Fix pet companions.

[sinful willow]

Now it's "rng paywall"

[upbeat lily]

literally all mmos are cheatable and still have trading...

[tall oar]

Let's not forget about enabling RMT

[amber stream]

"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. "

[upbeat wharf]

jajjsahsajajshjhajja

[amber stream]

I have a bit of hope

[upbeat wharf]

i had 4 hours ago

[signal burrow]

You must be new here

[amber stream]

Why?

[signal burrow]

LavaFlame2.

[upbeat wharf]

now I see that he just want us to forget about this and let the whales keep buying

maybe he does something, maybe he doesn't

[upbeat lily]

could probrably code inject a Dot, and enable it to be tradable

[amber stream]

Yeah, no statements with this amount of outrage is not a good sign

[upbeat wharf]

but he just wanted to make easy money now that idleon was a good game with a lot of active players

[sinful willow]

Dw the outrage will disappear after the post gets deleted

[upbeat lily]

I mean come on, even people code inject their bans to be unbanned

[signal burrow]

Literally exactly what's gonna happen

[amber stream]

Dang, did not realize the game was this yank

[sinful willow]

That happens when a non-coder tries to do everything himself

[nocturne pagoda]

we won't let the outrage die

[upbeat lily]

such a shame as ive been playing this for years

[modest zenith]

210 negitive steam reviews now!! wow!!

[signal burrow]

Careful Pjesus will freak out at you if you talk like that

[upbeat lily]

he just keeps adding to a foundation thats flawed

concept, art, gameplay is all brilliant

[nocturne pagoda]

Trust me with the outrage and the riot, I'm French, it's in my genes

[upbeat lily]

but refuses to code it properly

[sinful willow]

Yeah I like pixel art and sprites in general, and Lava's are generally good

But he said himself he's not a seasoned game dev or an expert on public relations

And it shows

[upbeat lily]

And when youre game becomes this big, you bring someone in

[tall oar]

His transparency was something to behold, but now it

[upbeat lily]

to help handle it

[sinful willow]

If you could get away with one or two mechanics per world, once you reach this point then everything starts falling apart

[tall oar]

Oh accidental enter press lmao

[tall oar]

But now it's just stupid

[amber stream]

This exactly, transparency is the key issue\

[sinful willow]

Ego and grandeur and things like that

[upbeat wharf]

Its lava idea probably

[upbeat lily]

the only reason he hired translators, is because the cost/benefits was astronomical as the audience he can reach.. Which again was a money grab

[sinful willow]

It worked with the sailing incident didn't it

[upbeat wharf]

he will then post a sorry message and pretend like anything happened

[upbeat wharf]

ofc

[upbeat lily]

He wont say hes sorry

[upbeat wharf]

i mean, it was a bit different

[sinful willow]

I still believe that hiring a small team to code for him and do public relations and stuff

Would make the game grow 10x as much and in a positive way

[upbeat wharf]

but still his bad, he can't just say the bad comments are haters and exploiters

[amber stream]

Was not around during the sailing incident, what exactly happened, I only know it was a dupe bug

[sinful willow]

Basically he said "it's not my fault you're the ones who were wrong"

[upbeat wharf]

yea, but the problem is on his decisiont, not in the game code itself

[amber stream]

Wait, how does that work?!? I thought is was a bug

[ancient terrace]

i got a ram

[upbeat lily]

He needs to transfer this game to a 64bit system in full and have someone fix its inefficiencies and spaghetti

[tall oar]

Hiring a team directly translates to needing more funding

So hey, more tactics to squeeze money ig

[sinful willow]

He has plenty of funding.

And with a better game, people would spend more gladly

I'm not wasting money on a jenga tower that's falling apart

[upbeat wharf]

yea, i dont think he needs more

today he made at least 10000$ 100%

[tall oar]

Certainly more than that

[upbeat lily]

without a doubt

[sinful willow]

Much more than that

[tall oar]

Some people have already squeezed more than 300$ for Doots

If not more

[sinful willow]

There are plenty of people who paid 2k and didn't get it

[upbeat wharf]

a single developer needs 10000$ a day to keep a game without stupid gachas? I don't think so

[agile ruin]

kidding? for SURE 100k's ++

[amber stream]

But alienating the players is gonna reduce the recurring income, i would assume

[agile ruin]

a dude printed a steam recipe of 480 eur total

[upbeat wharf]

yea, i've seen at least 10 persons who bought a lot to get doot

[upbeat wharf]

i don't think so

he will destroy the idleon community, but he probably won't care until money stops coming

then he will start giving gems and doing lots of free things again

and then he will do the same

[amber stream]

Ya think?

I guess I am more optimistic (maybe naive)?

[upbeat wharf]

he did it with IS, and he is starting to do the same here

[tall oar]

It won't

[signal burrow]

I just cant wait for the most tone deaf developer announcement from this

[upbeat yoke]

well have to see with his response what the long lasting effects of this will be

[amber stream]

IS?

[upbeat wharf]

I had hope that he won't start doing this things, but the hope is lost when he starts

[agile ruin]

idle skilling

[tall oar]

Many many sources will tell you that a game makes 99% of it's income through a small fraction of the top spenders

[signal burrow]

80/20 etc etc

[tall oar]

Yeah

Something around that sort

[upbeat wharf]

yea, maybe he makes now a free pet for day and everything is solved

[signal burrow]

It will still take you 2/3rds of a year to get doot, oh wait he rotates every 10 weeks.

[tall oar]

I'm still holding out to that tiny almost-nonexistant hope that this is just a stupid out-of-season April Fool's joke and it will all be gone the moment I wake up tomorrow

[upbeat wharf]

well, it depends on the type of game

diablo for example makes 99% from whales

[sinful willow]

"Yeah just shut it if you don't like it stop playing that's what I thought"

[upbeat wharf]

casual games makes 99% from small 5 or 10 $ purchases

[tall oar]

I'm legit just gonna say "deal" and leave

[signal burrow]

It's pretty normal monetization where 80% of your income comes from 20% of your playerbase and 80% of that pile comes from the top 20% within it

[upbeat wharf]

yea, but according to his reaction the last hours, I think he will just ignore this

[ornate dust]

Idk if idleon can be considered a casual game though it is an mmo with most players being allured by the f2p aspect

[tall oar]

The singular answer we got from him speaks more than we need to know

[sinful willow]

April's fools that people spent hundreds if not thousands of dollars on?

[upbeat wharf]

i think idleon got more from casual until this update

because there wasn't really a lot to buy

[cunning nest]

might as well reinstall that nexon title

[upbeat wharf]

spamming time candies was not worth

[sinful willow]

You can't even use time candies either way

W5 has its own premium time currency

[upbeat wharf]

now he will get from whales that wants doot

[ornate dust]

I mean that's true long term players eventually get auto-loot minimum i presume

[sinful willow]

Same for W4

[scenic magnet]

how can i get a refund for 5k hours of playtime

[upbeat wharf]

yea

[sinful willow]

Auto-loot has become a must after elites

And I hate that

[upbeat wharf]

i was thinking on buying autoloot when it comes back on rotation, but now i don't think I have any reason

we will get nothing spamming messages or bad reviews, but at least let's hope we make the most noise possible

[twilit scaffold]

Asking for a friend too... https://i.imgur.com/QqAQ5LM.png

[signal burrow]

Wait, autoloot isn't always available?

[scenic magnet]

5 bucks

[amber stream]

And that is fine, because paying 5 bucks in a free game is reasonable, but not 300 for a 50/50

[signal burrow]

Yeah but what did he mean about rotation lol

[upbeat wharf]

no?

if it's always available I don't know where it is

[ornate dust]

I think it's offered like a gem pack

[upbeat wharf]

not even a 50/50 hahhhsahaha

[vernal walrus]

It is, you buy it from the side menu

[upbeat wharf]

ooh

[signal burrow]

Usually right here

[upbeat wharf]

ooooooooh

[amber stream]

sadge

[upbeat wharf]

i thought i have to wait until it comes in the gem shop

[sinful willow]

I was thinking of buying autoloot after elites were first released

Then I kept waiting and waiting, eventually a friend gifted me autoloot

[signal burrow]

The fact that autoloot isn't just baked into the game tells you a lot about lava

[sinful willow]

And now I feel bad because I spent money on this game

[upbeat wharf]

someone calculated it and you need like 1700$ to get a good chance

[signal burrow]

especially with like, divine knight, bubo, es, etc

[burnt spindle]

Be sure to leave a review reflecting your honest opinions and don't forget to add some user tags to the game so new people know what type of game this really is

[novel pewter]

there are alot of things that make other features redundant unfortunatly

[ancient terrace]

I love king doot
He has king foot
He gave me pics
I want to throw lava bricks

[vital cave]

Unlocked new pet and new high level, rolled high twice, each one higher than the previous (65.5k)

[upbeat wharf]

700 for a 90% XD

[upbeat wharf]

XDD

[upbeat wharf]

now think that doesn't matter because doot and the second pet makes you get a lot more 🤣

[sinful willow]

We've done it

[upbeat wharf]

really???

let's fking go!!

[vital cave]

Eh still though, one of the few mechanics in the game that is a grind fest to top out on.

[signal burrow]

I wanna see this game get inspected by one of those anti gambling-in-videogames EU countries

[upbeat wharf]

yea i know

[rain berry]

Did he delete a future content blog message?

I feel like there was one there but I dint see it anymore

[upbeat wharf]

mmmm not sure

[rain berry]

Could be overthinking, idek what would've been there just feel like something was posted since the end of spring event

[upbeat wharf]

I think it was the stream alert?

[vital cave]

Also hope one of his language exports wasn't China, because they have a pity system requirement in their gacha laws.

[upbeat wharf]

hahahahah

genshin had to implement that because half of their players are from china

[signal burrow]

lol

[upbeat wharf]

hahsahashahaha

[sinful willow]

This guy spent money and got doot

[upbeat wharf]

XDDDD

[lyric otter]

"im having fun so everyone else's complaints are invalid"

[sinful willow]

"I'm the lucky 0.28% so the remaining 99.72% is untrue"

[signal burrow]

Bro doesn't know leaderboards exist lol

[tall oar]

"This issue doesn't affect me so obviously it doesn't affect anybody else"

[lyric otter]

leaderboards aside

[sinful willow]

Leaderboards are already fucked by cheaters accounts

[nocturne pagoda]

he'll change his review when second rota will come and he'll get shafted by rng

[lyric otter]

its not hard to understand that people want to get things in the game, and the path to doot could be infinifty money

[sinful willow]

Nah just spend more money

[upbeat wharf]

there is a lot of people that thinks that a game is only p2w if it has pvp

[lyric otter]

like if doot was like 20-30$ worth of green gems MAX, id be like "sure, fine."

[vital cave]

The fact the Lava hasn't really addressed the situation yet is pretty bad to be honest.

[simple sierra]

Single player game

[upbeat wharf]

it doesn't even need to have relation with leaderboards

if I just want to compare with a friend

[tall oar]

His singular answer gives enough insight already IMO

[naive summit]

Im a huge fan of this game but any game who create a paid currency only is a no no for me.. Just sell pets for a big amount of gem instead

[lyric otter]

The issue is people found ways to cheat gems, apparently

I'd rather if he's going to introduce a new currency to get around that, that he just prices shit reasonably

[vital cave]

Yeah because people totally won't find a way to exploit the game and sell doots for real world trading currency.

[prime pike]

Well somethings happening given that the post has been deleted about pets

[rain berry]

?

[vital cave]

Still there.

[lyric otter]

like Lava says he's this generous dev and he's not a greedy big dev, but idleon sure feels like it has mobile game pricing sometimes

but all the gem stuff is priced kind of not great

[prime pike]

Not that one the one in future content

[lyric otter]

40$ for like 40 pulls and you might not even get everything

[scenic magnet]

its never been a 10th of this bad.

[lyric otter]

Lab Chips were kinda ehhhh

[scenic magnet]

i was absolutely happy to look for the next bundle to buy

[lyric otter]

at least you could buy them for resources, but the rotation stuff wasn't great

[scenic magnet]

because it was nice and small and not rng... and yeah chips you could wait out

im still waiting on more chips

[upbeat wharf]

yea chips were boring and everything

[lyric otter]

like you dont play one week, miss out on choco chip, and kinda are screwed for however long it takes to show up again

[upbeat wharf]

but it felt fair

[scenic magnet]

and thats fine, not doot bonus level god tier supersaiyan completely gamebreaking power levels for whale wallet levels of spending

[lyric otter]

Lab gems at least had a knockout system

[upbeat wharf]

you couldget all free with 4 or 5 months

[scenic magnet]

you should be able to log in for 2 minutes once a week

[lyric otter]

if free pull pets are a knockout, I think that'd be a lot more fair, but I can't imagine they will be cause that would invalidate the RMT

[scenic magnet]

and we have spreadsheets to show you what gem/chip shows up when

[upbeat wharf]

with pets you need 3 years to get one of the rotating rares

[sinful willow]

So guys how's it going

[nocturne pagoda]

that's quite the dive

[upbeat wharf]

can we make the overall reviews become not very positives?

[tall oar]

Way too many reviews for that to happen

[lyric otter]

12k total reivews yeah, but 864 recent

[upbeat wharf]

it is starting to become visible in the overall reviews

[tall oar]

Can we get much higher

[sinful willow]

The one piece

[tall oar]

It's real

[vital cave]

He's been asking for positive reviews almost every update, but this time around I think he's going to see more reds than blues each update until he fixes it somehow.

[upbeat wharf]

how can I tag the game as gambling?

[sinful willow]

Store page, +

[upbeat wharf]

what???

[nocturne pagoda]

doot tier : unlocking a portal unlocks it for all of your characters 🤓

[leaden haven]

well suppose i'll go to bed, hopefully lava responds or does something to this

[signal burrow]

The thing is he can't fundamentally change the companion perks unless he also refunds sooo

Otherwise steam will give people refunds for bait/switch

[ocean egret]

He’s trapped

[sinful willow]

Doot tier: you can now trade coins to gems 1:1 rate (not like gems are worth anything anymore you can just cheat them in just buy my new and improved gems 2)

[nocturne pagoda]

sleep and pray that everything is better tomorrow

[tall oar]

gomm1 to gomm2

[vital cave]

Gambling is the 11th most tagged tag now.

[upbeat wharf]

maybe this is just the aprils fools late joke???

[tall oar]

I wish

[obsidian lance]

wish he would say something to address it

[sinful willow]

Petition to add "comedy" as well

[flat walrus]

3 suggestions to improve system

1. Make free pets daily instead of weekly
2. Allow blue gem conversion to green gems
3. Add a merge system to allow you to merge excess pets to improved tiers of pets like merge 2 commons to an uncommon.

[upbeat wharf]

gambling added

and also pay to win

[tall oar]

Now 10th

[sinful willow]

The conversion will never happen. Green gems have been added because lava said "kekw gems are client side so here's the new paid gems"

[upbeat wharf]

no hahaha, why you ask? idk, they are not secure

[tall oar]

Then make pets bought with blue gems untradeable, simple as that

[flint meadow]

then why don't they stay on 1 device then

[tall oar]

That's just super stupid

Frick it

[flint meadow]

imagine if lava's lying to make us not flame him for this terrible update

[sinful willow]

I'm not the dev, no need to tell me lol

[obsidian lance]

lava goes on vacation --> sees hes not making enough money --> goes from posting future content all the time to nothing --> this feaautre comes out. he knew this back lash was comming for it. he didnt care. hes sponging what moeny he can then ditching i bet

[simple sierra]

It's cause people cheat blue gems in

So we get bent over

Very lava move to punish the majority for the minority

[granite citrus]

Except who cheats in blue gems and then plays legit

[flint meadow]

howbout no trading

[upbeat wharf]

until they cheat green gems??

because of some spaghetti code?

[flint meadow]

[sinful willow]

Nah dw green gems are server side so 100% safe just like the rest of his coding

[flat walrus]

If they cheat blue gems what’s not to say they can’t cheat in green?

[upbeat wharf]

because he cant make them secure?

[flat walrus]

that decision is confusing as heck

[obsidian lance]

the trading is the worst excuse in this. becasue you need to pull so many time for the 1 rare one no one will ever pull after getting have 100 of the others and not care

[nocturne pagoda]

it's gonna happen extremely soon IMO

[upbeat wharf]

because he has to add the stupid trading thing????

[simple sierra]

Cause green gem amounts are checked with the server everytime they change

Unlike blue

[granite citrus]

anyways cheaters are already at the top of the leaderboards again, so obviously green gems didn't do anything

[upbeat wharf]

because he has to make the game seem a multiplayer??

[simple sierra]

So any discrepancy is noticed immediately

[upbeat wharf]

because dungeons are bad and he makes nothing with them???????

[flint meadow]

make blue gems server side

problem solved

[nocturne pagoda]

trading makes it so I don't need to code a pity, just trade the one you need 🤓 👆

[obsidian lance]

greem or blue gems is not the core problem with how this game feature was built

[granite citrus]

who's trading a doot for... a mushroom again?

[leaden haven]

if green gems can be server side, why cant blue be??

[granite citrus]

and you can't even trade unless you pay

[upbeat wharf]

xD, its just disgusting

[flint meadow]

your mom

[granite citrus]

damn my mom whaled on idleon

[upbeat wharf]

that would be sad

[nocturne pagoda]

wyd for people with 1M blue gems

[obsidian lance]

who ready so real money trading where people figure out how to cheat pull doot and sell him for cash in the 'trading" system

[tall oar]

That requires work 💀

[sinful willow]

You can't trade free pets either way so it's just a flawed design

[nocturne pagoda]

indeed but it was parody :c

[tall oar]

Would still be flawed design with free pets being tradeable since you could just spamcreate new accounts, roll for pets and then trade Doot (or anything else) if you got anything valuable

[upbeat wharf]

sure, they will find a way to make free tradeable rolls, or to get green gems

[lyric otter]

Trading just means people who pay are gonna get hacked

and noobs gonna get scammed

[upbeat wharf]

bruh i hope not

[lyric otter]

what do you mean you hope not? there's no 2fa

[nocturne pagoda]

NGL I felt the change of tone after the gold bar "incident"

[upbeat wharf]

that would mean that spaghetti code is really spaghetti

[flat walrus]

Only way I see a fix to this is to delete update. It never happened. Don’t worry

[nocturne pagoda]

he started emphasizing "free" in, everything

I think he burnt out from it

[tall oar]

That doesn't excuse the bullshit that is happening right now

[nocturne pagoda]

and wants out

[nocturne pagoda]

absolutely not

[upbeat wharf]

burnt out from what, people is free so give bad reviews for a bug

[flint meadow]

lava was bought by EA

[upbeat wharf]

if they lie it's another thing...

[leaden haven]

i'm confused at what the filter is here

[nocturne pagoda]

I'm not finding him excuses I'm just saying that we might have seen it coming

[upbeat wharf]

idk

[nocturne pagoda]

ngl it makes me sad af

[tall oar]

He could've abandoned it in it's current state without making it painstakingly obvious through this mechanic

Everyone here is either sad or rightfully pissed

[upbeat wharf]

i really thought that he was not dying from hunger and he didn't need to make 10000$ with a shit of update

[nocturne pagoda]

yes but whales whaled

[upbeat wharf]

i'm both...

[nocturne pagoda]

he probnably made way more than that on this update

[leaden haven]

i'm sad for the direction the game is going

[upbeat wharf]

sure, but i won't say any huge number just to secure

[tall oar]

Oh for sure, he certainly got at least 6 figures in the past hours from that update

[flat walrus]

I feel bad for the people spending tons of money for this gacha. Especially for the ones that aren’t getting doot which is most of them

[obsidian lance]

went down hill in world 4. the insane system that is whale fodder chips in lab never been addressed, horrible rng for the shovel but at least theres no real money tided to it jsut slows your progress unless your luckly for months at a time, valentines boxes, and now this.

[upbeat wharf]

yeah, it's just sad because they loved this game and some thought it was a good idea to buy

[mighty vessel]

It already went that way for a long time now tho lol

[rain berry]

Just looked in the bug reports and apparently you can get locked out of white companions, imagine spending money to get some then, not getting one of the common companions, and actually being locked out of it

[upbeat wharf]

autoloot was the first step

[nocturne pagoda]

I don't, people HAVE to learn to vote with their wallets and hold on before splurging

[upbeat wharf]

remember that pets were supposed to be like an autoloot XD

[upbeat wharf]

it's their choice

and sure they thought there was a pity with the chance upgrader

[obsidian lance]

on his side he made the bonus account wide so you dont need to farm 10 doots

[tall oar]

I don't really have issues with the monetising as much as the actual execution of that monetisation
Seriously, sell Doot's benefits for 200$ I don't care, but don't hide it behind RNG mechanics like this - I'd rather pay once and get something for sure and be done with it. People would still flock and buy the guy

[upbeat wharf]

then they see that the price scales too so the bonus is very small...

[flat walrus]

Yeah chip system is annoying it’s basically this system at a tinier scale

[nocturne pagoda]

honestly I'm fine with autoloot, by the time it's actually useful you got enough playtime for what those 5 bucks are worth

[upbeat wharf]

yea, i also think that

but it was the first "only paying real money" thing

[nocturne pagoda]

yeah true

[upbeat wharf]

now he comes with this bullshit of pets

the next is going to pay to unlock worlds

[obsidian lance]

next boss 2 bucks a key

[tall oar]

Yo stop don't give him ideas

[flint meadow]

imagine players past 10 require money

[nocturne pagoda]

nah but fr a scary part is w6 balancing if bonuses are kept the same

[upbeat wharf]

also have in mind that this will mark a huge difference between p2w and f2p, so balancing worlds to be hard for p2w but not impossible for f2p will be a challenge

[upbeat wharf]

hahaha exactly

[obsidian lance]

i feel sorry for new people the wierd scaling when your not here for each stage of the insane power get must be wierd and if rifts are end game does the mean all those bonus are ignored in balancing next world/

[nocturne pagoda]

balance it around people having those op bonuses and make it a nightmare for those that dont ? Or make it the same as before and whales push w6 in 5 hours ?

[granite citrus]

I mean one option makes more money

[nocturne pagoda]

true

[upbeat wharf]

sad truth

[granite citrus]

so this basically ruins the game forever and always for f2p players and there's no incentive for him to ever fix it

[lone jetty]

that would not be the problem. It would be a problem, if you pay 20$ for a 2% chance of getting the new world

[obsidian lance]

also rmeember when i spent time making funny charaters and world buidling and not jsut making another empty world to kill threw?

[upbeat wharf]

if he doesn't fix this pets thing, yes

[tall oar]

Remember folks, Nightmare Kattlekruk was supposed to have 250B health

[upbeat wharf]

ahahahahahsah

[flint meadow]

ez

[nocturne pagoda]

honestly it's sad, the game is a big part of my daily routine nowadays, if it dies like this it'd be a shame

[simple sierra]

Oneshottable

[flint meadow]

im not a whale either

[granite citrus]

You need a pet guide to take you to world 6 milord

[upbeat wharf]

the hell is kattlekruk?

[tall oar]

W5 Boss

[flint meadow]

w5 boss

[upbeat wharf]

if its the w5 boss, i dont think 250B for nightmare is anything

[nocturne pagoda]

ezpz just hit harder 4Head

[tall oar]

That's the point, you guys were discussing balancing

[upbeat wharf]

there is people with 100T damage before this update...

[tall oar]

Not even Lava expected such ridiculous power creep

[frozen scaffold]

hmm when does it change to the next lower raiting from mixed ?

[upbeat wharf]

not they will have 10Q

[sinful willow]

How didn't he expect it if he's the one who made it

[upbeat wharf]

someones even more

[tall oar]

95 - 99% : Overhwelmingly Positive
94 - 80% : Very Positive
80 - 99% + few reviews: Positive
70 - 79% : Mostly Positive
40 - 69% : Mixed
20? - 39% : Mostly Negative
0 - 39% + few reviews: Negative
0 - 19% : Very Negative
0 - 19% + many reviews: Overwhelmingly Negative

[sinful willow]

Lava: gives players 100k% scaling damage
Also Lava: wow I didn't expect this surprised pikachu face

[tall oar]

Copied this from a random article

[nocturne pagoda]

LUL

[upbeat wharf]

what we said, if he makes the boss have 250B it's completely free for p2w and endgamers, if he makes it a lot more its impossible for normal players

[tall oar]

He'd have to make that thing's health go up to in Qs for that to be challenging

If not QQs

[upbeat wharf]

we did it?!?!

[sinful willow]

Gambling is 7th

[upbeat wharf]

lets go

keep going

[sinful willow]

You have to check the overall status, those show your tags first

[nocturne pagoda]

stonks

[tall oar]

I already did my part

[upbeat wharf]

I see it fifth

[tall oar]

Yo it's 4th

[flat walrus]

I need to tag it as gambling tell me how I tag it

[tall oar]

See the + at the end?

Click it

[vital cave]

Must not be in order of most tags, because it's 7th on my drop-down list.

[flat walrus]

Ok thanks

[upbeat wharf]

well, before this update not even in the top

[flat walrus]

I’ll do my part

[tall oar]

Refresh your pages folks

[burnt spindle]

before this update it wasnt even in top 15 lmao

[vital cave]

Now it shows 4th spot on mine.

[tall oar]

Remember folks a negative review goes a long way as well

[simple sierra]

4th on a logged out page too

[tall oar]

Yep, then it's actually 4th

[flat walrus]

Ok I tagged it as gambling lol

[flat walrus]

I feel like I contributed to a great cause

[vital cave]

Sad part is, $50 in local provincial 50/50 firefighter draw is probably better gambling odds than Doot.

[brazen shore]

Damn

[flat walrus]

Lol

[upbeat wharf]

ahahahh

[vital cave]

I mean assuming everyone paid $50/100 tickets, that's still a 1/20,000 chance of taking home over $400k.

[burnt snow]

Its a bad update,
In other gacha games atleast you can save premium currency to get the char you want

But this is not we have to use our free draw and they is no saving to get the pet we want

[brazen shore]

This is the only time I'll ever respect raid shadow legends for having better gacha than idleon

I feel disgusted to say that

[brazen shore]

Lmao

[vital cave]

Some people spent like $400 on this update, so they would've had 8/20,000 or 1/2500 chance of taking home over $400k lol

[vital cave]

Come on, Raid is totally legit. You can play the entire game for free

Sad part is other than legendary heroes, you actually benefit in that game by sinking in time vs spending hundreds of $$$

Gambling is now #2 on the dropdown list.

[sinful willow]

I'm going to bed now since it's late

I hope to wake up to something interesting

[flat walrus]

Good night gambling should be hopefully be #1 when you wake up

[brazen shore]

Late for me too, sleep time

Hope interesting things happen

[upbeat wharf]

2:19 here

probably going to sleep too

[brazen shore]

I'm 1 hour different

Sleep is on the cards

[upbeat wharf]

hope lava did something when I come back...

[brazen shore]

Watch the only thing he will do is delete this thread and sweep it under the rug then say how awesome he is as a dev

And complain he's being bullied

I'll gamble on it

[frozen scaffold]

probably blame us for calling out bs

[vital cave]

I know a lot of people are trolling in suggestions but this is a legitimate issue once trading goes live. #player-suggestions message

[obsidian lance]

there are horrible odds to get stuff like the arcade pickle vial, red hat and stuff

[tall oar]

I see what you did there and I love you for that

[brazen shore]

At least you can earn the balls with gems over time

And earn the balls regularly

And via w2 skull

[vital cave]

And it now is #1 tag

[paper crow]

I'll really hope if he needs more income stream. Just making more skin to sell for. I'm sure people will buy it.

[brazen shore]

Nice before I even got to sleep

[random lagoon]

@queen iron still no response to all the people that are talking ?

[obsidian lance]

this issue is how powerful he made doot. this should be a rift reward not an rng. but if he didnt make the buff game changing whale wouldnt drop 1000's he didnt even have the decenticy to add pet pulls to killroy, give you a way to earn them in game, any kind of pity to cap the price

[simple sierra]

1st is gambling

[tall oar]

GG folks

[paper crow]

Making this complete pw2. I've spend roughly $500 on this game already and I felt disugsted by this update.

I dont' mind paying for custamtic stuff in game to look cooler

[hearty fern]

i am a gambling addict, was able to control it by getting help and quitting all gatcha games and this update made me fall back into my addiction 👍

[obsidian lance]

and he wants the whale to do this every 3 months so even if you think hell only do 3-4 diffrent big prizes how broken will that be for the f2p to p2w

[brazen shore]

Totally going against his original statements that got me into this game

They all appear to be just made up

[leaden haven]

yeah...

[brazen shore]

I regret spending a few hundred on this game given how it's degraded

I'm not angry, just, depressed

[leaden haven]

i feel you there.

[paper crow]

to add a new currency is just.... man. Be low key when asking player to spend money. This is just point blank, "give me money to exchange for stats".

[brazen shore]

"no matter how much you play you will never reach the level of a person who pays unless you essentially win the lottery, get screwed, enjoy your FOMO"

[vital cave]

Guess we'll find out.

[peak hare]

how will lava ever fix pet companions without pissing off the whales

[lyric otter]

I think it's less the new currency and more just how much you should expect to need to spend (or how much luck you need for f2p)

[rare mist]

frustrated that of all the times to have uncharacteristically good luck with RNG it's for this
rrreally hoping we see something change ASAP

[leaden haven]

there are lots of solutions, like refunding them straight with blue gems and adding new shop items.

[lyric otter]

if f2p pets give no dupes, that'd be fair
But that 100% would piss of the whales and make people not want to spend

[brazen shore]

Again, easy solution which he probably won't implement. Green gems equal tradeable pets, unlimited spend. Blue gems, limited to a few a day, untradeable.

It's a room temperature iq solution

[peak hare]

i feel like the best solution is make a shit ton of doot rarity pets and then give them to the whales who spent hundreds

[tall oar]

The lack of any statement is what pisses me off currently

[brazen shore]

Whales get to trade and sell, blue gems people don't

[paper crow]

I'm fine paying $20 for a really cool limited time hat custom. Not interested in paying for game mechanics purely just money for stats.

[leaden haven]

^

[brazen shore]

It's essentially diablo immortal

[tall oar]

At least acknowledge that you're doing something

And if you don't wanna change anything with the system, say it

Putting everyone in a silent chamber like this is only going to deepen our anger / disappointment even further

[brazen shore]

Gems gained from free currency are untradeable, gems paid for are tradeable. Blizzard are scum but at least they give gems

Even if not tradeable

[novel pewter]

biggest problem is there is no communication inbetween players and lava until everything is said and done

[leaden haven]

i'm starting to wonder if there's even testers?

[brazen shore]

I once was a tester, I can confirm at one point they did exist... Not sure about now

These past few patches at least

There's a possibility they do

[tall oar]

I was about to ask "Were you paid for this"

[brazen shore]

No I received no payment, no gems

Just a chance to bug my account out like making a skill have negative exp

And worry whether I'd get it fixed by release

I quit out soon enough out of fear of permanently breaking my account during alpha lol

Due to no separate alpha account

[tall oar]

Oh, you did not have separate environments?

[lost ermine]

lol

[lyric otter]

Ive never tested but never been interested in testing for this reason... its such a glaringly obvious issue given how almost every big game has special test realms for this reason

from what I remember it lead to a lot of angst in the past since some testers would end up with a head start over other players cause sometimes stuff would be broken in positive ways

[signal burrow]

Poor Windows got muted

[tall oar]

Rip

Fought for a good cause

[twilit scaffold]

Wow, really...?

[mystic prawn]

why

[signal burrow]

Drama in genchat

[nocturne copper]

When lava will know what he does are breaking gameplay

[tall oar]

Lava is more than aware of what he's doing - His response and the removal of the "no p2w mechanics" bit on Steam proves that

[nocturne copper]

Because lots of people in here got muted

[tall oar]

I didn't for some reason, despite being super negative

I've no access to this channel, what is it?

[twilit scaffold]

I'd rather Lava refund everyone, clear everyone's pets, and rebalance the rates to be appropriate...

Don't think so

[exotic furnace]

He’ll never refund, dude, and you know it

[signal burrow]

Lol same

[exotic furnace]

It’s player suggestions btw

[tall oar]

Still don't have access to it despite picking the everything option

Oh well

[upbeat yoke]

why don't I have access?

[lyric otter]

Yeah, trading is going to create so many problems lol

[zenith cape]

we have a degen chat?

[tall oar]

Trading just incites RMT and potentially hacked accounts due to lack of 2FA

[rare mist]

gotta react in the readme channel to get that one I think

[tall oar]

But that's probably been mentioned hundreds of times at this point already

[signal burrow]

I can't wait to see pets on RMT websites where you have a 80% chance to get scammed, or you're buying a hax0red pet that gets rolled back but you're still out $

This is so braindead and absurd on so many levels it literally feels like a joke

[tall oar]

Windows did apparently

[signal burrow]

Windows got muted for some drama that I didn't really read I just saw the mute happen

I super can't wait to see lava's announcement on this so I can formally decide if I'm going to keep playing or not

[tall oar]

Yep, guess that's the best we can do at the moment

Until then though, not getting into the game, not making any purchases

Going to sleep now, have a wonderful day or night or whatever

Blame timezones

[nocturne copper]

I won't play anymore until he realises what he does wrong and change his attitude

[signal burrow]

Legit if Lava said "I'm sorry I saw dollar signs and it made my judgment turn to mush" I'd legit forgive it.

But he won't

[nocturne copper]

Game breaking features

[signal burrow]

it's gonna be some tone deaf I'm lava y'all are haters response

I see no way that Lava can save face here unless he straight up admits that he got blinded by $ and made an error in design. Anything short of that is just gonna translate to "I'll find some other way to scam y'all that isn't so obvious"

https://tenor.com/2bUI.gif

[nocturne copper]

Some of my friends say next update is red gems

[lyric otter]

next pet follower

[signal burrow]

Reviews are on the verge of dipping below 50%, maybe that's the milestone needed to summon the lord of dorritos

This is basically the best review

[nocturne copper]

[frozen scaffold]

big sadge

[tall oar]

Hands down the best review so far

[glad eagle]

its impossible for me to get the frog now.....

[signal burrow]

Lol account is forever stained better reroll

[signal burrow]

Hey on the plus side you now have almost a 1 in 120 chance to get doot, every week

Cya in 4 years

[mystic prawn]

what was the "similar happened in idle skilling" stuff all about? I never felt like you need to spend a dime in idle skilling unless you want to support the game

gem gains felt exponential in idle skilling

[signal burrow]

People had too much premium currency banked so Lava made a new currency to force people to 💳 . Then basically vanished and he cashed out

[tall oar]

Realms followed the same thing - New premium currency, wasn't obtainable for f2ps by any means, was used in a part of the game that was super gamebreaking for everything else

[signal burrow]

Which is partially why I think he's abandoning the game. Just cashing in his good will for a Lambo

Pulling an Afterlife

[tall oar]

Do you want me to incite more panic?

Everything listed here is done

[signal burrow]

I'm far from the only one who suspects it

There's no other way I can conceive him intentionally tanking all the good will he has, removing the "I won't scam you like some money hungry CEO" blurb on the steam wall

Tell me why he removed that

In any other understandable way

[frozen scaffold]

even if its a joke its way to far

those reviews wont come back

same as the good will aint

[signal burrow]

And if he thinks this is acceptable the next mega-pet in 10 weeks is going to be similarly stupid and another $1000

This is without a doubt a giant squeeze and the only thing speculative about it is why

I think he's jumping ship

[nocturne copper]

I think lava didn't want to make this game so he just post some game breaking features to get more money

[frozen scaffold]

gonan see what happens maybe i can get some paypal refunds if it really shuts down like that

[signal burrow]

Think about Lava's headspace. He removed the "I'm not some money hungry scammy CEO" blurb on the page so you know he knows what he's doing. And he SHOULD know the internet never forgets so it's not like nobody was gonna bring it up, and he did it anyway

Something is fucked

It REEKS of "I'm done with the game and I just wanna get whatever cash I can out of it"

[tacit bough]

OIC this is how the game should looks like lol

[nocturne copper]

Let me show you guys something

NEVER TRUST LAVA

[mystic prawn]

damn

[nocturne copper]

My friends got 10k views but lava say it won't count

[frozen scaffold]

cause sudden new lava rule

[upbeat lily]

yo

could u dm me the images

if they aren’t allowed here for some suspicous reason

[nocturne copper]

Because I didn't ask him can I post

That's pretty rude

Sorry

[upbeat lily]

i mean

i’m not gonna post them here

[nocturne copper]

Let me ask my friend

[hardy kite]

Yo, can I get the images too?

[upbeat lily]

ok why do you need them

[nocturne copper]

Wait my friends respond

[upbeat lily]

it’s grumblo black market deal no outsiders

[hardy kite]

Curiosity? xD

[upbeat lily]

so close to 500 yes

[nocturne copper]

I remove those Picture by myself

Until he replied i won't post for now

[upbeat lily]

aw shucks

[ancient terrace]

[nocturne copper]

Yo

You back

[ancient terrace]

mm yes

[tacit bough]

Welcome back

[ancient terrace]

thank the you

[modest zenith]

I hope if he fixes how pets work he will refund me my money or green gems back. And anyone else who bought them. I only got the gem pack. So I’m not to hurt. But would be nice.

[hardy kite]

if he does something I think it's only going to be increase the times you can claim a free pet

Or smth like that

[modest zenith]

Yeah but still then devalues the purchase and could of changed some peoples minds before buying. If it was like one a day or every 3 day I prob would not of bought anything this time.

[nocturne copper]

I really hope it can be without effects

[modest zenith]

I still didn’t get all the pets and didn’t the the best ones. 😦

[tacit bough]

7 days per claim and change to 1 day per claim. This is definitely a fraudulent for people to buy the green gem.

[vernal ledge]

all it needs is a pity system. a way of rerolling 3 commons into a green or an increased RNG chance with each purchase etc

[nocturne copper]

Free cool looking pet is nice

[hardy kite]

Giving people more tries is better than what people is currently asking for of nerfing Doots effect

[vernal ledge]

an uncapped literal opposite of a pity system where it costs more to pull as you go is pretty unethical

[lyric otter]

I think it needs to be deterministic.
It should not be an uncountable amount of pulls to get everything.

[frozen scaffold]

even oot had a pity system with dampe digs lol

[tacit bough]

Yup, someone here already said that in Japan. Capped is need. Otherwise it is illegal.

[modest zenith]

Yeah I think the effects are a little strong. But if we keep them they should have a leveling system. Like cards do. But use time playing with each bet equipped. And candy does not work to help time level them. Then we can work our way up to max lvl. Solve some problems. You can get all let’s now but you will need to pick what one to lvl up to max first.

[lyric otter]

like Doot bonus is insane, and the odds are like, less then 1:100 - so for a f2p, thats over 2 years of pulls. (Not to mention the plans of new pets)

[tacit bough]

And some place may restrict the chance can’t be lower than 1.

[green nexus]

Almost 500

[lyric otter]

making the pet system not purely cosmeitc is the biggest problem IMO

at least in the context of wanting gacha and trading

[tacit bough]

Rewards problem

[lyric otter]

Beating a dead horse but trading is going to be a shit show

people are going to scam newbies and people will have accounts stolen

[modest zenith]

Trading will be a mess and real money will be exchanged.

[frozen scaffold]

there is already a pet system in world 4 why not build uppon that

[mystic prawn]

rmt is gonna be a shitshow

[silver rover]

If i were him i would totes make a statement that it was supposed to be guaranteed in x pulls but that the code was borked(probably a complete lie) and that a fix is being pushed out to rectify it, give those who spent greens on it there greens back, and give the "guaranteed" pets out to those who passed the milestones and then give 1 pull a day and make sure that the pity number is exactly the amount of days for the rotation so that i could make the claim that even f2p players could get all for free

[frozen scaffold]

after shiny another breeding whisc is that stat

[lyric otter]

Literally everyone figured the pet followers was going to be based on that yeah

Im not going to hold lava to assumptions we make, but it feels real lame that this was spun out into a seperate system

if pet followers were just a small add-on to Breeding, like pay some gems to have a pet follow you, having a pet follow you has this fixed bonus (bonus is same for all pets)

[mystic prawn]

tomorrow when I wake up I will notice it was just a bad dream

[modest zenith]

Out of all this it kills me that he has not made a statement yet.

[lyric otter]

sorry only quick statements when players cheat

[upbeat lily]

bro is def waiting a few days

[frozen scaffold]

only statements when he loses money

[modest zenith]

Yeah true

[ancient terrace]

500 when

[lyric otter]

Probably needs time to think of a way out of this that makes people happy but doesnt screw over people who've already spent

[frozen scaffold]

gosh people im so disapointed so many used this bug for personal gains

[frozen scaffold]

and that keeps his money

[modest zenith]

But he fed us hard with the chest that he left in the game and was to lazy to fix. But when he does it. It’s ok

For a cash grab

[green nexus]

Just a few words would be fine,
"Sorry, will fix soon" would be good enough

[lyric otter]

what is there to fix?

[green nexus]

Everything

[lyric otter]

I mean, from his perspecitve

[mystic prawn]

its gonna be really hard to fix this

[vital oxide]

the sad part is right, there are already people that have dropped their home loans to get doot

[lyric otter]

People are mad, but they don't "need" doot

[tacit bough]

That’s why the problem of making things not that good and buff it, is less than, making things so good and nerf it.

[nocturne copper]

@upbeat lily sorry but my friend say no

[upbeat lily]

sad

[rough trench]

But guys, now we have 2 unlink for week

[lyric otter]

its funny cause I remember him talking about doing this many times in the past

[green nexus]

500

[lyric otter]

its funny - I already unlinked this week, but I dont have a 2nd unlink

gotta wait till reset

[tacit bough]

You mean nerfing things?

[ancient terrace]

yay 500

[lyric otter]

I mean starting with stuff underpowered and buffing

[mystic prawn]

gz

[lyric otter]

easier to go up then down

[tacit bough]

Yes

[vital oxide]

i think the idea of the companions are really cool, but their bonuses are bordering insanity, it should be on the level of cards and be a skill or something idk man

[ancient terrace]

that should fix the forest fire of pet companions

[lyric otter]

he's claimed to take that apporach but obvious misses the mark a bunch of times lol

Saying it again, companions would have made more sense as purely cosmetic
Trading is then based on what people like, not what has insane bonuses

[modest zenith]

At some point people’s damage will be so high the game can’t take it. Lol. Or he will have to make new worlds with such high HP it will kill all us normal people

[tacit bough]

Especially deal with money, it may get lawyer letter if things get nerf after a short period of release

[signal burrow]

Or just shrink the numbers

[atomic ingot]

he is hitting a completely different mark at this point the pets are ridiculously powerful, hope he didnt just give up 😦

[vital oxide]

shrink like wow did

[mystic prawn]

I wonder how the reviews are doing, while im sad about the direction we are headed, I would lie if I said I didn't like the drama

[lyric otter]

I feel like Doot, Slug and the Alch Bubble ones are really the only OP ones

[modest zenith]

Yeah but that might make the number people pissed. Haha I would be fine with that. Tho

[lyric otter]

everything else is kinda ehhh

[signal burrow]

53%

[tacit bough]

King doot problem

[ancient terrace]

frog is okay

[green nexus]

The damage spread between f2p and p2w is so big that it's either way too easy or way too hard for either one

[modest zenith]

Didn’t get either 😦

[paper crow]

I'm more concern about the direction of the game.

[silver rover]

Ram is sleeper god tier

[pure abyss]

Ppl would prob be fine with that update if not for the new currency, guess thats the worst thing

[lyric otter]

hell no it's not

[paper crow]

If gotcha is the direction this game is going towards. Then it's an end for me.

[lyric otter]

maybe some niche shit like having insane chopping

but TK storage covers most of what Ram is good for

[paper crow]

not fun anymore. Just pure p2w

[green nexus]

New currency + absolutely insane bonus

[tacit bough]

So king doot make you never go for division and lab anymore. It got all cover. Also the lab you are free to connect everything

[lyric otter]

plus I have so many TP potions and free map warps that going to town makes Ram really kind of meh
(Which is why Im kind of sad I pulled Ram for free - but at least its cute)

[modest zenith]

Wow. Just wow.

[lyric otter]

yeah, Doot means no micro managing lab or divinity

[frozen scaffold]

also 6x prints

[tacit bough]

10 people free + lots of bonus. Is that OP? Definitely

[lyric otter]

and a ton of really big bonuses

[silver rover]

Once every what is it 2k seconds? And thats only deposit, if i want to say do the rift and want to pass all gear its a godsend

[nocturne copper]

This is what King Doot gives (May have missed something):
Every char out of lab to do other things (This is so huge)
Every lab bonus activated
Every char sitting in Div
6x printer bonuses on everyone
Huge coin bonus (From Harriep)

• talent levels on everything (Arctis)
  +30% afk for all chars (Snake)
  Huge afk gains for all chars (Goharut minor)
  Div pearls on everyone + Skill exp (Flutterbis)
  2x More kills and damage bonus (Nobisect)
  Elephant bonus on everyone + class exp (Omni)

[frozen scaffold]

besides other insane afk and skill epx gains

[silver rover]

Like progression wise ram is meh, but for ease of use its godlike

[paper crow]

I'll treat that as a DLC if that happens. Still better than gotcha.

[modest zenith]

All my people are in lab but 2 of them. I would love that never in lab or Div pet. Lol

[nocturne copper]

Also you don't need to unlock the god

[paper crow]

The only thing i hate about this game previously is the chip system. Now we got the pets...

[tacit bough]

King doot here you go lol

[mystic prawn]

and how does this suggestion compare to some best suggestions when it comes to upvotes

[modest zenith]

Only if I had the $$$ to blow. Ha. Sadly I have a baby and that’s not going to fly with the wife. Ha

[tacit bough]

Chip is fine at least you still need to manage it. Although I hate managing it

[frozen scaffold]

all chips passive for all chars as next pet bonus ?

[mystic prawn]

saying "sadly I have a baby" also probably doesnt fly with the wife

[pure abyss]

How many crystals is spent on each try?

[paper crow]

There you go.

[modest zenith]

Very true. Either way she will kick my butt. Lol. Gg

[lyric otter]

100 per pull at the start, it goes up as you move up tiers, but so does the chances, it's weird.

[frozen scaffold]

first you create a problem than later you ad a system to remove that problem

[mystic prawn]

butt will be kicked no matter what you do, I guess it's better to invest in some good armor

[modest zenith]

Hahah agreed.

[frozen scaffold]

10 more active print slots per char and everybody can take evedybodies prints

i cant type to tired

he probably will be pissed and is so disapointed in us that we reacted so badly and unconstructive

[modest zenith]

I think he should poll his ideas first. Lol

[neat lodge]

i think should sell portal on gem shop

[ancient terrace]

what portal

[frozen scaffold]

world 6

[ancient terrace]

ah yes

[modest zenith]

Haha

[lyric otter]

₍₀.₂₈%₎

[frozen scaffold]

thats what i meant lol

of curse jus 0,3% chance

from hero to zero in a few hours

[ancient terrace]

Balanced eh?

[lyric otter]

lol right, adding the "all gods" bonus before all god are even in lol

didnt even think about that

[real karma]

Honestly, if we could get a luck tier past tier 5 it wouldn't be so bad. But if you spend $40 bucks your luck caps out and then you have to spend another $2,000 and hope you don't get bad rng. That's what's the worst. Even if you whale there's a cap to your odds......

[frozen scaffold]

with how it goes i doubt they get added any time soon

[lyric otter]

I stll think 40$ is already too much to spend to get all pets

I dont think luck tiers fix that

[frozen scaffold]

10 bucks with according low power

better no power

[lyric otter]

gacha and lootboxes will never not be predatory short of having a knockout system

and even then

[leaden haven]

no worries, next rotation is chaotic doot, then nightmare doot after that. it'll be all right

[frozen scaffold]

you got a dublicate you get 10 obol fragments 😮

[silver rover]

Legit would have loved them to be just cosmetic or give minor bonuses based on how long you have them equiped

[atomic ingot]

this i feel like he sometimes manage to push it back on us

[glossy steppe]

4x all pet bonuses or something (0.00001% chance)

gotta get that 24x printer output

[nocturne copper]

It over 500!

[frozen scaffold]

always the the players fault no matter what

[lyric otter]

repeating myself, but it should have just been an extension of the breeding skill, pay for follower slots, they follow you around (comsetic) and maybe they get an added bonus of leveling up that pet's shiny bonus (regardless if shiny)

[frozen scaffold]

those follower pets would have been amazing for autoloot

[atomic ingot]

he's been a bit quieter since rift dropped, i remember pretty often snippets in future-content-blog before that. how was he in the past?

[frozen scaffold]

they run around and pick stuff up

thats it they do that just with different skins

but it had to be connected with some power shit

[upbeat yoke]

funny how theres litearly no mention of the actual pet bonuses in the patch notes.

[brazen shore]

Well that was a few hours sleep, no statement or action yet?

[nocturne copper]

Lava:I am the only one who can destroy the game

[brazen shore]

Time to sleep for a few more and hope for some kind of action

[atomic ingot]

if the bonuses were balanced and were obtainable more ethically/organically he totally would put them in the notes to get players hyped about the update

almost like hes hiding from us B(

[upbeat yoke]

exactly :(

[twin garnet]

does anyone know what is the chance of getting Doot?

[potent loom]

u can check in-game but iirc it's 0.28% at lvv 1

[nocturne copper]

1755$for 99%

[fallow frost]

0.28% when starting 100gems pull, 0.85% when capped on 250 gems pull

[twin garnet]

oh wow that's as bad as genshin

[lyric otter]

I heard Genshin at least has some better bad luck protection or something

[potent loom]

better free pulls than 1/week too no?

[lyric otter]

also arnet characters like, full on movesets and stuff

[twin garnet]

c6 character in genshin is around $2000 and that's with pity at 90 pulls

[lyric otter]

yeesh, okay

[fallow frost]

worse, genshin at leats has pity system

[atomic ingot]

cmon lava youre better than this gacha bullshit 😦

i liked petting the doggo before he turned into cash shop 😦

[lyric otter]

I like that it does it with no warning either

you could misclick and lose stuff you drop on the ground

unlike a portal you wont have time to react

granted, not something that happens a lot, but still janky

[signal burrow]

lab chips were his 1 allowable oopsie, him doing this makes us think he's just abandoning the game and doesn't care how scuffed he cash grabs

[meager plover]

not much to discuss. its blatantly dodgy. what is there to discuss? the level of how shit it is?..

[tacit bough]

Yup, not respecting all of the player. Only think us as a gold egg and generate money for him

[severe aspen]

I'm not against dropping cash on the game. A single dev doing THIS much work is phenomenal.

This though is very grabby and is a move toward unrewarding gatcha stuff. It makes me sad...

[rotund harbor]

imo, anything <1000 gems is kinda fair game. especially by w4, because you'll have a steady enough income of gems that you would only buy them to support lava

gems work really well as a premium currency imo. they have varied uses and are easy to get once you get the hang of it

[neat lodge]

bad review comment will get delete anyway

[verbal marlin]

Not even really a dev IMO. But who am I to say, I'm just a software engineer who has actual devops and development knowledge

[rotund harbor]

we're going off the assumption that normal people don't dupe

you're missing my greater point

[meager plover]

these two statements conflict

[rotund harbor]

they are accessible, paying extra for them is really only if you're incredibly lazy

[meager plover]

comparing a video game you are willing playing alot of to heroin is pretty dumb. not gonna lie

[rotund harbor]

"bad dev" isn't really a term that holds any meaning. a thousand different things go into gamedev

art, code, game design, ideas, etc.

what does that have to do with what I said? i was making the point that gamedev is a very broad range

saying "bad dev" is kinda meaningless

specifics are important

are you a game developer?

we might be losing track of the argument here

[fallow frost]

well, base requirement for any good game developer is ability to at leats understand code

or well, any designer too or head developer etc

[rotund harbor]

depends on how large the team is

definitely important for team leaders

which would no longer make him a solo dev

I think he has a very flawed concept of game design. a lot of things work on paper but once they're in-engine, they are a misguided jumble of mechanics

I'm not claiming to know his process, but I'm gonna go out on a limb and say he doesn't really bounce ideas around with people, which means he's missing out on one of the most important parts of coming up with fully formed ideas

[granite citrus]

yeah I mean there's a reason why gachas are so profitable

doesn't make them any less scummy, much like casinos

[rotund harbor]

psychological exploitation!!

[noble prairie]

i personally think this update is fine i dont understand where P2W comes into play theres no multiplayer aspect to the game except dungeons. its a mainly solo so if someone spends money so be it not like it effects the next person.

[fallow frost]

yh, and most whales are not exactly wealthy, but average and below average income with extremely incompetent money handling skills

[green nexus]

I get your point, but there is no doubt that it is completely p2w

[noble prairie]

where are these leaderboards

[rotund harbor]

the problem isn't that it ruins the game for individuals, the problem is that he's
a. blatantly profiting off of vulnerable people, and
b. throwing out OP buffs that destroy any fun sense of progression via RNG

[noble prairie]

its the first im hearing of them

[fallow frost]

and whats biggest worry is that with such brokenly OP stuff hidden behind extreme fomo gacha wall, any future game content is balanced for this broken shittery

[rotund harbor]

it's a full embrace of his new RNG-based game design philosophy

[noble prairie]

oh that leaderboard

[rotund harbor]

y'know, the one that made w5 the worst world by a long shot

[fallow frost]

you mean w4?

[rotund harbor]

i actually like w4 lmao

at least, the town skills. those are fun

[fallow frost]

w4 is where gacha only rng go introduced into game

[coral dawn]

not really XD

only the chips are

[rotund harbor]

breeding isn't really a gacha

[coral dawn]

gems are kinda worth to gacha since its permanent also its only once

[fallow frost]

I'm not referring to breeding

[rotund harbor]

oh, you mean the lab gems

[noble prairie]

the problem with that leaderboard how legit is it

[coral dawn]

hes talking about the gem shop chips

[rotund harbor]

eh

i never really used chips so i have no valuable input

[coral dawn]

gl

[rotund harbor]

that's petty lmao

[tacit bough]

Solo developers is not a exclusive. He can always hire developers for developing

[fallow frost]

solo dev is exclusive, if there is more than one developer its no longer solo dev

[short zodiac]

I thought this game was différents because thé dev listened to thé community, no?

[fallow frost]

he doesnt really listen community though

[short zodiac]

Well thats what we call false advertising

[fallow frost]

as far as it is, on idle games I know only handful of solo devs who actually listen community: Ruy from ITRTG, 4g from NGU for example

[daring moth]

people call it p2w, isn't p2w means pay to win? how do you even win in this game?
P.S this is a genuine question

[tacit bough]

If a gaming getting bigger and bigger. You will need more develop time to maintain everything. For example bug fix and stuff. The larger the game, the slowing the game developing. That’s what it is. At the time you feel like, oh that’s too much to handle then probably he need to hire some people to handle. Just like why normal game will have a game director and game developer. Lava is only try to get both working. If you have ability to do both, it’s perfectly fine. But when things get out of control. Then please don’t.

[short zodiac]

Honestly feels liké thé reason for solo developing is to have 100% of thé profits

[noble prairie]

thing is if people are complaining over just a leaderboard tho nothing stopping the top leaders from spending 24bucks and getting pets. im going to amit i spent 24 bucks got the 2000 gems and yes i got doot(very lucky). what he should do is allow blue gems but not tradable and green as tradeable that could balance the tides.

[fallow frost]

both of them also have never pulled scummy shit on any game they have made (4g capped ngu though; ruys itrtg is still growin after almost 9 years in going

[noble prairie]

then i must of really got lucky lol

[fallow frost]

ruys solution to that was patreons gets access to beta builds

[daring moth]

then its not supposed to be called "pay to win" right? there's not even at least a leaderboard in this game

[fallow frost]

yh, its more like pay to advance, not win

[short zodiac]

If thé stats of thé pets werent that Big this update wouldn't change much, but thé amount thé pets do in terms of progress is absured forcing anyone who wants to even have a chance of reaching w5 for example either play for a ridiculous amount of Time or spend money

[mystic sleet]

Future game balancing will be dependent on those who have and those who don't. They paid to get ahead. Everyone else got left behind

[idle dome]

People can find different ways to compete, the unofficial leaderboard is one of them.

[daring moth]

ok, there sure are a lot of perspective

for me i don't really care since i'm 90% afk the 10% is for the events XDD

[noble prairie]

whos getting left behind? your self because the last i checked its a single player game. plus the leaderboard is just a 3rd party site has nothing to do with the game.

[fallow frost]

you too have been left behind

[noble prairie]

ive been left behind from day one lol i pretty much just check my chars and get off

[fallow frost]

and you think you are behind of those going forward at lead, but in reality ytou are behind of those who are behind of those who are behind of those who are behind of lead

[mystic sleet]

If the stats don't matter, what does matter to you?
I'm a mobile player. I don't active aside from events. I use the game to help me sleep.

[short zodiac]

What are thé chances we all get muted and nothing changes about thé update

[noble prairie]

but how am i behind anyone on a "Singleplayer" game doesnt make any logic

[daring moth]

well, yeah i'd be happy like super happy but i don't mind if i don't get it it's not i'm rushing or anything i'll get those things just 6x slower. like i said i'm 90% afk and actually this games makes me have fun and thats what more important to me

[fallow frost]

as you lag behind, all content is balanced for those in front making you lag behind even more

[daring moth]

like i said i don't mind not getting it

[obsidian tulip]

Are you at w5 currently?

[daring moth]

i don't feel that because as long as i see my characters progress i'm happy enough, its a drag to think about others people progress

[noble prairie]

who said doot is getting rotated out he could still keep him having a OP pet like that and removing it isnt a good move he probly going to stay as top pet for a few rotations

[obsidian tulip]

Or add a new op one

[mystic sleet]

I'm like you. Passive playing only lol. I have been playing for a long time, however, so I'm endgame for the most part.

If he balances future content around this RNG stuff, I won't be able to experience new content like I have been. I've been able to keep up with everyone because it's fairly balanced.
I *will have to gamble to keep up with the people I've been playing with since I started.

[obsidian tulip]

Can't imagine how the progression feel if you get doot when starting the game tbh

Seem weird

[mystic sleet]

It won't take effect until you unlock all the gods, and we have no idea how the games gonna be after that.

[obsidian tulip]

Peoples said that it work even without w5 unlocked

[mystic sleet]

I dunno why I expected it to work any other way

[obsidian tulip]

Would quit the game fast personally, the game would be so easy it would just feel like i'm waiting for next portal to open, non stop for a while

[tacit bough]

I think if the game already push to w6/w7. King doot will make sense

[noble prairie]

if he adds blue gems to get pets that should fix balance issues

[obsidian tulip]

Imo doot is just too op rn, even if everyone could get it i don't understand why it exist

[meager plover]

I know why it exists

💵

[obsidian tulip]

So strong that honnestly, if you're early w5 its worth it to reset account until you get doot and play again

Rebirth

[mystic sleet]

Yeah. Pls don't make us gamble for QoL features

It's not QoL now, but in a world or two it'll be cool but probably not rock your world cool. Lava loves to jump the shark

[fallow frost]

yh, whole thing centers around few things: doot rotates out in 10 weeks = FOMO scammy practise; free pull is once a week only= high change to never get any good pets, there is no free way to make green gems = cash only gacha pulling

[mystic sleet]

Goodnight, ty for the chat. Hope you all see some positivity here and irl

[fallow frost]

also most upvoted threat in idleons history (or to that matter, most upvoited suggestion)

[meager plover]

needs its own feedback imo.

[worn plank]

Hi sorry I'm new to this whole discord thing so I report bug. I just got the "king doot" companion from my first free weekly companion claim(after talking to dog npc of course :P) but I think it only works on the carcaracter I've unlocked the companion onononon? This is very weird as the description says all my divinities should be active at all time. Anyways I hope this helps test your game thanks lava!

Oh sorry I forgot to mention

Please reach out if you need game testers in teh future 😛

[obsidian tulip]

There a bug report channel if ya want

[worn plank]

Oh sorry!

[worn plank]

Okay I will put it there too 😛

ahaha yes !

[tacit bough]

Unless Lava create a crypto ecosystem. Otherwise server sided gems probably RIP.

[meager plover]

broken? in what way? that is way too vague to mean anything

ah right thought that is what you were getting at. yeh still a bad way to handle it

[patent badger]

he slipped by saying that

i don't think he was sure of what he was saying when he did

might be the heat of the moment

[meager plover]

why not just change the way work?

maybe cut off date swap to new system so people can spend their remaining before it changes to new anti cheat system so cheaters cant carry over?

doesn't that just fix the whole system?

[proper goblet]

What about many of the people in the endgame channel like myself who have tens of thousands of blue gems from packs and natural sources that have nothing to spend them on currently? Do we just lose the months of progress to this new system?

[meager plover]

nothing to spend them on at all? really?

[proper goblet]

The only thing I can think to buy at the moment that would make any small bit of sense would be arcade balls for the future

[compact abyss]

this. and that still wouldnt change companions being scummy

[meager plover]

yeah the doot shit is another issue

[compact abyss]

but what youre proposing is also just not that reasonable. theres so many ways to get gems currently, all of which he would have to make server sided for that to be effective

[proper goblet]

I have all of the purchasable content, the only stuff left is repeatable purchases like candy (huge waste when you have thousands of hours already in stash). Arcade balls (currently maxxed on everything except for not yet in rotation rewards), and card packs, of which I have 5* ruby ready for almost all purchaseable card packs once I unlock it in rift. Keychains are okay, and I could probably use a few more max % afk rolls, but if I cared, I would use a few of the thousands of dungeon entries I'm neglecting. There isn't anything else "worth" purchasing. I know I'm not the only one in this situation.

I could buy bottled wind and gamin fert, but they are capped at a few per day, nothing I could spend my 19k claimed gems on, not counting what's in my stash currently.

*to note, I don't need the wind or gaming fert to progress anymore, it would just be a bit of a bonus to get the less useful unlocks I'm missing mostly.

[meager plover]

hmm it is quite the issue. well considering the game is mainly single player just switching to the new anti cheat system is probably enough then. not needed

[compact abyss]

refer to this

[proper goblet]

If the game is "mainly" single player, don't concern yourself with cheaters, if they have cheated doots, what does that matter?

[compact abyss]

^ only for supposed trading

[proper goblet]

Sure, but that didn't stop people from getting dungeon runs from cheaters, that wasn't an issue at all for Lava

The issue is the fact that he wants more money, and this new system forces EVERYONE, not just the cheaters to pay.

[compact abyss]

i mean

i can tell you now, cheaters aint gonna pay shit anyways

[proper goblet]

Exactly, this fucks over normal players only

Cheaters could just max their accounts in a few minutes, look at IE leaderboards and they are easy to spot.

[compact abyss]

removing trading and then just allow conversion to pet crystals would be a good fix imo

[meager plover]

yeah this is my take on it. fix doot and new system. make only the pay currency and patch it.
seems like a no brainer.

[proper goblet]

Remove doot honestly, it has no purpose being in the game.

It nullifies too many things

[compact abyss]

he cant remove doot anymore

[proper goblet]

Sure he can, refund peoples money.

He fucked this royally, he CAN fix it.

[compact abyss]

heh

[vital oxide]

its not that simple

[proper goblet]

But he won't, because he's a greedy SOB.

[meager plover]

make it so its not obtainable anymore. would of only been up for a day. people that fuss for scammed into buying refuned or something

[proper goblet]

Yes it is, none of the purchases have reached his account, and won't for a while. It's a few button presses on steam to refund people.

[meager plover]

like this edit I made?

[proper goblet]

Very on point

[vital oxide]

ooh can i put on gen chat xd

they will rave

[meager plover]

go for it lol

memes are ment for spreading >:)

💳

[proper goblet]

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Lava decides this is the end of idleon and ghosts the shit out of it like he did with idle skilling.

Put out one last cash grab and start working on the next "game" that will do the same thing.

[meager plover]

he already was sick of doing content for it

[meager plover]

yeah that was insta what I thought

[proper goblet]

He needed to hire help for the game a long time ago, he clearly loses focus on his games, and can't keep up with the backlog of content he has.

So many systems underutilized or left for dead despite showing room for growth and improvement.

Alchemy is the most egregious example with the atom collider, instead of making pushing bubbles interesting, it's now just a few button presses a day.

[meager plover]

yeah but hiring people to make his game better or ongoing costs $. what he is doing is probably more profitable..

[proper goblet]

It's short term profits

[meager plover]

doesn't have enough faith in his solo made games

[proper goblet]

If you generate a steady revenue stream, and run that out over the course of 5 years, that's far better than a spontaneous burst of cash flow.

The only way a spontaneous burst works is if you reinvest that into resources, assets, or talent. None of which he is doing.

[meager plover]

idk, hiring people to continue his game with content and stuff probably more of money sink then doing this scummy shit

[proper goblet]

Assume 10k people bought the 25$ pack, that's 250k before taxes etc, he could hire two mid tier developers for a year after taxes etc. and keep the game alive generating even more content that's actually worth spending another 25$ on. Instead he will not do that, and cash out early.

[meager plover]

but its pretty hard for either of us to say for sure without knowing the actual revenue costs vs income the game brings in. only thing we do know is what he is doing is objectively scummy

[proper goblet]

His revenue costs are whatever server he's paying to run the game on. Probably some cloud service provided set up.

[meager plover]

no I mean like, if he was to get a team for the game and ditch it himself

[proper goblet]

Based on my past projects, with ~10k monthly users, I was spending about 500$ a month on server fees.

[proper goblet]

Hire two devs at 100k a year, they will pay themselves off based on the price of packs, how many people buy them.

The more content released for the game means that there can be more packs worth buying.

If they released world 6 and 7 within a year, releasing a 25$ pack each time, they would bring in so much more than they are costing.

Not to mention all of the holiday packs, and random gem packs that people are buying.

There is an upfront cost to this, they will not onboard quickly, etc, but that's your opportunity cost that comes out of pocket with no expected return on investment. He should easily have the capitol to make this mild investment into his future.

[meager plover]

probably right.. either way. that option doesnt make you look like a complete cunt so yeh. probably a better option IF there is enough players and community.

[proper goblet]

The classic saying is that you need to spend money to make money, he could be doing so much more for the community and himself if he put in a bit of effort.

There are plenty of reasons why indie developers create small indie studios of 3-5 people to work with. I personally work for a company that has me on a team of 10 total, with 2 testers, and 2 product managers leaving space for 5 devs and an architect/lead. If it were just one of us doing all of this work, progress and cash flow would grind to an absolute halt.

[fallow frost]

patch, on that it depends a lot of who that solo one is

[meager plover]

yeah, maybe next game he makes he will learn this or something lol. I mean each game gets bigger with scope. idk how old he is, but he also might just be too lazy.

[fallow frost]

gotta remember that only solo devs thta could handle it efficiently are some of 3% of entire population ppl

[proper goblet]

Sure, there's an argument that an absolute 10/10 developer could handle the load of a team, however, you could allocate those other developers to other pieces of the platform. Leave the 10/10 to work on main content, and the other one or two to work on tertiary assignments.

[meager plover]

doesn't seem very relevent when we are talking about Stencyl indie game

[proper goblet]

There's also a huge benefit to having a second pair of eyes on things to make sure you don't release something like this pet update.

[tacit bough]

The only things is if player still trust Lava for the next game after this game

[proper goblet]

Think about Elon Musk for a second, and all the stupid shit he's done with his money, imagine if he didn't have people shutting down the rest of his horrible ideas before they see the light of day...

[fallow frost]

well, if this update was the swansong for this game; I definelty will not trust lava gain ... fool me once shame on me, fool me twice shame on you, fool me trice and I'd be idiot

[meager plover]

never fooled me 💳

[proper goblet]

Even if Idleon dies, you know he'll come back with a new game in a few years.

that's just how Lavaflame is

[brazen shore]

If he comes out with a THIRD game, I'll be dodging it at the moment

Unless he redeemed himself from this one

[fallow frost]

yh, only idiot would jump onto his 3rd game

[meager plover]

4th. didnt he make some shit flappy birds knockoff

[brazen shore]

Oh yeah chicken odyssey or something

[proper goblet]

Chicken Odyssey

[meager plover]

anybody know how old he is?

[proper goblet]

<30 for sure.

[tacit bough]

20 I think