Okay I think I have my last three build ideas down pat, now I just need to find appropriate drip
#Elden Ring (DLC hype room)
tropic stream
tropic stream
poison used to suck, no?
obtuse halo
It was fine, just overshadowed by Rot
it's still overshadowed by Rot, nothing's really changed. The only real secret to poison is Status = Arcane build is wisdom that will fail you here because poison is pretty easy to apply and Arcane only helps with application
tropic stream
fair nuff
I was planning on my arcane build being a pretty traditional bleed one anyways lol
obtuse halo
I used tons of poison on bow-only though because you need all the damage you can get for bows and Serpent Arrows can be purchased in unlimited Quantity
which is a godsend, farming souls and buying stocks is ten million percent better than farming crafting mats
If you actually want to focus a poison build though, you want: 1. Kindred of Rot Exultation and 2. either Poison Moth Flight or Poison Flower Blooms Twice as a payoff tool
frozen olive
fair nuff
obtuse halo
I have had quite a bit of invader success with my Snake Lady meme build
frozen olive
i was matching the armor mostly to the helmet since it's so shiny
obtuse halo
Who used a Heavy Serpent-God Curved Sword (it's a strength build) with Poison Moth Flight + the Coil Shield
Set up poison with the coil shield, then land poison moth flight with the kindred of rot buff for a crapton of spike damage
I have absolutely "oneshot" people with the one-two combo
(you can do more damage with the addition of mushroom crown but I make sacrifices for Drip)
tropic stream
I think I've figured out my martial arts build
dane's footwork, basically rags for the armor
blue dancer, two headed turtle, dragoncrest, and cracked stone talismans
frozen olive
wondering if it's wise to rush Divine Beast Dancing Lion with one scadutree fragment
oh i found a second fragment
lets fucking send it
oh, i need two to level it up 😔
actually, i probably won't need to grab all the fragments this time around
since i'm not going to 1v1 PCR
60/60 dex/str quality Flamberge Savage Lions Claw goes kinda fucking hard
stupid horned warriors
real shadow
frozen olive
Divine Beast Dancing Aggro bruh
damn
savage lions claw probably isn't the move for bosses
yeah Savage Lions Claw is doing big fuck off damage but it also just, is not something i can hit lmao
ok Blood Tax is actually kind of cracked on Flamberge
lose out on a bit of damage from not having quality but bleed procs make up for it
i've been playing too much monster hunter
i'm used to actually dodging when i press the dodge button and not dying whenever i lie on the floor
frozen olive
why does the grab have that much range
i won
sent that thing back to the higher sphere
that's one more boss on the list
outer flint
i'm used to actually dodging when i press the dodge button and not dying wheneve...
lmaoo
last week i was playing great katana against dancing lion and i tried to foresight slash the 720 breath attack
😭
frozen olive
lmao
tropic stream
I just realized something funny I did on accident
I made a faith based fire build
and an int based cold build
the fire build uses a curved greatsword, and the cold build uses a normal greatsword
funny
median rock
it melted and warped a little 😔
proven cloak
faith based fire curved greatsword
close enough, welcome back Carthus Duelist
tropic stream
lol
I still need a tenth build...
so far I have int/fth, a quality build, a strength build, a dex build, dex/int, cold int build, a fire faith build, a general faith build, and a bleed dryleaf arts build
lilac condor
Str/int?
Cogito ergo bonk
Although the int requirements on stuff like the ruins greatsword are low enough that most strength builds can make it work
outer flint
magic weapon bonk
tropic stream
Str/int?
eeeeehhhh the full int build is kinda already doing that
it's a barbarian fit with the DMGS
and I don't wanna introduce an imbalance of int vs fth
hmm
Well the int build with the dmgs is kind of a cold specialized build, might do to build a more general int caster
proven cloak
Str / Arc?
either one of the Big Bleeders or Marais or w/e
oh the dryleaf was bleed
tropic stream
I'm running out of gimmicks <XD
maybe some sort of powerstance build
none of these builds are dual wielding (outside of a weapon and a catalyst)
I'm a fucking moron the int/fth is using rellana's
(Also jesus all my builds use dragoncrest greatshield)
oh except my fire build
outer flint
it is super nice to have
i want to mess around with a caster build someday
i could just slot some miracles into my dex character and move 20 points from dex to get 60/56
tropic stream
i want to mess around with a caster build someday
it's fun!
that's why half my builds can cast
tropic stream
I might do a str/fth to compliment my dex/int
outer flint
although it was mostly
tropic stream
the builds are not ~ balanced ~
tropic stream
in terms of casting stat
outer flint
I didn't really use too many offensive miracles
median rock
so far I have int/fth, a quality build, a strength build, a dex build, dex/int, ...
poison flower blooms twice arcane build
poison infusion venomous fang is fun for that. not optimal damage for the weapon (that's occult or bleed), but you get the fun 90s deadly poison effect, and can purge it with poison flower blooms twice for the chunk damage when its near the end
obtuse halo
Int-Arc build. Enjoy your giant bubbles
median rock
but the other fun part is, strangely enough, poison flower can go on any melee weapon. it's not limited to like, light weapons. so you can do this with anything from antspur (for the rot) to any infusable colossal. zwei is funny
obtuse halo
I do wish there was a little more reason to actually combine those two, but the bubbles are fun
tropic stream
drip of the planned str/fth build
I apparently have a real talent for 'barbarian' fits lol
Quality and Str/Int builds
obtuse halo
oh man. I hadn't even considered the messmer soldier shield as finally a good round shield
I was using a black leather shield on my shieldmaiden type and just relying on parries
tropic stream
oof lol
obtuse halo
For barbarian fits, my favorite is still my Int/Arc mage, I was going for more of a D&D druid feel
obtuse halo
as a sidenote, axe ripostes go insanely hard every time for some reason
glossy delta
I like the smithscript shield, both because its a small roundshield with fairly respectable guard stats but also because its weapon art is crazy
My strength build is currently rocking smithscript shield + messmer axe
frail sky
I was using a black leather shield on my shieldmaiden type and just relying on p...
The black leather shield looks pretty great tbh
obtuse halo
I love snake lady too
'how much snake theme can I cram onto one character and have it still mechanically make sense'
frail sky
A lot as it turns out
obtuse halo
coil shield is great actually
I would have thought it was a meme but it actually does numbers in pvp
it has a tricky hitbox to dodge (or so it seems, people always seem to flub it) and I can frequently land poison moth flight while people are distracted fishing for a Bolus
tropic stream
So, you've decided you wanna make a strength faith build
congrats
now you need an ancient somber stone and a normal ancient stone
good luck fucking finding one
(this is me, kicking myself)
obtuse halo
well, there's a pretty easy guaranteed ancient somber you can get early
tropic stream
I likely have used it but shoot
obtuse halo
Ah it's the one at Moghwyn Dynasty Mausoleum
if you've already used it you've already used it
tropic stream
Oh yeah I've nabbed that bih
obtuse halo
it's notable that you can grab it super early though
without needing to fight anything too problematic
tropic stream
but yeah I need to upgrade the beastclaw hammer and the clawmark seal
obtuse halo
actually what's stupid is i couldn't grab it on snake lady because I wanted to keep the Dragon Communion Eyes
and you get the blood red eyes from that quest, which overrides the slitted pupils
she needs to look like a poorly-disguised yuan-ti for the bit
even if the people i'm invading will never be able to tell
I even gave her visible green scaly patches in the editor
outer flint
does the editor only allow you to toggle your latest eyes, instead of selecting which ones you've had?
tropic stream
I do actually know where to find a somber stone
I just need to kill two fucking night cavalry aaaaaaaaaaaaaa I hate it
light bridge
drip of the planned str/fth build
The Unknown
tropic stream
?
light bridge
The character from that horrible Willy Wonka thing.
tropic stream
~~I just need to kill two *fucking* night cavalry aaaaaaaaaaaaaa I hate it~~
first tried thank you messmer's axe very cool
light bridge
Fit looks amazing I must say
tropic stream
aww thank you
outer flint
the embrace of messmer's axe...
tropic stream
the embrace of messmer's axe...
quality build fuckin go brrrrrt
amended quality build drip
Barbarian King Time
obtuse halo
does the editor only allow you to toggle your latest eyes, instead of selecting ...
It's not even latest, there's a strict priority list and you can only toggle altered eyes on or off
Frenzied Flame Eyes always take precedence over Blood Eyes always take precedence over Dragon Eyes
outer flint
:(
dang,,
i guess if you really wanted that stone you could take the consecrated snowfield teleporter 😭
obtuse halo
yeah that would be the way to do it eventually
this locks off low level access though
obtuse halo
amended quality build drip
Barbarian King Time
What helmet is that? Looks great
I love the Kaidan chest + those boots too, got that nice scale continuity
tropic stream
What helmet is that? Looks great
Fang Helm
Which is one of those rly cool pieces that gets overshadowed in its own set
since its alternative is the Pelt of Ralva
obtuse halo
aha yeah that tracks
The Unknown fit looks good but like many elden ring fits I hate that it's barefoot lol
even the fur boots from the Ancestral Followers come with sandals why are so many people barefoot 😭
tropic stream
I mean for the str/fth it's for a whole like
weirdly ethereal vibe also lended by the zamor mask
on my dex build it's cuz she's weird
obtuse halo
lol fair enough
tropic stream
and on my arcane build it's cuz he's very weird
obtuse halo
I actually really like the Zamor chest piece but it can be tricky to match with stuff
atomic plinth
Yeah, that burnished silver color is really hard to match with
proven cloak
I'd love so many of the medium armors more if I could remove the shield-crests on the chestpiece
its just a little goofy, esp when two-handing gets involved
obtuse halo
a few headpieces do!
inconvenient if you don't want to use one of those though
offhand I think the red and blue hoods + confessor hood and nox monk hood do
tropic stream
okay...
I have 11 maxed somber weapons
1 I can't access (sorry millicent)
Now I just need to figure out which are the two I don't have and can get
I think one I don't have yet is from anastasia
Did I just fuckin lose two of them somehow?
tropic stream
Drip Dump Time
Characters are as follows; Moonsword Elexi (Int/Fth), Glintsworn Taya (Dex/Int), Hallowbeast Alle (Str/Fth), Wandering Sybil (Fth), High Moon Gurhal (Int), Fellflame Erza (Fth), Warlord Striyn (Str/Dex), Myth-Hunter Hern (Str), Swordstress Naia (Dex), Bloodfist Enbrus (Arc)
proven cloak
4th is crazy good 👀
tropic stream
Thank you!
outer flint
what’s the set for the 2nd last?
tropic stream
what’s the set for the 2nd last?
fia's hood, ansbach's attire, ansbach's machettes, sanguine noble waistcloth
languid tiger
oh, that's ansbach's? huh
tropic stream
ye
frail sky
Consider: you will get tears
obtuse halo
I just used pest threads to make it quick hunting furnace golems
get on torrent, spam pest threads targeting whichever leg is further from me so it hopefully hits twice
gets a stagger relatively quick and does enough actual damage that one critical should be enough
outer flint
get on torrent, spam pest threads targeting whichever leg is further from me so ...
ooh that's smart
i did some carian slicer spam when i was on my int build
😩
tropic stream
all furnace golems terminated
proven cloak
Do I wanna hunt all the fuckin furnace golems before I ng+...
Consider: It will be worse if you NG+ and then decide you want the tears
tropic stream
I mean they are all now dead lol
languid tiger
atomic plinth
That is straight up just a charge blade
tropic stream
also these devs like goldlewis
languid tiger
tragically
tropic stream
I'm wondering if my talisman setups for my builds are like
idk too basic and not catering to the build enough?
I think I wanna put Godfrey icon on my cold build for ice storm and the dmgs projectiles
tropic stream
no swinging it from the chains sadly 😔
In this-
kind garden
I have a proposal for the mounted moveset
languid tiger
based and real
vestal night
I have a proposal for the mounted moveset
Mourn, Lament, and Despair
proven cloak
also these devs like goldlewis
I will now play the mod
my Goat ❗
the lighting in this mod is really funny
"how do we make it seem more like gothic victorian england"
"remove the sun"
proven cloak
raw physical power
burial-based aesthetic
heavy use of spiraling motions
I mean
he basically already fits the setting!
outer flint
true...
tropic stream
For a blood build, should my arcane be about even with say, Dex?
tropic stream
for dryleaf arts it seems an even 60/60 is good
obtuse halo
ah yeah with blood affinity on a non bleeding weapon you'll typically get similar arc scaling to the dex scaling
actually it's lower than that but details
median rock
iirc for blood on non bleeding weapons, after ~60 arcane it's not worth leveling until you've got nearly 99 in the other stat. and they're mostly even until that point
depends on the exact weapon but the bleed scaling is super front loaded, even compared to the damage scaling
proven cloak
theres breakpoints for arcane
you want to hit the triggers that make it take one less swing to trigger bleed
the damage scaling is less important than those specific points
median rock
i'm pretty sure most of those breakpoints stop mattering in NG+, at least on most bosses
most bosses aren't going to be dead by the 2nd bleed, and you're going to have to hit them with damage anyway
tropic stream
my bleed and int/faith builds have both brought down godrick in ng+ now
tropic stream
oh dude the merchant in the hold keeps all the like
'convenience purchase' bell bearings in ng+?
awesome
obtuse halo
It was added in a patch about two days after the first time I said "okay let's try NG+" and was mad about it
it was not retroactive
obtuse halo
On my int/faith build I tended to lean on a lot of the usual suspects, but it's a good excuse to use Magma Shot early
which is a very underrated spell
it's more interesting on a relatively pure sorcerer as a source of Fire damage from your staff if you can swing the 10 faith for it, but it's solid on a split build too
at high levels my main workhorse spell was Discus of Light, but I also fairly frequently used Black Flame, Knight's Lightning Spear, Ancient Death Rancor, and Night Comet
One new spell from the DLC I think is very underrated is Rings of Spectral Light
median rock
'convenience purchase' bell bearings in ng+?
the list for kept bell bearings is everything that's not an NPC bell bearing
obtuse halo
it doesn't do incredible damage but it has extremely long range and good tracking
and it technically deals frostbite too lol
median rock
it doesn't do incredible damage but it has extremely long range and good trackin...
the damage is pretty decent with godfrey icon + gravebird hat, though its not the most FP efficient spell
tropic stream
On my int/faith build I tended to lean on a lot of the usual suspects, but it's ...
currently my list is night comet, ADR, Moonblade, Carian Phalanx, Microcosm, Fall Upon Them, Black Flame, Multilayered Ring, Pest Thread Spears, and KLS
I think I wanna put some buffs in there cuz I'm running rellana's twin blades
so fgms sounds good
I might do magma shot instead of multilayered and replace fall upon them with fgms
obtuse halo
Pest Thread Spears is a good one to add yeah
I did assume you were starting a new game, magma shot was tuned more for early/midgame. it might fall off a little this late
Still a very underrated spell though
tropic stream
(I do have Roiling as well...)
fuckit I'm doing a toxic buff rotation as this spellswords first set
obtuse halo
oh yeah buffs. I didn't mention buffs because I just kinda take those for granted on any build with the faith for them
frozen olive
thinking about PCR again
his theme is so hype i want to go fight him again
honestly i'm still in awe of the fight even so long later
i think the feeling of awe it invokes is only matched for me within Fromsofts catalogue that i've played by SSI
frozen olive
hopped on to fight him again but my inputs are gone after playing so much monhun
tropic stream
F
frozen olive
Got to phase two consistently but ya dude got hands
tropic stream
Rya quest good ending acquired
frozen olive
nice
proven cloak
his theme is so hype i want to go fight him again
it really does feel like a burgeoning divinity, yeah
when those church bells kick in? 
I like how hard they went into Miquella-as-light
well, maybe not in terms of fx
but the way he contrasts ranni's dark age? the way the charm is woven into the captivating nature of light, like with the full moon or the irises of grace?
I dig it
frozen olive
Miquella truly is the most fearsome of the rune bearers
proven cloak
Radahn truly is the most bear of the great runers
proven cloak
oooo
lots of fun little details in these that the 360p photos people were taking earlier didn't entirely show
like the funky ghost tree sprouting from a literal beam of light from heaven
or a new golden-ripple effect to morgott's slams that reminds me of the AoW for Ordovis + Devonia
or the way he purposefully summons the geyser-explosions, and has his sword encased in bloodflame, which probably both represent about the same thing
leaning more on his nature for strength
and its pretty sick to see Morgott dual wield a dirty-red and bright-gold sword at the same time, feels like very direct color symbolism given how often gold-and-red are contrasted
he's fucking you up with the whole damn shebang. pulling out every aspect to beat you to death.
idk if there will be any main plot to really sink into but mmmmmm
motifs
😋
real shadow
frozen olive
oh fuck yeah
real shadow
frozen olive
i still think Mohg, Lord of Blood was the best one CthulhuSeeker did
this shit slaps unreasonably
real shadow
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wy5_61tpsQ I dunno, Radahn's an all-time banger.
frozen olive
lemme give it a swing
ngl
don't really like it
it kind of
loses all coherence if that makes sense
i can't hear any Radahn in it
maybe i need to listen to Radahns theme again before i give it a swing but with other synthwave arrangements, particularly Mohgs, i can immediately hear the original in it
nevermind, i think i just find Starscourge Radahns theme to be sort of incoherent
oh it does come out a bit there in the latter half
nah i'm tweaking, it's fine, i'm just so used to PCR's theme i expect a bit more oomph from Starscourge
really forgot how long that theme is and how late the military style chanting comes in
i think i just prefer more bombastic themes
real shadow
Starscourge kinda gets lost in the fight itself, I feel.
frozen olive
yeah
that makes sense
it doesn't really take presence over Radahn being a fucking WMD of a guy
real shadow
You end up spending a lot of time going OH NO, ARROWS and trying not to get swatted away like a fly.
frozen olive
compared to PCR's theme which is just like
holy SHIT
the theme is just pure power just as much as the actual fight
which is something i really like about The Promised Consort as well as Divine Beast Dancing Lion
both themes that take up a lot of space and very strongly give you the sense for what their boss is about
Starscourge Radahn(the theme) takes a hella backseat
Divine Beast Dancing Lion is like, perfect set dressing for the very whimsical and cultural ideas behind the boss
whereas The Promised Consort makes you perfectly aware of the absolute danger you are in and the ridiculous might of the boss you are about to face
perfectly conveys the martial might and sheer strength of character of PCR
i certainly prefer the DLC themes for very strongly illustrating the story that they are connected to and being bombastic and taking space
The Final Battle is similarly great for this
the first half illustrating your battle with Radagon perfectly and the second half giving you this sense of ethereal awe for the Elden Beast
the bombastic singing and strong instruments for the essentially living god and king of the world that you face in battle
and the slowly rising piano and ethereal singing of the beast sent from the stars that you face after
I suppose it is somewhat fitting for that martial aspect to be lost in the larger part of Starscourges theme on account of Radahns state during that fight
atomic plinth
obtuse halo
This is beautiful, thank you for sharing
frozen olive
Lmao
Incredible
Man
I wih i could re-experience Elden Ring and SOTE
Going through SOTE on launch was genuinely kinda magical
3 straight days of just pure gaming
old brook
and it was dense/weird enough that everyone was discovering entirely different nonsense
'what do you mean, shrieking naked wolfman'
frozen olive
Me and my friend did literally nothing but play SOTE for those three days
I think i slept maybe 8-10 hours total between them
Prolly closer to 6-7 hours
We finecombed the entire dlc and found basically everything there was to find in that time
No guides, no vids, just pure exploration
Second most intense gaming i've ever done
Ds3 basegame takes the cake, since i played that nonstop for a week
Then it was like, 3 or so days more after that for the dlc's
glossy delta
I wih i could re-experience Elden Ring and SOTE
My first elden ring playthrough was fucking nuts
I stumbled into Frenzied Flame Proscription entirely by chance as soon as a I got into leyndell and got myself lord of frenzy'd
And went through the rest of the game pursuing Miquella's Needle in a period of time where the guides were not yet extant
signal harness
that rules
frozen olive
Neat
proven cloak
i certainly prefer the DLC themes for very strongly illustrating the story that ...
I like Metyr's quite a bit for not having music in the second half
its good wordless storytelling
a heavenly riff that corrupts each time it plays, until its just distant static
or how Midra's theme has those dark, dramatic strings while also fitting the unnerving grace he moves with
you know and then theres Gaius
💀
||his ass had to be a last minute model re-use of what would've been a miniboss enemy.||
old brook
Gaius and PCR.. the purple boys just didn't do it for me, but everything else was pristine
old brook
I think outside that my only boss-gripe is Midra could have used like 30% more HP or so
glossy delta
TBH the only part of Gaius I dislike is that he was just in the middle of a field off the beaten path
old brook
I'd like him a lot more if he was only the second half of his fight
glossy delta
You know what would have been a REAL cool place for him
||Where the Golden Hippo is in Shadow Keep||
old brook
The first is too much charging and pigslaps
glossy delta
Both were as elder brothers to the lion, and both were cursed from birth. In spite of, or perhaps because of this very reason, Gaius was both Messmer's friend and the leader of his men.
Put him in Shadow Keep!
proven cloak
only if you replace the Gaius fight with a duo hippo gank boss
outer flint
frail sky
He needs to go to the dentist
outer flint
he's eaten many a low vigor host
proven cloak
look those teeth are perfectly healthy
if they weren't crooked in every direction how could you tell they possessed the vitality of life itself
proven cloak
I think outside that my only boss-gripe is Midra could have used like 30% more H...
the funny part is how he clears every other boss already in raw-hp numbers
its just his resists are pretty bad
obtuse halo
Midra's resists should be randomized per savefile, because chaos
proven cloak
gains more resist the more damage he takes
last 1/4th of the healthbar is half his hp
very... enduring
obtuse halo
Duo Hippo Gank Boss, but then when you slay them you get a mysterious speech from somewhere offscreen and the fog wall doesn't go down...and finally gaius rolls in
outer flint
... with a hippo-resurrecting magic spell
glossy delta
in that tiny arena lmfao
tbh I use less than a quarter of the arena fighting gaius anyway
That may be because I firmly believe using Torrent in a boss fight ever is a waste of time though
obtuse halo
There are some cases where using Torrent in a boss fight makes sense but usually only for some short term mobility. The Tarnished is Mounted Infantry, not Cavalry
outer flint
obtuse halo
and yeah Gaius is not one of them
glossy delta
There are some cases where using Torrent in a boss fight makes sense but usually...
This is admittedly true
Using torrent as a supersprint to like, get back close to the dragon is usually decent
obtuse halo
He's not a fight that likes to run away from you, nor is torrent sufficient to get space from the boss
Yeah Dragons are one of the cases where torrent can clearly be very helpful
languid tiger
tbh I use less than a quarter of the arena fighting gaius anyway
That may be bec...
i mean yeah, just block him
obtuse halo
both to chase the boss when it decides to go a mile away and also for the speed to avoid that big side to side firebreath swipe (when you're too far away to close in before the arc reaches you)
outer flint
Yeah Dragons are one of the cases where torrent can clearly be very helpful
definitely holy crap
ride 10 seconds to poke at feet for 25 seconds
it's peak...
proven cloak
tbh I use less than a quarter of the arena fighting gaius anyway
That may be bec...
I honestly find him much harder on horse
but I'm not really good at using torrent either way tbh
maybe if I didn't already get used to how to fight dragons with the feet-poke method in all the other games
obtuse halo
I find every boss harder on horse lol
horse is bad for fighting on tbh
some people swear by it, and they baffle me
mounted combat is awkward and you can't really dodge without getting off the horse
languid tiger
it's probably because it's lower-commitment
you swing by and r1 once
so for people that aren't comfortable with/capable of dodging or blocking confidently, it lets them move while attacking
i've never understood it, but that's my assumption
obtuse halo
okay I lied, there is one boss that's probably easiest to bully on horseback - Tibia Mariner
languid tiger
oh, i can see that
obtuse halo
not that tibia mariner is hard but you can very safely chip at it on a horse and the only attacks it has that matter are highly telegraphed aoes that a horse makes it easy to escape from
and you can kind of kite its adds away from it if you're moving a lot
languid tiger
i usually just beat em up in melee, but fair
obtuse halo
yeah, again, tibia mariner isn't really hard
but Torrent does particularly effectively bully it
light bridge
Return to darkwraith (in another game)
languid tiger
real shadow
frozen olive
real as fuck
frail sky
https://tenor.com/view/ranni-elden-ring-elden-witch-elden-lord-gif-1797952059379...
@frail sky
nova smelt
Does anyone have an unupgraded smithscript dagger
tropic stream
interesting fact about Odin while looking stuff up for a homebrew mech I'm making
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
light bridge
In this case, very possibily refering to berserkgang
proven cloak
you think thats bad, try reading certain greek / medieval european cosmologies
(I was talking to Chronicles of Darkness players it was relevant)
Aristotle spends multiple chapters back-to-back just talking about how circular motion is the 'most eternal' form of motion, most connected to the heavenly spheres of the stars where all movement originates, set into motion by a first cause directly equated to active intellect (which moves things by.... yearning? It doesn't push, but "... produces motion by being loved.")
gives me conniptions....
later christians added the Empyrean 'above' this eternally spinning crystal sphere (The Primum Mobile) as the dwelling place of god
Dante visits both in the Paradiso they seem pretty chill
proven cloak
though this figure is interesting, most others consider the Primum Mobile = the Crystalline sphere as the ninth
like this
I still think its really cool how these sorts of metaphysics are blended with clear shinto influence
goes pretty hard
tropic stream
you think thats bad, try reading certain greek / medieval european cosmologies
I mean my theory is that the two and three fingers were once part of a five-fingered hand, and the three fingers got a thumb
this thumb, like in other parts of Elden Ring lore, like with the beastmen of farum azula, are associated with the bestowal of intelligence, and I think the three fingers, in their isolation and with their intelligence, fell into nihilism and embraced the flame of frenzy
Odin being a god of forbidden knowledge and being called 'lord of frenzy' is mostly strengthening my idea about the three fingers having the thumb
proven cloak
tbh I think Metyr is that five-fingered hand
her heads a thumb, the profile directly on looks like a pair of hands with an overlapping thumb as her head, right?
at least thats how I see it
proven cloak
this thumb, like in other parts of Elden Ring lore, like with the beastmen of fa...
this parts cooking though its pretty much what I think
I like to focus on the parallels between all the life in the Lands Between, regardless of the scale they're working on,
so I definitely find it more interesting to think of the Three Fingers as just fingers who fell to frenzy like any person could, instead of something innately different. Or just a creation of the frenzied flame or something.
just feels like it makes a harder-hitting point about nihilism and existential despair
frozen olive
Agree
Got PCR on the mind again
Been listening to his theme a lot recently
Prolly my favourite from the game, matched only by The Final Battle(Radagon/Elden Beast)
fleet bronze
I feel like Regal Ancestor Spirit flies under the radar because it's pretty low-key but I think it's gorgeous
frozen olive
Mhm
Admittedly, i very much prefer bombastic tone setting battle themes
I went back to a lot of basegame music after the dlc and found it felt a bit lacking for my tastes
A lot of basegame themes are closer to background noise andlet the bosses take center stage rather than go crazy and take up alot of space themselves
Which is not bad mind you
It works quite well
But i just prefer the crazy energy that the dlc battle themes add to the fights
Music is incredibly important for big moments like bosses and i like it when they go hard with them
tropic stream
I like to focus on the parallels between all the life in the Lands Between, rega...
I mean I will point out with my theory they did fall to frenzy just like any person would; they suffered something they were able to comprehend as a sapient intelligence, but could not overcome it, and thus fell to madness and despair
I think the reason the two fingers didn't do that is because they do not possess that level of intelligence and are also not in isolation
I also think Metyr's head being the thumb is more meant to symbolize she is the reification of the Greater Will's bestowal of the beasts with intelligence
proven cloak
yeah I was agreeing with you
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I don't know if I'm on the followup idea that the Two Fingers arent intelligent, or at least as intelligent as the average person
tropic stream
It's...
proven cloak
but I like the idea of the Three Fingers 'going mad'
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I do wish they were characterized a little more
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The fingers dont really have direct motivations in the same way a lot of the other actors in the story do
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like why does Ranni's fingers want her to follow in Marika's footsteps so strongly
"Because it would have greater control over here", well, maybe, but-
why does it want that? Whats the core motivation?
Do they want a surrogate mother figure? Do they want material power? Is it an ego thing?
🤷
tropic stream
lol yeah
proven cloak
Do they not question it, and they're like broken machines on a loop?
it could really be any
frozen olive
mfw the big fingie tells me to become god
tropic stream
lol
frozen olive
kinda funny how we got the god and satan parallels from the dragons
tropic stream
I think it's very telling Placidusax is in the same pose as the Two Fingers in Roundtable Hold when communing with the Greater Will
frozen olive
oh absolutely
tropic stream
I think 5 is an important number, and it's possible that the Three and Two Fingers were a 5 fingered hand while Placidusax served the Greater Will
proven cloak
Two still works, with the strong duality theme going on
tropic stream
There may be a distant possibility that Placidusax's loss of three of his heads is paralleling the Three Fingers being separated
proven cloak
I always saw the five-fingers as more a beast specific symbol, with two being something more cosmic
tropic stream
Yes, but the beasts are who gained sapient intelligence, and from whom humanity arose
proven cloak
but thats mostly because of the frenzied cosmology being so big into seperation
two is the first number that makes a 'distinction'
Did you see the big nightreign tree is made of two five-fingered hands, though?
tropic stream
I did not
frozen olive
Nightreign is surely going to do some interesting things to the ER lore community
proven cloak
frozen olive
cause on the one hand
more ER lore
on the other hand
whatever the fuck Nightreign has going on with bosses from other from games showing up
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its frustrating because like motif-wise its a dead ringer but theres nothing to actually make it mean anything yet
look at how these mfs curl around each other upwards, reaching towards the divine
:(
gives me conniptions
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around a ||divine tower, as well||
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that manifests out of the ||single golden ray of light from the sky remaining||
this is where your run heads towards, each nightreign cycle
the entire goal is to get to this thing, enter the 'spirit shelter' and then fight the boss past it
theres probably gonna be something interesting in the way it uses its visual motifs
same way dark souls 3 ringed city kinda
tightened up what that game had to say
tropic stream
All I'm seeing (hyperbolically) is evidence the number five, and specifically a five fingered hand, being important
XD
For my purposes, at any rate
proven cloak
go forth and theorize
I'm 📝 on the way light manifests a physical structure + some of the visuals of the spirit realm
what with the circlet of light, and the rings of light, and spira as a column of light, and the general use of eyes, and the two empyreans being broadly dark and bright
like incredibly bright like
"good fucking lord thats bright"
At this point if you said the Elden Ring itself was made of light, I'd go yeah probably
frozen olive
Miquella mailing you a flashbang
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Miquella mailing you a flashbang
with a little "<3 xoxoxox" attached
frozen olive
real
proven cloak
but see yeah he has charming ability, and is made of incredibly bright light
Renalla's moon had a 'bewitching' effect too - it was a full moon, a brighter moon
thematically, people head towards the light
frozen olive
milf moon
proven cloak
or maybe 'are drawn to'
frozen olive
🫡
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the only snag in considering the sun related to the Elden Ring itself - or the Elden Beast
is the Fell God also dips into a little bit of solar imagery
whats goin on there
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90% of all the sun related stuff is gold, or amber, or red-gold, or Elden Ringy
and then its just like btw heres another Sun guy whos just fire
and any proposed theory is speculation
maybe fuckin idk the Fell God previously held the elden ring. Maybe its a natural divine force shunned by (the current) Order like rot or growing-horns. maybe the symbols not even related to the Fell God originally, but that mf co-opted it from the divine towers and meteor worship.
maybe Tanimura said "Hey you know what would look sick"
frozen olive
my mind always goes to the Ancient Meteoric Ore Greatsword
proven cloak
AMOG'd I'm afraid
frozen olive
Fashioned from an excavated shard of an arrowhead that once was a part of the old gods' arsenal.
like
don't just hit me with an implication like this and leave
fucking explain yourself
proven cloak
it shows meteors are super old
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which underlines that Metyr was probably one-of or the first living thing
in the Lands
they might be the big skulls all over the place
frozen olive
could definitely be
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who are also (maybe) in Nightreign, as big shadows
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they exclusively face and walk towards the big tree-wreckage
and turn into tree roots as the days progress
frozen olive
Fromsoft making some of the most interesting lore known to man by explaining fucking nothing and dropping random ass fucking implications everywhere
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the setting bible gotta go crazy
I assume these big giant shadows are doing the same thing 80% of the other characters in the lands between are trying to do
Go Home
honestly I wouldn't need much more info on them, they walk towards the tree and turn to tree - no different from all those bodies wishing for erdtree burial
the big question is what the Night Lord is doing, and what their goals are
thats the sort of detail that fills in the rest
proven cloak
the big question is what the *Night Lord* is doing, and what their goals are
and Godefroy powerscaling, ofc
frozen olive
Godefroy, zeroth elden lord
obtuse halo
I was about to be like "yo hold on what's that drip" before realizing it was Duchess
proven cloak
real
gray leaf
I'm thinking about Elden Ring lore again, and in particular Godrick, and... man he did not know anything about anything, did he?
Everything he does is intended to symbolize the Golden Order and call back to a (heavily mythologized) history, but it's clear he doesn't actually understand anything about that history. He's crowing about being the last of the Golden Lineage (he isn't, but it's fair that he wouldn't know about Morgott and Mohg), but his actual holdings are on the bum end of nowhere, and his golden crenellations feel like an attempt to replicate the golden roofs of Leyndell when you don't actually know anything about the place other than "idk, gold".
He's an archetypal "reject modernity embrace tradition" guy, right down to having basically no understanding of the tradition he claims to be embracing.
frozen olive
Godrick do anything right challenge (impossible)
gray leaf
"thou art a true heir", he says to a modern dragon with fire breath, who isn't one of the lightning-using ancient dragons that the dragon cult actually worked with
frozen olive
I love how much of a loser he is honestly
gray leaf
yeah, he's pathetic, and it's honestly kind of great.
frozen olive
Genuinely the biggest fail guy in the golden lineage
gray leaf
it kind of makes sense when you remember that he's godefroy's younger brother, and as such primed to inheirit approximately nothing, and (understandably) kind of pissed about this.
gray leaf
also a reminder that it's possible to be a childish, incompetent, pathetic loser, and also a very real and terrifying threat to most of Limgrave. There are probably a lot of farmers who care very little about what's happening in Leyndell, but do care that their petulant manchild of a lord is kidnapping and grafting people.
gray leaf
he did, yes! And had ambitions for larger politics.
frozen olive
But he was for sure a threat to anyone that wasn't a freak of nature like the Tarnished or someone just stronger than him
Tf are farmers or wandering knight gonna do against him
gray leaf
he had political legitimacy, to some extent. But he probably didn't have any meaningful understanding of how to actually be a functional lord. He was too busy making grandiose gestures towards his piety and (misunderstood) history.
gray leaf
no kidding, especially given that he learned how grafting worked, but either didn't learn or didn't care that ||it works on the same fundamental principles that were used by the Hornsent in jarmaking, which was what prompted Marika's initial actions to begin with, and it's all come full circle||.
frozen olive
Fitting of such an absolute shitter
He didn't just get it wrong, he got it TURBO WRONG
potentially the most incorrect possible answer
gray leaf
but yeah. He doesn't know about how dragons work. He's trying to gesture towards the Golden Order, but the bizarrely overdecorated architecture of Stormveil Castle (at least the newer parts) bears no resemblance to... anything, really. Heck, just look at his axe, in comparison to Godfrey's.
Both are the same general archetype. But Godrick's is ostentatious and golden, while Godfrey's is... definitely also decorated, but in a very different way.
Heck, he even got the basic details wrong:
Greataxe wielded by Godrick the Grafted. This golden battleaxe is emblazoned with the figure of a beast, representing the strength of Godfrey, First Elden Lord and patriarch of the golden lineage.
Weapon of Godfrey, Elden Lord. It was broken in a battle fought as leader of the Tarnished during the Long March. This weapon is symbolic of Godfrey's vow to conduct himself as a lord, later becoming an emblem of the golden lineage. In the days of the past, a crown was warranted with strength.
Godrick sees the axe as a symbol of strength, and has emblazoned it with the head of a beast. Godfrey's axe, meanwhile, lacks the head of a beast (instead showing ornamented patterns vaguely similar to what the beastfolk did), and was a symbol of not strength but dignity.
gray leaf
Yeah, the beast in question was literally holding back his strength. I can see how, through generations of propaganda and distortion, important details would be lost... but it's still a sign that he doesn't understand the history he's trying to echo.
real shadow
Godrick just wants to graft, maaaaaan.
gray leaf
"...And one day, we'll return together...
...To our home, bathed in rays of gold..."
I still wonder: does he even know what he means when he says this? It sounds like the kind of thing he would have been told as a child.
Is he talking about Leyndell? Or does he realize that ||the home bathed in rays of gold is, almost certainly, the shaman village, even if all he knows about the place is that his ancestors once came from there||?
frozen olive
It does genuinely seem like the latter
Which
It would be INSANE if the only thing he got right was the ||Shamsn village||
gray leaf
Something about the phrasing makes me think that it was like... something told to him as a very young child, and he's just repeating it. It's distorted by time and myth as much as anything else.
Like... it is plausible that is all he knows about the place.
frozen olive
Yeah
I super agree
I feel like he IS alluding to ||the Shaman Village|| but i also don't think he even knows
gray leaf
it's honestly kind of tragic, in a way. Like, yes, he's alluding to his history as part of a bid for legitimacy, clearly... but at the same time, this is a person unmoored from the past, desperately scrabbling at whatever he can.
although, speaking of characters divorced from their past... ||imagine if Malenia could have talked to Romina, or the forager brood, or anybody who viewed the scarlet rot as something other than a plague to be contained and burned out.||
frozen olive
It is sort of just sad to see Godrick trying so desperately to cling to and glofify his lineage and just get everything wrong cause there just izn't enough information left to put the correct picture together
frozen olive
although, speaking of characters divorced from their past... ||imagine if Maleni...
Yeah...
gray leaf
yeah. Most of what's left feels like propaganda, minimizing Hourah Loux and maximizing Godfrey the First Elden Lord.
frozen olive
Don't love Malenia but that would go hard
(I'm kind of a Radahn stan so Malenia slander is on the agenda)
gray leaf
I think ||Malenia could have made a good warrior-queen if given the opportunity... but of course she never would. She was deprived of her heritage, deprived of the cultural context that would tell her how to manage the Scarlet Rot. So of course she fought for Miquella, who himself isn't really evil either.||
gray leaf
Honestly, the whole system is broken in a million ways, and everyone except for maybe Gideon Ofnir recognizes that fact. But they can't agree on how to fix it, and they uphold it because it gives them power or it's what they've always known or they can't imagine anything better or it beats the alternatives.
frozen olive
My GOAT would never shrive clean the hearts of men
Simply do debate club with god
Skill difference
gray leaf
Miquella ||correctly identified the problem, and made a plan to fix it, and... say what you will about the morality of the plan, but at minimum it seems like it would have more or less worked, and that puts him in the top 10% of people on its own||.
frozen olive
Good enough plan, fumbled the execution something awful
gray leaf
||I mean, the plan was to become a god, and he became a god.||
That part of it pretty directly succeeded.
frozen olive
Was thinking more on the ||fixing things by becoming a god|| side of things
Motivation behind it if you would
gray leaf
yeah, well. We don't really know for sure either way, since ||we kill him before he has the chance to do anything||. So it's ultimately speculation as to how that would shake out. And, honestly, there's something really fun and tantalizing about that.
frozen olive
Tbh the biggest failure of the plan was simply ||challenging the tarnished for the throne||
gray leaf
||He didn't. He was going to create a second throne. And when the tarnished shows up, he tries to talk them out of a fight.||
frozen olive
I don't agree with that tbh
gray leaf
||The Tarnished wasn't part of his plans in any capacity. They just kind of wandered in.||
frozen olive
I don't think his goal can exist separate from the throne of Elden Lord
gray leaf
The Elden Lord derives their power from the Elden Ring, and the Grace of Gold, and the Erdtree. ||Miquella's plan is to, with the Haligtree and Compassion, create a second throne, wholly divorced from that of Elden Lord.||
frozen olive
Sure
But that doesn't matter at all
Because ||Miquella wants to affect the lands between and the land of shadow as the god of a new age||
And no matter what, imo, that is in opposition to the Elden Lord, and thus the Tarnished
gray leaf
Fair enough. And in that case, it is relevant. But if so, ||I don't think he'd try to claim the throne. He'd try to conquer it outright. And it's worth remembering that, when he made this plan, there was no Elden Lord. A bunch of pretenders and aspirants, sure, but no real inheiritor. He didn't know that some random Tarnished of no great renown would make such an effective stab at the title.||
gray leaf
Yeah. The most coherent and organized opposition he was likely to face would be... well, probably, Godrick.
And maybe Morgott, but for all his personal power he doesn't really have terribly much political power.
proven cloak
Genuinely the biggest fail guy in the golden lineage
one of Miyazaki's favorites
frozen olive
Godrick is pretty fierce competition /j
proven cloak
I like him because his ass thinks he's in the club
like honestly if I was just a normal guy caught up in the Shattering I dont think I'd do much better tbh
frozen olive
I don't know that big M would have been abke to dean with him
gray leaf
yeah, he used the mimic veil and just ran away.
Went to, functionally, the ass end of nowhere, took over a castle which used to be politically important but wasn't anymore, and promptly overdecorated it.
frozen olive
Honetly valid but also he is still a loser
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and then shoved it full of walls on walls on walls
frozen olive
But yeah he was like
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he'd probably be happier if he wasn't trying to be a contender for the throne
frozen olive
Some nobody fucko in a world of shounen protags
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but I think he clings to his lineage as one of the few things he has
gray leaf
he seems like the kind of person who would be constitutionally incapable of being happy.
frozen olive
Yeah he does tbh
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Miquella ||correctly identified the problem, and made a plan to fix it, and... s...
(I personally don't think he ||correctly identified the problem||)
His overall perspective is most similar to ||Radagon, of all people||
frozen olive
My favourite guy is still Godfrey for that
proven cloak
||He's trying to create a more perfect and controlled system anchored around him, his problem with the Golden Order is that it didn't go far enough to curtail unwanted influences.||
frozen olive
He had no plans
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wife guy extreme
frozen olive
He was a whole ass smoke demon and nothing else
proven cloak
He had no plans
I think honestly thats part of being Elden Lord tbh
frozen olive
He loved his wife and he loved killing
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the God is the vision and you just kind of go "👍"
frozen olive
And good gods did he do a LOT of killing
I love that canonically Godfrey killed pretty much every strong creature in the lands between
Everything left is sorta just dregs and demigods for the most part
gray leaf
he kind of did, yeah. He was the face of the military empire.
proven cloak
I think thats a big reason for Raddahn challenging the stars
how do you prove your military might + personal power if your hero already did it first over the entire continent?
frozen olive
All the good terrestrial fights were already ganked by Godfrey
He already killed literally everything there was to kill
gray leaf
Radahn challenged the stars because there were still more starspawn showing up, to be fair.
frozen olive
Also potentially to help Ranni
gray leaf
Also possibly it was related to his learning from an Alabaster Lord (or an Onyx Lord? I'm not sure) since they're also connected to the stars.
Also, yes, potentially to help Ranni.
proven cloak
well its interesting because, theres items in the DLC that mention how beasts with large amount of rune power start to love the fight itself
they hunt out and attack other strong beasts for the sheer thrill of it
gray leaf
oh I did not remember those but that's interesting.
proven cloak
I think its not too different from the Tarnished, or Godfrey
gray leaf
Especially given Godfrey relinquishing the fight.
proven cloak
or even the space bugs
frozen olive
Certainly not Godfrey
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maybe its just a setting detail that things love to fight, may the strongest win
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yeah
idk if the starspawn are really an alien invasion, or moreso just
aliens also acting like how runebears or runegoats or whatever act
frozen olive
They got strong and wanted some smoke as well
Should have had Radahn launch Godfrey to the stars and let him duke it out
proven cloak
If only there was someone who wanted to move beyond violence as a basic underlying metaphysical principle of the world
frozen olive
Lmao
proven cloak
oh I did not remember those but that's *interesting*.
(it was the horn-strewn poop item, just to source it)
Found underfoot in places like forests where beasts dwell. It is said that the deadliest of the horned predators enjoy the sport of hunting and devouring other horned creatures.```It might just be me
but the way this was written always made me think, its one of those weirdly broad fromsoft item descriptions
frozen olive
Nah i see the vision
proven cloak
"It is said the deadliest of the horned predators enjoy the sport of hunting and devouring other horned creatures"
and I go 🤔
as I climb Bayle's mountain
frozen olive
Godfrey mah not have horns as far as i know but he was certainly emblematic of this
proven cloak
Godfrey mah not have horns as far as i know but he was certainly emblematic of t...
his kids definitely did
frozen olive
Trueeeeee
I like to imagine he was just born like that but him deciding to be a smoke demon and throw hands with every living creature he came across is also cool
It's ironic that his two horned sons seem to have inherited a far nobler nature than him
proven cloak
Godfreys one of those characters I'd most want to see the GRRM notes on
what originally drove him to Do All That
Was he regretful, putting his kids in the sewer?
proven cloak
Was he stoic about the whole "you and your kin are banished forever", following Marikas wishes even if he didnt want to?
frozen olive
Fascinating dude
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theres a lot there
first playthrough I was so confused by his second phase though
lmao
"Who the fuck is this guy"
frozen olive
I was genuinely awed
I don't think anything short of like
Bayle second phase or maybe PCR has as much aura as him discarding his armor amd weapons and ripping off serosh to fight at full power
proven cloak
but the way this was written always made me think, its one of those weirdly broa...
(bondstone from the DLC makes me think of the same sort of thing, but for Empyreans - "Bonds with the sprites were made to be broken", the swearing they do, how breaking a bond causes an 'explosion of spiritual power'? 🤔)
oh its so cool
frozen olive
Genuinely just the coolest shit ever
proven cloak
even if you dont know whats happening you know shit is serious
frozen olive
I don't think i've ever even seen another character in a gamd or book or other kind of story do shit like that
proven cloak
I always felt part of his tragedy was not really having a goal but to follow Marika's will
I can't imagine what he would've done if he had won
frozen olive
Insane aura to just throw all your tools away and go at it barehanded
proven cloak
||and killed her, per her wishes||
frozen olive
Yeah :(
frozen olive
Insane aura to just throw all your tools away and go at it barehanded
You gotta be one crazy motherfucker to throw away your deadly weapon and discard your protective armor and become genuinely several times more lethal
proven cloak
The weapon in the dlc that gives you the moveset calls it ||an esoteric technique of the Hornsent Tower Warriors||
which is 👀
frozen olive
Which moveset?
proven cloak
very directly the same sort of motions
An imitation of the esoteric technique of the horned warriors.
||the esoteric technique is probably divine invocation||
||ripping apart Serosh's spirit, and probably fighting him in the first place, lets him invoke his spirit in the same way you can get roar of Rugelea||
at least thats how I see it
bros got that 'dog' in him
frozen olive
||ripping apart Serosh's spirit, and probably fighting him in the first place, l...
That's so fucking cool
Gods elden ring lore rules
proven cloak
I like it more than any of the other fromsoft ones (no offense dark souls)
it feels more complete in ways that feel rewarding to poke at
ds was very much about vibes. Why is there an eclipse now, why is Gywndolin snakes? dw about it its literally not important
and it worked for those games, no issue with it
but I like the connections they don't point out as strongly in ER. Theres a whole life-based magic system going on in the background
and you can literally ignore all of it and still get the story and have a good time
but theres a reward for getting into the motifs, too
like the numen / shaman plant stuff
frozen olive
Yeah
It just feels more solid to poke at
So finding connections feels more real and rewarding
proven cloak
mhm
and sometimes the answer is still gonna be "because its cool" or "because its a game first"
frozen olive
Yeah
proven cloak
but theres a little bit more there
esp when they lean into allusion towards bigger problems
frozen olive
The world also feels more interactive in a way
Partially cause it has happy endings for characters
proven cloak
like Moore's quest is about the forager broad being abandoned by their mother, but its not just about that
frozen olive
Everyones quests don't just end with them dead
proven cloak
if you squint, its about the lands between being abandoned by Marika, or Radagon leaving Renalla behind, or ||Metyr abandoned by the GW - if all we want is a place in the world, what do we do if we're discarded? Do we have no option but to be sad forever?||
thats also true
theres less of a sense of everything ending imo
stuff was more impressive in the past, but not like ds where its saying it can never be that alive again
theres still new heights to reach, things to build towards
frozen olive
Mhm
frozen olive
if you squint, its about the lands between being abandoned by Marika, or Radagon...
Lands between mommy issues epidemic
proven cloak
ah so thats where the bloodborne went
gray leaf
there is a major theme, especially in the DLC, of figures who are supposed to serve as someone's mother and/or god (the two are conflated), but instead abandon that role. I'd go so far as to call that a very uncharitable, but still accurate, reading of the Age of Stars ending.
proven cloak
I think Bloodborne is more mommies HAVING issues
frozen olive
Lmao
proven cloak
there is a *major* theme, *especially* in the DLC, of figures who are supposed t...
oh for sure
it ties into the questions it raises about ideology and power structures you make
the duty a parent has for their children, the duty a god has towards the people who believe in them...
are they different?
Looking for guidance and purpose in your life
what you are supposed to do, right?
Thats why I like Moore so much for underlining the theme
its so direct
"our mother didn't give us shit and idk why we are alive what should I do"
gray leaf
albinaurics, by that virtue, are profane because they lack a mother. (I mean, that's not the stated reason why, but it's effectively the case.)
proven cloak
raising up meaning through the elden ring is trying to answer that question and make purpose
or establish an authority to give lives purpose
(which is why Ranni's ending is about doubt and fear and loneliness - its answering 'Idk' to Moore's question of what to do next)
but theres an honesty in it
everyones coping the entire way down, but nobody is in touch with any sort of divine plan
Ranni doesn't want to provide that sort of overriding vision, because it hasn't exactly ever worked out once
so she goes off to buy milk in space with her new sidepiece
gray leaf
...but also because she personally doesn't want to face that burden. It's for the sake of the world but definitely also for her own sake.
proven cloak
mhm
theres an interesting mirror to Miquella there, too
where he's incredibly selfless, doing what he does because he feels like he needs to for the sake of others
while Ranni (even willing to take a 'dark path' because she thinks its for the best) is still very hands off
gray leaf
I wonder how much of that is noblesse oblige and how much of that is guilt?
proven cloak
doesn't even ask you to join until you go the entire distance
oh for sure he's got guilt
He literally tears apart his flesh in bloody splatters to try and cleanse the 'sin' of his bloodline
gray leaf
Yeah. It's... not subtle.
proven cloak
btw on the mother issues thing
its why I think the demigods are given so much more character than older FS bosses, and put so far in the center
for pretty much all of them, their stories look at how they've gotten all twisted, usually in response to the GO / Marika
frozen olive
He literally tears apart his flesh in bloody splatters to try and cleanse the 's...
I think the funniest/ most fucked up part is it doesn't work
Bro mutilates himself for naught essentually
proven cloak
its about consequences, how causality and fate play out because people keep impacting each other in similar ways, and the same stories play out
frozen olive
In fact you could argue the self mutilation even plays into it
proven cloak
he wants to be 'pure' yeah
||another way I think he's similar to his parents, given Marika's relationship with Radagon / the Erdtree's relationship with crucible-cultures||
just remove the Bad Parts and keep only the Good Parts theres no issues to this approach
frozen olive
Not only does it not cleanse the sin it arguably leads him right to recreating it
frozen olive
Bro looked at the original sin, said "i hate that" then started rushing down the path Marika took to make said sin
We're not breaking the cycle of violence with this one!
gray leaf
no, but if we do violence this time, it'll fix things, you don't understand
frozen olive
The final act of violence that will end violence forever... How did i not see it
gray leaf
Would the Age of Stars ending even work, though? Or, in the absence of gods, would people simply attempt to create their own?
frozen olive
I mean, that's still within the remit of self determination innit?
There won't be a God if nothing else
The Age of Stars involves spiriting away the Elden Ring, primordial source of divinity of the lands between
The Age of Stars isn't meant to be perfect regardless
Plain and simple, it's a hope and a prayer
Ranni's answer of freedom to the world
gray leaf
yeah. The counterpoint is that one could argue ||the greater will did exactly that, and look how that turned out||.
frozen olive
It's a hail mary kinda thing
Plus it kinda didn't
The ||Elden Beast and the fingers were still around to help govern and influence shit||
gray leaf
||The fingers didn't really have ongoing instructions, it sounded like. It seemed like they expected to be recieving continuous ongoing instructions... and they were, but only from Metyr. Who, in turn, was trying to make up for the lack of instruction from the Greater Will. This wasn't a planned handoff.||
gray leaf
...🥁📀 but, yeah, true. Depending on how total the isolation the Age of Stars enforces.
old brook
That is a bit of a wrinkle, nobody's even sure how much this move will work
Ranni's mostly aiming 'New And Different' the little upstart
frozen olive
Literally no one else has any better ideas other than perpetuating the cycle or making it worse
Dung Eater being the guy trying to make it worse
old brook
Honestly how well it goes might depend on how thorough you are in taking out unrelated bosses, wouldn't do well to take the ring and run while leaving the avatar of rot puttering about
frozen olive
I killed basically everything
Might have left like, a stray starfall beast or smthn
Did a Godfrey run tbh
Not quite as generational maybe but i cleaned house for sure
proven cloak
Would the Age of Stars ending even work, though? Or, in the absence of gods, wo...
depends on what you mean by 'work'
I honestly think none of the proposed endings are like, the end of history
it would be against theme
it would solve the main issue Ranni has with the Golden Order, which is it enforcing itself over the land and wrapping everything up in Marika's vision for the world
it would probably have other consequences, who knows
frozen olive
yeah most likely
proven cloak
Godwyn's still there, the ||Nox(?) are maybe(?) still mad at her for stealing the fingerslayer blade - but they already killed her advisors and friends so idk if they'll do anything more||
people will probably fight and do horrible things to each other, even without a singular god-figure
in the same way the Hornsent did literally that
in the DLC
🤷
tis but a cycle
She kind of leans back and decides to let 'Fate' take its course, instead of trying to steer it
maybe a bit of an irony in her quest
proven cloak
Would the Age of Stars ending even work, though? Or, in the absence of gods, wo...
like if you wanted to deal with this issue
Miquella's plan of ||Become the central god-figure of everybody, charming their hearts in perfect, eternal co-operation|| is probably better
(though I don't think it would work out)
proven cloak
oh for sure
frozen olive
||brainwashing induced world peace is kind of dogshit tbh||
||i happen to kind of enjoy self determination and free will||
proven cloak
but thats his solution to ||the conflicts of different groups, becoming a universal god for everyone to be under||
proven cloak
||i happen to kind of enjoy self determination and free will||
yeah, and as long as you got this
you're gonna have the conflicts of people having different wants and perspectives
proven cloak
I like that they made her so Like That
very, very committed
||great example of the mommy issues, she's with Miquella because he granted her light to her 'faded', probably Tarnished, eyes||
frozen olive
yup
proven cloak
||Shes with him because he was the first person to really give her what she wanted||
what pretty much everybody in that fucked-up not-quite-ireland want
old brook
Everyone in the lands between is just so passionate
Rarely a thing done below 110% but Leda really shoots for the moon
gray leaf
wait. The axe also originally belonged to Godefroy, didn't it. We can't blame its horrid misunderstandings solely on Godrick.
frozen olive
not only is Godrick a failman but he was also sabotaged from the getgo
light bridge
Nightrein here or elsewhere?
atomic plinth
Aye
feral linden
frozen olive
my boy
languid tiger
the skins part, the one-being-artorias part, or the general fact of it having non-ER content?
plush cliffBOT
They're not microtransactions right?
tropic stream
the skins part, the one-being-artorias part, or the general fact of it having no...
the former two I suppose?
languid tiger
gotcha
tropic stream
I am skeptical of nightreign in the extreme now tbh
I have the same problem with Fortnite, of cool and meaningful things being divorced from their context to be resold
kind garden
I Pretend I Do Not See It
tropic stream
The best case scenario is this artorias skin is an in-game unlock, and thus just a... weird and foolish decision?
that cheapens the meaning of Artorias and his design on the altar of 'play as the very cool guy'
light bridge
Iirc, they said no micro transactions
I have no problems with popular characters being skins tbh. I could dress as artorias in 1 and 3, it didn't really detract from the character then, don't really think that changes now
plush cliffBOT
Unrelated to all of that, we are just now learning there is a playable doll character in nightreign and we are even more hyped for it than we were before
light bridge
Oh, the one that people guessed was the summoner?
plush cliffBOT
Apparently!
proven cloak
I'm interested to see how the music plays into the kit
probably buffs if they're the summoner
proven cloak
I have the same problem with Fortnite, of cool and meaningful things being divor...
its not too different from the switch version having things like Lucatiel's sword, imo
but yeah its not as cool as the OG context
plush cliffBOT
Isn't that gonna be put into the other versions too?
Scout | #1 Crucible Fan ↩️
