#Prototype Pattern Groups

1 messages · Page 23 of 1

muted blaze
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With the build I made for Saturday, I would equip no weapon for shits and gigs but it means there's a 50% chance on system trauma that I just drop nothing of worth

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So my main/aux has only a knife

vagrant grotto
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Please bring something in the main lol

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Idc if it’s a mortar or rpg or whatever

muted blaze
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Is this a demand or a request?

vagrant grotto
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This is a request that you treat the playtest like it might be an actual campaign

muted blaze
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Fair

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If I was more foolish than I am I'd do it in an actual campaign

ashen crown
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I suppose, but it kinda makes Gilgamesh look like a chump in comparison even if Gilgamesh has a little extra going for it

muted blaze
ashen crown
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Fair nuff

muted blaze
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Over time needs to be done proactively, unless "Pop core as protocol -> clear condition from protocol" works if you can clear the condition after popping the protocol

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But in truth, as a Gilgamesh you're gonna pop core when stunned, jammed or exposed and you wanna do something about it. You're not gonna be jammed and go "I should pop core, but I won't because I'll wait until I'm jammed, stunned, exposed and prone to make better value out of my core"

vagrant grotto
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Yeah no this is 1 condition per round over time, vs Gilgamesh shedding everything + prone + overshield + limited charge die all at once

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If you get dogpiled as a Gilg you can Psych Burst it and be set

dapper goblet
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It is NOT uncommon that gilg gets multiple value

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So yeah, I subscribe to this being a valid distinction

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thinking about the tarax that was stunned, prone, impaired, and on fire in my game last night

muted blaze
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F

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Poor shirmpy lad

dapper goblet
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Its fine they all tried to fight Jane Armory and theyre probably gonna win but turns out someone that can chain fire an Andromeda, displacer, and krakatoa is pretty good

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I actually think this is one of the more interesting peices of this. I do worry that there's some frames this kind of dunks on but most of the one mounters aren't really reliant on the weapon anyway. I think the big thing here is caliban but "use your flayer, moron" is a pretty fair response.

ashen crown
ashen crown
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Warm take: Zealots makes decent Manticore Analogs

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Hotter take: I don’t think Zealots really… earn the striker mantle? You have vanguard force multipliers like Leech and Priest and point takers/holders like Aegis and Barricade, most of which have offensive output stronger than Emberlight Nexus. Yet they aren’t really budgeted as strikers. I don’t really think the Zealot is a striker even when you go into the Valk classifications of Point Taking and Force Multiplication tbh.

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Like ultimately it’s semantics and a bit arbitrary but it feels like it could confuse people who pick up PPG out of the blue and give it a quick read

vagrant grotto
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Zealot makes the damage dealers more damage dealing and moves them up faster

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It’s an off-striker in that parlance, in the way that a Cataphract is a striker that mostly takes points instead of dealing damage

ashen crown
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Yes, and ultimately I think that’s still support more than anything. I don’t think putting a Zealot in a Sitrep requires you to put one less striker to maintain balance for example

vagrant grotto
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That’s why it’s main Support and off Striker 😛

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Classification is fine for now

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It’s a statement of intent of where I want the thing to stand

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This ain’t a priest

ashen crown
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I suppose I could always run a playtest where it’s budgeted like that- I understand it’s a statement of intent but idk if it fully translates accurately to the mechanics

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I could see a newer GM getting tripped up by that and trusting the classification more than their understanding of the mechanics of the class

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But yeah I probably shouldn’t say more on this without giving it a try

vagrant grotto
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The classification is fine, I’ll worry about new GMs getting tripped up when said GMs come in here to complain

muted blaze
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Surely it's as striker as a scout is artillery... Striker... Assailant, dps

ashen crown
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I used the Zealot a while ago so it’s been changed pretty significantly since then

sullen citrus
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Poking this so I have it pinned in my thingy

tame wharf
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MEANT TO ASK HERE WHAT THIS IS

steel apex
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if you mean "what is this in game terms" it's just flavor as far as I understand it

tame wharf
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that is correct yes

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but its in Jager Kunst I !V! which does not say how much movement is on it

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For the rest of this turn, when you start movement adjacent to an object or free-standing piece of terrain larger than you, you may flip kick off of it; the movement ignores engagement and doesn't provoke reactions due to the resultant momentum. You can do this multiple times a turn, but only once for each unique object or piece of terrain.

steel apex
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"what you start movement next to objects, that movement now ignores this stuff"

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Valk isn't a fan of JK1 giving you infinite free extra movement and this is their reworking of the system

vagrant grotto
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But yeah what Kai said

tame wharf
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ahh

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oklay

vagrant grotto
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Default JK1 has similar “flavor text” describing what’s happening

steel apex
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I actually would have a pedantic wording suggestion for clarity here, is that something you'd be interested in valk?

vagrant grotto
steel apex
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as it kinda (if you squint) implies there was some special movement granted

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I might suggest "that movement" or "this movement" to more firmly link it to the movement which prompted the system

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i.e. "when you start movement adjacent to etc, do a sick flipkick; that movement ignores etc"

vagrant grotto
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Yeah makes sense

muted blaze
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Can I suggest another wording clarity suggestion idea?

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
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When move near rock, disengage, as you flavour text
Instead of
When move near rock, flavour text, disengage

muted blaze
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Found another edge case 🔥 @vagrant grotto If a ghost is bonded with a target, and the target has lock on and is hiit by a tech attack that triggers hacker 1:

  • Both targets are affected by SNOW_CRASH and share the chosen choice
  • Both targets are affected by SNOW_CRASH and make their own unique choices
  • The ghost is uneffected by the SNOW_CRASH
vagrant grotto
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snow crash is technically not a tech action

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but! youre welcome to rule otherwise, that's just my strict RAW interpretation

ashen crown
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Funny thing I did notice that’s related: if you lock on to a Quantum Bonded character, the Ghost is also locked onto… sorta indefinitely. Since there are few immediate ways to cash out on it

vagrant grotto
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Yup, kinda funny

umbral sluice
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I just hit an exposed player with Auntie

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:3

gaunt heron
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o7

vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
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i havent finished the combat but

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next week i'll have feedback

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so far antigrav uppercut missed twice

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and Auntie just hit an exposed player

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this would have instantly structured if he didnt brace

muted blaze
umbral sluice
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also wow Scintillating Gleam with Double Vision

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that's a LOT of spaces

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was honestly fine though we had a chom system crusher it and delete the projectors

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can I say, I find the 7 heatcap on Prism pretty genius with the Chom interaction,

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that's exactly enough heat to overheat it with a full tech fragsig + system crusher if it used projector once

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if that was intended, well done, it feels very good

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sadly return to sender didnt trigger since the grenade user just didnt bother throwing at the hatchet and preferred hit other things

vagrant grotto
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Al: "Coolest thing ever to never happen videogames "

umbral sluice
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i even baited him into it by sticking the hatchet near a prism and hive but he placed the blast in a way that didnt hit the thing

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the MVP in this fight so far are the two basic untemplated hives somehow

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which is average hive moment tbh

vagrant grotto
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considering buffing Knight HP to 20/25/30, any strong feelings for/against

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could also consider 18/22/26 since I lightly buffed its evasion iirc

ashen crown
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I’d say 18/22/26 personally

vagrant grotto
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yeah I'm leaning towards that

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it doesn't need to be as chunky as an Anchor

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(which, IMO, finally feels pretty good)

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Clarity for where the Ghost appears when the Bond ends

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questions/comments/concerns?

umbral sluice
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i agree with 18/22/26 myself

vagrant grotto
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yeah there's just been a couple cases where it sounded like they got rocked, plus the question arose of why they're nominally flimsier than Hatchets

umbral sluice
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actually I am curious as to why the ghost shares specifically one of the targets spaces versus the Mule Harness wording

dapper goblet
vagrant grotto
dapper goblet
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20 feels high at t1. 18/22/26 is my vote

umbral sluice
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also 2 armour across tiers

vagrant grotto
dapper goblet
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ya i've used a bunch of knights just forgot what the numbers were off the top

umbral sluice
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ohhh that makes sense

vagrant grotto
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Which provides more clarity over the Kensei's goals, this:

The Kensei positions itself near objectives with its “MINUANO” KINETIC SABER to discourage opponents from remaining nearby. MASS DRIVER SHEATHE serves a versatile role by preparing a defensive MACH PARRY or a punishing CHARGED saber attack. Despite this flexibility, Kensei mechs boast below-average E-DEFENSE, leaving their strategies vulnerable to disruption.

or

The Kensei aggressively projects threat over objectives with its “MINUANO” KINETIC SABER. MASS DRIVER SHEATHE serves a versatile role by preparing a defen-sive MACH PARRY or a punishing CHARGED saber at-tack. Despite this flexibility, Kensei mechs boast be-low-average E-DEFENSE, leaving their strategies vul-nerable to disruption.
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sorry, edited one of them slightly

placid glacier
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My vote would be for 1

vagrant grotto
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String Theory Marionette
System, Quick Tech
As a reaction, a character bonded with the Ghost may BOOST, SKIRMISH, or use the QUICK TECH action, dealing half damage, Heat, or Burn.

Does this read clear?

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also thinking of renaming to "Action at a Distance"

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Also gonna add the 1 Heat (Self) tag, this is decent but I don't want it spammed

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
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which is fine, this is a melee guy

ashen crown
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Well the Sentinel has speed and doesn’t have a dedicated taunt

vagrant grotto
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yup

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Sentinel is also the least bulky out of all defenders, with no Resistance or Invisibility ability

ashen crown
ashen crown
vagrant grotto
ashen crown
vagrant grotto
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I was considering "Action at a Distance" in reference to "Spooky Action at a Distance"

Action at a distance

Action at a distance is the concept in physics that an object's motion can be affected by another object without the two being in physical contact; that is, it is the concept of the non-local interaction of objects that are separated in space. Coulomb's law and Newton's law of universal gravitation are based on action at a distance.
Historically...

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it's a direct reference to a physics concept

ashen crown
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Just doesn’t sound as cool to my ears I suppose :/

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Honestly I’m thinking about it- “Cat’s Cradle” randomly came to mind as a name based on “Schrodinger’s Cat” and “String Theory Marionette”

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“String Practice” also came to mind as a name lmao

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Both of those are probably too far removed from the mechanical concepts tho

vagrant grotto
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“Quick and the Dead” maybe

ashen crown
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That’s probably a physics reference but I’m still getting a “too many conjunctions” vibe from it

vagrant grotto
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It’s not this time

ashen crown
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I don’t really get how that connects to the mechanics tbh

vagrant grotto
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Lets them do an action quickly

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But sure yeah okay

opaque crescent
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maybe "Degrees of Freedom" ?

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iirc it's related to ghost fields in Quantum Field Theory

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or more rather the other way around, like (possibly incorrect info from a course from a couple years ago inbound) ghost fields are unphysical states that account for discrepancies in the physical degrees of freedom of a system

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maybe this is too much of a deep cut either way

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
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Degrees of Freedom is a little broad

“Geist’s Guidance” came to my mind

umbral sluice
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something that has to do with Quantum Entanglement and Superposition comes to mind but I can't form that into something cohesive atm

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base it off how entangled particles interact

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like when you observe one in the up state the other entangled particle is in the down state

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(it's been a while this may be wrong)

ashen crown
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“Puppet on a String Theory” would be worse which is why I think it’d be a great idea

vagrant grotto
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Yeah, no lol

placid glacier
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"Flyby Wires"?

vagrant grotto
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I’m this close to renaming it “Ghost Puppet” and never touching it again

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Last thought for tonight: it’s a tech action, so I’m thinking about remote access or control and “quantum locality” or whatever that means

dapper goblet
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Ghost in the Machine?

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Its on the nose but sometimes thats funny.

muted blaze
muted blaze
vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
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Once again in the debate with myself over Firefly Drone's Recharge vs. Limited tags and I can feel myself growing further and further away from God

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Recharge or No limit: If you blow it up, the Napalm needs to redeploy it. It gets immediate effect when it does so, but it keeps the Napalm from firing the STC same turn (unless folks are playing with the CRB overcharge rules and it's a veteran with limitless)

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so I guess because Napalm is a sibling to Bombard the question I should ask is "how does flare drone, a quick action no-limit drone, fare in comparison"

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it negates the difficulty for Bombard Cannon as well as peels off Invisible and Hidden

It doesn't affect the damage ceiling, just expected value of damage (due to accuracy)

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Firefly Drone in comparison makes some off-brand dangerous terrain, but that terrain doesn't immediately affect folks within it

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So Overcharge Firefly Drone + Barrage with STC doesn't immediately pile on the damage like Overcharge Flare Drone + Bombard Cannon can

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Limited 1: rewards killing the drone, which is hard for CQC attackers to hit

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How badly do I want players to cope here

muted blaze
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Is bombard cannon ordnance?

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So even with overcharge it can't OC into flare

umbral sluice
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bombard is ordnance yes

ashen crown
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Wait is the Napalm Cannon not ordnance?

umbral sluice
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it is too

ashen crown
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No it is ordnance

umbral sluice
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so i think the OC Firefly -> Barrage isnt an issue

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i wouldn't mind seeing how it plays with no limit

ashen crown
ashen crown
vagrant grotto
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if it runs a line of fire over someone with Firefly, they do not instantly take damage

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characters need to actively move into the area or end their turn there in order to take the Heat+burn

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which means the counterplay is usually "walk out of it" or "walk around it"

ashen crown
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Let’s compare an untemplated Bombard vs an untemplated Napalm.

The Bombard would need to deploy its flare drone during the first round, then it gets to fire and benefit from Cluster Munitions on the flare drone (because it intends to target it if it has it typically). Ideally it wants to tail end activation then activate ASAP to get the benefits as soon as possible, but regardless it can’t really obtain the primary effects of Flare Drone the same turn and therefore loses a turn of damage.

A Napalm will be deploy a Firefly Drone, and it’ll immediately lay down a line of fire. The Firefly drone’s effectiveness does not depend on the Napalms Attacks- it is completely independent of the Salamander (which is what I mean by “the Napalm sees the effects immediately”). Furthermore, unlike Flare Drone, it deals damage (about half of the Salamander), and the fact it flies 5 spaces in the air gives it a defensive bonus Flare Drone lacks. This outright increases the Napalm damage output on subsequent turns, and doesn’t require nearly as much upkeep as a Bombard which will keep destroying and needing to redeploy its flares, and the Napalm (potentially) can recoup its damage losses.

Now let’s give both of them limitless. A Bombard firing the Cannon and then overcharging a Flare Drone is still not going to immediately benefit from the flare drone since the Flare Drone inherently depends on the Bombard Cannon. A Napalm firing the Salamander and then overcharging a Flare Drone does immediately see the benefits of both since they’re independent of each other, increasing its damage output outright- however, the Napalm is also at greater risk of Overheating.

vagrant grotto
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I think something to note about the Bombard's Flare Drone here is that allies can immediately capitalize on the drone as well

ashen crown
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Breaking it down like this, I will stand by that Firefly is a stronger optional than Flare by a good margin. But I can see it still being recharge regardless of that, though perhaps Recharge 6 imo

vagrant grotto
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so I honestly fullheartedly disagree with the whole "immediate benefit" angle of things here

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
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ah okay, the accuracy doesn't help anyone but the bombard. But it does immediately peel Invis and Hidden, which is more niche but notable

ashen crown
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That’s more build dependent rather than being universally applicable like Accuracy or just straight up damage + difficult terrain

vagrant grotto
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I'll concede on that, at least. Though I will once again point out that the damage from Firefly is avoidable by sidestepping

ashen crown
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Tho I guess if you look at scout which is strong regardless of if a team has armored + infiltrator teams… yeah there’s that

ashen crown
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This makes Flare Drone area denial much more active than Firefly’s

vagrant grotto
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I think you meant the reverse but I understand what you're saying

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unless you meant something different by "active"

ashen crown
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Active as in “requiring a lot more actions to upkeep”

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More active for the NPC- a Napalm can fire and forget and therefore it’s more passive

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And once again, I’ll reiterate that due to Flare Drone being 5 spaces in the air, if you’re attacking a flare drone, nine times out of ten you’re not attacking anyone else with those same actions. That’s not necessarily the case for flare drone, especially since one of the big appeals of Flare is being a good Friendly Fire target for the Bombard.

vagrant grotto
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It sounds like I should keep Firefly Drone at Recharge or Limited, then

ashen crown
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I’m more in favor of limited personally, especially since the point of “flare is stationary and the bombard often goes out of its way to wreck it” is a variable I never considered, but I suppose recharge 6 is also good

vagrant grotto
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on an untemplated Napalm, destroying the drone means that redeploying would need

  1. the system to recharge
  2. sacrificing STC barraging
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The more salient argument for Limited 1 at this point for me is that if it's Recharge, the GM is just gonna give up and fire the STC anyway

ashen crown
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That’s a fair reason. It also somewhat patches the “Napalm can make 2 firefly lines at once” dilemma without actually changing the text- if that’s something you wanna address

vagrant grotto
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I'm already changing the text to end the line when the drone dies

ashen crown
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I appreciate that because it rewards targeting the drone more

vagrant grotto
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I refuse to change the heat/damage now though, it's staying 2 Heat + 2/3/4 Burn

ashen crown
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Oh I agree with that wholeheartedly

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I think the effects are as potent as they should be- walking through the firefly should feel bad

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The difficult terrain is also a good touch- when it hit me in the playtest it hurt but in a way that made perfect sense

vagrant grotto
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Moving on: I'm reducing Occultist's Lead Astray to +1/2/3 tech attack bonus

I could do flat, but Hydra's drones do exist, and 1/2/3 is mild enough scaling that I think it's fine

ashen crown
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Made me regret choosing to do so which is exactly what you want players to feel

ashen crown
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You could also drop it to +0/1/2

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Have it start flat and then scale to +2

vagrant grotto
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I'm keeping it at 1/2/3

ashen crown
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Fair

vagrant grotto
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Lead Astray
System, Recharge 5+, Quick Tech, +1/+2/+3
Make a tech attack against a DRONE within SENSORS. On a hit, the Occultist controls the target DRONE until the end of its next turn. This effect ends if the original owner recalls the affected DRONE.

Allow the owner to recall the drone to end the effect early, since the alternative is bursting down the Occultist

ashen crown
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Okay that’s great, and also a good reason to let Lead Astray Scale- it’s a lot easier to undo Drone Control than “oh it’s a pile of slag now”

vagrant grotto
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yeah I don't want it to be an ultimatum of "kill me or lose 1 repair"

ashen crown
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Well if it’s a Limited Drone it’s “lose 1 charge” but tomato tomahto

vagrant grotto
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Diviner’s Darts
Auxiliary CQB, +2/+4/+6 | [Range 5][3/4/5 Kinetic]
This weapon can attack 1–2 targets at a time. For each attack, a controlled DRONE within SENSORS may move adjacent to the target as long as it otherwise is incapable of movement.

Rewording to prevent double dipping drone movement

vagrant grotto
ashen crown
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I don’t actually recall if there are any exceptions to that

vagrant grotto
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This weapon can attack 1–2 targets at a time. For each attack, a controlled DRONE within SENSORS may move adjacent to the target as long as the DRONE otherwise cannot move on its own.

there, reworded it

umbral sluice
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this was to remediate the Wolfhound issue right?

vagrant grotto
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yes

umbral sluice
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okay awesome

vagrant grotto
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darts are intended for stuff that can't usually move

umbral sluice
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it has some knock on effects with like, a Lead Astray Orochi, but that's whatever

vagrant grotto
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that's fine

umbral sluice
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i cant think of any other self moving drones than that and the -hound missiles

vagrant grotto
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it doesn't need Darts for Orochi, that's all

umbral sluice
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probably more elegant than my suggestion of call Moloch a flock drone

vagrant grotto
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BTW for Prism and Scintillating Gleam: How is it?

ashen crown
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… ya know I should ask in #rules-questions if stuff like Orochi Drones moving violates Ordnance

vagrant grotto
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I don't think they do since the Drones move on their own, but yeah ask

ashen crown
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That would mean numbers for Reap the Chaff (and Anni Nexus I suppose). It’s niche enough to not matter to Occultist Balance but it’s still interesting

umbral sluice
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very good, probably not too much

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maybe too much specifically with the Veteran trait

vagrant grotto
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Prism's Burst 3s are a little wide I suppose, but if I reduce them to Burst 2 then I'd probably want to reduce the Range on Shattered Glass, Omniglass, and even Shardsplitter's threat to 2

umbral sluice
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i covered about Half of one of Al's maps with the zones

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which I personally thought was okay bc the counterplay was to overheat the prism, easily done with most dedicated hackers

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it doesnt turn off gleam,

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but deletes the projections

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which was ultimately the counterplay

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I say the burst 3 feels big but it's probably okay

ashen crown
umbral sluice
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it's not full blind like shroud charge

vagrant grotto
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hm. Prism gets resistance to Heat through projectors....

umbral sluice
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it does yeah, but the Chom was near the real one in this case

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I'd kind of want to see how it would play on a team without an easy way to shut off projections

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in a team with one I can say it does it's job well of making the prism a problem NOW

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which I assume is waht defenders are meant to do

vagrant grotto
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Good, that's good Tank energy then

umbral sluice
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in short i could say my thoughts are: Serves its purpose well, very good with the Veteran optional, want to see it vs a different comp

vagrant grotto
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thank you!

ashen crown
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Ya know it occurs to me that the Knight has a relatively high save target.

I’m not saying that’s an issue but it’s definitely something I’d be interested in interrogating in a playtest sometime eventually (idk when unfortunately)

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Also question about Champion’s Greatsword: it’s shred effect is triggered on targets “effected by Compelled Duel,” but Templar’s Shield refers to “its Duel opponent.”

Does that imply the target is only shredded for rounds they failed their Duel save for?

vagrant grotto
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they are still affected by compelled duel even when they succeed on the save

ashen crown
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Gotcha

vagrant grotto
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otherwise they wouldn't make another save later

ashen crown
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It also occurs to me that against the correct Pegasus, a Knight Compelled Duel-ing a Pegasus can be really mean lol

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
ashen crown
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Combined with Templar Shield

vagrant grotto
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aight I've churned through the bug tracker and now the only remaining issues are "write down the sitreps, you madman" crylaughing

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lemme dig out the list of stuff that still needs tested

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Stuff to Test

Classes

  • Anchor
  • Capacitor
  • Ghost
    • String Theory Marionette
    • Wavefunction Collapse
    • Coherent Entanglement (Ultra)
  • Hatchet
    • Reckless Dive (crylaughing)
    • Return to Sender (crylaughingcrylaughing)
    • Hurricane of Steel (Ultra)
  • Kensei
    • Mortal Draw (Ultra)
  • Knight (new statline)
  • Mesmerist
    • Hall of Mirrors (Veteran)
  • Napalm
  • Occultist
    • Lead Astray
  • Prism (but more is welcome)
  • Torrent
    • Provisional change that changes Undertow to not require a Save vs. Prone
    • Crashing Tsunami (feels like I need more data)
  • Vulture
    • Aggressive Refabrication
  • Zealot

Templates

  • Anomaly
    • Anything, really
    • Also, if you're building an Anomaly, read a feature, and gut-instinct feel like it's something you'd never pick it up, tell me
  • Brigand
    • Surgekiller (this'll require some actual Core Powers available)
    • Shredding Claws
  • Formation
  • Prototype
    • Again, anything here
    • Again, if you're building a Prototype, read a feature, and gut-instinct feel like it's something you'd never pick it up, tell me
dapper goblet
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Great news im about to do roguelite testing hurling people through a metavault so time to treat this like a shopping list

vagrant grotto
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cool, many of the things on this list are gonna be updated in v1.17 as a note

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idk if I'm gonna write up the sitreps today tbh

dapper goblet
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...specifically anomaly and prototype will get a workout

muted blaze
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PPG V1.27

Return to sender:
Trigger: A character targets the hatchet with a grenade, arcing, seeking thing
Effect: the triggering character fucking dies

It's still underpowered

vagrant grotto
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next time I run a playtest I'm requiring people to bring arcing and seeking

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It's the only fucking way to be sure

muted blaze
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The monkeys paw curls. I throw a smoke grenade at a hatchet

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
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A hatchet can parry a nanocomp melee weapon

vagrant grotto
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correct

muted blaze
#

As it should

umbral sluice
#

oh did we get any more data on Hurricane of Steel hatchet

vagrant grotto
#

we did not, gonna add that back

umbral sluice
#

anyway i should have some feedback on AUNTIE, Antigrav Uppercut (if it fucking hits) and ROKO soon

vagrant grotto
#

added Hatchet Hurricane of Steel and Mesmerist Hall of Mirrors to the testing list

vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
#

okay good, i was running it that way already

muted blaze
vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
#

It's time, I'm doing it, I'm making new optional rules

MECHS
BRISK FRAMES
Mech frames with a SPEED stat lower than 3 often struggle to get to where they are needed on the map, often resorting to various “movement tricks” in scenarios where SPEED is paramount. For these sorts of frames, consider raising their SPEED to 3 to preserve their slowness without relegating them to the sidelines or requiring intensive build investment. The Brisk Frames reserve can quickly apply this change in Comp/Con.

SENSIBLE SENSORS
Mech frames with SENSORS lower than 5 are almost universally better off avoiding anything that relies upon their SENSORS. This greatly constrains those mechs’ build options, and it pressures GMs to design scenarios to accommodate this stark drop in SENSOR range compared to most of the frames in the game. To relieve this pressure, setting the minimum SENSORS for all mechs to 5. The Sensible Sensors reserve can quickly apply this change in Comp/Con.
muted blaze
#

You already have a "give more repairs" one right?

vagrant grotto
#

I do yes, but it's intended to be a blanket

#

though you don't have to read it that way I suppose

ashen crown
tame wharf
vagrant grotto
ashen crown
#

Both of the contexts have been a full mission

vagrant grotto
#

Oh sadcowboy

ashen crown
#

First time in the first combat of the mission, second time in the second combat of a mission

#

It’s mostly been bad luck and simply being unable to crit tho

vagrant grotto
#

Time to make it an on-hit effect

ashen crown
#

Yeah I was gonna suggest- 2 Heat for both of those gate conditions feels pretty weak if I’ve not been able to trigger it once

#

Either that or make it more impactful

#

And it’s gotten my players to say “oh watch out” when they’ve scanned it but it’s never forced a core power usage

vagrant grotto
#

Gonna make it 1 heat on weapon hit then

ashen crown
#

Sounds fair- some NPCs can get some wild Multiattack nonsense even with the rebake

vagrant grotto
#

It’s meant to be light pressure at the end of the day

tame wharf
#

went over everything in the Anomaly and gave it my thoughts

vagrant grotto
# tame wharf

thank you, writing a couple things down

  • Feedback Lash: It has yet to get testing, but I think it's less mean than Horror's Disruptor whip or Leech's "I eat all your Overshield" option
  • Harbinger: This is to be used on the Anomaly's allies, not its enemies, to be clear
  • Everything else: Noted
tame wharf
#

i think its a really cool design space and i think ill try to run one at some point to test it

vagrant grotto
#

Starting to codify some objectives:

Transport (Escort or Extraction variant)

VICTORY CONDITIONS
• Total Victory: All PCs and the objective safely extract.
• Partial Victory: The objective and at least one PC safely extract while the rest surrender or retreat.
• Defeat: The objective is destroyed. Surviving PCs may still extract or retreat.

OBJECTIVE
An object no larger than the maximum SIZE the PCs can drag, either with their mechs or with appropriate equipment (such as a transport VEHICLE). For rules on moving objects, see OBJECT HANDLING under ACTIONS, APPENDIX A. Enemy forces want the objective and avoid damaging it if possible. The PCs must drag the object a distance depending on the desired duration:
• Short: 18 or fewer spaces.
• Medium: 19–24 spaces.
• Long: 25–36 spaces.
#

Right now my revised sitreps are looking like:

  • Blitz (Control/Gauntlet)
  • Repel (Holdout)
  • Sweep (Push buttons)
  • Transport (Escort/Extraction)
  • Triangulate (Recon)
muted blaze
vagrant grotto
#

"Enemy forces want the objective and avoid damaging it if possible."

#

The enemies want to stop the players

muted blaze
#

Ok cool

#

I can't see round timer listed so the only way to lose is implied to get it destroyed

vagrant grotto
#

they admittedly have a rough job in that regard, but I'm abandoning any pretense that fights in Lancer are "in-universe balanced"

#

and yeah or retreat

muted blaze
#

Partial victory is cool however

vagrant grotto
#

I'm adding an "introductory" section on how I'm defining these sitreps, so I'm working on defining Durations (1-2, 3-4, or 5-6 target rounds), introducing the Interact action, giving guidelines on Reinforcements, and establishing Retreat rules (and what that implies for the fiction)

muted blaze
#

"Here's a sitrep toolbox and here's 6 sitreps that use said toolbox"

vagrant grotto
#

but yeah adding Partial Victory here because so often I see Escort objectives just be "get the payload outta here!" and then it's "welp, guess we're all gonna walk home now"

#

like, lead isn't gonna stop spraying just because someone got away with the ball

#

there's a fuckin Sekhmet Blackbeard right in the middle of our squad, that's still a thing

#

also, each of these sitreps is intended to be its own sort of toolbox, too

#

I think what I'm gonna try to do here is take Enemy Forces and Reinforcements and make them standalone guidelines, then have each "sitrep" just have the rules necessary to the specific in-fiction objective

#

here's my current writeup for Durations

DURATION
All of the sitreps in the Lancer Core Rulebook automatically terminate after a set number of rounds. However, this hard cutoff is not a requirement. Often, an encounter can instead target a desired number of rounds and forgo a hard cutoff. I use the following terms when describing durations for this section’s sitreps:

• Short: 1–2 rounds.
• Medium: 3–4 rounds.
• Long: 5–6 rounds.

When using these targets, encounters may run shorter or longer than expected. Unless there is a reason for a cutoff time (in the fiction or in real life), it is not required to have one. If a hard cutoff is desired, the following are recommended for each duration:

• Short: End after 4 rounds.
• Medium: End after 6 rounds.
• Long: End after 8 rounds.

Soft cutoffs (i.e., factors that make completing the objective after a certain point more difficult or taxing, but not impossible) can also be used. This could be the introduction of additional Reinforcements, or it could be an environmental effect like damaging sandstorms or rising water levels. If the cost of continuing seems too great, players can choose to Retreat.
placid glacier
#

Did V!orator get tested with "one hostile action goes through convincing rhetoric before it gets turned off"?

vagrant grotto
ashen crown
tame wharf
sudden cosmos
#

Next Lancer game is looking to have a prototype and two anomaly buddies

#

The prototype is an ultra and taking advantage of being allowed to cross-class for sure

ashen crown
#

Thinking about making 2 atlas enemies in the future- one of whom is more focused on the Terashima Blade stuff and the other of which is more focused on the Hunter + Jager elements. They’ll be a duo of Elites, and while I was originally thinking of having it be an Assassin+Ronin pair, I was wondering:

Mechanically speaking, how would replacing one/both of them with a Hatchet and/or Kensei sound? If I had them as a team, how do y’all think that would go? (The 100% PPG version would be a Hatchet + a Kensei, but different combinations are also being considered, like Assassin + Kensei)

vagrant grotto
#

But don’t let me stop you

#

Legit there’s no wrong answer here

ashen crown
#

I was thinking “Kensei Shred Supports Assassin”, but also “Rebound + Return to Sender is Hilarious”

#

IMO, the double PPG roster sounds the least interactive, but having one of them be PPG sounds fun

#

Also if I made the Kensei size 1/2 it’d make Mass Driver Sheathe’s force move mitigation funnier

#

The Assassin + Kensei combo would be more force move, setup, and condition oriented, meanwhile the Ronin + Hatchet combo would be more able to be threats at multiple range bands, and the Assassin + Ronin combo would- admittedly- be most on theme.

ashen crown
#

I’ll probably go Hatchet + Ronin- seems more in tune with what I’m looking to do

opaque crescent
#

interest gauge for playtest on <t:1769886000:F> or the day after

vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
#

maybe saturday yes if something ends up cancelling the normal lancer

tame wharf
sudden cosmos
opaque crescent
#

filled, unfortunately

sudden cosmos
vagrant grotto
untold vault
#

Valk i may have an old PDF so maybe this question is outdated, but do you have plans to add some generic encounters that put together some good unit comps using some off your npcs mixed in with vanilla npcs? Or is that not really something you're interested in?

I think maximum threat did a really nice job with that. Would be cool to have some examples of the synergies your units have with the old npcs (or just entire encounters composed of your npcs)

vagrant grotto
untold vault
#

Cheers. Would be cool!

vagrant grotto
# untold vault Cheers. Would be cool!

Dunno if I’m gonna go through with it but this is what I have so far

Dive Protection
    • Capacitor
    • Specter
Capacitor Overshields Specter from Reliable damage, and provides them with AP for their attacks.

Slippery Skirmishing
    • Ghost
    • Hatchet
Ghost gives the Hatchet additional defense and unfettered mobility for retrieving its Thrown weapons.

Red Hot Onslaught
    • Zealot
    • Pyro
Zealot motivates Pyro to advance with Fanatical Charge, primes foes with Burn for its Flamethrower, and adds Knockback to the flamethrower for good measure.
untold vault
#

Oh this is an even better idea. I like that you're creating little couples that you can inject into a larger composition

vagrant grotto
#

Yeah I’d rather make micro-comps than full encounters here, I think

#

Just to showcase the synergies

untold vault
#

That's clever. I think that's cool actually. That's an even better way to arrange things - little duos or trios

vagrant grotto
#

Exactly exactly

ashen crown
#

Think you might make ones with specific Optional Strats/combos?

vagrant grotto
#

I don’t know, I’m making no promises here

muted blaze
#

Especially on rebake

ashen crown
#

Zealot + Pyro is mean tho. Hm. I wonder if giving one of them COmmander + Press the Attack would be fun too

umbral sluice
#

it is mean! I ran the (igf ch1) ||Andros Capella fight replacing the Hive with a Zealot, carnage ensued, as it should||

opaque crescent
#

i do not envy your party

umbral sluice
#

look they won

#

two mechs down but

#

they won

#

one of them exposed himself with OC and then got crit with a Boarding Leash for 22

vagrant grotto
# 
Risky Business
    • Ghost
    • Berserker
Ghost bonds with the Berserker to make it harder for opponents to Invade and Skirmish them on the same turn while generally remaining an invalid target for Aggression. However, care must be taken while the Berserker uses Phase Shift, as the Berserker's random attacks could potentially target the Ghost while active.

Nothing Personnel, Kid
    • Kensei
    • Mirage
Mirage layers additional protection upon the Kensei via Warp Sensors and Dataveil, and helps it move while Mass Driver Sheathe is active.

Protect the Wizard
    • Knight
    • Witch
Knight challenges the most deadly threat on the battlefield while Witch debilitates them, capitalizing upon the Lock On granted by Champion's Greatsword.
# 
Turret Nest
    • Anchor
    • Engineer
Anchor provides the Engineer with safety from hostile artillery while the Engineer does what it does best.

Sting Like a Bee
    • Hatchet
    • Hive
Hive grants soft cover to the Hatchet and forces its targets to choose between staying Immobilized for a Cleaving Retrieval or getting pushed a long distance while Slowed by the Monomolecular Axe.
# 
Sturm und Drang
    • Torrent
    • Archer
Archer Impairs opponents, leaving them vulnerable to saves inflicted by the Torrent. Torrent knocks enemies out of position, allowing the Archer to pick them off. Positioning is critical for this, as the Torrent could inadvertently knock an opponent outside the Archer's line of sight.
muted blaze
#

Uuuuuuuuuuu

#

Anchor engineer is VIIIILE

#

As it should be

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
# 
Alliteration Annihilation
    • Prism
    • Priest
Priest uses Investiture to empower the Prism's attacks and Abjure to dissuade attackers affected by Diffraction Beam. Prism draws aggression from a forward position while affording safety to the Priest.
ashen crown
untold vault
#

these are all so cool! part of me thinks that this format should be used to construct entire encounter sets. gives prefabbed instructions to the GM

vagrant grotto
# ashen crown hehe it tickles

Take your bug pun and get out /kidding

Firebug
    • Napalm
    • Hornet
Hornet Impairs opponents to be more susceptible to Napalm's Salamander Thermobaric Catapult, while being unlikely to be hit in friendly fire.
untold vault
#

"These two operate this way, these three work best this way"

muted blaze
#

Cool pairings also work well because they can make a good foundation of an encounter, but will also just get better as you give them more templates

vagrant grotto
# 
Can't Get a Lock
    • Mesmerist
    • Operator
Mesmerist holds down Artilleries that try to shoot the Operator and Strikers that try to chase the Operator, all while the Operator Skirmishes at a safe distance.
#

Revised Protect the Wizard:

Wizard, Thief, Fighter
    • Knight
    • Assassin
    • Witch
Knight challenges the most deadly threat on the battlefield while Witch debilitates them, capitalizing upon the Lock On granted by Champion's Greatsword. Assassin deals double damage thanks to Shredded from the same weapon.
#

it's a little committal to have 3 NPCs dogpile 1 PC, but way I see it, the Witch can shift targets if necessary

ashen crown
muted blaze
vagrant grotto
#

I'm fine with a trio

muted blaze
#

Valid

vagrant grotto
#

idk which are staying and which are going

# 
Survival of the Fittest
    • Vulture
    • Goliath
Vulture keeps Goliath protected and Crush Targeting charged with "Magpie" Subroutines. "Dandelion" Phosphorous Cannon creates a Catch-22 with Crush Targeting if the opponent cannot safely leave the cannon's soft cover zone.

Threshing Advance
    • Occultist
    • Ronin
Occultist protects the Ronin with FLOCK Drones and Reap the Chaff's Overshield. The combination of threat from Reap the Chaff and Ronin's Carbon Fiber Sword encourages opponents to fall back or risk their ruin.
#

there that's at least 1 for each PPG NPC

muted blaze
#

Unkillable buzzing noise

  • Hornet
  • ghost
    Ghost bonding with the hornet allows the hornet to be more of a problem than before, avoiding all reactions due to intangibility and making it even harder to hit with paradox state. Allowing it to traverse through walls and not limiting it much due to it's condition application not being effected by it's heat and damage application being halved
vagrant grotto
#

yeah seems good

ashen crown
#

Ya know my mind was brainstorming “fan optionals” for prototypes, so here’s one:

Blink Puncture (Displacer Analog)
Superheavy Rifle, Ordnance, AP, 4 Heat
[Range 10, Blast 1] [10/15/20 Energy Damage]
After firing this weapon, the Prototype immediately becomes Exposed and Overheated. If the Prototype is critically hit while Exposed in this way or after being Scanned, the attacker can forgo the benefits of a critical hit to rupture this weapon’s power cells, destroying it and dealing 5/7/10 Burn to the Prototype.

vagrant grotto
#

sounds neat, sure

ashen crown
#

As soon as I saw the Prototype my first thought was “this bitch needs a Displacer” lol

vagrant grotto
#

How about we add this:

ASURA-Class NHP
System, AI, Unique, Heat 3 (Self), Protocol, 1/scene
Take two additional quick actions or one additional full action this turn. These actions must obey restrictions on duplicate actions.
ashen crown
#

Pfft

vagrant grotto
#

"that's just ASURA"
"correct"

#

normalize giving PC gear to NPCs

#

and vice versa

ashen crown
#

I mean I’d be in favor if stuff like Elite and Ultra didn’t already exist

ashen crown
#

I could in theory drop the Exposed element of it if I ever used it, since the power cell puncture is already there

vagrant grotto
#

Exposed in itself works pretty well

#

honestly I'd just hand the NPC a displacer and tell them "go off"

#

10 self heat = exposed in most cases anyway

umbral sluice
ashen crown
#

Other fan optionals I was thinking of:

  • Ferrostasis Armor (a mix of White Witch’s deal, Kinetic Damage resistance, and Stasis from Breath of the Wild- perhaps not always active)
  • Sundowner’s Shields
  • Something with Explosive Resistance (I thought this could be Sundowner’s Shields but… no, it don’t work :( )

Lightning Rod inspired me and I thirst for symmetry

umbral sluice
#

yeah just give the NPC the white witch core power what could go wrong

#

/j ofc

#

nah fr the stasis idea is cool

#

what are you envisioning there

dusk zodiac
#

I mean an Eidolon layer basically has the WW Core Power IIRC

ashen crown
#

Listen I could just give NPCs PC abilities and it would be fine, but I like the idea of stuff that’s adjacent flavorwise but not the same

dusk zodiac
#

That's why you call the NPC ASURA the DEVA instead

umbral sluice
#

also if I wanted my players to feel the agony of a WW all i need is an argus armour ultra

ashen crown
# umbral sluice what are you envisioning there

First thought that came to mind:

Protocol become Immobilized, gain Kinetic resistance, and have a d6 charge die or something. Each time the Prototype takes Kinetic damage, it gains a charge die. At the start of its next turn, it deals 4 damage times the value of the charge die kinetic damage in burst 2.

#

Another thought came to mind of “every time it takes damage it gains Overshield equal to half the damage taken (overriding previous Overshield instances if necessary)”, but that’s best saved for some other optional prolly

#

Armor is not something I’d wanna keep in it tho- White Witch only in vibes

umbral sluice
#

i do generally agree with there maybe being more damage type optionals but like. idk if valk is willing to add any more to prototype

#

it already has a ton so

ashen crown
#

Ofc, again these aren’t suggestions these are fan optionals

vagrant grotto
#

you all should absolutely do these and say they're Prototype

ashen crown
#

“Wow this Ferrostasis Armor is super imbalanced”
“HAHA yeah, g-good ol Valk will get the feedback sweating “

placid glacier
vagrant grotto
#

Prototype is my way of giving GMs permission to void their warranties themselves

ashen crown
#

I thought was Anomaly

umbral sluice
#

anomaly is giving GMs permissions to do some absolutely batshit insane stuff and interact with parts of the game you dont see otherwise

#

yeah im going to rewrite this guy's backstory what about it

vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
#

what is brigand in this case

vagrant grotto
#

Underhanded, but fair game

vagrant grotto
#

This won’t be for PPG but I’ve started making 1-trait faction templates

# 
# Faction Templates

Templates that provide a small but defining mechanic to represent unity within a faction. 

## Curseborn (HORUS Cell)
Impaired targets receive +1 difficulty on saves inflicted by this character.

## Observers (SSC group)
Attacks that consume Lock On deal +1/2/3 bonus damage.

## Mauve Phalanx (HA AMT)
Gain +1 Accuracy to Attacks, Checks, and Saves while adjacent to an ally.

## Breakers (IPS-N crew)
Prone targets hit by this character are Shredded until the end of their next turn.

## Automatons
Gain +2 HP, but tech attacks gain +1 Accuracy against this character, and they are unable to carry out complex tactics.

## Bounty Hunters
Pick one PC most likely to be in trouble with an authority figure. All members of this faction gain +1 Accuracy to attacks against that PC.

## Professionals
1/round, one NPC with this template who has not acted yet may take their turn immediately after another NPC, without an intervening PC turn.

## Snakes
Reaction, 1/round
Trigger: An attack misses the Snake.
Effect: The Snake may move 1 space, ignoring engagement and reactions.

## Ambushers
If this character started its turn Hidden, they gain +1 Accuracy to Grapple a target.

## Stealth Ops
On their turn, this character may Hide while within line of sight of hostile characters. They must be in cover or outside of line of sight at the end of their turn, or they are no longer hidden.

## Amphibious
This character moves normally through water or other liquids.

## Shrikes
Attacks that consume Lock On deal +1 Heat.

## Hedgehogs
Attacks made against this character while within Range 3 first inflict 1/2/3 Kinetic AP damage to the attacker.
tame wharf
muted blaze
#

In emergency operation parameters as Cat mentioned I ended up making the template: Legion which is a vet/commander/ultra/elite exclusive template which grants access to a PC NHP. But because PCs gear should function differently to NPCs some I kept the same and some I scratched my head to make more NPC like and more like choreographed charge up abilities. Like Cat said Asura just gave that NPC another activation that round... Because how many PC traits can you give NPcs before you cross the line of "don't make PCs fight PCs"

(Also I'm not the pinnacle of game design. My NPC asura has seen the light of day once and PC and the feedback was "that's cool", there must be many more unbalanced combos I've not thought of so the usual crylaughing )

muted blaze
muted blaze
#

Fish mech

#

Why is ambushers explicitly grapple?

opaque crescent
#

first thought is flavour, like a black ops member jumping out of hiding to restrain a target for their allies to attack

vagrant grotto
# muted blaze Why is ambushers explicitly grapple?

This recent vid involving bugbears was on my mind
https://youtu.be/L2koRWVJXec

YouTube
Mystic Arts
How Mechanics Tell Stories

I've developed a small bugbear about D&D monsters, it's when they fail to tell a story. Thinking about the 5th Edition Bugbears I realized I had to go make some changes to tell the story about the special forces bugbears!

🎬 Created by Daði & Anna Birna ♥

▼ DOWNLOAD THE STATS ▼
Grab the Goblinoids PDF on Patreon: https://www.patreon.c...

▶ Play video
#

I agree that it’s niche right now though

#

Might be better to let them grapple automatically on melee hit after starting turn hidden or something

vagrant grotto
#

Getting the mechanics to tell a story of how they operate

They hide, and then they grab ya

#

But yeah acc on grapple is a little niche for the benefit

#

You know, I think I’m starting to see Clem’s “oops all bastions” comp as more than just a meme

#

They all have predictable stats and features, sure, but each is fulfilling a different role thanks to their cross class stuff

muted blaze
#

Ok ngl I just skimmed over the hidden part and assumed it was first round of combat, because the squad ambushers trait exists

muted blaze
#

So, Lancer it feels like without 3rd party additions the floor to support this is higher than DND due to the modularity of the existing NPCs yet the ceiling is also lowered because of the lack of Uniqueness across the NPCs (Monster manual, howver many hundred monsters vs Lancers 30)

#

And templates deffo assist, I think thought to properly encapsulate the "fighting" a specific army such as a bunch of group of spec ops bugbears in mechs a template and the ambushers trait will help yet to have the modularity as explained in that video that one trait would work better with optionals

#

And then your faction roster can be kitted out to be more akin to complimenting one trait granted rather than other things that work adjacent...

#

And I think that opens a cool door for how to manage template design...

#

OEP has the covert template which is all about hidden which I think can play cool into making a faction roster all about one gimmick, which some mechs will need the template as a crutch and some might not even need the template

#

Thinking of the video and how a "Here's an action that can define a faction" and had an idea for the KTB.

opaque crescent
#

I hope whatever is cooking in you brain relates to one official art of the guy onehanding a zweihander walking by a mech that I'm 100% sure he could take in a fight

muted blaze
#

Unfortunately my idea for a KTB faction trait is not "Titanium Balls"

vagrant grotto
#

But yeah, for these, I’m currently waffling between “leave each at just one trait and let the rest of the expression be NPCs that fit the theme” and “make the base trait and some optionals so that more NPCs can be squeezed into the theme”

#

They’ll also go in a different supplement than PPG tbh

muted blaze
#

Valid tbf

#

It's a decent amount of content for a project that you yourself have said should be closed at some point lmao

vagrant grotto
#

Yeah no, I can entertain sample combinations and sitrep rules, but I’m drawing the line at these

ashen crown
#

I like it, except for Hedgehogs. These templates look like they’re intended to be deployed En Masse to the entire Sitrep, and for the most part they work really well as optionals made for that purpose. Amphibious in particular feels useful if you decide to use Enhanced Combat Liquids.

However, Hedgehogs feels too potent to be deployed En Masse, and that it would severely screw over anyone close range regardless of who they were fighting. It feels too much to be a template optional rather than a class or structure template optional, and even if you nerfed it to adjacency rather than range 3 it just makes CQB better and melee worse. Plus, as a faction trait, I just don’t really see the theming. So idk if it’s a good trait to attach to specifically this template.

vagrant grotto
#

Noted

muted blaze
#

Oops all vlad

vagrant grotto
#

How about this

umbral sluice
#

lot more fun looking than "everyone has shrike armour" imo

#

just uh

#

if the hedgehod engages a PC

#

do they take the damage still?

vagrant grotto
#

Yes

umbral sluice
#

okay good

muted blaze
#

Clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk

umbral sluice
#

a whole sitrep of these may be spooky but like,

#

its engagement thats avoidable

vagrant grotto
#

Mm good point I can maybe drop the damage slightly

muted blaze
#

"I think that damage can be very abusable"
"You're right, it should be heat instead" /j

muted blaze
vagrant grotto
#

I’ll reduce it to 1 instead

#

I kinda want to see and/or encourage an abuse case

umbral sluice
#

oh my god cataphracts

#

engaged.wav repeat 8 times

opaque crescent
#

Anything that disengages

vagrant grotto
#

Honestly a clause about movement that ignores engagement ignoring the damage would be preferred I think

muted blaze
#

Me when I propose to my partner and they fucking die because they're a grunt

vagrant grotto
#

Then there’s player side counter play

#

Good talk folks

opaque crescent
muted blaze
#

Become engaged, don't lose speed

#

I don't remember the exact wording however

opaque crescent
#

Grazie

umbral sluice
#

yeah smaller characters than you dont cause Engagement (lose movement) but they cause Engaged (1 difficulty on ranged) iirc

ashen crown
# vagrant grotto How about this

A lot better- still messes with Melee and CQB but now ranged characters can also get punished + the enemy can prompt it, and the counterplay to it is either “don’t get engaged” OR “tank the damage once, then never stop being engaged”

ashen crown
#

Would it just not scale?

vagrant grotto
# 
## Reactor Cavaliers
While in the Danger Zone, this character may Boost or Disengage as a free action.

## Steampunks
While in the Danger Zone, characters making a melee or ranged attack against the Steampunk must roll a d6. On a 4+, the attack automatically misses. This does not stack with Invisible.

## Star Eaters
When this character hits a target in the Danger Zone with an attack, the target loses 1/2/3 Heat but takes twice the Heat lost as irreducible Energy damage.
ashen crown
#

Is this for a dedicated template?

vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
#

I’m just riffing on danger zone here

ashen crown
#

Ah okay

vagrant grotto
#

One faction does not have a monopoly on Danger Zone related effects

#

Tbf though there could stand to be more danger zone features in Lancer, period

ashen crown
#

Plus if these features were on their own most of the NPC roster (without Limitless) couldn’t willingly activate them

vagrant grotto
#

“When a target isn’t in the danger zone” too

muted blaze
#

But yeah...

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
#

Legitimately just need a +1 acc vs danger zone feature or something, like cmon

#

Assassin’s Heated blade could add danger zone to its list of things that double damage

muted blaze
#

I'm usually more averse to NPC facing danger zone abilities purely because NPCs don't have the same modularity and fine tuned heat management control PCs get access to (self heat traits being all or nothing or 1d6 for example) especially when granted via templates. But these look neat because the bonuses aren't insane

#

Well....

#

Steampunks looks kinda mad tbh

vagrant grotto
#

Gain fake invis while in the danger zone?

umbral sluice
#

perma invis in danger zone (except for tech) is scary

#

idk i guess i'd want to see it in play

vagrant grotto
#

I’ll add a “but not exposed”

ashen crown
umbral sluice
#

how easy it is to overheat them is the real question here

muted blaze
#

Those reasons I listed to me make it feel clunky but to each their own

umbral sluice
#

bc i see that being the main counterplay

vagrant grotto
opaque crescent
#

Reactor Cavalier should probably specify a round limit

muted blaze
umbral sluice
#

I also love Star Eaters conceptually

muted blaze
#

Steampunk scourer

ashen crown
umbral sluice
#

big fan of the idea of leveraging the opponent's reactor to hurt them

vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
#

i assume it doesnt work if you dont have any heat ofc

#

so the counter is staying cool

vagrant grotto
#

Though they can also set it up with a cheeky invade

#

Which may lead me to reevaluate

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
#

Probably a flat 2 heat/4 damage thing

#

I’ll check but part of the Lancer house style is being redundant (un)fortunately

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

Scourer enters the dangerzone then proceeds to travel 386 spaces like I do when it's after a playtest and I get a guy to just run around the map for shits and gigs

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
shut yew
#

not only do i not mind pings, i relish them

#

and YES these are very fuckin cool

ashen crown
#

I’m a sucker for Faction Templates

muted blaze
#

@ pig

shut yew
#

its so funny im literally elbow deep in a proof of concept myself. its not really similar to this but it is NPC work and its dope to see our little community toil together

ashen crown
#

Still looking for an excuse to use Cornylius’ Faction Templates and DataMoth’s Stellar Codex Faction templates but I guess I’m throwing this into the pile lmao

#

I now wish I had the time to just run pickup games on the regular

untold vault
#

Well i really like these Faction traits because templates usually confer so much strength and utility to a unit that templating all units on the field will probably break combat, even IF it's thematically appropriate to do so (if I'm fighting a pirate gang, intuitively it makes sense to give them all pirate templates but dear God don't)

This is a better way to give mechanical flavor to an entire encounter without imbalancing the whole kit n kaboodle

vagrant grotto
# 
## Star Eaters
When this character hits a target in the Danger Zone with an attack, the target loses 2/3/4 Heat and the Star Eater gains Overshield equal to twice the Heat lost.

## Ouroboros (HORUS)
Trait, Protocol
The Ouroboros loses all Overshield, and their next attack inflicts Energy bonus damage equal to half the Overshield lost on hit.

## Stasis Team (HA)
While this character has any Overshield, they have Resistance to Energy, Heat, and Burn.

## Contagion (HORUS)
This character can make melee, Smart, and tech attacks while Jammed at the cost of 2 Heat per attack.

After hitting with a melee, Smart, or tech attack, choose one condition currently affecting this character. The target gains that condition until the end of their next turn.

## Grudgers
This character gains +1 Accuracy on attacks, checks, and saves made against the last character to take hostile action against them.

## Hellions
A Hellion cannot be destroyed unless it is in the Danger Zone, continuing to act as normal while at 0 Structure. While it has 0 Structure, the Hellion receives 2 Heat per attack that hits it.

## Grippers (IPS-N)
Gain +1 Accuracy against all Grappled targets.

## Big Inertia Gang
Melee and ranged attacks gain Knockback 1.

## Shieldwall
While adjacent to an allied character, both the Shieldwall and the ally gain Immunity to Shredded and Resistance to all damage not inflicted by areas of effect.

## Bullies
Prone characters have +1 Difficulty on attacks, checks, and saves made against the Bully.

## Agonizers
The Agonizer inflicts +1 bonus damage on weapon attacks for each condition on their target.
# 

## Vengeful Pack
Pack Knife
Auxiliary Melee, AP, Thrown 5, +1/+2/+3
[Threat 1][2/3/4 Kinetic damage]
When this character would be destroyed, it may first Skirmish with this weapon.

## Giddy Vandals
Upon dealing Structure damage, the Giddy Vandal may move up to half their speed, ignoring engagement and reactions, and Skirmish against a different target, dealing half damage, Heat, and burn.

## Molerats
A Molerat may burrow partially underground as a quick action, remaining targetable but becoming Invisible. While burrowing, it ignores difficult terrain and obstructions, but cannot make attacks. It may stop burrowing as a quick action.

[consider also: Hide = burrowing, unburrowing > special effect]

## Flickers
Trait, Quick Action
Teleport 1 space. This can be used while Immobilized.
#

I revised star eaters so they gain OS instead of deal damage

ashen crown
#

Oh I hate the name “Grippers” lmao

vagrant grotto
#

I hope you can come to grips with it, lol

ashen crown
#

Oh I like Bully- could honestly be a Brigand base trait tbh but probably shouldn’t do that this late in

vagrant grotto
#

Unironically going through Mordenkainen Presents: Monsters of the Multiverse and stealing faction ideas from there

dapper goblet
#

Its a great tome

vagrant grotto
#

The dragon game has some useful stuff worth getting inspired over

tame wharf
#

could call one Strangers where 1/scene as a reaction they can become invisible?

muted blaze
#

GRIPPERS

ashen crown
muted blaze
#

Hey Valk, mind if I throw my hat in the ring with some ideas?

vagrant grotto
#

I’m not really taking outright suggestions at the moment tbf

muted blaze
#

Cool, I shall keep them within my large brain

vagrant grotto
#

Write them down for later for sure

ashen crown
#

I also like how these optionals encourage group tactics/coordination. some of them work well in a Vacuum but they seem to shine brightest when the entire OpFor has them

vagrant grotto
#

I may be down to take suggestions when this is further along

# 
## Bloodhounds
The Bloodhound ignores cover, Invisible, and Hidden against targets missing at least 1 Structure.
ashen crown
#

Ouroboros is a bit questionable to me- seems even more team comp dependent than Stasis Team to me since you need traits that refresh overshield rapidly rather than just buffing NPC while they have Overshield. Feels almost too specific to work on its own as a template optional

#

Like if you wanna use Stasis Team you can just deploy a priest and call it a day. Meanwhile Ouroboros seems like it just doesn’t work unless you have a Capacitor and/or a Zealot in the team comp

vagrant grotto
# 
## Tremor Troopers
A Tremor Trooper ignores Invisible against characters on the ground within its Sensors. However, if a character lands from flying or jumping within the same area, then until the end of the Tremor Trooper’s next turn, this trait only works against the landed target and all other grounded characters are treated as Invisible.
vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
#

Gonna make it key off of taking Falling damage instead of just landing

muted blaze
#

Me tanking by just jumping everywhere

umbral sluice
muted blaze
vagrant grotto
#

Fuck I thought of something and then forgot

#

Nvm got it

# 
## Snakes
The Snake may drop Prone as a free action. While Prone, they are not Slowed and may move normally. In addition, they have soft cover and are treated as 1 Size smaller for the purposes of determining Line of Sight.

Renaming the above Snakes to something else

#

Anyway yeah this is coming along

#

Ideal world, I’d have a list of NPCs in a sample faction for each

opaque crescent
#

make sure to put a lower limit on size here so that mirages don't phase out of existance

muted blaze
muted blaze
opaque crescent
#

PPG Foundry Module Update

  • Added functionality for NPC Recharge Heat automation
    -# No more separate LCPs or manually adding heat self tags (this is toggleable as well, so if you already set up NPC Recharge Heat some other way you can disable it in settings)
  • Added setting to toggle available features piecemeal
    -# Maybe you only want One Stress for All, you can do that now

As always, message me or put an issue up on the github page for bug reports or whatevs

ashen crown
#

The 1 size smaller thing may be awkward when you start considering anything other than height, since my first thought was “snake barricade! Make your own terrain, hide behind it, and ignore your difficult terrain penalties!” But then I remembered “wait size 2 footprint”

untold vault
ashen crown
#

Yeah but then Tom and Miguel will start tapping Mercenary with their Copyright Infringement Foam Fingers

#

(I jest the foam fingers have been burned and this is more than legally distinct enough)

opaque crescent
#

you shouldn't burn foam :(

muted blaze
#

Watch me

vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
# 
## Condor Asset Reclamation
This character may treat any of its movement as flying. It can lift Grappled characters of total size equal to its size or smaller off the ground while flying, but is Slowed while doing so.

## Chevalier’s Peons
Gain +1 Accuracy to attacks, checks, and saves while an allied character with at least 2 maximum Structure is within line of sight. Otherwise, gain +1 Difficulty on attacks, checks, and saves.

## Vox Vulpis Propagandists
Gain +1 Accuracy on attacks, checks, and saves against Jammed characters.
    • Witch w/ Chain
    • Cataphract w/ Lance Shot

## Engine Automatons
Increase any Heat dealt and taken by this character by 1. While this character is Exposed, tech attacks gain +1 Accuracy against it.

## Glacial Gravediggers
When this character inflicts Immobilize on a character, it additionally knocks that character Prone. It has Resistance to Heat.

## Breaching Saints
1/scene, when this character boosts, they may Boost their maximum speed in a straight line. If they do, one object in its path takes 20 AP damage. If this is enough to destroy the object, this character may continue moving through where the object was.

## Tagalongs
1/round, while adjacent to an allied character, this character may move with that ally’s movement, mirroring their movement up to their Speed+1. If the ally’s movement ignores engagement, reactions, or both, this character’s movement ignores the same effects.

## Overflowing Chalice 
When a character in Range 3 becomes Exposed, gain 3/5/7 Overshield.

## Star-Crossed Stampede
1/round, when this character inflicts Knockback, it may choose to move the same number of spaces directly towards their target, ignoring engagement and reactions.

## Terrible Terrapins
This character has Resistance to Explosive damage and ignores additional effects from sources of Explosive damage.

Fans of my modules might find some of these names familiar

sullen ingot
#

holy shit technophobia mentioned

vagrant grotto
#

I’ve made public enemy number one

## Gear Grinders
When using Quick Tech and choosing to Invade, this character may choose for the target to be Slowed until the end of their next turn instead of Impaired.
muted blaze
#

With the powers of a PPG invade doing 1 heat, a PPG elite witch can achieve what a rebake witch can do in 1 round

placid glacier
vagrant grotto
# 
## Migraine Squad
Impaired characters treat this character as Invisible.

## Silent Nights
While this character is Hidden, obscure their exact position from the players. This character takes 2 Heat at the end of each turn it remains hidden. The feature ceases while this character is Exposed.
muted blaze
#

O lord

#

The migraine squad hornets

vagrant grotto
#

New public enemies released

#

It’s fine, just be Superior By Design

placid glacier
ashen crown
vagrant grotto
#

I figured it had Cruelty Squad naming energy

#

But also: full of chucklefucks

opaque crescent
#

god i forgot how horrid the ui was for this game

round patrol
#

what hasth thou cooking

vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
#

Help, I can’t be stopped

Howler - Defender/Striker
    • Feral Howl - Quick Tech, 2 Heat (Self)
        ○ Hostile characters in a Burst 2 area enter a fight-or-flight state. At the end of their next turn, if they did not make a melee or ranged attack against the Howler that turn, they trigger the Howler’s Overwatch.
    • Ripper Claws - Auxiliary Melee, AP, Reliable 2/3/4, +1/+2/+3, Threat 2, 4/5/6 Energy damage
        ○ The Howler may ignore the 1/round limit of Overwatch when attacking with this weapon.
    • Rabid Lunge - Quick Action, Overshield, Recharge 5+
        ○ The Howler gains 3/5/7 Overshield, then moves twice its Speed in a straight line, ignoring engagement and reactions.
tame wharf
vagrant grotto
tame wharf
#

👍

dusk zodiac
#

Template or NPC?

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

For PPG?

vagrant grotto
#

Yes (save me)

opaque crescent
#

things to test for next week? joyous

umbral sluice
#

holy shit, Enkidu NPC in ppg...

opaque crescent
#

50 ultra howlers

umbral sluice
#

also uhh looking at this, doesn't it feel a little similar in function to mesmerist? could be just me tripping but Burst 2 tech attack that taunts + Threat 2 melee weapon seems a teeny bit similar?

muted blaze
#

One day I'll release PPg
NPCs reaching much more stable state of polish
One day I'll have to release it
...
What if...

umbral sluice
#

not necessarily bad per se,

#

just a gut reaction to it

muted blaze
#

Also 2/3/4 ap reliable feels like a lot

#

Alas, see it in play

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

Eh fair

#

Closed and placed down then

vagrant grotto
# 
    • No Escape - Trait
        ○ When the Howler hits with Overwatch, it may move directly to any space adjacent to its target, ignoring engagement and reactions.
    • Longclaw - Trait
        ○ The Howler can initiate and maintain Grapples against targets within Range 2.
vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
#

ooh ranged grapple

#

well "ranged"

#

range 2 still isnt much but

#

i feel like that unlocks some cool potential plays

vagrant grotto
umbral sluice
#

hm, true

vagrant grotto
#

In base kit*, MJaunt exists

umbral sluice
#

which sounds really silly on an NPC so I approve

muted blaze
#

Sorry for being pedantic

#

I also have some follow up questions depending on the answer

opaque crescent
#

The Howler can initiate and maintain Grapples against targets within Range 2.

vagrant grotto
#

Emphasis on “and maintain”

muted blaze
#

Ew

vagrant grotto
#

I don’t know what to tell you

#

Goliath Pin exists

umbral sluice
#

also I do have some feedback for the Prototype stuff I tested recently, so I'll get to typing that up now

muted blaze
#

But pin isn't a grapple and doesn't mimic movement so... :P

vagrant grotto
#

Well at least Grapple doesn’t jam :^)

muted blaze
#

So if I'm at range 1 and grappled by a howler with long claw and I ram it away, it still keeps the grapple?

vagrant grotto
#

Fuck I forgor crushing embrace is the jam

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

Ew

#

I think I'd need to see it in play

vagrant grotto
#

This prototype, untested NPC that is still very much a draft

muted blaze
#

Tru

vagrant grotto
#

Like that’s valid

muted blaze
#

Trust the process

#

Fight or flight is a cool agro taunt tool

vagrant grotto
#

I thank Orange Orange for that

muted blaze
#

Did this spawn from a GM corner convo?

vagrant grotto
#

I was probably gonna make it some sort of difficulty until I thought “huh let’s actually fuck with their actions”

#

Yes

muted blaze
#

-# biggest complaint so far, I keep reading howler and reading it as howitzer somehow... And I begin crying because I'm reminded of the GMS howitzer /j

vagrant grotto
#

Warwick Ult is finding a way into this, I promise

muted blaze
#

Who

vagrant grotto
opaque crescent
muted blaze
#

League?

vagrant grotto
#

Indeed

muted blaze
#

🤮

vagrant grotto
#

My werewolf touchstone

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

To think I trusted you with homebrew 😭 /j

opaque crescent
#

Karthus ult when joyous

#

it would surely be fair

muted blaze
#

You too!

vagrant grotto
#

Also Rainmaker has some of that

umbral sluice
# 

Generally with Prototypes, Novel Technology continues to feel great, in another team I could see this being a tax of some sort (which I think is fine, even), but this feature also lets Chomolungma feel great about Data Siphon, which I personally like. Good stuff, I think this one is perfect as is

Mesmerist:
ROKO-Class feels very nice on Mesmerist imo, I think it adds to the Defender's dynamic even more than usual, now if you want to attack my ally you're taking 2 heat AND giving me an accuracy on my next attack, and with a base neutral weapon it absolutely was appreciated. I did admittedly not stick as many NPCs near ROKO as I should have but that's partially the fault of Recon forces being spread thin across the map until the true control point was discovered (ran it so it was a quick action scan and not even I knew the point until it was determined). That being said, it did it's job amazingly with creating a lose-lose scenario for nearby players, indicating to me that it's working as intended. My players did do some unconvential stuff of intentionally missing with their assault rifles to still do reliable while pinging off the MIrror Images. As for ROKO, I personally want to see this on an NPC that forces saves also, as the save difficulty part of it is quite intriguing to me, but I can conclude that it feels very nice on a close range defender playstyle.

Hatchet:
Return to sender triggered never, despite my attempts to bait the grenadier into it, and antigravity uppercut was saved against every time, and it's not like they were bolstering particularly much or something. I just had some shitty luck this time :sob:```
vagrant grotto
#

Tbh a telegraphed Karthus Ult NPC side would be even more fair than Divine Punishment

vagrant grotto
#

Also that Novel Tech is doing well

umbral sluice
# 
Did say some stuff about this one before, but I'll reiterate here anyway. Double Vision was super useful on a Recon where I didn't know the true CZ so I could cover my bases, and went extremely well together with Scintillating Gleam. The Burst 3 area in 3 different points feels kind of enormous on one of Al's maps, but that's probably the point. It was a great taunt and basically yelled at the PCs to do something about the Prism right now, unless they don't want to deal with that Engi and Ronin chilling near the projector, and that Engi had six turrets so it was dire. Found out that Heat in general is a great counter to this thing, self heat + uneven Heatcap makes for very intuitive counterplay. I can say Scintillating is strong, but working as intended for a defender, so overall a positive note. 
Now, the infamous AUNTIE. I can say that with these two changes I made, it feels notably less mean than before. One thing that old AUNTIE could do is jump in and out of range with the free action boosts, and granted it can still go out of range now, but Ordnance heavily neuters it. The Prism spent like a turn or two setting stuff up before going for the AUNTIE, one of which was on an exposed mech lmao. Ordnance is a good change imo. Difficulty I can't speak too much on because I think it rolled above average on every attack and missed maybe once? That being said, player reactions were a bit uhhh, disgruntled maybe, at seeing the high base damage, but that was assuaded when they saw it was a superheavy and I brought up Sniper so I'm not sure now. It could maybe do with a tiny damage nerf but overall feels a lot more balanced now than the Hornet Incident. One thing I will note is how Heat Seeking played with the Death By Glamour Mesmerist, which is to say extremely well. Other than that, the only thing I have to say is that I found myself always boosting with the free action, not an issue per se, just something I noticed with how I tend to favour moving```
#

I think I need to add Recharge Heat into the game now, just to have Heat Seeking come up more often tbh

#

I've seen how it can be and I like it a lot

opaque crescent
#

Damn if only someone added that to some kind of foundry module meant for use in conjunction with the PPG LCP

#

someone should do that

#

(also i need it tested cus idk if it actually works as intended)

umbral sluice
#

I'll add it anyway

#

I'm not using all the valk houserules though

#

so I imagine there's toggles?

opaque crescent
#

yeah there's toggles for what's implemented (except pre-expose on heat and damage, I don't think there's a reason to turn that off)

vagrant grotto
#

Realized that Longclaw’s antisynergistic with Reactions, lol, lmao crylaughing

We’ll see if I keep Rabid Lunge as a base feature or move it to an optional in favor of something else

opaque crescent
umbral sluice
#

my Chomolungma will eat this up

#

he loves system crusher it's so funny

umbral sluice
#

don't actually do that but like,

#

I can see an NPC designed around it

ashen crown
ashen crown
#

Especially considering how the Howl works

#

Anyhow I like it cause it’s an Enkidu parallel and has a fun Howl gimmick

ashen crown
#

I found a PPG meme in the wild

image0.jpg
vagrant grotto
ashen crown
vagrant grotto
#

that's fine lol

#

also meme maker, they're not systems, they're all Traits :^)

#

thank you for sharing this though @ashen crown this made my day and I cannot stop laughing every time I look at it

ashen crown
placid glacier
vagrant grotto
#

I know nothing about Project Moon games but I’m glad that folks have found Anomaly to be a useful tool for replicating their experiences in Lancer

ashen crown
#

Weird thought: a Kensei could make a very half decent Raleigh analog

#

This is because I just saw art of a Raleigh Ronin and put two and two together

vagrant grotto
#

Today I’m weighing between

  • Prototype Pattern Groups work
  • playing Frostpunk 2
  • playing guilty gear strive
ashen crown
#

If you’re playing Guilty Gear your internet could potentially cut out so online play may be suddenly disconnected and that break in flow could be not great.

PPG could work but only if you’re doing it on a Laptop or something.

Idk what Frostpunk 2 is.

#

Wait I don’t even know if you’re in the US

vagrant grotto
#

It was rhetorical

muted blaze
#

Brave the cold

#

We yearn for the Coal mines

opaque crescent
#

Pushed a small update for the foundry module, forgot to check Recharge Heat on items without the recharge tag

#

please do not throw tomatoes at me

muted blaze
#

🫳 🍅

opaque crescent
vagrant grotto
opaque crescent
#

so for stuff without the recharge tag, it would error out of the switch statement handling the amount of heat the character is meant to gain, which then returns false to the flow causing it to stop

#

so e.g. basic tech attack on player mechs would just fail out

vagrant grotto
#

Okay I understand now

#

Does your mod skip recharge heat on systems that already have the Heat Self tag?

opaque crescent
#

no

#

is that meant to be the case with recharge heat rules?

vagrant grotto
#

I’d rec doing so in the future

#

Yeah but it usually doesn’t come up

#

But I think Kai’s Rebakes have some self heat + recharge abilities

opaque crescent
#

I can amend this patch and do that

#

wasn't aware that was a thing

vagrant grotto
#

It’s cool, it’s an edge case

#

But yeah I do mention it in the Recharge Heat optional rule

#

Basically if it’s already paying a heat tax, it doesn’t need to double dip

vagrant grotto
#

Frostpunk 2 to my understanding is more of a nation-building scale of that

opaque crescent
#

(if anyone already installed the update before the amendment, reinstall the module - I didn't make it a separate release)

vagrant grotto
#

Procrastinating sitreps and stuff:

NO SPLIT MOVES
While the ability to split movement before and after actions adds flexibility to positioning, it also introduces more decision points for players and GMs to take each turn. To reduce the complexity of a given character’s turn, replace SPLITTING UP MOVEMENT AND ACTION (Lancer, p. 62) with the following:

“Once characters begin to move, either by standard move or something else, they must end their movement and lose all remaining movement in order to take a different action. For example, if a character with SPEED 6 moves 3 spaces with their standard move and chooses to SKIRMISH, they lose their remaining 3 spaces of movement. They must BOOST or use a different form of movement in order to continue moving on their turn.”

To account for this reduction in effective SPEED, increase the base SPEED of all characters by 1. Use the FASTER PC reserve and FASTER NPC template to quickly adjust these SPEEDS.
vagrant grotto
#

Wrote up a Retreat procedure

placid glacier
#

I did not have a chance to mention it after session (was pretty wiped out) but I did get some testing for the Hatchet and Vulture

vagrant grotto
#

happy to hear it when you get the chance

placid glacier
#

very scattered thoughts

Sitrep was Train Heist from Enhanced Combat at LL9 so noting that I was using Tier 3 Enemies, mix of Archers, Sentinals, Sentries (Crisis Core) for the line troops. Hatchet was a Veteran, Vulture was an Ultra

Players: Melee Caliban, Displacer Ghengis, and a standard Frundsberg (melee barb)

Hatchet
Return to Sender: Couldn't get value 😔, caliban had grenades, but Hatchet was never in a good position to use the reaction (so not something to note about the optional itself, just wanted to note that I had the optional)

Reckless Dive: Used it to get away from the Frund by jumping to the axe thrown at the caliban, so the extra flexibility from the activation changing to any enemy felt really good. Players thought that the resistance felt fair to play against rather than it being a no sell to their attacks

Vulture
Aggressive Refab: It really feels like it has too many stipulations to use, being that it requires the vulture to

  • Spend 4 Heat to-
  • -Use a full action, meaning the Ultra either has to be within 4 spaces of an enemy, or risk more heat with an overcharge boost with the overcharge optional in order-
  • -to be adjacent to the enemy and-
  • -Have the enemy fail a hull save, and most players will have at least some hull marked, unless they're doing some kind of agi meme build.

And all of that... Just for the ghengis to mark a once per scene system that had already been used in the scene as the target system- on the second try of using the system because the player passed the first forced save. (The ghengis also has Superior by Design so was immune to Impaired. [So did the Frund actually so.]) I at least asked the player to choose a different system and they went with their ExBatts

all this to say- at the very least should add a stipulation that systems/weapons without charges/already used if 1/scene are not valid targets for destruction by the system. and long shot maybe easing up one of the conditions to meet?

vagrant grotto
#

nice, okay thanks for the feedback on Aggressive Refabrication. I'm already removing the extra Heat cost, and I'll consider how to reword the thing to be more like System Trauma

placid glacier
#

👍

#

oh right. Hatchet had Slip Drive too I forgot.

#

uuh. I mean it was fine I guess-

#

more mobility is always nice, but idk how to feel about the QA cost- I'll keep my thoughts to myself for now until I get a chance to test it again and/or someone else uses it

muted blaze
#

So I did a playtest for my talent rework and I have some feedback for the PPG house rules and such

PPG and Valk house rules used:

  • None

Feedback:

  • Fuck me I miss the valk and PPG house rules 😩
#

CRB Overcharge was actually painful wth

vagrant grotto
#

That's what I'm saying!! 😆

placid glacier
#

One of these days I'll do a Valk house rules skirmish one shot-

mental burrow
#

What does the memetic tag on the Anomaly's Memento Culpa mean?

muted blaze
#

Memetic is a weapon type added by no room for a wallflower which is not melee nor ranged and it's own thing, it doesn't care about engagement and it doesn't affect allies

mental burrow
#

Ahh I looked in the wrong sourcebook

#

My b

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
mental burrow
#

Yea I looked in dustgrave to see if it was in there but not wallflower

placid glacier
#

Honestly wish the tag was used more in PPG too, it's a funky little tag

vagrant grotto
# 
COVERING GUARDIAN
The GUARDIAN trait can be a great benefit when characters maintain adjacency, but doing so is undesirable on large maps with varied objectives. To help, this rule allows GUARDIANS to provide soft cover at a distance:

GUARDIAN
Trait
Hostile characters treat this character as a piece of hard cover when attacking this character’s allies. This character still does not block line of sight.
#

wake up babe, new optional rule just dropped

opaque crescent
#

hmm

#

maybe this is how greater guardian should just function

vagrant grotto
#

nah

#

as discussed with @muted blaze earlier, Greater Guardian I think should let the guardian block Line of Sight in addition to the above

#

be an actual wall

opaque crescent
opaque crescent
vagrant grotto
#

yeah, i'd nix the soft cover adjacency thing probably

#

you're a wall, be a wall, be THE wall

opaque crescent
vagrant grotto
# opaque crescent this still up to date? (obviously sans Howler which I imagine is nowhere near re...

yes-ish, but many things are in v1.17 limbo (I blame @muted blaze for asking for Sitrep stuff when I otherwise have a decent set of changes videogames)

If you want, you can build a provisional release off main with yarn build here: https://github.com/msprijatelj/prototype-pattern-groups-data

GitHub
GitHub - msprijatelj/prototype-pattern-groups-data: LCP data for Pr...

LCP data for Prototype Pattern Groups, an experimental NPC mech supplement for Lancer. - msprijatelj/prototype-pattern-groups-data

opaque crescent
#

I think I also asked for Sitrep codification joyous

vagrant grotto
#

WIP Changelog:

# 1.17.0

## NPC Classes

### Anchor

#### Newtonian Amplifier

- Change to affect both allies and hostiles.
- Clarify that characters in or above the area are affected.

### Ghost

#### Quantum Bond

- Clarify that the Ghost becomes tangible in the nearest free space after the bond ends.

#### Ghastly Vigor

- Clarify that the difficulty to tech attacks persists as long as the Ghost's target remains Bolstered.

#### String Theory Marionette

- Add 1 Heat (Self) tag.
- Allow bonded character to choose to Boost or Hide instead of Skirmish or Quick Tech.

### Kensei

#### Kensei Tactics

- Revise to clarify that the Kensei intends to discourage opponents from remaining nearby through threat of its sword.

#### Gaussian Blur

- Change so that the Kensei may move up to its Speed, instead of its maximum speed.

### Knight

#### Knight Stats

- Increase HP from 15/20/25 to 18/22/26.

### Napalm

#### Firefly Drone

- Change from Recharge 5+ to Limited 1 (I swear this is the last time).
- Change so the fire trail dissipates when the drone is destroyed.

### Occultist

#### Diviner's Darts

- Reword to clarify that each attack allows a Drone to move.
- Limit movement to Drones that lack innate movement (e.g. Hound Missiles and Hydra Drones).

#### Lead Astray

- Reduce attack bonus from +2/+4/+6 to +1/+2/+3.
- Clarify that the Drone can be recalled by the owner to end the effect.

### Vulture

#### Aggressive Refabrication (Ultra)

- Remove additional 2 Heat cost.
- Reword so that the weapon destruction works like System Trauma from the Lancer Core Book.
# 
## Templates

### Brigand

#### Surgekiller

- Change from inflicting 2 Heat on critical hits to 1 Heat on weapon attack hits.

### Faster

- New template, for use with the "No Split Movement" optional rule. Increases an NPC's Speed by 1.

### Prototype

#### AUNTIE-Augmented Minigun

- Add Ordnance tag.
- Add +1 Difficulty to attacks.
- Reword so that the free action must be taken on the same turn after attacking with this weapon.

#### Antigravity Uppercut

- Increase Recharge from 5 to 6.
- Reword to use "they" instead of "it" when referring to the target.

#### Chain Surge

- Add AP to damage.

#### Doomscroll

- Fix typo; the system only inflicts checks, not saves.

## Optional Rules

### Actions

#### Area Search

- Remove line of sight requirement.

#### No Split Moves

- New optional rule! Forbid splitting up movement with actions, but increase base Speed of all characters by 1.

### Mech Statistics

#### Brisk Frames

- New rule! Set minimum base Speed for all player frames to 3.

#### Extra Repairs

- Moved to Mech Statistics section.

#### Sensible Sensors

- New rule! Set minimum base Sensors for all player frames to 5.

#### Covering Guardian

- New rule! Guardian instead makes hostiles treat the Guardian as hard cover, with the implication that it provides soft cover for non-adjacent allies behind them.
vagrant grotto
#

So yeah the list you linked is still up to date

If anything, AUNTIE is much more reasonable now with Ordnance and Inaccurate

#

Happy to get feedback on optional rules but they're lower on the priority list

#

The "no split moves" rule is the one I'd anticipate fucking up a game the most

#

everything else I added, I'd be surprised if it broke anything

vagrant grotto
#

I'm moving the Retreat rules to the appendix for now, I'm instead making the initial page of Modular Objectives cover the shared "statistics" of all the modular objectives, and each objective will state how it changes the baseline.

placid glacier
vagrant grotto
#

Hell I’d even consider dumping HoG altogether

#

Lot of it is trying to “patch up” defender options that I’d just solve by making the existing talents better

opaque crescent
#

speaking of talents, this came up in last night's playtest for a different homebrew after the feedback was done there: what's the plan for Empath 2 (if there is any)

vagrant grotto
#

I thought I made one

#

Guess not lol

#

Must’ve been on the server somewhere

opaque crescent
#

yeah lol

#

went to go check my lcp version to make sure i wasn't talking out my ass

vagrant grotto
#

Why is rank 2 even structure and overheating, what does that have to do with Empath

#

There we go, past me was a genius

#

Do that

muted blaze
steel apex
vagrant grotto
#

Wait it’s immune to resistances?

#

I didn’t see that when I looked it up

#

I saw that it’s a Ranged weapon type, and the ignoring engagement + allies rule

#

And I was legitimately planning on including it in an appendix, it’s a valid issue

steel apex
#

TYPE based resistance

#

it's not kinetic, explosive, energy, or burn

#

Oh wait, did that make it into the final wallflower draft?

vagrant grotto
#

I’m a little lost, memetic isn’t a damage type

steel apex
#

Lemme check, at one point "memetic" was both a weapon and damage type

#

I haven't messed with eidolons in a minute

#

Ah yeah, looks like it's just a weapon type now

dapper goblet
#

Having just been leafing through eidolon stuff i do not think memetic is a damage type

steel apex
#

Yeah nah I was misremembering

dapper goblet
#

Fair nuff

vagrant grotto
#

Legitimately I once used to think it was a damage type so like, can’t blame the confusion

steel apex
#

Some stuff changed here and there, like how the barbarossa used to have the apocalypse rail be its own weapon statblock with unique typing as well

#

This goes to show about how much I've paid attention to eidolons tbh

dapper goblet
#

Still miss some of the old nhp names, though i know why they were changed.

steel apex
#

Memetic's a weird one since it really only ever got used with Eidolons. I suppose it makes sense given that they come with adds by default and so it's probably a safety measure to avoid friendly fire given that Shards are integral to how a lot of layers are meant to function

#

I think putting in a sidebar/appendix is fine, because I'm not sure how many people are even aware of it at this point

tame wharf
#

lol. lmao.

Screenshot_2026-01-28_185614.png
vagrant grotto
#

lol

viral bobcat
#

Many such cases

mild trail
#

it do be like that

ashen crown
#

Moving the discussion over here, but do you think it’d be better if it was a save instead of a Tech Attack? Less weird talent interactions and it ties into Gorgon’s high save target better

#

The effect not the trigger- I understand removing the save element of the trigger to make things simpler

south cypress
vagrant grotto
#

I kinda wanted to add a neat lil tech attack thing to a Horus license that otherwise lacks it but sure

#

Also: I think I stand by my later adjustment of “prime with a quick then interrupt with a Jam/impair until end of the current turn”

dapper goblet
#

Yeah scorpion has always stood out to me on power level. Much needed and smart adjustment that keeps it in line with gorgon systems

vagrant grotto
#

It just needed

  1. Broader coverage
  2. More texture in targeting
  3. Limits on use
  4. Tied to Reactions
#

Sometimes I look at Gorgon and think Tom ran out of ideas while designing it

#

Like if I were gonna scrap something I’d scrap monitor module and make something more interesting

#

Move Vorpal down to LL2 if necessary

#

Because you only have so many reactions and like, Vorpal and Monitor and Scylla are all doing the same thing with very teeny tiny differences

#

I am once again considering dumping the current version of jury rigged for a Scan-centric vulnerability version

#

I think I’m gonna do it

vagrant grotto
#

This likely is for a blog post more so than PPG but here

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
#

Yep true facts, imma do the save thing instead if anything

ashen crown
# vagrant grotto

The max modifiers for Loyalty rolls, at least for NHPs, probably need to exceed +6 in order to reliably succeed and not make Cascade much higher than 5% at max loyalty

#

As like. A thought.

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
ashen crown
#

Ahh okay- imo I’d not make the consequence of Cascades/failed loyalty checks not “lose control of your mech” in that case. If it’s gonna come up more frequently the consequence shouldn’t be so debilitating

ashen crown
vagrant grotto
#

Which is to say: get better at a specific thing, and do basically only that thing

ashen crown
#

Ohh- honestly if you’re gonna write up something similar to your idea for RPV, you could probably add “this is a good system for making RPV NPCs too” prolly

vagrant grotto
#

Which is probably adjacent to what you installed the NHP for anyway

ashen crown
#

Think you’ll write up something for each NHP class, or will you just write guidelines for that?

vagrant grotto
#

No idea

ashen crown
#

I personally am doing a “bespoke cascade behavior” doc too but that’s been collecting dust untouched for months

vagrant grotto
#

Something generic would be good for homebrew proofing

#

Or like, independent of NHP or dependent on temperament

#

But I don’t know

#

This was back of the napkin work

ashen crown
#

I feel like Gorgon being an aggressive defender is good, but it’s only passive reaction tool in the kit is Vorpal, plus it still needs more help actually defending, so a passive LL3 tool would be nice.

#

As is over half of its license requires initial setup which makes it difficult to work with because it forces you to be very preoccupied with setup

#

To be fair Gunslinger is a good Scylla Talent due to I Kill With My Heart + low damage numbers per attack making it so that damage being halved is a less big deal (half of 3 is still 2 for example)

#

However, idk if that’s something that necessarily should be encouraged

tame wharf
#

And I think I made it good as well

vagrant grotto
#

It’s honestly kinda funny to me that like, so many reactions require quick actions to prime, when the primary value of the reaction is that you can do it off turn outside of the typical action economy

#

Like sure you can prime your reaction with a quick, but is it actually more effective than Shooting Gun Now

#

or Moving Towards Buddy Now

#

The main way monitor and Scylla “break” the action economy is avoiding the duplicate action restriction, like Heavy Gunner and Archers

#

Which means that unless you’re overcharging, it’s probably worse to double up on priming stuff instead of just doing the equivalent quick action

vagrant grotto
#

There’s times where Gorgon license stuff seems to have reactions just for the sake of having lots of reactions lol, to justify its Gaze passive

ashen crown
#

I mean the Gaze passive is more about comboing reactions than anything

#

The problem is half the reaction combos are just the same thing twice

#

Mimic Mesh seems to be the key in making reaction combos but in practice it just doesn’t work like that

#

Because the setup is just so expensive + it triggering enough times to be significant means your ally is probably getting really hammered

#

Mimic Mesh isn’t bad or needs fixing imo, it’s just how it happens to work out where it doesn’t come up as much as you’d expect it to

vagrant grotto
#

Yeah no why mimic mesh and Scylla when you can boost and skirmish , which is the same if not better than getting each to proc twice

ashen crown
#

The main appeal I’ve heard of for Mimic Mesh is “to be in two places at once.” Stand next to one Ally while Scylla’d (or just loaded on Vorpals), then mimic mesh a friend that’s further away so if they get targeted you can rush to them to assist instead

vagrant grotto
#

Like the biggest benefit is low committal to positioning

ashen crown
#

Yeah that exactly

vagrant grotto
#

But as soon as you move, you’ve committed

#

Plus you have to commit to an ally anyway

ashen crown
#

I still think Mimic Mesh is good and has value tho, it’s just niche

vagrant grotto
#

If mimic mesh worked like avenger it would be much more interesting

ashen crown
#

Move toward enemies not Allies?

vagrant grotto
#

And no QA

vagrant grotto
#

Like at some point why not just Prepare a Boost for better range and potentially better coverage (enemy takes hostile action against an ally > I boost)

ashen crown
#

If the Ally gets hit once it’s not a lot of movement, but if they get hit a lot then at that point it’s excessive

vagrant grotto
#

The tipping point of value is getting hostile’d twice in a round

ashen crown
#

At the very least it’s “any hostile action,” so stuff like Lock On triggers it but the movement being overkill still stands

vagrant grotto
#

At which point how valuable was the first reaction

ashen crown
#

I think one of the values is like. Repositioning for stuff like Guardian? But I don’t think that’s exactly how it works

vagrant grotto
#

Like again, I’d rather have something like Fearless Defender or Avenger Mimic Mesh with a lot more flexibility

ashen crown
#

And a limited number of uses per round?

#

Or limitless uses?

vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
ashen crown
#

I assumed so- for an Avenger limitless makes sense because it wants to stay near Allies not move away. For any PC? yeah you do not want that to be limitless.

vagrant grotto
#

1 big leap of movement 1/round is better than several wishy washy movements that leave you out of position in the meantime

#

And tbf for Avenger it has a range 5 limitation

ashen crown
#

There is that but PCs are a lot more capable of exploiting + circumventing + getting more value of it than NPCs

vagrant grotto
#

Are they though

#

Are they really

ashen crown
#

Put Avenger Mimic Mesh on a Balor, pair them with literally any Vanguard build, and I’d say so

vagrant grotto
#

Lancer sometimes feels like it’s trying to get all the players to play like MTG Johnnys while simultaneously being terrified of what combos a Johnny can wring out

ashen crown
#

Actually fair callout yeah

#

… wait a second Ace 1 is unlimited, and this is about as constrained

#

Nevermind actually it’s fine

muted blaze
#

Ok so I was gonna comment on some stuff that was talked about last night but I was tired so now I'm gonna talk about them now... Gorgon I don't really have much to add because I've not seen their gear in play enough nor the Gorgon itself in play either

But I gotta ask... Wtf is the point in the monitor module outside of Scylla back home? crylaughing

#

(rereading my words, sorry if this comes across as negative at all. It isn't meant to be at all)

Opinion on jury rigged and brigand... First off, I like the current jury rigged. I'm not everyone however and I don't know how many people share my opinion or if I'm in the minority but I wanted to say I like it how it is right now.

When I squint my eyes and imagine the fiction of prototype and anomaly I can see where their base traits come from:

  • prototype: this thing is using unknown parts and technology, a preliminary scan has granted you the basics but a full scan can analyse structural weapons
  • Anomaly: Preliminary scans have no idea what the fuck is going on, investigate further

Whereas brigand to me is the one that felt like I had to jump through the most hoops to get through and figure out why it's buffed on a scan. "This unit has structural weak points identified, a full identification will make defeating them easier"

This feels like, it's somewhat stepping on the toes prototype and doesn't really fit my headspace vibe for brigand. Where both prototype and anomaly feel like their fluff is "the unknown" so brigand feels very much like the opposite and doesn't fit with the vibe of the unknown so having it be required for scan feels more off to me, it feels like lock on can achieve a similar result for my scan explanation I came up with. It feels slightly pigeonholey in terms of design aspect as well (based solely of my vibes)

#

And for the co pilot stuff, for human pilots, I need to see how it's implemented further more or less. For NHPs I'm not the biggest fan, even if the lethality of a cascade is tuned down and turned into something more akin to Sekhmet protocols automation and flow chart. At best with a +6 a 20% cascade chance is massive and not something I'd ever want in my mech outside of technophile. Cascade already isn't the best mechanic having a 5% chance on structure to either do something bad or spend a turn and a half rebooting. I'd not be happy with the ability to be able to be unable to predict my turns up to 20% of the time or worse especially with a limited or 1/scene ability. It feels to me the best way to interact with this mechanic is to take technophile 3 which is already a thing which I think is flawed for reasons I don't need to get into here. There's also a weird narrative thing where structure can cause cascade 20% of the time to 45% of the time if you're at +0 loyalty and like... That has weird narrative implications around cascade imo... I can't comment about human loyalty checks but the reason I'm bringing it up about NHPs specifically is they already are unfortunately, due to how the game functions, licences and cost system points and potentially limited charges. So increasing their downsides or risk of failure when they already have various other risks and downsides. They tend to cost a lot of SP, you can only have 1 base and they have a 5% chance to cascade, etc

#

Despite saying these preliminary concerns, please tell me if I'm coming off as a downer or negative I desperately don't want it to be seen that way, I'm still excited to see them in play. I'd genuinely love to see myself proven wrong

#

You've proven me wrong with overcharge rerolls before where I was an avid overcharge fan until I reminded myself what they were like last week 😛

#

God, I need to stop complaining about things 😔

#

In other news I had a fun idea for more PPG playtest but then I remembered I have a fuck ton of my own stuff I should be playtesting 😭

vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

Oops all anomalies, basically like I did last time with prototypes and stress tested how they worked en masse

#

Because that hasn't actually been done with anomalies yet 😛

#

Test some of the quirkier optionals that don't require a campaign setting just to see how they actually fare in practice

vagrant grotto
#

As for Brigand, yeah it’s not as “imperative” to scan them like Anomaly or the like. You got the flavor right though, seeing how shoddily it’s put together gets you an advantage

vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
muted blaze
#

And then I do it again

#

Wait

#

Ok time stop isn't too egregious. I realised a whole opfor can have it crylaughing but that ain't actually too bad just funny

vagrant grotto
#

alright I finally collected the offhand houserules I haven't put into a release yet

it includes Stortebeker, Empath 2, //SCORPION, ASURA, Arc Projector, and Zheng "Juggernaut" Core Power

#

if I forgot anything recently lemme know

#

I've been dropping a lot of offhand stuff here and there

muted blaze
#

What's the asura change?

#

👀

vagrant grotto
#

1 quick instead of 2quick/1full

#

in line with my OC changes

#

action economy must be tightly regulated

muted blaze
#

Any lessened limitations? Still 1/scene and limited same as before?

vagrant grotto
#

probably drop Limited and leave it 1/scene only

#

that's what Maria does and it makes sense

#

don't need folks playing with the limited charges in weird ways, really

muted blaze
#

Like limited 1 makes a difference anyway if you have 3 levels into Sherman you probably have 5 billion eng

#

I guess the hardest hit is Gilg tbh

#

But that sounds funky and cool

#

Still follows dupe action limits (as it should) I presume

vagrant grotto
#

Naturally

umbral sluice
muted blaze
#

More the loadout die

cosmic bluff
#

I heard there was playtesting
Gimme stuff to break

vagrant grotto
vagrant grotto
#

Priority list ^

cosmic bluff
#

pfffft

#

Put that on a class with a very low save

#

also I would never take forced obscelecense that would ruin peoples fun

#

Nor timestop

#

for entropic corrosion 2d3 is a lot

#

particularly by dealing negative armour

#

most frames have at most 1 and no way of getting more

tame wharf
#

I'd take Timestop on my end because in my head, there'd be only one Anomaly like a raid boss or something

ashen crown
tame wharf
#

if theres 6, I wouldnt

ashen crown
#

Well y’all should probably not be giving the same Anomaly trait to every anomaly in the Sitrep

vagrant grotto