#NG+ Any%

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

proud wave
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I'm gonna try and stream a run soon

patent root
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drop that link imma follow and if I'm not working I'll tune in

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unofficial WR shouldn't be too hard to beat in a few runs lol

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also I wanna have a discussion for what time should end on

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As of rn i've been final splitting on the last slash through the screen on the cutscene after you beat candy

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in kh speedruns which is what I'm experienced in time ends on last hit to final boss but I'd like a community decision

proud wave
patent root
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i haven't watched any devil may cry runs so i'm not familiar at all. if you also prefer ending on final hit of candy i'd be down for that

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it's just when act 2 comes out i'll probably change my split to how i've been doing it so far as i've been splitting for every chapter like that

patent root
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if there was someway to get up there then we could skip the fight inside the building

image.png
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which is a long fight

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cuz candy is literally in the circle up top

proud wave
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that's assuming the devs didn't put an invisible wall up there

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but if they didn't

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you could easily double jump>wallrun>rising upper on red until you hit the top, which would require you to either pop hyper mode or end the previous fight with 5 without using any turbothruster on the previous path (which does save a good few seconds) so unsure if it'd be the best possible decision but it -is- theoretically possible if everything up there is also true.

proud wave
patent root
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Oh there totally is an invisible wall there

proud wave
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sucks.

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that fight inside isn't too bad if you tackle the tall turret on the balcony first, take everyone else on as normal and then pop hyper and combo The End with Red's charged grounded combo's first two hits

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The End does extra hits/dmg in hyper so it's probably our best option for killing annoying targets like Jester

patent root
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Usually I just use jetsaw

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It shreds most enemies

proud wave
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I mean it does but some enemies have enough health to where you've gotta convert into other things to not waste time

patent root
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imma do more runs on Saturday

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maybe then my run will be verified on sr.com

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Only real reason I haven't kept doing runs is cuz I don't wanna spam submissions and it'll be still really easy to PB lol

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I just wanted a time on the leaderboards

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I have been offline experimenting and I still have no idea what I'm looking for with this aerial movement bug ash was talking about

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but someone is bound to find it and post it at some point

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be it runner or casual

proud wave
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also making progress with labbing out faster ways to clear Problem Rooms™

I got hit a couple times and that's a lil embarrassing but I think the video is still sick as hell

patent root
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damn i really do gotta get the scythe don't i

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insane crowd control

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dude my run sucks lmao

proud wave
proud wave
patent root
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i know it's just funny to think about

proud wave
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did you like the devil trigger burst to kill him with the spikes? LUL

patent root
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hell yeah

proud wave
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dude this game is so sick

patent root
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it really is

proud wave
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I've been tryin' hard to find tech and lab out cool combos that still kill fast enough

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I'm trying to find places/tactics that make red's tackle more effective since it does a decent chunk of damage

patent root
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i like getting enemies in a corner and using the tackle attack

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tackle and the end would probably go crazy together if you can line it up

proud wave
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sometimes in devil trigger you can build enough frame advantage with swords to start up The End and then cancel it immediately for extra flow so that red can do like... something. Usually I go for nukefist or tackle but honestly just doing the just frame on the level 1 charge can be just good enough

proud wave
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it was really finicky though

patent root
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yeah it'll probably take some setup to work consistently

proud wave
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fun fact: if you do a little damage to the Big Jester, (like a basic air combo into Blue's sawblade attack) cancel into DT and find a way to land The End (usually Summoned Swords>start The End>tag into Red>basic jab combo or lv1 charge just frame) you can actually make him split and then kill both jesters before they get to do anything.

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because The End in DT does about a full healthbar of damage for every hit and it hits like... 3 times.

patent root
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holy moly

proud wave
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it's kinda hard to set up

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I mostly go for it when I catch jester dropping presents like kohaku from melty blood with summoned swords, and only if he ends up landing near me believably. Sometimes you can also tag into red and double jump in time to pull him back down to earth with uncharged helmbreaker and force him to take The End

patent root
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usually i try to interrupt jester in the presents attack with the dash attack followed immediately by a jetsaw

proud wave
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I used to do it like that but I kept getting punished for doing it at weird angles

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felt easier to just projectile him and then do the same thing for minimal flow cost

patent root
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Valid

proud wave
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'quick' should be shorter than 25ish seconds but that's still a really annoying enemy to deal with and it was no devil trigger/minimal flow so having something for low resource moments can be nice too

proud wave
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@patent root have you figured out a way to make the bumper cars section go faster? 🥺

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struggling to make it not take like... a million years and it's probably the biggest source of wasted time in my run

patent root
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Idk if it's placebo but it feels faster if you press boost repeatedly rather than holding it

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but also if you're able to get that aerial movement bug you can probably just fly through it if you can manipulate momentum and it's probably faster than the driving

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also there is a fight you can skip with height

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and you can climb up to a higher point close to the end of the track that I also think is faster than driving all the way around

patent root
proud wave
proud wave
patent root
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hold

proud wave
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take your time

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just responding

patent root
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the fight skip happens at 15:00

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you just go over the fight trigger to skip it

proud wave
patent root
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i need to do personal testing to see the details

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but it seems to convert horizontal speed to vertical speed and send you flying

proud wave
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jump cancelling turbo thruster has a similar effect but not nearly as pronounced

patent root
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yeah i do a lot of jump cancelling turbo thruster

proud wave
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yeah, it feels very important

patent root
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yeah while flow is so good in combat, it's use in movement sections is just too nice to passup

proud wave
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yeah I've noticed that. there are a couple fights where it feels worth popping hyper even in non combat sections just to cut out the wait if you don't leave with a full 3-4 bars

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that's mostly for when you manage economy poorly or otherwise need to kill an enemy fast, but not fast enough to justify the hyper pop

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6 or 7 dodge>jump>dodge>doublejump loops can give about .5-.75 flow bars by themselves which is also worth noting for routing on the fly

patent root
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yeah i gotta lock in and grind out more runs

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leaderboard mod chan STILL didn't verify my run so who's to say it's ever happening lol

proud wave
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I'm still labbing out some fine details before I sit down, boot obs and stream/record mine

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my prelim runs are looking decent though.

patent root
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ooo

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are you doing IL runs rn for practice or just offline not timed runs?

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half a month in purgatory

proud wave
patent root
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the purple guys that fireball you?

proud wave
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I usually do it all in a row since it only takes me 35-50 minutes to get a run down, usually more if I have to do a repeat on a segment that makes me choke

proud wave
patent root
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oh big dudes

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beefers

proud wave
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blue gets a lot of damage off the last hit of her ground combo so I'm tryna find flow efficient ways to implement that so that red only has to spend two bars when I tag him in

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might cost a whole four but could potentially kill them like that snaps

patent root
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i would love to see the tech

proud wave
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I'll try and get a recording soon

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Discord disabled my ability to clip my own streams because I'm broke 💔

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so I'm gonna have to be more intentional about those unfortunately

patent root
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unfort

proud wave
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yeah. I might pop in call at some point and stream me labbing stuff out though.

patent root
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oh if i'm not at work or doin something with my roommates i'd love to join for that

proud wave
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of course. get at me whenever. I'm usually not too busy lately

proud wave
proud wave
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Genokids NG+ Any% in 38:22 on Hard

patent root
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Does hard change anything other than damage you take?

proud wave
proud wave
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PB'd at 37:57 :3

proud wave
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made it so close to hitting sub 36 and then I accidentally overextended with Pain Storm and gave Candy the unblockable loop right before her final phase... 💔

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also ate shit on valkyrie for some reason even though I labbed out a relatively quick kill

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think I'm not planning my Hyper Mode usage well enough tbh

proud wave
patent root
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holy W

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imma watch it rn

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damn i suck at this game LMAO

proud wave
proud wave
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if you want some help learning some of this stuff I'd be happy to show you what I've been labbing

patent root
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i don't have a lot of time rn

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hold

proud wave
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I undestand, no worries, wasn't tryna be weird or nothin'

patent root
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no you're fine you aren't weird

proud wave
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thank you 🅱️ oker

patent root
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i'm about to jump in a call to help someone set up their character sheet

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i'm down after tho?

proud wave
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whatever/whenever works for you lady

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take your time, hit me up whenever you got the time and the NRG

patent root
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i wonder if you can skip the 1st bumper car arena

proud wave
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I've been trying to figure that out myself tbh

patent root
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cuz the other one you can if you get enough height

proud wave
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yeah I've been skipping parking lot 3 consistently

patent root
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seeing you enter the fight on the vod got me thinkin

proud wave
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same tbh

patent root
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HUH

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YOU JUMPED OVER THE WALL??

proud wave
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which one

patent root
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3rd parking arena

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the fight loaded in but you went over the back wall

proud wave
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ah yeah apparently you can do that

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I was like ???? task failed successfully

patent root
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now that got me thinking if we can skip other fights by jumping over the walls lol

proud wave
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I tried it on a few

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most of them have proper invis walls on them

patent root
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makes sense

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or probably go past whatever height limit is set

proud wave
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( <@&433725697471807490> please don't fix the invisible wall on parking lot arena 3 in the bumper car facility, the skip there is really fucking fun to do)

patent root
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dev-chan let me keep my skip pls

proud wave
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I gotta ask, y'know? :LUL:

patent root
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no i respect the hustle

proud wave
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This is 200% my goty 2025 and it's not even out

patent root
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oh for sure the game is so fun

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i just need to learn how to do damage fast

proud wave
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beautiful artstyle. exceptional music. great voice acting and character designs. fun mechanics.

patent root
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oh 17:08 timestamp i'm 90% sure you can skip that fight if you go far enough left and skip the trigger

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i could also be stupid

proud wave
# patent root i just need to learn how to do damage fast

you had the right idea with using Buzzsaw all the time but you do wanna have slightly longer routes that use assists, because if you have a character making contact with an enemy when you swap to a bandmate you gain flow proportional to your Style rating and also the flow cost/damage of the move you used. (unsure if style rating is the thing that matters, all I know is that it feels like 'tension pulse' in Guilty Gear XX/Xrd)

Some combo routes I use are Blue: ground combo 4 hits>launcher>full air combo>cancel into buzzsaw (might need to L2 first)>cancel into Swap Red>Chase>Lv1 Charge Punch>cancel into Rising Kick>Lv1 Charge Punch>Lv 1 charge air launcher>cancel into swap blue>summoned swords (flow Square) and from there you can do pretty much whatever you want to chain to the next enemy as fast as you want

patent root
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ohhhh i didn't know about the bonus flow thing

proud wave
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Keep an eye on my flow bar when you see me calling a lot of assists

patent root
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yeah i was wondering why my flow economy sucked so much compared to yours lol

proud wave
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great example is the fat guy at the end of chapter 2

patent root
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yeah i'm noticing it a lot more now

proud wave
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you go in with full Devil Trigger and at least 5 bars of flow (2 to turbothrust through the travel route, 3 for the fight itself) you can chain Pain Storm >Swap Blue>Summoned Swords>swap red>nukefist>swap blue>the end and it'll combo 9/10 times

patent root
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also the fight at 22:13 you can straight up go around it to skip it

proud wave
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that's... insane lmfao

patent root
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left or right lol

proud wave
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that's so insane lmfao

patent root
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there is no invisible wall yeah

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i didn't realize it on one of my attempts

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i accidentally went to the left too far and was like ???

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cuz the fight trigger is a big line across but the fight perimeter is just that small island

proud wave
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that's insanely cool lmfao

patent root
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yeah

proud wave
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that might change how I have to route out the turbothrusters maximally

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tbh I like that fight I kinda wish it wasn't skippable, has a lot of cool stuff you can do wtih scythe crowd control

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but at the same time it'll be nice to shave an extra two minutes off the run

patent root
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simply run no major skips and do every fight

proud wave
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not really two minutes, more like 45 seconds

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but

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you feel me

patent root
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yea

proud wave
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oh, no major skips would be an interesting category

patent root
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any time save is good

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okay not any

proud wave
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For now I think I'm just gonna do every skip I can

patent root
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oh same

proud wave
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might try and pioneer the No Skips run though

patent root
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that sounds like a fun category

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i'll probably save that for when i get better at the full game though

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er

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the any% category i mean

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sorry i'm not sober

proud wave
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I'm pretty stoned, you're okay.

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I got what you meant.

patent root
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fight at 34:39 you can just go to the left up the ledge and can skip that fight

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imo holy grail of the run will be if someone can find Candy DM skip

proud wave
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closest thing I've found is saving your second or third devil trigger bar (hard to build the third without wasting time so probably second) and constantly staying at exactly halfway across the field from candy, doing this:

Dodge>jump cancel>airdodge>summoned swords>airdodge>swap to red>nukefist>swap to blue>airdodge>land (repeat)

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can't really seem to skip it yet from what I'm seeing but you can definitely kill her before it's even halfway through if you're doing things right

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also seems like you could maybe force her to take painstorm by having blue block the unblockable in DT so that red didn't take damage from it but that'sa inconsistent

proud wave
proud wave
tacit finch
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It will remain there

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It's quite pretty high up, getting out normally is very difficult

tacit finch
proud wave
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did you see me not doing something that she was?

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yeah tonight I was very close to hitting sub 36 minutes. I PB'd at 37:17 but I also died twice at chapter 6's Big Spike Room™ and only kept going because I had already had several failed runs at that point and mostly just wanted to drill in muscle memory for quick killing jesters and forcing Candy into her Desperation Move phase as early as possible

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I think I'm going to have to implement something in the spike room to get the first wave of enemies away from the path of the rotating spikes so that I can 1. have as much health and Hype as possible for Valkyrie and 2. Stop choking at what should be a relatively easy point in the run

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That's probably what I'm doing for stream tomorrow.

tacit finch
proud wave
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oh, past the first fight, turbothrusting past the ramp?

tacit finch
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ye

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Instead, you fighted. Was there a reason then?

proud wave
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yeah I did that today in the run I just did a few minutes ago; it's a shame because if I didn't die twice on Ch 6 we would've gotten almost to 35 minutes flat

proud wave
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'I should've tried that earlier'

proud wave
tacit finch
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Just so you know, we don't plan to keep updating the build much more, it's quite bug-free enough, and ACT2 will be a big update, not one that's done bit by bit

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So soon the game will be stable, as in we won't be touching it more, which I think is good for speedruns as nothing will change for a while

proud wave
tacit finch
proud wave
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the flow bar following your character? I might like that quite a bit.

tacit finch
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yes, the flow bar next to the character

proud wave
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I don't know how hard it would be to code but having a speedometer would be really, really nice for figuring out if I'm maintaining momentum with certain options or losing them

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but the flow bar next to my character would be great for figuring out how much I'm gaining/losing from doing Marvel Vs. Capcom style projectile assists

tacit finch
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I can tell you sprinting builds up speed up to a limit if you don't jump, you can notice it because speed lines start to appear

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speedometer... I don't know about that one, it could be done, yes, but it would take some thinking on how to implement it in the UI, I don't want to do that for ACT 1

proud wave
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ah, I know that much. I've just been finding interesting stuff off of dodging off of slopes and then jump cancelling the dodge, and it seems like you can hold the momentum a lot better by jumping within a few frames of hitting the ground and airdodging; the thing that I'm most curious about though is if double jumping reduces horizontal speed in the process of raising the vertical speed so swiftly.

proud wave
tacit finch
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double jump shouldn't touch the horizontal speed

proud wave
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ah, good to hear. My 'combo' for doing that is dodge>jump cancel dodge>airdodge>delay>double jump if you wanted to toy around with that/if you found spots that also greatly increased momentum off of dodge jump cancel

tacit finch
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yep the code doesn't touch horizontal velocity, I'm looking at it now

proud wave
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in ch1's beginning traversal segment, if you jump off the edge of the first slope and then stall enough to land off of the second slope's edge, you can build enough speed to see what I'm talking about.

In Chapter 3's beginning there's also a slope to the left of the hallway about 1/3rd of the way through that will give you insane momentum if you dodge jump cancel while facing the entrance to the first fight. Let me see if I can clip it because it's probably the best example of the tech I'm talking about

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thank you for the information and kindness btw

tacit finch
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yes, you kept a lot of momentum at the start of chapter 1, I didn't know that it could be preserved that much

proud wave
# tacit finch yes, you kept a lot of momentum at the start of chapter 1, I didn't know that it...

before I started recording runs I did a metric fuckton of practice runs so that I could understand the inner workings of movement and flow gain a lot better. I got the idea to test that out because of how momentum works in Quake 1 and 3 and it seems to work similarly for some reason, in that you lose most of your momentum upon touching the ground for longer than a few frames so you want to constantly hit jump as soon as you notice your descent

tacit finch
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I like how they feel

tacit finch
proud wave
tacit finch
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though I don't go around lookin for slopes, only rarely

proud wave
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dodging off slides saves -so much time- that I've had to toy around with it a little bit

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my biggest request for act 2 is please keep putting weird sloped objects in random places :LUL:

tacit finch
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hahaha

proud wave
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only half serious there dw I'm sure whatever you do with act 2 will have me clocking another ridiculous amount of hours.

proud wave
proud wave
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Just PB'd. 36:07. With a restart on Ch 7's second-to-last room. 😅

proud wave
# tacit finch yeeee jumping from sliding, and having to find slides in the map xd

in the last run I discovered new tech. Only really relevant for when green and yellow are available but still workable (but difficult) with just red and blue.

If you've gained high speed from a slope dodge, swapping band members really fast maintains height and prevents momentum loss until you touch the ground again (which, again, can be prevented or minimized by jumping within a few frames of touching the ground).

Helps a lot when flow economy is bad after a combat section before a crucial traversal segment.

patent root
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My only real big addition wish is an in game timer that pauses at cutscenes and load screens

proud wave
proud wave
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:c keep pbing all my splits to the point where even my red splits happening consistently don't stop me from sub 36 but I keep -choking- on the spinning spike room in chapter 6 and either dying there or dying to the valkyrie because of low health and poor hype economy

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Wish I knew how to build hype quicker or something... would help a lot with my choke points on ch 4 and ch 6

tacit finch
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I leave findings the specifics to you

proud wave
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thank you friend. you're a blessing

tacit finch
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I just checked the code

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You had to be under 2 or 3 flow chunks to get more hyper, but this was years ago. Now it's just if your flow meter isn't full, which is easier given how easily you can get flow

proud wave
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ooo. So essentially use assists to constantly regain flow but don't regain to five as much as you can

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that explains why using painstorm as an assist helps build hyper faster

tacit finch
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And spend it, don't let it stay there

proud wave
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honestly I don't know why I'm not using pain storm more

tacit finch
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50% more hyper

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Not bad tbh...

proud wave
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oh that's really good

proud wave
proud wave
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So... My struggle was like... breaking sub 35, right?

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er, sub 36

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which would be 35:59 or lower 😅

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well

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I got really good news ya'll

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stupidly good news

proud wave
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still riding off the sub 34 high. think the step to cutting the run down further is figuring out optimal places where red's tackle can be used to deal massive damage to multiple enemies at once. probably using scythe's basic attacks as specific times or in response to being dived on by pink bois

patent root
proud wave
patent root
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being able to check the code is a flex

proud wave
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ah...

patent root
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imo

patent root
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@proud wave my run got verified might as well go submit yours so i don't have fake wr lol

proud wave
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shit I keep forgetting to do this

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lmfao

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I've been trying to get shit with youtube to work a little bit better because I trust twitch highlights less and less as Twitch gets fucky with how much content a creator's allowed to save