Hmm... maybe I should make her smarter...
#Exalted
buoyant summit
velvet raft
Because the thing about Milton’s Satan is: he sucks
Yeah, Batman R.I.P. for the Joker
Oh shit! And K6BD
bleak hazel
Lunars have attribute charms not Linguistics charms, but the kind of things you can do with Magic Linguistics is always fun even if they're not actually called that
velvet raft
And V For Vendetta
buoyant summit
Lunars have attribute charms not Linguistics charms, but the kind of things you ...
Oh I meant more as a general usecase
buoyant summit
Just like literally eloquently writing about carrying on an affair xD
velvet raft
Kill Bill, John Wick (revenge), Breaking Bad, Eva, Tales of Berseria, We Know The Devil and Clair Obscur are the rest
mighty rover
clair obscur??
velvet raft
So apparently the Getimians inspired the Infernals waaaaay back
A lot of the warlock stuff was learning about the nature of exaltation
bleak hazel
getimians once again desperately attempting to have setting relevance, sorry gets
I am hoping for good Sach stuff in here, admittedly
velvet raft
Aw, they simplified “the Ebon Dragon fucked up” out of the lore here:
Thus was forged an apocalyptic pact: The Yozis would share what they knew of the secret of Exaltation, and in turn, fifty of the recovered Exaltations would be theirs to do with as they pleased.
merry arch
clair obscur??
basically a French jrpg that ppl have been raving about all year. haven't played it myself but I have it on good authority that the game fucks heavy
mighty rover
i know what it is
merry arch
ah
mighty rover
I'm just very surprised there's anything Infernal in there
velvet raft
When an Infernal dies, the Yozis laugh: The foolishness of our once-conquerors! When a new Infernal rises, they laugh: Another piece in the great game takes to the board! Though the Yozis still suffer for the ignominy of their defeat, their humiliation is now punctuated by bouts of dark and dangerous glee: Now, oh now, we shall at last have our revenge.
mighty rover
(having not played it myself)
merry arch
the manuscript references the fucked up environments
velvet raft
I do not like this portrayal of anyone but the Ebon Dragon
merry arch
as visual inspiration for malfeas
bleak hazel
I could also see Adorjan taking a general stance of "lol. lmao." but that's Adorjan
tulip folio
> When an Infernal dies, the Yozis laugh: The foolishness of our once-conquerors...
It seems to kinda narrow them all down to just 'malicious assholes'.
I also refuse to believe that SWLIHN knows how to laugh.
prisma sun
Aw, they simplified “the Ebon Dragon fucked up” out of the lore here:
> Thus was...
We already knew this though
Like that lore is in Abyssals
bleak hazel
Malfeas, Ebby and Adorjan all seem like they'd be down for that, not sure about SWLIHN and Cece
maybe the Yozi writeups will have stuff on their angles on the whole thing
velvet raft
Two things here: (a) [see earlier complaining], but I can at least see how they’re trying to preserve some element of “ya got fucked” I guess, and (b) oh thank god explicitly no more Lilith
No ambiguity on the Lilith question
The exaltations just float around
Some demons approach the potential Infernal in a pliable moment of desperation, grief or rage. Others observe and converse with the prospective Chosen for months, hiding from the sight of others. It might treat an imprisoned prince, yearning for revenge, as Hell’s highest aristocracy, likening her suffering in prison to that of its masters. A humiliated sorcerer might find themselves plied with stories of Hell’s great libraries. Either way, it portrays the Infernal Exaltation as a blessing from Creation’s true gods.
That’s better than the pitch made it sound in terms of what I was hoping for
At least one Infernal emerged from her Chrysalis with a womanly shape reminiscent of a neomah, rather than the male body she entered with.
Diversity win! The deranged, ruined primordials who want to render the world ash or something say trans rights!
velvet raft
They still have the coadjutator post-transformation btw
bleak hazel
Oh good I liked demon copilot
tulip folio
> At least one Infernal emerged from her Chrysalis with a womanly shape reminisc...
Oh good, much better than the 'Is UCS a terf' arguments I've seen before. XD
mighty rover
i thought prince diamond would disprove that
velvet raft
Apparently whether the Infernal can hear the demon directly varies
But it’s there giving visions and stuff
tulip folio
i thought prince diamond would disprove that
It was more an argument about how Eyes of the UCS interacts with HRT or gender-affirming transformations.
It got weird
mighty rover
wack
velvet raft
Hmmmmm
tulip folio
I'm sure they crack many eggs in hell, yes
velvet raft
Devil-Body Apotheosis
Alright OPP, you keep talking this up, show us what you got
prisma sun
I think the idea with UCS Eyes is it only works if it's a disguise, and not if it's your true complete form
velvet raft
Okay, so basically as an Infernal develops, their fundamental personal truth develops into a demonic form (which might be anything, demon kudzu and Evil Dodecahedrons are mentioned) that can emerge out of their human shape
Once it does this for the first time, the form is set
But until it happens, it keeps growing
Or, changing
tulip folio
So you want to save using it for as long as possible?
As once you use it, it's locked in
velvet raft
Oh, okay, it’s not fixed fixed
It’s not something the Infernal gets to consciously control
spring lynx
Okay, so basically as an Infernal develops, their fundamental personal truth dev...
fuck yeah gonna make Ramiel my stand
velvet raft
It’ll develop based on who they are and events in their life
But they can’t make decisions about it
spring lynx
prisma sun
It just seems like the shape is like a Lunar's soul shape
velvet raft
This transformation is fuckin’ rough and hard to do
Infernals save it for when things get real bad
The draft notes the irony and pain of this, since it’s the embodiment of their inner truth
Their divine statement of self-being
Which fucks them up to use
spring lynx
oh so they're Demon: The Fallen now
spring lynx
that's the one i meant mbmb
velvet raft
Well, in Descent it’s not that being in Demon form is hard
bleak hazel
Okay, so basically as an Infernal develops, their fundamental personal truth dev...
"Damn, I punched this guy and he exploded into a pile of ten-sided diamonds and rows of little dots. I wonder if I could make an SMA about that."
Episode Title: The One Where The GM Gets Ducked
tulip folio
It sounds like Demon the Fallen Apocalyptic Forms, yeah.
velvet raft
It’s that when you go loud, your enemies start closing in
And they will kill you unless you manage to hide, because they are always loud
Anyway
velvet raft
Which fucks them up to use
It also notes some Yozis think this is funny, which, you know what? Sure.
I can buy that
They’re huge assholes
Essence Fever is apparently like having a manic episode or panic attack
Especially for young Infernals
Great Curse makes them start acting like supervillains
They’re keeping the “this exaltation has not been properly washed” thing with past life memories
Okay, here’s a fun twist: second and third circles and Yozi often don’t really see how a new infernal is meaningfully different from that Exaltation’s previous host
They themselves tend not to die when killed
So they don’t really get why the two are two different people, especially with such vivid memories
tulip folio
"HEY MATE, GREAT TO SEE YOU AGAIN!"
Infernal: "I am three days old and what is this?"
buoyant summit
We are picking Artifact 5 for our first Merit gentlepeople
prisma sun
"hey dickhead, remember me?"
"no"
"too bad
velvet raft
Alright, I acknowledge: this is the correct kind of ill-directed spite
No day passes where the Yozis do not dream of vengeance. If they had their way, the Infernal Exalted would raise up temples taller than the mountains from which the enslaved mortal masses could be lead in worship of their Yozi masters. Freedom from their prison, they know they will never have, but to see Creation too in chains — perhaps that might satisfy the vengeful demiurges.
velvet raft
We are picking Artifact 5 for our first Merit gentlepeople
As one should, to be tbh
Have something in mind?
buoyant summit
Have something in mind?
a sentient weapon that can transform between a great, thrown hunting spear and a large warsword
That is either possibly or in the future infatuated with its wielder
velvet raft
Okay, they’re really focusing in on the idea that the first thing Infernals do after visiting Malfeas is typically to get even
They’re given armies and weapons and whatnot and told, “go forth and murder forty people in the name of your dog.”
The Infernal Essence even pushes them to do it
tulip folio
That would be rather amusing for the internal I played.
Since she was a mortal slave in malfeas
'Where are we going to get revenge boss?'
'Three streets that way'
'I guess we don't need to pack a lunch this time'
bleak hazel
The Immaculates should thank the Yozis for Anathemamaxing
buoyant summit
I have one hanging bonus point that I can't seem to finagle into anywhere lmao
Fuck
velvet raft
… see this makes me feel validated and I don’t like that
bleak hazel
easier wyld hunting than usual
buoyant summit
This is currently what I have attributes and abilities-wise
tulip folio
… see this makes me feel validated and I don’t like that
Yeah, I'm not really a fan of that. It feels very...limited...in the sort of character an Infernal can be.
buoyant summit
Could a cult be like
velvet raft
Like
buoyant summit
a group of ritualistic hunter followers?
velvet raft
I dunno that’s so boring
velvet raft
a group of ritualistic hunter followers?
Yes
fierce star
this reminds me of my complaint with lunars being rather one-note in their startng writeup in their book, tbh
boiling infenrals down to 'revenge' i slike boiling lunars down to 'rage'
velvet raft
You have taken my pathos-filled, mentally ill children and made them just angry all the time
sigh
Okay, nonetheless, there has been good stuff so far
I will certainly submit criticism of this segment in particular
Because even if they want the revenge thing it should not be this centered
tulip folio
I think actually the way I'd describe it is they feel stunted
Like they're less capable of emotions than they were as mortals.
prisma sun
I mean it's Essence Fever
velvet raft
This isn’t in the essence fever section
tulip folio
We're not talking about essence fever
velvet raft
Like they're less capable of emotions than they were as mortals.
Which feels off to me when transformation is such a big theme
Apparently Hell doesn’t keep them on a leash except in the sense that it’s great to them
And the second and third circles are probably who they socialize with
Oh, interesting
If you ever wondered why second-circles seem to actually run Malfeas, see also Octavian
It’s because the thirds mostly don’t give a shit about little trifles like that
They play their own big stupid games
Administration is somebody else’s problem
fierce star
The Great Game, Hell Edition
velvet raft
@bleak hazel you have been assigned second circle demon status
Notably, a few first-circles here and there have full citizen status
Most are serfs
But there are occasional exceptions
Thirds are the Unquestionable
Ultra citizens
buoyant summit
Fuck, I'm still having trouble picking <XD
prisma sun
prisma sun
Also
Another player is being added to the game
and they are A Dragonblooded from the Underworld
Who is gonna be a Mecha Pilot
mighty rover
pog
velvet raft
Had to pause, back to it!
Screencapping again because this entire segment frustrates me
It feels very
How do I put this
It really feels like they are simultaneously overly averse to constraining players, and yet also unwilling to follow through on a lore level
For all that Abyssals are goth solars they lack that undirected murderhobo vibe that solars have
Whereas this feels very “sure, you can play a green solar, BUT REMEMBER, the lore says you are prone to vengeance” in a way that.
I dunno.
buoyant summit
Holy fuck the art for the axe in the core book is just a drawover of the skyrim iron axe
that's great lmao
velvet raft
I would rather have a stronger scaffold on which to build than this set of half-measures
The core book is a mess in several ways, yeah
velvet raft
And okay, that was chapter 1!
Yeah, charms are a lot
You probably want at least one purchase of ox-body
bleak hazel
Things you want: agile beast defence, bending before the storm, finding the needle's eye, divine predator strike, ferocious biting tooth, an ox body
bleak hazel
Things you may want to consider building towards after the vitals: the tree that starts at Relentless Lunar Fury, Octopus and Spider Barrage
can't get that yet but it's a good grab for full moons
RLF is a particular kind of character so examine the vibes and see if you like them
buoyant summit
RLF?
Oh fury
Looking at it, meh
She prides herself on channeling her Exalt-given physicality through technique
bleak hazel
Fair enough no zerker build
buoyant summit
Is there a Charm or art for wielding a two-hander one-handed? XD
I wanna wield a sword as tall as I am in one hand
prisma sun
The mechapilot is named Sorrow Through The Sea of Time
never seen someone nail an Exalt Name in one
buoyant summit
My Lunar is named Adamant Fang cuz I'm boring
prisma sun
@bleak hazel I need your ghost lore misc
bleak hazel
Other popular lunar picks are Hybrid Beastman Transformation and Deadly Beastman Transformation, popularly known as war-form
buoyant summit
And her actual name would probably be entirely too vulgar for this server
prisma sun
Where can People Live in the underworrld
buoyant summit
I have hybrid beastman
bleak hazel
Both are fully compatible with big weapon
fierce star
lsat lunar I made was a hybrid beastman fighter using white reaper + golden janissary
buoyant summit
Oh shit no I don't I accidentally yeeted it, fuck
vale glen
I don't think I've got a luna, but I do have an infernal, an abyssal and a dragon blood.
bleak hazel
Where can People Live in the underworrld
Most places, luckily, although most living people are in shadowlands rather than the underworld proper
buoyant summit
Other popular lunar picks are Hybrid Beastman Transformation and Deadly Beastman...
Given my artifact is gonna be sentient and also My Wife idk if I like the drawbacks tho
bleak hazel
I need to sleep but the Abyssal book details a bunch of ritual and cultural afterlives as well as a cool shattered continent full of ghost kingdoms that the Silver Prince is warring with and colonising
bleak hazel
Given my artifact is gonna be sentient and also My Wife idk if I like the drawba...
Resonance only turns on and off certain clauses on the evocations, mechanically it's still a perfectly good artifact weapon you're attuned to
prisma sun
Most places, luckily, although most living people are in shadowlands rather tha...
It needs to be the Underworld proper I think, since I think the idea is that he and his ghostly pit crew are trying to escape from Hell.
Hell being the Underworld
But Hell is funny to say
bleak hazel
but if you don't want it for thematic reasons you can always get upgrades for HBT instead
bleak hazel
It needs to be the Underworld proper I think, since I think the idea is that he ...
The shattered continent is river hellscspe so possibly a good candidate
Check the skullstone writeup, I think it's in there
velvet raft
Anyway, I'm done with Chapter 1
I've got the first part of Chapter 2, describing the Demon City and its inhabitants, and I may go over that here in somewhat less depth tomorrow, but it's pretty long and in-depth from a glance.
prisma sun
Also can anyone post little blurb on ghost blooded
velvet raft
I think we should call the Underworld by a better name, like The Dank.
Shadowlands can be Danklands.
(/j)
prisma sun
Anyone know what book God-Blooded is in
velvet raft
Divine Blood
Is IIRC the name
There’s not a ton to it: for five dots, you get an eclipse charm and the ability to buy more
prisma sun
The Warstrider is going to be a reskinned Crusading Spear called "The Roar Of the Dreaming Dead"
which makes me think they hijacked a Deathlord's weapon
bleak hazel
Divine Heritage, it's a sidebar in Sid Linguistics
buoyant summit
Divine Heritage, it's a sidebar in Sid Linguistics
Oh hey ur back. I ultimately decided to take warform lol
tulip folio
It will be good to have Infernals back in some capacity.
Sidereal: "Now, let us see this new foe. I am a master of many styles, I will read yours and defeat you." flutes and string instruments playing
Infernal: "LETS DO THIS!" Electric Guitars and Keytars Wail
(I might have stolen the titles from Gloryhammer's Keeper of the Celestial Flame of Abernethy before for when an Infernal was introducing themselves before)
(2:32:44 PM) Loviatar: There is a surge of power...as she hears voices in the darkness around her whispering...
(2:32:51 PM) Loviatar: Master of Nightmares
(2:32:58 PM) Loviatar: Keeper of Celestial Flame
(2:33:05 PM) Loviatar: Sorcerer
(2:33:11 PM) Loviatar: Bound to the Darkness
(2:33:22 PM) Loviatar: Witch Queen
(2:33:25 PM) Loviatar: Chaos Incarnate
There's a lot of fun in being just the Biggest Drama Queen as an Infernal
tulip folio
Loviatar was just Pure Witch Classic. She lived to do shit like 'Put curses on your firstborn'.
(She was also originally a slave in Malfeas and liked the sense of control that playing the bad guy gave her. Bad things can't happen to her if she's the biggest and baddest person about. She was not a mentally healthy person.)
limpid badge
Layabout Prince is convinced that the things people do to each other isn’t any worse than Hell, so she should spread the fun (heretical cult doctrine) around!
Until all Creation knows the myriad joys of the Lotus Feasting Hall
tulip folio
Yay, this can't end badly!
limpid badge
It’ll go soooo well she is summoning so many demons
velvet raft
Yep
prisma sun
Should I make the Drowner of Saints a melee guy or a brawl guy
I dont think he has a described load out
buoyant summit
How important is Dodge if I intend to be pretty good at parrying and have Unusual Hide 3?
tulip folio
It's not essential. Having both defences solid lets you handle shit like 'Oh fuck, this guy has an unblockable attack' easier but there are charms for 'block unblockable'
buoyant summit
(Yes she's going to be into pain do you even have to ask)
chilly sluice
You'll still want some Evasion probably
tulip folio
Like it's nice to have but you can get by without a tonne of focus.
chilly sluice
But it'd mostly be for unblockables
tulip folio
That said: Just having Good Dex will get you a chunk of the way there.
buoyant summit
I have 5
chilly sluice
Also as a Lunar you can feasibly just be tough enough to tank the occasional attack that hits you
tulip folio
Like, it's an issue for RiRi because she's got an alch stat swap that lets her parry with stamina instead of dex. So her parry is 7 and her evasion is...1 😛
chilly sluice
Or have other defensive tricks
tulip folio
But for your lunar where both are based off dex you'll be fine
buoyant summit
does spirit shape grant any mutations while ur in it or your hybrid shape?
bleak hazel
Only if your spirit shape is a mutant or you picked those mutations for HBT
buoyant summit
shit
buoyant summit
But for your lunar where both are based off dex you'll be fine
you will be happy to learn, for Sire-Queen's sake, that I put the two points from Dodge into Integrity xD
chilly sluice
Having good Resolvr can also be important
buoyant summit
I have decided that Thrown is Overrated and am taking Even Blade
tulip folio
Even Blade is very fun. Not super complex but you don't always want super complex
buoyant summit
I do not lol
What sucks is now I gotta manually put all the Even Blade shit in
in the sheet
buoyant summit
Is it worth it to get the in total four charms in Even Blade to get the stance I want at chargen?
tulip folio
Stances are a lot of the value of martial arts.
tulip folio
And honestly, for a lunar getting martial arts charms at chargen is good value.
As you don't get the cheaper exp price later on that a Sid or Solar might.
buoyant summit
You're right, yeah
chilly sluice
Grabbing up to the Stance for your MA at least is usually a good idea
Forms are usually pretty important
tulip folio
Lunars and Alchs both really like chargen martial arts if they plan to do martial arts
buoyant summit
Now I gotta figure out what to cut xD
Argent Songbird Voice is probably an easy cut
And I actually have two slots spare so I only need to cut one more
Would Even Blade's form compensate for not having Agile Beast Defense?
prisma sun
I do not think you can get a form at character generation
Aren't they almost all essence 3
buoyant summit
Shit that's true
chilly sluice
most Forms are Essence 2
but I think a few are E1
buoyant summit
Oh, Even Blade Form's Essence is 1
tulip folio
There's a decent number of E1 forms.
E3 form is a rarity, mostly for the rare martial arts that go to E5
chilly sluice
it varies by MA
I know Single Point and Thousand Blades are both E2 forms
but Single Point Form is also Single Point Form 😛
tulip folio
Single Point Form: "What if my effect was to give you two times as many points?"
prisma sun
Single point, charcoal spider, and that flying magical daiklaive
Dont ever talk to me or me or me or my sword or my sword ever again
buoyant summit
Doesn't single point give your sword its own initiative so you have two attack turns or some shit
chilly sluice
correct
and if you and the sword act on the same tick, you can do some crazy combo attacks with yourself with the later charms
it's a bit unfortunate that Single Point is a little busted, because aesthetically I fucking love it
tulip folio
I'm glad Even Blade came out to give me another 'I am good with swords' martial art that isn't single point. Now we just need a sidereal that works with swords.
buoyant summit
Isn't Even Blade a Sidereal martial art???
tulip folio
Nah, it's a normal martial art. We don't have any SMA that use swords yet
It's why I ended up homebrewing a SMA for that
prisma sun
Doesn't single point give your sword its own initiative so you have two attack t...
The combo i just described gives you 5 initiative tracks
3 are you, 2 are your swords
drifting stag
henlo.
Question: What's Exalted's most beginner friendly edition?
limpid badge
I think Essence, definitely
Essence will get you into creation and playing with the Exalted with minimal fuss
3e can be a bit like jumping in the deep end of the pool, but unlike 2e or 1e they haven't tied weights to your legs this time.
vale glen
Essence is the most easy for beginners yeah!
chilly sluice
for me personally, Essence kinda doesn't do it because the mechanical complexity is in part what I come to Exalted for
but it does give you a way to interact with the lore and setting a bit I suppose, yeah
vale glen
Ahh, that's far.
drifting stag
thanks!
limpid badge
for me personally, Essence kinda doesn't do it because the mechanical complexity...
That's why i think its best for the general public, you know? it gets you going and if you end up not liking it you can set to learning 3e, the most Playable By A Human edition of Exalted yet known to mankind
bleak hazel
Isn't Even Blade a Sidereal martial art???
Even Blade (and Violet Bier of Sorrows, and the other four Bureau house styles) are merely normal martial arts that happen to be popular among Sidereals, because Sids are Exalted's biggest martial arts freaks
you can tell since they start at Essence 1, not Essence 3 with the prereq of one full normal style
in Even Blade's case it's popular for Bureau agents because the original three masters were Heaven's Dragons, members of the dragonblooded clans who live in the celestial city and are almost entirely distinct from the Dynasty on Creation proper
many of them find work for or alongside Sidereals in various capacities, the Bureau of Destiny can always use more manpower
limpid badge
hi rhi! i used Gorgon from Arms of the Chosen as the basic framework for the Black Blade of Sorrows
Which is why its a sword that is "asleep" until enough blood is spilled, and those it kills are petrified
buoyant summit
Huh, fun
bleak hazel
even if you can't just steal and reskin an entire artifact, steal as much as possible
there's usually something about right for your normal evocations in one of the artifact books
just don't use the ones in Core, they're all busted
velvet raft
The incredibly overcomplicated volcano sword, busted?!
Say it ain’t so, chief!
Alright, time to dig into the Demon City chapter
the demons bound within can escape only briefly — and the Yozis cannot escape at all.
Guys, I get it, the Reclamation isn’t a thing anymore. You don’t have to mention this every third page.
buoyant summit
even if you can't just steal and reskin an entire artifact, steal as much as pos...
Yes but I don't have the Big Book of Artifacts and none of the Lunar artifacts really fit
velvet raft
… you know, the beginning of this chapter doesn’t even mention that the city is never, ever silent
I feel like that’s important to establishing tone
The constant, nonstop mentions of spite are starting to wear thin
bleak hazel
Yes but I don't have the Big Book of Artifacts and none of the Lunar artifacts r...
wait one
velvet raft
Just going to post the history timeline, btw
Hell’s febrile, chaotic streets seem uniform and unchanging to outsiders
Someone needs to be talked to for this sequence of words
“Febrile” is an obscure word for “fevered”
So Hell’s streets are fevered and chaotic, but also appear uniform and unchanging? Uh, what?
bleak hazel
the streets look uniform and unchanging, what happens on the streets is fevered and chaotic
(even when Malfeas or some other Yozi is not actively reconfiguring them)
velvet raft
Yeah that … is certainly a possible generous reading
mighty rover
My take is like, how tv static is chaotic up close but turns into a uniform blur at a little distance
velvet raft
What they actually mean, from the rest of the passage, is that hell’s current state of chaos seems eternal and unchanging
buoyant summit
That is
limpid badge
hey gk its starting to feel like you're reading this to hate it
and im gonna say, maybe don't
velvet raft
I can stop talking about it if you want, but I am looking for things to like as much as anything, and I have talked about things I like
limpid badge
that's fair, i've just been peaking in here and there as you post and its felt very much like just picking at it- if i've misread or overstepped than i'll retract myself
velvet raft
I was just about to say that I like the idea of the passage, I just think that’s not a good sentence for expressing it
buoyant summit
hi rhi! i used Gorgon from Arms of the Chosen as the basic framework for the Bla...
Is the Black Blade the same weapon type as Gorgon or should I feel free to do something like take the evocations from some claws I found and put them on a daiklave
velvet raft
I am also taking an editorial eye as I read because I do have the ability to submit comment
bleak hazel
also scientifically, this is not symbiosis, this is at best homeostasis, but this is a highly specific ecologist complaint and should not matter
velvet raft
And I’m putting my thoughts in order
limpid badge
that does help how the messages read, ur goood gk, i just wanted to make sure- if my reads wrong it simply is!
velvet raft
I can not do that here as I go, if requested, but that is my intention
limpid badge
Is the Black Blade the same weapon type as Gorgon or should I feel free to do so...
i mean yeah i just reskinned the whole thing as Another Sword
velvet raft
And to entertain and inform while doing so, I guess
buoyant summit
well damn xD
velvet raft
What they are saying is that an outsider looking in would think, “Hell, hell never changes”
But the details are changing all the time
At the same time, apparently the outsiders are kinda right
Because the Yozis and the Thirds stamp out meaningful change
It’s an oddly written section, I would have approached it a bit different, but the underlying idea is rock solid
And could have real potential for stories centered in Malfeas
Oh this is fun: during the First Age, various Exalted attempted to conquer this or that part of Hell, or otherwise make inroads, and when they died or moved on their human servants were usually abandoned in Malfeas
So there are demon-blooded humans just wandering around the place, descendants of them
Concept: celestial exalted of some kind born and raised in Malfeas
Make them a Sid or an Abyssal for maximum weirdness
There’s also First Age manses all over the place, in various states of disrepair
The Zenith Chambrilian Peselle’s villa, impregnated by Kimbery, gave birth to the behemoth Scathra yn Thera, a living cavern of fleshy marble, nacre, and coral.
Oh my god
Kimbery got a manse pregnant
buoyant summit
who's Kimbery
prisma sun
Kimbery *got a manse pregnant*
I did that too she ain't special.
buoyant summit
So this is an intense metaphor
fierce star
It's also literal
buoyant summit
I mean yes it resulted in a literal monster
but an ocean and a house don't
fuck
velvet raft
She’s also the ancestor of the Lintha, a clan of demon-blooded pirates who are a continual problem in the West
prisma sun
You need to expand your mind on what a penis and a vagina can really be
buoyant summit
lol
velvet raft
but an ocean and a house don't
buoyant summit
xD
velvet raft
What do you call this
buoyant summit
flooding
velvet raft
Which half-rhymes with fucking
buoyant summit
It
does not?
fluh and fuh are not alliterative sounds
Unless you mean they literally rhyme, which sure
They share a suffix
velvet raft
My point is, a flood is just a kind of sex
prisma sun
When you impregnate someone something definitely gets flooded.
prisma sun
velvet raft
Oh, neat plot hook: a couple of exalts sought refuge from the Usurpation in Hell — and of the lot, we still know nothing about Lamia, the Lunar mate of one of the solars
(All the solars died)
(Lamia’s fate is unknown)
Hm.
So. It kinda feels like Chapter 2 so far was written by a different person than Chapter 1.
There are some outright contradictions, and some repetitions that feel like they could have come out of a style guide.
fierce star
infernals chapter 2 written by a different person than chapter 1? If chapter 3 follows, perhaps it is a curse.
limpid badge
but an ocean and a house don't
the moon and the world-spirit fucked and made a continent. remember that exalted is myths.
velvet raft
infernals chapter 2 written by a different person than chapter 1? If chapter 3 f...
I have no proof of this!
It's just a writing vibe I'm getting.
velvet raft
Right, just wanted to be clear that this is speculative on my part
They could also just have been written at different times, or out of order
prisma sun
I mean I'm pretty sure that is usually how onyx path books are written
velvet raft
I think it's how a lot of TTRPG books are written, yeah
Non-chronological and disconnected writing has been a recurring critique of Paizo APs, for instance (and allegedly we're going to see an end to that)
Realistically, the volume of work makes avoiding it difficult for a lot of companies
velvet raft
Kimbery *got a manse pregnant*
buoyant summit
the moon and the world-spirit fucked and made a continent. remember that exalted...
fair lol
buoyant summit
Question; how common are mixed-Exalt games?
prisma sun
Fairly
velvet raft
It's sort of an assumption that it's possible, to a much greater degree than WoD or CofD
prisma sun
The main problem is that like
velvet raft
The biggest potential issue is power levels
buoyant summit
Solars are at base more powerful than other Exalts?
chilly sluice
yes kind of
merry arch
it's complicated. solar-tier exalts have a running mechanical theme that lets them select one ability and pick charms up to e5 in
chilly sluice
Solars mostly because they were written first and have some Charms that are stupid
and also Supernal is pretty bullshit, yeah
velvet raft
Solaroid charms are also supposed to have more raw power to throw around, if not as much as they do
Abyssals, for instance, hit a much better benchmark while still being Observably Stronger at a lot of stuff
And of course Terrestrial Exalted (mostly DBs, but also Liminals and some Exigents) are weaker than Celestials
chilly sluice
the Terrestrial and Celestial split is pretty noticeable
Terrestrials generally get weaker or more narrow effects in their charms
velvet raft
So broadly it's Solars/Abyssals/Infernals > Sidereals/Lunars/Alchemicals/big exigents > DBs/Liminals/little exigents
I say broadly because it's not always so straightforward
A solar can absolutely hit harder than a lunar, but they're going to be more specialized and lack a lot of the weird abstracted/shapeshifting powers
A sidereal has a lot of weird bullshit that an abyssal simply cannot do, even if the Abyssal can probably liver punch them
And that's assuming even amounts of essence
I imagine part of the reason for this is that Solars have always been the central splat, and they wanted them to be able to stand up a little better to older and more powerful other types of exalt
buoyant summit
it's complicated. solar-tier exalts have a running mechanical theme that lets th...
fucking cringe
merry arch
it's stinky and I do not like it
velvet raft
Supernal is a bad idea for a whole set of reasons
The biggest one is that it predisposes builds to being extremely one-note
merry arch
it forces you into a niche (which you should be seeking in an exalted playgroup) but not in a very engaging or interesting way.
idk I like my Goku slowly getting better at his chosen thing instead of "yeah I just have all that shit off rip."
velvet raft
Getting to those Essence 5 charms takes a considerable number of your 15 starting charms
I think partially it's meant to address how most games will never get to Essence 5
And never get the best toys
But
It's not a good solution
merry arch
Getting to those Essence 5 charms takes a considerable number of your 15 startin...
which makes navigating non-supernal charm trees extra stinky because there's a fuckton of filler
limpid badge
the solar charmset is mostly bloat of dicetricks by volume, which is why a lot of people like to use solar rewrites
the bones are sick.
which i got from @dense verge
velvet raft
Aha
The funny thing is that Abyssals really do feel a lot better
They still have Supernal but like
dense verge
i got the turn of phrase from elsewhere
velvet raft
Houseruling that down to Essence +1 is common anyway
dense verge
its spread
limpid badge
tbf also for the solariods in the game im playing we're doing E+1 on our supernals
and i don't think bh actually has any E2 Melee charms despite having the apocalyptic
dense verge
the main flaw of abyssals is that they're stuck with having to deal with being solar mirrors
coral wraith
the bones are sickly
dense verge
in that, they need to have equivalents for the bad solar charms
velvet raft
Still, if you do E+1, building an Abyssal mostly feels genuinely good
fierce star
within reason, as long as you have a clear line of discussion to your GM, anyway
ask the enby that took apocalyptic sail assuming the game was going to be mostly island hopping when it turned out the 'shallow seas' on the map were actually underworld dunes because they made an assumption based on the relative color of them coampred to the deep seas around the campaign area...
limpid badge
i told bees im taking an evil sword of badness
and now there's an evil sword of badness.
vale glen
This is why I wanted a scythe of flesh-metal for my abyssal. It's sick
fierce star
now, being fair, abyssal sail does have some fun social tricks
and one hilarious combat charm I will continue to crow about where you force ghosts around you to remember how to breathe solely so you can drown them in stagnant seawater.
(it also drowns mortals, don't worry)
merry arch
i love abyssal sail it's so fun
velvet raft
I want to play a Sid so much -_-
vale glen
The Vagrant Sage of Pallid Chrysanthemum
Is the name I finally went with for my Infernal. Thanks to Delilah's advice on this one, I'm in love with the guy.
Old ass gambler
buoyant summit
nervous laughter I have to start planning out an Exalted game
buoyant summit
It is full already, existing group <XD
Before people ask
Thankfully some experienced people are in it tho
vale glen
Before people ask
Hahaha, yeah you'll have people chomping at the bit lmao
prisma sun
The thing about Solars is that they can get so good at one dice trick that if they can leverage that ability, they might as well not roll and simply state "I have won." To the ST.
Like a Solar general just takes 5 peasants and instantly declares victory in any situation
The weird thing is that like
For the most part the bones of solar are sick
But the core rules aren't except for crafting
Which is insane
dense verge
genuinely fascinating they didn't have to do much work on the underlying core rules to make them work for other splats
prisma sun
I just wish we had a solars 2
dense verge
cured bones
velvet raft
But the core rules aren't except for crafting
And naval combat
But yeah like
Most of Ex3 works at a system level
bleak hazel
sail is bad, craft is usable but only once you go through the six gates of hidden enlightenment to realise what dozen-odd charms total are actually useful and it's still way too much of an XP sink
prisma sun
I wonder what the devs say about solars
dense verge
right, i remember naval combat now, and how two mortal captains mathematically reach a stalemate neither can break from
velvet raft
Craft is usable but it does feel very silly in a number of ways
buoyant summit
Oh thank god there's a Foundry module for Exalted
prisma sun
It
doesn't fully help I think
velvet raft
Not even Autochthon can save you
prisma sun
Wondering if I can make a good cosplay for the Drowner of Saints in Wilds
knotty islandBOT
Hi hi. Do you folks know of any good character builders for Exalted, or is it just going by hand and praying a bit?
buoyant summit
<:peek:511747485081796618> Hi hi. Do you folks know of any good character builde...
Ah, one of my Players, they appear XD
By hand unfortunately <XD
There is a scripted google sheet tho, lemme dm it to ya
knotty islandBOT
Technically I'm not the planned player but.. 
buoyant summit
fair lol
merry arch
there's also lot-casting atemi
buoyant summit
This is a stupid question, but Even Blade says it's compatible with medium armor
Is this only with medium armor?
tulip folio
Is this *only* with medium armor?
Nah, if it says 'X armour' it is up to X armour.
tulip folio
I assumed the outside of most lunars was already made of leather 😛
buoyant summit
l m a o
Leather of things I've killed of course
Every little bit of soak counts
Even if my natural soak is already 7
knotty islandBOT
Our current Exalted character plan is er.
Bureaucrat A: "Hey, do you know where this fox lunar went?"
Bureaucrat B: "Yeah no. She went missing like 700 years ago?"
a while later
Celestial census officer: "Name?"
"Guān Bǎihé."
CCO: "..Oh so that's where you went."
buoyant summit
Would setting a game in a remote part of Halta be reasonable?
For a first-timer that is
prisma sun
Don't see why not
buoyant summit
The unobscured glow of the full moon on a cloudless night both bathes Sire-Queen's form and shines from her eyes and metallic weapons, near-blinding to mortals. A spectral manifestation of her Spirit Shape the Great Tiger-Dog clings to her shoulders, perched to witness the glories of her unleashed violence.Iconic Anima Display of an NPC Exalted the party is gonna be around fairly often
buoyant summit
Is it better to dedicate personal or peripheral anima to artifacts?
limpid badge
i can never remember the difference but
use the pool that flares your anima harder to commit, its bigger anyway
buoyant summit
fair
velvet raft
For a first-timer that is
Something to note about Exalted is that while it has very comprehensive lore, most people in Creation know little about it in practice
So players have an excellent reason for their characters not to know shit
velvet raft
Oh I mean your players
buoyant summit
fair enough
velvet raft
Creation is fuckhuge
So it’s very possible to do stories in or relating to remote areas, just to avoid needing players to know things
merry arch
yea also obv the lore isn't exhaustive and so that's why you've got lore skills to Introduce Facts about lore topics
merry arch
yeah if you have the 8 directions book then halta is a perfectly reasonable place to set a game
tulip folio
Back to tinkering stuff with Jadeborn. In this case, them as quick characters for an army if players end up working with or against a Jadeborn Mercenary Company.
merry arch
yeah if you have the 8 directions book then halta is a perfectly reasonable plac...
the scavenger lands is where the most shit's popping off but there's still plenty to do elsewhere tbh
limpid badge
yea also obv the lore isn't exhaustive and so that's why you've got lore skills ...
Bloody Hand got to introduce flowers that grow in the spilt blood of murders! Introducing facts is fun
Like, Creation is a setting where Pliny is right and Darwin is wrong
You can get away with saying some SHIT with introing facts
tulip folio
Like it's a setting where even without introducing facts there is a type of tea leaf that lets you see and touch ghosts if drink it regularly.
velvet raft
I mostly meant reasonable in terms of my necessary workload lmao
If anything it'll make it easier
Or, well, depends on what you find easier
Is it easier to make stuff up, or easier to memorize a ton of lore
buoyant summit
Make shit up
I barely prep my WanG game
Or my Pathfinder game
I am Queen of Making Shit Up
limpid badge
you wanna learn the general beats and tone of creation
and then you're good to just spin bullshit out
buoyant summit
Sweet
limpid badge
my favorite trick is "pick two historical cultures from different contienents, do a little research, mash together"
buoyant summit
Oh yeah Delilah our girlies can have that artifact duel you wanted now
Sire-Queen now has ||An altered version of Stormcaller||
velvet raft
do not fight the melee-apocalyptic dusk
buoyant summit
lmao
fierce star
Defining Intimacy (You Can't Tell Me What To Do)
velvet raft
Defining Intimacy (You Can't Tell Me What To Do, You're Not My Real Dad)
buoyant summit
Defining Intimacy (You Can't Tell Me What To Do)
Defining Principle: Fightslut
velvet raft
Defining Principle: Fightslut
Brawl solars and brawl abyssals are strongly incentivized to have this, btw
Oh! I meant to post this the other day when there was a request for a character sheet/builder
The Master Sheet is sorta the gold standard for Ex3
limpid badge
i love bloody hand's intimacies
limpid badge
g-d she's a contrary little shithead (she is 2m tall)
limpid badge
The Kingdom of ... Loathing? :P
no. she loaths her homeland, the Kingdom of Ul- a little bandit-kingdom of puffed up importance out in the hills of the Scavenger Lands
velvet raft
(Kingdom of Loathing was an old browser-based MMO with stick-figure art and off-color jokes)
buoyant summit
~~do not fight the melee-apocalyptic dusk~~
Even if I'm 5 Dex, 5 MA, with two different MAs at 4?
merry arch
fightsolaroids are very fucking strong
granted, i dont know if your character at present is e1 or e3 but
limpid badge
(Kingdom of Loathing was an old browser-based MMO with stick-figure art and off-...
yes i know this. i am explaining my thing cause i need to be clear- that is not the joke
🫶
merry arch
granted, i dont know if your character at present is e1 or e3 but
e3 fightlunar can fuck up a e1 fightsolaroid pretty good tho
buoyant summit
granted, i dont know if your character at present is e1 or e3 but
E-3, she's an NPC
velvet raft
Generally speaking, you can assume that most or all combat-specced characters will have the relevant stats at 4 or 5, so what it often comes down to is charms
merry arch
assuming you've got a fair number of combat charms i think you'd be able to fuck up bh pretty good based on what i know of her charmset presently
humble that girltwink
velvet raft
Dusks and dawns are able to swing above their weight due to overpowered charms and Supernal/Apocalyptic
buoyant summit
Her PC version doesnt have the second martial art or Stormcaller tho so PC on PC Bloody Hand prolly wins
fierce star
I wish more MAs worked with chakrams
it's annoying to be an MA user for thousand wounds gear because the only other option is like. air dragon? and they're rather skornergistic.
bleak hazel
if you highly optimise your chargen Solar or even chargen Abyssal you can fairly easily demolish anything with stats in Core (and Deebs, and Lunars, and everything in the NPC books besides the two behemoths, it took them a minute to start making enemies at that grade)
bleak hazel
"oneshot Ahlat with as few charms as possible" was a game for a minute
this is mostly because Solars are written very badly, are very overpowered and have a lot of stuff that was right at the start of the edition when the writers didn't know the system well yet because nobody did
merry arch
vanilla supernal fucking suuuuuuuuuucks
buoyant summit
Someone in here asked if my ref art for my character was a Zinogre
I forget who
Oh it was Iteration
She has Stormcaller so she is now lmao
fierce star
hell yeah
fierce star
this is mostly because Solars are written very badly, are very overpowered and h...
I will die as I lived, cursing and spitting upon the concept of 'natural language'
velvet raft
it's annoying to be an MA user for thousand wounds gear because the only other o...
Thousand Blades works
Thousand Wounds Gear, Air Dragon, and Thousand Blades all together ain't a bad mix
ruby geyser
this is mostly because Solars are written very badly, are very overpowered and h...
doesnt help that the core book(as well as Miracles or w/e, the only other book that specifically gives Solar charms) were written by Holden and Morke, and like all of the supplements have been written by the other Ink Monkeys without any involvement from the core book devs, iirc
limpid badge
if you highly optimise your chargen Solar or even chargen Abyssal you can fairly...
note- bloody hand is not an invincible sword princess. she is a Pretty Good Killer with a sword that gets better if she's allowed to terrorize/petrify a few mooks
velvet raft
"I will hit people with five telekinetically-controlled chakrams" this is the good shit
limpid badge
she does not do the e3 fight only the e1 fight
ruby geyser
which is honestly kind of hilarious considering the Ink Monkeys started out as a group of 2e fans who were making homebrew charms and stuff that functioned within the system better than a lot of the official stuff 
fierce star
🤔 thousand blades... I hadn't considered that. She does have a five dot artifact weapon that already counts as dual wielding chakrams... hmm. Will have to talk to GM.
velvet raft
For extra fun, Thousand Wounds Gear and Thousand Blades both have armor compatibility
I can't remember if Air Dragon has light-armor compatibility
It might?
ruby geyser
also delilah 
were you aware that there is actually a kind of lesser god called Bloody Hands that are gods of murder? (or at least, there was in previous editions, i dont know if Ex3 has confirmed they're still around or not)
buoyant summit
she does not do the e3 fight only the e1 fight
I do wonder who'd come out on top E1
Does BH have an accompanying martial art or simply the blade?
bleak hazel
I believe the god Bloody Hand is mentioned as a potential exigent patron in Miracles of the Divine Flame, very briefly
Bloody Hand has Abyssal Melee, which is going to take most martial arts to the cleaners
buoyant summit
lmao
limpid badge
only a little
buoyant summit
What does Abyssal Melee do?
limpid badge
Yeah here we are, Elegant Flowing Deflection, Five Shadow Feint, Savage Shade Style
velvet raft
It hits people with swords
limpid badge
She's got the Basic Suite of Abyssal Melee rn
buoyant summit
I remember seeing somewhere that something BH has makes her Essence count as +1 for her Melee?
velvet raft
That's Apocalyptic-but-toned-down
buoyant summit
Oh yeah I forget other Exalts have skill Charms, not attribute Charms
limpid badge
that's right~!
velvet raft
Alchemicals and Lunars have attribute-based charms
buoyant summit
Yeah I might be screwed
Unless having a juiced as fuck war form for a total of 15 Soak can stand up to that
limpid badge
most of what makes bloody hand deadly is that her three melee charms are uh, super fucking efficient
bleak hazel
she is a very light tough melee apocalyptic outside the 5-dot artifact
limpid badge
i wanted to give her room to grow
bleak hazel
give it two essence levels to get a few more charms in and she'll be fighting elemental dragons straight up
limpid badge
can't wait for her to start doing this shit
fierce star
I can't remember if Air Dragon has light-armor compatibility
It does, but the character already has a set of 'silken armor' equivalent so that doesn't really matter. I could maybe drop it to light armor and save a dot... hmm, more stuff ot ask the GM
also another PC for that game's already going thousand blades, so I might not for overlap reasons
buoyant summit
The fighting charms I have are Hybrid + War form, Sinuous Striking Grace, Agile Beast Defense, Finding the Needle's Eye, Breath & Essence Control, Close Your Eyes & Look, Death Between Heartbeats, Radiant Breath, Ox-Body, Ferocious Biting Tooth, and Divine Predator Strike
velvet raft
I hope we get a chakram-compatible SMA
buoyant summit
Bloody Hand has Abyssal Melee, which is going to take most martial arts to the c...
would it take Even Blade to the cleaners?
bleak hazel
honestly yes, it is almost identical to Solar Melee and Solar Melee is the combat tree that all other trees are benchmarked against and found wanting
buoyant summit
Well shit xD
bleak hazel
(because you can't benchmark against Solar Brawl, it's too stupid and alpha-striky despite usually being more disruptive)
you are probably fine in the E1 matchup, Bloody Hand just doesn't have that many melee charms
buoyant summit
can't wait for her to start doing this shit
This is absolutely fucked lmao
bleak hazel
but if you pair the two trees up then Solar Melee beats almost anything, I have to heavily optimise an E3 SMA-capable melee sidereal to stand a chance
limpid badge
This is absolutely fucked lmao
evocation for her sword yay
Gorgon doesn't have a lot and a bunch of it is locked at much higher essence
bleak hazel
and I am admittedly leaning hard on Essence Redirection, which itself is more than a little bit bullshit despite being really cool
limpid badge
so mostly BH is going to be poisoning people with it
buoyant summit
lmao
limpid badge
(the poison turns you to stone)
buoyant summit
Got me fucked up
Also Misc are you making a fucked up martial arts sidereal for my game? XD
bleak hazel
I am making nothing thus far, but I have several on tap
limpid badge
the rest of her shit is being carried by the rest of Abyssal Melee because eventually she will get [GLORIOUS CARNAGE TYPHOON]
and then its over for everyone (positive)
bleak hazel
almost all Sidereals are martial arts sidereals, they can use their regular combat trees with martial arts or jump straight from pure Melee/Brawl/Archery/Thrown to an SMA
limpid badge
love the description i think was in the draft book Armies die screaming as the abyssal cleaves through them.
buoyant summit
amazing lol
bleak hazel
Glorious Carnage Typhoon is the "you must be this tall to duel" gate for experienced combat Solaroids
buoyant summit
almost all Sidereals are martial arts sidereals, they can use their regular comb...
Oh yeah they can elide the normal SMA req
which makes sense
limpid badge
Glorious Carnage Typhoon is the "you must be this tall to duel" gate for experie...
its really funny and i love it.
bleak hazel
one of the hilariously overoptimised pure combat chargen solar builds is "Rush for GCT immediately, then take as many things that buff it as possible and a move that lets you skip the init order. Jump into the middle of them, spin to win, if more than one serious opponent is in decent fighting shape afterwards you lose instantly but they're probably all minced."
conveniently it would oneshot the generic wyld hunt E3 deebs in the corebook almost every time
because they're a touch undertuned
buoyant summit
This is more so I can reckon with the average destruction a normal fight in Exalted causes
bleak hazel
if you want to Dynasty Warriors almost every vaguely combat specced exalt can Dynasty Warriors
buoyant summit
What Essence would you say two Exalted fighting like Thor and Kratos do in GoW: Ragnarok are?
bleak hazel
if you don't it can merely be a normal wuxia sword duel at surprisingly high essence
buoyant summit
Weapon clashes calling lightning down from the heavens and shit
bleak hazel
let me google it
limpid badge
most of bh's danger right now is
- if she's allowed to kill grunts, her sword gets +Wakefulness to its Withering
- 1m/die post-soak damage up to 3, or up to 3 Auto-Successes on a Descisive
- 2m to get +1 Auto Success, reroll 1s until they fail to appear.
merry arch
I think 2 or 3 sounds about right
bleak hazel
I have not played a God of War
buoyant summit
I have not played a God of War
Their duel ends with creating a lightning bolt literally frozen, with ice, over the lake they fought on
bleak hazel
probably E2 if the participants are deebs
known lightning enjoyers
probably about the same for Celestials, but style can vary
bleak hazel
you can do every stunt in the film Hero with an E2 exalt
merry arch
e3+ is where you start getting shit like punching a river so hard you redirect it's flow
bleak hazel
you can do every stunt in Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon at E1, even
limpid badge
yeah i was gonna say, rn Bloody Hand is just a competent Xia
soon ™ she will be a Problem
bleak hazel
at high essence you start breaking out the domain expansions and so forth
but flashiness varies by exalt type, style and intent
velvet raft
tbf Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon is pretty low-end wuxia
bleak hazel
an E1 Lunar could just be the world's most graceful swordsman or they could be a battle T-rex glowing with silver moonfire
yeah, which is why you can copy all of it with Graceful Crane Stance
an E1 Athletics 1 charm
limpid badge
thanks Raiton's Nimble Perch!
velvet raft
I think you might need something else for the big jump across the lake late in the film
limpid badge
btw @buoyant summit in most of creation the symbolism of the raven is replaced with the Raiton, which is like if an archeopterix was a crow.
bleak hazel
Hero requires E2 just because that's where the Sid "look into his eyes and plan out the entire fight" charm and the Crane "deflect arrowstorm into my enemies" charms are, as well as the first kill-everything-within-X-paces AOEs
limpid badge
You can probably do most of Detective Dee and the Phantom Flame at E1, E2 yeah?
buoyant summit
btw <@494599098763313153> in most of creation the symbolism of the raven is repl...
Huh
interesting
bleak hazel
at essence 5 you unlock the nuclear arsenal and start grabbing cities and hauling them around, summoning living canyons to swallow your enemies or infecting the fabric of reality across an entire province with cosmic plagues by sundering the air with your martial arts
there is an SMA capstone that literally just lets you Roll To Win
(with a bunch of painful consequences attached, granted)
limpid badge
E5 is stupid, stupid, stupid
bleak hazel
You can probably do most of Detective Dee and the Phantom Flame at E1, E2 yeah?
Dee has strong E1 Sidereal vibes, I used him as the image for my neophyte Endings for a bit
limpid badge
The dragon-taming mace would make for a great little one-trick artifact
bleak hazel
I believe you can inflict the Phantom Flame on an institution as a punishment for corruption with Sid Bureaucracy, actually
yeah, Fallow Field Invites Flame, E4
limpid badge
i mean i just assumed that ||the beetles|| would be a thing you could find in creation
bleak hazel
oh they absolutely are but it's fun that there's a charm that turns it into an actual fate-curse
buoyant summit
So I gotta ask
bleak hazel
the thing about exalted power levels is that they are internally consistent but they don't perfectly match "standard fantasy"
buoyant summit
Why is 'Lunar' Exp unable to be spent on Lunar charms?
bleak hazel
medicine is genuinely hard, you don't get "replace lost limb" until you're an E3 master medic, for instance
there's no rez, "translate" is harder than it looks and social is split into lots of different techniques so you can't just buy a mind control charm or whatever
bleak hazel
Why is 'Lunar' Exp unable to be spent on Lunar charms?
every Exalt has [name of Exalt] XP which works the same way, and the answer is that if you let people spend 100% of their XP on splat charms they do so and you never see another ability dot, because charms are cool, but then the exalts don't really grow when they're not specifically using their new powers
so splat XP is for dots, martial arts, sorcery and the few other things that cost a bit of XP to do, like certain army or familiar buffs
it's also a good incentive for a social character to take a martial art, since you spend your core XP on your main deal and you have this secondary pool to make you basically-competent at fighting
whereas the Battles Sids and MA Dawns and whatever go "fuck it more martial arts" and have 30 MA charms by E5 or something
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lol
next delta
XP cost scaling (possibly even without that) also makes charms a better investment character power wise
Essence kind of goes overboard and has three different types of XP, but it does mean your character is forced to improve across attributes/skills/charms separately, more or less
Wait, maybe 4 lol
bleak hazel
there are three rough levels of Charm Power, there's Terrestrial (Terrestrial level Martial Arts, Dragonblooded charms, Dissonant evocations), Celestial (neutral level martial arts, Lunar charms, neutral evocations) and Solar (Mastery level martial arts, Abyssal charms, Resonant evocations)
they're fairly wide bands, obviously, the game is so varied that it's not going to be a hard line
but in general you're going to see a celestial charm doing more for less than an equivalent terrestrial charm
the gap between terrestrial and celestial is way bigger than celestial->solar, Sids and Lunars can absolutely hang in there with Abyssals but it's hard to be a deeb in a celestial group of any kind unless the GM gives you a chunk more XP and so forth
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mm mm
I think everyone in our group is a Celestial
at least, so I don't have to worry as much
bleak hazel
you may notice that splats do not stick to this line - Sidereals have better-than-Mastery martial arts, because they get the mastery keyword, can use their native charms with MA unlike Solars and get slightly cooler SMAs than everyone else
Deebs get Resonant evocations with jade gear, which is a big power jump (at a slightly increased XP cost)
basically everyone has a couple of ways to punch up, except Solaroids who are already at the cap and mostly benefit from getting more, faster (from Supernal/Apocalyptic) and having that range of power everywhere they care to look
they're also obviously nudging splats to play like they should do: deebs learn their secret martial arts from the Immaculate monasteries (celestial level) and use ancient relics passed down their heroic bloodlines (resonant evos) to equalize things with the more powerful but way less numerous celestials
dense verge
my ice cold take is that solaroids should have less of a power gap
bleak hazel
Sids are martial arts freaks and blue deck the fuck out of everyone with kung fu and highly specific but powerful charms, Lunars are absurdly flexible and if necessary can forego specific widget power and just throw raw stats at problems until they break
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they're also obviously nudging splats to play like they should do: deebs learn t...
Yeah the whole 25k deebs vs 200 Lunars thing
bleak hazel
well, most of the deebs are a bit busy doing stuff and feuding with each other
in practice, if you can fight evenly against 2 to 3 prepared dragonbloods at low to medium essence you are already a remarkable celestial exalt
limpid badge
there's a reason bh disguises herself as a Ghostblooded Merc instead of rolling out in Full Deathknight and that's because she doesn't want to get Hunted
bleak hazel
being outnumbered by peer opponents in this game is not casually overcome, because more essence-using enemies means more mote regen and no exalt can go all out forever
if there are three of them they regenerate 15 motes a round and you regenerate 5 while having to pay for defences against three times as many attacks
you can do it, I have seen builds of all celestial types who are basically raid bosses for deebs, but it takes XP, a good plan and a dash of luck unless you go for the most disgusting cheese
the martial arts freak Sidereal I mentioned before is one of those builds, and he's essentially designed to fight large groups of slightly inferior opponents
limpid badge
sidereal raid boss
bleak hazel
I still wouldn't like to fight two even-XP deebs below about E3
I mostly built him because I wanted to have Sid Raid Boss on hand in case I ran a game with big sids in it, rather than to play
but it's fun to start a PC with an end goal like that, especially since Gleam of Vanished Embers was quite a well-rounded E5 elder sid, he wasn't just combat specced
Rival is E1 so he's got like two MA charms and a little bit of Brawl right now, long way to go
velvet raft
a bit too over the top to be interesting
A lot of really cool stuff does come in at that point, and to some degree because of how the game works less over-the-top E5 stuff can still be entirely competitive with the over-the-top stuff.
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Rival is E1 so he's got like two MA charms and a little bit of Brawl right now, ...
summon horse nomad is a pretty good charm tbf
velvet raft
One of the strongest charms in the game is an E5 brawl charm that lets you immediately launch a free decisive attack after crashing someone with a withering
So like, yeah, E5 can mean you turn super saiyan and punch the moon for looking at you funny
But "I get to throw a one-two with a single action" is stronger
bleak hazel
one of the most powerful sidereal charms across any essence level is "pay slightly fewer motes to boost rolls in [speciality]"
limpid badge
the charmset helps really inform the exalt
velvet raft
Part of the reason the big flashy stuff gets to be so big and flashy is because like
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and sometimes siddies are so fucking efficient
but also can't check for spirits without blaring I AM A HEAVEN COP
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Often the understated stuff is overwhelmingly powerful
bleak hazel
something I like about the system is that I can make a character who is carefully optimised for efficiency and sustained ability and so on and "what if I get ran over by some big stompy bastard who just hits all his doomcombos" is a serious concern
and then I make a guy who is big and stompy and depends on explosive combos and "what if I'm outlasted by some sneaky bastard with efficient defenses" is basically exactly as big a question
(leaving out what happens if I get stabbed in my sleep, poisoned, talked around, seduced or betrayed, of course)
velvet raft
but also can't check for spirits without blaring `I AM A HEAVEN COP`
On the one hand they get Terminal Sanction, on the other hand without SMAs they cannot Just Punch A Dematerialized God
A lot of Exalts have particular areas of relative weakness
bleak hazel
the Sid gimmick is efficiency, in large part, but they're irritatingly squishy
Solars and Abyssals, when they're not being broken, have the primary downside of being really goddamn loud
they do nothing subtle, not even stealth in some cases
velvet raft
the Sid gimmick *is* efficiency, in large part, but they're irritatingly squishy
Get you Stamina 5, so that you're completely unharmed until, suddenly, you explode
bleak hazel
all Solar stuff that isn't explicitly stealth capability tends to be huge and sweeping and draws huge big arrows pointing directly towards YOU, THE GOD KING, LORD HUGEDICK and that can be a problem in a few ways
fierce star
Even solaroid assassin-types are uh
bleak hazel
both in attracting the bad kind of attention, in being sometimes a tad inefficient and in unintended-side effects form
fierce star
lacking in subtletly on occasion
like my day caste abyssal who's primary assassination trick was 'prick someone with a needle, they immediately contract every poison and disease known to mankind and also freeze to death'
bleak hazel
Lunars on the other hand, very sneaky, very flexible and inherently lacking in required setup
a Lunar can walk into town, get themselves a convenient new shape and be totally ready for basically anything in ten minutes
if they don't just turn into a bird and sleep on the roof
dense verge
its ludonarrative integration that the solar's sick bones make me want to put them back in the jade prison
velvet raft
Lunars are also extreme generalists
bleak hazel
flexing my abyssal anima of an astoundingly healthy skeleton while fighting my solar rival
velvet raft
Whereas solars and abyssals are very, very overspecialized
bleak hazel
oh yeah, it is entirely feasible for a normal lunar build that wasn't even trying to be that flexible to have an excellency in everything and enough stats that, with some work, they can be as good at literally any task as the best mortal hyperspecialist who ever lived
they can just sit down, hear someone explain the rules of chess and then play Kasparov to a draw
(while glowing a bit, probably)
velvet raft
Sidereals are less overspecialized in part because their charms do weird shit
velvet raft
The example that always gets used is Sidereal Craft
Which includes Craft (Wife) and Craft (Social Group)
bleak hazel
and Craft (working from home)
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Lunars on the other hand, very sneaky, very flexible and inherently lacking in r...
Me when I make a Lunar that does none of this and in fact has an Intimacy where doing this explicitly makes her feel uncomfortable
bleak hazel
nobody said you had to like it
Sids come with crippling social isolation as part of the package
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She must always present herself as Queen Thundercock of Moon Mountain or she gets maudlin
bleak hazel
Abyssals come with Doomoid Disease that makes them passively cause vampire deathy problems whenever they get too close to the living
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Which is why she goes nowhere there are Dragonbloods save at the head of a horde
velvet raft
Also Sid Craft includes that one charm that makes them dramatically more efficient in everything they do, so long as it fits a certain archetypal self-image.
bleak hazel
dragonbloods are remarkably well adjusted, probably because they have a little bit less juice to throw around
velvet raft
"Oh hello there I have a 2e Infernal Excellency"
bleak hazel
no great curse, but their emotions and passions are "greater than those of mortal men" and so on
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dragonbloods are remarkably well adjusted, probably because they have a little b...
They also get to decide who is and isn't illegal, so
xD
velvet raft
Technically they do have the great curse, but it's not mechanized
bleak hazel
yeah, they have a less dramatic form
velvet raft
It is assumed that as superpowered assholes in a TTRPG it will emerge organically
bleak hazel
in practice every single exalt is dramatic as hell and deebs are constantly getting in xianxia sect feuds and telenovela family drama anyway
but they are less likely to completely snap than their celestial cousins
velvet raft
Sids, wonderfully, see their curse get worse when they succeed
next delta
Dragonblooded are often maladjusted, but only because a bunch of them are part of the Realm (and other power structures) that have totally messed up family dynamics
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Lunars have... basically lunacy, which I think is very funny
bleak hazel
yeah, the most flexible one is Solars because they have "generic de-hinging and breakdown of some kind, pick your flavour" as the white bread exalts
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or at least a textually literal 'lunaticus' i.e. moon-sickness
bleak hazel
Sids are (as usual) my favourite though because they have the wonderful clause that their willpower bar refills as they gain limit
so you are heavily encouraged to get a little bit grandiose with it
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I think Miscs favorite Exalts are Sidereals guys
bleak hazel
I wonder why
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mine are probably gonna stay Lunars cuz like
bleak hazel
I basically wrote an Endings Sid before I knew Sids existed in the form of Vigil Galyon
bleak hazel
many such cases
I'm surprisingly fond of Abyssals and Dragonbloods too, they have fun stuff
Lunars are not really my jam
haven't played a 3e Alchemical yet
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You mentioning Abyssals has me remember some of Lilah's BH's inspos and I bet Blaidd from ER is a pretty straightforward Lunar
bleak hazel
oh yeah straight down the middle
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Given he is literally a supernaturally powerful wolfman who can one-hand a sword that like
bleak hazel
him and his infernal bondmate
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probably weighs more than you do
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him and his infernal bondmate
Ranni???
bleak hazel
Ranni also a decent witch-variety Lunar and obviously has the thematics, but four armed blue girl with weird magic could be a pretty good infernal
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ffffffair...
I will point out she almost certainly is also a necromancer, so I would still point to Lunar
bleak hazel
Blaidd is the reason I tend to imagine Ma-Ha-Suchi with a Welsh accent
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And Lunars can have four arms with a like
E1 something Charm
Not that I remember it
bleak hazel
any exalt can have four arms, but for Lunars and Alchs it's especially easy
bleak hazel
oh yeah there are a whole species of forty foot crystal bug lady Astels imprisoned in the depths of the sky above creation, sometimes Heaven has to hunt rogue ones down and/or negotiate with them about the provisions of the peace treaty and/or secure their help with Current Mission
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I...
bleak hazel
the Devil-Stars, of which the most known is Mun Four, who is so exceptionally cool that her mortal disguise-form has mirrorshades
limpid badge
my dear friend made one into an infernal!
prisma sun
King Hu is 9 feet tall and this is completely seperate from him being a lunar
People in exalted can simply be built different
limpid badge
my lunar is a squidwoman and that has nothing to do with her being a lunar
and everything to do with her being from Exalted Skull Island
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Mine started as a monkey woman, which had nothing to do with being a Lunar, and now she's a Monkey-Tiger-Dog woman
merry arch
daiyu was a dynast's daughter who didn't exalt and then got drowned and turned into anathema oops
bleak hazel
all my exalts are just guys, although Crimson was a coldblooded ghoul (fig.) before dying, taking the Bleak Exaltation and becoming a coldblooded ghoul (lit.)
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What's a fun second martial art for Sire-Queen...
Someone recommended one of the Abyssal ones
prisma sun
King Hu is my only not a guy I think
bleak hazel
generally good to pick MAs that use compatible weapons to your main one, which probably means more swords
since Even Blade does not punch
prisma sun
Drifts was just a random guy (his exaltation is super important but thats it) and Scrimshaw is just an autistic guy who had obsessive gumption
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generally good to pick MAs that use compatible weapons to your main one, which p...
Can I not use unarmed attacks while in an Even Blade stance?
I can still kick, elbow, knee, etc
bleak hazel
you can, but you get no benefit from any of your Even Blade charms and you have to roll it with an unarmed-compatible ability
since Even Blade does not have unarmed attacks in the "compatible weapons" section
buoyant summit
Such as an unarmed martial art
bleak hazel
yeah
a lot of the benefit of mixing martial arts is constructing combos, but if you just also want to do some punching that's also an option
limpid badge
Bloody Hand is Just A Human
she just also Touched The Sword That Kills You Instantly
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lmao
wise ocean
There's something wrong with Graves but nobody knows what it is yet
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The only other sword styles I remember are steel devil, which is incompatible with Even Blade since the former uses a pair of swords, the latter necessarily a single sword
limpid badge
hiiii rhi if a living person touches the Black Blade of Sorrow and they aren't important enough to have a statblock they immediately petrify into a twisted mass of fossilized coral and shells
prisma sun
Fire Dragon also does swords
merry arch
there's that one flying sword ma coming in the sid companion iirc
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Sire-Queen isn't doing anime timestop commentary cutaway sword bullshit she's doing 'this sword kills, all other is pretense'
Can Lunars learn Deeb Martial Arts?
limpid badge
yeah just need a master
merry arch
yea anyone can learn any ma just need someone to teach it to u iirc
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is there any deeb who's gonna teach a Lunar? XD
bleak hazel
some outcaste somewhere, sure
merry arch
could be a scorned outcaste somewhere
bleak hazel
not even scorned, sometimes it's the deep threshold and they just Live Here
prisma sun
You will be worse at deeb martial arts than a deeb though
Since a lot of it requires elemental essence
limpid badge
or even someone you trick into teaching you which'd be proper lunar-y
limpid badge
you know you don't need an MA
bleak hazel
VBOS is the most immediately compatible style with Even Blade, otherwise there's a dearth of sword styles
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I mean ye
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you can just use Strength and Dex charms
bleak hazel
but in practice a single MA + Lunar Charms is plenty
that'll eat your XP for the forseeable
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VBOS is the most immediately compatible style with Even Blade, otherwise there's...
VBOS?
merry arch
violet bier of sorrow
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Ahhh
bleak hazel
my only character who truly goes multistyle has one Water Dragon charm, Crane, a Sid combat ability and then SMA, and he's only ever doing two of those at once because water dragon was done at chargen and SMA comes after the other two
still trying to decide whether to go Brawl or Melee, Melee eats more XP and has more compatibility problems but man is it cool
and it has the benefit of guaranteed shenanigans to get into Crane Form
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I'll just stick to Lunar weapon-based dex charms I guess
bleak hazel
lunar combat charms are not -anything based, a dex charm works on any attack roll and the only restriction on strength is that you can't use those charms with weapons that calculate damage using things-other-than-Strength
so firewands and sorcery
feel free to use all that stuff on a bow you picked up randomly
prisma sun
Sids are the guys who do martial arts tbf
bleak hazel
if you want to multi-track drift with combat abilities, there is always Quicksilver Arsenal Adaptation
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Nani the fuck is this
bleak hazel
(this is an outdated version, final release of Many-Faced Strangers lets you put them in MAs as well)
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Does this pool also draw from Martial Arts in Many-Faced?
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So I could use this to take my 5 points in Even Blade
and Oops, Five Points In Tiger Style
?
bleak hazel
yes, which is basically a 12xp discount given the usual cost of dots
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holy fucking shit
prisma sun
I do think these are my least favorite charms
bleak hazel
yeah, spend xp to save xp is a bit gamey sometimes
prisma sun
I sorta hate onyx path and white wolf xp efficiency math
bleak hazel
Craft has it as necessary tech, in this case it's a fun Lunar thing but I dislike anything that fucks with the XP economy in general
Alchemicals have a mildly disgusting one that lets you just print free evocations from crafting
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Sorcery I assume requires high Intelligence?
Or can I get up to some nature magic bullshit
with a different stat
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(this is an outdated version, final release of Many-Faced Strangers lets you put...
Oh Misc I discovered a fun albeit probably not optimal combo
Swaying Grass Dance Style uses batons
Even Blade lets you use your sword as a baton while sheathed and still use Even Blade charms
It would be more optimal with the iaijutsu stance of Even Blade, or the one where you hold your sheath in your offhand as a baton
But it is very funny
bleak hazel
oh yeah, that is a nice one
SGD has some fun buttons, although it is dependent on a bunch of unconventional secondary abilities
Sorcery is Int-based but other than needing Int/Occult to become a sorceror in the first place it's not too big a deal how much you have
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Huh
bleak hazel
unless you're binding demons or using battle magic
demons will resolutely not be bound if you're bad at it because it rolls against their stats
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Immanent Steel Even Blade actually quite likes a lot of SGD
bleak hazel
and then they will be Mad
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Both use a lot of surprise attacks
bleak hazel
luckily there are lots of convenient ritual magics and not-ritual-but-not-time-sensitive spells that work fine even if you're a bad sorceror and take 2-3 times as long to gather the juice for them as a dedicated Twilight/No Moon
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and immanent steel is the iaijutsu one
meaning your sword is sheathed, and thus a baton, a lot of the time
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I have ended up giving Sire-Queen Single Point as an extension of her having Finding The Needle's Eye i.e. she uses her superior Lunar senses in combat etc etc blah blah blah
velvet raft
Immanent Steel Even Blade actually quite likes a *lot* of SGD
I used to use this acronym for Sora, Goofy, and Donald in Kingdom Hearts and I can't not see that