Exalted

[marsh garden]

feels odd that the war weapon is the worst possible choice against battle groups tbh

[fierce star]

remember: people are brawl weapons.

[velvet raft]

Truuuuuu

Honestly I think the inclusion of the katar for brawl is kinda weird

I guess they wanted to have a katar style for OSOI

[bleak hazel]

it was either the caestus or the katar, since it's The Gauntlet

[marsh garden]

caestus would make more sense so you could use Smashfists, no?

[fierce star]

for some reason ex3 seems leery about giving smashfist styles

you basically just have falcon

god-kicking boots at least has centipede, falcon, and swaying grass

[bleak hazel]

they're the signature Brawl weapon for whatever reason

I think brawl-resistance solar with dual smashfists has taken up most of the smashfist brainspace

[tulip folio]

Still surprised they didn't just make smashfists and god-kicking boots the 'unarmed artifact'

[chilly sluice]

PAOC is still mostly the only way to get artifact unarmed right?

[tulip folio]

Yeah. Weirdly enough, Alchs don't have a way to do it.

They can literally have fists made of magical material but they're not artifact statline. XD

[prisma sun]

And being a Lunar

[marsh garden]

abyssals can do it with their e5 brawl, which i assume mirrors solars'?

[prisma sun]

Solars just kinda have "My fists are better than an artifact weapon and also I can put an artifact weapon on top of it"

[tulip folio]

...honestly, with how much alchs love artifacts, I kinda feel like they should get an 'artifact fists' charm.

[velvet raft]

It would be an extremely natural strength charm

Or even stamina

[tulip folio]

A high essence submodule of this would make sense.

[chilly sluice]

I always forget you can't parry lethal damage unarmed by default

[next delta]

You can stunt it though

It's a weird rule given how basically every action is kind of expected to have a level 1 stunt. I guess it mostly makes NPCs sad

[prisma sun]

NPCs can also stunt

[next delta]

Mostly unimportant NPCa are sad then, ha

[tulip folio]

Iron Knuckle Suite Submodules

Flowing Moonsilver Fist(3xp): The alchemical's unarmed attacks can have the traits of a mundane Light, Medium or Heavy weapon. This can be changed as a miscellaneous action.

Warding Jade Plating (3xp): The alchemical's unarmed attacks gain the Shield keyword, without reducing their damage.

Soulsteel Pipete Knuckles(3xp): The Alchemical's unarmed attacks gain the Poisonable keyword.

Bilocating Starmetal Strike(3xp): The Alchemical's unarmed attacks gain the Flexible keyword.

Crushing Adamant Grip(3xp): The Alchemical's unarmed attacks gain the Chopping keyword. She can spend 2 motes instead of the initiative cost to make a Chopping attack.

Unmatched Orichalcum Inlay (6xp, Essence 4): The Alchemical's unarmed attacks gain artifact traits.

[chilly sluice]

Formalised poison on unarmed is nice

[bleak hazel]

artifact unarmed has to be expensive because going down to merely normal fists with no bonus accuracy, overwhelm or medium weapon parry is the price you pay for being able to mix whatever the fuck you like

artifact unarmed but only for a particular tree is much more straightforward

[tulip folio]

Yeah, it's why despite me thinking they should have it I pushed it all the way back to E4 to make it so you're not getting it any time soon. It turns up just before you turn into a mech.

[bleak hazel]

even then I would be attaching mote and willpower costs, like most Summon Artifact Weapon charms

is Flowing Moonsilver only for attacks or also for parries?

attacks only totally fine, but not getting medium weapon parry on unarmed is also part of the martial arts balance

[tulip folio]

I suppose. I've never been super a fan of how all unarmed attacks use the same statline.

[marsh garden]

oh wow, this is a real good strength replacer

jeez

[bleak hazel]

smashing is also an amazing tag

[tulip folio]

Yeetfists

[velvet raft]

You could possibly space it out across multiple submodules so that it's something the alchemical can build into piece by piece

[mighty rover]

what does a typical Exalted campaign module look like
or i guess, two questions:
what does a shortform module look like in Exalted
what does a premade longform campaign framework look like, other than the horror stories I've heard of Return of the Scarlet Empress

[south horizon]

There aren't really any

like, Exalted has a few 2e premade stuff aside from the big one

and for 3e there is tomb of dreams which was made purely for conventions

and the essence one which i've skimmed through but haven't really touched

[south horizon]

I'd say you'd need to focus less o like

a solid point a to point b structure

and more o ly "here is a list of characters, motivations, and scenarios "

that's essentially what thr essenve one does

mainly because exalts are so wildly sttong in their ability to.shift the narrative that iy's really hard to build a pre-made thing that can like

manage that

[mighty rover]

Makes sense makes sense

[marsh garden]

are there any artifacts (or Eclipse charms, actually) already printed that boost join battle, or is that mostly reserved for native charms?

all of the arties i've seen with JB interactions are just

"when you win"

as opposed to better mote efficiency or non-charm dice or some such

[wise ocean]

I just stole an Awareness charm with flavor/power tweaks for my artifact, honestly

[marsh garden]

which one?

some E1 solar, deeb, or lunar stuff i assume? since i imagine those are more straightforward than e2-3 stuff and sid/alch tech

[wise ocean]

e1 infernal

[marsh garden]

ah ic

[south horizon]

Voltspindle in Alchemicals is one

but ye

it's not uncomon

[bleak hazel]

that reminds me I need to write up Rival's swords

unsure what to do with these in particular

his armour has all the stance-changing and weapon swapping effects, his swords are just swords

possibly if I put some capitals on that that could be a decent two-sided theme actually

Just Swords, half of the stuff is "here are some incredibly normal but very good swords" and half of the stuff is all about fealty and so on

wait these are Captain Carrot Swords

[velvet raft]

Just realized that Grandmother Spider Mastery's flurry-simple-charms ability is fully compatible with the ability to flurry three actions from Invisible Motion at the end of sid Athletics

Lacks the sheer versatility of EGOA form and only kicks in at Essence 5, but the combo feels cute

And lets you use all three initiative tracks each turn

[bleak hazel]

by the time you finish firing off 40 motes of ongoing charm plus the cost of three CMOS Simples your enemy better be fucking dead because even with Sid excellencies that's going to be your entire battery

[velvet raft]

Fortunately, Invisible Motion has an all-day duration

But yeah

It's expensive

I'd actually rather use the triple-flurry to do something like Simple Charm + Full Defense + Stealth or something like that

Unrelated: does getting advance warning via Prior Warning make it harder to use Futures Best Avoided because that would be kind of funny

"Actually Nerd Style Kung Fu prefers you have as little Awareness as possible"

[tulip folio]

Role Assuming Methodology
Cost: —; Mins: Wits 2, Essence 1
Type: Permanent
Keywords: None
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: None
There are few things more powerful than a good story and the Wanderer knows such. She weaves a little narrative into her flesh and clothes, allowing the world to carry some of the weight of her work.

At the beginning of each story, the Wanderer names a persona (Such as 'Sephia, Devoted Knight', 'Chou, Scheming Assassin' or 'Miss Ichika, Wise Broker') and chooses up to 3 intimacies that align with that persona. For the duration of the story:

-These intimacies increase their resolve bonus and penalties by 1.
-Once per day, she can reduce the willpower cost to resist an effect that would weaken, remove or alter one of those intimacies by 1.
-Those who encounter her assume her Persona is what she is unless they know her already or until given reason to believe otherwise.
-She treats her persona as a Lore Background for attempts to Introduce or Challenge a Fact.
-She may not voluntarily change these intimacies for the duration of the story.

The chosen persona cannot be a person who already exists, except for that of the Wanderer herself. Even then she must pick a specific narrative aspect of herself (Such as 'devoted knight' etc) to reinforce.

Keys:

Stagehand Outfit Donning(Essence 2): Others suffer a penalty of (higher of 3 or essence) when attempting to see through a disguise assumed by the Wanderer, as long as that disguise is not a specific person and generally aligns with her persona. A persona of a 'Sephia, Devoted Knight' could allow her to walk freely in an enemy camp by taking on the role of one of their knights but not enter a castle kitchen as one of the service staff. Trivial characters cannot oppose disguise attempts enhanced this way.

Station-Assuming Stance(Essence 2): She suffers no penalty for lacking tools or information related to her persona. For example, an 'Chou, Scheming Assassin' would suffer no penalties for attempting to pick a lock without tools, while a 'Anyfean, Brilliant Strategist' would suffer no penalty for not knowing her opponent. If she has sufficient tools, she instead gains the benefit of Exceptional Tools.

Acting For Two(Essence 3): Once per story, the Wanderer may change their persona as a simple action, choosing new intimacies for it.

Doing up Wanderer stuff, drawing on the fey side and how fae just Take On Personas to have identity.

[limpid badge]

I’m writing a short adventure for exalted and my plan is to ”TOURNAMENT ARC DO A TOURNAMENT ARC RN”

[mighty rover]

pog

[velvet raft]

So I got my hands on (bought) Miracles of the Divine Flame, the Exigents Companion

And there are some artifacts at the of the book

One of them is a fighting chain that is specifically usable with Brawl

As its attunement bonus

And that's not even all

Oho, there's an orichalcum mask that seems perfect for some infernals, all about eating gods

And oh shit, a five-dot suit of silk armor

Dang

[marsh garden]

oh wow

that's a pretty nice e1 option

[velvet raft]

That's from the silken armor

Which is all about Peace & Love

The final artifact is a moonsilver "devil-breaking rod", which seems to mean a collapsible baton that can turn into a full-sized wrackstaff

[marsh garden]

👀

[velvet raft]

Also good for cooking and fishing

Now, what is a larceny roll involving fish? I have no idea

[fierce star]

Stealin' from the fishmonger

mongering from the fishmonger

sneaking into a fisher's hold?

unlocking the chest that was hidden inside a whale's gullet

[marsh garden]

i just thought it meant you can use larceny to fish

[wise ocean]

presumably it's [Larceny rolls] [or Survival rolls involving fish]

but fish larceny is funny

[velvet raft]

You are probably correct

[fierce star]

Fish Crime is a terrible problem all across creation

[marsh garden]

hmm

back on my bullshit a bit, having trouble fucking with things i think are compelling, but

would appreciate opinions on balance and flavor for an evocation

[next delta]

It's for when you want to exceed your quota or catch fish in another nation's territorial waters

[velvet raft]

But yeah this establishes an excellent precedent

[next delta]

Making it a chain that allows smash attacks and refreshes the initiative costs seems like an insult to smashfists lol

[velvet raft]

Aside from that the book has four new terrestrial and four new celestial exigents

[marsh garden]

INSOLENT TONGUE IMMUREMENT
Cost: 6m, 1wp; Mins: Essence 2
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: None
Duration: One story
Prerequisites: Wolf at the Door, See As I See
The bearer makes a special Persuade or Threaten roll with (Appearance or Charisma + Occult) against a character that insults her Anchor. If he has at least four Marks of the Beast, the penalty to Resolve they impose increases to -2 for this roll. On a success, he forfeits use of his voice for the duration of the story, or until he performs a major task that displays genuine and profuse regret for the offense. While the effect lasts, the Anchor may perfectly mimic the stolen voice and its owner's mannerisms.

Reset: Once per story.

is this too much? too little?

[velvet raft]

And new charms for a bunch of the existing exigents

[marsh garden]

can probably ignore the prereqs

[next delta]

There are other voice stealing things. At least a core book spell I think?

[marsh garden]

ah, i see

i uh

probably should look at core more

it just makes my head hurt

[next delta]

Oh, corrupted words is a specific thing and not everything.

(I think you might want to say something about how the perfect effect interacts with other perfect effects?)

[marsh garden]

i have no idea what that means

i didn't think anything involving mimicry had a carve-out for other perfects

[next delta]

Like if you can perfectly mimic someone's voice/mannerism, is there any roll/magic that can determine it? And what happens if the other person uses a perfect effect that can see through disguises or whatever

[marsh garden]

the lunar, abyssal, and sid ones didn't

oh wait

the sid charm

[next delta]

Huh, interesting

[marsh garden]

i should go take a look at that for power level

...okay, that was useless

the charm i was thinking of is actually a sid e1 and e2 charm, but both are like 5x stronger than the evocation. the issue is now that i don't know if that's because it's a Shaping effect, because sids are just broken in very specific ways (and i shouldn't emulate any measure of their power), or because i drastically undertuned the evocation

[coral wraith]

I mean the Sid charms don't steal someone's voice

And make them unable to speak

[marsh garden]

an e1 charm steals their name and makes them unable to be identified or identify themselves, which is at least thematically and mechanically similar

but with more reach (and more disguise power at e2)

[coral wraith]

Yeah sids are the spy splat

[marsh garden]

and there's a lunar spell that steals faces...

[prisma sun]

All of them?

[marsh garden]

this probably isn't interesting or effective enough for e2

[marsh garden]

all of what?

[prisma sun]

I mean Lunars can steal faces just kinda as a matter of course

[marsh garden]

oh no no no

as in like

actually steal the face

which afaik is not something lunars do by default?

[bleak hazel]

Shaping effects always have increased power budgets relative to non-shaping because the game has an inbuilt shutdown switch for them on almost every splat

the easy solution is "put shaping on your evo that does shaping things"

or psyche, or whatever

[tulip folio]

Hmm...do you think an artifact Dragon Sigh Wand having a bayonet is worth being the 'free bonus when you attune the artifact', like how many give you a free charm? Or is that normal enough that it's kinda just a non-factor, like how a lot of small artifacts give you a pair because they expect them to be used paired?

[limpid badge]

i feel like its fair, and then you can tag specific charms as being melee or ranged

treat it as a light artifact melee you get with the Dragon Sigh Wand and build off it sort of as a trick weapon? making one of those has been on my thoughts a lot hrmn

could even completely build it as set of charms and make it like a dragon sigh wand with a pilebunker

[tulip folio]

That's fair. I'm messing about with doing up a variant of Wyrdflame for an Infernal as both like mutating people and I want to make it distinct, not just a 1:1 copy. XD

So it will keep a chunk of the 'mutate stuff' but it's going to get a bit of adjustment to still be it's own beast too.

[tulip folio]

Special: The Arc-En-Ciel waives the initiative cost for full defences and is considered Exceptional Equipment and Sorcerous Means for Occult rolls involving Elemental or Fae Magic.

Pondering this as the 'passive bonus an artifact gets' but not sure if it's interesting enough.

[marsh garden]

what're the dots?

seems meaty and satisfying for a 3, dunno how 4s stretch in comparison

and i'd be sad if that was all you got from a 5

[tulip folio]

4 or 5, still deciding.

[marsh garden]

i have no idea how strong it is, but it definitely feels tame for a 5

just conceptually

[tulip folio]

Okay so this charm is mechanically 95% a copy of an existing charm but just checking if this seems like it makes sense as something a Fae + Elemental artifact could do to someone/seem thematic and fun.

[bleak hazel]

considering joining the Sorcerous Martial Art party with Travel Without Distance Style

had a brief idea that it would involve a form that gets more and more charged up the longer you're in it, and when it maxes out you can reflexively cast the spell if you like, but until then it just lets you flash step everywhere and butcher people with knives made of portals

this shard of light takes whatever bit of you it touches Somewhere Else

[wise ocean]

Presumably the mass combat version of the sorcerous MAs, since there's single-target (close) and single-target (kiting) now?

[marsh garden]

...every time i see dex applied to yet more bullshit, i yearn for the artifact whose capstone ability is just "20m, 3wp: all dex scores are 0 for the scene"

which is an extreme overcompensation, but it's made me curious

what kind of magnitude, cost, and scale would be viable to do as a "fuck you, -X to this stat, incl. reducing excellency caps"?

like, if i make a banner out of the torn flag of a sunken ship, could its capstone be an aura effect of "anyone who doesn't have Sail 5 loses 2 dexterity dots"?

[bleak hazel]

penalising all dex rolls is something a few things do, see stuff like Sidereal Shell Games and so on

but don't fuck with excellency caps because the effects of that are incredibly variable across targets

90% of nonexalted don't care, Sids/Deebs/Alchs ignore the excellency effect completely, Lunars don't care much, Solaroids get totally deep sixed

[tulip folio]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/18cv3MSyXVyspDGhAW6swZhCnhJRetPoj2WmRVIYnuGo/edit?usp=sharing I really should redo this some time, as while I like the concept for the martial art I don't super like how I implemented it these days.

[dense verge]

you know what you're winning me over with talk of fucking over solars

call me chejop kejack the way i wanna see the solar's downfall

[tulip folio]

There's a second circle demon that kinda does that.

Everyone's favorite player of games has 'The Game Is Real'

[tulip folio]

Where everyone's dice pools are capped at Int+War

But they can spend 1 init to cheat and use their normal dice pool for a roll.

[tulip folio]

Arc-En-Ciel (••••)
Orichalcum Razor Parasol
Long ago, there was the Fourfold Victorious Queen, Maeve. This Raksha of great power earned her story with a daring raid upon Creation, returning with a golden branch taken from the very centre of the Elemental Pole of Wood. She carved this wood into a staff, wielding creation's power against her own kin who threatened her. 

With her next raid, she returned with runes scorched into the frame of her staff by the lifeblood of terrestrial gods from the Elemental Pole of Fire itself. Yu Shan readied itself against her attacks but the Aerial Legion was cast from the air at the pole they defended, a storm serpent's soul shaped into the staff. The Censor of the West fared no better, forced to flee as she quenched her weapon in the heartwaters of creation itself. 

Finally, she set her eyes upon the last pole denied her. Those who tried to stop her were assaulted by the elements she had claimed dominion over and killed or driven into retreat. She stood upon the peaks of the Imperial Mountain, declaring that she would have this power in turn. Drawing it deep within herself she realized she had made a terrible mistake. Earth is not merely stone, it is stasis. The staff was plucked from the grip of a statue, mouth frozen in a rictus grimace.

The Arc-En-Ciel is seemingly an exceptional but mundane staff or broom to most and can be used as such when unattuned. When attuned and wielded, however, runes flare along the haft and a quintet of rainbow jewels form representing the elements of creation.

Attunement: 5m
Type: Medium (+3 ACC, +9 DMG, +1 DEF, OVW 4)
Tags: Bashing, Melee, Concealable, Disarming, Shield
Hearthstone Slot(s): 2
Era: Time of Cascading Years
Special: The Arc-En-Ciel waives the initiative cost for full defences and is considered Exceptional Equipment and Sorcerous Means for Occult Rolls involving Elemental or Fae Magic.

Creation-Shaping Chaos
Cost: —; Mins: Essence 1
Type: Permanent
Keywords: None
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: Hell-Binder Mastery
The shimmering light of the Arc-En-Ciel has encompassed all of creation’s elements and they cannot resist its call.

The Wielder treats Unexalted Elementals as demons for purposes of her Infernal Charms that affect demons if this is advantageous for her. Elementals with Essence 1-3 count as First Circle Demons for such effects.

When she uses Inner Devils Unchained, she may instead transform the target into an Elemental of Essence 1-3 instead of a First Circle Demon.

How's this seem so far? Working on an artifact weapon for a spellcaster infernal.

[marsh garden]

i believe those numbers are off for an artifact thrown weapon?

or, oh, that's not thrown

it's a shield

my b

[tulip folio]

Razor Parasol but that's basicly a shield.

[marsh garden]

ye

i enjoy the elemental replacer

[tulip folio]

Iridescent Light Dispersal
Cost: 5m; Mins: Essence 2
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Resonant
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Prismatic Elemental Twist
With a simple flick of her hand, the work of gods and elemental kings becomes nothing but morning dew.

The wielder can use her Parry to defend against Spell, Psyche and Shaping effects. If the effect could normally be opposed with a roll or static value, the wielder uses her Parry instead. Against unrolled effects, the opposing character rolls a dice pool of the Storyteller’s choice.

The wielder gains an additional +1 non-Charm Parry against Spell, Psyche and Shaping effects that is based in Elemental or Fae magic.

Resonant: With an Essence 3 repurchase, the wielder can pay a one-Willpower surcharge to extend this Evocation’s duration to one scene.

Also pondering putting this in.

'I attack your guile with a shaping effect'
'I parry it'
'...what? That's not even unblockable, that's just flat not even targeting your defence'
'I parry it'

[chilly sluice]

Very fun

[tulip folio]

I'm trying to keep to...this is for a spellcaster but it's still a weapon. So I should keep a chunk of the charms playing in 'doing things weapons engage with'.

[marsh garden]

based, love parrying shit that you can't parry

[tulip folio]

This charm I basicly stole from an existing artifact but I liked the effect and gave it a new theme:

Prismatic Elemental Twist
Cost: 5m, 1wp; Mins: Essence 1
Type: Simple
Keywords: Decisive-only, Resonant, Shaping(Body, Soul), Stackable
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: None
In a brilliant conflux of light, the wielder of the Arc-En-Ciel unbalances her target’s elements, warping her form. 

She makes a difficulty 5 gambit with the Arc-En-Ciel or a Spell, inflicting one of the following transformations for (Essence) days if successful:

Soulfire Refraction: The target’s soul is filled with an element shining the colour of a single emotion, spilling out into his body. She picks a specific emotion and he suffers a -2 penalty on inspire and instill rolls based on any emotion except the chosen one, as well as bargain and persuade rolls that do not make use of that emotion. Anyone who sees him assumes he’s an elemental, fae, or similar spirit unless they succeed on a difficulty 3 (Perception + Occult) roll. Characters who know him add +3 dice on this roll; on a failure, they assume he’s such a spirit that’s somehow stolen the original’s shape.

Elemental Anomaly: One of the victim’s limbs or organs is transformed with elemental power — a mouth that constantly sounds like it is talking underwater, an arm turned to stone, eyes becoming pits of fire, etc. — inflicting a -3 penalty on rolls requiring its use.

Terra Incognita Invocation: The target becomes unknown territory even to his closest companions. Recognizing him by sight, scent, or voice is impossible without magic, and even then requires a (Perception + Awareness) roll at difficulty (wielder’s Manipulation + Essence). This can’t disguise him as another individual. Individual features, such as hair colour, can be recognised but those who see him find it nearly impossible to identify the combination of features as the individual.

The wielder can stack multiple gambits on a single foe but can’t stack the same gambit — with the exception of Elemental Anomaly, which can be applied once per body part. Arc-En-Ciel’s master can develop new transformations of comparable power for three experience points (or one bonus point) each.

Resonant: The wielder makes a damaging decisive attack instead. As long as the damage inflicted beats the gambit’s difficulty, she may forgo three levels of damage to inflict a single transformation.

[marsh garden]

what arty is it "from"?

[tulip folio]

Weirdflame, Lunar one.

Weirdflame is 'Hey, I have a Mutation Gun. I will shoot mutation flames at you and see what happens'

This one is more 'I have an elemental manipulation staff, I'm going to mess with your elemental alignment'

[marsh garden]

passing out time, but before i do i'd like to ask: are there any artifacts with the current templating that introduce custom familiars/servants/battle groups?

[prisma sun]

What if I made one of the sentient wolves in the east a solar

[coral wraith]

Eye of the Storm Enlightenment
Cost: 6m, 1wp; Mins: Martial Arts 5, Essence 4
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Perilous
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Silent Wind Severance

The final words gleaned from Adorjan by the sorcerers of old were not for the wind, but the ears of her killers; the final erudition of soul-death. Thus and so, the stylist finds freedom from mortal peril.

After damage has been rolled by an attack or other source of harm, the stylist perfectly dodges it, even if it's undodgeable. Uncountable damage is negated completely, and she becomes immune to a recurring source of uncountable damage. She then vanishes into her winds, freeing her from any grapples or restraints, and reappears at a location within extreme range of her choice.

Reset: Once per story.```

last charm of stormwind rider style :)

[velvet raft]

IIRC there’s a clockwork snake familiar artifact

[tulip folio]

Added a new quick character to the list of them I've done. Flame Ducks!

[bleak hazel]

they turn into highly specific anime girls, I see

I like that they have Principle Of Motion's pacifist cousin

[tulip folio]

Entertainingly, that part is directly from the 2e version. Presumably 'because 2e'.

And yeah, Principle of Motion is powerful enough that I don't think it's a good charm to have in the game but it's also core to demon design, so I kinda went with a varient of it that promotes a bit more variety of actions than 'Attack + Attack'.

[marsh garden]

thank you! do you remember where in? i'd assume alchs

[velvet raft]

I think it might even be in Arms

[tulip folio]

Yeah, it is. It's kinda overpriced but interesting.

[marsh garden]

thanks, both of you

[dense verge]

okami time

[marsh garden]

...could a person Exalt twice?

like, someone who's going to be a deeb (not that anyone knows this) is dubbed with an Exigence

[bleak hazel]

nope, only one tier of super special boy allowed

[marsh garden]

expected but tragic, would be funny if the deeb bio exaltation got around that

[bleak hazel]

theoretically someone chosen as a Sid/Exigent/Abyssal/whoever "could have" exalted as a deeb later in life but a) nobody can know and b) I don't think they would have, these things have a way of working around each other

[fierce star]

There's definitely some arguements there, but also bear in mind most deebs exalt as teenagers or earlier

[tulip folio]

One type of exaltation could likely steal the jump on another though. Like someone who was Going To Be A Sid having a run-in with some outside of fate threats, getting stabbed a lot and ending up a Deathknight.

But it's hard to know for sure as there's rarely direct conflict there.

[bleak hazel]

I don't think that's possible, myself

you just die

since Sids get capital-C chosen at birth, and nobody can be chosen twice

[fierce star]

until the exaltation is attached, though, they've got the spot open like anyone else. Other 'normal' celestial exaltations would gloss them over, and a 'free' abyssal one would, but a deathlord offering it directly would bypass that I think

[bleak hazel]

I don't think they do have the spot open

[fierce star]

There's nothing there, though, th exaltation is not yet present

it's still inside someone else

[bleak hazel]

none of them have ever randomly become deebs, at least not that we know of

and they get the pre-Sidereal signs and portents and all that stuff

[fierce star]

but this is like, a niche case of a niche case

[bleak hazel]

I don't think one exaltation patron Choosing gets to override another, regardless of who it is

[dense verge]

It's more of a reserved spot thing than having the Exaltation sewn on at a distance, is how I understand it?

[fierce star]

I think it'd be an interesting character, personally, heaven going 'okay what the fuck'

[dense verge]

got fucking exaltsniped

[bleak hazel]

I dislike any kind of "but I got the super special extra fucky exaltation" character on general principle

[fierce star]

I don't think they'd stack, is the thing

[tulip folio]

It's a bit of a 'we're not sure either way, so ti's mostly just guesswork' area.

[fierce star]

like

I am not saying they'd have SPOOKY SIDEREAL AND ABYSSAL POWERS COMBINED

just a history of wierd fate shit, and now, death

[bleak hazel]

you're already one of like a thousand super special megaboys, you don't need extra chosen one narrative primacy even if you get only one set of powers

[tulip folio]

New sid mission to just quietly push people who were going to be abyssals out of the way of danger. XD

[fierce star]

man it's exalted, if my 'clone of the scarlet empress made by house mnemon as a backup to claim the scarlet throne when the clone exalts as a deeb but then exalts as literally anything else' isn't too mary sue, nothing is

(unless you're template stacking)

(stop template stacking, this isn't 3.5e dnd)

(or owod)

[bleak hazel]

nobody is guaranteed to exalt as a deeb, though

my personal mental picture of this is that anyone who gets celestial juice wouldn't have exalted as a deeb or Sid anyway

[fierce star]

you're missing the point, misc

[bleak hazel]

which produces a lot fewer brainworms about everyone else getting override privileges on the Dragons and/or the Maidens

anyway, in broader scope, yeah, no exalting twice

not even in sequence, since despite Abyssals being draculas they aren't actually dead when they get picked

[fierce star]

I don't even think it's override privledges, I think it's 'crazy shit happens'

[tulip folio]

Also: We totally do have an example of an exaltation that can overule another one. Infernals who would have been a solar but faceplanted into failure 😛

[fierce star]

crazy shit is allowed ot happen, especially when primordials get involved

[bleak hazel]

I don't think anyone can guarantee "would have been a Solar" either

and if Sol can go "sorry Mars, I sniped your boy that you explicitly already chose" that is by definition one Exaltation getting primacy here and I don't think that's how they work

[fierce star]

Again, I don't think normal celestial exaltations would do that

but the broken ones of abyssals or the inverted ones of infernals might be able to, if the ST thinks it would make for a fun story

[bleak hazel]

....haven't you got those descriptors the wrong way around?

[dense verge]

green is an inversion of yellow, kinda

abyssal and solar are light route dark route to me than inversions

[bleak hazel]

but the Abyssal and Infernal candidate pools are explicitly variants on "people who were already Sunboss-inclined" so I don't think they do get to change the perms that much

[fierce star]

look I'm recovering from a stomach flu and my blood sugar is very out of wack

due to a liquid diet

[bleak hazel]

there's already a huge spread of people that the deathlords straight up can't offer the Abyssal exaltation to, since they have to pick people who are suitably larger than life

[fierce star]

(liquid/clear liquid/plain food diets SUCK for diabetics)
(IT'S ALL SUGAR FUCK)

[dense verge]

oof

feel better soon ID!

[bleak hazel]

so I assume future Sids/Deebs are just in the large set that get the dota 2 inapplicable noise

meep morp

[fierce star]

but the point stands, I think the 'broken' styles of exaltation could override it, because they're not part of the heavenshare and I think it could make for an interesting story. Otherwise it's a (not in univers,e but like, thematic_ coinflip if any bastard kind of a dynast could exalt as any other form of exaltation

since they might/maybe/could have/perhaps been a deeb

and like. IIRC does fate know who will exalt as a deeb? i don't think they do

[bleak hazel]

Fate might know, its various maintainers sure don't

fate (abstract) has been left pretty wibbly wobbly

[tulip folio]

There is no method to predict who'll exalt as a deeb, so I think even fate is in the dark there?

2e: "Well you just get put the punnett squares and put on your eugenics hat and...*
Gets thrown out the window

[bleak hazel]

this does bring up the very funny mental image of a discarded destiny that might have been a valid Getimian if someone hadn't written in "AND THEN HE EXALTS AS A DEEB" in with big red pen before throwing it out

foolproof getimian prevention method, does some mild massive collateral damage to fate

[next delta]

There seems to be some heredity component, even if you can't guarantee a prediction

[bleak hazel]

we know there is, since you can buy merits for it

and it specifies that the best the deebs can do right now is marrying two exceptionally pureblooded dragons, at which point you get about 80% deebitude in your kids

[next delta]

Though the merit is more about DBs believing it is a component, ha

[bleak hazel]

mechanically yeah

but I don't think they're stupid enough to just imagine the difference in exaltation rates over the last five millenia

[marsh garden]

maybe if it were 2e

they'd be that dumb

[bleak hazel]

in 2e your "breeding" merit literally determined your mote pool

went the other way

[tulip folio]

2e had Specific Percentages yes.

[bleak hazel]

every PC was Breeding 5 for obvious reasons

[marsh garden]

lmao

incredible

[tulip folio]

Like I think in 2e 2 Breeding 5 characters had a 100% DB child chance, while 2 breeding 1s wre like...40%?

[bleak hazel]

now one deeb is as strong as another once you get the exaltation itself

[marsh garden]

it'd still be the kind of thing they'd do though

[tulip folio]

Which was terrible

[bleak hazel]

guaranteed was Legendary Breeding, wasn't it?

[tulip folio]

Possibly, yeah.

[bleak hazel]

which you could only get by having an elder deeb punch the impure blood out of you and probably kill you, or GM fiat

[tulip folio]

I remember they had a fucking punnett square breeding table.

You know what I'm also am not not sad hasn't made a return in 3e? Half-Castes. Which I swear existed purely to make Dragonblooded Feel Worse.

[next delta]

I believe the current way it works is "if you do anything other regular nobility wedding nonsense, no it doesn't"

[bleak hazel]

oh yeah, the infinite numbers of low essence solars who got solar charms

[tulip folio]

'This guy isn't even an exalt but his dad was a solar so he's better than your entire dragonblooded exaltation' was rancid

[marsh garden]

wait what

[next delta]

It's now more like god-blooded at most in 3E right? Or maybe a tier below that?

[bleak hazel]

yeah, vaguely sun-themed chumps

at least relative to Exalts

old half-castes got to use low essence charms from their parent exalts

[marsh garden]

absolutely incredible

[bleak hazel]

so Golden Children could use the entire Solar paranoia combo + most of the "fuck your social structure" charms

[marsh garden]

and so because e1 solar charms were stronger than any deeb charms you could just do whatever the fuck?

[bleak hazel]

yeah, at E2 you got the charm that let you talk to a janitor at the local temple over a beer and force them all to introduce We Love The Anathema Day

for reference on how bullshit old solar social charms were

and obviously there was no limit on how many miniSolar kids you could have so there was a whole subplot about first age solars steadily replacing their deebs with armies of heavily augmented and power armoured halfcaste kids

[next delta]

How did the wyld hunt ever stop Solars lmao

[bleak hazel]

ST fiat or liberal use of literal bugs in the charmset

[marsh garden]

in e1

[bleak hazel]

in E2, a single low essence deeb could probably one punch a solar with one good attack because it was ludicrously lethal

so anyone without a paranoia combo got dunked by the first highroll

anyone with a paranoia combo is immortal

[marsh garden]

lol

[bleak hazel]

the default PC tactic was to use aforementioned bugged charm to autodetect celestials and then beat them up with a gang of dudes armed with big hammers

since if you were surrounded by five guys one of them got an automatic hit

[next delta]

Before the Jade Prison was broken, Solars never figured out Paranoia combat

[next delta]

lol wut

[bleak hazel]

now I do think that a deeb magistrate escorted by five ceremonial hammer bearers, one of each element, is kind of a sick character gimmick

[dense verge]

that is aura

[bleak hazel]

but it's funny when they go around using essence 1 cheap and shit investigation charms on everyone until it autofails and then sic 'em

[next delta]

Why hammers specifically?

[bleak hazel]

giga base damage

you just wanted to bonk hard enough that anyone who got hit was dead or death spiralling from wounds

[dense verge]

i am very glad i have never had to deal with 2e bullshit

[bleak hazel]

the charm in question was "revelation of associates hunch", a baby deeb investigate charm that just told you who someone had been hanging out with lately

but because the authors loved nerfing deebs, it had the then-common clause of "autofails against celestials"

boom

perfect anathema detector

run around firing it off until it goes MEEP MORP and then you've got the bastard

they literally made a charm so bad that it stack overflowed into a super-perfect effect

I don't know if anyone ever actually did this in a game but it was basically the only shot you had mechanically against an optimised sneaky solar

[fierce star]

does it count if I was the GM

[bleak hazel]

yes

[fierce star]

tehn you know at least one person who actually did that in a game, bu tin my defense the player literally said 'prove it' when I said I could get around his solar bullshit with a wyld hunt

[bleak hazel]

incredible

I do find paranoia combat kind of interesting on a technical level

there's something elegant about this giant attrition engine of flurries, leaping dodges, surprise negators, 2/7 filters and so on all built around the idea that attacks are boolean and everyone has 1hp

it just sucked as a game

[lament owl]

I read one of the enemy books recently and honestly I think God Blooded(and similar) as Jobbers are less interesting to me now than “oh shit that god blooded has some swag actually”

Since some of those example guys are real, they got like a full page of charms and a 4 dot artifact.

[bleak hazel]

yeah, the few most-impressive X-bloods can be pretty powerful

I like that most people with spirit blood just have like, hair that grows flowers or something and that occasionally it spits out a ghostblooded with a mote pool and real charms

the latter being the default got a bit odd but they're a cool type of guy

[tulip folio]

Paranoia combat would be very interesting as a card game or such.

Not an RPG

[fierce star]

I miss enlightened mortals being like, a Thing

just a dude that meditates until he has a shitty mote pool and a martial art out to the form charm

come at him bro he knows secrets beyond your ke--oh fuck a deeb run

[bleak hazel]

I have considered writing a "sorcerous initiation" that allows you to gather martialartsious motes for enlightened mortal purposes

[nova yew]

Oooo

[lament owl]

There are a couple in adversaries of the righteous!

They tend to have an extra reason

[bleak hazel]

sit down, roll something+MA, gain X + successes motes

[lament owl]

But they do exist

[bleak hazel]

this also has the benefit of getting you cultivators

[next delta]

Is it like a thing that doesn't have a general mechanic then?

[bleak hazel]

who have to go sit in a cave in a demesne for a week to recharge their battery post-fight

it has a general mechanical class

[next delta]

(very Ex3e to have bespoke enlightened mortals lol)

[lament owl]

Yeah

Sometimes there is just a person with Enlightened Essence for a reason that is hard to explain

[bleak hazel]

10 mote pool, the usual regen, terrestrial MA, knows 1 charm per essence level

but the reason a given person is in that class varies wildly

and it has to be something beyond "tried really hard"

[fierce star]

it's also not like, a Specifc Ruled Class as far as I've read

it's a pattern in design

not a template

[bleak hazel]

some sorcerors, spirit-blooded, blessing from a snake god who lives in your dojo

it's a template, it's Divine Heritage Mortal Edition

[fierce star]

oh is it? I either blanked it out or was unaware, sorry.

[lament owl]

Don’t forget “had a wicked flame invested in them by The Bishop”

[bleak hazel]

you can use sid charms to apply it to random people by forging godly signatures on adoption papers

[lament owl]

Where did he find that

Can he just do that?

[fierce star]

oh wait the merit, right

ehhh

i guess fair

[bleak hazel]

I think if you're the bishop you can make some pretty good wicked flames on your own, yeah

I think there's an Abyssal charm for it too

something something pyreflame apostle

[fierce star]

I aso kiiiiinda miss ex2's take on sorcery but I understand why they decentralized it, its' better for the setting this way

[bleak hazel]

I like to port Salina and Brigid back in

[next delta]

Do you think the snake god blesses mortals at its dojo so it can live vicariously through their MA prowess? Since they themself doesn't have the limbs to do it

[bleak hazel]

Salina is just a great example for great cursed solars who are big dangers but aren't going fully into stereotypical killpeopleism

on top of being a fun character

[fierce star]

Salina and Brigid can be drug from my cold dead grave-twisted hands, yeah

Brigid is fun for making people ask if the ebon dragon was always such a failson fuckup (yes, yes he was)

[lament owl]

There is also a Goddamn Essence 5 mortal in adversary of the righteous with like 20 charms and 100 personal mote pool because he “found a cool thing” and then “got brainwashed off that thing”

[next delta]

Snake god currently has a petition for an exigence, but it has gotten tied up in the bureaucracy because it filled out the form slightly wrong

[lament owl]

Evil ass rock that makes you stronger than most Deebs like goddamn

[fierce star]

man AOTR and HDNP sure are books aren't they

core book ass books

[bleak hazel]

Which guy is that?

They also have an abyssal with shit pools and literally two charms

I think the godbloods could easily take them

[lament owl]

Eldran Tabrar Witch-Tyrant of Lock

[next delta]

Witch-Tyrant is a sick title

[lament owl]

He can summon artifact whips at will and has a superform where he fuses with his evil rock and turns into an Angel of fire and obsidian

[dense verge]

Prince Resplendent in the Ruin of Ages you suck so much ass, i love him so much

[bleak hazel]

"hey dude check out how hard I can ORB"

goes DBA

To be fair the perfect of paragon is already a mortal with a bullshit artifact and an inferiority complex

Mortals with enough external juice can absolutely throw down with exalts

[lament owl]

I really like them because they give a lot of really fun and interesting ways for things for things to be strong

[tulip folio]

Time to Down Mercury until I enlighten myself.

[lament owl]

And also has just… interesting characters

[fierce star]

oh, sure

[bleak hazel]

It has some legit bosses

[fierce star]

but I also like the core book of ex3 despite the flaws, as long as it's not the charm chapter, y'know?

[bleak hazel]

Gajam-Ur is the real solaroid-circle-fighting deal

[fierce star]

like they can be good, likeable books while also being bad, busted books that don't make sense

the circle of books

[spring lynx]

ok i know what you mean but also remember Mercury (capital M) is a person and reread that sentence

[marsh garden]

yum

[lament owl]

I still need to work on making that Social Behemoth idea I had

Big slime monster that is good at influence rolls but can only do influence rolls through your senses of smell and taste

[tulip folio]

But more seriously: I think enlightened mortals being enlightened for a reason like sorcerers are sorcerers for a reason is good.

You know who I'd let enlighten mortals? That second circle demon who just Is A Hell Dojo. He turns up in various malls for parents to send little timmy to for karate lessons and they come out either a member of the Mishima family or not at all.

[lament owl]

Yeah!

[marsh garden]

hmm, are there no qcs that just Are Battle Groups? just individuals that you template out?

[lament owl]

I don’t believe so

[bleak hazel]

Grelidaka

the gear check wyld birds

[lament owl]

Based off the fact slimes are always called “puddings” and otherwise sound very edible

What if there was a slime that wanted you to eat it

[chilly sluice]

You just take the statblock of whatever the BG is made up of and apply the BG adjustments AIUI

[marsh garden]

alas, i was hoping to see if i could save on space in that way

[lament owl]

Oh another type of enlightened mortal that comes up sometimes

Undead people who aren’t ghosts or exalted

[marsh garden]

the skeleton appears...

[lament owl]

Like those people who drink the sinister potion in the core book

Or that lady mask of winters put the heart of in a jar and uses as a spy

[marsh garden]

ah sick, thanks!

[tulip folio]

'Do you have AOE? If no, hahahah. Oh boy'

[marsh garden]

gwuh

hydra time...

[bleak hazel]

I have E5 exalts that grelidaka technically autowin against

[lament owl]

God blooded who is stronger than their parent was because they used the fact they had enlightened essence to start cultivating it on purpose

[marsh garden]

lmao

[next delta]

I basically had the Grelidaka as a narrative fight in my Essence campaign. Where the players suggested ways to deal with it and we rolled to see if it worked

[lament owl]

When your mamas a blood ape so you drink malfean vitriol every day for 20 years and train in several martial arts

[next delta]

Was there a default way to defeat them with combat?

[lament owl]

Yeah I was about to ask how the heck do you deal with them

[bleak hazel]

AOE does real damage

[tulip folio]

Grelidaka exist to go 'Hey, did someone bring Obsidion Butterflies or Flesh Sloughing Wave?' XD

[bleak hazel]

but if you don't have comrade sorceror or whatever you can be totally fucked

[tulip folio]

Felsh Sloughing is particularly good there as it just Dissolves Them rather than breaking them apart.

[lament owl]

Lightning Ballista

Btw I feel like lightning ballista is kinda disappointing for a 5 dot artifact siege weapon

I know siege weapons aren’t something your supposed to build your character around but 5 dot artifacts are

[next delta]

Oh, that's a bit boring, ha

[bleak hazel]

Yeah, hence "gear check birds"

[tulip folio]

There are dawns that would get gear checked by them.

'I can make 5 super good decisive attacks'

'Cool, cool. You just made it worse'

...unironically? I think Mr Dawn's best plan against the gear check birds if he doesn't have a specific AOE weapon would be hammering the 'I can intimidate mindless beings' anima power repeatedly.

[bleak hazel]

My battles gets rinsed by them since his anti-battlegroup is crane style

[tulip folio]

Just waving his arms around like a demented scarecrow.

[next delta]

That would be extremely funny actually

I guess you could try to start a fire if you don't have any AoE magic?

[tulip folio]

RiRi makes the gear check due to 'knows flesh sloughing wave'. Most of my sids...do not.

[bleak hazel]

There is provision for ST-approved gambits

My last encounter with them was resolved by the full moon picking up a tree and waving it around like a comically large club

[next delta]

Getting initiative for them against a BG will suck though

[tulip folio]

...I think the Abyssal I have planned would have to fight them in the slowest, stupidest way. XD

Grapple the Swarm and hold it in place while the Freeze Aura Survival Charm chips away at them.

[fierce star]

I think my infernal just eats them

(metagaos charms are fun?)

[tulip folio]

If you swallow them whole, they do avoid duplicating.

[fierce star]

🤔 but what if they don't avoid duplicating because damage dealt while bieng dige--nope, no, not going there

[bleak hazel]

Lancer: Grapplegroup

we also ruled that agg damage worked, but since both sids only had agg damage on decisive it was very much a slog

[tulip folio]

My Infernal is a Sorcerer so um...lol. 'Is X a sorcerer' tends to be a pretty hard counter to them.

[next delta]

Replicating that scene from Monty Python
"Wafer thin Grelidaka?"

[bleak hazel]

my E5 Sid has exactly one spell and the merit that lets him cast any other spell 1/story by searching through dad's giant spellbook

he's Int 2 Occult 5, not exactly a natural sorceror

so it's just him sitting crosslegged swatting away birds until he finds the page on Obsidian Butterflies

[tulip folio]

That is a great merit.

[bleak hazel]

it's really fluffy for a shit sorceror who was mentored by a good sorceror

and very funny

[next delta]

As an aside, the phrasing of the Metagaos charms being "can eat" always makes me think of the stereotypical school teacher rejoinder of "well, can you?".

[tulip folio]

I did up a necromancy version of that merit for one of my sorcerous initiations.

Remembrancer (Merit ••••): The Necromancer draws on fragments of the past, calling up memories of ancient magic. Once per story, she may cast a necromancy spell she doesn’t know, although she must still meet its prerequisites. Thereafter, she may learn that spell without a mentor or source. The Storyteller may deem some spells do not echo deeply into the past, primarily those newly invented by Second Age sorcerers.

[next delta]

Necromancer who sees a cool spell and then goes "damn, I wish I knew that" before waiting a few millennia so they can use that merit to cast it

[tulip folio]

Yeah, I wanted there to be some limitation like they 'it might not be in the book'.

So 'look, maybe not enough people who know that spell have died yet, you ever think of that?' came into play.

Also did up an Artifact N/A related to that initiation (though it's not one of those initiations you learn from an artifact so find it the hard way).

Starmetal and Adamant Bells that give +1 Necromancy Tier, to a max of second circle. Lunars/Solars can't use them to access third circle etc. They also prevent you from using any spell of that tier that creates permanent undead (Though hungry ghost battlegroup is fine).

They belong to Saturn and are necromancy designed for maintaining the order of death.

Rather than defying it.

[bleak hazel]

trying to think if second circle necromancy actually has anything that does that

I guess TCGs count

even if they're a bunch of pre-existing zombos

[tulip folio]

Yeah, it's not a big restriction.

Mostly a flavour one

They exist like 90% because I got a bit pissy that Endings Sids can't get second circle necromancy and would totally trade second circle sorcery for it 😛

[bleak hazel]

now we have the Infernal "necromancy really fucks you up" charm I might be inclined to focus a punch-up-necromancy artifact in that direction

[velvet raft]

It’s especially odd since there are a bunch of Endings charms that make a Sid more Abyssal-ish

[tulip folio]

I could see (IF THE CHARMSET WASN'T CLOSED) a follow up to Crossing Plutonian Shores that does the necromancy thing.

As that charm makes you undeadish

[velvet raft]

Technically it’s not closed

You just gotta ask nicely

And I was thinking the same thing :D

[chilly sluice]

just ask the Maidens for a favor :)

[bleak hazel]

"Satuuuurn can I make bigger abominations please? One of the spells makes really good dogs and I want one"

[velvet raft]

Honestly I could see Robin doing that

[bleak hazel]

doesn't she already have a good dog

[velvet raft]

Yeah the dog charm would not be the point :D

[bleak hazel]

unsure if baby Rival in the Voy server gets his big book of spells he doesn't know purely because "4 secrets charms" Is an annoying requirement for that guy

possibly he hasn't got to that yet

[velvet raft]

But like, Robin going up to Saturn and Jupiter and being like “could I pleeeeeease have Shadow Circle Necromancy”
Saturn: “Why do you want it”
Jupiter: “give it to them”
Saturn: “wait why”
Jupiter: “you know I can’t answer that but I promise you this will be funny”

[bleak hazel]

hmm

silken armour is silken armour

what artifact passive makes sense for Rival's swords that he's constantly swapping to and from

I am considering +1 non-charm resolve against psyche and shaping, since his robes is the serious "teachings of the composed master" artifact bequest and the swords are "here are some sharp sticks to kill people with, do try to remember what they're for"

[velvet raft]

Does Rival have any weird focus areas in his charms? I’m thinking of how the Enlightened Abnegation Sabers let you stab someone with Sid Shell Games

[bleak hazel]

his main area of focus is stabbing people normal style, I'll be honest, but there's a good amount of Craft and Presence in there

possibly "I knock you on your behind and you get Impose Natured" works

goku swords, you ally people you beat up

[velvet raft]

Pearlescent Unweaving of Strands Style

Once there was an outraged maiden,

Who had spent one too many hours at the loom.

So they toppled the beams and snapped the shuttle,

Found a spinning wheel to toss through the window,

And made a mess of things until there was no telling warp from weft.

After a while, the maiden grew restless,

For without their weaving, there was nothing to do.

So they gathered up the pieces of the loom,

And put it all back together again.

So when you tear up the floor,

And knock down the fenceposts,

You better make sure you have somewhere to sleep!

[velvet raft]

@nova yew thinking about Robin Style

[nova yew]

OH SHIT

[velvet raft]

Scripture of the Doubting Maiden?

[tulip folio]

Goblin Thrall

Parents throughout creation tell their children the stories of Hobgoblins, of the horrible creatures formed from the nightmares of children that lurk in the shadows. They talk about how if they do not behave, these monsters will chase them down and gobble them up. Every word of this is true.

However, there are many sorts of fear. Creeping terrors with bloody smiles and sharp knives invoke a fear of monsters and of death but there are some that are drawn from sadder fears. From the dreams of helot children and the slave markets of nexus come Goblin Thralls, embodying a fear of incapacity, abuse and the lash of a master's whip.

Thinner than their murderous kin, Goblin thralls are also smarter...smart enough to realize how powerless they are and how hopeless their lot is. Dreams of weakness, they draw sustenance on the abuse levelled upon them. However, where Hobgoblins relish the pain they feed upon like the finest of wines, Goblin Thralls find no pleasure in it. They hate what they are and they hate their masters but their very nature is to not have power to resist it, hating to live but too afraid to die. They would pray for salvation if they believed any god would care.

Some slavers on the edges of creation have found Goblin Thralls to be very profitable, the creatures unable to escape or disobey. They talk about how they are doing the poor creatures a service, for they cannot live without a master and are happier this way. Such cruel lies only serve to tighten slavery's hold on Creation and create more such tragic nightmares. It is only when such dreams cease that these creatures will find peace.

Decided to do up a minor fae, drawing from the idea that hobgoblins come from the nightmares of children and just how widespread slavery is. ||Also dunking on Harry Potter's absolutely wretched 'let's both sides slavery'.||

[velvet raft]

Pondering this:

1st charm: use simple energy charms to do reflexive/simple attacks, increase the power of those charms generally. Maybe opens up some MA compatibility for solar bolt/etc? Imbue energy into unarmed attacks and vice versa? Enlightenment removes some of the specific limitations of Unweaving method.

2nd charm (prerequisite 1st): defend self with the power from energy charms. Enlightenment adds hell theming and makes this defensive field actively harmful to attackers, unmaking them.

3rd charm (prerequisite 1st): attacks an enemy’s structure, attempting to break them down to prevent them from doing stuff. Some kind of crippling shaping effect? Specifically attack anti-shaping protections? Enlightenment adds something Wyld-themed, maybe? Some sort of ongoing effect that attracts further aggression?

4th charm (prerequisite 1st): use energy for mobility in some way, zooming around by ripping holes in reality. Enlightenment adds Oblivion-theming, making these portals themselves into ongoing nodes used to attack from/do other stuff from.

Form charm (prerequisite 2nd, 3rd, 4th): stylist becomes partially unwoven, becoming difficult to target or land meaningful effects on, and deleterious to interact with in general.

6th charm (prerequisite form): briefly charge self with chaotic energy, becoming own energy blast in order to shake off effects and attack all at once.

7th charm (prerequisite form): create an area in which most/all things are automatically clashed by entropic energies.

8th charm (prereq 6th, 7th): absorb energy from targets harmed or impeded by this style or by blasts, can use this energy to repair or bolster other things

9th charm (prereq 8th): completely undo sources of harm or alteration, although it can’t prevent them in the first place

Still thinking about 10th, 11th, 12th

Trying to stick to the old 2E concept of the charms being linked to lines in the scripture

[velvet raft]

10th would probably expand on 7th, perhaps creating some kind of hazard zone. 11th could do 6th for symmetry, making it into more of a transformation into some sort of chaos kaiju. 12th ... hm.

[tulip folio]

There we go. They are minor and not really dangerous but they can mess with things about themselves and they're actually pretty solid spies.

[velvet raft]

Reflexive Unraveling Essence

Wielding destructive essence has become second-nature to the stylist, who calls upon its crackling force without thought.

Simple charms that are used for direct offense — such as Unweaving Method, Crypt Bolt, Mind-Hand Method — become usable reflexively as part of simple or reflexive Martial Arts charms that call for an attack, and their mote costs overlap, incurring only the higher of the two mote costs. If it was not already, it becomes compatible with martial arts that use thrown or archery weapons.

Enlightenment: Unweaving Method no longer contends with bonus soak and hardness against undead enemies or those protected from the Wyld. It can make attacks as a light artifact close range weapon in addition to an archery weapon, and adds +(Essence) to its base damage and +(Perception) to its Overwhelming value.

[tulip folio]

It's interesting but I do worry a bit that the Enlightenment might need an update when Gets get released 😛

[velvet raft]

Possibly!

Does that seem about right for the starter charm of an SMA?

As a secondary goal I’m trying to write it so as to be compatible with your energy bolt MA rather than replacing or copying it

[tulip folio]

Permanent, I'm guessing?

[velvet raft]

Yeah

Hence why I didn't bother with the full header >_>

Starting an SMA with a permanent charm is unusual, so I'm not sure it's wholly kosher

[tulip folio]

I mean, Angry Yelling from the corebook starts with one.

So I think it's valid

Oh, and Thousand Blades

Neither are SMA but they're both martial arts

Shieldbearer's Posture
Cost: —; Mins: Martial Arts 1, Essence 1
Type: Permanent
Keywords: None
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: None
When you wield a Short Spear, Spear, Javelin, Lance, Halberd or Shield, you can add or remove the Two Handed tag. Wielding two of those weapons of any sort grants you the bonus of dual-wielding two identical weapons for clashes.

Speaking of which...not sure if this is interesting/fun for a intro martial arts charm. It's to let you freely use Polearm + Shield. I feel like it likely needs more, as I mean the intro charm for Thousand Blades is right there and is rather a lot more.

[wise ocean]

just listing every type of spear is both unwieldy and not great future-proofing, but "polearm-type weapons" also feels a bit awkward. hm

and yeah, I definitely think it needs a little more sauce if it's eating a charm slot

[marsh garden]

i have heard from y'all that thousand blades is a bit

extremely juiced

[merry arch]

thousand blades good

[marsh garden]

but imo you could just give it some kind of small mote spender for its second feature?

[merry arch]

i'm trying to work out making a v2 ultrakill alchemical using a dragon sigh wand with a bayonet as the signature weapon for thousand blades

[wise ocean]

oof, that's rough

[marsh garden]

like the assorted "perm thing + 2m: ignore x soak", "perm thing + 1m: add E withering" etc.

[tulip folio]

Yeah, it's tricky being a polearm + shield style as heavy weapons have 2 handed by default in 3e and most polearms are heavy weapons. XD

[wise ocean]

trying to reload five firearms at once is going to be

[merry arch]

HAHAHAHA

righteous devil!!!!

it has a stupid fucking charmset lemme pull it up

and im trying to cook up a starmetal artifact coin for Reasons

stupid fucking murderbot

[wise ocean]

my sniper deeb is a RD gamer, I am familiar with the grindset™

[merry arch]

EPC is the railcannon

https://tenor.com/view/popuko-pop-team-epic-nodding-yeah-yes-gif-16322848

[wise ocean]

oh, hm, I suppose thousand blades doesn't say you fire every gun when you use them

the other four are just kind of

there

[merry arch]

oh shit i forgot subluminous doesn't work with flame and i changed it for something else.

rapid barrage config

[wise ocean]

RD makes for a good 2dot dip to snag ebon devils for the reload, but blossom is supplemental and so you can't use it to enhance TB attacks

[merry arch]

yes it's actually????? strangely friendly to flame weapons????? it's fuckin funny as hell

[wise ocean]

let me check the interaction between flame keyword and TB range extension

I suspect that doesn't work either

[velvet raft]

It's maybe the only MA in the game that, entirely on its own, forms a complete combat package where you basically don't need anything else

It takes a while to get there, E4 and Mastery

[merry arch]

flame asserts unless a charm directly contradicts the flame tag it doesn't give range boost

[velvet raft]

But it's strong.

Thousand Blades is also only compatible with melee weapons/attacks

[wise ocean]

ah, yeah, and firewands are Short

[tulip folio]

btw, anyone have any thoughts on the little fae I did?

[merry arch]

homophobia.

[tulip folio]

mechanics here

[wise ocean]

They look fun! I try not to speak much on homebrew because I ain't know shit.

[coral wraith]

entry level evocation on firewand: "compatible with thousand blades because fuck you."

[merry arch]

true

[merry arch]

i'm joking that the reason it doesnt work is homophobic which is obviously not true, im being hyperbolic

[wise ocean]

unfortunately even then you can't parry with them (firewands, even with bayonets, aren't melee weapons outside of RD form, which has a specific callout) and can't make multiattacks with them unless explicitly specified, so that's a lot of stuff with TB that just

doesn't work

[merry arch]

anyways dream dead i'll abandon this idea now

[velvet raft]

I do think a set of firewands specifically meant to be used with TB could be fun

[wise ocean]

this is the weirdest shit, because the entry says "treat it as a short spear!" and then RD says "yeah lmao you can't use it for melee outside of this form, in which case you stat it this way"

[merry arch]

lmao

[velvet raft]

But you'd probably want them to function more like melee weapons with the Flame tag, if that makes sense

[tulip folio]

I think RD might just not know what it's talking about but such is life. XD

Corebook, sick bones etc

[wise ocean]

the charitable interpretation is "RD makes a bayonet a martial arts weapon that does less damage and forgets all of its other tags"

[merry arch]

issue is that it clashes with the image of v2 doing fucked up gunshit so i'll probably just toss this idea until i have enough mental illness to make a v2 martial art or something.

which likely will not be for a very long time because im babie and only just learning how to homebrew for this game.

[velvet raft]

Remember though that TB's third charm lets you attack out to medium or long range

[wise ocean]

you'd have to explicitly contradict the flame tag and/or archery restrictions so many times to make guns work with TB that it's kind of awkward

inshallah there will one day be a way to make guns good that isn't RD though

[velvet raft]

Yeah, I'd write it up as a new weapon type if you were to do it

[merry arch]

yeah it's tough and something i'd need to really sit with and figure out

[wise ocean]

clearly (I bring this up again) alchs need sge nouliths

[merry arch]

true

[velvet raft]

My hot take is that the ability to be Mami is worth it though

[wise ocean]

guns with the primary attribute to shoot them being medicine! new nerd art just dropped!

[velvet raft]

https://tenor.com/Qss8.gif

[coral wraith]

darktide needle pistol

[merry arch]

yes this is also important it's true. perhaps it's only something that can happen in auto or something. anyways throwing it into my growing pile of homebrew ideas

[wise ocean]

I'm A Healer, But
Martial Art

New weapon: medicine gun
Compatible with citrine poxes retroactively

surely this is workable

[velvet raft]

I mean, Citrine Poxes is usable at range

So it's not setting new precedent

One of its form weapons is needles

Which are Thrown (short)

Yes, this means you can be the horrible acupuncture throwing needle death man

[next delta]

It's called a medicine gun because you will need medicine after you get shot by it

[limpid badge]

are there good archery martial arts.......

i have to make a cowboys battlesid

for brain poison reasons

[marsh garden]

i believe the answer is "fuck you, no"

[velvet raft]

Unfortunately not yet

[prisma sun]

Devil caster style thats it

[marsh garden]

although apparently wood dragon should be an archery MA?

and could be with minimal changes?

[velvet raft]

Wood Dragon was archery in 2e and honestly I think it still should be

[next delta]

The gun one in core doesn't fit the cowboy vibes well enough?

[velvet raft]

It absolutely feels like it's still an archery MA

[wise ocean]

Needle Piece

blah blah they use air essence to accelerate very sharp metal needles that can be tipped with various things

Lethal, Archery (Short), Slow, Poisonable```

[merry arch]

how im gonna be looking throwing all these fucking homebrew ideas into the pile

[velvet raft]

Allegedly the Battles Division martial art in the sid companion will be archery-compatible

All that said: Sid Archery on its own is pretty rad

[limpid badge]

this is what i figured

[velvet raft]

Big on distract gambits

[limpid badge]

i just felt like i was not using the whole siddie if i didn't get an MA

[velvet raft]

I hear you, but the combat abilities do let you enter SMAs with them

[limpid badge]

anyway i have to go make her a fucked up crossbow/cavalry rifle

[merry arch]

i think righteous devil + a bow and arrow is a cute combo

[velvet raft]

And use unusual weapons with those SMAs

[merry arch]

give her a devil caster and a crossbow...

[tulip folio]

Hmm...trying to put an interesting spin on charm I took from an existing artifact when putting one together but really coming up blank on what would be a good replacement for its current trick. Hmm...

[velvet raft]

Changing name to Instinctive Unraveling Essence, sounds better

[tulip folio]

Twisting Ash Brand
Cost: 3m; Mins: Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Wyld-Flame Crucible
Weirdflame exhales a spume of varicolored smoke and glowing cinders. As its wielder aims at a foe, this smoke clings to him, lowering the difficulty of the next gambit made against him with Wyld-Flame Crucible by two.

Weirdflame has a Special Custom Gambit it can do that's difficulty 5 and gets this to reduce the difficulty by 2 if you aim. That makes sene, as Weirdflame is a Devil Caster and Archery Weapons/Flame weapons love aiming.

But the artifact I'm putting a copy of that gambit charm on is a Staff for Casters. So it's not quite the same and I don't think a 1:1 transfer would be right.

but I also am not 100% sure what to replace it with. As it does kinda need a 'reduce the TN' charm as TN 5 gambits be hard.

[coral wraith]

hey dont worry. clay maiden enlightenment ok?

[limpid badge]

hahaha yaaaaay

[marsh garden]

...when you take a Shape Sorcery action and don't cast a spell?

[limpid badge]

hi briar im making a cowboy butch battlesid

[coral wraith]

this is the way

[limpid badge]

her name is Stern Gaze of a Red Star

[coral wraith]

fuck yes

[tulip folio]

Shape Sorcery is a maybe, yeah. Pondering things.

[velvet raft]

All four combat abilities have a charm like this, so starting without an MA is no longer a great loss for a Sid

[tulip folio]

Perfect.

[velvet raft]

Since they'll be able to go into SMAs regardless

[tulip folio]

I especially like this because with a name like this there is exactly two ways the other PCs will abbreviate it:

'Red'
'Star'

And both are very cowboy 😛

[limpid badge]

i have been calling her "Stern" tbh

[tulip folio]

Hmm...I should ponder if my sid names need revision as they're a bit too 'Basic Name'.

'Glacier Jade'
'Shining Nephrite'

[limpid badge]

i mean my actual pc sid is Golcanda Paloma

[merry arch]

basic is just as good as complicated

[limpid badge]

Stern's for a story i want to run soon ™

[coral wraith]

my main sid's name is just Grinning Mask and shit it works

[merry arch]

i got Delightful Cacoethes, and her previous incarnation was Spindrift Weaver Nests Upon Warped Providence. both are fun despite their relative differences in complexity

[tulip folio]

I guess my Abyssal has a more Complicated Name and that's where it really matters.

'Iron Tomb of Lost Dreams'

She's a Fae-Blooded Abyssal, so of course her 'chain your armour to yourself' charm uses Iron.

[prisma sun]

I have to decide if King Hu is actually the title King or the word King

[merry arch]

I think it's funny if it's both

yes it's a title it's also his name so put respect on it.

[tulip folio]

Fivefold Elemental Ward
Cost: 4m, 1a; Mins: Essence 2
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Uniform, Resonant
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Prismatic Elemental Twist
Sparks fly as the Arc-En-Ciel catches enemy blows and spells alike, the assault charging its jewels.

The wielder gains the benefits of light cover against an attack. This is improved to heavy cover if she benefits from a full defence action.

If she successfully defends, the Arc-En-Ciel is empowered and lowers the difficulty of her next gambit made with the weapon this scene by two.

Resonant: This cover can also be used to defend against spells, shaping and psyche effects; applying to to any static value when used this way.

Maybe this?

[tulip folio]

Primordial Elemental Mastery
Cost: —; Mins: Essence 1
Type: Permanent
Keywords: None
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: None
Arc-En-Ciel's wielder can gather Quintessence while wielding the staff. She gains one Quintessence whenever she successfully casts a spell against one or more a non-trivial foes in the same scene, creates a Sorcerous Working, lands a decisive attack with the Arc-En-Ciel against a non-trivial foe that resets her initiative or defends against an effect from a foe that is Spell, Psyche or Shaping.

The wielder may expend Quintessence reflexively for any of the following effects:

- Waive the Initiative cost for a Full Defence.
- Waive Initiative and Defence costs for a Smash attack.
- Reduce the difficulty and cost of a gambit performed with Arc-En-Ciel or a spell by one per Quintessence expended, to a mimumum of 1.
- Flurry Countermagic without the usual penalties for flurrying or not knowing the affected spell.

Arc-En-Ciel can store up to five Quintessence. Quintessence lasts until used.

Could maybe change the weapon to one that has resources like Voltspindle or Huskflayer.

[bleak hazel]

Unweaving Method with 9 overwhelming is very spicy indeed as a generic attack. You might want to to just list all the charms this works on and then say "this charm can also be used on other ranged energy attack Simple charms where the ST deems it applicable".

Unsure whether Overwhelming 9 to 11 Unweaving Method is too much for a Permanent, it's definitely extremely good.

the wording for the cost overlap should probably be "simple or reflexive charms that create attacks" since right now it's free whenever you use a 3+ mote reflexive charm to boost it

[velvet raft]

Gotcha, thanks. I think it’s basically just Unweaving, Mind Hand, and Crypt Bolt.

Unless I’m forgetting something

Oh maybe the sand blast charm from Infernals instead of/in addition to Mind-Hand?

[tulip folio]

Yeah, the infernals one isn't really mind-hand

It's the sand blast

[bleak hazel]

Blazing Solar Bolt

which is way stronger than all the rest of these but most of the cost is init/wp and it's 1/scene so you're probably good

[tulip folio]

brb, going back to 2e to find that one DB being prepared for SMA just to Make You Do Extra Homework.

[bleak hazel]

the E3 solar meleeist is unlikely to go for SMA just to make BSB better

[velvet raft]

Yeah, I guess I can include it

[tulip folio]

...considering there are +1 Tier Sorcery Artifacts, I wonder if +1 Tier Martial Arts artifacts could exist.

[velvet raft]

I think you can sorta go nuts with N/A artifacts

[tulip folio]

Likely 'maybe but they shouldn't, as martial arts are less on their own than magic. Giving a guy +1 tier of magic matters to a setting but less so an individual game'

[bleak hazel]

I could see an N/A artifact boosting you up a tier via an odd method

one of the new exigents can spend his accumulated mystery solving points to momentarily get Mastery, deebs can spend aura to lose terrestrial, something like that

I'd like SMA to be sacrosanct but practically I imagine it would be something more like the infernal necromancy fugue but Instant

[tulip folio]

I know the GM for the game I'm in fucked around there. The other alch has access to a singular SMA. Because she's a medical Alch and her Big Messing With Things Gift was 'Can eventually learn citrine poxes but no other sma'

[bleak hazel]

use technique but it really fucks you up, like Bahal Hesh

[velvet raft]

Maybe Perception/2 instead?

[tulip folio]

SMA sorcerous martial art when. XD

...you know what would be cruel?

A sorcerous martial art for a necromancy spell of the second tier.

A martial art a sid can never learn

[velvet raft]

Mainly I wanted to get Perception into Unweaving Method somehow, since it already has Wits and Int for attack and damage and it feels right with what I'm going to be doing

[bleak hazel]

I feel it's slightly mean to make it more MAD than it already is

but somewhere in the order of +2-3 whelm would seem more reasonable, yes

[velvet raft]

Hm, alright. I'll think about it

[bleak hazel]

idea for my Endings Sid + Adamant Alchemical heavenly detective duo: both of them go the FMMF/integrated artifact route and learn the evocations of Divergent Emperor Vaidurya

for extra swapsies

[fierce star]

hey so the Blight counts as a supernatural disease right

[tulip folio]

Likely? Why?

[fierce star]

citrine poxes :V

[tulip folio]

I think it would fall under the same 'no incurable ones' as the Great Contagion

[bleak hazel]

oh yeah it kind of does have a disease statblock

[tulip folio]

Hmm...how does this scene?

[fierce star]

Sounds like fun utlity to me?

[bleak hazel]

yeah, nice support perk

also rereading various deeb sections and it is very funny how much Ragara is just Commander Farsight

except with finance instead of point blank murder

he has the exact same "get lifestealing sword -> stab many guys -> go into seclusion to hand over my domain and wrestle with my ideology -> not die due to sword, become creaky old man forever" arc

[fierce star]

a random thought from binging Steve1989 videos: I wonder how the various creation power's military rations are. Given teh relative tech levels, they're probably pretty same across creation, hard tack (clack clack), jerkies, dried fruits. 'pound of meat, pound of flour' sort of things.

[tulip folio]

Autocthonia: "Mmmm...nutrient paste."

[fierce star]

not even military rations that's just normal food lmao

[tulip folio]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mknig0moTGW9ji8Bb3NGM02ReVUKYBhpYrSFcH9-miE/edit?usp=sharing Okay, got the first four charms of the Arc-En-Ciel done but still pondering what to do further with this. The idea is that while it's a weapon and I plan to give it charms that revolve around what weapons do, it's a spellcaster's weapon with an Elemental theme.

Any thoughts on what would be fun?

[wise ocean]

sorcery + social builds end up extremely MAD, I've found; I need to have high wits, intelligence, charisma, manip, and perception, plus it's a good idea not to totally dump app so you can get bonus dice vs. average guys

[bleak hazel]

some splats have Read-Intentions-with-Wits, and you can sometimes dump charisma

but it does depend on your intended social route

[wise ocean]

a lot of sorceries have their attack rolls with perception for some godforsaken reason, so even that doesn't save you

[tulip folio]

I think you can get away with Charisma or Manip for social, depending on the character.

As an aside: Social + Sorcery has the same stat setup that mass combat has too. So social + sorcery can very easily add 'Using sorcery to make battle groups to lead when you need to fight'.

[wise ocean]

indeed, the optimal play there is "go my thousand blood apes, observe as I obliterate your enemies with repeated butterflies casts" to an extent

regrettably the more I look at this build and suffer the more I regret following through with the character concept and going bureaucracy

[tulip folio]

RiRi gets a lot done with App + Cha + Int. Her manipulation is ratshit but she can lead summons and inspire people to be better and cooler. XD

[fierce star]

Manipulation 1, just never lie

[tulip folio]

I mean, she has the perfect honesty charm.

She literally can't lie.

😛

[bleak hazel]

Charisma tends to have more charmtech hung on it in newer splats

since it doesn't determine static values like Manip and doesn't add dice like App

a Sid can do fucking anything with charisma

Rival crafts with it, does social with it, hits you in the face with it via Crane Style, etc

meanwhile Crimson is the exact opposite

[tulip folio]

I think it also depends a lot on if you're attribute or ability-based.

Attribute-based splats tend to have very specific themes in 'X social stat does Y'

While ability-based is more flexible

[bleak hazel]

interesting quirk of the way Enlightenment works

Rival carries around a couple of metal batons to bonk people with but because currently he only uses them with melee, he can't throw them

when he Enlightens into PAOC he's now using them with martial arts, which means I think he can throw them for no extra cost

the harmony of all things teaches pace bowling

[velvet raft]

Slowly working on my SMA, which now includes charms with such names as, "Everything-Jamming Method," "Opposition-to-Existence Technique," and, "The Triumph of False Sympathy"

(The charms are still unfinished)

[tulip folio]

Very fun. Meanwhile I'm trying to brainstorm things for a relic that is a Sorcerer's Staff.

[velvet raft]

ponders

I almost want to combine Duck Fate and Shield of Mars for this one charm

Something that kinda rolls against an offensive effect and can mess with perfects

Not exactly a clash

Just minimizing the effect

But also like Duck Fate kinda works against Everything

[tulip folio]

Hmmm...man, proving remarkably tricky to brainstorm this shit.

[velvet raft]

Likewise. Maybe my first Exalted homebrew should not be an SMA but I am enjoying myself.

[tulip folio]

Part of it is that I'm trying to work out stuff to make this a Weapon For Casters that feels justified as a weapon. XD

[velvet raft]

Makes sense

Maybe look at Seven-Star Alignment for ideas?

[tulip folio]

Yeah, that makes sense.

Oh, Auspicious Conjunction of Forces is very fitting/fun to borrow

Auspicious Conjunction of Forces
Cost: 3m; Mins: Essence 2
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Perilous, Resonant
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Omen-Gathering Apogee
Seven Star Alignment’s wisdom draws no distinction between the ebb and flow of combat and the subtle patterns of sorcery.

When the wielder regains Willpower for successfully casting a spell in combat (Exalted, p. 465), she may exchange it for five Initiative. If the spell lets her make a decisive attack, she gains this Initiative before rolling the attack.

Resonant: This Evocation loses the Perilous keyword.

Letting you weave 'beating ass' and 'casting spells' together.

[velvet raft]

Yeah, Seven Star is probably my favorite artifact

I've never quite been able to figure out how to build for it, though

I think it really has to be your whole thing

[bleak hazel]

yeah, by its very nature you need sorcery and martial arts and evocations and that's so much XP

probably SMA too, since you're almost certainly a siddie

[velvet raft]

I figure you want one (1) normal MA, probably Centipede or Snake, exactly five (5) terrestrial spells, and then probably CMOS

CMOS because it has gambits built-in which Seven-Star loves

Monkey might also be an option for the baseline MA

Again, because gambits

Unrelated, how does this look?

Everything-Jamming Technique
Cost: ?m, 1wp
Mins: Martial Arts 2, Essence 3
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Enlightenment, Uniform
Duration: Instant
Prereqs: Instinctive Unraveling Essence

... who had spent one too many hours at the loom.

The stylist wreathes themself in destructive essence, destabilizing and undermining whatever tries to bring them harm.

In response to an outside influence or attack, the stylist rolls (Awareness), imposing a penalty equal to the number of successes on the roll for the influence to succeed. As long as the stylist rolls at least one success, it becomes possible to defend normally against unblockable and undodgeable effects. This defense extends beyond physical attacks to environmental hazards, shaping effects, psyche effects, sorcery, influence actions, and other charms or powers that would change the stylist's nature or condition. In cases where the stylist must roll to avoid the effect, she gains a number of non-charm dice equal to the successes on the roll. Everything-Jamming Technique perfectly defends against sources of uncountable damage, leaving her immune to the source of the damage for the remainder of the scene.

Enlightenment: Incorporating the non-essence of Oblivion into their defense, every success inflicts one point of initiative damage to the sidereal's attacker. Attackers in Initiative Crash instead suffer one health level of damage for every three successes, minimum one. At the storyteller's discretion, this effect might reduce or even eliminate hazards or environmental effects as they are drained into the sidereal's destructive essence.

I legit have no idea if this is too much, too little, or just enough

It is, at least, the type of thing I want the charm to do

[tulip folio]

Yeah, this is a more conservative 'You want a moderately okay melee and sorcery'

As while it's got some stuff that cares about making attacks, it doesn't have anything that relies on you being an absolute shitkicker in melee.

[velvet raft]

I think the form charm for this style is gonna be kinda like VBOS/Soul-Fire Shaper in that it discounts/improves the four charms preceding it

[tulip folio]

Always fun.

[velvet raft]

Not sure if the lack of perfect defenses in SMAs is intentional, really.

Or just sorta incidental

[velvet raft]

@bleak hazel If you don't mind, do you have thoughts on this?

[tulip folio]

I imagine it's due to sids having a couple alredy they can combo with SMA easily enough.

Dead wife etc

[velvet raft]

Ye

Center Must Hold, Duck Fate

I think melee has a good one

[bleak hazel]

Toad has one, so there's no ban on them in MAs

it's just extremely uncommon

[velvet raft]

I think the assumption is that you will take your native perfect dodge, yeah

[bleak hazel]

sometimes I do wish Sid Brawl had block unblockable

I'm not sure any brawl tree does, actually

I'm just unfamiliar with non-Sid and non-Solar brawls

[velvet raft]

I don't think DBs or Abyssals do

And Lunars are attribute-based

I have not really looked at Infernal Brawl

[tulip folio]

Iridescent Light Dispersal
Cost: 3m; Mins: Essence 2
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Uniform, Resonant
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Prismatic Elemental Twist
With a simple flick of her hand, the work of gods and elemental kings becomes nothing but morning dew.

The Wielder gains +1 Block. On a successful block, her attacker finds their elemental force drawn away from them, suffering (Essence) dice of unsoakable withering damage, doubling 9s if the attacker is Dragonblooded or an Elemental. The wielder gains one Quintessence but doesn’t gain Initiative from this.

Resonant: An enemy crashed by this damage suffers −1 to all static values against the wielder’s spells and gambits until he recovers from crash.

[velvet raft]

Huh, looks cool

[bleak hazel]

block isn't a stat, I must point out

[velvet raft]

So Parry

[tulip folio]

...dammit. I always get tripped up that the effect of using parry is blocking but the stat is parry. XD

This is nearly as bad as 'The ability is dodge, the action is dodging but the stat is evasion' 😛

[bleak hazel]

might make it 4m, just because it really is a very big zap at higher essence levels

is this a medium weapon?

[tulip folio]

It's a medium, yeah and that's fair.

[bleak hazel]

I see what you're going with here but it's very fiddly, especially with the enlightenment effect

[tulip folio]

it's general theme is 'Omm Nomm Nomm, Delicious Elemental Power'

[bleak hazel]

the chance of the foo unfooable clause failing are like 8%, you might as well just make that guaranteed to save space, and the against-rolled-effects thing can just be Awareness/2 noncharm dice for starters

[velvet raft]

... yeah, that makes sense

[bleak hazel]

attackers in crash instead suffer one health level of damage, done

[velvet raft]

Also makes sense!

[bleak hazel]

if you get 6 successes on 5 dice then well done you but I don't think it happens enough to be written around

[velvet raft]

Yeah, an earlier draft was Perception + Awareness

But that seemed like too much

[bleak hazel]

I would remove the "storyteller's discretion" thing because it's just a faff and also a whole extra sentence

[velvet raft]

Makes sense

Do you think it needs the wp cost? I'm unsure

[bleak hazel]

and then you're left with an effect I have no idea how to price, because "global foo unfooable" doesn't really exist anywhere else except Duck Fate, and Duck Fate is odd

namely it doesn't make you any better at dodging, it just lets you dodge, and it costs a fortune

I would definitely keep the willpower cost

[velvet raft]

Gotcha

[tulip folio]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mknig0moTGW9ji8Bb3NGM02ReVUKYBhpYrSFcH9-miE/edit?usp=sharing Okay, so it's not yet done (It only goes to E2 right now) but how does this seem for a Defensive Wizard Staff? It's not really designed to be the deadliest things in a Raw Beatdown but it's designed to be quite good for 'I want to Parry and Blast'

The Arc-En-Ciel, top of them.

[velvet raft]

Cleaned it up following suggestions

Everything-Jamming Technique
Cost: ?m, 1wp
Mins: Martial Arts 2, Essence 3
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Enlightenment, Uniform
Duration: Instant
Prereqs: Instinctive Unraveling Essence

... who had spent one too many hours at the loom.

The stylist wreathes themself in destructive essence, destabilizing and undermining whatever tries to bring them harm.

In response to an outside influence or attack, the stylist imposing an (Awareness/2, rounded up) penalty for the influence to succeed. In cases where the stylist must roll to avoid the effect, she gains an equal number of non-charm dice to her roll. This makes it possible to defend normally against unblockable and undodgeable effects, and extends beyond physical attacks to environmental hazards, shaping effects, psyche effects, sorcery, influence actions, and other charms or powers that would change the stylist's nature or condition. Everything-Jamming Technique perfectly defends against sources of uncountable damage, leaving her immune to the source of the damage for the remainder of the scene.

Enlightenment: The sidereal incorporates the non-essence of Oblivion into her defense, dealing (Awareness/2) withering damage to the attacker. Attackers in Initiative Crash instead suffer one health level of decisive damage.

[velvet raft]

Duck Fate is 7m, so I think that's a good baseline for cost here

[prisma sun]

Question

how does one make a battlemap for exalted

[lunar magnet]

Vibes and with a hatred of range bands in your heart.

[prisma sun]

I have found something neat

[chilly sluice]

It's mostly just kinda zones

[chilly sluice]

And something like this yeah

[prisma sun]

You put these on the bottom of the map to keep track of who's wherree

Can anyone help me find

Art of an evil spooky island that can work for Sharktooth

[next delta]

I basically used zones when I played Exalted, but technically range bands are different

[velvet raft]

How big does it need to be? I might have something.

[prisma sun]

Its gotta be a background

[velvet raft]

The island in the image I mean

I’ve got a spooky storm-tossed lighthouse

From Arknights

[prisma sun]

Oh doesnt matter

[velvet raft]

https://arknights.wiki.gg/images/Background-Eye_of_Iberia.png This is what sprung to mind

https://arknights.wiki.gg/wiki/Category:Background_images AK has a pretty big catalog generally

MtG cards are also a good source, I'd bet some of the island cards from spookier sets would be in the right conceptual space

[tulip folio]

I did a horrible thing.

||Infernal Monster||

[velvet raft]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[mighty rover]

unleash the beast the primordial

[velvet raft]

https://gatherer.wizards.com/prints/island/en-us

Man, MtG's brand identity is just completely vanishing ...

[prisma sun]

Naaah too modern looking

Auto correct into laughter what an evil device i have

[velvet raft]

Try one of the Innistrad block islands then, maybe

[prisma sun]

Its a pirate island

[fierce star]

blocked, blocked, blocked, none of you are free from sin

[velvet raft]

Folks, does an effect that works like a hazard but from inside the opponent's body sound like it has sauce?

[prisma sun]

Isnt that a disease/poison?

[velvet raft]

... yeah I guess you're right, this would probably work as a weird poison

[marsh garden]

like your blood impaling you?

[velvet raft]

I was thinking more like the empty spaces in your body being annihilated such that you are transformed into undifferentiated primal matter

[marsh garden]

incredible

"Sids, remove one electron from every atom in this Anathema's body."

[velvet raft]

I'm thinking like

You know how Democritus said, "all is atoms and the void"

This is an attack that targets the void in question

If I am doing it as a poison I gotta make it meaningfully distinct from Maw of Dripping Venom, which is sad because Maw of Dripping Venom does look pretty close to what I want

[velvet raft]

I guess the case for doing it as a hazard is that I could do shenanigans with the duration

Unless ...

[velvet raft]

Opposition-to-Existence Attack
Cost: 7m, 1wp
Mins: Martial Arts 3, Essence 3
Type: Simple
Keywords: Withering-only, Enlightenment
Duration: Instant
Prereqs: Instinctive Unraveling Essence

So they toppled the beams and snapped the shuttle ...

Targeting the imperceptible empty space in between their foe's constituent parts, the stylist attacks the underlying balance of their existence, a pain that can only be relieved by allowing a sudden collapse into undifferentiated primal matter.

The stylist makes a withering attack. On a success, her opponent suffers a poison with Duration (stylist's Essence + extra successes on the attack roll), and a -3 penalty. Each round, he can choose to either take withering damage equal to (stylist's Essence/2), or end the poison immediately but allow the stylist to reflexively make an unblockable, undodgeable decisive attack on him that is not subject to clashes or counterattacks and converts extra successes on the attack roll equal to the remaining duration.

Enlightenment: In imitation of the Principle of Opposition himself, the stylist becomes what her opponent is not, gaining an equal amount of initiative when her opponent suffers withering damage from this poison. If he chooses to end the poison early, the poison's penalty is not removed until after she has made her decisive attack.
As always, no idea about balance, but I feel like I'm starting to see the outlines of how to play with mechanics here.

[marsh garden]

oofte

session 3 goin' on

first combat of the game

two size 3 might 2 battle groups, nothing else

https://tenor.com/view/danger-gif-15291718235185428481

[tulip folio]

That's...a lot of very powerful dudes.

So you're getting charged by like a hundred demons?

[marsh garden]

nah, GM made an oopsie, we're talkin about it right now

it's several hundred hungry ghosts, but someone else pointed out that those shouldn't be might 2

[tulip folio]

Nah, surprisingly, Hungry Ghosts are might 2.

It gets mentioned in the spell that summons them

Vompires are scary

Still a lot of hungry ghosts

[wise ocean]

hope you've got a white reaper stylist 🙂

[marsh garden]

oh!

huh

[marsh garden]

also nah, i'm brawl/middling-stat necromancer with zero combat spells and we've got a social infernal and a Wound Penalties Georg violet bier sid

who's also i think half-social

no aoe to speak of

we have another two players, but both are missing rn

[next delta]

Doesn't fighting only BGs really suck because you are going to be completely initiative starved? Though I guess you don't need it for Decisive attacks?

[marsh garden]

yeah, init starvation is killing my little blorbo rn

BGs deal decisive against crashed targets

so you want initiative for that

[bleak hazel]

if they're poorly drilled battlegroups of chumps you can kind of just keep whacking them with artifact weapons until they fall over

if they have leadership or good base stats you're in more trouble

[marsh garden]

hungry ghosts are apparently highly damage-biased, so i have taken three hits and am about to die

sad

[wise ocean]

what's your defensive dice cap looking like

(for the future, it's not much going to help at -4 penalty)

[marsh garden]

oh, the three hits was over two turns

defensive dice cap...that just refers to the (dex+ability)/2 one, yeah?

that would be 4 (or 5, if it rounds up)

but i was out of motes

[lunar magnet]

Yeah no Hungry Ghosts are a nasty battlegroup.

[tulip folio]

You don't wanna fight a whole Gang Of Draculas.

[marsh garden]

i'd spent all of my motes on other dickery earlier

[bleak hazel]

oh yeah that'll get you

big BGs are bastards in the attrition stakes

[marsh garden]

eh, it's more just me not knowing how to build

[bleak hazel]

if you have a tanky full moon or infernal or anyone else with giga soak you can just have them sit on the BG and keep hitting it because big soak means you take effectively no damage

[marsh garden]

and not knowing how to pilot

[bleak hazel]

but anyone without soak relying on active defences they don't have motes for has a bad day

[marsh garden]

i have an artifact and the solar sense charm committed, so I'm at 22 motes normally

(whatever it's called, i only know the abyssal name)

and then i spent all of those and my personal on awareness, occult, and eventually a full FoS excellency

[coral wraith]

I think this is more on the GM for throwing two size 3 might 2 BG's at you solo

[wise ocean]

evasion or parry, defense is both (and yes, it's (+ specialty) / 2)
and by penalty I didn't mean onslaught, I meant wounds

if you're nearly dead / on your -4 box then you're pretty much relying on the kindness of your GM at that point since everything'll hit you

your dice cap is how many motes you can burn on excellencying your defense, because the point of things like hungry ghosts or apes is that they're normally really quite bad at hitting you but do gigadamage on contact

[marsh garden]

ohh, yeah the last hit on me knocked me through to my -2s

[marsh garden]

everyone in the group is apparently very used to playing with BG mulchers lol

[prisma sun]

Were you not able to run away?

[marsh garden]

being discussed rn, the other two players were a Huskflayer White Reaper abyssal and her GM in their last campaign, and the current GM also plays with super fighty groups

[wise ocean]

oh lmao

[marsh garden]

so "two BGs, that'll be whatever"

was uh

all three of their understanding

[wise ocean]

yeah white reaper solaroid vs. two size 3 battlegroups is done and dusted in a couple turns

can't hit her, can't meaningfully wound her if she has apoc MA for WR capstone, huge damage

[marsh garden]

and mine was "i'm playing Exalted :D"

it still is, i just feel bad for the GM, she seems pretty flustered

[bleak hazel]

yeah most combat exalts can throngle that

[wise ocean]

that said if I was your GM I would just straight-up have not played session if the Player I Clearly Balanced The Encounter Around wasn't there

[marsh garden]

neither of our other players are aoe monsters either

there are just two more of em

and this is the fighty part of the circle

[wise ocean]

aoe isn't a big deal here, there's only two targets

[bleak hazel]

but BGs are more stat-checky than most enemies because it is very much just "line attack pool against parry pool and damage against soak" without most of the complexities of standard bard guys

[marsh garden]

just a confluence of oopsies

learning has been done!

[bleak hazel]

I would expect three exalts to be able to take two solid BGs but there's a giant gap between "3 exalts (5/5/1 combat pools, artifact gear, 3-4 combat charms) and "3 exalts (two of them have 3 dots in melee, the third is strictly noncombat)"

and there are tables that play at both those levels perfectly fine

[wise ocean]

the problem is more "social exalt has no combat, vbos dip sid is going to get fucked by wound penalties not existing on battlegroups, necromancer with no bone buddies to counter-battlegroup, and they're going into an encounter balanced for the circlemember that AFKs through any encounter labeled is battlegroup"

vis-a-vis "lack of aoe"

[marsh garden]

it's more that i'm a single-target build and i didn't understand everything about the combat

and rolled like absolute dogshit on initiative

i'm definitely taking most of the blame there, the other two did fine

i just got absolutely mulched

[wise ocean]

it's fine to be a single-target build

battlegroups are beefy single targets

[bleak hazel]

hungry ghosts don't have the best pools, I don't think you need an anti-BG spec in particular to beat them up, but no motes and getting all hit as a group by a collective six attacks a round is rough

[marsh garden]

no as in like literally and explicitly single target

battle groups are multiple people

you cannot grapple a battle group

the artifact i'm carrying around does not work on battle groups

(it demands single targets)

[wise ocean]

ah

[marsh garden]

and then the rest of my build is mostly social support stuff and a couple awareness/athletics charms

[wise ocean]

[marsh garden]

yeah when i say single target i mean single person, not single health bar

and i didn't realize how badly i would get mulched by BGs, so i didn't make compensating spells a priority

[tulip folio]

...I'd have to double check but I don't think that's actually a restriction.

[marsh garden]

huh!

is it just that battle groups autograpple?

and can't do normal grapples?

[tulip folio]

Yeah, checking it - Battlegroups can take the Engage action but not the Grapple action. However, nothing stops you initiating a grapple on them.

You can 100% collect the entire group of dudes in a ball and yeet it into a wall.

[marsh garden]

baffling

oh wait - that wouldn't actually have changed anything much for me, i was misremembering blood-drinking palm

doesn't need to grapple

i just held off because my initiative was f i v e

and i didn't have enough boosters to buff that into something reasonable

[tulip folio]

Ooof, that'll do it

[marsh garden]

a confluence of narratively important, but likely mechanically bad decisions on my part (including my build) that culminated in just getting the shit kicked out of me against an enemy everyone underestimated

[tulip folio]

Sorry to be a bother, does anyone mind taking a squiz at the top artifact here I'm working on?

[velvet raft]

I'm abbout to go to bed but I'll open it up to look in the morning

[tulip folio]

Thanks

[next delta]

There is a loosey-goosey rule about grapples and how it should not work on "opponents where a grapple simply doesn’t make sense" at the end of the grapple section (and it in particular calls out grappling armies as an example where it doesn't)

[marsh garden]

i hoped i wasn't crazy...

it's just core being core

i'd be happy to take a look and share my thoughts on staff as well, i just don't think they're likely to be very helpful

[marsh garden]

just backlogged a conversation about spells and got mentally boomed over the fact that i 80% recreated rain of doom without knowing that spell existed

...and that stormcaller already also fakes rain of doom

so i can't even just go "okay yeah this evocation mimics rain of doom"

ough

[tulip folio]

It's okay to do things existing charms already did.

I'm planning on doing a 'emulate a solar circle spell' as the E5 for this artifact.

[marsh garden]

yeah it's just

the problem of being the e5 capstone evocation of a storm-themed artifact that's comically similar to the e5 capstone eovcation of an existing storm-themed artifact (or at least a storm spell that it imitates)

i can't do that

so i've got to figure out some different mechanical expression for the idea/desire that spurred the entire artifact, because i'm now fond of the other things i want to do with it