huh? nah, the huge aoes are super slow
#HADES by Supergiant Games
placid thistle
you can stand in em for a while before they come up
and standing behind him means you're mostly safe from his stomps
gotta space a bit, but his hitbox is so huge that it's fine
covert egret
The giant circles only damage when the roots reach all the way to the edges
So you can just sit in them and whallop away, then leave when you're running low on time
His normal stomps can also be blocked with the special, so you can really just sit in his face and bonk him
worthy anchor
Nice. I just managed to beat ||Eris|| for the first time, using the skull - though the actual last hit came from my cast xD
I got an ||Icarus|| boon that makes it auto-explode (although that does also hurt you), which was really strong, since the boss just kept jumping around all the time and I couldn't actually get any hits in.
fresh nebula
So far Staff and Knives are my favourite weapopns
dawn musk
Woo made it to Chronos
||That lunging attack is annoying, since he lunges from outside the view||
covert egret
Yeah, wish the fight zoomed out a bit more, like with ||Cerberus||
gilded token
oh actually
something I somehow never figured out
How do you dodge ||Hecate's sheep polymorph attack||
dawn musk
How do you dodge ||Hecate's sheep polymorph attack||
Just dodge into it
fresh nebula
How do you dodge ||Hecate's sheep polymorph attack||
Dodge into it with iframes, or ||Frinos can body block it, which makes Hectae salty||
fresh nebula
You gotta do it while the iframes are active
it's pretty tight
honestly, familar or just tanking it and dealing with being a sheep for a while
gilded token
Yeah I have been just tanking it
dodging as a sheep is like
surprisingly easy?
its mostly a time waster
worthy anchor
So far Staff and Knives are my favourite weapopns
Same. Staff, Knives, Skull all feel pretty good to use.
Staff has some nutty hammers, but all three can be good with the right build.
Axe is fun too, but feels like the special is just... Very Meh.
Flames... Need tuning.
Oh, on the topic of dodging:
How am I supposed to handle ||Eris' shotgun blast or burst shots?|| I can't tell the attack based on the windup, and while I can be far enough away from the shorter one, I need to be all the way across the map (where there's hopefully no fire) for the longer one.
Which doesn't seem viable for how little warning I get.
I have occasionally managed to get behind the boss for the longer-ranged one, when they don't turn fast enough to get me, but the blasts absolutely will get me.
Am I just missing a visual cue, or do I need to memorise the attack order (if that's even a thing)?
fresh nebula
Same. Staff, Knives, Skull all feel pretty good to use.
Staff has some nutty ha...
I dont, personally, like skull all that much. Hasent clicked for me - i like the rythms of it, but i;'m yet to make it feel good. need to figure out what boons it really likes, Apollo seems the best appraoch honestly
fresh nebula
Am I just missing a visual cue, or do I need to memorise the attack order (if th...
No idea, honestly. THere's a few bosses that have attacks with wonky hit boxes or just comes out too fast - Chronos has killed me with an attack that spawned underneath me with basically zero windup animation (Oneo fh is swipes, i think? it literally started right underneath me)
very annoying
worthy anchor
I dont, personally, like skull all that much. Hasent clicked for me - i like the...
I had a good time with Hephaestus on the attack. The CD is low enough, especially after a pom or two, that it's just a nice boost. And the attack is plenty strong as-is, ime.
Did have Apollo on the special, though, which rocked.
worthy anchor
No idea, honestly. THere's a few bosses that have attacks with wonky hit boxes o...
Yeah, I noticed some issues there, too... I hope that's something they're still working on improving.
fresh nebula
Yeah, I noticed some issues there, too... I hope that's something they're still ...
Hopefully! I wish they had teh f8, submit report option that thingymajiiger does, Rotwood
worthy anchor
Yeah, I was surprised to not see any option to report stuff! I suppose they have telemetry for at least statistical info on runs and kills etc, but I expected them to also want to know about this sort of feedback.
worthy anchor
Lol. So I tried a Scorch-maxxing run with the staff, trying to get the blessings that make it tick down faster etc.
I didn't get those, but I got the Demeter/Hestia Duo boon that makes it so that Scorch goes up on enemies whenever you inflict Freeze.
Leading to goldwraith having just shy of 60k scorch damage stacked on it when it finally died.
(Because I had freeze attack, with the hammer that disables the omega attack, but speeds it up massively. Also the double-shot special hammer.)
It was, as expected, not very good because Scorch ticks down much too slowly, but it is reliable extra damage, so it worked reasonably well.
Died to a misjudged hitbox in Chronos phase II.
turbid sparrow
There is a Hestia boon that does that
worthy anchor
Hestia has a boon, where 300+ Scorch gets turned into immediate damage.
50% at common/no poms.
I was trying to get that, or the Legendary that doubles the tick rate for it.
Either one would've made this build go nuts I think.
Probably the regular one better than the Legendary, even.
Getting to 300 scorch was really easy, which would've turned into 150 damage immediately, every time.
That's a decent damage boost.
bold palm
I know I had a Hephestus+Demeter duo boon that meant the explosions cleared freeze
so you could freeze, do some damage, explode them to shatter the freeze, then freeze them instantly
paper spire
I hope Hephaestus gets some boost, I love his stuff but the delay is soO long and ranking them up barely helps
bold palm
Eh, taking two seconds off each with every level up makes them pretty strong
worthy anchor
Hephaestus is currently overtuned, if anything, actually.
There was a recent interview where Amir Rao is asked whose boon he'd pick, and he immediately goes "Hephaestus. The numbers are a bit off there, eventually it should be a harder choice, but right now, clearly Hephaestus." or something like that.
turbid sparrow
worthy anchor
worthy anchor
I don't think he's terribly overtuned, but he is strong. And I love the design.
bold palm
they literally have one where you just get a free recharging armour...
Actually, combo THAT with Aphrodite's recharge of top level health and you've got an amazing high health buffer even if you take a real beating
dusty storm
got an early Heavy Metal and then managed to nab Scarlet Dress from Arachne.
Was pretty insane.
worthy anchor
Combo with the Poseidon one where you reduce the damage you take (if you can spare the mana)
Yeah, I got it early in a run where I was trying the Silken Sash
I managed to cover the entire life bar in armor xD
bold palm
I love the silken sash
honestly just a full hephy and sash run where it's an entire other life bar for the fight
It's interesting that no one else seems to deal in armour
worthy anchor
Poseidon does damage reduction, both Hermes and Demeter have damage-negation, but yeah, no armor.
cobalt shard
I wonder what the justification will be for continuing to do runs after finishing the main story
like how in the first game you were testing the underworld security
turbid sparrow
"Grampa is getting lonely go beat him up"
gilded token
Chronos is prob getting a redemption arc let us be honest
bold palm
I gonna beat him till he redeems
bold palm
||Hercules|| just left our encounter by saying "Peace". Which is a good character moment. That's his goodbye, Peace, despite it all
poly vs the axe is rough
cause you get close and boosh he jumps in your face
placid thistle
poly's jump attack having a hitbox the whole time he's in the air is really frustrating
worthy anchor
My best axe v poly experience was with a lot of damage buffs all stacking together - I waited and waited while he attacked, then one hit would do 600+ damage... That was pretty lucky though.
Because otherwise I agree.
I tend to facetank him with the axe - get lots of health and/or armor, and just beat him down faster than you take damage...
bold palm
the axe either needs a bit of a bigger range or just a bit faster. It's tuned very oddly.
placid thistle
oh, I don't have a ton of trouble with him on axe, it's just that one attack that really doesn't feel like it should have that hitbox
bold palm
Okay but I love her she's the best aunty
summer wren
hestia is always the best
bold palm
Rock and stone
Fuck you Eris I just built your anti-Boon
damnit
Her shotgun move where she just runs to the middle of the arena and instantly takes up the entire quarter of the place facing your direction is kinda bullshit.
dusty storm
an important thing for Eris we think is for the love of all the gods do not let her destroy those two pieces of cover
worthy anchor
Both of her bursts are really terrifying if you're close to her when she starts them up
placid thistle
it's annoying that all of her moves are so instant
worthy anchor
The cover helps - but you also kinda need it for her sniper shots.
placid thistle
like, her snipe is just faster theseus toss
worthy anchor
I don't know what I'm doing to dodge them - just occasionally she misses.
placid thistle
with less telegraphing too
dusty storm
the sniper attack sucks to get hit by, but it's one bullet, and it's possible to dodge one bullet with effort. The rapid shotgun and rifle on the other hand will hit you if you can't get behind cover
placid thistle
and then the shotgun is just
worthy anchor
(and with slower enemy projectiles, I can dash dodge it)
placid thistle
"okay this half of the map isn't safe, hope you were in the center and moved out of it instantly"
"no? take 40 damage"
worthy anchor
Also, I somehow just managed to defeat her with the flames - Hephaestus is actually overtuned, wow.
Volcanic attack and special really did a lot of work.
placid thistle
it's just a very unfun fight
winning does not feel rewarding, and losing doesn't feel justified
dusty storm
winning does not feel rewarding, and losing doesn't feel justified
personally speaking we felt pretty rewarded when we beat her
but we did beat her while abusing knife/Sorcerer for all its worth.
it's not an easy fight
worthy anchor
Also, has anyone tried Aspect of Medea on the skull yet?
I just unlocked it and tried it on skelly, and wow that's a weird choice.
I can't imagine that working.
It's like loading your casts into your shield in H1 - but no way to shoot them out? So they eventually just explode around you.
dusty storm
we just tried it on skelly and the skulls explode when you dash into them which
worthy anchor
ohhh, that would help, but still feels weird?
dusty storm
shield of beowulf
born 2018, born 2024
bold palm
AHHHHH HAHAHA
||I just learned how Icarus is back alive, and yes he is alive||
fresh nebula
Also, has anyone tried Aspect of Medea on the skull yet?
I was working to unlock it never I thought it would be you could throw the skulls and they'd stay a certain range from you?
worthy anchor
I was working to unlock it never I thought it would be you could throw the skull...
Yeah, no - it stays on you.
placid thistle
AHHHHH HAHAHA
||I just learned how Icarus is back alive, and yes he is alive||
wait really? mind talking about it?
I'm out of town so I haven't played, and all I've seen is references to ||him being a shade||
worthy anchor
I also thought from the description that it would stay close, but it's literally on you. Much like Beowulf shield.
placid thistle
oh shit the skull is just beo shield?
that seems really good actually
since you already want to omega special a lot
worthy anchor
I'm out of town so I haven't played, and all I've seen is references to ||him be...
I've seen a hint that Meli somehow "repaired" him...
placid thistle
I thought that was just ||going from one of those wisp-shades, like how Od talks about his crew not being as substantial as he is, to Real Icarus Again||
worthy anchor
oh shit the skull is *just* beo shield?
Well, Medea skull, anyway. The skulls stay on you until they eventually explode. Absinthe said they also exploded when you special into someone.
worthy anchor
Gotcha.
placid thistle
meli skull is maybe too sweet to trash, though
the huge bonus base damage is fucking cracked
worthy anchor
Yeah, especially if you get the +2 skulls hammer.
placid thistle
yep
worthy anchor
(I maintain that +1 skull is probably good for the skull in general.)
The hammer could stay an extra +2 or go down to +1, it would still be good, but not feel as necessary.
Which, I know, isn't strictly true, but it kinda feels that way.
fresh nebula
Right now it feels like staff has the best hammers, they're just all nuts in various ways
placid thistle
3 feels like plenty to me usually
fresh nebula
With some really crazy ones like double attack, omega doubles up but doesn't go backwards, or melting strike
placid thistle
staff has broken hammers yeah
worthy anchor
It always feels like just a bit short on ammo. And the slow drop free omega hammer kinda really doesn't work.
worthy anchor
Yeah, that exists for the skull too and it's amazing.
50% armour per hit on the special.
placid thistle
H1 also had terrible hammers on some weapons
and some terrible boons
I'm not envisioning major changes
people asked for changes all throughout EA and they never did any, so I assume it'll stay like that
same with busted ones
bold palm
I'm out of town so I haven't played, and all I've seen is references to ||him be...
Spoilers for what was asked about
||So Icarus WAS a shade before, yes. And apparently used to be in Camp! But uh... yeah, turns out he had a fear of flying and seemed pretty sad in those days and Melinoe wanted to put to a test if you could really bring a shade back to life with enough effort and... well that's why her arm is all fucked up now. He's alive, and her arm has taken on the shade aspect.||
bold palm
yeaaa
worthy anchor
Ooooo
bold palm
||he left the camp cause he was feeling super guilty then just started fucking with chronos||
fresh nebula
H1 also had terrible hammers on some weapons
As much as I like super giants games, which to be clear, is a whole lot, they do often have weird warts and decision points
My guess is because they focus on a narrative first experience
And I'm very much a game first approach
placid thistle
yeah, H1 is not a game that I'd consider like
a 10/10 game
solid 7 though
it has some really wacky balance decisions and rough edges
bold palm
I'd go 8 but I'm forgiving of some of the jank
placid thistle
and H2 is keeping a lot of the mechanical fuckery and bizarre menus and general shenanigans
and rough option balancing
because they consider the (stellar) art and (excellent) writing more important
and you know what, it made for a very pretty narrative experience that I enjoyed
fresh nebula
I remember I mainly burned out on h1 because I just didn't enjoy the heat system, and past a certain point do repeated X minutes runs to trigger a little bit more dialogue got very frustrating
Speaking of rough balancing: screams in act 3 and act 4 shade charming minigame
dusty storm
Tablet of Peace is a uh
tool that gets worse over time
placid thistle
I have yet to touch it
which is apparently why I don't have familiars
you need to use every tool
fresh nebula
I'm bugged on one of the familiars
Can't recruit the cat because she left one area, but won't spawn in the other area
Very annoying
placid thistle
rip
dusty storm
the tablet is exceptionally useful for getting a lot of Psyche quickly, which is otherwise a resource that is somewhat slow to amass.
boreal vale
yeah tablet is "i don't need any of the other stuff urgently and want to focus on grnding some Personal Metaprogression"
and/or you've got a bunch of Shadow to make
worthy anchor
I just the "OP Axe" chaos trial and LOL
that is fun
ludicrous setup
Heroic Nova Strike, always to the last hit of the combo, never do the omega move but attack faster, regen mana quickly
I hit Hecate four times and that was it.
Oh, chance to double hit, too
cobalt shard
because they consider the (stellar) art and (excellent) writing more important
that's a pretty cynical take
gameplay is definitely very important to them
and most people love the gameplay of the first game
there is some lopsided balance, but that's going to be an inevitability in rogue likes with random builds
worthy anchor
Okay, wow. Turns out you can build Blitz Daggers into an incredible damage powerhouse. Chronos down, no death defiance used because he just died that quick.
8 mins better than my last run!
The ionic gain was really useful - not for regen though, but for pushing my mana down!
Turns out, the Zeus boon that strikes every couple seconds is actually really useful for triggering Blitz on enemies. Although by the end, I didn't need it, as I got the Aphrodite/Zeus duo, which lets you sprint into Blitz'd enemies for 2x Blitz damage.
That ended up regularly doing 550 damage, and all I needed to do was hit the enemy with a throwing knife every so often.
Air Quality and the Poseidon Attack + Chain-Lighting turned the attack into a massive AoE, thanks to the Hammer that disabled the omega attack - couldn't do that anyway, so it was just endless damage instead.
(the hex contributed +10% damage while not ready, since I literally had no mana I could ever use xD)
They probably need to stop you from committing more mana than you have.
But yeah, that was a really fun run.
dusty storm
special boon
dusty storm
Hestia sprint is *very* funny in it, however
We can confirm that Hestia sprint hard-carried us
Well.
Our build was good by itself just
the sprint helped.
Considerably
fresh nebula
Funniest combo I've done so far is having Hera on my attack, and the giant meteor hex... Against Scylla.
I got all three of them linked, and then I dropped the meteor such that it hit all three of them.
So they each took 1k damage, and then another two instances of at least 50 damage
blap
Killed the two minor characters instantly and forced Scylla straight into a new phase, funny as hell
bold palm
Hestia run is hilarious but I always worry I'm going to find out last second that it doesn't apply for X or Y
dusty storm
the "most projectiles" part of the boon demonstrates its power but leaves you in fear of its limitations
cobalt shard
i really don't see it as an interesting design choice
just "you might sometimes take 20 damage because you had no way of knowing which projectiles we decided count"
dusty storm
We see it more as a necessity, ourselves, than anything good.
Because they can't exactly list what specific projectiles work or don't.
For what it's worth it has seemed to work on basically every... well. "Projectile" we've found.
The lightning from Lamias don't seem to be affected, but that's the weirdest example we could fine, really.
Maybe Hecate's ground fire doesn't work with it?
As in, like. Her three-pronged wave attack where she spins to follow you (we are unsure if that clears it up that much)
bold palm
What about the barrels those guys throw?
dusty storm
uhhhh we think those are legally like, lobbed explosives
which, for athena, would have been reflected, but they don't seem to work for hestia
dusty storm
man.
we've beaten ||Eris|| 2/3 runs and have yet to beat ||Chronos|| every time we've gotten down to him
cobalt shard
sorry, you've done three total surface runs and won two of them??
bold palm
I have become bodied so hard over and over
dusty storm
sorry, you've done three total surface runs and won two of them??
eyup
almost won our first one too tbh
just got slammed by the shotgun and such
dawn musk
just "you might sometimes take 20 damage because you had no way of knowing which...
Seems pretty consistent that wave-like projectiles aren't affected
weary steeple
christ
||almost beat eris first try, both on magic pixel health, hestia's dash was kind of mandatory||
bold palm
Oh that's a point hestia's dash seems like it'd be amazing for that fight
weary steeple
just gobbling up bullets yum
rose holly
||misread that’s as hestia’s death and was upset I got THAT spoiled :3||
weary steeple
||NOOOO HESTIA DONT GO. I NEED YOU TO BE MY HADES 1 DIVINE DASH||
neat harbor
Oh that's a point hestia's dash seems like it'd be amazing for that fight
||both times i beat her eris was really easy because of that dash||
||it counters 90% of her moves||
bold palm
Yeaaah I've beaten them once and it was not that dash. And even that was insanely lucky
bold palm
Okay so this is decently late game stuff so spoilered but
||I've got two animal companions, Frinos and the... cat that I forget their name. What others are knocking around that I should look out for? What treat bonuses do people like feeding them?||
worthy anchor
Haven't seen any others that I could recruit. There's a ||pollcat|| and... one more... that hung around the crossroads early on, but they lack animations and eventually leave to "scout".
bold palm
I want animalbs
worthy anchor
I'm certain there will be more 🙂
So far I've bonded for bonus health - the tool use eventually becomes 3 per run, as long as you swap, and that's good enough for me.
dawn musk
Haven't seen any others that I could recruit. There's a ||pollcat|| and... one m...
Those are ||Hecate's||, so I doubt you'd ever be able to take them with you
worthy anchor
Ahh, that's a fair point.
fresh nebula
Okay so this is decently late game stuff so spoilered but
||I've got two animal...
I cant get the cat 😦
Which is really annoying
covert egret
At least for me the moment I got the treats the cat stopped spawning
Presumably just bad luck, but super annoying
paper spire
Decent way to make Blitz Work; Have every hit of your Axe Charge Attack deal enough damage to activate it
weary steeple
Presumably just bad luck, but super annoying
for me it ||started to appear on the surface|| maybe your luck will be better just doing runs there? Haven't seen it much/given it a treat so not sure
weary steeple
Decent way to make Blitz Work; Have every hit of your Axe Charge Attack deal eno...
that must feel so good to play with 🤤
paper spire
There's a Demeter boon that makes your Omega cost 10 more mana but do double damage
weary steeple
weary steeple
There's a Demeter boon that makes your Omega cost 10 more mana but do *double da...
I love that one!!
cobalt shard
Decent way to make Blitz Work; Have every hit of your Axe Charge Attack deal eno...
well the blitz did about 25% as much as your attacks in total
while other boons can give around a 70% increase to attack damage
so even in optimal conditions it's still way worse than normal boons
cobalt shard
phew
paper spire
well the blitz did about 25% as much as your attacks in total
Oh I got it pretty late into the whole deal but you're not wrong, this is just the best it's felt
turbid sparrow
Hope they add a chance to change tools at boss fountain rooms
paper spire
That seems like the smartest way to go about it if they wanna keep it limited
Also didn't realize people weren't into her mobility :|a I love the dash/sprint
cobalt shard
it just feels really awkward
you never really want to sprint except for a few super telegraphed AOE attacks
and having a single dash with a long cooldown is rough
placid thistle
i always still dash
cobalt shard
like obviously you still need to dash
but it being so limited compared to the first game feels rough
oh i'd gotten mixed up
neat harbor
i kinda like not having more than one dash
covert egret
I like it most of the time but there are some attacks that can really screw you over if you dash poorly, in unfair-feeling ways
IMO if they gave you a bit more iframes on being hit or removed the hitstun it would be fine
gilded token
I think 1 dash but it's a bit better would be good
covert egret
I kind of hope they make sprint entirely automatic
Not sure why you have to hold the button right now
worthy anchor
well the blitz did about 25% as much as your attacks in total
Those aren't really ideal conditions, I think. I just had another successful blitz run, shoulda saved the stats...
I was using the flames (which, tbf, suck at damage dealing), with blitz on the special, and a hammer that made it melt armor.
So blitz was easy to have on there all the time, and with poseidon dash, trivial to trigger, too. the omega special reapplied it real fast, and then just keep sprinting...
And whenever you have to wait out an AoE, just spam specials.
That was pretty excellent.
Although all my poms and multipoms went to engagement ring because they all offered that and nothing else useful xD
So by the end, that did like 200 damage to any spawning enemies, and singlehandedly stopped the swarm that Scylla summons xD
So, I dunno. Blitz needs some support ideally (the Aphro Duo where sprint triggers it for x2 damage is great, fex) but it does do a bunch of damage very reliably.
bold palm
Heeeeey so...
this is... strong isn't it?
cobalt shard
Hephaestus on both attack and special seems pretty bad tho
Hephaestus is good if there's one you don't otherwise use
covert egret
One to break armor one to finish the kill
cobalt shard
but then what do you do for the twenty seconds in between
covert egret
Cast
(Is there a way to reduce that cd? Because I tend to avoid Heph boons for that reason)
cobalt shard
heph boons are good in that you can attack for twenty seconds, then get a little burst of bonus damage every once in a while from your special that you wouldn't otherwise use
since you often don't use both anyway
cobalt shard
eh a lot of duo boons are very niche
summer wren
but still strong in that niche
dusty storm
but then what do you do for the twenty seconds in between
wait
be patient
alternatively pom one up sufficiently so that that twenty seconds is looking more like 10.
(something we did do on our first surface run)
[4 second attack blast, like 12 special blast]
cobalt shard
i mean you could also take a boon that lets you attack as much as you want while doing nearly as much damage per attack 🤷♀️
covert egret
Does the blast scale with weapon damage? I assumed it would be good for giving things like the daggers a heavy hit that they're normally lacking (outside omega attack)
bold palm
Gaze upon my girth
Also the blast is by itself, and as you can see I got this one down to 4 seconds
dusty storm
i mean you could also take a boon that lets you attack as much as you want while...
well, not if you're using the torches :3
covert egret
Gaze upon my girth
bold palm
Wide Melinoe
Also I'm using the skull and one of the hammers means I fire more damage but the skulls drop slower
and they explode for damage when you pick them up
picking them up also counts for my melee explosion Hephy boon
so sometimes I just COLLECT them and people explode and die
Killed them! haha fuck you old man, it's the new age now
They give me the good booms
So this is pretty late game but here is a clip of my Boom Boom Boons
dusty storm
this dash glitch is hell
dawn musk
Sometimes you move in slow-mo and can only move via sprinting
Heard it's related to the Dark Side Hex
dawn musk
Ugh I got to third boss like three times then something changed and I barely get through second boss now
fresh nebula
No? why no?
It was bugged with the cat next spawning, but they seem to have hot fixed it, I have the cat!
fresh nebula
lol
Killed final bosso n lower path without using one of my 4 death defiances
Turns out "reduce any damage to max of 15" really does mean any damage
including his one hit kill attack
fresh nebula
Also, i wanna like Aspect of thanatos axe
dusty storm
what dash glitch?
The game gets us stuck in the sprint until we like attack or something, at which point we can't dash at all.
fresh nebula
but it's... kinda iffy.
fresh nebula
The game gets us stuck in the sprint until we like attack or something, at which...
Oh, i have gotten a different version wherei can only dash, and not move at all otherwise.
dusty storm
is it just the dash not working because it's on cooldown?
We wouldn't call it a bug if it wasn't a bug.
We know how to work around the dash's timing, thank you very much :p
worthy anchor
but it's... kinda iffy.
What's off for you?
(I haven't tried it yet. Only tried alternates for the staff, daggers and torches so far.)
fresh nebula
What's off for you?
(I haven't tried it yet. Only tried alternates for the staf...
so what it does is your omega hits give you crit chance - 1% per hit. Caps out at 20% fully upgraded, i think?
But the moment you take any damage, you loose all that crit chance
I still beat the final boss iwth it via Omega special abuse, but that was more down to having stuff to let me double up on it and extend the block longer
than actually benefiting from the axe's passive
(Also unlocked aspect of charon, and in the background Skelly yells "Aspect of WHO!?"
worthy anchor
Given that +20% crit seems strong, and ime axe usually rewards a playstyle where you tank the occasional hit, this seems like an interesting way to promote a very careful style instead.
But it also seems really hard to keep up.
fresh nebula
Yeah, it's mainly that you loose it all on any chip damage.
placid thistle
it generates extremely quickly, though
fresh nebula
I made it work through a bunch of stuff, but it was like... a minor part of the build
Ehhh
It doesnt, really, it's 1% per hit, on omega specials.
even the axe spin doesnt make it that fast
placid thistle
omega attack is very good at stacking it
fresh nebula
and hitting multiple things iwht an attack only gets you 1%
not 1% x number of things hit
Bkeeggh, my run has bugged and i cant use my omega cast anymore ;.;
And now i know why, it's my stupid imprevious hex
if i cvast that i cant use the hestia aim my cast anymore bit
covert egret
Ohhh that explains why I kept losing the ability to aim my cast
dawn musk
Neat little discovery, Demeter can inflict two separate statuses
I think she's like the one god that can do this
Her cyclone inflicts chill and her attack inflicts freeze
placid thistle
I believe aphro still has weak + charm
weary steeple
debating on turning on god mode just so my hands dont hurt as much playing
worthy anchor
Go for it! It's essentially an accessibility setting, so use it as such.
worthy anchor
I think she's like the one god that can do this
Yeah.
Zeus only has Blitz, Hera has Hitch, Apollo has Daze, Hephaestus has Vent, Poseidon has Slip and Hestia has Scorch.
Aphrodite has Weak and technically Charm, though that's on a single boon, iirc.
Demeter has Chill and Freeze.
dusty storm
we're betting that Hitch is a very solid effect for Origination just since it lasts a while and is easy to apply.
blazing shale
Side comment but I love Chaos' design in 2
placid thistle
we're betting that Hitch is a very solid effect for Origination just since it la...
that's what H2 calls the two-curse bonus, yeah?
i think hitch + rupture (or whatever poseidon's curse is called in 2) is probably the easiest combo to keep up
bold palm
slip
dusty storm
yup yup, Origination is the two-curse card
placid thistle
since vent has a pair of timing restrictions, blitz sucks, freeze has a CD, weak isn't really on what aphro wants to be doing most
dusty storm
Slip is also very good.
placid thistle
and scorch has its own dps problem
dusty storm
But Weak is fairly easy to apply (Glamour Gain has it active literally all the time and the cast applies it easily [though the same goes for Scorch])
covert egret
Chill is pretty easy to maintain as well
dusty storm
also minor tech we think Scorch is affected by Evil Eye
placid thistle
i suppose glamor gain is a good one, yeah
novel kernel
Just grabbed Hey Deez 2 and had a good old time, Hephaestus is my man
dawn musk
since vent has a pair of timing restrictions, blitz sucks, freeze has a CD, weak...
I think Freeze still counts even on cool down
dawn musk
I distinctly remember still hearing the Origination slash smash sound even when I hit mobile enemies
Granted was late at night so might have not paid close attention
fresh nebula
Daze is a good one too, and apollo has good boons in general
placid thistle
damn, 55?
dusty storm
Fitting that we did so with ||Thanatos' scythe, as pointed out by Melinoe||
placid thistle
long run
dusty storm
We were taking ||phase 2|| slowly since
the ||genre change to a bullet hell|| does hit
but we managed it
dawn musk
How did you dodge Chronos's attacks
I hate how much the lunge and swipe attacks get me
pulsar swallow
Can you block his attacks with the axe special?
fresh nebula
Can you block his attacks with the axe special?
A chunk of them, yes
pulsar swallow
Nice
bold palm
Any of the orbs are blockable, I think some of the rips are too
cobalt shard
one thing to remember is that as long as you're standing behind his back he can't hit you with anything that isn't telegraphed
bold palm
also I've found often a good way to avoid his attacks are to dodge into him.
yeah, get behind him. It's one of the things the daggers are super useful for
by the time you've engaged on him he's facing the wrong direction
dawn musk
||Just got to Chaos's conversation about Chronos, damn Chaos why did you go and do that lmao||
dawn musk
by the time you've engaged on him he's facing the wrong direction
It gets tricky when he uses his two scythe swipe attack
pulsar swallow
Dodging into enemies is good praxis
bold palm
Also, I actually kinda love Hephy and Aphrodite together
he only does double swipes in the second half of the first phase
so you can know when to expect him to start double swiping
I know there's a duo boon with HephxAph and I remember it was pretty damn nice but can't remember what the fuck it does
I think it might have been playing around armour but my brain is fried
fresh nebula
I know there's a duo boon with HephxAph and I remember it was pretty damn nice b...
Soft Caress - first damage you take is turned into healing instead.
I dunno if getting hit in armor counts as "Damage" is the one issue i can think of
fresh nebula
Well, that seems kinda butts theen, because you dont benefit if the hit crunks your armor
i guess?
or does it convert the hit into extra armor, in which case lol
bold palm
So they would hit me while I was in armour, do soft caress to heal me, then have to chew through my armour
It's only like 10 armour so you've always got a bit of health missing from previous fights
fresh nebula
It can actaully be quyite a bit higher if you get it rare+
bold palm
but it means you're not missing much off the top because armour's taken hits, then if you get hit it turns it to healing, and you can play around with having armour to try and help heal more if need be
fresh nebula
Heph/Hera's b oon is fucking werid.
bold palm
I haven't seen that one
fresh nebula
givs you a monster 200% damage boost.
...as long as your attack or special doesnt have a boon attached.
It's kinda good, but also kinda awful?
bold palm
Seen a Apollo/Hera boon that revives the first creature you kill in a fight to fight for you
I'm not sure how I feel about Heph/Hera's one there. It's like... super good for some things but you really restrict yourself
I suppose that's the point, Hera seems all about restrictions and punishments
fresh nebula
The issue i have with it is hera/heph is a combo that wants both things to be booned
so you can easily hitch stuff then use a hephy for big aoe damage
bold palm
Do you need both for it or does it give you the bonus if you don't have attack but do have special?
fresh nebula
it's a bonus to whichever ones dont have a boon
There's no way to trade in boons either htoguh
bold palm
It's definitely one that you can base your entire playstyle around
But unless it's that, it's kinda poop
fresh nebula
My main issue is there's no way to get rid of an attack/special boon that i know of
I think the qualifactions are reasonbly okay to get it
bold palm
Only trade stuff and that's replacing it
fresh nebula
i need to check (i unlocked the "See the requriments" incantaion and that's so damn useful)
bold palm
I just picked up the hera/hestia boon, or at least looked at it... trying to remember what it does
fresh nebula
I just picked up the hera/hestia boon, or at least looked at it... trying to rem...
Gimme a mo
Hera/Hestia is inflict scorch while channeling your omega moves.
Mainly let down by scorch itself being kinda bad
bold palm
Eh I find it decent, specially if you can get it so it pops
though it could do with a bit of a faster tick
But yeah, that's the one
dawn musk
I think scorch is good for killing mooks? Like inflict scorch then once they have enough to die just ditch them to burn out and handle the next group?
But then might as well use that for any boon that gives extra damage
bold palm
I'm honestly not sure if scorch even effects guardians...
fresh nebula
it does!
dawn musk
It does
Just they have too much health lol
There was a vid of someone chunking the game with scorch
Using Hephaestus and Demeter's duo with Hestia
bold palm
Oh yeah freezer burn or whatever it is
I've seen it but not sure I got it off properly
pulsar swallow
Scorch has, afaict, a set 40dps, until you get the boon which causes it to instant burst for 50~% when you hit 150
Fire extinguisher!
worthy anchor
Yeah, without that it's just too slow. Probably even if you get the boon that doubles its speed.
I managed to get like 60k Scorch on a miniboss once.
Sure, I could just wait until it dies, but that'd take ages.
Blitz is actually pretty good though.
If you've got a quick way of triggering it, it's solid.
F.ex: Poseidon sprint does enough to trigger it.
Or the Aphro/Zeus duo that makes sprint trigger it for 2x damage.
dawn musk
Seems even the weaker status effects have ways to be made potent with the support boons
worthy anchor
Right now, I think all effects and gods work on their own except Scorch (which only works with the burst boon).
It is neat for keeping the "2curses on enemy give bonus damage" thing going though.
It just needs to tick down a lot faster - ideally scaling somehow.
Maybe something like "every group of 400 scorch ticks down individually". So you put down 800 scorch and it ticks down twice as fast, and so on.
pulsar swallow
I mean thats basically fire extinguisher?
worthy anchor
No, that one consumes it immediately at a certain threshold.
This would make it more like H1's Dionysus debuff - more stacks mean faster ticks, not just longer duration.
And importantly, it wouldn't depend on getting that specific boon.
So that without the boon it's 40dps up to 400 stacks, then 80 up to 800 and so on. (Obvs numbers are placeholders and would need to be balanced properly)
And then with the boon you can no longer get the higher tickrate, since you use the stacks up before then, but instead you get the burst damage.
Which avoids the silly situations of being able to stack millions of scorch damage on bosses for no benefit. If you stack it that high, it starts ticking down so fast, it's almost instant - like the boon, but at much higher numbers.
So you can then try to just apply lots, or you can use the boon and have a similar but weaker effect at lower numbers.
Right now, as far as I can tell, Scorch is pretty useless unless you have the boon to trigger it or are using it to keep 2 curses on the enemy for a damage boost.
(well, okay, except against very weak enemies, where you can sometimes leave them to burn down while you go deal with the next group)
fresh nebula
Looking at things, it looks like we're going to get at least 2 more familars.
maybe 3 more
There's two more moon icons on the ground for familars to sit, but there's a rubbed out emptyh one too
bold palm
I got bothered by a miniboss recently, cause those weird big darkness causing things that you can have one as a miniboss in the first area, they don't take damage if you're not standing inside their shadow. This includes scorch already on them, which is sucky.
I thought I could put a ton of scorch on them and leave and they'd cook in their own shadow but nope.
dawn musk
It gets funny when third area boss summons a bunch of them prior to second phase
Can't even see anything
bold palm
Ah frick the darkness
dawn musk
Lmao
Turns out you can kill ||Roxy so fast that she doesn't play her death animation, and still plays her attack animations but they don't affect you at all||
bold palm
I was so prepared to fight through life after life, check out my death defies, but a mix of Coarse Grit and Slow Cooker I burned that bastard to the ground.
dawn musk
Woo congrats
I am still getting got by the second part of first phase
Does he get easier to deal with in the second phase?
weary steeple
sorta
he uses more projectiles and arena attacks instead of spamming the 3-hit combo of scythe and charges ime
i like the 2nd phase more than the first
bold palm
I then turned around and bodied the second top boss
finished the fight with the Hephy run boon which was a 550 explosion boon that turned into vent
worthy anchor
Man, H2 is a bunch longer than Hades. Even a decent run just takes rather longer.
I didn't have lots of powerful boons, but enough.
weary steeple
yeah i keep finding that the hades 2 runs just chop an hour of my day off
turbid sparrow
surface runs are already pretty long, wonder how much that time will come down once I max out my psyche and upgraded arcana
worthy anchor
I'm pretty close to that, and well - this run still took 45'.
I think a great run can probably get that down to 30'? But holy hell, 9' per biome is gonna be tricky to do! Not like the 12' that the first limit gave in H1.
bold palm
kbitty
weary steeple
i got a pretty okay surface run that landed me 22, but underworld ones take sooo long
on that note i wish ||Eris|| had more tells to what she was going to do
bold palm
At this point I just try and put the frog between me and her until she's done with her moves
weary steeple
ohh smart
fresh nebula
Boy i do not like aspect of pan
i can see how it works and it's high points, but it's just way too fussy
bold palm
it's just cast and right click right?
fresh nebula
Sure, if something is in your cast, and if it's not too far away causing the proejctiles to run out of time, and if they all manage to home
paper spire
It works wonders with the Hestia or Zeus Cast-Targetter, beat my first run with that'n
bold palm
There's also Apollo's one that expands even more as it goes along
and hera's one that means it lasts for ages
Won't work well with Hephy's cause Hephy's makes it smaller
paper spire
Also the Dagger Hammer Special Upgrades are so good
fresh nebula
and hera's one that means it lasts for ages
I found this made it worse, honestly. Killed your ability to retarget bosses
bold palm
Giving Pan daggers a test and oh boy
I got lucky with a hammer
it almost instantly gives you fully charged special
bold palm
Pop goes the Weasels
dusty storm
We believe this was the immediate next run. ||And with a Vow no less.||
dusty storm
I hate how much the lunge and swipe attacks get me
Abuse your i-frames. The dash has a lot of them, and as long as you time the dash right, his slash won't be able to touch you.
dawn musk
Yeah, I tend to just sprint
Doesn't help with bad reaction lol
Thanks, gonna try it when I can
bold palm
I know I got lucky with an early "immediately get full special charge" but damn
Also, third most damage, "Aphrodite". Do NOT anger her
dusty storm
We have a tendency to run the axe, though our most successful runs tend to be with other weapons.
...Though our first successful Chronos run was with the axe so...
bold palm
This last one was me trying out the Pan daggers, since I wanted to give the homing shots a try
I'll switch to whatever has the dark thirst on it at that moment
though I will admit my least favoured is the torches, if only because the right click doesn't make people flinch
dawn musk
Whats everyone's favorite weapon?
Staff and torch
I like the staff's Omega, and the torch is spam incarnate so fun
proven orchid
Whats everyone's favorite weapon?
dagger and staff
worthy anchor
Tho axe is a close third.
bold palm
The skull is pretty cool honestly
I'm not the biggest fan of it's version that stores the attacks in the weapon and they explode around you though
But the base form is super fun
dawn musk
I just got the skull and I liked it too
Damage of the axe but way faster
Collecting the skulls isn't that big of an issue since you can just charge through with the special
worthy anchor
Yeah. It really only feels slow if you get that one hammer. Still torn on how good it is, gotta try it a few more times.
And I maintain that it really wants 4 skulls default, with how good the +2 skulls hammer is.
dawn musk
I think if you have the mana to spare then it's pretty good
If you're doing a no arcana run then maybe a lot weaker since I feel that most of the strength comes from how powerful the Omegas are
Also woo made it to Chronos phase 2
Misclicked and charged into the insta-kill zone
worthy anchor
nooo
dawn musk
Speaking of arcana
So the bottom right arcana is just for people doing no arcana run right?
worthy anchor
Sorta? I mean... combine it with the Circe keepsake and you can get a lot of Arcana active, tbh.
fresh nebula
Funny discovery
Echo's "Boon from the previous night"
Can give you duo boons. Including drumroll Queen/King's ransom. When you have no hera or zeus boons whatsoever XD
dawn musk
Oh lmao
worthy anchor
I hope that's something they'll fix, as funny as it is^^
fresh nebula
Nah, it should stay because it's hilarious
One of these boons isn ot like the other, one of these booons doesnt belooong~
novel kernel
Did my first few runs with the wands, seemed pretty neat but the firerate left a lot to be desired, really made me miss the crossbow in 1
Excited to give the axe a whirl
fresh nebula
The wands are just werid.
I would like to like them, but they're just... not good.
The best thing they've got is the omega special a,dn it's just awkward as fuck
absoloute miss for me, which is very annoying
(As in, i am grumpy they made it this far with this design, because it's a very ???)
dawn musk
Really? I love the wand
fresh nebula
Just super awkward for me, no easy high points
but my favourites are the staff and daggers
dawn musk
It feels somewhat reminiscent of Malphon
fresh nebula
aka "Dash in and rip shit apart"
dawn musk
Like I interrupt my attack with dashes with the occasional special
The wand seems like ranged weapon but I feel that it's played more like dive bomber sort of way?
fresh nebula
Mm, i just do not enjoy the wand, i find it very awkard as a whole
I susepct i'm a little grumpoy in that i woulda liked them to bring something like the spear back?
sometiems there's a "Reinventing the wheel" feel going on
dawn musk
I feel like the staff is this game's spear
pulsar swallow
I mean, the staff is kinda like the Spear, in that it's linear, ranged special
Yeah
fresh nebula
Probably true enough! It's been a loooong time since i played the first game
Look, i just want to steal exagryph from Eris 😛
dawn musk
Lmao
I wanna see the rest of the weapons
Doubt that any of them will make a return but who knows
fresh nebula
Well, we're missing 1 + the aspects
er, the transofmring apsects thing
you know what i mean <.<
dawn musk
Those are the non-Greek myths aspect right?
fresh nebula
Yeah
Excalibur, Guan-Yu, Ramna, Beowulf, Gilgamesh, Lucifer (WHY DO I REMEBER THESE)
dawn musk
Brain worm
fresh nebula
I would like my brain to remeber actually useful information, thankk you very much
i was a big Excalibur and Gilgamesh fan
dawn musk
I don't think I ever meshed with any of them
Wonder how Zag would fare against Hades 2
fresh nebula
His shitty casts would be a huge issue.
fresh nebula
D oesnt help vs stuff like the opirahana swarms
dawn musk
At least they don't blow up this time thankfully
worthy anchor
D oesnt help vs stuff like the opirahana swarms
I think he could handle them fine with various of his boons and some hammers. Exagryph could probably do it just with grenades.
I don't think he'd struggle too much.
bold palm
Excalibur, Guan-Yu, Ramna, Beowulf, Gilgamesh, Lucifer (WHY DO I REMEBER THESE)
I'm high fiving your brain worm and you can't stop me
also I rocked the Lucifer
Dionysus attack on the Luci applied so much dot so quickly it just melted people
I am actually in Penguin's camp here, there's something missing about the wands. I can use them fine, I did a scorch/special run with them and beat Chronos, but I feel very defenseless when I use them. Tapping the special button won't cause the enemies hit to flinch, and I don't always feel like I have control of where my attacks are going.
Honestly, I just want the option to turn them into a flamethrower or something. Let me feel strong while using them and not like I have to spam special taps and leave the area to hope the enemy gets hit
dawn musk
I don't use the special much
I tend to hold attack and dash around
The special is just there to occasionally lend more DPS or add statuses
fresh nebula
I'm clearly doing it wrong with them. I'll have to try focusing on attack and give them another go
What boons do you favour @dawn musk
dawn musk
I think I tend to avoid Zeus, Aphrodite, and Hephaestus on attack
The rest is fair game
fresh nebula
Aph really feels like you need daggers/staff/axe to truly shine
I did well with aph special on momo staff though, that was funny
Also I gotta finish upgrading all my arcana. It's niggling at me I might be sleeping on how good the bottom left 4 are - though it means giving up a bunch of the scaling attack boons
Not sure how good the Artificer one is though, it's very over priced?
But like more boons makes gunning for the really good legendary boons a possiblity. Apollo, Demeter & posiden all have amazing ones, I know that much
Apollo is double attack on omegas, just very good on any weapon that likes using it's omegas. Posiden is bigger aoe... And a monster 150% damage boost to his splash effects on guardians.
Demeter is the good ol "enemies fucking die" at 10%
Hephs seems weird, very weapon dependant, and I don't know if it works if you're already upgraded?
Zeuses seems too random, I have no idea how to evaluate aphs, I don't know what hera's does, and I have no idea how to evaluate Hestia's because burn DPS is... Bad.
Mercury has a really good one
dawn musk
So Heph is occasional 400 to 600 damage
fresh nebula
Oh, right Hera's is a massive damage reduction thing
dawn musk
It's fine but it just means you have to rely on on alpha strikes, so it's better with weapons with a fast special like sister blades or staff
fresh nebula
So Heph is occasional 400 to 600 damage
How so?
Oh, no, I'm meaning this legendary boon
dawn musk
Oh oops
fresh nebula
His*
dawn musk
I haven't seen too many of them
fresh nebula
Basically train of thought is:
If you're taking the lower left 4 arcana, you're giving up various attack up arcana for +2 boons and selection across a run. Which to me says you're trying to force a legendary boon ASAP
(+2 boons because 300g is 2 boom purchases in a shop)
Boon* even, GDI.
And if you're trying to force a legendary boon as fast as possible, then which gods are worth this?
Apollo, Hera, Posiden and Demeter are the ones who leap out to me
bold palm
I've used artificer a few times, it is rather expensive to use but it van turn a forced bones/ashes/psyche room into a centaur heart or nectar room. I know there's others but those are the two results I've had so far.
For a six cost arcana it sure is a one use a run random change though
It's never a bad item to get, just a bit uncertain at times you know?
Also I love the concave stone
Free boon is such a cool reward, specially on the early run when the more boons the better and I don't need healing or damage trinkets
fresh nebula
Free boon is such a cool reward, specially on the early run when the more boons ...
My current keepsake strategy is God keepsake to start, then concave or moon water in act 2, usually the other in act 3, and Knucklebones in act 4
Mainly because fuck you Chronos ~
The narcissus one is also really good in act 2/3 if I need the healing and have a common boon worth upgrading, since you can switch to it, immediately benefit, keep it though the act, benefit from post act fountain, switch keepsake
bold palm
The blackened fleece is pretty good for the final boss too if you have an omega build like I did the pan fire build
Like free 20% damage at base yummy
worthy anchor
Wowza. So I went and checked my records for runs, and for one, this game feels like runs will be longer than in Hades 1, but also, there's a massive difference between surface and underworld for now.
My best underworld run is just shy of 45', my best surface run is just about 15'!
Oops, no, it's 30'. Missed that one.
Still.
bold palm
Heck yeah
what were you rocking?
Also, what do people think would be the best set up to start a Judgement run?
The three you're allowed to pick
blazing shale
The twin blades or whatever they're called
bold palm
Like Death Defy is good but I don't know about starting with it, maybe the one where you increase your health and mana as you go?
The twin blades do be real tasty
Uh the progression one can't be included...
dawn musk
I'd say mana regen, sprint boost, and omega slowdown
worthy anchor
Depends on what you wanna build, but mana regen, omega slowdown and chance to get upgraded boons would be my go-to.
Or alternatively omega slowdown, sprint and damage in casts, if that's valid (since it also activates the dodge).
hot wren
weary steeple
LETS GOO THATS CLASS /ref
boreal vale
📢 Your Sprint is innately faster and turning is more responsive; re-scaled abilities that boost this
📢 You now can Dash out of many attack recovery animations more reliably
📢 You now can gather from any resource point once you have unlocked the corresponding Gathering Tool; you now can Prioritize any available Tool in the Training Grounds to make its resources appear as often as before, while resources for Tools you do not Prioritize will appear far less often
thank fucking god that's all i wanted
solar cloud
My husband did some relevant history research, quick scrolling tells me nobody's talked about this here but I could be wrong, sorry if it's old news. Spoilered, obvy.
Themes of ||syncretism|| also pop up to me with how ||Chronos looks extremely egyptian and the Fields look extremely catholic||
weary steeple
i recognize ||corinth|| from uhh! Oedipus! i think
that's really interesting and honestly
someone i knew noticed how ||Chronos looked very Egyptian but i didn't think too hard on that||
I'm glad those dots are connected now!
solar cloud
Those two cultures practiced a common form of syncretism where they'd say "oh yeah we just call your gods a different name!" so
weary steeple
:0
solar cloud
Long shot, pointing at the stands, "never in a million fucking years unless" level of theory:
||Chronos is doing all of this as a sick 'test' to prepare the pantheon for the future he saw: Other religions.||
weary steeple
oooo that's interesting!
that'd be cool to ||see some of the weapon aspect figures from hades one appear as characters||
solar cloud
||The Aspect of Lucifer is very definitely, specifically, the Lucifer of fellow Religious Fanfic Paradise Lost. So man can you imagine if we get a mainline actionized Megaten game with better gameplay than Raidou The Devil in our game??||
dawn musk
Long shot, pointing at the stands, "never in a million fucking years **unless**"...
||"So your being an asshole was a test?"||
||"That was just me, my girl."||
solar cloud
Trying to square that we need endless runs like H1 with the fact that the big man is an actual villain now, basically
Also ||Chronos's theme just straight up has egyptian instruments in it. It's ancient egyptian techno metal. There's something else going on here.||
dawn musk
Mmm
Wonder how they would ever make Mel and Chronos's relationship become more amicable
rose holly
A necessary alliance against a greater threat makes sense
Tbh I could see other routes like… unlocking over time in the full story
And the baseline underworld run is kept as like, training grounds or something
dusty storm
There are elements shaking up in the narrative for Melinoe to become overall more sympathetic towards Chronos as well.
Like, he's not a good guy, but some of what Eris, Nemesis, Arachne are saying (among others) is making me a touch suspicious of Hecate and, all-in-all, our role in supporting a somewhat wretched status quo
covert egret
Just got ||Word of Greater Girth|| and it pitched Mel's voice down an octave, this is my favorite thing
dusty storm
The ||other one that shrinks you|| makes your voice higher pitched instead, it's cool
placid thistle
Just got ||Word of Greater Girth|| and it pitched Mel's voice down an octave, th...
who's that from?
||medea?||
||circe?||
boreal vale
||circe||
cobalt shard
hey look, that was me!
i am the giant dumbass who thought the cutscene froze with no way to advance because i didn't think to test WASD, and submitted a bug report for it
bold palm
Same, but it was thankfully brief
prime timber
So, I have no idea how to make the Torches effective. Any hints, or is it just kind of a stinker of a weapon?
boreal vale
it's definitely teh weakest weapon
and it's awkward
my advice is use the special more
and only use the attack when you have room to fire up
prime timber
Duly noted.
cobalt shard
i think the best piece of advice for the torches is to get the hammer upgrade that makes the specials do three times as much damage
preferaby also with the hammer upgrade that makes them travel in a straight line
for the best projectile in the game
though that's obviously very rarely going to actually happen
dawn musk
Why does everyone suggest using the special?
Like you can dash while attacking, treat it like you're using Malphon
boreal vale
malphon did much better damage and also you had better dashing
the torches lock you into a slow movement state and the weakened dash makes you very vulnerable to getting caught out of place
dawn musk
You are never out of place if you aren't in the middle of a group
boreal vale
the special does comparable damage to the attack, lets you keep your fully mobility, and is spammable
it's just basic risk/reward
prime timber
Malphon was faster with its attacks.
My biggest problem with the torches is that the attacks come out so slow
boreal vale
also that yes
they're slow enough that some enemies won't be consistently stunned by them
dawn musk
But that wouldn't be a concern when you are well outside of their range
boreal vale
when you can cast, back up, and fire consistently it's decent
but there's so many rooms and especially bosses where that's not possible
prime timber
The range isn't also great.
boreal vale
particularly with the crappy range on the default attack yeah
and the weird speed of it
where it acts like a projectile with momentum and sometimes just comes to a halt before impact
prime timber
The collision is awful
It's what made me stop using Moros.
Because sometimes they'll just stop right in front of me
boreal vale
it's awkward, unsuited for many encounters, makes you more vulnerable than most weapons, and you look like an idiot holding it
it's definitely the worst weapon
dawn musk
I think I'll just disagree and leave it at that
boreal vale
it's either it or axe and axe is much better in this patch since they reduced the lag time on being able to dash out
boreal vale
axe has a basically useless attack omega and a somewhat awkward special omega
but with the dash change it's a lot nicer feeling to use
boreal vale
i always evaluate omegas by "can I use this to overcome the actually challenging encounters"
and the axe omega is just not good at them
it's fun to spin to win through chaff but the vulnerability is so bad
fresh nebula
"actually challenging encounters" is very nebulous though
That's going to vary a lot based on personal player skill and build approaches
prime timber
It shreds through Scylla and Poly, and Chronos with cronies.
boreal vale
anything that locks you down like that is just bad as you increase the intensity
fresh nebula
Also there's always Apollo axe
Which is the funniest shit because your range becomes gigantic
fresh nebula
"I have decided to hit the entire room"
Hera/Charon with Apollo Cast is some nice stuff
I don't like Hera's cast at all
fresh nebula
The worst bit is the duration increase doesn't hit stuff like Demeter's cyclone
prime timber
My go-to for "I just want things to die in here" is Demeter or Hestia for Cast.
In that those two make me remember to use the damn thing.
fresh nebula
Hitch is really good except if you get Hera/Aphro boon
Which seems great but in practice just wrecks the use case of Hitch
fresh nebula
My go-to for "I just want things to die in here" is Demeter or Hestia for Cast.
I really like Apollo or Zeus omega casts
boreal vale
you just gotta get something else for thrown cast
prime timber
Zeus does have a tasty Omega cast, yeah.
boreal vale
if you manage to get hades to give you his it's probably the best one
fresh nebula
Posiden Omega is nice sometimes too
boreal vale
poseidon omega is good except when it has anti-synergy with something else you have lol
fresh nebula
I'm not actually a huge fan of thrown casts, I like being able to drop and run
True enough, but Poisy has so much for good stuff.
When his double chance one goes off, boy does it go off
And he's do happy about it!
boreal vale
poseidon is my pick for strongest overall god in this one so far
but that might just be weapon choice
i luv flat damage
fresh nebula
I mean, he's great on Staff and Daggers, two of the strongest weapons
And both of them like his boon on either attack or special
boreal vale
i'm not sure if artemis daggers is the best weapon but it's certainly the most fun so far
fresh nebula
I still need to unlock that. I don't like Pan daggers, but base daggers are so much fun
boreal vale
they're really good and fun
fresh nebula
How about more damage?.
boreal vale
it's better than axe block because it's not directional and it lasts as long as you're holding the omega charge
fresh nebula
To the point that getting the over channel axe special is very good
dawn musk
if you manage to get hades to give you his it's probably the best one
Hades's sticks to enemies, so might not be ideal sometimes
fresh nebula
Side note, you can dash between the parry and the deployment of the special explosion with Axe
boreal vale
and it then gives a brief invincibility window so if you react to the noise you can just release the button and instantly Get Started
fresh nebula
Which opens up it's uses a fair bit
dawn musk
It throws off the aiming though
boreal vale
yeah it winds up aimed in the direction of your dash
which is weird and awkward
anyway, parrying into the crit chance is amazing
get aphrodite on attack and just watch the Big Hits roll in
fresh nebula
I'm pretty sure I've been able to dash backwards and send it forward, I'll have to test
covert egret
You can also dash during the final attack in the axe primary combo
Though again it aims in the direction you dashed
It's weird since I don't think you can dash during the attacks of any other weapon? Except torches ofc
dawn musk
It's weird since I don't think you can dash during the attacks of any other weap...
I find that you can always dash out before an attack finishes
covert egret
Yeah but normally it cancels the attack, no?
dawn musk
Nope
boreal vale
yeah no
dawn musk
Got hit a bunch of times because I spammed the attack on the staff and dashed before it finished
boreal vale
dash-partioning your combos was a big part of hades 1
in terms of getting the most of certain weapons
as far as I can tell it's the same here but you have less reactive dashing so you have to be more careful lol
covert egret
Oh, do you mean canceling the post-attack animation?
dawn musk
I don't think you can?
covert egret
You definitely could with some weapons in H1
boreal vale
yeah stricty speaking you can dash during the startup of the followup animation
the axe final blow is just very long
so you have a long time to get away with it lol
dawn musk
I feel like you felt like you could because H1's weapons were way faster
covert egret
Hm, maybe it's just more visible on that one
dawn musk
2's are a lot more committal
covert egret
I feel like you felt like you could because H1's weapons were way faster
No, it was very obvious on a few of them
Magnet Gloves spring to mind
boreal vale
it's also tricky because you have to keep in mind that doing that sort of dashing doesn't trigger "dash-strike"
that's a specific attack that comes out of a raw dash into action
if you dash midcombo you will not get a dash strike
(imo they should make some weapons have a "sprint strike" in this one)
(unused design space!!)
covert egret
In H1 it was pretty easy to accidentally disrupt some of the combos with dash strikes, again the gloves spring to mind
covert egret
I suspect because they had a very short or nonexistant window to dash during the attack
boreal vale
so you just got a raw dash into strike
covert egret
because the combo was so fast you rarely partioned it
I partitioned it all the time, you really needed to on higher heat - just had to be careful to not click during the dash, lol
(Or at least you needed to with my playstyle)
boreal vale
i usually wanted the dash strike anyway on the gloves
lots of good dash strike options on them
covert egret
It was nice but the dps of going first half combo > dash strike > first half again wasn't as great as going first half > dash > second half IIRC
Loved the magnet gloves dash strike though
boreal vale
yeah strictly speaking it was worse dps but they had good dash strike hammers
and I liked picking up artemis dash too
covert egret
They had such good hammers
I used Athena dash as something of a crutch, it was just too good
boreal vale
it was very good but I got bored of it
I basically tried to only use it on merciless end setups
covert egret
Ha, fair
boreal vale
where it was the final fucked up piece to turn doom into DOOM
weary steeple
got a 35 minute chronos run, it's a lot better than the 50 min ones 😅
prime timber
OK so following the advice of "Use the special instead for Torches" has helped immensely.
boreal vale
yep
regardless of if the attack is actually good or not, if you're not vibing with it the special lets you play differently and will make you feel better lol
prime timber
It now feels actually usable.
solar cloud
They gotta do something about the gamefeel though
The Rail had worse range, you couldn't move and shoot, and the mortar was much trickier than the special... it also felt a lot more badass to actually use!
boreal vale
a lot of is basically the dash changes undermining stuff you could do in the first game
solar cloud
Yall were extremely right too that you look like a goober holding them out like that. What poses would you do? I was thinking the classic one up in front, one arm arched up and behind that dual wielders love?
boreal vale
which makes certain weapon archtypes feel bad
solar cloud
They want you sprinting in cases you'd dash soam in the first game I think
boreal vale
yeah i don't know what pose I'd do other than definitely not that one
solar cloud
The ninja run with em looks great!
One of the only weapons from Bastion that Supergiant has never really went back to in any way way was the flamethrower. Maybe they could take some ideas from that
placid thistle
Yall were extremely right too that you look like a goober holding them out like ...
imo just floating behind her like Hekate
solar cloud
Oh SHIT YEAH
dusty storm
Hera's cast is awful.
Okay we're gonna have to hard disagree here, Engagement Ring is so fucking useful if you aren't using your Cast for damage.
It hitting every reinforcement/misc. spawn for like, 100 free damage is so handy.
Every boss has summons, and a fair few of them summons mooks that will get one-tapped by that 100 damage. The other reinforcements don't exactly like it either.
In normal rooms, it's exceptionally good at countering swarm enemies and it can basically act as your AoE for the entirety of Oceanus.
The cast lasting forever is a bit of a double-edged sword, but anything that steps in the Cast is unlikely to be able to leave for its entire like 10 second duration. ||Phase 2 Cerberus|| has a couple attacks that become functionally nonexistent thanks to it.
It's definitely not something you'll want to always take, and we could see it starting to fall off at ||higher Fear levels (in particular the one that gives every enemy a Barrier)|| but it's very useful in our experience.
cobalt shard
yeah engagement ring is extremely useful
fresh nebula
It's definitely not something you'll want to always take, and we could see it st...
The enemy has a barrier thing is ugggghhh
L:ike it's such a non issue for dagger/staff, but at the same time it shuts down a ton of interesting boons.
dusty storm
It's probably the easiest one tbh
fresh nebula
Probably, but easy != Fun.
cobalt shard
for me, the "enemies may be from the next zone" pact has been by far the easiest
the vast majority of the game is completely unaffected, and the enemies that do get upgraded aren't that big a power difference
fresh nebula
Aww, i broke my arcane dress... on Scylla
managed to get not a lick of it damaged verus hectae, after she went on about it not surviving the lames
prime timber
God, I remember the Joy of getting a dress up to 80 armor
And then loosing it all to Hecate because of those damn Torches.
cobalt shard
I know it's a video game and they need a boss battle
but Hecate fighting you seems so dumb
like, even if you're not "worthy", there's no difference between you dying to Hecate and you dying in oceanis
the only difference Hecate is making to the fight against Chronos by challenging you is draining your health so you're less likely to succeed
prime timber
Well. It's a raw skill check.
If you can't handle the Titan that's taking it easy on you, what hope do you have against Chronos actually trying?
cobalt shard
yes but in-universe what reason does Hecate have for challenging you
prime timber
If you can't handle the Titan taking it easy on you, you're not going to be able to stop Chronos yet and need more training.
Literally the in-universe reasoning.
cobalt shard
if melinoe isn't ready to fight Chronos, she will die to some other enemy and there will be literally no downside
prime timber
Except she's now out of the forest of Erebus and could be more easily found.
cobalt shard
but she might get farther and get more resources to get stronger for future attempts
prime timber
But if she's not strong enough to break out of Chronos' time spell (that happens in Oceanus) then it's all meaningless.
And since you can keep fiddling with the Arcana, use different keepsakes from the gods, get different boons, it's something that needs to be checked each time
cobalt shard
and what if melinoe would have been strong enough to break out of the time spell, but battling a Titan weakened her so that she wasn't able to
prime timber
Also, after a certain point, taking care of Hecate is a formality.
It seems like you've already settled on this being a bad idea.
cobalt shard
if the situation was that melinoe would actually be hurt if she wasn't strong enough to proceed, it would make sense to test her
but that isn't what the situation is
it just feels unnecessary story-wise
prime timber
It's like Polyphemus says during one of his boss fights. Everyone slips up sometime. Maybe today's your day.
fresh nebula
Awww, nearly took out final bossy face without using a single death defiance
but i slipped up vs his one hsot attack
twice
because you can actually iframe it.
prime timber
The oneshot is a killer.
fresh nebula
The oneshot is a killer.
BOO THIS MAN
prime timber
The Demeter 15 damage limit also works against it!
fresh nebula
So i idndt get in the circle and didn't dodge it properly
rip
Also i had Meloine claiming that she came from the future with Chrono's help to stop him
he laughed it off
but i do wonder if they might do something with that to explain why chronos changes his ways
prime timber
I mean, I wouldn't mind a reconcilliation myself....
fresh nebula
I am trying to get Apollo/Zeus duo boon
i have been given Zeus/Demeter and Apollo/Demeter so far >.>
Finally!
Poor Chronos
Phase 2 just got destroyed
fresh nebula
@dawn musk So what Gods do you favour with the torches?
prime timber
The special is amazing for status, yeah.
Zeus also gets a mention for if you can get the big attacks going, because of the zaps.
covert egret
I am getting
very
very
tired of the stunlocks in this game
Think it's time for me to go play something else until it gets a few more updates
dawn musk
Hephaestus be like: "lol, lmao, even"
dawn musk
<@619688837266014248> Grats!
I learned to stand still in front of Chronos before he did his attack
Still face-tanked through the second phase but it's a start
fresh nebula
.,..
I just got kill stolen on Chronos ;.;
by my own resummoned Satyr
ps: The revive dead denemies thing does SO MUCH FUCKING DAMAGE
esp if y ou can get "They benefit from your special" and have a good % damage special
gilded token
(Last Boss Spoilers) holy fucking shit I love Melinoe
Also I did not expect to win with a Hestia build of all things'
rose holly
Hestia good! DOT was good in hades 1 and by god it’s good here too
gilded token
Hestia suffers immensily from the normal 40DPS limit
the immediate conversion to dmg boon was the silent MVP here
fresh nebula
I take back everything bad i said about Than Axe
This run was some nonsense
Than Axe with Apollo attack is just "The entire room is going to get blendered"
Also seriously, that bloody damage on Omega - 186k.
bold palm
Hell yeah
Also I got the Hephy/zeus boon and oh boy their dialogue contains the most acid lined "dad" I've ever heard
fresh nebula
Heph is just harsh towards his parents, which like, GET THEM HEPHY
worthy anchor
Ten Times, and probably my fastest run yet. Not perfect, but just squeaked in under 25'.
