Jenna Moran Games (Nobilis, Chuubo's, Glitch, WTF)

[patent tiger]

If you want to do something, do it

[hollow spruce]

Well, what in theory stops you from runnin it

[patent tiger]

Hold on, let me pull up the WTF charts to reference the obstacles in the process of beginning to play a game...

[frank light]

she’s gone off the deep end this time

[sturdy ledge]

I think the things that stop me from running a game are, in the order generally encountered:

1. am I able/willing to make the time to sit down and read enough of the game to form a working idea of how to play it

2. based on the information available in the game's text, am I able to form a working idea of how to play it that seems both viable and fun

3. am I able to convince enough other people that the game is viable and fun in order to assemble a group of a size appropriate to play the game

4. am I able to navigate the logistics of scheduling and preparing a game with that group

[hollow spruce]

I'd love to GM more than I do but I suck at making the time to prep and schedule

[fleet harbor]

Lack of successful GMing experience, mostly, for reasons similar to yours

But I think a Nobilis PBP might get around that

[patent tiger]

Unfortunately, a lack of successful experience is only solvable by attempting more experiences

[vivid wraith]

until memory record technology becomes viable

[restive ridge]

Getting better st GMing is a Project

Every Failure is 10 Destiny

[sturdy ledge]

It's an ongoing journey

[vivid wraith]

saw this note on drivethru. is there any secret lore about Glitch v0.9 that would be cool to know about

[restive ridge]

https://www.tumblr.com/jennamoran/748170750670880768/i-have-adored-nobilis-for-at-this-point-the?source=share

Nobilis GMing advice

[fleet harbor]

This is technically a senryu

[magic mason]

Would you rather go to the secret Angel/Fallen kissing forest or the secret serpent sap world full of cosmic truth

[fleet harbor]

Snakes for sure

[magic mason]

Angels/Fallen in the secret kissing forest are probably way more chill though

[fleet harbor]

I don’t think Angels or Fallen can be reasonably be called chill under any circumstances

Meanwhile, sneace and snove

[vivid wraith]

but the angel of frost, seawater, and aloofness is such a cool gal

[undone flame]

Who is Aaron

[vivid wraith]

Moses' brother, evoked metaphorically in a poem by Alexander Pope that seems to be the source of Nobilis' use of "Aaron's Serpents"

[restive ridge]

https://www.tumblr.com/jennamoran/190107521343/ive-often-wondered-who-is-aaron-and-why-does-he?source=share

[fleet harbor]

Aaron Imperator, inventor of Imperators

[fleet harbor]

Cross-posting from tabletop because I'm unreasonably proud of it.

McDonalds ...
... is inauthentic. (1)
... is generic and flavorless. (2)
... is a well-known and widely accepted standard. (2)
... is head-and-shoulders ahead of the competition. (1)
... can never make you a fucking milkshake. (1)

[patent tiger]

Love to have Imperators make decisions on impulse

(For context - Sylvia is a long story, but it's kind of the Power of Hope split across many bodies. Jessie is the Power of Stars, and also the crush of one of the other PCs)

[hollow spruce]

geometry noble is dead because oseric there killed her ass in backstory

[restive ridge]

LMAO BASED

Most well thought Gamelord plan

[frank light]

I hate herrrrr

[restive ridge]

Also lmao a week to get an opposing Quest miracle

[frank light]

Its an imperial miracle so it makes sense it takes a while

[restive ridge]

Time for Oseric to speedrun an Arc by spending 200+ Cost

[magic mason]

MANICAL LAUGHTR OMG

[frank light]

I plan on using a greater divine plan to try and pin down the estates

[patent tiger]

She didn't even think tbh she just did it

(Read: I, the HG, just went "fuck it" when the idea crossed my mind)

[candid compass]

my character is currently dangerously close to potentially fully killing this Imperator

[frank light]

currently having to actually kill his pc to make sure he doesnt do anything stupid

[fleet harbor]

It sure does suck when the Imperator governing hope is a huge dipshit

[restive ridge]

We all

Hoped

They would be better

[undone flame]

No one ever said Hope was good!

[patent tiger]

Hope is an Estate of the Dark, in this world. So it's pretty bad

(Despair is an Estate of the Light)

[undone flame]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJUP-VWgfAA

[magic mason]

The Estate Of Fell Artifacts

• Wield Spectacular Power
• Drive Their Wielder To Madness
• Corrode The World
• Are never truly gone

[undone flame]

https://tenor.com/view/returntheslab-gif-13914588

this mf

[magic mason]

Def an option

[magic mason]

Alright gamers
I have a take

Due to our POV we normally view Nobles through, its easy to forget they are full force Greco-Roman Deities

The one guy who continues to live up to expectations? Joktan
Bro is the main metaplot villan of an entire other hidden world setting

[patent tiger]

Yeah, I'm definitely guilty of that

It's hard to remember that this is, like, a god

Like, they're definitely some random goober with more power than they can be trusted with

But, so are all the gods in that world

[undone flame]

I have based my guy almost entirely on a Greco-Roman God so it's probably hard for me to forget

[magic mason]

Nobles aren't like how they used to

Your supposeed to be dueling hurricanes for the fate of cities

or causing problems on purpose

[patent tiger]

Now they only know be bisexual, eat hot chip, and lie?

[magic mason]

yeah

Start a War!
Create a Hidden World!
Something

[undone flame]

[nocturne epoch]

this is literally how my last campaign started

Chaos and Sloth fought for city

[frank light]

Two nobles were so lazy they nearly let an excrucian murder the concept of hope in our game

Another excrucian had to kill his ass before that could happen

(The secret? Those two Excrucian a were us and I had to kill my friend to prevent him from doing something we both would regret)

(And I feel badddd ;-;)

[hollow spruce]

I still maintain that we probably don't need hope that badly

[wheat cobalt]

Nilind wouldn't be that fazed by it, honestly

he's been managing fine without it for 15 years

[hollow spruce]

yeah this is my in-character stance when it comes up: the world can run without hope

definitely not biased with his sad sack 5000 year old ass whose existence is a practice in losing things he cares about

[patent tiger]

The primary downside from that perspective - the loss of Hope would give a big power vacuum for the Estate of Despair, and the Imperator of Despair would have a very strong reaction to the death of the Imperator of Hope

[wheat cobalt]

Nilind unironically does not think about situations beyond the immediate and/or attending to solving problems and helping people in the current moment

[hollow spruce]

fuckin toxic yuri

[wheat cobalt]

and I mean, yeah

but that's more adjacent to the whole "Hope vanishes from the world" thing

[wheat cobalt]

(is this a good coping mechanism? unclear, but it's better than average in the Warhost, at least)

[vivid wraith]

average warhost coping mechanism is like, "i'm gonna unmake a star about it"

[hollow spruce]

been there done that

killing the sun does not make you less sad

[wheat cobalt]

I dunno

Nilind was pretty happy when he killed the Sacred Feminine

[patent tiger]

This would unmake every star, actually!

[wheat cobalt]

that was a good day for him

[hollow spruce]

the time after having killed something as huge as Impossibility and the Sun is what made gaulmara go 'man why the fuck Am I doing this anymore'

so he just kind of stopped, and then his life got Worse ™️

[wheat cobalt]

there is an alternate life path Nilind might have gone down where he just became one of those Strategists that specifically seeks out 'bad' estates to erase, but he's too resistant to principles loftier than "survive until tomorrow" to really commit to that sort of bit

[patent tiger]

See, this is why Taingern doesn’t respect you

You gotta have convictions

[wheat cobalt]

this is why Taingern is getting put inside the hypercube

because Nilind knows how motherfuckers like him work, because he's not actually that special in the Warhost, he's just slightly angrier and slightly more ominous in a crowd of angry and ominous goths

there is the force of a Greater Strategy behind it but you sorta notice patterns when you operate as a dedicated support person for the mentally unwell gothic obliteration patrol

[undone flame]

Imperator of Hope is killed
I walk outside
It's the exact same as yesterday.

[hollow spruce]

Well, there is a distinct lack of stars in the sky

And geometry

[patent tiger]

lmao

[undone flame]

City
And I failed geometry

World still the exact same

[patent tiger]

Okay yeah a nightmare vision goggles bit here would be very funny

[wheat cobalt]

no the nearest city is gone too

sadly we failed to get all cities though

we were so close

[hollow spruce]

Ru our entire existence is nightmare vision goggles

[patent tiger]

But no, if Hope dies I will be torturing the PCs relentlessly

[hollow spruce]

That's just what Glitch is

[wheat cobalt]

being a strategist is sort of like being trapped in the nightmare blunt rotation forever

[patent tiger]

As opposed to now, where I torture them relentlessly but also mention that the fact that they can hope to change that makes them sad too

Glitch is fun to run

[wheat cobalt]

see this is why Nilind doesn't care that much about Hope

all it does is distract from the things that actually get him through the day

like discipline, and five cups of coffee

[patent tiger]

Alcohol

[hollow spruce]

See I'd also argue that you can change for the better without hope too
not that gaulmara is thinking about that unless you put his ass into the industrial wine press, but

[wheat cobalt]

no, that's what he drinks when he slips and actually lets himself get optimistic for once

[undone flame]

You can't think you can make things better without hope

[patent tiger]

Aww, come on, just one relapse

What’s the worst that could happen

[undone flame]

I mean even then

What's the point of drinking if you don't think it will make you feel better

[wheat cobalt]

Nilind has never assumed things will get "better"

only different, and then nonexistent

[undone flame]

You're HOPING it will help you feel better

[hollow spruce]

I'd disagree, actually! You can know that something will improve without putting faith that it will get better

[wheat cobalt]

if things DO improve, that's good

[hollow spruce]

You can be a better person without necessarily counting on it

[patent tiger]

Oh, no, Improvement hasn’t been a part of Creation for a very long time

[wheat cobalt]

but he tries very hard not to be tethered to this idea

[patent tiger]

That won’t be happening no matter what

[hollow spruce]

Shut up Ru

[undone flame]

I think if you conceptually remove hope you only have input and output

[patent tiger]

Mwehehehe

[undone flame]

You scientifically know there may be dopamine released as a result of an action but the journey would be pointless

[wheat cobalt]

Improvement is gone but Cultivation still exists

[hollow spruce]

Nah, I think you can work to do good by the people around you and yourself without hoping

[wheat cobalt]

you can do it if you put someone in the nightmare feng shui torture room to harvest their spirit energy

[patent tiger]

But only in a questionable power fantasy kind of way

[hollow spruce]

To hope is just to put faith in a better future, it has no tie to your actual action

[patent tiger]

Yeah

[undone flame]

Also I think if you conceptually removed hope in modern day Earth

[vivid wraith]

[the absence of Hope is filled by Spite, no actions are changed]

[undone flame]

Uh everyone under a certain economic class would probably instantly have a bad time

[patent tiger]

Oh, it would be very bad for a lot of mortals, yes

Despair is an Estate of Rules in this world, so they’d probably still be alive

[wheat cobalt]

see but the sort of bad time would vary

[hollow spruce]

Hope isn't 'things can get better', it's 'I believe that things can get better', which is a definite difference!
Oh it would still suck make no mistake

[patent tiger]

Buuuuuuut

[wheat cobalt]

for some people, they might give up

others would probably go "okay, this is not going to improve magically. time to do something insane"

it would be an interesting first few weeks

[patent tiger]

With Hope as a Game Estate, its loss will reduce the number of people doing insane things

I can say that much

[hollow spruce]

I'm moreso just shopping my own character's point of view on this because he is sad and deeply weird

[patent tiger]

Yeah, for sure

[undone flame]

I mean I wouldn't survive for one.

One because Hope is all I have and two because I'm a star.

[wheat cobalt]

yeah no I'd definitely say the loss of Hope is bad ooc

[patent tiger]

Gaul’s got an interesting take on it, the man lost his hope like thousands of years ago

[wheat cobalt]

but Nilind would not care

[hollow spruce]

Trying to figure out how Gaulmara feels about some things is wild

[wheat cobalt]

he actively threw his hope in the river and has been working on his life without it ever since and things have gotten better, somehow, for certain values of better

so he's not really keen on fishing it back up

(this is not a metaphor)

[hollow spruce]

of course it isn't

[patent tiger]

And this is why she has the second line of defense, “one of the PCs is crushing on one of my Nobles so you can’t kill me”

[wheat cobalt]

lmao

[wheat cobalt]

||all Deceivers have an experience they can pull out of someone, turns out||

[undone flame]

In my games if anyone gets an animal companion it instantly becomes narratively immortal

[patent tiger]

She’s got a whole defense onion scheme

[hollow spruce]

The events of this day alone for Gaulmara have included:

chatting with the dead fragment of a god he killed a couple thousand years ago, realized they somehow have worse emotional intelligence than he does
went on an outing with coworkers, started being eaten by a Wish, got ambushed and yelled at by another PC for fucking things up, then cried a bit about an opera performance
is later going to go fight a wizard with one of the coworkers, this is by far the easiest part of the day in his brain

[vivid wraith]

nothing complicated about wizard fights, all you gotta do is win

[patent tiger]

Of note: Gaulmara is not, particularly, a wizard

[hollow spruce]

He is not! but he also is not very worried about wizards

[patent tiger]

I’m just saying, who knows how well you’d be able to compete in the mundane challenges. You could be seriously outmatched and have to resort to overwhelming godlike power

[hollow spruce]

he's just going to go help out his World Of Darkness Hunter ass friend go fight a World Of Darkness ass Wizard

[patent tiger]

That’d be embarrassing

[hollow spruce]

Well Malonas will probably be there to make the situation worse somehow, and she's definitely a wizard

There's also whatever secret sauce suprise you have cooked up for that event

Because I know it won't be that easy

[patent tiger]

Why, I can’t imagine what you mean

[wheat cobalt]

also I just realized

Oseric went to yell at Gaul and then immediately went to kill a piece of creation, potentially putting the town in jeopardy and then some

[patent tiger]

YUP!

He sure did

[hollow spruce]

And it was hilarious

[wheat cobalt]

Oseric you dumb motherfucker, I know you are three weeks old but come onnn

your queerplatonic joyfriend is gonna hate this

[patent tiger]

“This is our brilliant commander, we would follow him anywhere” - you all to a violent three-week-old with severe emotional issues, for some fucking reason

[hollow spruce]

gaulmara will probably spend tomorrow following up on helping twinkboy supreme, trying to work something out to save the forest And deal with the rift/maw, and also whatever Wizard Fallout happens

[wheat cobalt]

Nilind sees Oseric as being idealistic and strong-hearted, not, like, a genius

he definitely does not see oseric as brilliant

probably literally anything other than brilliant

[hollow spruce]

there's probably cadavi trying to ultra welken rite using the wizard ritual or something

[wheat cobalt]

strong-willed? absolutely. good character? yes. dashing? unclear. but not brilliant

[hollow spruce]

we know that rat bastard's been up to something

[patent tiger]

Oseric was not dashing today

[wheat cobalt]

he was a little dashing

[patent tiger]

This was an explicitly not dashing moment

[wheat cobalt]

he was literally slaying a dragon

was it a good decision? no, however,

[hollow spruce]

Niles might still have him beat in the dashing department

[patent tiger]

Yeah but it was for unjustifiable reasons. He murdered the princess who was in the dragon’s clutches, too

[wheat cobalt]

is that what the hydra is??????????

[patent tiger]

Among other things

[wheat cobalt]

I-I guess?

[hollow spruce]

Sylvia is, to be fair, a lot of things

By definition

[patent tiger]

There’s actually a few possible princesses in this narrative, but Sylvia is absolutely one of them

[wheat cobalt]

listen there's only one princess in this town and it's Nilind

lmfao

[patent tiger]

And probably the most plausible one to be rescued from the dragon we have on hand

[hollow spruce]

I'm sure we could wring a princess backstory out of Astel in her third season

[patent tiger]

Oh yes Astel is one of the princesses

That is true

[wheat cobalt]

Astel has been the princess of the monarchy of louisiana this whole time, making her Nilind's blood nemesis

[undone flame]

I'm definitely able to follow this

[hollow spruce]

Astel is, for reference, the world of darkness hunter coworker of my PC

[patent tiger]

Glitch is a difficult game to run and an even more difficult game to talk about because things keep happening

[wheat cobalt]

things: they do that!

[hollow spruce]

she has a long and complex tragic backstory that I had to burn cost to pay attention to

[patent tiger]

There’ve been a lot of dramatic character moments lately, is the best way I can sum it up

One of the PCs has entered fucked up and evil mode due to witnessing the horrors

(The horrors kinda hoped they could talk it out)

[hollow spruce]

Is the horrors Sylvia in this case or

[patent tiger]

Yeah

[hollow spruce]

okay just checking

there's a lot of The Horrors

[patent tiger]

There sure are

[hollow spruce]

but yeah, Glitch, or at least, the way Ru runs it, is just melodramatic event after melodramatic event after bizarre collision of 3 different melodramatic event plotlines

absolute nightmare to untangle

It's very fun and things are hideously complex

you couldn't publish this shit

[patent tiger]

Maybe you couldn’t

[hollow spruce]

I'd be both mortified and fascinated to see you try

[tall jolt]

I had a brain blast

Power of The Fourth Wall
...It can be broken
...Can be used to surprisingly hilarious effectiveness
...Opens you to infinite potential.
(Maybe other definitions)

Bond (5) I can rewrite the rules
Affliction (5) Hi Charos! I don't want to do that today!

[candid compass]

So was Oseric at first
I'm gonna put that one on Aldmillia tbh
Maybe pushing the already unstable Strategist over the edge was a bit of a bad play by her

Do feel bad for Sylvia though
He didn't even mean to hurt it, that much anyway

[magic mason]

Cooking some Content inspired by my take from last night

The Sugar Rot

Transcript of a lecture given by Prince Malcom Malcontent
For centuries we have ruled the world from the shadows. The Blood Alchemy which animates us has continued to be innovated upon, increasing our power exponentially and removing many of our former flaws. However, in 2002 a blight was unleashed on our people I am sure we are all aware of. Before I get into my research I would like to retell the story of how it happened.

At 9am on April 9th, 2002 a meeting was called among the New York Delegation of the Headsman’s Guild for routine procedural duties, several council members were missing or otherwise late at the time of the event. A woman, naming herself Lily and dressed in Victorian clothing, entered the meeting chamber at 9:22 am, mistaken for one of the missing congressmen making their way inside(The vampires chosen to guard the location were found butchered, not metaphorically, they were cut apart as if to be eaten). She confronted the council, and maintained a casual demeanor while declaring her intentions to make the Headsman pay for their “sins against mankind”. Assuming she was a overly ambitious cleric-hunter, the elder vampire leading the congress attempted to kill her right there. She unseamed him with a butterfly knife before the younger vampire there even processed that a fight had occurred. From there things get a little blurry despite the camera footage, Lily can be seen hovering above the ground for a moment before speaking a command in a language we still do not understand. From there the camera footage cuts out and our only reports are from the confused and terrified interns at the time, attesting that a rapidly spreading inclination for the consumption of vampiric flesh, which we now know as a symptom of the sugar rot took hold of the council members. In their madness they tore each other apart.

[vivid wraith]

nice nice nice

[magic mason]

From a mythic perspective:

The Noble Of Cake Uses a Greater Motion to say that cake will haunt vampires Forever because she follows the song of the light and fucking hates them.

[frank light]

Objectively dumb play

That imperial miracle was kinda a dumbass move

We weren’t even forced to do anything about it

So it was just scary but ultimately did not help her situation

[patent tiger]

Yeah lmao

[frank light]

Girl…girl what were you thinking

[patent tiger]

Listen

I'm happy to write people who are dangerous, or terrible, or overwhelmingly strong

But it will be a cold day in hell before I write someone who can make good decisions and meaningfully improve their life through their own actions

This is the kind of villain you're getting

[frank light]

Christ

And this is a god

Of like things. In the world

And this is the kinds of plays she’s making

[restive ridge]

To match the protagonists temper of course

[patent tiger]

Gamers don't make good decisions

That's just how it is

[patent tiger]

Well naturally

[magic mason]

People: are fighting a gamelord, a living intrusive thought
Also people: are suprised the gamelord lets her intrusive thoughts win

[patent tiger]

Her priorities are [fuck with people on purpose] and [commit to the bit]

And that's it

[magic mason]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HJtm1PpeuB4

Lord of games type post

[patent tiger]

Yeah

[magic mason]

This trend in general is very The Game https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dPZaBEGxXM0

[magic mason]

Far Roofs is the perfeect power level for a Botanist game, at least in my head

or at least a game where you play a lot of Botanist type guys

[magic mason]

I might be doing far roofs homebrew 👀

[restive ridge]

Eternal Reincarnation
4CP

The quintessential spirit of the Estate you govern is deeply bonded to your soul, and it has a movement, a mind of its own, you are a master swimmer of the waters of Samsara. When you die (or more specifically when you are Defeated when your last Health Level is filled), over the course of a second or a minute or a century or whatever is narratively appropriate and approximate to what it would take you to heal at least one Wound your Estate will find someone in Creation close to who you were before, someone on the cusp of a great personal revelation and change of heart most likely, and it will reveal to them a secret- that their whole life they have been secretly the Power of your Estate, that everything before this was just a backstory, that they are a reincarnation of an actual honest-to-Cneph God and you will be revived. This process will be notionally perfect, your own story will completely overwrite theirs, but it is still a good excuse and time to switch up Bonds and Afflictions.
  This Gift is a (Domain) Lesser Motion of You.

(Base 6+1 Auto+Almost Anywhere -1+ One Trick(Revive you when all HLs are empty) -3+ Uncommon +1)```

[frank light]

Silly as hell gift

[magic mason]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9PoshXXA7M
Average Erus

[fleet harbor]

I hate UMG

[magic mason]

UMG?

[vivid wraith]

united music group, i assume

[magic mason]

ah ok

A copy of my grand designs 🙂

[fleet harbor]

Hey folks https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linsang

They’re fake cats and fake otters

The world is a lie

[vivid wraith]

Did the linsang estate get broke

[frank light]

Omg

[candid compass]

what a creature

[vivid wraith]

a gap filled by Cats and Otters together

[fleet harbor]

It will when I’m done with it

This is an outrage

The world is a lie, this will not be allowed to stand

I keep telling myself “oh but it’s a beautiful lie” during meetings but this

I will not allow this

This estate is going down

[obsidian dagger]

Just remembered this relevant meme I have saved

[frank light]

Oh lmao

[magic mason]

Technique
You gain a special Superior or Magical skill called a Technique that you use to wield your Title. Either gain a new, 2 point superior or magical skill or put 2 points into a superior or magical skill you already have and make it your Technique.

8+: The next time you roll with your Technique, you may reroll any number of dice once. 

Froofs stunt

[obsidian dagger]

I was going to ask "is there a way to directly stop The Ace" from doing something and... no. There isn't. Gold (Aspect) is the color of simply Winning Conflicts™️, whether by having awesome magical powers that can help push through, being able to just Be The Best at stuff, or engaging with problems on an axis which enemies just... can't even interact with.

If someone on an island sets up an effect saying "nobody can get onto the island" and it's presumably a chthonic effect meaning it establishes an Auctoritas and probably also establishes an Obstacle (since chthonic effects are allowed to just create obstacles directly, rather than altering the world in such a way that leads to obstacles as a logical consequence of that)... the Ace can probably still swim onto that island, can't they.

[fleet harbor]

Have you read Fable of the Swan, Banana?

[obsidian dagger]

I think what I need to read more about is chthonic effects, instead. Because usually chthonic effects aren't supposed to directly oppose stuff too often, but sometimes they do, and... given the ways in which these abilities:

• monkey with intentions directly, and with the intention resolution system;
• are tagged as "Special"; and,
• were written before Chthonic actions existed (I'm pretty sure)
  I think these are actually chthonic effects in disguise and I should be reading about what happens when those conflict with each other.

[obsidian dagger]

I have not, and I need to. I tried to read Hitherby Dragons (yes, including the weird pre-narrative stuff) and I did in fact enjoy it, but just randomly dropped it anyway.

[fleet harbor]

I dunno if you want spoilers but I find it illustrative re: high level Ace and Aspect miracles. In it, Natalia gets in a fight with ||the Lord of Death's Dominion, and he's whupping her sort of because his movements are four-dimensional, with an extra dimension of Existence-ward and Nonexistence-ward, and hers are only three-dimensional so he's just sort of operating on a plane she can't ... and then having observed the way he moves enough, she literally grabs him and judo tosses him out of Town.||

[obsidian dagger]

I think I will avoid clicking that out of the delusion that I will someday read Fable of the Swan.

[fleet harbor]

FWIW it's not really a plot spoiler, but whatever you prefer

[obsidian dagger]

Alright. I clicked it, then, and... yeah that seems about right, depending on how you classify the various abilities in question.

[fleet harbor]

I love it as a moment

[restive ridge]

Aspect is really dun

Fun

I remember that in Nob 3e one of the example ways to defend against against an attack is just

Using Aspect and your sword to just cut the miracle in half

You can just do that

[vivid wraith]

get choppin'

[frank light]

Yeah

Aspect is cranked

[candid compass]

Aspect is powerful, but it's not unbeatable

if someone can match you in terms of miraculous force, you still get overpowered

[frank light]

It’s a force of impossible feats in the world of impossible feats

So it fits right in

High level aspect is bullshit but lower levels are “slightly” reasonable

[candid compass]

the real strength of Aspect is mostly that it just makes you good at everything

[frank light]

Same with like, Eide

Which I consider to be something of a counterpart or foil I guess.

[candid compass]

the main wrinkle with Eide is that you don't have any ways of doing miraculous Stunts

[frank light]

Yeah

[candid compass]

unlike Aspect with Perfection, Greater Conviction/Determination

[frank light]

Your main sources of miraculous overpower meant would be

Talent, cliffhanger, greater cliffhanger, and greater misdirection

Which are themselves surprisingly strong but for different reasons

In a glitch game I mimicked “cut the soul” by using greater misdirection to say “you actually can’t use aspect miracles”, rendering all their attempts phantasmagoric unless they can beat a level 12 rating

[candid compass]

your best ways of miraculously meeting force with force as a Strategist are Wyrd and ironically Flore

[frank light]

Yeah lmao

Flore is cranked if you invest in it

[fleet harbor]

I think the other strength is that it's direct

"Just hit them" is not a thing every Estate can help you with

But if you can confabulate a way a body or mind could solve a problem, Aspect can solve that problem

[candid compass]

also true yeah
it does let you do basically anything that can vaguely be construed as something a human could do

[obsidian dagger]

The downside of Aspect (or of Ace, to be clear; the other Aspect arcs aren't as locked into this) is mostly that it doesn't do more than that, You can only engage with miraculous stuff insofar as it directly gets in your way, and can only act on the fields of action that a mortal could, albeit powered up to contend with the miraculous.

[magic mason]

Another downside, though smaller, is that it doesn’t work with magic

[magic mason]

Far Roofs calls them Training Arcs which makes things a little less confusing

[obsidian dagger]

Chosen One changes this to "what your magic can do", and Reality Syndrome changes this to "what your Hack can do" which is an entirely unique and different set of constraints which is generally exactly as broad and as narrow as the Ace's but basically indepenedent from those in terms of specific limitations and difficulty.

[fleet harbor]

Is Chosen One equivalent to Holy?

[obsidian dagger]

Of course not! Magic is impossible, after all (which is why it always faces an Obstacle of at least 2). Unless you're a Chosen One; then it's OK.

[obsidian dagger]

I doubt it? What does Holy do?

[magic mason]

Adept

Holy is creature of light

[fleet harbor]

Ah, Adept

Adept was the one I meant

Was mixed up

[magic mason]

Guy who has Adept with an enemy of Free Will

[candid compass]

well also yes and no
because at the really high end Aspect can still do some insane stuff
that's the point where a Noble can punch you infinitely hard, or drink an entire river, or pick up a mountain and carry it around
conceptually it is still stuff that is "possible" for a human, but only in the broadest possible sense

[obsidian dagger]

yes, but that's still a limitation. You have trouble interacting with stuff that isn't matter or energy and isn't directly opposing you.

[candid compass]

it is a limitation definitely, but Adept likewise has a lot of narrow powers in that you need to figure out how shielding from/blasting your Enemy helps you in a situation
and Sealed also has to deal with its System

[obsidian dagger]

Reality Syndrome being called Sealed is very cool, just wanna say. And... yeah, I think that's just what Gold Arcs in general do.

They're excellent at a constrained selection of things.

Chosen One/Adept is Immortal, and allowed to work in specific constrained ways as proscribed by the reality. Ace/Aspect is Frantic, and allowed to do what it does on its own, which is taking normal things and doing them perfectly and more-than-perfectly. Reality Syndrome/Sealed is about inventing your own skill or talent that you're good at, and telling the world "no, this is a talent that exists which can do these sorts of things, and I'm very, very good at it".

[magic mason]

Funny conflict idea

Gatekeeper who’s Other is a Gatecrashers hidden world

[fleet harbor]

I will note that one of the classic examples of things you can do with extremely high Aspect miracles is punch a character in a movie. Like ... from your chair. In the theater. So really you just have to be able to conceptually envision an interaction, which makes it broader in scope than it first appears.

It absolutely is limited in scope but it's also enormous in scope, if that makes sense?

[obsidian dagger]

That feels wrong because the Gatekeeper's Other is a proscribed part of the world which exists and which it's your job to mediate with, whereas Gatecrasher (being Frantic) is about another hidden world which, narratively speaking, on a player level, is Your Thing.

[obsidian dagger]

It absolutely does, yes. Although at the highest levels of everything those limitations start to break down.

[vivid wraith]

If you can imagine it, you can do it?

[fleet harbor]

Kind of! It still has to make sense within the boundaries of what a body or mind could accomplish.

Like you can never use telekinesis with Aspect

Because bodies and minds don't magically levitate objects above the floor

[vivid wraith]

hmmm i see

[obsidian dagger]

If you can imagine it being possible, you can do it. You can't say "this makes no sense and I'm doing it anyway". For instance, no matter how good you are with a sword, you can't chop next Tuesday in half, because... what? But you can totally erase it with World-Breaker's Hand (which is admittedly an extreme example, but the point still stands).

[vivid wraith]

needs a.... mundane natural logic of some kind

[fleet harbor]

Right

It's not just raw power, you can do some legitimately weird miraculous stuff

But you have to be able to justify within the framework of like ... stuff a mythic hero could accomplish, kind of?

[vivid wraith]

writing down "must limit aspect feats to what the sword guy from Lupin can do" (including cutting the moon in half to change its phase and cutting the film they're being animated on)

[obsidian dagger]

No matter how good you are at building inventions, you can only make inventions that sort of make sense within the laws of physics, even if they're impossibly good at it. Nightmare Science, being a magical skill, is a perfect example, because a compass that points towards morality doesn't... make sense... as an invention, because that's just not a thing a compass could point to.

[fleet harbor]

"I'm going to lift up this mountain and put it in my shirt and sneak it through customs" makes absolutely no real sense

But it does make like, a mythological sense?

[obsidian dagger]

Sure, but lifting objects, putting them somewhere, and sneaking them somewhere makes sense, and that's fundamentally what you're doing.

[fleet harbor]

Right

Aspect kind of lets you get around questions of "wait, but how does that--"

How did you direct the entire volume of the river into your mouth? Where did the water go? Shut up.

Don't worry about it.

That's why it explicitly has effects like "get anywhere just in the nick of time"

[magic mason]

That’s fair, I mostly just meant using the power set to represent like

Some bastard scp researcher binding your homies

[obsidian dagger]

It also tends to work better against things you're in direct opposition against. If someone else loses their memories, you probably wouldn't be able to patch them together.

[obsidian dagger]

That's fair, and I suppose possible, but in that case... that looks less like Gatecrasher and more like Impressario, honestly.

[magic mason]

Interesting

[obsidian dagger]

Gatecrasher isn't really about individual friends. It's about an entire world, and while it's reasonable to be friends with some of them, they're not just your friends you want to protect. That world is Your Thing™️ in a Frantic way, meaning it exists kind of independently of the rest of reality, and on a narrative level you kind of get to decide if people are in it (although new NPCs can come from within it). The concept isn't unworkable per se, but that Gatekeeper would probably be an NPC?

A Gatekeeper has a job, on some cosmological level, to negotiate between different parts of reality and maintain the boundaries. A Gatecrasher has another world (or, rather, part of the world) attached to them. And the Wounded Angel has one inside of them which is trying to invade reality.

Claiming ownership over and control of Wounds is also somewhat sickly, because Wounds are impositions on your character concept, or at least negotiations with reality over it. If someone says "I stab you with a spear"... well, your character concept probably does not like having a spear in them, because that would kill them. But you also can't just say "nuh-uh". So what you do is take a wound saying "I was stabbed nonlethally". It's an imposition on your description of your character, but it's also... almost like an immune response, sequestering the world's imposition upon you?

Except that a Wounded Angel can turn that around, and claim it, and say "yes, I was stabbed in the side with a spear, which by the way is a wound which does not heal but constantly leaks blood which can cure any injury or disease". Wounds are notionally the world's attack against you, but you get to be Sickly and overwrite the ways in which the world is trying to overwrite you.

But it's a Divine Health Level, because now that injury — that description that was imposed on you — is now part of you. It's not just your body that's been influenced, but your identity (if not as a person, then at least as a character).

But by doing so, you're engaging in negotiations with your Blasphemy, a world or meaning which should not be and does not belong in reality. Your identity is reinforced with extra divine health levels because you are the gate and the lock against your Blasphemy, but should your identity as a mythical Divine being be sufficiently injured, the lock shatters and the blasphemy gets out.

I don't know exactly why Chuubo's makes me like this, but maybe because it's the intersection of philosophy, narrative analysis, and mechanical sorting and analysis, and thus the exact bullseye for things that absorb my focus. (Incidentally, this is also why classpecting is a sort of dormant-but-not-dead special interest for me.)

[hollow spruce]

today in Glitch, my PC went to go see an opera that was so thematically resonant it just killed him

[restive ridge]

Most pleasant Gaulmara evening

[vivid wraith]

Five star performance

what's a good soundtrack to read Glitch to

[hollow spruce]

yeah he was watching it and it just hit emotionally so badly it killed him

musical theater is dangerous

[hollow spruce]

Hmmm, I've collected a lot of Glitch-energy music but there's not a ton of it 'chill' enough to listen to while reading I wouldn't think

You can have my PC's playlist if you want though

[vivid wraith]

ooooh yeah that sounds fun

[hollow spruce]

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5b0viOBQvSRGT4gKhQJh1G?si=moYOMYc-Rs6WvF9ncOR_AQ&pi=84c0gTFSRH2Jr

Stuff that really fits the bill for Glitch but isn't on here includes things such as most of anything made by Will Wood

[vivid wraith]

got it!

[hollow spruce]

https://youtu.be/DENwgtD_OGM?si=azRgQjcRXfUEpcmb
https://youtu.be/g4UGCaLg2SY?si=jDmYSbhcXKJ_k_F_

[magic mason]

I listen to a lot of Penelope Scott songs for glitch vibes

[vivid wraith]

ooooooh

[magic mason]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sujN2hG9psY

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KQZ0qbkKbZ4

[vivid wraith]

oh yeah I can see it

[magic mason]

Feel Better is a personal fav

[hollow spruce]

https://youtu.be/v64-DpcLEvI?si=jnRb4HyyWIAWOb5-
https://youtu.be/0Kk0SWtSoOA?si=zW4wmIH_Iv6FNTg6
https://youtu.be/4BIMLf2_mUM?si=C6Odb43qYwMJmHQO

and a more electic mix

glitch vibes are everywhere

[vivid wraith]

i REALLY should have thought of Mother Mother early

[magic mason]

8 graves is also my favored “injecting some edge right into my veins”

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EAnwEG4NroQ

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=00mAlg1qylc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwkF2gNHSrE

[vivid wraith]

good picks y'all

[undone flame]

Derpghost's "What is good for Glitch" is suspiciously close to "Average LGBTQ playlist"

[hollow spruce]

Yeah they're the same thing

It's queer allegory all the fucking way down

[patent tiger]

Trans people have the World-Breaker's Hand

[frank light]

i love OK

[undone flame]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vfZjdK8Ktw

might as well throw this in too

[frank light]

solid one

though that may be more deceiver core

still solid though

[fleet harbor]

Expert In A Dying Field by the Beths

Cap it off with Komm Susser Tod

[vivid wraith]

excellent

[fleet harbor]

https://thebethsnz.bandcamp.com/album/expert-in-a-dying-field

Maybe actually switch the order of those

[vivid wraith]

title track is already giving some good lines

[fleet harbor]

Start with Komm Susser Tod for the "become a strategist" experience and then the album for the Chancery experience

[undone flame]

Why does Glitch only let you play Strategists

[fleet harbor]

That's just what it's about

[patent tiger]

Same reason Nobilis only lets you play Nobles, I suppose

[fleet harbor]

Strategists have a unique experience that bears addressing on its own

[undone flame]

But the weird thing is that it's like "Here's 4 different kinds of nobles, you can only play as one of them"

[vivid wraith]

nobilis does kinda do that
Describes your Imperator options but doesn't let you play as one

[hollow spruce]

Part of it, I think, is that Glitch is so specifically about Strategists that playing another splat would make you lose something

So much of the game is about the idea that you are fucked up and sad and dying

[undone flame]

Well an Imperator is a different Thing

A Strategist is one type of Excrucian who are all equal things

[hollow spruce]

Decievers and Warmains have their own reasons to get angsty but they lack that inbuilt dichotomy of 'I am something of the void bound to suffer within a Creation i can no longer kill'

[patent tiger]

The thing is, the Excrucians types are all quantitatively very different from one another

They actually aren't equal things at all

[fleet harbor]

Qualitatively, even

[hollow spruce]

A deciever game would be really fun! but it wouldn't be glitch

[patent tiger]

That too, yes, but also quantitatively

[patent tiger]

In fact, I believe at one point in time there was a Nobilis expansion about playing as Deceivers

[fleet harbor]

I think also, given some things Jenna has said, she specifically wanted to create a game about empathizing with the Excrucians who in previous games had really simply been the worst

And it's true that strategists kind of had the least going on

[patent tiger]

Essentially - Glitch is specifically about playing the Strategist experience, which is a lot different from the Warmain experience, which is a lot different from the Mimic experience, which is etcetera

[fleet harbor]

They deserved a touchup

[patent tiger]

And a game couldn't meaningfully encompass, probably even just any two of those, without significantly diminishing their deals, and the different levels of power and dynamics, and etcetera

[magic mason]

because everyone else has a completly diffrent power set and completly diffrent story set

[hollow spruce]

Also, part of the thematic conceit of a Glitch party is that you play as a group of freaks who are all fundamentally in the same boat

You probably don't even like each other that much but you can all fundamentally relate to each other

If somebody was playing a Deciever, that kind of disconnects them from that in couple ways

[fleet harbor]

I think also also also, because Strategists had so little clear about them beyond "the worst" and "World-Breaker's Hand", there was an opportunity to use them to express a set of metaphors that I suspect were very important to Jenna personally (and to a lot of her audience)

[undone flame]

gkathellar is the one who has answered my question tbf I was looking more for authorial intent

[fleet harbor]

Mind I'm guessing here, I don't know Jenna personally, but I think they are educated guesses at least based on things she's said

[frank light]

Yeah more or less

Tbh glitch made me fall in love with strategists conceptually and I adore how much they suck in other books

[vivid wraith]

okay just got a rec from another source too good not to share
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os7kvLzYKgY

[frank light]

Because “these guys are the worst they fucking suck I hate them”

Is great when you’re playing as one and you’re very sad about it

My pc explicitly sucks so bad she is not at all innocent in this war
I explicitly made her have a reputation as an awful evil strategist

Just so that her going on a whole redemption arc is even harder for HER to do and also because it’s funnier now

Her reputation and penchant for violence and lack of empathy have only caused problems for her ability to try and be a good person(she’s working on it)

[hollow spruce]

I've managed to craft such a deeply bizarre and sadsack man

[frank light]

Yeah

It’s great

[magic mason]

The two ways to make a Sealed/Reality Syndrome power

• Choose a broken power and then limit it somehow.
• Watch 32 youtube videos about Hard Magic systems

[vivid wraith]

also this one
https://youtu.be/jFrC1c5hbeA

[fleet harbor]

Oh actually for Strategist Songs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwUBJXKcOEY&list=RDMM&index=18

[hollow spruce]

Oh yeah this is a good one GK

[fleet harbor]

Jenna reposted an animatic about the Chuubo's strategist girl that used this song

That's why I know it

[hollow spruce]

Hah! Nice

[fleet harbor]

Uh ... Miramie?

[hollow spruce]

I just got it on my Spotify and went 'oh yeah that's glitch right there'

[fleet harbor]

I kinda think love songs with an ironic or tragic edge are good for Strategists

[hollow spruce]

Yee, slots right in

[frank light]

Shit yeah

Community gardens is a mal song too tbh :3

[obsidian dagger]

I think a lot of Reality Syndrome stuff is done power-first, which isn't necessarily entirely wrong, but it obfuscates what Reality Syndrome 1-2 looks like. Personally, I think Forbidden Scrollery is a great example of exactly that, with the arc 1 Childish Wish being something that actually feels like a childish wish ("I wish I could read everything!") and sort of logically builds from there. It's also a Gold Arc which isn't about overt martial arts... I think. I could see Purple or Blue, even, but I think she goes Reality Syndrome 1->2 halfway through the story, and hits Reality Syndrome 3 at the very end before we get to actually see her Hack in action.

[magic mason]

I always kinda saw it as the kinda... "Gimmick charecter" of the cast

Like if Superman is an Ace Reality syndrome Mfs are The Flash

The Flash is my general Reality Syndrome media touchstone tbh

[obsidian dagger]

I think some great examples of Reality Syndrome are... I really want to say Yukari, but probably not. I think a better example of it is... okay. This is a very specific reference, which goes a bit afield, but bear with me.

Spacebattles is a forum originally dedicated to discussing how a fight between characters from different media would go down (and we don't need to get into discussions about badwrongfun or missing the point or anything). And there was one particular character who was known for causing problems: Dio, from Jojo's Bizarre Adventure.

Dio has, most prominently, the ability to briefly stop time. So a lot of fights boiled down to him instantly winning in the time stop. If he couldn't instantly win during that time, due to not being able to effectively damage the target, then he instantly lost.

In my mind, that's the quintessential essence of Reality Syndrome: your power level, and the way in which it interacts with other people's power levels, is just on an entirely different axis than what most characters engage with. You're fundamentally asking a different question to determine what you can or can't do.

Or, to put it another way: teleportation magic might work in such a way that teleporting greater distances is more difficult than teleporting short distances, and then Reality Symptom might have a Hack that lets you teleport where it's easier to teleport to places you know well and harder to teleport to places you're unfamiliar with, totally independent of distance.

Or power copying is frequently on Reality Syndrome, because instead of the question being "how well-suited are my powers to this problem?" you face the question "how well am I able to gain access to powers which are well-suited to this problem?"

That said, you’ll know a character is on Reality Syndrome if they do have a Hack — if they have one of those powers that’s arguably just an I-Win Button forever, only, they don’t seem to be able to actually use it like that.
Per Jenna Moran's official description of the arc.

[magic mason]

Yeah that is why Flash is one of my favs for it

[obsidian dagger]

Super speed and time stopping aren't the same, but they belong in the same sort of field of "if you can do it at all, you can do it easily. If not, you don't have anything to help you."

[magic mason]

because I feel in the case of Flash it also feels very Yellow in how it is used and manifests

[obsidian dagger]

I don't know too much about Flash. Most of what I know is from the worse examples, or the more poorly-written examples.

Then again, anything that literally grants wishes belongs on Reality Syndrome, where the difficulty of completing a task is more explicitly "how in-character is this for you?"

...the other thing is that the intention ladder grants rewards in a specific order. If you do something productive (i.e. makes your life better) it's also implicitly able to be effective (moves you closer to your goals) and correct (impresses the people around you). Reality Syndrome does not guarantee that. It's totally possible to use your Hack in a way which doesn't actually move you any closer to your intended goals, but helps you in some other way.

[frank light]

Flash has a power that could basically do anything but doesn’t

Which is pretty in line for sealed/reality syndrome

[obsidian dagger]

(Technically you can do that with skills, too, but it's something you choose.)

I also think it's important to get better about understanding Reality Syndrome as more than just that. Or, at least, it's important to me; I'm not trying to make a sweeping moral statement or anything.

[frank light]

I mean yeah

[magic mason]

Here is the thing though, in Flash stuff there is a lot of Childish Dream and Little Push type stuff

[frank light]

But at it’s core is a power that is super powerful and should win anything but…doesn’t

From being able to make wishes to the second skin of decievers

Yeah

Flash as an example works really well for a speed based reality syndrome

[magic mason]

like Flash basically being infinitely quick as long as its for like... a bit where he's grabbing everyone food rq

[frank light]

Including the childish dreams bit

Yeah

Exactly

[obsidian dagger]

Undead Unluck has kind of a lot of examples of this, including the ability to ||make people do the opposite of what they perceive as "just"|| to (this is much bigger spoilers) ||being able to copy the powers of anyone who hates you||.

[frank light]

It’s a really solid example you could use

[magic mason]

in Far Roofs there is a guy who's system is that he can take elemental gems out of things "gem slots" and add them into other things "gem slots"

[obsidian dagger]

"pockets full of improbable stuff" is probably also a common hack?

[frank light]

It’s mentioned that deceivers use reality syndrome/sealed to copy people’s entire stats. But they have a bunch of restrictions on it

[fleet harbor]

Yeah most Deceivers' Sealed power is Second Skin

[frank light]

It’s a fun power

[fleet harbor]

Assume the powers of another being, but if someone can name that being to you, they can use it like a True Name a bit

[obsidian dagger]

I sort of view it as, when you're determining how well you're able to accomplish some task, you're asking a different question than what everyone else asks. Instead of asking "how hard is this" you're asking "how in-character is this" or "how easy is it to phrase this as something to ask my genie" or "how well can I describe the series of actions I'd need to take in order to accomplish this while time is frozen".

A lot of seemingly-impossible things are trivial, and a lot of seemingly-trivial things (such as getting ice cream) are very difficult, because you're just operating on a different axis.

[candid compass]

They can give you one command
And you either have to do it, or very painfully discard your Skin

[tall jolt]

So is 3e the best Nobilis edition? (Im not edition warring, this is a genuine question)

[patent tiger]

Its system is pretty similar but somewhat cleaner than 2e's, from what I recall (it's been a while since I last read 2e)

And I don't know much about the first edition

[tall jolt]

Ye I have read TV tropes that there was some disappointment from the writers of the web page about certain things being cleaned

trying to find it....I think its something to do with estates

[patent tiger]

A lot of the tone got shifted, if that's what you mean?

[tall jolt]

Thats perhaps it, but I thought it was the way Character Creation worked

[nocturne epoch]

I think it's sometimes worse in tone

Rules wise I love it

Layout is dogshit

The tone is not as up its own arse as 2e which is great but sometimes veers on a little too twee

Art is dogshit

2e's art was also pretty bad though

[vivid wraith]

I like 3e's art

[hollow spruce]

honestly I think 3e's art adds to the charm

gives a very programmer art touhou energy to it

[patent tiger]

(That's 'cause a lot of it is plagiarized touhou fanart)

[vivid wraith]

not in my copy! I think

[hollow spruce]

lmao I forgot about that bit

I just remembered there was Something that happened with one of the main artists that fucked everything up

and none of these games have a good layout honestly

[restive ridge]

I like the art of both 3e's

Both of these are good

[restive ridge]

First edition was a really small book and included in 2e basically

[obsidian dagger]

I am tired and probably still hypomanic and staring at the descriptions of what each stage of Reality Syndrome means and what I know about what it means to be Immortal or Frantic or Sickly and I feel like I can see the code. There's fundamental underlying patterns about what it means to be however many steps deep in an arc, kind of regardless of what that arc is, about having your truth (whether part of, independent of, or inimical to the world's) and learning how to get used to it, and learning how to get along with it, and then learning how to make it be True and learning how you can interface it with others and finally how to break your own rules.

The way in which the various stages of Reality Syndrome are described seem a lot like how something like Primordial works, when you go from (i.e.) holding someone else's Hope, to holding what could lead to Hope, to holding your own hope and being able to have things without needing help from others. About when you can work with others, and when you no longer have to. It's dancing just beyond my fingertips.

[nocturne epoch]

it's more the like, traced touhou fanart and even a lot of the replacement stuff

[obsidian dagger]

But I am not going to try to read every arc and cross-reference what things happen when and what they mean, because I know this is a fool's errand and also I need to at least try to sleep and also also I will not divine the Deep Ludological Structure within Chuubo's Marvelous Wish-Granting Engine tonight and also also also I kind of just don't want to bother.

But somewhere, beyond words, beyond conscious understanding, some thread of that logic and understanding lurks, snagged on the tangled wire of my brain (and evidently encouraging me to emulate a Moran-esque pseudo-poetic voice.)

[restive ridge]

Ok so

initial context

Now fire

[fleet harbor]

Yeah no I can buy it

I would say we're top-middle

[restive ridge]

Mm mmm

That makes sense to me

[magic mason]

I wonder how dangerous a Haunt could get

like is it dangerous from a Mortal perspective or from a Power perspective

[obsidian dagger]

I have remembered two things:

• A hypothetical writeup of a Chuubo's miraculous perk (i.e. it could probably be wrangled into a Gift if I understand correctly) which fits for fey tricksters and shapeshifters and all sorts of mischief-makers but was, admittedly, originally concieved of for Robbie Rotten
• The anime Kamichu, which is one of the most Chuubo's things I've watched. Just... everything about it.

[vivid wraith]

Kamichu you say

[obsidian dagger]

I don't remember how I wrote up the first one of those exactly, but the basic gist of it was as such:

You can spend MP to put on a miraculous disguise, either sustained on its own, or combined with an Intention (not an intention to disguise yourself, but to do whatever it is you wanted to do while disguised). The disguise has some limitations; first and foremost, it can't be used to intentionally disguise yourself as any specific character who's appeared in the narrative before (although you might disguise yourself as a specific named character incidentally). Instead, you pick some generic role, like "caterer" or "plumber" or "visiting celebrity", and disguise yourself as someone who meets that role. In addition, you must pick one or more of the following limitations:

• A certain group of people can see through your disguise (children, animals, your mortal enemies, your family)
• People can see through your disguise by looking at you in a specific way (through a stone with a hole in the middle, through their fingers, between their legs, in the infrared spectrum, in a mirror)
• You have one "tell" which is never disguised (a tattoo, a scar, a specific turn of phrase, a way of fidgeting when anxious)
  (I'm pretty sure there was a fourth category but I can't remember what)

Otherwise, your disguise stands, Miraculously. Even if someone notices something "off" about you, they're inclined to believe any explanation you give so long as it's at least remotely plausible, and even if someone knows about your disguise they'll be hard-pressed to reveal it to others (not sure how this would work, but presumably kind of like the Auctoritas Magister but for the disguise rather than the intention? Or an inherent Obstacle against people noticing your disguise, or at revealing your identity to others?)

The main way the disguise ends is by ending the Intention it's tied to. If you successfully complete your intention to your satisfaction, you can dramatically reveal your true identity, but otherwise you have just enough time to duck into a nearby alleyway or conveniently-placed closet before it vanishes; if something interferes with your Intention, or defeats it in a direct contest, your disguise will fall off at the most inopportune moment.

Kamichu, meanwhile, is about a middle school girl who wakes up one morning to discover she's become a god. Everyone is kind of weirdly okay with this; like, one of the episodes starts with her biking to school and an old lady says "so I hear you've become a god?"

It's all over the place in some of the best ways, and just... very Chuubo's. Becoming a goddess is in practice less of a metaphysical change, and more of a social one. I'm torn between sharing some actual episode synopses or leaving them as sort of spoilers.

[vivid wraith]

iiiinteresting

[obsidian dagger]

Okay, two of the episode premises are "my shrine maiden classmate has me set up giving out advice/blessings for Valentine's Day, and a girl asked for help getting close to a specific guy, but I have a crush on that guy" and "the Prime Minister called me in to negotiate with an alien".

Or, for an early one:

• The main character's shrine maiden classmate has informed her that her shrine's god has gone missing, so she has to enter the realm of the gods to investigate ->
• She enters the realm of the gods and ||all the gods there are super respectful of her and kind and this weirds her out (there's literally a moment where she refers to the other gods like she would to worship them, and they say "no, you don't have to be like that! You're our peer now!")|| ->
• ||She finds the god of the shrine! Turns out he had left to start a rock band. But he's a terrible musician and it's annoying the other gods too, so she convinces him to come back.|| ->
• ||He agrees to come back, but doesn't want to be the god of that shrine any more because he was feeling stifled. So now the main character is the god of the shrine, and she has to deal with stuff like "being expected to speak to a crowd before a festival" and "having people literally worshipping her"||.

[frank light]

had a very interesting convo in the ninuan discord server

on strategists

[obsidian dagger]

Which one does Eide translate to again? Flore is Sentimental I'm pretty sure (which I know strategists have) and Lore would be... Gatecrasher?

[candid compass]

Eide is Troubled

[vivid wraith]

sure is

[candid compass]

Lore is Gatecrasher
Flore is Sentimental
And Wyrd is Accursed

[obsidian dagger]

Ah, alright.

[fleet harbor]

Oh hey another Kamichu knower! Kamichu is great!

"Mitsue, I became a god"

[obsidian dagger]

I need to rewatch and finish it,

I will never forget the cat episode, which I don’t want to spoil a single thing about.

[fleet harbor]

You’re right though Kamichu has enormous Chuubo’s and World Ash vibes

[magic mason]

Lore is Gatekeeper*

[frank light]

Yeah lore is gatekeeper

[candid compass]

Oh yeah sorry

I got mixed up for a moment

[frank light]

All these damn gates

[obsidian dagger]

If Wounded Angel wasn’t such an iconic and evocative name, I’d be upset about it breaking the pattern.

[magic mason]

I also don’t know what gate you would make

“Pov you are the gate”

[restive ridge]

I love Chuubo

Chuubo be like "this awful person is trying to convince the innocent woodland creatures that Christmas isnt worth it"

And then you check Nob 3e and that person used to brainwash children into soldiers of the Warhost

[vivid wraith]

jenna's done it again

[fleet harbor]

Hey Iolithae Septimian is exactly as bad as she used to be (that’s why she’s stuck in a basement)

[restive ridge]

Average Lore 5 strategist activity

[magic mason]

Honestly this might be Flore 5

Warhost geomancers pull this shit

They feel bad, of course they feel bad

But not bad enough to stop

[candid compass]

It's also great that the writeup of her in 3e says she loves to corrupt children, but leaves just enough themselves that killing them isn't a mercy

[restive ridge]

Lexiarchos is like...

My favorite Strategist ever

Besides the one Dying of Mechas

[candid compass]

also because I always translate Excrucian names, Lexiarchos is
Lex- (LIKENESS [LIKE (A/AN/THE)]) + -archos (TREASURE-HOUSE)

[fleet harbor]

I will hit her with a hammer

[frank light]

Lexiarchos I think was also originally supposed to be like, the example chancery strategist.
Jenna mentioned wanting to do a story with her(that’s partially where tiramisu came from in that one quest)

And the example project in Nobilis 3e is giving her a redemption arc

She’s great

OH WAIT SPEAKING OF lemme post something.
I wrote a writeup for my strategist but written in the 3e style from noble pov

I don’t think I posted it here

Malonas Augadda 

This is an Excrucian Strategist dying of Black Holes; she is covered in slowly multiplying dark orbs that eat away at her and cause her to eventually simply die. She eventually collapses into a black hole, reforming in a chrysalis in the lands beyond creation, returning with a new fresh body. She is a monstrous thing, with too many hands, a tail, claws, and sharp teeth. Her pale gray skin is always cold, and she carries with her horrors from the beyond and magic taboo to creation. She wields the Abhorrent weapon Rancor, named Beusula, which she used to slay the angel Orakum. Her vice is cruelty, she often takes great pleasure in antagonizing mortal groups wizards and mages, but also setting elaborate plots in motion during her welken rites. She prefers watching people attempt to rise against her, but inevitably fail in the face of void divinity.

:3

[candid compass]

and because I'm still on that page in 3e, Adhemar likewise is
Adh- (WEALTH [WEALTH BRINGS (THE)]) + -mar (FEVER)

And Malakai is
Mal- (GRINDER [OF (THE)]) + -kai (FLOWERS)

[vivid wraith]

Wyrd girl Wednesday!!!!

[frank light]

Ye

[frank light]

YEAH!!! WYRD GIRL WEDNESDAY

[magic mason]

Flashback to they/them theft Thursday

[candid compass]

oh and Textrix is HAND ELEGY

[vivid wraith]

Incredible

[candid compass]

unfortunately their luthes are not written, which would give more insight into the name 😛

[hollow spruce]

I also did this for the bit

Gaulmara Pieres 

This is an Excrucian Strategist dying of Rhythm; the world around him is twisted into an everpresent song he dances to, until he eventually is subsumed into being yet another instrument of Creation. He strikes a morose figure, always donned in a long coat and draping black hair, and is a terrible and subdued power, forcing others to move to the same melody he does as his voice warps and tears reality apart. His vice is apathy, often willing to simply let things happen as they spiral to a slow and inevitable end, including himself. Ancient and hands bloodied with the death of the estates Impossibility and The Sun, he still persists in the world, but his machinations are unknown.

[frank light]

I love doing “her vice is cruelty”

It’s so funny to me to give my 19 year old strategist that

She’s working on it

[candid compass]

I likewise also jumped onto this bandwagon, because it was fun 😛

Oseric Liutica
This is an Excrucian Strategist dying of injustice; the small woes and troubles of life intensify and accumulate around him, until they wear down and swallow him and those around him. He styles himself as a dark knight, a grim faced avenger setting out to right the 'wrongs' of this world at sword point. Curiously this one seems almost as likely to attack his erstwhile allies in the Host as to rail against the law-beings, if either should get in his way. He can be reasoned with occasionally, turned against a common enemy, but one should always be wary. Between his acts of apparent kindness he is prone to outbursts of incredible violence against those he deems guilty.

[frank light]

:3

[magic mason]

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/comments/jbml4t/goblin_trips_balls_tears_a_hole_in_reality/
No One:
Jasper's Brother:

[magic mason]

I am having a lot of trouble thinking of a way to make Strategy/Scheme work in Far Roofs

anyone got ideas?

[frank light]

oh

heres my take

so
you find an opportunity you can seize OR something that pushes against the status quo. This alllows you to make your scheme/strategy

This scheme slash strategy involves the table talking together about what seems feasible, including the resources involved (same way it works in glitch), with everyone having the ability to veto a plan.

Then once its finalized, the plan will more or less work unless a miracle suddenly makes it useless or impossible
But while it works mundane actions involved in the plan i thihnk just straight up work or have edge
etc etc

and y'know
the plan works

with the example in glitch
You see an angel fall, so you make a scheme to help them regain their divinity by helping them cheat at a game of cards where that divinity is at stake
and everyone agrees as that as a plan

[magic mason]

TROUBLED/ EIDE

[undone flame]

Had a weird nobles adjacentbdream

[frank light]

Ooooo?

[tall jolt]

Would a the Power of Powers be able to go past the cost of stuff like World breakers hand?

🤔

[candid compass]

well is that Powers as in the Sovereign Powers, or Powers as in miraculous powers?

[frank light]

Probably not

Wbh is ANYTHING

[candid compass]

but also either way, WBH will erase pretty much anything

it is the purest form of destruction by the void

[frank light]

Plus I don’t know if powers by default have an estate

[restive ridge]

This is why Chuubo/Glitch introduced Cthonic actions/Rites :p

[tall jolt]

Powers as in like "Super Powers" kind of things

[frank light]

Ah I see

Still wouldn’t really go past it

[tall jolt]

Like anything you can reasonably identify as something extremely exceptional

[frank light]

Cus superpowers are usually still mundane

Like magic and psychic powers n shit

Which is separate from the power of a miracle

Not weaker just…not a miracle

[tall jolt]

Superpowers have expanded a lot, Gods generally could be considered to have super powers. Example: Darkseid

[magic mason]

Yeah but Miracles are a specific type of thing that are seperate from normal Magic/Super powers/Psychics

They just Happen

[frank light]

Yeah but like still technically mundane

Mundane forces can still rip apart time and space and bend reality

They’re just…not miracles

[magic mason]

Shoutout to all the mortals who think they can beat powers or excrucians because they got a few bonds

[restive ridge]

Tier 1- Noble who is a streamer and has their chat as a treasure
Tier 2- Deceiver who has a chat as a Pstate
Tier 3- Spirit of the chat of a streamer who is a Noble themselves but does not care about the streamer

[frank light]

Hey I mean it’s possible

Wards only protect against miracles

[patent tiger]

I don’t even have that and I’d win

[frank light]

So if you have the grit, the ability to not die, and the bonds…hey it’s possible

[restive ridge]

I could argue Lord Entropy to death

[patent tiger]

But why would you? He spreads evil and hatred throughout the land, he’s great

[frank light]

Hate himmmmmm >:((((

Explosion

[restive ridge]

To eat his heart and become the Imperator of Destruction Desecration and Scorn myself

[magic mason]

Could always pull some shit that far roofs sorcerers do

Evoke that divinity is something that can be devoured and try to pull something other than normal redtooth rite with it

[restive ridge]

To spread my own, more wicked evil

Also canonically Helen of Troy used Shine 5 to rizz up an entire army of mortals to kill an Imperator

[magic mason]

Yeah

[candid compass]

it was incredibly based of her

very curious about the other two times an Imperator was killed by mortals though

[magic mason]

Wizard who fucking ate a wildlord

He’s still like around

[tall jolt]

Shoutout to all the people who died of hubris in thinking they were better then the Gods. Not me though, I am better, maybe even better then the Gods....

[magic mason]

But yeah its completly possible to be the Power of superpowers but miracles aren’t superpowers

[candid compass]

Creation of superpowers is pretty funny

[frank light]

Yeah lmao

scion

[tall jolt]

Guess you gotta play the Power of Miracles LUL

[magic mason]

I think Miracles are like Flowers and Imperators

There aren’t laws for that shit

[candid compass]

in seriousness, the book pretty heavily advises against letting people take estates with that much metaphysical reach

like Flowers, yeah

[magic mason]

Or any of fucking Firstborn’s estates

[fleet harbor]

I think it has to be part of your game’s specific premise

[frank light]

Meaning and existence are a bit hard as estates in play yeah

Though admittedly playing as ananda’s powers seems funny

[restive ridge]

I dont think Meaning and Existence would be like "overpowered" like how Miracles or Flowers would be

[fleet harbor]

I’d you want to do a two-player game as Firstborn’s powers that would be cool but I think you gotta know what you’re getting into

[candid compass]

now I wonder what the properties of the Fourth Age are

and what Domain miracles for the Fourth Age would look like

[magic mason]

The fourth age

• is an age of ruin
• has not yet occurred
• might be a high school AU
• there are rats I think
• earth dies

[fleet harbor]

But yeah I also think this is accurate

Destruction of Existence would not work like WBH, I think

[frank light]

Admittedly the domain miracles for it would be wacky

[fleet harbor]

It would work in weird, conceptual ways

[frank light]

You could talk to…existence spirits?

[patent tiger]

I think that very much depends

[frank light]

And you could make existence?

And destroy it

[patent tiger]

That is, having read WTF semi-recently

[frank light]

It’s a weird one

You can also protect and nourish existence

[patent tiger]

I would be hard-pressed to interpret Meaning miracles as not having direct control over the play of the rpg

[frank light]

And edit it’s destiny

[magic mason]

I think destruction of existence might be able to Prescott somebody

[fleet harbor]

WTF?

[patent tiger]

Removing the Meaning from something removes it from being relevant to the game

[magic mason]

Wisher Theurgist Fatalist

[frank light]

Wisher theurgist fatalist

[patent tiger]

Wisher, Theurgist, Fatalist

[fleet harbor]

Ah

I am not familiar

[frank light]

Omg I’m playing wtf

[patent tiger]

It's a morangame that's also an exploration of rpgs as an experience

[magic mason]

Omg were playing wtf

[patent tiger]

I'd recommend reading it, iff you have the right game designer brain to appreciate that sort of esoterica

As it happens, I do have that

So it's a fun thing to read

[candid compass]

it's a game about playing RPGs in a lot of ways

[restive ridge]

... Is yet to come
... Is a promise
... Is an omen
... Promises better things
... Will require a great battle to manifest
... Inspires hope
... Is awaiting it's own coming```

[magic mason]

The fairies in it are bastards

[vivid wraith]

sburb ttrpg if you squint

[fleet harbor]

Meaning…
…exists in the heart
…is constructed from moment to moment
…is necessary for life
…can come from anywhere

[frank light]

fuck

stepnix youre right

[fleet harbor]

(There’s a convincing argument that the actual Homestuck RPG is Roll For Shoes)

[candid compass]

notably one of the roles, the Theurgist I think(?), also has the power to change how the rules of the game work

and the other two have control over the world, and the relation of the roles to each other

[restive ridge]

Found them finally

http://nobilis-aleph.wikidot.com/estates

[fleet harbor]

Existence…
…encompasses all things
…relates one thing to another
…justifies itself
…is imperfect
…is a crime against the void

[restive ridge]

But yeah I'd be ok with like having PCs with these Estates

[vivid wraith]

[candid compass]

huh, there it is

[vivid wraith]

This could be the last guy's estate properties I'd be cool with that

[restive ridge]

Like they are not more inherently powerful or anything, miraculous combat is a matter of conversation, where the player's cleverness is more important that a more "important" Estate (that is the Ghost Engine dominates mechanics)

Remember the Power of the French Fry that Flew into the Corner

[magic mason]

😌😌

[hollow spruce]

being able to be a clever bastard is half the fun

[magic mason]

The French Fry

[hollow spruce]

also morg what is your name

[vivid wraith]

The French Fey

[fleet harbor]

And part of the whole point of Nobles having Persona is to give them non-obvious ways to wield their estate

[vivid wraith]

Power of Miracles that maxed Domain

[restive ridge]

I also Miracles would rock as like

[magic mason]

Honestly even with a very narrow estate a good Greater Motion toy make your estate more important might pass people off but it would fix your issue

[restive ridge]

Not the magic of Nobles but like

Where is that Chuubo quote

The Power of this feeling

[magic mason]

Like my thing that I should definitely continue writing where the Noble Of Cake said it should haunt the vital undead(vampires) forevermore

[patent tiger]

Elysium ||as in Disco Elysium||

[magic mason]

And now Cake, while still being cake, probably has a lot more spooky manifestions that it had to create in order to haunt vampires properly

[restive ridge]

Ru had this exact username years ago and I stole it as a symbollic gesture as part of a rite to devour her power

[patent tiger]

It was "Ru, Genghis Gal" actually

If memory serves

[fleet harbor]

That’s what I recall

[restive ridge]

Miracles...
... Come from the core, the truthfulness of things
... Demand response
... Change lives
... Have a deepness and richness of experience to them
... Bring new truths to surface
... Tend towards good
... Are deeply personal```

[undone flame]

I was the Power of Chivalry and Romance (somehow both don't worry about it) and I went to a Tournament run by all the gods.

[patent tiger]

Hell yeah

[frank light]

lmao

[undone flame]

I had a pegasus and a bunch of other shit happened that I did not write down so now I forgor

[magic mason]

Ace
You learn Ace powers via Training arcs.

Dauntless
8+: Automatically win a contested roll you lost earlier in this scene with an attribute or superior skill.

Refined
You have a +2 Bonus to Self Care.

Push Yourself
5+: Until the end of the scene, you gain a +1 bonus to an attribute or superior skill of your choice.

Cosmopolitan
You speak all languages and everyone you meet treats you as you would be treated by peers in your home culture(For example, if you are attractive among the people of town you are still considered rather attractive by the rats of fortitude.)

Bounceback
At the end of each chapter, regain 2HP up to your starting value.

Determination
8+: Reduce the penalty on a roll with an Attribute or Superior Skill by 3, to a minimum of 0.

Conviction
You have perfect motive control over all parts of your body including things that you would normally not have control over like hair,organs or body temperature, and it also includes your mind allowing you to have perfect control of your own train of thought, have a photographic memory, or cause yourself to viscerally hallucinate something specific.

Anime Moment
Whenever you roll quadruples or quintuples, draw a card.

Ace: The next time you would roll with an attribute or superior skill, treat it as if you rolled 1 1 1 1.

Practice
You gain 1 skill point that can only be placed into Superior or Professional skills. At the end of each Chapter this skill point is returned to you and can be spent on different Superior or Professional skills.

Unbreakable
The first time you would be reduced to 0HP in a dramatic conflict, instead you are reduced to 1HP and draw a card.

Aspect for Far Roofs

[candid compass]

The Worth of the World (40xp)
You used to be so sure, that there was something worth saving in this world
That there was a goal at the end of all this, that would make it all worth it
Now, not only is there no goal, it seems there may never even have been a road in the first place
Still, you are stuck here for the time being, and you have responsibilities still
So perhaps you'll find a way to make do

Major goals - 5xp each

• You give a genuine apology to someone you've hurt, especially if they reject it
• You experience a moment of true beauty in Creation
• Someone close to you gives an impassioned speech on why you shouldn't give up
• Someone close to you turns away from you

Quest flavor -
Something gives you a measure of hope
You lament that the world is wrong
You just give up for a while
A conversation about whether something is even worth doing
You wrestle with feelings of unworthiness
You are called out for being a hypocrite
Someone just doesn't understand

putting this here as well, just because I think it came together fairly nicely
I wrote up a little quest since my character is currently experiencing a bit of a crisis

[vivid wraith]

ooooooooh

[winged smelt]

https://www.tumblr.com/prokopetz/750597149874585600/which-excrucian-splat-would-king-charles-be

Excrucian mention

[frank light]

The Gaudtrixia

The Gaudtrixia is a semi-formal regular ceremony held on a specific day that doesn’t exist. Of course, by the correlative nature of ninuan, this means it happens a few times a year.

Excrucians, all over the ash, may sometimes come to their Welken-Law cruxstones, and together, light lanterns carrying some marking of the world they siege.
Not everyone participates, or some are simply too busy, so the varying dates are really a boon for those excrucians with busy schedules(particularly strategists, notably terrible at remembering dates).

By the welken-law, those who participate may watch Lanterns carrying marks from alfscienne, jotunheim, earth, hell, and worlds beyond. It is a day said to mark the creation of the world, a day full of solemn melancholy, a day to mourn those lost in the war.
Some say it is cathartic, to see your fellow ninuanni and know you are not alone.

It is traditional during the Gaudtrixia to also leave a flower from the void in your lantern, though this is optional. Sometimes it is difficult to source a Welken-rose or Autoposy depending on your location.

melancholy little ceremony

[magic mason]

High deepness Decievers the types of mfs to become a mind plague so they can do bits

[patent tiger]

And they’re right to do so

[magic mason]

btw anyone got feedback on this

[patent tiger]

I have not played Far Roofs so I don't have much of an eye for discussing/assessing content for it

[magic mason]

Very fair

[fleet harbor]

This is weird, but I'm reading this article https://thelampmagazine.com/issues/issue-17/shadow-on-the-sun linked by Misc a few days ago in #technical-discussion

And I cannot stop thinking "this is an Actual"

"This is the scariest portrayal of an Actual I can imagine"

Some of that's just the language the author uses to describe it, which is honestly worth looking at re: how to depict an actual, I think

[vivid wraith]

👁️

[fleet harbor]

It looks slightly different from above. From the satellite view on Google Maps, Spanish Springs is a tiny dense huddle, three blocks by three. And surrounding it, for acres and acres on every side, the parking lots bloat. Beyond that, there are only suburbs and golf courses. Suburbs without sidewalks, flat sterile streets feeding into eight-lane highways. Golf courses lodged into every gap. The blank formless form that destroyed all the tiny old towns so convincingly simulated by Spanish Springs. There was never an Allan & Storms. There never was a Fountain of Youth. Something depthless and cruel, with the face of its long-vanquished enemy flayed off and worn as a mask.

Tell me this isn't an Actual

I could post literally any paragraph from this article and it would have these vibes

[frank light]

oh fuck yeah

[vivid wraith]

bro went to florida and got glitched

[fleet harbor]

Dying of Florida

It'd be an interesting narrative -- not sure it's campaign material, but could be a good story -- if a Strategist discovered that their Glitch, while something really wrong with the world, was initiated by contact with an Actual created by the Valde Bellum

[fleet harbor]

The campaign version of that might be ||that Creation itself is something resembling an Actual||

[frank light]

honestly possible

the true glitch is revealed when shit starts breaking
so if the world is getting stretched and damaged, that might cause some people to glitch

[fleet harbor]

I think the way I'd frame it is

This Strategist has been fighting the war

Being angry

And they've never looked back at their old life

They've been busy, and why would they?

The world is wrong

But then something calls them home

Something war-related

And they find that something very different is wrong at home

Something infectious

And they find that they can't ignore it

[frank light]

oooo

that could be fun

[fleet harbor]

They go home expecting to murder all their old friends and then they find their old friends have been turned into something twisted and it's just ... it's hard not to do something about it.

[fleet harbor]

An estate that would have really cool Domain uses: lies

[candid compass]

Tell a lie once, instantly Destroyed

[restive ridge]

Preserving Lies is fun

[patent tiger]

We've seen what Lies as a Psuedoestate can do, as an Estate proper I'd be terrified

[fleet harbor]

Even just destruction and creation would be absolutely wild

[vivid wraith]

edits your miracle ladder

[patent tiger]

"Excrucians don't have miraculous power, we're all just playing along to humor them"

[fleet harbor]

I don't think I'd interpret it as being able to edit reality and choose what statements are true or false, but even without that, the ability to create a falsehood or destroy a falsehood would lead to some crazy places

[frank light]

The persona miracles are already solid as hell

Lies as an angel or a fallen?

[magic mason]

I would probably put lies as a fallen

[frank light]

I could see it being an Angel

[magic mason]

Or maybe a Gamer if every world has their own emergent lies god

Or a rules lord of lies could be funny

[fleet harbor]

What about Wildlord?

(Serpent might be funny because of how weirdly it fits)

[frank light]

Wildlord works too yeah

Oh that reminds me lemme post a custom splat for a miraculous being that works as a fun quick antagonist

Praetors - Long ago, at the start of the valde bellum, there was a very very small world. This world was so small it had no gods of its own. It had no grand guardians to defend against the excrucian tide. 
So they built a weapon. 
They organized the entirety of their civilization, the whole grand flow of their industry into this weapon.

But their weapon was too powerful. It was born only to defeat the excrucians, and to defend its creators. So it conquered its world, and then it shattered itself. It took each and every one of its pieces, and placed it into its creators.

These it named Praetors. 

Praetors purchase Ability for 1 character point, they are extremely skilled at navigating the world and developing new skills on the fly.

Praetors possess Adept, organizing themselves against the excrucian host wholly and completely. Their magical techniques and research far surpass that of any mortal being. They are built to defend against attacks made by void beings, and have weapons that are mortally deadly to Excrucians, including mimics if their blasphemy is exposed.

Praetors possess Gardener, this they use to create enclaves and build grand foundries for armies of war machines.

They containg Vastness, taking the form of ambigously large titanic engines. They crawl and permeate throughout the world as giant ambiguous masses of machinery. They have powerful weaponry and emanate their hatred for the host in their very breath through this. With this they take the form of fleets, of armies with uncountable numbers, as an infinity of tendrils and nanomachines and as titanic walking beasts of steel.

Finally, they are Wanderers. They are possessed with a constant urge to travel, to never stay in one place, to constantly build new encalves and eliminate old ones. They carry with them in their hearts and bodies memories of their home, twisted by time. They bring forth these memories in gateways and as armies, as treasures from their heart.

i had a vision

Throw a giant robot army at your players

[magic mason]

One of these mfs but in Chuubos

[frank light]

Robo boy

[tall jolt]

Hear me out: Lies as Light

[fleet harbor]

I always like the notion that Wildlords are not like ... intentional parts of creation

Their estates are their own contributions

[frank light]

a bit yeah

according to them they seem to unfold from introspection

wildlords are always funny

[restive ridge]

Wildlord Estates are like if someone added a bunch of mods while a game was still running and everyone just had to deal with that

[frank light]

yeah

theyre at the very least harmonious with creation, or not that corrosive

but i get the feeling that sometimes a wildlord just shows up and you have to deal with that

same with serpents i guess? Theyre birthed directly from the ash

im certain new angels show up on occasion

and new fallen would just be like...y'know when an angel goes to hell

[fleet harbor]

Serpents might be an ... unintended effect of the design?

Sorta like True Gods

[frank light]

yeah

theyre just sorta...the divinity present in the world bubbling up as normal

[candid compass]

the Ash does apparently just have a whole ecosystem out there

[frank light]

though true gods are a super interesting one

[candid compass]

there's also giant bees

[frank light]

that there is

tbh
i would say its possible that sometimes new imperator types can be born from other imperator types with NO fuckin regard for being the same splat

two angels get together and you get a lord of game

how? dont worry about it

[restive ridge]

Yeah thats explicitly in the text

I dearly love Wild Lords tbh

[patent tiger]

Gamers are as close to god as humans can get

So that makes sense to me

[frank light]

see thats a fun explanation!

i love that shit

where things just dont really have to make perfect sense

[restive ridge]

Imagine if Laughter and Toys and Sunshine were divine and they were a together an ephemereal mind that thought of itself in endless meditation and discovered more of itself, more of the fractal iron-brass laws found within them in this process. But they were also not closed-systems, they wish to their discoveries to be done through you and they did not regard you as pathetic or mortal or different- but regarded you with perfect justice, as if you were themselves. Imagine if the body, the image that your brain created to interpret this divinity was a fox with pool noddles for tails

[frank light]

thank you

[fleet harbor]

I kind of think of Wildlords as fey

The extreme solipsism seems like a good fit for that

As does the “release yourself to madness” angle

[restive ridge]

Yeah thats the inspo behind them I think

[fleet harbor]

But of course fey can take many forms

:D

[frank light]

plus their alien morality

[restive ridge]

I really like Wild Magisters

[frank light]

theyre rarely malicious

[restive ridge]

They are my fav Imperators

[frank light]

they just operate on a different ruleset

[restive ridge]

They can be funny, terrifying, powerful, impressive but always alien but just.

[frank light]

though it is mentioned in 3e that if you really really take the time and effort

it might be possible to get one to understand you (and maybe for you to understand it)

which seems like a good source for a story

that seems lke a fun Project or Quest

[fleet harbor]

… if I ever write that Strategist story there will be a Wild Magister who develops that sort of relationship with the protag

(I will not write this)

[frank light]

that would be so fun

[restive ridge]

Wild Lords talking to Excrucians is always funny to me

[frank light]

tbh Percipience or Greater percipience is actually a fairly useful tool for strategists to deal with/talk to Wildlords

[restive ridge]

"Personally if I entered Creation I would just learn to live in harmony with the threads of its existence without being (more of a) horrific monster with no care for others (than other Imperators) about it, skill issue."

[frank light]

"so how did you make that chancel"

[magic mason]

Shoutout to Non-Excrucian gods of the Void

[frank light]

but yeah wildlords are quite silly

especially since i think many of them arent actually quite sure that theyre in a place where there's more than one thing

[magic mason]

Chat
Chat they don't know they aren't in Ninuan

[frank light]

cus in ninuan, existing in pure solipsism is like
normal
thats natural and easy

[patent tiger]

No shoutouts for cowards and centrists

[frank light]

with correlation you dont actually have to know or percieve anything beyond your own internal parts

[patent tiger]

Fuck you, go murder reality

You're getting drafted into the forever war

[frank light]

lmao

Greater Hunt(Military Draft)

[magic mason]

I am sure they are off doing their own thing in the Void

fighting their own wars

[frank light]

using Greater Invocation to Draft the faceless horrors of the void into the war

[patent tiger]

Honestly I'm not sure war as a concept makes sense in the Ninuan

It kind of only tracks with Creation

Cneph invented war, this is my take

[frank light]

there is mention of non excrucian beings going about their own business in ninuan

i mean there might be Void wars

where correlated beings fight other correlated beings

though i doubt they have the same...ferocity the valde bellum has

[patent tiger]

Sure, but, like...

They aren't fighting other correlated beings, is the thing, by my understanding of it.

[frank light]

mmm

[patent tiger]

They fight, and are correlated to other things that are fighting

[frank light]

if you believe in the legends of Creation
and you assume that there wasnt any real murder in ninuan

the first murderer was the creator of the universe

which could be fun excrucian rhetoric actually

[patent tiger]

But just like the hunter is not hunting a particular prey, a [war], as in a unit of several beings defined within their relationships, is only an emergent and transient property

[patent tiger]

Yeah, for sure

By being a Scholar of Perseverence, Cneph also inherently had to study, and invent, the end thereof

[restive ridge]

Cneph played too much Metal Gear and invented Ninuan-War so sad

[frank light]

its said harumaph is the master of death
though true death is simply returning to ninuan and nothingness

anyway here it is
these things are probably meant to represent things like powerful miraculous arcana, horrifying existential threats as fuel for binding arcs, and probably whatever Cneph and Harumaph and Narsinha are

[vivid wraith]

who up stalking the void

[frank light]

who up stalking they void

[magic mason]

Otherworldlly arc when you are the noble of light or justice where the corpse of Azbogah starts talking to you

[frank light]

N'mosnikttiel is also a fun one

since its corpse made the angels

[restive ridge]

Not me, I am a being of Creation fully

[patent tiger]

L

Get Greater Destroyed

[restive ridge]

Get Perceived

[patent tiger]

Augh

[restive ridge]

L+Ratio+Bleak Effect+I love existing+your solipsism blinds you to the Other

[patent tiger]

Honestly, The Sight being a basic Noble power is very funny in retrospect with context of perception being violence

[frank light]

yeah lmao

[vivid wraith]

hey look these are from the same source

[restive ridge]

So based of them tbh

[frank light]

a lot of perception based effects are somewhat temporary
with greater focus changes to a ninuanni disappearing soon after

and its said that the ripples of perception in ninuan slowly fade

but its interesting

[magic mason]

I love how this has Vaugely Fruity Mad Scientist vibes for Cneph

[frank light]

oh huh! never noticed that

[patent tiger]

It's great

This passage absolutely crystallized Cneph's vision in my head

This is just what artists are like

[frank light]

yeah lmao

[candid compass]

the Cneph X Harumaph ship

[patent tiger]

I'm sure it's been done

[magic mason]

Where is the Nobilis Tumblr post

[vivid wraith]

the author shows up again here, and has a bunch of references in Nobilis

[restive ridge]

Thinking about how the Jennagames discord has a role that's just "Terrifying Creational Invader" and those are the vibes I wish to invoke in any Glitch discussion

[frank light]

[patent tiger]

https://www.tumblr.com/universalthaumaturge/741156875829149696/nobilis-dash-simulator?source=share

[frank light]

this one makes me smile

alchemist/botanist appreciation

[magic mason]

😌

[restive ridge]

This one is a real banger

[frank light]

augh rereading stuff on magic and alchemy in nobilisverse

i love that its like
not really normal

its shit that breaks the world a bit

magic is so cool :3

formation magic <333

i also really like exorcism
i have a headcanon that the reason strategists and excrucians are practiced in it is because its partially a skill you develop when doing flower rites

flower rites involve affixing spirits in your attention and telling them the world is wrong/a lie

and exorcism is that art, its the art of using your attention

to like
affect the intangible

[vivid wraith]

ooooooh

[obsidian dagger]

...I am remembering a very specific very early chapter from Ra which is not directly relevant to this and yet is somewhat relevant.

[frank light]

oh interesting
Conjury has its own law being

i suppose thats to be expected

[obsidian dagger]

Also: an interesting quote from the very beginning of Reach Heaven Via Feng Shui Engineering, which isn't really relevant to anything but felt very relevant in a hard-to-articulate way:

“When the father of modern cultivation Gu Lingtian rebelled against the Heavenly rule”, Qian Shanyi said, “He sought justice for many, but instead of responding to his challenge, the Heavens barred their front doors. But there were twelve other ways into heaven, and he would seek out every one of them.”

She paused, bringing a cup of tea to her lips to take a sip.

“Only in one thing were the Heavens united with him: they would both rather see the world cracked in half than accept defeat”, she continued, “To lock the first two gates, the deities made the suns set and never rise, and shattered the moons into a rain of stone and dust. Not giving up, Gu Lingtian traveled the world, from the northern oceans, to eastern jungles, and even dug deep into the earth, but all the paths spoken of in legend broke at his touch. In the south, he stared into a candle flame for seven weeks without blinking once, but when he comprehended its truth, Heavens extinguished all fire in the entire world lest he find his way in. In the west, he forged a gate out of the purest metals from the mines of Kunlun, but when it opened, everything within a dozen kilometers was obliterated by a fiery light. When he painted a bridge out of his familial love, Heavens erased his family, and made it so that he was an orphan all along. He studied the flows of the written word, gathered every Queqiao bird in the world, and even descended down into the Netherworld in desperation to force the demons to help, but everywhere he went, Heavens were a step ahead of him.”

[frank light]

The law-being 
that governs Conjury acts as a kind of garbage collector 
for the flotsam and the jetsam of the real and weaves it 
together into a coherent thing ... but also sequesters it 
away, declaring it occulted, hidden, and befogged; naming 
it, most importantly of all, a thing that people should not do, 
or, at least, that should not be done.

[obsidian dagger]

“Finally, he forged a personal invitation from the Heavenly Emperor, and for a brief moment, he stepped into Heaven - but immediately, he was thrown back down to Earth,” she continued, “Twelve were the ways to enter Heaven, and they have barred them all. Then, in a rage, he took up his sword, and cut his own, thirteenth way inside. The blood and ichor flowed in rivers, and it is said that the sounds of slaughter drove all within a hundred li into madness, but after seven days, the Heavens have bowed to his demands.”

something about the idea of painting a bridge out of familial love, and in response having his family retroactively erased from reality, just feels very Nobilis. ...is this a Deciever?

This definitely feels like something, but I'm really, really not sure what.

[candid compass]

this reads Strategist to me

if you wanted an Excrucian type

[magic mason]

I find the way we usually only know what type a named imperator is or their estates is interesting

Like the big 4 we know their estates but not what they are
Meanwhile we get Luciefer and the only estate we know is pride

[candid compass]

Strategists are always full of righteous anger and hatred about the flaws and injustices of the world

[restive ridge]

Lucifer is afaik 2 estates Pride and Persuasion

[candid compass]

doesn't he also have Persuasion listed as an estate somewhere?

[magic mason]

I dont rembor

[tall jolt]

Hi chat. If you were the Power of Museums how would you define it and what fun things do you think it could do?

[vivid wraith]

it's in the index of 3e

[vivid wraith]

but yeah if you know their imperator type vs their estates they both work very well as vibe packets

[magic mason]

I would talk about History and Knowledge and maybe some Theft

[vivid wraith]

And there's less of a need for one if the other already delivers the necessary vibes

[frank light]

we have no idea what the fourth's estates are tbf

[tall jolt]

Yeah having museums associated with theft was definitely an idea

It'd be cool if you just has like, MAX treasure.

[frank light]

we also do have a ton of named imperators whom we know their estates

[magic mason]

well no on knows what he has going on 😝

[frank light]

like sennacherib

[magic mason]

true

[tall jolt]

ok stats of museum. Like 5 Treasure, 2/3 Domain 1 Persona? Something like that XD

[magic mason]

What about aspect?

[tall jolt]

I assume just Aspect 0