That is the smarter route yeah
#GURPS
compact garden
limber mason
okay actual question here
the power "Warp" works via indirect vision. is there a way beyond choking the range to do that?
mighty hinge
i dont understand the question
limber mason
... okay i'm coming down with something
let's try that again
the power "Warp" works via indirect vision. is there a way beyond choking the range to remove that feature?
i was attempting to make a character from a game with it
mighty hinge
ah, so only allowing via direct line of sight
i dont think there's an official limitation for that, but i think a standard accessibility type limit would work fine
like Special Portal in Powers, where you need a particular gateway of some kind
-XX% for "No Removal" (which is what the penalty for not having LOS is called)
limber mason
yeah figures i'd need to homebrew
using GCS i had this HUGE list of modifiers from every book
mighty hinge
"Accessibility, Only if ..." is fairly common honestly, its barely homebrew
the funniest has to be Ghostly Movement from Horror
limber mason
i was trying to replicate blink from Dishonored.
mighty hinge
yeah i think a basic "Only within line of sight" is fine
limber mason
yeah barking up the wrong tree if i'm only using basic set
mighty hinge
or however you want to word it
limber mason
dh is gonna lean SUPER HARD on having powers
mighty hinge
watching a video about a guy making a titanium bow, remembered GURPS has rules for custom bows
ST 50 means a draw weight of 1250 pounds
mighty hinge
okay this bow math is really annoying fuck this
mighty hinge
anyway, the other thing id been meaning to do, DF's Combat Effectiveness Rating
this assumes he's carrying <500 lbs of gear and not wearing armor
oh, actually, i forgot to include injury tolerance
for reference only two published monsters (listed in P3/77) have CER >200, the Terrible Hedge and Terrible Whipping Willow in P3/77
and looking at their stats, i think mainly because they both have 2d Corrosion (Cyclic, 100 cycles, 1 second)
like damn bro
limber mason
mighty hinge
having GURPS LitRPG thoughts (and i dont even like LitRPG really)
fun fact, the standard limit for gaining points; 16 hours of intensive training per day, seven days a week for 52 weeks (then one more day for 365) is a whopping 58.4 points or 0.16 points per day
mighty hinge
in terms of bonus points, this is the equivalent of averaging 3 points per session across 19.5 sessions [19.46_]
mighty hinge
oh, DF actually provides a fairly good system for calculating bonus points https://i.imgur.com/p4gSXCA.png
not on the standard per session metric but more suitable for my LitRPG thoughts
teal bolt
Beyond gca and and gcs, what are some cool softwares to dig through gurps ?
mighty hinge
so i decided to put the Mk44 into Gun Stats and then also decided to make a """rifle""" version for my giant lad https://i.imgur.com/wNWG63I.png
despite the 1/3rd shorter barrel, the books math suggests almost no difference in damage, 2d by default, so i just kept it the same across the ammo types
ST is lower on the rifle almost entirely because the handwave recoil system and because of the change in the math from empty weight to loaded weight (very very technically the ST and Rcl should both get worse as you fire it but also he's ST 50 so...)
also im using the practice round off the data sheet on Northrop-Grumman's website because i didnt feel like doing the projectile math two more times for the other rounds
the HEI-T explosive damage is correctly based on the PGU-46's much higher projectile weight, though with generic numbers for the filler since they dont provide that
the APFSDS-T also has a higher weight and higher muzzle velocity but again, even more math
(especially because i dont know how much of the bonuses provided by the APFSDS rules in the book account for that stuff)
(also the HEI-T should list "0.9x range" because thats the Tracer's penalty)
also a very funny minor detail from the spec sheet is the only one theyre coy about is the APFSDS
everything else gets exact values but its "<725 g" for total weight with no projectile or propellant weight listed and it penetrates ">105mm RHA"
compact garden
The illustration, for reference: https://www.sjgames.com/gurps/4erfaq/GURPS BS 4e Rev hardcover.jpg
mighty hinge
also some previews of the interior, to show that not too much is changing https://www.sjgames.com/gurps/4erfaq/basic set 4e interior comparisons p345.jpg https://www.sjgames.com/gurps/4erfaq/basic set 4e interior comparisons p379.jpg
(original left, revised right)
compact garden
I do like the two column layout
Also they've already said that the new art is all art they liked from other GURPS books and had around
mighty hinge
yeah, that melting guy is from UT
the section about metamorphic viruses or something
spiral linden
GURPS dot jpg
I've been looking at GURPS again recently though because of wild nonsense ideas
limber mason
spiral linden
Wonderful
mighty hinge
gurps.tiff
spiral linden
I might poke about tomorrow about maybe figureing out OCs in GURPS or something
mighty hinge
its most of what i use gurps for, since i dont have a game, obviously
spiral linden
Look, I think the hard part is setting a point limit for myself maybe/ I don't know
Trying to port Iris is already a mess
limber mason
Just get a gauge for the relative points of your character and stick with it
mighty hinge
maybe its a 200 point guy, maybe its a 2000 point guy, its a mystery!
spiral linden
Look sh e's already at 350
mighty hinge
thats not bad
compact garden
The GURPS Action standard is 250 pts
mighty hinge
remember the 100-300 range is like, Normal (Player Character) Humans
spiral linden
I've been flying by the seat of my pants here
mighty hinge
if youve got actual Powers, its hard to come in under 500 most of the time (unless youre really weak)
compact garden
And Action is like the level of Italian Job and Ocean's Eleven and such
(I didn't need to pick two heist movies they just came to mind)
compact garden
if youve got actual Powers, its hard to come in under 500 most of the time (unle...
I actually ran a 150-pt Powers game way back, I definitely woulda done things differently in retrospect
mighty hinge
i mean its possible but it certainly doesnt sound like a good time unless you just ban a ton of options
compact garden
Nah nothing was banned really, people just didn't have enough pts for actually-cool powers
So we ended up with like tough guy and big guy and fireblast guy (no other fire powers, just blast) and intangible girl
Intangible girl had so many disadvantages she was not a functional human or party member
mighty hinge
i guess the real restriction is that you have a fairly narrow range of options per character
and the disadvantage problem, yeah
spiral linden
I think the hard part I'm really having is like...defining Iris physically in some ways
mighty hinge
iris is the clay girl, right?
spiral linden
Yea
mighty hinge
injury tolerance (homogenous, no blood, no brain), immunity to metabolic hazards, ablative DR maybe?
spiral linden
This is what I've poked with so far
mighty hinge
hmm, or maybe damage reduction instead
oh, maybe also limited DR against crushing (since punching clay isnt very effective)
i see doesnt breathe, but does she qualify for doesnt eat or drink?
spiral linden
Probably, I might have missed that
mighty hinge
if she can mold herself, elastic skin as well
also whats the aging situation? ie: extended lifespan or unaging
spiral linden
She's unaging
mighty hinge
also if she's invertebrate due to the softness of her body, she's probably also Flexible
compact garden
if she can mold herself, elastic skin as well
The issue is she can do more than just elastic skin can, she's in the zone of like Mr Fantastic or Plastic Man but significantly less durable
mighty hinge
oh then thats Shapeshifting (Morph, Mass Conservation)
probably also Cosmetic and Unlimited
compact garden
Yeah and then you gotta decide how good a shapeshifter
B/c it's a leveled trait, more points means more flexibility
mighty hinge
Morph is... 100 points plus the difference between your native racial template and the most expensive template you can assume
(an argument for her template to be her version of Body of Earth minus the shapeshifting itself is reasonable, i think)
and Unlimited and Cosmetic cancel out so those dont change the math
compact garden
If using Powers, woud probably take Improvized Forms Only
compact garden
Morph (Active Change, Flawed, Improvised Forms Only, Mass Conservation) is 190 pts base and then I guess a N pt pool of how much you can do with it
And +0 is legal with Improvised Forms Only as well, since you can take on disadvantages as needed (including ST, DX, or IQ penalties)
Skip Elastic Skin (since that's AFAIK free with morph), but do probably take Flexible separately
mighty hinge
oh, she probably qualifies for Hard to Kill and/or Hard to Subdue, though ive always found those difficult to discern values for
High Pain Threshold if getting hurt doesnt hurt as much, Supernatural Durability is probably too much (since it lets you completely ignore injury)
mighty hinge
oh right
spiral linden
Initally I wasn't sure if I should give her Unkillable 2 or not
mighty hinge
Regeneration and Regrowth (Reattachment Only) seem applicable
compact garden
There's a case for Supernatural Durability instead of Unkillable
mighty hinge
the wording on Unkillable 2 is very specific to a certain idea but i think "becomes a functionally indestructible puddle" is a suitable replacement for doing a Wolverine, if thats appropriate for her
compact garden
Yeah
mighty hinge
and i think Supernatural Durability is a little messy here because you suffer no penalties from injury until at <0 and that only reduces your Move and re-enables crippling injuries, and you have to have a specific vulnerability that kills you
spiral linden
I think High Pain Threshold makes more sense, as yuou can tell she's completely unphased by extreme dismemberment
compact garden
Mmhmm, I think I do prefer Unkillable 1 or 2 too, just thought I'd mention the option
mighty hinge
oh also, i think Supernatural Durability would make the limb severing from Independent Body Parts only function below zero as well, since it relies on crippling injuries
compact garden
I think High Pain Threshold makes more sense, as yuou can tell she's completely ...
HPT does make sense but I could also see treating injury as physically disruptive, it doesn't hurt so much as she needs a second to reform/adjust, this would be a 0 pt feature if it's just flavor, or a -1 quirk if it's visibly distinctive or some other thing
mighty hinge
yeah, even if shes not actually hurt, the shock penalty is mostly just distraction
spiral linden
Distraction/disorientation
compact garden
If you wanted to lean into it, you could even reskin Low Pain Threshold as this and take the double shock penalties
(Reskinning should probably change the will against crying to something else suitable)
compact garden
Next up: dealing with water
spiral linden
How is that going to work anyway
compact garden
I'd probably choose Weakness, but Revulsion and Vulnerability are also options
You can also opt to take two or all three of these, though Vulnerability to water-based attacks is... weird?
You can also make abilities turn off while wet if you want to get fun with limitations
spiral linden
Yea I guess the question is how do we translate...becomes soggy and moist
compact garden
For powers shutting off, I'd probably do Accessibility, "Only when dry" I'd say is -10% in most campaigns
spiral linden
Do they really shut off though?
compact garden
It's your character
spiral linden
Because I don't really think they do
compact garden
I don't think the meta-trait or anything in it does, but I can see morph doing so
And if you want to turn into a useless puddle when soaked, Quadriplegic (normally -80 pts) with the mitigator "Being dry" at... -70%?
spiral linden
I almost thought about it being Fatigue loss, but she can remain concious as a puddle
I'd have to figure out how to make that mitigator real quick probably
compact garden
Vulnerable mitigators are usually -60% but dryness is free and widely available so I knocked it down a bit more
spiral linden
I think this is what I have now?
spiral linden
Thinking about it, I'm probably going to need Ultra-Tech for liquid metal right?
mighty hinge
I think theres rules in powers
also even in UT, the not-T-1000 doesn't have that much specific to being liquid metal
though Living Metal is a specific technology, basically just semi-solid nanotech
oh actually, something i just remembered
for iris too
you should give them bonus HP to bring them up towards the amount that an object of their weight would have
(and this is on top of Injury Tolerance, big objects are tough!)
spiral linden
I just got off work so I'll review this when I get home
spiral linden
I forget the name of the character sheet program I'm using
mighty hinge
yeah you can either raise ST, which includes HP, or HP directly
though i prefer using the "Increased Strength" and/or "Extra Hit Points" traits because it makes the accounting easier
(its functionally the same, its just displayed differently)
spiral linden
I'll probably just do extra hit points
compact garden
Personally I like spending up in the attributes section so it doesn't clutter up the trait list
spiral linden
If I'm reading this right, Iris would have around 50 HP?
mighty hinge
sounds about right, though you dont have to be exact
she's fairly soft so less is reasonable
like a solid block of rock or wood of her weight would be ~50 HP
spiral linden
mighty hinge
whats her total now, 600 something?
spiral linden
650 almost
mighty hinge
not too bad
spiral linden
I should tweak her skills next probably
mighty hinge
skills are one of the messier parts of modeling OCs for me but i think thats mainly a lack of experience of actually playing GURPS
spiral linden
Also trying to decide if I want to give her Ritual Path Magic or not
Because she was originally a Mage character
Also I'm poking at Isabelle as well starting with Nanomorph
I'll likely need to give Iris regeneration/regrowth maybe?
compact garden
Yeah I'd give her regen
Maybe also Regrowth with an accessibility limitation?
Regrowth (Requires replacement clay, -40%) is 24 pts
spiral linden
Also giving Iris Ritual path magic like she had is a big bump in poitns for her
Probably at the point where if IW anted to I could pare down the amount of points they cost, because they're both past 800 at this point suddenly
compact garden
Also giving Iris Ritual path magic like she had is a big bump in poitns for her
Honestly about what I expected, she's a powerful mage
Like I'd not've been surprised just on vibes on her being a 500-pt char without all the clay stuff
spiral linden
And Isabelle is just already 700+ points form nanomorph alone
mighty hinge
magic is basically always expensive
see my challenges trying to build my dragon archmage OC
i think even now hes like, 1800 points?
compact garden
Oh I've played in games with low-point wizards
Was using skill-magic (the defualt) and had like... 5 useful spells
spiral linden
I haven't even really gotten to equipment and all that
compact garden
You can kinda skip most equipment outside weapons/armor if you're not doing a campaign
spiral linden
Also good god Isabelle
mighty hinge
look, shes heavy and she can throw her weight around
spiral linden
I think the funniest thing about building Isabelle is her nanomorph trait is TL12, but she's a TL8 character.
mighty hinge
well, thats assuming shes actually made of superadvanced nanotech
spiral linden
I think its the closest fit right now for being a t-1000 anyway
spiral linden
Fair
spiral linden
I'm debating lowering the regeneration that Isabelle got from nanomorph
mighty hinge
yeah its like, 1 per second or something by default right?
spiral linden
Yes
mighty hinge
yeah you only really need that much if you want them to be able to recover from injuries almost immediately
spiral linden
Yea I was thinking of taking it to the next step down to 1hp/min
mighty hinge
and since i assume she also has unkillable, it also sets the timer for how long it takes for her to come back from maximum dead
(since damage is capped at -10xHP, its that amount divided by the regeneration rate, so 50 HP and 1/minute means 500 minutes)
spiral linden
You know, Isabelle doesn't have unkillable actually....
Should I give her unkillable 2?
I'm genuinely a little unsure.
compact garden
Could go for Unkillable 1
spiral linden
That's an idea yea.
mighty hinge
yeah even unkillable 1 is powerful stuff
spiral linden
Also some idle talk around makes me wonder if I should attempt to run a gurps game or not
mighty hinge
fringe hawk
I might be interested
spiral linden
Look, I make no promises right now.
spiral linden
I would mostly limit myself to Basic (duh), Ultra-Tech, and High Tech right now?
mighty hinge
really depends on exactly what the setting/genre/theme/etc would be
spiral linden
Honestly my immediate first thought is maybe some kind of megastructure stuff.
Because that's something that interests me
Which likely means the structure itself would be TL11 or 12
mighty hinge
ooh
compact garden
Don't forget the ^
mighty hinge
what if... topopolis
okay i mean strictly speaking thats not even above TL9, but its a very cool megastructure
spiral linden
That coudl be cool. Have the players be a bunch of explorers or something on a derelict(?) mega structure
Wait I need to check something now involving Psionics
mighty hinge
a topopolis is big enough that it doesnt even need to be derelict
spiral linden
I wanted to check to see if robots could be Psis
mighty hinge
assuming an (internal) 8 km diameter and a standard cylindrical habitat that fully encircles its star (at a radius of 1 AU), thats a "length" of ~940 million km / ~584 million miles and a lateral surface area (internal "land" area, basically) of ~24 billion square km or 9 billion square miles. in other words, 46 Earths
if even 1% was uninhabited, thats still half the area of Earth
compact garden
Various topologies of big dumb object are all so fun
mighty hinge
if it was constructed out of standard 8x32 km O'Neill cylinders, thats nearly 30 million segments
compact garden
"What would you build if you had like a gazillion tons of steel and weren't at the bottom of a gravity well"
(Sometimes you need super-steel)
spiral linden
I think my main mental inspiration is always Blame
mighty hinge
also, for those who know Heaven's River, it's bigger not just because it loops on itself (three trips around the sun) its also very wide, ~1 billion mile total length and 56 mile radius means ~351 billion square miles of "land" (counting the connector mountains but the segments are 560 miles long so they represent less than a percent of the overall length)
(thats ~1787 Earths)
spiral linden
Much area to derp around in
mighty hinge
enough place to lose entire societies
spiral linden
Might be fun to find fun ancient relics and such
Unsure on stuff like...points though
mighty hinge
one billion points
spiral linden
The players are now space stations
mighty hinge
honestly, youre multiversal hyper-deities by the millions
spiral linden
I was thinking around maybe 450 to 500 though.
Wanting the pcs to be some flavor of augmented
compact garden
A pretty good starting point for high-level GURPS
spiral linden
Some flavor of augmented and/or robot
spiral linden
I'm somewhat open to ideas though
mighty hinge
space uncharted
one part "we're just doing unlicensed archeology because these are important discoveries", two parts "we are going to keep any particular cool stuff we find though"
spiral linden
I dig it
spiral linden
Could add in some kind of underlying treasure hunt
mighty hinge
also started playing D2 again recently and my boy Cerberus+1 is great for some of the new missions, so I was thinking about it and i think GURPS is one of the only games that could actually replicate how it functions and with surprising simplicity
basically a standard assault rifle except its got an ROF of 15x4
4 bullets per bullet!
HT has rules for a bunch of multiple projectile loads, but none exactly match how C+1 works
mighty hinge
the biggest problem would be deciding how much damage destiny guns do, but "whatever the closest real gun does" is probably suitable for 90%
graviton and some of the other weird energy weapons being the main outliers
spiral linden
I'm home so I can devote energy to thinking about this more
mighty hinge
the really complicated thing would be the special effects like those that trigger on kills or headshots or combos or whatever
but i think just cutting those out or simplifying them would be reasonable
compact garden
They're not really standard for GURPS but they're doable
Gimme an example, it can even be a complex one
mighty hinge
uhhh
spiral linden
ALL ROADS LEAD TO TELESTO
mighty hinge
how about Osteo Striga, that's a weird one
Kinetic SMG, 29 rounds, 600 RPM
Fires a stream of sentient, toxic projectiles that track the targeted enemy.
Landing a final blow or multiple precision hits triggers a burst that poisons nearby targets.
Poison final blows return ammo to the magazine
oh and the last one allows overflow up to 300% capacity (so 87 by default)
mighty hinge
nah
spiral linden
Because I was thinking of the game being either TL10 or TL11 and said artefacts being TL12
mighty hinge
i think mostly it depends on exactly what weapons and armor are available from UT and whether any balance adjustments are made to them
spiral linden
Oh?
mighty hinge
UT's balancing is officially acknowledged as wonky because it was one of the first 4e books and was only balanced internally (ie against other UT stuff) and even that wasnt done very well
compact garden
Kinetic SMG, 29 rounds, 600 RPM
`Fires a stream of sentient, toxic projectiles t...
The hardest part of this for me is remembering how tracking bullets work but I think UT has one of those
mighty hinge
so some stuff is weak, some stuff is overpowered, some stuff has weird stats, etc
spiral linden
Ah, is there no eratta or is there a homebrewed rebalance?
mighty hinge
yeah i guess Homing works
no official errata (itd basically be a second book) and there are various homebrews that adjust things, mainly the weapons since the armor is (largely) fine
compact garden
I think the armor could be a little weaker too since it's not quite as good as the weapons but still on the same scale
I remember the campaign where I looked at the TL10 Holdout Laser and went "yeah, this is pretty reasonable as a starting weapon" and then didn't even use 10 RoF b/c I didn't need it, stuck to 1 or 3 RoF
mighty hinge
thankfully they did include the non-powered UT armor in the armor design rules in Pyramid, so you can make new armor fairly easily and even boost the numbers if you want
compact garden
And then a bit down the line GM hands the party a TL10 Heavy Laser Pistol as loot and I was like "damn, are you sure?"
mighty hinge
but those (2) and (3) divisors are nasty
spiral linden
That's half and third, right?
mighty hinge
yeah
so the holdout is 2d(2), which means on average 7 damage gets at least one point through DR 12 (divided by 2 to only 6)
compact garden
So I take it (I'm the only one with Beam (Pistol) anyway) and use it and keep sticking to low RoFs
And then we get some boss battle and I'm like "well, better get serious" and go the full RoF 10 and cut a hole right through it
mighty hinge
also standard UT ballistic armor has two DRs, a higher value against cutting and piercing and a lower value against everything else
so a TL10 Nanoweave Vest is DR 18/6, great against guns, terrible against lasers
compact garden
The boss was a big robot with like 60 DR semi-ablative so I kinda had to
mighty hinge
though there is laser resistant armor which basically flips the relationship, good/okay against lasers, terrible/usless against guns
also largely semi-ablative (every 10 points of damage rolled reduces the DR by 1 permanently)
TL10 adaptive nanoplas is 36 (lasers, semi-ablative)/6 (other, not)
spiral linden
A (10) divisor scares me mroe than a (∞) divisor...
mighty hinge
anything with a (10) is scary shit
anything with an (∞) is wizard shit
compact garden
Maybe it was 30 semi-ablative DR? Regardless the first few shots of the burst did nothing but burn away the armor
And the last few shots of the burst are burning a hole in the rear armor XD
mighty hinge
the ∞ divisor does barely get used though, but (10) is common enough and usually attached to powerful weapons that even an RPG-7 is a threat against battlesuits
the RPG-7 using the 93mm HEAT round deals 6dx8(10) cr ex with a linked 6dx3 cr ex
a TL12 Warsuit has DR 300 that's Hardened 3 against shaped charges, that reduces the divisor by 3 steps, so 10 becomes... 2, so avg. 168 damage against DR 150.
(also since the extra damage is linked, not a follow-up, it doesn't ignore the armor.)
anyway, the other thing about TL11 is that power armor becomes fairly affordable
the "civilian" Cybersuit is only DR 40 but also only $35k and gives Lifting and Striking ST+5, Basic Move +1, Super Jump 1, climate control from -459 F to 250 F, 30 atm. of pressure support, Radiation PF 5, filter mask, hearing protection, hyperspectral visor, small radio, dynamic chameleon surface, sealed and vacuum rated, the suit is a Printed Standard Computer and runs for a week on a D cell with sunlight and a full day without.
the military version is DR 80 and $50k and adds infrared cloaking, radar stealth, tactical ESM, raises the ST bonus to 10 and Super Jump to 2, upgrades the computer to a microframe, replaces the D cell with an RTG that lasts 10 years, 100 atm. of pressure support and radiation PF 10
fringe hawk
Seems like much better value for money
spiral linden
Huh, how does starting funds work anyway
mighty hinge
well its also higher LC, 2 instead of 3
TL base amount modified by wealth level
one second, i have a chart
fringe hawk
LC?
mighty hinge
Legality Class
spiral linden
Legality Class
fringe hawk
Ahhhh
spiral linden
The 0 is peak comedy
mighty hinge
its great
also Signature Gear is half of Average per point
(but SG has a lot of caveats)
spiral linden
I think I'd be ok with TL10 for the players with 500 points
mighty hinge
at TL11, it costs 2 points of Signature Gear to get a Military Cybersuit
(with $25k left over for other stuff that you presumably also stole from the military)
spiral linden
I think the biggest caveat is that the PC would need to be some sort of cyborg or robot.
mighty hinge
thats not too hard at TL10
spiral linden
Yea that's part of the intent.
mighty hinge
could even be an uploaded mind downloaded into an android or other robot
spiral linden
Exactly
mighty hinge
standard TL10 Android is... $50k and 122 points, Living Flesh (+50% dollar cost) or Synthetic Organs (+100% dollar cost) is 0, Mind Emulation is +5
compact garden
https://i.imgur.com/hZyejJu.png
These are the default numbers but there's also a recommendation that like in modern-ish settings 80% of your lifestyle is in like your house, car, furniture, etc and only 20% is spent on adventuring gear
mighty hinge
yeah
compact garden
For a given campaign many GMs will just straight up tell you what your fun stuff budget is
spiral linden
If you're relic hunters, then a lot of job pay is going to be in the what you find
mighty hinge
(job as in like day job, though it can be "adventuring" since theres otherwise no real way to decide how much players earn)
average pay at TL10 is $5,600 per month
if you work 40 hours a week every week, thats $35 per hour
if you do one job on average every other month, that's $11,200 per job
it works out the same
spiral linden
A question I should ask myself/the players is: What does home look like for the group? A rebuilding settlement somewhere in the topopolis or do they have some kind of mobile base that they drive around in?
mighty hinge
Spaceships! Spaceships! Spaceships!
spiral linden
Hum....that's an idea
mighty hinge
i dont have any appropriate TL10 designs on hand but heres two TL9^ designs [snip]
actually lets do those individually
(i called it a colony ship but i actually designed it as essentially a passenger liner)
spiral linden
I like the Interliner I think maybe
mighty hinge
for the colony ship, even with the absurd price of fuel pellets (89% of operating costs assuming one refueling per year), it only needs 2.5 trips per year to turn a profit
(with the ticket prices and wages i pulled from the relevant books)
spiral linden
I'm just having a hard time visualizing sizes right now on either one though
mighty hinge
the interliner is about the size of a large airliner
but probably a much wider cigar/barrel shape with a similar length
the "colony ship" is... well, actually my boy Fiver is SM+13 https://i.imgur.com/X71vxR2.png
(yes, that little diagram on the spreadsheet is the primary reference for the render, by AdmiralKew)
(GRF is the lower)
spiral linden
I guess a concern I have is size/landing
mighty hinge
like on planets?
spiral linden
Well, topopolis in this case, but yea.
mighty hinge
that depends largely on design, both of those are obviously space only vessels, but the colony ship has a hangar for shuttles and whatnot (and 10,000 tons is a lot of room), some of which could be suitable for planetary landings and/or in-atmosphere flight
and Spaceships includes the relevant components and rules for that
but even fairly small ships can at least have a hangar big enough for a tiny shuttle or two
the smallest actual Spaceship you can build is SM+4 (think single engine airplane) at 10 tons, which fits neatly inside the hangar of an SM+7 (~small passenger plane)
(or 4 SM+6 hangars if you combine them)
if you consider the Life Pod in UT a kind of rudimentary shuttle (and its stats indicate it should be usable for that purpose), then it can fit inside the hangar of an SM+5
(but its limited to 0.1G acceleration and a maximum dV of... 0.6 miles per second)
(which actually isnt terrible)
spiral linden
I think if the players had a space ship to travers the topopolis, the idea would be for it to be a small mobile base.
mighty hinge
yeah thats doable
here, one of Fiver's drones is sort of close if you can imagine slotting stuff in https://i.imgur.com/ZYMKJsV.png
(the only thing thats TL11 here is the armor, fusion torches and the specific stats of the control room)
(also ignore the alternate prices, thats a different thing)
compact garden
Also speaking of Wealth and adventuring, I have sometimes considered a house rule that shares of adventuring pay are in proportion to Wealth level
spiral linden
Honestly that might be workable in a way. PArts of the ship were repaired with salvaged future-tech
mighty hinge
its not much work to build Spaceships spaceships once you get how the pieces fit together, i could hammer out something specific another time
- pick a size that determines basic ship stats
2a. you have three sections with five slots each and two free slots you can assign
2b. pick pieces and put them in sections that match - assign stats to those pieces based on the ship size
- assign additional slotless modifications and optional rules
- determine final ship stats based on all that
spiral linden
That doesn't seem too bad
mighty hinge
the most complicated part is probably dV calculations... but i have a chart for that too
the colored boxes are... various interplanetary courses mentioned in spaceships, i dont remember exactly which ones
5.6 is "get to low orbit", 7.7 is "get to orbit and then escape velocity", 12 is "escape velocity to moon in 11 hours, mars in six months, jupiter in 20 months", 4000 is Alpha Centauri in 400 years (incl. deccel)
i dont remember why i marked... 1.5 and 3.2?
but at TL10, we're probably well past that section and on the second half
even a basic TL10 fusion pulse drive gets 10 mips on a single fuel tank and a fusion rocket gets 60 mips (thats earth-mars in <2 months)
(1 mile/sec = 1,609 m/s)
spiral linden
Fuel salvaging might be interesting?
mighty hinge
yeah thats an option for a bunch of them at higher TLs
the nuclear thermal rocket and fusion rockets (rocket, torch and super torch) can use either hydrogen or water (1/3rd dV but 3x acceleration)
the mass driver can use basically anything since its just a gun
the conversion drives obviously can use literally anything but theyre magic and theres also reactionless drives that dont need fuel (besides whatever the power plant needs)
oh the ones that can use water can also use ammonia [2.9x] or methane [2.8x] as well
also if you dont mind taking forever to get anywhere, theres always fission sails
standard lightsails are 0.001G at 1 AU with Sol but get divided by the square of the distance and multiplied by relative luminosity and also only away from the star, magsails/plasma sails are 0.001G but can't exceed 375 mps and don't work in interstellar space
magsails are actually not terrible because its free dV but they arent very competitive past TL9
anyway i have to go do the dishes and take out the garbage and then go to bed so buh-byyyyye
spiral linden
Have fun!
mighty hinge
no!!!
(im having dessert first)
i do have a follow thought
if the topopolis is big enough (in terms of radius), has openly connected sections and has a way to get large (relatively) ships inside, the PC spaceship or shuttle could allow them to travel around inside as well
even if its designed for vacuum, at a certain diameter the center of the cylinder will be in vacuum unless the atmosphere is extremely thick
though theres probably a sun tube and/or other infrastructure at the center but the margin of safety there also depends on radius
mighty hinge
oh also, an important thing about spaceships is that they are very expensive. even a tiny ship is going to cost hundreds of thousands, millions if its got ftl, weapons, good armor or other expensive systems
okay i did actually chart this out before
(thr f.rocket/pulse and adv. pulse columns are the final prices)
oh and its 6 cargo sections (30% of total tonnage)
obviously the armor is about half the price and you could cut it down a lot by getting cheaper armor or forgoing it all together
oh also TL10
mighty hinge
anyway, for more practical considerations
assuming the base ship is only for the party and a few NPCs and people don't mind sharing rooms, an SM+6 or 7 should be sufficient
thats 1 or 2 cabins per habitat and up to two people per cabin
you can also replace two standard cabins with one luxury cabin (still just two people) or one cabin with one bunkroom (four people)
so something like SM+7 ship, two habitats, one luxury cabin, one cabin and one bunkroom for a max occupancy of 8
spiral linden
I think SM+7 would be reasonable
mighty hinge
heres a quick rough design https://i.imgur.com/BXX888u.png
6 cabins, up to 12 occupants
60 tons of cargo space
10 ton hangar, an SM+4 spaceship or other vehicles
fusion torch [TL10^]
stardrive [TL^]
contragravity lifter, allowing it to ignore up to 10G of gravity for the purposes of flying or reaching orbit
fusion reactor to power both the stardrive and lifter (though powering both at the same time isnt strictly necessary)
streamlined for better performance in atmosphere (at the expense of reduced armor), winged for even better, artificial gravity for comfort
additional expenses, hydrogen is $2k per ton (so $90k for a full refuel), standard rations cost $1000 per ton and provides 500 man-days (so ~41 days each with a full crew)
other engine options
TL10 fusion rocket would provide 4x dV [60 per tank] but only 1% acceleration
TL10 Adv. Fusion Pulse would almost double that [100 per tank] but fuel pellets are $50k per ton
TL10 Antimatter Plasma Rocket or Torch(^) is better still [120 per tank] but uses antimatter boosted hydrogen (read: grams per ton)
spiral linden
Antimatter plasma sounds absolutely wild
I assume Cargo Holds are just for most purposes empty space?
Can hydrogen be scooped by the way?
mighty hinge
cargo holds are effectively empty space, yeah (and are also free if you dont add either the refrigerated or shielded options)
though having a cargo hold in a section is required to have the associated "cargo bay doors", which actually let you get large items into the ship
and yes, using the Chemical Refinery system, Chemical Refinery (TL7): Different types are possible, but the most common spacecraft type processes ice or water into hydrogen and oxygen for rocket fuel or reaction mass. It is rated for the tons of fuel refined per system per hour.
theres nothing about actually scooping or otherwise acquiring gaseous hydrogen but in Spaceships 6 theres a gas giant mining ship that harvests helium-3 that is just described as having pumps as part of the refineries
note that saturns atmosphere is >90% hydrogen so scooping that would be around ~0.9 tons per 1 ton of harvesting rate
for an SM+7, 5 tons per hour by default
(though personally i feel the Slower Industrial Systems rule from S7 makes a lot of sense, reducing on mining, refining and factories from "per hour" to "per day")
so a single refinery would let that ship completely refuel in ~10 hours (or days)
(50 tons of atmo for 45 tons of hydrogen)
(also because everything scales, this will remain relatively consistent, 1 refinery = either 3 or 3.3_ hours per fuel tank)
mighty hinge
anyway, trying to think about character ideas for this and, yknow, i could....
honestly surprised i havent tried to build FOEMIND in GURPS before
mighty hinge
okay, downside to paying for a cool robot body with points, armor is expensive
DR 80 is 240 points (w/ Can't Wear Armor)
i think this is the correct way to model having four tentacular limbs that you can either walk on or use as hands? https://i.imgur.com/S5U5fck.png
and i feel like i wouldnt also take one of the Legless options since that seems to be included in Foot Manipulators
spiral linden
anyway, trying to think about character ideas for this and, yknow, i could....
Imagining one of these going through ruins is funny
mighty hinge
this is very expensive but also why not be a little spaceship https://i.imgur.com/1iTbMbq.png
(Move 10 = 1 g acceleration)
oh and i changed it to only air move 10, since thats 20 MPH
am i already 160 points over budget? yes. will this stop me? no.
also i went with 10 levels of EM(S) because a TL10^ Fusion Torch with the high thrust option would get 7.5 mips on a single tank
this is very generous to what FOEMIND actually had but im not super focused on getting it exact
spiral linden
What books is all of this from anyway?
mighty hinge
which thing specifically?
extra arm, enhanced move and flight are all Basic (incl. modifiers)
the thing about the fusion torch is Spaceships
spiral linden
Ah I haven' tlooked much at Spaceships
mighty hinge
also FOEMIND's full Injury Tolerance is very silly https://i.imgur.com/jErSj80.png
because hes just a ball with arms
spiral linden
Normal Injury Tolerance things
mighty hinge
normal killbot things
compact garden
No Vitals?
I assumed there were important bits in the ball
Even if they're mechanical instead of biological
mighty hinge
oh i didnt mean to include that
and no head technically includes No Brain but its more "the computer is very centrally located such that its not a weakpoint"
compact garden
No Eyes also implies no optical/etc sensors
compact garden
Ah, check
mighty hinge
and its "You lack eyes or other vulnerable optics"
compact garden
Don't forget 360 vision and enhanced tracking if you want them
mighty hinge
ye
360 vision, scanning sense (radar, extended arc 360, multi-mode, targeting), hyperspectral vision
mighty hinge
very expensive first pass
(thats 1233 total)
240 is the DR, 110 is space flight
spiral linden
A little bit overbudget
mighty hinge
just a smidge but thats FOEMIND for ya
obviously this doesnt include skills but it also doesnt include weapons (besides the talons)
which at this point where im paying for everything, it probably should
which is also VERY expensive
ex: a TL10 laser rifle https://i.imgur.com/UXPtCf2.png
i forgot to include the (2) in the statline but its in the advantage
(the laser rifles actual range is 700/2100 but the range increases dont line up so i figured thats close enough)
compact garden
And you also don’t have the reputation or wealth associated with being a one-bot security company
mighty hinge
yeah
also, "uses" for limited use means "how many times can you use the full RoF", so 10x8.3=83 [5-10 at -10%], Fast Reload means 3-5 seconds to replace that amount by replacing the ammo/whatever [-10% -> -5%]
more than 10 "uses" means no discount, which a bunch of UT weapons would have
also as Powers demonstrates, even a "basic" assault rifle is 63 points https://i.imgur.com/Ky9WE94.png
(500/5000 for the range is generous but not excessive, a little low on the 1/2D, a little high on the Max)
also only Acc 3, which is low
spiral linden
How many points are you at now?
mighty hinge
oh sorry, the base Acc is 3, so Acc 5, thats good
i didnt include the laser rifle so still 1233
mostly i just wanted to feel out how expensive FOEMIND was
spiral linden
And here I thought Iris and Isabelle were crazy
mighty hinge
DR is expensive and he has a lot of overlapping abilities, which a more experienced builder could probably find a way to optimize to lower the costs but yknow
anyway, cutting back and modifying some things to be closer to the droideka concept (art also by Malkshake for me), only 393 points now https://i.imgur.com/teN4wHl.png
though without any real "personal" advantages or disadvantages
(also the injury tolerance in Machine was reduced to the baseline No Blood, Unliving)
and without skills, obviously
spiral linden
That seems rather nice so far
I assume 107 points would be more than enough for skills?
mighty hinge
should be
now a much funnier but also more complicated (both design-wise and in play) concept is "the ship's AI that can only join the party by remotely controlling robots", which means i'd basically only have to pay for the AI's mental abilities with points and both the ship and robots would just be equipment
spiral linden
That does sound funny
mighty hinge
(is this a character concept i stole from when i was playing around mongoose traveller? yes but that wont stop me.)
the main limitation would be 1. actually having a supply of good robots 2. maintaining communication
spiral linden
So you envision this character as a salvager?
mighty hinge
huh?
spiral linden
Typo sorry. I just noticed the name
mighty hinge
oh yeah, since i assume thats the campaign concept
(the original idea for the actual Droideka OC was that he was a retrofit/demilitarized unit that survived the Clone Wars and is now working as a dockworker/deliveryman in the Imperial era)
mighty hinge
hmm, would a collection of robot bodies count as Puppets?
Digital Possession is a thing and they wouldn't be too expensive as Allies
okay i lied theyre very expensive
oh wait, hello
because the robots are nonsentient, that means they'll have one of the cheaper (negative) machine intelligence lenses, which will cut their costs dramatically
Non-Volitional is -38, Weak Dedicated is -83 and Drone is -255
(Drone is 0 IQ so it cant do anything without being controlled)
the TL10 Warbot (Walking Tank) would be 606 points, but with Drone its only 351! which is under the 100% threshold
spiral linden
Wild
mighty hinge
TL10 Military Android (w/ any 0 point biomorphic lens) is 602, so it can also get under 500 with Drone
a standard Android is 123, so its already under 25%
a single military android or warbot is Ally [100%, Appears Constantly, Minion (IQ 0 or Slave Mentality)] for 20 points, a group of 6-10 regular androids is [25%, Appears Constantly, Minion (IQ 0 or Slave Mentality)] for 24 points
(both Non-Volitional AI and Weak Dedicated include Automaton which includes Slave Mentality)
so 44 points gets a combat rated "main" body and 6-10 "civilian" bodies
also i am envisioning this AI as a big desktop computer on wheels that just plugs into the ship when he needs to control it or use its systems
(which is most of the time)
being completely immobile would be even cheaper (-50 instead of -30) but i like the idea he can actually move around and isnt part of the ship (either originally or currently)
spiral linden
Moving is probably good
mighty hinge
oh also Combat Androids are "only" $200K and regular Androids are $50K, so 4 and 1 points of Signature Gear respectively, if i didnt want to spend regular money on them, which is probably appropriate for Ally/Puppets
(so 14 points for 1 combat, 10 regular)
mighty hinge
current thought is that he's designed to fill most roles aboard the ship if needed but not specialized towards anything specific (besides the advantage of a high IQ)
i actually had more room leftover than i expected but i did give him a lot of disadvantages
(also he's SM-1 despite being 2 feet tall because he's basically a cube, so he gets +2 effective SM)
and the weight is the 40 lbs for a microframe plus Other Stuff
oh i just noticed he has 2 HT, that's very wrong
should be 12 for 20 points instead, so 28 unspent, not 128
(oh and "Electronics" on the skill list is a bunch of Electronics Operations and Electronics Repair specialties, one point each all, at 17)
spiral linden
https://i.imgur.com/putQvyW.png https://i.imgur.com/0vFSF89.png
Also looking over this I'm not sure if I should be scared or not
mighty hinge
hm?
spiral linden
OH wait this is what the Ship AI could be, I'm a derp
mighty hinge
oh also looking at it again i realized i forgot that telecommunication (radio) only has a 10 mile range by default, so that needs Increased Range; +60% for 100x means 1,000 mile range and 22 points
actually thats probably too high for his internal comms, 20x for 200 miles matches the TL10 Medium Radio [20 points]
and obviously he can use the ship's comms instead when he's plugged in
spiral linden
That's where Possession comes in right?
mighty hinge
yeah Telecom + Mindlink + Possession + Allies + Puppet = remotely controlled bodies
oh also, rediscovered that Future History has a relevant racial template Prosthetic Body https://i.imgur.com/f3tFKsh.png
mostly similar to the Android in UT which can also be used as a replacement body but more fit for purpose
spiral linden
Oh shit this looks almost perfect I think?
mighty hinge
this is a GITS style brain-in-jar cyborg body but could be swapped to be a robot brain body fairly easily
spiral linden
I feel like this would be a great thing to know about for this theoretical game
mighty hinge
(pretty much just dropping the nutrient solution and aging and adding Doesn't Breathe)
spiral linden
I'll have to remember Future HIstory
spiral linden
Becauyse if I decide to convert more OCs to GURPS I have at least one that would need that
mighty hinge
FH is mostly GM advice about planning and describing future societies
spiral linden
mighty hinge
also just because i had the thought; 50 AU brachistochrone [constant acceleration, flip, constant deceleration] requirements and times https://i.imgur.com/a0lozsm.png
(assuming only one drive)
the 12^ Fusion Torch one isn't actually possible, because that should would be 19 Fuel Tanks and the Fusion Torch, with nothing else
well... maybe possible
spiral linden
Super Conversion Torch sounds funny
mighty hinge
you need 7410 mips and 19 fuel tanks gets you 8550. so you might be able to have a few smaller fuel tanks and slot something into the gap
(you can replace a single system of SM+X with three of SM+(X-1), with reduced performance)
not sure how that works out with the fuel tank multipliers
and yeah, the conversion and super conversion torches are matter-to-energy drives
their fuel is Yes
Pion Rockets and Torches are 1:1 matter/antimatter
also 50 AU is arbitrary but its about as far as youd ever need to fly inside a solar system unless you were going the long away around
theres a reason reactionless is so good even if its low acceleration
like the standard reactionless is 0.5G at TL10, so its equivalent to the TL12^ Fusion Torch except it needs no fuel tanks, just a power plant
1 month or less to anywhere in the solar system
spiral linden
I did finally open up Spaceships for the first time
spiral linden
Ice armor sounds so funny
spiral linden
Yea that would be good idea
I'm going to look over that craft you designed again now that I have the book
Because my thyinking brain is on
Because I'm thinking since this is largely a party of salvagers I'm wondering if it'd be possible for the ship to have at least one piece of TL11^ kit
mighty hinge
could be the stardrive
FTL as available tech but mostly scavenged or purchased from older/bigger civs
spiral linden
I do like that idea. Maybe the TL11^ Super Fusion reactors are EXTRMELY valuable if found.
Which that could be a whole scenario
Find out which section of the topopolis has it and go from there
mighty hinge
had a thought about vehicles since i remember Pyramid added wheels so heres an ATV thing https://i.imgur.com/7DjqsXX.png
a regular car is like, SM+3, so this is about big pickup/small truck size
the turbines run on hydrox, so its fairly easy to refuel
and its, uh, 0.25 tons to refuel both, i think
2 dDR is essentially nothing in Spaceships, but it is still 20 DR
spiral linden
Oh this looks nice
mighty hinge
UT has perfectly serviceable vehicles already but yknow, proof of concept for custom stuff
actual size on any hypothetical ground vehicle is obviously limited by the size of the ship and its hangar (if any)
mighty hinge
oh also, relevant art
Neil Blevin's Topopolis for the Megastructures book
and for another insanely massive one but on a slightly more comprehensible scale, the Rungworld https://www.artstation.com/artwork/Qb8x8
if these are full sized CNT MK Cylinders, then thats a radius of ~700 miles and a height of ~7000 miles, so each has an internal surface of about 15% that of Earth
(>8 United Stateses or Chinas)
and you can also put them around a star as well, obviously
obviously these are less connected than a topopolis but you could still feasibly design them so walking between them is possible (if difficult because of the distances involved)
mighty hinge
oh also, another logistical thought, oneill cylinders (and thus topopoli) are big enough that they can theoretically run entirely on "local" solar. if you have a non-rotating outer structure (good for radiation and impact protection and makes rotating the cylinder easier), you can cover the outside in solar panels on the side facing the sun, even at only 100 w/m2 (~10% efficiency at Sol ~1 AU), a 4 km x 30 km area of panels provides 12 gigawatts
at the very least, this would provide the power required for lighting
spiral linden
Today's brain bees are telling me to convert another OC to GURPS
mighty hinge
do it
compact garden
Gloria?
spiral linden
No probably not Gloria
Possibly Felicia or my nerf robot?
One is probably easier than the other
mighty hinge
Innate Attack (1d-5, armor divisor (0.1), no knockback, no wounding, no blunt trauma)
spiral linden
Lol
mighty hinge
also fun fact about <1 armor divisor, no DR counts as DR 1 against it
mighty hinge
its pretty rare though
i think most of the uses are on afflictions (so your armor provides a bigger bonus on the save)
spiral linden
She's very much made of plastic and nerf parts though.
mighty hinge
hmm
Fragile (Brittle)?
though that does involve parts being destroyed which is maybe too much
spiral linden
Possibly. She's not meant for real combat, just fun nerf combat.
Also she's somehow sapient despite running on a raspberry pi
mighty hinge
that happens sometimes
speaking of OCs to build in GURPS, i really should do Hunter and Killer, who i absolutely cannot share art of here because i only have one picture of each and they are fully NSFW
Hunter is a ~9 ft tall alien-"horse" guy who is like, (baseline) Hulk level strong and also has unlimited extremely fast regeneration thanks to being wirelessly linked to a superscience device that feeds him pure energy
he's not actually very tough but even if you blow his head off with a rocket, he probably won't even fall over before his head regrows
Killer is his pet/friend/coworker Alien Monster/Lab Experiment/Weird Cyborg that's like, big dog sized and has nearly as few morals as Hunter (which is impressive)
Hunter is the leader of a band of space mercenaries (the rest of whom are basically just normal scifi grunts) that roam around space looking for trouble to get rich off of
spiral linden
You know, thinking about I already know one trait I'd give Nerya up there. Night Blindness
Also One Eye
mighty hinge
okay good, i did post a picture of Hunter's ship (stolen from Traveller) https://i.imgur.com/27TwL6N.png
its a brick but its a brick that works
spiral linden
Because in the pictures you can see she only has the one optical sensor
mighty hinge
ya
spiral linden
And night blindness because its a common visual sensor that isn't designed for night vision.
I do have Another OC that I might want to convert as well though.
Possibly maybe making a template? Because aside from specific characters, its a standard model that the company the OC owns produces.
The fun part is probably all of the different visual sensors.
I think I'm going to use the Android template as a start for her from UT and then customize it for her model.
She should be at least TL10
spiral linden
This is what I'm looking at so far.
spiral linden
Also grumble at mind emulation computing costs
compact garden
Don't gotta use the Complexity system from UT at all if it doesn't fit your setting vibe
spiral linden
This is wh at the template is at now.
spiral linden
Had to add Telescopic Vision as well
spiral linden
Started working on Klara proper though.
I...think Multimillionare 2 is enough for her? She's the sole owner of a massive robotics company.
mighty hinge
oh also, i dont remember where i read it, but i THINK that "Complexity-limited IQ" refers to racial IQ, not individual IQ but don't quote me on that as a hard rule
ah its actually right in UT
so humans are Complexity 9 as a Mind Emulation
spiral linden
I thought human average was 10? Wouldn't that be complexity 8?
mighty hinge
its (IQ/2)+4 for mind emulation
volitional AI is (IQ/2)+3, which is probably what youre thinking of
[technically these should be rounded up but yknow] https://i.imgur.com/MpPPhyE.png
(an AI with IQ 6+ isn't automatically sapient, thats just the minimum)
spiral linden
My UT book lists (IQ+5)/2 for the complexity
mighty hinge
what version is it listed as on page 1?
mighty hinge
yeah, should be 3.2 https://i.imgur.com/tECEOTX.png
a lot of the UT stuff in GCS hasn't been updated in a long time
ive personally submitted a few corrections
spiral linden
Weird I just had a master library update today
mighty hinge
no, i mean the master library itself is wrong and hasnt been fixed
UT is fairly low on the priority list from what i know
which is also why Loadouts: Starship Crew only has semi-functional versions of the TL11 lists, because someone did those themselves for a game and submitted them
(and also because L:SC has a bunch of problems)
spiral linden
That means for a TL computer in a robot it would need to be a Genius Personal Computer I believe
mighty hinge
yeah genius personal or a fast microframe
which is doable, the UT combat android has a microframe
spiral linden
That's a quick text change
But yea voidium drones are designed to hold emulated minds
Klara even has a free program for trans people to get uploaded onto a body free of cost
spiral linden
Because despite being dumb wealthy she throws as much money as she can at trans rights and services
mighty hinge
id say the "cost" is being turned into a faceless drone but i know people whod pay for that
spiral linden
Yea, just customize the face later
Or other parts. I have a voidium drone OC that has hair and hooves.
Also a more masc oriented frame
spiral linden
Question though: for the price of the body, how is that calculated?
Is it just a page I missed possibly?
I might have as I was like half awake working on this last night
mighty hinge
unfortunately something GURPS 4e is lacking
if you dont mind doing a LOT more fiddly math, you can check out GURPS 3e's Robots book
spiral linden
I might just call it 50 or 75k and call it good then
mighty hinge
thats probably reasonable
spiral linden
At some point I might work on variant lenses for the drone but the vast majority are as shown
spiral linden
I'll probably look over advantages for Klara and figure out exactly how wealthy she should be
spiral linden
I think this should be the final final™ version of it?
mighty hinge
new (space scav) character thought; human-style android that just serves as an interface for a bigger mech body
(like Ghor from Metroid Prime 3)
circumvents issues normally associated with having a fragile human in the mech but doesn't require you to actually swap between bodies
spiral linden
Oh that could be interesting and cool
mighty hinge
unrelated; had a thought about UT missiles and decided to do a quick compare; TL11 100mm Tactical Missile Launcher Shaped Charge vs. the modern Javelin's MS-HEAT
the TL9 and TL10 are both actually weaker (if you count both stages together)
however, the TML has a range of 3000/15000 while the Javelin is only 220/2200
which also means the Javelin travels at ~450 MPH (Mach ~0.6) while the TML goes at fucking 6000 MPH / Mach 8
also the Javelin has a Homing skill of 10 (+6 Acc) while the TML is 14/15/16 (+3 Acc) if its using the Multi-Spectral Homing option
and it can also fire the Striker Missile, which is a loitering muntion / missile drone
fun fact, the smallest missiles in Spaceships are 160mm and an SM+4 fighter can carry 5 of them per Major Weapon system
and then there's HEMP; which for 100mm is 6dx12(10) at TL10, 7dx13(10) at TL11
https://i.imgur.com/lspzvje.png
HEMP's advantage is that it's available for smaller rounds, so not immediately relevant here
but a 10mm pistol firing 8d(5) is scary stuff
oh and TL11 makes it 10d(5)
(well, 10d+1 but 10d)
also im focusing on TL11 specifically because im thinking about this in respect to my boy Fiver and his interactions with Earth's military
also importantly 10mm is where the TL9 Storm Carbine is, which is an assault rifle that normally does 7d, so HEMP is actually both stronger [damage and divisor] and cheaper than solid AP rounds
and while he does have rainbow lasers, they're only (3) and the strongest portable one is the gatling at 12d
the blasters are (5) but a Storm Carbine with HEMP is 10d(5) with 50 rounds at 8 lbs while the Heavy Blaster is 8d(5) with 20 rounds at 20 lbs
but also the blaster is 10+4 Acc while the Storm Carbine is only 4(+4 if you had an ETS)
idk im rambling now
spiral linden
Rambling is good. I'm slowly asborbing this
mighty hinge
Many Options
oh superscience also adds Plasma and Fusion guns, which are higher damage but only (2)
the TL10^ Heavy Plasma Gun is 3dx5(2)
the TL11^ Heavy Fusion Gun is 20d(2)
both 20 shots at 20 lbs with slightly worse range and Acc than the Heavy Blaster
but they do burn explosive instead of burn surge
spiral linden
Oh I wonder if I should maybe look in to finding a good fit for the One Voidium weapon I had art done of.
mighty hinge
laser or railgun?
spiral linden
The original intent was some sort of energy smg
mighty hinge
ah okay
spiral linden
But I'm open to either
mighty hinge
options:
infrared laser/blue-green laser/UV laser/rainbow laser (+pulse)
electrolasers (laser tasers!) which can be less-lethal or lethal (both do work on machines)
blasters (charged particle beams), also have a less-lethal add-on
plasma/fusion as mentioned
i think thats everything that might fit, gamma-ray and x-ray lasers are useless in atmo, microwave weapons are... weird and very different, the sonic weapons are also very different, i highly doubt its a gravity/force or any of the infinite divisor stuff or the neural/mind disruptors
spiral linden
I could just make it a Gauss PDW
mighty hinge
yeah for the projectile weapons the EM guns make the most sense straight up, thats simpler
spiral linden
Especially since Voidium is roughly TL10
Would also make it simple for what weapons their military and security would use
spiral linden
Now I wish I could play a voidium drone in a game damn it
mighty hinge
oh also, because a youtube video reminded me, another megastructure concept, a much less plausible one for me but theoretically feasible especially if you allow superscience (mainly artificial gravity)
shellworlds!
spiral linden
Ah yes, for when I want to run a Septerra Core campaign
mighty hinge
its a planet with a planet inside it with a planet inside it with a planet inside it-
and you can play around with the separation of the layers and the functions of them and so on
spiral linden
I think Torin's Passage was also a shell world as well
mighty hinge
the art on dA i linked is based on Sursamen, from Matter (from The Culture)
The shells were fitted with thermonuclear artificial stars which either stayed fixed (Fixstars) or rotated (Rollstars) around the ceilings of each shell on semi-regular paths. Access between the shells was through the huge 14-kilometer wide access Towers using Scend Ships.
Matter is very interesting because the main protagonist is the prince of a medieval fantasy kingdom (the Sarl) just having recently developed gunpowder weaponry
and then because of The War, he winds up leaving and having to deal with all the various aliens that have various claims of ownership over Sursamen and the space beyond and then their political connections beyond that and so on
the funniest culture shock for him (no pun intended) is when he finally gets to the surface and goes "oh, there's no ceiling"
not quite as heavy on the medievalisms as Inversions, of course, but that one is set on an uncontacted (but not unContacted) and fairly ordinary world
spiral linden
I see I see
mighty hinge
anyway my point was uh
oh yeah, you can fit a LOT of stuff into a shellworld
while still having it be fairly planet-like from the perspective of an inhabitant but also having distinct separation between layers
mighty hinge
building another existing OC; being a member of a military (Rank, Duty and Allies) probably precludes taking an opposing military as an Enemy unless they're very personally targeting you, right?
limber mason
depends on the genre
like captain america during ww2 has Enemy (Hydra)
but that's because Hydra is an org inside of germany and it's pulpy
mighty hinge
specifically its a Halo OC, a Swords of Sanghelios Shipmaster during the post-war era (2552-2558)
limber mason
i'd say you couldn't take Enemy (Opfor)
but you could take Enemy (Sons of the Halo) or whatever the spinter group is actually called
compact garden
building another existing OC; being a member of a military (Rank, Duty and Allie...
I would say that Enemy counts if you might encounter them outside of your Duty
limber mason
yeah exactly
mighty hinge
and the Enemy would be Covenant Remnants, but i think thats both too broad to consider a single organization and not specifically targeting him
limber mason
i think i'd let you have a single NPC enemy
compact garden
Like if it was Cap fighting general WW2 Nazis and sometimes Hydra shows up to fight Cap on top of the Nazi problem, Hydra counts as an enemy
But if the campaign then pivoted into fighting Hydra all the time, as GM I would tell the player to pick a new disadvantage for the same points (or pay it off)
limber mason
i'd just let them get away with the points
hardly their fault if a disadv falls off
compact garden
But if Cap's player decided they want a specific Hydra commander as a replacement enemy in the Hydra arc, I'd go sure that's legit
mighty hinge
also actually thinking about it, he shouldnt need Allies for his own forces, i dont know why i thought that
i am keeping the two ally groups; just making it his officers (primarily his two Hunter bodyguards) and the Spartan fireteam [its a joint taskforce]
mainly because both would have high point values
compact garden
A whole Spartan fireteam might be worth more than is legal for allies
mighty hinge
well im currently assuming he's ~400 points personally so at 75% each, they'd be ~300 points
3 points for 75% and exactly 6 of them so the 6-10 group for x6 for a total of 18 points
(Appears Fairly Often 9-, x1)
his guys are 100%, 6-10, 15- for 90 points
(the 2 Hunters plus some other guys as needed)
oh wait, hmm, i just re-read the wording on Ally Groups
For a group of more than five identical and interchangeable allies that share a single character sheet
that doesnt work for either group
i guess this is technically legal? https://i.imgur.com/okpRSy0.png
(i havent named any of the Spartans yet because thats six more entire OCs)
compact garden
As individual allies, you'd RAW also roll them individually
mighty hinge
that's fine actually, i call the Hunters bodyguards but theyre just part of his forces
and the Spartans' availability is entirely contingent on how cooperative the UNSC side of the taskforce wants to be
so the actual appearance rating here is less "can they be deployed in a military operation" and more "can they be deployed exactly and exclusively where he wants them"
see Space Marine 2: "i'd like ten guys" "ill give you two"
mighty hinge
hmm, what category do you think the Needler and "Covenant Carbine" fall into?
would they be Guns?
probably Guns (Rifle) for the carbine, since while it does have weird ammo it is technically just a rifle
the Needler... Guns (Needler) feels too specific, Guns (Gyroc) doesn't seem quite right but its probably closest
also the Needler is so fucking big https://i.imgur.com/52poQYY.jpeg
(the actual size actual size prop version, as opposed to the incorrect size actual size prop version)
spiral linden
What in the world
mighty hinge
Sangheili are big boys!
spiral linden
Is it really that huge?
mighty hinge
you have to remember they average 8 feet tall
(this guy is ~6')
and next to a Spartan-III https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/2/29/Halo_Reach_Biped_Comparison.png
spiral linden
That's wild and cool
mighty hinge
(Noble Six is nominally 6'9")
spiral linden
Video game scales are weird
mighty hinge
well the thing in Halo is that they do actually scale your character height accurately, its just you're either Chief or Six except in ODST
so everyone looks smaller
and they often avoid actually putting Sangheili too close to humans in most shots to avoid the size discrepancy being too obvious
my funniest example of this is the promo shots for Halo 3 https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/d/d9/H3_John_and_Thel_Back_to_back.jpg https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/d/d1/Halo_3_-_Cooperative.jpg
where they intentionally place the Sangheili behind Chief and angle the camera up
spiral linden
That's a godo camera trick
mighty hinge
because Chief is 7'2" in armor and Thel is 7'10"
Usze (left) and N'tho (right) are 7'11" canonically, though i think they're the same height in-game
(players 3 and 4 in co-op)
spiral linden
I love how they have their own names as well
mighty hinge
theyre canon characters! they even come back in the books
mainly Hunters in the Dark, where the two of them and two Spartan-IVs get sent back to the Ark
anyway
600 is higher than I planned but yknow
mighty hinge
also related to how big Covenant weapons are
Halo ships in general are massive https://i.imgur.com/PifQ36m.jpeg
RAW, the middle ship there (Jeht's "flagship" for his fleet of three) is SM+18
spiral linden
That's wild
mighty hinge
then theres this shit https://i.imgur.com/y57Hnnj.png
the Sh'wada-pattern supercarrier Long Night of Solace is 28,960 meters long and 11,447 meters wide at the widest
oh and 3,563 meters tall as well
this particular ship is actually relevant because Jeht is a relative (of no specific detail) of Rho 'Barutamee, Shipmaster of the Long Night of Solace and Supreme Commander of the Fleet of Valiant Prudence that led the attack on Reach
making him a relative of Rho is barely anything because Rho is a non-character, he literally doesn't even appear in Reach even though you have a whole level about the LNoS and he dies when you blow it up and most of his lore comes from the dead minis game Fleet Battles
spiral linden
Yopu're kidding right?
mighty hinge
oh sorry, my mistake, you never actually board the LNoS
the mission of that name is aboard the Ardent Prayer, which you take control of and then fly into position near the LNoS
you do fight the Shipmaster of the Ardent Prayer though, the only named Sangheili General, Ardo 'Moretumee https://halo.wiki.gallery/images/f/fb/HR_Ardo.png
also just realized i never posted Jeht
(by Jose Connolly/RatDadJoe)
limber mason
Maaan
i don't got any blorbos to make
I was thinking i'd get in on this and just kinda blanked
earnest notch
Cross-posting/linking here at Lusunati's direction: #tabletop-discussion message
spiral linden
Working on some kind of military Voidium Drone OC
spiral linden
I can't decide if I want him/her to be specifically attacked to a unit or they're more of a mercencary
spiral linden
OH my god the equipment modifier for superfine vibroblade isn't finished
mighty hinge
its just the cost, you have to adjust the damage yourself
also remember vibroblades have an on and off state, so both versions of the damage should be listed
spiral linden
OOOhhhh alright
I wonder, is it possible to have GCS list out all of the different damges if you have different grenades?
mighty hinge
yeah you just need to put them in the main equipment section and it should list them all as weapons
spiral linden
Huh, I can't find 25mmG
mighty hinge
does seem to be missing
spiral linden
Trying to build the 25mmG HEMP grenades, but I'm unsure how to make the linked damage show up
mighty hinge
you just have to make a second weapon
for example https://i.imgur.com/JUxyTiR.png
same with Follow-Up
spiral linden
Like thus?
mighty hinge
ya
spiral linden
Also uhhhhh armor is silly
mighty hinge
it be like that
spiral linden
This is traits and skills right now
And others
I might increase the strength of the basic Voidium model though
OH idea
I can use Lifting ST for increasing encumbrance, duh
I'm very smart
I can probably drop some skills by 2 points and get them right at 500 points if I wanted
mighty hinge
more halo thoughts; MJOLNIR is probably similar to TL9 Powered Combat Armor, DR 50/70; enough to stop nearly all (<=TL9) small arms without difficulty, at least without AP ammunition
this also means that Covenant energy weapons are probably a mixture between GURPS blasters and plasma
the blaster pistol is 3d(5); so effective avg. 52.5
the plasma pistol is 7d(3); so effective avg. 53
mighty hinge
small arms is anything a person can carry and use on their own (more or less)
DR 50 is sufficient to stop up to .50 BMG (on average)
limber mason
Oh well that doesn't make a tonne of sense imo
Mostly because the marine's assault rifles kill a spartan with enough fire
And the spartans are considered counterinsurgency operatives for human rebels
As seen in the first level of reach
mighty hinge
so there is an important seperation between gameplay and lore; which even Bungie has said is favored quite heavily towards humans for gameplay balance reasons
MJOLNIR is canonically nearly immune to most human firearms
and covenant weapons are canonically significantly more powerful than they are in the game as well
so in-game; human and cov weapons ~equal; in-lore human weapons <<< cov weapons
limber mason
Mm. Fair then
mighty hinge
however, the official lore does provide a fairly simply reason for at least the assault rifles effectiveness, its officially loaded with AP rounds by default
which, if we allow TL9 AP ammo, is just a divisor of 2 with no damage penalty
bringing the assault rifle from 7d, average 24.5 [the same as real world 7.62x51mm rifles with long barrels] to 7d(2), effective average 49
limber mason
Man this game scares me
mighty hinge
[M134 minigun, FN MAG, FN FAL, M60, M14, G3, FN SCAR, etc]
now the main concern is actually covenant armor
limber mason
Hmm.
mighty hinge
they have the advantage of 1. energy shields (easily handled, not a problem) and 2. canonically not able to reliably block the AR loaded with AP rounds once those shields are down
(for Sangheili specifically)
so we know it should be less than 50 in some locations
and conveniently, there is something in UT that lines up pretty closely; the TL11 Cybersuit
DR 40 on all locations but flexible; which can be solved (in this hypothetical) by adding solid plates instead of leaving the suit bare
for the energy shield; the Personal Force Screen is DR 60 but semi-ablative, so for any damage it blocks, every 10 points reduces the DR by 1 and it heals 6 per second
so you need to be dealing more than 60 per second to bring it down, which sounds like a lot except GURPS doesn't need automatic fire
so avg. 49 damage per bullet x 10 rounds per second = up to 490 damage per second
(well, thats not strictly true because thats not how armor divisors interact here but you get the idea)
spiral linden
Wild question: How does Hollow Point interact with a TL10 railgun
A TL10 Gauss Rilfe has a divisor of (3), but hollow point says it adds a (.5) divsor.
If it said replaced like other types I would understand
mighty hinge
yeah i think it would replace the original divisor
also funnily that mention about not having problems expanding is in direct reference to an option rule in HT that already technically exempts TL9+ HP ammo
At the GM's option, the round only expands and gets its improved damage type on a roll of TL-3 or less on 1d.
so at TL9, that's, yknow, 6 or less
mighty hinge
also even with the (0.5), EM guns are pretty scary because their main disadvantage is dealing mainly small piercing
spiral linden
Yea, that's why I was considering it
mighty hinge
and obviously they (mostly) cant use most of the Cool Ammo For Cool Guns (10mm+)
spiral linden
No, but that's why the underbarrel has a line for HEMP grenades
mighty hinge
exactly
the underbarrel can also be a shotgun, since you can use Shotshells with grenade launchers
for the UB EMGL... it'd be 1d pi / 1x9 / 180/1100
which is, damage wise, partway between a 20 gauge buckshot [1d pi but x7] and 12 gauge buckshot [1d+1 pi but x9]
(so actually pretty good)
spiral linden
Oh that could be fun
mighty hinge
and obviously the default ammo is functionally a slug/bullet/whatever
spiral linden
Sometimes you just gotta use the big slug
mighty hinge
additional fun fact; (launched) grenades can be homing
spiral linden
mighty hinge
any projectile can be homing as long as its big enough to fit one of the homing options
at TL10, thats 10mm+ for infrared and 25mm+ for multi-spectral
limber mason
Finally got round to that copy of how to be a gurps gm i was passed aeons ago
What a disappointing book
Mostly just a book about running a tradRPG, and the npc section just kinda shrugs
Man you gotta give me some magic numbers to consider ot some ways of estimating things like average damage
Like it's just "welllll you know. It's not points it's skill numbers." Cool what kinds
It runs away at the bits i need to know the most
/rant i guess
mighty hinge
something i noticed; Action 1 mentions Bulk 0 firearms but as far as I can tell, no such weapons exist https://i.imgur.com/8N0vWeU.png
the only Bulk 0 ranged weapons i can find are the Shuriken and Sonic Shuriken
wait! i found two! i missed them on my initial pass of High Tech
1d pi- is... not the worst
spiral linden
That's like minimum viable product
mighty hinge
i think its the lowest damage any firearms have
(shared with several other guns, usually also .22 LR or .25 ACP)
a few projectile weapons that use gun stats have lower damage but its like, paintball guns or dart guns
or the Daisy Number 111 Red Ryder in High-Tech
limber mason
https://i.imgur.com/vGJYUoh.png https://i.imgur.com/8G5czdP.png
Thankfully it made the joke for me
mighty hinge
i actually had a Red Ryder (the modern version thats functionally identical), it was pretty fun though that lever is hard on the hands
mighty hinge
yeah thats why i included the description
and yes, the 1000 figure is accurate
also a modern version should be in .177, not .175
yknow... with how some monster weaknesses work... this isnt a terrible weapon
.177 pure silver BBs
limber mason
Very buffy
mighty hinge
thats only about half a gram of silver!
oh wow i didnt realize how much silver went up in the last year
used to be under a dollar per gram now its almost 3 and it spiked to almost 4 last month
all the more reason to use silver BBs for monster hunting
(well, silver pellets probably, you'd want the point)
limber mason
Actually BBs are small enough with little enough primer that it might be useful for a lot of banes
You know those water BBs? Holy water BBs for vamps
mighty hinge
bbs dont have any primer, theyre just solid
and propelled by either raw spring power [spring and electric] or gas [CO2 / "green gas")
you want a paintball gun for fluids
mighty hinge
oh yeah thats a different thing completely
though its the same concept as a paintball gun just smaller
(more or less)
honestly i didnt even realize they made "sports" versions of them in the style of airsoft/paintball
but Australia/China makes sense
also for paintball in GURPS, it does suffer the disadvantage of having a fractional armor divisor