Nullium

[wild glen]

one page table is 4 mb

yis

so to take 27 mb i need 6.75 tables

im gonna take 7 because i have a singular braincell that told me to

7 page tables for the kernel damn

at LEAST 7 actually

because its growing

im gonna make my pmm have permission values actually

or should it

idk

i want to put the permission values there so the vmm can actually read it and do something

it shouldnt be architecture specific because any modern architecture has permission thingies

damn

wait

the vmm is gonna be a clusterfuck

[wild glen]

idk if i need more tags

these are the most necessary ones

[wild glen]

everything is gonna be a clusterfuck actually

programs are gonna think they start from 6 mb or smth

which is fine

but thats all programs

i have to constantly remap them to 6 mb

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[wild glen]

multitasking idea probably:
(load program before this)

map program at top of memory
only allow access to the memory that it owns (no access to other programs )
program do thing
go back to kernel
do for next program

i cant just not use the "owner" field in my pmm

would be quite a disappointment

[lethal summit]

whar

oh 32 bit

[wild glen]

32 bit

what is it on 64 bit

[gloomy musk]

each page-table takes up 1 4KB page iirc

[wild glen]

1k - 1024 bytes
page - 4k
page table - 1024 pages so 4m
page directory - 1024 page tables, so 4g

oh

wait

misread

[wild glen]

thats what it is on 32 bit?

[wild glen]

big oopsies

64 bit page table has 1024 uint64_t's instead of 32

also includes whatever the fuck that is

more page tables bcs more memory 👍

im staying with 32 bit this looks like foreign bullshit to me

or using limine i think limine does all that automatically

all hail funny obscure boot protocol

[sour pollen]

64 bit page table has 512 entries

[wild glen]

oh

stroke

dont quote me on anything i say abt 64bit

[sour pollen]

4096 / 64 vs 4096 / 32

512 and 1024

[wild glen]

ok true

i thought it was larger

[wild glen]

Due to the complexity of some of the Nullium functions, we will increase the stack size to 3 GB.

Previously it was 27 MB, but my code is too superior for such a small, limiting size.

So, due to my superior status over this entire server, backed by my 50 years at Blizzard Entertainment, the stack size is increased to a forgivable 3GB.

[lean relic]

how is 16384 * 8 bytes

a 27mb stack

[wild glen]

idfk

[lean relic]

its 128kib

[wild glen]

oh

damn

its all my code thats 27 mb tho

[lean relic]

how

[wild glen]

no i.mean

the binary

[lean relic]

do you have like all your paging structures defined

[wild glen]

kernel binary

[lean relic]

in the code

and what else did you put in there

[wild glen]

brb

back

[wild glen]

everything

it counts everything

ld_end

[lean relic]

yeah

what large data do you have in your binary

do you page

if so did you make all the paging structures be inside the binary

did you leave a large bitmap or something

im just guessing but yeah

i had a 511mb bitmap in my code this morning

[fluid moon]

WHAT

you'll only need max 2mb of stack for a kernel

how recursive can your code be to require 3gb of stack?

[wild glen]

Idk. I"m judy fkcold forjehskw dueuw

hjdk

Do t3 tjbe cose

[fluid moon]

hjkl

[wild glen]

anyways that was a shitpost

its actually being increased to 90

90 GB

[fluid moon]

yeah, reasonable

don't forget to add support for x2apic so you can use up to 4mln CPUs

[wild glen]

uhhhh

Ok

im gonna finish paging when i get home

hopefully

[lethal summit]

google chrome only needs a 1024kb stack

sounds like skill issue

[wild glen]

cool

[hushed briar]

2mb? He’s on 32 bit and I am too

[fluid moon]

oh right

a 16 bytes stack will do the trick

[fluid moon]

yeah bc recursion is bad

and does a lot of heap allocation

[nova otter]

👀

I've never seen this thread

I assume the title is outdated considering the github saying

An A/UX inspired OS.
?

also, may I ask, what makes A/UX and/or Nullium different from other UNICES/UNIX-likes?

[lethal summit]

seven mutual servers is crazy

[nova otter]

lmao

I've got 7 with utcq also, a few different ones tho

[fluid moon]

LMAO

[nova otter]

every time I go to this server I feel guilty for sitll being unable to code

I should learn, I really want to learn, I just can't get myself to keep going

I don't even struggle with indecisiveness anymore just lack of motivation

[lethal summit]

if we have cloc (count lines of code) then when will we get ccoc (count columns of code)

[fluid moon]

cock
count occurrence of kernel

[wild glen]

ues

it is

[wild glen]

aux is classic mac os placed over unix

i actually want to do the opposite and do the unix thingies on a mac os like

[nova otter]

oh, neat

I knew about the first bit, I was moreso reffering to the underlying unix 😅

are you gonna aim for compatibility with classic macos programs?

[wild glen]

except with preemptive multitasking

[wild glen]

idk if i can just make a 68000/ppc translation layer

[nova otter]

fair

source compatibility maybe?

[wild glen]

idk

classic mac os didnt have stuff like gcc

[hushed briar]

Is that why it’s so fucking dogshit for ram usage

[wild glen]

it had compilers specific to it

idk maybe ig

[hushed briar]

It’s okay man

Just learn

Even if it’s slow

:)

[wild glen]

have certain system libraries compatible with classic mac os

[wild glen]

learn basic c concepts

[hushed briar]

Yeah fr

[wild glen]

userspace stuff

[hushed briar]

Data structures are extremely important too

Like

You need to know what a linked list and shit is

All of that

[fluid moon]

(void*)(u64)(*(u32*)((u8*)madt + offset + 4))

[wild glen]

i just remembered the fact that i want to write an insanely expansive manual for nullium programming later

[nova otter]

my big problem is that

I can't figure out what to write to learn more, every time I try to find a project it's either so trivial I finish it in like 20 minutes or it's too difficult so I spend an hour staring at a blank text file

[fluid moon]

I hate poiner arithmetic on C++

[hushed briar]

Pointer arithmetic is so fucking cancer

What is wrong with c++

[wild glen]

c++ is somewhat cancer

[hushed briar]

I literally have a certificate of proficiency in C++

[nova otter]

if you get it working on commonly available hardware or working well in like qemu, I'll (try and) make stuff for it :)

[hushed briar]

And I still hate it

[wild glen]

i havent found any of the features on it useful

[fluid moon]

warns a lot (ik I can disable it but I don't want to risk some wrong evaluation)

[nova otter]

have you tried dlang?

[hushed briar]

Yes it’s fucking amazing

[nova otter]

it seems nice imo

ah

noice

[hushed briar]

I love dlang

[nova otter]

for C/C++ replacements the one that most catches my eye is Zig

[hushed briar]

It’s one of the best systems programming languages out there

[hushed briar]

Rust :)

[nova otter]

but I don't think it's stable yet

[hushed briar]

Jkjk

[wild glen]

afk once i come back i can do paging 🔥

[hushed briar]

Okay bet

We can call if you need help

[fluid moon]

still better than carbon

[wild glen]

https://tenor.com/view/chat-goodbye-goodbye-chat-ultrakill-gutterman-gif-482436514492225348

[nova otter]

rust is nice on the simple level until you get to async and await then it's the worst thing ever (imo)

[hushed briar]

It’s also shit for kernels

[fluid moon]

nah it gets bad when you start doing OOP

[hushed briar]

Sorry to my rust kernel devs

[hushed briar]

REAL AS FUCK

[nova otter]

(im not a coder obviously so it's not like my input matters but yk)

[hushed briar]

HOLY HELL

Imma rewrite my pmm boys

[fluid moon]

no more buddy?

[hushed briar]

No imma use buddy

It’s just

Extremely shit

Like the code base for it

[nova otter]

I don't care for rust itself, but, I do like cargo

my eventual dream project is a systems-programming-dedicated LISP dialect (primarily based on CL and Scheme, my favourite ones), and I'd want it to have a cargo-like build system probably

[hushed briar]

Like I’ll keep the alg

But

I need to make the code more modular and easy to read

Because pmm_alloc_pages is extremely hard to read

Like

[fluid moon]

so OCaml with some imagination

[hushed briar]

Really bad

[nova otter]

I wish there was a good equivalent to C/C++, I tried cabin previously but it's kinda janky at least when I tried it

That may be a good project to try and write my own maybe

[fluid moon]

nvm OCaml is not LISP

lisp sucks, ocaml doesn't

[nova otter]

I'm too lazy to learn cmake or makefile so I just write my "build scripts" in sh

[hushed briar]

Bro WHAT

[nova otter]

you suck 😡 /j /lh

[hushed briar]

build.sh is actually a real thing

Wtf

[nova otter]

if it works it works

[hushed briar]

Lisp is goated

[nova otter]

why is that suprising? sh is very simple and intuitive at least imo

[fluid moon]

1. not natural syntax at all
2. emacs uses it

[hushed briar]

No one uses it to build software

[nova otter]

yeah, I wanna learn common lisp but idk if it's the best idea for a first lang really

[hushed briar]

Literally everyone uses make or something

Like

Makefile isn’t that hard

It’s really really not hard at all

[fluid moon]

I love makefile

cmake sucks for freestanding

[hushed briar]

You can learn it in 1 hour

[nova otter]

I never said it was, I'm just lazy

[fluid moon]

I feel free when using Make

[nova otter]

LET ME MAKE EXCUSES 😭

[hushed briar]

Yes it’s good for userspace

Make is goated

Meson is cool too

But make is better for freestanding

Make is extremely customizable

[fluid moon]

I tried it and it's pretty confusing to use for freestanding

[hushed briar]

And easy to read

Yeah

[fluid moon]

also custom commands suck

[hushed briar]

It’s not good for free standing

[hushed briar]

Yeah, that’s what make is the best at

Extremely customizable

It’s why Linux uses it

It doesn’t help you at all

Which is good for a kernel

[fluid moon]

I don't like autoconf, automake and all that though

I set variable config flags in my makefile

[nova otter]

alright y'all convinced me, time to learn Makefile ig

[fluid moon]

gnu make is goated fr

I could and do use it for everyday userspace projects

[nova otter]

what's the diff between gnu make and bsd make

I'll learn the latter just because I don't like gnu

[fluid moon]

syntax

bsd make is more minimal

[nova otter]

ah

[hushed briar]

Automake isn’t good

[hushed briar]

Me too!!!

[nova otter]

thanks for putting up with my dumb questions btw 😅

[fluid moon]

bsd make is pretty strange, while you would do my_var := $(shell echo 0) in GNU, you have to do my_var != echo 0 in bsd

[hushed briar]

I do this

This is why I like make

Super super customizable

[fluid moon]

lmao CWARNINGS

[hushed briar]

Lol

Everyone

Shirt

I should get rid of

Interrupt flags

I used to handle interrupts with gnu interrupt attribute

[hushed briar]

Which requires general regs only

[fluid moon]

hell nah, I like having stubs that call the function and handle the return gracefully

[hushed briar]

Yes I do that now

My isr calls a c function

[nova otter]

fuck it, imma learn a BASIC
they're quite simple, and https://discord.com/channels/440442961147199490/1083829658849652838 got me interested again

[fluid moon]

which is the standard way

[hushed briar]

Yeah I unfucked my isr not too long ago

[fluid moon]

I'm gonna ditch uACPI as I'm not using it, I'm parsing ACPI by myself ( ). I'll probably use LAI though

[hushed briar]

I’m gonna parse acpi myself

At some point

[pale marsh]

LAI

[hushed briar]

Funny name

You’re Albanian

Kosovo is Serbia

[pale marsh]

no im not, just for the memes

also offtopic

[fluid moon]

pakistan

[pale marsh]

anyways what is nullium even about

[fluid moon]

I swear I find it easier than using premade implementations

I don't have to deal with kernel APIs implementations

[hushed briar]

Idk

[wild glen]

https://tenor.com/view/ultrakill-gutterman-hello-chat-hello-chat-gif-17477162012223149783

[hushed briar]

Check out my os

[fluid moon]

and I know how the code works exactly

[fluid moon]

paging done?

[wild glen]

no

[hushed briar]

https://discord.com/channels/440442961147199490/1305395406662012928

:)

[pale marsh]

shameless advertisement sure

[hushed briar]

sorry for shameless plug

[wild glen]

i said when i come back ill work on it

[hushed briar]

Pls star too I’m almost at 20

Bet

[wild glen]

its ok ill just steal your code as payment

[hushed briar]

Wanna vc at some point

[hushed briar]

No worries

[wild glen]

wont talk but maybe

[pale marsh]

shameless fucking plug bro, if you gonna do that then i gonna do that, check out my shitty OS

[hushed briar]

Show me

[wild glen]

man ykw

check out MY shitty os

its the shittiest of them all

[hushed briar]

I scroll through your source code quite a bit

[pale marsh]

#1404638046175105215 im currently working on uh acpi and scheduler stuff... still havent committed tho im waiting until update finis

[wild glen]

damn

brb my windows laptop shat itself again

(bluetooth headphone no work)

[hushed briar]

Sad

[fluid moon]

oh you're the debian transparent windows guy

I'll always remember that centered debian logo

[pale marsh]

im debianing it

[wild glen]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1305395406662012928/1409299630788968651/stack.gif

[hushed briar]

Funny ass nene

Meme

[wild glen]

RESB 16384 go brrr

this appalling piece of shit dies first though im sorry

i have to update discord on linux machine

:<

why cant i just start doing shit

[pale marsh]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/829403502349647952/1408983772883456011/drm.gif

[wild glen]

nvm this is worse

[hushed briar]

Oh LORD

what the hell is that shit

[wild glen]

pirate software

50 years blizzard entertainment

[pale marsh]

lifetime blizzard

[wild glen]

69 years blizzard entertainment

programmed microsoft windows

ceo of mann co

he did it all

it grew to 32 mb

what

what the fuck

whuh happened

what specifically is shitting itself this badly

[fluid moon]

what are you statically declaring?

bitmaps? stacks?

[wild glen]

the data segment ends at like 1 mb

[wild glen]

uhhhh

a sec

ok so the bss is giant

its fucking huge

[fluid moon]

static allocations

[wild glen]

bitmaps (fonts, etc), code(no shit), some arrays (pmm and paging and shit)

maybe theyre making everything big as shit but idk

[fluid moon]

code is not bss, what does your pmm look like

please tell me it’s not statically allocated

[wild glen]

uhhhhhh

it is not statically allocated ||(lie)||

ok fuck

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1305395406662012928/1409299630788968651/stack.gif

time to slightly rewrite it

ok so um it was a big part of the problem apparently

[fluid moon]

time to use scratch

[wild glen]

❌

unfuc aray

[lethal summit]

wowzers that's a big binary how large is your codebase

a few million loc?

holy smokes that's a huge binary

[fluid moon]

new windows is in town

[wild glen]

absolute poo ass sized codebase

im gonna do two page tables for the init as a temporary solution

its just short of being less than 4 mb

;-;

[fluid moon]

two page tables

wha

[hushed briar]

Yeah what

That doesn’t make sense

What were you doing before…

Were you creating every page table on init

[fluid moon]

you can have only one page table active

you would have to switch it on page fault otherwise

[hushed briar]

Yeah

I only create one

[wild glen]

i have to reserve a page table for 4 and something mb

one page table only covers 4

to cover all the space i might need to map a second one

identity maps and all that bullshit

[lethal summit]

this is so cooked

[wild glen]

absolute clusterfuck

i am NOT getting out alive 😭

time to do random shit to my pmm and hope it works

[lethal summit]

christmas time is here... happiness and cheer...

[wild glen]

reminder

i dont live in pakistan

[hushed briar]

What

[wild glen]

it was the culprit behind the 27 mb stack space

im gonna reform it so it will not take as much damn space

im making my pmm more like paging

no more details provided until i actually finish it

[fluid moon]

WHA

[wild glen]

(spoiler: tables in tables in tables )

[lethal summit]

this is so cursed

what is even happening

[wild glen]

im going insane

i want medical help

paging is gonna be my #1 reason for the destruction of the universe

i swear to god

https://tenor.com/view/jet-bean-killer-bean-ragdoll-ragdoll-fall-gif-23762382

ok so uh here's some type of plan here

• pmm (fucking shit)
• paging (even more of a fucking shit)

i hate memory

why cant we just revert to monkey atp

ok anyway

[fluid moon]

paging is easy I swear

https://gitlab.com/utcq/meow/-/blob/main/src/kernel/src/mem/pages/arch/x86_64/paging.c

[wild glen]

https://tenor.com/view/aww-hell-nahh-aww-hell-aww-hell-nahh-gif-9659330954843262630

[wild glen]

nice

my pmm is basically the entire problem

• clogs up a shit ton of memory
• fucks up paging

so anyways pmm will now use memory addresses instead of page numbers

also im gonna try to make a buddy allocator

splits shit in half until something happens

anyways nothing is permanent until its done because i wasted all my braincells on unrelated things

dont quote me if i say something and then it turns out to be something else please

this project is basically fucked until i fix the pmm

ok thanks

ok so i figured out how to implement it

without absolutely fucking over the size of the kernel

ignore the crashout above

so geniune plan

• make a buddy allocator
• make it work WELL
• put paging (might be the simplest task after all this crap)

im like fully sure its definetely gonna be a buddy allocator

also to anyone who's gonna think im gonna do something really dumb again

• its gonna return actual memory addresses
• its not gonna be 26 mb 😭

[lethal summit]

make it parallelized and numa aware while you're at it

coz it needs to work WELL

[wild glen]

read numa stuff?

[lethal summit]

no this is a joke don't do that just get it working first

[wild glen]

if it doesnt work well i will commit a few war crimes rewriting it again

[wild glen]

oh ok

i deadass need that pmm to be the best code i ever wrote

[lethal summit]

famous last words

[wild glen]

ok true

somewhat ok code i ever wrote

so far

[vocal root]

mcr reference

[wild glen]

Le budy(tm)

idk if its how its supposed to work

i shouldve finished it more so i can actually fucking explain this piece of code

a sec

help

my scroll wheel

this is what i assume it looks like

if its not then idc funny directory tree go brrr

[lethal summit]

isParent?

🤪

[wild glen]

basically means if its a free segment or not

[lethal summit]

whar

why not say free

[wild glen]

uhhhhhhhhh

[lethal summit]

[wild glen]

because if its not free then it is either a parent or a page

ok ykw free makes more sense

free time

[lethal summit]

why are there two addrs

[wild glen]

ah yes

directory tree splits into one address

[lethal summit]

directory tree?

whar

[wild glen]

i m a g e

it splits into two repeatedly

[lethal summit]

why not call them left and right then

[wild glen]

oh

[lethal summit]

and point to other buddy page structs

[wild glen]

true

thats what i wanted them to do

[lethal summit]

we have trees at home

[wild glen]

this is a tree of all time

this is now somewhat readable

[lethal summit]

why do you initialize pointers to 0

that funny

[wild glen]

uhhhhhhhh

[lethal summit]

it's not a huge issue just funny

[wild glen]

truly

[lethal summit]

typically you say NULL 💥

[wild glen]

oh

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1305395406662012928/1409299630788968651/stack.gif

[lethal summit]

coputer

[wild glen]

    buddy_InitSlice.free = false;
    buddy_InitSlice.left = NULL;
    buddy_InitSlice.right = NULL;
    buddy_InitSlice.tier = 0;

[lethal summit]

fantastic

[wild glen]

now it is somewhat peak

[wild glen]

changed free to used

because if its 1 its not free

void buddy_mkBranch(buddySlice_t* slice, bool direction){
    // direction: left is 0, right is 1
    
    buddySlice_t new_slice;

    new_slice.tier  = slice->tier + 1;
    new_slice.used  = false;
    new_slice.left  = NULL;
    new_slice.right = NULL;

    if (direction){
        slice->right = &new_slice;
    } else {
        slice->left  = &new_slice;
    }
    
}

le code

i forgot to add the statement if its like the max tier it can be

whatever

this is basically the code for multiplying that

the declaration for the new slice itself is gonna be changed

[wild glen]

also the problem with all this bullshit is that there are like a million tiers

this is gonna be absolute diarrhea in memory

lemme check if im doing all this right

[lethal summit]

this is going to give you a UAR

[wild glen]

a what

[lethal summit]

Use After Return

[wild glen]

oh

https://tenor.com/view/jet-bean-killer-bean-ragdoll-ragdoll-fall-gif-23762382

right

[lethal summit]

new_slice only exists on the stack during the duration of that function, after it returns, it is gone

[wild glen]

it erases and shits itself

[lethal summit]

💥

[wild glen]

this is basically my plan for memory thing described in shitty mspaint

anwyays

uhhhhhh

[lethal summit]

sanity

[wild glen]

sanity

oh no this is becoming a clusterfuck

💥

how tf do i allocate buddy tier things

[lethal summit]

huh

[wild glen]

dumbest solution would just have 1/4 of the entire ram to be dedicated to fucking buddy segments

actually no that would suck ass

in multiple ways

[lethal summit]

4GB RAM (3GB usable)

[wild glen]

that

can i put a struct in a struct for some ungodly reason

[lethal summit]

wdym

[wild glen]

for left and right put structs in it because idk how do i allocate it without the kernel growing to ungodly sizes

[lethal summit]

struct a {
   int boom;
};

struct b {
   struct a a;
};``` is valid

you cannot do

struct b {
   struct b b;
};```

[wild glen]

shit(TM)

i have an idea

nevermind

nevermind hold up it might work

cant really describe it yet

tldr reserve some pages for block info

[wild glen]

ok this is a good idea

[hushed briar]

Why wouldn’t you do that

Just reserve some pages for a page info struct

Very simple

[lean relic]

rust async not that bad vro

[lean relic]

huh

its like the simplest oop ever

[fluid moon]

the borrow checker makes it way more complex than C++

as I have to be mindful when to either set a lifetime or allocate on heap

and whenever you set a lifetime you encounter borrowing problems

[lean relic]

lifetime is so ez

it might complicate things but it nukes some ub

(at least some 🥀)

[wild glen]

thats what i wanna do

yesterday i couldnt figure out how i wanted it to be

[wild glen]

increasing the stack to 4 tb 🔥

[rocky elbow]

legendary

[hushed briar]

lol ok

[wild glen]

guys

geniune tip

if you have a choicer

and you can pick only ONE thing on it

please use fucking radio buttons

i can not deal with this shit

also as an attempt to save the kernel binary size im gonna consider compressing all the bitmaps except the font

bcs theres too much symbols already im lazy

not home yet though

[wild glen]

nvm im way too lazy for this

i wanna store all bitmaps on a file on your hd

except i cant currently

[lethal summit]

how large is your codebase bro that is a massive kernel image

i've made smaller linux images

crazy

[wild glen]

somewhat small, also shitty pmm

its being rewritten

[lethal summit]

what does small mean, small is relative

my codebase is 32,000 lines and I consider it quite small wheras others find that large

[wild glen]

uhhh

[lethal summit]

(my binary is like 450kb)

[wild glen]

idfk i didnt count

[lethal summit]

ok i will count it

[wild glen]

i need to consider something now

[wild glen]

old code btw the new one takes way less space

[lethal summit]

only 3000?

how is the binary that big

ah wait and 1,500 of those lines are for bitmaps

[wild glen]

how many times do i have to tell you my old pmm was fucking stupid

[lethal summit]

no but like this is actually fascinating

how did you get the binary that big

am curious

[pale marsh]

StuPMM

[wild glen]

it statically allocated a million structs 😭

[lethal summit]

smart

[pale marsh]

My kernel is like 150-200kb

[lethal summit]

dang what techniques do you use to shrink it

[wild glen]

this

[lethal summit]

how large is the source codebase

size matters

[pale marsh]

I haven't done cloc in a while so like 1000-1300 lines

it's smol

[wild glen]

what tool is this btw

[lethal summit]

oh nvm

[lethal summit]

cloc

[wild glen]

oh ok

[pale marsh]

You can also use wc

[wild glen]

once i get home ima send the results of the new binary

[pale marsh]

word count

[wild glen]

its like 3 mb at most
not sure how much bitmaps take maybe i can compress them

ok no i def can

im pretty sure you can make a struct that manipulates individual bits

nvm these are called bit fields

ok so im gonna compress the fonts so they wont be disappointingly big

they probably take the 2 mb out of 3

(1st one is linker start)

oh wait so kernel bin is 2 mb then

i can reduce it to 1 or less tldr

[lethal summit]

how many phyiscal memory allocatros do you have

[hushed briar]

https://tenor.com/view/it's-over-9000-it's-over-9000-its-gif-6159356195145880706

[pale marsh]

never use gimbap pmm

freelist onop

[wild glen]

none that are working its getting rewritten

[wild glen]

indeed

[wild glen]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

i wanna cry man

ok this shouldnt be in progress report

[lean relic]

paging?

[wild glen]

unrelated

[lean relic]

https://tenor.com/view/i-woke-up-in-a-new-bugatti-car-gif-5913316359309196724

[wild glen]

anyways im gonna try to compress fonts

by compress i mean make them not take a byte instead make the pixels take 1 bit

le efiecentyc

[lean relic]

did they not before…

[wild glen]

no... :(

nobody told me to so i just went with the easiest option

[lean relic]

thats ultra fucked

[wild glen]

ULTRASHIT

[lean relic]

how big are you characters

[wild glen]

byte for each

wait no

byte for each pixel 😭

[lean relic]

i mean like 8x8 8x16

[wild glen]

oh uh

7 * 11

77 pixels total

[lean relic]

i would make it 8 * 11

[wild glen]

might be a shit ton of bytes for a single character :/

why

[lean relic]

so you can

byte 1 - row 1

since 8 bits

[pale marsh]

Exploit russians

Oh wrong place

[wild glen]

😭

[lean relic]

like

[wild glen]

true

i have a few letters that may not work with 8x11

(also ngl i want a second terminal font that is 8x8)

[lean relic]

like just add a extra bit of spacing

no big deal

[wild glen]

maybe idk

[lean relic]

and dont render the spacing in the terminal

if you do

then it would make more sene for 8x12 tho

and just leave a empty row and column

[wild glen]

m

[lean relic]

and have spacing built into the font tm

[wild glen]

ok fair im gonna have empty space

[lean relic]

and then its veri simple

[wild glen]

because 7x11 is a lie its usually indeed 8x12

empty space

[lean relic]

byte 1 - row 1
byte 2 - row 2
…
byte 12 - row 12

[wild glen]

the bitmaps are 7x11 but the font is treated as 8x12 basically

[lean relic]

since each pixel = bit and 8 pixels = 8 bits and each byte has 8 bits

[lean relic]

yeah

[wild glen]

mk

also mouse cursors might require 2 bits

they are 11x15

[lean relic]

shrink them

[wild glen]

i can just remake them theres only 2 really

[lean relic]

https://tenor.com/view/i-woke-up-in-a-new-bugatti-car-gif-5913316359309196724

[wild glen]

damn

i thought theyre already somewhat small

[lean relic]

theyre too bit vro

bug

fucking hell

big

[wild glen]

O k

text first

[lean relic]

well jokes aside i would make them 16x16

so

[wild glen]

ph

oh

yeah makes sense

some cursors are wide for no particular reason

[lean relic]

byte 1 - row 1 column 1-8
byte 2 - row 1 column 9-16

and shit

[wild glen]

i remembered that 0b[insert number] exists

not 0x but 0b

binary

[lean relic]

yeah

[wild glen]

im just gonna use that idrc about the size of the c files

[lean relic]

also https://github.com/viler-int10h/vga-text-mode-fonts

[wild glen]

oh

[lean relic]

https://github.com/fcambus/spleen

[wild glen]

ykw im taking this for the terminal font i dont particularly want to write a terminal font

the 8x8 idea

[lean relic]

Theres a ton of nice fonts there

if ya want to you can make your own but just saying

[wild glen]

im keeping the gui one

[wild glen]

aight

[lean relic]

spleen is kinda nice though

https://camo.githubusercontent.com/e503694f97d014ac696c814aa624d82aeb78059035f171315fd1ed62ddc5ebc6/68747470733a2f2f7777772e63616d6275732e6e65742f636f6e74656e742f323031382f30392f73706c65656e2d68656c6c6f2e706e67

[wild glen]

nice

afk brb

[hushed briar]

Such a random font size

[wild glen]

the letter "x" looks better on non even numbers

deadass the reason

[hushed briar]

Mmm

I see

[lean relic]

what the fuck the more i look at spleen the more i fall in love with it

[hushed briar]

Disagree tho

[hushed briar]

Look

I’m using default Flanterm font

The x looks fine

[wild glen]

Yis

where is the x used

[hushed briar]

Addresses

In the buddy init

[wild glen]

oh

true

the x looks fine

im keeping the funny uneven ass nullium font though

[hushed briar]

Bet

I like the font you made

But if you ever change it

[wild glen]

thx

[hushed briar]

There’s plenty of decent fonts

Right now I’m adding font changing

Well

After I get to userspace I will

[wild glen]

i think since i have a kernel shell i think i might want to add everything switching

i cant just dump everything in the kernel

i already had the problem of it being 27 mb big

[lethal summit]

are we cookig

[wild glen]

https://tenor.com/view/family-feud-survey-says-strike-buzzer-wrong-answer-gif-16312959

ok im turning all the font arrays into bits

12 bytes per letter

instead of um

165

i thought 12 was shit but then i remembered the old number

also my kernel binary itself is 91 KB

or maybe thats because i already shrinked it to death

anyways it takes way more in memory than it does on the hard drive

both are too big i dont have shit in them

[lethal summit]

very important

[wild glen]

very

91 kb still seems too big

[pale marsh]

Then use -O6

[wild glen]

what does that do

[pale marsh]

G minor optimizations

[wild glen]

oh ok

huge update

91 kb down to 76!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lets goooooooooo

[pale marsh]

That's enough dude

[wild glen]

no i just compressed the fonts

by making them 1 byte

per row

everything else in nullium works ok

printing works

nvm its 84 mb

KILOBYTES

NOT MB

FUCK

kernel still 4 mb

in memory

[fluid moon]

hello everynyan
my binary is 864kb and my codebase is currently 5258 LoC

864kb are way too many

I shall optimize

[wild glen]

optimizations 🔥

i have a better idea for my buffer

its gonna be faster than the current one

way faster

it might be the second worst problem with the size of the kernel

also framebuffer btw

its really only used for mouse cursor

ITS 1 MB NOW

IT WAS THE PROBLEM

LETS GOOOOOOOOOOOO

[fluid moon]

oh no it's fucking flanterm bump_alloc_pool with size 852kb

that's basically 96% of the whole binary size

[wild glen]

biggest weight loss arc 🔥

[wild glen]

lmao

anyways my kernel is now truly small

i won humanity

it went from 27 mb to 3 to now 1

[wild glen]

oh damn

are all of yall using flanterm

lame /hugeJ

[fluid moon]

it's really convenient

I'll make my own VT someday

I don't want to deal with geometry rn though

[wild glen]

maybe

idk im gonna write my own VT probablt

basically vga text mode

[fluid moon]

I hate the expression "godspeed"

[wild glen]

i dont even get it

what is it even supposed to mean

bruh did nullium forget how to load stage 3 (the one with mouse cursor and stuff)

i think i did something goofy

holy shit the framebuffer is fast as shit now

[fluid moon]

something like may god prosper you, something like "inshallah" for arabic (?)

but everytime I read it I think about something going at the speed of god

[wild glen]

lmao

[lethal summit]

https://tenor.com/view/sanic-the-hedgehob-running-gotta-go-fast-fast-gif-4964355

[hushed briar]

Lol I still use the bump alloc pool

[fluid moon]

https://tenor.com/view/sleep-well-kitten-gif-25115971

[wild glen]

paging should work theoretically because entire kernel fits into 1 mb

or 1.5

at least not 4

do i add on page tables only when i need them?

[lethal summit]

that is typically the approach yes

and you can even take this one step further by only adding on page tables when you actually touch the pages

[wild glen]

my mouse buffer is still absolute dookie farts

i want to repair it

:|

so the mouse buffer is a 16x16 square that should keep up with everything behind it, so when the mouse moves it can safely remove the mouse cursor from the screen

without doing any funny shit to anything that was behind it

the off brand finland was an attempt to check if pixels were drawn over that square

AAAAAAAAAAAAA

my sanity

vs

two 15 second unskippable youtube ads

fucking kill me already

unrelated but i feel like my bones are gonna collapse

ykw it will slightly be laggy for now

not as bad as that fucking double buffer that took up 3 mb of memory before

my buffer is so good i triple faulted my os :D

[wild glen]

i have a mouse cursor again

let me just give it an icon and then im gonna stop for today my eyes hurt

or a drawing

what is it even called

(easiest questions ever cant be answered when you have a fucking stroke)

im so done for that i somehow put the x variable and the y variable in the wrong places

why the fuck is the dependency for a graphics driver the mouse driver

this pssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssr bv

me cursor work

https://tenor.com/view/yippee-happy-celebration-joy-confetti-gif-25557730

i wish open source projects had paychecks

matrix

(tm)

[wild glen]

my fucking eyes are falling out

should i make the nullium theme dark mode by default

[lethal summit]

are we doing graphics to cope with no paging

😢

[wild glen]

no

i had my mouse cursor before and i want it back now

i dont think im getting it back because im deadass in physical pain

I WILL FUCKING KILL SOMEONE IF I WITNESS A YOUTUBE AD ON MY SCREEN AGAIN

enabling an adblock is just gonna make it say "lol disable ts we see you"

[gloomy musk]

a sprite?

[wild glen]

maybe

honestly im just gonna use a regular bitmap for sprites

i meant mouse cursor

s

they only take a single kilobyte anyway

or 2

nvm

[lean relic]

a coca cola

[fluid moon]

personally I don't like working on external devices before having working internals, you'll get in a mess and you'll have to rewrite the whole driver at some point

[wild glen]

the driver works i just want to draw a cursor

[wild glen]

pepsi

[lean relic]

https://tenor.com/view/i-woke-up-in-a-new-bugatti-car-gif-5913316359309196724

https://tenor.com/view/andrew-tate-top-g-cigar-smoking-andrew-tate-cigar-gif-26262606

[wild glen]

new bugatti wake up in me

https://tenor.com/view/pyro-pyro-tf2-teamfortress-2-thumbs-up-pyro-silly-gif-11595703996617225189

[fluid moon]

I touched userspace!

[wild glen]

how do you touch that

[fluid moon]

with your toes

[wild glen]

maybe

[fluid moon]

automatically generated by rust bindgen

[lean relic]

yeah wrong thread

[wild glen]

rust of all time

[wild glen]

switching to the x31 architecture

[wild glen]

how do i add images to starting thread thing i dont think i even can :^(

also im gonna make every text mode window in nullium have a 90x60 thing

i want 3 window types

• raster - useful for games, deadass the entire window is a bitmap
• vector - placeText(10,10,"Hello World");
• text mode - fucking vga bruh

tldr

idk if i should permit changing sizes for 90x60 text mode windows

maybe that would be maximum size

only if the program wants the size changed

https://tenor.com/view/pyro-pyro-tf2-teamfortress-2-thumbs-up-pyro-silly-gif-11595703996617225189

[wild glen]

by "vga bruh" i actually mean (SIMULATED IN A WINDOW) vga text mode
maybe i can add bold text and other formatting but idk

its not on 0xb80000 though no shit

[lean relic]

why

make it be on 0xb8000

[wild glen]

https://tenor.com/view/plankton-plankton-meme-gif-15640350090336605258

[hushed briar]

Why not userspace first 😢

[wild glen]

because kernel shell

a windowing system is required for program operation anyways

[sour pollen]

what about text based programs

[hushed briar]

Yes and every sane window manager is in userspace ….

You realize WHY we don’t put these things in kernel space right?

Any exception will crash your shit

Operating systems are MEANT to run userspace programs

It’s just meant to allow the programs to get services from the kernel

Like

Syscalls exist for a reason

Because a syscall won’t nuke your system

But a bare file operation in kernel mode might

Lots of people end up doing their entire file systems in userspace

Microkernels

For this exact reason

You should read up on some theory more brotha

[gloomy musk]

what about Windows? Isn't it

oops

I was gonna say I thought Windows' WM was in kernel space

or am I remembering wrong?

[wild glen]

it is sorta i think

idk

win9x def had a kernel space wm

[hushed briar]

No…

[gloomy musk]

nvm then

[hushed briar]

Historically it was

After windows 7

They made it in userspace

[wild glen]

winndow as well

[gloomy musk]

it took them that long to put it in userspace?

yeesh XD

[hushed briar]

Yeah

Well

[wild glen]

if you end explorer.exe then you can still make windows

idk maybe the wm is some other executable

wtf am i supposed to do just resort to a framebuffer terminal???

[gloomy musk]

anyhow, uh yeah, kernel shell (emulating a user space shell) is generally bad

[wild glen]

death

[hushed briar]

Before they put it in userspace, the window manager did run in kernel space but the win32 api accessed it through userspace it’s kinda stupid

Like win32k.sys was in kernel mode but

user32.dll and gdi32.dll were user mode components to access it

The dll’s provided an api to forward calls to the kernel

[hushed briar]

Look above

[gloomy musk]

how silly lol

[hushed briar]

I mean it’s kinda just

A really cursed system call

[gloomy musk]

🤣

[wild glen]

uhhhh

so what do i do

[hushed briar]

Create a scheduler …

Wait is your pmm functional

[wild glen]

T h e n

[hushed briar]

And your paging

[hushed briar]

Finish that first lmao

If you can make a good scheduler

You’re good

[wild glen]

(paging) currently not

we alr started talking about this so i just want to know what a sane person does

[hushed briar]

For a kernel?

Wanna know what I did

Like the steps

Maybe that’ll help you

[wild glen]

whar

[hushed briar]

gdt->idt->pmm->paging->vmm->vfs->tmpfs->sched

I would recommend making a vmm

Probably

That would help

And if you don’t have a kernel heap allocator

You should get onto that

Look up “the slab allocator”

[wild glen]

O k

what do i do with that gui thing i have

mouse cursor and the other funny

[hushed briar]

Back burner

Switch to to userspace at some point

It should be trivial

[wild glen]

maybe

wait if its in userspace i can add other gui support

[hushed briar]

Yes

[wild glen]

Yes

neuron activation

[hushed briar]

You can port the X Window System even at some point

Imagine that

[wild glen]

isnt wayland better nowadays

[hushed briar]

You just need syscalls

[hushed briar]

Eh

Depends who you ask

[wild glen]

fair

[hushed briar]

Most people would say Wayland

[wild glen]

gnome is dropping x support soon (sad)

[hushed briar]

I disagree

Yeah and gnome as a desktop environment has been shit for 15 years so

[wild glen]

idk i still use it

ok ykw it is kinda shit

[hushed briar]

Dude it’s horrible lmao

[wild glen]

where on god's green earth is the minimize button

[gloomy musk]

Never used it lol

[hushed briar]

Just use xfce or mate or kde…

Or cinnamon

Or just any sane DE

[wild glen]

mk

i used kde

[hushed briar]

Yeah it’s nice imo

[wild glen]

cinnamon is literally michael windows

[gloomy musk]

I like KDE :3

[hushed briar]

I like cinnamon

It’s the one I use

Because it’s similar to windows

Lmao