt
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We have a niche for other realms, and a (very minor) niche for towers

vagrant thistle
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dorado at least adds some survivability to otherwise squishy realm but is more of the same with a passive that is almost unusable

frank saddle
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i think i'm gonna devote some youtube videos to realm sucking at every day things that other classes can do well

vagrant thistle
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lol

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i will subscribe

frank saddle
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like show my deity one shotting pegasus pack

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and then show my realm one by one gs3

vagrant thistle
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then realm blind and asleep until death 25 turns later lol

frank saddle
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ya

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or like needing 12 sweeps

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after 3 mana pots to clear level 22 of t11 horde boss

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vs caster pressing 1 button

vagrant thistle
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herp derp dance go brrr

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at least we're not filthy mages so we got that going for us which is nice

sharp crypt
frank saddle
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speak for yourself

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i'm as filthy as they come

vagrant thistle
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well yeah, but not a mage

frank saddle
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my first celestial and only is deity ara

vagrant thistle
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i won't judge you for that

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i thought about deity ursa but kinda want to phase deity out of my class rotation in general and just play between realm and gilga

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i'm sure i'm going to end up buying the two realm classes eventually but no idea if and what i'll use them for

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i think swash dorado has some potential

frank saddle
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tbh if nothing changes i'm just gonna go full deity and not fight it

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melee can die whatever

sharp crypt
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Dorado has a lot of potential to be really good if resurgence just goes away

vagrant thistle
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NF is having some trouble in replacing passives

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look at what happened to poor gilga ursa

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crest of avalon?!?!

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like gtfo

sharp crypt
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Yeah =/ though at the moment I'd take that over resurgence lol

vagrant thistle
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dex passive on a class encouraged not to use dex gear, etc...

frank saddle
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i think every other class has an obvious celestial they're like

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oh yeah that makes sense

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if NF has product/app analytics they can see it too

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like 99% gilga got herc

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99% heretic got ara

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95% of deity got ara

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realms are like uhhhhhhhhh

sharp crypt
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I'm sure plenty of realms got Dorado, but it's use case is just towers

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I bought a celestial to better be able to farm other celestials

frank saddle
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or they hit that button?

vagrant thistle
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i bought realm on day one the class got released and quickly realised it doesn't really stand on its own

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which is when i started leaning into gilga and playing both

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but the disp[arity has only gotten worse except for very specific content

frank saddle
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i'd be interested in data for t10/11 active player who mostly spend their time in one class what celestial they bought

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i bet "uptake" for celestials for realms are low

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same for gs

vagrant thistle
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i've heard a lot of complaints about the gs celestials

inner violet
# frank saddle

I love how badly cropped this is. It makes it extra flippant

vagrant thistle
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So update, I just unlocked Dorado

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Switching to majistrate for tower spotting was too annoying lol

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On a side note, am I the only one that thinks the celestial classes should be grouped with their base classes instead of after deity?

inner violet
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would be nice

atomic geyser
oak dirge
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i'm pretty much just swapping around deity ara here ara here corv now

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it's much better at current placement

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only time i swap out of those 3 is for rs/majistrate during monday resets

winter glade
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If you by mistake enter the tower with it, at least you won't die

oak dirge
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i'm good, i insta close app after every tower entry anyway

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since we can queue now

green lagoon
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Its clear that melee classes have suffered from the tower content. I dont include gilga from this though as they got some solid content

atomic geyser
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Gilga can at least tank out the hordes

valid roost
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And Chain Spikes chield help à lot now

atomic geyser
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Has anyone tested how well that fares with Dorado?

elfin glacier
frank saddle
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@sharp crypt has bis gear and with all dragon dmg it’s 60k

atomic geyser
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Oof

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I'm guessing it'd do 2-2.5x more than that if realm Dorado had a passive that allowed him to use gilga skills somewhat more effectively

frank saddle
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Correct

desert zodiac
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I saw a dorito today with 318k ward. Cant remember his name. AL in the 60s. 58k hp. That was sexy to see

chrome sedge
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Just unlocked rs corvus after a extensive grind and its baaad...
I've been testing different damage combos and no matter what it ends up worse than just ordinary rs.. Rs 2 got a 5% improvement to miss chance and if you crit 10 times you do more dmg... Welp.. Thats not working well with trying to keep temporary buffs up - if it doesn't miss you end up doing less damage anyways just because temporary buffs disappearing.. It's useless in pvp cause you run out of mana, useless in towers cause it got no aoe skill and not really good for raids cause you're just chugging mana potions and buffing up 4/5 of the time

desert zodiac
chrome sedge
desert zodiac
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Hmm. How about some temp up gear? Only can’t think about 2. Temp all 1 and attack 1

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So that’s ashen gear and…yggy?

chrome sedge
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I get that every celestial has its pros and cos but with the realm celestials the cons majorly outweighs the pros..

chrome sedge
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Even with that it still hits the 10% miss change fairly often

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Atleast once every 10 hits it seems

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Which makes sense but sucks

desert zodiac
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Hmm.

winter glade
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Even with 2 rift gears there are times I miss 4 times in a row with Realm strikes

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It's just sad

desert zodiac
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Ashen head, yggy chest, rift feet, get zerk from chimera or weapon (depending on content)

winter glade
desert zodiac
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Well. I’m not sure what content we’re talking about though. Sooo. Yeah. Lmfao. Can’t really talk

winter glade
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As there's no Res from that ashen and yggy chest

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And the bow of chimera is very bad with realm

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And you will lose more damage with one hand weapon

winter glade
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If we talk about RS it's always raids

desert zodiac
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Ok. Raids.

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Yeah. Bow out

winter glade
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It's sad in Party horde as carry

chrome sedge
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The only thing rs excel at xD

desert zodiac
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But ashen head is still good. Proc chance is decent on it

winter glade
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Yeah

desert zodiac
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Yggy is meh…

winter glade
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That's the only thing we can talk about

inner violet
winter glade
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Shoes were good but head gear nope

unkempt kiln
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Endless is probably the only thing where it isn’t outclassed though

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It’s not the fastest at raiding even after Corvus released

winter glade
unkempt kiln
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It can’t compete in AoE

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What’s the point atm?

winter glade
winter glade
unkempt kiln
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We are, we just need to do it suboptimally

desert zodiac
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Idk. Does it need to be the best headpiece? Wouldn’t the 25% extra damage for 1-2 turns beat more protection?

winter glade
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When no one does

winter glade
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Like till Fey chimera we can easily survive

desert zodiac
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I want corvus. Just need one more class first. I’m curious to try it.

winter glade
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But after ashen phoenix and raids with 10mil+ hp that's where it gets wonky

desert zodiac
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Now that I got heretic corvus, I’ve been working on Godforges easier

winter glade
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I think I will get Gilga Herc first for chained shield

desert zodiac
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My realm getting back into it 😍

winter glade
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Unless they give RS better skills we need to get by, by the other classes skills

desert zodiac
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Meh. I’m a swash at heart though. I was thinking yesterday how swash sacrifices everything for max damage, but isn’t max damage anymore. I don’t like that

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I think in terms of damage it should always be swash first, sequencer second. They are the only 2 specs that actually sacrifice something to get the extra damage

winter glade
desert zodiac
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Who was?

winter glade
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Sequencer by miles

desert zodiac
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Omg

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No. You’re wrong

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I’ve had both. Was with Tires. Sequencer wasn’t first back then

winter glade
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We are talking about max damage right?

desert zodiac
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Never.

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No.

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Max damage is what heretic does.

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Swash is dps

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Swash, back then, was always the fastest to get to certain damage

winter glade
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Yeah, but sequencer double cast is too op

desert zodiac
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It’s been falling off slowly, until this update, which fell off completely

winter glade
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I agree with that

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There was a time

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Well before the achlys adorns

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Swash was comparable

desert zodiac
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Yeah. Dps should always go to swash imo. Since the sacrifice is so massive

winter glade
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Lol everything is sacrificed

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Sequencer can have high def and res atleast

desert zodiac
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I thought that corvus would be the answer to that. I still hope

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Since y’all don’t play swash…

winter glade
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Let's wait for balance patch

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Yeah Oracle is just too easy and safer

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Slower but safer

desert zodiac
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Yeah. Since there’s no sacrifice, Oracle should be much lower on the dps rank

unkempt kiln
#

At least for what realm is concerned

desert zodiac
#

Yeah. And not even a good one

#

It’s just holding on for dear life

winter glade
#

Every class has second chance now

#

So if we miss we die

#

If they get 2nd chance we die

desert zodiac
#

Meh. Second chance with hp passive? That’s…kinda strong no?

#

And high tenacity too

#

I’d see it on Dorito. With the suggestion I saw someone made that the passive draws from ward and hp. Then it would seem more fair

winter glade
desert zodiac
#

Yeah. I can see second chance on that build

#

Would be a cool warrior/ realm build

winter glade
#

We don't need second chance

#

But do give corvus it's mystic feather back

#

I just worked things in my mind and it will be shit without it against amorri or Quetazcoatl type of raids

#

They hit very hard and will surely kill corvus before he gets the chance to kill them.

#

Even ashen phoenix will be hard to kill without it

unkempt kiln
#

I did a few AMorris with yet

#

Definitely riskier than base realm

winter glade
unkempt kiln
#

Ashen Phoenix isn’t really an issue, it dies too quickly, just can’t gunnr

winter glade
#

Yeah you can survive without gunnr

woven plume
chrome sedge
winter glade
lucid niche
winter glade
#

Damn my mistake then

lucid niche
#

🤦‍♂️ bro you need to get a swing shift job 😉

#

too much orna

winter glade
winter glade
lucid niche
#

i just finished my first 50 today. finally found one on the way to get groceries lol

#

i don’t even use the schedule bot or anything. i just speed run towers for the raid mats anyways. nice break from soloing 300 raids for my next ascension

winter glade
#

Raid mats are easily available

#

After getting all the classes I need, like corvus, Gilga Herc and deity Ursa, I will do towers for fast clears for mats

lucid niche
#

i can’t stomach a long tower. under 30 floors and i don’t even look for chests. straight for the finish line

winter glade
#

First stage is I am focused and do towers.

#

Second stage I lose focus and then stop doing towers.

#

Rinse and repeat

#

And after few hours I complete one

lucid niche
#

ok, that makes sense. that would negate the reason i hate it so much…lose interest=make bad decisions

winter glade
valid roost
#

Corvus cant be that bad

#

WE can solo raids under 10 turn . 3 k Mana is enough to do some rs

winter glade
valid roost
#

Modified sorry

winter glade
#

It's not good compared to base rs

#

So the reason of getting that class is not.to use it but just for the skills

#

I would still use base rs for longer raids

#

For short ones corvus can be good

valid roost
#

Y sad

elfin glacier
sharp crypt
#

I've had another idea for Dorado in the area of multi hit skills

Once per round, if Dorado dodges an attack is retaliates with an equipped skill. Rewards stacking dex, adds some randomness and complexity based on load out, and keeping it to once per round we can't auto clear floor by dodging x5

#

Orrr, have a skill that triggers the above effect

#

So if you don't dodge anything, nothing dies, dodge everything and clear the floor (no limit if it's a skill)

#

(Yes, this would be blatantly better than the gilga Ursa equivalent, but that is a really low bar to set)

frank saddle
#

trash idea, how dare you want aoe for melee

#

ok but in seriouness

#

the "speed' of encounters would still be slow

#

because you'd need to wait x turns for mob to act

#

for a chance to kill

winter glade
#

Heretics are doing 150k hit to two enemies with high M1 spells

sharp crypt
#

I'm just trying to get something, the more things I throw at the wall the more likely something is to stick 😅

winter glade
#

And here I am trying to find skill which can kill these Goblins faster and not zero when they defend

frank saddle
#

tbh the holy sweeper thing was awesome, it had limitations for melee in terms of immune mobs so there's still a catch but you could stack stuff and do decent dmg t1 full hp

#

it's just too bad ANYTHING with element can be abused by ultima

#

it's still a worse aoe than mage dance/pavane because of resistance/immunity

#

and you had to explicitly gear for it

#

that's all gucci

#

another idea would be what if there's a physical augment (wooooow something for melee)

#

and you can stack a bunch of those in and get sweep to do decent dmg

#

i don't care about mana cost if it's enough dmg to 1-2 shot

winter glade
#

I was like wait what about this build

#

And I had to share with everyone

sharp crypt
#

Just get x5 ornate spine for the 1800 attack 2H and sweep that way. Duh

winter glade
#

But alas that was nerfed

frank saddle
winter glade
#

Lol

frank saddle
#

like legit better than making chained shield work

winter glade
#

I wish you luck

sharp crypt
#

I am 0% of the way there with 0 ornate spines lol

winter glade
#

I only one ornate spine

#

And I am already using it on myself😎

frank saddle
#

spine of what

#

i wanna see if i have anything good

#

i guess spine of anything is +atk lolz

#

i got 40k out of ss2 lol

winter glade
frank saddle
#

ya a bit rough

winter glade
unkempt kiln
winter glade
#

Ss2 49k

#

And ss3 80k

frank saddle
#

love it when the only option for realm is to make a gilga skill work

#

when most gilgas are like "wow how do i break 150k ward"

winter glade
frank saddle
#

and geared realms with 250k ward are like ummmmm

#

100k or so lolz

#

coz base realm and i'm still crit adorned

winter glade
frank saddle
#

double dragon dmg amity

winter glade
#

Oh

frank saddle
#

and bulwark

winter glade
#

I have 229k ward

frank saddle
#

use bulwark + 2 dragon dmg amity

#
  • dragon gilga axe
winter glade
#

I don't have two of them

#

Let me try

frank saddle
#

ok peasant

#

and you call yourself a realm

#

pfffftttt

#

i should know this but there's no dragon align pet right

unkempt kiln
#

Nop

frank saddle
#

is there holy align pet?

winter glade
#

The heck

#

Ss1 61k, ss2 63k and ss3 67k

#

Wait

frank saddle
#

...

winter glade
#

Ss3 is 120k

#

Ss2 is 67

frank saddle
#

so your chained shield is 67k or so

#

good enough for towers imo

winter glade
frank saddle
#

you can juice more ward out of AP boots

#

but yeah that looks good

#

basically realm has bis gilga gear

#

hits for 50% 😄

#

nice

unkempt kiln
winter glade
#

So I need better Dragon damage amity

#

And that celestial axe

frank saddle
#

yep

#

then you can be a worse gilga

winter glade
frank saddle
#

or you can just switch class > gilga

#

use the same gear

#

and do 150k chained shield

#

with 0 asc

#

just did 72k on gilga

winter glade
#

It did 200k ss3

#

So it can do around 120k ss2

frank saddle
#

yep

#

you can one tap meliodas

#

up to F35

winter glade
#

Well I will get chained shield next for clearing those hati and goblin one

valid roost
winter glade
#

Wait I got one idea to really balance the classes.

#

Mages have ultima and damn high magic gears
Gilga have their spiked shields and high ward gears
But RS just has mystic feather and no speciality.

Then how about the RS class get 100% of the effect of zerks while other classes who aren't RS gets just 50% effect.
Just like gilga's SS attacks and all the ward attacks

frank saddle
#

yeah

#

suggest that

#

make zerk a realm thing

#

❤️

winter glade
#

Okay

sharp crypt
#

that is going to get downvoted so hard lol

frank saddle
#

let the world burn

sharp crypt
#

I've long said that an innate way to activate zerk effects as realm is needed though

#

if for no other reason than to get away from chim

elfin glacier
#

I predict that's going to do just as poorly, if not worse, than every other time that's been suggested

unkempt kiln
#

Not gonna lie, I thought the suggestion was just gonna be “delete realm”

frank saddle
unkempt kiln
#

I literally typed out “I predict salt coming” while Sore was writing lol

#

Glad I was wrong at the very least

elfin glacier
#

i've seen plenty suggestions in that vein:

  • give realm the berserk skills
  • give realm one of {berserk 1, 2, 3}
  • give realm a unique passive that gives it berserk (so it's not just free buffs for other classes)

are the main ones. they all got horrendous votes lol

#

every time

winter glade
sharp crypt
#

woah woah woah, I just saw the suggestion you made for the elemental books too

winter glade
sharp crypt
#

I'd never tried, but what the actual F, why can I not equip the elemental books?! WHAT?!

elfin glacier
#

oh, I know why. trust me, you don't need to tell me why 😆

elfin glacier
#

obviously

winter glade
#

So I went to equip the earth book for my RS and bamn

sharp crypt
#

sigh

winter glade
#

Lol, it's funny how so many things are Mage only

#

And there are 4 classes which can equip mage gear

#

Sooo

#

You know

inner violet
winter glade
#

Also, have you all noticed one more thing?

#

The bis gear for realm since the past year be it weapon or armour all use rare or raid mats? While it's not like that at all for mage classes now

#

Before Ymir we had, Realmspikes it used platinum

#

As for armour was phoenix gear which used silk and gs

#

And now ARR which uses fogstone and titanium

#

Looks like I am quite annoyed to even take a note of this.

frank saddle
#

man you're raging hard today

#

it's nice we're rotating the rage baton around

winter glade
#

We should name that pic by Ruxx as the The Dark Truth of Orna

elfin glacier
#

there's a bunch of discrepancies for realm/thief gearing, but I doubt they're intentional discrepancies. it's just.. really unfortunate lol

winter glade
gray mauve
#

[Snip] Off topic

winter glade
unkempt kiln
#

Trying to figure out how that would work gameplay wise and I honestly feel like it’d not feel good to play

#

The fact that 90% of endgame content is horde doesn’t help, but slowing down solo content would be a shot in the foot imo

winter glade
#

Yeah, it would slow the RS down

gray mauve
#

yeah probably

#

I guess it was a way-too-text-heavy way of saying I want to be a thief and not a barbarian haha

unkempt kiln
#

Thief classes in games have leaned into the assassin archetype as well for example. Which, imo, justifies the current state of single enemy content

winter glade
#

Assassin's have the highest penetration but that's no where to be seen

elfin glacier
#

I like the general idea of a more assassin-esque thief class, and I'd love to see that concept in a future celestial class. Odie has (now) brought up future celestial classes on numerous occasions. I'm not sure about that specific implementation, but I like that concept of "vanishing" and having associated mechanics eg. lowered hit chance, increased crit/target damage, increased status chance/severity etc.

#

likewise a Realm celestial that leans into the barbarian style (berserks) even more would be awesome. something core to it like High Tenacity 2 with an extra effect eg. an enrage with a unique status effect, for example

#

the scope of this thread is the current Realm celestials though, I'd think

gray mauve
#

Ah my bad!

elfin glacier
#

and changes/improvements to those -- Corvus, Dorito

#

reworks are also off the table, per another Odie comment

sharp crypt
#

if dorado is stuck with resurgence I don't see any meaningful changes that could be made that would be less of a rework

hushed pond
#

It depends on what/how the passive works, and how that change works with the class' existing skillset, but likely yes

#

However, I am not NF, so there's no reason it couldn't be proposed as an option

sharp crypt
#

yeah, mostly interested so I know how to focus/channel proposed feedback

elfin glacier
sharp crypt
#

changing resurgence into anything else is my preferred option by a mile, but if that is DoA I'll brainstorm other stuff

elfin glacier
#

as unfortunate as that is

sharp crypt
#

resurgence -> bastille would be good enough for me

elfin glacier
#

I really do like that hybridised passive of bastille/resurgence. scales with both ward and health

winter glade
# sharp crypt yeah, mostly interested so I know how to focus/channel proposed feedback

Realm Dorido

This class is a mixture of Thief and Warrior or RS and Gilga. So why doesn't it have the passive based on it?

Since, RS gets stronger by losing hp, and Gilga Gets stronger by maintaining its ward. Then instead of Resurgence II give it a new passive which is a fusion of this.

Like

Resurgent Bastion: Start less ward and get a lot stronger when you gain more ward and get not that much stronger when you lose hp.
So 50% for losing hp and 70% for gaining ward, similar to deity and new heretic passive.

And then also give it the passive which allows it to use skills like Spiked Shield more effectively (not as good as Gilga but better than any class other than Gilga).

This will make this class useful and allow us to temper with it.

#

This was my suggestion a few days ago

elfin glacier
#

yeah, resurgence -> bastille 2 would be a decent change. loses a ton of stats (2.0x -> 1.6x), but it's a more thematically appropriate and usable passive

#

Realm without a high stat passive is pretty shite, so i'm sorta wary of "only" 1.6x stats

sharp crypt
elfin glacier
#

oh lol

#

that is fair then

sharp crypt
#

if I'm going low health I use base realm. Literally no reason to use dorado right now

#

doesn't help that it starts at 50% HP instead of 100%, so it doesn't ever trigger in towers either

#

bastille also opens up zerks again, it would be a pretty powerful change imo

elfin glacier
#

I do like the idea of giving it Bastille II, honestly

sharp crypt
elfin glacier
#

just replace resurgence and dorado's ward (or whatever that passive is called) with Bastille II

winter glade
#

It would be better than current Dorido

elfin glacier
#

I would rather v2 of bastille over v1. it's a more potent stat boost, and it seems thematically + balance appropriate for dorito

sharp crypt
#

definitely would need to be v2

winter glade
#

Yeah

#

And also a bit of mana boost too

#

Hopefully we can try to carry with it?

elfin glacier
#

I honestly am curious about a world where:

  • Resurgence II -> Bastile II
    AND
  • Dorado's Ward: "autoward, ward regen" -> "Your ward skills grant more absorption." say.. 10%
winter glade
#

Yeah that would be great

sharp crypt
elfin glacier
#

that latter change makes WoO go from 85% -> 94% absorption, allowing use with other +abs sources to WoO for 100% abs

#

which I think is just interesting as a concept

vagrant thistle
#

Having resurgence start at 100% instead of 50% could be an option

elfin glacier
#

additional abs is just a neat effect to me

elfin glacier
vagrant thistle
#

For towers specifically it could be useful

#

And maybe thats resurgence 2 for Dorado

elfin glacier
#

i think it's lame to shoehorn it into "being useful for Towers". you're right, it would be more useful than 50% resurgence for towers, but not really matter much elsewhere

vagrant thistle
#

In the vein of balancing vs rework it feels doable

#

Would make dungeon farming feel better too

elfin glacier
#

it's a mechanical change.. that i don't know how much effort it is. switching resurgence 2 to bastille 2 seems like less implementation work, fits better thematically imo (than from 100% hp resurgence) and solves more problems than 100% hp resurgence

vagrant thistle
#

Giving Dorado Bastille 2 and letting us use chained shield would be awesome

elfin glacier
#

so like.. yeah, if that's the only option then sure, it's fine. i don't think it's the right change though, for all of {implementation, thematic, balance} reasons

vagrant thistle
#

I know running gilga herc I inherently take damage running towers, so translating that into more attack from the beginning to fuel Dorado chained shield would be sweet

#

Gilga chains will start to drop DPS without good buffs, but if that was built into dorados passive synergy that could feel really good

unkempt kiln
#

Id be content with dorado being able to use chained/spiked shield with no penalty