#Helldivers 2: For Managed Democracy!

1 messages · Page 83 of 1

cobalt patrol
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Things are on cooldown? That bt is going on cooldown too.

tall stone
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Autocannon, HMG, Laser Cannon.

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These are the unsung heroes of the Dive.

stone bridge
cobalt patrol
stone bridge
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Not in my experience

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Would you be able to record a video of it when you have the time, potentially?

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I just have not had any luck without it being a major ammo sink

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But that was before they got nerfed, so

cobalt patrol
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Next time i'm streaming

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https://helldivers.wiki.gg/wiki/Bile_Titan

This claims their lower butt is Armor 5, and the AC is apprently AC4? But the but is fatal if blown off, and the armor drops to AC4 once the guts are g one. |

Also shooting them in the throat so yi'm hitting hte arms has worked out

Helldivers Wiki
Bile Titan

The Bile Titan is a massive, heavily-armored Terminid that appears to be the final growth stage of a Bile Spitter. Despite its size, it can quickly catch up to Helldivers, spewing its lethal bile onto them similarly to Bile Spewer. Helldivers near it can also be crushed by its hulking claws.
They can be found on Challenging difficulty as an Elim...

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(Wiki.gg is great for helldivers, it has a huge breakdown of the parts, damage thresholds, etc)

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For contrash, the autocannon is doing 240 damage a shot, and 240 durable.

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So the fact the guts are durable doenst stop you

unkempt river
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<@&1206091872716595200> I'm getting myself a snack, then would people be up for some games? I was thinking diff 7+

stone bridge
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yeag

sage plume
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yee

graceful bluff
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yag

unkempt river
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Sweet, I'll be on in like 2 minutes

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Or however long this bagel takes in the toaster

sage plume
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eat raw for flavour

unkempt river
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in vc

graceful bluff
cobalt patrol
cosmic spruce
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hey

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how is everyone doing

stone bridge
hexed steeple
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hasn't blowing the bile sacks with AC always been a good tactic tho? won't kill em but does make them a lot less threatening

cobalt patrol
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It's certainly a big tactic

unkempt river
odd arch
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as without sacs they start running into melee constantly

hexed steeple
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haven't had much trouble with that

cobalt patrol
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I still prefer ye olde OPSing. Though one thing autocannon can do is take advantage of Orbital Gatling/120 barrage or similar cracking their back armor

daring monolith
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I’ve really warmed up to OPS

Used to run airstrike, 500kg, railcannon, support weapon for bugs but OPS is taking the place of 500kg for me now. I’m also loving just dropping a gas strike on a bug hole

odd arch
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gas strike the goat

strange vine
odd arch
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expected reaction: holy shit I can pen now
real reaction: holy shit I don't have to walk forward to pen now

strange vine
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spore cloud has expanded...

image.png
burnt vapor
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This may affect the trout population

ionic holly
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NOT MY TROUTS

strange vine
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couple things id personally do to make the Charger more fun to fight:

  • Keep the high durable to the butt but reduce the health by 50%. The high durability is already a damage debuff to 90% of the weapons in the game, and it doesn't immediately kill the Charger anyway
  • Reduce the armor of the leg armor to 4. This lets AP4 support weapons be useful from the front but still require more work to handle than one of the AT weapons, and since the AP only matches the armor the damage is cut by 50% regardless.
  • When a Charger's leg armor is broken, disable its charging abilities. This means, much like how you can shoot off a Hulk's arms or disable their legs to force them to limp, you can neutralize the Charger's biggest threat while still keeping it a potential threat on the battlefield. If I lose 50% of my leg mass I sure as hell am not gonna be sprinting.
    For the Behemoth Charger
  • Same changes as the Charger, but let the frontal legs keep their 5 armor. Instead, reduce the armor health down to 600 so AT weapons can strip it. This time, instead of the AT weapons being an instant kill, you instead can just settle for a crippling from the front. Medium pen support weapons should still be able to penetrate and destroy the rear leg armor
  • Really reduce their spawn counts even more. Keep regular Chargers in the spawn pool at high difficulties, as since they're much easier to kill you can afford to spam them more while keeping them from being overwhelming as a Charger swarm used to be
graceful bluff
lethal badger
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Are the current mines like

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Really that bad

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I really like the idea of anti tank mines

strange vine
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Theyre like okay but not the best

lethal badger
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Oh reddit fucking hates them

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I'm just happy I got a new toy for free

tall stone
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They're mines, they trigger on everything and not just tanks.

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So they're really just about as meh as the other mines.

bold moat
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I had civies on an extract mission step on a few that some rando dropped

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Which is dumb

tight zephyr
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I'm mostly upset because we were deprived of The Bit.

strange vine
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Ehhh it was kinda overstaying its welcome

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3 times is more than enough

tall stone
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It wasn't going to get better than the hospital.

stone bridge
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Yeah fr

tight zephyr
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It's not like we gained or lost anything I guess.

graceful bluff
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The mines are nice on level 10 missions

tight zephyr
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I haven't done Level 10 yet.

tight zephyr
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Maybe I'll give it a go this weekend if I can get a full team in voice chat.

strange vine
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Mines in general need like a 40 second cooldown or something

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They really arent that impactful for the cooldown time they have

keen zinc
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fr

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200 seconds is so long for something staitonary

cobalt patrol
glacial light
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Being triggered by light enemies bother me considering the field is less dense and has less mines

tight zephyr
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Being told that “this loadout is what you must take” is part of what kind of turns me off of the high difficulty missions.

cobalt patrol
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Gives you a bunch of firepower to take on all comers for the bug hoard, everyone has infinite stamina zoom buttons

keen zinc
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i am a middle difficulty marvin

cobalt patrol
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I didn't actually say that. I said "this is the best approach I've seen so far".

keen zinc
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the problem is, in practice, it is actually is what you do need to do

cobalt patrol
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Which is very different to this is mandatory

keen zinc
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except if you dont do it or something like it, you spend 15 minutes filling your blood with cortisol and then failing

tight zephyr
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Wait what’s cortisol?

keen zinc
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stress hormone

cobalt patrol
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I don't really view "there are are a set of challenges you need to overcome, and you need to build around that' as a problem. Like as you say, that's what lower difficulty is for. Part of the fun of high difficulty stuff is in fact the build crafting and honing stuff to beat the challenges

tight zephyr
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Ah.

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I like the Punisher.

tall stone
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Again, this is why bots are great. Multiple solutions to the problems.

cobalt patrol
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Man, I don't get the stress hormone response to high difficulty. I just start laughing like a loon happily

tall stone
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Bug tell you to go fuck yourself and bring anti-tank.

tight zephyr
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And I prefer the MMG to the HMG.

cobalt patrol
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Punisher is really good!

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Also really good, I'm not Ann expert on the various MGs, they aren't my style

tight zephyr
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I find the MMG to be useful for most things I’d also use the flamethrower for.

cobalt patrol
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I've seen both the stalwart, mg & HMG do really well

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I'm just plain bad with the mgs, while I can make the flamethrower sing

tight zephyr
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And with Peak Physique you can use it almost as a primary, then use the Punisher Plasma.

cobalt patrol
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The evil bit on diff 9+ is you get multiple holes in a breech, instead of one.

So the usual flamethrower tactic of behold my cookout stops working

tight zephyr
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I tend to look at the Plasma as a weaker GL.

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(Because that’s basically what it is.)

cobalt patrol
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Punisher plasma into bots is just cheffs kiss

tight zephyr
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I’m way more comfortable with bots, yeah.

cobalt patrol
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Having a "delete this trooper swarm" button is very useful

tight zephyr
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I find the bugs to be way harder.

cobalt patrol
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I love them both, but they're very different experiences

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Bugs is a more traditional hoard shooter, but the counters are more extreme and defined

tight zephyr
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The constant pressure from bugs makes me get frustrated easily.

cobalt patrol
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Bots you play like an insurgent and it really rewards accuracy and weak point hunting in a way bugs don't

tight zephyr
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Yeah. It’s a lot easier for me to get my head around.

cobalt patrol
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It def can get frustrating, but it's often because things have gone sideways in the exact same way bots do (you're getting too much aggro/not focusing the objective properly)

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Generally if you aggressively smash an objective, and everyone works too suppress breeches when they appear, stuff is pretty manageable

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Watching a breech pop up only to be meet with two Gatling barrages and a gas strike will never not be funny

tight zephyr
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The constant pressure from the bugs is really difficult to manage for me.

cobalt patrol
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Bugs: maybe we just stay in the hole today

tight zephyr
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I struggle to fight Chargers, too. Like everyone else.

oblique lotus
cobalt patrol
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Chargers are mostly a distraction, I find.

The best way to kill them is just drop a stun grenade underneath them, then blow their butt off with something - breaker Incin can still do it, flamethrower & autocannon are great.

Obvs, commando/eats etc work

oblique lotus
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If you ask the subreddit arrowhead is a pack of incompetents who turned the flamer into a watergun

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Whereas in reality the flamer is still perfectly usable against a wide variety of targets

cobalt patrol
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You can kill them with two impacts, if you throw the impacts underneath their belly.

tight zephyr
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Maybe I’ll start running the RR again.

cobalt patrol
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Baiting them into smashing bug holes/other bugs/each other is always good.

I like making a pair (+) crash into each other and dropping a stun + ops/500kg on them

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I'm yet to get the quadraple kill this way, but I've gotten the triple charger kill, and double charger kills are pretty easy

tall stone
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Running the Dummies is great.

tight zephyr
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So just use stun grenades.

tall stone
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Before I fully fell in love with Yeet Armor, I loved distracting BT's and Chargers with the 50/50 armor.

cobalt patrol
tight zephyr
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I prefer incendiary grenades, but Chargers piss me off so much that I’ll take any edge I can get.

cobalt patrol
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I can trick shot chargers all day, but reliable is better than fancy in my books

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Like does it look awesome when I predict the charge and make it run over a 500kg? Hell yes.

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And do I look incredibly silly when I muff it?

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Also yes.

tight zephyr
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I have to play grabass with a Charger for like five minutes to kill one if I’m not the one with AT that mission.

cobalt patrol
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I find the real thing with bugs is you just can't swiss army knife like you can bots. You need a player going hard on add clear, just like you need a player bringing heavy at stuff

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So at high difficulties, teamwork issues are a big problem

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And even then loadouts like ft/grenade pistol/Dominator/ops/500kg/shield are incredibly flexible

tight zephyr
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I don’t even do high difficulty because it’s so frustrating. Now with Impalers… I dunno.

cobalt patrol
tight zephyr
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I’m definitely in the “wow these suck ass” camp with Impalers. Although I did generally like this patch.

tall stone
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Now that I'm a bit more used to them, I'm fine with Impalers.

cobalt patrol
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"how are you still alive?"*

*Regular question asked of me, the undead aquatic avian

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Impalers are hella fun

tall stone
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The tentacles are easy enough to chase off

cobalt patrol
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They're a nice shake up to bugs

tall stone
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Basically all the BIG THING DIE strats work just fine on 'em.

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The face is a lie of a weak point, but OPS is my beloved

cobalt patrol
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Also if you have an autocannon on the team, just mark them. If your autocannoner is any good, that impaler is not long for the world

tall stone
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Yeah, the anti-mid stuff works better on 'em imo

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Anti-tank is too slow for the face.

cobalt patrol
tall stone
cobalt patrol
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At should be going for their back leg, as that's easy to strip and kills them once it's destroyed

strange vine
tight zephyr
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I’ve been wobbling between MMG, AC and RR lately.

tall stone
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I do like running dedicated anti-horde into bugs myself.

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Because BT's and Chargers are pretty easy to manage still.

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But fucking Hunters kill me.

strange vine
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Right now its just kind of a short range machine gun except MGs have range

tall stone
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I hold a grudge against those bastards.

cobalt patrol
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For AC vs bugs I've been digging Ops, gas, flex (120, 500kg, Gatling, airburst), with the cookout and senator as weapons

tall stone
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OPS, Gas, Rover, Support of my choice depending on team.

cobalt patrol
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Gas shuts down hordes and also teammates

tall stone
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And I get to be the horde-killing god thanks to Blitzer.

cobalt patrol
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(I'm sorry teammates)

tight zephyr
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I know it’s basically a cliché at this point but man I don’t like Chargers. I even prefer bile spewers.

strange vine
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Chargers are so boring to fight compared to Hulks

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Same with BTs vs Factory Striders

tight zephyr
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I tried the Blitzer last night. It was fun. I think I still prefer the Punisher, though.

strange vine
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There's very little counterplay you can do

tight zephyr
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Yeah. It’s like one thing or playing keep-away with it for several minutes.

tall stone
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It's very "What do you want to do to handle this?" vs. "Do you have the specific list of tools to handle this?"

tight zephyr
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Yeah.

oblique lotus
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I like the blitzer

tight zephyr
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Yeah, it’s fun.

oblique lotus
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Also it doesnt arc so less tk

tall stone
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Until a dum-dum walks in front of me and is grounded in a swarm.

tight zephyr
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bzzt

tall stone
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The amount of people who will just walk into your fire lane sometimes....

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Had someone get fucking nailed by a quasar shot because of that once.

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I did not apologize.

tight zephyr
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The funniest ones are the ones who do it when you’re using a laser.

tall stone
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I told 'em they were a dumbass.

tight zephyr
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Do not walk into the huge energy beam.

tall stone
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I accept Rover will hit you every once in a while. That's the danger of doing business.

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Do not walk in front of my electric shotgun

tight zephyr
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I like the ballistic one better now that it can be reloaded.

strange vine
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Chargers having their legs be brought down to AV 4 would do wonders for making them more fun to fight

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It means stuff like AMR, HMG, AC, LC can still do something

tight zephyr
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I agree.

keen zinc
strange vine
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like you can probably test out how it works during an acid storm planet

cobalt patrol
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<@&1206091872716595200> Who's around and interested in diving, currently?

keen zinc
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what diff?

cobalt patrol
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At least diff 7.

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At least

oblique lotus
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I can do one quick

cobalt patrol
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(Sorry, i had to do some life stuff)

oblique lotus
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Eating

cobalt patrol
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Kay

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Lemme know when you;'re free

oblique lotus
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ok back on

cobalt patrol
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<@&1206091872716595200> Any more for diff 7 buggles?

keen zinc
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as long as its 7 and no higher

sharp crater
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I could but I'm a lil rusty

cobalt patrol
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It's seven

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get in 'ere

trim breach
cerulean sluice
trim breach
cerulean sluice
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haven't played this game in a hot minute

cerulean sluice
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@trim breach if you're still down my code is 5590-3862

trim breach
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Request sent

cerulean sluice
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accepted

trim breach
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Open lobby?

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I ahve somebody else I'm playing with, so I can invite then you can invite who you're with?

trim breach
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@keen zinc @cerulean sluice @quick plinth Think I'm done for tonight. Thanks all!

supple siren
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Oogh, new Primary Flamer feels nice

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And still cooks Chargers

cobalt patrol
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Booo

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Crossbow + Ballistic shield is awful

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becuase you dont get a crosshair, and even if you're aiming at center screen, the bolt comes out to the right

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so you ahve to aim to the left of things

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...Tank damage really well, but the rest is real ewwwww

hexed steeple
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haven't had much issue with that

cobalt patrol
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Props to you then, i was fully on the struggle bus

keen zinc
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<@&1206091872716595200> anyone up for early morning mid diff missions

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6/7s

trail nymph
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I will be in about an hour

keen zinc
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did they nerf the scorcher

heady halo
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i dont think so

cobalt patrol
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No?

keen zinc
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i find myself having to put way more shots into stuff than i used to

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maybe explosive damage changed?

cobalt patrol
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They don't stealth nerf stuff. If it's not in the patch notes, it's either a bug, a mistake, or you're imaging things

keen zinc
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it might be a bug

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since it is taking a lot of shots to kill hive guards

heady halo
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huh odd

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oh i think they did add more unit types

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and some are tougher and dont look that different

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but otherwise i dunno

keen zinc
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i also dont remember having to put a whole mag into a devestator to drop it

cobalt patrol
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You sure your aim isn't off?

keen zinc
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i think they changed how explosive interacts with armor when they changed something and the scorcher isnt getting its explosive damage through medium armor like it used to

cobalt patrol
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It can vary dramatically depending on where you're hitting

keen zinc
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very odd

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i think they tweaked how explosive damage pens medium armor

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you can still drop devs in decent shots if you hit limbs

ionic holly
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Hey maybe its just a side effect of me not having played for a minute but uh
when did they make the spear able to lock bug holes?

strange vine
ionic holly
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Tracks i suppose, muscle memory was just never bring it to bugs

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still might not often but that shits fun

sweet surge
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Welp one planet is gone

keen zinc
strange vine
ionic holly
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Crisper feels
surprisingly nice?

crystal canopy
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i cannot believe we're playing Helldivers 2: Tears of the Kingdom

quick plinth
heady halo
keen zinc
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its very inconsistent

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sometimes it takes a handful of shots, sometimes it takes a whole magazine

keen zinc
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i wish grenade armor made it so you got a grenade back from ammo pickups

keen zinc
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<@&1206091872716595200> anyone wanna play

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i fuckin love the crossbow

trail nymph
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I'm available

unreal merlin
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Crossbow is fun, I do feel like it's a not-actually-primary weapon a lot of the time though. 5 bolts per magazine and it's functionally a single-target weapon, multikill is just fortune and against actual medium-armor targets I'd rather use something that just kills them faster.

cobalt patrol
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I wanna mess with it a bit more. IDdnt like it with the isled becuase o fhte inaiblity to aim

keen zinc
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its a grenade launcher

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you use it to close bug holes and kill spewers

cobalt patrol
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I know how it works. In conjunction with the shield it's really tricky to aim

strange vine
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i mean you've still got the reticle?

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are you always using fpv?

keen zinc
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yeah i dont understand what ur talkin about

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do you not have your crosshair always-on?

cobalt patrol
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If you have the ballistic shield out

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You dont have a reticle, it aims to the right, signifncatly

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and you can only see through teh shield's tiny gap

quick plinth
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that's only if you go first person no?

cobalt patrol
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Even in third person, i think? id have to check

quick plinth
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it really shouldn't because i've lately been using the ballistic shield and it only does what you described in fp

tight zephyr
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Finding a new appreciation for the Laser Cannon.

cobalt patrol
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maybe something was being fucky in my controls then

keen zinc
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ngl this update just aint all i hoped it would be

not really upset about any nerfs or anything but man i expected more from all the sentiment the devs were sharing about a new design direction and slower pace for better outcomes

graceful bluff
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<@&1206091872716595200> Who be up scrappin they bot

graceful bluff
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What is it with pubs and fighting literally everything and never doing objectives

unreal merlin
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My chief complaint is when they refuse to help me open bunker doors. When they LOOK AT ME AND THE DOOR, from ten feet away, and choose to just walk off.

trim breach
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Bonus if it's one guy doing it while the entire rest of the team is blowing up bases/nests and getting the side objectives

graceful bluff
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Worst part is that we ran out of time with a single button press needed on the objective

trim breach
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Was this bugs or bots?

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The thing is, I also know exactly how this happens.

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It's because they take so long killing one group, that they call in reinforcements, and meanwhile more patrols are spawning and coming in piecemeal. Which they then try to deal with until the cooldown runs down on the reinforcements again.

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Repeat ad nauseum

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Which SHOULD be easily dealt with by just killing the immediate threats and then moving on, but...People don't do that.

graceful bluff
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bots

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they were just hunkered down like ~200m away from the objective, just camping there

sage plume
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<@&1206091872716595200> so do we wanna do a few missions without pubs?

unkempt river
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Tomorrow night?

graceful bluff
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sure

sage plume
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alr that would be? in 18 hours?

unkempt river
sage plume
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ah ohno

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alright then the wait begins

cobalt patrol
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<@&1206091872716595200> Who's around and wants to blow up some RoButts?

sage plume
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i might ill just finish up a dota game first

cobalt patrol
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Eta?

sage plume
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ehh 10 mins

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sorry

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the enemy team just learned how to be competent and ive been playing this match for over an hour

sage plume
cobalt patrol
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I had one match in me, asi t turned out, and... was done abotu the time you were free <.<

sage plume
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daw alright have a great rest of your day tough

cobalt patrol
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It is after midnight, @sage plume AFTER MIDNIGHT 😛

sage plume
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yeah you got 24 hours left of your day

keen zinc
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i jabe awoken

sage plume
keen zinc
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Dive.

sage plume
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yey :D

keen zinc
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Will be there in butter moment

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<@&1206091872716595200> wake up divers we're going dying

sage plume
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<@&1206091872716595200> last call before we open up for pubies

keen zinc
glacial light
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Oooo the hellpod booster affects every hellpod

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EATs just got more interesting

honest acorn
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👀

glacial light
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But also guess I got to check if anyone ever brings it before a match

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It includes resupply too

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Honestly I don't think I could really recommend it cause other boosters are just a lot better but if AH ever makes the base full ammo/nades/stims booster just inherent then I could see it, just running EATs and commando and having a weird source of ad clear is neato

heady halo
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or splits boosters into like. a seperate pool of "upgrades" for the strong ones and boosters for the fun ones

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so they can still ad multiole as steong as full supplies and make you choose

glacial light
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Offensive hellpod boosters does seem fun, like one that turns a hellpod into like a mini sentry for a bit

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For when your teammates hot drop your beacon into a swarm

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I'm not sure how they could change boosters so there's less must picks without rebalancing them a lot. Maybe weaken them and split them into 2 catgories but let players bring one of each type. Like a strategic and tactical where one slot is for things that directly affect a helldiver like optimization, vitality, muscle, etc and one that doesn't directly target players like localization, pelicon ones, reinforcements

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Or a dangerous amount of buildcrafting, have boosters work regularly if you bring one but weakened if you choose to bring 2

tall stone
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I think it being all hellpods does make it competitive with things like the stamina booster, experimental infusion, and the like.

glacial light
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I did try it a bit and it's really fun but the AoE seems lower than I expected and it's not a huge boost even if everyone brings EATs

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And the damage seems low enough that it only really affects light enemies which I did expect

hazy oriole
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problem is the pod booster does friendly fire damage to ur mates

glacial light
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Yes it does

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It's not a huge AoE again and unless you're standing really close you won't get hit

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I still wouldn't take it over the top tier boosters

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Unless i'm playing low diff

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Kind of a shame cause it's the first offensive and hellpod booster and it's underwhelming

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Or moreso it's not on the same level as the most picked boosters which are just so much better

tight zephyr
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<@&1206091872716595200> Who wants to do some Diff 7-8 bots?

keen zinc
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lemmefinish my lunch

sage plume
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sure, bone no hurt

tight zephyr
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4314-2796

keen zinc
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actually head kinda hurty

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might takea nap and be bakc later

hazy oriole
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since this is one of the more cool-headed helldivers chats i'm familiar with, i'm curious as to what you guys would change about the game rn, if anything
i'd personally like a few less chargers when playing bugs but then again im mostly a bot player anyways

keen zinc
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Buff primary weapons

trim breach
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Or nerf chargers slightly. Because right now there's only a small amount of ways to deal with Chargers and Bile Titans (and now Impalers) which means that if you Bugdive there's always gonna be a very narrow spread of strategems that somebody is going to have to bring.

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Whereas with Bots, there's enough unique ways to deal with the big stuff that it's not typically that much of an issue.

keen zinc
#

I don't think primary weapons should have to spend whole magazines on enemies that get spawned in greater numbers than you have magazines

trim breach
#

Again, that's typically a bug problem

#

(Fucking Spewers...)

keen zinc
#

Generally yes

trim breach
#

Bots are either squishier, or they have obvious weak points.

#

Whereas what you'd THINK is a weak point on most bugs is Durable

#

So you're only doing like 15% damage

#

Charger butts, the sides of spewers.

keen zinc
#

I just don't like how so many primary weapons are just not good

trim breach
#

The squishy underbelly of a Bile Titan can no-sell medium pen weapons for some reason

#

Yeah, a lot of them need a buff

#

There is zero reason to take the Liberator Concussive or the Liberator Penetrator

keen zinc
#

All the assault rifles have really bad TTK except the Tenderizer

trim breach
#

Fortunately with the changes to beam damage, the Scythe is now merely mostly useless.

#

The fixed Slugger is fun now, though

#

The Breaker got nerfed too hard, and now I never use it in favor of the Punisher

#

The standard ones, not the incendiaries

keen zinc
#

Yeah

trim breach
#

My only major complaint about the Cookout is it actually does less durable damage than the Incendiary Breaker

keen zinc
#

Things either have really unsatisfying TTK or awful ammo eco

#

Or just FEELS like awful ammo eco

trim breach
#

IDK

#

The Sickle is decent

#

But, again, laser weapon

#

So if you have bad ammo eco with it, that's more a you problem.

keen zinc
#

The sickle is amazing

trim breach
#

I mean, I don't need a gun to do everything, I just need it to have a niche it's good at.

#

And a lot of the guns don't have that

keen zinc
#

I want a gun that covers at least a base or two

#

Without needing to expend whole magazines to do it

#

Because that feels so weak

tight zephyr
#

I agree with whoever said that they should reduce the armor on the Charger legs by one stage. It was someone in here but I don’t recall who it was, though.

keen zinc
#

iirc was skaiandestiny

honest acorn
#

I'd be ok with that

#

There's so many chargers

keen zinc
#

honestly i feel like a lot of weapons could go up one AP level without any severe balance problems

#

or enemies brought down an AP level

cobalt patrol
#

I'd prefer tweaking enemies and hitzones than generally upping weapon ap.

stark ether
#

random statement: Fenrir III seems to have good maps for sc farming

keen zinc
cobalt patrol
#

knocking bile titan belly armor down and their chin arm armor downs as well would smooth things out too

#

Bile spewer heads loosing 1 armor would also help

#

Factory strider innards (You can shoot the armored side with a logo with an EAT to expose the innards, a second eat kills) loosing some armor would be nice too

keen zinc
#

this doesnt solve the problem of 13 primary weapons being so lackluster

tight zephyr
#

Yeah, just less Chargers would be nice too. Also I'd like it if higher-difficulty bots had more Troopers instead of it being a solid wall of Devastators and Hulks.

cobalt patrol
#

I see plenty of trooper swarms on high diff bots

#

iut's actually why i take plasma punisher

tight zephyr
#

<@&1206091872716595200> Does anyone want to help me unlock Diff 10?

cobalt patrol
#

and plasma punisher is probnably why trooper swarms cant be too much of a thing, because troopers are really not much of a thing

cobalt patrol
keen zinc
#

im down

cobalt patrol
#

Though, hmm. I have a bit of a headache already. I'm gonna go aoutside and seeh ow i do

#

and revise based on that

keen zinc
#

i promise to be chill

#

shook off my rust

tight zephyr
#

I'm just gonna do a quickplay Diff 5.

cobalt patrol
#

Nah, it aint you amko - i literally do have a headache, and i know Helldivers tends to make that worse

#

This is long covid is kicking my butt and i need to rest, not anything else

keen zinc
#

cong lovid

strange vine
#

the only truly shit primaries imo are liberator penetrator, liberator concussive, and purifier

#

reg breaker is still pretty good, just not a top tier pick. I used it in high level bots and it still did work, especially vs trooper swarms and berserker packs and can still take out a devastator or 2 fishing for the head or mag dumping into the crotch. You've also got the shortest TTK against a hulk vent too, like 3-4 shots

#

breaker spray and pray needs something else to it too but its not strictly bad, maybe an extra 2 magazines so it has the best ammo economy of the breakers

#

scythe got a good buff given it can light stuff on fire now, which in bots helps it against its primary weakness the berserkers

strange vine
tight zephyr
#

I figured out where to shoot factory striders with the laser cannon today, so I had a productive time.

strange vine
#

give it a belly rub or head pats :3

tight zephyr
#

For whatever reason, I rarely get to actually fight them. They always seem to get killed by my teammates before I've really been able to grapple with them, so I never got to learn their weaknesses very thoroughly.

#

Next I'm gonna figure out how to kill Bile Titans and Chargers with the laser cannon because I've come to really like it now that I've given it a proper try.

strange vine
#

laser cannon is great

tight zephyr
#

Yeah, I didn't really like it when I first tried it out but decided to give it another chance and it's grown on me.

cobalt patrol
#

@tight zephyr Re factory striders, i think i mentioend it earlier, but another weakness to know is see those big automatom symbols on their side?

One EAT/RR/etc will blow the plating right off and expose the innards

https://helldivers.wiki.gg/wiki/Factory_Strider

Helldivers Wiki
Factory Strider

The Factory Strider is a massive, heavily armored, four-legged Automaton super heavy assault vehicle. Its armaments include twin gatling lasers below its chin and a large heavy laser cannon atop its main body. It sports a dark gray body, with Automaton insignias on its legs, body, and main cabin. They can be deployed by Dropships and their spawn...

ripe cloud
#

Hey, i have a small question, is the new pump action inciendary shotgun good on the bots ?

cobalt patrol
#

I havent tried it out specifically, but in theory, it should be

#

high knockback makes it good into devastaros, burn is actually useful agianst bots, it's fast enough it should swat troopers

#

and it hsould be good for keeping beserekrs off you

odd arch
#

depends on the rest of your loadout

#

my primaries are usually for devs and berserkers and yeah shotty can do that

ripe cloud
#

Well for bot i usually run the normal pump action and the senator for précise shot. Also take the railgun or the autocannon

unkempt river
#

<@&1206091872716595200> WHO WILL SPREAD MANAGED DEMOCRACY WITH ME??

sage plume
#

:D

unkempt river
#

:3

cobalt patrol
#

Early bed for me, sorry hades 😦

#

Def keen to play Helldivers with you soon though

keen zinc
odd arch
#

my balance thoughts are mostly
I really like how the game plays, the same way that turns many away - it's more frantic and desperate than hard because you'll be ineffectively flailing more than getting wiped out

#

and the nerfs that really rubbed the community wrong were to weapons that previously allowed them to bypass all possibility of flailing

#

so like I really don't agree that they were the worst thing ever because I like that flailing

#

but also most primaries are just not satisfying to use in ways that aren't directly related to their raw power

#

I think the oddball ones are the best off because you pick them up expecting something weird and that's what you get

#

and the ol' reliables... aren't

#

this is also a problem because most of the arsenal is advertised as conventional reliable weapons

#

so tl;dr the game just really doesn't present scenarios for the more Normal primaries to shine and they're relegated to a fly swatter you hope to reach for as little as possible so no matter how good their stats are they are doomed to feel bleh

keen zinc
#

i wouldnt mind light armor pen primaries being relegated to flyswatting if theyre good at it

#

the sickle and tenderizer, for example, are good at flyswatting

strange vine
#

idk for me most of the primaries do feel good?

#

maybe not exciting but i dont feel like im shooting a wet fart

keen zinc
#

i dont remember the last time i saw someone running any liberator or either non incin breaker

#

or the scythe

ionic holly
#

Ironically in my 7+ pubbing i've seen a good few

Found a guy who swore by the liberator carbine, was chill and pretty fun to hang with and a friend of mine loves the spray and pray just to name a pair

#

At the end of the day how guns feel is 100% subjective

#

i bet you there are folk who unironically enjoy the dagger

#

(pre burn)

odd arch
#

it's pretty convenient for boardroom presentations

keen zinc
#

i know some people find them fun, but what would be the harm in tweaking them so that more people found them fun

strange vine
#

the issue is breakpoint numbers are really tight here

keen zinc
#

so what if a liberator kills a scavenger in one fewer bullet

strange vine
#

scavenger isnt the issue

ionic holly
#

I feel like that's a super narrow way to look at the balance respectfully

odd arch
#

weapons that fail to take down their intended targets because they have the precise amount of damage required but it rounds down by one due to how falloff is implemented is the funniest thing ever

strange vine
#

yeah that part's silly

ionic holly
#

Now that i can agree with

strange vine
#

just give the regular diligence 5 extra damage

ionic holly
#

But yeah, iunno, weapon feel is such a subjective thing that it's not a great factor to balance off of

#

especially since some weapons pay for their power in how they feel with worse handling or the likes

strange vine
#

then it can hit the breakpoint of popping devastator heads so its a viable pick compared to the diligence CS

sage plume
#

<@&1206091872716595200> in houour of my now broken flipflops anyone down to dive?

keen zinc
#

sure

tight zephyr
#

What if the Laser Cannon didn't do a lot of damage but instead was like hitting an enemy with the Acid Rain debuff?

#

Do you guys think that'd be useful, not useful or so useful it'd completely obliterate the meta and make it an all but mandatory weapon?

odd arch
#

it already doesn't do a lot of damage

#

I'm married to the laser cannon as a bot main but I think giving it the acid debuff without much of a nerf anywhere else would make it more bug relevant

#

if it's localized to the body part it's hitting and doesn't persist long after the beam is cut it wouldn't be outrageous

keen zinc
#

why not let it do damage AND melt armor

#

i think it would be cool if all beam weapons debuffed armor when above half or 75% heat

tight zephyr
#

Or when you keep the beam on-target for a set amount of time.

royal lantern
#

Yeah, the beam weapons all need some juice like that and I think it would make it really interesting as more of a team support type weapon

#

I've always liked the laser cannon but it does feel a little bit like a downgrade compared to the autocannon or quasar

stone bridge
#

it does plenty of damage

royal lantern
#

Yeah, it's really pretty solid for bots

#

Probably not optimal but it competes well enough that I don't feel bad bringing it

#

Especially on the ice planets

stone bridge
#

it even sets things on fire now, like

#

cmon

royal lantern
#

Oh shit it does? I've only just picked the game back up after a long absence

stone bridge
#

all the beam weapons ignite targets after a lil bit now, yeah

glacial light
#

Fire dot did buff the laser stuff and even the laser cannon which was already great

keen zinc
#

scythe and dagger are still bad, even with the flame

stone bridge
#

the scythe is good actually

keen zinc
#

disagree

stone bridge
#

you prob havent tried it for a bit

keen zinc
#

i did try it

stone bridge
#

but it got directly buffed a few patches ago

keen zinc
#

yeah i played with it this patch

stone bridge
#

ill be honest, i do think you have a really particular/high bar for what a good weapon is

#

based on what I've been seeing

#

all I'm saying is I've seen it do work

trim breach
#

The only ones I'd say are unambiguously bad are the Liberator Penetrator and Concussive, the Dagger, and the Purifier

#

The Scythe would be down there if not for the last patch

glacial light
#

Oh purifier I had such high hopes

trim breach
#

I usually run the Tenderizer or Adjudicator for bots, and the Liberator/Carbine or Punisher for bugs.

#

Though the Torcher is reasonably fun

strange vine
#

Yeah scythe fucks a bit now

glacial light
#

Scythe you can kind of do the mid range sweeping laser fantasy of like sweep it between a target in a swarm and the dot will kill the ones that were on fire

#

For bugs

keen zinc
#

you have to hold the beam on the target for it to ignite

#

ive only tried it against bugs so

#

maybe against bots its weakspot damage is good

trim breach
#

I know the cannon fucks against bots

#

Then again, the big advantage with anything against bots is nearly all Bot units have one or two big obvious medium/light armor weakspots.

#

With bugs, the weakspot is a lie.

strange vine
#

Devastator heads are barely better

keen zinc
#

no offense but everything works when headshotting bots

strange vine
#

Its way easier to do it with the scythe

honest acorn
strange vine
#

Cause yknow, beam

honest acorn
#

I should play hd2 more I guess

#

scythe was lowkey good after its first patch it seems great now

strange vine
#

Also the scythe is extremely good against jetpack raiders and mg raiders

trim breach
#

I actually like the Tenderizer for it. Because the recoil is so low, you can just spray in the general direction of the head, and it only takes 3 or 4 hits to kill a Devastator

keen zinc
#

yeah, i use the tenderizer or sickle for bots

strange vine
#

Because the beam so much as breathing on their cooling pack/jetpack will detonate it instantly

keen zinc
#

they can both hit reliable headshots but also DPS down targets that rush me

trim breach
#

Sickle works for this too in the same way, honestly, but that's a low bar to clear. 😛

honest acorn
keen zinc
#

the Sickle IS my bar, tbh

trim breach
#

Honestly there is one minor detail that really freaking bugs me about the Sickle.

#

It's a laser weapon

#

But the rounds have travel time

keen zinc
#

i miss the old pulse laser effect from hd1

#

but that might cause epileptic problems in first person

strange vine
#

Its a some weird energy bolt thing like what the automatons have now

#

Is it still called a pulse laser? I forgot

keen zinc
#

primary weapons i like: the tenderizer, the punisher, the crossbow, and the scythe

#

because i like weapons that go through a bug breach or bot drop without expending half of their ammunition supply

trim breach
#

The Tenderizer has lousy ammo economy

keen zinc
#

i use it on burst

#

ammo economy isnt just its supply, its ammunition spent per kill, and the tenderizer has great ammo spent per kill

trim breach
#

I sometimes worry I'm falling into a routine with drops

#

Because 99/100 if it's bugs, I'm going to be bringing Napalm and Gas

#

Bots is always an airstrike, and then typically walking barrage

#

Which has gotten even better with the last patch

strange vine
#

Bots have way more loadout variety

keen zinc
#

i think thats why i call a lot of weapons poor

#

because in my mind a weapon has to pass the bar on both fronts to be "good"

#

just one, and it is at most decent

strange vine
#

Nah i dont subscribe to that

#

Because by that logic incendiary breaker is only decent

#

Which

#

Very much isnt the case

keen zinc
#

incin breaker works on both fronts, what?

honest acorn
#

tbh I think if you're classing most of the weapons in the game as poor you probably have mixed up expectations somewhere

strange vine
trim breach
#

I'm okay with weapons that are great against one enemy faction but lousy against the other

strange vine
#

Yeah

trim breach
#

Just means you have to adapt your loadout to what you're fighting

strange vine
#

Bugs really need the chargers and bile titans reworked

trim breach
#

It's not the weapon nerfs that bug me

#

It's that Chargers and Titans have a very limited handfull of ways to deal with them

#

Which leads to the 'bring the same loadout every mission' problem

strange vine
#

And its fine if theyre rare

#

But on high difficulty theres a ton of them

keen zinc
honest acorn
#

Chargers have always had some issues with having too few ways to fight them yeah

keen zinc
#

most are decent

#

but i wont call them good

strange vine
#

They have the whole armor stripping mechanic but its criminally underutilized because theyre big hp tanks even then

honest acorn
#

I don't really care about that distinction

strange vine
#

You have way too high standards tbqh

trim breach
#

And the thing is everything that can strip their armor can kill them anyway

#

So it seems most people don't know about the armor stripping mechanic

#

If the amount of pugs I've seen running away from a charger with naked front legs is any indication

keen zinc
strange vine
#

Like if all they did next patch was make charger leg armor 4 armor

#

It would make them way more interesting to fight

glacial light
trim breach
#

This is also why the most economical way to kill Impalers is to run around to the back and shoot a back leg 3 times with a Commando

strange vine
#

Because armor 4 means med pen supports can deal with them, but it still cuts their damage in half meaning AT weapons still are more efficient

trim breach
#

if you try to shoot thsoe armorless spots, everything just bounces off

strange vine
#

Also it doesnt help theyre way too maneuverable tbqh

#

Like the chargers are way too agile lets be real

keen zinc
#

i dont really have a problem with regular chargers at all

trim breach
#

If anything I think they've buffed their agility

keen zinc
#

behemoths bug me but regular chargers are fine

trim breach
#

My only issue with regular chargers is that you basically NEED AT to deal with them in a timely matter

stone bridge
#

chargers would be fine if they weren't glitchy as shit and moved while stunned

honest acorn
stone bridge
#

you can deal with them just fine with a MMG or HMG these days

keen zinc
#

yeah

trim breach
#

This is less a problem to me because I'm usually the person bringing the RR

keen zinc
#

just walk around them

trim breach
#

Because charger headshots are immensely satisfying

stone bridge
keen zinc
#

i kill them with machine guns, railgun, impact grenades

keen zinc
strange vine
#

They should give behemoths another body part for the head thats all their armor, hit it once with an AT to break it and then you can dump into the head with medium pen weapons

keen zinc
#

you bait the charge, sidestep, they do their really long slow down anim, you shoot their guts

#

or just pitch impacts under them

stone bridge
#

ok

strange vine
#

That really doesnt work out ill be real

keen zinc
#

idk i also fight Hulks in melee

honest acorn
#

I don’t think it’s just everyone except you is ass at the game haha

keen zinc
#

no, because yall have apparently way better time with other weapons than me

trim breach
#

Impacts are great for killing tanks, I've found

keen zinc
#

maybe i am bad at using niche weapons, but i have no trouble dealing with scary big boys

strange vine
#

What difficulty range are we talking about again? 7-8 or 9-10

trim breach
#

I usually play on 7

keen zinc
#

7s is where i like to be

strange vine
#

bot 7s now are my relaxing difficulty lmao

keen zinc
#

and again, talking about chargers, not behemonths

strange vine
#

Ive done bot 10s and theyre exciting

keen zinc
#

i hate behemolochs

#

you cannot matador them like chargers

trim breach
#

Behemoths, however, do take the exact same amount of Commando rockets to kill as normal chargers

glacial light
#

The walk slightly to the side method does work for charger, but one charger is rarely an issue it's when you can't kill chargers fast enough and you've got like 5 charges on all angles charging that's when avoiding them becomes hard

strange vine
keen zinc
#

so say behemoth, not charger

strange vine
#

And about like 2-3 of them per breach

daring monolith
#

Normal chargers I find fine. Its just behemoths I struggle with now.

trim breach
#

At that point it's more 'everybody brings railcannon'

keen zinc
#

yeah

trim breach
#

Precision also works, but you have to get the timing exact, or stun them first

strange vine
#

Chargers and behemoths really just suffer from the same problems, just the behemoth is more so, so i dont make a distinction

supple siren
#

Infested Chargers were a fun surprise

#

( exploding, i mean )

trim breach
#

The Spore Chargers?

supple siren
#

Ye

strange vine
#

Im fine with spore chargers especially since you can actually damage them with primaries

#

In their pustules

trim breach
#

they HURT when they go up. 😛

#

I've killed myself on them a couple times

strange vine
#

I kinda wish they kept calling them bile chargers cause then theyd match with the other bile enemies

#

Cause theyre clearly the same design

trim breach
#

I honestly think my most hated bug enemyh

#

Not the chargers, not the titans

#

It's the goddamn spewers

keen zinc
#

i hate mortar spewers

#

with a passion

strange vine
#

The real issue with spewers is that you really dont know if theyre gonna be in your mission or not

#

If you did then you can prep your loadout for them

#

But if youre armed for hunter swarms or antitank then youre fucked

honest acorn
#

Yeah I concur, the “bile map guessing game” isn’t that fun since it changes the dynamic so much

strange vine
#

They really need to introduce subfactions soon

#

We effectively already have subfactions with the spawn lists but theyre not visible to us

#

I just hope they differentiate them a ton

keen zinc
#

the mortar spewer double dipping being armored and an artillery piece

strange vine
#

Like eg. Acid Brood has only spore chargers and bile titans, while armored brood is the only one that has behemoth chargers and impalers, with predator brood replacing chargers with stalkers

keen zinc
#

naturally spawning stalkers?

trim breach
#

I can see why they didn't do that

strange vine
#

Big stuff that forces you to have totally different loadout combos

trim breach
#

So we don't have to play the game of 'is it a random spawn, or is it a nest'

strange vine
trim breach
strange vine
#

Well as long as theyre different kinds of stalkers

#

In helldivers 1 there was a stalker variant called the shadow

trim breach
#

Visually distinct?

strange vine
#

That could call in bug breaches

#

And had regenerating health

#

Different from the reg stalkers

trim breach
#

If you can tell the difference between a 'natural' stalker, and a nest stalker, that'd solve it.

keen zinc
#

idk i like this look

pn_MuEs8n3GzH.png
#

enjoying the railgun

strange vine
#

Railguns good now

keen zinc
#

ye

hazy oriole
tight zephyr
#

mm stims

image.png
unreal merlin
strange vine
cobalt patrol
glacial light
#

Same, 9s and 10s feel like the early helldivers near launch where like at least half your loadout should be AT for all the heavies

cobalt patrol
#

I dont mind, hoenstly. and even on bug 10s, i was loving my flamethrwoer

graceful bluff
unreal merlin
#

Yeah it's been like that for quite a while. I've been doing it this whole time. Definitely not a recent change.

graceful bluff
#

huh

#

I guess it's because 90% of the population only plays bugs so I didn't hear anyone talk about it

#

it just needs a scope that isn't fucking x1 now

unreal merlin
#

Instead they downsized the red dot on the scope a lot so you can actually see what you're aiming at

cobalt patrol
#

I'd still prefer ap roper zoom scope, personally

unreal merlin
#

It's perfectly serviceable vs both bots and bugs, and even a modicum of patience (stop and crouch) lets you make decently ranged shots. Probably wouldn't hurt much to have like a 2x optic mode.

cobalt patrol
#

Oh, yeah it's good, it's pure a quality of life thing to just have a zoom so i can see a bit easier

graceful bluff
#

it's just wild to me that the fucking liberator has a zoom option and this doesn't

oblique lotus
#

I don't mind the 1x but it'd be nice to have a bit of zoom

unreal merlin
#

Liberator doesn't cut devastators in half.

#

Speaking of, the liberator, what a good versatile gun. Chef's kiss.

strange vine
honest acorn
#

That's my feeling as well yeah

#

A number of strong weapons (RR, laser cannon, AC, scythe kinda, etc) have bad sights to keep them in check

cobalt patrol
keen zinc
#

what about 30hr a week casual dad type gamers

cobalt patrol
#

If you are 30 hours Week, you are by any definition, not a casual player

#

Given that's literally a whole fucking day and a quarter of playtime

strange vine
#

dev announcement

Fellow Helldivers,
I want to directly address the feedback you've raised about the Escalation of Freedom update. We’ve spent the last week listening to feedback, reflecting about the path ahead for Helldivers 2 and how we want to continue developing the game. In short, we didn’t hit our target with the latest update. Some things we just didn’t get right - and other more fundamental inconsistencies in our approach to game balance and game direction.
All of that is on us and we are going to own that. As many of you have pointed out, and we agree, what matters most now is action. Not talk.

To that end, here's what we intend to do in the upcoming updates.

Our aim within the next 60 days:

  • Continue to re-examine our approach to balance. Our intention is that balance should be fun, not “balanced” for the sake of balance.
  • Update how the fire damage mechanic works to tweak how the flamethrower serves as a close range support weapon. (A quick straight revert won’t work, as it would break other things)
  • Rework gameplay to prevent excessive ragdolling
  • Re-think our design approach to primary weapons and create a plan for making combat more engaging
  • Re-prioritize bug fixes so that the more immediate gameplay-impacting bugs are prioritized.
  • Improve game performance (frame rate is a focus)
  • Rework Chargers

Additionally, from a bigger picture perspective we will be:

  • Exploring creation of an opt-in beta-test environment to improve our testing processes and we consider this a high-priority.
  • Post regular player surveys to gather more insights and feedback from the community.
  • Improve our process for patch/release notes - providing more context and reasoning behind changes.
  • More blog posts and streams where we expand on these topics for those interested.

We also want to thank you for your patience. We're grateful that so many of you provided constructive feedback and suggestions on the latest update.

Mikael E
Game Director & Arrowhead Game Studios

supple siren
#

I have not had one single issue with new flamethrower, the reddit implodes over every change

graceful bluff
#

yeah it's so annoying

keen zinc
#

i mean if they want to make things better and more fun for a good portion of the playerbase

#

thats a good thing

graceful bluff
#

Yeah, it's just annoying when they whine about every slap on the wrist balance wise

supple siren
#

I more feel bad for the devs cause like anything they post at all is just swarmed

strange vine
#

flamer needs to be better crowd control tbh

#

like its weird enemies can just power through it

trim breach
#

Yeah, it needs a mild stun/slow/knockback

strange vine
#

the flamethrower in hd1 flat out stunned enemies who were hit

supple siren
#

That'd be a fun shift, throw on a bit'a stagger

graceful bluff
#

yeah that's my only problem with it, alpha broodlords just super armor through it and slap your shit

supple siren
#

Fire Resist Armor + Flamer + Jetpack has been an absolute ride though

trim breach
#

Warriors and Hunters will just power through it and slap your shit

strange vine
#

i dont know why they didnt keep something similar in hd2

trim breach
#

Really the best way I've found it use it, which thankfully is mostly automatic for me from playing DRG

#

Fire in front and below, then work the flame onto them directly

graceful bluff
#

I just want a napalm flamethrower

trim breach
#

So they're taking damage from the flamethrower and the ground burn

strange vine
#

when are we getting this

main-qimg-05ea3d241eae325da2f14e9896e3c2f8-lq.jpg
#

this is realistic

graceful bluff
#

Fuck realistic give us the napalm silly string launcher from ratchet and clank :v

odd arch
#

no give us the stupid jet suction cups from EDF

#

I love them

#

genuinely my favourite weapon

#

sticks to enemies and vehicles too

tight zephyr
#

I have generally liked the Escalation of Freedom update, even though I really don’t like Impalers and Chargers are still annoying. We got a ton of buffs and I like the incendiary Punisher a lot.

cobalt patrol
#

Impalers are hella fun in my opinion, I like the ohh shit nature of them

#

And how they change the dynamic

tight zephyr
#

I think they’re just kind of annoying.

#

But I get their role and I barely ever fight bugs anyway, so I don’t have much room to complain.

keen zinc
#

Impalers are both cool as hell and annoying and bad

hazy oriole
#

still like them more than bts because at least i can hit their weakpoints

tight zephyr
#

Yeah. I find them too tough to crack for what is effectively an artillery unit designed to hem you in from a distance.

keen zinc
#

60 days is a pretty wide target timeline

cobalt patrol
#

Like shit takes time

keen zinc
#

space marine 2 will suffice for me

#

in the interim

quartz cloak
#

Oh right that's coming out
Soon-ish

heady halo
#

i think they should stop listening to anyone external and just do whatever.

but im grumpy as i have had a bullshit few weeks and havent even got to use the new flame physics yet

glacial light
#

I have complex opinions on this but the gist of it is use metrics and analytics to see if something works or doesn't.

Use community feedback to find symptoms of a problem but don't always take their solution and tackle the root of it.

#

Ime players do not know what they want and that's your job to create the thing they didn't know they wanted, but a player does know what they don't want even if they point out the wrong issue it's a signifier of something adjacent to that is an issue.

tight zephyr
#

I remember a game a while back where there were two sides that had different rifles and the only thing that was different was the sound effects for one was a little louder and the players were convinced that one was weaker than the other.

oblique lotus
#

it was a WW2 game comparing the thompson and mp40

stone bridge
#

Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory

honest acorn
keen zinc
#

yes queen give us less

cobalt patrol
honest acorn
keen zinc
#

I am just getting tired of this sentiment that all the negative feedback is from some nebulous niche of angry redditors. If thousands of reviews and survey responses are not relevant in your eyes to "measure" up to being addressed by the developers, i dont know, it just seems like you think you're better because you play Super Helldive with your eyes closed and can't relate.

#

It all feels very intentionally dismissive and disingenuous.

#

this is not just "skill issue redditors angry about flamethrower"

steamwebhelper_0iBQqLreKQ.png
#

It helps no one to be so reductive when the game is in clear need of better of feedback.

#

I think theyre doing exactly what they should be, and taking feedback into account but not bowing to the vocal but misinformed, and instead wanting to try and find underlying causes in direction or development and addressing it at the root.

#

But to say that the communtiy doesn't deserve it is almost pompous.

honest acorn
#

Ok apologies there I think there was some spillover

#

I don't mean to say that the feedback is entirely unwarranted or similar but it seems like a situation where the devs can do no right anymore

tight zephyr
#

I just had the first game in a while where I just quit. It was a blitz and I was literally the only one destroying fabricators. One guy was just kind of wandering around and the other two were fucking around with an SEAF arty site for like half the mission for some reason. Also one of them kept dropping 380 strikes near me.

cerulean sluice
#

Honestly I miss launchdivers when every weapon and armor was bad and even the good ones (railgun) had major catches.

Felt it fit the vibes more

strange vine
#

i mean it just solidified into the breaker-railgun meta

honest acorn
#

Felt like weirdly good commentary though it really did hurt the gameplay

honest acorn
#

I try to avoid doing it because it feels bad to abandon people

trim breach
#

What gets me is how like at launch you had the connection issues. But anybody who complained about them got downvoted to oblivion. Because 'It's a good game! Let the dev's cook!'

#

And this lasted exactly as long as it took them to nerf the railgun, then the sentiment did an instant 180

honest acorn
#

I'm glad they fixed the weird crossplay lobby and friend issues recently

#

It was rough for me as a PS5 player

shy prairie
cobalt patrol
#

Though I had two people quit because we got a mildly spicy drop in 7 the other day, and it was very funny. (Me and the other level 100 player stayed, crushed it, and went on to crush the mission it was great)

burnt vapor
#

Yeah in my experience a good number of missions start off incredibly spicy before stabilizing and cruising through the rest of the mission

cobalt patrol
#

Taht one we got a factory strider and various tanks immediately

#

So yeah, spicy! but also like... oh no, whatever

odd arch
#

the magic of good walking shoes

#

though I had one really scuffed match where we couldn't go anywhere ever without running into patrols and it spiraled out of control into the entire map being a mosh pit

cobalt patrol
#

MOSH MOSH MOSH

daring monolith
#

did my first diff 10s yesterday (have never even done 9s before and only a few 8s)

very fun. Both bugs and bots. Definitely felt like we were punching above our weight, nobody carried particularly hard, we all did our part. Bots we succeeded but didn't extract, bugs we managed to extract.

trail nymph
#

Did you get the egg from the mega bug nest?

ripe cloud
cobalt patrol
#

My god, people are... bad at balance. Some guy posted a ninteny five hour document or something (as in they'd spent that long) and one of the first suggestions is "remove behemoths" which just...

lol

#

You're not going to throw out an entire fucking asset like that.

tight zephyr
#

To clarify, I stuck with the mission until the five-minute warning and left when I got another 380 carelessly lobbed at a group of enemies I was fighting at close range.

honest acorn
#

But I suppose that’s the designer’s job haha

#

Behemoths are basically just chargers from before they could be 1 tapped by the RR

blissful sparrow
#

the issue is usually people describe their poor solution instead of their good pain point 😄

tall stone
#

This is what I have actually tapped into as the problem point for the Flamethrower changes.

#

If you're playing with randos, you cannot rely on them to kill the massive amount of chargers that are present.

glacial light
#

To me, seriously arm chair deving to the point of becoming a platform is like a random person trying to self diagnose a medical issue and wanting specific meds from a doctor instead of accepting their treatment

honest acorn
#

Word

#

It’s also why I am not that enthusiastic with the devs being as receptive as they are. It’s basically self described that they aren’t sure how they want to fix or change things either and are sort of just responding to pressure

#

And it feels weird to me that there isn’t a stronger design vision for how these things should be working which they’re communicating

#

I trust em though even if I took a long break from the game because of crossplay woes

royal lantern
#

I suspect there's a certain amount of conflict of vision or vision coming up against the realities of player experience

#

Like they definitely have a design philosophy of not wanting to make the player feel too powerful/wanting the enemies and especially the heavies to feel scary and to force being built around

#

Which is perfectly legitimate

#

But it comes in to conflict with players wanting to find the best possible option/the option that makes them feel the least powerless/the option that works best universally in pubs without a team with specialists

#

The latter being the way the majority of people play the game the majority of the time

cobalt patrol
#

Yeah, there's very mixed messages

#

There's stuff i would tweak - i think adjusting the charger leg armor asm entioned here is a genius idea, hoenstly

#

ando ther little bits

#

but a lot of hte reactions etc are just so overblown i have a very hard time taking them seriously

honest acorn
#

My naive “fix” for chargers would honestly be adding a new “light charger” to add speedy bulk to the bug hordes without requiring as much hard AT

cobalt patrol
#

Even stuff like priamries not feeoling great - i'd go so far as to argue for most of the primaries that dont feel the best, what they actuaslly need?

A bit more ammo in the mag, a bit faster reload.

#

sharpen them at being viable hoard clear options.

honest acorn
cobalt patrol
#

Yeah, means autocannons/amr etc can break charger legs.

honest acorn
#

Yeah that’s good

cobalt patrol
honest acorn
#

That or even just like 3 reserve mags

cobalt patrol
#

Because i can genuinely, straight faced tellyou the reason i dont use a lot of primaries is... they're bad at what i want them to do (Clear chaff)

honest acorn
#

There’s definitely a few weapons which are like “this is fun” “whoa I’m at 50% ammo already?”

cobalt patrol
#

Eh, i specified bigger mags and faster reloads for a reaosn - it's too easy to run dry and get overwhlemed (*bugs esp)

#

i think actually having to weigh your reserve mags is good

short rune
#

They should... make the Stalwart a primary again.

tall stone
#

"Oh. Where has all my Breaker ammo gone?"

cobalt patrol
#

but i am 110% in the "actually, i like the idffuclty" camp overall

honest acorn
#

That is reasonable as a change yeah

royal lantern
#

Well the Stalwart being a primary would just be the best of the "just a gun" primaries

tall stone
#

The difficulty is good, even if I mostly stay at 6.

honest acorn
#

Yeah I find above 6-7 too stressful to be a norm for me but I like how it gets brutally hard

tall stone
#

My Primaries of choice are Eruptor, Blitzer, and Sickle.

royal lantern
#

I only really have problems with bugs at higher difficulties, in terms of it feeling really stifling build wise

short rune
cobalt patrol
tall stone
#

Eruptor is just a good sniper and can pop fabricators

uncut hatch
#

I would like to see them make the game harder again, I’m still chasing the high of how it was at release and diff 10 just isnt doing it for me

short rune
#

Eruptor is great with the new scope

cobalt patrol
#

But then i have to conclcude my stress resposne is werid

honest acorn
#

I like 7 a lot!

#

It’s my goto

cobalt patrol
#

because @stone bridge can confirm i just start cackling like a mad scientist when everything is going to hell on diff 9 etc

tall stone
#

Blitzer is my go-to for bugs because it will always fire.

honest acorn
#

But 8 and 9 get to where you must pick your battles and play around supply drops and have real macro

#

And that’s stressful haha

tall stone
#

And Sickle Just Works.

cobalt patrol
#

(Full on i seriously do start Cackling when it's all going tits up and everything is on fire, i am having a BLAST when that's the case)

cobalt patrol
#

FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT

#

(Admteidly, my loadouts are tuned for hyperr aggression, so you know)

#

I dont really know what to do with myself if i'm not setup to be a one man army

#

"uh...turrets... uh... shit. How do i use these?"

#

"fuck it, 500kg, ops, acid cloud, autocannon,. EVERYTHING IS GOING TO DIE"

#

(Teamamtes included!)

#

and most likely

#

me.

honest acorn
#

I actually love the turrets for play aggro

#

But they NEED little hills and such

cobalt patrol
#

Yeah, it's 110% a me thing i'm just bad at placing them on such

strange vine
#

rocket turret is p invaluable on high level bots (esp 10s) i feel

#

it just does a lot of work

cobalt patrol
#

But pitching a ops so it rolls to a stop and the bile titan has comical sad faces moments before it gets blown to bits?

#

I can do that allll day

strange vine
#

hmg emplacement too

#

a single hmg emplacement can shut down an entire diff 10 bot drop (save for tanks) pretty easily

#

which is invaluable when the enemy reinforcement cooldown is real low

cobalt patrol
#

It's part of why i really love gas strike/gattling etc

#

Invaluble as "And fuck you too, hoard"

#

not as good as a well done HMG, but a very tactically flexible option

blissful sparrow
#

i just like airburst cause it has solid base

cobalt patrol
#

Airburst i wish was a little more compressed in it;'s firing

#

As in teh bursts hit closer togther in time

strange vine
#

the balance changes id make:

  • make the barrager tank have armor 4 for all of its turret. Its ironically the toughest tank out of all of them because all of its armor is armor 5 everywhere, meaning theres no weakspots to exploit with non-AT weapons. Which also doesnt make sense, because its turret is filled with highly explosive rockets. Its also the most dangerous tank because its rockets are deadly and can hit you from behind cover like mortars. Making it the most fragile tank would make them better balanced (as well as fixing the bug that lets the turret stay alive even if the chassis died)
  • chargers having armor 4 on their legs and reduce their butt hp pool, as ive detailed before
  • in a similar vein, make Bile Titans have destructible leg armor. Make a single AT rocket be able to take out the leg armor of a BT and let it reduce its movement speed a lot, while letting non-AT weapons kill the leg too. BTs and Chargers have the same issue where theres not a lot of interactability with their design, meaning theyre extremely oppressive loadout checks
  • reduce impaler heads to 1000 hp instead of 1700. This means its only 2 AT rockets to kill or 1 Spear missile. Right now the fastest way to kill an impaler with AT isnt to shoot its head, its to shoot its back legs, which is weird. The impaler is already fairly dangerous especially when its hidden, but it should be easily killed when its left exposed
cobalt patrol
#

Bt's i'd actually be inclined to tweak the armor on their face arms and their belly.

royal lantern
#

This is all seems reasonable and about where my head is at too

cobalt patrol
#

Basically encourage a "Get under htem and rend them"

#

though admteidlly, iu dont think being able to kill them via their legs is a bad thing either

strange vine
royal lantern
#

I actually do really like Cyan's suggestion of a light charger that replaces some of the chargers so hordes can have more punch without also needing so much AT all the time

strange vine
#

thats also a nice idea

#

the larger the enemy is the more ways you need to interact with it

royal lantern
#

I'm a bot diver and mostly that's because of chargers

#

They just feel like big brick walls unless you have EAT, quasar, or recoilless

cobalt patrol
#

I still find lfamethrwoer etc works fine against them

#

but i am misisng being able to toast their leggies, i admit

royal lantern
#

I have always found it funny that bugs have, on the whole, heavier armor than the bots

strange vine
#

i still want a short ranged high damage high AP beam weapon

#

same sort of playstyle as old flamethrower but on purpose

cobalt patrol
#

I was ltierally just talking about how i want the Disterngrator from Abuse in the game

honest acorn
#

Melta gun yeah!

cobalt patrol
#

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abuse_(video_game)

Abuse (video game)

Abuse is a run and gun video game developed by Crack dot Com and published by Electronic Arts in North America and Origin Systems in Europe. It was released on February 29, 1996 for MS-DOS. A Mac OS port of the game was published by Bungie and released on March 5, 1997. The game's source code, along with some of the shareware content, has been i...

tall stone
#

Yeah, Bots allowing me to use my favorite weapons vs. Bugs telling me to kick rocks is why I prefer bots.

cobalt patrol
#

One of the weapons was basically just a beam saberish type thing

#

Let you dive into a bunch of Totally Not Aliens and just shred them

tight zephyr
#

Pain point: It’s too hard to consistently hit the weak points of Chargers. They’re too tough for as common as they are.
Solution: I dunno, you figure it out, Arrowhead.

#

Pain point: Bile Titans, where is the head hitbox? Where is it?!

tall stone
#

Schrodinger's Hitbox

strange vine
quick crown
#

Catears helmet??

strange vine
ionic holly
#

Had a feeling

tight zephyr
#

Something I’ve been struggling with lately is that I’ve been waiting for a game like this for like twenty years and it just feels like lately the consensus has shifted to “The thing you like is Shit, actually.” just in time for me to get invested in it. I know there’s a lot of legitimate criticism to be made, but I feel like the negativity is starting to erode my enthusiasm because it feels like everyone around me is having less and less fun.

strange vine
cobalt patrol
#

But it's also who I try and push back with actual critiques etc

odd arch
#

I think with games specifically it's more that people get the social imprint of influencers

cobalt patrol
#

It's okay to have complicated, even negative feelings about stuff, but you need to exist and understand the feelings, not let them control you

odd arch
#

so now everyone wants to be critic

#

funny thing is I found two very positivity focused youtubers through helldivers

#

I really like this one's mindset of not getting angry at teammates and instead focusing on your own actions to squeeze teamplay out of them

steady flameBOT
trim breach
graceful bluff
#

We still haven't seen the missile silo call in at all yet and it's been in there since release lol

strange vine
#

its got all the assets ready now too including the icon

#

similar to how the commando was before it actually dropped

heady halo
tight zephyr
#

You ever just kind of black out for a while and...

image.png
#

So yeah the Cookout? Pretty good.

cobalt patrol
#

That into bots?

tight zephyr
#

Nah, bugs.

#

I was trying to help with the current MO.

#

But it's a pretty high number of kills for Diff 6.

cobalt patrol
#

Oh, yeah, cookout into bugs is great

tight zephyr
#

There isn't a Punisher variant I don't like.

cobalt patrol
#

Cookout into bots is actually pretty okay, maybe even good?

#

The fact it ignites stuff is very relevant, you can just fire in the general drieciton of an army of troopers and they'll die because they got winged by a single pellet and caught ifre

#

works pretty well for executing bersekrs too, and enough kick to be a devastaor bully

#

no good on striders unless you cna get behind them, which is a ding vs PP, but still

unreal merlin
#

I don't think striders are much of a problem if they're within running distance anyway, you can serpentine sprint at them and just flank the driver.

#

If they're at range or there's just too many of them/other enemies, that's probably a scenario where a stratagem is more appropriate anyway

odd arch
#

they also die pretty quickly to having their kneecaps/groin hammered depending on the specifics of your weapon

unreal merlin
#

I'm a railgunner, so if I don't feel like running for a flank I'll just pop them in the hips with one shot and they're neutralized :v

tall stone
#

At range is my favorite for Striders because Eruptor.

sweet surge
cobalt patrol
tall stone
#

Tried out the Cookout as well. Can confirm it's doing well into bugs.

#

Still might prefer Blitzer, but it has good hitstun and the fire helps with little gribblies.

tight zephyr
#

I’ve been using the Cookout and oscillating between MMG and RR for bugs.

#

The RR is a security blanket support because I have a trauma response to Chargers at this point.

strange vine
#

i pray for a good charger rework one day

trim breach
#

Honestly

#

Just cut the damn agility

#

Chargers that turn on a dime and instantly turn back around when they miss you are bullshit

tight zephyr
#

Yeah, they're a little too agile. In addition to being irritating, it makes them not feel as heavy as I think they should be.

glacial light
#

It's weirder cause if you dive they will like turn on a dime to hit you but if you walk like slightly forward and to the side they'll whiff past you

#

Which idk if that's really intended it just seems weird that barely moving is better than running or dodging

#

I think diving to the side last minute should work to avoid chargers cause walking forward at an angle is barely an inconvenience and you can still fire your gun , on the other hand diving means you go through a impact and standing up animation even if it did work

tight zephyr
#

And not diving out of the way is kind of unintuitive.

#

Like, you see a giant bug charging at you and your instinct is to dive out of the way, right?

strange vine
#

yeah chargers should not have such great turning

#

its completely unintuitive to their enemy archetype

burnt vapor
#

That’s chargers in a nutshell Unintuitive

tall stone
#

Don't shoot the butt, shood the more heavily armored head!

#

Don't dive out of the way, just gently sprint at an angle.

quick plinth
#

3 autocannon shots to the arse and they bleed out(this applies to all charger variants

trim breach
#

I really wish they'd tell you what's in the spawnlist before you drop

#

Because autocannons are great for spewers

#

But sorta meh if there aren't any

graceful bluff
#

<@&1206091872716595200> bugs

short rune
odd arch
#

new support weapon: really big drum

strange vine
#

gloom spread has reach mirin

image.png image.png
sweet surge
glacial light
#

It's fine

hazy oriole
#

where do i aim at bile titans with the autocannon

quick plinth
#

under the chin

#

ish

#

Railcannon into 3 or so rounds that actually connect kills them

tight zephyr
#

The two Viper Command armors are supposed to have random skintones, right?

#

I'm just asking because I've only seen one skintone for like... three days or so?

strange vine
#

ive gotten random

#

skin tones

tight zephyr
#

That's what I thought. Guess it's just RNG doing RNG things.

trim breach
#

It's random

tall stone
#

Also, hoo boy this seems like a hard MO

strange vine
tight zephyr
#

Is that why the Major Order said it was completed earlier?

#

I thought the payout for the last one just came in late.

#

That really sucks.

daring monolith
#

I saw the 4.5mil samples done already and yeah. That explains it

tight zephyr
#

That's pretty upsetting.

#

But I imagine they'll just roll it back.

sage plume
#

<@&1206091872716595200> is anyone up this early?

graceful bluff
quick plinth
#

gimme a sec

trim breach
tight zephyr
#

I drank the Eagle Sweat and I don't feel so good.

glacial light
#

Well there's your problem Eagle Sweat is a cologne it goes on the outside not the insides

tight zephyr
#

I threw up.

tall stone
#

Gotta love that chemical weapons reassignment. 😛

377f9d4d2a612b872ba8ea50214aaca8.png
strange vine
tight zephyr
#

The orbital gas canister is loaded with Eagle Sweat.