Exalted

[tulip folio]

Also I think I have the capstone sorted.

[bleak hazel]

you do need to specify with the mastery whether you act on the same tick as the person you've counter-interrupted or not, because that determines whether you're clashing (and you can't clash TRA)

[tulip folio]

That's fair! I'll clarify that it's before, not same tick if you're doing 'Hey, I see you're trying to do Funny Buggers with init'

Titan of the Streets
Cost: -(+5m, 1wp); Mins: Martial Arts 5, Essence 3
Type: Permanent
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: Introduction to the Stone Prince, Fleeting Wings Of Dust
A master of First Pulse Style knows the streets. She has lived on them and slept on them, eaten off them, breathed them. The streets are her domain, and she is equally at home on the back streets of the Imperial City, in the oldest and worst districts of Nexus or surrounded by the celestial slums of Yu-Shan. All such places are alike, in spirit if not appearance, and the master has taken the thousand hard lessons she learned there and internalized them.

The martial artist may pay a five-mote, one-Willpower surcharge when she uses First Pulse Form to gain the following additional benefits:

-She adds her Strength to her Natural Soak.
-She ignores Difficult Terrain
-When she makes a withering attack, decisive attack, or gambit, she may pay 5 motes to have the attack treated as a Surprise Attack. If this is the first time the martial artist has used this effect with an Improvised Weapon in this scene, the defender must pass a (Perception + Awareness) check at a difficulty of the martial artist’s Guile or have it instead treated as an Ambush.

It's based on what I was pondering earlier but I added an extra hoop for the 'You get a mid-battle ambush' as that's very potent. XD

You need to Actually Fool Them to make it a Proper Blindsiding

Hopefully matches up to other 'capstone upgrade the forms' like Conclusion-Pursuing Approach in effect.

[dense verge]

@bleak hazel hey check this out

[bleak hazel]

sweet

[dense verge]

rattle me bones

[bleak hazel]

I assume necromancy is not quite so powerful as to provide an infinite supply of fuel for your skellington warstrider

but I do love the idea of building a megasword out of half a dozen different ghosts

[fierce star]

Hmm. how would you price a disarm gambit evocation that causes the disarmed weapon to fly to the character doing the gambit instead of a random point within short range of the disarmed character?

[spring lynx]

not unless you have infinite skelly bois to throw in the ectofurnace

[bleak hazel]

I'm not sure how quickly or sustainably Essence necromancers can produce skelly boys

clearly more slowly than 3e ones because a necromancer that good in 3e would be trivially able to produce enough zombies to feed his warstrider basically forever

[prisma sun]

Sidreals have this exact charm

[fierce star]

well damn

i'll think of something else then

[dense verge]

well, there's still charms between splats that have function overlap and such

[tulip folio]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Hz0AYxSD7MulgBWoJVnQSBx1JxoXRgs5bbKM722_rcI/edit?usp=sharing Okay, so I think I've gotten 3e First Pulse done, minus some fluff.

Thoughts/feedback appreciated.

[fierce star]

okay going to admit 'all your stuff is lethal but you can stunt it to do bashing' is a clever inversion of the usual martial art rules

[tulip folio]

First Pulse Style
First Pulse, like many styles, draws from the world about it. Instead of the flow of rivers or the movement of animals however, it focuses on the power of civilization and worked stone. No matter how mighty the mountain or hostile the forest, civilization will make itself known in time. Mere mortals, armed with hammers and spikes, can carve their way through stones that the primordials themselves crafted and shape it in their own image.

Some claim that the original creator of this style was a slave pit fighter in Nexus, who drew inspiration from the shattered bones and splattered stains left upon the arenas that he fought within. Some Lunars claim that it was invented by one of the first Immaculates, a precursor to Earth Dragon that was discarded as the order sought to hide the brutality of their conquests in the illusions of protection and stability. Others among the stars theorize that its violence is divinely inspired and that this style is one of the reasons that even when the Bureaus of Heaven and Humanity comes to blows in their disputes, few are willing to challenge Wun Ja within Yu Shan’s walls.

First Pulse is violence without restraint; lashing out with driving fists, shattering knees with brutal stomps and gouging at eyes. Only a fool believes it is violence without thought, however. Its practitioners are masters at identifying the cracks in the bedrock upon their opponents' styles stand and then hammering them like an architect’s wedge splitting apart a boulder to craft the bricks of a new street.

Okay, did up First Pulse fluff. Tried to give it a bit more Philosophy to it. It is still Brutal Street Fighting but the original fluff was always a bit 'I dunno, someone Brutally Street Fought until it Made Charms', which doesn't line up well with 3e's 'For most exalts, charms are not a distinct object'. Even with martial arts being more of a distinct set of techniques it felt a bit underwhelming.

Also for some reason in 2e it was associated with Air Dragonblooded for...I'm not sure why? Because it's Fast? All the theming was Cityfighting, Blood and Stone.

[prisma sun]

2 things I think this style is missing on a read

1. Parkour ability
   I feel like having an urban fighting style that doesn't supplement fighting on rooftops is a crime
2. Some kind of Terrain interaction.
   Making use of alleys or slamming someone into a building seem quintessential

Doing that shit from the For Honor trailer e

[upper stratus]

why do they call it first pulse style when you first pulse the fight opponent last pulse out the style first pulse

[tulip folio]

That's sorta what the Slam Focus is. As that's the Exalted thing for 'Grabbing a guy and smashing him into a thing'.

[prisma sun]

Ye but that seems to just be for Huckin' a guy

I'm talking more like "I bounce you between two walls of an alley like a Smash Bros stage"

[tulip folio]

It does have the provision for being better if you're throwing them into a deadly object but...fair, I'll ponder things.

[prisma sun]

An upgrade on it where it does something if you throw them into a building could work

or well, Terrain

[tulip folio]

Vague Pondering: Add an option for Flagstones Meets Face for 'Throwing them into a Notably Deadly Object' instead of 'A second person.

[upper stratus]

looks like 8 charms total? most styled go to 10. there's room for more if you wanna do that kinda stuff

[tulip folio]

9 total but yeah, there is room for a 10th.

[upper stratus]

yea 9

sidereal bait

[tulip folio]

Right now the 'shape' of the style is:

Shattered | Heels | Blood
Flagstones | Street
First Pulse Form
Stone Prince | Wings
Titan of the Streets.

So there's likely room for either a 4th E1 no prereqs option, or a 3rd in the post-form charms.

[prisma sun]

Wondering what you can do with a Parkour charm

[upper stratus]

is there much of a point to improvised weapons gaining grappling?

like you can already do that with unarmed anyway

[prisma sun]

Unironically

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD3ZaytFKiU

This is how I'm imagining the style fighting

• like

Any Jackie Chan fight

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vZAe8OfEe8

[tulip folio]

Mostly a bonus for people who can get Better Improvised Weapons.

Like sids having artifact-tier improvised

[upper stratus]

right but grappling is a gambit which is a type of decisive so that means your weapon's accuracy doesn't apply

[tulip folio]

Fair. Maybe I should go with something like Chopping.

As that's a very 'I hit you Extra Hard' quality

[upper stratus]

chopping that yea

[tulip folio]

...actually, slight adjustment.

[prisma sun]

You could also make the capstone like

"I hit you with an object and gain a bonus equal to how hard it would be to feat of strength to break it"

Solar or Lunar suddenly goes:

https://tenor.com/view/patrick-star-smash-gif-19642208

[tulip folio]

The martial artist gains the following benefits:
-She ignores the initiative cost to attack with Improvised Weapons.
-Improvised weapons she wields can be treated as any appropriate mundane melee weapon (Such as butcher's cleaver as an Improvised Axe), gaining the Balanced tags while she wields them.

Does this seem more interesting? For the form.

[prisma sun]

Oooooo

[tulip folio]

As right now improvised weapons are 'clubs' or 'mauls' in the rules.

[prisma sun]

yeah that's good

Means you can turn rope into a whip

or etc

I would specify "mundane"

[tulip folio]

Yeah, that's fair.

[upper stratus]

you can get any tag in this beautiful world if you get creative enough and i think that's lovely

[prisma sun]

I hit you with my jade wallet and it's now a goremaul

[tulip folio]

Somewhere, there is a First Pulse + Dreaming Pearl Courtesan martial artist going 'I draw my hairpin out and hit you with an Overwhelming 3 Dagger'

[prisma sun]

https://tenor.com/view/tsukuyo-gintama-shinigami-courtesan-ninja-gif-17438965

[tulip folio]

And my thoughts on a 'mobility' one would be to not give you a Huge Bonus to such things but instead avoid a penalty.

Make it Ignore Difficult Trerrain + Give a bonus on avoiding Enviromental Damage.

So it's less 'I am the fastest in a straight line' and more 'You can put any obstacle in my way and I'll get over it fine'

If that makes sense?

[prisma sun]

Ye makes sense

I'd also make sure to put some Mastery in

[tulip folio]

Right now 3/9 have mastery and 2/9 have terrestial. That too little, you think?

[upper stratus]

i think if you put in a mobility about parkour or such charm you're gonna bump into the fact that almost all exalts have some thing in their athletics tree that's gonna obliviate such a thing anyway

[prisma sun]

Just because everyone CAN fly doesn't mean parkour isn't part of the fantasy herre

[tulip folio]

...huh, I just did a check. Oddly enough, despite everything else they have, Solars don't have a 'ignore difficult terrain'.

I guess they make up for it with a lot of 'Go To Enemy, Regardless Of Distance'

[upper stratus]

do they not have a reflexive jump or anything

[tulip folio]

Right, they can Bunny Hop, I suppose.

By just constantly spamming Monkey Leap

And as long as the difficult terrain is Purely Ground-Based, they'd bypass it.

[upper stratus]

yea

[tulip folio]

Alley and Rooftop Steps
Cost: 3m ; Mins: Martial Arts 3, Essence 1
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: None
Duration: One round
Prerequisite Charms: None
The martial artist knows what lurks in the shadows of darkened alleys, moving swiftly through paths that others would overlook.

Until the start of her next turn, the martial artist ignores Difficult Terrain and adds (+Athletics) to avoid Environmental Hazards.

This had been my pondering but you're not wrong.

[prisma sun]

Hmmm

What about "Alleycat's Worldview Assumption"

[tulip folio]

I did work out a 'Fuck them up with the environment' tinkering though.

An adjustment to Flagstones Meet Face.

Flagstones Meet Face
Cost: Xm; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Decisive-only
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Shattered Cornerstone Shards, Heels on Cobblestone Echo
It is always an advantage to throw your opponent off guard. Slow reactions in a deadly conflict show a lack of focus, but controlling someone else's reaction? That's skill.

This charm supplements a Decisive Slam attempt. The martial artist attempts to Slam the victim against another Character or Environmental Hazard within Short Range.

-When the victim is slammed against another character, make a Decisive Attack against the target as with a Thrown(Short) Improvised Weapon. If they hit, divide the martial artist's initiative evenly between the two targets, gaining the full dice of the Slam against both targets. On a miss, treat this as a normal Slam against the initial victim.

-When the victim is slammed into an environmental hazard, the target must immediately test to avoid that Environmental Hazard, regardless of its normal Interval. Its difficulty is considered to be (Higher of 3 and Essence) unless it would normally be higher.

If a character attempts to Clash this attack, any harm the Clash would cause is inflicted upon the unwilling projectile instead of the martial artist.

Where if you throw them at a Hazard instead of a Dude, they Immediately Test Vs The Hazard

So grabbing a guy and yeeting him into a bonfire will be Very Unhappy For Him.

[prisma sun]

I like that a lot

[tulip folio]

Oh right, need to get a cost for Flagstones. I forgot (I just noticed it's listed as X motes) XD

[upper stratus]

"pay what you want" aaa charm

[tulip folio]

Considering it's a Second Attack, it's likely a Motes + 1 WP cost charm.

You don't get to get second attacks cheap

[upper stratus]

yeag

[tulip folio]

Maybe 5 + 1 wp? That's the same price as Iron Whirlwind and this really Isn't Iron Whirlwind but Iron Whirlwind is also Bullshit and likely shouldn't be the point of comparison. Earth Dragon is a martial art and gets 'Every fucker in close range once' for 10m + 1 WP with earthshaker attack.

[upper stratus]

that one doesn't reset initiatice but has some other eay to calculate damage right

[tulip folio]

It does reset init if you're Earth Aura, as it's 'Str + Divided Init + Reset afterwards'

The non-earth aura version doesn't reset but also doesn't add init

I'm finding it ironically hard to find multi-attack charms that only add a second attack for comparison.

Even the DB ones scale to at least 3. XD

[tulip folio]

...I wonder if there's a good way to refer mechanically to those various 'Throw an Exalt-Type Specific Blast' or if you'd need to name them all specifically.

On that topic: How is Unweaving Method/Elemental Bolt Attack/Crypt Bolt Attack/I Couldn't Find The Solar Equivalent?

(I should really stop my pondering of how you'd do a martial art that focuses on that sort of blasting)

[upper stratus]

unweaving method is nice cause its attacks are rolled with occult so it serves as a "backup doohickey" for sorcerous sids who don't really build for combat

[tulip folio]

Yeah, unweaving is the one that got me pondering.

As it is expressly Martial Arts compatible.

So I ended up pondering 'There's not many ranged martial arts you could use it with...I wonder what would be a hypothetical martial art designed to work around it'

As like, even the very few ranged martial arts tend to go 'FEED ME CHAKRAMS' rather than working nicely with it

...actually, I'm not sure even they work with it.

It works with any martial art that's compatable with any ranged weapon.

[velvet raft]

Are there any of those?

[tulip folio]

But does that mean 'any martial art that's compatible with a ranged weapon of any sort' (Which becomes 'most' as very few can't use knives and knives are thrown) or does it mean 'martial arts that can work with every ranged weapon, regardless of type', there isn't any.

[velvet raft]

Probably the first thing

What’s the exact language?

[tulip folio]

She can enhance this attack with Archery Charms, Thrown Charms, or Martial Arts Charms that are compatible with any ranged weapons, but can’t combine Charms from multiple such Abilities unless they’re explicitly compatible with other Abilities.

[velvet raft]

I would say absolutely first thing

The “any” is an unnecessary article but I don’t think it modifies anything

If it were all, it would be “every”, imo

[tulip folio]

In that case it would work with...Righteous Devil Style, Silver-Voiced Nightingale Style, Air Dragon Style, Ebon Shadow, Violet Bier of Sorrows, Swaying Grass, Crystal Chameleon, Thousand Wounds

As ES, EVoS, SW and CC list Knives or Short Spears as form weapons.

And they've got thrown

And if it's that wide...it doesn't overall seem like a martial art targeted at such things specifically would be out of place.

Elemental Bolt for Dragonblooded works with Archery and Thrown charms, so it's also got Real Combat Charms backing it up.

As does Crypt Bolt.

So it seems, overall, like a Martial Art that works with 'Exalt-Specific Energy Bolts' doesn't seem like it would be doing anything that the exalts can't already do on raw balance front. XD

[velvet raft]

Yeah that seems entirely reasonable

Essence kaboom seems fine

[tulip folio]

My thoughts on the form weapons is: 'Wrackstaffs, Knives and 'However I word the Essence Kabooms for this'. You get a choice of 'Stage Magician' or 'Wizard Classic' in your non-mote-costing weapons. XD

[velvet raft]

Something like, “in addition, this martial art is compatible with Simple charms that fire offensive blasts of essence, independent of any weapon, such as (elemental bolt and some other charms maybe). Its charms can explicitly be used in combination with those charms”?

[tulip folio]

Potentially, yeah.

Iki: "I wonder what other exalts have one of these?"

Somehow forgot this exists

Other Exalts: "I will call up mystical energy to consume you with arcane force!"
Alchemicals: "I'm heading out, Dr. Light!"

...I think I also know exactly what I want to do with one of the defensive charms for this.

A relatively cheap defensive clash that can only be used against Spells and attacks made of Energy (Fire Bolts, Necrotic Energy, Essence Cannons etc).

[upper stratus]

going back on this, most other such charms still rely on archery or thrown at which point the main advantage to me is that it gives you access to ranged attacks without needing to ready a weapon, the rules for which are normally rather restrictuve

[tulip folio]

Makes sense.

[velvet raft]

Beam war?

[fierce star]

oh boy beam clashes from anima!

[upper stratus]

like you can have a melee deeb who can bust out the elemental bolt technique as a backup ranged weapon without needing to spend an action readying another weapon

[velvet raft]

Just like in my animes

[tulip folio]

I'll need to brainstorm a bit on theme as while it's very much inspired by Stage Magicians and Wizard Classic, I should work out a solid 'what makes this a true martial art' theme. XD

[velvet raft]

It’s DBZ

It’s stage magicians and wizard classic doing DBZ

[tulip folio]

Relentless Torrent of Power
Martial Arts 5, Essence 2
3-4 Motes
Supplemental
Some Prereqs, This Isn't An Intro Charm

You get the benefits of aiming on an attack against a guy, as long as you attacked him with an aimed attack in your last turn. So it won't let you start attacking with aimed shots, it lets you maintain the benefit over turns as long as you never spend a turn not attacking him.

...considering it was something I was griping about, I might make 'You ignore the damage capping effects of legendary size' part of it's Form Charm. I'ts a very good monster-buster to just blast the shit out of him with a torrent of energy.

Maybe creating an area of environmental hazard.

[tulip folio]

Smoke and Mirrors
Cost: 3m; Mins: Essence 1
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Perilous, Terrestrial
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: None
A cornerstone of Mirror Flower Style is that beauty is not something that can be held in one's hands. Embodying this philosophy, they slip that beauty away from oncoming blades easily.

The Martial Artist, or an ally she has targeted with Defend Other, dissolves into a flurry of energy, adding +1 Defence against an attack. They then reform at some other point of the Martial Artist's choice within Short Range.

Terrestrial: This counts as that character's movement for the round.

Less good for protecting allies than Fluttering Cry of Warning, less good at protecting oneself than Serpentine Evasion but it can do both and it allows movement while doing so.

[fierce star]

oooh

I like it

[tulip folio]

Ended up going with 'Mirror Flower Style' based on a chinese phrase that translates to 'Mirror Flower, Water Moon'.

For things that seem tangible but you can never touch. Dreams, Objects In Mirrors etc

Which seemed fitting for a style based around Energy.

[bleak hazel]

I'm sorry, Exalts do not dissolve into intangible masses of pure energy at essence 1

also incredibly strong and cheap flurry breaker - given +1 parry is 2 motes, this is 1 mote for an improved Leaping Dodge that I can put on a deeb and doesn't need to block the attack first

[tulip folio]

The intent was they only move if the defence is successful (But the wording was poor there) but...hmm...back to pondering.

[bleak hazel]

the style based around Essence in general with a sideline in beauty exists already, it's Prismatic Arrangement of Creation

personally I would go for something more tightly focused on slinging fireballs of various kinds

[tulip folio]

...

I mean, that's not really something that feels like a martial art imo.

Like obviously that's part of the focus but martial arts tend to have some philosophy and some amount of 'general function'.

[bleak hazel]

sure, but "martial arts based around literal interpretations of broad, abstract principles" is the brief for Sidereal Martial Arts, not X-bending

to the point there already is an SMA for "essence" and an SMA for "dreams"

I would say a dedicated blaster casting tree needs to be about the blasting, even if it does that in various ways (to get your defence charms and so on)

[tulip folio]

Okay. I guess I'm getting a New Name, New Thematic Theme and New Mechanical Theme for hthis martial art :S

...I'm also not sure why you think this is a Dream-Focused Martial Art...it's not about dreams, it's about 'things that seem tangible but are not' because it's a Stage Magician martial art.

[bleak hazel]

I think there's absolutely a slot for a martial art that works with all the various Divine [Exalt] Death Blast moves because everyone's got one and even Deeb lore doesn't go for tons of bending moves

also you did say dreams like ten seconds ago

[tulip folio]

...when explaining a chinese phrase that inspired the name.

[bleak hazel]

if it's stage magic, give it stage magic tricks, not turning into energy balls

[tulip folio]

...I mean, things vanishing and reappearing elsewhere is stage magic. That's one of the most classic tricks about.

[bleak hazel]

partly this is a vibes thing that just grates with me, but that really feels more like "I am a billionth level wizard and can spam Teleport"

[tulip folio]

...I'm not sure I can do stage magic without 'Smoke and Mirrors' as part of the theme. Making things change location unexpectedly is a cornerstone of stage magic...I might just go back to the drawing board and try to work out a new theme from the start.

[bleak hazel]

at the very least it should be "aha, I was secretly over here the whole time, I'm playing around with your perception of distance" and not "turn into glowing white light, zip over there, reform"

[tulip folio]

I mean, that's not really playing with the 'This has the Energy Manipulation Charms as Form Weapons' side...but fine, I'll come back when I've got a new theme.

[bleak hazel]

we do have buttons for turning into pure lightning or molten glass, and they're both Celestial Circle Sorcery

so maybe at the very top of the style where the weird stuff goes, like Gazellecarp

I feel that the first couple of layers being about punching (or in this case fireballing) people is pretty core to how martial arts work

[tulip folio]

Look, is the other defensive charm idea horrible too?

Reflexive Clash that works on Spells and Energy-Based Attacks. Can use form weapons that require a simple action reflexively for this clash.

[bleak hazel]

no, that's great

beam war very fun, and doesn't really exist yet

I love the idea of Divine Skeleton Death Blast style

[velvet raft]

Suggestion: a lot of MAs are focused around imitating the movements of a specific type of being. What about a martial art focused on imitating the movements of an energy blast?

[fierce star]

I feel like more overtly supernatual bullshit is fine for specific martial arts given the existance of thousand blades lettng you start with 'I am Gilgamesh Fate/PickOne' at ess1MA1

[dense verge]

i think if stage magic is a theme, then less literal teleport and "i hop a range band through some clever shifting of focus" would fit the theme more as flavor

[tulip folio]

My thoughts on the form right now is:

-Layers of crackling energy grant you an additional -0 health level. This is filled by damage before any of her other −0 levels, and vanishes once filled. This health level is automatically regained at the start of each of her turns.
-You ignore Legendary Size's damage capping and can hit Dematerialized targets.
-Your form weapons gain +2 Non-Charm Dice on Clashes (Doesn't stack with dual wielding or two handed) and can be used for reflexive actions, even if they would normally take a simple action to use.

[bleak hazel]

That's still fundamentally based on hitting people with swords in various different ways, I think the first couple of levels of the fireball style should be more "doing [thing]-bending" than "my physical form is irrelevant, I turn into a gust of wind" - even the Dragon Styles can't do that, and they're rightfully top dogs of elemental kung fu

[bleak hazel]

yeah, this all seems extremely reasonable, although the regenerating shield might mean this has to be an expensive form (see: Halting the Scarlet Flow, which is a slightly worse way to get 1HL per turn and is still capped at Stamina turns of regen)

[tulip folio]

...doesn't halting heal Real Damage?

[bleak hazel]

it does, but it isn't ablative

let me find the solar Extra Health charm to compare

aha, [Stamina] levels at once for 6 motes

[prisma sun]

There's a martial art where you can kill people by yelling, one where your blade becomes sentient, and one where you can fly by surfing your cool swords

[bleak hazel]

Single Point is just Swording Real Fast

your sword is not actually an independent entity in anything but the rules text, unlike that one artifact

[velvet raft]

The difference is that convention MAs are all “move in cool way”, whereas SMAs are “move like [abstract concept]”

[bleak hazel]

my favourite style in terms of steadily ramping esoterism is Dreaming Pearl, which is overtly supernatural (robes of 10 hardness magic) to start but still recognisable as hand to hand combat, before eventually it starts making you too pretty to hurt and then at E3 it lets you go "aha, screw you, I am a deer spirit fish now"

[prisma sun]

I mean conventional MAs are all inherently supernatural

they require Essence

[bleak hazel]

if it gave you gazellecarp at essence 1 as a basic evasion charm it would lose a lot of the juice

[velvet raft]

MAs do all kinds of weird cool supernatural stuff but they are fundamentally still things that sort of make sense for a body to do

SMAs let you punch the character in a movie you’re watching, otoh

Citrine Poxes of Contagion is like an animal or elemental style except you’re imitating Sickness

Not “being sick” not “sick people”

Not any particular sickness

Just the abstract concept of illness

[bleak hazel]

elemental martial arts style starting at E1 has strong precedent in the dragon styles, which throw rocks around and give you blazing fists of fire but are still very recognisably punching people or doing basic blasty stuff until you get to really high up in Wood Dragon

[prisma sun]

I still think having a martial art that's dedicated to swindling is fine

[velvet raft]

Oh for sure

[prisma sun]

But like, even the regular martial arts have stuff like "I can make you believe that you started this fight"

[velvet raft]

But Misc’s contention was that literally dematerializing was too much for an Essence 1 charm

[prisma sun]

oh

Then yeah

That's a bit much at E1

[bleak hazel]

essence 3 sorcery can and does do stuff like that, because sorcery is definitionally Big, Loud And Weird

[tulip folio]

Yeah, I should have made that E2 like the inspiration. XD

[velvet raft]

Thinking about it, of the SMAs we have seen styles that imitate:

• sickness
• pattern spiders
• board game strategy
• your own reflection in a broken mirror
• the underlying structure of all creation
• dreams
• the breakdown of the reasoning mind in the face of the sheer absurd immensity of reality

[bleak hazel]

I would say that turning yourself into strange non-physical constructs has already been well established at E3 by the various sorceries (including the alch lightning form one), Flickering Moonsilver Approach from entry level SMA, gazellecarp, etc.

[tulip folio]

I feel like it would need a lot more oomph to end up the Capstone Charm.

[bleak hazel]

yeah, I would simply fluff the basic defensive charm as Not That

[velvet raft]

Give it a lot more oomph, then XD

[bleak hazel]

even solar dodge, the solar tree that I would say comes closest to "fuck off, sun man, get some more levels before you start doing that stuff", only starts going wibbly at E2

[velvet raft]

Honestly, “I become indistinguishable from my own constant misdirections and illusions“ sounds like a rad capstone charm

[prisma sun]

Listen

[bleak hazel]

(Seven Shadows is Perfect Dodge but is unclear about the methods so fine, Flow Like Blood lets you go wibbly and let a sword pass straight through you, which I feel is outside E2 solar remit slightly because that's the Lunar trick)

[prisma sun]

just make the capstone some Now You See Me bullshit

[bleak hazel]

I've always liked how the one that replicates the flow of magic throughout the fabric of the entire world is the entry-level one for baby sids, because at least you can go look at a manse

[prisma sun]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKfdls1fqJE

base an entire martial art off this

[bleak hazel]

Scarlet Patterned Battlefield is the one that I think is consistently least drippy apart from the last few charms, though

[velvet raft]

The critical thing isn’t even that SMAs have to be stronger per se, normal martial arts have Mastery after all. It’s that when Sids do martial arts they take the core premise — adopt the movements of some other thing — to some really strange places

[bleak hazel]

tends to be very boring mechanically until you get to Empress Lives For All and such

well, they are stronger, but it's more that they start out at Mastery tier and climb from there

[velvet raft]

Righteous Devil is about being a Righteous Devil

That’s pretty straightforward

[dense verge]

red SMA was the driest of the SMAs in the essence supplement from what ive seen

[bleak hazel]

yeah, they cut the only good charms at the end

[velvet raft]

Righteous Devils can do cool things

[dense verge]

oh laughing monster can snatch an intimacy out of a person and make it into a funny little imp, thats a weird MA

iirc

[bleak hazel]

I don't know how Essence works, maybe Double 8s To Punch is actually some kind of massive effect that justifies its boringness with sheer power

but it is still boring

[velvet raft]

But they can’t force someone to trade in all forms of language for artistic genius

[bleak hazel]

also a really good example of the scaling here, because the first half is dodging in an annoying manner that makes your opponents get in each others ways and so on, things you could easily visualise someone doing in an action movie with a bit of suspension of disbelief but no outright magic

[tulip folio]

I redid first pulse to have you act like a brick from E1. Just mostly in 'Bricks Break Bones' ways 😛

[bleak hazel]

and then it steadily escalates to Imp Mode

[velvet raft]

Proper SMA charms are increasingly difficult to understand as anything but metaphors as they scale in power

I love it tbh

[bleak hazel]

I did like the little aside in old 2e BOKL that was basically "this isn't compatible with weapons, but trust me, you don't need one"

you are beyond sowrd

[velvet raft]

Sword has stopped being relevant to the ways you fight now

[bleak hazel]

essence does this in a cute way by just giving all attacks made with that style artifact traits, casually

like, you can absolutely dismantle people with kung fu if you want but it eats zero charm space, it's not what you're here to do

[velvet raft]

Not even, “you’re stronger than sword could ever be”

Your powers are now orthogonal to sword

[bleak hazel]

yeah, that's a very good way to put it

the way Enlightenment works in 3e probably means you can be a stickler about the old traditions and use a sword with it anyway

but I am not sure it would help

[velvet raft]

In 2E the whole idea was that Sidereals can’t develop custom charms

So MAs are their way to keep growing

And SMAs symbolize them pushing that farther than anyone

[bleak hazel]

these days this is still mostly true, but you can petition the maidens for a new charm and this will usually involve a big cultivation story arc or quest so they do get new ones, but they do so as a community and much more slowly, they can't just invent a handy new trick on the fly

the flower of the perfected lotus is still how you get bigger normally

[velvet raft]

Sids have to go their own way after a certain point

[bleak hazel]

the Sid version of "wait, that's rad, I bet I can do a cool move with that" is "I bet I can turn this into a martial arts move"

[tulip folio]

Though in 3e it does encourage you to go 'no, sids could always do that' if someone wants a charm and doesn't have Paperwork Time.

[bleak hazel]

I had considered writing my Anti-Solar Charm as something that some sid put an antimemetic effect on after the Usurpation, in shame for what it had been used to do

[velvet raft]

A Solar can keep pushing their raw ability to fistfight to impossible heights, but it’s still fistfighting

[bleak hazel]

so Sids could in fact always do that, but they didn't know they could

Lunars actually do get to get kind of weird with it in ways I like, now

[tulip folio]

I know why (It would make gaining init too silly) but it's amusing how much easier it is to get Multi-Target Decisive than Multi-Target Withering. XD

[bleak hazel]

they don't get as esoteric as sidereals, but they can go "I can shapeshift into a swarm of bees" or "I can shapeshift into a ghost"

(sort of)

if Alchs could learn SMAs they'd learn Prismatic, but I think if Lunars could learn them they'd be all over Quicksilver Hand

[tulip folio]

Alchs should totally be able to learn prismatic.

Alch: "I am both a Manse and at least one of these materials already, likely more. I have a head start."

[bleak hazel]

"no, this is the style of being the concept of a manse, if you're just one individual manse it doesn't count"

new arguments for Sid and Alch robocop to have while wearing out their shoe leather on the golden flagstones

you know what we don't have yet? Five Dragon Style

the generic set of Deeb Bending Styles that got taught to people who weren't going for full immaculate initiation

I suppose it's just Deeb Melee now

[tulip folio]

I think that got folded into DB Brawl, like Solar Hero became Solar Brawl

[bleak hazel]

wait, anti-solar technique that was memetically sealed should be the capstone of not!Solar Brawl

a Sid who actually tried to formalize Generic Heroing Style in-universe

[tulip folio]

I am still sad that Dark Messiah Style (And likely Infernal Monster eventually) are just 'X brawl'. I really miss being able to learn Illustrative Overkill Technique as other exalts 😛

[bleak hazel]

I too would have an easier time building combat exalts if I could just take Void Avatar Prana

/s

[tulip folio]

...you know what we lack, as it's not returned as martial art or brawl?

Lunar Hero

As Lunars don't have a Brawl Tree, they're ability-based

[bleak hazel]

I genuinely could not tell you what was in that because 2e lunars hold zero space in my mind

it's raw stats baby

[tulip folio]

It was 'I am a berserker' and 'You can't get away from me'.

Lots of 'If you try to leave, I go with you/stop you'

[fierce star]

'I will run you down and tear you to pieces and nothing and no one in this world can stop me'

it was better for solars than lunars

[tulip folio]

it's capstone iirc made you constantly bleed health for bonuses, with the assumption that lunars would regen through it. XD

[velvet raft]

This is just RLF :P

[tulip folio]

RLF?

[velvet raft]

Relentless Lunar Fury

Wait was that a 2E thing

Look I’m very very tired

[tulip folio]

I think it was also a thing in 2e but well, Lunar Hero was an extrapolation of lunar stuff into a Real Martial Art.

[velvet raft]

I recall

If I were a lunar I would be a large angry pig

[fierce star]

I gotta work on my carrior bee lunar some more

[velvet raft]

Lunar games seem fun

Everyone pick an animal

I pick beeg peeg

[bleak hazel]

pangolin lunar

very apologetic

[fierce star]

"I'm sorry about this good chap but it really just does behoove my circle to ensure your cessation of existance, eh wot? Behoove, get it? Ah, nevermind, a bit of nighttime humor."

I dunno why but Pangolin lunars always read as british to me

[bleak hazel]

the only annoying thing there is that ruleswise that's a Pestletail, and those are a little bit cheesy, so I'd go easy on the combat suite

on the upside, combat form can be Siege Lizard, which is extremely expensive and very fun

Really Big Pangolin

[spring lynx]

i always wanted to make a polar bear lunar

[fierce star]

this is a really cool charm

[bleak hazel]

neat

honestly the text starts blurring whenever I try to read the Lunar charmset because there are So Many Attribute Charms but they have lots of cool ones

[tulip folio]

Hmm...what are some decent AOE withering charms? I know lots of decisive ones

[bleak hazel]

lunars have a withering flurry which is quite mean

although it's not strictly an AOE

Solar withering AOE is the essence 5 melee capstone, so it's working quite hard

[tulip folio]

Yeah it's remarkably rare I'm finding

[bleak hazel]

well, you can see why

[tulip folio]

Yes, hence me looking for examples of how it was made work.

As 'AOE' feels like an important fireball throwing thing. XD

And while it could be locked to only on decisive attacks, none of the energy blast charms are decisive limited and making them fun with withering too seems important

Permanent 
When you make a successful withering attack with a form weapon, gain motes equal to the number of init you gained, to a maximum of the number of motes needed to attack with the weapon (But not motes spend enhancing the attack)

Vague Pondering. So a Sid can regain at most 3 motes with unweaving because that's what unweaving costs to shoot.

You're, at best, mote neutral if you're getting a good hit every time that's neither soaked nor avoided.

And it's not counting stuff like excellencies that make the attack better.

[bleak hazel]

you're at essence 1-3, so that means full init withering nonsense is right out - there are a few ways to do a capped withering AOE, usually it's "you get full init from your highest damage roll, [essence] init from the others" but it can just be "everyone gets withered, you get no init"

[tulip folio]

My pondering was you only get init from primary target, yeah. Or even just like 'Everyone on short range of the target loses 1 init, which you don't gain'

Shock wave, not full nuke

[bleak hazel]

seems reasonable

[tulip folio]

Moon on the Water's Surface
Cost: 4m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Withering-only, Mastery
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: <Two Prereqs Here>
The simple often masks the ephemeral, much like torrents of arcane power masks clever movements and more subtle legerdemain.

This charm supplements a withering attack against a target within Close Range. If successful, the wearer makes a reflexive pickpocket roll against the target regardless of distance, gaining a number of bonus dice on the (Dexterity + Larceny) roll equal to the initiative lost by the target. 

Instead of an object, the martial artist can instead choose to steal up to (Higher of 3 or Essence) Sorcerous or Necromantic motes from the target, gaining them as her choice of Sorcerous or Necromantic motes which last until the end of the scene.

Mastery: This can supplement an attack against a target at any range.

Decided to make the Secondary Abilities for this 'We're doing some stage magic' Occult (For the magic side) and Larceney (For the stagecraft side)

[fierce star]

I'm building out a lunar that can best be described as 'hey, wouldn't it be fucked up if you had a familiar that was [x]' where x can be damn near anything

'wouldn't it be fucked upi f you ahd a familiar that was yourself?'

also 'wouldn't it be fucked up if you turned your loyal soldiers into VELOCIRAPTORS'

[dense verge]

i do love the swarm charms on lunars

[upper stratus]

swcharms

[dense verge]

do wish there were lower essence grade ones for battlegroups

[upper stratus]

schwarms?

[fierce star]

wait... wait... wait...

pestletails aren't legendary size

well this is just silly

[fierce star]

Also, random but quick history check here, since I get timelines mixed up between editions, the Immaculate Order was founded basically immediately after the solar purge in ex3 right, and was the primary faith of the shogunate still?

[dense verge]

I think the Immaculate Order was founded after the Scarlet Empress fired the Realm Defense Grid and Chejop showed up on her doorstep like "whats good we got a philosophy to make"

and that was a stapling together of earlier philosophy iirc?

im home soon so i can check the book in a bit

[fierce star]

right, the earlier version wasn't called the order

since it's the immaculate faith in lookshy and then the intou heresy from the intou shogunate

[upper stratus]

immaculate order was formally founded during the shogunate, based on pre-existing philosophies that have texts dating back to the first age

born when the Elemental Dragons incarnated to lead
the Dragon-Blooded in glorious rebellion against the
demonic Anathema, raising the Dragon-Blooded to
their rightful place as Princes of the Earth. This view
of history suffices for most lay mortals, and even for
incurious Dragon-Blooded, whose station doesn’t de-
mand the full truth. Once a monk has received suffi-
cient spiritual preparation, she learns a more nuanced
history: that the Immaculate Order was founded during
the Dragon-Blooded Shogunate, that the Immaculate
Dragons’ great deeds are allegories condensed from
dozens of historical Dragon-Blooded across various
time periods, and that the Solar and Lunar Anathema
are Exalted themselves, though doomed to insanity.``` The Realm, pg. 90 

```Though the Immaculate Texts aren’t subject to offi-
cial revision, they remain a complex, living creation.
Compiled and altered by Dragon-Blooded scholars and
Sidereals — and in rare cases, fabricated outright by the
Bronze Faction — with the aim of designing a self-sus-
taining society, the Texts have always been a mélange
The Immaculate Philosophy is largely unconcerned
with otherworldly lands beyond creation — such
knowledge is unimportant and irrelevant to most
adherents. While Dragon-Blooded have access to
education and texts that provide extensive knowl-
edge on these, most mortals in the Realm only
know the following.
Heaven: Yu-Shan is the abode of the most powerful
spirits. It isn’t an afterlife for mortals to aspire to.
Hell: Not an afterlife, but the strange land from
which demons hail. Few know the name Malfeas.
The Underworld: The inauspicious realm of
ghosts who refuse to submit to their rightful rein-
carnation, and the hungry dead. Shadowlands are
perilous places to be avoided.
The Wyld: A dangerous, chaotic land haunted by
mutants and Anathema.
of topics ranging from herding to hygiene to erotica.
Dragon-Blooded quest through First Age ruins for texts
worthy of inclusion in Immaculate canon, following ap-
propriate revisions. Linguistic drift and Creation-wide
distribution have resulted in varied translations that
further complicate the Order’s sprawling doctrine.``` The Realm, pg. 89-90

[fierce star]

👍

basically writing the backstory for an artifact, needed to figure out if an immacualte monk or sohei being around pre-contagion would be ahistorical

[bleak hazel]

....I really want to see the Big Red/Chejop Kejak workplace comedy now

[valid summit]

one of the devs described Hesiesh as an allegory about how there was once a Fire Aspect who didn't solve every problem by lighting himself on fire and charging it which really makes you think

like "consider: guys, what if you didn't"

[bleak hazel]

that was reasonably young CK and Big Red is a very large deeb so they would probably be of relatively similar power level

[bleak hazel]

this only stuck for Cathak Cainan, didn't work on any of the other guys

[dense verge]

that was only 800 years ago, chejop was still old as dirt

800 or so

[bleak hazel]

oh yeah I forgot that he was literally 5000 years old

never mind, funny Young Chejop will have to be set far earlier

[fierce star]

Soul-Plucking Maestro's Gloves (Five Jade Smashfists, Artifact ****)

Attunment: 5m. Type: Light (Acc +5, Damage +10, Defense +0, Overwhelming 3)
Tags: Bashing, Brawl, Grappling, Smashing, Worn
Hearthstone Slots: 2, one at each elbow
Era: Late Shogunate

These jade smashfists consist of overlaping plates of every color of Jade, sewn together with string made of Song by the Raksha Lady Gloriana Heartstealer, who fell in love with the dedication and sadness of the Immaculate sohei Long Journey of the Forlorn Soul during the Shogunate era, not long before the Great Contagion and Balorian Crusade. They take the form of long gloves reaching the wearer's shoulders, with short talons on the end of each finger. Exalts who are resonant with any color of jade are Resonant with the Soul-Plucking Maestro's Gloves, as are Raksha, faeblooded, and any character with a major or defining intimacy centered around lost love or sorrow towards another being.

For resonant users, these gloves may draw on elemental forces and dreamstuff to create Excellent quality tools for any use of the Perform skill, be it forming a harp from mist and dreams, a flute from a plucked reed and a few drops or water, a pole of crystal and hope, or even simply echoing words of longing and loss to accompany a dirge or hymn.

All users may treat any improvised weapon based on a tool of performance--a musical instrument, a twirling pole, a conductor's rod--as if it had the statistics and tags of this artifact, and may attack with them without paying the initiative cost.

Do these base powers feel alright for a four dot?

[bleak hazel]

enjoying the Jenna Moran commentary on Sid charms

[fierce star]

lol

[prisma sun]

"The Ten Spinnerets of Duality"
Attuning to them allows the user to waive the cost of shooting strings with Charcoal Spider style, and also allows them to pay 1-5 motes in order to create any kind of string they require, gaining a single non-charm bonus on any roll they might use it for. Strings made this way last for a scene at most before fading into ambient essence.

Would a pair of regular gloves count as smash fists? Or armor

[tulip folio]

Huh, didn't know Lunars could do the Circe thing. Do they still have that 'we can expand transformation past animals into elementals/gods etc' option?

[fierce star]

Yep!

They can even eat ghosts to get the form of the ghost's living body (when it was living)

[tulip folio]

So if you've got an elemental/demon shape, you can turn a battlegroup into elementals/demons?

[fierce star]

ah, no, since it specifies animal shape there, I think.

[prisma sun]

Ye it does

So no turning everyone into the One God you ate

[tulip folio]

Aww...boo 😛

I almost liked Lunars there for a second XD

[upper stratus]

what cost is being waived here?

[prisma sun]

The initial string shooting charm of Charcoal that I don't have the name for cuz I am at work

[upper stratus]

unseen rain of threads is a 5m scene long, you pay the motes once and then you have infnite strings for the rest of the scene

[prisma sun]

Oh I missed that bit

I thought it was 5m each time

[upper stratus]

that'd be crazy

[tulip folio]

How decent is a Lunar more focused on the 'witch' side of stuff over the 'Shapechanger' side?

[prisma sun]

You can summon zombies, eat Gods and get their cults, and make a grove where people can turn themselves into beastmen

You can do some wacky shit

[tulip folio]

Mostly pondering how to translate an old 2e character into 3e when she was kinda tied a lot to the old Infernal stuff/the infernal stuff from Essence doesn't seem like Infernals are going to line up with her.

I should find what the Lunar 'Blast with your innate energy' is, like a lot of other exalts have.

[bleak hazel]

CMOS is actually pretty mote efficient by SMA standards

only Prismatic really does it better and that's because Prismatic has about five charms based around More Juice

[fierce star]

this is I believe teh clsoest lunar equivalent to 'I blast you with Exalted Power'

[tulip folio]

Huh, they don't have any 'shoot wyld power at people'? Aww. XD

[bleak hazel]

you know how we occasionally sit around and bemoan Solars launching infinite doom flurries at people? turns out a single 2e Celestial Martial Art had a flurry breaker good enough to just end that nonsense immediately

hilariously, it's Arms of the Unconquered Sun Style

mental image of Conky holding four kid solars back with one of his hands on each of their foreheads

[fierce star]

Not that i've seen, though there is 'make a copy of you that can attack' and 'vomit up a swarm of bees at people'

[velvet raft]

The trouble is of course that in a 2E context it only typically took one successful hit

[tulip folio]

brb, stealing for other martial arts 😛

[bleak hazel]

yeah, in 2e you had your combo of ambush negator/perfect defence/flurry breaker together so that you could perfect the first swing and then either jump out or in this case just negate the rest of the flurry

[velvet raft]

This doesn't work unless you get hit, does it?

[bleak hazel]

you get hit, you can still perfect soak

[velvet raft]

Oh right Soak was step 10 or some shit

[bleak hazel]

trigger perfect soak on step 7, yeah

step 2 perfect dodge, step 7 perfect soak, use the former against stuff that had poison/duck punch/grapple/other instant doom riders on it and use the latter against anything that didn't because it was more efficient to see if the attack missed first

anyway, Day and Night Kata would be incredible in 3e, likely too strong as written

[tulip folio]

Yeah, 4m is super cheap for 'I only use this after I see someone pop a multi-attack and it auto-works'

[bleak hazel]

traditional jumping flurry breakers just get you slapped with Thunderbolt Attack Prana for double damage if they haven't used their move action yet, although that's still better than eating attacks 3 through 5 in a conventional flurry if you can jump upwards and stand on air

like a Sid

if you can't they just get double damage on punch 2 and then continue full comboing you

[tulip folio]

I had been pondering a flurry breaker where you just vanish into Nowhere until the start of your next turn would be fitting for Sids. XD

[bleak hazel]

well, they have a flurry breaker, Hungry Spider is genuinely very good

beats Leaping Dodge or Hopping Firecracker Evasion in reliability, and can dodge any close range flurry short of Automated Assault Pattern or Invincible Fury of the Dawn

(although it should, at that essence level)

it's just flurry-breaking optimised solar meleeists is asking for it and ticklong defence is very rare

[fierce star]

A Song of War and Loss
Cost: 2m, Mins: Ess 1
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Evocations: None
The bearer of the Soul-Plucking Maestro's Gloves may flurry starting or maintaing a performance with a Withering or Decisive attack at no penalty. If the attack is purely the result of a charm such as Essence Bolt Attack, the bearer may pay a 1wp surcharge to turn the duration of this charm to scene-long or until she attacks with a non-charm based attack.

Does this read okay/get the point across?

[bleak hazel]

yep

[fierce star]

excellent

Feel appropriately costed?

[bleak hazel]

depends pretty heavily on what performance nonsense you can combo this with

Solars break it (ongoing perform charm that caps all enemy dice pools at their charisma + performance) but solars break everything, that charm is just insane

[fierce star]

Well, it's being built for a deeb

so most of the performance stuff is--jesu sfuck solars

[bleak hazel]

oh you're totally fine then

go, kung fu hustle people

[fierce star]

yeah most of the performance stuff is social (not that in battle social isb ad) and/or buffs

War Song Of the Ten Thousand Dragons or whatever it's called is really nice

Battle Anthem

[bleak hazel]

let me hit you with the double double take there

[tulip folio]

iirc, that solar charm prevents you actually starting fights/can't be used if the fight has already started?

[bleak hazel]

has started, but if activated beforehand, it remains active after Join Battle has been rolled, up until the Solar is forced to stop her performance.  ```

strongest pre-fight buff in the entire game

[fierce star]

perfomrance 2 essence 1 5m

[tulip folio]

I love how most exalts have a battle anthem. Somewhere there is an Exalted Band that just makes the most Fucking Terrifying Battle Group.

[fierce star]

at least it doesn't like

work in combat lol

[tulip folio]

Oh, no

It works in combat

As long as you started it beforehand

[fierce star]

right, that's what I mean

[bleak hazel]

the best part is that your performance doesn't even need to be good

[fierce star]

so like if you get ambushed

... not tha tsolars can get ambushed easily

[bleak hazel]

combat solar can just grab this and doot while they sword

[tulip folio]

I do think it would be more reasonable if it actually worked more like the Alch Jukebox, which can be used in combat but also goes 'no, you can't do anything non-reflexive while keeping this up'.

[fierce star]

goddamn hunting horn mains

... I forgot ther ewas an entire sub-category of performance charms for solars just for sex

[tulip folio]

GM refusing to let you use them unless it's an orgy because clearly sex with one person is presence, not performance

[bleak hazel]

it doesn't specify whether that's a hard cap at Cha + Performance regardless of weapon accuracy or non-charm dice, or whether it just caps your attribute + ability scores

[tulip folio]

My bigger issue with the Solar charm is...most characters are Quick Characters. We don't know their Cha + Performance.

So I'm forced to just assume that all demons have a really good performance because it's Malfeas, if you can't make noise or dance, you're in for a bad time 😛

[fierce star]

lol

[dense verge]

thinking more on bird exigent, will probably only ever build them out if i use them for a game, but it is fun to think of increasingly stretched justifications for the exigent relating their charms/moves to an extinct species of falcon and no one can argue that the bird didn't do that, as the only remaining source is the exigent

[bleak hazel]

Bird Samsara

knife exigent gets to pull out charms themed around vague concepts of cutting, so I'm sure you can get very weird with it

[tulip folio]

I wonder what exalt type is best for 'Witch/Warlock Classic'. Solar can Do Anything and get the Highest Tier of Sorcery and Lunar has some amount of 'witch' in the charms but doesn't have a 'blast people with power' like sids/abyssals do.

[dense verge]

misc they put Sword Law in pillars

[bleak hazel]

yet another opp for Tang

literally everyone wants this guy/gal/sword's job

[tulip folio]

Sword Princess needing to defeat Tang's seven evil exes over here

[prisma sun]

Doing Drifts in Gossamer's intimacies

https://i.imgur.com/NgXiCeg.png

Oh wait adding one more Minor

Paperwork (Avoidant)

[prisma sun]

https://i.imgur.com/Hae5KX6.png

[tulip folio]

...wait, wouldn't martial arts (Charcoal Spider-Style) be a seperate ability, not a spec?

[prisma sun]

Can it not also be an Spec?

Also I did realize he can't actually

Start

with Charcoal Spider style

cuz E3

HRMM

[tulip folio]

I think you'd need something more specific than that.

As that would be like having 'melee' as your melee spec

[bleak hazel]

normally you just pick your weapon

[tulip folio]

A spec can't encompass the entire skill

[bleak hazel]

you can get into Charcoal March of Spiders Style at essence 3

but you do need to run up a different tree and either finish the MA or get Enlightened

[prisma sun]

Melee can get "Swords" and Martial Arts being "This specific one" seemed right to me

[dense verge]

spec, "unarmed" would be a valid one right

[bleak hazel]

the thing about MA is that you can mix their charms freely, so a spec in your best MA is the same as a spec in all of 'em

[dense verge]

spider-manning spec

[tulip folio]

...so when would you roll Charcoal Spider style martial arts in which the spec doesn't apply?

[prisma sun]

Well it's a moot point cuz I gotta get rid of it anyhow

[bleak hazel]

are you starting just at the very border of E3?

[tulip folio]

Like if RiRi gets her staff knocked away she can still use Golden Jannisary style but she can't use her (Staff) spec for it

[prisma sun]

Well I just did character creation normal

[dense verge]

ah so E1

[prisma sun]

Ya

[bleak hazel]

oh, yeah, then you just need to pick what your prereq tree will be if you plan to get it

I assume Thrown?

[prisma sun]

Yeppers

I did want to get Nightingale

[tulip folio]

I have too many sid ideas. I shouldn't be pondering another sid. XD

...actually, this setup would work entirely fine with one of my existing sids. Yes, she's Int 1 but Unweaving is Wits + Occult, not Int. XD

[tulip folio]

Though I am still pondering this.

[coral wraith]

It's okay to ponder the best Exalted type

[prisma sun]

I feel like you don't need a "shoot people with power" charm if you have sorcery that can do that

[tulip folio]

Sorcery can do single big hits but it's not really a reliable, ongoing strategy.

[dense verge]

i think that solar is intended to be the WIZARD-est exalt due to their sorcery-est-ness

[tulip folio]

And Lunars while they have some witch, are more about that shapechanging.

[prisma sun]

Alternative

[dense verge]

lunars feel like the kind of, swamp witch archetype in their niche

[prisma sun]

cast rock

https://i.imgur.com/zMmdnpI.png

[dense verge]

true

good old Smiling Rat, who loves necromancy and lives in the boneyard

[tulip folio]

...ironically, it almost feels like alchemicals wouldn't be a terrible option as they've got the most in-charmset support for their 'blast a fucker' charm and they've got a fair bit of 'Oh, you're doing some nasty mystical work' with their manipulation skillset having a lot of 'Oh yeah, just Break This Man's Brain Until It Leaks Out His Nose'. XD

The character I'm pondering was originally an Infernal but A) They have no rules right now. XD

[prisma sun]

I feel like it'd be a weird fantasy breaker for Lunars to have a Ki blast tbh

I get Solars and the Other Solars having it because they're all Gokus

[tulip folio]

Lunars do a lot with the Wyld and Fae. I honestly think Lunars have more call to have Wyld Shaping Technique than Solars do but it's an iconic solar charm and that isn't changing 😛

But yeah...I guess Solar could work. Hmm...

[prisma sun]

What's a good dodge specialty?

Hard to specify how you
"Move Away From A Thing"

[dense verge]

diving, dodge rolls, social situations

[prisma sun]

Dodge (Responsibilities)

[tulip folio]

'Unencumbered' if you plan to be in silk armour a lot.

[prisma sun]

Oh that's good

[tulip folio]

Might run into isses if someone Actively Messes With You but well, specs do exist to be turned off at times so that's pretty normal.

[prisma sun]

Yeah the specific vibe is that he's flowy and flighty when he dodges

[tulip folio]

Moon on the Water's Surface
Cost: 4m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Withering-only, Mastery
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: <Two Prereqs Here>
The simple often masks the ephemeral, much like torrents of arcane power masks clever movements and more subtle legerdemain.

This charm supplements a withering attack against a target within Close Range. If successful, the wearer makes a reflexive pickpocket roll against the target regardless of distance, gaining a number of bonus dice on the (Dexterity + Larceny) roll equal to the initiative lost by the target. 

Instead of an object, the martial artist can instead choose to steal up to (Higher of 3 or Essence) Sorcerous or Necromantic motes from the target on a successful pickpocket, gaining them as her choice of Sorcerous or Necromantic motes which last until the end of the scene.

Mastery: This can supplement an attack against a target at any range.

Back to tinkering with that martial art, how does this seem?

[prisma sun]

Btw

What would you classify a pair of gloves as an artifact

Smashfists? Or just like

Armor

[tulip folio]

I'd say smashfists if you plan to attack with them, yeah.

[prisma sun]

Just like
Concealable smashfists

That will have to synergize with MA...

Hmmm

[velvet raft]

Easy enough to have "they can be concealed" as their unique property or something

[tulip folio]

Well, there's already the concealed tag and you could just add them there. I'm not sure it's even worth a full unique propery, not for smashfists.

[velvet raft]

Probably not

Hm, an evocation related to revealing them might be fun

Like, commit motes to make them disappear, release to make a surprise attack where they manifest

Or some shit

[tulip folio]

Unlimited Torrent of Power
Cost: —; Mins: Martial Arts 3, Essence 1
Type: Permanent
Keywords: None
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: None
When you make a Withering Attack with a form weapon, gain 1 mote for each initiative the opponent loses. You cannot gain more motes this way than the form weapon takes to attack. This does not count charms used to enhance the attack, only the cost to use the form weapon itself. These motes are your choice of Peripheral or Personal. 

If you have Terrestrial Tier sorcery you can instead gain Sorcerous Motes, or Necromantic Motes if you have Ivory Tier necromancy. Sorcerous and Necromantic motes gained this way last until the end of the scene.

Playing about with that 'martial art for exalt-specific blasting'

Means Unweaving is Mote Neutral if you hit and the target lost 3+ init.

[tulip folio]

Shattering Phantasmagoria
Cost: 4m, 1i; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: Clash, Perilous, Withering-only, Terrestrial, Mastery
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Unlimited Torrent of Power, <Another E1 Charm>
Much like a crack in a mirror will shatter the illusion of a flower, a brilliant use of force can dissipate the ephemeral.

When the martial artist or a character she is protecting with Defend Other is targeted by an attack that is Energy-Based, Shaping or a Spell; the martial artist may reflexively clash it with a Withering attack. The martial artist gains no Initiative for this attack, though the target loses it as normal.

Terrestrial: This counts as the martial artist's combat action for the round.
Mastery: The wielder can clash hostile Energy-Based, Shaping and Spell actions that do not involve an attack roll, opposing the roll for that action. Against unrolled effects, the opposing character rolls a dice pool of the Storyteller’s choice. 

A Powerful Clash but one with a Very Specific Usecase. If it's not Energy-Based, Shaping or a Spell, you can't affect it. So the counter to this is literally just 'How about you just Fucking Stab Them'

[tulip folio]

Need another E1 martial art charm. Perhaps a defensive one? (As right now I've got an efficiency and an offensive charm)

[bleak hazel]

I love the idea of beam war, but I'm a little unsure on Clashing solar circle sorcery with withering accuracy bonuses at essence 2, given the existing general purpose spell punching device is Essence 3 SMA that clashes with a decisive pool, doesn't deal damage unless you're a Sidereal and costs a lot more.

[bleak hazel]

this, on the other hand, is great

[bleak hazel]

because I wanted to pick up World-Shaping Artistic Vision, my Sidereal has three dots in craft that I just realised I forgot to assign to any subspeciality

Craft (Cooking), go

(I have no idea what I'm ever going to do with 11 dice cooking rolls)

[tulip folio]

Yeah, I wanted something for some Mote Efficiency but I didn't want it to be too effecient/reliable as the blasting is pretty decent/it costs motes for a reason. XX

[tulip folio]

Hmm...could scrap the 'can clash non-attack effects' part. As spell shattering palm works on all spells, this would be 'Sure, you can clash solar circle sorcery but you can only clash Death Ray there, not any other spell'.

[bleak hazel]

death ray is the only solar circle spell that targets you, though

[tulip folio]

Rain of Doom also does so if you're in the targeted area (Though it's very much also the 'including the effects on other characters' bit)

[bleak hazel]

at the very least, this this is E3 and needs to be a lot more expensive, since "directly power-creeping Sidereal Martial Arts" is pretty directly out of the remit of normal styles

[tulip folio]

...at that point I think people will just go with 'clashes that work on any attack' over it.

As it's an incredibly situational clash/doesn't work on much.

[bleak hazel]

those are quite hard to get

[prisma sun]

It does also give invincible sword princess effective Immunity from Sorcery

Which is a concern

[bleak hazel]

also works on shaping, so clash Pattern Spider Touch with this

(to be fair, Invincible Sword Princess can apparently heavenly guardian defence her way through sorcerous curses that don't do any damage at all, because core book is badly worded)

[prisma sun]

Huh wha

[bleak hazel]

personally I would say this is just this move but given Uncountable Damage is not precisely defined it is also a perfectly reasonable interpretation to say that it lets you parry anything that might be bad

[tulip folio]

Invincible Sword Princess could also already Blade Rebuking Wrath any attempt to hit her with Death Ray with her Mighty Solar Boot.

I'll remove the 'can clash non-attack spells' bit but...well, this is a very narrow charm, that is unlikely to have any effect in like 80% of battles. I'd like it to not be worse than more generic 'Can clash any attack' charms.

[bleak hazel]

I feel that if you can't make the charm any narrower than "almost direct improvement on higher-essence sidereal martial arts" it might need to be something different

[prisma sun]

You could focus on it being a redirection

[bleak hazel]

have you considered removing "clashing sorcery" and instead going for "clash ranged attacks in general"?

[tulip folio]

...I mean, to be fair: Spell Shattering Palm gets its ass beat by Dragonfly Finds Mate 😛

For any spell that has an attack roll

Salamander Swallows Flame even makes the 'beating death ray' real solidly reliable with all the bonus dice

[bleak hazel]

sure, because that's a generic reflexive clash

I would suggest making one of those rather than a speciality anti-sorcery button that powercreeps the other anti-sorcery button that's way more expensive and harder to learn

[prisma sun]

If you wanted to make it different you could make it not a clash with an attack

But instead a clash with a feat of strength

And go that angle

You literally shatter the spell

[tulip folio]

...making it a generic reflexive clash would make it better than it is now. It would still work on sorcery attacks, it just wouldn't say the word sorcery

Dragonfly Finds Mate shatters Obsidian Butterflies just fine, for example.

[bleak hazel]

sure, but if it was "clash ranged attack" it would not by default let you blow up rain of doom or sleepy mist

while still letting you have awesome beam wars with enemy sorcerors because they just make ranged attacks

and that's totally within the remit of E2 martial arts because Snake Strikes The Heel exists

[velvet raft]

You could just put a clause in that says it clashes direct sorcery lasers specifically

Not all sorcery ever

[bleak hazel]

sorcerous laser beaming can be clashed by default, not necessary

at least by things capable of clashing attacks from long distances

[tulip folio]

Yeah, sorcerous laser beams can be clashed by virtue of 'being an attack'

A guy with a bow can clash them

[bleak hazel]

hell, you can clash them with some normal close range clash charms, you just don't do any damage

[tulip folio]

(Honestly, my general opinion is that Spell Shattering Palm is kinda overpriced/priced like it's the only way to clash combat magic, when it's often worse than any other clash if someone's yeeting firebirds your way.)

[prisma sun]

Okay concept

[bleak hazel]

yeah, it's very much a sidegrade for straight up beam wars but it's great if someone's rocking Mist of Eventide

[prisma sun]

Charm that lets you perform a feat of demolition on a sorcerous work

[bleak hazel]

or DOOBing the entire party

[tulip folio]

I'll make it only work on ones with Attack Rolls.

But I want to keep it relatively cheap.

So I'm not making it a generic 'any ranged attack'

[bleak hazel]

it's a clash, so it costs willpower no matter what most of the time

thems the rules

(besides SSP, which if you could normally just counterspell the incoming magic becomes motes-only)

oh, dragonfly is motes and initiative, nevermind

I am apparently not well read on deeb archery

yeah, I would pull out Shaping and non-attack Sorcery and just just go for "energy based attacks and spells" if you really want it to be that cheap with the incredible efficiency of withering dice pool

[tulip folio]

Hmmm...

This supplements a Withering Attack or Feat of Demolition. Other Characters within Close Range of the target lose 1 init, which the martial artist does not gain.

Pondering

Throwing Fireballs

AOE withering is very powerful so rather than making it an attack, making it more of a shock wave drain.

[velvet raft]

I am extremely jet-lagged so I read that as Sorcerous Twink

[prisma sun]

Lmao

[bleak hazel]

would this just be as a passive?

I like it as a steadily ticking suppession effect in big fights

[tulip folio]

I was looking at supplemental, not sure on mote cost

[bleak hazel]

fairly cheap, I'd imagine

compare Searing Edge Attack from Fire Dragon, which is usually going to be better and costs 3m

so likely 2, since it's not going to burn as many points of init on average but you also don't need to hit

if you did need to hit I'd even say 1

[tulip folio]

I think I'll go with 2 or 3 and add a small extra bonus

[prisma sun]

Could probably have the int scale with Essence tbh

I don't think that'd break anything

[bleak hazel]

then you have Searing Edge Attack but AOE, which might be a little much

but would work if it was way more expensive

not sure that's the vibe here though, I think this is more "sorcerer sitting at the back spamming lightning bolts and blasting guys off their feet" than "one giant mega bomb"

[tulip folio]

Yeah this is intended to be more of a repeated disruption

I think I'll go 2 but ally friendly

This supplements a Withering Attack or Feat of Demolition. Enemy characters within Close Range of the target lose 1 init, which the martial artist does not gain.

So you can throw into melee with friends

[tulip folio]

Do we know who's the city father of Yu Shan?

Pondering for making a Quick Character.

[prisma sun]

Don't believe so

[spring lynx]

does yu-shan have a city father

[fierce star]

legitimately I think it'd just be Wun Ja, de facto if not de jure

[tulip folio]

Fair I'll just sorta write around specific characters.

Looking at doing up a First Pulse Quick Character

[bleak hazel]

pretty sure it's Wun Ja, yeah

[tulip folio]

Hmm...I wonder what 3 stats for an architect fit Yu Shan? Appearance is likely one.

[prisma sun]

I mean would it be Wun Ja?

I feel like City Father of Yu Shan and God of All Cities are distinct enough that they'd require 2 Gods

[bleak hazel]

I think when I talked about this with ID previously we got to Int-Manip-Appearance

and yeah, there could be a different god but she is "Goddess of the Shining Metropolis", which is pretty singular

[prisma sun]

Like you'd basically be governor of Texas and the president simultaneously

[bleak hazel]

this was mostly in the context of "Wun Ja makes an exigent of herself alone, Celestial Architect of Yu-Shan"

lmao

[tulip folio]

Pondering this in the context of 'Wun Ja is one of the Potential Inventors of First Pulse in the redo, so doing up an Architect of hers as a first pulse using quick character could be fun' XD

Should check how many charms they generally give quick character exalts

[bleak hazel]

leaving this here to aid in abyssal charop

extremely efficient eclipse charm

[tulip folio]

It's such a cheap charm for what it does.

Cam sids get eclipse charms?

[bleak hazel]

in a couple of different ways, yes, but all reasonably high essence

[tulip folio]

Seems like it would be great for thier squishy asses. XD

[bleak hazel]

Aster Petal Covenant (Linguistics 5, E3) lets you bargain for them

Divine Heritage (5-dot) gets you one at chargen

Contraband Miracle Confiscation (Larceny 5, E4) lets you steal them, along with basically any other charm or power

Bound In Ivy Fetters (Occult 5, E4) gives you a war-form with 10 mutation dots and 4-5 eclipse charms that you can learn normally to use them when not transformed

Ceasing-To-Exist Approach (Stealth 5, E5) lets you turn yourself into something that appears to be a god and learn eclipse charms from your new identity before discarding it

Earth-and-Sky Bargain (Medicine 5, E5) lets you learn essence charms from a god you've merged with

• A couple of different artifacts and hearthstones

pretty sure that every single kind of exalt can get their hands on eclipse charms somehow

[bleak hazel]

does let an E5 sid max out their parry for 4 motes in Sid Melee form, which is neat

got to love def 12 before alterations

[tulip folio]

I know Alchs can install Megaman's Copy Function a charm to learn them.

[bleak hazel]

worst case scenario you grab the sidereal greater hearthstone that you can use to hold eclipse charms from other characters until you can learn them

[tulip folio]

They commit motes instead of exp by default but can grab them with exp after a bit

[bleak hazel]

this one's kind of neat

does present the extremely funny mental image of:

First and Forsaken Lion: "why won't you DIE !?"
Sidereal, in Borat voice: "My Wife!"

[prisma sun]

Hilariously

does not make your partner immune to Arcane Fate

[bleak hazel]

I think this is the only "uncapped" mote pool expander in the game, which makes sense because it's really more of a mote pool combiner

still pretty wild

[tulip folio]

Quickly who's the person with the most health levels you can marry?

Likely a third circle demon

[bleak hazel]

forget the health levels, bond to a Lunar and throw out a centimote's worth of SMAs before you even start getting tired

remember, they pay the mote costs, you don't even start glowing

(they can also be on the other side of the planet rectangle)

[tulip folio]

lunar starts glowing with no sign of anything happening
"My wife must be busy today."

[bleak hazel]

I think the "intended" use of this is "I am Linguistics 5 social sid, but we need to kill, let me marry Battles Sid and they will use all the motes"

[tulip folio]

But the optimal use is trying to find the Biggest Wife.

[bleak hazel]

conveniently, Lunars have both large mote pools and lots of health levels

plus regen charms that they can use to regenerate mid-combat

[tulip folio]

And recover very easily from crippling effects

[bleak hazel]

but yes, if you spent a lot of time socialling her to remove the large number of intimacies that suggests she would want to leave her spouse to take the hits so that they grow and become wise, you could conceivably marry snakewall and gain 55 health levels

[tulip folio]

So the lunar can occasionally just drop an arm off your save you.

[prisma sun]

Imagine just exploding into bonfire while you're asleep

[bleak hazel]

this would only require sorcerous workings to summon an unbound third circle demon and then seducing them, which I'm sure is totally safe

[prisma sun]

Sidreal about to get up to some nonsense

[bleak hazel]

you could be an exploitative bastard, summon a hueg second circle and marry them, because bound summons have a defining tie of loyalty to their summoner and that would very much fit with Venus' view of love even if I find it slightly distasteful

[tulip folio]

Venus: "I have decreed that in order to maximise appearance, a Sidereal must get in the maid outfit and wear the blindfold. It's mechanically optimal. I'm not weird."

[bleak hazel]

wait can you put infinite rings on it because you can have one partner pay the cost for the charm to add a new one

clearly this is sustainable, we just give every member of the exalted host a defining intimacy for everyone else and then the glorious exalted hive mind will rule creation

[prisma sun]

THE FIVEFOLD POLYCULE

[bleak hazel]

fivefold polycule can channel at least 3.2 kilomotes and 495 willpower through any one of their members when required, assuming 99 sids with one E5 and the rest E1

there are exalt charms to end ongoing effects that could slice the ring off your finger, Sauron style, but they'd also need to

[wise ocean]

love exalted for saying "charop is pansexual polyamory"

[bleak hazel]

Lover's Oath was apparently used for stupid hypothetical broken builds back in 2e, too, but the 3e corebook mentions that it's basically impossible for a character to sustain more than a few Defining Intimacies so you can no longer merge the world

unless you get some very good AOE social charms from somewhere

[tulip folio]

Lover Clad In Raiment of Tears: "Love is a lie and will fail you."
Polycule Sid: "Hey Dumbass, watch this."

[wise ocean]

love is in the air? correct! maiden divine death blast

[tulip folio]

Hmmm...how many charms do you think is too many for an e3ish quick character Exalt?

[bleak hazel]

Fulgent Melody has eight, Sazay Shadow-Dancer has nine

for a Sid and Lunar respectively

so, you know, somewhere in that ballpark

I don't think it matters much if you go a few over, especially if some of them are reasonably small

[tulip folio]

Fair. I'll look over the Architect ones when I get home.

For a Classy Brawler

[tulip folio]

...okay, I think I'm going to do something amusing with this, if they're an Architect of Yu Shan.

Giving them all the 'My Memory is Insane' charms and note that 'While she's not entirely unaffected, Sidereals find how often she can shed the effects of arcane fate uncanny'

As looking at this she's sitting on:

+1 Autosuccess
+4 Non-Charm Dice
Reroll 5s and 6s until they stop showing up.

On 'stuff that relates to memory', before her dice pool gets involved.

Went with Appearance, Intelligence and Wits as her 'foundation' stuff (Though she's a First Pulse practitioner so she's plenty good at physical stuff)

[dense verge]

thinking again about sid numbers and how 5% of all endings sids are enemies of heaven going by the 100 number

[upper stratus]

😭

[dense verge]

the numbers dont lie

i also had an idea for a solar that somewhat compels me, which is ex-pirate lintha that got keelhauled, beaten, and thrown into the sea for suggesting to his captain they should be somewhat less vicious

decided to turn her life around after that

[velvet raft]

And they spell disaster for Chejop at sacrifice

[upper stratus]

arada will work hard enough to make up for their betrayal

[fierce star]

I feel like Steiner Math would be like, an Infernals thing. Like I coudl see an infernal giving that rant.

[tulip folio]

...if you've got 4 arms, do you gain the +2 bonus for Dual Wielding and the +2 bonus for Two Handed Weapons on clashes?

Mirror Flower Form
Cost: 8m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Simple
Keywords: Form
Duration: One scene
Prerequisite Charms: Moon on Water's Surface, Shattering Phantasmagoria
The martial artist stirs her anima into a whirling flux, both to empower assaults and to conceal their movements, gaining the following benefits:

-Layers of crackling energy grant you an additional -0 health level. This is filled by damage before any of her other −0 levels, and vanishes once filled. This health level is automatically regained at the start of each of her turns.
-Her attacks can inflicted damage and onslaught penalties against Legendary Size or Dematerialized foes normally.
-Her form weapons gain +2 Non-Charm Dice on Clashes. This does not stack with bonuses granted from Dual Wielding or Two Handed.

Pondering the form/if it's good for helping those form weapons.

[tulip folio]

Brilliant Encore
Cost: 3m 1i; Mins: Martial Arts X, Essence X
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: XXXX
A skilled amateur can perform perfectly once. A true master of illusions can perform perfectly again and again.

A supplemented attack gains the benefit of aiming, as long as the martial artist made an attack that benefited against that target from aiming against the target during their last turn.

Pondering this. It's a free aim but it requires you have already aimed and attacked that guy in your last turn, locking you into who you're attacking/what you can do in your turns.

[prisma sun]

Hmmm

I think it's balanced but lacks flavor

[tulip folio]

Yeah, it's a bit 'Well, this is a Ranged Weapon Style, ranged weapons need aiming to function beyond short range, I guess it needs something aiming there'

[prisma sun]

Okay what if

You only get the bonus if you flurry with a distract Gambit?

That seems more Magiciany

[tulip folio]

...actually, vague pondering.

Normally, distract init is lost if the target doesn't attack immediately.

Maybe something to let the ally keep the init, even if they don't attack.

As they're manipulating the battlefield/confusing the opposition, not merely feinting.

Smoke and Mirrors
Cost: 2-3m; Mins: Martial Arts 3, Essence 1
Type: Decisive
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: None
Crackling lightning and flowing smoke leave foes off balance and allies shielded.

This supplements a Distract gambit. The martial artist reflexively makes a Defend Other that includes the ally benefiting from the Distract. That ally does not lose the initiative if they do not attack the gambit's target on their next turn.

Go with a more 'helping allies' area.

[fierce star]

Hmm. 3m feels fine?

[prisma sun]

3m seems fine for that yeah

[tulip folio]

Earth-Shattering Crack Burst
Cost: 2m; Mins: Martial Arts 3, Essence 1
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: None
The air echoes with the impact of fire and divine wrath.

This supplements an Attack or Feat of Demolition. Enemy characters within Close Range of the target lose 1 initiative, which the martial artist does not gain.

When this supplements a Feat of Demolition, the Martial Artist adds +Essence to their Strength when determining if they can perform the feat.

And based on what was discussed last night.

[bleak hazel]

that is very neat indeed

big fireball enables smashing

Since Prismatic Arrangement has Four Magical Materials Form (turn into a living artifact made of the magical materials), Games of Divinity Form (beautiful flowing motions that people cannot bear to harm) and the capstone form that lets you take three forms at once, I am pretty sure this is a valid allegorical depiction of a sidereal martial artist

https://youtu.be/c0DYBdfoJOk?si=4WFaCb5SWY3Fhvfp&t=5

[tulip folio]

Alright. Got 6 (Though one is a maybe) charms for this martial art sorted.

Got to just work out some Fun Capstone Tricks for the post-form.

[fierce star]

'now you see me' make a bunch of clones fo yourself 'now you don't' destroy all clones to turn invisible and undetectable to do an in-combat ambush

[tulip folio]

Clones would be funny but avoiding 'metagaming issues' would be difficult/it would be very wordy. XD

[fierce star]

you can steal the wording from the Lunar charms that do it, look in the Swarm tree in dexterity

[tulip folio]

Do I look like a person who Reads Lunar Charms? 😛

(Fair, I could look at things)

(Making the capstone capstone 'When you enter form, get some illusion dopplegangers' could be fun)

[tulip folio]

'When you assume form, pay +7 motes and 1 WP: Get a Cunning Anglerfish Decoy setup going'?

[fierce star]

That could work! CAD is only e1 so it's not like you're making beginning lunar tricks, like, defunct with it

[tulip folio]

Yeah, my thoughts is 'e3 martial art charm that just paid 13 motes and 1 WP can likely replicate a 5m, E1 Lunar trick. XD

[fierce star]

yeah lol

[tulip folio]

Three Card Monte
Cost: -(+5m, 1wp); Mins: Martial Arts 5, Essence 3
Type: Permanent
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: Whatever I Make The Post-Form Charms

The martial artist may pay a five-mote, one-Willpower surcharge when she uses Mirror Flower Style to spin out (Essence) illusionary dopplegangers within Close Range, complete with convincing (if non-functional) duplicates of her equipment.

These dopplegangers lacks true intelligence or agency, and can’t make actions requiring rolls, but are realistic imitations of her. They can’t move beyond medium range from the Martial Artist; doing so causes them to dissipate into nothingness.

The dopplegangers use the Martial Artist’s Evasion, Parry, and Guile. If hit by an attack, the doppleganger dissipates in a silver flash. Characters with superhuman or magically enhanced senses can roll (Perception + Awareness) against a Doppleganger's Guile to identify it as a fake. The Martial Artist can disguise her attacks as coming from any doppleganger and as such, attacking will not automatically reveal her as the real one.

@fierce star

"Behold, the ultimate form of this Exalted Martial Art" Casts Level 2 D&D Spell Mirror Image

[fierce star]

Lol

[bleak hazel]

what action is distinguishing a shadow?

[tulip folio]

I'm not 100% sure. A lot of the wording was grabbed from the Lunar charm...anyone know what action that one takes?

[bleak hazel]

not sure I like the fact they regenerate, honestly - that strikes me as extremely annoying in longer fights, especially since they automatically absorb at least one attack without granting any initiative whatsoever

[tulip folio]

Maybe. I was a bit iffy on a form charm bonus that can be entirely degraded but I could give some other passive effect even after you've run out of dopplegangers.

[bleak hazel]

if you're absorbing [Essence] attacks reliably that's way overboard for a form charm upgrade, honestly

I suppose "flurry or go home" is certainly a thing you can do but I'm not sure I like it

although Sids do have a very funny "counter" that soaks an entire turn but does neutralise the charm, assuming you're a similar essence

[tulip folio]

I mean, you can also work out the Real One and just Hit Them.

It's only soaking (Essence) hits if it takes you (Essence) attacks to hit the Right One.

[bleak hazel]

"look, Saturn, just point the bugger out to me please"

fair enough

I think the "what action is looking at the decoy" is a fairly important question but it seems way more reasonable without instantly respawning coinflip shields

"someone's split off a bunch of decoys once" has a lot of counters that take a similar amount of effort, "every round I have to flurry a detect roll or have a 50% shot at wasting my turn" less so

[dense verge]

the Sidereal receives no warning if all the options she proposes are bad ones. all options bad? a matter of perspective simply

[bleak hazel]

in this case you can conveniently go "I want to hit this guy, do I stab A, B, C or D?"

rarely is a wise choice so clearly defined

[tulip folio]

I suppose if you want to refresh the decoys, just enter a second form and go back to the first one. Easy done, 21 motes and 2 turns, that's it 😛

[bleak hazel]

now, if an Essence 2 deeb uses this charm and you choose who to stab when they approach, but then a goat lunar hides behind two of the shadows and they swap position.....

[bleak hazel]

the way Form switching works actually gets you an out on this - the cost of your first form discounts the second, so moving from an 8 mote form to a 10 mote form only requires you to commit 2 more motes, and moving back just uncommits those 2

so while I presume you'd have to pay the enhancement cost again, you don't have to throw mega juice at the forms

[tulip folio]

And you'd need to hope you somehow hit the Reflexive Enter for both forms unless you wanna eat turns

[bleak hazel]

what is the reflexive condition for this one

[tulip folio]

Damn good question. Not sure. I'm pondering 'Do a Big Distract'

[bleak hazel]

guile vs awareness is generally pretty doable, so I would expect to see a lot of flurries used for this

assuming "inspect form" is a miscellaneous action

you still get some benefit here because while they're doing that they're at -1 def and -3 to swing

[tulip folio]

I imagine so, yeah.

It's based on a lunar charm that Doesn't Say but not being able to flurry with the attack would stink

And would be just miserable and unfun

[bleak hazel]

the lunar one is I think mostly for noncombat purposes

"can't be her, she left the city yesterday"

also fun combo with Obsidian Shards, which gets you a true Second You

this is my reflection, these are the two decoys of me and these are the other two decoys of my reflection

together we form a mediocre dance troupe gimmick

[tulip folio]

'How many of you fuckers are there?'
Soul-Fire Sid with Obsidion Shards
"...yes?"

[bleak hazel]

wait, the form here is 10 motes, right

so 15 all told with the enhancement?

[tulip folio]

I think so, I'd need to doublecheck.

[bleak hazel]

soul-fire:

prismatic arrangement

I start the fight

I spook someone

I reflexively enter clone form, spitting out 5 clones as a max essence sid

going bonfire triggers the soulfire form condition, at which point I shift to Prismatic Arrangement of Creation form and combine those two + one more of my choice for 35m 3wp

doesn't get me any more shadow clones, but you have prismatic form, which means you probably just split into a colour-coded five element dance squad and became a one man wyld hunt

does this get me a better stunt on my distract gambit

[tulip folio]

Infernal: "God Damn Power Rangers."

[bleak hazel]

I would consider a henshin sequence a valid distract gambit personally

everyone knows you can't attack during the transformation sequence

there aren't actually that many forms that cost the exact 15m that you need to instantly go prismatic with that setup

[spring lynx]

...ivan ooze, as an infernal....

[bleak hazel]

rita repulsa is clearly a Survival Solar

many charms for making monsters grow

OK, now very down for Shadow Clone capstone

conveniently as an upgrade charm you can adjust power level by just sliding the cost up and down, since it's not something you can reasonably spam unless you're just being annoying and making distract gambits, in which case fair enough

[tulip folio]

Pondering how good a distract gambit I should limit it to for reflexively entering

[bleak hazel]

or if they end up getting vaporised too quickly when you test it, you could let someone spawn more by landing more distract gambits

many options here

[bleak hazel]

I swear there's at least one other martial art that does this but I can't think of it

Monkey?

yeah, monkey

little bit more annoying

[tulip folio]

nods
So doesn't need to be notably good

[bleak hazel]

don't think that works great for this because if you're sitting in the back chucking fireballs you might not have tons of init

beat target's Essence in successes? no idea, but I'm not sure it's a huge deal

does the rest of the style have any good bamboozling methods that could be used to set something up?

[tulip folio]

IT's got an E1 Distract booster so far and an E2 'Steal your shit'.

Smoke and Mirrors
Cost: 3m; Mins: Martial Arts 3, Essence 1
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Decisive
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: None
Crackling lightning and flowing smoke leave foes off balance and allies shielded.

This supplements a Distract gambit. The martial artist reflexively makes a Defend Other that includes the ally benefiting from the Distract. That ally does not lose the initiative if they do not attack the gambit's target on their next turn.

Moon on Water's Surface
Cost: 4m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Withering-only, Mastery
Duration: Instant
Prerequisites: Unlimited Torrent of Power, Smoke and Mirrors
The simple often masks the brilliant, much like torrents of arcane power masks clever movements and more subtle legerdemain.

This charm supplements a withering attack against a target within Short Range. If successful, the wearer makes a reflexive pickpocket roll against the target regardless of distance, gaining a number of bonus dice on the (Dexterity + Larceny) roll equal to the initiative lost by the target. 

Instead of an object, the martial artist can instead choose to steal up to (Higher of 3 or Essence) Sorcerous or Necromantic motes from the target on a successful pickpocket, gaining them as her choice of Sorcerous or Necromantic motes which last until the end of the scene.

Mastery: This can supplement an attack against a target at any range.

[bleak hazel]

then you can do "land a distract gambit or pickpocket roll enhanced by one of this style's charms", I think

you hit them with the kansas city shuffle and then when they look for where their belt's gone there's three of you

[tulip folio]

Three of the same guy pointing at each other "He did it."

[bleak hazel]

spidermen pointing except it's power rangers pointing

[tulip folio]

I hope Moon on Water's Surface seems okay. I'ts a bit situational but look, you often need to Steal Shit from people and it's got an extra bit of 'Steal Shit (Magic)' added. XD

[bleak hazel]

I like it, not everything has to be Hail-Shattering Practice

and "hey, I lifted six obols from that deeb we were fighting" is really fun

[tulip folio]

It originally had a cap on the sorcerous motes stolen based on how good a theft you did but then I remembered Solars Exist.

And can just go 'I autowin a pick pocket and if you think you have a chance to magically win, I still get a billion autosuccesses'

[bleak hazel]

well, you can only steal shape motes, not the important life battery stuff

[tulip folio]

Yeah, that's the intent.

2 more to do...should likely do something more for 'General Offence' and something for 'General Defence' as there's a lot of Situational Toys here. Maybe a Soak Reducer, as you just punch straight through it with mystical power.

...you know, with Beuro being an Ending thing, Sidereals should totally have a charm where if they kill the head of an organization and it just instantly ends the entire thing.

(Yes, I'm being inspired by modern news)

...do Gambits get a bonus from 'Decisive Attack Raw Damage' boosts? As they do still roll init, they just don't apply it to Health Levels.

Mostly pondering if a Decisive Attack Damage Booster would also be a 'Better at Distract Gambits' booster.

Cost: 5m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Flower Mirror Style
Unweaving her foes from reality or levelling fire stolen from the gods, the martial artist's sheer power cannot be denied. 

When used with a withering attack, the Martial Artist adds (Occult) to her raw damage. Alternatively, on a distract gambit or a decisive attack against an enemy with lower Initiative, it adds (Occult/2) the martial artist’s to the initiative dice rolled.

In either case, she gains Double 10s on Damage or Initiative Rolls for the affected attack.

Not 100% sure on price. It's basicly 'spending a 5 mote excellency' for damage, with the bonus of double 10s for being E2 and being in the back half of a martial arts tree.

[bleak hazel]

They did!

[tulip folio]

Oh, I somehow missed that charm. What's the name?

[bleak hazel]

http://ninjasensei.wikidot.com/charms:the-empress-lives-for-all

Old SMA

[tulip folio]

Ah, I see

[bleak hazel]

admittedly only works in fite, so I could see a variant that was explicitly "I stabbed the guild factor, his empire crumbles"

[tulip folio]

Yeah, I was thinking less 'They die' and more 'the organization dies'

Rather than each person in it

[bleak hazel]

It does knock out everyone subordinate to your target within a minimum of thirty miles, but that would require a lot of boring cleanup

[tulip folio]

So if you go and kill Faffle, the Legion Sanguinery might dissolve into local warlords or pass onto lethe or whatever the ghosts in it would otherwise do. XD

But either way, the org he was leader of is no more.

if that makes sense?

[bleak hazel]

Yeah, that seems like a suitable Sid move

There's no bureaucracy system, so you can kind of bootleg it with a big prophecy if you have to and get a similar effect, but that's a lot more time consuming and tends to have less automatic scope

[tulip folio]

Judicial Dissolution
Cost: 6m, 1wp; Mins: Bureaucracy 5, Essence 3
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Corruption Elimination Agenda, Paralyzed Committee Infliction

Upon Incapacitating the head of an organization, the Sidereal inflicts the fated death penalty upon the group itself. Over the next several days and weeks, members drift apart and offices close until there is nothing but empty buildings standing like gravestones. To all outside observers, this is a normal event as internal tensions come to a boil or the shocking news of the head's defeat shakes the group to its core.

Those within the organization with Essence equal to or higher than the Sidereal can spend 1 willpower to realize that something supernatural has occured. If they are a leader of a subdivision, army or team they can also attempt to make a ((Charisma or Strength) + Bureaucracy) check at a difficulty equal to the Sidereal's Bureaucracy to maintain the structure of their own subsection, cut off from the rest of what was part of the organisation.

Attempts to recreate the Organization increase their TN by the Sidereal's (Essence), though this penalty decreases by 1 each Calibration.

Organizations that have power that flows from one other than the known head are particularly vulnerable to this charm, as a mortal chief who is nothing but a puppet for his Solar advisor falling before heavenly blades can shatter his village despite his advisor's best efforts.

@bleak hazel

[tulip folio]

Working out 'price for charm that works purely in-combat but has purely non-combat effects' has be going 'eh, I'll ballpark it'

[tulip folio]

Dazzling Jubilant Ignition
Cost: 5m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Flower Mirror Style
Unweaving her foes from reality or levelling fire stolen from the gods, the martial artist's sheer power cannot be denied. 

When used with a withering attack, the Martial Artist adds (Occult) to her raw damage. Alternatively, on a distract gambit or a decisive attack against an enemy with lower Initiative, it adds (Occult/2) the martial artist’s to the initiative dice rolled.

In either case, she gains Double 10s on Damage or Initiative Rolls for the affected attack.

[bleak hazel]

This feels like Essence 4-5, and the TN increase doesn't quite parse because the worst TN increase you can get is TN+2 for target number 9, TN+4 would literally be impossible. Could probably just be +1, as is normal for prophecies.

Might still be a little strong, and heavily encourages the memetic Sidereal death squad, but it's hard to benchmark without an actual bureau system

[fierce star]

Hmm. Solars can spend 1m per success to add up to [str] successes to a Decisive attack with melee charms. For an evocation for an artifact being designed for a DB, would 2m per dice of damage to a decisive attack, to a cap of (perfrmance or essence, lower if you don't have na active performance, higher if you do) be about right?

[upper stratus]

you don't have to hold back on evocation design based on what the intended wielder is, evocations that are stronger than native charms are a key way for them to punch above their weight class and also why deebs pay extra xp for them

[bleak hazel]

so there is a basic DB damage adder, as there is for all splats, compare to that and maybe up very slightly

[fierce star]

... huh, I never noticed DBs were 12 per evocation instead of the 10 for everyone else.

... shit, even terrestrial-tier exigents are 10 per evocation, not 12

DBs: the worst at artifacts, I guess, lol

the basic DB damage adder is, for decisive attacks, doubling (STR) 10s

for 3m1wp

[bleak hazel]

also, Fire and Stones does not add damage successes, it adds damage dice

[fierce star]

It transfers dice from rolled to auto-successes on decisive, which is different, admitteldy, than just adding auto-sux

or, wait

it adds from attack rolls

[bleak hazel]

yeah, attack roll success -> raw damage, which means damage dice

[fierce star]

ah

right

I should probably caffienate and/or double check rules before writing homebrew, shouldn't I

[bleak hazel]

in the same way that "+5 raw withering damage" is the weakest kind of withering adder because it's subjected to soak and then rolled

(but tends to be cheap, so you can really pour it on)

[fierce star]

A Song of Winter and Woe
Cost: 2m per die, Mins: Ess 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Decisive
Duration: Instant
Prerequisitive Evocations: A Song of War and Loss
The wielder of this artifact may use this Evocation to supplement a Decisive attack used with a charm-based attack (such as Essence Bolt Attack or an attack with a charm-created weapon such as Glorious Solar Saber). They may add up to [Lower of Performance or Essence] raw damage to the attack for 3m per die. If they have an active performance, they may add the [higher of Performance or Essence] raw damage instead, paying 2m per die.

is what I have so far

[bleak hazel]

expensive for a supplementary, almost certainly fine

+5 raw damage is a lot, but you're also paying ten entire goddamn motes

and you're a deeb so you can't just blow a billion essence whenever you want and get it all back with Essence-Gathering Temper

[fierce star]

I could add a ribbon effect to it if it needs it? something something 'if you spend at least 6m on this charm your opponent is also deafened [for some duration]'?

[bleak hazel]

yeah, that works

also hot damn, Lunars

that's some damage adder

[fierce star]

Lunars have always had excellent ways to boost damage and shitty ways to boost accuracy (compared to solars)

[upper stratus]

god it also just works on every type of attack. melee, brawl, archery. who give a shit. go my lunar

[bleak hazel]

Sids have two, actually - one adds up to 1/2 perception dice of postsoak withering or decisive, so it's a just a smaller Fire and Stones but also has a secondary function as a broad-spectrum attack penalty negator, the other adds aim dice to damage for 2 motes, which is more efficient than the others as long as you're aiming already

and you should be because Sid Melee has reflexive aim at essence 2, which basically means you get double the excellency, fuck you dice cap

[fierce star]

lol

[bleak hazel]

Sids are actually ludicrously accurate, they can reasonably clash into Solars and put them on the floor

they just don't have the defence and generally have a slightly smaller mote pool

[fierce star]

If you spend at least 6m on this evocation, your target is also Deafened (if you have an audible performance active), Blinded (if you have a visual performance) or both (if you have both ongoing) until the end of their next turn, but are still considered under the effects of your performance 

Since DBs have a 'blind on parry or winning a clash' charm early on for 1m1i

[bleak hazel]

seems reasonable

the fun thing about Sid clash builds, which are your go-to for melee combat against superior opponents, is that you are extremely dangerous but can't match Solar parry nonsense or Lunar durability so you end up going with this instead

feels great when it works

[fierce star]

god

that reminds me that a guy I knew once pitched to me a disco elysian fanfic where Harry was a solar and Kim his lunar mate and i just could not see Harry as a solar in any sense or meaning. (Or Kim as a lunar, though that makes slightly more sense to me)

[bleak hazel]

harry strikes me as an Infernal

he gets back up from abject failure and misery with new voices in his head which are all bits of him

Kim would make a good Sid actually

[fierce star]

yeah, that's my thoughts on the matter

Harry's an Infernal, Kim's a sidereal

honestly if anyone in DE was a solar it'd be Measurehead

[bleak hazel]

Kim does textbook Sid stuff, he stands there bouncing all your chaotic nonsense and occasionally just gently tapping Harry back into the correct lane until they reach the climax

(re: clashes, Deebs also love them against Celestials - they can't buff them to quite the same extent, but even a Solaroid can't risk not throwing double digit mote counts to go all-out on a clash so it lets you drain your opponents far faster than if you had to try to hack through their boosted parry with your smaller dice pools)

[fierce star]

I do really like the DB reflexive clash performance charm

[bleak hazel]

I haven't seen that one

[bleak hazel]

Sids have a more expensive reflexive clash than Solars but they can use it to defend their friends, which means you can actually do the Kim thing

oh that's very cute

also only E2

[fierce star]

yeah

DB perform in general has some fun, nice stuff in it

'This is not a murder, it's just street art!'

[upper stratus]

this is how it feels when a fighting game stage has background characters cheering you on while you're fighting a character who is the manifestation of all sin or some other lore tomfoolery

[fierce star]

A Song of Endings and Beginnings
Cost: 15m 2wp. Mins: Ess 4
Type: Simple
Keywords: Dual
Duration: One Performance
Prerequisite Evocations: The Ess 3 Evocation
The wielder begins or adds to an existing performance; reshaping reality according to the story they are attempting to tell with their performance. The Exalt is center stage; everythin else revolves around them. They control the appearance of all terrain out to Long range, and can create environmental hazards that deal up to [Essence]L damage as a flurryable action during their turn. They may reflexively create light cover for allies whenever an ally is attacked. The user themselves may only attack with charm-based attacks such as Essence Bolt Attack or an attack with a Glorious Solar Saber, but these attacks are always made with a free full excellency while the performance persists.
At the end of their performance, the Exalt may pay a 5 silver XP surcharge to make the environment they created permanent, including the cover and hazards. Otherwise, it fades back into mundane reality over the next several minutes. Additionally, the Exalt suffers 3 levels of unpreventabled Aggravated damage from the backlash of this effect.

I guess 'unsoakable' is the word I want instead of 'unpreventable' but I don't want flat ignore damage effects to stop it either

[bleak hazel]

so you can't flurry Simple charms, which means you can't add this to an existing performance because said performance would end while you cast it

might need a clause for that

"free full excellency on every single attack" is completely nuts, even for an Essence 4 charm

some of the best scenelong charms in the entire game are Divine Executioner's Stance and Ways of Exaltation, and those get you 4 dice for 1 mote and 3 dice for no motes respectively

you need to provide a difficulty for the environmental hazards - I would suggest not going above 4 or 5, since bonfires are already perfectly mean enough and those deal 4 damage at diff 5

[fierce star]

All legit points, expect a second version when I'm back at my computer

(this started as wyld shaping technique but not permanent but then I reread the rules for it and went nevermind)

[upper stratus]

i think you need to shore up the terminology on 'charm-based attacks' a litlte cause there's also like for example normal melee attacks that are a simple action, which makes the entire action based on a charm too

[fierce star]

That's fair

the intent is attacks made purely from like, a charm source, as it were. Conjuring blasts of elemental power, or a weapon of golden light, or--hmm, I guess mutations granted by charms is within that description, too...

I guess I could make it a tag and then go explicitly list the currently avaliable charms

like, that fit what I want out of it

I could just only limit it to EBA

since this is designed for a DB PC

[bleak hazel]

yeah that's much easier

[fierce star]

but my brain always goes 'but you should futureproof it. What if your homebrew becomes third party? What if you want to reuse it for another splat?'

[bleak hazel]

I would honestly remove the "permanent terrain features" thing because now you can permanently stick bonfires all over the place

[fierce star]

yeah i'm thinking back over it and i'm probably gonna do a complete rewrite of teh charm

[bleak hazel]

or things that basically have the stats of bonfires

if I had Pillars of Creation I'd cross reference the capstone of Border of Kaledoscopic Logic, which is a very similar kind of Reality Marble charm but obviously way more juiced

[fierce star]

I like the idea but it's rolling out as too fiddly, I think.

nods

I do not have PoC unfortunately. It's only out to backers right now, right?

[bleak hazel]

yeah

[fierce star]

My other vague thought for effect for what I want is to basically turn yourself into a fountain of elemental blasts performance-based BS. Could make it like... a scene long go crazy charm with that with a crash out at the end. I'm always fond of player characters with super modes that damn near kill them.

... one agg health level per turn maintained...?

anyway, things to consider

[bleak hazel]

pondering a Sid or Lunar who wants to be the Best Sorceror in the World, and as such really wants to get that delicious solar circle goodness

really this is more Lunar territory, but I like the idea of wizened old sifu with the pocket Death Ray

this is probably not possible without a really nice N/A rated artifact, because Raksi hasn't bootstrapped herself up there with Solar Workings over the last millenium

[coral wraith]

That's part of my Sid's ambition, at least somewhat

All knowledge is sacred and good, so Solars, please pass the juice along thank you

[upper stratus]

gold faction but only to marginally improve your odds of stealing mnemon's hat

[bleak hazel]

Second Circle Necromancy is definitely doable, you can grab the shady equivalent of mnemon's hat. Solar Circle probably needs some more work

[coral wraith]

it gets it

[bleak hazel]

I'm not sure the hat gives you "+1 circle", I think it might just get terrestrial sorcs to celestial

[upper stratus]

it's gonna make a good basis for figuring out the next step up

[coral wraith]

How many dots is her funny hat

[bleak hazel]

N/A

there is one known artifact that does just give you +1 circle, which is the Mantle of Brigid

it's a big red cloak formerly worn by a certain empress of all reality

[wise ocean]

So in other words, beat Mnemnon and ascend the Scarlet Throne and you too can cast solar sorcery as a sid

[bleak hazel]

Sids can cast Celestial Sorcery at baseline, so robbing Big Red's magic wardrobe will do it

[wise ocean]

I figure Small Red has a slight claim on her mom's walk-in closet as it stands, so it might take some involvement anyway

[tulip folio]

Oh, no. That's supposed to increase the number of successes, not the TN. I just got my terminology mixed up.

Judicial Dissolution
Cost: 6m, 1wp; Mins: Bureaucracy 5, Essence 4
Type: Reflexive
Keywords: None
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Corruption Elimination Agenda, Paralyzed Committee Infliction

Upon Incapacitating the head of an organization, the Sidereal inflicts the fated death penalty upon the group itself. Over the next several days and weeks, members drift apart and offices close until there is nothing but empty buildings standing like gravestones. To all outside observers, this is a normal event as internal tensions come to a boil or the shocking news of the head's defeat shakes the group to its core.

Those within the organization with Essence equal to or higher than the Sidereal can spend 1 willpower to realize that something supernatural has occured. If they are a leader of a subdivision, army or team they can also attempt to make a ((Charisma or Strength) + Bureaucracy) check at a difficulty equal to the Sidereal's Bureaucracy to maintain the structure of their own subsection, cut off from the rest of what was part of the organisation.

Attempts to recreate the Organization increase their Difficulty by the Sidereal's (Essence), though this penalty decreases by 1 each Calibration.

Organizations that have power that flows from one other than the known head are particularly vulnerable to this charm, as a mortal chief who is nothing but a puppet for his Solar advisor falling before heavenly blades can shatter his village despite his advisor's best efforts.

Fixes to Difficulty, not TN, makes E4

[coral wraith]

The writers really do not anyone but Solars to learn Solar Sorcery huh

[tulip folio]

Dazzling Jubilant Ignition
Cost: 5m; Mins: Martial Arts 4, Essence 2
Type: Supplemental
Keywords: Dual
Duration: Instant
Prerequisite Charms: Flower Mirror Style
Unweaving her foes from reality or levelling fire stolen from the gods, the martial artist's sheer power cannot be denied. 

When used with a withering attack, the Martial Artist adds (Occult) to her raw damage. Alternatively, on a distract gambit or a decisive attack against an enemy with lower Initiative, it adds (Occult/2) the martial artist’s to the initiative dice rolled.

In either case, she gains Double 10s on Damage or Initiative Rolls for the affected attack.

Back to pondering this. As it's competing with 'Just use an Excellency', which would be 1 die per mote without being 6 charms deep into a style. XD

[bleak hazel]

excellencies cannot add damage unless you are a Lunar

[tulip folio]

Or an alchemical!

[bleak hazel]

it's on the list of "things that were lost in the great fall of the bright and shining First Age" so the writers really want to drum it in that it's one of the reasons Solars are a Big Deal

of course Lunars and Sids can do max power Solar-level sorcerous workings anyway, it just takes a while and is more difficult, so it falls a bit flat when the sum total of excluded effects are the three solar spells in the core book

[tulip folio]

"The mighty Death Ray spell."
"...isn't this shit worse than just Being A Combat Character?"
"Shut Up"

[bleak hazel]

it mostly breaks when combined with Solar Arete to repeat the insanely boosted attack roll on every subsequent turn of the battle, and that can't be the standard method of using SCS because Fate-Shifting Solar Arete is stupid as hell

I think the really big thing is Bind Third Circle

[tulip folio]

Yeah, which is ironically the only one of the only spells non-solars can cast if they Mug Menmon. XD

[bleak hazel]

well, it could just be a hat with Bind Second Circle in it

[tulip folio]

But yeah, how does Dazzling Jubilant Ignition seem for a late-in-martial-art damage booster?

[fierce star]

I think it's good?

[bleak hazel]

seems perhaps slightly cheap - double 10s is a surprisingly large amount, it's +25% damage for what is effectively 2 motes, plus a Fire and Stones Strike equivalent, but it's a fairly expensive lump sum so maybe it's fine

I could see it at 6 motes but it's definitely not breaking anything too badly

[tulip folio]

Yeah, my pondering was sorta 'I think the double 10s makes it it's a hair underpriced but it's also got a lot more prereqs than things that are comparable without the double 10s'

If that remotely makes sense?

[bleak hazel]

I think I'd price it for what it is, it's replacing about two different charms in a "standard" melee tree and rolling them together into one big button to hit whenever you need to Do Big Damage