Warhammer and Such

[broken dew]

I do kinda want him in the list to support the dreads

[pastel rampart]

So, if you aren't hardcore about getting official GW models and don't mind 3D prints people have made STLs of Saturnine termies that are at or can be scaled down to normal terminator size. This assumes you have access to a 3D printer or find a store on Etsy or elsewhere, but it is an option.

[broken dew]

I'd definitely consider it

Having the chapter master as Feirros would be really fitting

Especially since he does know tech marine stuff so Feirros abilities would fit

[pastel rampart]

https://cults3d.com/en/3d-model/game/saturnine-captain

https://www.myminifactory.com/object/3d-print-mk1-terminators-204514

[broken dew]

I'd probably just go with the centurion squad thing honestly cause i do want to maintain the size if i'm being honest

And the gw sat's look really good

[pastel rampart]

Fair. An option would be the GW ones as centurions and STLs for regular termies if you want to keep a certain visual look consistent.

[broken dew]

Wanna do cataphractii relic termies and indomitus termie squads for my normal ones

The saturnine are the chapter masters most elite guards, the chapter only has 4 total

They have maybe a few Tartaros but only the Chapter Master is using tartaros

[jaunty dawn]

I think feirros has lone op near a vehicle fwiw

[broken dew]

He does yeah

Tbf the solution to including him is just

Making a head techmarine named character and proxying them over Feirros lmao

Honestly like, low-key should have a big tech boy anyway since i did make artifice part of the chapters traditions

[mental birch]

Terminator captains are on 50s though

[broken dew]

Yeah?

Terminator squads are on 40's though, same with aggresors

Captain can run termie squads and Feirros can run aggressors but sat's are on 50's which i would need a centurion squad for basically

So Abachyle would have to be a Centurion sergeant

[mental birch]

Ah

[broken dew]

He's gonna look a bit teeny on a 50mm since he's a Tartaros but that's whatever

Oh ffs centurions are 3-6 as well but with the sergeant taking up one slot

I'm just making the extra guy a standard bearer or something

[broken dew]

If i ever make this army a reality it would have to be a casual on with the proxy and legends i've got going lol

Though i mostly just want to have representation of my named characters cause that would be cool

[upper bluff]

30k Skitarii?!?!?

[tranquil ivy]

working on Company Heroes

just need one more (i already have an ancient i'm happy with)

[broken dew]

i should make a list of which normal space marine armors the Dusk Defiant field since i've done termies and dreads

[spice flicker]

Thoughts on this idea for 750 pts crusade list for SM? Going to try and aim for a mix of gravis and phobos units by the end but was going to use this as a starting spot. Ignore the name as it was just something randomly chosen as I cant come up with a good chapter name.

[rocky shale]

Doesn't really have anything to punch into a T11/12 tank

Other than just volume fire

And getting lucky on mines

Oh I guess if you get the invictors into melee they can

[spice flicker]

Well this at 750 points so hopefully nobody brings anything of that level of toughness this early. I was looking at possibly some predators, lance, or something else for heavier shooting when I reach 1000 pts and above.

[rocky shale]

Fair

Invictor melee should be fine

[spice flicker]

Thats what I was thinking for now at least

Suggestions for when I move up to 1000 pts?

[rocky shale]

Gladiator lancer for anti tank?

[spice flicker]

And the remaining 90 points?

[rocky shale]

Whatever your heart desires

Maybe something with melee?

[thin ibex]

Scout squad wouldn't hurt

But yeah melee seems good

Assault intercessors are around 90?

[spice flicker]

75 for 5

Assault intercessors with jetpack is 90

Should I stick with 160 pts for the lancer or spent 20 extra points for a repulsor?

[rocky shale]

The lancer has better anti tank

Repulsor is the big transport, right?

[rocky shale]

I'd go with these to be fast

[spice flicker]

Lancer+assault ints with jump packs it seems.

Should I stick with the vanguard/shadow shadowmark detachment and stay general sm or have my crusade army be dark angels successors so I can have access to the wrath of the rock detachment for the defense bonus to infantry and mounted (WotR doesnt care if the infantry is deathwing or not just astartes)?

[spice flicker]

Is the falchion tank worth looking into down the road in the crusade at 515 pts? It reminds me a bit of the apocalypse/mammoth tanks from the command and conquer series.

[thin ibex]

This is more of a you question at the end if the day, as far as the feel and vibe you want to go for

A big honkin tank for crusade seems fun, very expensive though

[spice flicker]

The falchion and the mammoth

[broken dew]

love looking at wiki's for cool stuff i wanna have the space marines of my chapter use and find out it's vanishingly rare and it's unlikely or impossible for my chapter to have any of it in even a half decent quantity

[west zealot]

https://old.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/1nwa5tc/statistically_backed_stereotypes_for_each_40k/

This is deeply funny

[rocky shale]

Most legends units are kinda jank

[broken dew]

Iron armor, sick as hell, old enough that it's apparently relegated to ceremonial use

errant armor, also pretty sweet and fitting for my purposes, apparently never went into proper full production and now Mark X armor is supplanting it completely so it's unlikely to ever do so

i'm just gonna say the chapter artifice tradition lets the Dusk Defiant customize their aquila suits to become like Errant armor

[pastel rampart]

"How did this chapter get so many relics" can be answered with "don't ask such things/they found it in a space hulk/they stole it and don't want to say from who/uuuuh don't worry about it."

[spice flicker]

Ah yes the blood ravens approach.

[broken dew]

we are gonna have to go to the Processional of the Damned at full chapter strength for a looting tour

i'm just gonna give some ok explanations for things and have all the cool shit because it's less fun if i don't

[pastel rampart]

Yeah. Like, a big thing about 40k lore it's that it's a backdrop and a well to draw ideas from, not something to follow strictly.

Not even GW follows the lore that closely.

[jaunty dawn]

Howling griffons have a ton of mk8 and theyre not like

Really anything special

[spice flicker]

What's good to have ride in a repulsor executioner? Bladeguard vets? Infernus marines? Assault intercessors? Trio of aggressors?

[jaunty dawn]

Its mostly just like a artefact of explaining why only one guy in your tactical squad has a gorget. Or why deathwatch look different

[broken dew]

mhm

[pastel rampart]

It's an in-universe reason for why Jess Goodwin drew that one piece of art 30+ years ago.

[broken dew]

in my case, my whole chapter basically wanna wear heavy armor so it's gonna be MKII, MKVIII and Gravis armor that's the ones they like

[jaunty dawn]

Theres also the fact that like theres a ton of retro mk10 parts in production

That are made to look like other designs of armour

[broken dew]

fair enough

[west zealot]

There was a 40k lore post about how can i justify a chapter having all terminator armor, and people liking the arugment of 'Really, really, really beats up on chaos warbands and steals their stuff"

[quaint compass]

-# Any chapter is a chaos warband until proven otherwise

[spice flicker]

How's this for when I finally get around to 2000 points in the crusade? Bladeguard in the repulsor with the judiciar, and thanks to crusade i can infiltrate the aggressors and heavy ints.

[sonic hare]

keep in mind all the points are probably gonna be different by the time you've bought, built, and painted 2000 points

[spice flicker]

I will admit this is for tabletop simulator which ie part of why I wqs also considering the falchion at one point.

[west zealot]

Ultreamines just out there practicisng ressurection, obviously a chaos chapter.

[desert jay]

Makes me want to model them by taking Chaos Termies and snipping the spikey bits off

[west zealot]

Do it. (it's also just very ufnny to imagine a thousand strong terminator chapter. Call em the Iron Goblins)

[desert jay]

Oh hey looking at the sprue and some of the spikey bits you can just skip putting on in the first place

I'm unlikely to do a SM army anytime soon tho

Oh hey found an example pic and yeah without the star on the shoulder could def pass for a loyalist, esp in different colors

And that's just skipping the hunch spikes, didn't even touch the upper collar or trim down the pauldron flanging

[broken dew]

I feel like robbing chaos marine armor is maybe not the best idea

[charred bridge]

I don't see why a loyalist space marine would rob anything from a chaos marine that isn't a Daemon weapon, chaos marines got no logistics and little infrastructure for making solid equipment like imperium does aside from the random iron warriors and hereteks, which might just more likely use you as a test subject for a new daemon infused device

[broken dew]

Termie armor would be nice but chaos corruption kinda sucks

[charred bridge]

Besides you can get holy spikes and skulls blessed by the Omnissiah compared to their heretical skulls

[broken dew]

Even my lads who are absolutely fiending for Termies at all times wouldn't risk it

[pastel rampart]

Not every chaos terminator is going to be festooned with corruption, mind. An Alpha Legion termie is probably going to look only slightly more evil than the average SM termie, assuming they don't just flat-out copy a loyalist for fun and profit.

Red Corsairs too, probably.

[stark cypress]

"You cannot have this!"

"But it's from the Grea-"

"No! It is corrupted to hell and back...It must go into the fire."

"Can't we petition the Mechanicus to do the Rite of Expulsion?"

"No. I will not owe a favor to their order."

[floral herald]

Cause their shit is older, which makes it better since the modern stuff is run down garbage

(Relatively speaking)

[vital barn]

the 40k AL in Harrowmaster have old 30k Lernaean termies, which were Cataphractii toting conversion beamers

damn good unit

[stark cypress]

Oh yeah, A 30K marine company would probably krump a 40K marine company.

Like Great Crusade shit was wild

[vital barn]

40k marines are significantly more experienced individually, I'd say they could maybe swing it

would depend heavily on the ground

[stark cypress]

So wild to the point that ultra rare shit like Volkite was common place.

[vital barn]

in open battle the 30k Marines just drop two Mastodons on then and march out in rank after rank of terminator plate

[charred bridge]

I mean older stuff was good but who's maintaining it consistently

[stark cypress]

Also true

[vital barn]

but a lot of those guys died in the Heresy and the Heresy-era new recruits sucked

[charred bridge]

Imperium stuff is already falling apart with a fairly large amount of ad mech compared to the number of hereteks

[vital barn]

in various different ways

[stark cypress]

Ya know, this talk is making me want to buy Space Marine scouts and headcanon them as a chapter heavily influenced by their Fief's guard tradition.

[charred bridge]

Chaos marines kind of mostly raid cause they don't got the infrastructure to like, make more advanced parts themselves unless they sub it with like weird warp stuff

[floral herald]

Yeah in this case the psychopathic zealotry and broadly greater level of experience might swing it

[floral herald]

Post Imperium Nihilus CSM also have a much larger industrial base

[charred bridge]

Codex Astartes despite the memes does make loyalists on average more effective fighting force

[vital barn]

I am actually looking forward to getting this AL army done because if I add an extra terminator squad I can probably break up my Saturnine gang into some obliterators and a daemon prince and get a decent 40k army out of it

also AL finally have good units

the Lernaean Terminators are done with your shit

[floral herald]

On average no, individually yeah

[broken dew]

true

[floral herald]

It’s much more efficient overall to run logistics and recruitment for 100k plus marines than to make every 1000 do it themselves

[broken dew]

but i'm sure it's vanishingly rare to find a chaos terminator that isn't corrupted at all to loot their armor

[floral herald]

But the codex is meant to prevent exactly that

[vital barn]

this should mean that the Word Bearers are logistically swole as hell, as one of the only intact Legion-scale forces with (vaguely) unified leadership

but this will almost certainly never come up

[broken dew]

the biggest loot spots i can think of would honestly be like

Istvaan III and Istvaan V

[stark cypress]

Yeah

[broken dew]

i'm sure i can find some termies and dreads and old armor

just gotta like, not disturb Rylanor

leave him to it

[charred bridge]

That's mostly specific to them and they're still growing

[stark cypress]

Ya know, how many loyalist traitor chapters are out there?

[vital barn]

both of those were looted extensively for several years starting from the day after each battle, but there may be some real dregs

[broken dew]

yeah

my guys would loot even like

[floral herald]

Black Legion and IW also have logistics trains

[broken dew]

stuff that's basically scrap

so long as there is something left working we can remake it

[floral herald]

I think they’re the big 3 for numbers

Since DG are weird

[broken dew]

we just need to not tell the Mechanicus and we're golden

[floral herald]

And most of the rest are broken or small now

[charred bridge]

Abbadon's crew is fairly well organized for chaos when it is

[vital barn]

hmm, do we think I could get away with a Saturnine daemon prince with several dragon heads, formed from the merger of a Possessed Marine with a suit of armour taken from the betrayed Salamanders

that seems suitably AL

my dragon now

might be a bit hard to cut indents for two more heads into the breastplate

[broken dew]

the Dusk Defiant make shrines for all the marines they corpse loot so it's ok

venerate all the ghosts away

[vital barn]

wait, there are big circles on each shoulderpad

easy cerberus build

[floral herald]

Oh yeah that would work

[vital barn]

heads go in there

[broken dew]

easy money

also i'm watching the first Adeptus Ridiculous ep on War of the Beast and man War of the Beast sure was something

[vital barn]

yeah, that was... not a particularly coherent series

[broken dew]

i've just been informed that all of the Imperial Fists have been completely eradicated

they sent the whole chapter out and an Ork Attack moon just killed literally all of them

RIP Imperial Fists

[charred bridge]

I watch adeptus ridiculous too, Bricky gets stuff wrong quite a bit but it's funny

[broken dew]

i'm watching it for the funny more than i am for the lore

[vital barn]

yeah, although I think the BL is a bit more splintered when Abby isn't banging the big Black Crusadin' gong and marshalling everyone in one piece

not much of the old Sons organisation left

[broken dew]

it's really fucking good to have in the background while doing stuff

[charred bridge]

My theory is still that the Beast was on its way into evolving back into a krork

[broken dew]

but yeah i am interested to know how the fists come back from getting squat-ed

[charred bridge]

And now its ghazgul

[broken dew]

since The Beast™ seems to have killed literally every single Imperial Fist

also i love the fucking Ork Moons eating bits of the planet not for resources but to make bullets out of

what if we started making ammo out of the planet, just rip out massive chunks and mount them with thrusters

[charred bridge]

I mean emps almost was killed by a warboss during that campaign

[broken dew]

also why the fuck did they name an Imperial Fist of all people "Slaughter"

[floral herald]

They bounced back

Since the Fists quietly bypass the codex in a couple of important ways

[broken dew]

i wanna know how they bounced back from total annihilation is all

[charred bridge]

The Beast is aptly named for being probably one of the strongest ork in imperium's history

[floral herald]

The imperial fists have centralized recruitment with most of their successor chapters so they can just route the recruit pipeline into yellow for a bit

They basically had to re-found the chapter

[broken dew]

oooh i see

yeah i thought it might be that

kinda fucked that they just all got axed

[floral herald]

I think they kept some successors on as officers and such while rebuilding

[vital barn]

honestly I kind of liked the fists getting whomped

it made sense that eventually something would put a thousand marines down at once

[floral herald]

Same

Their Thing is being stubborn and unyielding even when it means taking excess casualties

[broken dew]

The Beast really went

https://tenor.com/view/mrbeast-ytpmv-rap-battle-squid-game-squid-game-vs-mrbeast-gif-25491394

and blew up the whole chapter

[floral herald]

So they gotta actually take the losses or it doesn’t really count à la Dark Angels

[charred bridge]

I like SM as a concept but like the numbers seem often way too low

Like a legion taking a hive planet by themselves

[vital barn]

In the 30k novels it's very rarely just a bunch of legionnaires

there's Imperial Army regiments absolutely everywhere during all the Crusade sections

[broken dew]

one billion imperial guard

[vital barn]

same as the Black Books, outside the Exemplary Battles, and even those seem to be doing the medieval-art thing of having a bunch of implied army chumps around that aren't being looked at here

40k marines on the other hand just show up on their own way too often

[charred bridge]

Some of them didn't during the crusade

They were noted to like conquer the planet before the guard got there

[vital barn]

Legion is a good example, there's about fifty different army regiments fighting a war and the AL are just kind of hopping in and out making nuisances of themselves

[broken dew]

this is why the Raptors are based iirc

[vital barn]

same with the Space Wolves in Prospero Burns

[broken dew]

they work with the guard

[charred bridge]

Those make sense cause the guard basically conquered the planet, SM were a strike team that assisted that

[vital barn]

they're also the strike-team legions, at least mostly

[broken dew]

"Look it's the grandmaster of the assassinorum, the only more sus character in the imperium is Malcador, and he ain't around anymore" lmao

[vital barn]

the SOH spend the first two novels doing nothing but decapitation strikes, the Death Guard conquer a planet by ramming into the main hive city and murderizing everything in the upper spire, can't think of anyone who got an Exemplary Battle that wasn't of a vaguely reasonable scale

I suppose the IH and IW get full campaigns that don't mention anyone else

[charred bridge]

Unless you're the emp's, malcador is your bro

[broken dew]

the broest of bro's

[charred bridge]

Or Alpharius

More like the dad Alpharius never had

[brittle salmon]

IW being handed the worst jobs as always

[broken dew]

oh slaughter survived the imperial fists getting turned to dust

[desert jay]

Que? Isn't this an oxymoron?

Unless you mean loyalist successor chapters of traitor legions, in which case "officially zero, unofficially probably several"

For any of the GW examples, it's only ever hinted at

[broken dew]

i made my guys loyalist successors of a traitor legion cause i thought it would be the most interesting conditions to make a chapter under

[desert jay]

Ye, but if keeping with GW examples, their paperwork with the Inquisition would say "founding chapter unknown"

[broken dew]

their paperwork says they are probably Salamanders successors

or just outright says they are Salamanders successors

i was gonna go with Dorn originally but uh

they use a lot of fire and they like to do artifice as a chapter tradition

so Vulkan fit better

[desert jay]

Or yeah pick one of the other legions, both that and "unknown" are options

[floral herald]

I like the ones which are unknown but there's just like, they forgor

[desert jay]

Yeah there's plenty of "I forgor" to hide amongst

[floral herald]

There's no real reason to think its anything strange

[broken dew]

it's a very fun place to like

make a chapter in

cause they know

they gotta pretend like nothing is wrong

and they gotta really play it cool so nobody thinks to look any closer

[desert jay]

And also if you're breaking with GW examples do whatever, maybe the inquisition thinks they're just useful enough to not force the issue as long as no one is too loud about it

[broken dew]

especially cause for my guys in particular, they happen to have a lot of heresy stuff that should probably be accounted for among the Salamanders

[desert jay]

Or even a few sympathetic (radical) Inquisitors know and help them keep the the paperwork looking nice and non-traitory

[broken dew]

relic dreadnoughts and terminators mainly

"oh you have scores of Cataphractii and a contemptor who is like 7000 years old... where did you get those"

[west zealot]

Pshposh, what could possibly go wrong? why Steve hasn't eaten a serf for weeks

[stark cypress]

"One of your number eats the chapter serfs?"

"..."

"How many times?"

"...20."

"...You know what, there are worse chapters out there."

[west zealot]

(cut to Steve trying to hold onto his suit as it grows teeth and bounds after chapter serfs)

[stark cypress]

(all while tech marines try to tranq the suit)

(takes about five volleys to bring it down)

[west zealot]

Inquisitor, aware they're in a room with multiple heavily armed Marines: really, I don't see any problems here (madly signalling acolytes "let's get out of here while we can"

[stark cypress]

(And then they later send a report that is sent back with a reply of "What is new.")

[west zealot]

Most sensible Inquisitor: I don't know why I even bothered.

[west zealot]

It's extra funny when you consider stuff like the Red Scorpions (literally left an Inquisitor to die because fuck having mortals on their battle barge or sometime?) or Minotaurs.

And that's just offhand.

[untold swallow]

eheh

eheheheheh

I am not generally superstitious

but

I rolled a Perils roll as a test on Roll20 for the West Marches DW server I'm in

It was the same result that uh

killed the most recent librarian casualty

Who I've joked is someone I am here to replace

[pale narwhal]

it's cursed

[untold swallow]

thankfully it seems that rolls on perils are rare so long as I don't

Push too hard

[sour sequoia]

Played Grey Knights & Exp. Cadre Tau today, the new genestealer list is crankin

I understand why the chaos marines players with 30 possessed are like that now

Violence has filled my heart

30 metamorphs
25 power tools

[pale narwhal]

mein gott

[sour sequoia]

fucking batshit stratagem

Just palm slamming 42 strikes into their second line units since 3 * 9d6 wound rerolling flamers blasts through chaff and screens

[pale narwhal]

obscene

[sour sequoia]

Why do metamorphs have 2-damage strike attacks

[pale narwhal]

for enrichment

[sour sequoia]

Hello its One Wound Willy with a blowtorch from the supply closet. I gib deathwing knights

[pale narwhal]

diabolical (as I expect and love from GSC)

[brittle salmon]

We've come full circle back to Space Hulk

The good 'ol boys are murdering Terminators out of ship corridors this time

[floral herald]

Dang it I was gonna make that joke

[brittle salmon]

[rocky shale]

improve the attacks...
okay yeah sure thats good
AND WEAPON SKILL???

[rocky shale]

Better question, why do they even have strike/sweep profiles

[brittle salmon]

Because you need something to make the alien insurgent army stick out besides the Ford Hilux Technical

[rocky shale]

we're not so different (into MEQ), you and I...

[sour sequoia]

You have no idea how many people hear strike/sweep and go yeah yeah yeah and then it hits and just fucking evaporates most of a blightlord stack or a whole deathwing unit or today, the full paladin brick

And just lose their fucking mind

And even better, look at the box art paintjobs for acolytes and metamorphs. Tell me which one is the guy that’s going to fucking obliterate terminator bricks and which one is the button pressing action doer chaff

[rocky shale]

With that +1A, +1WS buff they basically hit like howling banshees into terminators, jesus

[sour sequoia]

Now add lethal hits and +1 to wound

Or if its not that, the acolyte iconward also for 50 points makes their feel no pain a 4+

[rocky shale]

im ignoring the exarch weapon or leaders in my calculations because jain zar also makes banshee units insane

But yeah thats spooky

[sour sequoia]

Now before we get into melee, 9d6 pistol flamers rerolling wound cuz they got out of a pickup truck

[brittle salmon]

The difference is that Jain Zar costs a lot more than GSC Chump Leader #56

[rocky shale]

Banshees still win in having fights first and massive threat range but these are very spooky dudes

[sour sequoia]

The real thing banshees have over metas is the blanket anti-infantry, innate advance and charge, the god of death that is Jain Zar

And an easy No Overwatch

[sour sequoia]

Look at what the GSC locus does

You’re gonna laugh

[rocky shale]

lmao

wild

though cant double up on metas

[sour sequoia]

Its actually not a good option cuz you can’t double attach to metas and you can’t attach him and a biophagus to power tool acolytes but. 45pts fight first is hilarious

Exactly

And tool acolytes are only ever attaching biophagus, nobody else does enough for em

Prior to dataslate a primus fucked immensely but he’s so nothing now

[rocky shale]

yeah banshees have roughly equivalent killing power but theyre also threatening you with 18" range on a 2" charge roll

[sour sequoia]

Xenocreed can get you two units advance + charge and the detach is reroll advances and charges everywhere forever but its not nearly as intense

[desert jay]

Just for lethal hits and the familiar?

[rocky shale]

8" base +2" from army rule + 6" auto advance from jain zar (or rr advance from autarch) + charge, ignore vertical movement and overwatch too lol

[sour sequoia]

Its just that I have like 5 pseudo banshees bricks that respawn

[rocky shale]

Oh yeah no its def crazy

They do have deep strike too

[sour sequoia]

Yup, that +1 to wound is a huge breakpoint. DWK on 3s, Blightlords on 4s, crack Frenzied and annihilate someone’s 500pt pet unit

[brittle salmon]

And Scouts
And FnP
And Surge Movement

[sour sequoia]

They’ll be AP3 D3 real easy but you will struggle into stuff like Blightlord Terminators who are gonna show up a ton still because Death Guard has not been hurt nearly enough

[rocky shale]

my favorite part of playing aeldari is getting to say the words "melta 6"

[sour sequoia]

So a 1/game very real shot into them and probably halving a 10-man gets you your leg up—they absolutely die to crackback but Xenocreed gets 2 more resurgence points than other detachments and thus you can rez 3 ten-man squads.

And fucking run into them again

And honestly if I need to kill 10 blightlords I’ll eat an overwatch to one of these 5 squads, then cult ambush it back. Any two of em + characters are still cheaper than that DG gunboat brick by like 150 points

[rocky shale]

TBH I'd probably play GSC if they werent such ugly bastards

[sour sequoia]

I’m gonna get your ass for that check under your bed for metamorphs

[rocky shale]

The playstyle seems fun but I cant imagine painting 200 dudes who look Like That

[brittle salmon]

That's the trick, GSC are funny exactly because they're ugly

The flashiest model in the army is a 1993 Ford Hilux

[sour sequoia]

I get a huge kick out of it because they’re all little revolutionaries with the accurate amount of gear

[rocky shale]

The vehicles are fun

[brittle salmon]

And that tickles me pink

[rocky shale]

TBF I also dont like how most nids look

[sour sequoia]

Consider The Kelermorph

[rocky shale]

the characters go hard

[sour sequoia]

Who is also easily the worst nightmare of banshees in the entire game lmfao

[rocky shale]

its the other 190 guys in the army

[sour sequoia]

6 shot Full BS overwatch that isn’t an overwatch, hitting/wounding on 2s, AP2 ignore cover, battleshocking, and then a D6 reactive move

[desert jay]

TBH I think the Ridgerunner is more Hilux than the Goliath

[sour sequoia]

We got the hilux and the ford super war

[brittle salmon]

That's what I was referring to yeah, heh

[desert jay]

Also annoyingly, the GW website lists all the broodbro-compatible Guard models when you sort by GSC

[rocky shale]

I love any and all vehicles in 40k that look like real industrial equipment

Which is why votann have been calling to me

Votann vehicles are sooooo cooooool

[sour sequoia]

At the risk of your wallet, a neophyte heavy army is a lot less mutant

[desert jay]

Come on GW no one is sticking a Banehammer in their Brood Bro army

[rocky shale]

Cool people are

[sour sequoia]

Okay you jest but before brood bros existed that was actually the thing to do

Because 90% of guard models suck ass with no orders but a baneblade does baneblade things

[desert jay]

No you get the Stormlord instead and 40 mutants pile out of it

[sour sequoia]

Stormlord can’t carry GSC 😔

[desert jay]

Shit, really?

Oh right they gave transport capacity faction tags, ugh

[sour sequoia]

We can take Taurox Primes but not any units that go in Taurox Primes

[desert jay]

Doesn't that mean it also immediately self-destructs?

[sour sequoia]

Mount Up is comically abusable with GSC statlines is the thing so I dont blame em for not letting me do this actually

And yeah, they will die on game start

Brood Bros is a really really bad detach my guess is in 11th since they added the guard but not the tyranids they’re gonna retire brood bros and just let us ally guard

That store change only hit a few weeks ago

[brittle salmon]

Going back to 9th ed rules lol

[sour sequoia]

People are legit conspiracyposting about it

[brittle salmon]

That's literally how it was in 9th ed

[rocky shale]

Isn't there a nids ally detachment now too

[brittle salmon]

you could just ally in X points of guard models

[desert jay]

Oh, technically you can take (some) guard characters and put one of those in a Taurox Prime by himself

Like a Castellan

Uh... specifically just a Castellan or a Primaris Psyker

[sour sequoia]

Yeah, peep Final Day. Real strong detach but it makes certain people really upset because its not “Nids have pet GSC”

It is Genestealers using fast/sneaky bugs as markerlights - lictors, gargoyles, both kinds of raveners are your playmakers

+1 to hit against anything within 6” of a bug, strat for reroll wound against anything in 6” of a bug

[desert jay]

I need to get off the internet

[sour sequoia]

So say we all

[desert jay]

Specifically, I did not imagine what I expect you meant when you said some people wanted "Nids have pet GSC"

Though I guess also it's past my bedtime

[sour sequoia]

LMAO

[mild glen]

Can I still count it as Orktober if I do bloodbowl orcs instead of 40k?

[pale narwhal]

Theyz orks, ain’t ey?

Theyz there ta krump, theyz green. Theyz orkz

[charred bridge]

My favorite meme theory for how Warhammer is all connected is AoS and 40k are games in the universe of Blood Bowl

Chaos God's just made AoS and 40k it's why they're all consistent

[mental birch]

https://www.newrecruit.eu/app/list/pMS7T

What do folks think

2k retaliation list

[pale narwhal]

okay, thoughts:
the HOBC on the fusion commander should be swapped for another fusion blaster.
Ion rifles are just better on pathfinders (though I respect if you want to keep the funny railrifles)
you've got a LOT of crisis suits. Might consider swapping a sunforge unit out for a ghostkeel just to keep some tankier stuff on the table
Riptides probably want smart missiles, a single plasma shot won't do all that much
other than that- lotsa crisis, two riptides, a bunch of commanders, and kroot + pathfinders to hold down the fort, two units of stealths. Solid list.

[broken dew]

my friend awakened me to the idea of a space marine having something like Megatrons Fusion Cannon so i'm giving the leader of my chapters tech marines a arm mounted weapon of some kind

[mental birch]

The hobc is more for taking advantage of the sustained 1 and mild flexibility improvement

2 sunforged is like IMO minimum anti tank

[spice flicker]

10 man jump assault intercessors or a 5 man terminator squad?

[thin ibex]

what are you going to use em for

10 man jp assault intercessors you are getting a big blob of melee aggression

terminators youre getting a block of tough ground holders

10 dudes wiith 2 wounds and 3+ save and a lot of move speed can be quite scary in a general sense

but termies are fun and cool

and its even harder to wound them easily

[spice flicker]

Trying to plan ahead for a crusade in tabletop simulator but for blocks of tough ground holders I already have a 10 man brick of heavy intercessors and a 6 man brick of bolt aggressors (also with infiltrators.) I have some phobos units (invictors and incursors) as well for support but realized I dont really have anything for deep striking and/or being an inconvenient nuisance.

I like terminators but also think jump packs are cool so cant really decide.

Or should I say screw it, its crusade so swap out the planned repulsor executioner for a land raider and take some centurions?

[thin ibex]

i think jp intercessors would be more flexible but a less tough in terms of model per unit; the extra move speed will help mitigate any deployment errors you make with deepstriking them potentially

i wouldnt over think it, if you have a plan/idea, might as well test it before making big swaps and stuff

its crusade so its a space to kinda do what you want/shine spotlights on units you like

[spice flicker]

The full size jp intercessors do seem like the better option. I had 260 pts to work with when brainstorming the progression from 1750 pts to 2000 pts and saw i had enough to do one of those with some points to spare and figured id ask to see if others had suggestions or thoughts on it. Here is actually what I had planned for up to 1750 points.

[thin ibex]

i do think experience works nicely with big blobs

[spice flicker]

Hmmm....

Outside of what I mentioned already, any suggestions for the 260 points?

[thin ibex]

could do an inceptor squad and a 5 man jp intercessor squad as a deepstrike pair

thats about 210 out of 260

not sure how to spend 50 points

[spice flicker]

Hmmm....

[sour sequoia]

If you’re running vanguard eliminators are worth their weight in gold

3 guys fairly reliably bumping off custode size threats

[grim mango]

Here's the Force Ghost of Grand Master Voldus XD

[vital barn]

Blackshields rules are out for Horus Heresy

they include an option that lets you ally Movie Marines

all this stuff translates to "Your allied detachment contains only Captain or Lieutenant equivalents, all of which are terrifying in combat. They can't join units and if they die in melee you get one objective's equivalent in VP."

so you just have a squad of lone models running around making glorious last stands, I kind of love it

currently trying to cram my Istvaan III Survivors list in so that I can have my lore-accurate 27 guys while making my seven World Eaters all Alone and Forgotten centurions

[floral herald]

Ok that’s cool

[vital barn]

the rest of the blackshield rules are also really good

tons of great fucked up armies here

https://assets.warhammer-community.com/eng_09-10_thehorusheresy_legacies_blackshields-19qd4ghgwp-azrdg7jskx.pdf

[thin ibex]

Oh black shields are space wolf lone wolves

[jaunty dawn]

Just that one kind

[vital barn]

you can scavenge some xenotech and shoot people with splinter cannons, or you can play poormarines and swap all your bolters for autoguns and heavy stubbers

[jaunty dawn]

Was dual wielding heavy stubbers in the last iteration

[vital barn]

with your usual allowance for Raptors/Fabius Bile experiments or Iron Hands going off the techheresy deep end and turning themselves into automata

[broken dew]

That's sick as hell

Omw to make my army of lone wolves and have them all die gloriously

[vital barn]

you can have an army that's just 30 badasses

but it probably works better if you have the lone wolf armada as an allied det

[broken dew]

Oh yeah for sure seems like it'd benefit from having allied units

[vital barn]

my current movie marine squad

[broken dew]

Having 30 dudes who don't work together and are basically set up to die doesn't exactly bode well for your chances of victory

[vital barn]

sarge is not actually a terminator, he's just swole as hell

WS7 W5, which is elite-praetor level

not the most attacks, but he'll throw down with any legion champion going

[broken dew]

Nice

[vital barn]

I am taking some artistic license with the weapons, they're World Eaters fighting a last stand on Istvaan III so the claw guys have two small chainaxes and the hammer boys have one big one

the chapter fiction they're from even gave them the cheesy name of "Revengers" already

[broken dew]

Nice

I'm dabbling in a army list for my dusk defiant and so far have run into the really funny idea of fielding no normal marines

I've got like 6 aggressors so far as the only non terminator/dreadnought/Centurion detachment in the theoretical list

[vital barn]

argh, 80pts over with the cheapest aesthetically pleasing version of this list

[broken dew]

Can terminator armor be artificer armor? As far as i can tell Artificer armor is just fancy/old and upgraded versions of normal power armor so i don't see why you couldn't do the same with terminator armor

[floral herald]

I think it generally already is

[vital barn]

yeah, terminator armour is already the nice stuff

and mechanically you can't beat a 2+ save so there's not really anywhere for that to go, statistically

[broken dew]

Ic ic

[vital barn]

presumably "this is masterwork termie armour" is one of the many different justifications that Captains get for that 4++

[broken dew]

Mhm

[vital barn]

between "iron halo" and "my jaw is just that chiselled"

[floral herald]

There’s some mentions of fancy ones

Calgar’s Armor of Antilochus as one

But it’s just terminator armor with trim and a teleport homer

[broken dew]

I was just thinking cause my chapter fields mostly termies for higher ranks

So they wouldn't have a lot of artificer armor around

Presumably anyway

They probably have a lot of otherwise customized and minorly improved power armour but Artificer armor as i understand is on a different level

[thin ibex]

I wonder if changing from d6 to d8 or d10 would be overall good for describing differences stats and rolls for 40k

[rocky shale]

Yes but it's also harder to buy 50 d8s

[vital barn]

ah, they didn't actually put any limits on 30k allied detachment numbers, so now people can take as many allied detachments of Alone and Forgotten blackshields as they want, to give every single model the 1/detachment prime HQ bonus and letting you spam hyper-elite snipers/moritats/duelists

that is a little silly

they should really make allied dets 1/faction

but otherwise I'm loving this

also it turns out you can give all the Alone And Forgotten guys jump packs, so I should probably actually do that if I want this to be a serious list

[pastel rampart]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/596197650332778498/1425920667433304286/IMG_2299.jpg?ex=68e9579b&is=68e8061b&hm=a313329530c638cfd4fc717bb89fa56daf9d95a2cf99fae09f88e4c11805267a&

[upper canopy]

He didnt even get a knight and hes hype

[pastel rampart]

https://www.patreon.com/posts/140813197

[spice flicker]

Immolation flamers or twin multi-meltas on SoB immolators?

[rocky shale]

In agents? Almost always meltas

[soft willow]

In Knights almost always flamers.

[spice flicker]

Alright then in that case how does this look for 2000 pts agents crusade?

[rocky shale]

A 10-brick of deathwatch is better for giving strats to

And they really want the big 2cp strat to kill tanks

That is also a ton of immolators

[spice flicker]

I want to be able to deal with armor, thats why I habe so many immolators though I might change that. This is still a wip brainstorming exercise.

Might swap 2 immolators into turning the deathwatch into 10 man bricks

[rocky shale]

Hammers are better at killing tanks that immolators IMO

[spice flicker]

Really?

[rocky shale]

2 S9 shots is veeeery swingy

4 hammers with watch master and this strat is nasty

Watch master makes that cheaper and gives advance +charge

[spice flicker]

So i swapped two immolators to be able to make both deathwatch into 10 man squads, should I replace the subductors or make some other changes to have a 2nd watch master?

[rocky shale]

You can only use this strat on one squad so probably only 1 WM is strictly necessary

Like meltas are good and helpful but you have to roll 5s to wound real tanks

[spice flicker]

Alright just have 20 extra points now.

[rocky shale]

IMO I'd want more subductors in general because they're amazing

[spice flicker]

What to swap?

[rocky shale]

Maybe a unit of sisters?

If you like sisters then run as many as you want, but imo one squad with one immolator is all you really need. Put all the good guns in the immolator and use the other half of the squad to sticky home and then screen out deep strikes.

Roll the immolator forward to sticky more stuff and maybe get lucky and pop a tank

Like most sticky obj units they have diminishing returns

Subductors are one of the best screening/tarpit units in the game if you give them infiltrators and dump them in front of your opponents dz

Similar purpose as nurglings but subductors have OC and some amount of melee damage

[spice flicker]

Should I consider rhinos for the subductors?

Or is footslogging them the way to go?

[rocky shale]

Typically you use the clandestine operations enhancement to give them infiltrators

[thin ibex]

what are they doing for you, really

[rocky shale]

They're way less good if you don't start them 9" from your opponents dz

[thin ibex]

if they need to get up the board safe and fast, rhino. If they are mostly claiming mid and your side of the board, just foorslog and use ruins for cover and los blocking

[rocky shale]

Typically you save rhino's for more important squads like deathwatch

[spice flicker]

I see

So use clandestine on the subductors (instead of the deathwatch) and consider rhinos for the deathwatch.

Is this looking better than before?

[rocky shale]

You can choose to use it on the deathwatch if you think it's the play for a specific game, but it's generally the subductors

You want your deathwatch alive to get to the hard targets, infiltrators die T1 often

[rocky shale]

Looks solid

Plenty of decent stuff for hard targets

You could swap out a couple of the deathwatch guys without hammers for frag cannons, since those are decently punchy

Maybe flamer for the Grey Knights? Idk if psycannon is that good

[spice flicker]

Duly noted, now that I have a general idea for 2000 pts, just need to translate it to a 750 pts starting army.

[untold swallow]

My Librarian with faith in the God Emperor is having a moment with his Black Templar squad lead calling him a witch.

In the Watch-Station Chapel.

Literally going 'God gives his greatest challenges to his greatest soldiers, you no-space-wizard-havin'-ass bitch.'

[rocky shale]

I'd drop armigers and one squad of DW for sure

Use one squad of DW as your hammer and then bring lots of utility

[spice flicker]

I wasnt planning to start to use the armigers until 1000 points tbh.

[rocky shale]

The helverin especially isn't doing much

[spice flicker]

Priorities are aiming for the warglaives by 1000 pts

[rocky shale]

Sanctifiers are also a very good unit to consider having to bring in against horde armies

Soooo many flamers

[floral herald]

Very good in KT too

But yeah oops all fire is good

[tranquil ivy]

Just an ancient with his pet skrungly

[upper bluff]

Brother FistPunchicus and FistPunchicus II

[tranquil ivy]

now I just need a Company Champion

[west zealot]

‘Yarrick,’ scolded Hawthorn. ‘You know Linoleus. Remember?’
‘I’ve been gone a long time,’ Rakkan said in excuse, glad the interviews concerning Hawthorn had been so extensive. He reached out to scratch the creature.
not behind the ears
Rakkan pulled his hand back, just as Yarrick opened his jaws.
‘He’s an old man now. And cranky. Now, that must be Macharius, but… who’s this one? Where’s Creed?’
Hawthorn sighed, then knelt and rubbed Yarrick’s silvered face. ‘Creed lived up to his name a bit too well. Squared up against an ursid on a hunt rather than running away. The new one is Ibram Gaunt. He’s a good little bird dog, aren’t you, Ibram? You lovely boy.'
'The next time we have a Militarum delegation,’ Rakkan said, ‘best not to mention the names. They wouldn’t appreciate it.’
‘Why not? It’s a tribute. And it’s proper. Isn’t that what the Guard is for? Flushing the prey out of the bushes for us to shoot?’
‘It’s verging on heresy.’
‘A heretic? Me? What a thing to say about your mother. Besides, this is our world, we can do what we want.’

Heretical dog names

[west zealot]

Anyways, assassanoriun Kingmaker is pretty good so far. Fun to see the politics of a knight house, and them all viewing Guillman as a manipulative shit

[past sphinx]

very refreshing to see a character actually call Cawl a heretek

[stark cypress]

And he is

For...so...many...things.

Especially the Necron cooperation.

[past sphinx]

and the AI

[stark cypress]

I mean...

Landraider's though.

They straight up have an AI.

[past sphinx]

you know its a weirder line than you would think with machine spirits

[stark cypress]

Sure, "machine spirits".

A thousand schisms have been born right now

[past sphinx]

like cawl secundus is definitely and AI trained to think itself cawl

but machine spirits are more like an animal intelligence rather than a general intelligence

[stark cypress]

Ah

[past sphinx]

like a roman gladiator vs a chimp with a machete

[stark cypress]

So, we technically can make a golden retriever coded landraider?

[past sphinx]

maybe, spirits are pretty shots in the dark

generally the bigger the thing more violent it is

though not always

Warhound spirits are like meth pitbulls vs the sheer strength of will a reaver or imperitor has

[stark cypress]

So, basically, an Imperitor is just an armored, temperamental horse.

[past sphinx]

a horse with potentially the memories and personality gestalt of every previous pilot

[stark cypress]

Dear God

Now I wanna see how that would go with a horse from that horse girl anime.

All right, sidebar.

Why does anime do that?

Why does anime make a girl out of everything?

[past sphinx]

because humanity has created a world of deep loneliness

[west zealot]

From what I've gathered, horse girl animes commitment to the bit is significant, like deep pulls on the history of each of the horses etc.

It's weird and silly, but It smacks of being a passion project here - someone who really loved horse racing, and found a way to make it accessible

This is just an outsider's perspective though

[charred bridge]

He went on trial for tech heresy

[charred bridge]

Also turns you into a noble

Knights just make their pilots that survive be super into protecting the people and full of codes and honor

Like a little personality adjustment from the machine spirits of previous pilots

[west zealot]

I do kinda hope they hit the Schism!!!! Button eventually.

I did actually like how it was made clear his entire cadre on his ship are basically all hereteks, and also, there's a gigantic line between "let's actually be scientists and test stuff, learn stuff, move forward again" and "I am going to mainline warpjuice into this waffle iron"

[charred bridge]

Probably too useful to gulliman, for now

If he did make tech with warp that'd probably get him

And he's for some reason basically the only tech priest thats in novels

[stark cypress]

"Lord Robute...The Martian's are being fucking weird again."

"Ultra Sigh How weird?"

"They're fucking trying to give the community waffle iron a warp injection. Three Battalion's of His Majesty Illustrious Black's have been dispatched to s-stop this madness!"

"...I am too old for this, Dad! I am too old!"

"Who are you speaking wi- Oh."

[tranquil ivy]

the Company Champion is complete

[charred bridge]

Tbf cawl's new tech is usually real important in like progressing a stagnant imperium, then there's cawl inferior

[tranquil ivy]

he takes trophies

lots of trophies...

[stark cypress]

heresy meter starts to beep

[charred bridge]

Its been beeping he just turned off the noise

[west zealot]

Even Cawl is concerned about Inferior at this point, which is funny

"wait, totally not ai me has been requesting what"

[charred bridge]

There was a reason men of iron arent a thing

[hollow laurel]

Looks great!

Also we find that pose a little funny just “hang on need to clean my sword before I start stabbing people again”

Pixel ↩️

[Reply to:](#1161696278640594954 message) the Company Champion is complete 📎

[charred bridge]

Maybe he purged that part of his memory of how bad daot men of iron were

[runic swallow]

Yeah, that guy is just a Totally Normal Mechanicus Robot

[west zealot]

(Cawl actively thinks making himself fabricator general is a throne awful idea on multiple levels, even just starting with the political ramifications(

[stark cypress]

"Brother..."

"Yes?"

"A few of the sword brethren and I have been...concerned about the nature of your battlefield trophies."

"What about them?"

"Your trophy taking methods are...extremely enthusiastic."

A month earlier

"Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhaha! YES! YES! Bring me skulls for the golden throne!"

[west zealot]

Which I like, because it makes it clear that while Cawl is many things, idiot is not one of them

[charred bridge]

Not a robot, just a device that responds to inquiries with preprogrammed response /s

[charred bridge]

Cawl Inferior though definitely wants to be fabricator general

[west zealot]

(arrogant and reckless yes, and Cawl would cheerfully tell you as much himself)

[west zealot]

Yeah, and Cawl proper is like what the fuck about it, because it's a bad idea on so many levels

[charred bridge]

I will say his blackstone pillar idea is a good one cause like it just negates 2 factions

Just got to figure out the drives mortals insane part except SoB

[thin ibex]

If they can solve the eye of terror, that's the narratives supposed biggest threat dealt with. (I still think the nids are a bigger one)

[tranquil ivy]

o wait

[past sphinx]

giant space bandaid

[charred bridge]

Yea the nids thing to me is kind of odd, I wonder if like orks work normally in the field

[tranquil ivy]

I was thinking more "Your flesh has dulled my blade."

[past sphinx]

Orks dont use the warp, they have their own thing going on

[charred bridge]

And SoB still able to use powers that very much look like warp powers cause emperor's blessing

[past sphinx]

except when they do use it

but mostly not using it

[tranquil ivy]

but i now have a full squad of Company Heroes yippee

[west zealot]

The implication is that the green is just distinct enough from the warp that they do fine, I think?

[charred bridge]

No it severs nids connection to the hive mind

They act as if theres no neuro units around once they go into the field

[west zealot]

The Green is the Ork's warp stuff

[tranquil ivy]

nids without a hivemind connection go apeshit and feral

I dont think orks know anything other than apeshit and feral

[charred bridge]

Thats why I wonder if orks waaagh would be affected

[west zealot]

(they absolutely do. Read Brutal Kunnin' or The Big Dakka)

[past sphinx]

nids without a hive mind is a tornado, orks without the green is still a highly directed avalanche of murder

they just have an inexhaustible love of the game

[west zealot]

The implications from the Ghazghul and Grotsnik novels is that The Green is distinct enough that usual warp rules may not apply.

I don't think there's hard the green vs warp suppression stuff, but there's enough hints at it

[floral herald]

Blackstone pillars also have a finite capacity to mess with the warp

[charred bridge]

Yea theres afaik no instance of orks dealing with blackstone

[west zealot]

And Gork and Mork actively blocking chaos influence is all but explicitly stated

Hell, weird boys can get possessed... And then the demon is screwed, because it's just stuck inside the weird boy having arguments with him

Which is very very funny

[charred bridge]

It must be a big capacity cause it just, makes Chaos a non issue

[west zealot]

(the Ork will of course argue outloud with whatever's possessing him, much to the confusion of the other Boyz, but hey, weridboyz are pretty weird)

[floral herald]

Well, it has

[past sphinx]

it also fucks up people iirc

humanity is directly tied to the warp

[charred bridge]

Thats the thing that stops cawl from using them

Its like a blank field and you couldnt use it in a hive city as is

[thin ibex]

Wait how do we know Blackstone has a finite capacity? I thought it just had a finite effect and so you needed complicated arrays and vast quantities to do what you want

Cause like, the array at cadia stood for millennia fulfilling its function

[floral herald]

Noctilith is basically a substance which can channel warp stuff around some and you can do a lot of things with it

[broken dew]

I love Orks

[floral herald]

The pylons were in some kind of low power state and Trazyn "turned it up" somehow

It's part of an active device and it's not clear they last forever on their own

[broken dew]

Mfw maintenance

[floral herald]

Same with the polarity reversing stuff like the Blackstone Fortresses and the flip in Space Marine 2

[charred bridge]

Well those were manufactured to enhance the warp

It can either negate or enhance depending on polarity

[floral herald]

Cawl also mentions getting the network on Cadia to "full power" in fall of cadia which also points to some sort of active system

[floral herald]

Yeah that's what Noctilith does

[broken dew]

If you closed the eye of terror somehow using them and they break would it just open again or would it stay shut cause it was closed

[charred bridge]

Someone just likely turned them off on purpose or accident

[broken dew]

Not that it matters much now that we have the cicatrix maledictum but if they were just gonna be a temp solution anyway then everyone is screwed regardless

[charred bridge]

I guess it does have finite capacity, abbadon was hunting the necron pylons and found he could overload them by throwing tons of warp energy at it ala throw a ton of daemons at it

Those were smaller than ones on cadia

[thin ibex]

So were the Blackstone fortresses, as weapons against the ctan, ultimately warp cannons of the highest order?

[floral herald]

yeah

[thin ibex]

Kinda crazy that such a powerful weapon was suicide crashed into cadia, seems a true waste of its potential

[desert jay]

IIRC he crashed it because he was gonna just lose it otherwise

[broken dew]

Ywah i think it was very much an "i might as well" thing

[desert jay]

It had been boarded and partially disabled

[floral herald]

And it looked hard as fuck

[broken dew]

It did

[floral herald]

It also seems to have been fairly damaged

Oh huh the cutscene calls it the "wreckage" of one

[upper canopy]

So far the sacrifice seems to have panned out

cuz like

Abbadon has done nothing but win since Gathering Storm

[charred bridge]

Yea abbadon fought extremely hard to capture it

It would have been a monster of a boost to the eye of terror if reversed

He destroyed it so the imperium cant use the pylon network to close the eye of terror. It hurt the imperium way more than it hurt abbadon.

[desert jay]

Abbadon, win? That's illegal

[floral herald]

Abaddon also had a spare

But they're at their most useful in pairs or triplets

[vital barn]

Abby at this point has lost several blackstone fortresses, it's a running theme

but that new robot daemon guy can apparently pull fully operational battle space hulks out of his ass whenever he likes, so they're like Imperator Titans, there will always be one around to blow up dramatically

[charred bridge]

The power of ultramarine plot armor

[vital barn]

I still don't know why that guy wasn't a darkmech archmagos or something instead

someone was really into Doom cyberdaemons

[west zealot]

The idea is of a fifth chassis god is appealing, but Vashatorr is kinda awkward right now in demi good position + the usual plot stalling

[vital barn]

also he's sitting right on top of the position that should by rights be a giant spooky dark magos, considering we've had thirty years of lore about cool hellforges that do stuff like that

[floral herald]

I think Vashtorr’s neat he’s a payoff for some stuff planted all the way back in codex chaos daemons 5e

But I also want darkmech

[vital barn]

but that's nothing new, the best Archmagos is all about space marines, the Forge of Mars series is mostly about people who aren't techpriests, etc.

[runic swallow]

Is he not a dark mech guy who went demon prince?

[vital barn]

not as far as I know, I think they just made up a guy

[floral herald]

He’s the lord of the forge of souls

[vital barn]

although honestly part of this is that I think Scoria looks cooler in approximately every single way

[floral herald]

A now really old bit of lore about an independent (minor) power in the warp which does exploitative contracts on daemons to turn them into daemon engines

Original a few line blurb to justify soul grinders when they were new

[vital barn]

yeah, that's been mentioned fairly regularly, although a bunch of other people also make daemon engines of various levels of cool

like this guy, who was making daemonbots ten thousand years ago but hasn't been mentioned since

[brittle salmon]

they didn't figure it out

[broken dew]

Bro looks like a demonbot

[vital barn]

runs the hellforge that makes the hellblade, hell talon and the giant bomber version thereof, which have been deleted from the game and will probably never be seen again

so now the only darkmech presence is a couple of shitty cultists and a random daemon who will proceed to occupy every single bit of lore that vaguely relates to chaos tech, as usual

grumblegrumble

[broken dew]

Sadge

[vital barn]

aforementioned giant bomber, the little guy to the left is about normal-fighter sized

[floral herald]

Something I am hoping we get out of the weird model line split is 40K daemons distinct from AoS ones

Since I think it’s kind of lame how swordy they are

Arcs of Omen have some really cool fucked up daemon-tech things which look basically nothing like the current crop

[vital barn]

to be fair they've been sticking awesome unit design seeds in campaign books and doing nothing with them for four decades now

I was amazed we even got a Scoria model

[upper canopy]

Unfortunately 40k cant have good model designs

They refuse, for some reason

[vital barn]

also no chaos unit is allowed to look like someone designed it

[vital barn]

has to just be vague animalistic shape + spikes

OK I do like the last fellow there

[floral herald]

Scoria’s model is cool but the studio paint job feels so drab

[vital barn]

I would honestly prefer more cohesive daemon lists but only because I actually like model interoperability and GW has declared open war on that, so it's not happening

[floral herald]

Yeah if that was gonna be a thing I’d probably prefer it

I like stuff working for multiple game lines

But I don’t make those decisions so

[vital barn]

it matches the usual Xana scheme, which looks great on the robots, but he's got a lot more going on so a bit of colour does make him pop a bit more

[floral herald]

Gimme the weird chaos stuff instead I guess

[floral herald]

Yeah that pops a lot better

[vital barn]

my complaint here is less "don't make funky daemon engines" and more "hey, you know that whole faction who have been nothing but background fluff for thirty years and that everyone loves? maybe put them in charge when you're doing their exact thing"

HH1e was going to have a third of a book for Darkmech stuff but then Alan Bligh died and the remaining writers royally fucked up HH9: Crusade

so you get the absolutely badass fluff he'd presumably already written about Ulan Huda, Darkmech Unicron, and then zero rules implementation

[floral herald]

Oh yeah word

Darkmech and LatD are my white whale

At least kill team has some of em

[vital barn]

there are many funky darkmech options in 30k, luckily

in 40k they get nothing good day sir

hence my mostly pointless grudge against Vashtorr

put a black robe on that guy

oh yeah, also the new blackshields have something for that

cutting out the fiddly rules text that takes up a fair amount of space under this

points at space marines: "you should automatize yourself, now"

fairly sure this one is meant to represent some of the really fun blackshields zombie-false-flag-attack stuff from Black Book 6

[pale narwhal]

god I love Anacharis Scoria's model (and also rules)

just an absolute unit of a dark mechanicum archmagos

[vital barn]

he's not as killy as he used to be but he's a lot tougher

he's basically a baby Brass Scorpion

[charred bridge]

Somewhere out there someone is coping about Malal

[west zealot]

Give her neon rave color highlights, I'm not even joking.

[vital barn]

people were giving Scoria's freaky eyes the carameldansen lights eight years ago, that's nothing new

Mr. Rave Scorpion

I do like his pet spiderdrone and Robocop-style rubber-mask face

good way to do a Magos who looks reasonably human at first glance until he gets into the doom scorpion body

[upper canopy]

Thats the dude from ghost in the shell

[desert jay]

Batou

[upper canopy]

Thats the bitch

[broken dew]

man looking up Watchers in the Dark again and what an enigmatic group of creatures

[tired cairn]

Idea: Khorne-worshipping world where "Khorne cares not from whence the blood flows" is used in a similar sense as "shit happens"

[west zealot]

Someone says that, then just shoves a clown down a really, really, really long set of stairs

[broken dew]

finished up writing about the armors that are generally employed by the Dusk Defiant and about 1st Captain Ghaumagan Vhyal so now it's onto weapons

been having a lot of fun going into like, specific detail about what stuff the chapter has and uses

need to put it all in a doscument at some point and share it

[west zealot]

There is a helldiveri n my match named Settra the Imperishable. I'm not sure that's comptabile with democracy.

[broken dew]

i'm sure Settra is very democratic

also updated the Dusk Defiants stance on the Deathwatch since i learned that Deathwatch Chaplains actually need to know all the chapter specific rituals from pretty much all chapters

which makes it, actually possible for Dusk Defiant marines seconded to the Deathwatch to be returned without mindwiping them and such

[west zealot]

He died twice then quit the mission.

[broken dew]

incredibly undemocratic behaviour

[broken dew]

been playing some more space marine 2 and one thing i've really enjoyed is being able to deploy cadians to help out in siege mode

fighting alongside guard as a space marine is just cool

they keep calling us Ultramarines for some reason though

[pale narwhal]

Lost my killteam league game vs deathwatch

It was decently close at 8-13, I just horrendously whiffed dice rolls killing a marine (rerolled a 1 I needed to hit in order to kill a marine, rolled another 1. On a flamer, which hits on a 2+, and then whiffed a second flamer, a krak grenade, then finally killed with a heavy bolter), made a couple of order-of-operations blunders, and mis-positioned two of my servitors (didn’t pivot away from a clearly-lost flank and thus they weren’t in any position to do much turning point 4)

[broken dew]

Heretic smashing time

[pale narwhal]

Hell yeah

[broken dew]

playing with mods as a Terminator and i tried making something approximately like a Cataphractii

repping the Dusk Defiant Colors as well of course

[pale narwhal]

It’s great. The missions where there’s occasional guardsmen just firing away are great too. Puts it in perspective how much of a demigod astartes are comparatively

[broken dew]

yeah

[pale narwhal]

This is my last two league games summed up

[broken dew]

Lmao

[pale narwhal]

I’m feeding servitors into the elite, currently-meta astartes killteam meatgrinder in an attempt to score points and get cheeky with a meltagun

[pastel rampart]

https://www.uuinstagram.com/p/DPccIAvDH9B/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

[west zealot]

From a discussion on Genestealers:

"It would solve alot of the issues in the 40k universe if we killed all the bald people."

Vulkan will probably be kay though

[stark cypress]

Let us not commit genocide by hair.

[broken dew]

man the mechanicus are weird

just helped a mechanicus guy in SM2 by finding a heretek brain in a jar

[broken dew]

Also learned of a prime space hulk looting spot that unfortunately is only accessible by webway

[desert jay]

I think it’s implied somewhere that GSC outbreaks are containable by anyone who has their shit halfway together, and the Imperium just doesn’t

Nowhere else has underhives full of an entire society to hide weird hybrids in

[broken dew]

Prolly for the best since the star in this place is spawning horrible fucking warp creatures that drive you insane and summon ghost crews onto the space hulks

Also there's apparently a Flayed One empire in the Ghoul Stars

Rip to the Death Spectres

[broken dew]

ok the Death Spectres are much weirder than i thought

they have a freaky ancient glass throne that they plonk their chapter master on that gives them crazy psychic powers and apparently have a fucking Lisan Al-Gaib style prophecy that they've been working towards

Over the millennia, the Death Spectres have been preparing for the Cadash, which translates to "Living Chalice," someone of great significance who, upon taking their place upon the Shariax, will bring about the "Great Resurrection." The leadership of the Death Spectres has apparently been sowing the seeds of fate to bring about the Cadash's rise throughout the Chapter's history.

that's just the Bene Gesserit making their Lisan Al-Gaib

they even have the fucking golden path future vision shit with their psykers being specifically good at divining the future

[pastel rampart]

Death Spectres are pretty cool except for the "human breeding stock" shit.

[broken dew]

yeah uh

[pastel rampart]

That one is very 😬

[broken dew]

that one is very yikes

i will henceforth refer to the Death Spectres as the Bene Gesserit chapter

[pastel rampart]

It's the sort of thing I'd just ignore if I ever played them, basically.

"Yeah that's just propaganda an angry inquisitor started when we didn't let him look at our special throne."

[broken dew]

it's kinda weird that they also just

don't really have a chapter master

they've got a mini emperor guy going on

[pastel rampart]

It's one of the more interesting reasons to not have an active chapter master.

[broken dew]

it is yeah

i'm still stuck on the fucking Bene Gesserit messiah shit

[pine matrix]

I wanted to write a story about Primaris Marines being given to the Death Spectres

Since I don't think they have much else in terms of geneseed weirdness? So the Torchbearer fleet would just have a bunch of normal marines to give and they turn up one of the Most Weird chapters out there

[broken dew]

why the fuck did the Flesh Eaters call themselves that

[pine matrix]

They were second founding, right? Guy who was running them wanted to tear some flesh, I think

[broken dew]

you're thinking of the Flesh Tearers i think

the Flesh Eaters and Flesh Tearers are not the same guys

the Flesh Eaters apparently got accused of being cannibals but consider this slander

which you know

you could have NOT called yourself the Flesh Eaters

[bright dove]

It's not cannibalism, it's counterintelligence operations!

[broken dew]

Sanguinius kids sure are fucked up

[floral herald]

Getting mad about it is funny

So many space marines have weird eating habits

[broken dew]

the Flesh Eaters seem unbothered by the accusations of cannibalism

[tired cairn]

It would be funny if the organ that didn't work for Flesh Eaters was the consumed brain memory one

[broken dew]

the Flesh Eaters actually don't seem to eat people

[bright dove]

They are statistically average Space Marines in terms of how much cannibalism they engage in.

[main pagoda]

theres non zero chance

when in the red thirst no real telling of what your going to do to the poor guardsmen who happened to win the "I wish I was anywhere but here" reward

[spice flicker]

How is this for reducing down this 2000 points list down to 750 points? I might reduce down the deathwatch to a 5 man team but in that case any suggestions for the 95 points left over (which isnt enough for a 2nd deathwatch squad.) I do plan to remove the voidsmen when I move up to 1000 points to make room for a pair of armiger warglaives.

[rocky shale]

This looks solid

[spice flicker]

Inquisitor with deathwatch in the rhino, voidsmen camping at home, breachers and subductors infiltrating with help from the rogue trader's clandestine operation.

Should I keep deathwatch at 10 man squad level or spend 90 points elsewhere?

[sour sequoia]

Played two more Xenocreed power tool zerg rush games yesterday, Mont’Ka and Flyblown Host Death Guard with 20 Blightlords—can hold my own vs death guard on any sitreps besides purge based on that game with no real spikes (the GSC autolose sitrep) so thats good

Mont’Ka blows my ass outta the water because it says “whole army advance and charge rerolling charges/advances and mass anti-vehicle melee? bet” and then the Tau start running it down midfield as well and it’s terrifying

Debating rawdogging Final Day, can get one rep in on next Wednesday before the tourney but the list lock-in is tomorrow night 😔

Have not played bugs ally detach before at all but I own em all and the fundamentals is mostly about ridgerunner trading pieces and gargoyle move-shoot-move tech + lictor & hyper-adapted ravener schmovement

[rocky shale]

I'd keep the 10 between it will cost RP to reinforce them later

Your killing units are them and the RTE/breachers squad

Funny enough you could skip the rhino and have every unit except the voidsmen infiltrate

Rhino is still maybe worth it but that is funny

[spice flicker]

And here I was planning to use the RTE/Breachers as home objective campers at 1000 points since I need something to stay home due to lacking sticky.

Rhino was there to give the DWKT some extra movement and durability until ready for the charge...and to serve as a large metal box shaped tarpit once done moving the space marines.

Though tbh I think the rhino is one of my least favorite transports in the game.

[rocky shale]

Breachers buff the RTE and together the whole squad is decently shooty

Breaches with draxus make her really nasty

When playing agents I would also ask the person running it if you can repove epic hero from assassins, it's a common house rule

They're a core part of the army but not getting upgrades on them sucks

You can keep the only take one rule

[spice flicker]

I am normally weary of epic heroes in crusade myself due to an annoying experience with an eldar player, in a crusade i organized, who spammed them to avoid worrying about battle scars and exploit the system. The guy running this one doesnt particularly care but I will ask and see about the assassins. Vindicate and Calladius seem neat.

[sour sequoia]

Its overall a loss to take more than one even if you are using the hero traits

Battle honours go crazy and the risk of scarring is low

[spice flicker]

So i guess get rid of the rhino and spend the 80 points on another squad of voidsmen or a navigator?

[sour sequoia]

But the hero traits are nice and make it not a total loss if you’re a faction dependent on epic heroes (side eyeing TSons)

[spice flicker]

The eldar player also thought aircraft were neat....to the point of brining 3 by the time we were at 1250 points. He also found a way to give aircraft OC1 somehow but this was a while ago and so I cant remember the exact details how.

[rocky shale]

You don't have to drop the rhino

The assassind are only epic heroes to keep you from spamming them, just replace that with an "only take one" rule for crusade and let them get battle honors basically

Also the culexus goes crazy because in crusade you can know if your opponent is a heavily psychic army before you add it to your army list lol

Up against tsons? Lol. Lmao.

[spice flicker]

Alright so I will keep the list as it is now and when I go up to 1250 points I will see about an assassin on top of the helverin to round out my trio of armigers.

[broken dew]

the terminator class in this SM2 mod has a really fun ultimate ability where when i use my deep strike teleport it summons 3 lads in for 60 seconds

it's also named after the whole "most i can spare is 3 men" thing lmao

[spice flicker]

Wait I just realized my strategy won't work. The rhino cant transport terminator models....and the Inquisitor in TERMINATOR ARMOR is going to be attached to them until I get a Grey knight squad in the army.

[vital barn]

I do not know that particular thing

SM2 would probably brick my PC but it is still tempting

[broken dew]

in Space Marine 2, whenever you talk to Acheran, the guy commanding the planetary battle

Titus keeps asking for reinforcements

rightfully so

since he is dealing with overwhelmingly dangerous things

and Acheran keeps saying that the most he can spare is 3 men

which is basically nothing and not sufficient at all

[tranquil ivy]

I love this little squad I built

Company Heroes + Vulkan Hestan

[broken dew]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDuRR7kWK14

there's a lot of memes about it

[upper canopy]

THE BEST I CAN DO IS THREE INFINITELY RESPAWNING MEN

[broken dew]

the humble lone Cadian guardsman coming to help us with the Heldrake

[spice flicker]

Hmmm.... keep the terminator inquisitor attached to the DWKT but infiltrate them instead of riding in a transport or keep the transport but attach the terminator Inquisitor to some subductors in the meantime?

If I replace the chimera with a 2nd voidsmen squad, that means I can still have a voidsmen squad camping at home when I reach 1000 and use the points plus one swapped voidsmen squad for a pair of armigers.

[floral herald]

They got terminators now?

[broken dew]

playing with a mod

[rocky shale]

Then just infiltrate them yeah

[spice flicker]

Alright

[spice flicker]

Which assassins are actually worth considering?

[tired cairn]

I think the uppy-downy one is the most popular

[broken dew]

I'm having way too much fun just endlessly finding new details to write about for my custom chapter

Rn i need to rewrite chapter specializations, write about ranged weapons, melee weapons and chapter ranks as well as figure out who my tech marine leader is gonna be

Also chapter history

[upper canopy]

That's Your Dudes For You

[rocky shale]

All of them except culexus unless you're against a psyker heavy army, then them too

[broken dew]

Need to write about the chapters history

[rocky shale]

Callidus is the best as an ally to other factions but the others are strong in agents as well

[broken dew]

Been going into specific enough detail as to specify all the power armor, terminator armor and dreadnought patterns fielded by the chapter

Gonna specify all ranged and melee weapons they use too

[thin ibex]

i kinda wish desolators got balanced instead of left at unusable costs

i had hte impression they just jacked up the cost as a placeholder till they could figure out how to balance em

but like

200 points is just too expensive

[broken dew]

also learned about Void Hardened Armor and how it was a catalyst for the creation of Terminator armor, which naturally my chapter will put to great use

also introduces a fun quirk of the chapter where they are sort of a ticking time bomb due to their extensive use of ancient, rare and difficult to maintain armors

any major loss of the chapter would be utterly catastrophic

[upper bluff]

What if the Library of Alexandria was a flying space chapel that went to war style chapter

[broken dew]

their main method of space combat is flying their fortress-monastery into fleet battle at ramming speed

so yeah basically

[charred bridge]

Titus is a perpetual confirmed

[broken dew]

they do a one-two maneuver of sending their Fortress Monastery Star Fortress into battle at ramming speed, harpooning anyone who doesn't get out of the way, and then having their second flagship lumber after it firing its impressive array of weapons to shred whatever the star fortress catches as well as any stragglers or anyone trying to do flanking

also the Warrant of Trade is so fucking funny

the fact that Rogue Traders operate by rule of a hand written note by god himself which is approximately the size of a fucking house presumably because god is/was enormous that says they can do whatever the fuck they want is just

funny

[charred bridge]

And they're non fungible, the only proof is the fact rogue traders have it. There's no checks besides if an inquisitor gets curious

[spice flicker]

Also so here is the original 2000 points list I started with and then reduced down to 750 points start with before working my way back up to 2000 pts.

Here is the 2000 points list that ended up being created after working my way back up to 2000 pts from 750 points. Which would you guys recommend?

[broken dew]

it's so fucking funny

[vital barn]

there was a guy in Forge of Mars who faked his warrant, the Archmagos in charge of the expedition found out and went "I like this guy's vibe, so I got him a real one"

when his subordinate said "you can't do that" he replied with "I'm an archmagos, I can do whatever I want"

[broken dew]

lmao

[spice flicker]

Former gives more bodies, sticky objectives thanks to sisters, and additional meltas.

Latter gives me two assassins and a navigator so more characters, deep strike denial, and still havent heard from the crusade organizer about assassins getting xp.

[spice flicker]

Archmagos Lexel Kotov (might have mispelled his first name) is one of my favorite 40k Imperium characters and my favorite Ad Mech character alongside Cawl. If I could pick any 40k book character for ad mech ro become a new epic hero it would be him.

[charred bridge]

Based, who in the imperium reads well or has enough time enough to care

A lot of the factions outside the Lex are like basically all vibes based, just don't be too heretical and you can do whatever as long as another outside the law organization catches you

I love cawl, but we need to see more active magos

I think a by the Omnissiah 's dataslate type of magos would be a great foil to Cawl

[broken dew]

gods Adeptus Ridiculous is good

watching the Guilliman episode again and Bricky is talking about Space Marines being kinda ugly for various reasons and Shy has appended an image of Erebus with the caption "VERY related image of Erebus"

[charred bridge]

Shy is a peak editor

[broken dew]

she's great

it's so weird cause i used to watch her as a Warframe youtuber and when i started watching Adeptus Ridiculous it's like

[charred bridge]

Even if she's not making Warframe shit posts anymore you can feel the gremlin energy from her just editing someone else's podcast

[broken dew]

oh those are some of my favourite blorbo's

[charred bridge]

And she's not even saying a word

[broken dew]

look they're all gathered in one place

excellence

[charred bridge]

If you don't know Bricky made a spinoff channel for Trench Crusade called Acceptable Losses

[broken dew]

tbf it is pretty much her podcast as well

iirc they mentioned she originally came up with the list of topics

[broken dew]

already watched the first episode

Bricky and Kirioth are just as fun as they have been in Adeptus Ridiculous in Acceptable Losses

the Trench Crusade ep is a really interesting one

[charred bridge]

Seeing the first episodes with Kirioth, how the mighty have fallen. He used to be the super serious guy and nows he's becoming more stoically unhinged

[broken dew]

i never really watched Kirioth outside of Adeptus Ridiculous

but he seems to be having fun

which is always good

[charred bridge]

Maybe cause he's an actual dad with kids, but he has stronger married dad vibes while Bricky has strong divorced dad energy.

[broken dew]

true

[stark cypress]

And DK has "bachelor with FAFO energy".

[broken dew]

it's time to rewatch the TTS vox logs again

[charred bridge]

Yea he does now, at first he gave, in law son Bricky has custody of on weekends and decided to do a podcast

[broken dew]

he definitely did

it's funny to go back to the earlier eps of AdRic and see how the art has changed

[charred bridge]

The posters are unashamedly horny bait

[broken dew]

absolutely

i was thinking more the art of Bricky, Shy and DK for the videos

[charred bridge]

All it took was one episode of Bricky simping for Lotarra and it was over

[broken dew]

it didn't take much

[charred bridge]

Oh yea that too, DK was forcefully catboy'd against his will

The artist will find a way to add cat ears on DK

[broken dew]

dread it, run from it, cat ears arrive all the same

[charred bridge]

Shy also just picking the worst thing from the setting

Cherubs from 40k as her avatar

[broken dew]

yup

[stark cypress]

Isn't DK vtuber avatar like a fem looking cyclops?

I feel like the cat conversion thing was there in the first place

[broken dew]

DK is some kind of Admech, Bricky seems to be part of the Ecclesiarchy, Possum is an inquisitor and Kirioth is either a tech marine or an iron hands space marine

[stark cypress]

And Shy is the ever suffering remembrancer that is dealing with everyone's bullshit.

[broken dew]

well, she is literally a cherub

she is long suffering though

[spice flicker]

Well i asked the organizer of the crusade about assassins getting experience and this was initial response:

"Let me ask a question in return. If (player who used multiple epic heroes in the past) had an unnamed epic hero in his army should I also allow it to gain experience?"

I pointed out that IA (and technically genestealers but maybe eldar/harlequins depending on how you looked at the solitaire and avatar of khaine) is the only faction with unnamed epic heroes and how the assassins' epic hero label was new to 10th which is what led to the house rule being common for assassins and the patriarch for genestealers.

Ah more response:

Give me some time to consider it I'll let you know before 1000 point matches begin. It's a matter of balance which I'm not the most familiar with so I would like to phone a friend or two"

Thoughts on this?

[desert jay]

Cherubs are pretty bad but not the worst thing in the setting, we don't talk about the worst-worst but there's other stuff in between

[charred bridge]

Worst you can get away with on youtube

That daemon thing would probably get removed if visualized

[desert jay]

It actually showed up in a Bricky2 vid (with pixel censor) recently

[spice flicker]

How the iron warriors made a way to get even more new members faster is one such thing.

[desert jay]

Also dangit you two I just said we don't talk about it :v

(It's the Daemonculaba, google at your own peril)

[spice flicker]

I never technically said what it was, just who made something worse than cherubs.

[broken dew]

yeah the Daemonculaba is fucking horrid

i didn't even watch the AdRic episode on it cause i just

don't want to know more about it

[spice flicker]

Its like ||that one scene from Alien vs. Predator Requiem|| to put it as vaguely yet plainly as I can.

Put spoilers warning just in case.

[broken dew]

trying to decide if my chaplain equivalents or tech marine equivalents should be responsible for maintaining chapter history and lore

[vital barn]

your techmarines appear to be quite busy already

[broken dew]

that is true

honestly i feel like i should almost make a small dedicated group of marines that maintain chapter lore and history

cause the Chaplain equivalents are mad busy being genuinely obsessively suspicious about everyone

and the Tech marines are fuck off busy dealing with the fact that everyone in the chapter is wearing stupid rare, expensive or difficult to maintain armor

the librarius equivalent are not going to be helpful for this cause they're too busy being some of the chapters most elite warriors so they can fight daemons

[vital barn]

they can be choppy and keep the records, that's normally how a librarius works

[broken dew]

true

they're sort of just normal dudes and i imagine their attrition rates are probably not great

which is why i thought maybe not them

they are notably the guys who wear the least special armor in the chapter

They get tacticus and aquila armor and anti-daemon flamers and have to just lock the fuck in

Librarius is usually full of actual wizards who have better ability to combat daemons

I guess i can just have them keep meticulous written records on the Indefatigable's Return and the Dread March

Have evey member of the company keep records for cross referencing purposes and have a crazy library of history from a hundred differeng perspectives

Yeah that could work

Honestly every member of the chapter is becoming a irrecoverable and important cog in the machine with the way i'm writing these guys

Kinda fun to have them be sort of a ticking time bomb

Also gives more weight and logic to their oenchant for sending out larger groups of marines than necessary to most any encounter

[spice flicker]

With the release of the drukhari codex, is that every faction now with a codex released?

[rocky shale]

Yes

[sour sequoia]

Besides Deathwatch and Daemons

But Daemons got a full codex of content for Free

[brittle salmon]

Now it's just a matter of time before 11e

[desert jay]

Rumors are for a SM vs Ork launch box

[stark cypress]

Oh god no

Please 11th edition guard don't be trash

[sour sequoia]

I was hearing white scars vs dark eldar and doing a big bikes refresh but that coulda been furious copium

We have like 9 months, at least. Game’s earnestly in a good spot if DG and Knights take another hit

[desert jay]

Also in a recent vid about the history of the 40K game I noticed a trend that sometimes they do "yeah you can use last edition's datasheets/codices" and sometimes "toss your old books, it's index time" and they've not yet done the latter two editions in a row

[sour sequoia]

I see a lotta good guard lists but Guard has some of the highest “I will play one list and if GW doesn’t like it they clearly hate the Entire Faction”

Recon Element is literally classic guard and just swept LVO

[jaunty dawn]

They have in horused heresy fwiw

But thats the first time

I guess kt24 counts too but thats further from a mainline game

[desert jay]

KT and HH also haven't really had the same index/codex system either

[rocky shale]

Begging GW to remember IK and CK don't have the same win rates

CK is only doing OK off the back of the double gatling despoiler being absolutely wacky and infernal lance being an amazing detachment

The army rule is stealth outside of 18" and maybe you pick some other stuff that barely matters late game

The real army rule is Better Dark Pacts from infernal lance lol

[sour sequoia]

Begging GW to either squat them or make them real armies that don’t ignore half the game we are not the same

But yeah I think you can honestly like, buff a lot of CK and delete the gat. Literally just delete the gat.