Finally
#Deadlock
magic summit
Watched from on top of a roof as a viscous with recharging rush dribbled my mo and krill 5 consecutive times yesterday without them ever parrying
I'm ascendant 3
Why is this happening
warped ridge
Why is this happening
ranks are really sporadic rn
like I'm Oracle V or something with no real map rotation knowledge
late hare
need to learn Sinners spawns so I can play Rem more effectively
still swan
I have learned today you can apperantly refund boon points
warped ridge
also to be clear like
I suspect a bit ranks are also a bit all over the place since they removed ranked mode and now it's just normal mode
it's why there's only really match MMR and no like, open MMR info but I mean game is in testing anyways
final osprey
Why is this happening
Ranks are done in comparison to the entire playerbase so with a bunch of new players coming in existing ones are being pushed up.
Is how it's been explained to me at least.
warped ridge
I don't think it's worth using ranks thaaat much as comparison
we don't have much of an idea of how they work outside of like that which like
why would they even do that?
just leave it as is and MMR will sort itself out
warm sonnet
I have learned today you can apperantly refund boon points
Huuuh?
vivid nimbus
I wasn't sure if it's time based or you have to have not used the ability since the investment
magic summit
Quite possible. The only time its come up for me is when I try to level mid combat and fuck up
agile void
me when I was getting beaten by a vindicta in lane as mo
"nice argument, however"
P strike + combo
final osprey
Phantom strike is good on every character. You simply have to use it at the right time
merry verge
Phantom Strike, silence wave, do not let them play the game
woven nacelleBOT
so deadlock keeps getting mentioned in #video-game-discussion and we've been meaning to try it but there's a weird invite system right? how does that work?
candid horizon
someone you’re friends with on steam who has the game needs to invite you
woven nacelleBOT
alright, ty
autumn field
Bruh the way I play graves is literally “does the orange give debuffs” and then I right click it and bounce to shop when I can
She’s the most braindead macro ever
I love graves
She’s incredible
Apollo is really fun
vivid nimbus
Phantom strike is good on every character. You simply have to use it at the righ...
Phantom Strike on Vindicta?? When is the time for it?
finite grotto
yamatos aa animations breaks with high aa lel
rich grove
Phantom Strike on Vindicta?? When is the time for it?
someone on the official dl server onetricked melee vindicta for a while
now if you do this in my games I will call the police, but I suppose that would be the situation
finite grotto
someone on the official dl server onetricked melee vindicta for a while
holy
vivid nimbus
So what you like phantom strike, bird, shoot them at point blank and punch, use ult for execute?
finite grotto
use flight to drop in fro mda sky for heavy melee?
rich grove
finite grotto
my goat
rich grove
markiplier.gif
rich grove
So what you like phantom strike, bird, shoot them at point blank and punch, use ...
up til its nerf(?) phantom strike was pretty much one of the only ways to truly unreactably get at least one melee from just about anywhere with los at zero windup
merry verge
I don't understand Melee Vindicta but to each their own
finite grotto
Warden moving a bit down in my heroe lineup. I dont know what it is (well i kinda do) but I just am not great at his early. I always feel like I am way more tanky then I actually am 
rich grove
yeah he's really not all that big
he has pretty good base hp but I always find myself needing to buy some kind of 3.2k defensive stopgap sooner rather than later if I actually want to kill the team
otherwise, you just play him as mr. run ya down
quaint kernel
Man this game is a self confidence demolisher
I can't really queue with teams just because my game time is pretty sporadic but getting told I'm useless when trying to play a game is awful.
median lantern
You just gotta mute and move on
People rage because they’re not happy with their play and anyone on their team is an easy scapegoat
ivory reef
Man this game is a self confidence demolisher
I strongly recommend
- disabling team communication
- and then just queueing with a team
this is gonna be a relatively new experience to you if you're not someone who plays a lot of team games, but basically people who solo queue into team games are open to a unique kind of terrible brainworm where they can externalize all their faults on teammates and not just game systems and enemies and shit
quaint kernel
I strongly recommend
- disabling team communication
- and then just queueing wit...
Can't really queue with a team due to my limited time with games tbh
quaint kernel
Very sporadically
ivory reef
that makes sense
median lantern
Eventually you achieve inner peace or become inured to suffering or something in MOBAs and just ignore it
median lantern
Yeah
terse aspen
Speaking as a former League player, the mute button is absolutely your friend
ivory reef
like they are not going to be giving you helpful coordination data
quaint kernel
Yeah that's probably the best way to do it
ivory reef
but I'd also like to show you the team experience sometime
tell me when you're free sometime and maybe my stack will be around
median lantern
When I was playing jungle a lot I’d immediately mute both laners if I ganked a lane and it didn’t go well lol
They have nothing to say
rich grove
it's usually some bullshit like "warden are you saving your ult for next game" from mr. 3/14 in the middle of a mid fight against venator who can stun me out of it by pressing one button and a max antiheal mirage
basically just assume your team is run by twitch chat
ivory reef
yeah I do interact with allchat but I do it as like
- someone with an established very high behaviour score in dota, so the game is putting me up against other 15k behaviour score players
- someone who has a full team of friends. so we're mostly chatting with our opponents
and honestly at that point you do get some nice experiences
I have a few game uploads that are just pleasant conversations with enemies
merry verge
If I block all communication how will I see the crossteam love develop between Paige and Celeste
rich grove
i use allchat as a way to barometer test by asking some innocuous question like 'anyone eat any good sandwiches lately' and then watching the result
ivory reef
lmao that's a good strategy
oh my god
you've reminded me
i have an upload
to make
merry verge
An early pause for laneswap proves a great litmus test for the game
median lantern
i use allchat as a way to barometer test by asking some innocuous question like ...
I used to reflexively mute people who did this lol
rich grove
one time I got frame 0 slurred
wise blade
yeah I do interact with allchat but I do it as like
- someone with an establishe...
Does behaviour score carry over across Valve games? That's a nice touch
rich grove
but then other times I actually got handed the most luxurious sandwich spots I had never even heard of
ivory reef
Does behaviour score carry over across Valve games? That's a nice touch
no, I think deadlock is getting its own implementation
I just mean that's my dota life
wise blade
Right on, that makes more sense
rich grove
I really hope it's a lot less
uh
laissez faire than CS
and we get a lot more people being handed coal and in-game bans on-stream
merry verge
Do they still Vote to Frog hackers
merry verge
Sames, on some stream
quiet sapphire
yeah i don't think i've ever come across a hacker in game
median lantern
I’m reminded of that guy’s speedrunning the n-word in cod
merry verge
And they did so poorly because the game doesn't care how well you aim if six people beat you with hammers
rich grove
I’m reminded of that guy’s speedrunning the n-word in cod
n-y%
median lantern
I don’t need to link these directly but this gets the gist across lol
Silksheets got it down to like .5 seconds though
Fuck CoD
rich grove
he looks like he just saw someone get disintegrated on the sidewalk
ivory reef
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVsPJFhfSXQ @quaint kernel my deadlock social experience
plain furnace
Is the "Highly Competitive" option good in the settings ?
rich grove
might be entirely placebo
quiet sapphire
basically just assume your team is run by twitch chat
chat is my lane partner procedurally generated??????
frail jasper
I forget who said it but it was something like "just assume your team is all malfunctioning AI"
"Even you are just a malfunctioning bot honestly"
merry verge
It's always something to have something breach allchat and learn the enemy Yamato has been losing her mind all game
And then you befriend their Vyper or whatever
rich grove
like adopting a rescue animal 😭
merry verge
A toxic teammate on a losing team means you get to watch them not win
There's benefits
frail jasper
the other day I found out I mind-broke the enemy mina into rage quitting, I only found out when the silver told me I impressed them by it
I went and reviewed the replay though and it wasn't just me, my lanemate abrams also dunked on her VERY HARD
rich grove
powa dunk
merry verge
An enemy Mina was absolutely dominating until like 5/6 of us bought targetted counter items and just ate her in teamfights, dead silence for 40 minutes and then just "fuck my chungus mina life"
frail jasper
mina solo-ulted abrams, so he wall jumped -> double jumped -> heavy melee'd her and instantly killed her
don't need no abilities, don't care about no silence bats
merry verge
mina solo-ulted abrams, so he wall jumped -> double jumped -> heavy melee'd her ...
Brutality....
quiet sapphire
let's see what this book can do.
rich grove
COMIN THROUGH
quiet sapphire
THIS BOOK BETTER SAVE MY ASS
frail jasper
vast sandal
I can't really queue with teams just because my game time is pretty sporadic but...
It’s not about you, it’s about them
merry verge
Abrams why must your gun hurt so much
ivory reef
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deqVEPUO78U old upload for @granite heath . @mystic breach @arctic basin cameos
vast sandal
A) if they were such hot shit compared to you they could win the match anyways
B) if they were such hot shit they wouldn’t get matched with you, odds are they’re roughly as skilled as you are
C) everyone was new to this once, bagging on a teammate for playing bad just shows your willingness for it to not be your fault your team lost
quiet sapphire
d) fuck 'em.
granite heath
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deqVEPUO78U old upload for <@203733729577926656>...
nyoooom
ivory reef
"Holliday is coming in, she has like a 1000 unsecured souls"
the perfidious Tom: 👀
quiet sapphire
got urn and the bag
get 6k souls in 30 seconds
started clip at 27k
26k actually
damn
finite patrol
alright, ty
if you want an invite I can send you one just provide your steam nick/profile
granite heath
"i'm in pursuit" - magic carpet noises
The key to magic carpet is to pretend I am suddenly in a plane or perhaps space game and need to shake a bogey off my tail or pursue the bandit.
rich grove
unhappy flare noises
astral lava
So what's good advice to deal with Lash in lane? I feel like every time I lane against him I just spend the whole time dying to stomps and flogs
warped ridge
As who?
astral lava
anyone.
twilit roost
spirit shielding and pushing him once he uses those abilities
warped ridge
I usually just kill him or kill the minions so he cant be aggressive without the minions fucking him up
agile void
So what's good advice to deal with Lash in lane? I feel like every time I lane a...
slowing hex him off cooldown?
he basically loses grapple so he cant escape for free
astral lava
it always feels weird buying 1600 items as first buy but if I must
warped ridge
That or outzone him and focus on farm/denies
astral lava
does slowing hex also stop stomp if hes already in air
agile void
rusted barrel is also an option, since his gun is technically strong early
agile void
does slowing hex also stop stomp if hes already in air
sadly no
astral lava
ridiculous lol its a movement ability!
the things slowing hex does or doesnt stop is wild
agile void
ridiculous lol its a movement ability!
and calico gets 3 out of 4 of her kit disabled
ivory reef
So what's good advice to deal with Lash in lane? I feel like every time I lane a...
taking control of the high ground is pretty good against him
agile void
just how it is
astral lava
calico ult: movement
apollo 1: not movement
ivory reef
if he's gonna stomp you just, like, dash towards him or in any other direction than the one he's predicting you're going really
astral lava
i feel like its usually under my tower that im dying
ivory reef
if you're being pushed to your tower you are actually in a fairly vulnerable position yeah
agile void
you could also buy enchanters
ivory reef
I don't recommend enchanter's if you're doing badly
astral lava
playing that far back feels like its just an invitation to still lose tower
twilit roost
spirit shielding is gonna give you a temp shield basically equal to the life youlose in lane from him, it's very worth it
astral lava
also rip reactive barrier activation After the cc
vast sandal
Losing a tower bites but you just lose the tower and then you farm
ivory reef
like the reality is you just may not be in a position to really meaningfully, like, kill a lash in the laning stage
the important thing is your souls
even dying once or twice is really not that big a deal
somber creek
A lot of lashes will commit full combos as poke
ivory reef
take sidecamps, take boxes between waves, make sure you're securing creeps, etc
somber creek
Which can be used to bait
ivory reef
like that is actually the first and main metric you need to start with
it's easy to like, lose the plot a bit and be proud of killing the other guys a few times and they never killed you but actually they still exit the laning stage with more souls than you
if that happens to you that is bad
agile void
still like I said, if you get slowing hex, you are telling them to be careful
they dont have the second grapple to get out
ivory reef
if we're talking midgame stuff
lash is comically weak to counterspell
practice it against him
just parry every death slam, parry his ult
agile void
midgame ofc knockdown too
astral lava
counterspell im mostly fine at doing vs him (besides forgetting its 2 dings and not 3) its truly Just laning that i can't deal with him
ivory reef
oh excellent
agile void
he gets the full demerit of being in the air if you knock him down
ivory reef
okay then honestly like try not to worry too much about it
get early lane regen like healing rite or extra regen
vast sandal
Laning against Lash is gonna suck a little but the one thing I will say is
Take your damage
vast sandal
He sticks his head out? Take ya damage
astral lava
its truly just. every damn lash lane
ivory reef
like the truth is that beating lash involves a lot of like. dark souls skill stuff
agile void
like voy mentioned
ivory reef
you'll get there
vast sandal
If he loses his HP now he’s taking his life into his hands going for the combo
astral lava
also always feel like im wasting every healing rite any time it gets interrupted at all mostly because I am also always interrupting it on my enemies
vast sandal
Take ya damage
astral lava
hard mode 2: I cant fucking aim at people moving fast
ivory reef
also always feel like im wasting every healing rite any time it gets interrupted...
okay if you're someone who can't use healing rite easily don't get it. just get extra regen
extra regen is a fine item
like get what works
agile void
if you fuck any of it he already has to disengage
warped ridge
Extra regen is great, it's basically pots from other mobas but non consumable
finite patrol
also always feel like im wasting every healing rite any time it gets interrupted...
so the best way to use healing rite is to buy it, put it on, then go do boxes
if you're 1hp its not like you can do much in lane anyway
ideally you just pushed wave, took a trade, and you can back off and do boxes while your lane ops manage their wave
also good when roaming between lanes
if youre staying in lane and fighting, extra regen is much better as people mentioned above
astral lava
I see
god I need to get better at learning box locations relative to where I am. Also my kingdom for vents being on the minimap
autumn field
if they ever do deadlock figures they NEED to do a silver figure
finite patrol
if people want i could take some of yall down some box routes and map shortcuts. im not the best at movement but I can still show you plenty of things
idk if there's a good box route video on yt
finite patrol
ah never mind here you go
this will be almost entirely current since bases dont have boxes and the other changes to box locations are relatively minor
rich grove
if you're Like That the reliable dodge option for 1 compared to trying to roll out of the aoe (when he can freely spin 360 to hit you) is to double jump out of it
finite grotto
can i even upgrade anything?
rich grove
can i even upgrade anything?
your teammates should consider selling some 800s so they can buy a new router
rich grove
you might actually be in silent hill
quiet sapphire
purgatory
finite grotto
we are approaching 75 minutes
stray arch
That’s painful
finite patrol
siphon bullets perma stacks?
median lantern
Deadlock is incredible it’s combining FGC scrubquotes with FPS and MOBA discourse
astral lava
if you're Like That the reliable dodge option for 1 compared to trying to roll o...
does it need to be a double jump? is that why jumping over it never works lol. god my friend who's way better than me is terrible at advice
finite grotto
siphon bullets perma stacks?
no siphon bullets
this is how the game is currently looking
autumn field
silver is harder than apollo imo
warm sonnet
ye
autumn field
her output is super breakpointy
i was testing this build in bots
like, earlygame
she can barely do anything
late game, her gun basically deletes everyone
rich grove
does it need to be a double jump? is that why jumping over it never works lol. g...
yeah they nerfed the height a while back so you can reliably double jump but idt a single works
the only issue would be if the lash dives at you and gets the dragdown but that seems like a really silly choice when the aoe gets wider further away, so you want to land at a moderate distance from your target to cover the most space possible to their left/right
finite grotto
cant backdoor either
graves is literally perma sitting in theor base
i cant fight the graves xd
she just melts me
I wanna die
ok by this point it has crystalised we are being held hostage
I am so fucking drained
lavish shale
Deadlock is incredible it’s combining FGC scrubquotes with FPS *and* MOBA discou...
that's kinda real honestly
torn gulch
she can barely do anything
I think there is like
finite grotto
99 minutes
finite grotto
and like 40 minutes of that being held basically hostage
torn gulch
Then kinda falls off until ult
Get some oranges, good again
Rising into midgame and then falls off in late
Being able to put 3 bullets into someone is really good especially if against a widebody hero
median lantern
that's kinda real honestly
I don’t think it’s completely false but I do think it’s super normal for there to be low elo shitter hitters and high elo demons as far as MOBA characters go
torn gulch
Also true
lavish shale
I don’t think it’s completely false but I do think it’s super normal for there t...
that is definitely normal, yeah
vivid nimbus
There's also some M1-oriented characters that perform just as well at low level as high, like Wraith
finite grotto
thinking about the game I think until a certain point there was nothing we could have done and should have just waited in base for minion death
vast sandal
lots and lots of patches as of recent
finite grotto
you might actually be in silent hill
confirmed silent hill purgatory hell
autumn field
Deadlock is incredible it’s combining FGC scrubquotes with FPS *and* MOBA discou...
is it just me or does this feel fine to me?
astral lava
https://youtu.be/4kdsGuncqSE
thank you btw
autumn field
esp when deadlock also has the "ability that requires good aim and preplacement" characters (im looking at you doorman)
rich grove
entire team is babies
heavy voice
finite grotto
Ye had the same happen to me after the 99 minute fiesta with two dcs from our side xd
finite patrol
My rank hasn't changed from Oracle 3 since the last rank adjustment lmao
warped ridge
did they do another one recently?
terse aspen
Does anyone have tips for dealing with an enemy Apollo? I laned against one as Ivy alongside a Silver, and we didn't stand a chance. He quickly got to the point that he could dive us under walker, score a double kill, and escape mostly unscathed.
candid horizon
was there a crazy soul diff?
terse aspen
I don't recall, but I don't think so? At least initially, later on there definitely was just from how much he was killing everyone.
rich grove
focus wave with monster rounds, try to shove him under tower and keep him there so you can breathe, just try to farm in general and stay safe with items like extra regen or rite
terse aspen
Looking at the match graph, it looks like he was actually behind until about minute 8
terse aspen
focus wave with monster rounds, try to shove him under tower and keep him there ...
Gotcha
rich grove
like most of these lanemonsters you really need to get as much breathing room as possible and you likely trade extremely poorly into him
in particular when he gets 1AP into his 3 he immediately just wins any trade because perfect timing gives him HP back on hero hits
Ivy in particular is not an incredible kill laner so I would really just focus on staying alive and outfarming him: if he's just harrassing you he isn't running boxes and often can just outright forget CS depending on the elo
so often I've been in lanes where I feel I'm conducting trench warfare and then I look at the soul count and somehow we are dogwalking them by an entire k
vivid nimbus
Yeah I’ve had lanes like that
rich grove
in general you're just trying to shove them so far back you have enough space to catch jungle+boxes as they spawn
vivid nimbus
Where it feels like we’re fighting for our lives or even behind in deaths and then we look at the top and notice we’re ahead in souls
rich grove
and if you can do that and they can't they're still going to be very much broke
they're basically gambling that their reduced time picking up farm will be compensated by kill bounty
finite patrol
apollo really hard to fight in lane but not the best at pushing wave
dont be someone who has to get up close against him idk anyone who beats him in lane rn
rich grove
dont be someone who has to get up close against him idk anyone who beats him in ...
hes just red yamato
finite patrol
does Yamato have heal in lane?
candid horizon
yes
rich grove
does Yamato have heal in lane?
3
frail jasper
Her 3 is really good for lane healing and making positive trades
vernal parcel
been loving playing this eepy guy
however ive been having the worst luck of people dc whenever i play him
quaint kernel
Deadlock is incredible it’s combining FGC scrubquotes with FPS *and* MOBA discou...
It's funny cause I think a lot of the appeal of deadlock is it is just a game that lets you improve and get good
FGC people like to get good
Also this is absolutely a FPS scrubquote frfr
median lantern
Yeah it's kinda funny to look at this as a moba issue when the same has happened in every FPS
rich grove
yea
median lantern
Like how Widowmaker needed substantial nerfs on release in OW because the Freaks would take over lobbies with her
somber creek
or how Sniper TF2 is the objective best class and has been for like 20 years
median lantern
I am not sure of that outside of some mathematical definitions of objective best
astral lava
FREE one hit kills
median lantern
Look I'm just saying all the pro leagues do max 1 medic max 1 demo not max 1 sniper
astral lava
i've still got that ugc highlander Tin division medal
median lantern
It's funny cause I think a lot of the appeal of deadlock is it is just a game th...
I also agree here, Deadlock has so many dimensions of skill
quaint kernel
Can't believe the ... uh... wait oh no...
astral lava
too many dimensions. jumping will be removed next update
quaint kernel
I do really like it I just wish games didn't take 40 minutes to finish
astral lava
[BAD JOKE] just win faster then
median lantern
The only thing worse than a moba with long game times is a moba with short game times
quaint kernel
I'd take half an hour games on average tbh
I'm very much a fighting gamer though and the reason I was able to stick with that genre is that I can play for legit 5 minutes and feel like I had a good time and dip out
astral lava
what if they add a techies-like character whose job is to make the game go longer so carries can get more built
quaint kernel
That would make me sad lol
Also finally getting the hang of Celeste and how to farm with her, I just need to figure out the rhythm of jumping people
raven spindle
or how Sniper TF2 is the objective best class and has been for like 20 years
A good Sniper really just shuts the entire game down in a way that no other player is really capable of
quaint kernel
I think she is a very long range poke character but she can kinda instant kill you at late game I'm just really bad at it
median lantern
What I’m kinda thinking of is that shorter moba game times tend to have to sacrifice laning phase, secondary objectives, or comeback potential or something
A lot of them have tried to get game time down
quaint kernel
It's deffo a hard balance with these games for sure
median lantern
Yeah
quaint kernel
The thing with Deadlock is that it's already a pretty exhausting game too, and it feels like there's mostly a clear winner by 30 minute mark
So you are slogging through the last like, 15 minutes of the game after having played 30 minutes of a really hard game, and even with games I won I can feel that pacing grind to a halt and the momentum just doesn't push hard enough towards the end sometimes
Part of that is not queue-ing with teams I know that
If you have a group of people communicating it's a lot easier to swing that momentum towards a win
But cutting some comeback potential right at the end might be a good idea IMO. Removing one of the healthbars for the patrons could do it too
somber creek
idk, I always feel like it's worse to just keep stomps stomps
quaint kernel
Wdym by that?
Also I'm kinda a genre outsider so I'm not privy to a lot of stuff inside MOBA's
somber creek
I feel like removing built in comeback mechanics because a winning team should just steamroll a match feels worse than having hope at a victory
median lantern
Comeback mechanics are tricky to balance
quaint kernel
They can either extend a frustrating game or give you a good amount of hope yeah
Removing just the second Healthbar on the patron is probably just enought but thats me spitballing
somber creek
Well what that does it get rid of of the respawn reset
autumn field
do i just shoot whenever i see a marker appear while im on mirage?
somber creek
?
autumn field
theres a little purple marker that appears when i shoot w/ mirage
somber creek
ya
that shows up whoever you shoots
and is a stacking damage buff
that procs a bit afterwards
it deals double damage per shot landed
So you should be shooting whoever you have shot
somber creek
He needs a rework tbh
His kit is like 4 different mechanics that just kinda
exist beside each other
median lantern
He’s TF
vivid nimbus
I think the only weird part of his kit is that the scarabs lower bullet resist but his bullet damage kinda sucks
finite patrol
its very weird to look at him and then look at the newer heroes who have tons of synergies
his gun used to hit a lot harder iirc
okay not a huge amount but base -10% then reduced growth by ~15%
finite patrol
I do think traveler, tornado, and mark are cool skills for an m1 carry but scarabs are a brawler spell
somber creek
and not a dive
finite patrol
tornado could also be a brawler skill i guess
its flexible cus it does like 8 different things
vivid nimbus
okay not a huge amount but base -10% then reduced growth by ~15%
And also scarabs reduced bullet resist by 10/25%, now only 8%/16%
finite patrol
I would be happy if they got rid of scarabs I hate that skill
somber creek
Like TF is a pretty genius kit imo
finite patrol
Yeah his kit is pretty similar but mirages teleport is so much worse
median lantern
Yeah not being free targeted (albeit a much bigger deal in 3d) changes a lot
finite patrol
part of that is just cus of how an rts style game works compared to a 3ps
somber creek
Safe CC, an attack speed buff, and easy AoE that he can do infinitely thanks to mana stacking
So TF is really hard to dislodge from lane and can use early advantages to manipulate macro
Mirage has a damage passive, a one target skill shot, and his main AoE is his mobility and his hard CC
So he can't push waves well, he has no sustain to prevent him from being bullied out of lane, he has one hard CC that is his only initiation tool and also his only escape
TF's whole thing is he can engage from relative safety to farm ganks
Mirage can't really do that
frail jasper
This is why people buy Ricochet first item on mirage
now suddenly he CAN do all that
vivid nimbus
LoL creep waves also are AOE-able in more predictable ways than DL creep waves
But yeah I guess tesla or richochet exist
somber creek
DL creep pathfinding infuriates me
finite patrol
bro WHY are you in the tier 3 camp
I do think replacing scarabs with whatever tfs cone attack is would be a net positive for mirage
imagine if he could farm before ricochet
somber creek
Scarabs also is imo just like
the worst feeling ability in the game
Even if you do it perfectly and hit all of them it doesn't actually feel like you did anything
it doesn't even feel like you shot a projectile
it looks like you pressed a button and mirage jankily waved his arm and spent all the charges
frail jasper
candidate for most forgettable basic ability in deadlock
somber creek
Mirage is too cool to have a jank-ass kit
lavish grove
I remember his release when he was busted
His tornado lifted for like 3 seconds base
And his gun hit like a truck
lavish grove
So he played like Haze but with hard CC, a map teleport and evasion for no reason
I’m still frustrated he has evasion tbh
I never see him anymore so I don’t care as much but I still hate the mechanic
frail jasper
volume warning
early mirage screamed all the fucking time
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1244976268534091816/1434523841320718438/for_the_djinn.mp4?ex=69950baf&is=6993ba2f&hm=63908d8e8580a56c9252225264cef0a70c5ac7d3fc5e506310a8e58152a41225&
autumn field
twas a bot match but like
lavish grove
volume warning
early mirage screamed all the fucking time
https://cdn.discordapp...
Ok but they should bring this aspect back
Ever since mirage stopped screaming FOR THE DJINN he hasn’t been the same
autumn field
bots won't know how to play around his marks so you just blow them up
yeah but just his kit doesnt have any fun factor for me
finite patrol
volume warning
early mirage screamed all the fucking time
https://cdn.discordapp...
I love how this video is like. 108p
frail jasper
in theory mirage is really simple though. you just keep tagging people with your gun then explode them for 8x or 12x damage, repeat until you can afford ricochet and now you do it to the entire camp/lane/teamfight
lavish grove
Honestly I’m just not sure what they want mirage to be anymore
frail jasper
ult to split push like a bastard
lavish grove
He has the makings of a gun carry but his gun is mediocre
He can teleport around to support but he’s got no synergy with support items
finite patrol
he's solid as a gun carry tbh
his gun should be weak if its also doing marks
gun carries that can't be defeated by metal skin always have value
autumn field
how do i say this
lavish grove
I mean maybe but Mina has a very similar mechanic and a way better gun
somber creek
Because his kit doesn't have much oomph in animation, sound design, or numbers
lavish grove
Honestly Mina kinda just does what Mirage did but more satisfying
Each of their abilities besides their ults are very comparable
finite patrol
mirage being boring is a pretty common complaint
lavish grove
the worst *feeling* ability in the game
Also yah this
Scarabs, suck
They’re a good ability objectively
But I don’t think anyone enjoys using it
astral lava
Keep the scarab so he can keep yelling about it but make it do anything else
finite patrol
I wouldn't mind if it was just a line or a cone and you didnt have to fuck with it
would be nice if it synergized better with his medium range play instead of being a close ranged brawling spell
rich grove
scarabs are mid as shit even in lane now that you can't panic shit 4 of them in a row
you just buy mystic regen instead and shoot one person every 8 seconds with your god-sized bullets
he just kind of has a load of random abilities stapled together and then his 1, but it turns out "free invuln" + "lane jesus" + "global map presence" is good enough to see regular play
the character is clearly good but i think he maybe has one on-theme ability and the rest is "fuckin uhhh I guess he's middle eastern"
the teleport rules for the bodyguard fantasy but basically no other thing about him speaks to that fact
I like making people fucking Die of a Heart Attack but outside of that he's the epitomy of the "I like water with no ice" meme
autumn field
it is so fucking funny if you can get like, 50 stacks of siphon bullets
mossy lance
But I don’t think anyone enjoys using it
they need better feedback is my thought personally
like the fact i can press a button and A: have no clue what happened, B: have no idea if it did anything, and C: doubt myself whether i pressed the button to begin with
is impressive
final osprey
Phantom Strike on Vindicta?? When is the time for it?
When you get phantom striked, use it to counter phantom strike leaving both of you slowed and disarmed. Increasing your chance of getting away.
finite patrol
the character is clearly good but i think he maybe has one on-theme ability and ...
racist game design
finite patrol
When you get phantom striked, use it to counter phantom strike leaving both of y...
this is legitimately insane
rich grove
"when you get shot, aim the bullet wound at your target to disorient them with the blood spray."
final osprey
The only way to stop a bad guy with a phantom strike is a good guy with a phantom strike
finite patrol
what about a good guy with dispel magic and warp stone
finite patrol
"when you get shot, aim the bullet wound at your target to disorient them with t...
t. The Xenomoprh
vivid nimbus
like the fact i can press a button and A: have no clue what happened, B: have no...
I tried watching a VOD of Mirage and went "wait his 1 is on cooldown now, what happened" before I actually noticed it being used
frail jasper
what are they gonna do, copyright claim it?
autumn field
actually
small thought
why does vindicta NEED to scope in
why cant i use it without the 3x zoom
mild flume
mirage does a truck load of damage to whole teams when loaded
and application of crap
frail jasper
woe, toxic bullets + inhibitor + silencer + healbane + suppressor + spirit shredder
autumn field
God damn
mina really goes from "throwing the whole game" to "deleting the lobby" at a really specific time
finite patrol
why cant i use it without the 3x zoom
i think its so that people have time to react
similarly why ira domini has a loud vocal cue and an animation where he pulls out his xbow
but it would be nice if you could charge up while scoped in
rich grove
"why don't valve just make the sniper rifle clearly intended to be used at longer ranges but weak at short range stop having the visual modification that makes it easier to use it at long range, and harder to use at short range"
finite patrol
yeah its also that
autumn field
"why don't valve just make the sniper rifle clearly intended to be used at longe...
Weird thing but I have a REALLY weird thing where I for some fucking reason CANNOT aim at long range unless I’m using a 1x scope
I don’t know why or how this works
agile rune
I ran into someone with the exact handle as my fucking roommate
was it them?
finite patrol
I don’t know why or how this works
you havent learned how!
agile rune
yet
autumn field
you havent learned how!
Ok but like I mean this seriously
I used to play games where I would dominate on a sniper
But I always used a 1x because it just controlled that much better
Even though 6x was kinda the meta
vast sandal
Okay I’m kind of arriving at an annoying conclusion about Wraith
Which is that her core items that actually make her pop off are Mercurial Magnum and Surge of Power, but those are both Spirit items
agile rune
explain, I am not a wraith gamer
frail jasper
wraith wants to 4 someone then 3 and bullet hose them to death, MM and SoP both add a lot of spirit damage to all bullets and also skyrocket the fire rate
vast sandal
okay so Wraith's 1 has a gimmick where instead of being on a cooldown it charges when you shoot someone
this makes increasing her fire rate really good, and also if you can somehow (foreshadowing) tie using her 1 to increasing her firerate and reloading her gun, it feeds back into itself
autumn field
Which is that her core items that actually make her pop off are Mercurial Magnum...
Her 3 scales on spirit which is fine
vast sandal
so you imbue 1 with Mercurial Magnum and Surge of Power, so that when you use her 1 you reload her gun, gain damage, gain firerate, and gain spirit damage on your gun
this feeds back into itself and causes you to absolutely cook people with Fullest Auto gunfire
autumn field
Also bullet resist shredder is core on her
vast sandal
yeah
agile rune
I'm not seeing why this is an issue luna
vast sandal
if you have no gun damage your gun deals no damage
vast sandal
Capacitor, Mercurial Magnum, Surge of Power and Bullet Resist Shredder are expensive basically
and at some point you wanna buy Leech too, or you're gonna get folded
autumn field
I think this is the build I ran
finite patrol
Tesla + swift striker you buy before surge or merc mag i think and thats gun spike and thats enough
autumn field
Though I’m 99% sure it’s outdated
vast sandal
honestly the frustrating part is that what you really want for laning is Tesla Bullets
finite patrol
BRS is also increasing gun damage for card generation
vast sandal
but Tesla Bullets is kinda 'spensive with it
idk it's just kinda like
you need a bunch of expensive shit for Wraith to pop off and before that all you have is a pretty strong gun and cards that are kinda tricky to aim but really hard to dodge
agile rune
wasn't it wraith you were tinkering with being a bullet status pita
vast sandal
yeah
tbh Wraith has a really complete kit and I'm kinda just grumbling about her hypercarry status requiring a lot of farm to achieve
to the point that most games it feels like I'm just farming/splitpushing a lot and not participating much
mild flume
thatsa the cost for what you do once you get the money
rich grove
does anyone know if curse beats unstop
vast sandal
so the real question is uhhh
how do I, you know, contribute
when I am playing the greedyguts carry who wants everything
mystic breach
how do I, you know, contribute
farm 40k souls and kill the enemy team fifty times and melt every objective in under 5 seconds
vast sandal
yeah but by the time I have 40k the game's already over and my team won without me doing shit
mystic breach
like, that's kinda what you're complaining about but like
that's how the character works
finite patrol
Farming and pushing side lanes are important
mild flume
push walkers when peolpe are busy
finite patrol
and often get left behind in pubs
rich grove
you don't have to be literally god in order to participate in teamfights
play around power spike timings
vast sandal
I was just a useless asshole the whole time while everyone else did stuff and then at the end when the enemy team is already broken in half I'm like "hey guys my build's finally ready"
finite patrol
and yeah if you leave wraith alone with a walker its dead right
rich grove
when you get tesla start looking to turn someone's ass inside out
vast sandal
and yeah if you leave wraith alone with a walker its dead right
oh yeah Wraith is gonna eat your walker
mild flume
set up ganks with a +1 when like, its just you and someone depushing you
rich grove
5AP in 3, start getting ornery
vast sandal
Wraith is REALLY REALLY HUNGRY and if you leave her alone with your lane she will devour it
rich grove
the suspiciously walker-shaped wraith:
mild flume
your kit is a pretty guaranteed kill for your yamato or whoever is if you give them the setup
when someone comes to stop you being in a lane
vast sandal
okay so start turning split push opposition into an opportunity for a gank ?
I can see that
mild flume
yeah that can be good
aggressively steal sinners and stuff as you get strong
take their farm when you can get away with it or your team is close enough
rich grove
play off of the radar to see when it's likely they send you a 1v1 and tear them asunder
finite patrol
anyway yeah wraith is a late game hard carry and not the best early on thats how it is
mild flume
there is still a lot you can do to farm and make money in a way that contributes
rich grove
ultimately if you're keeping their wave shoved back you're still doing a good amount
whether or not your team can capitalise off of that space is uhhhhh but yknow what
vast sandal
okay okay
so it's kind of a balance between being a lategame carry and living that life, and also getting value where you can while you're still on your way to the big big power spike
rich grove
yeh
knowing when you're strong is kind of difficult
changing priorities as the game goes on is one of the pain points of learning the game
vivid nimbus
But I always used a 1x because it just controlled that much better
I think could be a mouse sensitivity issue for you, unfortunately I don't remember DL having a separate scoped sensitivity setting
frail jasper
IIRC that's a setting you can adjust, yes. It might be out of whack or just not what your muscle memory anticipates so aiming becomes problematic
mild flume
and also bullying them out of farm and such where you can
agile rune
important to bully when you can
mild flume
yes
and I guess also you are most likely your teams best midboss damage
so yeah doing that
or being in position for opportunities there is good
stable forum
:3
still swan
So Seven is basically a Lich right
final osprey
How are you defining Lich?
undone galleon
hes an undead prison wizard
dim tendon
mhm he's not like
Undying, like a lich would be as far as im aware
you can still kill seven it'd just be yknow
hard
because he's seven
still swan
Skeletal Undead Occultist with an ego, an immense amount of knowledge, and brimming with ambition to get even more power
undone galleon
the main thing is he doesnt have A Separate Thing that keeps him alive
still swan
Yeah, thats the one catch
undone galleon
or at least hasnt been implied to have one
still swan
He doesnt have a soul gem/phlactery/etc
final osprey
Skeletal Undead Occultist with an ego, an immense amount of knowledge, and brimm...
I think he's more like, a skeleton robit guy is the thing
dim tendon
i wouldnt even say he's very skeletony personally
final osprey
Actually you are right, he is more a guy who's burned
dim tendon
its just his head thats skeletonic
final osprey
it's mainly his face that's skeletal
dim tendon
tbh Seven is simply Him
magic summit
What part of him is undead
dim tendon
theres an argument that maybe his body died but his soul didnt
i guess?
but its kinda flimsy
undone galleon
all of hims undead
im p sure the face is the part that melted bc they had a like
electrocution from the top execution situation
dim tendon
true but its kinda hard to say if he's undead, or just fucked up (magical style) and alive
i've always leaned towards the latter
magic summit
There just isn't anything that actually says or implies he is dead at all
dim tendon
yeah
magic summit
And we've got a few dead characters
raven spindle
it's mainly his face that's skeletal
And that's not really his face, either-
dim tendon
until we get a voiceline of Slork asking if seven wants a cheeseburger after the ritual and seven going "i cant eat anymore and also dont talk to me" we'll never know x3
raven spindle
Seven doesn't really have a skeleton face as much as he has a glowing skull that pokes through a prisoner's veil
final osprey
What part of him is undead
Imo he's a like ghost haunting his own corpse which is in a weird like technological suit type thing.
But that's just vibe based
raven spindle
Also liches are a real thing in Deadlock (bc of Graves) and Seven very notably distances himself from them
Though to be fair, Seven is arrogant enough to just Call himself a different thing even if he did basically qualify as a lich
vivid nimbus
So Seven is basically a Lich right
Not quite, but Kelvin is
warm sonnet
Also liches are a real thing in Deadlock (bc of Graves) and Seven very notably d...
That's because she's a mentor, not for being a lich
raven spindle
Fair enough-
raven spindle
Not quite, but Kelvin is
Idk what the distinction between a wight and a lich is in this universe bc I don't know if they're going by folkloric rules or DnD rules
undone galleon
kelvin calls himself a revenant
magic summit
I think a difference is I'm not sure that Kelvin chose to come back, I think it just happened what with the giant magical artifact on his back
vivid nimbus
Also, found a popular fan theory that Seven is not just Kelvin's old mate Ettrick, but that his name is Mr. L. Ettrick
(Say it out loud)
undone galleon
god, see the thing is i wouldnt put this past the deadlock writing team
raven spindle
I think that's funny enough that it should be true
magic summit
undone galleon
lmao
finite patrol
evil gay electric crime skeleton
still swan
Old Man Toxic Yaoi
undone galleon
speaking of i was abt to ask how much yaoi is tjere already
magic summit
speaking of i was abt to ask how much yaoi is tjere already
A new voiceline is this
undone galleon
lmao
gray otter
Also, found a popular fan theory that Seven is not just Kelvin's old mate Ettric...
AWESOME
astral lava
Ettrick is also 7 letters
undone galleon
loathsome gameswriter
undone galleon
im lowkey evill
tidal elm
was playing a pretty good drifter game
got matched against a full duration Mo and Krill
the ult is like, 5 seconds long
quaint kernel
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/HBV3hZAbcAIXNCD?format=png&name=900x900
TBH He has been doing a pretty good job, the slams have all been really good marketing events
finite patrol
I think with sup duration mnk ult is only ~4 seconds but it sure feels like 10
agile void
I think with sup duration mnk ult is only ~4 seconds but it sure feels like 10
sup duration + arcane surge
warm sonnet
And let's not forget subjective experience
Adds/removes at least one to eight seconds
finite grotto
they blasted us early (not the warden) so we are 10 kills behijnd but even in souls
finite patrol
well build spirit resilience and spellbreaker gg
not a single orange item on the entire damned team lmao
vivid nimbus
He's 6/1/7 but also second least souls somehow?
finite grotto
quiet sapphire
He's 6/1/7 but also second least souls somehow?
the furtive dynamo:
finite grotto
might be a witchmail game for sure
quiet sapphire
damn
vivid nimbus
Yeah I noticed Dynamo late
quiet sapphire
i guess he's just burgerboxing and not farming
hitting the wrong kind of box runs, so to speak
vivid nimbus
And now Holiday gets oranges! ... For recharging charges and applying more spirit damage
vivid nimbus
It's honestly not a bad build tho
vivid nimbus
Viscous why do you have battle vest
random urchin
Warden shoots you with a gun so you should buy gun resist
merry verge
Celeste is kind of hard to defend against with her damage amp and they aaaalways build more shred
finite grotto
jusr did a bad teamfight and it snowballed from there sadge
vast sandal
it's kinda wild how Celeste gets to counter defending against Celeste for free and also has a shield so she's hard to kill
merry verge
Spellbreaker wasted on the 200 damage Starter Nuke
astral lava
no reason her ult is just immune to counterspell
ivory reef
it's not immune, it stops the damage
bleak thicket
yeah
and you get a lil icon on you when its homing in on you
ivory reef
yeah
and you get a lil icon on you when its homing in on you
OOH
is that the icon?
damn that's so useful
bleak thicket
i think so
vast sandal
okay that's good to know
finite patrol
Celeste ult is very hard to deal with. You have to split up and then you can't fight as a team. Sometimes you get lucky though and you can take the ball away after a couple bounces and it does very little except take one person out of the fight for 5 seconds. Which is still quite a lot in some fights
ivory reef
it does seem like your classic skill issue ult
lich's ult is truly game defining until you learn how to delta split
and then it becomes increasingly more and more deep when people learn how to like
individually run away with the ult on them
quiet sapphire
it's also surprisingly quiet
merry verge
I still think the camera perspective adjusts the optics here
quiet sapphire
lich ult is BIG and LOUD
ivory reef
so the rest of their team doesn't even bother
@bleak thicket pointed out that you literally have a homing indicator on you
this is huge
and like. frankly none of us know that
quiet sapphire
celeste ult sometimes your team runs into you whilst you're isolating yourself
ivory reef
we're just learning
ivory reef
if you see the sparkly icon on you you have a ball incoming
merry verge
'No two people can run away the same direction' is an issue
bleak thicket
thats a coordination issue
merry verge
And it bounces off minions jungle and herself
bleak thicket
lich ult is fine in dota
median lantern
lich ult is BIG and LOUD
They should just add screaming vfx for the duration of the ultra bounces
ivory reef
lich's ult:
- takes away like half your life per hit. you will die in like 3 bounces. it is absolutely brutal.
- ignores terrain
merry verge
Idk how fast you all can instantly communicate
ivory reef
as far as I can tell celeste's ult has like 15 bounces but each individual bounce does not that much damage
and I think it needs LOS?
quiet sapphire
i've had ball go through terrain
bleak thicket
i do wonder if it could do without the "prioritizes enemy heroes"
quiet sapphire
i dont think it does
ivory reef
like if you dive into a hidey hole you take the orb away
I don't fully understand the rules
I'll need to do more testing
autumn field
as far as I can tell celeste's ult has like 15 bounces but each individual bounc...
18
ivory reef
but bluntly I think we as a general community just aren't used to it and haven't figured out all its rules yet
autumn field
8+10 (t3)
lavish shale
Lich ult is also a lot slower
ivory reef
Lich ult is also a lot slower
that's not really true
autumn field
a
ivory reef
I've noticed that celeste's ult has a minimum travel time
the orb has to go up, then travel to above the target's head, then go down
you can't get like a 50 bounce per second situation
you can do nasty shit with lich ult
merry verge
It also slows you and makes your dashes worse, so splitting up is instantly harder
bleak thicket
i do think it usually gets to the 18 bounces if it has targets
merry verge
And you just need to Know Where It Is
bleak thicket
since its a linger limit not a total duration limit afaik
quiet sapphire
yeah
ivory reef
also I'll note lich's ult can be upgraded to infinity bounces
quiet sapphire
it'll linger for up to 4.5 seconds each bounce
ivory reef
and he can put down a terrain object that is a bounce target
merry verge
These are different videogames
quiet sapphire
not last 4.5 seconds in total
bleak thicket
yeah and they have the same head designer
ivory reef
like my general point is that she's stealing design from a guy that many of us already know with a very sicknasty ult
it is for sure very strong
bleak thicket
and a lot of deadlock abilities are just straight up dota abilities or items
merry verge
Yeah and they removed Raven's ult for being Medusa's ult which is heinously unfun in a 3d space
I'm saying they innately function differently
ivory reef
... raven?
vivid nimbus
Raven was one of the hero labs ones
vivid nimbus
Raven was the older guy with the eyepatch and the white tux, he had a banger design but a terrible kit
bleak thicket
again, i do wonder if the "prioritizes heroes" part could be lost
ivory reef
my perspective seems to be echoed by the designers which is just that she needs some numbers tweaking
merry verge
I was just trying to say everything that works in Dota might not always work here, sorry
somber creek
Raven has fun lore
bleak thicket
a big part of the lich ult balance is if you run into a bunch of creeps it loses a ton of power
ivory reef
but fundamentally it's okay to have characters with super strong game definign ults
vivid nimbus
The ult was not even the worst part, his 1 fucked with your turn rate if it hits you
median lantern
Speaking of new stuff I’m always reminded of how I got a 31 kill streak as Bastion on day 1 of Overwatch by setting up in this dumb little hovel on king’s row - and then 48 hours later everyone realized he wasn’t that good
bleak thicket
celeste is kinda the opposite
where if a bunch of creeps are near you youre kinda fucked
median lantern
It’s a really extreme example but it takes time to normalize new stuff
random urchin
Celeste ult is particularly rough in Deadlock imo because the 3rd person view means it's harder to tell if someone is running away the exact same direction as you. In a 6 stack it's less bad but with randoms it can be chaos.
finite patrol
yeah the creep waves are super helpful to her lol
autumn field
a big part of the lich ult balance is if you run into a bunch of creeps it loses...
I wonder if that would help, curiously
somber creek
I do think Celeste being a bounce target herself is really annoying
ivory reef
Speaking of new stuff I’m always reminded of how I got a 31 kill streak as Basti...
yeah I think day 1 I got my first teamwipe by playing bastion
and the entire enem team walked into my gun
like I didn't even know about the homing indicator
that alone is massive and is gonna make fighting celeste ten times easier for me
she's just a chaos character, you need to beat chaos characters by imposing order on the battlefield
bleak thicket
I wonder if that would help, curiously
imagine it as
celeste casts her ult
its you and a group of creeps
right now
youll most likely get 9/18 bounces on you
without the hero priority it will get distributed more evenly across the whole group of valid targets
warped ridge
The bouncy ball thing?
bleak thicket
so if its you and 4 creeps youll get like 3-4 bounces
(assuming the creeps wont die and such)
ivory reef
yeah that's true, you do get some really funny stuff with minion management vs lich
like lich is just useless against broodmother
the ult sinks into her pile of 50 spiders and never comes out
autumn field
without the hero priority it will get distributed more evenly across the whole g...
Mmmm
warped ridge
Yeah first time I 1v1d Celeste as Haze it bounced between me and the creep wave.
You can def spot dodge it with iframes but Idk if you do that if it continues to bounce
autumn field
Also what’s fun about creeps is they’re EASY to manage once you get to like, 25-30k
merry verge
Haze has iframes? :|a
bleak thicket
Yeah first time I 1v1d Celeste as Haze it bounced between me and the creep wave....
what do you mean by iframes?
warped ridge
No no I mean
autumn field
Since you can practically delete them instantly
warped ridge
Sorry
autumn field
Maybe even earlier, but unsure
quiet sapphire
Since you can practically delete them instantly
you can't shoot your own creeps :P
warped ridge
If you play a char with iframes on an ability like Mina (or I thought she had iframes on her bat mode/tele thing) you can dodge the bouncy ball as it homes in on you
final osprey
Haze can get I-frames with her 2 maxxed level. No Haze has ever done this though so no one knows about it.
ivory reef
yes some characters can flicker
merry verge
I think they could definitely tighten the bounces
ivory reef
I'm honestly not sure what the interaction there is
warped ridge
Yeah sorry, that's what I meant
merry verge
24m with Greater Expansion is wild
warped ridge
My guess is maybe it would bounce because it tracks but it prevents the person being hit by damage before going back to something else
autumn field
you can't shoot your own creeps :P
Wdym?
warped ridge
When they flicker or like, if Apollo does a riposte
merry verge
I think it continues to bounce of Riposte
autumn field
You don’t want to kill your own
quiet sapphire
enemy celeste ult will bounce on you and your creeps
autumn field
Correct
merry verge
But it's always hard to tell if the Riposte is catching Torment Pulse or some other hit
bleak thicket
why would she right now
its free bounces
warped ridge
But it's always hard to tell if the Riposte is catching Torment Pulse or some ot...
True, I'd have to be the Apollo and try it myself
quiet sapphire
yeah
with it prioritising heroes it's
just something that keeps the ult alive for longer
ivory reef
I do wish we had a more general force staff tool in deadlock 
like warp stone is great but you can't all get warpstone
warped ridge
Also I'm curious how the orbs bounce against Etheral Shift
somber creek
Isnt Rescue Beam like half of that
ivory reef
Isnt Rescue Beam like half of that
oh, huh. you're not... wrong. it does have a similar use case yeah
merry verge
Testing E-Shift with the self bounce on bubble and it still seems to work
ivory reef
I use force staff to push my friends into the enemy team
or pull enemies out of position
but yeah sometimes it's to save someone running towards me
merry verge
I forget the video but there was someone being really racist on a team so people just bought Rescue Beam and Magic Carpet and kept stealing him
somber creek
I do think both of those uses dont fit deadlock since theyd end up messing up peoples gameplay more than helping it
bleak thicket
Testing E-Shift with the self bounce on bubble and it still seems to work
it doesnt bounce back to you with eshift
at least an enemy one doesnt
it just stays there
merry verge
So the self-bounce works differently, hm. Neat!
somber creek
Theres way too much focus on your own personal movement to make "i throw you into the enemy instantly" to not just be a trolling tool
ivory reef
Theres way too much focus on your own personal movement to make "i throw you int...
you say that but like. movement is an insanely big deal in dota.
bleak thicket
it does still come to you if it targeted you before you activated eshift
bleak thicket
but then it doesnt target you again for the duration
autumn field
why would she right now
its free bounces
In team fights an so on, so it doesn’t get burnt on the creeps
final osprey
Theres way too much focus on your own personal movement to make "i throw you int...
Which is generally how the friendly push version of Doormans cart is used
somber creek
Dota has movement but theres no way you can compare the movement tech of deadlock and Dota
bleak thicket
In team fights an so on, so it doesn’t get burnt on the creeps
again, it wont target creeps unless its the only other target, cause it prioritizes creeps right now
ivory reef
like, we already have an ult that just picks up a friend and takes them anywhere
you're missing the point - deadlock has tech but deadlock does not have more impactful positioning
in dota, breaking a blink dagger on someone is game winning
tournament winning
bleak thicket
so if there multiple enemy heroes
the creeps arent an issue, if they start running away
the creeps are a plus cause they extend the range by providing jump off points
ivory reef
and there's nothing in deadlock that is even a shadow of blink dagger
bleak thicket
if theres only one enemy hero
the creeps let the ball keep bouncing
and half will go on all the creeps, half will go on one hero
autumn field
so if there multiple enemy heroes
the creeps arent an issue, if they start runni...
Oh yeah I was talking about removing the hero priority
autumn field
Yeah
vivid nimbus
There's also Doorman blue cart
bleak thicket
sorry that part kinda got lost somewhere along the way
vivid nimbus
Oh wait Ddraig mentioned that
ivory reef
like, I can't help but think about how when league implemented their version of pudge they removed the hook-your-friends stuff because it was considered Anti-Fun. meanwhile no yeah dota just has that. dota lets you do this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIaDYKxSlRg
0:50
finite patrol
I do feel like the ult currently has too many anti-feelbads for Celeste and not enough anti-feelbads for the people getting bonked heheh. But they got a lot of knobs to turn
ivory reef
@ornate moth hooks alex out at 1 hp and then swallows her to disjoint incoming projectiles
then pukes her out after
bleak thicket
chat is it yuri if the horns are touching
somber creek
I feel like Deadlock is focused much more on personal mobility and skill expression to make something like Force Staff a good idea
At least a "use on friendlies" thing
bleak thicket
you know what we need
a green/orange/purple
6400 upgrade for warpstone
ivory reef
I feel like Deadlock is focused much more on personal mobility and skill express...
I think there's more joy-of-movement stuff in deadlock for sure but I do not think deadlock heroes are meaningfully more mobile or skill expressive than dota ones
like. we literally don't have tp scrolls
finite patrol
chat is it yuri if the horns are touching
avatar tumblr selfcest image turning to celeste
somber creek
But that's not the mobility I'm talking about
ivory reef
I miss the speed of global dota counterganks
you're talking about joy-of-movement stuff but I'm talking about the tactical consequences of Going From Place A To Place B
merry verge
I'm fine without the game having TP scrolls/single use stuff tbh
somber creek
I'm talking about all the movement tech someone has to devote brainspace to focusing on and how easily that could get screwed up by an ally randomly boosting you into the enemy team
finite patrol
There is a certain joy in picking up your overextending carry with rescue beam like you pick up a cat trying to kill themselves
ivory reef
I promise force staff is very disorienting
there's a lot of losing-your-own-position in dota
that deadlock simply doesn't have
bleak thicket
oh ye getting randomly force staffed is disorienting in dota too
ivory reef
like a common problem in my dota stack is people thinking they're dead
but they're not dead
the isometric camera makes it easy to assume you got chunked
having a first person camera means you always know where you are
but in dota I can like, blink up to an ally, swallow them, then vomit them 3 screens away
stuff like that
you need to adapt
merry verge
Deadlock should start letting you Cliff people
ivory reef
Deadlock should start letting you Cliff people
if we had ways to reliably decliff them after then yes yes yes lmao
finite patrol
deadlock fall damage
ivory reef
send them to the underlayer
vivid nimbus
I also want to note a funny thing about Thresh's history, early on enemies would stand on the lantern to keep your ally from clicking on it. So Riot fixes this by giving the lantern collision... which then results in Thresh sometimes using it to block off enemies, esp that spot between turret and wall
merry verge
I guess technically I did that to a Rem with Venator's shotgun once
Sent him beneath the map
autumn field
Ooh really funny item: Reverse Lash
frail jasper
Woe, unexpected paradox swap on ye (camera whirls about as you electric slide into the next zip code (they maxed range items) )
autumn field
Wait not that’s just phantom strike
somber creek
As Silver I did send Rem out of the map
ivory reef
god this is reminding me of how many times I have to shout "YOU'RE ALIVE" in a pitched teamfight to a friend I exiled out of lethal
final osprey
Ooh really funny item: Reverse Lash
Heal people the higher they are compared to you
merry verge
Rem is so small, easy for him to fall out v-v
ivory reef
I feel like one of those sci-fi asimov androids screaming at car crash victims as I pull them out
vivid nimbus
Oh when you said "Reverse Lash" I imagined grabbing all your allies in LOS and sending them to a target spot
ivory reef
you are EXPERIENCING a VEHICULAR ACCIDENT
bleak thicket
god this is reminding me of how many times I have to shout "YOU'RE ALIVE" in a p...
in our defense
you literally disappear us out of reality when were at near 0 hp 😭
ivory reef
yes i'm sorry
bleak thicket
i was low health, then my model gone
warped ridge
god this is reminding me of how many times I have to shout "YOU'RE ALIVE" in a p...
Does Dota not do the uhh, muted colors screen thing that some games do?
bleak thicket
brain goes: im dead
ivory reef
i do vaporize you
vivid nimbus
Oh when you said "Reverse Lash" I imagined grabbing all your allies in LOS and s...
"Hey team it's engage time"
ornate moth
<@82986432565612544> hooks alex out at 1 hp and then swallows her to disjoint in...
i miss this shard
frail jasper
Does Dota not do the uhh, muted colors screen thing that some games do?
It does
ornate moth
i remember one game i saved ashley like 3 or 4 times by our bottom t2 on radiant when she was OD
final osprey
"Hey team it's engage time"
Like what you'd have to do sometimes in Marvel Rivals as Jeff the landshark
ivory reef
thank you for all the vore theyflower