Warhammer and Such

[untold swallow]

That's literally my fanon explanation for having femmarines besides 'fuck you I do what I want'

'Cawl wanted to see if he could'

[sonic hare]

wait is the only way to get a skorpekh destroyer lord through the royal court box

i love this on ebay: buy it in canada, $100 plus free shipping. buy it from the uk, $15 plus $25 shipping

[pastel rampart]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1310753524883263518/1378815433628581948/RDT_20250601_1520101460220320823483640.jpg?ex=683df970&is=683ca7f0&hm=0eec7d45ec21b1109198418fc2c37c4e1b9f5014f83c39b55e813a712d70398a&format=webp&width=597&height=896&

[pulsar cairn]

is that nagash?

[pastel rampart]

yup

[desert jay]

Also the whole Great Crusade thing which set up a lot of other pieces on the board

[jaunty dawn]

Chaos knights coming out with a 7 wardog battle force lmaooo

Just 3.5 of the wardog box too no helverin/warglaive bits

Executioner/huntsmen

[rocky shale]

Those are from a completely different kit so I get it

[jaunty dawn]

Battleforces usually contain more than one kit

Which is in fact what I find so amusing about the situation

[thin ibex]

so.. its just a plus size war dog kit

which isn't the worst thing, especially if you want war dogs

but it a little funny

though also kind of a critical problem with knights in general

just lacking in variety

[jaunty dawn]

Its actually pretty practical assuming the internal balance of the codex isnt massively shaken up yeah

Gonna sell out quick I imagine

[tired cairn]

Knight Players: Please James Workshop, can we have more reasons to bring big knights
Games Workshop: lol, lmao, here's an easier way to buy more war dogs

(the conspiratorial thinking is that they are rebalancing things and will want to move stock of the little knights, but I'm not convinced GW is reliably that clever lol)

[paper bluff]

Imperial know players want more variety of amigers

[tired cairn]

I think both want better big knights? Though the armiger variety is a lot less on the Imperial side, yeah

[rocky shale]

They did confirm one detachment would be war dog spam

[paper bluff]

As an imperial knight player, I got big knights, I just wish they were better. I could use more variety of armigers.

I don't need new big knights

New armigers

[paper bluff]

And war dog spam works with chaos knights! And they have variety with them

10th ed is not a great one for knights. Especially when a tau unit that's a 3rd of the cost can kill a big knight in 1 turn

And then you're down a 1/4th of your army and can't even play for objective

[brittle salmon]

On the contrary, things have really turned in the favour of Knights recently

If you've been following GT results they're picking up top 3s and even first place finishes all over the place

Imp Knights, even

And CK War Dog spam has been a competitively very consistently good list since its inception

[paper bluff]

Tournament =/= fun in casual play

[brittle salmon]

I find them fun in casual play

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[floral herald]

If my pile of shame wasn't as big I'd totally buy the dog house box

I love how war dogs look

[desert jay]

AIUI the thing about the anti-titanic units is that they're so specialized that there's only 3 reasons to bring them:
A) Plain cool factor
B) Knights or other titanics are dominating and everywhere
C) You're grudge-building a list against a specific player

[past sphinx]

https://tenor.com/view/wtf-disbelief-what-huh-gif-15892515

i like wardogs but got ive shot so much of them

General chaos beatsticks

Mostly because our guns suck

i keep a lascanon for wardog defenese because thats what the genefather intended

3 karnivores break into my house "By the primarch!" i done my skull mask and skin cloak, i blow a cannon ball sized hole through the first abominated with a havoc team, i draw my legionaries rocket launcher and miss the second beast entirely because its terrible and nail the nearby cultist squad. i have to resort to the vindicator at the top of the board loaded with 480mm rocket propelled anti fortification rounds "AVE DOMINUS NOX!". the rocket shreds the second karnivore in the blast.

[rocky shale]

My pile of shame is rough but with 7 war dogs I'll be pretty much done collecting chaos knights since I'm not trying to get any of the forge world kits

Everything except the new big knight, which I might just look for the upgrade sprue on ebay for

[past sphinx]

i really think NL's are gonna get a character model next edition and i pray to got hes got that goofy ass combi gun

[paper bluff]

They're going to have some very cool HH units

[past sphinx]

that i am going to steal

like a true son of nostromo

[sonic hare]

looking at my flayed ones, then back at the human, then back again

[west zealot]

Very smart, but coherency varies is how I've seen him portrayed. When the chips are down he'll be laser focused and capable. When they're not, well, he's still brilliant but you know maybe you wake up with a squig where your brain was and rockets for arms

[paper bluff]

Shame we'll never get grotsnik, szeras, and Bile talking with each other

[thin ibex]

Grotsnik comes across as the kind of brilliant entity that both szeras and bile would dismiss out of hand. Honestly szeras would consider both of them beneath him. Necron have huge egos

[west zealot]

We at least got Bile and Cawl going at it, which gave us the line "you're a cliche in a horrible coat"

[soft willow]

Cawl has the best diss game in all of 40k

[west zealot]

The best part of that diss is he's not even wrong

It was ap retty good book, overall

I find Guy Hayley hit and miss - Genefather is genuinely really good , the Dark Imperium/Plague trilogy is just... kinda stinky.

And not ina good nurgle way, it's just not great

Lots of meaningless bolter porn, which is not his strong point

[thin ibex]

What's the series of books that details Guilliman's resurrection and that whole adventure?

[desert jay]

Dark Imperium, I think

@thin ibex Okay I looked it up, Guillman wakes up in the third book of the Gathering Storm campaign book trilogy, but actually does stuff in the Dark Imperium novel trilogy

[west zealot]

Dark imperium is post him having visited Terra

So it's when he's kicking around ultrimar etc

[paper bluff]

Which would you prefer meeting szeras, cawl or bile?

[west zealot]

For a moment i misread this as Which would I prefer meeting, and it was going to be Cawl all the way.

I honestly think Cawl meeting Szeras has the most actually interesting potential. Cawl is very interested in necrons, but i suspect he'd fine Szeras horrifying, Bile meeting Szeras is just two egos in a room

[paper bluff]

Szeras would accuse Bile of using warp nonsense, using vile derivative of a derivative tech and failing to do what he has already done.

Cawl i think might be horrified szeras but find kinship with him

He'd chide Szeras as needless cruel in supposed indepth investigation and find him much like many of his colleagues in the mechanicus

To which szeras would find extremely offensive

It would be like comparing a sundial to an atomic clock

[deft crest]

This is the one thing that might make me play World eaters lmao

[sour sequoia]

The [verb]fiends got serious hands in world eaters now if you want Big Metal Dog tbh

Forgefiends with triple plasmas haunt my dreams, maulerfiends even better than they were

[floral herald]

World eaters get forgefiends?

[sour sequoia]

World Eaters get forge fiends now and they’re horrifying in Goretrack detach

[floral herald]

Crying_emperor’s_children

[sour sequoia]

I don’t think EC even needs em when they’re as fast as they are

EC is like AoS ogres

[floral herald]

They don’t need them no

But sometimes you wanna splash ectoplasma everyone

[rocky shale]

Rumors that knights are getting a bit cheaper/lower toughness/more wounds

And 4++ against ranged for big knights

But we're talking potentially like 220 T9+ wounds

[floral herald]

Didn’t they already have a 4++?

Or was that just a strategem everyone spammed

[dense idol]

ah, i get it, like carcinisation but towards wardogs

[rocky shale]

It was a strat

[floral herald]

Ahhh

[floral herald]

That’s a nice buff

[floral herald]

I know from spoilers that someone is getting me a chaos knight for my birthday

So this is fuckin dope

[rocky shale]

I'm trying to get the blessed 7 war dog box

I already have one kit of each big knight type (except the new one obv)

[rocky shale]

Nice

[floral herald]

Same I reckon with the dogbox and the abominant I’m probably like 1-2 models away from a whole army

[rocky shale]

7 dogs and 2-3 bigs should be a full list

Depending on which ones you run at least

[desert jay]

Wild that you can fit 6 bigs in a list if the rumors are true

[rocky shale]

These are probably codex points so they probably aren't that accurate

[soft willow]

Those points feel like they confirm the Toughness drop/Wound increase.

[floral herald]

Playing Big Kill Team at that point haha

[tired cairn]

I feel like I would have preferred more points but scarier Knights. But I don't think the 40k team has figured that out (I've heard AoS handles big expensive models better?)

[floral herald]

I think that’s just sort of unworkable from a faction standpoint

[tired cairn]

🤔 I kind of want them to be really tanky but degrade more granularly?

[rocky shale]

AoS has like one big thing in a faction, knights is all big things

[floral herald]

Yeah AoS has some “huge” models but they’re all single centerpieces

[tired cairn]

Fair. I also don't know how well-liked their knight-equivalent army is (Giants?) or how many you get

[floral herald]

Giants look kind of similar to how knights are shaping up

3-4 Big Things and some Medium Things as filler/connective tissue

[tired cairn]

(I also think knights should get regular infantry but I don't think that will ever happen directly)

[floral herald]

Thanks to the allying structure probably not

[subtle bough]

ogor mawtribes is like that too, someone im in an online tournament with had like 4 or 5 units at the start

[rocky shale]

Knights getting fuedal world troops would be so cool

[tired cairn]

Yeah, I 50% want it for the aesthetic lol

[rocky shale]

AoS knights proxied as subductors is a decent option

[sour sequoia]

AoS handles things a lot better because toughness and invulns simply do not exist, and Giants get Fun Abilities instead of ‘here is 3 turbofuck cannons on a stick’

Things are balanced to die a lot more, shooting is a little more auxiliary

Sons of Behemat get to like, throw objectives and terrain around and judo throw units

Their sitreps and terrain placement rules also guarantee movement of anything 130mm or smaller, everything above that has Fly which works how you’d actually expect it to work versus 40k’s neutered version

You don’t run the risk of accidentally making entire armies unable to wound the giants, they just do their 4+ wound roll

[tranquil ivy]

Glad i got this corkboard now

Hell yeah jump packs

[rocky shale]

Which is basically why only the huuuuge knights get 2+ armor saves

[sour sequoia]

Right, but you’ve still got the toughness statcheck on war dogs. Tyranid shooting above S10 essentially doesn’t exist besides Tyrannofexes.

AoS literally does not have toughness or strength, weapons have a wound roll they use for every single target

GSC can bring a lot of lascannons if they so choose but its still amounting to about 8-10 shots across the army that threaten knights for real

[tired cairn]

War dogs should probably have less toughness

[rocky shale]

They're likely going to T9 in the codex

[thin ibex]

I think 40k actually has decent mechanisms to help armies wound the big guys, or to ignore them and focus on scoring

[tired cairn]

I don't think it's inherently bad that there is a distinction between infantry and tanks wrt weapon effectiveness. It's a problem with Knights because they are so skewed. There has been times a similar problem with infantry horde lists, but GW has nerfed those generally so they aren't popular right now (plus no army is as heavily tilted to that as knights are to being armor)

[thin ibex]

Things like rerolls, bonuses to wound, ways to skip the wounding step, etc

[rocky shale]

Dogs at T9 3+, 5++ against ranged and bigger knights at T11, 3+/2+ (knight tyrant) save with 4++ against ranged (strat to take mortals to get 4++ against melee)

[thin ibex]

I also think that when your army is like 7 models or something, they should be kind of hard to wound

[deft crest]

How do Bloodthirsters do against most knights?

Do they trade well enough in melee on average?

[thin ibex]

I think in most cases if the bloodthirster gets the charge, he eats a knight for breakfast in melee. Knights can just hit back real hard if they live or if they were the one who did the charging

[rocky shale]

They don't get invuln in melee so it's rough

[sour sequoia]

11th edition, T9 plague marines mark my words

I’m down with knights getting to be tough but currently there being armies where antitank doesn’t actually exist is kind of a black mark on knights being a viable faction, without them getting overhauled to be some kind of infantry + big mechs

Especially given that even war dogs operate on ‘move into LoS -> pick up whatever I’m looking at -> do it again’

[floral herald]

Monster killer melee tends to shred knights

Like, even Khorne Chosen with their +1 to wound buff and I think 1 round them

[sour sequoia]

BTs will obliterate knights on the charge, knights will beat a bloodthirster to pulp on their own charge. Advantage you have on knights is that you have volume to deal with other stuff in the same datacard

[tranquil ivy]

Yey

[deft crest]

BEAKIES

[pulsar cairn]

i'll say

imperium mechs are pretty cool looking

[upper bluff]

True

[quartz heron]

Im reading the Eisenhorn books at the moment.

These are the best books i’ve read in a long time.

Im on book 2 now. Truly fantastic.

[west zealot]

Best books in general or best 40k books?

[pulsar cairn]

Whenever they decide to end 40k and maybe do 50k or something of the sort after that

I hope they make something good

[thin ibex]

yeah i really enjoy the eisenhorn novels

i actually really fell in love with a bunch of the characters

[pulsar cairn]

Is eisenhorn like a detective?

[quartz heron]

Best books in general, at the moment.

I haven’t read a good book for about 3 years now.
Last was Ravenor, so I technically read the sequel trilogy first.

[quartz heron]

He’s an Inquisitor, and does detective work to weed out Heretics & Chaos cults mostly.

[pulsar cairn]

Sounds fun!

Is he a likeble character? How charismatic is he? I understand a character doesnt have to be like that to be a good character but i wanna know!

[quartz heron]

Sometimes the investigations he goes on at first look like chaos and then turn out to not be, such as in the short story Missing in Action.

[thin ibex]

I think overall Eisenhorn is a likeable character. However he does make some cold cold decisions

[finite compass]

He's very 'human' if that makes sense

[pulsar cairn]

I like human characters

Like that feel human

[finite compass]

||Which makes the ending of the whole thing all the more painful, because you can see exactly where all the missteps that led to catastrophe occured and what the reasoning for them was||

[pulsar cairn]

Aaaah

Not gonna read the rest of that

Im interested in reading those books now

[quartz heron]

He is genuinely likable.

He gets along well with his retinue and other characters.

He’s very open about his opinions, but does lie when it is needed, and can be cold at times, but never heartless.

Many times the books displays his true opinions for the reader, such as genuine concern, sympathy, pity, or shock over the unfortunate fates of complete strangers.

[pulsar cairn]

i like that

[quartz heron]

He’s a very human character.

The forces he fights are truly, monsterously evil, and him facing it and trying his best to allow others to face it with him is one of his best qualities.

He prepares himself and others thoroughly before taking action.

At times months can pass in the span of a page.

He’s also not invincible. He gets hurt. Often, and it has lasting impacts across his journeys and further into the future.

[thin ibex]

Naturally it's noted that amongst the ranks of the Inquisition, he is a ||radical||. Initially because of his more... humanistic and less dogmatic views. Then for... other reasons

[quartz heron]

I haven’t even read that far yet.
Im currently at the stage where the ||Inquisition is questioning if he’s gone a concerning amount of radical||

||Im not even sure yet if they are right in that assessment.||

Other books I have at the moment regarding warhammer are the Ravenor Trilogy, Mechanicus, and Titanicus.

The latter two I have not yet read.

[main pagoda]

Ravenor is good. Mechanicus is a great primer for ad mech at war

[thin ibex]

Titanicus was my first encounter with skitarii and the skitarii in that book are VERY different than the ones on the tabletop

[main pagoda]

basically the name of the game with 40k

[finite compass]

Titanicus was written a while before Skitarii became an actual army

ANd it's kind of annoying because the 'classic' Skitarii are so much cooler.

[thin ibex]

I don't hate the current ones, but man the ones in titanicus are rad

[elfin orbit]

Hello nerds

I made a thing and thought 'yall might appreciate it

"From the moment of my birth, I understood the greatness of 7ft goth women. I craved the strength and certainty of mommies. I aspired to the purity of the subbie wubbie. Your kind cling to your normie relationships as if they will not crumble and fail you. One day the crude culture you call a temple will wither, and you will beg my kind to save you. But I will already be saved. For the Goth Mommy is immortal."

[main pagoda]

imho titanicus does show its age abit

If you want pure robot smashing

check out titian death

[past sphinx]

Titanicus is probably the best big gun novel

[pulsar cairn]

Who's the word bearer that went back to worshiping the emperor at the horus heresy?

I remember he had something to do with the imperium becoming religious

[main pagoda]

The anchorite

[pulsar cairn]

Thank you!

[main pagoda]

Hes in the book Conquest

[pulsar cairn]

[west zealot]

Could you expound on the differences? I'm curious

[finite compass]

Tabletop Skitarii are basically just cyber-enhanced soldiers, linked to their AdMech masters, and considered faceless and expendable.

Formerly it's like "We have an entire warrior culture venerating the Machine God, we have implanted vat-grown muscle into ourselves, given ourselves fangs and retractable claws, and go into battle adorned in crazy pelts and ornate armor meant to intimidate as much as protect"

[elfin orbit]

To be fair, the tech priests themselves are considered faceless and expendable by the people above them, it could be a matter of perspective and multiple things that end up called "skitari"

[jagged dawn]

Tbf the Titanicus skitarii are sort of still around because the Titan legions have their own guard

[finite compass]

They were basically Sarduakar crossed with cyberpunk-style implant weapons

[west zealot]

Ah, yeah.

I def prefer that version than the faceless and expendable

[finite compass]

Somebody tried drawing the Titanicus-style Skitarii as described in the book.

[west zealot]

I wanna do a high ranking mech priest going off about how stupid the humans are expendable shit is, and how it's wasting the omnissiah's bounty

Immediately flagged as heretek for this, ofc

[elfin orbit]

That wouldn't be heretek I don't think

Like "don't waste unnecessary resources" is incredibly Orthodox

[jagged dawn]

We made a commander for our Krieg army who had a bit of a similar idea

[elfin orbit]

And the motive force itself includes the concept of human nerve endings as like the place to start and holy itself

In mechanics doctrine

There's even sections of the mechanicus that focus on biology

We just don't see them as much talked about

A forge world that focuses on biological products and has elite bioenhanced skitari would fit just fine

It just wouldn't be Mars doctrine

[jagged dawn]

Basically “my men will die as all children of Krieg must. But they will die for a good reason”

[elfin orbit]

The skitari on tabletop are based mainly on Mars, so we don't get a lot of the fringe stuff

I remember a story where a guardsman stood up to a space marine about that and was congratulated by the space marine for the idea

[west zealot]

It is, but what the Orthodoxy says vs how they act is very different

Similar to how you have strains of real life religions who's holy works say one thing, but who's actions are totally different

And if there's anything the imperium is good at, it's immense hypocrisy

[floral herald]

Humans are fine to waste

There's no shortage of them

[finite compass]

That's honestly how Krieg SHOULD be, but they've been pretty flanderized

The original concept was less "We will throw ourselves at bullets with shovels and die for the Emperor" and more "We specifically volunteer to take the most hazardous and vital assignments and warzones"

Even the Vraks stuff is portrayed as "We have specifically calculated how many of our men we expect to die to achieve our objectives, and have prepared for that in advance."

[elfin orbit]

That depends on context, not every world is a hive world

[floral herald]

Sure, but there's always more people to throw

[brittle salmon]

Sure, in a planet to planet context it depends, but "the roiling masses of Humanity are the Imperium's most vast and expendable asset" is one of the most prominent themes it has

Exterminatus as the final, gravest sanction that can be done to a planet isn't a last resort because the people on that planet are precious to the Imperium as a whole, it's because planets aren't replacable

The Imperium's terraforming abilities are garbage and many planets hold countless potential secrets that are lost forever if you destroy them

What is the value of million, ten million, even a billion lives compared to that? To the Imperium on a macro scale, nothing

[floral herald]

said it better than me haha

[elfin orbit]

Yeah but relevantly, a given tech priest of the mechanicus could be in a position where human lives are a finite enough resource that they value it

[brittle salmon]

It's a vast galaxy and anything is possible - hell, it's a compelling character hook, but the point is that'd be a rare tech priest indeed

[west zealot]

It's why I'd do it personally - showing a tech priest we can emphasize with .. and how that makes them a heretic in the eyes of the imperium.

Grim dark by contrast, basically

[past sphinx]

Life is not valuable, their knowledge is

[west zealot]

(sometimes the best way to show how grim things are is to attack it from the other angle)

[past sphinx]

Thats pretty routine in the books. "Sure its not great the arch magos bit a bolter round but he was frequent with his memory uploads so its not really a loss"

[untold swallow]

The most recent SM2 mission has this kind of premise tbh

[floral herald]

There's a really good... hammer and bolter I think episode with a tech-priest luring guardsmen into some isolated part of the base to whack them and make them into servitors

[untold swallow]

'This magos biologis is refusing to withdraw'

'I am literally a brain in a jar running a mining complex please leave me alone'

'Fuck you'

[floral herald]

It's probably my favorite bit of techpriest media and really gets into the meat of why the priesthood of Mars is so monstrous haha

[past sphinx]

im pretty sure a exporator kills a group of guardsmen because their sergeant has a cybernetic that can be used to repair their robot in one

[untold swallow]

yup

Pascal in Rogue Trader is also great

[still warren]

also a plot point in Eisenhorn funnily enough

[floral herald]

This is sort of a plot point in Mechanicus where Subdomina Khepra has a bunch of lines kinda to the effect of "it's so nice you don't literally emotionlessly hate skitarii btw"

In an unusual way

[brittle salmon]

Yeah, which is really quite interesting

[uneven ember]

"whatever happens, you will not be missed" was the closer of the IT IS THE FORTY-FIRST MILLENIUM spiel for a reason!

[junior summit]

there's been a couple that are more human friendly because they don't want to waste good workers

but only a few

[mental birch]

War dogs need to be t8

If spamming

Make plasma able to punch them again

[brittle salmon]

it'll be t9

if anything

[rocky shale]

All the rumors say T9

[desert jay]

Plasma might not be S9 but meltas and rokkits and such are

[rocky shale]

The break point for meltas is pretty huge

[desert jay]

S5 stuff also goes from 6+ to 5+

[rocky shale]

that's also pretty nasty

[charred bridge]

I was never big into Imperium and reading up on Custodes is funny by accident. They're just so well made to take on threats greater than so much that one of them defending Terra from heretic space marines during the horus heresy they thought it was suspicious how easy it was to take them out they must be planning something. The chapters he was fighting wasn't even a crafty one like magnus's or horus's, it was ones just doing a direct assault against the custodes and failing hard.

[pastel rampart]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/fstxtjge/rules-in-the-age-of-darkness-how-do-advanced-characteristics-work/

[paper bluff]

Bringing back rouge trader era stuff is a wild pull imo

[floral herald]

Aw man

I am getting more tempted by HH stuff with these rules

[jaunty dawn]

Really funny how the commitment to space marines being the baseline means they barely interact with this new mechanic and then you get shit like tech thralls and ogryns

I do think splitting up leadership jobs is potentially really cool though

Very tempted to pick up new mk2 and mk3 breachers when theyre out 😭 oh dear

At least I dont think Ill be grabbing the big box. Santurnine is cool but not really what im going for I think

[floral herald]

Yeah I was disappointed when they were like “wow 4 new stats”

And the the space marines have 7,7,7,7 lol

[jaunty dawn]

I wonder if legions will mess with it at all

Word bearers are already quite morale based in their legion rule so it might be able to be a little more interesting

[west zealot]

Inquistor screeching in heresey (I'm sure 7 is a chaos number somewhere)

[jaunty dawn]

Nurrgle

[west zealot]

Oh, it's 3 and 7 for nurgle,. i knew 3, buth uh

[unreal cosmos]

I think it's a given. Ultramarines had a +1 Ld last edition, and I can't imagine Night Lords won't be all about the debuffs

[jaunty dawn]

Fuckin ultramarines man

I think. I think word bearers should get +4 leadership and also warpfire guns should have double shots 😊

[junior robin]

Corvus Corvax Cormfirmed?!?!?!

[pastel rampart]

Primaris Lieutenant with power fork.

[junior robin]

finally, the only agri-world chapter, the emperors amish

[past sphinx]

an annebaptist unit would be pretty horrific historically

[empty siren]

1000 dollars on marketplace

Whole ahh Tau army. Super tempting but I need to start collecting kroot and no kroot

Also so many damn drones

[thin ibex]

@sour sequoia Question, since i know youre knowledgeable about necrons
I had my first loss in the league against WE and i was considering using my one time list mulligan (something we agreed on for everyone in it) which of these is better?

the second is the potential rework

noting ive made a few rules errors, i think my first list has nothing wrong with it, but i also havent been really utilizing hte tomb blades well and not having anything with long range can be a challenge

the skorpekhs have actually done real nicely for themselves, usually getting to beat a unit up before dying

[paper bluff]

A Doomsday arc is very good. I'll say this, idk if Wraiths are more killy than Skorpekhs. What were you using the technomancer before the wraiths? Heals?

[thin ibex]

FNP 5+ plus 4++ plus T6 makes them very difficult to efficiently kill, they're tanks rather than killers

also if they linger near the ctan shard, the technomancer can heal the ctan shard

[paper bluff]

Aye, Technomancer with waiths has alot of staying power

Idk what the meta with with WE now though

[thin ibex]

ah they werent playing meta anyway, were running angron and kharne and such

[bright dove]

WE are simple.

They want the axe time.

[paper bluff]

If only it still was....

[thin ibex]

ironically, they are weirdly weaker against a melee centric army that charges them firsst; a lot cues off of them getting their charge off

at least in zerker warband

so its almost always in your interest to charge the zerkers first

deny them 2str and 1 extra attack per model

in my case, Scorched Earth really screwed me over, as i was not playing aggressively, I wanted to thin out his army first knowing id be regenning and he wouldnt be

meant he burned two objectives

[paper bluff]

Kill agron, any fiends they have and predators then there is nothing they could threaten you monolith with

[thin ibex]

then a brilliant screening play with a rhino kept me from saving my warriors as kharn and a zerk squad tore them to bits

[paper bluff]

Monolith melee is better than you would assume

[sour sequoia]

Scorched Earth into WE is very hard for necrons currently unless its specifically like full skorps or 18 wraiths

[thin ibex]

They pretty much killed the moolith using a deepstrike squad of eightbound led by a slaughterbound and a land raider rapid firing their lascannons

[thin ibex]

hmm ok so i was on the backfoot from the get go? Think my desire to run a rework is maybe unwarranted?

[sour sequoia]

Thisn is one of those times I prefer nightbringer

[thin ibex]

cause i got no other WE opponents

my next fights are against guard, guard, votann, and tau

[sour sequoia]

Because that way you go ‘run eightbound and I will pick them up. Do it. Go.’

[thin ibex]

one guard is running bridgehead, the other recon

i think my existing army will play pretty well into both guard, iffy against Votann, and well against tau

[sour sequoia]

Bridgehead vs Hypercrypt gets funny. I’d eat the loss and move on currently, you’re on a scoring list thats harder to pilot than it looks

[thin ibex]

bridgehead is bringin a lot of taurox, meaning my void dragon is gonna have a lot of snacks

i made a rookie mistake and forgot my reanimator boosts heals for any of my units; for some reason i assumed it was only warriors

[paper bluff]

Running the lord with translocation shroud over standard in hypercrypt not worst idea

[thin ibex]

yeah that was a consideration, or using a blade and tach arrow

benefit from the rerolls to push it through

on a deepstrike turn

Though i was alo considering voidscythe purely to be a punch back when something gets into a fight with the immortals

[sour sequoia]

Outside AD I prefer the blade over scythe tbh

[thin ibex]

better general purpose?

if i take trans shroud i get deepstrike without investing in a enhancement, if i take tach arrow, i get a one time hard punch

[sour sequoia]

Losing the point of WS on the scythe hurts

In AD you get to go back to 2+

[thin ibex]

ahh ok

yeah i might use my mulligan for a very minor change, swap out my lord

just trying ot decide if i like res orb more or tach arrow

tach arrow is KIIINDA memey, but its also a decent pocket punch against a bigger target

[paper bluff]

I forget, in scorched earth, is it only battle line that can burn objectives?

[thin ibex]

yeah, i almost stopped one burn, it was the obj closest to me, but he managed to use terrain and a rhino to block a skorpekh charge

and my warriors were not about to clean up a zerk squad

I foolishly also did not activate orikan in that moment

i did have fun with death ray killing angron before he got to do anything

sus hits went off, fired 4, hit 3 turned into hit 9, boom one dead demon prince

[sour sequoia]

You earnestly dont need to be that picky with Orikan

I’ll absolutely fire it to kill a rhino fuck your scoring vehicle

[thin ibex]

yeah i learned my lesson, if he kills a unit or just tears some shit up its worth it

[sour sequoia]

Goddamn rhinos doing recover assets

[thin ibex]

hahaha

yeah rhino was a true mvp for him

also reaaaallly smart screenin on his part

[sour sequoia]

I’ll uhhh see if coffee and breakfast makes me any smarter here

Had a 12hr shift at work into one of the most brain melting games of AoS last night running till like 4am so you got me at my absolute weakest toy soldiers brain

[thin ibex]

100% understandable

I dont have a rematch with him, but yeah i think i eat my loss

i dont think keeping the staff of light is worth it

ill switch to a trans shroud lord i think

[sour sequoia]

Yeah never do staff of light

[thin ibex]

brain went "Oh he can also help shoot, that'll be nice!"

i dont know that the tach arrow would be worth because it can always get eaten up by an invuln, while hte orb will net me guys back guaranteed

[sour sequoia]

It kinda sucks to suck but it doesn’t do anything at range or melee, versus when they charge and you can at least say ‘ogayyy I challenge your shitty little sergeant and deal twice his health’

Tachyon Arrow is dog dookie except maybe in one specific and obscenely funny scenario in this upcoming match play pack but its still unusable on every other mission rule

Since there’s a mission rule that just says +3 attacks to every profile on your warlord

And honestly an overlord gets by just fine on doubling their voidscythe attacks there, 5-6 of those and you’re a primarch killer

[thin ibex]

i was figuring itd be funny to jump in with a tach arrow that has full rerolls on wound and hit; but it can still whiff pretty bad

[rocky shale]

The first rule of warhammer is that a single shot 2+ always misses

[sour sequoia]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-nod-noddin-kitty-kit-gif-1704737976774288658

[floral herald]

Dogs dogs dogs dogs

[thin ibex]

I think... I think I should be able to win against the guard opponents, I think also I might do ok against tau. The votann may end up another loss for me

[tired cairn]

Hmm, I wonder if this means that one war dog will lose the character keyword

Also, the war dog detachment rule requiring you to include a wardog is a bit silly given how of course you are going to take at least three wardogs

[sour sequoia]

I think that’s hedging against stupid cheese more or less, like reapers wager running no harlequins to be most competitive

Or the zero monolith 5-6 ctan shard hypercrypt being dominant

[tired cairn]

Maybe. Though that'd be surprising given that the core detachment rule only benefits war dogs (but it is possible the strats are good and more generic). It does lets them word the character in a way that is a mild downside (you are a bit weaker to certain anti-character stuff than you might want).

Reaper's Wager being better without Harlequins is wild. The strats + enhancements must be pretty good if you basically don't get a detachment rule

[onyx elm]

"What are we... some kind of War...Hammer?"

[charred bridge]

Is that allowed

Necrons be hundreds of millions of years old and haven't died of old age yet, mostly

[paper bluff]

All necrons are already dead

[charred bridge]

That's a good point

Necrotyr did also die like every 30 years too

[paper bluff]

And old age for the necrotyr was like.... 32

[charred bridge]

Since then though, not so much

[charred bridge]

Harlequin behavior or something, I don't know current Eldar well.

[paper bluff]

no not, this is us having the same thought about necrotry old age being about 30

[charred bridge]

All I know about 40k is Orks, Tyranids, Necrons, and how the other factions interacted with Necrons before the current setting. Necros were the OG grimdark

Suffering before many other races even existed

As necrotyr, as necrons, they find new ways to suffer

[upper bluff]

Necrons would be really silly if they weren't like lacking souls and 99% of them weren't mindless drones

[charred bridge]

The souls one and ig mindless drones are pretty big deals. No soul means no warp so they lost hard against Eldar who got tech and warp mastery

Mindless a more recent issue since 60 mil nap caused the only sentient necrons nobles to go senile, if necrons could get souls again 99% of them wouldn't have to act entirely on the orders of the lords.

When a single point of failure failed in my tombworlds

[untold swallow]

squints this is a movie reference or something...

[paper bluff]

As I understand, a bit from a story. How ever obviously the necron peasants are either mindless or cannot act

[west zealot]

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/AZaBx5

This is some weird stuff! Not a super fan of any of it, but also it's still really cool?

[west zealot]

This actually happens in the novella Severed.

[rocky shale]

It's cool but the only thing that makes it read as a 40k redesign is the text telling you that it's supposed to be that

[untold swallow]

what... in the Kentucky fried All Tomorrows fuck?

[untold swallow]

lol nice

[west zealot]

Eg, I can see linkages. The Ork and imperium of man stuff is probably my favorite. The nid stuff is real weak, though s starfish Lictor is great

[west zealot]

---Obyron could no more ignore duty, than gravity. And so, with a deep and rumbling sigh, he began to lever himself from the rock.
‘Are you all right, old chap? You seem rather glum.’
Obyron’s initial reaction was complete panic, as he had clearly lost his mind. Finally, the exertions of the campaign had stacked up and, under the crushing pressure of his decision, his mind had snapped like a twig, and he was hearing voices. But no: the voice was entirely real, and so was its speaker. Standing a few kubits behind him, in the shadows of the antechamber, was Nemesor Zahndrekh, draped in a cowl of rough cloth.
Obyron had many, many questions. But they all piled into one another on the way to his vocal actuators, and what came out surprised even him.
‘My lord,’ said Obyron, ‘what on Gidrim are you wearing?’
‘A disguise, dear friend!’ proclaimed Zahndrekh, with a flourish. ‘I’ve concealed myself as one of the peasantry, in order to make my way down here without being bothered.’
Obyron was now completely sure he had gone mad, but since his mind had run away from him, he felt he might as well see where it was off to.---

[untold swallow]

lol

[west zealot]

Zahndrekh put an arm round him in consolation, and continued.
‘Let me pose you this thought, Obyron, in the hope it will bring you ease. What do you think caused you to hold true to me for all this time – despite all the power you might have enjoyed through betrayal – if it were not a soul? What can love, but a being with a soul?
‘Even if we all ceased to be flesh and blood millions of years ago, which of course I don’t believe for a moment,’ – Zahndrekh actually winked – ‘wouldn’t it have suited us better to live in denial of that, as some fools might say I had done? Wouldn’t it be better, Obyron, just to accept our fate, and enjoy immortality for the everlasting life of merry campaigning it has proved to be?’
Obyron stared hard at Zahndrekh, unsure of what he was hearing. ‘You old bastard. You knew all along.’
‘I knew nothing of the sort, old friend. But since you seem to be labouring under some delusion that you’re a soulless machine, I thought I should at least make some attempt to set you straight.'

[untold swallow]

Future scholars will say they were roommates

[charred bridge]

Definitely not soulmate after walking into the necrodermis forges.

They would have been tombmates. 2 guys, never married women, lived together, buried together. What could this mean?

[sonic hare]

this rules

[quaint compass]

The Necrontyr Crypt Market is in shambles from the sounds of it

[charred bridge]

Necrons really are fighting imperium cause they heard about pre thunder warrior era crypto currency and were very upset they got woken up when it wasn't even about trading death as money so they're sending strongly worded gauss weaponed complaints for interrupting their sleep with stupid stuff.

[paper bluff]

Imagine how mad necrons would get if they learned about purtetuals

"WHAT DO YOU MEAN SOMETIMES THEY'RE JUST IMMORTAL AND COME BACK?!?WE HAD HYPER CANCER BAKED INTO OUR VERY DNA AND THEY GET NATURAL IMMORTALITY? "

[quaint compass]

Necrontyr perpetual would have the perks of Deadpool (Immortal, Zany, A real Jester) and drawbacks of Deadpool (Cancer forever, not sexy enough to benefit from bisexuality)

[thin ibex]

Lol they gave Leontus back the ability to order titanic units

[paper bluff]

So you can order a baneblade now eh?

[thin ibex]

yah

also

stealthsuit teams got 20 points more expensive

thats fraggin wild

[paper bluff]

And death marks got cheaper

[thin ibex]

tau did get a HUGE buff tho

[paper bluff]

12 points per for snipers is wild

[thin ibex]

FTGG now gives the +1 BS to the spotter and guided unit

[paper bluff]

They didn't need the buff imo

[thin ibex]

i think they had like a 38% win rate

or have

TTBattles app puts them at a 45%

i think being in the bottom 4 does warrant them a buff

not sure if that specific buff was the way, but i suppose we'll see

[mental birch]

It doesn't:(

Excluding units in an Observer unit

[thin ibex]

ah perhaps i misunderstood, is it that everyone who targets a spotted unit can benefit?

[mental birch]

You mark out specific Observer units that point to a target

These units do not benefit from the +1 BS

[cinder wraith]

hey

guess what

https://tenor.com/view/willy-wonka-and-the-chocolate-factory-gene-wilder-willy-wonka-you-get-nothing-nothing-gif-5432076

[thin ibex]

rereading, still a good buff i think. The 20 point increase to stealthsuits really hurts

[floral herald]

Huh

[paper bluff]

Terrible

[thin ibex]

wait doesnt this mean that if you spot two different units

you can now split fire with +1 to BS for both targets?

[floral herald]

Lion is also a freak now

[thin ibex]

i think they gave tau split firing back

[mental birch]

Yes

Stormy boyyy

[thin ibex]

i think we're gonna see some fun meme lists with stormsurges prolly

and now i can use mixed loadouts with less guilt

(i think single loadouts are prolly still more efficient)

but i like mixed loads for flavor

i also wonder if the pathfinder double spot and the stealthsuit 20 point increase means we'll see more pathfinder picks

or if peopl are just gonna eat the 20 point tax

[floral herald]

What the fuck lol

[thin ibex]

lion's back baby

[floral herald]

And he’s gone

And he’s back again

[mental birch]

Pathfinder lost double spot

They now spot for themselves

[thin ibex]

guh

sort of double spot

just only for them

ah so their thing is guilt free spotting

being an observer as a pathfinder is irrelevant, still getting that bonus

i wonder if i wouldn't have swapped abilities with the stealthsuits...

give pathfinders classic observer status but rr1's and w and h and give stealthsuits guilt free spotting

would feel more narratively aligned

[empty siren]

Hey chat

Guess what I got for 50 dollars

[empty siren]

:0

[empty siren]

THEY WHAT

Okay that's fair TO BE FAIR

It is rerolls hits and wound of 1

20 is a bit much...

Should've made it a weird awkward number like 15 or 12

Cause we're Tau, we get fucked because we're not any other faction. Giving us a random number only makes sense. Gives us the real feeling that GW pulls a "Randomizer-inator 4000™️" when balancing us

[thin ibex]

i think the "everyone gets to shoot at spotted units now except observers" is a hefty buff

makes sense to nerf the stealthsuits when they can impart the rr1's to everyone

[empty siren]

Yeah. I should look over the new stuff for Tau

[desert jay]

A pile of Tau drones?

[empty siren]

How are we looking though?

[thin ibex]

overall i think we got a buff

[empty siren]

For Tau. Good changed? Still mid? Getting better?

Okay good

[thin ibex]

due to the ftgg changes

[thin ibex]

some stuff that has to do with spotting got nerfed

[empty siren]

Even better than drones but not by much

[desert jay]

Oh wow that's a lot of paint

[empty siren]

Airbrush system is what I'm after. And the paints

I have a shitty temu airbrush that I don't use

1. I don't have the paints
2. Shitty airbrush

So this is an upgrade and a half

[desert jay]

Yeah even just a decent airbrush and booth is worth the 50 bucks

[empty siren]

A LOT of paints tho

So YIPPEEEEE

[desert jay]

But also wow that's a lot of paints

[empty siren]

Oh yea. For 50 bucks too

For everything

My brother sent me the posting like 5 minutes after it was posted and I scooped that bad boy up IMMEDIATELY

[desert jay]

Cheaper than a dollar per paint bottle!

[empty siren]

Picking it up today

Am excited :)

It's a lot of goodies for so cheap. It also forces me to clean up my studio to make room

But hell yea. Great deal

Speaking of deals. I found another Tau army for sale but it's not one thousand dollars this time lol

Maybe deal? Idk. 450 tho

[deft crest]

Looks like a pretty good deal, not the greatest but

[empty siren]

Yeah. I'm hesitant but like, that's a lot of vehicles ...

[deft crest]

If you need just a starting stuff this is good

[empty siren]

Hammerhead🤤

[deft crest]

But if you are like me and go for mechs

than maybe somethign else

[empty siren]

Oh I need more mechs omfg

I have like two crisis suit units and DAS IT

I need more suits, a stormsurge, two ghostkeels, more kroot, and more vespid

[deft crest]

Yeah I'd just save your cash and shell out for a start collecting, And then get some riptides

or yeah that

[wet grotto]

Triptide or nothing bby, love my big bois

[empty siren]

Im almost 3k so far with the stuff I have

[empty siren]

I ran duotide against my friend and it wasn't till BR4 he was able to even start hitting them

[deft crest]

I want to bathe the feild in brustcannon shots

[empty siren]

riptide burst cannon gang???

[deft crest]

And if its a heavy vehicle faction or knights well

[empty siren]

The next list I'm building is gonna be silly

I need MORE broadsides

Missile-sides 🤤

[wet grotto]

My list is like 4 crisis suit units, 4 broadsides, 3 riptides, and 3 groups of stealthsuits. Was gonna drop the broadsides for more crisis suits but now that they changed the army rule I wanna run a storm surge or 2

[empty siren]

I want to collect at LEAST...5k-6k pts :)

They changed the army rule?

[wet grotto]

Yeah? It was in the data slate this morning

The ftgg is now just you pick spotters and who their spotting and anyone and everyone can see be the observer, no more pairing and no more splitfire penalty

[floral herald]

Seems like a big shot in the arm for riptides

[empty siren]

KAUYON GOT ITS ZUSTAINED HITS 2 REMOVED????

WHAAAAT

:(

Okay the ignore all modifiers is good but...still...

Okay they streamlined the guiding tho I like that

You declare who's an observer at the start of the shooting phase now, yeah?

[wet grotto]

Why? I dont think anything really changes for them

[pastel rampart]

Holy shit that's a HELL of a find, good job.

[floral herald]

They like to split fire and don’t have the same splitfire penalty

[empty siren]

Not bad for rules changes ngl. The Pathfinders is a bit unfortunate. But, I do like that they can shoot and spot. They feel like a decent unit. Okay guns. Idk if they changed the pts cost, but 90 feels a bit much now that they can't spot twice

OH I DIDNT EVEN REGISTER THAT WE CAN SPLIT FIRE NOW

AHAH THIS IS GONNA BE FUN

[wet grotto]

The splitfire penalty is gone so no one has it, ftgg is now just if your shooting a spotted unit and the shooting unit isnt an observer you get the ftgg bonus no more +1 the balistic score if you dont shoot whats spotted

[empty siren]

WE ARE SO BACK

[wet grotto]

Yeah but now you can run triple rail rifle on them and actually hit the broadside of a barn since they get the spotting bonus too now

[empty siren]

I'm rocking burstides

[empty siren]

YESSSS

I'm so happy

[wet grotto]

Now I wanna make an oops all railguns list with a taunar, broadsides, railheads, and pathfinders

[empty siren]

The more I look at the Kauyon change from sustain hit 2 to ignore modifiers

The more I'm like...ya know what. That is kinda brutal

I must work now unfortunately. I like the changes. Kauyon is a bit unfortunate but I'm happy overall

Tau players! Rejoice! We are now...decent!

[tepid stratus]

My EC list just went up 90pts with no rules changes. Brutal

[floral herald]

54% release winrate in tournaments feeling

[soft willow]

WDP needed to change, but they didn't do a good job of targeting Coterie and letting the faction balance internally.

[floral herald]

Honestly I’m glad it’s just moderate points increases and we keep The Juice

[soft willow]

So I suspect Coterie remains the only viable comp list.

[rocky shale]

Oof the Aeldari point increases are a bit rough

[soft willow]

There might be something in Carnival and the transport one, but I don't thik it's as strong.

[rocky shale]

Maaaybe a fire prism is workable at 150now tho

No imperial Agents changes looking rough...

If they had no intention of balancing the faction it would have been nice for them to say so before selling a bunch of people on it as a new army

[soft willow]

https://tenor.com/view/first-time-meme-first-time-the-ballad-of-buster-scruggs-gif-24656975

Pretty classic GW move tbh.

Rules are temporary, your cool Imperial scrungo models are forever.

[rocky shale]

Yes, but I like playing the game too

I would own half as many IA models if it was just a painting project

[tired cairn]

Oooh, Tyranids got a new detachment

[rocky shale]

Yeah it looks pretty cool

[tired cairn]

And the new ravanors datasheet. The kill team isn't out yet right?

[past sphinx]

oh hey disco lord isnt totally dogshit anymore

[tired cairn]

The "hyperadapated raveners" being a five-man leader unit that can attach to regular raveners is a really weird way to implement things

And thank goodness that finally gave admech robots the army rule

[rocky shale]

Robots stay winning

[floral herald]

Nope

[pulsar cairn]

Is Grandpa lion any less hostile than he was back in 30k?

[tired cairn]

Quite some buffs/changes to the psychophage. It now buffs AP instead of gives 6+++ and it has a much better melee profile. The funniest part is that it gets the smoke keyword now

lol at the admech chicken walkers going down in points again

[thin ibex]

I think he's more measured, but I suspect he's generally just as reserved and suspicious of others

I do believe he's slowed down in his old age tho

[pulsar cairn]

[dense sedge]

Imperial agents is the wrist faction

Worst

[thin ibex]

since when did accursed cultists not regenerate models?

[floral herald]

Codex

[thin ibex]

bah

also humbug

[floral herald]

They got reworked into scouts

Might have been 10e in general?

I forget but it’s not new

[thin ibex]

i suppose thats more effective for an all melee unit

mustve been dex cause i was doing for fun lists pre dex

i was doing a knights list for the fiefdom

thought regenerating cultists would be great for sacrificing to the knights

alas, i just have some chaff infantry to throw at my foes

i do love the flavor for the iconoclast fiefdom

[tepid stratus]

WDP was absolutely warranted I agree but the noise marines getting hit is brutal since we have no other shooting options. Lucius going up I can begrudgingly live with despite how cheap his loyalist contemporaries are. Fulgrim is still too expensive IMO

[tepid stratus]

I do think carnival has gas. The transport detachment is table dependant. It works on GW tables but WTC tables are too restrictive for it. Personally I've found a lot of success with mercurial host but it's undeniable that coterie is a cut above the rest and now becoming the only way to get value out of your more expensive work horses

If GW considered noise marines a problem, then bumping the lord kakophonist up 15pts instead would limit how many buffed units would be tearing things up while letting base squads still feel fine to take

[sour sequoia]

Bikes 5 points cheaper and all min size GSC units now only 2 points to resurrect

My list has 10 bikes you have to kill 50 bikes

Purestrain genestealer jailing units now fully worth rezzing I think

[upper bluff]

Kastelan Robots have the army rule as standard 🎉

And our units continue to drop in points...

11th Ironstriders wont bankrupt you for sure...

[rocky shale]

In 11th you actually get negative points for taking chicken walkers

[upper bluff]

They actually made them mandatory for the army too

Every legal army needs a warlord and 3 chicken walkers

[rocky shale]

How much are they now?

[rocky shale]

18*

[upper bluff]

All of them dropped 5 points

And the Scorpius disintegrator dropped 10

[rocky shale]

So they're like 40 points for $60?

[upper bluff]

No they're 70 points

But they probably shouldn't be

Scorpius disintegrator just needs an invuln and it could be like 200 points

I'd have to double check the sheets but I'm almost certain it is the only model in the entire army without an invuln save

Maybe the leaders don't either but seriously

[thin ibex]

what makes the skorpius better than the dunecrawler? I generally feel like hte invuln and aura invuln are quite nice on the dunecrawler

[upper bluff]

Exactly. The 4+ invuln save makes the dune crawler outclass it in basically every way

The one thing it has over it is more guns

But that doesn't matter if it dies turn 1 to a couple lascannons

Why do the flying davinci skitarii have a 5+ invuln but the tank doesn't even have a 6+

Anyways as much as I'd like to continue complaining I still think Admech is in a good spot right now

[thin ibex]

as i understood it last i checked, the skorpius is generally considered the better pick was why i asked

[upper bluff]

Who told you that? Idk maybe in competitive lists but that feels like too much of a gamble. Like what you're just hoping the canon does well enough the one turn you can guarantee having it?

[tired cairn]

Huh, have they ever given a single model in a squad the character keyword before?

[jaunty dawn]

Yeah

Wow big tau change

[sour sequoia]

Every TSons psyker has it I believe, just about every command unit in Space Marines & Guard

Relatively common when the sergeant is like, actually important rules model

[tired cairn]

Huh, interesting. Wait, so can you snipe out TSon psykers then?

[sour sequoia]

Yep, thats the main counterplay

Or you get to be GSC in Host and say ‘lol lmao my benefictus unit now shoots its 50+ attacks on 3s”

[thin ibex]

so usually characters that join a nit give that that unit the characterkeyword right?

do the tsons sorcerer that comes wit hthe rubrics have the character keyword?

[rocky shale]

Oof the CK leaks are a bit rough

The point drops make more sense

[rocky shale]

Only the attached character, you can't kill the sesrgent equivalent

[rocky shale]

No

[thin ibex]

ok yeah i think that was teh core of the question

[rocky shale]

I think the only time this happens is like IG officer squads?

[thin ibex]

doesn't every model in the command squad have character?

[rocky shale]

No, apparently

But also the one that is a character is the only officer that lets you give orders

[pastel rampart]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C46A_wf-bMs

[tired cairn]

Yeah, the Hyperadapated Raveners give only the prime the Character keyword and I've never seen it before

[pulsar cairn]

Do Dark Angels like the watchers?

Or were they tolerating them just cause you couldnt kill them?

[wide veldt]

The big thing is that someone who is marked is marked for the all army now right

[thin ibex]

yup

also no negative for targeting non spotted armies

also not all the army perse

all teh army except observer units

[rocky shale]

CK army rule leaked too

It's neat but not ideal at least without seeing the rest of the codex

[desert jay]

The one-character-in-a-unit I remember are Guard command squads (and Gaunt's Ghosts), SM command squads, and CSM dark commune

Tau and Votann I think might have them too for HQs that have drone buddies

Oh wait forgot Tau drones aren't shootable

[rocky shale]

Drones aren't units, they're tokens

[desert jay]

But Brôkhyr and Grimnyr have that sitch

[thin ibex]

maybe the chaos cult leader unit too?

[thin ibex]

thats just hell divers

https://tenor.com/view/helldivers-epic-dive-bile-titan-no-reinforcements-gif-11990433295822767885

[charred bridge]

Helldivers eat Bile Titans for breakfast.
HIerophants eats guardmen regiments for breakfast

[rocky shale]

All CK detachments leaked

We're cooking

[finite compass]

Hierophants are...Quite a bit larger

[dense sedge]

What are they?

[floral herald]

You know, stoves, ovens, grills, open flames, that sort of thing

(I also wanna know)

[rocky shale]

They're on reddit but it's index, dark pacts sorta thing, big knights, small knights

[thin ibex]

Sounds a bit like the iconoclast fiefdom?

Or whatever it's actually called

[empty siren]

Look at the terrain my friend painted. We're both new to the hobby side of stuff. I'm super impressed

His first time painting terrain I believe

[thin ibex]

Looks great man

They should be proud

[empty siren]

That's what I'm saying. He just said quick and simple. Like brother, take pride in your creations lol

Man, the unfortunate thing about Tau is that I find it someone difficult to think of a grimdark style that actually fits without slapping a bunch of skulls onto the base

[rocky shale]

Kinda, but the knights damage themselves on failed leadership

[thin ibex]

Faceless enforcers of the state can be pretty grimdark without needing skulls

[dense sedge]

I find tau work best as a reminder that the grimdark is unnecessary

Which makes the grimdark elements even more grimdark in a paradoxical way

[empty siren]

Yeah

I could do Kroot grimdark thooo

And it doesn't take away from the Tau

[thin ibex]

i feel like tau are kind of plenty grimdark? Like yes, living in the Tau empire will afford you better quality of living; but also they a hierarchal imperial colonial state that does not value you as an individual and dogmatically enforces its ideology not just through volunteer evangelizing, but through re-education camps and disappearing people

And farsight is a military junta focused around the cult of personality celebrating their immortal leader while surrounded on all sides by forces seeking to destroy them, disconnected from the technological progress of the empire

[charred bridge]

I don't imagine that's what many Tau fans enjoy about the Tau though

They probably like the hope of good aspect most

[empty siren]

I like the hope

[pastel rampart]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3mPHPwcwqY I feel like the best way to get a Grimdark Tau on a visual level is lots of battle damage and oil washes. Weathering is a core component of the "grimdark" style.

[thin ibex]

sure, but those are elements of the tau that are there, have been there since like the beginning

[charred bridge]

You as like a thing as a whole but like some parts more and not like other parts

[empty siren]

For me, the Tau embody genuine progress with that hint of grimdark that tells me, "they belong in this universe."

[pastel rampart]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gI83Fs6uTyM

[thin ibex]

It's just that when someone says they can't see the Tau being grim or dark, it bears reminding that those elements are already a part of them to be engaged with. I get being more engaged by some elements than others, but that doesn't make those elements not exist, if that makes sense

It's one thing to be all about tau because big robot, its another to say "tau has too much big robot, I can't imagine them having auxiliaries or infantry"

[charred bridge]

The grim dark aspect still exists of Tau are altruistic, the idea that emperor had plans to make humanity great and failed and now imperium is a stagnated nation and failed dream. Tau being the we see their errors and will do better and have a chance to do is eventually but for now many will suffer is grim dark

The good suffering through no fault of their own because the rest of the universe is worse aspect I think is still fitting however you see Tau

[empty siren]

I like the T'au because well...big robots. But also because they remind me most about the aspects of humanity that I especially like. They're hopeful and they work together under one banner for a goal that is the betterment of their species. They're naive and they are experiencing the horrors of the universe and realizing just how small they are, but most just keep on keeping on

From my view

The Tau are the most human

[thin ibex]

for me i like the tau for a myriad of reasons, I enjoy the suface level hopeful, naive, explorers of the 40k univers, but I also really like the undercurrent of really dark shadow government stuff. They have a clean exterior, but there's plenty of clues as to how deep the rabbit hole goes with them.

[empty siren]

The Tau are new to the galactic stage

I like seeing them at least trying their best

[thin ibex]

I think also, Tau in the 40k universe are hopeful, they are not, however, good. I think its a common mistake made with them by both their biggest critics and their most fervent fans

And to be clear, Tau are my main faction, this is coming from a fan for as long as ive known about warhammer

[empty siren]

I completely agree

[thin ibex]

I think a lot of casual observers just don't see the elements of the tau that clue in to their less savory elements. Which is how you get people claiming they're too brighthope for the setting

[empty siren]

The Tau aren't THE good guys. But they are a good guy in comparison

[thin ibex]

which i think is nonsense

[empty siren]

They're the only faction I'd like to be under

If I were born in an Imperial world. I'm just fuckin dead

Eldari....maybe. But my cool wizard powers are limited because Slaanesh and you bet I'm gonna be casting fireball every chance I get regardless of consequences

[thin ibex]

i doubt id like to be under the tau all that much to be honest, I'd just like it better than most imperial worlds. Though there are absolutely imperial worlds where you can live good, high quality lives grow old and die without ever interacting with the horrors™️

[empty siren]

I don't think anyone here could live under any faction if we were put there exactly how we are right this instant

Except me

I'm built different

[charred bridge]

Also a key aspect, you could call Tau good but not every Tau is good, there are definitely ones in higher positions with their own motives.

[empty siren]

Well nobody is perfect

However

Me saying that

It's not a valid excuse

[charred bridge]

And like many of their clients races have societies that are not good and they have to make complex decisions to keep cliend races from conflicting violently

[empty siren]

Obviously nobody is perfect. But the Tau are prolly the best bet to just living a normal peaceful life where you just work and do whatever to survive and you're not scrounging for food or nothing

I mostly gravitated towards Tau because they are EXACTLY how I run empires in stellaris

[thin ibex]

somethng id add to the tau grimdark list is they Cyberpunk'd Puretide. Straight up Arasaka Soulkiller'd the guy

even tried to map his engram on top of existing commanders, to not amazing results

[charred bridge]

I think theres an interesting complexity to trying to be the moral police of the race when say a certain client race might think slavery is morally correct conflicting with others with very different morality. Someone has to budge and no action will be perfect to everyone, you just have to pick ones thats overalll better better for Tau the collective

[empty siren]

You have rights. But you're gonna be a fucking artisan whether you like it or not because I'm low on consumer goods because y'all mother fuckers apparently need things like paints and minis😒

Ngl. I love playing Tau because I love playing stellaris

[charred bridge]

I do like fiction where trying to be better doesnt mean everything you do is good, or every action betters you. Its moreso of a long term goal with setbacks and being better is to take those setbacks and choose to be better still instead of bitter.

[empty siren]

I completely agree

[charred bridge]

Tau have a super problem of, its whatever an author believes the most

[empty siren]

I'm a hopeful and optimistic person, but that doesn't mean that progress is without its tragedy and consequences

[charred bridge]

They swing so hard on morality depending on edition and current writers

[floral herald]

say a certain client race might think slavery is morally correct
Those fucking regressive Gue'vesa

[empty siren]

Progress only comes because of a need to improve. But that need to improve can often conflict with other peoples beliefs and values. The prospect of progress can often be blinding enough for people to throw caution to the wind and not think twice

[thin ibex]

"Just dont consume the dead in front of us"

[empty siren]

The Tau are so blinded and fanatic about progress that they destroy other people's culture and progress of their society because of a selfish belief that their beliefs are the only one that matters

[charred bridge]

Its not slavery, its just patriotism enforced by the faithful /s

[floral herald]

No no you have a moral duty to slave for the Emperor

[charred bridge]

The servitors were aware of this beforehand

[floral herald]

That doesn't stop just because the Emperor can support the greater good

You still gotta work bitch

I wanna see more stuff with Imperial converts for the Tau

Cause they have such a weird mindset haha

[empty siren]

You guys are discussing it as though it were a choice. You heretics! Serving the God Emperor shouldn't even be a question! It's your duty!

[thin ibex]

look you got two options. Greater good Emperor, or 4 armed Emperor

[empty siren]

Just for saying this, I will, in fact, be executed because I have acknowledged what you're talking about instead of just executing you. My bad😔

[charred bridge]

Id want to read it, like the humans act like expats and are like yes this is nicer than imperium but why is everyone here a commie? Tf are these lazy xenos who probably cant work 14 hours a day

[empty siren]

Three. I choose the silly guy in the webway who acts like the Joker if he listened to too much Blink 182

[thin ibex]

also saying the emeperor had a sword, a claw, and a shield. Coincidence? I think not. compelling evidence of the four armed Emperor

[charred bridge]

And the Tau are like, you are so broken in ways you dont understand and blind to your trauma

[empty siren]

I must go. Into the webway I go to be a silly guy (Im heading home)

[floral herald]

you can't punish imperials with work camps because they get sad if they slow down

[charred bridge]

Tau leaders: Why are you making the new humans work 16 hours a day?!

Locals: Well they started crying when we said they cant work 20 hours a day and we agreed on 16.

We also tried some positive reinforcement and words of affirmation and they tried attacking us

[empty siren]

Fine. You get a TWO minute break. Ungrateful fools. We feed you your friends who died on the factory floor and this is how you repay our kindness and generosity to at least recycle them😒

Cremation isnt efficient. Uses .2% more power

[desert jay]

Y’know, the march of technology must be wild for Earth Caste

Because like they’ve been bred (and genetweaked?) for millennia for being big strong manual laborers, but I’d expect basically most of the manual labor to have been automated by now

So you have a guy built to lift a fridge sitting around at a control console

And on some planets you have a bunch of Gue’vesa civilians about who haven’t had years of schooling in factory automation or whatever so they’re taking a chunk of what’s left of manual labor stuff

[charred bridge]

Many a imperium hive worlds need the big guy manual labor, time for an exchange program /s

Is it still the case fire caste is the military and dont want any other caste butting in.

[desert jay]

"Look, if you want them trained in the details of drone operation you first gotta help them unlearn this thing they call 'tech-heresy'"

[charred bridge]

"Also you cant just call everyone xenos, each one of the races have a name with many ethnic subdivisions."

For any regular imperium citizen to choose to join Tau, its probably the biggest culture shock to exist.

Id see maybe like tech priests that arent dark mechanicum levels of chaos worship bad but wnat to invent something that isnt based on an STC

[floral herald]

Honestly "chaos moderates" is like the most underexplored thing in 40k

There's some hints of it in Black Crusade (the RPG)

look you gotta venerate the four passions some but I just go cheer at gladatorial matches and make to forget to take the trash out every couple of weeks

[charred bridge]

I dont know ifs much of a thing but like chaos as in very much into warp but not the big 4 chaos gods, just moreso "neutral" entities from the princes. Like Eldar had many gods and there are other warp entities/deity during/before war in heaven kind changed the warp a ton

Id called those Chaos Moderate

[past sphinx]

warps a big ass pond

the 4 are the biggest sharks

[charred bridge]

Love immaterium, hates daemon princes

[floral herald]

I meant more like just people who aren't that hardcore about following the old 4 but not that intensely

[desert jay]

nods. Fortis, Mutabilis, Almis, and Perfectum

[brittle salmon]

iron warriors my beloved

[floral herald]

Oh yeah they are kinda like that

[brittle salmon]

I've always seen IW as at the extreme end of what I call "Chaos Pragmatism"

[pulsar cairn]

They take what they need from chaos

[brittle salmon]

The gods, their servants and their boons are all a means to an end

Nothing more, nothing less

[past sphinx]

"were not puppets of chaos were just using it for our own ends"

is always cope

[brittle salmon]

Incorrect, it's cool as fuck

[floral herald]

The Iron Warriors kinda replace fealty to chaos with being like, really neurotic and mean in their own way

It's cool

[brittle salmon]

Iron Within was a cool WH+ vignette

[sour sequoia]

Chaos pragmatism feels more fun in fantasy where they’re actual demons you can deal with and not ‘heads I win tails you lose’ where all positive emotions also just feed the same big 4 in the same way the negative stuff does

The way the warp is written its just fundamentally Cope

But I do love a Loser, nobody malds like Iron Warriors

[past sphinx]

Makin munda weirdos again

[solemn gull]

Holding up the plasma coil so it doesn’t snag on anything is very funny

[empty siren]

Yaaay I get to pick up a whole lotta paints and an air brush!

YIPPEEE

[past sphinx]

tripping on your plasma power cable is always embrassing

[empty siren]

Holy shit I got an amazing deal...

I'm just moving the boxes to my car and there's definitely more omfg , I'm so happy

Not even done...more boxes...

[charred bridge]

Ooooooo

Damn thats so much paint

This is the time you get a 3d printer to make things to paint to practice for warhammer minis

[empty siren]

This was an amazing deal

Plus, I'm happy to take them off the hands of the person I'm buying them from. It was their husbands stuff and I'm more than happy to continue the story and history of his paint supplies

Cause let's be real. There's a bit of a story to the brushes we use

There's another box in the other seat

[charred bridge]

Daaaamn

[empty siren]

50...dollars

[past sphinx]

This man sells a mean sump kebab

[pastel rampart]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/386423192685641728/1379938772350795876/image.png?ex=68420fa1&is=6840be21&hm=909df00a01e10970f4e17eb5f477445672475d24fe7b5d78192ffee52386bf0b&

[dense sedge]

That’s from the mtg set right

[sonic hare]

yeah it's some land card

[charred bridge]

Im going down yet another darktide youtube binge

I learned laser sight squigs are a thing

[junior summit]

targeting squigs!

[charred bridge]

Where they just shove a laser sight into one of the squig's many eyes and put it on the gun and the laser just goes where the squig decides to look but it gives orks mad sniper skills

I also learned orks will install windows or punch holes in ship hulls so they can literally do a drive by against another ship. Space driveby is so ridiculous but funny

[charred bridge]

Old lore orks kinder and more reasonable than most inquisitors
https://youtube.com/shorts/DTa2DQd8ZZ0?si=yfmK06WnSj_A382i

[empty siren]

UHMMM

I'm overwhelmed

I GOT THIS AND THIS PLUS ANOTHER BOX OF JUST HOBBY STUFF FOR UHH 50 DOLLARS IM FUCKING AAAA

THIS WAS A FUCKING DEAL OF A LIFE TIME I DIDN'T EVEN REALIZE THAT THE AIR BRUSH WAS LIKE 250-300 DOLLARS I...WH...A....I...UHM...my brain is exploding

[sonic hare]

hell of a deal

[empty siren]

Hell of a deal is an UNDERSTATEMENT

This is actually insane omfg

[west zealot]

Damn dude, very nice!

[pastel rampart]

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/V2QrD8

[paper bluff]

Chaos votann would hit hard

[west zealot]

They have been hinting at bringing back the Chaos Dorfs i think

[wet grotto]

Itd be cooler if they finished making votann first before making another space dwarf faction with 10 units

[verbal ermine]

moisturized. Hydrated. In my element. Flourishing

[west zealot]

Oh, so, to be clear: When we're talking Chaos Dorfs, i was was literally talking about the Hashut worshiping dwarfs in AoS/The Old World

[pulsar cairn]

fantasy and AoS have more than just the 4 chaos gods right?

skaven and chaos dwarves have their own?

[still warren]

5 major chaos gods, da big rat got into the pantheon

[obsidian flume]

“Minor Chaos Gods” are a lot more of a thing

[west zealot]

Horned Rat managed to upgrade himself to Great Horned Rat with the advent of Age of Sigmar, though it's heavily implied that if Slaneesh breaks free, the other three would gleefully turf him.

Hashut currently isnt active in AoS lore other than having a Warcry warband (Horns of Hashut) - biut there's a lot of lore refrences to Chaos Dorfies being active, having their forge cities etc.

Hashut is not big league chaos god, but he's not exactly small leagues either - he seems to be some sort of Chaos entity/demon that either came into existance on it's own, or broke free from one of the gods, then managed to bootstrap himself a religion off the Chaos Dorfs and has grown in power as a result

[pulsar cairn]

slaneesh breaking free? is it trapped?

[obsidian flume]

The elves got his ass

[still warren]

Slanesh went into a food coma

[west zealot]

Wentinto a food coma from eating elves, three of the sruvivntg elves proceed to shove himherit int oa big ol no-place and they;'re trapped

and break a bunch of the elfy souls out

of course, Moraathi just had to Do Some Shit, so slaneesh is slowly breaking free

[obsidian flume]

Trapped her in the eclipse of infinite light and infinite dark

Bound in chains that could hold down Khorne, etc

[west zealot]

https://ageofsigmar.lexicanum.com/wiki/Slaanesh

[thin ibex]

Can you still play slaanesh in aos?

[pulsar cairn]

[obsidian flume]

Yep!

[pulsar cairn]

the elves deserved that win if im being honest, even if momentarily

[obsidian flume]

It just gives your army a more complex set of emotions and motivation than most chaos armies

[west zealot]

You've got we're going to free the dark prnce, I'm the new dark prince, and "I need all the mirrors, and also, we're killing troggoths"

Sigvalad's a massive dick

[obsidian flume]

Great Gatherer is a chaos god of thieves and cut throats worshipped by an evil thieves guild who wears crow feathers(faction is in one of the smaller scale skirmishy war games for AoS)

Belakor isn’t a chaos god but acts like one

Slaanesh had a kid to try to escape called Newborn that latter split into twin gods(playable on tabletop!)

The Speaker In Stone, a chaos gods which is worshipped by an order of warrior masons and builds evil Jade pillars all over in an attempt to break it out of prison. Buddies with Tzeentch, might just be Tzeench demon who outgrew his master.

There is also, for extremely minor chaos gods. Like “brought up in one line type guys”

Necoho: who appears to be some sort of god of doubt
There is a bunch of guys all claiming to be gods for the beast men, at this point I don’t believe them

Also special shoutout to the Gods who are part of Grand Allegiance chaos, but are not chaos gods

They just decided to uh, side with chaos

Coiling Ones are serpentine animal gods who also have their own minor faction like Great Gather and Speaker In Stone

And The Ever Raging Flame is one of the elemental gods from the winds of magic that Sigmar and Nagash cast down from their thrones, survived and now is buddying up with chaos

Has a faction, and also mentioned in the rpg

A couple other old elemental-gods have wanted to join chaos, the skaven almost recruited one but the Lumineth went destiny 2 on that shit

ReKilling Iron Demiurge before he ever left his tomb-prison

[west zealot]

One of the things that makes AoS very cool as a setting in my books at least it's that is high fantasy

Why a big emphasis on the Fantasy

Shit gets bonkers and there's a lot of genuinely batshit in good ways stuff in there

[obsidian flume]

I’m a really big fan of the post-titanomachy chaos sympathizers

I hope they get more love at some point but you can’t really put them in the main wargame except as like “here is a unit for slaves to darkness who worships one”

[west zealot]

Who are those? The ones you mentioned earlier or ?

[obsidian flume]

Ones I mentioned earlier but there are a lot of these guys that Sigmar, Nagash and Gorkmamorka killed or imprisoned back in the day

Who might not be too fond of the other grand allegiances

Shoutout King Of 100000 constellations or whatever his name is, who was a god who singlehandedly enslaved the mortal inhabitants of heaven until Sigmar woke up

Their cultists do shit like “eat magical stones like their fucking skaven and turn into elementals”

[west zealot]

Ahhh

That's fun

I freely admit a lot of my lore knowledge is drawn from 1d6chan, tvtropes etc, so it may have holes.

[obsidian flume]

Ima be real this is a situation of me reading the rpg and getting obsessed with an obscure corner of the lore

Which is “gods who are part of chaos besides the big 4”

[floral herald]

I’m honestly not sure what to read for aos lore

I have the broad strokes from the rule book

I guess I gotta read some of the novels haha

[obsidian flume]

Soulbound, the AoS rpg gives a lot more lore details

In depth breakdowns of all the realms and factions

Their currency is a liquid, which is neat

[west zealot]

I've heard Reynolds is good, but he's stopped writing for black library. Mike Brooks does incredible 40k novels, and I think he's got some AoS stuff? Reddit can probably help

[spice flicker]

As a person who enjoys chaos knights and imperial knights, I have to say leaks are making me quite sad

[pulsar cairn]

oh nooo

[main pagoda]

Court of the blind king fucks

all the gortrek stuff is good

Soul wars is also good

[west zealot]

Reddit discussing HR in space Marines, leading to this beautiful line

"To be honest, if the Emperor had done his 2 week mandatory sensitivity coaching we wouldn't be in this fix."

[jaunty dawn]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/ainqvvwt/rules-in-the-age-of-darkness-what-are-tactical-statuses/?fbclid=PAZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAacsz5YBtER7aYb65nE4h-eYu7TReDhfodAgof_TvwxUn7gOdG32GPgdf7EX2w_aem_ekwnEjq_VDfp77N6UMf7LQ

I hope this is good

I want this to be good so bad

[floral herald]

This has potential yeah

[deft crest]

Loud stomping up hallway WHATS THIS? Someone in another channel made a meme about splitfiring is it true

Is it worth getting those models back out chat

[tired cairn]

Seems mildly weird to have Cool and Leadership be different stats

[empty siren]

speaking of splitfire

I'M SO HAPPY THAT T'AU CAN FUCKING SPLITFIRE NOW YIPPEEEEEEE

Also our army rule is now easier to keep track I believe

Cause by the sounds of it, you select units to be the observers before shooting takes place

Also, one thing I found out- completely unrelated to data slate. Is that, T'au are fantastic at scoring secondaries

[paper bluff]

It would be nice if they made factions with more than 10 units

[paper bluff]

Somethings stay the same

[past sphinx]

tau couldnt splitfire?

goofy ahh rulebook

[thin ibex]

it wasnt that they couldnt it was that they were punished for doing it if they used their faction rule

what was spotting

the way it used to work was you use 1 unit ot spot a guy for another unit; when that unit shoots at the spotted guy, they get +1 BS, but if they shot anything else? -1BS

now it works like if a dude spots an enemy, any tau unit that isn't spotting gets +1 BS against that guy, no negatives for not shooting that guy

meaning tau can splitfire at their normal BS while still being good at shooting the spotted dude

[thin ibex]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DKfDy4BsaZW/?igsh=MXN2enQwZXN2ZXZ1ZA==

th3willminiatures

Custom saturnine armor #saturnine #horusheresy #horusheresysaturnine #kitbash #spacemarines #whitescars #miniaturepainting #warhammerpainting #warhammer40k

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[past sphinx]

Bigger.

[pulsar holly]

It got imprisoned….and then Morathi -sighs- Morathi being Morathi shot herself in the foot and screwed over everyone else by making Slaanesh’s eventual release very likely.

[pulsar cairn]

Imma punch morathi

[bright dove]

Always the correct impulse

[tardy vault]

Everyone hates to see a girlboss winning

Morathi is part gigantic snake monster and part hot lady which means she is always justified in what she does

(to actually explain, she created a portal into Slaanesh's stomach and ate the souls of the Phoenix Kings in order to complete her ascension into godhood)

(this worked, but she hesitated before eating her husband which let him split her in two causing her to become two bodies with a shared soul)

[pulsar cairn]

Oh no

[upper canopy]

Killing off Khaine fucking sucks tho

I will sayy

[sonic hare]

would the avatar of khaine models be as lit though

[upper canopy]

There's no Avatar of Khaine in AoS!

There's no Khaine!

He dead!

He Just Dead!!!

[tardy vault]

There's an Avatar?

It fucking sucks

but there's an Avatar

[quaint compass]

Temu Avatar of Khaine

Made with the strongest Morathium

[tardy vault]

It's like 120 points and still unplayable lol

[tepid stratus]

I highly recommend the Cado Ezechiar novels or the last Volari for death shenanigans. Godeater's Son or Darkoath for good chaos rep

[empty siren]

They could. But -1 to BS was well...BS

[thin ibex]

thats a lil lame

[empty siren]

Idk how much more I'll be spending on my Tau army, but that change to their army rule is making it REAAALLY enticing to get a stormsurge

I'll prolly drop a thousand 😭😭😭

[final tide]

https://pastebin.com/LYKNuZQh big waaagh feels kinda bad to build in but i still love it even if its a Bad Soup

at least i have my orky soup i love them

[sour sequoia]

Everything getting cheaper makes me wonder abt big waagh

Especially if you do the krag n piggies

[spice flicker]

Thoughts on this for an 750 points agents crusade force as a starting point?

[rocky shale]

You need a way to hurt a vehicle

[spice flicker]

Which is a real struggle in imperial agents

[rocky shale]

You could give your agents meltas, or swap in a immolator + BSS

What detachment is this?

[rocky shale]

Are you set on those Grey Knights?

[spice flicker]

Is there something better to attach a terminator Inquisitor to?

[rocky shale]

Deathwatch with hammers swing into tanks harder

Are you set on the termie inquisitor?

[spice flicker]

I think its pretty neat and the paycannon gives it better firepower than a base inqusitor

[thin ibex]

I think the termites can punch a vehicle to death at 750

They come with hammerhand don't they?

[rocky shale]

Wounding on 5s and relying on lethal otherwise is pretty rough as your only way to kill vehicles

Hsmmerhand is just lethal on charge

[spice flicker]

120 points for agents+Chimera
190 points for Grey knights
200 points for sisters+immolators
280 points for DW+blackstar

[thin ibex]

Yeah but at 750 if the opponent is bringing a lot of vehicles, you're gonna outscore or out position them most likely

Also using Grenade and chimera tank shocks can supplement

[rocky shale]

You can do DW in rhino for less

[thin ibex]

All you really need to do is face roll the chimera intimate the enemy vehicles for two rounds

[spice flicker]

Aye but the firepower of the blackstar i like more than just the atubber of the rhino

[thin ibex]

Into*

[rocky shale]

Or honestly just giving the agents multimeltas

What detachment is this?

[sweet solar]

they should flesh out votan with chaos votan a la the scientists in doom 2016

with a doomguy votan single model unit

not a new faction just a gr9uo you caj add to reggo votan

[thin ibex]

They need more votann media just so that there's balance to how hard their dex glazes them

Not mad at that, a faction dex should glaze the faction its for.

But there should be more