Space Marine 2

[sly shore]

You’re way more into this than I am.

[woven vigil]

play how you want, i'm nobody's boss

I've been playing Tactical lately and I like the Stalker Bolt Rifle

[vestal cedar]

i've been warming up on Bulwarks shield

[woven vigil]

I've wanted to try Bulwark since it's the Healer class

but i just dont like the weapons

bolt pistol is alright as a secondary, but can't scratch a neurothrope which is bad, and i aint a huge fan of the low level plasma pistol

[vestal cedar]

i've been using powerfist

it's kinda ass ngl

[woven vigil]

i tried it on assault and enemies step back a single inch and you whiff every punch

[grand lantern]

I swear something is bugged with it in Operations

[vestal cedar]

extremely fucking useless for recouping contested health

[grand lantern]

They said that they significantly increased the damage of fully charged heavies but I don't see it

[vestal cedar]

it might as well not even affect contested health for how little you get back

genuinely kinda pathetic

[grand lantern]

But in PvP it 1 taps

[vestal cedar]

it's also just difficult to hit with consistently

all around, not my favourite

[grand lantern]

Admittedly, landing the 1 tap is kind of hard but its very very funny every time it works

[vestal cedar]

i'm only really using it for completion

Chainsword is still the GOAT

[woven vigil]

Chainsword my beloved

[vestal cedar]

power sword is also cool

but just, not as good for my playstyle

[woven vigil]

left hook left hook left hook and then oh big surprise LEFT HOOK

[vestal cedar]

light attack, light attack, light attack, STOMP

even better, STOMP, STOMP when i get the Vanguard shit going

[grand lantern]

I have been doing more pvp lately and I don't really like the chainsword in it, which is a shame

But also melee in general is kind of wonky in pvp

[vestal cedar]

hiut em with the parry hit stomp stomp

[woven vigil]

GUILLIMAN LIVES STOMP STOMP

[vestal cedar]

well

true

but i'm not an ultramarine so

i mean he is still the lord commander of the Imperium i suppose

GUILLIMAN LIVES STOMP STOMP

[woven vigil]

look, i'm a silver skull, that means i solve problems

[vestal cedar]

I'm a Lamenter, that means i cause problems

[woven vigil]

not problems like "what is divinity?" because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of theology

[grand lantern]

Or maybe you just have problems :p

[woven vigil]

i solve prognosicated problems

[vestal cedar]

me and the boys on our way to die in the most horrific and heartwrenching way possible

we do be suffering all imaginable pains fr fr

[woven vigil]

like lets say the prognosticators predict a dark eldar raid on a strategically critical agri world

my answer is a gun

[vestal cedar]

i have a Death Company fit ready also in case i do a little bit of trolling

we do a little bit of Black Raging

[sly shore]

I got my Crimson Fists look as close as I could to the real deal.

[vestal cedar]

eyyy nice

[sly shore]

Rogal Dorn's Normalest Sons.

[vestal cedar]

i know shit all about them unfortunately

[copper swallow]

they're trying their best

[sly shore]

They're my favorite Space Marines.

[vestal cedar]

my faves if it wasn't obvious are the Lamenters

[sly shore]

I'm sorry to hear that.

[vestal cedar]

thank you

[sly shore]

It must be difficult.

[copper swallow]

their chapter history is basically "really unlucky shit happens, but they keep on trucking"

[vestal cedar]

hey that's what the Lamenters do too but probably with a lot worse Unlucky shit

[sly shore]

The Lamenters or Crimson Fists?

[copper swallow]

Both to an extent

[sly shore]

I'm pretty sure the Lamenters couldn't turn on the Mr. Coffeenatus without it exploding.

[copper swallow]

The Crimson Fists get screwed a bit less I think

[vestal cedar]

they fought a whole Hive Fleet as their first encounter after they got put on a penitence crusade!

[grand lantern]

Crimson Fists aren't like... generally unlucky but also had an extremely bad unlucky catastrophe

[copper swallow]

But they did lose their fortress monastery to a missile misfire IIRC

[sly shore]

Killed the fuck outta those damn Orks though! Mostly!

Kind of!

Pedro Kantor survived!

[grand lantern]

(errant missile launch failure blew up their whole fortress monastery and most of the chapter while under attack from orks)

[vestal cedar]

100 years penitence crusade, immediately have to 1v1 a Hive Fleet

they also got curbstomped by the Minotaurs like

immediately before that

[copper swallow]

yeah Crimson Fists are more the "one really, really shitty day" while Lamenters is "multiple shitty events in a row"

[vestal cedar]

after they accidentally seceded from the Imperium and unintentionally sided with a Chaos chapter

timeline was basically

[sly shore]

Crimson Fists: "Pedro Kantor and the Awful, Terrible, No-Good, Very Bad Day"
Lamentors: "A Series of Unfortunate Events"

[proper cosmos]

Tbf, astral claws weren't chaos during the badab war, iirc

[copper swallow]

they're worse, they're tax evaders

[woven vigil]

they had the galaxys worst looney toons moment at the worst possible time

poor crimson fists

what happened on Rynns World was tragic

and a little hilarious

[copper swallow]

Find it kinda darkly funny that this has sorta happened multiple times IRL

[woven vigil]

my mental image will always be the missile flying up then making cartoon sputtering and coughing noises before whistling back directly into its silo

[vestal cedar]

Lamenters history in a nutshell:

Siege of Corillia, got fucked so bad only 200 of them survived, said 200 immediately got turbofucked even worse and disappeared into a warpstorm which they had to battle their way out of for a century
Liberation of Slaughterhouse III, which was so fucking awful Lamenters were literally falling to the Black Rage on the spot out of pure misery, they denied a Iron Halo from Marneus Calgar cause they viewed it as such a moral failing, which earned them the contempt of the Ultramarines, as well as only 100 surviving battle brothers
Badab War, accidentally seceded from the Imperium and got fucking curbstomped into the dirt by the Minotaurs and had all of their shit stolen as war loot, about 300 of them survived
Penitent Crusade which immediately led them into the Second Tyrannic War, doing a 1v1 with Hive Fleet Kraken, they are still 300 battle brothers strong at this point, which is around their encounter with Hive Fleet Kraken

[copper swallow]

US submarines during World War 2 had a bad "oopsie the torpedo went in a circle" problem too

[grand lantern]

"Random catastrophic munitions failure" is probably one of the most realistic 40k fuckups

[vestal cedar]

the Lamenters get absolutely fucked in all major events they participate in

and everyone also just hates them

[copper swallow]

Seen videos of malfunctioning Russian missiles do exactly that too, just straight up fly around and return to sender

[grand lantern]

Admittedly the unrealistic ones are like "farmhand listened to the whispers, planet lost with 99% casualties"

[copper swallow]

TFW there was a Lamenters dreadnought in the Deathwatch that figured he was the last guy left and the rest were dead

[vestal cedar]

mostly for no reason, for the Ultramarines they don't like the Lamenters cause they feel the Lamenters slighted their Chapter Master Marneus Calgar

[vestal cedar]

yup, poor old Amadeus Chyropheles, aka Dreadnought Chyron

[woven vigil]

https://tenor.com/view/oops-bugsbunny-fail-funny-gif-6224921

[vestal cedar]

depressed Dreadnought moment

[woven vigil]

crimson fists

meanwhile my boys the Silver Skulls stay winning

[copper swallow]

You mean, Trazyn the Infinite?

[woven vigil]

lmao

that IS funny

[vestal cedar]

But their victory had unforeseen problems; they had liberated 3,000,000 human prisoners who now looked to their saviours to deliver them from the hands of their enemies. Reluctant to leave the prisoners behind and unable to transport them away from the planet, the Lamenters resolved to fight and if need be nobly die while any chance remained, their Techmarines desperately trying to restore the captured Ork starships to operational flight status. The single Battle Barge and less than 200 surviving Lamenters battle-brothers stood against the nightmarish odds as waves of Ork starships and Fighta-Bommers attacked, only to be beaten back by the Lamenters' savagery. Unprecedented numbers of the Lamenters succumbed to the Black Rage in the bloody struggle. The freed slaves took it upon themselves to end the impasse; after a last prayer of thanks to the Emperor they signalled the Lamenters' Battle Barge and requested a merciful death, knowing that at least they would die as free men and women rather than as the pawns of the bestial Greenskins. With another Ork fleet massing for the attack, the Lamenters had no choice and granted the former slaves the Emperor's Peace by detonating a series of hundreds of seismic charges that had been honeycombed through Slaughterhouse III's mines and collapsing the tunnels. The explosions laid Slaughterhouse III to waste within solar minutes, creating one of the largest planetary tombs in Imperial history. With fewer than 100 battle-brothers left standing, the battered but unbowed Daughter of Tempests escaped the Slaughterhouse System, trailing a handful of converted Ork slave transports, carrying with them less than a tenth of the liberated slaves.

[verbal mortar]

Hey er, I just want to say, thanks for posting this, since I saw it and told my sad GF and now she's less sad. Crimson Fists are her favourite chapter.

Fang [He/Him] ↩️

[Reply to:](#1280637260777263187 message) Crimson Fists: "Pedro Kantor and the Awful, Terrible, No-Good, Very Bad Day"
Lamentors: "A Series of…

[woven vigil]

https://tenor.com/view/wiley-e-coyote-road-runner-smash-rock-gif-16217830

[vestal cedar]

The single Battle Barge and less than 200 surviving Lamenters battle-brothers stood against the nightmarish odds as waves of Ork starships and Fighta-Bommers attacked

Unprecedented numbers of the Lamenters succumbed to the Black Rage in the bloody struggle.

the Lamenters had no choice and granted the former slaves the Emperor's Peace by detonating a series of hundreds of seismic charges that had been honeycombed through Slaughterhouse III's mines and collapsing the tunnels

With fewer than 100 battle-brothers left standing

carrying with them less than a tenth of the liberated slaves

When offered the honour of an Iron Halo in reward for their efforts from Marneus Calgar, the Lamenters took the almost unprecedented step of refusing this esteemed Chapter honour. This caused some of their Imperial allies to accuse them of deliberately insulting the Crusade's commander, further breeding suspicion and dark rumour among those already ill-disposed towards the Chapter.

average Lamenters moment

Slaughterhouse III lived up to its name

whats fucked is the Lamenters literally saved 3 MILLION people at full personal cost after the Ultramarines told them it was tactically unsound, then got fucked cause nobody backed them up and they had no ships, and ended up getting decimated and only saving a tenth of the civilians

[copper swallow]

f-for those we cherish we die in glory T_T

[vestal cedar]

they definitely did die in Glory

considering only 100 of them made it out of Slaughterhouse III out of the 1000 that presumably went in

i don't think they have made it out of any notable event they have participated in with 50% or more of their chapter

[grand lantern]

I think the Lamenters were pretty below strength for that

[verbal mortar]

They had 200 when they had 3mil survivors, it's mentioned in the text, but I dunno about before that.

[vestal cedar]

ah

well that's still pretty bad

[grand lantern]

Yeah

[vestal cedar]

they get absolutely annihilated in every battle they partake in

[grand lantern]

Lexicanum says 2/3rds casualties which is still very bad

[vestal cedar]

2/3rds is fucked

they seem to have entered their Penitent Crusade with like, 400 or so battle brothers too

at which point they met with a Hive Fleet

[copper swallow]

they got some Primaris, wonder how those guys are doing

[vestal cedar]

probably not great

hopefully a bit better than their first founding brethren

[copper swallow]

the real reason why there are so few Lamenters in canon: very few people want to paint a full army of checkerboard shoulder pads

[vestal cedar]

yeah

they are so unlucky even their chapter heraldry fucking sucks

[copper swallow]

as in, better than the Blood Angels?

those guys got bodied again recently

[vestal cedar]

oh i meant uh, what do you call non-primaris?

[grand lantern]

I don't think the Lamenters are the worst official parade scheme for space marines to paint but they're up there

[copper swallow]

Firstborn

[vestal cedar]

firstborn

that's the one

[copper swallow]

Commander Dante upon surviving all that bullshit and then having to rebuild the Sanguinary Guard after they got decimated for the second time in like ten years:

[vestal cedar]

i learned recently that the Lamenters apparently have their own like, equivalent of the Black Rage which leaves them super melancholy constantly

which is interesting cause like

they also get the black rage...

so they are doubling up on psychic dad problems

[copper swallow]

I wonder if the 10th edition codex supplement has anything on Sanguinius's most unfortunate bois

[grand lantern]

At least the BAs have a really good recruitment pipeline

[vestal cedar]

what i want to know is

[worldly pebble]

Ultradepression has nothing on Blood Angels Depression

[vestal cedar]

what is up with their Chapter Master

[worldly pebble]

he's playing DMC2

[vestal cedar]

cause all the Wikis i can find say he is either presumed dead or in exile

[copper swallow]

I wanted to get some death company dudes but I lack the cojones to paint twenty-plus checkerboards

[woven vigil]

i just learned that GW writers have basically confirmed the Silver Skulls aren't related to Dantioch and are JUST Ultramarines

[vestal cedar]

but that would suck turbo dick for the Lamenters

[woven vigil]

man why the fuck do they always gotta shoot down the fun stuff

[copper swallow]

wait, as in the Lamenters chapter master?

[vestal cedar]

yeah

[copper swallow]

He's MIA?

[vestal cedar]

Malakim Phoros

that's what the Wiki's all say

Phoros was believed killed when the Minotaurs Chapter destroyed the Battle Barge Daughter of Tempests, but rumors abound that he survived unseen in the wreckage and will rejoin his brethren in exile.

this is also like

[copper swallow]

maybe he just miraculously survived

Sevastus Acheran straight up escaped wherever he was stuck in at the end of 8th Edition unscathed in time for Space Marine 2 lmao

[vestal cedar]

implying that like

he's been gone since the fucking badab war

[grand lantern]

He's been MIA for a long time in IRL years

[vestal cedar]

which would REALLY suck turbo dick for the Lamenters

[copper swallow]

they should have picked a replacement by now right... right?

[vestal cedar]

that means they haven't had a chapter master for like, 80 years

[grand lantern]

Technically its automatic but GW hasn't talked about who it is

EG the highest ranking space marine who isn't like MIA is the chapter master

[south swallow]

I feel like the crimson fist thing is "if orks have no haters I am dead"

[copper swallow]

I wonder is my boi Gabriel Angelos is still kicking

It's been like 100-200 years since Dawn of War 2's events happened (since the magpies in OG space marine used the post-Retribution battle cry)

[vestal cedar]

TL;DR, woe to the Lamenters

[worldly pebble]

how long can a veteran space marine live for anyway?

[copper swallow]

Dante has been in service for like 1300

[grand lantern]

About 500 unless they're a blood angel

[worldly pebble]

i was about to ask if 400 was plausible but that blew it out of the water, what the fuck?

[copper swallow]

That might not be the upper limit but he's one of the oldest (who didn't spend a bunch of time in stasis)

[grand lantern]

In which case its more like 1000+

Since blood angels don't age like others do

[worldly pebble]

are sanguinius' genes That Good?

[grand lantern]

Yeah

[south swallow]

circa the end of DOW3 and gabriel angelos was stil laround

and hes massive

[copper swallow]

honestly I assume most Space Marines can live to really long but get murdered by something or another long before that

[worldly pebble]

I'm supposed to like legions other than the blood angels. this is not helping

[grand lantern]

Sanguinius' geneseed is so good that you can put it in barely human bestial mutants and get exemplar space marines out and they don't die of old age

[south swallow]

like significantly bigger than even normal terminator

[vestal cedar]

The downside is mostly like, Black Rage, Red Thirst, stuff like that

[copper swallow]

He's been rebuilt with xxxxl sized prosthetics after he got squashed by Kyras idk

[grand lantern]

And you can make Blood Angels in a year with a fancy coffin instead of like 5-10 years of surgeries

[south swallow]

im pretty sure Gabriel Angelos got some "gifts" of custodes gene manipulation or something, between 2 and 3 he got so much more mass

and the man can do front flips in terminator armor

[copper swallow]

I think it's just augmetics

[vestal cedar]

My favourite massive boy is Tyberos, the Red Wake

[primal venture]

Are Marine ages canon now? When was that put to writing?

[copper swallow]

they had to replace him so they made him super thicc

[worldly pebble]

well yeah, you can technically make it to four digits but that assumes you haven't gotten The Disease by then

[south swallow]

in any even he survived the end of dow 3, so as far as i know gabriel is still around and kicking

or hammering i should say

[grand lantern]

I think its in an old index astartes thing

I'm having trouble finding it

[copper swallow]

I think there aren't a lot of data points for how old a marine can live to other than Dante

[grand lantern]

There's Cassius, who is the oldest ultramarine and is, iirc, about 550 now

[vestal cedar]

After the Lamenters' participation in the Badab War, their Chapter Banner was a tattered remnant. When they were granted the Emperor's forgiveness, the banner was given to the Adepta Sororitas to be repaired and purified. The Sisters' handiwork was said to be inspired by the Emperor, and it is said that they wept as they wove, contemplating the Emperor's great sacrifice for humanity at the end of the Horus Heresy and the terrible sins of the Lamenters against Him. The banner became an artefact known as the Banner of Tears and was taken with the Lamenters on their subsequent crusade.

[worldly pebble]

it was a hypothetical " somehow doesn't catch a bullet or go berserker mode in an entire millennium" lol

[vestal cedar]

Also really funny thing about the Lamenters

[copper swallow]

tbh the Ultramarine 1st and 2nd companies regularly get massacred so I don't think the issue is old age here

[grand lantern]

Cassius was the oldest before the Tyrannic wars though

Also the sus-an membrane can make this tricky to evaluate since there's some run-on exceptions

[primal venture]

I prefer the idea of marines kinda just... living semi-forever until they're killed

[vestal cedar]

The Sororitas sobbing thinking about the Emperor while fixing their chapter banner is such a bad fucking omen

[south swallow]

i presumed space marines were, assuming a lack of external forces, functionally immortal

[copper swallow]

there's an upper limit somewhere IIRC

(the Hrud can kill them with aging rays)

[grand lantern]

IIRC that's how its supposed to be but they slowly degrade these days

[copper swallow]

I just assumed that it's a moot point for everyone not named Dante

[south swallow]

i wonder how old bjorn is, counting only his waking moments

[grand lantern]

Like I think Sigsimund was kicking ass at age 1000 but had degraded (part of why Abaddon kicked his ass)

[vestal cedar]

Mfw i am expected to carry the "Banner of tears" into battle

[grand lantern]

But the Fists these days are mostly degraded from rushed attempts to refill casualties or similar so they are built different (worse)

[vestal cedar]

Wonder how Primaris compare

[worldly pebble]

too early to tell

[grand lantern]

In theory they should be at great-crusade spec

[copper swallow]

Probably less degraded since Cawl had the Emperor's Good Stuff available, but likely too early to tell

[grand lantern]

So Primaris Greyshield Imperial Fists have their betchers gland and sus-an membrane

[copper swallow]

maybe he fucked it up and no one's caught it yet

[vestal cedar]

21st founding moment

[grand lantern]

(Which most fists don't since Dorn started skipping those to make more marines faster for the siege of terra and then suffered casualties so high that the full-produced imperial fists died out)

[copper swallow]

Thanks Dorn

[grand lantern]

The Imperial Fists are the realest huge casualties takers imo

[worldly pebble]

also cawl allegedly fucked around with traitor genestock used some exciting new avenues for gene modification

[copper swallow]

don't worry about it

[sly shore]

We don't need to spit acid or go into suspended animation.

Now help me fortify this position.

[copper swallow]

Why would you need to spit acid? Keep your damn helmet on brother

[vestal cedar]

My image of Dorn is forever just TTS Dorn tbh

[copper swallow]

why do you need suspended animation? If you were awake you could have fortified this position harder

[vestal cedar]

He's such a striking character in TTS it's impossible to imagine him any other way

[worldly pebble]

i love the concept of the imperial fists. most obstinate motherfuckers in the Astartes

[sly shore]

Same.

[south swallow]

to this day i maintain that imperial fists make better "standard" space marines than ultramarines

[sly shore]

They are yellow.

[copper swallow]

Counterpoint: yellow is hard

[sly shore]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-40k-rogaldorn-gif-10829755

[south swallow]

they're most notable aspect is their deep love affair with bolters

even more than fortification

[copper swallow]

I feel that in terms of chapter culture this makes sense but

yellow

[vestal cedar]

Big E sending the Ultramarins to the Planet of the Sorcerers without Gellar fields to capture Magnus the Red is still my favourite gag in TTS

[worldly pebble]

holy shit. rogal dogal

[copper swallow]

... hey, it worked.

[vestal cedar]

Also him telling them to cut Guillimans life support

Fucking hysterical

[sly shore]

The one Guardsman with the Ultramarines who just gets frightened every time anything happens.

[copper swallow]

if only spamming a crapton of bolters on the tabletop actually worked well...

[south swallow]

it actually works ok in casuals; anvil siege force gives a massive volume of +1 to wound bolter fire

[vestal cedar]

Can you even play Lamenters in 10th

[south swallow]

sure

[sly shore]

Back when I actually played 40k tabletop, I played Imperial Guard so I can't really comment.

[copper swallow]

I keep needing to walk people over to objectives, so it's a pain

(Also my hot take is that this works even better with Hellblasters since that makes em wound almost everything on a 4... if you actually manage to get there)

[vestal cedar]

Is is just generic space marines then?

[south swallow]

you can play any chapter you like

[copper swallow]

no special rules, use Blood Angels ones

[vestal cedar]

I can't imagine they have any named characters in 10th

[copper swallow]

Yeah there's none

[sly shore]

I did have one game where a squad of normal-ass guardsmen bayonetted a squad of Khorne Berzerkers without taking a wound due to Dice Fuckery.

[vestal cedar]

Honestly i'd be surprised if they had any in 9th

[south swallow]

Hellblasters work best yeah, but heavy intercessors and regular intercessors are easier to bring en mass if you wanted to

[copper swallow]

even Gabriel Seth is gone, I think there's like one named dude with unique traits who's not First Founding, Deathwatch or Templars

[vestal cedar]

Considering they apparently don't have a fucking chapter master since the Badab War

[copper swallow]

tbh Hellblasters are relatively cheap to collect since they come in boxes of 10

I, uh, have thirty

[worldly pebble]

it's the unmatched power of the sun, HERETIC

[copper swallow]

it's my boi Pedro Kantor

[vestal cedar]

I want to paint some Lamenters at some point

[copper swallow]

does anyone know what Lamenters Death Company look like

[grand lantern]

They're a blood angels successor so you can play them with the BA codex

[copper swallow]

I saw someone paint them with blue Xs, like 90s X-Men style, and that looked rad

[vestal cedar]

Not cause i want to get into 40k cause i find it egregiouslu expensive, but i do want to just have some Lamenter Minis

[copper swallow]

Kill Team is the cheapest way to have a functional bunch of playable Lamenters blorbos imo

[grand lantern]

Though I think since they're a weird one just using codex space marines could also work

[vestal cedar]

I want to get a Space Marine action figure at some point as well and repaint it

[worldly pebble]

of dubious canon but i saw this on the lamenters subreddit, maybe it'd be cool-

[copper swallow]

still not cheap, but space marine kill teams are relatively cheap as far as collecting 40k goes

Sweet

[vestal cedar]

I did this for my Death Company Lamenter in-game

[worldly pebble]

i saw!

bisecting color schemes are fun-

[copper swallow]

playing as Assault?

so much easier to do here than on the actual minis

[copper swallow]

Ooh vanguard

[vestal cedar]

My Death Compsny Lamenter

[grand lantern]

The Badab War books have a D-Coy Lamenter

[vestal cedar]

Huh

[copper swallow]

been playing a lot of Vanguard lately since I finished leveling Tac and Sniper to 25

so uh, same as every death company but harder to paint...

[vestal cedar]

I'm on Bulwark atm after i maxed out Vanguard

[south swallow]

i personally enjoy the sleeper pick of hb devastators for the detach. Not saying they're the best pick, but they do kinda work

[vestal cedar]

Good to know

[proper cosmos]

There was a salamander who survived from the horus heresy until m40.

[copper swallow]

Vanguard is really fun

Like the balanced relic combat knife the most in terms of feel

[vestal cedar]

I have a space marine paint kit of Ultramarines i've been meaning to paint

And a paint kit with Necrons

Got both for cheap which is why i have them

[grand lantern]

He's one of those sus-an membrane exceptions iirc

[proper cosmos]

Yeah

[copper swallow]

Just yeet over to a dude and attempt to shank them to death
(works less well on Rubrics they keep deciding to bug out before I can finish stabbing them)

so I have to use guns and shit

[proper cosmos]

He was also quire mad from being fused into his armor

I think the real answer is that they may be technically immortal but never make it to the big numbers

[copper swallow]

I feel like the relic fencing combat knife is too sluggish to swing and I might as well bring the chainsword on everyone who isn't the sniper (who has no choice)

[grand lantern]

My vague understanding is that space marines usually slow down a little with age but its battle which does them in

[proper cosmos]

Yeah

[grand lantern]

There's a HH book with marines getting force-aged thousands of years vs Hrud I think

[vestal cedar]

I think these are the two sets i got

[grand lantern]

And they can hit a thousand or more according to that but are in poor fighting shape

But BAs and some lucky others don't really slow down

[proper cosmos]

But also the astartes may be compatible with juvenile treatments which can get baseline humans to 3-500

[pliant copper]

Wait there’s a planet called Slaughterhouse III?

[vestal cedar]

Yeah

Full of Orks

[pliant copper]

Amazing

[proper cosmos]

40k is not afraid of reference

[vestal cedar]

The Lamenters got turbofucked there trying to save civvies

Was so awful for them they started spontaneously falling to the black rage in unprecedented amounts

And the Lamenters are genuinely notable for not falling to the black rsge much

[pliant copper]

Black Templars they apparently were not

[vestal cedar]

They managed to save 3 million

Then had to give about 90% of them the emperors peace as a mercy

Which is low-key an Ultramarines L since they could have genuinely prolly saved all of them if the Ultramarines had just helped at all

[pliant copper]

But as previously stated

The blueberries are not above the classic astartes pettiness

[vestal cedar]

Whats even worse to me

After those 90% civvie casualties, and you know, 100 surviving Lamenters

They got pissed off at the Lamenters for not accepting an Iron Halo from Calgar cause they were so fucking sad about how everything played out

[copper swallow]

Ultramarines and bone headed responses to tragedy, name a more iconic duo

[vestal cedar]

The Lamenters refused a medal of Honor due to feeling like failures thanks to grievous civilian casualties and the Ultramarines got pissy at them for a percieved slight against their chapter master

[copper swallow]

"Let's just delete Titus from the record because we're so sad he got taken away by a loony inquisitor"

"oh no he assumes we don't want him back and stayed in the Deathwatch"

[vestal cedar]

Yeah lol

Epic fucking fail

[copper swallow]

Kinda let down that they haven't given Lieutenant Titus any tabletop rules yet

least they could do is let vanilla Lieutenants take chainswords

[vestal cedar]

Mhm

[grand lantern]

Titus has a funky minigame in target at least

[south swallow]

I wish chainswords felt more... balanced against the other weapon options sometimes

In tabletop

[pliant copper]

Yeah I don't fucking get it lol

And like

People like the Chaplain in the game and feel it was a twist that it was ||Leandros||?

Nah, absolutely not

||There is one motherfucker who would act like the Chaplain acts to Titus||

[worldly pebble]

tbh this is in line with how pristinely stupid the imperium often behaves

[pliant copper]

If I were Titus I'd be a bitter angry fuck and demand to go back to Deathwatch lmao

"I was a Black Shield for a reason, and the fact you carry a torch for me is kind of weird tbh."

"Byeeeeeeeee."

[copper swallow]

he certainly is a cantankerous prick to Gadriel and Chairon lol

[pliant copper]

lmao

I feel bad for Chairon lmao

Bro is from Calth

And woke up to gestures to present situation in the Imperium

[copper swallow]

There are no good reasons to be mean to Chairon

[pliant copper]

Gadriel said the funny line in a way that tells me 100% Leandros admitted he said that in a moment of weakness to him

So like

Gentle ribbing is allowed

anyways this point's been belabored to no end but SM2 should've been a Deathwatch game

[copper swallow]

it'd have made the customization options make more sense anyway

[worldly pebble]

a deathwatch game would be rad

[copper swallow]

they just released a new Deathwatch short on warhammer tv

and had to post a footnote saying "Yes we'll let you have your Deathwatch army back"

[pliant copper]

I'd honestly like to see Deathwatch, as in the ttrpg, get the Rogue Trader treatment

You could have a Kill-Marine solo Ironman mode

[pliant copper]

Speaking of, just finished my Deathwatch drip for my Bulwark lmao

[copper swallow]

Hey that'd be neat

I still haven't bought the Deathwatch shin guard

[pliant copper]

oh my drip only has the silver arm and pauldron

The base requirement

[copper swallow]

I got the shiny arm, pauldron and helmet

[pliant copper]

I'm putting the helmet on my sniper lmao

[copper swallow]

Been using it for my Vanguard for a bit (my Tactical has leveled into even more extra drip so Deathwatch drip feels like a downgrade)

[pliant copper]

Cuz all the sniper helmets are a s s

[copper swallow]

it clips a bit at the bottom rip

I like the silly cyclops visor, hood and mask one

[pliant copper]

Give me the new frowny Focus, I beg

[copper swallow]

beakie is on the way, frowny soon hopefully

[pliant copper]

idk I just don't like seeing a head I can't then also customize

[copper swallow]

a stark reminder your dude is a cosplaying Ultramarine

[pliant copper]

lol ye

And by new frowny I mean like

The Infiltrator helmet

Not the Mk VII helmet

[copper swallow]

oh yeah the basic infiltrator helmet is MIA for some reason

[pliant copper]

Beaky would be a vibe too tho, tbh

Well it's MIA because we're the phobos units that don't have it

Tabletopically speaking

[copper swallow]

Ehhh, Decimus has an omniscrambler, incursor helmets and a reiver grapnel

But cannot use a marksman bolt carbine and has stolen Scipius's instigator somehow

[pliant copper]

lmao

Well in this metaphor

Scipius has stolen the marksman carbine

[copper swallow]

he's just doing whatever the hell he wants and the techpriest is too nice to tell him no

yeah if it was a tabletop friendly loadout the two would be switched lol

Guess they wanted the Sniper to have a rapid fire option

[pliant copper]

I think the holes we poke are rather easily papered over with the 'they're a kill team, shut the fuck up' defense

[copper swallow]

that is true

[pliant copper]

Me using the marksman variant of the carbine like an AR-15 with a 10.5" and tapping the trigger because automatics are illegal in my state

[copper swallow]

tfw only taught to fire my service rifle on semi-auto at the range when I was a conscript

[woven vigil]

show me the enemy

i want to punch them

[pliant copper]

wants to punch them

doesn't get a power fist

[woven vigil]

chainsword gets a sick left hook

[pliant copper]

lol tru

[copper swallow]

I feel like if the Tactical got the power fist nothing much would change in Operations

would prob affect PVP though

[pliant copper]

I mean it's also a class with a rifle so

wouldn't make much sense animation-wise <XD

[copper swallow]

true, thoufh apparently Intercessor Sergeants are fine with handling rifles with a power oven mitten on the tabletop

[pliant copper]

I have an interesting prompt regarding a different power weapon

[copper swallow]

... I don't know how they reload. Do they tell their battle brother to do it like in that Tithes episode

[pliant copper]

I have said before I wish other classes got a power sword

Would that playstyle be viable?

[copper swallow]

Which class should get it?

[pliant copper]

a power sword with no storm shield?

Well I was thinking mainly on tactical and assault

It feels like a very sergeanty weapon for Tactical

[copper swallow]

If I were giving it to anyone, prob Tactical or Assault (though Tac doesn't need it)

[grand lantern]

Tactical is already a top 1 class in PvP I think giving them OHKO melee would be too much haha

[copper swallow]

yeah pretty much all my justification for it, it's sergeanty and tacticals are feel sergeanty

[pliant copper]

Assault it just feels... right for certain chapters that use lots of jump troops?

cough Blood Angels coughing continues

[copper swallow]

need it for the Sang Guard cosplay huh

Eviscerator when?

[pliant copper]

Oh I could give a shit about Sang Guard lol

I just think Blood Angels fans deserve stuff

As a fan of one of the most overserved chapters myself

[copper swallow]

Which chapter?

[pliant copper]

Dark Angels

[copper swallow]

I stan the Blood Ravens but I bought a bunch of Dark Angels things because I think robes look neat

yep the Unforgiven are overserved lmao

[pliant copper]

Look we have unique bike units we really don't need

[copper swallow]

White Scars were robbed

[pliant copper]

Do we really need to be the best way for White Scars players to play?

[copper swallow]

and then we go "we won't play with you any more" because they're sucky compared to Deathwing

[pliant copper]

I mean

I could give a fuck about Deathwing

I just

Don't need bikes

[copper swallow]

TBH right now the best way to run bikes is... uh... as reflavored wolves

[pliant copper]

I have three stormravens hauling my three main orders of battle

anyways this is general warhammer chat not SM2 chat lol

[copper swallow]

yeah containment breach

we... uh, could use a power axe, on the topic of wolves

It'd be neat to give the Assault or Vanguard I think

[pliant copper]

I do think melee variety is in order

[copper swallow]

yeah though I can understand why the game launched with much more ranged weapon variety than melee

[pliant copper]

mm mm

tis a shooter

[copper swallow]

easier to animate a bunch of bolt rifles with similar ergonomics than to come up with new finishers for every enemy type

[pliant copper]

yeah lol

I hope, for the love of the Lion, that the new skins coming with the Dark Angels champ pack include a shield for bulwark that looks like a DW Knight shield

Give me my big heater and not the dumb cross

[copper swallow]

I don't remember seeing any leaks of that, but there was a beakie

for now, gotta use the one with the whole-ass skeleton on it

wait that's still cross shaped rip

[grand lantern]

The SM1 power axe was cool

It was assault only but also SM1 had very different classes

[pliant copper]

vanguard axe would let the space wolves among us free

[grand lantern]

(There there only 3)

But also you got class perks which meant that I think there was overall more customization than in SM2

[pliant copper]

I mean

[south swallow]

I do judge the game for taking away the ultramarines power axe

[pliant copper]

There are class perks in SM2?

[south swallow]

I know the power sword is iconic, but ultramarines have a thing for axes

And it's been erased

[grand lantern]

I mean in PvP - but the perks were mostly a lot higher impact

[south swallow]

All I remember is that a tactical with a knife and a pistol in 1 was all you needed to win in pvp mp

[pliant copper]

ah

[south swallow]

Then again in 1, admittedly late into its life, you could occasionally also play a dread in pvp

[grand lantern]

One of my favorites was the true grit perk for Assault which just let you have a bolter

Instead of a pistol

As one example

[south swallow]

I do remember that!

[sly shore]

After finishing the campaign for SM2, I can honestly say that the writers understood the assignment. They knew that 40k is a completely stupid and unserious setting that takes itself deadly seriously and it captures that tone wonderfully. I really liked it.

Also I hope the DLC features ||Necrons.||

[proper cosmos]

I think I'd we get either chaplain or librarian, we'll get either croizus or a force weapon

I'd like to get lightning claws

Terminator could also be a cool class

[modest oxide]

Power Axe being in the intro cinematic and not ingame still rude

Kept waiting for it v-v

[sly shore]

I would like a power axe.

[modest oxide]

Decimus has lines about dual wielding chainswords, the Marines crave more melee violence

[south swallow]

For the record in actually very pleased they put a power fist in the game

[grand lantern]

Same

[woven vigil]

i knew you as a crimson fist fan would enjoy ||the funny last stand on a hill moment||

[pliant copper]

If it's the scene I think ur talking about, someone made an edit where "Separate Ways" by Journey is playing in the background

[woven vigil]

classic space marine moment

[pliant copper]

Also I just realized something quite funny

In the multiplayer, not only is Quartus a Bladeguard

He's a Bladeguard Ancient

[woven vigil]

i just noticed

[pliant copper]

B E A K Y S P O T T E D

[woven vigil]

||1st company beakie arrives with calgar||

[pliant copper]

You know what I bet would look awesome

a bladeguard variant of a beaky

That has more holes like an irl bascinet does

[sly shore]

It’s SO FUCKING STUPID I LOVE IT

[karmic scarab]

MALUM CAEDO ?!?!?!?!?!

[barren coral]

Considering the Lord of Change wasn't immediately killed the second he appeared on screen probably not.

[karmic scarab]

true

[sly shore]

I can hope.

[brisk notch]

Hey saber why did you have to do me dirty like that ? So the bullwark is a bladeguard veteran... And the dark angel are my favorite space knight... But for them the Blade guard veteran are in the deathwing... which doesn't use the normal DA color scheme but another that is impossible to make in SM2 (let the DA cosmetic pack correct this please...°

[grand lantern]

Bladeguard can probably also be greenwing for DA

We were just discussing it in the other 40k channel haha

It’s weird that Deathwing isn’t possible though

[vital summit]

Ofc bro would be there

He's killed atleast two lords of change without any assistance

[pliant copper]

Can't you make the Deathwing scheme?

The off-white is Wraithbone and the green is Caliban Green

[brisk notch]

You cannot change the color of the cloth and i don’t think wraith bone is a tertiary color...

[pliant copper]

The cloth is a problem, yeah

But iirc Wraithbone is a color in all slots

[sly shore]

https://tenor.com/view/malum-caedo-malum-caedo-warhammer-40k-space-marine-gif-494563405176942733

[pliant copper]

Free him!

[sly shore]

There are enemies of the Imperium that are still alive and he yearns to rectify this.

[woven vigil]

the friend and i that were playing coop were just like YOO THEYRE DOING THE WARHAMMER THING

[turbid nebula]

Same

As soon as he pulled out the flag, everybody was all "ARE WE DOING THE THING!?" with pretty much the exact same wording. 😛

[pliant copper]

<@&1281758630688981034> any takers for substantial? I am personally taking Bulwark

[pliant copper]

An Assault and I just balled out and did the Heldrake boss as a duo

God

Amazing

[timber mulch]

Nice stripe

[sly shore]

I'm still puttering around on the lowest difficulty, but I represented my Chapter well.

Seems like pubbies never want to play Tactical for some reason. That Auspex Scan is fucking amazing.

Recite the litany of Fuck Off Weirdo and point your holy instrument (bolter) at the enemy and pull the trigger until the Emperor's wrath has been sufficiently visited upon them.

[copper swallow]

I've encountered tactical pubbies reasonably often at Substantial difficulty, kind of an even split of classes picked there

Tacs rock though, no weaknesses just as the Codex intended

[vestal cedar]

Heavy stutter fix you say

i hope that applies to mine cause i've been dealing with a lot of stuttering and lag

[sly shore]

If I set my lobby to private, can I do operations with bots instead of pubbies? Sometimes the connection is a little iffy.

[uncut sedge]

yep

it's basically the way to "solo" things

[sly shore]

I see. Thank you.

[granite zinc]

Hope they optmised the game abit more, it takes almost 10 minutes to load when I stat the game

[pliant copper]

It does load a lot faster

I just loaded in a minute on an HDD

[granite zinc]

https://tenor.com/view/pootis-engage-yes-very-yes-heavy-tf2-gif-17755424

[verbal mortar]

It works on my machine now! I am so happy! :D

[vestal cedar]

yippeeee

[pliant copper]

All the classes I play have purple weapons now 😌

[granite zinc]

It runs so much better now holyshit

[grand lantern]

<@&1281758630688981034> anyone up for an operation or two?

[pliant copper]

I just stepped away for chores 😭

[worldly pebble]

I'm down, I can hang in SSC

[grand lantern]

sounds good

[pliant copper]

looks up tabletop bladeguard stats to see if I should switch to plasma pistol to be tabletop accurate

sees they all have heavy bolt pistols

https://tenor.com/view/disappointed-disappointed-fan-seriously-what-are-you-doing-judging-you-gif-17485289

[vestal cedar]

hah

[pliant copper]

GIMME THE SPACE DEAGLE FOCUS

C'MON!

At least we're getting neo volkite

[vestal cedar]

true

[pliant copper]

Trade with the Assault players; you receive access to power sword, we receive access to heavy bolt pistol

also I just realized it'd be reltively easy to kitbash an Ezekiel mini as a Phobos Librarian

wait that's general warhammer not SM2 whoops lmao

[granite zinc]

I just want Salamander Drip
The scales would look so dope

[worldly pebble]

I GOT DCED AT THE VERY END

AFTER I FOUGHT TWO ZOANTHROPES AND A NEUROTHROPE

AS AN ASSAULT
## AAA

[pliant copper]

You despise seeing it

[granite zinc]

Spoilers ||https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/437863525965365249/1293282520380477440/twittervid.com_jackpesaurus_b8f433.mp4?ex=6706ceb4&is=67057d34&hm=bec3332cc87e5b91594b74ec1854edb76c23ae7265c79342aa552720cabddddf&||

[worldly pebble]

this was after i told cyan that i was going to make it to the end, bc "i'm a brave boy"

my connection actually cursed me i think lol

[grand lantern]

That sounded like a nightmare

But also I think it was the Tuesday night curse

[worldly pebble]

there's a tuesday night curse?

[uncut sedge]

steam does maintenance on tuesdays, which causes it to drop connections in a rolling fashion

i.e., not everyone gets it all at once, but there's usually a brief spike on the user charts when the servers go down

[modest oxide]

They really need to do something about the Neurothrope/other Thrope

It is just misery if you have more melee-focused classes

and they just barely engage with the parry/dodge system either, truly blah enemies

[sly shore]

The thing is that this isn't even that much of an exaggeration.

[worldly pebble]

the zoanthrope's ball attacks do not need to have a homing/aim assist

the fact that they Do is horrific

[modest oxide]

And the good ol' 'was aiming at someone else so you don't even get a warning before being blasted'

[grand lantern]

Yeah its dumb how they're basically melee immune

[sly shore]

I hope they get a rework. I main Tactical, so I have to handle them while the Bulwark and Assault on my team just stand there staring at it.

[tropic widget]

Some of the melee animations hit them while floating.

[grand lantern]

Neurothropes at least have "melee phases" but zoans can be really annoying to melee ever

[tropic widget]

But also your melee folks should be unloading their pistols on it.

Plasma and the heavy bolt pistol can both do some respectable work.

[proper cosmos]

I would have fewer problems with zoans on bulwark/assault if I could start with kraks

[grand lantern]

Also this patch really helped with performance

[sly shore]

I need to start doing the next tier up, I have to get some purple resources.

[grand lantern]

I'm down to do some runs if you're playing now

[sly shore]

I just wrapped up for the moment but I might fire it up again after I get in some Helldivers.

[grand lantern]

nw

[grand lantern]

Feel really good about this - managed it on max diff with a green gun

[sly shore]

If you're still up, I have time for one run before bed.

[grand lantern]

Yeah I'm down

I'm in HA hangout

[worldly pebble]

mind if i roll the dice and join yall?

[grand lantern]

yeah sure

FHRGT

[pliant copper]

Oh no Assault is pushing my buttons

[uncut sedge]

someone's gonna get the code FIGHT

[grand lantern]

probably yeah

[grand lantern]

BX3CI

[sly shore]

All this time I thought you guys were just keysmashing because you were excited.

[woven vigil]

Fang called yall BOTTOMS

[pliant copper]

lmao

[grand lantern]

all space marines are bottoms

[woven vigil]

maybe yours

[silent mist]

Compared to the glorious light of the Emperor, all imperial citizens are bottoms

[tropic widget]

The Horus Heresy was just a power bottom getting spicy.

[grand lantern]

Sfxcsfdsfcsd I never wanted to unleash my legions

[granite zinc]

Does that make the Inquisition the tops?

[turbid nebula]

I've seen plenty of fanart that would suggest otherwise.

[granite zinc]

oh no

[woven vigil]

i hate it here

[granite zinc]

Talking about fan art, i always love to draw my friends as the God emperor when they say something anti-religious

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/606570785959575581/1293357006694121583/image.png?ex=6707bcd3&is=67066b53&hm=96571f82fd2f7b3e70ddacb698237c966b5db4851ff53f17a48e37ace56b1f10&

[worldly pebble]

neothpilled

[granite zinc]

Do they know 40k? barely
but is fun

THE GOD EMPEROR GAVE ME TWO HANDS, AND I SHALL USE THEM TO DRAW BULLSHIT

[worldly pebble]

true and real

[tropic widget]

Praise the Omnissiah for allowing you to distribute that bullshit to the masses.

[sly shore]

I do that regardless of context, but usually keep it to myself so as not to be rude.

[pliant copper]

So Ruthless was not as bad as I expected

Feels

Like Substantial but with some higher damage?

[sly shore]

Substantial knocked my teeth out, so that’s a little worrying.

[pliant copper]

Substantial and Ruthless require some basic comms tbh

[grand lantern]

I’ve done it with experienced randoms but yeah you need to stay huddled up

[south swallow]

substantial is doable with randos consistently except when you are doing the step up from average to sub, because you need weapons on-tier to really be able to tango

and the main skill you gotta have developed is the necessary dodging/rolling/grenading needed to keep yourself alive

[tame surge]

And to keep moving, and not wait for more spawns to show up.

[pliant copper]

I will say I was playing Bulwark, which some people have called

easy mode

and like

eh, kinda?

Personally I am very substantial, but I also pull the squad support role

[sly shore]

I only have greens.

I felt like my heavy bolt rifle was shooting ping pong balls.

[pliant copper]

Such is thy fate

Sadly lol

[sly shore]

I’m switching to the Plasma Incinerator.

[pliant copper]

Incinerator and Melta are both very good

[sly shore]

I wish I could use a bolter like a normal person but they made them too weak.

[grand lantern]

I think the easy way to break into substantial is heavy plasma incinerator heavy

Weapon is SCUFFED rn

It’s great

[grand lantern]

• evaporates any minoris near the point of impact
• 4-6 ammo spent for majoris kills (green gun on ruthless)
• deep ammo pool
• I got gold kills with a green one on Ruthless

This is the gun the ruinous powers don’t want you to know about

[stray smelt]

Wait I thought that gun was bad, did it get adjusted?

[grand lantern]

Yes it got turbobuffed

[stray smelt]

I thought it just got more ammo

I mean, I might swap out my Heavy Bolter for it just to try it out

[grand lantern]

Also more damage more AoE and faster boolets

[stray smelt]

Oh
Oh yeah that's scary

[grand lantern]

And much less heat gen per shot

[stray smelt]

I do like plasma in this game, or rather, want to, but I felt it was underwhelming, but with changes like that I'll try it out

[grand lantern]

It was very underwhelming before the buff yeah

[stray smelt]

Is the Tactical's plasma gun good?

[worldly pebble]

oh, yes. it is v good

all of the plasma guns are p good

[stray smelt]

Welp
Time to cook some xenos then

How do you generally use them, when and when not to charge and all that?

[grand lantern]

I don’t charge the HPI unless I get the perk which makes it use less ammo

But charge shots for spawns and groups only imo

[stray smelt]

What about the standard one?

[proper cosmos]

I mean grey st tier 1, if you land a charged hpi shot on a group of warriors they all just die

The normal one I charge for swarms and majors

And also, charging is low commit because charge state is binary

If you don't fully charge it costs 1 ammo and does normal damage

[uncut sedge]

you can dodge roll to cancel the charge shot too

[stray smelt]

Ahh, good to know

I play Heavy and Tactical, so both having a similar weapon will help

Usually Tactical because Heavy is taken more often

[sly shore]

I still have yet to complete a Substantial. But I can't get purples without completing Substantial.

And Reliquary sucks ass.

[vestal cedar]

Do the first mission on substantial once you get close enough to play on it

It's by far the easiest one imo and generally has very few complications if you know the gameplay and get a half decent team

[pliant copper]

What sucks is most people doing Ruthless are doing that too

Cuz it's the easiest to farm for armory data

[grand lantern]

Oh huh, I thought the kill the hive tyrant one was best for that

[pliant copper]

It's cuz Inferno has the easiest encounters

Whereas rigging the explosives in the tower on Decapitation can go bad

[pliant copper]

You fucking take that back D:<

[granite zinc]

Praise the Omnissiah!
Let the hivemind of the Omnissiah ever growing library spread it's knowledge and bullshit

[pliant copper]

?

[granite zinc]

.
I forgot to hit enter

it was suppose ot be a reply to someone here, sorry about that

[pliant copper]

lolol

[woven vigil]

<@&1281758630688981034> anyone wanna play?

[worldly pebble]

i'd be down if you still are

[woven vigil]

shore

RTGZ9

[pliant copper]

Fully mastered Power Sword 😌

[brisk notch]

What are your secrets ?

[granite zinc]

Heavy mode for hordes, light mode for warriors and up

and attack, wait, attack is stronk

and don't hold the movement button when attacking

[pliant copper]

I meant in terms of the weapon progression, I have all the perks and shiz

But uh

What Mizu said basically

mix up what kinds of attacks ur doing to infinite warriors

like doing a light into a bash into a heavy into a bash into a light into waiting so you do the leap slam etc etc

power sword is like

I feel weird saying it's a tech weapon?

But it kiiiiiind of is?

It's the closest the game has imo anyways

[copper swallow]

I've finally git gud enough to do most of the missions on Ruthless with randos

(haven't attempted Sword of Atreus on Ruthless yet. Don't dare to without some kinda team comms)

[grand lantern]

That’s fair that finale is kinda rough

[vestal cedar]

yeah Sword of Atreus is kind of a fucker

[grand lantern]

I think it’s doable with randoms but you need to have a team which knows what’s up

[sly shore]

Which one is that?

[uncut sedge]

the last one where you escort a battery

[modest oxide]

Strangely I find the other chaos mission more difficult

Not the final portion but there's one stop along the Bridge Full Of Burning that always turns into hell

some teleported-away Knight summoning on the other side of the damn map

[grand lantern]

Yeah that one can go so wrong so fast

[sly shore]

Ahh a fellow Reliquary hater.

[pliant copper]

cris in likes Reliquary

[proper cosmos]

I dont mind reliquary I just wish that two of the classes had better dps options for it

[pliant copper]

lol fair

I will say I do know it's odd to like Reliquary as a Bulwark main, however

Knight killing a dragon

[modest oxide]

I just loathe the double decker midpoint building on the bridge

Too many places for enemies to be fully unreachable before call in

The fight itself is real neat

[sly shore]

I'm having such a bad time with Substantial.

[vestal cedar]

The jump from diff 2-3 is alot worse than diff 3-4

[sly shore]

At least the parrying isn't so bad now that I've got a fencing chainsword, but the Hive Tyrant's dodge timing is fucking impossible.

[vestal cedar]

Yeah it's pretty tricky

[sly shore]

It caught me every time during the second phase.

[vestal cedar]

are you playing rn?

i could hop on for a mission and try to help out if so

[sly shore]

I just signed off for the night because I have work in the morning.

[vestal cedar]

👍

[sly shore]

I'm just kind of grouching because I'm really struggling.

[vestal cedar]

if you need help tomorrow or however you would say, i should have time during the day

[woven vigil]

i'll also most likely be around

and can hop on my assault to help with tough stuff

[brisk notch]

thx

[copper swallow]

I have trouble handling Decapitation on any difficulty

I still died even when I cleared it as Tactical

Luckily I got my auspex off on it

I'm doing my part!

(I managed to get gold samples by following a more experienced friend earlier on so I'm probably better armed than the average player trying to jump from 3 to 4 though)

I also dislike Reliquary because there's a chance your team just wipes on the bridge because someone decided "yep now's a good time to make a break for it" and it really wasn't, and sometimes that person is me

also, kind of a pain if you don't have a Tactical on your squad

[sly shore]

I think they should put in Malum Caedo as a bot you can call in if things get too hard.

Just because it’d be funny.

Funky Mode

“We would have attempted the Rubicon Primaris on him but he won’t hold still long enough.”

[stray smelt]

He's a first company veteran, he doesn't need primaris surgery

[sly shore]

They couldn’t get him to hold still long enough anyway.

[brisk notch]

hey when should i augment the operation difficulty ?

[sly shore]

Still struggling with Substantial and dying a lot, but at least I got some more upgrades and finally got Abaddon Black to finish my Crimson Fists color scheme.

[sly shore]

I'm really not sure how you're expected to survive on this difficulty when it's a constant barrage of attacks and if you fuck up dodging or parrying once it eats most of your health.

And when there's that much going on at once, I can't figure out how you're supposed to filter out all the shit going on to spot the one gaunt who's about to jump on you when the blue marker decides not to show up. It's really frustrating. I might just go back to the second difficulty level for a while, I think.

[proper cosmos]

The game kinda just expects you to cultivate situational awareness and game sense

[uncut sedge]

it takes a bit of getting used to yeah

[sly shore]

I've never been very good at parrying/dodging mechanics like this, so it's an uphill climb.

[uncut sedge]

I felt the same on the first few new-difficulty ops

[sly shore]

Does it also expect you to be fully leveled? Because I'm a little under halfway through the Tactical leveling track.

[grand lantern]

It says it expects you to be level 10 iirc

For difficulty 3

[sly shore]

Man.

[vestal cedar]

2-3 is deff the hardest adjustment

Honestly the jump from 2-3 was so bad for me that the jump from 3-4 made me feel like 4 was easier than 3

[grand lantern]

yeah

That was also my experience

[sly shore]

I’m just having trouble even staying alive.

[grand lantern]

2-3 was really tough but 3-4 is like... barely noticable

[vestal cedar]

I genuinely prefer to do missions on 4 than 3 because of the jump

[grand lantern]

Yeah might as well get the more xp and gold data

[vestal cedar]

My advice would be focusing on reupping shields as much as humanly possible during big fights, you need to be on that shit non-stop cause health doesn't really last that long

[primal venture]

make sure to parry small enemies as much as you can

[vestal cedar]

I've been in a situation where i was like, 1v15 against rubrics with tzangors trynna swarm and i just had to keep getting executes on the rubrics to shield lock my health

[sly shore]

They’re always jumping me.

[grand lantern]

yeah armor is way more resiliant

Since I think your "armor bar" is at least as big as your health bar it just looks really small

[vestal cedar]

Armor melts just as fast as your healthbar

Crucially, you can regen it

[grand lantern]

I think its actually tougher now

[vestal cedar]

Which is not so much the case for health in most situations

Is it?

I'll need to check i suppose

[grand lantern]

Like the melta gun triple blast move that Flamer Rubrics have does like 1.5 armor bars and like 70-80% HP if you have no armor

It might be closer to equal because the health bar is a liar and the second half of the bar is probably like 75% or more of your health

[vestal cedar]

I see

But yeah you gotta focus on shield regen a lot

[grand lantern]

yeah

I like heavy for it because the stomps generate gun strikes a lot

And fencing weapons make it easy to get armor back from squishing minoris

[vestal cedar]

Are there majoris and extremis? Ficus on getting them to executable

Get gunstrikes on minoris as much as you can

I use the running punch with the power fist on vanguard cause it's guaranteed gunstrikes and so long as i can keep getting them i'm immortal

[grand lantern]

I might be biased but I think its more important to kill Tzaangors than Bolter Rubrics but otherwise I agree

[vestal cedar]

Tzangors my beloathed

Honestly chaos sucks to fight compared to nids for many reasons

Their majoris and minoris are both much more obnoxious to deal with

[grand lantern]

I think Chaos would be basically fine to fight if Tzaangors entered an execute state like gaunts

[vestal cedar]

Ehh

Would be a significant improvement

Rubrics are just miserable to deal with when backed up by tzangors and don't get me started on the guardsman snipers and the obscene level of damage their guns do

[sly shore]

I’m using the Plasma Incinerator, but maybe I should switch to the Melta because it’s usually the little shits that get me.

That and I still don’t know how to dodge the warriors with whips.

[grand lantern]

I fuck that dodge up too much too

If you wanna do an op this evening I'm free

[vestal cedar]

Why hello chaos guardsman, of course you can have all of my shields in one shot, that's perfectly fine

[grand lantern]

The sniper goons don't bother me that much except on that one part of Vox Liberatis where they get to attack from a bunch of high up balconies

They used to more when more could spawn

[vestal cedar]

Iirc their spawns got nerfed

So there can't be as many of them around as they used to

[grand lantern]

yeah its capped at like 3 now and used to be like 5-6

Which combined with lower overall spawn caps for chaos makes them way easier to pick out and shoot

[vestal cedar]

Before there would be just way too fucking many of them constantly shooting at you and taking all of your shields

[grand lantern]

yeah

[timber mulch]

i fuckin love the power fist holy hell

[vestal cedar]

It's my least favourite melee so far

Very cool

But extremely wonky for actual combat

[timber mulch]

i
alright.

[turbid nebula]

Every time I try to use it it seems to whiff on things right in front of my face

[proper cosmos]

It's incredibly satisfying to make work

[pliant copper]

I have grown to appreciate the Big Hand in Warhammer

However it is on classes with options I prefer over it

Now, if Saber does something hilarious and adds a boltstorm or flamer gauntlet

[uncut sedge]

give the assault lightning claws

we'll figure out how they use a bolt pistol later

[pliant copper]

honestly

assault power sword would go hard

[vestal cedar]

I think my main problem with the power fist is mostly that it is entirely useless for doing anythin related to contested health in my experience

I've been running it on bulwark which has made this issue rather significant

[vestal cedar]

To be entirely fair to the Power fist, my favourite melee is the chainsword so that really isn't saying much

I don't really love any of the other options except maybe the power sword

[woven vigil]

i'd sacrifice a ranged weapon for lightning claws or chain fists

yes i know chain fists are terminator weapons

idc

[south swallow]

i just like the running superman punch

on the power fist

[vestal cedar]

it's great

[woven vigil]

https://tenor.com/view/assault-marine-sergeant-dawn-of-war-space-marines-execute-dark-angels-gif-23567051

[south swallow]

https://tenor.com/view/acces-denied-no-nope-nah-headshot-gif-10481869666719359459

[stray smelt]

So, uhh
Is it just me or is the Heavy Bolter rather underwhelming now with the post-patch Plasma Cannon?

It just seems to take really long to kill things

[woven vigil]

always has been

[grand lantern]

The plascannon rules it’s definitely overshadowing other options yeah

It’s probably the best gun in the game

[vestal cedar]

melta gun moment

[grand lantern]

I think the plascannon is better than the melta rifle

[woven vigil]

it has precious range

[south swallow]

the hb is fun because brrr, but often feels way less impactful

does have the beenefit of being able to modulate ammo usage; except that it has to pour bajillions of shots into meaningful enemies

plasma you can just glomp shots out in between dodges and rolls

[woven vigil]

automatic weapons kinda underwhelming compared to alternatives

[pliant copper]

Marksman Carbine 😌

[woven vigil]

it felt a bit anemic to me

[viral patio]

same

[woven vigil]

stalker bolter slaps

if the marksman had accurate hip firing i would use it

[pliant copper]

I should level Stalker

marksman just feels more flexible to me

And also lmao 180 ammo reserve

The marksman gives me the funny haha Reach DMR feels

[sly shore]

My biggest complaint with Space Marine 2 is that all of the guns feel kind of weightless. Even the ones that do good damage.

On Tactical especially. Even the Plasma Incinerator and Melta Rifle feel like you might as well be throwing ping pong balls or pointing a hair dryer at a Warrior.

[grand lantern]

Yeah there isn't much of a "oh damn this is powerful" gun

I think a lot of it is the feeling of weightlessness yeah

[sly shore]

You have a device to Mildly Annoy a Warrior or your melee weapon which can Moderately-to-Severely Annoy a Warrior.

Right up until you annoy them so much that they give up and you can push the button to kill them in a gory fashion.

It's probably my biggest criticism of the game.

[pliant copper]

I can't wait for the volkite pistol

I waaaaant

[sly shore]

I want a main weapon that actually does something.

[pliant copper]

I really must disagree when you say main weapons don't do anything

[grand lantern]

Plascannon and Las Fusil feel pretty good for impact ime

I'm really excited to see how a gold plascannon works because the weapon puts in WORK

[pliant copper]

This feels like 'oh the dmr in helldivers is ass' all over again

[sly shore]

Maybe it's just a thing with Tactical, but I feel like throwing the gun at a Warrior will do more than actually shooting them with it a lot of the time. They just tank multiple fully-charged shots from the Plasma Incinerator like it's nothing and the melta rifle doesn't even slow them down.

[grand lantern]

tbf those are both kind of area-attack weapons

[sly shore]

Maybe I'll switch to a different class. Tactical clearly isn't working for me.

[grand lantern]

I can't think of a great single target tactical weapon though

Stalker maybe?

[worldly pebble]

Tac is the one i found the hardest to work with, bc their gimmick is just "keep scanning groups of enemies & bosses"

[sly shore]

It really needs a team able to capitalize on the Auspex.

[grand lantern]

Yeah Auspex is super good but also one of the most teamwork oriented abilities

[worldly pebble]

assault can divebomb into a group of enemies, bulwark can ignore ranged damage and regen armor, sniper can go invis and beam down priority targets, heavy can ignore ranged damage while Also hosing down enemies, and vanguard can stagger + zip to a single target

[sly shore]

I dunno, maybe I'll try Vanguard again.

[grand lantern]

I've been enjoying Vanguard

[worldly pebble]

tactical relies pretty squarely on you knowing your fundamentals and doing them well

[grand lantern]

Very high-risk high reward since you tend to be knee deep in enemies

And have like the best perk in the game with that 50% perfect parry window one

[worldly pebble]

the higher parry windows can help A Lot

[sly shore]

See, I need that because I'm fucking shit at parrying.

[grand lantern]

I'm not that reliable with em unless I have that perk

But it makes it pretty easy

[sly shore]

Guess I'll just go with Vanguard.

[worldly pebble]

it doesn't help that higher difficulties also change the parry timing

[sly shore]

That sucks!

[grand lantern]

Oh I didn't know that

[worldly pebble]

the lower two and higher two difficulties have different parry timing, with the lower two being more lenient iirc

[sly shore]

Why?

[worldly pebble]

shrug

i think it'd be better to have one be constant, bc it really fucks with your habits unfortunately

[grand lantern]

Yeah I'd prefer it just be tighter at all difficulties instead of scaling like that I think

Or just not scale lol

[sly shore]

Yeah, you shouldn't learn a different parry window on lower difficulty, then have it be different on a higher difficulty. That's just fucking with you.

[woven vigil]

the game really does not teach you how to play 3/4 when playing 1/2

its totally different rules

[sly shore]

Just don't make it scale. Make it punish you harder if you fuck up on a higher difficulty, maybe, but don't change the timing.

I've been bashing my head against 3 the past few days and it's been a nightmare.

Which is why I went back to 2.

[woven vigil]

if you need teammates for trying 3, you can always ask people here instead of smashing your head against it

[stray smelt]

Ooookay, yeah, the new plasma cannon is disgustingly powerful, I just swept through difficulty 3 with more damage than my teammates combined

Only issue I have is the ballistic arc and slow projectile

[woven vigil]

i dont like the "Damage dealt" as an indicator of quality

[stray smelt]

I mean, it is for a weapon

Also comparing it to my usual heavy bolter which is uhhh
Sad

[woven vigil]

had to carry an absolute dogwater level 2 vanguard through a substantial the other day but because he had the melta he got top damage

[grand lantern]

Yeah there's a learning curve to landing long range shots but the weapon is really nuts for damage

I like how it stops sentries in 2 uncharged shots

[stray smelt]

It does have a capstone perk that bumps up the projectile speed by 50% which
I will get there in like a year at this rate, but I'll certainly enjoy it once that happens

You know, I play Iron Hands, but with how much I like the plasma weapons I'm quarter-tempted to pledge to the First Legion

Err, chapter

[worldly pebble]

so i cannot find the original source that stated this (i hope i wasn't talking Completely out of my ass) but there is a thing that everyone Does agree on and it's that parry windows are different for minoris and majoris

the different parry timings across difficulties could genuinely just be shit netcode, but the timings for minoris and majoris are real

[grand lantern]

Oh that's good to hear

[worldly pebble]

minoris allow you to parry basically as soon as the indicator starts, and majoris require you to parry Right before the attack hits

[stray smelt]

Do you mean the minoris jump attacks?

[worldly pebble]

yup

[sly shore]

The visual queue for it is inconsistent as hell too.

[grand lantern]

I was super happy with this performance but given that this was with a master-crafted plascannon on Ruthless and I had teammates I think were real solid I think the weapon is probably overperforming others for damage

[stray smelt]

I found that you can parry those whenever the blue marker is on screen

[grand lantern]

I'll probably be able to breack 25k damage with a purple or gold one

[worldly pebble]

yep, that's the one. minoris jump atks can be parried p much as soon as you see the flash. majoris attacks require you to get the timing down to the Hit

and that's what probably fucked me up some

especially when you get an offscreen parry indicator and have no idea what it's for

[stray smelt]

Yeah, parry windows are weird, because on one hand they're really large, on the other, they're really inconsistent

[worldly pebble]

i tend to dodge more than parry

[stray smelt]

I play Heavy, quite often I can't dodge

[worldly pebble]

yeah, same here, but trying to use heavy's clumsy melee strikes is a far bigger gamble to me at times

[grand lantern]

heavy melee is lowkey good imo

[stray smelt]

It is better than expected, just not very good

[grand lantern]

It's really clumsy but it makes so many gun strike minoris opportunities

[pliant copper]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-40k-space-marine-dark-angel-gif-13342898

[turbid nebula]

That feelign when you're a living weapon, evolved and bred solely for battle and killing, and you get perfect-parried to death by some guy smacking you with his big gun.

[stray smelt]

I feel like second company ultrasmurfs are a bit above 'some guy' classification

[turbid nebula]

Still

[pliant copper]

There's actually a guy whose homebrew chapter is him assuaging this for himself

By making a Dark Angels successor that like

some of them think they're Iron Hands successors

[stray smelt]

That's
Confusing

[pliant copper]

It's an 'on paper they're X according to their records, but they might be Y because of some reason'

[grand lantern]

I feel like the bugs might be coming out ahead on this front

[pliant copper]

Like how Blood Ravens don't know who their primarch is but it's totally Magnus

[stray smelt]

It's so obviously Magnus it's not even funny

[grand lantern]

It's probably Guilliman tho

[stray smelt]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1104183721021677659/1287075145986347038/rapidsave.com_anylnyw0chod1.gif

[turbid nebula]

Well they did drop this bit in A Thousand Sons

It's too late... the Wolf is at the door and it hungers for blood. Oh, Throne...no, the blood. The Ravens, I see them too. The lost sons and a Raven of blood. They cry out for salvation and knowledge, but it is denied!

[sly shore]

I hope it’s Vulkan!

[woven vigil]

Blood Ravens are basically guaranteed TSons successors

some looneys try to say Word Bearers but NAH i dont see it

[sly shore]

They certainly seem to have a disproportionate number of Librarians.

[pliant copper]

GW! GIVE US UNIQUE BLOOD RAVENS RULES TO RUN MORE VARIETIES OF LIBRARIAN AS LOYALISTS AND MY LIFE. IS. YOURS!

[woven vigil]

let blood ravens cast fiery convocation

https://tenor.com/view/fiery-convocation-total-war-warhammer-lore-of-high-magic-high-elves-phoenix-gif-19589031

[granite zinc]

Does that make the blood Ravens
Nerds?

[grand lantern]

I mean that was never in doubt

[woven vigil]

They have the nerd rage perk

Protagonist level power up when at or below half chapter strength

Which is why they lost on Kaurava

[turbid nebula]

I exclusively use the Blood Ravens scheme wiht the Ultramarines DLC weapons

[vestal cedar]

peak

tbh

[stray smelt]

Pfft
Those 'gifted' weapons

[sly shore]

Gave Vanguard another shot and it's definitely gelling with my playstyle better than Tactical.

[stray smelt]

Ooga booga?

[vestal cedar]

big vanguard fan personally

[sly shore]

Having a more generous parry window has helped my survival immensely.

[copper swallow]

DW kayvaan shrike manages it somehow

Also I just realized there's basically no actual reload animation playing an Assault with a powerfist, bro just ejects the magazine and lowers the gun and a new one materializes

[sly shore]

A gretchin does it for you.

[vestal cedar]

He's sick nasty with the reloads so you can't even see him do it

Alternatively, Emperor Protects

[copper swallow]

i assume Azrael reloads his stupid side mounted magazine using a Watcher in the Dark

[copper swallow]

they say Space Marines can move faster than the human eye can see

[vestal cedar]

There you go

[copper swallow]

Alternatively Belisarius Cawl never told you about the fourth secret extra augmentation, the hidden pistol reloading arm

[vestal cedar]

Could def be a thing

He's fucked around in worse ways

[copper swallow]

I feel like it's probably only a thing for the Iron Hands

[vestal cedar]

Looking at you, totally-not-traitor-geneseed primaris chapters

[copper swallow]

the way they did "how does the one handed guy reload" in one of the recent animations was "Make the two handed guy do it and straight up toss him the entire gun"

[copper swallow]

Vanguard's really fun, really activates the almonds

[vestal cedar]

The idea of Bobby G telling Cawl not to use traitor geneseed in primaris and him rubbing his hands together like how flies do, and doing it anyway is a really amusing idea

[copper swallow]

Cawl straight up created an AI fascimile of Guilliman to figure out whether the big man will approve his projects or not, basically, and the AI straight up says "you heretic what have you done" whenever he boots it up

[vestal cedar]

Which is hilarious

Cawl is probably my second fave after Trazyn just cause he's so fucking comedic

Cawl out here treating the idea of tech heresy with the same amount of respect the Black Templars show for the Codex Astartes

[copper swallow]

Cawl fun

I'm not sure who my favorite is because Idk if I'm enough of a basic bitch to name a space marine

"wow your favorite is a primarch so original"