#Warhammer and Such

1 messages · Page 150 of 1

soft willow
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Which ones did you get?

rocky shale
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Got a good deal on 2 sagitaurs, a einhyr champion, a grimbyr, and a khal NiB

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For like $125

remote wharf
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I'm not big on the Overlord with Translocation Shroud, so I'm kind of tempted to get Imotekh and like, slightly kitbash him to reduce his Imotekhness.

rocky shale
soft willow
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Great deal on those models.

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Should give you a good idea if you like the feel of the range.

rocky shale
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What I mostly am excited for is the big robots they announced

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But I do love the vehicles too

pastel rampart
paper bluff
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pretty sure Big E could Ligma kaldor

pastel rampart
floral herald
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Yeahhhh

pastel rampart
paper bluff
remote wharf
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I came up with an idea for my necron dynasty and I think I'm cooking. What if my dynasty and two Phaerons? Twin brothers who bond is so strong they even rule together.

floral herald
pastel rampart
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He's very Realm of Chaos-core.

paper bluff
remote wharf
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Oh no, quite the opposite.

charred bridge
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We already have bitter lovers, its orikan and trazyn

remote wharf
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I am torn between characterizing them as either creepily similar to the point of almost acting like the same individual across two bodies or having them have the red oni blue oni dynamic.

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Or maybe both. Perhaps once one was hot headed and the other cool headed, but something fucked up happened during the long sleep and they've almost seemed to synchronize.

paper bluff
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Oh the twice dead king bros but twins

crimson solar
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or alpharius but metal skelly

quaint compass
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In a fluke of bio-transference, neither brother made it through as they should have. Both becoming more like their serfs, unthinking and obedient. Thankfully their servants, with combined intellect, successfully program schedules and behavior each day to make them pass as themselves.

pine matrix
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I do like that idea, a Phaeron who is basically out of commission but their court pretends they have all their facilities

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Weekend at Bernie'ing their engrammic dynastic codes

cinder wraith
remote wharf
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I even settled on names for them. And maybe a few epithets. Rahamzak and Settai, Settai and Rahamzak, The Twin Suns, The Two Who Are As One, The Brothers Phaeron.

pulsar cairn
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i saw a reddit post of a guy that just made me laugh

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old post

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but still funny vicksyLUL even if i dont play the tabletop

tired cairn
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Hrm, weird that the KT starter set doesn't include the core rules or an approved ops deck

floral herald
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Yeah

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It sucks tbh

tired cairn
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I guess GW is like "it's a discount for two kill teams!"

finite compass
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from an ironically brighter era

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John Blanche's old CSM concept drawings

floral herald
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I see you in every world

image0.jpg
thin ibex
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gw should do a larger scale skirmish game lol. Let us play KT with action figures

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I guess you could theoretically just uniformally scale things up

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and use those joytoy action figures

pulsar cairn
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Is green skin also a slur in age of sigmar/Fantasy or is it the actual race name for orks in there? vicksyThink i only see them being called that in there....

finite compass
thin ibex
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oh i never played that

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whats that all about

finite compass
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It was a 54mm skirmish game

main pagoda
finite compass
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The one thing I remember that amused me greatly

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When they added a Space Marine character

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This guy

floral herald
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There are… surprisingly few textual slurs in warhammer

finite compass
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RAW, the way strength bonuses worked, he could do more damage by throwing his bolter at somebody than by firing it.

floral herald
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I guess there’s Mon’Keigh?

finite compass
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'Twist' for mutants

floral herald
floral herald
finite compass
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It's in the Eisenhorn books

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Notably the mutants also call each other Twist

tired cairn
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Maybe they are reclaiming it

finite compass
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Because they've adopted it as kind of a badge of honor

tired cairn
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Oh, so they are lol

thin ibex
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im guessing its like... not a thing anymore?

tired cairn
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No

finite compass
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It was discontinued

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but the rulebook is free, IIRC

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And there's a bunc of 'I28' conversions

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to change the ruleset to 28mm so you can use it with standard warhammer minis

floral herald
finite compass
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But yes

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Notable for being the first appearance of many things

floral herald
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There’s so much warhammer which is from Inquisitor yeah

finite compass
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Including Inquisitor Eisenhorn, Cyber Mastiffs, Daemonhosts, and Arco-Flagellants

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Basically all the Inquisition lore we have came from Inquisitor

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Like the radical/puritan split and the various philosophies

pulsar cairn
finite compass
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But yes

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All the miniatures and some official conversions, I think

thin ibex
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do yall think the custodes are aware of the terminus decree?

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and if they are, why would they allow grey knights into the imperial palace?

floral herald
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I don’t think they are

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I don’t think more than like maybe 6 living people know about it

thin ibex
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makes sense

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might be an interesting conflict; though since the sisters are on teh custodes side, id favor them

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it was kinda cool after reading watchers of the throne, learning that the anathema psykana are not exactly super happy about the state of things despite their loyalty to the emperor

floral herald
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I would assume that the imperial palace is not intact if the decree is getting opened

charred bridge
crimson solar
floral herald
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The OG

thin ibex
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that right there is john warhammer

floral herald
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Harry the Hammer

charred bridge
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Warhammer .001k

runic swallow
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It’s used by Karl Franz, the emperor of one of the factions in WHF, and later by Sigmar (or one of his guys he loans it to) in Age of Sigmar

soft willow
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It was originally used by Sigmar back in the day

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The Dwarves made it for him.

jaunty dawn
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isnt the big guy also karl franz

thin ibex
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40k, weirdly, has no "The Warhammer" as the emperor uses a sword. Or a claw. Or a spear.

jaunty dawn
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the big stormcast guy

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or implied to be

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the celestant prime

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a "great king" during the world that was and the first soul to be stormcast

pine matrix
charred bridge
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And that chaos god's name? Sigmar/Emperor

jaunty dawn
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Thinkin about sigmar lied

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And then the reveal is just like. For one not a reveal because it was kinda already established. And it wasnt even really a lie. And even then the people actually saying sigmar lied are just like "but were like fine with it I guess"

still warren
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yeah that tagline was pretty weird

runic swallow
still warren
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coming back multiple times is bad for your health, which was also established already

pastel rampart
still warren
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whole thing with the ruination chamber being opened basically stormcasts who had been reforged too many times and are close to losing their last vestige of humanity completely/turning into lighting ghosts

tired cairn
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Oh, I didn't realize the Terminus Decree was explained very recently (the most recent Grey Knights Codex)

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Seems a weird thing to seal to only be open at the most dire of times.

"Even with the Emperor fighting by our side for the past century, we are still losing to the ruinous powers. We must unseal the Terminus Decree"
...
"Well that is really awkward"

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... do we think this is foreshadowing the Emperor getting a model lmao

still warren
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the emperor wants a snack

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doubtful

finite compass
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Doesn't it also directly contradict The End and the Death?

still warren
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is that the deadmans switch one?

west zealot
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On Custodians and unthinkable casualties

jaunty dawn
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Ended up being uh

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Vaguely

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“Sigmar said we’d be immortal heroes, but ‘lied’ because eventually we become soulless robutts”

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But also like

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The whole reforging thing has been an open problem since 1e I think. And its always being worked on by the stormcast and sigmar

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But also the ruination chamber guys,the ones most affected and the pov for the tagline, they like. Dont actually care. They dont feel betrayed or anything and they are still ultimately doing what they signed up for

upper bluff
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It is a little underwhelming, huh

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"Sigmar lied I'm not eternal. But also I'm still chill dying for him over and over"

pastel rampart
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It also puts into question: what happened to the anti-astartes virus.

upper bluff
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Who made that? Was that Big E?

pastel rampart
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According to the Horus Heresy Series, the Terminus Decree concerns the anti-astartes phage developed by the mad scientist Basilio Fo.

upper bluff
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Weird

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I partially hate that the terminus decree has an actual answer in the new codex but also I kinda love how the decree is "If I ever stand up from my throne where I'm fed 1000 psykers a day then send 1000 psykers to put me back in it"

tired cairn
still warren
tired cairn
tired cairn
pastel rampart
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They'd have to get through all the Custodes, the Sisters of Silence, and the contingent of Imperial Fists first.

tired cairn
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The fact that custodes outnumber the grey knights is pretty funny to me

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Unless they cheat and/or also have multiple chapters

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(which, tbf, they deal with warp stuff enough they probably accidentally break the rules a lot)

pastel rampart
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GK don't have a limit to their number like normal marines, but since they're supposed to be the best of the best their numbers are likely quite low.

upper bluff
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Oh I did not know that. I suppose that's one of the benefits of being a super secret chapter

tired cairn
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... Ok, dumb idea, the grey knights are supposed to be limited to 1k but anyone who tries to count gets killed for knowing too much about them

still warren
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couldn't they always teleport into the throneroom? a nuke almost was during some bloodgames

upper bluff
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I guess? Idk teleportation is warp stuff so maybe sisters of silence have some anti teleport shenanigans

pastel rampart
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GK arrived during the Second Founding (7 years after the heresy) and already had 1,000 members; they were included as part of the founding but they're not really beholden to the Codex Astartes as they're their own separate, special thing.

floral herald
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But honestly giving the phage to the GK doesn’t make as much sense

pastel rampart
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Yeah.

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It's one of those "this could be it" things, which is a lot more fun than giving a definitive answer.

thin ibex
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void shields and presumably other shielding blocks teleports

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to the ocmment above about teleporting in

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the throne room almost guaranteed has its own independent void shields

paper bluff
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Iirc

thin ibex
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Well, generally, a teleport assault on a vessel can't happen until the shields are dropped

still warren
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look all I know is new lore is Kesh (femstodes so this is pretty recent) tried winning the bloodgames by teleporting a cyclonic torpedo into the throne room and was only stopped when a shield captain boarded the ship

thin ibex
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If teleport assaults worked on the palace horus and khorne's army wouldn't have assaulted the front gates

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Not sure if there are void shields for sure, but there's something making it a non option

floral herald
bright dove
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I'd assme that Void Shields are very much DAoT stuff.

floral herald
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Teleport jamming is also a thing outside of void shields

thin ibex
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Apparently the imperial palace also has null shields, the emperor himself destabilized warp stuff in a radius around himself, and there are other defenses

floral herald
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The traitors did kinda successfully teleport into the palace with all of the damage to reality and warped space going on but that doesn’t count

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Thought I think a hypothetical terminus decree operation is gonna look more like the GK hunting down the starchild somewhere remote and going back to Terra or jumping into the apocalypse where the planet used to be

main pagoda
main pagoda
crimson solar
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sorry I had to

cinder wraith
jaunty dawn
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Apparently gw has a bat now

pine matrix
west zealot
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I like the teroy the terminus decree is just a way for emps to get hand delivered a bunch of really high quality psyker souls when he's probably gonna be real hungry

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(Tbh, i do not actually like this reveal much at all, but it is what it is etc)

floral herald
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I think it’s funny that people are interpreting it is “yeah he’s just gonna stand up for no reason”

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Though I think that theory in particular is dumb because it completely doesn’t understand the reason for the soul sacrifice haha

bright dove
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Might be there because of the fact that it could be the Dark King standing up, not the Emperor.

floral herald
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If that happens the GK probably don’t have time to open the box

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Since it probably means the great project of the heresy delayed so long comes to fruition and chaos completes itself or whatever was gonna happen exactly

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My feeling is the decree is most likely to be used to prevent a new emperor from arising

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Starchild stuff basically

junior robin
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he is also quite usefull as a lightower in the warp/cork in the door to the earth webway

floral herald
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Tbf a walking unwounded emperor could do all that just fine

junior robin
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maybe asking the emperor to just sit back down could work.

floral herald
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you gotta go back to the broken eternal torture machine pops

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Kaldo Draigo to the Starchild circa M43

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thin ibex
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would big becoming a warp god break his perpetualness?

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big e*

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or would there then be a warp emperor and a resurrected emperor?

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i could see how that would be a problem

floral herald
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At least at the time of the HH if The Dark King manifests from the emperor there’s just briefly the warp god (no mortal left) and then nothing

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Since TDK is the self destructive end of chaos

pulsar cairn
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Whats TDK?

desert jay
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If a sane and cognizant Emperor gets healed and wakes up he's probably just going to keep sitting there and start giving instructions on fixing shit

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What's a harder fix job to instruct people on? The literal mountain of machinery that he's sitting on, that he built but only he knew how it fully worked and has been constantly tinkered with over ten thousand years by people with half an understanding? Or the socio-political structure of the Imperium?

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Wait this is just Emperor TTS with less jokes

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"Fine, get me the Fabricator General of Mars and the smartest tech-priest you know of" "Shouldn't those be the same guy?" "You'd think so, wouldn't you?"

mental birch
paper bluff
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Hey now! There's more than tech priests in there

finite compass
# pulsar cairn Whats TDK?

'The Dark King.' The theoretical fifth Chaos God that the Emperor either literally is/will be, or is the lynchpin for. The Potential Chaos God of self-destruction, and the drive to annihilation without reason or aim.

pulsar cairn
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sounds scary

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still, would be really cool to see

finite compass
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It amuses me how much this sounds like Malal.

finite compass
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pq-6aj9sNvo

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If the Emperor had a Text-to-Speech Device Short 4: Decius breaks t...

Decius explains to his Cardinals that Emps isn't actually the god they thought he was.

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▶ Play video
untold swallow
main pagoda
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thats uh

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not an STG44

runic swallow
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I think it’s an HK rifle I can’t remember the name of

pastel rampart
junior robin
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"scrap code, not even once"

paper bluff
untold swallow
floral herald
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I think it’s an action figure rifle which looks vaguely like one

main pagoda
pulsar cairn
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Dakka

untold swallow
main pagoda
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different mag different forward sight assembly different ejection and notably polymer

floral herald
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This gun is plastic

main pagoda
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well yeah its a toy gun lol

runic swallow
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It kinda looks like a slightly goofed G3 tbh

jagged dawn
charred bridge
pastel rampart
storm schooner
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I think the term assault intercessor is a bit violent. Better make sure you can only purchase those in Cash

upper bluff
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Visiting Intercessors would be much more advertiser and payment processor friendly

mental birch
upper bluff
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Lol that's why I'm so scared of buying anything with a flight stand

crimson solar
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it probably sucks to be a dreadnought within the emperors children, right?

floral herald
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I didn’t save it though shucks

tired cairn
west zealot
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Generally speaking, you're not having a good time.

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Except for Ravered, the Raving Dreadnought. He's only ever having a good time

thin ibex
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So mechanics wise, chaos has no Dreadnoughts. But narratively some legions do right?

upper bluff
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Yeah, in lore most chaos legions use whatever loyalist tech they can get their hands on

tired cairn
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Helbrutes are basically dreadnoughts

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I guess there are legions that don't basically constantly torture their dreadnought pilots?

floral herald
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It’s not unheard of

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My general understanding is that being in a dreadnought is torturous but if you’re a loyalist space marine you probably love pain and duty

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So it’s a sacred torment

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Chaos space marines have broken free of that conditioning and wanna have fun and kill people since they’re still all screwed up

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So being in a dreadnought sucks ass

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So chaos space marines use it as a punishment detail which incentivizes making it worse

pulsar holly
soft willow
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If being in a Dreadnaught is torture, then some of the EC probably aim for it as a lifestyle choice, if we're answering the original question.

pulsar cairn
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They got something better

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Hellbrutes

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Those are horror guaranteed

upper canopy
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This would in fact be even worse for a EC

floral herald
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It is also aiui kind of physically uncomfortable

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But probably not in the cool extreme way they like

upper bluff
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I assume once they get to the Helbrute phase of chaos dreadnought that will all change

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Slaanesh demons gets melded into a dreadnought partially and decides to be chill for the bit seems unlikely

junior robin
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So on what side of "put the emperor back on the throne" would the sisters be? 🤔

upper canopy
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I think if the Emperor stood up, no matter what, it would result in a devastating civil war with most institutions split evenly

junior robin
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Feels like with their bad luck, the lamnenters would be the only chapter to get the order to stop the grey knights

floral herald
# upper bluff Slaanesh demons gets melded into a dreadnought partially and decides to be chill...

be slaanesh daemon in the warp
causing excessive problems, shit is cash
keeper of secrets says you gotta possess a dreadnought now, some asshole got enough slaanesh funbux
wtfyes.gif
imagine being the cause of grief in the materium for a while
KoS says you gotta be chill actually do and say nothing
wtfno
do it, not looking to get Masque’d this millennium
helbrute pilot gets really really mad and then helplessly despondent
sup deeply it’s all worth it

bright dove
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Actually you know, the Grey Knights must really look askew at Thorian Inquisitors.

upper canopy
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I mean like, the Grey Knights don't know about the Terminus Decree

upper bluff
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Yeah they're only supposed to look when the Imperium is in danger, right?

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Which if emps standing up is chill enough at first could lead to the hilarious event of learning what the terminus decree is years after they were supposed to have done it

floral herald
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Only the company captain equivalent and up even know it exists and idk who among them know what it says

upper bluff
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Honestly the only person who knows what it says should be Kaldor Drago

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Not for any real reason

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Just because I love the image of Kaldor Drago assaulting the imperial palace by himself long before the rest of the Grey Knights read the decree

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Kaldor Draigo has been living in the walls of the imperial palace ever since Guilliman came back anticipating Emps return

desert jay
upper bluff
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Oh Kaldor Draigo is the supreme grandmaster lol

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Sometimes I forget that he isn't just some absurdly powerful wizard knight roaming the warp

desert jay
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I bet the other GKs don't even know what the box is

upper bluff
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Wooden box with a "do not touch" sign hanging from it

desert jay
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It's just another artifact safely stowed in the vaults on Titan, and half the other stuff in those vaults is possessed daemon shit

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So you don't just go opening random boxes in the vaults on Titan

thin ibex
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Do is only for Draigo but also Draigo can't leave the warp for longer than a little at a time and he doesn't really choose where

jaunty dawn
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I think the terminus decree reveal is good tbh

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since like

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it adds a (small) new dimension to the faction

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like I think reveals can suck when they're just like. duh

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basically what I'm getting at is I think the revealed answer is more interesting than the mystery box

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because it's like a motivation/purpose/idk that doesn't really exist anywhere else in the imperium, so it's a new thing

floral herald
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Yeah I agree

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I think it's weird how there's a bunch of people who seem to genuinely not like it

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Admittedly this is 40k twitter and if the 40k fandom was all 40k twitter I wouldn't be a fan of the game tbh

jaunty dawn
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ye

runic swallow
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Some people just like getting bent out of shape

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Which is honestly just true for the internet generally

upper canopy
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Part of it feels like people are power scaling the Talons a bit

upper bluff
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Oh absolutely

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Like if your biggest problem with it is that the Grey Knights couldn't beat Custodes you're thinking about it all wrong

bright dove
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Who's ready for HORUS! HERESY! 2!

pulsar cairn
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Horus heresy 2? vicksyAww pls explain!

upper bluff
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Honestly I could kinda see GW pulling a massive shakeup like that

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Or do you just mean the new edition lol

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If Mourge meant "the Terminus Decree is setting up a massive shakeup in the lore where something let's the Emperor 'wakeup' and that causes a massive schism in the imperium acting as an additional explanation for why the imperium armies would fight (aside from the fact the imperium's politics are insane)" then yeah I could see that happening one day. If Mourge meant "new Horus Heresy edition" then that's something I'm not as excited for

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Like one-day ill probably make a mechanicum Horus Heresy army

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Just not anytime soon

past sphinx
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yall im fightin the elves tomorrow and ive never done that before

upper bluff
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AoS or do you mean Aeldar?

past sphinx
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i have no idea what a fire dragon does but theres gonna be 15 of them

upper bluff
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Oh Fire Dragons are melta units

past sphinx
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MY KIND OF ARMY

upper bluff
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Yeah they're cool and even cooler ever since they had a model refresh

floral herald
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oops all meltas guys yeah

upper bluff
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Think of them kinda like hyper mobile Primaris Exterminators

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I think both have anti vehicle rules

finite compass
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I'm just remembeirng that one post

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"So what do you do as a Fire Dragon."
"You get a meltagun."
"What are your tactics?"
"Everybody around you gets a meltagun."
"Is the training hard?"
"Meltagun."
"Oh, right."

upper bluff
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Fire Dragons have the immense privilege of holding a hot stick

rocky shale
rocky shale
bright dove
jaunty dawn
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I think also like the chances of the gk succeeding feels besides the point

upper bluff
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Yeah it's not if they can win it's what happens when they try

pastel rampart
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The mystery box had its appeal but having a definitive answer does spur a lot of discussion about "well okay how would they even attempt this," "what happens when they try to do this," "how would they even succeed" and finally "what happened to the anti-astartes phage, who the fuck has that thing"

upper bluff
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EC has been doing whippits with the phage

pastel rampart
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That or Bile got his sticky fingers on it.

sour sequoia
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I’ll be real terminus decree has been the first time since the 5th ed codex I’ve thought Grey Knights had a reason to exist in the setting

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Cannot think of one time prior where their inclusion was ‘oh shit thats cool/neat’ and not ‘oh god dammit the Specialest Chrome Guys are here again I guess’

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Custodes as the emp’s personal rep and the Grey Knights as last argument of imperial status quo is lit

charred bridge
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Terminus decree is setting up heresy 2 electric boogaloo and 40k 2 Age of Sigmar but sci-fi Emperor

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Grey Knights would need mega support cause they'd lose against Custodes by themselves. To me it'd make sense of multiple factions received the note independently to put them on even grounds but I'm guessing they're keeping it open ended to draw whatever faction to each side

past sphinx
upper canopy
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See I used to disdain Grey knights

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I actually still do

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However the custodes are involved

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And thus I am instantly rooting for the Grey knights

floral herald
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I think it's kinda neat to have some potential beef between the most elite space marines and the custodes

charred bridge
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Sisters of silence would have a word about psykers

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A bunch of them severely nerfed magnus

upper canopy
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The Grey knights do have guns tbf

charred bridge
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Sisters of silence are very used to enemies having guns

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Custodes protecting sisters would also be big

upper canopy
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I think it'd be the other way around

charred bridge
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Custodes can handle primarus psykers fine

upper canopy
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I will say

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They never retconned the couple of Harlequins that made it to the Throne

pastel rampart
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What might give the GK the edge in this theoretical situation is how much power they can pull from the Inquisition. Like I don't imagine they'd go in alone with just 1,000 marines, and the =I= can pull some real wild tech out of the garage if they wanted to.

upper canopy
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It wasn't even a full troupe

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it was like 10 guys

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So the Custodes are actually historically bad at keeping out a group of hyper-mobile psykers

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from making it to the Emperor

floral herald
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In a hypothetical showdown which suddenly happens with no other things happening (which I think is unlikely) the GK probably struggle because they're assaulting an extremely fortified position and outnumbered at least 10 to 1

charred bridge
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Yea 1000 Grey knights vs 10000 Custodes

floral herald
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Admittedly all they need to do really is get to 2 places

charred bridge
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It's very lop sided unless other factions get involved and traitors do an alpha strike to severely weaken the loyalists like horus heresy. Which I think makes it more interesting, who sides with status quo vs change

floral herald
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And they've got the most reliable prognostication services in the Imperium, exceptional strategic mobility (probably the best in the Imperium) and are relatively low on Foolish Hangups

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So I wouldn't count them out even in that situation

tall depot
upper canopy
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The Emperor gave them a direct order

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if he ever gets off the throne

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the Grey Knights have to put him back

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by any means necessary

tall depot
#

Oh shit

#

I agree, that's pretty interesting

charred bridge
#

Cawl inferior and roberto had a conversation about it

#

If the emperor came back what gets out of the throne might not be the same as what day down

#

Cause apparently each psyker sacrifice gets added of screams as a chorus to the emp's. Which over 10k years

floral herald
#

Though I think that's less likely than like, a reincarnation or something appearing

charred bridge
#

Conversely the Custodes might sense that's not the real emps in a weird loophole

upper canopy
#

What do the Custodes do if the Emperor orders them to kill himself

floral herald
#

they kill him

charred bridge
#

If it is the real emps then Custodes would stand down immediately

floral herald
#

and probably self destruct while doing it

charred bridge
#

If there's a twist like technically what sat up isn't triggering their "must listen to emps" innate whatever it could go both ways

#

The meme answer is "emps told them to pretend it's not him when he gets off the throne to make the GK note more legitimate" cause he foresaw it

upper bluff
#

Emps doesn't know that we know that he would tell the custodes not to know

#

In all seriousness though I assume that if this were to happen we would see a 50/50ish split in the custodes between "I don't feel compelled to listen so it's not him" and "that doesn't prove anything"

floral herald
#

Custodes civil war would rip

upper bluff
#

Honestly a Custodes Schism is awesome to think about

#

I'm just imagining the like weird proto custodes that could become a thing if that happened

still warren
# past sphinx

About to fuse 1000 powerful psykers to take his place on the Golden throne

upper canopy
#

I would love if they split the Imperium in half again

#

BALKANIZE IT

#

DO IT COWARDS

upper bluff
#

If 1000 grey knights was all it took to sit on the throne that would be such a copout

still warren
#

I mean how many shamans did it take to make big e?

past sphinx
#

i mean big E is gonna need a helluva breakfest after 10000 years of fasting

#

breakfast

#

hate that word

floral herald
#

Would he?

upper bluff
#

To be fair to the shamans they didn't just fuse themselves but like 10000 years worth of psychics too

floral herald
#

I thought the 1000 psykers a day were to keep the throne on

upper canopy
#

Yeah

upper bluff
#

Oh I think Atlas means literal food lol

still warren
#

1000 shitty psykers a day though

upper bluff
#

Skeleton stands up and the first thing he asks for is a BLT

still warren
#

Regardless that's why I like the new lore, still more questions than answers

past sphinx
#

well not saturn

#

but close enough

floral herald
upper bluff
#

I've got myself all excited over the ideas of a custodes schism leading to less conventional custodes being born to fill in the ranks of each faction

#

Like "we don't have the time to MasterCraft a super warrior we need more soldiers"

charred bridge
#

Basically the age of Sigmar but for 40k

upper bluff
#

I severely doubt we'll see a split in 11th but it certainly seems possible

charred bridge
#

Maybe we'll see back some loyalist primarchs

upper bluff
#

Remember that old fake leak for 10th about Cawl and Guilliman splitting off from the imperium

charred bridge
#

I was worried you were gonna say that conversation between cawl and Girlyman was fake cause that's a load bearing lore for me

upper bluff
#

Oh lol a little bit more important than a joke about the baneblade

charred bridge
#

The one where cawl inferior says what gets up might not be what sits down, and how all gods, whether they mean to or not, are a blight on existence. The emp's truly becoming what he hated would be interesting

#

And how thoughts alter reality, 10k of almost every human believing what sits on the throne to be a literal god

upper bluff
#

The only issue with emps standing up is just how crazy it would be for nearly 40 years of corpse god in the setting to change

#

Like that's the 40k thing

charred bridge
#

Well terminus decree seems to suggest that might change

upper bluff
#

I can absolutely see some writers at GW having so much fun about the idea but marketing must be terrified

charred bridge
#

And it's not unprecedented with fantasy Warhammer, a reset with age of signar I'd argue is bigger than emps standing up

past sphinx
#

emperor stands up and everything gets way way worse

upper bluff
#

That's true but I feel like the end times is just another point on the side of them not doing it

upper bluff
charred bridge
#

It doesn't have to be end times if emps stood up

upper bluff
#

Gloves come off from every faction 100% if that happens

charred bridge
#

Like civil war would put things in neutral

#

Big progress big E standing up, big set back from basically cutting imperium in half and the loyal half being in shambles

upper bluff
#

Yeah I guess it wouldn't quite be end times level but I just mean more so upsetting the status quo seems unlikely from a business standpoint

charred bridge
#

It's actually a good idea for many works of fiction

#

New things cause new players to come in

upper bluff
#

Absolutely, I hope they do it, but I can absolutely understand if higher ups are scared

charred bridge
#

Like a major DLC drop brings in a ton for games, a new codex for 40k, a whole big twist like this? Huge. Even a little drop like terminus decree did

#

They're scared until profits is low then they want ideas

upper bluff
#

There is one massive question though. If Emps stands up who gets the model?

charred bridge
#

New faction /s

upper bluff
#

Probably 😦

#

At the same time though Custodes Avatar of the Emperor would go hard

charred bridge
#

Primaris Custodes when /s

upper bluff
#

Honestly I would love for a custodes schism to have both side having access to emperor avatars where both sides think theirs is the real one

charred bridge
#

Or ultraprimaris ultramarines /s

upper canopy
#

Listen

#

I would love if the Emperor became one of the main settting antagonists as an insane zombie that's lauded by the Imperium as their savior returned

#

but it's just this gibbering fucked up abomination

charred bridge
#

A custodes civil war split would be interesting if it's revealed Custodes weren't mind controlled to obey the emp's fully just never harm him. So there could be traitor Custodes that kind the false emps is using his image to prevent the Custodes from attacking him

upper bluff
#

Yeah exactly. Its not a secret that a lot of people don't like Custodes and I think this could be good for them

#

Make them a little less perfect

charred bridge
#

I like Custodes more than I like named ultramarines, only cause the latter gets too much rep which I understand is a branding thing

#

But Custodes have the nice tidbits of lore where they basically suffer ultra depression like Roberto

upper bluff
#

I like that Custodes have hobbies

charred bridge
#

And how they're more than warriors being scholars, philosophers, and artists of mad proportions

upper bluff
#

It's why I like the Salamanders too

charred bridge
#

Salamanders I love how they still see their parents

upper bluff
#

Like yeah you're 9'5" and can run 100 miles per hour but you do pottery in your downtime

#

Good for you 🙂

past sphinx
#

i based my custodes on the turbodepressed HH veterans

#

surviving 40k long enough to see everything go completely to shit is interesting

upper canopy
#

My dislike of a faction in 40k is proportional to how powercrept they are

upper bluff
#

You know what fair

#

2+ saves and 4+ invuln on everyone is enough to drive anyone insane

upper canopy
#

Emperor > Custodes > Grey Knights > First Founding Legions > Regular Marines > everyone else

charred bridge
#

They got the ultra imposter syndrome

charred bridge
upper bluff
#

My first game of 2000 point 40k was Admech (me) vs grey knights (my friend) this was like 6 months into 10th and it was painful

charred bridge
#

6 dudes that can never be pushed off the objective and just succeed everything

#

In lore I like them

past sphinx
#

the secret to killing custodes is bolt guns

upper canopy
#

My Chaos Knights absolutely dunked my friend's GKs

#

I felt really bad

past sphinx
#

not melta or las cannons or anything fancy, just slap the fuckers with a boltguns and they will fizzle out

#

heavy bolters or the heavy bolter rifle things work great to

upper bluff
#

Custodes are hard to balance on the tabletop because the fantasy is that you have like at most 30 dudes who can take on entire armies

floral herald
#

If you make them save enough they will scratch out on 1s eventually

upper bluff
#

Then the 30 dudes just ends up being really swingy where they either never get hurt and survive lascannons and assault canons to the face

#

Or they get 1 tapped

#

The less dudes you have the more likely the dice can ruin your day

past sphinx
#

hit em with da vindicator

upper bluff
#

Custodes might be the one faction in 10th that heavy bolters would excel against

#

What other imperium armies would a civil war be fun in?

#

I guess sisters?

#

Like what would Celestine think seeing emps stand up

past sphinx
#

i think the assassinorum would essentially instantly mexican standoff eachother to death

upper bluff
#

I feel like everyone in the assassinorium would have some sort of dead man's switch that says kill my rival

#

And it would just be a huge dominoes of assassinations

#

Also a civil war would be a fun time to make the inquisition an actual thing on the tabletop

charred bridge
#

Ordos Chronos would be a funny one

#

They're already civil warring

upper bluff
#

You even saying that just proves how much room there is for imperial agents to be cool

charred bridge
#

The meme answer is the civil war was caused by whether the ordos Chronos believes emps staying on the throne or leaving it but causing abject chaos is better

#

Ngl imperial agents were the most interesting for ne

#

I love the bolter porn associated with astartes but it's not what keeps me interested, it's the human stories interacting with seeming demi-gods astartes briefly and knowing those dudes are like one shot by some Necrons

past sphinx
#

to the ordo chronos the emperor is both on and off the throne

charred bridge
#

Both and neither at the same time

upper bluff
#

Oh that's such a cool idea

charred bridge
#

Never ask an Ordo Chronos inquisitor what year it is

upper bluff
#

Like they haven't chosen a side in the civil war they just kinda walk in and if they're not shooting you they're on your side

#

"Oh they must be from earlier"

charred bridge
#

Cause you know if emps got up, he'd go for the inquisitors first probably

#

Since they're so far removed from what malcador originally intended

gray basalt
#

I don't think so, Big E is above all else a pragmatist

charred bridge
#

Or rather what if cause maldacor sat on the throne followed by E, they sort of fused and are in conflict

gray basalt
#

He'd probably cull a few but he'd use most of them

upper bluff
#

I feel like it wouldn't be that simple just because if they want to make it kinda ambiguous if Big E is himself they would have to make him not just instantly decommission them

gray basalt
#

Even if he was fully himself he wouldn't decommission them

upper bluff
#

If they want to make it obvious this is something else he would probably kiss them metaphorically on the mouth

gray basalt
#

Big E is a fundamentally evil person he just is evil for humanity's sake

charred bridge
#

Probably, some of the inquisitors tread a fine line

upper bluff
#

A real "I do this because I love you"

charred bridge
upper bluff
#

I'm not an expert on Big E but I feel like any named inquisitors who are kinda ok with experimenting would be chill for him

#

Like that one who uses the shuriken rifle he would probably think would be useful

gray basalt
#

Big E is weird bc he shifts himself to fit what people expect of him but he also has at least some control over what people see

#

So like some of the Primarchs will see him as an honorable king, where Arkhan Land sees the quintessential scientist who calls everyone including his sons tools

#

All versions are a little true

upper bluff
#

Again I really hope that if they do a major shakeup like this that the writers are having fun with it

#

There's so many ways they can do this

#

Like I can't even begin to think how the Admech would react

#

Like it would obviously be similar to everyone else but what would actually happen?

#

Like what happens when a sectors forge world stays loyal to the emperor in a system doubting his rule

#

That's such a cool space to explore

charred bridge
#

Same, 30k stuff was my favorite cause of how human the conflicts were

#

And to have that again but in 40k would be great imo

#

It isn't just chaos God's manipulating everything, these would be human actions that might not even actually involve chaos whatsoever

upper bluff
#

It wouldn't even be that hard to tie the xeno factions into this as well

#

Just have the psychic waves wake up a load of necrons, attract a bunch of Tyranids, and brainblast a bunch of aeldar

#

Then the Tau can have a humanitarian crisis occurring next door

floral herald
bright dove
#

Honestly, the tau would love another giant Imperial Civil War.

#

Because boy can they Market with that opportunity.

upper bluff
#

The only thing about an imperium civil war that I struggle to imagine is any of the loyalist primarchs being on opposite sides

#

Like unless something massive happened to some of them I couldn't imagine them willfully fighting

runic swallow
#

It depends on context, especially if you do a Came Back Wrong situation

floral herald
#

Tbf there’s just 2 and they’re not that close

upper bluff
#

Yeah, maybe Guilliman and El Johnson but I feel like they're way too level headed to fight again

charred bridge
#

Everyone forgets Khan

upper bluff
#

Like Guilliman is Guilliman and El Johnson has this whole "I'm old and mellowed out" thing going on

runic swallow
#

Corax is out there somewhere

#

Vulkan is waiting for the salamanders to finish the geocaching game he set up

upper bluff
#

Doesnt Corax try and break into Lorgar's tower every few decades

charred bridge
#

Vulkan in the 40000th gulag match

charred bridge
upper bluff
#

Ok this is kinda out there but Lorgar and the Word Bearers coming back to the imperium because the Emperor now accepts their worship

#

Word Bearers have kinda been getting shafted recently

#

And that would add a primarch to the hypothetical "came back wrong" emperors side

charred bridge
#

Lorgar trying to put emps back on throne to keep him a god

upper bluff
#

I could see that too

pastel rampart
#

Robby G and Lion are loyalists, if not to the core than for practical reasons; same with Vulkan. Dorn, probably the same, but who even knows what's been happening to him and him returning could get kind of weird depending on how GW goes about it. Khan is potentially in this camp too.

Russ is something of a wildcard and I could see him taking a stand against the imperium on principle, especially if he catches up on what's happened since he was gone (Months of Shame would tick him off). Corax is possibly too warped and bugfuck crazy from turning into a warp bird to even consider sides beyond "must rip and tear Lorgar's guts out."

#

Corax is a single-issue voter and that issue is shoving Lorgar into a locker.

runic swallow
#

Khan was always a bit independent, I could see him doing his own thing

pastel rampart
#

Yeah. He just gathers the rest of the White Scars and rides off into the webway or something.

charred bridge
#

Khan would pick the right side

#

What it is and why no clue

charred bridge
gray basalt
#

Khan and Lion both I could see doing a rebellion

#

Corax should've been a traitor in the first place idk why he chose big E

gray basalt
paper bluff
upper bluff
#

It would be really cool especially since Lorgar is kinda... boring for a daemon primarch

#

Like obviously they can write whatever lore they want but the current stuff that exists isn't a lot

gray basalt
#

I'd dislike Lorgar turning heel like that

floral herald
#

If Lorgar comes back he should be like the “chaos emperor” IMO

#

Dude has spent the last 10,000 years studying chaos and enuncia and inventing new forbidden cultivation techniques to try

#

He’s gotta be like STUPID strong now

upper bluff
#

I agree that is all stupidly cool but like the same could be said about all the primarchs

floral herald
#

Not most of em!

#

Fulgrim’s been fucked off on super vacation

upper bluff
#

Like if the Kahn came back we would assume that 10,000 years of Drukharii raiding would make him a double badass

floral herald
#

Angron’s just brainworms these days

upper bluff
#

True all of them wasn't quite right

#

But he wouldn't be alone in having a time skip training arc

floral herald
#

Corax is just a sad bird

floral herald
gray basalt
#

Problem I see rn is idk what Lorgar's drive is, like he tried to be the arch traitor and failed also he probably still loves his brothers and probably still doesn't want to hurt them so like I only really see him spreading the good word

upper bluff
#

Yeah that's why I think Lorgar going back to Emperor worship would be neat for him and the Word Bearers. The role of Chaos Undivided champions of the gods is already done by Abaddon and the Black Legion

#

And soup factions are basically dead so they wouldn't even be the daemon summoning legion

#

Just cultists I guess

gray basalt
#

I could see him maybe trying to force Big E to become a warp entity on par with the chaos gods

floral herald
#

Or believes he has anyway

upper bluff
#

Oh that is a good point. Lorgar joins the "I'm manipulating chaos not the other way around" party bus

#

Except maybe he's right

floral herald
#

Or is

#

Yeah

#

Keep it ambiguous probably

gray basalt
#

Eh Lorgar really likes believing in a higher power so unless he believes in a different god I don't see him slipping from chaos god belief

#

Or maybe he becomes a god

#

I wonder what would happen then

upper bluff
#

Anyways yeah this entire discussion is based on if the Terminus Decree is foreshadowing and not just a divisive lore addition

gray basalt
#

Would be funny if the Terminus decree is 40k's end times into AoS

upper bluff
#

Like there has been plenty pointing towards a massive shakeup in the universe but this could just not be one of them

#

I seriously doubt that they will straight up reboot 40k

#

The end times was super controversial for fantasy because as some people here have said ending an entire universe of characters with them just dying is rough

#

Like that DC crisis on infinite earths thing where they killed all the other universes is a great example of just how rough that can be

gray basalt
#

Agreed

upper bluff
#

Now we wait I guess

#

Like no guarantee this actually happens in 11th

#

This could be 12th foreshadowing or it could be nothing

gray basalt
#

I'll be poking my head into the Warhammer situation here and there bc I like the setting but I kinda stopped playing all the games

#

Except Blood Bowl

#

Unless they change how blood bowl plays I will always play that

upper bluff
#

You know you're not the first person I've met who's said that lol

#

Blood Bowl is way more popular than I think huh

charred bridge
upper bluff
#

Warhammer 40K Terminus is a hard ass name honestly

gray basalt
upper bluff
#

Yeah I remember seeing the gnome team with the big goose

charred bridge
gray basalt
#

Oh and if they brought back BFG but kept the rules similar to the OG stuff I'd play that too

rocky shale
#

I think it would be a softer reboot than AoS tho

#

40k players would riot if their armies just got deleted

upper bluff
#

Absolutely. There would be riots in the streets if they erased everything

rocky shale
#

Just like a big lore shakeup but not much else

gray basalt
#

I love me some fleet combat wargames

upper bluff
#

I would also play BFG if it returned

#

Hopefully they take advantage of the huge boom in everything Warhammer to bring back some of the older discontinued things

gray basalt
#

I alas don't think they will

upper bluff
#

Its the tragedy of liking something produced by a publicly traded company. They are literally required by law to not take cool risks like that 😔

gray basalt
#

I don't blame them, fleet combat games usually fail which is a shame bc they are all cool

thin ibex
#

the thing about lorgar returning to the fold to worship big E is that the imperium wouldnt buy it because he's so extra. Somewhere between the blood and skin decorations and the tasteful addition of spikes to all things, they'd go 'wait a minute

upper bluff
#

Probably but what if the huge resurrected God Emperor welcomed him back with a smile

muted elm
#

honestly I want an imperial civil war/disintegration arc to happen...and for humanity to be Just Fine. break the myth that the imperium is necessary for Human survival or useful for Human wellbeing

upper bluff
#

"yeah he turned my brother's spine into a ritual spear but god said he's chill"

gray basalt
#

Iirc Lorgar's demon Primarch form is supposed to look like Big E but also super angelic but idr if that's a canon source

upper bluff
upper bluff
gray basalt
#

He has always been in my top 5 Primarchs after reading first heretic

west zealot
paper bluff
gray basalt
#

I believe everyone spawns faster than Morty bc the rest probably actually enjoy at least a little of what they do

upper canopy
#

Yes Angron respawns in like

#

8 days

#

Whatever the khorne number is

runic swallow
#

It’s 8

#

7 is nurgle, 9 is Tzeentch, 6 is Slannesh iirc

upper canopy
#

Then yeah

#

Angron stays down for 8 days

west zealot
#

Khorne apprently decided that the human week was pretty cool and workable around

runic swallow
west zealot
#

Khorne is just really into Human Time.

upper canopy
#

I defeat angron permanently by turning all the eights to the side

gray basalt
#

Also Tzeentch and Nurgle both claim 3 as a second holy number

#

They fight about it a lot

runic swallow
#

I love stupid bullshit like that

humble plover
pastel rampart
gray basalt
#

Big E would never bring love, that's clearly a demon in disguise

charred bridge
pastel rampart
rocky shale
#

Oh wow votann preorders already

soft willow
main pagoda
#

"The box includes a Leagues of Votann transfer sheet comprising 555 decals."

#

god mfering damn thats alot of decals

valid brook
#

Nice round number

west zealot
#

I really like the steeljack's design

#

And the data priest ironkin

pulsar cairn
#

Think they planning something with this Terminus decree lore?

upper bluff
#

Maybe. Last night there was a pretty long discussion about it

#

Both cool ideas for if they do and reasons why they might not

#

Honestly my biggest reason why I think it might happen is that Custodes are kinda boring. So if the Emperor stood up, "came back wrong", and caused a split in the imperium then there could be a cool plot of Custodes having to grapple about disobeying or obeying their creator

runic swallow
#

Personally I think it’s just a neat little lore bit but they could potentially spiral it out into a bigger thing

#

But if they do I really hope they finally Balkanize the Imperium

floral herald
main pagoda
#

its one of those "Wouldn't it be cool if this happened things "

floral herald
#

Yeah there’s a lot of tidbits and what ifs and random color strewn throughout the codexes and GW isn’t like the MCU or something with an overall narrative plan really

#

So it’s not so much like “setting up the next arc” so much as another neat little thing and excuse for imperial blue-on-blue or a bit of mythmaking or

sonic hare
floral herald
#

Command point tax

#

I guess

upper canopy
#

We know if it's gonna be plot relevant if it's in a Black Library novel that gets a suspicious amount of marketing

#

not if it's in a codex

sonic hare
#

giving players a base 85% chance for something really good and important to happen and a 15% chance for nothing to happen grinds my game design bones into dust

main pagoda
#

its just how revives work in 40k

rocky shale
#

Fuegan does the same

sour sequoia
#

No guaranteed revives outside GSC and Necrons

upper canopy
#

you can gurantee any troop revives if you're quick enough

sour sequoia
#

Oh fuck Voy’s learning my strats

sour sequoia
#

Necrons and GSC have it as an army mechanic and its profoundly contentious even when their units aren’t necessarily good otherwise

main pagoda
sonic hare
#

im more looking at it as this is a single character, once per battle, presumably balanced around showing up twice, so why not just give it to him

#

grumbling aside i really like the look of these dorfs, and i would pick this up if i ever decided to pick up a second army

sour sequoia
#

Guaranteed rez can often mean people will simply stop bothering to kill - trying to fight guilliman in a one phase army is a nightmare

sonic hare
#

so its hope, then

rocky shale
#

Yeah it being swingy makes it feel more fair on the other end

sonic hare
#

gw designing around the "i saw that healthbar move, it can bleed, it can die" sickos

rocky shale
#

A guaranteed revive is basically just double wounds but better

sour sequoia
#

my ass piling 50 autostubber shots into deathwing knights

main pagoda
#

Angron is the only thing with a infinite revive afaik

pulsar cairn
#

i mean demons already have infinite revive wixelsSit but he's got the good one!

#

do you think Khorne does that just to torture him?

#

i feel like while he's being rebuilt he at least gets a timeout from the pain wixelsICANNOT but Khorne just brings him right back to the fight telling him to do MORE

main pagoda
#

he very explicitly is never free from the pain of the nails now

#

post demon hood

#

on the topic of revives you can cuck people out of them with correct spacing

upper canopy
floral herald
past sphinx
#

the elves rocked my shit

#

but i have a solution

sour sequoia
#

Genestealer profiles definitely butcher elves

#

I feel like 3x5 suits you better than 3x10 tho, easier to hide

charred bridge
#

Imagine emps comes back but decides not to stand up

#

Throne comfy, has tasty thousand psykers a day

#

TTS emps is what comes out of the throne, the psychic imprints of 1000 psykers a day for 10k years to the throne had unintended consequences

rocky shale
#

I did not know this model existed

image.png
#

Bro's just hanging on the hood of the car

west zealot
#

Some models are better than others

gray basalt
#

For Chaos Knights crusade rules do you need 1 big knight or can I get away with all war dogs? Don't really care about how good it is, just wanna know if I can use all the crusade rules

rocky shale
gray basalt
#

Damn

rocky shale
#

The dark boons and idolator offerings are only for titanic

#

Granted, the war dog buffs are incredibly good, but you can still do like a 2-3 big knight list with plenty of dogs

gray basalt
#

Eh I don't like the big knights much

#

But maybe I'll take one just to use the stuff

rocky shale
#

The big knights do provide useful buff auras to the dogs

#

And technically you can still run them in houndpack lance if you want to be that focused on dogs

gray basalt
#

Yeeeee

rocky shale
#

Infernal lance is also a fantastic option for like a 3/6 bigs/dogs list

#

The iconoclast upgrades on the big knights can get super silly though and its very fun

#

My double gatling despoiler just have ignores cover on everything. My tyrant has a 4++ invuln and -1 incoming damage

pastel rampart
pulsar cairn
#

this is probably on of the most active threatds in the server i imagine

tall depot
#

i wish black templars weren't so loved by fascists
i always like space marines the most when they lean into the anachronistic sci-fi knight vibe they have sometimes

floral herald
#

Huge mood yeah

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I really like the black templars as well but it’s like

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Eugh I don’t wanna be associated with you

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I dig their focus on vows and ad-hoc knightly orders and how they’re a bunch of zealous assholes

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The most “drippy candle” of the space marines

tall depot
#

dark angels are also up there for similar reasons and i love the almost occult vibe they have
but i kinda hate how basic the greenwing are, they're not knighty enough for me

main pagoda
#

I think my love for BT is purely rooted from Sigismund during the SOT

bright dove
#

I'm trying to remember the claymore using chapter from the Deathwatch RPG.

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Because they're rad.

floral herald
#

Storm Wardens!

thin ibex
#

Oh, are the storm wardens space Scottish?

floral herald
#

Yeah though I wouldn’t say that’s their like totality

bright dove
#

Ye, the storm wardens! They're a cool take on the Knightly Marine archetype.

crimson solar
main pagoda
#

white black and red does just look good

crimson solar
#

I'm still hoping that GW will do something, anything interesting with the iron hands

#

I guess if you want proper feudal knight stuff you have to settle with the imperial knights.

sour sequoia
#

Truly it is 7 chapters of Black And Trim + ultras/imperial fists/white scars

crimson solar
#

sounds miserable

main pagoda
#

you can pick out chapters within the legion that have different trims

floral herald
#

Are HH blood angels not red??

main pagoda
#

they are

floral herald
#

Okay phew

sour sequoia
#

My recollection of Blood Angels is always repressed I deadass forgot they existed

floral herald
#

There’s some weird color changes in HH and that would have really confused me

sour sequoia
#

They are red, just a lil more boring than they are in 40k. No sanguine guard no death company makes em feel Weird

crimson solar
#

aren't the space wolves baby blue in HH?

main pagoda
#

the schemes are as follows
DA: Black red
SA: Green black
WS: White red
BA: Red bronze/gold
SW: Grey/Red
RG: Black white
IH: Black silver
IF: Yellow/Black
UM:Blue gold

main pagoda
#

or well lighter

crimson solar
#

I'd go as far and say this looks a little better. I tend to mix together some slate-ish color when I paint anything space wolf-ish

main pagoda
#

tbh theres very little overlap in HH legion schemes apart from black being the primary colour on 2 loyalists

tired cairn
#

Huh, seems weird there was a color change

crimson solar
#

It makes sense that the color schemes would change a bit over the millennia

south axle
#

"We sadly lost the only planet that could produce this specific shade of grey"

sour sequoia
rocky shale
#

Looks fun

floral herald
#

I think virtually anything would be more interesting than grudge points but I also do like these

gray basalt
#

Tbf DA do the knight order in space more and better than Black Templars

#

Black Templars are more crusader era knights which personally makes me dislike them more

past sphinx
#

black templars would march into the desert without water to fight Saladin 100%

floral herald
#

Ooh

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Orb seems funny

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And life spiraling losing initiative is goated

tired cairn
#

They probably won't, but it'd be nice if they had double copies of the objectives players secretly select

past sphinx
#

one day i will play kill team

thin ibex
#

i havent tried the newest edition

#

but i think its fun

floral herald
#

It’s good stuff

#

The new edition did a lot I liked

deft crest
#

The reroll inia.tive thing right

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I play 2 factions that can force a reroll during those rolls

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and if they just reroll before I get to use it to make them reroll I can't use my command points on it

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Excited to see the other changes though

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I really hope the tomb world isnt a bitch to set up like gallowdark

#

I've only played 3 games of it at all

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because it takes SO LONG to build lmfao

floral herald
#

Real

#

I hope it’s a little more straightforward

tired cairn
#

Hmm, what makes it annoying to setup?

floral herald
#

I’m also hoping there are teleporters

#

I want to play Quake Team 2: Arena

tired cairn
#

If they ever make a teleporty faction, they need to be able to telefrag people

floral herald
#

They kinda did with Mandrakes

#

Though the thematics is less teleporting and more killer shadows

pastel rampart
tired cairn
#

Man, I haven't thought of that map in a long time

#

It's neat how the two building models are the exact same but look so different

pastel rampart
#

I think of it every time I sit and eat a Costco hot dog.

#

But yeah I wanna make a pair of those. Not the inside parts, that's too much of a hassle.

vital barn
#

I'm going through some of the Mechanicum stuff for HH3e and I'm liking it so far

#

outside the HQs, the mech are generally cheaper and squisher than before, but only relatively

#

Castellax went from 120+pts to 75pts, Ursarax are now 25 and 2w, etc.

#

will probably be a less swingy army than 1e, where monstrous creature spam was almost unbeatable

#

there's kind of a shortage of WS5+ or AP3/2, but I think that's been toned back across the board for the marines too, judging by the stock plasma weapon statlines

deft crest
#

Gallowdark is about sections of walls and pillars that fit together VERY tightly and also need to be built in a VERY specific configuration

#

EACH one of those walls is 1~2 peices

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and all get a corner peice that fits on to the other half of their pillars on each side

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And they all have a cap

#

and they all need to be put on CORRECTLY

rocky shale
#

I 3d printed a set of that terrain that isn't nearly as tight of a fit

deft crest
#

I tried printing my own and i fuckin bought it after trying to assemble them once

main pagoda
deft crest
#

nightmare tolerances

vital barn
#

not sure what shred does this edition, still skimming all the books

tired cairn
vital barn
#

wait never mind I just got to Thallax

#

20ppm, phased plasma fusils or photon thrusters on any model for 10-15ppm

#

they're going to blend marines

main pagoda
#

them being ap3 was obnoxious

vital barn
#

mech seems really solid this edition, although obviously this is just first impressions

#

thallax/ursarax/scyllax all being encheapened and moving to 3+/6++ T5 W2 means you can have a lot more models

#

and both ursarax and scyllax have great can-opening melee

main pagoda
#

how about vorax?

vital barn
#

thralls are weirdly expensive at 10ppm, 6+ save, no decent combat capability, but Lacyraerta can regen them like nid screens

#

let me check

#

power blades up to AP3

#

solid S5 AP3 attack count and really fast, but suffering from WS3

#

will have to see how accessible cybertheurgy is for them

#

myrmidons nerfed a bit, WS4/BS4 on non-sarges, but that's fair enough

#

it might be hard to have magi keeping up with the fast stuff, jump/jet packs aren't on the wargear list and magi cap out at 6" move

main pagoda
#

are jet packs in the legacy doc?

#

or rather they might be in the legacy doc

vital barn
#

basically everything that isn't a myrmidon or a techpriest has awful willpower/intelligence, but great Cool

#

no wargear for us in legacy

#

shitty shotgun thralls, decent Arlatax and Termites, annoyingly options-stripped Macrocarid and pretty awful Ordinatii

#

the volcano cannon one can roll the dice and see if it can pop a thanatar in one shot, I guess

#

but 800pts is a bit much

main pagoda
#

ordinatii much like titans will always be in this weird spot in terms of balance

vital barn
#

the Aktaeus is kinda funky but probably way too expensive, I think they're firmly up there with Reaver+ titans as "funny apoc game setpiece"

main pagoda
#

which ones that again

#

big missile?

vital barn
#

thunderbirds drill

main pagoda
#

they have also stopped selling them completely

vital barn
#

drops a large blast anywhere within 36", then either waits a round and does it again from the previous blast position or hits everything under the template with an AP2 autowound and disembarks its units from the template

#

which is kind of neat

#

surprise myrmidons

#

900pts, so mostly a meme, but cute

main pagoda
#

the humble termite

vital barn
#

termite has no special rules at all, it's just a transport with deep strike

#

so supposedly you could just trundle them around on the surface

#

they are cheaper than any other transport mech has, so probably not awful in the drill role

main pagoda
#

meant more if you wanted the suprise blob

vital barn
#

yeah, but it's less funny than punching a neat 5" hole in the enemy army and disembarking Anacharis Scoria directly into it

#

he's still around

#

pretty large, not total meme unit large but pretty large

main pagoda
#

the triaros has always kinda been in a weird spot where its your only transport worth a damn but its also a spartan equal in terms of protection so it gets priced high

vital barn
#

yeah, 200pts now

main pagoda
#

I imagine the spartans probably like 40pts more with flare shield

vital barn
#

in 1e it was 135, which I still maintain was an insane deal that mostly was not exploited because nobody actually had enough of the model to spam it

main pagoda
#

in 1e as well it was a good option in a pool of amazing ones

#

you sometimes saw them used with haywire secutarri blobs

vital barn
#

arvus lighter or termite were my favourite for those, triaros felt a bit overkill but it was board presence

#

anyway, haven't got the marine book so I'm not sure how much the spartan is

#

macrocarid is actually the same price as the triaros now, and is definitely tougher and more killy

#

not sure this thing was priced correctly

main pagoda
#

my scene had alot of RG and BA players so you saw AA sicarians that saw the arvus get caught as a innocent victim

vital barn
#

ah yeah that would do it

#

I did have one arvus of them get exploded and enough of them lived to tase the deredeo that did it to death

#

but that was a rare case

#

anyway, liking my 200pt macrocarid as a Secutor carrier, will have to get mine out of the box

#

Draykavac is a real blender, and can roll his nerd stat to avoid giving up VPs when he dies

#

Arcuitors are 6" move and 115pts before wargear, but quite choppy, I'll have to see if their infiltrate rules confer to units this edition or whether they can hitch a ride on vorax or what

#

I'm expecting Thallax with this many mean special weapons and decent basic lightning guns to be real standouts

#

these are good troops, although we're lacking in solid scoring - lots of Vanguard, very little regular obsec

#

ah wait I was wrong - we don't have Line, we instead have "Comptroller" - we want to hold objectives with techpriests, because our HQs get +VPs from scoring instead of our troops

#

abeyant gives us cheap reactions and unsurprisingly Mech has crazy battlesmith capability

pulsar cairn
#

do we have any humans who ever defeated a space marine in melee combat?

#

like in a duel? vicksyAww

main pagoda
#

yeah

charred bridge
#

One was killed by a wooden spear to the neck

#

That was not a duel though it was moreso finishing blow

#

In a technicality, an assassin did kill Curze, mostly cause he gave up basically and wanted to be killed to be proven right

#

Kind of funny how Night Lords are like the only traitor legion to not fall to chaos. THey just had their own issues that made them not loyalistst

#

Chaos didnt even have to corrupt them to use them

main pagoda
#

You could apply that to quite a few traitor legions in the start

#

IW and WE spring to mind

charred bridge
#

Well those guys eventually got corrupted by chaos

main pagoda
#

nights lords did as well

#

painted count being the main example

charred bridge
#

Painted?

thin ibex
#

KT question

#

can you play with gallowdark now in the current edition

#

just like as an arena choice?

#

or are they a whole sub-ruleset

main pagoda
upper canopy
#

Though it was a sparring duel with an apothecary who wasn't taking it seriously, and Cain said it was the hardest fight of his life

#

Cain did win and the Apothecary said he'd never get the mark on his armor fixed as a reminder never to underestimate an opponent

vital barn
#

of course it was the hardest fight of his life, Jurgen wasn't there to skip the final phase with the meltagun like normal

charred bridge
#

I only vaguely know him as the guy who couldnt get rid of a very clingy daemonic blade

upper canopy
#

Cain in a fair fight sweating bullets

floral herald
#

Since some stuff like guard is added

#

All the main KT21 map types (open board, ITD, BD) are supported

main pagoda
charred bridge
charred bridge
#

After like curze died

upper canopy
#

You can do fine I just like the idea that in a fight where he can't cheat Cain is like "fuck I'm fucked"

main pagoda
#

fell apart long before curze died

charred bridge
#

Yea I thought it was the final nail in the coffin after they killed the assassin

#

Night Lords are a faction basically gone, you could say that probably even when curze vanished and left them leaderless to prove himself right against other primarchs

pulsar cairn
#

Ciaphas cain is cool wixelsSit

#

I like his books

#

Makes 40k seem less miserable when he's around

pulsar cairn
pastel rampart
#

Yeah, the NL were in disrepair long before Curze got his head chopped off. Had Sevatar survived he might've been able to keep them them somewhat held together but at this point they're a bunch of disconnected warbands scraping by and doing their own thing.

upper canopy
#

Ciphias Cain should be treated as another version of the 40k setting entirely

#

it is so tonally differrent to everything else

remote wharf
vital barn
#

looks like they nixed my old Death Guard character Crysos Morturg

#

I guess he didn't have a model

#

I wonder if DG are just banned from libbys this edition or if I can just make a generic version of

vital barn
#

also borrowed the HH3e Astartes book from a fiend - Spartans are 400pts, so two macrocarids, and only 10HP to the Macrocarid's 9

#

they do have rather bigger guns and Assault Vehicle, though

jaunty dawn
tired cairn
#

Outside of special walls (like doors), that's a bit silly and annoying, yeah

charred bridge
#

Through entirely my own free will

#

The way mind scrabs would barely have to do anything

cinder wraith
pulsar cairn
#

Chaos?

#

Sometimes i cant tell vicksyLUL

upper canopy
#

A loyalist world eater I think

#

Hard to tell

#

guy is built like a warboss in disguise

pulsar cairn
#

He sure is wixelsICANNOT

pale narwhal
#

I’m so tempted to get saturnine purely because the saturnine termis/dread lend themselves perfectly to freehanding exile markings on the shoulders

sour sequoia
#

They are an extremely nice kit, surprisingly posable

#

I’m assembling a bunch for folks around town

cinder wraith
#

world eaters saturnine praetor

#

for chaos

upper bluff
#

I love the saturnine terminators. They're another perfect example of 40k being so dumb and so cool at the same time

upper canopy
#

They're a superior 40k design

#

Because theyre inhuman

past sphinx
#

they dont have triple magazine storm bolters

#

witch is a major ding against them

upper bluff
#

They don't have triple magazine storm bolters yet

#

And who does?

past sphinx
gray basalt
#

New saturnine is just too big scale wise for me

upper bluff
#

That's half of the fun for me

#

I love Centurions and those aren't long for this world

past sphinx
#

they should be 30 to 50% bigger

#

but just the pauldrons

#

though admittedly id be more interested in them as a smaller dreadnaught than a bigger terminator

upper canopy
#

Saturine does the Space Hulk fantasy better

#

Terminators ARE small dreadnaughts!

upper bluff
#

Yeah Saturnine have the surface area to take up an entire hallway

upper canopy
#

Its literally called Tactical Dreadnaught Armor!

past sphinx
#

in the "mostly dead guy inside" sense

gray basalt
west zealot
mental birch
vital barn
#

Mech book actually tells us how many wandering Cybernetica battle automata there are, by giving the standard strength of a Cybernetica Cohort at 25k and saying there were "several thousand" cohorts at the outbreak of the Horus Heresy

mental birch
#

Am I misreading the book

#

Or can we just +6 models in a tech thralls unit every turn

vital barn
#

I am going to politely ignore this because there being over a hundred million battlebots running around in units a third the size of a Legion makes it hard to add them to fights without dropping the megahammer on most warzones

vital barn
#

downside is that thralls are strangely expensive now

#

10ppm is a lot for a conscript with a 6+ save

mental birch
#

T6 tho

#

T5 but like

#

Doing that spell every turn

vital barn
#

I did not notice that, nevermind

#

they still kind of suck but they suck little enough that a megablob being constantly respawned by the local Magi is good board holding

#

they were always T3 4+ or 5+