I like Votann
#Warhammer and Such
quaint compass
Free Overwatch/Heroic Intervetion to Big Bots in range and extra "Yield Points" generated
pulsar cairn
Heard someone saying is good
quaint compass
Whatever that may be
grim mango
awkward that the transport capacity is 5 on the transports
rocky shale
The ironkin look so good because it's the cool votann armor design but on a tall frame
grim mango
and not 6
valid brook
mole mortar mole mortar
pulsar cairn
More like Bat tamer 
rocky shale
The best part about the votann release is no fomo box
vital barn
LOV lore when they came out was very much "hey, this is the Best Faction, we have great tech, psykers, AI and a reasonably sensible social structure, downsides are for other people" and this irritated me
on the upside, I can loot all their kits for parts because they are cool-looking
upper bluff
The downside of Votann is that they're ruthless space capitalists
pulsar cairn
on the upside, I can loot all their kits for parts because they are cool-looking
Spoken like a true Ork
upper canopy
For other people
vital barn
that's not really a downside for them, is it
rocky shale
If IA don't get an army rule by the end of the edition I might have to send mine to the farm upstate and build some ironkin
pine matrix
Great Scott!
upper bluff
Just think of it like every Kin is the 1%
floral herald
Great Scott!
I like that one
still warren
upper bluff
I like it too
floral herald
Oh fuck that’s sick
upper bluff
AoS really does have awesome models
pulsar cairn
What the hell is that fleshy thing
dense sedge
Flesh eater courts are great
still warren
What the hell is that fleshy thing
smoke I think
upper bluff
What the hell is that fleshy thing
I think it's the smoke from its potion
still warren
it's some nasty smoke
upper bluff
I love flesh eater courts
pulsar cairn
I thought it had bottled up a monster or something 
dense sedge
Yeah poor color choice, my brain read entrails at first too
still warren
it's very fleshy
upper canopy
Flesh Eaters are great
upper bluff
It's good contrast so I see why they chose it though
upper canopy
I wish they did not launch the way they did
still warren
chorfs!
upper canopy
to make me have a gut instinct hate for them
upper bluff
Hurray Chorfs!
pine matrix
HAT MENTION
upper canopy
Because wow did years of "Oh, they DID add Bretonnia!" do a number on me
still warren
mechabull!
grim mango
chorfs
floral herald
Oh they seem very mean
upper bluff
Dang that mecha bull is sick
pine matrix
HASHUT HASHUT HASHUT
pulsar cairn
Is it like a daemon engine?
west zealot
I like the warp stone but competent vibe there
pulsar cairn
Or actual magic robot?
still warren
upper bluff
I would assume it's something like that
Oh there we go, demon fueled weapons
They crush em and use them for fuel
Hashut taught them how to do it
still warren
hobgrot with a massive gong
upper bluff
Yeah...
pine matrix
Look at that hat and that beard
still warren
cathay was always gonna be tow lol
floral herald
THE HAND
rocky shale
Yeah but I like the models but don't want to play ToW lmaooo
still warren
Yeah but I like the models but don't want to play ToW lmaooo
real, time to play cities of sigmar then
upper bluff
Yeah but I like the models but don't want to play ToW lmaooo
It's the same problem Horus Heresy has lol
grim mango
need the old hats!
upper bluff
Like I love the robots but Horus Heresy
upper bluff
Yeah the hats are a little tame
rocky shale
real, time to play cities of sigmar then
CoS Cathay would go hard
quaint compass
They're clearly reserving the properly Chorfian hats for the name characters
still warren
oh damn ok that is the spearhead, wasn't sure with the big bull robot
pine matrix
God I fuck with this robot so bad
west zealot
Tbh, I like the tamer hats. They're still overstated without being "my center of gravity is yes"
Like that Despoilers hat is 2x his own head in size at least
still warren
oh thank god spearhead isn't all their units
pine matrix
Rocket battery!
jaunty dawn
Guess age of sigmar beat old world in the fist fight
pine matrix
Fuck I guess I'm playing AoS now
floral herald
Many such cases
still warren
bull centaurs
floral herald
This is a big ass range
pine matrix
BULL CENTUARS LERS GOOOOO
upper bluff
Thank God it's a big range
Too many new armies release with nothing in 40k. Glad AoS is doing it differently
junior robin
oh my god, chaos dwarf 🥹
pine matrix
Damn they look good
jaunty dawn
Invader atv 2!!!!!
pine matrix
Also they're confirming Hashut is an Ancestor God as well?
rocky shale
Invader atv but cool
jaunty dawn
Mole mortar is cool too
upper bluff
I love the little baby iron kin
still warren
Also they're confirming Hashut is an Ancestor God as well?
at least in aos, might have gotten a spot after the world was blown up
pine matrix
Invader atv 2!!!!!
Love that, looks like a Lego model and I mean that with all the love in my heart
junior robin
had my hopes up for some big guys for votann but happy we got more robots
floral herald
Turns out the Chorfs got the big robot
still warren
blunderbusses
upper bluff
The new Ironkin for Votann are cool
west zealot
Those appear to be cannons.
floral herald
Can also be built with flamers
pine matrix
Let's Go
still warren
lady chorf I think with the fancy hat
pastel rampart
Real glad I finished my chorf army a while back, haha
pine matrix
lady chorf I think with the fancy hat
Yeah there's at least beardless options
Shitass hobgoblins
Love it
jaunty dawn
Blunderbussy
pulsar cairn
Are there any chorf books? 
i feel like i wouldnt enjoy it cause they are some evil bastards but im curious anyway
jaunty dawn
Sorry
floral herald
Bubblewrap!
jaunty dawn
Hobgrotsss
main pagoda
think there are some chorf short stories
pine matrix
Ooo I wonder if they will still have the curse of stone
main pagoda
think there are some chorf short stories
i was wrong, they have their own army book a gotrek book and a wulfik book
thats it
tardy vault
floral herald
Oh 2 big robits
pine matrix
God that is cool
still warren
good lord the bull centaur is big
west zealot
So a pegasus is a flying horse, this is... bullsus? Either way, I appreciate i made a flying armored effigy off my gods sacred creature
west zealot
good lord the bull centaur is big
Post a pic!
still warren
sorry missed the pic from the stream, hobgrot comes up to it's knee
floral herald
And the yet bigger one
tardy vault
floral herald
Cool underworlds leader model
west zealot
Ah, becoming a bull centaur is what happens when you square a Dorf and a bull, instead of just multiplying them
floral herald
Cool elves
pine matrix
They are sick, the AoS wood elves are pretty cool
upper canopy
Oh hey more Kurnous stuff
rocky shale
Exodite proxies
tardy vault
still warren
did the stream die?
pine matrix
Still on for me?
Huh, that's interesting, the Chorfs don't believe they are corrupted or part of chaos
pastel rampart
tbf they didn't really feel that in WHFB either.
floral herald
Chunky
pastel rampart
They'd felt betrayed and abandoned by the dwarfs and turned to Hashut as he promised salvation.
upper canopy
Yeah they were seperate
main pagoda
hashut was legally distinct
quaint compass
As anyone corrupted by an otherworldly force, they know they're in control of their faculties at all time
pine matrix
That's fair, I guess they never laid out if Hashut was an ancestor god or a chaos god, now they've confirmed he's an ancestor god
With a domain of beasts apparently!
floral herald
Ough
upper canopy
Well he was definitely a chaos god
floral herald
Wait Saturnine Armor requires some degree of psychic potential to use?
upper canopy
Huh wuh
floral herald
Mentioned in the stream offhand
jaunty dawn
I love these
pine matrix
Damn, Scouring book series
jaunty dawn
Archer man less so but
south axle
Archer's helmet looks like it is falling off or somehting
pastel rampart
grim mango
not more bloody space marines!
pastel rampart
I'm okay with a new Vulkan He'stan model.
pastel rampart
floral herald
Fuck yeah
pine matrix
Damn got an Oni club
floral herald
Looking fucking sick here
pastel rampart
floral herald
👀
grim mango
okay... hes fuckin cool
floral herald
Even more gothy
pine matrix
Three head options???
floral herald
Bike bike bike bike bike bike bike
pine matrix
That's a great bike
rocky shale
These space marine primaris lieutenants are getting out of hand
finite compass
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/sjcpuxok/the-big-summer-previ...
HASHUT HASHUT HASHUT
finite compass
Also at a glance, I read that as 'Suddenly Khan'
Which I suppose is appropriate for a guy on a jetbike wiht a glaive.
upper canopy
"Suddenly Khan" is in fact the easiest way to describe the WS battle strategy
paper bluff
Bike bike bike bike bike bike bike
It would be funny if that gun on the front doesn't have assault
Like the custodes bikes
grim mango
NEW CRONS!
floral herald
Fuck this is a good kill zone
pine matrix
Oh damn Gallowdark but necron
floral herald
upper bluff
Kill teams in my kill team?
pastel rampart
Ooooh I like that terrain
still warren
john killteam
floral herald
The namesake!
upper bluff
A new kill team for Imperial agents
rocky shale
I'm excited for continued boarding patrol support
still warren
The namesake!
using a necron sword
floral herald
They have some hipster fuckin chapters in here goddamn
past sphinx
Hmm About 30% less stronger than I desire but those are pretty good
floral herald
Huhhhh
rocky shale
using a necron sword
The old kit had that too
finite compass
i'm just getting all my info from here
floral herald
The DW Kill Team is another 5 model elite team
finite compass
Because I tried to watch the stream and it made me watch an ad
past sphinx
ALSO FLESH TEARERS LETS GO
finite compass
Then I tried to go back to the beginning to get it from the beginning and it made me watch the same ad
pine matrix
Oh damn they have proper shoulder pads not just transfers
finite compass
Then I tried pausing and restarting to do something and it made me watch the same ad
So Twitch can go fuck itself.
past sphinx
A fleshtearers singular atleast
floral herald
More necrons for KT
upper bluff
These necrons look sick
floral herald
Looks like another weird mixweight team?
pine matrix
Centipede is a lady too!
rocky shale
DWkt kept all of their weapon options that's big for IA
pine matrix
Damn the box is gonna have support for co-op
thin ibex
You i saw a guy with a polearm
Let's go
I can't believe lysander is back alive again
junior robin
as we all know, the only thing that truly kills a imperial fist is getting their hand cut off.
glad spear
I was going to post it here but the new space marine stuff looks siick
thin ibex
The steel steeljacks also look sick
glad spear
Very happy as a raven guard fan
thin ibex
White scars getting a bike character, at long last
glad spear
I also like how that goofy ah invictor warsuit sneaks into every raven guard box
jaunty dawn
This paintjob is cool
pastel rampart
Oh that looks way better than the defacto color scheme
jaunty dawn
Ashen circle/imperial heralds for the oldie suits is perfect
sonic hare
More necrons for KT
can I get some more necrons for 40k please. specifically the lokhust destroyers
jaunty dawn
Necron into the breach is cool
floral herald
Centipede is a lady too!
I do think it’s kinda funny how this one is “Elite space marine kill team vs the janitor, her assistant, and a team of robot dogs”
pine matrix
I do think it’s kinda funny how this one is “Elite space marine kill team vs the...
She's the Final Girl Vs a bunch of killer bioborgs
mystic saddle
very excited for AoS chorfs
jaunty dawn
White scar on a bike!????
This makes up for the iron hands char being kinda ass haha
floral herald
No that guys also sick
mystic saddle
also in the article they specifically say you can build the hellsmith-riding-bull as 'either a son or daughter or hashut' with different head options. age of wokemar continues to please me
floral herald
Honestly really cool to see since I’ve been around the IPs for a while
I remember when “are there women guardsmen?” Was a real setting question haha
pulsar holly
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1019696708847947837/1395863336939425955/all-the-new-leagues-of-votann-models-and-newly-announced-v0-16cgyk3pcodf1.webp?ex=687bfe89&is=687aad09&hm=b66667188932cf2594125a4e86e2dbae04112a281341b1469213e4ea5a4944f8& God I love the new Ironkyn units
rocky shale
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1019696708847947837/1395863336939425955/a...
They're peak
vital barn
those are really neat, they're less-goofy Kastelans
even if I still think the name is silly and they should just be Kin without the y
upper canopy
Tall dwarfs
south axle
Un-dwarfs your space dwarf
upper bluff
They really are just the Kastellans she tells you not to worry about lol
I remember when I first saw Kastellans and didn't know a lot about 40k I assumed they were supposed to be robotic doubles of Space Marines. These new Iron Kin give me the same vibe
vital barn
the Kastellans she tells you not to worry about are the Castellax, really, but these are definitely the Kastelans' gymnast younger brothers
paper bluff
Naaaaaah what are you talking about
desert jay
I also wanna say, "critical hits have precision" is a neat effect
paper bluff
The steeljacks and the photos armor are completely different
rocky shale
I also wanna say, "critical hits have precision" is a neat effect
There's a few other things with it iirc
Or critical wounds have it
jaunty dawn
I think index tyranids had it
past sphinx
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1019696708847947837/1395863336939425955/a...
Normal sized f****** legs I'm dying
pulsar holly
even if I still think the name is silly and they should just be Kin without the ...
That’s going in the book. You will be nice to our Ironkyn brethren
vital barn
you don't even have a comically large book, knockoff dorfs with your dataslates
upper bluff
Why do the new ironkyn have their grippers out 🤔
rocky shale
Why do the new ironkyn have their grippers out 🤔
They are naked
upper bluff
Tru
pine matrix
Ironkin nudists
south axle
The Y stands for "Y wear clothes"
jaunty dawn
Has more in common with the escher stuff
rocky shale
Debating on if I want to try and sell my existing dwkts for the new ones
humble plover
and I'm definitely gonna convert the DW team into some Alpha Legion Headhunters
remote wharf
Oh Chaos Dwarf are coming back.
Neat.
So all the chapters with new chapter master minis are getting new combat patorls, but the only ones getting their new chapter master mini in them is White Scars.
upper bluff
Its sad that you can't assemble the new white scars guy as a generic character though
Epic heroes in box sets are always such a let down
Or I mean they would be if you buy more than one
Which sometimes you should because of discounts and stuff
jaunty dawn
Yeah
remote wharf
On a semi related note, I think they should have stuck with the grav theming and made outriders grav bikes.
rocky shale
I think that new bike indicates that they might be wanting to, but just haven't yet
jaunty dawn
It mightve been on the cards before the response to the initial primaris vehicles possibly
pulsar cairn
Someone took a screenshot of this one 40k book where an ork takes a piss
How the hell do they do that
I imagine they dont have...ya know what
rocky shale
The primaris vehicles are almost cool
I feel like a hover tank shouldn't be so blocky and tall
pulsar cairn
Primaris hover tank? 
rocky shale
How the hell do they do that
||however they zoggin want||
remote wharf
Primaris hover tank? <:vicksyAww:1324105444926689413>
They have several.
jaunty dawn
I like the pickup one
jaunty dawn
More refined than the original one
jaunty dawn
Very low hover haha
pulsar cairn
What does the pickup one look like?
remote wharf
There's the Repulsor, Impulsor, and Gladatior
pulsar cairn
Ooh
remote wharf
There's also the Astraeus Super-heavy
thin ibex
It always surprises me that the repulsor is a pick up grav
upper bluff
They hover by punching the earth so hard
For real?
thin ibex
No matter how many times I see it
upper bluff
Like are they loud as hell then
remote wharf
If i remember right, there's a scene in one of the books where a chaos space marine tries to roll under one to plant a charge only to get pancaked.
upper bluff
Oh right they punch the ground because you can still run people over!
jaunty dawn
I think the impulsor has stummers but otherwise probably
upper bluff
It's about as big as one of I'm correct
Kinda bizarre it's on a base now that I look at it
remote wharf
It has a flight stand under it so it kinda needs one.
I'm shocked we've never gotten an Overlord Gunship mini or even art of the damn thing, but with forgeworld seemingly slowly dying off it's even less likely now.
upper bluff
It's kinda sad when you think about it
rocky shale
The pickup one looks jank and the others look too much like a rhino
The astraeus looks bettet
upper bluff
Because of no games like battle fleet gothic or aeronautica imperialis there are a lot of lore things that don't get art
upper bluff
The pickup one looks jank and the others look too much like a rhino
I agree they're way too square and boxy
The astraeus has dimensions
But I must admit I kinda love the pickup truck
Just because it's a space pickup truck lol
rocky shale
The pickup is funny it just doesn't make sense for space marines
Its more like gsc or votann
upper bluff
My custom legion the Bovine Boys. They specialize in using repulsors for rapid deployment and play guitar in their freetime
Yeah I agree though
Way too improvised in theming
jaunty dawn
The pickup is meant to be the land speeder storm replacement
remote wharf
RIP to land speeders btw.
upper bluff
I honestly prefer the idea that Cawl designed them to fulfill the role of real life pick up trucks. As in light to medium loads and then the Marines just started hopping in the back
remote wharf
Also, funny thing, there's a land speeder that even more resembles the impulsor then the storm, the sirocco
remote wharf
Also from the same issue of white dwarf comes the funnist land speeder, the land speeder assault buggy.
upper bluff
I like the idea of rebuilding a hover car into a normal one
Then adding a spare tire
Because that's a new problem you added
Anyways this is all I can see when I see land speeders
remote wharf
A tire is probably easier to replace then a broken grav plate.
upper bluff
Probably but I think it's just a new logistics issue to add
Like unless your company is already carrying a bunch of spare tires for bikes it feels a little like a sidegrade
floral herald
Also from the same issue of white dwarf comes the funnist land speeder, the land...
That kicks ass
upper bluff
It does kinda look like the ATV but cooler
floral herald
40K version of this
remote wharf
Fun fact, Arkhan Land, discover of the STCs for the Land Raider and anti-gravitic plates, hated the name Land Raider.
upper bluff
I would too
Like guys I made a monumental discovery stop making this about me 
Is it ever discussed why Land Raiders are big enough for Space Marines? Because that's a discovery from early great crusade, right?
remote wharf
They're just very big. Meant for carrying big things and lots of cargo probably.
past sphinx
That iron hands is getting turned into a warped Smith ASAP
jaunty dawn
Its really funny when people think thats a retcon and not just vintage satire
upper bluff
Huh
floral herald
Its really funny when people think thats a retcon and not just vintage satire
Think what is a retcon?
runic swallow
They hover by punching the earth so hard
Honestly that’s a really cool representation of a weird techno hovercraft
paper bluff
Is it ever discussed why Land Raiders are big enough for Space Marines? Because ...
You know the LoV terminator equivalent? Well that is their size of a suit the DAoT had
jaunty dawn
Think what is a retcon?
Arkhan land
upper bluff
Oh yeah, Arkhan Land does read as parody
Jimmy Space
And his Space Marines
Tim Bolter
remote wharf
Yeah Arkhan Land is a very british bit. It's not the Land Raider and Land Speeder because they go over land, no they where orginally Land's Raider and Land's Speeder, after the guy who discoved them.
floral herald
Ngl I assumed it was a riff on Land Cruiser when I was first playing
past sphinx
the only really truely stupid fucking name is the Astartes not in fact being named for a sumarian war goddess but for a literal lady named astarte who worked on the project
mental birch
past sphinx
sorry a Phoenician war goddess
hardy harness
Random question, animals having three eyes is an indicator of Nurgle corruption, right?
sour sequoia
Eyes is a tzeentch thing pretty often
main pagoda
but having them in that triangle shape is oft an indicator yeah
pale narwhal
three in particular is one of nurgle's two kinda 'numbers'
along with his actual sacred number seven
paper bluff
Random question, animals having three eyes is an indicator of Nurgle corruption,...
Many eyes and feathers, tzeech. Three eyes and kinda smelly, nurgle
gray basalt
Tzeentch and Nurgle fight over 3
Tzeentch's number is 9 which is 3 3s and Nurgle has the trilobe
So it's kind of a sub number for both
main pagoda
doom looking dudes
floral herald
So it's kind of a sub number for both
The real reason they have beef
gray basalt
Well and Tzeentch is a bully and Nurgle takes that personally
floral herald
The deathwatch kill team being a 5 person team makes me wonder if they’re gonna nerf space marines to 5 in general or if they’re just bad asses
floral herald
I agree
Esp since the only space marines left dominating competitively are Warpcoven (don’t even run 6 guys that much) and Phobos
I love watching the Mets shift despite like no changes
sour sequoia
Have finally tracked down the bit of rules that lets GSC heal in reserves I can get so much more annoying now
Had been playing without that because I assumed the rules abt coherency applied
pastel rampart
https://www.reddit.com/r/TerrainBuilding/comments/1lyho3d/shanty_town/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button Oh this could make for a fun KT/Necro board.
floral herald
👀
pine matrix
https://www.reddit.com/r/TerrainBuilding/comments/1lyho3d/shanty_town/?utm_sourc...
Hell yeah
floral herald
https://tenor.com/view/tomas-nido-new-york-mets-mets-lgm-creepy-gif-26420280
What does this mean haha
paper bluff
What does this *mean* haha
There is an American baseball team called the Mets that I like. That is a player from the team
floral herald
I know that part
pastel rampart
desert jay
I know that part
You typo'd Mets instead of meta
floral herald
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
main pagoda
its all about the mets baby
paper bluff
its all about the mets baby
come one baby mets get a home run!
even more so against cinnicinati tonight
cinder wraith
empty siren
I don't play space Wolves but I'm picking up some kits
They look SO DOPE
Wolf priest and head takers
I have some space marine stuff left over
Oh shit I need to repair my dreadnoughts 😭
sour sequoia
Heresy enjoyers
Does the saturnine box have anything non-generic
I do not care for salamanders or IW
main pagoda
no
sour sequoia
Sick alright
pulsar cairn
Also
I think its boring that they made space wolf successor chapters go crazy all the time
Give me cool space wolf successor chapters
pastel rampart
Oh going for the BIG battery pack here, dang.
main pagoda
Give me cool space wolf successor chapters
we have 3 new ones
pulsar cairn
Really?!
main pagoda
its an issue inherent with their geneseed, yeah wolfspear, mooneaters and icefangs
pulsar cairn
Are they still operating?
main pagoda
yeah
pulsar cairn
Yay
main pagoda
they are ultima founding
pulsar cairn
Whats Ultima founding btw?
main pagoda
primaris basiically
pulsar cairn
right
paper bluff
its an issue inherent with their geneseed, yeah wolfspear, mooneaters and icefan...
My personal theory is that if you had OG space wolves gene seed it could be another founding (and wolfspear kinda prove this since Cawl went to the source)
the problem is that the Canis helix has been exaggerated/exasperated due to being use on fenfisian gene stock for so long because fenfisians are mutants just a little bit
I believe that fenrisians are just a bit genetically manipulated to survive and that the wolves are the ones that went too far off the human book
pastel rampart
It's a little funny that with Robby G and the Lion back, the two chapters with arguably the most stable geneseed now have...even more stable source of geneseed.
paper bluff
they never really talke about how you get gene stock from a primarch....
is it a template?
pastel rampart
It grows out of the primarch's body and they just excise it.
paper bluff
and you harvest gene seeds from them?
they have the 2 gene seed but it grows back with them?
main pagoda
well not really
paper bluff
other theory, human is to custodian as astartes is to primarch
main pagoda
the primarchs geneseed isnt taken per say but when the first batch of astartes were made it was using the gene print of the primarchs now its just self replicating
pastel rampart
A normal space marine grows only one additional gene seed, but a primarch can continually generate one. It's a slower process though, it's not like they're popping out one a day here or anything.
paper bluff
the primarchs geneseed isnt taken per say but when the first batch of astartes w...
the primarchs have... purposeful cancer?
main pagoda
other theory, human is to custodian as astartes is to primarch
if you want to be real a marine is to a custode what a primarch is to a human
paper bluff
A normal space marine grows only one additional gene seed, but a primarch can co...
tahst's what I was saying/thinking
main pagoda
custodes are the pinnacle of genecrafting out doing even the primarchs
paper bluff
custodians are humanity genetically perfected but they don't have the extra organs
floral herald
the primarchs have... purposeful cancer?
It's more like extra regenerating organs aiui
paper bluff
I'm saying a primarch is what a space marine is generically perfected
and the primarch natively have the designed organs
main pagoda
custodians are humanity genetically perfected but they don't have the extra orga...
yeah because the process is different
the process to become an custode compared to a marine is like an F1 car compared to a shitbox
charred bridge
It's more like extra regenerating organs aiui
I assumed it was similar to a fruits from plants , hence geneseed
I like how Custodes were peak in like everything, each one is not only a master combatant but a master artist, philosopher, sage, etc and aside from malcador they were the emp's council
They were more than murder machines they had liveish outside of fighting, albeit whatever lives you can leave near the imperial palace
main pagoda
"I watched the death of my king’s dreams, and then the death of my king. I watched half of your kind rebel against the empire it took us almost three centuries to build, and I watched you turn it to ash. I’ve watched even the most loyal of you scheme against your brothers, whine about who was favoured over whom, and go to war over your arrogances, heedless of consequence, like some moronic pantheon of ancient gods. You, and the malformed coven of tainted genetics you call a family, have no right to set foot upon this world. You say you lost a father. But you didn’t. You lost the scientist that created you. You lost the visionary that had such high hopes for you. But He was never your father. Your fathers love you dearly, primarch. Even now they dance through the warp, laughing at what good boys you’ve all been. You say the Emperor would trust you now with the resurrection of the Imperium. If He trusted you, why did He need ten thousand bodyguards? And why weren’t you one of them? Why weren’t you called upon to defend the webway? Why did He entrust that most vital task to His true chosen? Why, whenever He related the truth of the galaxy, was it never His ‘sons’ that He told? Diocletian could say all of this. And it would be so satisfying. So vindicating. Or… He forces a slow breath from his body. It takes all his self-control to do so. Next, he forces his knuckles to unclench from the haft of his spear. ‘Talons,’ he says. ‘With me.’ Diocletian leaves the chamber, the weight of Guilliman’s eyes on his back, and the incessant sound of praying rising to his ears from outside the walls. Kaeria, at his side, gestures in an elegant flourish of thoughtmark. Her sentiment is cold, but it warms Diocletian with its sincerity. She can smell the stink of defeat on Guilliman, like an aura around him. She believes he will die soon. ‘They all will,’ Diocletian replies. ‘They weren’t built to last forever.’ "
There wasn't exactly love lost between them post heresy
paper bluff
The future was for humanity and the custodians are peak humanity, perfected in the vision of the emperor
The space marines and the primarchs were always the new thunder warriors
charred bridge
Thunder warriors with feelings that bit the emp's back in the butt due to his gross misunderstanding of human emotions
pine matrix
"I watched the death of my king’s dreams, and then the death of my king. I watch...
You know I didn't care for the Custodes until I got this kind of viewpoint of them. Truly holding the Primarchs in contempt, robbed of their purpose, a bunch of golden bodyguards to a corpse they call a king
The bitterness of it all
paper bluff
Diocletian can also get to the actual throne. Somthing not even Bobby g is allowed and he doesn't know about
pine matrix
Owned
charred bridge
The emp's also confided in the Custodes about everything and asked for their guidance with every decision he made
paper bluff
More than a few age of conquest custodes are around
charred bridge
In a sense they feel the guilt of his failure with the astartes
paper bluff
More than a few age of conquest custodes are around
So they've have that dislike of the astartes project for a long while
charred bridge
Were they to give him different council and say the right thing this could have not been, whether or not that's true and emps would have listened is another thing
pine matrix
Yeah, though I somewhat got the impression that, with the Custodes having this kinda baked in loyalty, the Emperor is kinda just rubber-ducking with them
Is it even possible for them to gainsay him?
paper bluff
Oh the custodes can hate the emperor
pastel rampart
Custodes are completely unable to contradict Emps over anything, ever. Which is of limited use.
paper bluff
They can contradict but they cannot go against
charred bridge
They can't ever act against the emp's but can say things
pine matrix
I guess he didn't want anyone else close to him who'd disobey him after his former collaborators
pastel rampart
But only say so much. Because they know they can't act against emps. A space marine and their primarch have free will.
charred bridge
They often critiqued his original approach on many campaigns and such but ultimately they're mostly on Terra and hang around emps most of the time so their perspective is limited
paper bluff
The custodes could swing their spears at the actual emperor but they could not actually hurt him
They're like angels in Islam in a way
charred bridge
Also my headcanon is like emps, the Custodes are too well protected against chaos and therefore they do not understand the baseline human struggle and allure of chaos
Which is a huge oversight and blind spot that led to misjudgement with astartes and imperium as it didn't account for chaos intervening so well
paper bluff
Also my headcanon is like emps, the Custodes are too well protected against chao...
Like in the valdor book with the last thunder warrior primarch pitying valdor for having no enjoyment, no passion, no anything that would make him human and valdor agrees
pine matrix
yeah, I see them as kind of...less than human? Despite their post-humaness? They don't have fully free will. Valdor is kind of the poster child for that, a Thunder Warrior even calls him out on it
Same brain
paper bluff
Clown to Clown communication
charred bridge
Real harlequin behavior
paper bluff
It's been put more rudely but broadly I agree that every custodian is neurodiverent
charred bridge
Neurodivergent but in the sense your psyche is literally designed to be different from baseline humanity
pine matrix
The Emperor made 10,000 friends to be in his gang and always do what he said
charred bridge
I think a big thing is the Custodes are basically Miniemps
paper bluff
With no psychic?
charred bridge
The good at everything new human that have poor relatability with baseline humans. Even if they weren't made to by loyal they'd probably still defer to him overall cause they're more similar to emps than a human.
Oh yea no psykers
Humanity's most power psyker, has best friend who is 2nd most powerful human psyker says no psykers for humans
paper bluff
The emperor is the one custodes psyker i joke
charred bridge
When you can build your own echo chamber
pine matrix
Emperor's Palace is just 10,000 golden boys saying "exaaaaaactly" to the Biggest Golden Boy
paper bluff
By the by custodian psyket mini some one made
paper bluff
Emperor's Palace is just 10,000 golden boys saying "exaaaaaactly" to the Biggest...
Not all boys for the custodians btw
paper bluff
Custodes tech savant mini from same person
charred bridge
Emperor's Palace is just 10,000 golden boys saying "exaaaaaactly" to the Biggest...
Universe's biggest redditor that can make other super redditors
pulsar cairn
hmmm
i feel like it needs to look more banana like
not saying it looks bad, looks great
i just wouldnt think it was a custodes unless u told me 
pine matrix
I think the golden colour scheme helps picks out the fanciness
pine matrix
By the by custodian psyket mini some one made
I loooooove the halo
pulsar cairn
I think the golden colour scheme helps picks out the fanciness
fair
maybe i would have recognized it if it was painted
sour sequoia
The baroque sun pattern is usually the best giveaway on iconography
paper bluff
Just wanted to post her
paper bluff
Shame that GW might have plagiarized
jaunty dawn
Whaaaaa???
humble plover
Shame that GW might have plagiarized
Care to explain?
paper bluff
Care to explain?
Seems an artist known a Gij_Arentz made a mancer design in 2022-2023 that is very similar to what GW did
past sphinx
anyone try out the arbites dlc for rogue trader?
i play with lore weapon damage as a mod so i cant give a totally honest opinion but it ight, i find the death cult assassin to be more interesting
but ill need a second go around without modding to really feel it out
pale narwhal
it's pretty likely this model has been in development for awhile
but yeah that is a startling similarity
upper bluff
I think there are enough differences that this is probably coincidence but maybe we'll see
main pagoda
Think it's more than a stretch to think gw plagiarised
empty siren
When is T'au 2
Like. There's Space marines. Then Space Marines 2. Like, of course the blue berries got a 2 in their name. When will my favourite faction get a 2 in their name :(
Oh wait it's because we're number 1 and will always be number 1. Nvm :)
nocturne onyx
GW has added 5 years to the xenos game wait time, just for you
empty siren
What the fuck have I been saying?
I'm confused by my own words. I wrote that while I was just waking up
empty siren
GW has added 5 years to the xenos game wait time, just for you
NOOOOO
I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG FOR A SEQUEL TO BEST VIDEO GAME OF ALL TIME
FIRE WARRIOR 2 IS GONNA TAKE FOREVER
dense sedge
I guess drukhari are saved for last
thin ibex
Asking for tau 2? A xenos player asking for content? Smh
Tau are blessed as Xenos to have models that have really stood up well to the test of time
But share in the Xenos curse that we don't really get refreshes or new models
mental birch
But share in the Xenos curse that we don't really get refreshes or new models
Kroot
Ahhaah
Still coping for melee suifs
past sphinx
Still coping for melee suifs
you get 1(one (singular)) fushion blade in a single detachment and have to like it
(hey GW where the fuck is the boxing glove?!)
mental birch
(hey GW where the fuck is the boxing glove?!)
Commander Fis'To
valid brook
This hand of mine is burning red! Its loud roar tells me to grasp victory!
jaunty dawn
only tau vehicles are really that old right
rocky shale
Still coping for melee suifs
I would expect this to never happen tbh
jaunty dawn
I guess stealth suits
though even they aren't the original model for the unit
sniper team haha
valid brook
Yeah, I guess the Devilfish hull is still 3e isn’t it
Plastic stealth suits are from the second codex, 4e
sour sequoia
(hey GW where the fuck is the boxing glove?!)
Paying for the crimes of 2-3 editions ago, like most xenos factions lulw
past sphinx
we werent even that good in 8th!
vital barn
Tau and Eldar are very much paying for the sins of 7th, where they were disgustingly overpowered to an almost uncontestable degree
sour sequoia
Prescribing another 6 months of 55% or higher Death Guard & Thousand Sons & Knights
Everybody always has tons of fun when the faction that opts out of 80% of the game wins by statsticking
vital barn
there was a rumour that they wrote all the rules for the Eldar codex, presented one of the execs with a list of changed point costs and were told "no, keep the points where they are, if you make the models more points-expensive they buy less"
which would in fact explain the 300pt wraithknights with Strength D guns that could one-tap baneblades
thin ibex
im not even convinced tau were actually that op in 7th rather than just havign a single effective strategy that they propped themselves up on while actually generally being mid; and the game just never got updates
vital barn
they had riptide wing, stormsurges and 2+++ stealth suits, plus infinity 3+++ drones to put wounds on
they were absolutely that OP
sour sequoia
Tau closer to that description than Eldar tbf
vital barn
just not if you actually tried to use Fire Warriors
sour sequoia
If Tau and Eldar were more split out then Tau would be even more notably a nightmare
But both went from ‘have been unplayable for almost a decade thanks to outdated codexes’ to ‘shitstomping every tourney’
But it was Tau and then Eldar 2 months later immediately after
vital barn
mostly it just lasted a really long time without any balance changes
these days stuff gets shaken up way more often
sour sequoia
I think they deserved it after the fuckfest that was 6th
“Hello you are shooting army. You get nothing else.”
“Yeah sorry you hit the actual meta on 6s because uhhhhhhh spooky jet planes”
vital barn
Even in 7th they just occasionally forgot to give an entire army Skyfire, it was kinda wild
floral herald
Eldar were competitively oppressive for like half of the editions of 40K too
Tau just pissed people off in 3e in a way which was memorable cause it had a cool name and again with their super mech era way later
But Eldar were cleaning up GTs for like 4-6 editions in a row
pine matrix
Made some janky kill team cards cause I ain't paying for them
runic swallow
It can be helpful to have quick reference cards, yeah
pine matrix
I'm also trying to make the order tokens but that's not going as smoothly
pulsar cairn
Was it the Silent king who made a truce with Dante to fight nids?
floral herald
Made some janky kill team cards cause I ain't paying for them
Oh those are nice looking
upper canopy
Was it the Silent king who made a truce with Dante to fight nids?
Yea
pulsar cairn
And people did not like that?
deft crest
Made some janky kill team cards cause I ain't paying for them
Oh here i actually have a super useful resource
It's all free, this dude does a really good job in terms of making the data cards resized for like poker card size and such
But there are the normal sized variants as well
I typically get the Easy cut, cut them out and then I put them in a sleeve with a bulk magic card behind it
west zealot
And people did not like that? <:vicksyThink:996566524225663086>
In universe or outta universe?
thin ibex
I'm one of the subset of tau players who really does want to play an alien coalition
thin ibex
I'm trying to decide if the generic Vanguard Detachment or the saga of the hunter feel more right for Wolfspears thematically. Thoughts?
upper canopy
I want tau to have MORE auxilleries
pine matrix
Oh those are *nice* looking
Thank you!
pine matrix
https://ko-fi.com/phil_g/shop
Nice, I have kinda committed to these ones but I'll see what else this guy has got for future reference
west zealot
I want tau to have MORE auxilleries
If nothing else it feels like they could really cut loose the modelers a bit
pulsar cairn
In universe or outta universe?
Out of the universe, i heard people here mentioning that some folks in the fanbase didnt like that truce
main pagoda
like with all things GW people are never happy
main pagoda
the advice I give to people coming into the community is basically if you interact with the online GW community prepare to experience levels of doom and gloom found only in people who believe that GW personally has it out for them
quaint compass
But... But they do!
main pagoda
it is what it is its not what its not
pastel rampart
pine matrix
The hive fleet skipped leg day
west zealot
NGL, for malstrain or similar, that'd go hard
paper bluff
I read the twice dead king and just read the Am-heht the warlock chapter
And they reminded me that necrons can be way beyond things and are an elder civilization
floral herald
I don’t know about this games workshop the black templars are really not that good at respecting the rules
paper bluff
They're talking the comedy rule of three
floral herald
Oh that’s fair, the open mic nights on the Eternal Crusader are legendary
paper bluff
The first joke is always "THE CODEX ASTARTES AM I RIGHT!?" With the marshal pulling a face and uproarious laughter
valid brook
They have a big light-up sign that flashes “LAUGH LAUGH LAUGH” so the brethren know when it’s appropriate
quaint compass
Of course, obedience to the rules of comedy are integral to good humor
main pagoda
would you rather attend the codex compliant comedy night or the non codex compliant comedy night
pine matrix
"You see, Black Templars purge the unclean like this, but Ultramarine, they purge the unclean like this"
paper bluff
would you rather attend the codex compliant comedy night or the non codex compli...
An ultramarine comedy night would be observational humor with the "agreed", "that is true", "yes" coming from the crowd rather than laughing
sour sequoia
Hoppin over to the Helena GT this weekend, here’s the plan
Hybrid Metamorphs in the trucks have honestly done crazy work every time, hope is the two of them is enough pressure/counterpunch to hold some mid-board space for neophyte hammers.
Two mortar ridgerunners for easy crossfire Funney and a lot of mobile scoring chaff as needed.
bright dove
would you rather attend the codex compliant comedy night or the non codex compli...
Heretic comedy night.
main pagoda
filling out the Big E apology form for 10k years is heretic comedy night
paper bluff
Heretic comedy night.
I don't think there's anything specifically stopping a human from following Cegorach
pulsar cairn
What do you think Abaddon would do if he found out that he's not even real he's just a character in a tabletop game?
main pagoda
probably cry again
pulsar cairn
jaunty dawn
Arms would fall off
brittle salmon
Arms would fall off
This
misty violet
The classic 40k switcheroo where the idealistic and well meaning Inquisitor tries to figure out scientifically how the useful alien technology works only to be corrupted by the evil magic it actually runs on
vital barn
Though I'm sure some of the alien tech is pretty close to evil magic
only humans can get corrupted by evil magic tech, you know that
Tau guy hands over a pulse rifle and boom, instant demonic possession
glad spear
Sickk
crimson solar
I'm a bit annoyed with mine because I did a big whoopsie.
one of those 3AM ideas
"if I use this acrylic spraypaint instead of painstakingly painting everything yellow I'll get a more even coat"
now the shoulder armor is just a big yellow goop mess
rocky shale
Do you just not glue the top armor to get access to the inside?
charred bridge
Imagine someone's running arbites and they bring only cyber mastiff,
- from Mister E's darktide discord arbites update contest
sour sequoia
"if I use this acrylic spraypaint instead of painstakingly painting everything y...
Just undercoat pink!!
Seriously
Will save your life
crimson solar
I'll keep it in mind when I order paint next time
floral herald
Imagine someone's running arbites and they bring only cyber mastiff,
- from Mis...
Small but vicious dog pilled
cinder wraith
deft crest
Imagine someone's running arbites and they bring only cyber mastiff,
- from Mis...
Real
soft willow
What type of chain are you using for that conversion with the marine body?
pastel rampart
Scored me a good'un for $5.
Flipping through it and it's honestly shocking how much of the rules are the same from 6th and 7th.
Hardly any differences.
(4th ed book btw)
soft willow
WHFB sorta figured out the core stuff by 4th, and just iterated small tweaks from then on.
Honestly part of what led to it getting end-timesed.
pastel rampart
Probably a relatively small part.
The issues with WHFB were a multitude but the big things, really, were:
- Steady price increase with shrinking box contents; a unit of Dark Elf Witches was 10 models for $50 and you really wanted at minimum 20, so it became prohibitively expensive
- Which, with the above in mind, the rules for 8th really encouraged having big units to maximize the bonuses that came with it (rank bonus + fearless if outnumbering the enemy unit)
- And with that also in mind, some armies were just blatantly more powerful than others thanks to either their army book being overtuned or just having ready access to the big spells that could wipe out a unit in one go (Purple Sun being the big culprit). Some armies hadn't even gotten a book in two editions, like Brettonians, and by end of life some armies were still running 7th or even 6th ed books.
- As such, this made it a very difficult game for new players to get into because it was expensive, you needed a lot of models, and the army that caught your eye might be way behind the curve and no one wants to get into a game for an army with effectively zero support.
Building on and iterating from a rule base over several editions isn't bad, but 8th really just killed a lot of the game for people. It was very easy to reduce the tactical feel of it to "I fire my spirit bomb at your elite unit that costs you half your points and nuke it from orbit."
soft willow
Yeah, part of the reason the big unit cost was there was a lot of folks using the same models/units over multiple editions with little need to change them.
Doesn't matter if Spearmen are 10 for 50 if I already own 100 from when they were cheap.
But yeah it's a contributing factor if not a major one.
pastel rampart
Yeah. Plus like...if you're doing Empire or dwarves you're spoiled for choices when it came to either one and if the LGS didn't give a shit, yeah use whatever range of models.
I do miss WHFB dearly but not enough that I think I'd play it, because it's just so clunky and crusty compared to more modern rulesets. Which for some people is certainly the point but I'd rather not spend an entire afternoon trying to get 4 turns in.
upper canopy
I miss Bretonnia
pastel rampart
I did dig into TOW a little tonight, and really seems like artillery and shooting in general is in a weak spot. Or so commentary seems to indicate.
upper canopy
I just really find it hard to care about TOW
Despite how much I like WHF
It really is just like "I wish you had just retconned End Times or done an AU, how am I supposed to get invested in this setting"
pastel rampart
Yeah.
upper canopy
"Why would I make a Bretonnian army, I know you hate them"
bright dove
I mean, you can know how a story ends and still be invested in a prequel.
Like bring back old armies that aren't present in AoS, sure.
Make new ones, absolutely rad!
pastel rampart
Nominally yes, but Fantasy's story ends on a bad and sloppy note and people are still annoyed over that.
bright dove
My big objection is that they announced the Beastman retraction.
Right after I bought the Beastman codex and planned an army
pastel rampart
Maybe GW thought it'd work out like HH did, but WHFB players are less receptive to that given the dicking around they got from GW over the whole End Times thing.
Also yeah, poor Beastmen. My first WHFB army and only ever suffered awful things after 6th.
bright dove
I was looking forward to making a Beastman Army in AoS!
They seemed neat!
Had a good build variety going for it.
pastel rampart
Hey, there's always OPR's Age of Fantasy ruleset! They got Beastmen, they seem pretty good.
upper canopy
How am I supposed to get invested in Bretonnia when I know their story ends with "They suck and die off-screen"
Like maybe if End Times was good this wouldn't be a problem
but it wasn't and it unfortunately hangs like a cloud still
Same thing with Cathay tbh
"You get killed by Grimgor off-screen, fuck you"
bright dove
Maybe this comes from my lessened attachment to Fantasy compared to AoS, and my love of comic books.
But boy can I just ignore stories I don't like.
Hell, I have to do that in 40k too.
floral herald
Yeah I’m familiar with the feeling
I basically dropped all Star Wars stuff since I know it’s all heading for the disappointing sequel trilogy
upper canopy
I mean you have outs with everything else
"This space marine chapter died"
"Well a guy refounded it"
There's no outs with End Times, there's no avoiding it and there's really no ignoring it
tired cairn
Alternative timeline where it doesn't happen seems like the obvious choice?
But I thought the point of putting it 100 years or whatever before the end times was to be able to not seriously care about it?
topaz hinge
Y'all are caring about GW lore?
pastel rampart
At least 50% of the enjoyment for GW games is the lore and if the lore of a line series ultimately ends with "and then everyone and their factions you enjoyed died like a fart in the wind" it's going to severely impact the enjoyment.
topaz hinge
I guess I'm an anomaly then, I have a vague contempt for the lore
upper canopy
I don't see how it's not understandable that it's hard to get invested in a faction that was written with like
an active sense of contempt for the people who like it
wait hold on let me reword that
pastel rampart
It's one thing to ignore the lore when the line is actively supported, I can go off and make my own Chapter Master Doofenshmirts of the Failgenius Brothers out fighting in the eastern frindge because the galaxy is huge and allows for making your own little blorbo doing whatever.
WHFB is not. It was one world, with a defined timeline, and ended in a bad way. There's only so much enjoyment one can wring out of it now.
upper canopy
except for Total War which is an AU
thin ibex
i can kinda get where yall are coming from but i guess i just dont like... sync with it or share the vibe?
i think brettonia is pretty cool
however else things end up
'ending up' is like a... abstract state that kinda doesn't exist for fantasy
Maybe in a real sense i just kinda take the end times as like... some side fiction
or something like that
pastel rampart
I mean, it's how the line ended, it's not really side fiction. Even TOW rolls it back a few hundred years to avoid dealing with it.
thin ibex
sure, but that reality sits on you way more than it does me of course
like thats an obstacle for you obviously; it doesn't really intrude on my ability to enjoy a thing
pastel rampart
Okay but we're not talking about you/people who don't consider it an obstacle.
thin ibex
that was just me trying to explain how it doesnt impact, not trying to drag yall.
heck my only interest in fantasy for tabletop is 100% just cause i think the cathay models look sick
topaz hinge
I wonder if my immunity to this stuff is just from being resistant to fandom in general. The hobby is fun, the games can be fun, but I don't like investing myself in fandom stuff.
upper canopy
My enjoyment with Warhammer is My Dudes
thin ibex
though in my mind, fantasy is kind of set in a locked time state where the lore wont ever progress right? Like the inevitability of the end time is an abstract permanently distant event because fantasy wont get there? Or are they planning on retreading the path to end times?
upper canopy
and I don't enjoy when GW comes in and says "Your dudes suck and they're all fucking dead"
topaz hinge
But that's kinda ignoring the core principle of Yer Dudes
upper canopy
Except it isn't
topaz hinge
Okay there
upper canopy
The World Blew Up
They're all dead
they places they come from are all explicitly written as being destroyed and all the people inside dead
topaz hinge
GW didn't come to your house and smash your minis. Yer Dudes are still there. You can use your imagination
thin ibex
brettonia didn't even get the like sidewrite of being part of the cities of sigmar did they?
upper canopy
Nope
They had an initial lore of being "cosplayers of the world that was" but then eventually got completely written out
thin ibex
thats actually double lame
wouldve been an easy shoe in for cities of sigmar cavalry
just do a aos city of sigmar that like high fantasy paris the city state or some such
pastel rampart
though in my mind, fantasy is kind of set in a locked time state where the lore ...
I suspect they're just Not Going To Talk About It and never actually advance down the timeline, just continually release new models and occasional little things like mini-campaigns or siege rules or whatever.
thin ibex
thats kinda what i figured like
time locked ish
its got more in line with like... historical battle war games, where they all take place in the past and we kinda know how those wars end
pastel rampart
Also they won't bring Bretts over to AoS due to the weird fuckery of splitting factions by department to track sales, which is why Beastmen are in TOW now and basically sunset from AoS.
thin ibex
instead of ww2 its like "the reign of magnus the pious" or something
pastel rampart
Yeah.
thin ibex
side note it would be cool to see cathayan vibes in aos, but i figure thats not a thing thats coming at all
i guess you could represent steelhelms with cathayan units
pastel rampart
Or in Mordheim which was in the imperial calendar year of 2000 despite WHFB happening (at that time) like 500 years in the future.
thin ibex
miao ying is just not a character you can port over
pastel rampart
At best she could be an allied unit with Stormcast as a count-as for one of their dragons.
sour sequoia
Practice round for the tourney saturday, WE been one of my hardest matchups and got one of the best WE guys in the state
Only real mistake was not ditching Marked for Death I think, spent too much time flailing about it instead of killing his berzerkers to secure no man’s land objectives
tardy vault
brettonia didn't even get the like sidewrite of being part of the cities of sigm...
the tongue in cheek answer for "where is Brettonia in AoS" is they're there! They're called Flesh-eater Courts 🙂
finite compass
My 'favorite' bit of End Times
Is the bit where, in the space of a few paragraphs, they completely invalidate 30 years of lore, character motivation, and internal consistency by going
"Actually Malekith was the legit Phoenix King. He just should have stayed in the flame a bit longer."
This goes beyond bad writing and into actively insulting
hardy harness
Is Space Hulk worth getting?
main pagoda
Is Space Hulk worth getting?
Which one? Deathwing or tactics
hardy harness
Deathwing
main pagoda
Do you have 3 friends
jaunty dawn
Oh right video games exist
hardy harness
Do you have 3 friends
I have much more than three friends
The question is, then
Do I have three friends who also play Deathwing
...oh, five of my friends have it, neat
main pagoda
It's friendslop, you really want 3-4 players to enjoy the game
main pagoda
Well idk about randos probably fine tbh
junior robin
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/591429239211950081/1396984395163766865/20...
always wondered with this art, is he hitting 2 goblins standing next to eachother or a mutant 2-headed one? 🤔
crimson solar
they seem to be good sports about it
dense sedge
"Actually Malekith *was* the legit Phoenix King. He just should have stayed in ...
I like the dark elves and I hate this
Makekith’s thibg is that he was the seemingly perfect ruler who was rejected by their magical test and then proved exactly why he deserved to be
He’s the world’s pettiest bitch who just had enough power to be a threat
jaunty dawn
yeah
dense sedge
Also him deciding to serve under Grimgor is laughable, he’d rather die than serve an orc
It was basically a bunch of who would win’s decided by whoever kicked the most puppies
jaunty dawn
unadulterated grimderp
main pagoda
End times is really what you get when business decisions force lore changes
You get a bunch of rushed books that blow
pine matrix
I miss Grimgor, he was my favourite. I collected a shit ton of black orcs because of him
thin ibex
I think for me, it's more a matter of me not knowing really any of the aos characters. Which leads me to feeling like it's absent the personality and appeal of many of the old world's named guys
Stormcast feel guilty of like having a billion characters
I'm sure if I dug into it, I'd find a few characters to like
pastel rampart
To be fair AoS has only been out a decade and not the 30-odd years of WHFB, so there hasn't been quite enough time to really cement some recognizable characters.
bright dove
We also wound up with some of the Old World's characters in Death anyways.
pastel rampart
All except SETTRA THE IMPERISHABLE grumble grumble
floral herald
Settra’s got crazy tennis game
upper canopy
Settra’s got crazy tennis game
That's actually canonically the Von Carsteins
Since Castle Drakenhof canonically has an indoor tennis court
floral herald
Ah, so they serve
main pagoda
I think for me, it's more a matter of me not knowing really any of the aos char...
to be honest I think nearly every AoS character has a novel or atleast short story, but fantasy was really guilty of one million schmucks go
thin ibex
its just like every time i open aos stormcast hq list
i reprel off of them like oil and water
main pagoda
different strokes for different folks
thin ibex
its just so many
its more than space marines
which is saying a lot
the hq list not hte named character list i think
i think space marines still have more
main pagoda
you have 3 editions of massive range refreshes plus book tie in models
kinda expected lol
thin ibex
for true, but when i was trying ot learn how to build a list it was like "i dont know what any of this does and their names are all so similar" vibes
which is kinda what people have with space marines lol
are all of those characters useable/applicable in play and not like irrelevant cause of newer characters?
main pagoda
fairly sure they are all playable
tepid stratus
are all of those characters useable/applicable in play and not like irrelevant c...
A bunch of them got legends'd when GW realized stormcast shouldn't be treated like space marines and the culled the range
A whole bunch of characters got retired to research duty or killed off by the big bad of 1st edition to cement his apotheosis to daemon prince
Of you want a short list of relevant characters for stormcast:
Ionus Cryptborn
Bastian Carthalos
Cekestant Prime
Neave blacktalon
Tornus the redeemed
Yndrasta
Gardus steel soul
Iridan the witness
Krondys
Karazai
Still a decent sized list but ultimately a fair sized cast for the poster boys
main pagoda
Gws approach to stormcast refreshes is a double edged sword is it good to basically keep everything to the same standard yes, is deleting most of peoples 1e models bad yes
tepid stratus
1E stuff mostly got resculpts with 3rd. It's the 2e range that mostly is gone with no replacement
main pagoda
what did they drop from 2e?
tepid stratus
It's mainly just the Paladins from 1E that are dead in the water
mental birch
what did they drop from 2e?
The entire magic chamber
main pagoda
oh right
tepid stratus
what did they drop from 2e?
The lord Arcanum and variants, lord ordinator, knight incantor, Asteria, evocators on foot and mounted, castigator, sequitors, ballista
Now all "recalled to research the reforging flaw"
pastel rampart
Removing the ballista is the weirdest one because it's like...what, stormcast ran out of giant crossbows?
tepid stratus
Removing the ballista is the weirdest one because it's like...what, stormcast ra...
No they just gave an even bigger bow to a foot hero
Knight judicator is a better artillery piece than the ballista was lol
thin ibex
as far as the generics do they each have their own role?
tepid stratus
as far as the generics do they each have their own role?
For the most part yes. There's some hybrid overlap but in general there's a guy for every job
thin ibex
weird question, but i remember seeing those big boys with the giant shields; their shtick was being meteors i think, are they buildable around?
tepid stratus
Knight judicator is your sniper, the relictors are your priests, Arcanum your mage, Questor is an objective holder, celestant your captain
tepid stratus
weird question, but i remember seeing those big boys with the giant shields; the...
Oh absolutely. As a matter of fact there's an entire army of renown that runs exclusively them and the main 3 named heroes
thin ibex
oh they're that deadly/beefy?
thats neat
do they also work as like a centerpiece offensive unit in an otherwise normal army?
tepid stratus
They're one of very few units with a 2+ save in the game
The grand hammer variant trades the save for fat damage
thin ibex
thats pretty cool
tepid stratus
A 6 man of grand hammers is a great hurt piece
thin ibex
what's their lore are they like mega elite hero souls or something?
cause they're literally bigger
big bois
tepid stratus
cause they're literally bigger
Bigger armour, it's essentially their terminator armour
thin ibex
ah gotcha
quaint compass
Don't they also deal Mortalé Woundese when "deep striking"
thin ibex
yeah cause they arrive like meteors
tepid stratus
Don't they also deal Mortalé Woundese when "deep striking"
Yes, in a 10" bubble
quaint compass
Aight, now I know the name of the bastards that were a bane to my krulite boyz
tepid stratus
Then the shields have a chance to give strike last when being charged while the hammers get strike first on the charge
thin ibex
do heroes join units like in 40k?
tepid stratus
No but some heroes do have rules for daisy chaining units after them with a buff if they're in range of eachother
IJ megaboss can make brutes activate after him for example and gives them +1 attacks if they do
We do also have a "lookout sir" rule, non-monster heroes within 3" of friendly units are -1 to hit with shooting and infantry heroes can't be shot at all from outside of 12"
sweet solar
To be fair AoS has only been out a decade and not the 30-odd years of WHFB, so t...
though to be fair in a different direction, thats part of why its such a recurring problem
because they had so many popular characters and only kept some of them like others have said
when even if they had done the same basic setting but it was "all the old factions evacuate to the planes of magic and at least one or two of the most fan favourites from each faction get new dbz like powered up versions", it would have some continuity for everyone
rather than just. only a little. like iiirc theres the implication of balthus arum the stormcast balthasar gelt
but why not just make uhhhhhhh, balthazar gelt the self-cast, the steamtank-that-walks. so the new setting has new models with new rules for new factions, but continuity
upper canopy
The decisions on who to bring back are so arbitrary
sweet solar
wait, sudden brainflash idea
re-fuse the old world and the age of sigmar
but
do a timeskip for the old world
and make it so the re-fusing was a paradoxical dragon-break like event where both the old world and the age of sigmar plane were the primary actor, bringin the two back together
with the planes of the age of sigmar becoming a combination of "the dreamlands" and hyperborea that you can visit, an eldritch source of knowledge and power which is holding back the chaos wastes, for a 1850s-1990s-depending-on-location-and-faction "waking world"
and due to magic bullshit, a bunch of the old world favourites and factions are still there in both new versions and old in an achronal technology level soup like its an age of empires game
sour sequoia
This would be really funny because it would finally render both fandoms into eternally angry grognards and completely obliterate fantasy wargames for GW forever
sweet solar
i dunno, i think its possible, you just have to not wipe out either the old status quo or the new one
sour sequoia
This is some King Solomon cutting a child in half kinda wisdom
sweet solar
you just add and build and change like the old new editions used to do all the time
and of course you still keep the reneisance tech level themeing
and aesthetic
like they are doing this now by bringing back the old world with changes while continuing aos
upper canopy
See im past hating AoS
I think it rules
I just think End Times is one of the worst things GW has done
sour sequoia
Oh without a doubt
upper canopy
And like I just can't get over how they basically just like
sweet solar
same, like i wouldnt want it to go away
upper canopy
Quadrupled down on never admitting it was bad
sweet solar
but i also dont want the old world to have gone away or to be treated like it can come back with just ignoring the end times basically
and i got the mental image of the two settings interacting
upper canopy
I think you could have kept the old world and just had the realms be the magical planes like dnd
sweet solar
a conan like warrior wandering into the wastes and through the chaos into age of sigmar where he rules like a king
a stormforged reaching out with magic into the dreams of the waking world like a lovecraftian eldritch horror, grating voice and long many-times-dead soul whose every death you can feel in the dream communication
main pagoda
i do think the HH/40k approach they have gone for is the best
WFB has largely been resurrected in the popular sphere by games and people who really didnt like 1e AOS
bright dove
And we'll see if those folks buy minis
sweet solar
yeah like the core audience for old-school whfb are the people who still have their old armies and play together by old rules
and the whfb ressurection is not like horus heresy where its new rules for a new setting capturing and old school vibe and a part of the setting you never got to directly play
bright dove
They are doing the "Things you haven't done before" a bit with Cathay
sweet solar
thats true, the only people ive seen making entirely new whfb armies has been cathay
main pagoda
they outside of a few have just reused old moulds
sweet solar
so if they want to be able to get enough ongoing support, they need ongoing sales, so need to be able to offer something new that interests the old players and new players similarly to cathay
sweet solar
and chaos dwarves now
main pagoda
more range refreshes
thin ibex
I kinda feel like a part of why whfb exists is the popularity of total war
bright dove
Agreed
sweet solar
yeah
pine matrix
though to be fair in a different direction, thats part of why its such a recurri...
I could go for SSJ4 Grimgor tbh, local Black Orc literally took 'ard to die
bright dove
I am just not sure that will translate into minis
sweet solar
obvs what they should have done is base the reboot on the warhammer total war games in terms of rules and playstyles
bring back warmaster
bright dove
Heh
sweet solar
and include the links to buy your favourite units in the total war games
thin ibex
Was that large scale fantasy?
sweet solar
yeah
thin ibex
Sort of like apocalypse for 40?
sweet solar
more like epic
smaller models, "bigger" armies that didnt cost that much more because the units are smaller in physical scale but more numerous
the opposite of aos
thin ibex
Ahh OK
sweet solar
honestly unless gw can beat the price and convenience 3d printers will have in 10 years or so from now, it feels like the only way to get a game to have ongoing support is if its got a large enough player base to be worth paying more for official models for accsess to the space
like playing classic fighting games via old copies or new downloads of cracked copies vs buying the new remaster vs playing street fighter 6 with all the proffesional support
but people have also been saying similar for the past 15 years
so i dunno
im yellin into the void, and am an old grognard who models but doesnt really play anymore
thin ibex
I do wonder what their 10-15 year plan is. They can't live on the quality pedestal forever
tired cairn
Eh, maybe they can win on price. But I don't think they will be terribly convenient. Especially compared to "buy from store"
thin ibex
Well it's more like people will buy 3d printed minis from a digital store front too
Not necessarily print it themselves
tired cairn
(and recasters have been around forever without GW going out of business)
thin ibex
Though that's becoming more accessible too
sweet solar
yeha
bright dove
So a GW store offers something a 3d printer absolutely cannot
People you can play the game with
thin ibex
Quality, accessibility, and cost have all been improving for years.
main pagoda
well
sweet solar
the current "bleeding edge" of "easy to use" 3d printers is getting closer and closer to a box that can be in the same room as you, you fill with material, and it makes indestinguishable models on demand from 3d scans someone can do with a rig of 4 smartphoens
main pagoda
they are moving away from that
tired cairn
I would be surprised if 3d printed minis bought from someone else will be cheaper. It takes a long time and is more labor intensive
sweet solar
currently it needs a few days of trouble shooting every month
but you used to have to do that almost every time you printed anything
thin ibex
I do think having hobby stores that create communities is kind of one thing that gw has going for it that printers generally simply do not
main pagoda
I think if 3D printing was a serious risk to GW as a business they would have stepped in and either A taken over the market or B been alot more heavy handed about dealing with it
thin ibex
But I don't know if that's a market scheme that wins out 10 years out from today
sweet solar
have a hobby store with a more industrial grade 3d printer in the back and sell 3d files
with the larger company being basically a media wing with vestigal model and rules production
thin ibex
They're generally heavy handed about their IP but they can't do anything about legally distinct models
sweet solar
or honestly about indestringuishable models
base them pretty and you can even weigh them to tell the difference if its high enough quality
except for the HUGE models, anyway
bright dove
And like, I'm happy to give GW money because they seem to actually treat their employees well.
rocky shale
Resin 3d printers are much nastier than FDM ones and I wouldn't keep one outside of a dedicated and well ventilated space
I also much prefer the GW plastic for the fact that you can use plastic glue, being less brittle, etc.
sweet solar
you can get ones made to be in a regular space, but they have to be kept in a gasket-ligned-lidded box with an air tube going out the window, that makes them compared to what they are if you have a spare room, about 0.5x more expensive and twice as complicated
rocky shale
I think we're still a long ways off from resin printers that are easy enough for your average hobbyist to want in thier house (FDM printers are maybe barely there)
sweet solar
yeah itl be another generation/10 years or so at least
but i do think that the relative increase in ease over the last 10 years makes it something that has to be thought about
sweet solar
I also much prefer the GW plastic for the fact that you can use plastic glue, be...
thats another thing gw can lean into honestly
jaunty dawn
3d printing is only as cheap as it is partially because of piracy/chronic underselling by model designers