Astral

[bronze nexus]

If you have steam you should in theory have most of chromium in the bag too since it uses chrome embedded

[hardy vine]

yea guys what is the x86_64 archetecture?

never heard of it

probably some weird and niche arch i mean x86_64 is so weird

[fleet osprey]

yeah everybody knows that PowerPC achieved world dominance already

[hardy vine]

true

x86_64 is so random man, its probbably not supported anywhere

[bronze nexus]

Also current image run in qemu as is just page faults before doing anything

[grand shadow]

💀

I need to update that stuff

When I work on the wine blog post Im likely gonna update a bunch of stuff

[grand shadow]

https://giphy.com/gifs/head-bang-desk-xxCNsOokj8Rxp8EtUL

[grand shadow]

I have been trying to get steam to run for at almost 2 weeks now, maybe at some point I should just raise the white flag

so close yet so far

there is an EXTREMELY annoying bug where the unix syscall dispatch will be called with a zero rcx

and trying to get the dll from just the return rip has gotten me nowhere because I think it applied non-logged relocations

[grand shadow]

yeah I think I am just gonna take a small break from trying to get steam to run, see what other cool stuff I can try running and write a blog post and push whatever I have already

[viscid flame]

port gtk

[grand shadow]

I mean more as in wine stuff

I'm gonna probably try:
baldis cuz unity game - DEFERRED because unity bs might take too long
spooky jumpscare mansion - works, very slow
factorio - window opens, does not load
scp cb - no worky :(
ftl - works!

[split lance]

spooky!

[grand shadow]

baldis seems to be doing some bullshit

ok I think baldi is going to take an eternity to do that so not gonna test that today

yoo

ftl seems to be booting up

its a bit in slow motion but its playable

spooky's jumpscare mansion seems to be loading

[worthy mica]

cool

[grand shadow]

this is so slow 😭

oh lord this is laggy

it reaaally doesn't like to respond huh

I think it wants a loopback tcp connection which is kind of broken on astral

anyways thats enough for me today

if anyone has any cool and reasonable game ideas for me to try, lmk

[viscid flame]

hello neighbor

hoi4

[grand shadow]

keyword reasonable

hoi4 would probably run at like

1 hour per hour

real time ww2

[viscid flame]

y

ill play hoi4 on astral

[viscid flame]

or you can run age of civilizations 2

[prime mulch]

@grand shadow diversion: look into xnu's "zone cache" its their implementation of slabs and magazines its quaint

[stone oracle]

"maga zone cache". 😁

[fierce forge]

you don't get it if you're under 21

wait

[prime mulch]

make america great again zone cache

is this trump's plan for managing the strait of heap-uz

[gritty shore]

How does it differ from the classic solaris way of doing things

is it described in the book? I haven't gotten that far yet, I should continue it

[prime mulch]

mostly implementational

honestly im not sure its unique actually

but like

they have a region of virtual address space where the slabs go

and they have an array of descriptors elsewhere which they index with the relative page number inside that region and they grow it as needed by adding more page frames to it

[gritty shore]

One thing that freebsd does different for example is having two different magazine types, one alloc and one free

[gritty shore]

Which prevents thrashing

[prime mulch]

is that different isnt that just how it works

[gritty shore]

the classic bonwick one doesn't do that

[grand shadow]

Ack, added into my list of stuff to look into

[split lance]

ayooooo

[fleet osprey]

local os dev discovers that mesa software rendering is actually dogshit and abysmally slow even on good hardware

[grand shadow]

Tbf it was like 1 core on a slow hobby os with questionable code quality

[fleet osprey]

sure that may be contributing

but it does actually suck, this is not entirely your fault

[mild sentinel]

ULTRAKILL

I don’t know any other DRM free games on steam

That would work well

[grand shadow]

True I should

[viscid flame]

0 fps gaming

[grand shadow]

finally pushed everything I had locally

18 commits

[hearty fulcrum]

bash 5.3?

[grand shadow]

slooow

really needs optimizations

[cyan junco]

how could you optimize it ?

[analog berry]

I wonder what your main bottleneck is

[marsh sparrow]

CPU rendering

[analog berry]

u cant say without knowing the linux numbers on a similar vm

also its a pixel game lol

[mild sentinel]

Yooooo based game

[opal lotus]

same

[gritty shore]

Probably not one thing in particular but a combination tbh

[mild sentinel]

Syscalls using cr2 as a temp
And probably other things too
And don’t say talk is cheap send patches because I can’t even compile astral to make the patches which I would try to

[gritty shore]

Software rendering should be plenty fast

[opal lotus]

yeah

[gritty shore]

is cr2 slow?

vmexit?

[mild sentinel]

It’s serializing

[gritty shore]

ah

[opal lotus]

💀

[mild sentinel]

I don’t expect the worlds largest speedup

It it certainly can’t hurt to patch it

💀

[opal lotus]

maybe fbdev is an issue?

tho it shouldn't be terribly slow

actually it shouldn't really matter because plainfb is similar enough to fbdev

[mild sentinel]

Is there even an easy way to speed up fbdev? Idk how mode setting works though I know it’s in the middle of a full GPU driver and the GOP/VGA?

[gritty shore]

Like I said, I doubt the cpu rendering is the issue

People ran doom on 486s

[opal lotus]

no

plainfb is whatever you get from the firmware

[formal patio]

local man is baiting me to continue working on lil

[mild sentinel]

Then fbdev is a thing for userspace to use that properly and get info on it and MMAP it?

[bronze nexus]

fbdev is an interface

[mild sentinel]

Yeah

[analog berry]

Do it

[viscid flame]

is lil usable btw

[willow rapids]

it works fine but it crashes on 50% of real hardware

[formal patio]

works for eDP output on Skylake/Kaby Lake/Coffee Lake, hopefully

LVDS output on Sandy Bridge/Ivy Bridge is in the works

[grand shadow]

Erm not anymore

Something something profiling is needed

[mild sentinel]

yoooo

🗣️ 🔥

[grand shadow]

Doing that made no difference btw

And now I use 8 more bytes of memory per cpu grrr

[mild sentinel]

💀

damn

[analog berry]

What a waste

Should've done a tss scratch space like Linux

[mild sentinel]

or should more kernels be using CR2

[grand shadow]

Yes its a secret cheat code to make your cpu 10% faster

[viscid flame]

literally unusable

[grand shadow]

Ive got the blog post almost drafted down on my notes, then Ill pass to my computer and do a second pass

[fleet osprey]

it isn't, Mesa llvmpipe sucks

[fleet osprey]

that was at a much lower resolution, which a lower color depth, with an astronomically more optimized rendering pipeline

[fleet osprey]

even on Linux it's still slow as crap

especially on weak hardware

I actively see it as low as 5FPS on weaker hw

if you have absolutely baller hardware to toss an entire fast as hell CPU at it then it can pull off some somewhat decent framerates

but for everybody with average hardware, and especially who isn't going to dedicate their entire system to it (only running the VM with a subset of their hw) then it very much does and will run like crap, because it's just slow

even for "simple" stuff like basic GTK apps it's still not that great

[formal patio]

funny how you're shitting on llvmpipe despite multiple people here running it to great success, with surprisingly decent perf

on managarm, normal desktop (weston) use with a few GTK apps is easily in the hundreds of fps

and supertuxkart is still getting 40-60 iirc

[fleet osprey]

so you all have stupidly fast CPUs then

I'm talking about average CPUs like Math's 10300H

even the worst code will still appear to run fast if you just throw infinite compute at it

[formal patio]

it won't be great on some low-power CPU starved for clock and power obv, but that doesn't justify shitting on LLVMpipe, that's just a limitation of the hw

it's like having a slow-ass GPU and blaming the driver for low fps

[fleet osprey]

it's not a hardware limitation, those CPUs are still plenty fast, and if llvmpipe was actually efficient it would be able to achieve far more competent fps on such CPUs

[formal patio]

[citation needed]

the point is that LLVMpipe is very optimized, and to get something better is either very, very hard or might not even be meaningfully possible

compare it to softpipe for instance, LLVM is quite the perf uplift

[fleet osprey]

literally just compare it to what came before it

go boot up like Debian 5 and compare glxgears perf against Debian 13

it's clear as day

[mild sentinel]

ive had LLVM pipe run a 2d vulkan 1.2 unoptimized af game engine at a reasonable FPS on a 900MHz laptop Pentium
i dont think LLVM pipe is the issue here

[formal patio]

willing to bet it's some dumb config stuff as vsync on wayland

[fleet osprey]

nah, I'm not even talking about wayland anything here

anyways I need to go catch the bus in a few minutes so I gtg
but yeah it's really simple if you just benchmark them lol, the pre-gallium software rendering used to be at least semi-efficient, but llvmpipe is awful, and softpipe is even worse

the regression in perf was like 4x from my testing

though that was on weaker hw

would be curious to see how faster hw stacks up, to see if that influences my opinion any, since I don't really have any to test

[sharp carbon]

there are so many other differences between those two that any comparison is meaningless

you really need to test with the only difference being the renderer

[formal patio]

do you mean swrast?

[fleet osprey]

I know I built my own Linux kernel for both, because I was testing it on niche hardware

(Nintendo Wii U )

so that couldn't be a difference

[fleet osprey]

yes iirc

though I don't recall exactly, I just woke up and am getting ready for school lmao

[formal patio]

that got nuked from mesa a long time ago for being old and slow

swrast basically interpreted OpenGL state with little optimization, while LLVMpipe is a JIT

that goes to great optmization lengths

[fleet osprey]

well it was significantly faster than both softpipe and llvmpipe on all hardware I've tested

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[fleet osprey]

this was not the only thing I tested it on fwiw, I also did some stuff with misc x86 and arm devices

just much less extensive testing

don't have hard numbers for any of those off the top of my head

[formal patio]

the problem with that statement is that it doesn't line up with either mechanistic logic, or people's experiences, making some issue in your testing plainly the likeliest scenario

[fleet osprey]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

I may check it again once I get back home

[mild sentinel]

Or the Nintendo WiiU just has strange ass hardware

[fleet osprey]

but this was my actual experience across multiple devices, so that's what I based my opinion on

[fleet osprey]

^^^

[mild sentinel]

Ah

[fleet osprey]

that's just where I remember that 4x number from

[fleet osprey]

also imo it's stupidly normal, it's just 3x PowerPC 750CL cores each at 1.2GHz

though it's very bus constrained, all cores share a single 248MHz bus

however I do low level development for it and the other PPC consoles on a daily basis so I have become somewhat normalized to it

[gritty shore]

Huh? It's pretty damn fast for what it is

I have written a faster renderer in the past but that was stupidly well optimized and not as generic

[fleet osprey]

not worth repeating myself when I need to leave in 2m lol

read the above

[willow rapids]

@formal patio i'm sorry i read that as lai 😭

i didn't even see that yall were taking about gpu stuff i just saw that message

[opal lotus]

[marsh sparrow]

It's possible that llvmpipe sucks on wii hardware

[formal patio]

that wasn't the claim though

[marsh sparrow]

I could imagine that llvm output is worse than hand optimized swrast for ppc

Especially for stuff like old school fixed function pipelines

[grand shadow]

I am curious how many other hobby OSes implement this compatibility mode stuff

[analog berry]

pmos

[grand shadow]

blog post underway™ I hope to have it written by tomorrow

[grand shadow]

https://www.reddit.com/r/osdev/comments/1sb3rm6/porting_wine_to_astral/ something something please updoot kind strangers thanks for the reddit gold

@prime juniper remember that managarm clock picture with like 3-4 different clock applications?

I have a new suggestion to add to it

wine clock.exe

I'm looking at the wine builtins and theres some cool shit here

4kb/4kb 99% cpu usage

[prime juniper]

Yeah of course

I made it

[neon crane]

This is so cursed

Wine task manager with whatever WM's window decorations

Also you should try running my fireworks test on astral

[grand shadow]

I ran xfireworks a while ago

I should add a lua interpreter into the kernel

[mild sentinel]

Lua eBPF for astral?

[grand shadow]

Sort of what netbsd has

[mild sentinel]

Huh Thats interesting

So you can like make drivers via Lua?

Like a USB driver for a controller etc?

[grand shadow]

Idk what I will do with it other than its cool

[mild sentinel]

I’d presume it would be good for HID shit like drivers for PS3 controllers etc

I know Linux’s driver for that is really fucking nasty to bootleg controllers so being able to tweak it in lua to work is nice etc

[neon crane]

Not the same thing

My fireworks test runs each particle in an individual thread

Xfireworks probably just runs one thread entirely

[grand shadow]

True

[proper meteor]

🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷

[upper dragon]

could that allow you to implement the age verification thing in lua?

age_checker.lua 🙃

[spare sky]

🇧🇷 💪

[grand shadow]

It is more so a solution looking for a problem atm but it is a very cool solution

[grand shadow]

alright so

I won't have a whole lot of time this week cuz exams and all

but I might try to get some bugfixes done, especially some things that pitust raised

[fleet osprey]

Astral has been brought up in the ReactOS discord server btw

[grand shadow]

interesting

[grand shadow]

don't be e a vagueposter smh did they say anything

[fleet osprey]

nah that's all 😭

just dropped the link

no discussion about it

[grand shadow]

damn

[fleet osprey]

just thought it was funny that it was mentioned at all lol

[grand shadow]

clearly you need to necro it to say how good astral is /j

[fleet osprey]

lol

[obsidian pivot]

does astral print "LDT INIT... OK"

for its LDT syscalls

@grand shadow

[flint condor]

only gdts can be init ok

[viscid flame]

epstein patches

[grand shadow]

ldt init ok is like elite osdev gdt init ok

[flint condor]

what about allocator init ok

[grand shadow]

BUMP INIT... OK

[flint condor]

keyboard interrupt enable

lol bump alloc

I am currently brainstorming a basic debugger that can freeze the rest of the system and selectively step through just the one program

[fleet osprey]

PAGING INIT... FAIL

[flint condor]

basically hijacks the scheduler

[flint condor]

paging init: identity map

wait....I'm roasting myself

[fleet osprey]

still failed

[flint condor]

console output: fa
<TRIPLE FAULT, REBOOTED>

[fleet osprey]

[grand shadow]

Kerneç init... FAIL

[flint condor]

loading kernel... kernel not found

[fleet osprey]

loading kerneç... FAIL - kerneç not found

[willow rapids]

Kerneç long mode init... FAIL - falling back to 16-bit kerneç

[fleet osprey]

AS-DOS

[grand shadow]

larp larp larp larp larp sahur

[grand shadow]

finally stopped being lazy and implemented this

so nice to get a backtrace through interrupts instead of manually backtracing

[grand shadow]

I have been slowly working towards something very nice today: a real init system
so far openrc starts up, does its stuff and then starts an agetty on console and com0
one small problem there seems to be: something seems to be HAMMERING the cpu which does not really sound good

I really need to add a way to list all the processes and their system load

theres still a lot of failures during openrc init I still need to fix/patch to do something astral specific

also I'll need to hook it up to astral's power infrastructure etc

[grand shadow]

gigabrain programming?

[opal lotus]

root@

[hearty fulcrum]

No mail.

[winged basin]

good work

which reminds me that keyronex needs service management

[robust geyser]

systemd? 👀

[winged basin]

i'm going to write my own, but for pragmatic reasons i'll probably make it compatible with a subset of systemd

[grand shadow]

The cpu being hammered was likely init just spinning on polling the cmd fifo

Because of a misimplemented nonblocking open

[prime juniper]

InitWare resurrection?

[winged basin]

less ambitious for now, only the subset of functionality that keyronex benefits from in the immediate term

but that might be the right way to go about it anyway

[prime juniper]

Of course

Also with systemd 259 and newer there’s a bit more libc is not glibc support so upgrading components (if you’re going the InitWare route)

[grand shadow]

I think my goal for upstreaming this should be writing a few service scripts like sshd, netd, acpid and making sure everything else works fine

So far it mostly works but still doesnt power off etc

I also have to fix up many service scripts

[prime juniper]

Just port systemd lol

[grand shadow]

Keep yapping sir

[prime juniper]

I did it. How hard can it be

[grand shadow]

Tomorrow I think one of the things I will work towards is making my mount utility better i.e. adding fstab support

[flint condor]

systemd is cheap, send init scripts

[mild sentinel]

Sorry I only have openRC ones saved

My servers run alpine Linux

[grand shadow]

Based

Openrc <3

Time to switch to portage as well for the gentoo larp

[mild sentinel]

Why not port aports and APK?

I’ve used the build system a little and hosted a repo for a bit privately and it was pretty nice

Become alpine larp

[grand shadow]

Gentoo larp is better cause if I compile all my packages in my os thats a big flex

[mild sentinel]

https://tenor.com/view/a-gem-benjammins-chud-door-door-cam-gif-7224643390232569308

True

Wait wtf

Did I just see

Did

That Ben jammis person

Really do that

To this gif

😭

[errant zephyr]

wtf i looked at astrals pushlock code

wtf is this lmao

thats not how atomics work

a compiler could soundly do a lot of wild shit here im pretty sure

[fierce forge]

If it works it works

[errant zephyr]

its not gonna work as soon as my new llvm pass lands /j

[analog berry]

What's your pass

[wraith surge]

?

[errant zephyr]

well if you do a nonatomic access, then nothing which does synchronization, then atomics, then the atomic can be turned into a nonatomic access

[analog berry]

Make a pr

[errant zephyr]

the combination of [nonatomic load, atomic store] constrains you into having no other thread which accesses the value

[errant zephyr]

llvm is really large tho

[fierce forge]

ask a clanker to do it

[errant zephyr]

its also not that easy to prove because you also have to make sure the value you loaded is noundef

[analog berry]

i mean for astral

[errant zephyr]

i mean i could

[analog berry]

fix every ub in astral

[errant zephyr]

fix all bugs in the current folder make no mistakes

[grand shadow]

I do have a rewrite of it in my local tree but I cant tell what you are talking about so Im probably doing it wrong again

So stop vagueposting and share your wisdom /hj

[errant zephyr]

i mentioned above

its a nonatomic load lmao

[grand shadow]

Do I just have to __atomic_load(relaxed) instead?

I think I do it in my local tree

[errant zephyr]

yes

i like using a struct wrapper over all the atomics to make sure you cannot fuck it up

[grand shadow]

I see

Thanks

[grand shadow]

implemented fstab support in mount and now openrc mounts all the shi I tell it to

[mild sentinel]

🔥

[grand shadow]

next thing up is add netd to it and properly daemonize netd (or at least add an autodetection to it)

[mild sentinel]

What’s your plan for that?

[grand shadow]

disable gentoo newnet services -> add service for netd -> write device autodetection (probably just if_getindex() and find the first non loopback) -> properly daemonize it in the end with a TODO of sending keepalives

and ofc allow configuration for it in /etc/conf.d

[grand shadow]

well that was simple

I should also remove that netmount script since yknow

no network filesystem support yet

maybe the swap one as well

[hearty fulcrum]

did you get steam or firefox installer working? I haven't been following

[grand shadow]

I wish

do not have the patience to debug another "absurd 1 line fix bug that takes a week to track down"

[hearty fulcrum]

cloud plz fix all bugs make no mistakes

[grand shadow]

@grok is this real

root

root

BRUH

lmfaoi

[hearty fulcrum]

groot

[grand shadow]

wrong window

[hearty fulcrum]

clear

[grand shadow]

next thing I gotta do is get the hostname command working

[grand shadow]

hostname is up!

[fleet osprey]

Astral for world's best server OS 2026 trust

Linux doesn't stand a chance

[flint condor]

Linux? just some little European hobby os lol 😂

[grand shadow]

Next thing is getting it to shutdown properlu

[sage locust]

awesome!

[grand shadow]

just gotta patch it to actually shut the system down

[formal patio]

astral is just suckless managarm /s

[grand shadow]

reboot also works

[grand shadow]

aaand power button

I think this just leaves cleaning up some of these error messages and writing service scripts for things like sshd

[hearty fulcrum]

sync takes quite some time

[grand shadow]

I dont think its actually syncing there I think its just general slowdown

Idk why it happens, its random and depends on how happy wsl is

[mild sentinel]

You trying to upstream support to openrc right?

I hope they accept the patches

[grand shadow]

Probably not, I really doubt they would even accept it

[mild sentinel]

I know managarm is upstreamed on bash

It’s worth a shot

[grand shadow]

I mean it is also managarm

[mild sentinel]

Especially if everything is working properly

[grand shadow]

It has a whole team of people vs random ass astral made by one dev

[mild sentinel]

Fair but astral is a pretty fucking good kerneç

[grand shadow]

Kerneç init...
Ok

[bronze nexus]

Where did the Kerneç thing come from anyway

Is it a typo that became a joke

[grand shadow]

Yeah lmao

[bronze nexus]

lol

Just like BACKRTACE

except more famous

[mild sentinel]

memory corruption

[bronze nexus]

didn't matthew just say it was a typo

[mild sentinel]

i could have sworn it was due to that?

[obsidian pivot]

no

it was a typo

[mild sentinel]

damn

[tall bluff]

That's a crazy typo

[bronze nexus]

probably alt on some non-us keyboard layout or smth

lolwut

why is your kernel in tree with the distro

[mild sentinel]

mine is too. its called a monorepo

[bronze nexus]

yea but

why do this

[grand shadow]

Makes it easier to work on the kernel and distro at the same time

[bronze nexus]

perhaps

The only disadvantage I can see to my way of two split repos is dedicated commits just for updating the kernel, though

Like it doesn't seem to make much of a difference in terms of that

[gritty shore]

hey have you ever watched cidade de deus

you probably have

its a banger

[grand shadow]

Not rly Im not very into warching movies

[gritty shore]

it's a very famous brazilian movie

so I thought you would have watched it

[opal lotus]

but managarm isn't astral, and bash isn't openrc

https://giphy.com/gifs/no-correlation-sirclues-mlwmSCYcDAcgWkz8s4

[grand shadow]

find complaining about EBADF standard output
look in syscalllog
no syscall returns EBADF

@prime juniper next time you in linux mlibc, can you try out find /usr/bin -name klhgdfhjdsoihfsdjhfdihfsdjfsdkgsfdjgs to see if its an mlibc issue or astral issue

I don't think that error is a big issue anyways so go go gadget //

HOT

just gotta write service scripts for like sshd now

[analog berry]

Damn

[mild sentinel]

astral is lowkey close to being daily driveable

I’d honestly replace my windows install with it at some point

[grand shadow]

yay

(local tcp is kinda borked rn tho)

I also need to figure out why it seems to randonmly take a while when exiting a process

alright, I think this is it

tomorrow I'm gonna work on upstreaming it

o7 trusty old init that lasted 3 years

[mild sentinel]

https://tenor.com/view/salute-gif-8977961

[grand shadow]

Think this is one of the things Im gonna look into tomorrow as well, since now that the boot process starts up like a thousand processes....

[prime juniper]

Noting for testing later today

[grand shadow]

Ty bro

[quartz granite]

Astral got signed 8 bit overflow

[pure thunder]

this is so cool 😭

[grand shadow]

https://github.com/Mathewnd/Astral/commit/eda48f24e560fcca79793fe12d4526df1643521c

[grand shadow]

for some reason running poweroff with smp completely breaks the next boot, need to figure out why

[fierce forge]

Are you using uACPI?

[grand shadow]

yeah, mostly talking about the openrc side

it gets to openrc but it seems to skip the runlevels, not sure whyt

[bronze nexus]

lolwut

wouldn't the hardware powering off reset the CPUs to their default states on next boot?

[analog berry]

fs corruption

[bronze nexus]

AH

I see

That makes sense

[neon crane]

maybe syncing disks should come after terminating all processes dont you think?

[grand shadow]

openrc-init does sync() after kill(-1, SIGKILL)

[neon crane]

consider doing another sync after every process is killed

what if you have mmapped data that hasn't been flushed correctly

[grand shadow]

Yeah it could be it

[grand shadow]

lmfao I think I found why it randomly slows down then exiting from a process

peak astral code

if the exiting thread is lower priority... lol lmao xd

it has to wait until the waitpider gets its own priority lowered by running

[grand shadow]

Anyhow, fixed this and the openrc thing

Maybe I can look into doing some smp perf work tomorrow

Ive also done some more fixing on the things pitust had pointed out

The biggest issue right now for smp is on multithreaded applications I think

Because of tlb shootdowns related to how I handle anonymous mappings

[grand shadow]

Another thing I might look into is prefaulting already in core program pages on an elf_load

[grand shadow]

Speaking of vmm optimizations,

@prime mulch I remember you mentioning windows still has a zero page thread, do you think this is something worth doing?

[prime mulch]

with wise optimizations to limit bandwidth used yeah

i would use nontemporal writes to bypass cache and avoid obliterating the cache of the core the zero thread is running on

at that point you run the risk of causing massive bus contention

so you also want to throttle it to like

probably not more than a megabyte or two of zeroes per second

maybe you can do more if you know the whole system is largely idle

and less if you know its busy

[grand shadow]

I see, thanks!

[gritty shore]

The dragonflybsd guys found it to be worse for performance even, but ymmv

[prime mulch]

we showed that to an NT guy and he said "we saw that and were unable to replicate their findings"

so it is contested

[analog berry]

same as linux

they found out its beneficial to zero the page on the faulting thread

[errant zephyr]

so even if its beneficial, its not worth the complexity

[prime mulch]

thats not true

its pretty self contained

[prime mulch]

i think these guys didnt experiment hard enough lol

they condemned it based on lackluster implementations that hadnt been updated since the early 90s

[grand shadow]

I also wanna profile things like configure scripts

And gcc

I think my goal now is gonna be self hosting

Aka stability and perf work

[fleet osprey]

[marsh sparrow]

did you get all relevant drivers to work for the machine that you needed to run astral on?

[flint condor]

how do you do local TCP

do you create a dummy interface for it that forwards outbound packets back again

[grand shadow]

Only missing xhci, really. Which is deep in git hell as its like 80 commits behind atp

[grand shadow]

Pretty much yeah

[viscid flame]

didnt you had xhci support

[grand shadow]

Iretq was working on it on a fork

[viscid flame]

no merges ???

[grand shadow]

It was kinda broken still

@robust geyser how much effort do you think it would be to rebase it

[robust geyser]

probably negative

[grand shadow]

xhci when

https://tenor.com/view/pray-crying-black-guy-pleading-plead-gif-15911108386383402751

[robust geyser]

yeah just do it bro

should work just fine

[fleet osprey]

32-bit support when

[hearty fulcrum]

16-bit support when

[fleet osprey]

8-bit support when

[flint condor]

how does it break, I'm curious

I just do this in my outbound packet handler

    if (ip_is_loopback(dst_ip)) {
        ip_scratch_sel ^= 1;

        uint16_t pkt_len = ntohs(packet->length);
        unlock_spinlock_irq(&tcp_send_spinlock, flags);

        ip_handle_packet(packet, pkt_len);
        return;
    }

ip_scratch_sel just flips between two dedicated static buffers for shuttling localhost packets, probably not how you want to do it yourself

[robust geyser]

lol

[flint condor]

I copy packets when they go into the inbound packet queue as it makes it easier for me to store them to deal with fragmentation

[grand shadow]

I have no idea, I thibk it is so.ething in the tcp code

Maybe theres something in astral packets that astral doesnt like

[flint condor]

too much astral in your astral stream

[opal lotus]

say wallahi bro

[grand shadow]

glxgears

with 4 cores

the flamegraph is also quite interesting

like fuck you mean you spend like 10% of the kernel time in pushlock_acquire

the kernel spends 50x more time on pushlock_acquire function than doing shootdowns lmfaoooooo

this shit is FUUUUUCKED

[gritty shore]

might just be contention

[grand shadow]

I would expect it to be sleeping

since this only tracks tsc cycles so running time

[grand shadow]

minecraft is 34.63% kernel time and 65.37% userspace time on max settings on the other hand

[opal lotus]

I'm calling mlibc perf here

[grand shadow]

uhmm

what the fuuuck bro

this is the mc flamegraph

😭

me when half of kernel execution time is spent in pushlock

the pushlock implementation I have in my tree is different from the one upstream, I wonder if it is this one which is fucking shit u

p

or if its a general problem

[opal lotus]

just make a better one

[grand shadow]

old pushlocks makes it even slower

yeah this shit is fuuucked bro

I think I am somehow hammering pushlocks somewhere

[gritty shore]

why are you using pushlocks even

[grand shadow]

wdym

[gritty shore]

why pushlocks

[grand shadow]

also I think I found the issue and you guessed it, it is extremely retarded inneficient code from 2023

[grand shadow]

theyre pretty simple and neat

[grand shadow]

static vmmrange_t *allocrange() {
        vmmcache_t *cache = cachelist;
        vmmrange_t *range = NULL;
        while (cache) {
                MUTEX_ACQUIRE(&cache->header.lock);
                if (cache->header.freecount > 0) {
                        --cache->header.freecount;
                        uintmax_t r = getentrynumber(cache);
                        cache->header.firstfree = r + 1;
                        range = &cache->ranges[r];
                        range->size = -1; // set as allocated temporarily
                        MUTEX_RELEASE(&cache->header.lock);
                        break;
                } else if (cache->header.next == NULL)
                        cache->header.next = newcache();

                vmmcache_t *next = cache->header.next;
                MUTEX_RELEASE(&cache->header.lock);
                cache = next;
        }

        return range;
}

you get a paperclip if you can see why this code sucks ass

what the fuck was I even thinking bro

I hate my past self

[gritty shore]

turnstiles tho 🥺

[grand shadow]

like I did this in the most inneficient way possible

[grand shadow]

I gotta have some nt stuff here to balance out the unix smh

[gritty shore]

then implement DPCs and IRQLs (VMS but whatever)

and cool async io

[grand shadow]

I have dpcs and irql (even if my irql implementation seems kinda questionable)

async io is way too not unixy for a unix clone tho

[gritty shore]

not really

you can always implement sync on top of async

[grand shadow]

yeah

but then I am just managarm

[grand shadow]

anyways I am going to replace that entire inneficient system with just a slab object cache

atomic bomb vs coughing baby

[grand shadow]

much better

(new glxgears flamegraph)

a lot of time is just spent copying data around

and I think it was like a 75% userspace-25%kernel split

I can kinda feel a perf improvement in mc!!!

time to profile mc

and then try out the new stuff multicore

now mc is 72% userspace time and 27% kernel time

most of the mc kernel time just seems to be spent in the vmm

[gritty shore]

how many fps are you getting now

[grand shadow]

with 4 cores on tiny + fast:

_ _

[gritty shore]

that's pretty good

[grand shadow]

for the first time I actually get a higher fps on multicore

though I think now the place to focus optimizations on is probably userspace side

which means profiling mlibc

[gritty shore]

is mlibc built as release?

try that first

[fleet osprey]

Build everything with -Ofast

[gritty shore]

yes unironically

[grand shadow]

mlibc builds as debugoptimized by default

[fleet osprey]

(It breaks so much shit and can actually make stuff slower due to that, 0/10 would not recommend)

[grand shadow]

I should try to do another gcc compilation run on astral again to see if its still stable enough to do it

esp. with smp on

but first I'll do gnu hello and then mlibc

[prime juniper]

I tried it. And I didn’t have findutils installed yet lmaooooo. Will fix next week and report back

[marsh sparrow]

why?

that sounds like baseless speculation?

what operation in mlibc are you thinking of that would be slow?

[opal lotus]

the way it's built

i.e. compiler flags

[marsh sparrow]

debugoptimized vs release doesn't change perf

[opal lotus]

is debugoptimized the default?

[marsh sparrow]

debug is the default if you pass nothing but you should basically always pass debugoptimized

[opal lotus]

hm

i mean astral also uses a 4 month old mlibc

[neon crane]

debugoptimized still has asserts though doesnt it

[marsh sparrow]

yes but asserts are usually cheap

[analog berry]

btw @grand shadow kvm has paravirt helpers for tlb invalidation and ipis etc

if u implement it u could gain a lot of unfair advantage over managarm

[grand shadow]

[analog berry]

ipis work via a hypercall + bitmask

tlb flushing is a bit more funny, it's not actually assisted, but u can walk over all vcpus and check if they're currently preempted by host, and if they are just tell kvm to flush the tlb on resume, and clear them from the actual dst mask

https://elixir.bootlin.com/linux/v7.0/source/arch/x86/kernel/kvm.c#L665

[grand shadow]

https://github.com/managarm/mlibc/pull/1767

pushed from astral for max aura farming

[bronze nexus]

nice

[grand shadow]

built from astral

including git clone, downloading and extracting the linux tarball, installing linux headers, etc

[analog berry]

Self hosting done?

[grand shadow]

big W for self hosting

[grand shadow]

nonono

only after I get a minimal distro from within astral

[analog berry]

Whats missing atm?

[grand shadow]

stability mostly

and speed

other than that I think I have everything

I fixed one of the annoying bugs that happened when compiling gcc/doing heavy disk work

so it should be smooth sailing.... after I profile it a bit

[analog berry]

So like, u can compile the entire thing and run it now?

Well also kde is missing ofc

[grand shadow]

theoretically yeah

realistically it'd probably take too long and probably crash on the way

[hearty fulcrum]

doesn't jinx need namespaces and stuff

I read that somewhere

[grand shadow]

who said I would use jinx to do it lol

I will do it like a real man smh

configure make make install

[marsh sparrow]

How long does mlibc take to build on astral?

[fleet osprey]

I wonder if you could use Astral to cross-compile other complete stuff atp

perf would suck as you've mentioned

but maybe it could do a small embedded buildroot image or something

would be a neat test

[grand shadow]

not that much but it could be better

I didn't really time it

[grand shadow]

don't see why not

[grand shadow]

I am gonna try to do a gcc build

full wget -> patch -> autoconf -> configure -> make -> make install

[grand shadow]

A cpu thats a bit betrer than mine at home on short render distance

[analog berry]

did it like crash in the background lol?

[grand shadow]

No its just prints

[analog berry]

did something segfault

[grand shadow]

I should figure out a way to silence the non fatal ketnel prints when running xorg

[grand shadow]

Java did but its normal

[analog berry]

lol

[grand shadow]

Something something segfault handling

[analog berry]

ohh

[deft oak]

you dont do that already???

how was it not annoying until now

[grand shadow]

Because it almost never happens tbf

Realistically it only happens when a program segfaults

[analog berry]

There are very few segfault driven programs

[fleet osprey]

I've made one

it's also sigill-driven

[viscid flame]

for example

[fleet osprey]

https://github.com/Wii-Linux/dol-tools/tree/main/src/dol-run
problem-state PPC virtualization in userspace

[analog berry]

Java

[fleet osprey]

(it's as slow and cursed as it sounds)

[grand shadow]

Java and wine seem to like to take segfaults

Qemu too I think

[analog berry]

Jits do that in general I guess

[formal patio]

yeah there's a few uses for that

I once used it for tracing nvidia's userspace library calls to the kernel driver

[grand shadow]

Got the clanker to write a stub clock_getres and FIONBIO for sockets for me, now meson subprojects download works

Which also means I should maybe be able to run mlibc tests wink wink

[analog berry]

when move to #1495060704418463934

[grand shadow]

Trvthke

When astral on openslopware repo

[opal lotus]

i cant believe you've done this

[viscid flame]

im going to commit to it

with astral

now you are cancelled

[analog berry]

you're going to commit WHAT

[grand shadow]

ccplover0 is claudes greatest soldier

[viscid flame]

wrong im gemini user

[mild sentinel]

Use Claude to make PR btw

Then openslopware can go onto openslopware

And it will implode

[viscid flame]

it was joke 🙏

[grand shadow]

openslopslopware

[marsh sparrow]

use claude to enumerate all lists on gh with CLAUDE.md and auto submit them to openslopware

[winged basin]

ai in Astral

betrayed....

live reaction

[grand shadow]

😔

[grand shadow]

Added support for smap/smep

[viscid flame]

dw i use ai too

you are not alone

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/116914772766752769/1381405358022721648/togif-7.gif

[grand shadow]

Im mostly gonna use it for static analysis and some pieces of code I dont care much about

The core of the stuff will still be written by me

[opal lotus]

about time

[grand shadow]

Trvth

It already found a typo for me which is nice

[fierce forge]

I've decided I'll only use agentic ai to debug specific bugs in my OS, which I cannot find myself after a reasonable time

It's such a slippery slope

[analog berry]

its great for reviewing code as well

that doesnt make your code slop and u get a lot of bugs spotted for free

like just ask it to review (not make any edits)

it may spot fake/bullshit bugs as well but sometimes its useful

[grand shadow]

just remembered I never really profiled wine

maybe I should do that and find out what was causing shit to be extremely slow

still not really sure if I want to keep trying to tackle that GetAdapterAddresses() bug because damn that fucking sucks

maybe I can leave the clanker trying to see what that is about

[mild sentinel]

The clanker took 40 minutes to find a tiny bug in my elf loading. I wonder how long it would take to find that bug 💀

[grand shadow]

autom4ate just fucking segfaults for some reason

💀

I really need to get some sort of userspace debugger going

go go gadget ptrace

oh hell naw perl bug

its a very silly context dump as well, I think perl is casting some pointer to int

0x000000001002e38d <+1853>: movslq %eax,%rdi
0x000000001002e390 <+1856>: add $0x1,%rdi
0x000000001002e394 <+1860>: test %eax,%eax
0x000000001002e396 <+1862>: cmove %rbx,%rdi
0x000000001002e39a <+1866>: call 0x10017010 strcmp@plt

https://tenor.com/view/giga-fly-gif-13779114805087374100

spin the wheel, perl bug or gcc bug

(the reason why this did not happen before is because I recently changed the default base mmap to be somewhere in high 64-bit space)

((and for some ungodly reason this code wants uses a 32-bit pointer

congratulations

I think its because my_memrchr is not being defined

[viscid flame]

mmap have some lower memory flag

[grand shadow]

not my problem, they can just hint it to be at some lower memory

"abandon all hope, ye who enter here"

theres code from 1991 here, damn

[viscid flame]

💀

[grand shadow]

Anyways missing -D_GNU_SOURCE award for my perl recipe

autoconf should work on gcc now... Hopefully....

Cant try until layer

Later

[grand shadow]

Yay xbps install from tmpfs is fixed

[viscid flame]

yo

try to run ultrakill on astral

with wine

[grand shadow]

Local tcp is also fixed now

[grand shadow]

Unity game 🥀

[versed terrace]

h

[opal lotus]

h

[obsidian pivot]

h

[wraith surge]

h

[bright knoll]

h

[mild sentinel]

h

[bronze nexus]

h

[spare sky]

h

[grand shadow]

h

[fleet osprey]

h

[dim arrow]

h

[fierce forge]

h

[tall bluff]

h

[bright knoll]

h

[split lance]

h

[grand shadow]

things I actually need to look into doing:

• continue iretq's xhci work
• profile gcc build (maybe I'll start by profiling an mlibc build)
• profile wine

I have a gcc build going rn

did wget -> untar -> patch -> autoconf -> configure and its now in make -j2

[bright knoll]

Really weird way to spell “h” but alright

[viscid flame]

h

[hardy vine]

h

[grand shadow]

yay I left gcc building overnight and it did

and if the stat is not lying to me, the last thing it did was around 4:48 am

  File: x86_64-astral/libstdc++-v3/src/.libs/libstdc++convenience.a
  Size: 39957322        Blocks: 9756       IO Block: 4096   regular file
Device: 7,1     Inode: 210496      Links: 1
Access: (0644/-rw-r--r--)  Uid: (    0/    root)   Gid: (    0/    root)
Access: 2026-04-25 04:48:49.000000000 -0300
Modify: 2026-04-25 04:49:06.000000000 -0300
Change: 2026-04-25 04:48:49.000000000 -0300
 Birth: -```

which is, comparing with confure.log, a ~4h50m build

a MUCH bigger improvement than the olden over 24h

and this was with only a single core

Huge step in the right direction with this

Still could do better

With perl now I dont think youd even need to like patch the makefile for maie install anymore

yup, with perl it now installs in a single shot

so astral was able to do the full "download tarball -> untar -> patch -> autoconf -> configure -> make -> make install" process with gcc

astralbros we are so back

:p

[bronze nexus]

yoooooooo

nice

[grand shadow]

broke: mount a real disk device or nothing
woke:

[sharp carbon]

dev zero on root??

[opal lotus]

why is your tmpfs called none

[sharp carbon]

df lists the source, not the type, and for tmpfs the source is ignored so you can just pass whatever you want to mount()

you can see this on linux too. if you do mount -t tmpfs none dir you'll see none mounted on dir in df

[opal lotus]

well then ig all my fses are called something

[sharp carbon]

the "convention" for fses where source is meaningless is to make it the same as the type

or just some other descriptor for that matter

[opal lotus]

how does it get the list of fses? fstab?

[sharp carbon]

/etc/mtab iirc

which on linux is a symlink to /proc/self/mount or something along those lines

[opal lotus]

/mounts but yes

[grand shadow]

My root device autodetection kinda breaks when there is no root device 💀

[grand shadow]

I need to make some virtual packages like "base" and "x11-base"

[grand shadow]

Ive already merged some of iretq's work and Im gonna start on finishing his evdev work

[hardy vine]

h

[grand shadow]

evdev merging progress: have gotten xorg server to enumerate and detect event* files

this neede some bullshit xorg-server detection code

but at least now theres no need for annoying /etc/xorg.conf

I think now its just a matter of doing a final review pass of the code and then committing it

[opal lotus]

udev the long way

[marsh sparrow]

it's not udev, right? It's changing the programs to work w/o it

which is a possible route to get it working

[grand shadow]

Yeah its not udev

[opal lotus]

yeah i was just joking

though you totally could do that

[grand shadow]

"I like kicking pregnant dogs"

[opal lotus]

managarm kicks dogs

[grand shadow]

evdev support by @robust geyser is merged after some bugfixing!

cc @viscid flame

[viscid flame]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/116914772766752769/1381405358022721648/togif-7.gif

[hardy vine]

does selfhosting for you means being able to build and run astral on astral or being able to uninstall linux and use astral as the daily driver

[grand shadow]

being able to compile a minimal distro of itself inside itself, maybe extending that to being able to compile a distro that can compile another distro that can compile another distro etc.

just being enough of self replicating ig

[hardy vine]

ah

[grand shadow]

I've always followd the later as my definition of self hosting but people often mean it as just compiling the kernel

which is boooooring

[hardy vine]

[grand shadow]

Hmm do I work on xhci merging today or do I profile gcc

[mild sentinel]

I vote for XHCI

[viscid flame]

xhci

more important

[native pollen]

XHCI for me too

Also how can I see the first post of this thread

I’m trying to read the project description but it doesn’t let me see it

[elfin turtle]

there is an up arrow button (top right on desktop)

[native pollen]

I’m on mobile and there isn’t

I can’t use desktop discord

[elfin turtle]

discord is fucking stupid

here you go

[native pollen]

thank you

[grand shadow]

damn old astral is close to new astral but still so different

[spark sentinel]

on ios you can always press on the clock or the top bar basically and it will take you to the topmost thing

like everywhere

[native pollen]

oh wow it works

nice

[spark sentinel]

it‘s very annoying most of the time when you accidentally activate that feature and it scrolls all the way back

[grand shadow]

astral is pretty close to 500 stars on github

where do I have to shill it to get to 500

[native pollen]

r/osdev

you might get mogged by Shrek though

[opal lotus]

unmappedstack

[bronze nexus]

LinkedIn buzzword soup

[grand shadow]

didn't sam altman post some bullshit about opertaing systems a few days ago

I should shill it to openai and get a job there

[bronze nexus]

oh god

my god, LinkedIn has so much AI slop posting on it

[grand shadow]

I should port startx

so I don't rely on this

stupid ass startwm script

thats more so a hack from before I even had signals

[opal lotus]

port wayland

[hearty fulcrum]

doesn't wine have desktop mode

use that

[grand shadow]

running startx causes the entire kernel to implode for some reason

actual insanity

[grand shadow]

ok I am going to start on the xhci stuff soon but like

first I gotta

noita

on astral

to see how faster it got

[grand shadow]

bruh

82% userspace hits

17% kernel hits

hell naw

maybe it is some bullshit in mlibc or whatever

[mild sentinel]

Maybe it’s DNS

[analog berry]

that must be it

u really need to port glibc just for performance comparison i swear

[grand shadow]

the kernel time seems reasonable

like the stuff thats happening during kernel time

[grand shadow]

I should really stop procrastinating it and actually profile mlibc

[analog berry]

wouldnt it be faster to port glibc just to confirm that its an mlibc problem

[grand shadow]

I don't care who gloire sends I am not porting glibc

it would also help if I updated mlibc

I am currently on uh

4 month old mlibc

[bright knoll]

glorie is a front for big libc so they can push glibc harder

[mild sentinel]

Maybe big libc would have better luck if they actually made a good libc

[bronze nexus]

Just make a custom libc, duh

[hearty fulcrum]

libc is for the weak
real men use raw syscalls

[mild sentinel]

Implement Syscalls via page faulting at a canary address for a true challenge

[bronze nexus]

lmao

[bright knoll]

make the address determine the syscall number

and not in the boring oh canary + 1 = syscall 1

no make it random

[mild sentinel]

SASLR

[marsh sparrow]

You can already compare gcc perf on linux-mlibc vs any linux disteo with glibc

[opal lotus]

W

[wraith surge]

this will cause you a lot of problems if you try to use libc++

[opal lotus]

good thing we don't do that cringe around here

[analog berry]

I suppose

[sharp carbon]

i decided to do this, and there's a significant difference
left = arch linux, right = linux-mlibc, both using the exact same vm config

[marsh sparrow]

Interesting

I wonder where this comes from

Can you test other programs as well?

[sharp carbon]

sure, what do you want me to test?

[marsh sparrow]

Maybe gcc

[sharp carbon]

what would be a good benchmark for that

[marsh sparrow]

Maybe compile something like gnu hello

Or mlibc itself

[grand shadow]

Seems like I should stop procrastinating and start profiling already

Ill keep saying this and keep procrastinating pls like scream at me if I dont

[marsh sparrow]

I wonder how we can profile mlibc

[analog berry]

why are llvm versions different

[marsh sparrow]

Ideally we'd use something like perf but iirc that is a pain to compile

[grand shadow]

I thought that came with binutils

Oh nvm thats gprof

Or gperf

[sharp carbon]

because arch packages a different version than linux-mlibc, but the difference between the two distros is too large to attribute it to that imo

[marsh sparrow]

And just compiling mlibc with gprof enabled probably won't work without massive do-not-instrument annotations

Yeah i agree, it's unlikely that llvm improved perf by a huge factor

within one release

Unless it's something like the mlibc version not using the same SIMD instruction set

[gritty shore]

valgrind

[sharp carbon]

given that the renderer strings both contain 256 bits i think the sets are the same

[gritty shore]

id say get perf working tbh

it's worth it

[marsh sparrow]

makes sense

[analog berry]

yeah 5x diff is too much

[marsh sparrow]

I wonder if there is a more lightweight sampling based profiler than perf

Maybe i can vibe code a statically linked one in rust

[gritty shore]

couldnt you try statically linking/compiling perf on your machine?

[marsh sparrow]

Probably if you can get the linux kernel build system to do that :^)

[errant zephyr]

whats the problem with perf?

you can get perf built against musl i think anyway

[marsh sparrow]

It is built as part of the linux kernel's build system and iirc doesn't support cross compilation

[gritty shore]

id be curious to see musl vs mlibc performance as well

[errant zephyr]

oh that sounds awesome (not)

[grand shadow]

LD_PRELOAD in something that sets up SIGPROF to run every once in a while

[errant zephyr]

the go way

(go's profiler does that)

[grand shadow]

Is it even any good

[gritty shore]

valgrind would probably be good enough to get a broad overview no?

instead of perf

I know it doesnt paint the whole picture because its an emulator

[errant zephyr]

for go? yes

[grand shadow]

Interesting

[errant zephyr]

surely you can set up a static musl sysroot and use that to build

[errant zephyr]

there is also samply

which may or may not work for you and which is written in rust and doesnt need to be built in tree

[marsh sparrow]

yeah, probably

samply looks interesting

[errant zephyr]

anyway here is a statically linked build of perf for aarch64

make -f Makefile.perf --no-print-directory -j8 O=  CC='zig cc -target aarch64-linux-musl -Wno-gnu-variable-sized-type-not-at-end -Wno-uninitialized -fno-sanitize=undefined' CXX='zig c++ -target aarch64-linux-musl -Wno-gnu-variable-sized-type-not-at-end -fno-sanitize=undefined' all NO_LIBTRACEEVENT=1 NO_LIBELF=1 NO_BACKTRACE=1 perf```

and a patch

[marsh sparrow]

$ ./target/debug/vibeperf /usr/bin/ls
Cargo.lock  Cargo.toml    src  target  test  vibeperf.out
$ cat vibeperf.out 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0x15844
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0x14317
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0x22f22
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0x7af2
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0xe130
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0x9272
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0xa094
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 0x1f4ad
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6 0x28020
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6 0x1669ae
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6 0x164426
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6 0xa33c8

[marsh sparrow]

:^)

[errant zephyr]

so in the same amount of time i got most of the real thing working 🙃

obv missing debuginfo etc but like

[marsh sparrow]

yeah, proper perf is obviously better

why are you using zig to compile lol

doesn't clang work?

[errant zephyr]

so that i can make a static binary?

[errant zephyr]

if i had a sysroot yes, but i dont have one

[gritty shore]

Lol why zig

[errant zephyr]

so that you get a static binary? idk whats so complicated about that

zig cc is the easiest way to do that

[gritty shore]

ah because it ships musl?

[robust geyser]

"why use a good cross compiler?"

[marsh sparrow]

the code quality is definitely a bit questionable, particularly around the use of unsafe :^)

[formal patio]

one obv bottleneck is printf/scanf code in mlibc I'd guess

I think the shader emitting/parsing could be sped up with some work

but I'd rather focus on getting it to be entirely correct + building out our testsuite to validate that first

[sharp carbon]

well apparently mlibc is being built in debug mode which definitely doesn't help https://github.com/managarm/linux-mlibc/blob/6dcd0d591b02acf6074f50db7b583e9d0f1ffd7b/bootstrap.yml#L335

as in -O0

i recompiled it with -O2 and now it's 1.6k FPS

so still a big difference but not as big as before

[marsh sparrow]

CC @prime juniper

[analog berry]

what if O3+LTO

[sharp carbon]

compilation failure

[493/498] Linking target ld-linux-mlibc.so
FAILED: ld-linux-mlibc.so 
x86_64-linux-mlibc-g++  -o ld-linux-mlibc.so ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_gcc_stack_protector.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_gcc_guard-abi.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_allocator.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_debug.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_ensure.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_essential.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_inline-emitter.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_frigg.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_internal_generic_ubsan.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_rtld_generic_main.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_rtld_generic_linker.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_rtld_x86_64_runtime.S.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/sysdeps_linux_x86_64_arch-syscall.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/sysdeps_linux_generic_sysdeps.cpp.o ld-linux-mlibc.so.p/options_rtld_x86_64_entry.S.o -flto -Wl,--as-needed -Wl,--no-undefined -Wl,-O1 -shared -fPIC -Wl,-soname,ld-linux-mlibc.so -nostdlib /var/lib/managarm-buildenv/build/tools/bootstrap-system-gcc/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-mlibc/14.2.0/libgcc.a
/var/lib/managarm-buildenv/build/tools/bootstrap-system-gcc/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-mlibc/14.2.0/../../../../x86_64-linux-mlibc/bin/ld: /tmp/ccgZv29Z.ltrans0.ltrans.o: in function `allocateTcb()':
<artificial>:(.text+0x2f69): undefined reference to `memset'
collect2: error: ld returned 1 exit status```

lto doesn't like libraries that define mem* ime

[analog berry]

damn

[errant zephyr]

wtf

[grand shadow]

I think the ~2.x difference was what fishix reported when switching between mlibc and glibc