Also higher number is better in this
#Deadlock
magic summit
lavish grove
Wrecking ball Abrams
wintry arrow
That made me mad.
I'd call my teammate a liar if they explained that happening to them
rich grove
literal abduction
finite patrol
I'd call my teammate a liar if they explained that happening to them
school yard larping ass game mechanics
nah uh yuh huh core
near current
that is fucking awesome
rich grove
ivy mains will literally do particle physics and solve world hunger just to get 0.5% more uptime on escalating exposure
buoyant plank
I feel like ivy isn't gonna be rubick
she's consitently pudging all over the game
with weird ass bug after weird ass bug
mild flume
hmmm
finite patrol
mild flume
I parried an abrams first time he tried to punch me
and he immediately left the solo lane to join the double lane beside it eventually pushing one of them back to me
finite patrol
I feel like people just know how to parry now and unless other stuff is going on you should not expect a straight up heavy melee to connect
mild flume
I suspect my mmr is low enough that thats not the case yet
finite patrol
you have the secret tech then
magic summit
One thing I do in lane is intentionally turn and run away from them if I think they will heavy melee me
Which baits them into doing it
And then I can just parry without looking at them and turn
This does require the sound que to work correctly which is not always the case
ivory reef
magic summit
A 20th paragon remake has hit the building
finite patrol
This does require the sound que to work correctly which is not always the case
yeah that's a lot of trust in the games sound cues 😛
though tbf the animations are just as unreliable
love when the game gets paused and then after unpacking everything is in a different place
magic summit
I've had a whole lot of melees being charged up around a corner that i couldn't hear
Happens less nowadays thankfully
rich grove
ideal statline
lavish grove
A good game of seven feels so fucking good
Just running around at 60 MPH throwing balls around and murdering anyone who dares enter my stun range
jaunty garden
Love Geist
One of the only characters that can just straight fuck with Abrams in lane
finite patrol
love that Warden ult is now even hard to interact with
frail jasper
hi have 6 new heroes bye
Madman
rich grove
time to go 0-10 by the 8 minute mark as haze
jaunty garden
LMAO
finite patrol
😭
jaunty garden
Me as Geist: Evil Cackles
finite patrol
Geist got nerfed
jaunty garden
Evil Sobs
Hmm
- Shrine Flex Slot moved to "All Shrines"
Don't like that
It'll almost never get unlocked until actual end of the game I feel like
There's a decent time you can snipe ONE shrine out
But both is usuallyt just the end of game anyway IME
rich grove
I've been in a lot of situations where you can push for shrines + patron but then have to back, but by that point it's kind of marginal right
definitely at high levels where they're not fumbling every single opportunity they have to win the game at least
rich grove
yeah it's interesting
jaunty garden
Easier to parry
jaunty garden
I think it's good.
rich grove
I don't play with a good enough connection most games to actually feel any difference there
jaunty garden
The intent I think is that big hits just shouldn't happen vs a player who is paying attention/not stunned
Mild resto shot nerfs
Oooo, like the Long Range time
Change*
-20% reload time instead of +25% ammo
OH SHIT
" - Tesla Bullets: Proc cooldown can now be reduced by cooldown reduction"
😄
Oooo Titanic Magazine grants Spirit + Melee resist instead of bullet
rich grove
yeah the tesla bullets change is uhhh a little insane
jaunty garden
Extra Health upgrading into Fortitude is really nice
rich grove
yuge Paradox buff
jaunty garden
YES
MAJ LEAP BIG NERF
26s to 45s cd
And can't drop while being shot
No Spirit Power on Leech 😦
WELL
- Surge of Power: When the passive procs, you no longer get slowed when shooting (similar to Fleetfoot)
- Surge of Power: Movespeed reduced from +3 to +2
That's fucked up
Lmao
Woahhhhh
- Ethereal Shift: Active now grants +40% Spirit Resist for 5 seconds after returning
40%???
rich grove
part of me wants to just use eshift as a preemptive pop before a fight like bootleg warden ult now
jaunty garden
I mean it's only 5 seconds but
Eh, Geist nerfs aren't that bad
You don't tend to use Malice much until you've got a couple points in it anyway a lot of the time tbh
edgy fog
wrecker...
rich grove
yeah if you could still end it early it would be bananas
jaunty garden
- Mirage: Djinn's Mark T3 cooldown between multipliers improved from -0.5s to -0.75s
Well that's a little fucked up probably
rich grove
finite patrol
puts it to 1.75 now iirc
jaunty garden
Oooo, M&K big buff, 20% less damage from headshots
It's good their head is HUUUUUGE
jaunty garden
- Paradox: Kinetic Carbine now does 15% more damage on a headshot
Oh fuuuuuuuck
I'm scared 'yall
rich grove
GOOD
jaunty garden
Biiiiiig Shiv nerfs to tank builds
rich grove
actual zero counterplay to "just chuck aoes the size of the sun into a teamfight"
jaunty garden
Huuuuuuuuuuuuge Vindicta buffs
finite patrol
she needed em
jaunty garden
For sure
finite patrol
- Paradox: Kinetic Carbine now does 15% more damage on a headshot
this feels unnecessary lmao
jaunty garden
Yeah
finite patrol
Kinetic Carbine is already nuts damage
rich grove
tbh I think people were building for t3 wall first and foremost in a lot of cases
just because of how much annoyance you can cause silencing half the enemy team for existing
pretty nasty in lane though
rich grove
I don't know how reliably most players are gonna be able to get it but getting hs for half my life as Haze is gonna be a fun lottery spin
rapid rounds buffed, active reload buffed burst fire buffed lucky shot buffed vampiric burst buffed, superior stamina buffed, extra stamina also buffed, reactive barrier buffed
nvm Haze did get buffs
lavish grove
What the fuck do you mean magician now has some of the most lore in the game?
twilit roost
rich grove
Denied orb sound will no longer play beyond 2500 game units from the player
finite patrol
no model all lore
rich grove
the sound of 600000000000 plates breaking whenever someone crossmap forgets to secure a walker will never haunt me again
merry verge
What the fuck do you mean magician now has some of the most lore in the game?
They must never change icon 3
twilit roost
what are magicians abilities anyway?
lavish grove
Effectively a projectile they can redirect, a turret they can swap their place with, I don’t remember their 3 and literal paradox ult
jaunty garden
What the fuck do you mean magician now has some of the most lore in the game?
Where did you see this
I couldn't find info on the new stuff
lavish grove
In the list of heroes there’s a box you can tick to see the experimental heroes
From there you can read their lore and go to sandbox with them
Honestly despite all of them besides maybe Holiday being very far from done (at least by the standards of early access) their lore is honestly pretty fleshed out
Well not all of them but Holiday, Magician and Wrecker all have quite a bit to em
Wrecker also shines a big light on the setting on a whole, being how she relates to how wars even work in this setting
lavish grove
Lol
It is so funny how bad Pocket is at hiding their identity
Literally every member of the cast knows they’re Fairfax’s kid
jaunty garden
Were they trying to hide it?
rich grove
yes
pocket is an assumed name
they're nominally running away from assassins
they seem to be really fucking bad at it
finite patrol
idk pocket is pretty ace at running away
rich grove
the first guy who buys a silence glyph is gonna have them dead in the streets
merry verge
Pocket is bad at disguise
lavish grove
the first guy who buys a silence glyph is gonna have them dead in the streets
Luckily Fairfax assassins refuse to buy active items
cloud shuttle
How much was pocket in the public eye
cloud shuttle
Might be just that they're surrounded by people in the know and gossipy
One champ doesn't keep their mouth shut, the entire ritual finds out
merry verge
Holiday's kit seems real fun
cloud shuttle
Oh god i just realized. Deadlock animated trailer at some point
lavish grove
I’m so excited
cloud shuttle
Holiday's kit seems real fun
The jump pad and lassoo seem wild
rich grove
sfm meet the deadlock..
merry verge
The jump pad and lassoo seem wild
people actually good at the movement ( not me ) are going to do evil stuff with that ult
frail jasper
Viper buys the two slide-distance increasing gun items, proceeds to be uncatchable like the slippery fuck she is
edgy fog
question: Is Ivy Batman?
rich grove
she uses a gun
short quiver
that too
finite patrol
rich grove
hey now
sometimes it tells you update disabled instead and you have to suffer for 5 minutes trying to figure out why
buoyant plank
26s to 45s cd
Why do they hate me having fun
rich grove
yeah you just have to save it for high value plays instead of covering half the map at random to go push waves or scare one guy off walker or w/e
finite patrol
viper has extremely slow bullets but starts off with fucking 200 base dps
80 m/s bullet speed. for reference warden has 80 base dps and 200 m/s bullet speed
rich grove
80 m/s bullet speed. for reference warden has 80 base dps and 200 m/s bullet spe...
I think that's literally as fast as a tf2 rocket
finite patrol
for reference warden has 80 m/s movement speed
rich grove
that's without 2 or divine barrier obviously
with 2 he emits a sonic boom every time he presses W
rich grove
its just slark
his internal name in the codebase is slork
frail jasper
If you haven't, take viper into sandbox and buy Fleetfoot + whatever the other slide distance item is and max her 3. Sliding around at the speed of sound, hold lmb with infinite ammo
mild flume
his internal name in the codebase is slork
finite patrol
If you haven't, take viper into sandbox and buy Fleetfoot + whatever the other s...
hell yeah
wispy ingot
<@&1277035919182008330> new champs. Lash is still an asshole. Who's up for a gaym? (Once I finish updating -_-)
finite patrol
I love holidays 3
just fucking headshots you for 1/3 you health
runic cedar
Sure gimme 10
Nope scratch that, turns out we still have no Internett (something is wrong with the Internet itself so idk)
buoyant plank
<@&1277035919182008330> new champs. Lash is still an asshole. Who's up for a gay...
literally just started making breakfast rip
wispy ingot
damn, we got destroyed 
buoyant plank
Smh smh utter garbage cs
mild flume
the anvil sound on knockdown is the funniest shit
rich grove
CLANK
knockdown on haze is actually so fucking toxic as well
the radius is wide enough you can throw anvil while you're unseeable with 2
so then you run up to them spraying, they got knockdowned, then you immediately knife them as soon as they wake up
3s of totally uninteractable melt
mild flume
messed up
another nice bit of being dynamo is I can kinda buy whatever
and its not too bad
if I need some random support item
buoyant plank
the anvil sound on knockdown is the funniest shit
Sound design for "you fucked up" stuff in general is just great, like the "you got denied" sound
magic summit
There seems to be a sound for when I eat projectiles on Pocket now
Lotta new sounds this patch
rich grove
the eaterrrr
edgy fog
Some of these really do feel like uh... they're just DOTA characters
buoyant plank
Wouldn't be surprised if the lizard literally is a dota 2 asset that they're using as a placeholder
frail jasper
Some of these really do feel like uh... they're just DOTA characters
Fathom is actually just Slark
Has the forward pounce + damage, the ult is %hp regen when not visible to enemies, ambusher play style
mild flume
they are a little bit normal for dota characters
not quite enough weird utility and a few too many straightforward damage abilities
but I guess thats the genre really
mild flume
Wouldn't be surprised if the lizard literally is a dota 2 asset that they're usi...
not that many lizard dudes in dota because not many in wc3
warm sonnet
The fishes though, now that's a staple
buoyant plank
not that many lizard dudes in dota because not many in wc3
I mean more that it's just some model they had that they never used
frail jasper
yeah, though like all actives it's only powerful if you remember to use it
finite patrol
as a proud button masher I am slamming that the moment it gets heated along with every other key in the western conference of my kb
cloud shuttle
Infuser is and was vital for a few spirit characters
Key to early game lane survive and bullying
lavish grove
Yah Infuser is one of the best early items for characters like Kelvin and Infernus
Basically anyone with strong early spirit damage
buoyant plank
infusers really nice yeah
and is honestly one of the main reasons infernus is such a fucker early on
lavish grove
Probably yah
Especially with how much he can heal with it and his 2
Even ignoring his after burn
jaunty garden
Yeah I really don't like its design personally
finite patrol
it is like a tier 3 in terms of stats when that active is up
jaunty garden
And it's not even that long a children
Cooldown
You can reliably use it every 2 waves
Early on it actually has.... About the same cooldown as infernus dash
lavish grove
Honestly it’s good on a lot of characters
Abrams also gets a lot of mileage out of it
lavish grove
Vindicta?
lavish grove
Oh yah
jaunty garden
Her ult is spirit based I believe
She gets damage on attacks AND fire rate on attacks from Spirit too
She's being strong encouraged to build Spirit now
lavish grove
Everyone is crashing constantly
Oh no
rich grove
lavish grove
Also if they’re gonna give Grey Talon his movement speed off spirit again, they really need to revert his stamina buffs
Legitimately he should not go that fast and have an extra stamina for free
He’s not even a close ranged character he’s a sniper
jaunty garden
That's ok with me tbh if he's supposed to have to kite people
Which he does
His defense stats are pure trash if you catch him he still just dies
rich grove
on principle I hate him having both movespeed scaling and 4 stam
lash doesn't have either and grapple doesn't make his gun do 12 million unmissable damage spread across the width of a city block
lavish grove
Especially when Lash needs to get out of a safe position to deal damage and doesn’t have a way to immediately disengage from fights and have an ult that deals a giant AOE stun from half the map away
rich grove
also maj leap just got nerfed which was one of the best ways of actually getting in range to interact with them
for gods sake vindicta has two stam
edgy fog
Slark this man
lavish grove
for gods sake vindicta has two stam
Oh yah I forgot
lavish grove
Slark this man
Speaking of, I didn’t get to play any last night how were the experimental heroes?
jaunty garden
Unfinished
rich grove
very
jaunty garden
I played for a little bit and then went "ehhhh"
lavish grove
I thought Holiday’s kit at least was pretty complete?
rich grove
oh maybe so
jaunty garden
Ah no Calico is finished
lavish grove
I’ve only tried them out in sandbox
rich grove
Holliday doing an extra o n e h u n d r e d damage on a headshot is probably not making it into release
lavish grove
Holliday doing an extra o n e h u n d r e d damage on a headshot is probably no...
Probably not yah
rich grove
Calico instagibbing people with one million stacked unseeable wards also probably not
but I like her theoretical playstyle
lavish grove
Calico instagibbing people with one million stacked unseeable wards also probabl...
Yah I noticed that in sandbox
They do just last forever huh?
Also ngl I feel like Calico is gonna be crazy good once she actually releases
jaunty garden
Yeah
lavish grove
At least in a competitive environment
jaunty garden
Calico gonna just setup on mid or urn probably and murder people repeatedly if thaty's how it works but
lavish grove
Being the only character who can use wards in a Moba is like, instant top pick material
jaunty garden
Although there's a LOT of alternate routes in this game tbh
Way more than most mobas
lavish grove
True yah
jaunty garden
You can legit just go over basically every piece of terrain
So you can't just ward chokes
In the same way as most mobas
edgy fog
Ah I looked at Fathom's background and it seems they are going to be an actual horrible beast creature not just a man in a suit
lavish grove
Yah they’re not going with kid wearing a shitty plastic shark hat unfortunately
edgy fog
mascot horror but it's the horror of being a mascot dude fighting in a conflict for people who own your debts
calico is... look I might have a type
spiral slate
anyone got tips for goin up against yamato? Been running into some really good ones latrly and they're scary
twilit roost
Does being high enough elo to run into good Yamatos count as a skill issue?
I would play a few games against bots as Yamato to get a hang of them and see how they play to counter them
finite patrol
silence glyph is extremely effective
magic summit
anyone got tips for goin up against yamato? Been running into some really good o...
Try not to let them keep pushing the wave to your tower, they want to tower dive you and harass you with their alt fire.
Watch when they have ult, the moment they have Shadow Transformation up they will want to dive you
Try not to melee trade with them. They have higher than normal melee damage.
If it is outside laning stage, silence them when they are starting to get low health, because they usually don't pop their ult until they are low.
Anti heal is also good because they have an ability that heals them nearly to full if they use it in the middle of your team
There also isn't a guarentee that you can preempt the damage they will build into so be flexible and check what you are actually dying to and what they are building, good Yamato's will often start out with a lot of gun damage before they transition into spirit
spiral slate
nod nod, gotcha
I find I have a hard time dodging their 1, it always feels like it hits like a brick too and effectively takes me out a fight by leaving me at a "you get fucked unless you get out" amount of healþh
magic summit
In lane buying an early stamina and keeping in mind to stay both behind cover and a bit behind it can dodge it
A bit behind because if she hits the cover itself it can clip you around a corner
jaunty garden
What character are you
twilit roost
I've somehow just noticed this but you will automatically stick to cover if you're hugging a wall and shooting which explains how someone can stand behind info booth between bridge and stairs and be able to hit me when I can't hit them back
jaunty garden
A lot of characters can just outspace her tbh
She can engage pretty much any time you're at midrange, usually I find the trick to winning against her is to just keep fighting her because she'll usually try to fight, throw out all the abilities, and run away
And if you just don't let her run away without poking her coming in and leaving
She can't get optimal trades in
Until she gets ult, her cooldowns are often long enough you can just keep fighting into her as a lot of characters and win
It's on her to disengage
finite patrol
Holiday headshot build is silly as expected
headhunter long range pristine emblem dome someone for 850 from down the lane
jaunty garden
Yeah she's gonna get nerfed
finite patrol
yeah i mean as expected these heroes are all over the place
like fathom has bloodletting except better lmao
wrecker seems fucking awful
viper is hilarious and very all or nothing
edgy fog
Sliiiiide
finite patrol
and i got to play wrecker and he fucking sucks
3 channels that prevent you from moving in one kit lmao
rich grove
there's a separate queue where you get to play them
rich grove
ach im the exact same only i cant be cast by exiling a black card from hand and if i do i have "when this creature enters sacrifice it"
finite patrol
is that the grief analogue from another card game lmao
rich grove
no this is the thoracle analogue in that it just kills you
you wanted to draw the card you put in reserve for just such an occasion? ok die
edgy fog
All of my team left so Ivy and I played hide and seek for a bit and starting throwing the urn back and forth
Also had a series of really rough games
Just could not lane against a gun viscous he was absolutely wrecking my shit
agile void
first match after not playing like 2 to 3 weeks
wtf is that objective damage on my team
lavish grove
Jesus were no towers taken?
jaunty garden
Looks like lmao
finite patrol
wide spread seems very niche since her spread is so tight anyway but neat
cloud shuttle
edgy fog
cloud shuttle
short quiver
I don't get it
edgy fog
look at the bullet marks on the wall
short quiver
Still don't get it
jaunty garden
It's a dumb meme about a comic that was about someone's ACTUAL miscarriage
That they didn't even have permission from the person who had the miscarriage to make into a comic
And now is a huge meme that people try to hide in stuff constantly
edgy fog
:3
finite patrol
this is very fucking fun
agile void
much fucking better
though also wtf geist?
get fucking alchemical fire, cinetic dash, dunno
mild flume
people really don't like filling all their 500s for some reason
berserker is huge value on geist too, might as well at least get that like soul shredder and a couple of 500s
jaunty garden
Yeah
There's so many good yellows for spirit builds
People not filling those are just not understanding how items work
rich grove
no soul-shredder bullets???
the fuck
literally a giant blinking red light saying "i buff spirit as a gun item"
mild flume
geist gets beserker stacks so fast
jaunty garden
Well and Resto Shot is still broken in lane
Basically every character should be rushing resto shot atm
mild flume
yeah might as well get it
rich grove
you would rather go without it but if you're losing you should definitely buy it
rich grove
resto that is
mild flume
geist usually wants to rush the +35 damage on spirit thing
jaunty garden
Yeah
mild flume
and a healing item
rich grove
headshot booster on haze just makes me sad
jaunty garden
You should still buy it probably lmao
rich grove
but on warden big 👍
jaunty garden
The fact the flat damage isn't effected by falloff
Just makes it a premier lane poke item
jaunty garden
Lmao
Well...
I have bad news for you..
Random headshots popping for 60 from across the whole lane
Is a hell of a thing
rich grove
jaunty garden
I go Resto/Headshot on most characters atm
Because you just heal like 60 and deal an extra 60
And that swing on gun poke is just
So hard to deal with
Now that I'm getting better at the game I'm finding the gun or hybrid characters a lot more appealing tbh
rich grove
that and they just nerfed like seven different spirit items and added spirit resist to a bunch of items in place of bullet :v)
jaunty garden
Atm I'm rocking Mirage really hard
mild flume
I am just mashing dynamo
jaunty garden
He has insane sharp trades and poke
rich grove
hybrid is probably the way to go
mild flume
winning the game feels good
jaunty garden
Dynamo is so gooooood
jaunty garden
Dynamo 4 is best button in the game IMO
But all his buttons are so good
And he even shoots decent
mild flume
I think he farms a bit awkward
jaunty garden
He has to farm with gun yeah
mild flume
but I have had pretty good results with torment pulse
rich grove
dynamo has like lowest prio in the game on farm as well anyway tbh
I've had games where I'll be like 10k down from the rest of my team and it just doesn't matter because I can slide in and ult the team
mild flume
yeah
rich grove
🤷
mild flume
honestly avoiding a bunch of dumb abilities with 2 is so nice too
jaunty garden
I don't like Torment just because I find I need to hold slots for duration/reach/stuff
mild flume
its unconventional but it has been working well for me
jaunty garden
Extra Charge/Duration/Reach/Cooldown, those are it
Just maximize utility
Is my aim there
mild flume
and it helps when I'm just around stuff
those are definitely the important ones though yeah
jaunty garden
If you wanna use a Flex slot for Torment I can see it
But usually I'm just mashing defensive items and utility items
XD
jaunty garden
Knockdown/Ethereal/Decay/etc
mild flume
thats what I tend to get after yeah
jaunty garden
TBH Decay is a nuts item
mild flume
sometimes if I need to I get gun stuff and he can scale that way nicely
jaunty garden
Anyone who isn't going down primary Spirit and has some extra slots should just grab Decay a lot of the time IMO
It's sooooo nuts
rich grove
also just mandatory to actually fight so many characters
rich grove
trying to m1 abrams to death
jaunty garden
Cold Front basically 1shots a wave
Since it does 2x to minions
And gives a decent chunk of Spirit Resist
mild flume
I'll give it a shot
mild flume
do give torment a try sometime
jaunty garden
Will do!
mild flume
it does a surprising amount to people
jaunty garden
It's just expensiiiiive
mild flume
yeah
jaunty garden
And I feel like if I'm ahead I'd rather grab gun damage?
mild flume
it also just adds like 300 ish to your ult usually
assuming you get a couple of people
I like that its just constantly happening so even as I use my other abilities, run around people, reload etc
jaunty garden
Fair
jaunty garden
Yeah
The melee builds on Abrams have stopped building it as much IIRC tho'
Since people figured out melee is so much better than spirit so they just focus melee and defence items
mild flume
yeah I mean not saying its the best build for abrams now, just that it was common for these reasons
jaunty garden
Oh yeah for sure
mild flume
I do agree it fights for slots
I also like that it constantly applies healbane
which I find I buy a lot of games
magic summit
Cold front being a farming item now is really cool
It's a very big boost in power for its relative cost
rich grove
huh is it
to be honest I kind of thought it was just counterbalancing the massive spirit resist troopers get now
but i suppose jg didnt get shit
finite patrol
well the spirit boost is as the game goes on so its still dealing more damage than it did early on
magic summit
Yeah I don't really feel the spirit resist on troopers until like
20 minutes or so
But this is playing 90% pocket.
And you are right, I throw one ability and cold front on a medium camp and it is mostly dead already
Also that plus mystic vulnerability both have spirit resist on them which evens out to make Pocket take normal spirit damage
rich grove
yippee
finite patrol
cold front is just a very good item right now i feel yeah
lavish grove
Twitter
finite patrol
calicos character design rules hard
her kit is sweet too aside from the turrets which are obnoxiously janky
buoyant plank
I do hope she comes out proper soon, one of my favourite character designs+one of my favourite kit designs
edgy fog
yes very good
agile void
shiv has a dash and a execute
if you get fucked by an abrams, you get fucked by an abrams, he is way more fair
lavish grove
The F key isn’t even the Abrams counter
The Abrams counter is not standing in front of walls
finite patrol
slork is busto
buffs:
shiv
majleap
seven
yamato
nerfs:
grey talon
mcginnis
paradox
kelvin
rebalance:
bebop
finite patrol
not being able to stack on hit but not losing stacks on death is a nerf for good players imo
the cd buff is good for everyone
rich grove
I don't know how often you'll get stacks anymore in the first place
certainly you don't get a kill or even assist off every bomb like you could reliably get one tag with every bomb
finite patrol
im glad mcginnis is getting a bit of a nerf, she's so obnoxious to play against since the last big buff
i think they could have gone farther though
rich grove
they also broke monster rounds affecting turrets so uhhh
shiv rage decay buff is fine
was pretty silly that shiv had to take decay just to access a part of his kit post-nerfs
hitting wall and then some amount of spirit resist on turrets is reasonable, just making her somewhat less annoying to lane against
haven't played against her since I often queue with a ginnis onetrick lmao
finite patrol
once she gets some hp her turrets are fucking unkillable late too
and she's a menace in lane
good time to be a mcginnis one trick lol
rich grove
yeah lol
I would argue it's been a good time for a couple patches
fought a mcginnis once called PushObjectives and she rolled us by way of dealing 40k objective damage and solo taking three of our walkers on split pushes
I think the actual buff to mcginnis that pushed her over the line was alc fire
it turns out being able to drop an aoe that gives people -50% bullet resist combined with wall to make them stay in it is really fucking good
finite patrol
yeah she says this is my world and has one of the best crowd control abilities in thr game to keep you in it
rich grove
the existence of wall also gives her some shockingly favourable matchups
biggest one being the best dynamo cancel in the game
can't believe dynamo died of ultma
wintry arrow
Bebop is the most fucking 'We're cooked, we're back, we're cooked' balanced heroes I've seen in a minute.
rich grove
the bonus spirit scaling is apparently pretty big
lavish grove
God they’ve changed bebops stack mechanic like every patch for the last 10 patches
jaunty garden
Huh
Yeah
I mean
Infinite stacking mechanics are HARD to balance tbh
Requiring kills is kinda reasonable IMO, like Grey Talon
I'm sad they keep moving Shiv farther from the spirit builds
But I know not everyone enjoys DoT silliness
XD
I feel like the urns still need a like, "At least this flat number AND this %"
wintry arrow
I'm perfectly happy with him ending up green/purple, but I'll be sad if he ends up orange.
jaunty garden
Because early on it can literally swing the advantage crazy
I mean he has had higher weapon winrate IIRC than spirit for a bit
And has wanted to build at least hybrid
The uppercut strongly incentivizes you to build some weapon damage with the upgrades
And he provides SO MUCH utility with grab without building any spirit at all
magic summit
https://streamable.com/xz638j
That fucking Infernus's name, lol
rich grove
💀
mild flume
mess of a game
mild flume
(those shots were sick tho)
agile void
edgy spear
The display for the chat in this game is its best feature
ivory reef
#1159983908885106879 message chatting about deadlock down in the dota thread
I'd love to poke at deadlock sometime
finite patrol
it's very good
warped ridge
I haven't been able to keep up with it enough but it's got enough dotaisms that I've seen people significantly express frustrations at the creep mechanics
So all in all a good game but it's gonna have the same learning curve as dota
I've been kind of cautiously watching it because like all 3d positioning based games, there's some movement tech and whether or not it's going to be healthy is gonna depend on how much the devs want to allow
So far hasn't been too bad though and thankfully movement isn't so ridiculously broke that you can out move abilities atm
lavish grove
Yah dashing is generally enough to dodge most AOEs
Assuming they aren’t targeted on you like Seven 2
warped ridge
You can do some goofy movement tech right now by spamming slides for extra bullets and slides into parries but IMO it really shouldn't get much crazier than that
lavish grove
Movement goes especially hard when you get some items like fleet foot and majestic leap
warped ridge
Ye
buoyant plank
slide tech is incredibly important for the characters with altfires too
like the goo'd boy and 8head
lavish grove
Also ngl, i really don’t get why everyone doenst by the speed items
They seem so essential for any map presence
edgy fog
Had a real fun Ivy game then
laned with a Shiv so between the kudzu bomb and the blood knives people were getting chewed up from a distance
And it's great when you're throwing them around and your team is aggressive and strong, because you can toss your bomb behind the enemy and it'll cover a massive area that they'll be forced to run through to escape
Plus their Bebop kept grabbing me and pulling me in, at which point I'd turn into a gargoyle and stomp on his head
jaunty garden
I'd love to poke at deadlock sometime
Happy to teach people, I've been getting pretty good.
jaunty garden
I haven't been able to keep up with it enough but it's got enough dotaisms that ...
I like the creep mechanics a lot more than dota personally
ivory reef
I like the creep mechanics a lot more than dota personally
it looks really cool and involved in a great way
I bet I'd like it more too
dota's creep mechanics were never designed - they were a happy accident
it's nice seeing designers do denial and last hitting deliberately and built into the bones of a game from ground up
jaunty garden
Yeah
It forces constant involvement from both players
In a way that not having denying doesn't
In a way I think is interesting
I kind of didn't like it in DotA because it's just that single point right
But with this game you can't deny if the enemy isn't farming
And you get money for doing so
It also makes insane wave clear less good
Because if you toss a spell to clear a wave all at the same time, enemy has a much better chance to just deny half of it
Current split is... 70/30 for last hit vs deny I think?
So even if you ARE getting denied, you are getting 70% income and enemy is getting 130%
That's... Still a huge difference
But it's not 0%
warped ridge
Some info about last hitting
It's always slightly in the creep killer favor
Certain guns have faster firerate which means slightly better at getting CS
twilit roost
Did they change the creep soul split again, thought it was 60/40 as of a week ago?
rich grove
fire rate and ammo is also a balancing factor in an interesting way
jaunty garden
Yeah
Also Bebop's gun is WILD
It's the only gun in the game with a hard range limit and the only gun in the game that's not a projectile
rich grove
it's not a projectile but it has a defined projectile speed and I genuinely do not know what that even does
finite patrol
my main issue with the creeps in deadlock is that they are extremely unpredictable. sometimes they do the weirdest shit
but the soul securing system rules
rich grove
when they decide to wander off onto a bridge or some other route is completely unpredictable
warped ridge
Pathing is frustrating yeah
magic summit
That at least is something I just put off towards it being a beta game that is actively being fixed on
I assume that my creeps in the ideal version of the game will not be trying to blair witch it up in a corner
rich grove
~emergent gameplay~
lavish grove
My main problem with creeps is that they are very strong vs walkers rn
They can take one with only a single wave pretty often
finite patrol
Yeah a lost solo lane can often spiral into a very early walker kill and that is such a massive swing
finite patrol
magic summit
Yeah this seems normal
That is a thing that should happen
I remember this scene in Flubber
finite patrol
we love giant slime creature
rich grove
agony
frail jasper
Objection your honor, the court can clearly see two deaths on the scoreboard.
agile void
thin line
warped ridge
I mean I hate pocket too but that's just cause they are annoying to fight against
Reminds me of Fizz
finite patrol
magician is coming
we get to have a 2nd they who is obnoxious to fight against
maybe a 3rd? m&k disarm is pretty annoying
rich grove
as a haze YES IT IS
magic summit
Twitter
finite patrol
nice those are my 1st and 3rd fave of the new heroes design-wise
rich grove
magician having fountain hook because of the placeholder paradox ult is so fucking funny
place your teleporter in base, throw the swap and teleport right before it hits
magic summit
I admittedly haven't played labs yet cause I am more interested when they have their full kits, but anything related to trickery like magician I want
I am also desperate for Wrecker to be updated in some form
I want to be the trash man throwing boulders at people
finite patrol
having played wrecker i feel like he needs a total rework
magic summit
having played wrecker i feel like he needs a total rework
I really like his 1 and the general concept of just being a trash elemental but then his other buttons feel very placeholder
Just let me throw trash at people
rich grove
I want to run around with Prey recycler charges and a big wrench
no game has made an explosive feel quite as swag as the recycler charge
jaunty garden
I think he just needs to not have to channel every fucking ability tbh
And he'd probably be fine
Let him keep Goku's gaia ball of trash
finite patrol
his kit could use a little cohesion on top of that
jaunty garden
But everything else like, why is this even a channel
finite patrol
although i guess a bunch of random garbage for skils does fit his theme
jaunty garden
It does.
rich grove
na na na na na katamari damacy
jaunty garden
Although I feel like... "Have a giant trash ball" "Turn a minion into trash" "Yeet the trash minion" all make sense
finite patrol
But everything else like, why is this even a channel
it feels so godawful to play in a fucking movement shooter
jaunty garden
And then the ult is bizzaro weird
I think "Turn a minion into trash" needs to work on enemies and have it like, just be a healing chomp basically like Nunu from League
And "Yeet biotrash ball" maybe should be more differentiated from "Yeet trash ball"
Maybe it's a biovomit?
But a melee range just like, nom a thing that gives you stacks for some other use sounds fine
Probably you should be able to charge trash ball while you move but like, not dash?
But I don't think he needs a complete rework, partial rework probably works out fine.
rich grove
evil voice make it move at sprint speed
jaunty garden
There are some neat concepts in there.
finite patrol
the minion eat should just be uhhh. cho gath eat minion
jaunty garden
Yeah that's basically what I was thinking except probably not perm max hp
finite patrol
does he still have the eat button idk
jaunty garden
XD
finite patrol
no the temp fire rate is fine and hilarious
but like, instant cast just kill the minion
and probably heal less to make it not the best lane sustain skill in the game
jaunty garden
That'd work, although it should probably be longer than Mirage keeps it
rich grove
we've yet to see any heroes aside from warden even create shields, let alone interact with them in meaningful ways
seems like obvious design space to try and experiment with especially for a "junker" flavored character
jaunty garden
Yeah
Shield and size increase maybe
Loses size as he loses shield
And then the biovomit consumes his shield for damage?
IDK
finite patrol
Shield and size increase maybe
#1276682303384457256 message
we could make the biggest boy
jaunty garden
Yes giant trash golem
finite patrol
valvo hire this tohu
magic summit
You can solve the instant eat issue by having it still need to channel in lane then requiring a level up to become instant
finite patrol
you can get 60% bullet evasion uptime with mirage and 25% lift "up"time
all items he likes anyways
ult cool down also hits 45s even imbuing everything on nado
spiral slate
oh god
jaunty garden
rich grove
paradox wall lets you see through veil because it overwrites the veil texture with its own transparency
this character is funny
finite patrol
that makes sense
jaunty garden
That is pretty funny
cloud shuttle
got me to boot the damn game
rich grove
LMFAO
cloud shuttle
i was so hoping
rich grove
just to see the sniper yattas first-hand
cloud shuttle
damn right
finite patrol
(is that a good shoe I don't know shoes)
rich grove
neither do i
finite patrol
I know I'm not a pervert because I never noticed she was barefoot until it was loudly pointed out to me by several perverts during a match
finite patrol
I think mirage might need a nerf tbh he's kinda cracked now
buoyant plank
<@&1277035919182008330> Anyone wanna be bad at videogames?
finite patrol
three60nsette
rich grove
cannot overstate how much of a dopamine cannon vindicta 4 is
spiral slate
anyone got tips for playing against grey talon? got absolutely mollywopped by 1600+ charge shots by one a few days ago and i'd appreciate any help that could be offered
ik knockdown is useful for getting him while he's in the air but idk what resistances i should build against him/how to avoid those massive projectiles
rich grove
generally spirit resist is the play in all games but it's never not useful if you find you're being directly annihilated by charge shot
slowing hex at 1250 isn't the worst idea either just to deny him the ability to fly out of bad positioning, but kd is the go-to option to get him to sit the fuck down
edgy fog
One of the things is that it's just rough. He's a massive bully. If he tends to use the charge shots during flight you can wait them out a bit, as he will quickly get impatient if you get cover, and you can hear pretty quickly when he shoots at the wave and know he's distracted.
rich grove
the only real tip I have for dodging arrows is saving at least one stam in 1v1s to force him into the mind game of instant releasing vs. delaying arrow
but the hitbox is roughly the size of pangaea
so
dodging it is a bit rng
edgy fog
Wait for him to move attention away, hit with something solid, go back into hiding... It's not the best but it means they don't get to lawd it over you in the sky
magic summit
An important note for him as well is he does not like to be run at
Just chimp out on him
They don't tend to get a lot of resists because he needs to scale to be useful and if slowly gliding through the air doesn't work he has no other moves past try to charge shot you in the face
jaunty garden
Yeah, the biggest counter to Grey Talon is just kill them first
You will lose basically any poke fight
mild flume
the anvil is pretty nice midgame
just kick them out of the sky
early game its tough tbh
finite patrol
Grey Talon, Mirage, Paradox, Metal Skin, Siphon Bullet nerf.
Improved Burst Buff.
Bebop stack change YET AGAIN (buff)
all of these changes seem reasonable to me except the fire scarabs one. in that i dont feel like it does anything to the skill
rich grove
prolly not
finite patrol
they need a little symbol beside items you have in your inventory that can be upgraded so i stop forgetting to buy improved armour
rich grove
playing abrams instead of just carrries is likely objectively better for my winrate and average team comp
but holy fuck
it is so miz
finite patrol
Abrams seems so mid
finite patrol
just had a very fun game where we got pushed to our base. lost a couple urns and rejuv. then had a couple great fights and stole a rejuv into wiping them multiple times and won
I got to do the max cdr mirage thing that game it is as silly as I expected
lifting 25% of the time and bullet evasion 50% of the time with teleport up every 50 seconds
wintry arrow
Unga bunga is very zen.
Big health bar, slamming into people like an action-figure fight.
buoyant plank
jaunty garden
This meme will be eternal
lavish grove
Are we on back or over rn?
magic summit
beep boop was just buffed again so probably back
Do still think he's going to be one of those "picked constantly no matter if they are shit or not" heroes though so I have accepted that most games will include the occasional cross map hook
jaunty garden
Are we on back or over rn?
They put 1% damage scaling on all hits and the 5% on kills
So he slowly builds up some damage improvement even without kills
lavish grove
nice
rich grove
no worse feeling than nearly winning a 5v6
abrams jumpscare is unfortunately starting to grow on me
finite patrol
burmst damej :)
rich grove
I tweaked my itemization and now I'm scout that also becomes reinhardt
finite patrol
someone in another server found that if you build solely for burst you can do like 4k damage with echo
late game though
mobile Abrams is definitely more scary that 1 trick
rich grove
I genuinely considered getting echo shard for an extra stun
buoyant plank
sadly abrams hardcounter is getting high enough mmr that people start parrying
rich grove
you still get the true combo if they don't bother buying debuff reducer
you also just get regulsr old shotgun light melee anyway
buoyant plank
Yeah it's just funny meeting abrams players where it's obvious it's the first time they've had to deal with parrying
it just absolutely tilts them for that match
rich grove
the haze in my lane fucking dash jump parried me melee confirming a creep 20s into the match
brother
what did I do to deserve this
jaunty garden
Anyone who plays Haze
Has to learn to do that shit
TBH
It's the only way they wqin lanes
buoyant plank
We don't need haze to be even more annoying :v
edgy fog
I tweaked my itemization and now I'm scout that also becomes reinhardt
I'm remembering a video I saw a while ago where it's a bunch of army dudes who were doing a marching chant to "super sonic racing"
Just super deep yelling of SU-PAH SONIC RA-CING as you tank and thunder around
rich grove
roooolliiiiing STAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
rich grove
I FUCKING LOVE HEAVY MELEE I FUCKING LOVE STUNS
edgy fog
I love landing on people as Ivy then whacking someone in the face with heavy melee
yall going to learn how to take a punch today
finite patrol
one day ill be able to press the f key in time lol
edgy fog
I did that once. The shiv left.
finite patrol
i did just have a nongame where the abrams was going on the geist, i tornado'd his charge, then the geist parried his melee and we killed him
edgy fog
the parry button is effectively "debuff player" button
finite patrol
immediate dc
magic summit
Until Abrams gets t3 ultimate and buys unstoppable to punch you for 10 uninterrupted seconds
finite patrol
lmao
rich grove
next time I'm laning against Mirage I'm gonna try the restorative locket tech
since every mirage beetle is a separate cast and most mirages will spam 3 proc if you play cover for too long
finite patrol
nothing will make laning against mirage tolerable until scarabs gets a real nerf
rich grove
to be clear this moves an 2-8 laning matchup against mirage on every one of my characters into a 3-7
abrams, haze and vindicta all get pretty fucked
finite patrol
plink plink plink scarab strike plink plink pop
rich grove
vindicta probably only has a reasonable matchup as soon as she gets snipe
where yeah mirage can dodge her m1 but not crow or stake and as soon as he's under 50% blammo
but abrams and haze you just die
jaunty garden
I feel like Abrams can just shoot trade a lot too?
rich grove
you effectively do not have shoulder charge and your effective range compared to his is 0
finite patrol
shoulder charge into tornado is like one of those fighting hard counter moves
rich grove
like yeah if you hit him with shoulder charge you kill him
finite patrol
as mirage I feel like geist and mcginnis are the only really threatening opponents
rich grove
you should also never hit him with shoulder charge unless he actually falls asleep
meanwhile you get pelted crossmap with djinns mark and beetles getting bullet resist shredded for your entire healthbar
rich grove
@magic summit veilwalker pocket with slowing hex in scrims... is Eido cooking
magic summit
Barriers don't inherit resists
So barrier items on pocket remove their inherit spirit resist deficit
I don't really go veil walker but I do always go enchanters barrier and diviners kevlar
Likely Eido is trying to do a 1v1 build where it's just impossible to remove Pocket so long as they stay around a veil
I know of Eido but haven't really watched them, I have a weird thing where I don't like looking at content for characters I main
rich grove
It also makes a lot of sense from a power spike consideration at least coming from an ex-veilwalker Warden player
Pocket stomps people mid but falls off lategame, so you build shields to maximize the roll
and then in lategame uhhhhhhhhh just win before then 🤷
rich grove
also going invis and being very fast seems obviously good for the character who dumps 600000 abilities then leaves
kevlar eshift soul rebirth 💀
least killable pocket player
this is so cooked lol
magic summit
That seems pretty standard, yeah. I have been going cold front and not slowing hex and I usually pick up an early spirit lifesteal but otherwise this is pretty much my build
rich grove
still having the enduring spirit instead of spirit lifesteal is some shit
magic summit
A cool pocket trick I think I mentioned here is if you buy superior duration and put it on cloak you can use it, e shift, and then cloak out when e shift ends
rich grove
I need to play with eshift more
frail jasper
Cold Front is so good right now.
rich grove
people really be soloing tier 3 camps on spawn with cold front and a dream
truly silly item
twilit roost
Did they just add a throbbing animation to Geist's hand?
don't remember seeing it before
rich grove
@magic summit is there an answer to grey talon as pocket other than "die"
finite patrol
outlook not good
magic summit
<@142842792564097025> is there an answer to grey talon as pocket other than "die...
Yes and no.
In lane no, he is very good against you in lane especially after the shotgun range nerf. But you play it like any pocket lane, wait until you can all in him and try to conserve your health in the meantime
Out of lane you either buy knockdown and/or majestic leap. If you buy leap you need to learn how to be an aerial combatant
Pocket is very good at maintaining airtime
Late game is rough because of the dumb reason of gray talon moving so fucking fast he just outruns your spells
A dire, expensive answer is also Phantom Strike
merry verge
Please game, just rework the old man. Least fun kit to interact with.
frail jasper
My recent six experiences around GT can be summarized as "holy shit how is he doing so much damage" after he kills me through 70% bullet resistance
finite patrol
well he does a ton of spirit damage
jaunty garden
Yeah
I mean, GT is a bit overtuned atm I think most people agree
But if you get on top of him he DOES just die
finite patrol
flight has like 25% uptime but it feels like 75%
jaunty garden
Also buy knockdown
Or just slowing hex if you think you can get him before he jumps
magic summit
I have never once met a Bebop that thinks to wait until I suitcase to bomb me
I am a step short of Eternus and they are still like this
twilit roost
suitcase away I still want my 1% dmg upgrade lol
rich grove
it's on damage not stick
:v
also the real shit is fucking TELEPORTING IN CASE
what the hell
it just did not click with me you could do that
magic summit
You get a lot of your surprise burst by doing that
twilit roost
I'm a fan of the coat teleport fake out, great way of making space just playing against pocket
twilit roost
oh wtf you can do that?
rich grove
that was my reaction too!!!!
coating onto someone in briefcase is the classic but I had not seen "bye I'm on the other side of the map dumbass"
magic summit
You still count as being in that spot so the teleporter still thinks of you as a valid for channeling it
frail jasper
Viscous can walk into a teleporter and self Cube and suddenly nobody else can damage him or enter the teleporter either. Very useful when running away
finite patrol
I think wrecker can astral project with the urn if you time it right
at least i saw one move the urn devilishly quickly and heard the project sound before urn capture
frail jasper
Viscous can carry urn in goo ball as well, if you take a direct path you can easily score it before being revealed on the map
edgy fog
I think I've managed to fly it was ivy before. It just takes some good timing before it silences you
Probably can do same with m&k burrow
edgy fog
very true
but people don't come over because they're jerks
or immediately drop themselves
rich grove
felt
finite patrol
when you get what you want but not what you need
near current
i dont even rmb what happened this game but i feel that. was a norms tho so lol
finite patrol
how the fuck did so many kills happen in a 50 minute game good god
near current
my friend was really low elo i think and the mming was still fucked. my elo was low too and i didnt really understand macro (and that i could just facetank walkers to take them as shiv)
finite patrol
almost 1.5 kills per minute on your team and around the same on theirs
near current
deadlock if it was good
finite patrol
God those objective damage numbers lmao
not just you, no one pushed except mcginnis
magic summit
i dont even rmb what happened this game but i feel that. was a norms tho so lol
Least violent Shiv game
finite patrol
i dont think they knew how to aim
