Warhammer and Such

[thin ibex]

Game plan is the big cultist mobs with dark communes are massive screens on objectives or near the enemy line and the legionaries occupy every good bit of cover on the map

And play for as big of an early game lead as possible

Both lords in reserve

I think big scary melee might be my undoing

But otherwise got plenty of tar and plenty of lascannons

[thin ibex]

a tomb world would make a cool boarding action setting huh

[uneven ember]

hell yeah

[thin ibex]

Tau squad marking transfers are hard to replicate free hand

any advice on simple ways to do squad markings?

im thinking stripes maybe?

[floral herald]

https://x.com/mklenger/status/1845525894590275814?s=46&t=RjdIzh2qFuWkjovzBmgCsQ

ratarchy 💚🖤 ΘΔ (@MKlenger) on X

Queek Headtaker after an entire day of killing people

Twitter · Oct 13, 2024, 6:03 PM

[thin ibex]

also opinion wise, do yal lthink breachers should have a different helmet color from a strike team?

or maybe just have stripes

[unreal cosmos]

I'd take advantage of the helmet shapes to break up colors differently

[pulsar cairn]

@surreal crown

[cosmic tulip]

Silly idea

Guevesa sororitas

Also yall I can’t decide

60 bucks for a box of solar auxilla or 50 for Cadians?

Or neither and I just get a battlesuit or something

[pulsar cairn]

Guevesa sororitas feel a bit out of character

mostly cause the more religious elements of the imperium are kind of cray cray

[cosmic tulip]

It does but it would be kinda intriguing ngl

Religious converts

I’m not sure what would be cheaper or a better deal overall I have 100 dollars

[pulsar cairn]

i like tau robots

[cosmic tulip]

The Coldstar commander is 63 dollars

[pulsar cairn]

Oof

[cosmic tulip]

Idk it’s going to be 60 regardless

[thin ibex]

It looks like my magnetized guns are gone for good

No idea where they might be

[uneven ember]

booo

[floral herald]

That sucks

[jaunty dawn]

I think guevesa are often still like

emperor worshipping? iirc

so honestly I could definitely see tau sisters

it would be highly unusual though

[balmy wave]

the Gue'Vesa have the option to keep their faith

most do, because they don't know any better

[cosmic tulip]

The water caste removed a lot of the xenophobia

[balmy wave]

but considering sisters are devout followers of the Imperial Creed and also act as the chamber militant of the Ordo Hereticus, I doubt many of them would suffer the xenos to live

like, these are nuns with guns whose belief in the Emperor is so intense that they literally cause miracles to happen on the battlefield

and in recorded history, like 3 of them have fallen to chaos

[cosmic tulip]

We know a bit about how the imperial creed was changed

Ironically it’s a lot like the imperial truth

[balmy wave]

one of the added clauses is "Big E is god"

[cosmic tulip]

Removed the xenophobia, bigotry, and a lot of the iconography but do allow the guevesa to keep wearing imperial uniforms or armor

[pastel rampart]

https://fixupx.com/OculusImperia/status/1845538247553986842

[ebon forge]

https://redd.it/1g2dhk8

[valid brook]

Powerful commiseration, I once accidentally sold a bunch of magnetized guns because I’d hidden them in a box I decided to get rid of.

[remote wharf]

Damn, the rogue intern has been working for GW since the 80s? You'd they'd be a full employee by now.

[jaunty dawn]

til there's a whole conspiracy war about the gaz/thatcher thing (or lack thereof)

[surreal crown]

so eeby 🥺

[bold halo]

I'm finding out how people are running striking scorpions in 40k right now and it's horrifying god damn

my boys finally get the respect they deserve

the tl;dr is cannonball them down the middle in a falcon with karandras riding shotgun and delete whatever they charge into

falcon's fire support letting them reroll to wound on the turn they disembark, all of them have devastating wounds vs non vehicle and monster models, 4 goddamn chainsword attacks each with sustained hits, exarch either gets 5 attacks at +1 strength -1 AP or 4 attacks at a worse to hit roll that you just throw your army rule rerolls at w/ 8 strength and -2 AP

and then karandras is just a monster

+1 to hit for the unit he's leading, he crits on a 4+ if he charged, also has devastating wounds taking advantage of that 50% crit

but he's only limited to non-titanic for DW

like they're a blender into infantry, even heavier more elite infantry just due to the volume of devastating wounds that can come in, and the exarch w/ claw and karandras can be a can opener into even bigger targets

I need a falcon

pushing up my plans to turn the autarch kit into a kitbash karandras too

even though I know I should just wait for what I know is going to be a sick new mini when it lands

anyway my take away is welcome back 4th edition clown car tactics

just can't spam them because karandras is a special boy

[untold swallow]

Man

Chaplains would be so much cooler if they weren't so fuckin edgy imo lol

[desert jay]

They really do be on that memento mori type beat

[untold swallow]

Honestly my complaint is mainly about the Primaris Chaplain and the idea behind the skull helmet generally

I guess I can respect the terrifying visage type beat but like

after a while it gets a little stale lmao

[floral herald]

I think they should be moderately edgier, the SM2 chaplain with the popped collar and trench coat over power armor is a good addition

[untold swallow]

I mean

[lofty warren]

Primaris aesthetics are all sorts of goofy

Tbh

[untold swallow]

the SM2 chaplain is the Primaris Chaplain

Like

[floral herald]

Perhaps some sunglasses over the skull

[untold swallow]

Made into an in-engine model

[untold swallow]

Oh I forgot the Indomitus Chaplain is a different model

[lofty warren]

He'd take to sunglasses well

[floral herald]

It doesn’t have the popped collar

[untold swallow]

This is where I will give

The weird, Jesusy side of the Blood Angels some cred

Death masks rock

[bold halo]

if they drop a bunch of new phoenix lords next year like people are expecting it's going to ruin me

god damn

[desert jay]

Imperial studies have found that the average astartes does in fact need more reminders of his own mortality

[lofty warren]

Between that and fulgrim

Real pheonix year in the making

[untold swallow]

Look, my chapter goes fully into the idea of the gene-seeds as Marines living on

[bold halo]

I am #1 aspect warrior enjoyer and it's kicking back into full gear right now

[untold swallow]

To the point there were initial misgivings about Primaris adoption because they didn't have the vaunted lineages of firstborn members

[bold halo]

the fact I can just skip taking guardians entirely makes me so happy ngl

[floral herald]

I hope the codex makes some of them more elite/glass cannon-y

(Looking at Banshees mostly)

[bold halo]

banshees have always needed some help

[floral herald]

Yeah they’re not usually that strong but they don’t really have a niche right now

Good at killing battle sisters I guess

[bold halo]

back when I played in 4th/5th they were in such an awkward spot of like, all power weapons to go after high armor save targets but only strength 3 so they couldn't hurt the high armor save targets

[desert jay]

Also now wondering where they get rib bones large enough to fit to the outside of their power armor

[bold halo]

spirit halloween

[desert jay]

Ah of course

[floral herald]

I thought they had S4 on the charge from Furious Charge back then?

I played Orks so they never really scared me ngl

Now the 4e/5e wraithlord, that scared me

[bold halo]

sure, +1 strength from furious charge putting them at strength 4

wounding space marines on a 4+

[floral herald]

I think it was a T8 W6 model?

[floral herald]

Killing space marines on a 4+ really

[bold halo]

yeah which means after filtering through WS 4 vs WS 4 you kill roughly 25% of the unit and get tarpitted

going down to a 5+ to wound

banshees were rough

[floral herald]

Didn’t the banshee masks debuff WS? Or am I getting mixed up

Maybe they just worked like frag grenades

[bold halo]

morale check vs lose 1 WS

for the first round only

the hard targets they would want to throw power weapons at generally pretty good at those

idk they just never performed for me, harlequins just kind of ate their lunch

higher WS, 4th ed rending was busted

with some hot dice you could punch a tank to death with clowns

[bold halo]

had to go back and double check and yes it was T8 but what the fuck do you mean three wounds

god and the absolute privelege to spend 80 points to twin link your bright lance, forgot that's why my model has two different guns

one big gun was mandatory, second was optional but cost the same as the first one and duplicate choices just twin-linked

[floral herald]

Whaaat

[bold halo]

so I'm like 90% sure I used mine as pure volume of fire with scatter laser/shuriken cannon for like, 7 attacks

[floral herald]

I forgot it was 3 wounds

[bold halo]

3 wounds and if it's not within 6" of a warlock or farseer it has a 1 in 6 chance to just do nothing for the round lol

S10 with rerolls to hit in melee though so keep your tanks far away

man having adult money rules, I'm gonna be able to build the eldar army teenage me always wanted

I love that fuegan and karandras are cracked out of their minds because those were my two favourite aspect warriors back in the day

warp spiders close third but they don't have a phoenix lord still

fuegan's actually fucked though, 2+/4++ with fnp 5+ and then if you do get through all that

nuh uh

with AP nuh uh on all his weapons

[untold swallow]

Is it normal to want to make homebrew rules for your characters lmao

[bold halo]

you are not immune to blorbo

[untold swallow]

look

XD

[granite basin]

in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war.

and spirit halloween

[bold halo]

a tyranid hive fleet scours every ounce of biomass from a planet leaving it a barren, lifeless rock

and then in september up pops a spirit halloween

[granite basin]

at least they get regular clientele

[bold halo]

I can't wait to spend 25% of my points on a brick of wraithguard/blades and a spiritseer lmao

huge points:dollar ratio

[bold halo]

hell yeah

[floral herald]

Karandras is so cool

[past sphinx]

scorpions look ridiculous and i love them

[bold halo]

I think I'm gonna try for this kind of scheme when my paints arrive

brighter than average green, dark accents, bring in some of the yellow other schemes use

[upper bluff]

All the aspect warriors look ridiculous and I hope they never change

[bold halo]

I mean scorps got new sculpts this year and they've absolutely got the sauce

huge hopes for a new karandras after these boys

[floral herald]

Yeah the new sculpts rule

[bold halo]

I'll buy new warp spiders yesterday if they're anywhere near this good

[floral herald]

End of an era if they release new ones

[bold halo]

it's an era that can end, please god

[floral herald]

I’m kinda hoping for a Necron style mid-teleport pose if they update them

[past sphinx]

new fire dragons on the single condition they dont fuck up with dude with the long ass one

[bold halo]

most of the aspect warriors are still on sculpts that were old when I picked eldar up in the mid 2000s

[past sphinx]

genuinely one of my fav 40k models

[floral herald]

https://frontlinegaming-org.cdn.ampproject.org/i/s/frontlinegaming.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/1yq2OOf5U2ntppj6-846x846-1.jpg

This model is so lit every time I see it I wanna get some roboys

[bold halo]

yeah that fire dragon exarch might be one of the best aged minis they've ever produced

[past sphinx]

hes so cool

[bold halo]

man is caked up

[upper bluff]

I think they should update the warp spiders by just perfectly recreating the current model in plastic

Nothing changes

[floral herald]

lol

[bold halo]

but they've already showed us what they're cooking in the autarch kit

let the old minis die pls

they've held on so long

[cosmic tulip]

LMAO

(New sculpts are too)

[uneven ember]

counterpoint: nuh uh skull helmets are dope

[bold halo]

agree

they do it all

[past sphinx]

the skull in the imperium isnt always about being scary, its the symbol of humanity. a totem of humans "birthright" to rule the stars

and i think thats what the chaplain helm represents

now the reiver helmet

that can go in the can

halloween store lookin ass

[thin ibex]

I think the reiver looks cool

[uneven ember]

and/or the Chaplain helmet is the face of the EMPRAH
the Chappie's identity is unimportant, he's just speaking the WORD

[cosmic tulip]

A dead birthmark? Damn the metaphors.

[thin ibex]

Dark reapers, they're not particularly in vogue for Aeldari meta rn are? Meta aside, how are they these days?

[floral herald]

I believe the skull helm is meant to symbolize the Emperor’s sacrifice and to depersonalize the chaplain

[past sphinx]

reaviers halfmask is pretty good, but the fullhelm shouldve been more realistic in its skull motif

[past sphinx]

that too

[floral herald]

Oh yeah I didn’t mean it as disagreement just as another thing

[past sphinx]

and they look sick ass hell

the teeth thou

still get me

[floral herald]

Space marines will see this and go “hell yeah brother”

[bold halo]

reapers have put up some recent tournament results, they don't show up in every list but they do some solid work

[floral herald]

Reapers used to be super meta but everything indirect got hit

[bold halo]

like the reaper launcher is a powerful gun that plays well into basically anything

they're not gonna thin out a giant swarm of infantry but you have other models for that

[cosmic tulip]

https://x.com/Firemetal5/status/1845255402121761172

𝕱𝕴𝕽𝕰𝕸𝕰𝕿𝕬𝕷 (No commissions) (@Firemetal5) on X

discussion

Twitter · Oct 13, 2024, 12:09 AM

[thin ibex]

So reapers are kind of your anti elite, light vehicle generalist firepower?

[uneven ember]

hm
so Back When I used to make my Marshal (my fluff Marshal, I had another mini that I statted as a Marshal but fluffed as a Castellan) as much of a close combat terror as I could
I wonder if it would still make sense to run him as a Marshal or do him as a counts as Helbrecht conversion

[untold swallow]

consider: deathmasks when done well are even cooler

[uneven ember]

consider: lookit that face

[untold swallow]

You're not actually helping your case that much cuz I am running a Dark Angels successor that pointedly doesn't have any Terminators lmao

[past sphinx]

to poor for terminators

shame

boomer firstborn chapters and their 55 suits of relic terminator armor

70 thunder hawks

and a knight house sworn to them and leaving the primaris to pull themselves up by their bootstraps

[untold swallow]

It's not that they're too poor for them, it's that how they operate is so restricted to avoid censure by the Inner Circle

That Terminators are just impractical

They mostly operate in Kill-Teams

They also don't dreadnought marines

They think it's denying the marine their just reward for service in reincarnating into a new marine

[granite basin]

i think giving marines bare-ass skulls is a bad idea no matter how you spin it.

[bold halo]

no I lied, big part of what made them popular before indirect fire got nerfed was the tempest launcher on the exarch, they could wipe out hordes without even needing line of sight

people would just take min sized units with a tempest on the exarch

regular reapers are good at shooting into elites, exarch wipes out soft targets

[thin ibex]

Out of curiosity how did the exarch alone let them do that?

[past sphinx]

No head protection grants +1 toughness

[untold swallow]

lmao

[bold halo]

2d6 attacks blast w/ -1 AP from one model

[past sphinx]

And intimidates your opponents by actually learning to paint faces

[untold swallow]

idk if you meant to make the Deathwatch ttrpg reference but if you did

Nice

[thin ibex]

I guess that's equal to a vehicle huh

Just didn't seem wild at str 4

[bold halo]

average 7 attacks, hit on a 3+ for 4-5 hits on that average, wounds most infantry on 3s or 4s, unit only cost 80 points

so for 240 points you were throwing 6d6 attacks downrange without line of sight

[granite basin]

i just need steadier hands-

[untold swallow]

has very suddenly been introduced to the terminator backflip

[desert jay]

I heard faces are way easier when you're not trying to give the eyes pupils

[uneven ember]

yeah that's a level I've never worked at

[thin ibex]

Yeah that makes a lot of sense, compared to say the imperial guards wyvern

[lofty warren]

man new chaos bikes when

we also need gothic bikies

[untold swallow]

You know what

I'm gonna give my Chief Librarian a purified Tzeentch sword

As a treat

Logan Grimnar gets a Khorne axe

[upper canopy]

Wrong on one front

The model does not have SM2 chaplains sick ass popped collar

[untold swallow]

'sick ass'

sick ass

[upper canopy]

https://tenor.com/view/collar-pop-my-collar-popping-collar-fix-my-collar-fixing-my-collar-gif-12182962

Lameazoid detected, bet this foo' never even was a businessman making 6 figures in the 1980s while consuming copious amounts of the sweetest and roughest Columbian cocaine in order to stave off the existential dread of knowing full well they are a replaceable cog in a grand machine who's wife and house are simply facets of conformity that bring no true joy whatsoever

Smh

[thin ibex]

Calgar has chaos gauntlets, Logan has chaos axe
Is Dantes axe just a real good axe and not chaos?

[upper canopy]

Yeah

[thin ibex]

Good for you dante

[upper canopy]

Dante has enough problems

[thin ibex]

"Hey what's your axes story?"

it's really old. And it's so fucking good.

[untold swallow]

I think I like the idea my Chief Librarian took her sword from a Fallen librarian who was a daemon of tzeentch

[mild glen]

"What's the deal with your axe, Dante?"
"It's... it's an axe. Do you not know how axes work?"

[paper bluff]

Some one said to me "you'd play kill team if they put out a custodes one" I told them right there a custodes kill team would be like 1 custodian

[upper canopy]

You can play Custodes in Kill Team

It's 3 Custodes

[south axle]

Wasn't Custodes just a compendium KT?

[desert jay]

It was a compendium one yeah

One of those "take two fire teams" designs, and each fire team could either be 5 sisters of silence, or 2 custodian guard

So 4 custodes in a pure custodes team

AIUI, 4 custodes are simultaneously murder machines and routinely lose on objectives

[jaunty dawn]

stodes are gone now yeah

[desert jay]

Oh is 3e out out? I thought it was just previews still

[jaunty dawn]

yeah it's been out a week or so

[tired cairn]

I wonder if they will do a custodes kill team

[floral herald]

I think it’s reasonably likely

[tired cairn]

Though one where it's like, a "retired" custode plus all their henchmen would be funny

[floral herald]

The kill grade table only goes to 5 so they won’t be the same 4 person team though

[tired cairn]

Oh, interesting that it goes to five. Are there any teams that are that few?

[floral herald]

Nope!

Not yet anyway

Also only goes as high as 14 and Chaos Cult lost a model to accommodate that

[tired cairn]

Huh, that seems like a weirder choice

[jaunty dawn]

I'm glad it seems that hive secundus stuff doesn't mean ash wastes is being abandoned

oh shit plastic??

I hope we get more nomads stuff

[south axle]

These are the best part of the trike kit

[soft willow]

Oh man.

Those bikes are super cool.

[south axle]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/B3EtzIYC/kill-team-starter-set-space-marines-vs-plague-marines/ GW giving us reprints and MDF terrain, oh my

[floral herald]

Yooooooooooo

[jaunty dawn]

oooh

this is kinda wild!

[floral herald]

Also nice to have a non-gachapon way to get the space marine heroes box

[uneven ember]

ZZ Top squats

[granite basin]

ZZ Squat

[paper bluff]

I wonder why the kill team focus

Well necromunda I mean

[jaunty dawn]

I think someone on necromunda team just loves squats

they've gotten so much stuff

[pastel rampart]

Meanwhile the LoV are just kinda...there, release-wise.

[jaunty dawn]

two kill teams is pretty decent tbf

and a handful of promo minis

compare that to world eaters and there's not much to complain about imo

[floral herald]

Tbf they also have 2 cool KTs

[soft willow]

Votann just need more time to cook.

[silk verge]

they should just sell the mdf terrain separate

[south axle]

Might do in the future

[floral herald]

I think it’s funny how that box has no vantage points and the Eliminator is one of the sickest vantage point campers in KT24

Good for those plague marines you don’t need to face the beast

[desert jay]

They got Jagers Yaegirs post-release but yeah

[quaint compass]

Hopefully there's a decent batch of models in the works instead of a drip-feed

[upper bluff]

Yeah hopefully the codex doesn't drops with one new character

[sweet solar]

OH SHIT NON PLASTIC GW MODELS

one step closer to the return of the perfect card ruins you could buy masses of officially for cheap

and starter sets coming with a couple of big models on card so you could try them out as a beginner without building/painting or most inportantly paying for them

[bold halo]

mdf terrain actually rules

[floral herald]

SVVN

[sweet solar]

RE7URN

as a.tiny child i always thought the bull bannerpole top was its head lol

peak performance

[untold swallow]

Every time a new space marine kill team doesn't have a librarian, I cri

[floral herald]

It’s unlikely there will be one

HQs/characters don’t usually get into Kill Team

[bold halo]

yeah this is Just Dudes town

[jaunty dawn]

i mean I think there could be a balefire acolyte equiv

plus captain justian is here

[floral herald]

Yeah it’s not impossible to have a little psychic guy

Sort of like the helix adept

[sweet solar]

imo the ideal starter set for 40k would be

imperial guard command squad + infantry section, heavy weapon support squad, chimera, deathwatch kill team, card leman russ, card knight auxiliary

vs

farseer, exarch, 2x guardians with support weapons, waveserpent, 1x striking scorpions, mercenery freebooterz unit, mercenery kroot unit, card wraithknight

or something similar

so you have more than a single starting point for 1 faction vs 1 faction, a huge chunky card unit or two you can use for bigger games after doing some begginer games, and multiple killteams worth of units for trying more than one system at once

and a ton of card terrain

[floral herald]

That seems neat yeah

[solemn gull]

Any space marine can be a librarian with a big staff and an outstretched hand

[bold halo]

honestly speaking on starter boxes the thing I miss about warmahordes is the starter boxes being like, $50, in coloured plastic that looked alright unpainted

that was a friendly intro to games

[floral herald]

I think your best bet for running a librarian-alike is counts as Legionaries Balefire Acolyte

[sweet solar]

you know what you are right but prices are so fed right now you would be lucky to get a unit and a character for one faction with no rules or scenery added foe that price

[bold halo]

I don't think warhammer could do it fwiw, warmahordes had the specific dynamic of a force being centered around a character model and a handful of big monsters/robots that let them ship starter boxes of like, 3-4 minis

[tired cairn]

I hope the plague marines get the interesting rules treatment and not be compendium style

[floral herald]

The DG kill team was pretty interesting for a compendium team already

So I wouldn’t worry too much

[tired cairn]

Oh, interesting that they are using MDF terrain too

[floral herald]

Kinda hoping we can take 7 space marines with them though

[tired cairn]

Has GW sold MDF terrain before?

[sweet solar]

the ideal cheap starter set would be like.....

$100, but available in 2x $50 halves

guard command squad, guard squad, marine character, 5 strong space marine squad, 2x card chimera, card razorback

vs

chaos sorcerer, 5 strong chaos legionaires squad, 5 strong ork freebooterz squad, 10 strong kroot carnivore squad, card hellbrute, caed ork buggy

card terrain

googles - WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU MEAN 10X CHAOS LEGIONAIRES ARE $80

oh thats cad

60 isnt, that much better

god

[untold swallow]

A balefire is a cultist, right?

[floral herald]

Squad “medic” basically

Has a nasty melee weapon, a fireball attack, and can heal allies by damaging enemies

[bold halo]

yeah temper expectations remembering that the current introduction box is 5 marines vs 11 tyranids for 80 cad

[untold swallow]

okay wait that's cool as fuck

I think I know what my first kill team is going to be lol

loyalist minis but with legionary rules

[floral herald]

I gotta show off the cultist psyker though since it’s crazy as hell

[untold swallow]

amazing

[floral herald]

I think this works really well now that you can make a shootier team

[untold swallow]

are the acolytes in the 2021 or 2018 ruleset?

[floral herald]

The only really tricky to make loyalist specialist is the Anointed

[floral herald]

2021 and 2024

[untold swallow]

Cuz I'm not seeing them on New Recruit with either lol

I

was looking at the wrong one

Ignore me

[floral herald]

Haha

[untold swallow]

three different heretic astartes kill teams moment

[lofty warren]

Nah dude he just locks the fuck in

[floral herald]

Yeah it’s doable especially for blood angels

[untold swallow]

## ++ Legionary Kill Team ++ [10EP]
**Configuration**
Game Type: Matched
**Leader**
Chosen: Slaanesh, Plasma pistol
**Operative [10EP]**
Balefire Acolyte [2EP]: Malign Scripture, Tzeentch
Butcher [3EP]: Aggression Stimulants*, Slaanesh
Heavy Gunner [3EP]: Suspensor System, Tzeentch, Heavy bolter
Icon Bearer: Slaanesh, Bolt pistol and chainsword
Shrivetalon [2EP]: Frag Grenade, Slaanesh```

So in terms of models a Captain, Librarian, some Thunder Hammer model, a Heavy Intercessor, a Chaplain, and a Reiver

[past sphinx]

TRIKES BABY

[lofty warren]

This is for kt 21

[untold swallow]

new recruit doesn't have 2024 yet sadly

and this is just concepting

[lofty warren]

Yeah but i do think a lot is very diff. Mostly that equipment doesnt work at all the same

[untold swallow]

shrugs

[lofty warren]

Its not a big deal

But worth keeping in mind

[untold swallow]

I'm going to maybe buy these minis at some point in the distant future lol

[lofty warren]

Ah, i see

[untold swallow]

Like I don't got space to store, assemble, or paint these xD

I think I'm gonna write about them mainly

I do know what models I'd pick for five of them tho

Lazarus made into a captain for the Chosen, Primaris Librarian for the Balefire, Gravis Captain with Heavy Bolt Rifle for the Heavy Gunner, Primaris Chaplain for the Icon Bearer, and Reiver Lieutenant for the Shrivetalon

maybe an ancient for the icon bearer instead

Yeah, Ancient for the Icon Bearer

I have no idea what to do for the Butcher tho

Maybe a Judiciar but cries in is only in the Indomitus box or on EBay

or Honoured of the Chapter, rather

[floral herald]

No rosters is kinda big

As is no roster locks for Legionaries

[tired cairn]

I think it makes sense. It was very arbitrary which teams were affected by rosters

[floral herald]

I agree

I like gods being unlocked for Legionaries

Them and Inquisition probably got the most out of it

The meta is pretty chaotic atm but I’m curious to see how teams are landing

Reddit seems to think it’s

• Tsons
• all other space marines
• Inquisition
• Kasrkin
• everyone else

[bold halo]

I've been seeing a lot of rumblings that the new rules heavily favor elite teams

[floral herald]

I think that remains to be seen but that’s the feeling people have

[bold halo]

yeah I think it's way too early into release to call still

[floral herald]

Elites are definitely much stronger than they were but they also got “solved” and people learned how to beat them with most non-elite teams really well

So I think there’s a lot of adaption to do

[bold halo]

wouldn't be the first time I've seen a kneejerk reaction to something feeling really strong just because it's the first strat to get figured out and pick up steam

[lofty warren]

I hope GW isnt going to pull the rebalance lever too soon

[rocky shale]

Rumors are for fire dragons, fuegan, asurmen, spiders, spider phoenix lord, hawks, baharroth, corsair prince, a corsair jump unit, but not karandras

He'll definitely get a update eventually but none of the rumors mention him

[bold halo]

I am a true believer, he'll come

[rocky shale]

He's just the safest one to make a proxy for right now

[floral herald]

KT has scheduled releases so I don’t think there will be anything before December-January

[rocky shale]

Gw is gonna clear out my wallet with Aeldari in January

[bold halo]

same

[rocky shale]

I gotta burn through my pile of shame fast

[bold halo]

spider phoenix lord is

[rocky shale]

I want new fire dragon sculpts sooooo bad

I refuse to buy resin

[bold halo]

that was basically me not wanting to buy aspect warriors forever, didn't want to spend $70 per five metal minis for a unit of 10, then they made them resin which is just unpleasant to work with

not to mention the massive issues with the finecast rollout in the first place

[upper bluff]

I'm still surprised that I like playing Aeldar as much as I do. Something just clicked and I went "oh its like Admech but less weird"

Cool weapons, hyper specialized units, and a load of invuln saves

The biggest difference is that Aeldar is fast as hell

and by that I mean 1" more than skitarii

[bold halo]

yeah the eldar fantasy of a swiss army knife of hyperspecialists is so cool

[upper bluff]

It's funny I like that part so much when one of my biggest frustrations with wargames are hard counters

It's why I hate Imperial Agents as a concept, "oh you took anti-psyker stuff into this thousand sons matchup now they have to fight uphill"

But when the counter is just stats and not explicitly Anti-Psyker it feels better

I like building armies as like a closed ecosystem that once built I just have to change my strategy in matchups

[hybrid oyster]

I do like inquisiion for exactly the reason you dislike them, their "rule" is to swap out for friends instead of a different in game tangible benefit like chaos cult mutation

it also lets you change your force to suit the mission not just the enemy team

[tired cairn]

I think if the counter is too hard it feels bad for the opponent

Kill Team is hypothetically based on changing operatives based on the situation (unlike 40k) though

(I don't know how often people do this in practice)

[bold halo]

kill team list building BEGS you to counterpick your opponent

it rules

[hybrid oyster]

Other teams can choose to do stuff like swap a flamer operative into a melta operative gunner if theyre facing down something like space marines

inquisition just does it better than anyone else due to the amount of options they get

Personally, the most feelsbad army to play against last edition was kasrkin

elite points are the stuff of nightmares

[floral herald]

It’s common

There’s a few staples

Like CSM pretty much always take a gunner and Balefire Acolyte because they’re cranked

The rest can vary a lot these days

[floral herald]

A lot of people didn’t like it yeah

I think they’re a little more under control since plasma has been nerfed

Oh huh I didn’t realize

Elite Points are just gone

[tired cairn]

What did Elite Points do before?

Oh, they get what is basically Doctrina Imperatives now

[floral herald]

Spend EP for autohits basically

Gave them extremely reliable shooting

[tired cairn]

That does sound pretty good

[floral herald]

Especially since they got 4 gunners

[tired cairn]

Do they have a better BS score now?

iirc that was part of the justification for them. To be in the middle of 3 and 4 BS skill

[floral herald]

Yeah they naturally shoot at 3+ now

That one dude on 4chan who never got over it can rest after years

[hybrid oyster]

to be fair

if a kasrkin was targeting you they were hitting you 3/4 times minimum

and if it was the plasma or the melta gunner you were dead

[floral herald]

Yeah

[brittle salmon]

Crazy to me Felgor Ravagers are nowhere to be found there

Considering the 2024 rules almost completely wind the clock back to pre nerf status

[floral herald]

I think people are sleeping on them

Though there’s more ways to get crits when shooting now which kind of nerfs them

But I think they’re probably getting under-rated

[brittle salmon]

Considering how hard they were menacing tables pre-nerf I think people had better watch out

[floral herald]

Yeah

[ebon forge]

Something I am surprised nobody made fan art of it
is how the Sayans would 100% be Khorne adjacent, even to become Super Sayan you need so much rage and hatred it would please him

[thin ibex]

Rage is only one possible trigger, if you're talking dbz lore

[ebon forge]

True, but Goku and SS2 Gohan were absolute rage

Vegeta was jealously? I think

[upper bluff]

I feel like making Khorne Super Saiyan fanart would just lead to getting swamped with "umm actually" people from both Warhammer and Dragonball

Its like the markings on a butterfly. To us it's pretty to others it's a threat

[ebon forge]

You got a wonderful point

But I already throwing myself into the lava by drawing a Ork Lucario so hey -runs

[cosmic tulip]

Did they keep the rule where you can ally etherals and Farsight in your army as enclaves sympathizers?

I was considering getting Farsight

But I only have one other crisis suit Commander

[ebon forge]

Kill Team PVE seems to allow you to join with anyone so
hey :)

[cosmic tulip]

Oh no I meant for crusade specifically

[cosmic tulip]

Oh

It was custom septs in 9th ed

[lofty warren]

fucked up that i don't have any game to play a daemon prince in

they should add them to kill team. for all chaos teams

for free

[floral herald]

Chaos will truly be the one true answer

[lofty warren]

i do think that too many skirmish games lack the vibes that a big fuckoff guy can bring to them

obvs theres ogryn and whatnot but they don't have the same vibes as TAGs from infinity

60mm bases and huge guns

kill team could have that juice

[upper bluff]

Agreed

[floral herald]

War Cry does this

Not to say that Kill Team couldn’t

[lofty warren]

even more reason to say it could

[untold swallow]

The Librarius is a space of contemplation, learning, debate, and visions. It is equal to the Reclusiam in terms of importance to the spiritual health of the Blades Contemplative, as the faith of the Chapter in the God-Emperor recognizes that he is also the most powerful psyker in the galaxy. Librarians of the Chapter view their sojourns in the Black Ships before their selection to be angels of the Emperor as a test of their resolve when faced with the horrors of the Warp, and their selection as a sign of passing said test in the eyes of their god, who saw fit to raise them up to the vaunted heights of the Astartes. Librarians of the Chapter universally wear hoods which conceal their eyes from the world, and the world from their eyes in turn, a form of ritual aid to focus their attention on the dire powers of the Warp they wrestle with and unleash.

M o a r L o r e

[thin ibex]

kill team used to have things like crisis suits in it; personally i think the current version is better for not having em

as far as bit bases

[lofty warren]

I do think the game is incomparable

to the smallhammer version of kill team

were crisis suits in 2018, even?

[dense sedge]

played the 40k vr game today, had a blast

[desert jay]

Kill Team 1e also had rules for Blackstone Fortress guys

[floral herald]

I think so with the commanders part but it was super scuffed

[desert jay]

Seems the crisis suits were in the "Kill Team: Elites" expansion

[floral herald]

pedant voice um actually KT1E was from 4th edition 40K and predates blackstone by more than a decade…

[lofty warren]

This is why i use the years

[desert jay]

Ah, well... KT 2019 then, w/e

Kill Team: Commanders had cadre fireblade and ethereals for T'au

[floral herald]

I remember hearing Commanders was super busted

[floral herald]

Ironically the new PvE mode is the closest kill team has been to that edition

[lofty warren]

yeah

[desert jay]

Wild going back to KT2019 and seeing it was freeform 100-pt lists instead of structured teams

Crisis Suits are also barely too expensive that you can't take 3, minimum cost for one is 35 pts

... You could make a legal 100-pt team that's a warboss and 2 gretchin

Or a cheaper warboss and 12 gretchin

[floral herald]

Lmao

I think War Cry is the evolution of KT19

Similar list building and goofy stuff like that

[ebon forge]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/UzwGM4cCaz0
"There was a space for an ocean of disappointment from between those two words"
How to even recover after that amount of disappointment, holyshit

[untold swallow]

gotta say that's a bad line read lmao

'room for an ocean of disappointment'

doesn't even pause between the words

And he's not even necessarily disappointed in Felix specifically if the line is properly read

It's him having to take a moment and swallow the disappointment of 'wow, all the space marines who I tried to teach through the Codex are like this.'

'I... fucked up, really bad, didn't I.'

[floral herald]

Yeah I think its fair to say that if you want to emphasize a space between two words it probably shouldn't be said in the same breathless rushed TikToker cadence as the rest of it

There's only a space for a stream or perhaps a riffle of disappointment there

[untold swallow]

Primarchs are at their best and narratively coolest when they realize they have been born, bred, and molded into pure, utter fuck-ups as people in favor of being mindless warmongers for their father

[upper canopy]

I think the thing is that like

to a space marine seeing your primarch look at you going "oh I fucked up, didn't I?" is the same as like

[untold swallow]

Because the Emperor being a terrible parent and leader is the fucking point, GW

[upper canopy]

every possible aspirational figure in your life all line up in a row in front of you and click their teeth and shake their head

[hallow star]

even in my limited knowledge these 3 guys are going to have it rough

[upper canopy]

Bobby G just starts vomiting

[cosmic tulip]

Weird thought when playing darktide

[hallow star]

Nah, Gorillaman has actual empathy, he would probably put them up to speed then throw them at the deathwatch since they are loyalist

[cosmic tulip]

I wanna see a hive city in its prime

Stripped of imperial icons

[bright dove]

What would a Hive city in its prime be

It doesn't seem like a good thing no matter how you slice it tbh

[floral herald]

A set of foundations if you ask me

It's all been downhill since the second floor was added

[granite basin]

it's a tossup between execution on the spot and "okay guys take this new armor and if ANYONE ASKS YOU YOU'RE ULTRAMARINE SUCCESSORS NOW"

[cosmic tulip]

A dark age arcology

We know Terra in the DAOT was a huge arcology

But when the automated systems failed famine set in

[ebon forge]

Shame

[cosmic tulip]

Also a possible clue to the man of iron revolt having chaos influence because it happened right when slannesh awoke

[untold swallow]

I like the implication that since that TSon isn't a rubric that means he's a librarian

[granite basin]

i think then it'd be an arcology, bc the concept of a hive city is a nightmarish imperial invention

[untold swallow]

Bro's gonna go fistfight Ahriman

[cosmic tulip]

UR and another AI in the Nepenthe short also mention that Chaos does.. something

[untold swallow]

the Men of Iron rebelling due to Chaos feels

[cosmic tulip]

It makes AI go naturally a little crazy

[untold swallow]

Cheap

[hallow star]

"But- but what about our own legi-"
"They are either traitors, demons or both, You are better off shotting them and not ask questions"

[cosmic tulip]

I think it’s interesting ngl

That even the brightest science of mankind will fail

Because the universe just hates humanity

[untold swallow]

But then it's not a choice those beings made in response to oppression

I think that lets humanity off too easy

ironically lol

imo the Imperium is the bed humanity laid

sweetly rotting, inevitably dead

all beacons of progress and differing thought snuffed out in reactionary fear

[granite basin]

like, i understand, in universe, that chaos is very present and very tangibly A Threat

but i would like for things to not be directly orchestrated by chaos all the time please

[untold swallow]

The Imperium is eating itself alive every day

Its carcass is simply so huge the central nervous system hasn't noticed

[granite basin]

one might even argue they feed chaos just by nature of their existence

[cosmic tulip]

I’d argue humans in the Tau are.. I guess what humanity could be in the future

But that’s just me

[untold swallow]

A gue'vesa who has yielded to the greater good is going to get shot the instant they step foot on an Imperial world

[jagged dawn]

So question what’s the whole deal with agents of the imperium because they seem a bit…kitchen sink-y to us

[untold swallow]

Even if the greater good is objectively better than what the Imperium and its Creed has on offer

A citizen of the Imperium is going to do what they have been taught to do

Silence all who seek to criticize the Imperium

Violently

[cosmic tulip]

I know

But it’s a hopeful sign humans aren’t as inherently fucked as it looks

Also there could be plenty of hidden little enclaves outside the imperiums reach

Like the Severan Dominate!

[granite basin]

i mean, humans? debatable. humanity? they're fucked

[untold swallow]

the Imperium is the bad end of humanity

Liek

Textually

emphasis on end

Because it has no humanity left as we would recognize and appreciate the concept

[granite basin]

they can learn and thus unlearn their habits, as can anyone, but humanity as a greater whole has clung to something that has pretty well weeded out any better options

[untold swallow]

Some people sometimes bring up like

[cosmic tulip]

I choose to hope

[untold swallow]

'Oh the Imperium has no allies because all the aliens wanna kill us so their xenophobia is justified'

[cosmic tulip]

(: because why not

[untold swallow]

key point missing

The Imperium fucking killed the aliens that would want to ally with us

sorry, I get the sense I'm unintentionally yuckin your yums too much I just

I am very passionate about examining the Imperium and in the interest of that passion not indirectly turning into browbeating I am gonna stop

apologies

[granite basin]

correct, lol

[cosmic tulip]

Wait what

[wild fog]

'The imperium has no allies because all the aliens wanna kill us.'

Yeah, have you seen the fucking Imperium?

[cosmic tulip]

I’m not disagreeing with yall!

Not at all!

[untold swallow]

Oh I mean

I am saying I don't think there's really any hope for humanity

[cosmic tulip]

I like the inquisitor in broken sword

[untold swallow]

and that it follows on that I don't think there deserves to be

[wild fog]

In the fictional space of the Imperium there is a space for pretty much anyone though. Like in 'lore' a Gue'sava would be a heretic and put to the sword but like, some distant agri world? Might be surprisingly cool with it.

[cosmic tulip]

“We consider the eldar a failed empire. They consider the same of us. The imperium is come and gone. The tau represent something new.”

[untold swallow]

I mean a lot of those distant agri-worlds

Become t'au worlds

[wild fog]

On that side of the galaxy sure.

[cosmic tulip]

That’s how they spread when the Damocles Crusade was introduced

Giving efficient farming tech to worlds left behind by the imperium

[untold swallow]

Again, rotting Imperium not keeping control of its own people because its tools are fear, dogma etc etc

while the greater good's is

[cosmic tulip]

And how the Inquisition took notice

[untold swallow]

having bread

and getting to retire

Because that is how low the bar the Imperium has set for humanity

[cosmic tulip]

My finest success was getting my imperium simp friend to finally say “to be honest, I’m gonna agree with you. I’d live on a tau world if I had the choice.”

[untold swallow]

Oh I'd absolutely live on a t'au world given the choice if I was a human

Now

[cosmic tulip]

In my view the tau being the youthful unpredictable empire is cool as hell!

I don’t like the inherent idea that they’re doomed to fail, tbh

But I’m the minority

[untold swallow]

Whether I'd choose to be human

Is debatable

[wild fog]

Living on a Tau world would be awful.

It would be the best world to live in 40k by a huge margin

[untold swallow]

I feel like the t'au being doomed to fail is both

not set in stone

[floral herald]

No I think craftworlds beat them out tbh

[untold swallow]

but the likely outcome

This is the Grim Darkness of the Far Future

There is Only War

hope exists to, to be frank

[wild fog]

Living in a Craftworld means living as a Craftworlder though, and having a low level anxiety that if you slip up even for an instant you are condemned to super-hell

I'm not sure I'd want to have an eternal existential anxiety crisis

[untold swallow]

be shattered, mutilated, and strung up for all to see

[floral herald]

I am not sure if living with a bunch of repressed dramatic theater adults is a good or bad thing

[untold swallow]

I mean I already have generalized anxiety disorder

[floral herald]

It might be personal preference

[wild fog]

The thing about 'T'au are doomed to fail' is that several factions that have tried to force that issue have found out the T'au are surprisingly hard to fuck with

[untold swallow]

unironically a soul stone would actually do so much for a lot of anxiety

Because you know what I bet a lot of Eldar do?

[wild fog]

Like they have a pretty nasty counter punch, turns out

[cosmic tulip]

Nuh uh

[untold swallow]

This is not a meme

I bet a bunch of Eldar fucking fidget with them

[floral herald]

Plausible yeah

[cosmic tulip]

Even the old lore about the universe being sentient and actively hating hope was changed

So that’s not even set in stone fully

[untold swallow]

I mean in 40k that is the base outcome of a hopeful character, unless it's a character like Grimaldus

Whose hope is

[floral herald]

Hope has shooters in 40k tbf

[cosmic tulip]

Yriel does! He has his on a necklace in Valedor

[untold swallow]

'I want to kill all these Fucking orks so hard'

[floral herald]

They're often Rubric Marines but they're shooters for hope 100%

[cosmic tulip]

Idk I like 40k as a raging against nihilism

Amp up the madness just fuck it we ball

I know I’m the minority

[wild fog]

There's room for that story in 40k I believe pretty firmly.

[cosmic tulip]

But it’s what drew me

[untold swallow]

I can't bring myself to engage with 40k as that because

The ones raging against the nihilism

are the ones for whom their religion is textually 'wrong'

<XD

[cosmic tulip]

(The amount of people who told me to go to aos was a lot)

[cosmic tulip]

This is why I play tau with a lot of guevesa and kroot

[untold swallow]

I mean AoS does what you seem to want a lot more straightforwardly, but

[uneven ember]

There is a god of hope in Warhammer 40K!
It's Tzeentch!

[cosmic tulip]

The indomitable human spirit with something a lot more worth fighting for

[untold swallow]

40k has space for peeps like ya

[cosmic tulip]

It does but I like the sci-fi a bit more

[wild fog]

As someone who loves AOS, it still feels.. disjointed.

[cosmic tulip]

I am collecting cities of Sigmar but 40k just had this claw on my soul

[floral herald]

tbf the only real religion on 40k is uh the Passions to put it politely

[cosmic tulip]

I love it

[floral herald]

The rest are ideological lies but the Old Four are real

[untold swallow]

I am indeed a Tzeentch Enjoyer

But through the lens of

[cosmic tulip]

I saw a howling banshee and a guevesa in a battlesuit

And I was fucking sold

[untold swallow]

I love playing absolute bastard sorcerers

[cosmic tulip]

(And then I started admech when I transitioned)

[upper canopy]

We're all gonna be fine if we can just get Ynnead back

[untold swallow]

Look

I like me some space elves

But no

[floral herald]

That's probably gonna happen at some point

[untold swallow]

That is going to fix

One thing

Kind of

[cosmic tulip]

I am kinda going away from eldar tbh

[floral herald]

I don't think its gonna kill Slaanesh but it might AoS Slaanesh

[upper canopy]

Kills Chaos

[untold swallow]

it is going to kind of counter Big Thirsty

[upper canopy]

LMAO

[untold swallow]

Maybe

[cosmic tulip]

As I age I find they’re less relatable and more.. annoying

[upper canopy]

The idea that Ynnead shows up

[cosmic tulip]

I like the tau

[upper canopy]

In AoS

and just kills Slaanesh as a deux ex machina

[cosmic tulip]

The tau genuinely feel very hopeful and joyful to play

[upper canopy]

and absolutely no one can understand how or why

[floral herald]

Oh lmao

[cosmic tulip]

When I win with tau (never have) it feels like I’m making progress (I get my shit kicked in)

[floral herald]

I can see how that read that way

[untold swallow]

two of the machine? (/j)

[floral herald]

I meant more trap Slaanesh in a metaphysical prison

[upper canopy]

Banned

[untold swallow]

XDDDDDDD

[cosmic tulip]

I did nuke a defiler with a broadside and beat a friend through sheer things I killed once

Not objectives

It was my proudest moment

(: the indomitable human/alien spirit and GUN

[untold swallow]

petition to start calling Slaanesh Big Thirsty

[wild fog]

Playing the Tau: If we all work together and SHOOT A LOT, we can do it!
Angron: Angry Angron noises
Tau: Oh no oh no oh no

[untold swallow]

I feel

Bad

For like

All the traitor primarchs

Except Kurze

[cosmic tulip]

SHOOT THE ANGRON

[untold swallow]

Kurze was born an awful little shithead

[uneven ember]

the Tau really are taking on the galaxy with the power of friendship and also this gun

[wild fog]

I mean Perturabo was also kind of always a jerk.

My favorite T'au detail is their staunchest ally, the Kroot, are really just there for the munchies.

Kroot be like "Yeah Greater Good sure yeah pass the alien meat please. Yes it's our culture, no you can't question it."

[untold swallow]

Perturabo suffered from being competent

[wild fog]

Competent and insufferable about it.

[untold swallow]

And who tf did he learn that from I wonder?

[uneven ember]

Peturabo was done wrong and also he was just the worst

[untold swallow]

angry iron warrior noises

[floral herald]

I think the most sympathetic read is that Perturabo was assigned-shithead-at-creation by his warp power to supernaturally see the flaws in all things

Including all his allies and himself and the universe itself

[untold swallow]

Perturabo got that ultra self-critical treatment resistant warp depression

[floral herald]

So its not surprising that he winds up bitter and resentful and incapable of appreciation

[untold swallow]

You know what I find really funny

My favorite loyalist primarch inherited in my opinion the Emperor's worst trait

NEVER FUCKING TELLING ANYONE ANYTHING

[brittle salmon]

Perturabo did a couple of things wrong but he really did get fucked over

[untold swallow]

JONSON WILL YOU PLEASE CONFIDE IN SOMEONE JUST ONCE

[untold swallow]

I cannot wait for Lion's version of this moment

It is going to be so good

Or it's happened already but I don't read the novels

[upper canopy]

Perturabo at least is the only chaos primarch that was allowed to win

[floral herald]

This is basically the whole plot of Lion: Son of the Forest haha

[untold swallow]

God I really need to read that book, huh

[floral herald]

It's a fun one

Probably about 90% of Lion's 40k characterization as well

[uneven ember]

Yeah, & he even gets a moral victory over the other traitor Legions
When he turns the whole Siege because Horus goes "Legion 4 gets broken up to reinforce the other Legions" & Pete just gets to go "know what? fuck y'all I'm out"

[thin ibex]

"i said id breach the imperial palace, I did. Rest is on yall"

[untold swallow]

https://youtu.be/hTOKJTRHMdw

Perty remains based

[brittle salmon]

By the twenty-seventh of Quintus, Horus' forces had captured both the Lion's Gate and Eternity Wall Spaceports. This allowed him to fully land his last and greatest reserves: the Legio Mortis Titan Legion. By this point in the battle, however, acting siege commander Perturabo had become fed up by the state of the traitor armies. Daemons swarmed the ranks of the traitor armies of his brothers and allies had now pledged themselves fully to the Ruinious Powers. Seeing that the war was no longer one of Legion vs. Legion, Perturabo's breaking point came when Horus ordered him to break up his Legion and disperse it amongst the greater traitor armies. Mortarion and the Death Guard would instead take up Perturabo's positions, and the humiliation proved too much for the Lord of Iron to tolerate. Fed up, he ordered his Legion to leave Terra for paths unknown.

horus: hey your guys suck. go back up my other, cooler brothers.
perty: nah. leaves

[untold swallow]

Perty: 'You have gravely fucking miscalculated who really holds the cards here bro.'

[bright dove]

I mean, Age of Sigmar is the better game.

[cosmic tulip]

No no

It was for my perspective

“Your perspective doesn’t fit in 40k, I recommend AoS”

I did play my first game of AoS last month

It was very fun!

Couldn’t tell you which game was better but AoS seems faster slightly

[thin ibex]

I feel like better is going to be subjective on what you like about either game

rather than just an objective statement

Doesn't really demand you take a polarized stance

[untold swallow]

Yeah

I generally prefer fantasy

as in the genre

But of the Warhammers

I prefer 40k

Because

well I'm gonna be honest cuz space knights in powered armor kind of just kick

enormous amounts of ass

[cosmic tulip]

True

[thin ibex]

as far as an actual game and mechanics, they're different enough that you dont have to pick one you like

you can just like both (if you do like both)

[cosmic tulip]

I do like both

[thin ibex]

now as far as your wallet goes, choosing one is probably wise

but it dont matter which

just that buying minis for 2 games can be... expensive

[untold swallow]

Or you can play daemons

[cosmic tulip]

I only plan to play cities of Sigmar

And keep them a small army at best

[thin ibex]

that was actually what i might do, at some point

but honestly im trying to think of an army that i can hand to people to play against me that is pretty balanced

and space marines seem probably best for that

daemons are kinda skew

despite giving me both games as options

[bright dove]

So, uh. Daemons do not do one army in AoS

[thin ibex]

If you do mono God they do right?

Or was it the other way?

[floral herald]

I think Mourg is refering to how Daemons are like 4+ armies in AoS because of how they're split up

[thin ibex]

That's fair, but if you collect Daemons, they can be used in both games

And if you collect the right demons, you can field them in an army in both games

Right?

[floral herald]

yeah

AIUI Unless you mono-god for 40k you'll probably have a couple of AoS armies which need to be fielded separately

But I think this is less of a problem then it sounds because AoS armies are generally lower model count than 40k ones

[granite basin]

is monotheism a debuff

[untold swallow]

It's theoretically a strategy pigeonhole

[jagged dawn]

Hmm, seems our question got lost which is fair considering the discussion

[tepid stratus]

Yes but no. In AOS the daemons are folded into their mono god books with their respective mortal counterparts. There's no way to run mixed daemons in AOS, at least there hasnt been since 2nd edition

[brittle salmon]

they're explicitly meant to be that way to serve as a kind of ally matrix for Imperium factions to soup into their army

Daemons of Chaos serve the same purpose for Chaos armies but they act a lot better on their own

[tepid stratus]

It's this funny little thing called having an army rule lol

[floral herald]

Yeah Agents are 80% a grab bag for other imperial armies

[brittle salmon]

I mean, yes, but also they have an actual roster with varied units

rather than 8 different flavours of infantry and some transports

[floral herald]

Daemons are also extremely cranked rn

One of the strongest armies in 40k rn

[tepid stratus]

You mean you don't want a roster of dozens of flavourful but mechanically overlapping infantry and no tanks or anti tank options?

[brittle salmon]

You aren't meant to play em as an actual army anyway, so

It's whatever to me

[tepid stratus]

I'm honestly surprised I don't play daemons in 40k. Between my tzeentch and slaanesh armies for AOS I could probably build a decent list

[floral herald]

I think the Imperial Agents army is great because their combat patrol is phenomenal for getting a kill team

[brittle salmon]

[floral herald]

I actually did get their combat patrol because it gives 2 kill teams in full and a super sick bonus model or 2

[ebon forge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urpmmutO5PY Angron can't catch a fucking break

[tepid stratus]

I'll give this to the agents book tho, it's actually given my scions list a good thematic melee threat by letting me take a Corvus and deathwatch veterans

[brittle salmon]

hype to get some more deathwatch units back

[tardy vault]

One of my favorite bits of 40k demons and AoS demons having the same model is this

One of these is not like the others lol

[floral herald]

same

[jagged dawn]

Fair enough. We were just looking at them as an actual army as opposed to units to add to other armies because we wanted to do stuff with inquisitors

Unfortunately all the armies we think are cool often have the problem of having to well, paint them

[brittle salmon]

I'd really just add an Inquisitor to a Guard/Scions army with some suporting units, ngl

[jagged dawn]

gods we hate painting faces

[floral herald]

I do think they make a relatively poor standalone army because a lot of how good an army is rn is how good they are at rapidly contesting the midfield and how good they are and killing T12

[thin ibex]

So if I went mono khorne I could field broadly similar armies across both games?

[jagged dawn]

we like IG but we hate painting faces

[floral herald]

And while they're very good for the former they're very bad for the latter

[floral herald]

yeah 100%

[brittle salmon]

Scions are fully helmeted besides sergeants

[jagged dawn]

please GW don’t make us paint faces

[tired cairn]

Do they have an alterantive head for the sergent that is with the helmet on?

I know some boxes work that way

[brittle salmon]

They might

[rocky shale]

Imperial Agents are workable currently but could really use a good source of lascannon shots so they aren't forced to run knights

[jagged dawn]

Same problem with sisters of battle, normal units can have helmets, important people don’t

[floral herald]

idk about Scions but Aquilons have enough heads to do all helms or (nearly) all bare headed

[jagged dawn]

And we’d have too much anxiety over making the commander look good

[tepid stratus]

In this case yes because the daemon book will inevitably have mono god detachments and the AOS books will probably have formations that lean heavy into daemon builds

[floral herald]

I still haven't decided if I want all helms or all faces

[tired cairn]

I think more helmets is good if you want to lean into the evil look

[floral herald]

I'm leaning towards all faces cause I love suffering

[rocky shale]

Faces are a lot easier to paint once you find a contrast paint you like

[brittle salmon]

The funniest bit about 40k/AoS daemon overlap is that Soul Grinders exist

[floral herald]

And there's some sick breath masks

[jagged dawn]

We have never used a contrast paint in our life

[tired cairn]

(The trailer is interesting in that the first half they come off as the bad guys, but in the second half it's standard heroics)

[floral herald]

Vashtorr laughin all the way to the inter-setting bank of souls

[jagged dawn]

And that’s because after several years of procrastination we settled into a mindset of “fuck it good enough”

[brittle salmon]

So AoS canonically has 40k tier cannonade and machinery in it

[tepid stratus]

Wouldn't surprise me if they find a way to put vashtor in AOS. Then again Syn and Dex didn't get into 40k

[jagged dawn]

We can always add more detail later on but for now we need to actually assemble and paint the damn things

[floral herald]

I think its funny that Vashtorr can't actually hang out with Daemons

They just don't like his ass

[tepid stratus]

Yes but tragically it's terribly mediocre compared to the double cursed armour and shields made from the shattered cores of dead worlds

[floral herald]

So he hangs with chaos space marines

[tired cairn]

Part of his purview would be "shoving unwilling demons into machines", so I can see that souring things

[floral herald]

They are willing tbf

[rocky shale]

I wouldn't like a guy known for welding me inside a killdozer either

[brittle salmon]

We'll see if that stays true

[floral herald]

In a contractually enforceable way

[tired cairn]

Oh, I thought it was only sometimes

[brittle salmon]

And hey, they're also in Warhammer 3 so the Old World has them too and that's even funnier

[tired cairn]

And that it kind of sucked

[floral herald]

He's kind of like a "deal with the devil" kind of guy but for daemons

[tired cairn]

(But I guess sometimes better than being in the immaterium)

[tepid stratus]

Read up on Syll'Eskke. Tragic soulgrinder hours in that backstory

[thin ibex]

Also wait, cyan, what makes you say Daemons are cracked rn, I haven't seen a lot of buzz about em

[rocky shale]

Vashtorr is borderline not even a bad guy, he just runs a store and is a very good lawyer

[floral herald]

I'm out of date

They used to be top 5 for competitive win rates

Fast melee killers and great board control

Since the aura buffs from greater daemons turned lessers into blenders

[tired cairn]

Great Unclean One could also be made hilariously tanky

[thin ibex]

List building seems not complex for khorne xD

[tepid stratus]

Greater daemons are the best transports in the game lol

[untold swallow]

You know

[floral herald]

But they've fallen from greatness

[tired cairn]

I don't know if people used him competitively, but it was kind of funny

[thin ibex]

Wow it's weird seeing space wolves up there

[untold swallow]

Was Vashtorr working with the Black Legion or with the Iron Warriors?

[floral herald]

It's a nerd, jock, and goth girl meta atm

[floral herald]

Within the AoO books it was the Black Legion

[thin ibex]

But they're buff to their detach and Logan is super strong

I suppose it makes sense

[untold swallow]

I have a feeling him crossing paths with IW would be cool

[tepid stratus]

Necrons also have a sleeper build that's a nightmare to deal with right now

[floral herald]

My crack theory that probably isn't true is that Perturabo is a Daemon Primarch of Vashtorr

Since we know he's not affiliated with one of 4

[jagged dawn]

Pleasantly surprised to see GSC that high up

And not at all surprised to not see chaos knights

[tired cairn]

Maybe he became a demon primarch all through his own hard work and bootstraps

[jagged dawn]

But disappointed to be sure

[floral herald]

I think GSC have had a 50%+ win rate for nearly all of 10e

[tired cairn]

Is he for sure a demon prince?

[floral herald]

They used to be the third best army in the game early in the edition

[thin ibex]

Gsc has consistently been good in 10th yeah

[tired cairn]

I thought they did really bad when their codex was new?

[jagged dawn]

Huh, was not aware

[floral herald]

He is an ascended daemon primarch or of the warp

[tired cairn]

Ah, ok

[floral herald]

https://www.stat-check.com/the-meta
Also direct link

[tired cairn]

Would be slightly neat to have a traitor primarch who didn't get too full of demon juice

[thin ibex]

I wonder if space wolves rn ate seeing more play in champions or still mostly storm lance. I do know Logan is an amazing pick in either case

[jagged dawn]

Tbh we’re not overly aware of the competitive side since we don’t have any actual playable armies

[untold swallow]

Speaking of crack theories

Any on the lost Primarchs?

[floral herald]

There's a breakdown

[thin ibex]

What're the columns?

[untold swallow]

My crack theory is that one of them was 100% already a chaos sorcerer when Emps found them

[floral herald]

Sorry this is the better one

[thin ibex]

But actually it does look like champioms are seeing more play which is cool

[floral herald]

This website is so info dense

Champs of Russ is certainly not doing badly

[tired cairn]

I'm on team "never confirm anything about the lost legions"

[thin ibex]

Yeah I'm happy about that

[untold swallow]

I mean sure

Never confirm anything

Shotgun blast a bunch of theories on the wall tho

[rocky shale]

I choose to believe the maid marines are canon

[thin ibex]

I like champions of russ for its flavor

[untold swallow]

Or at least let us do it

[tired cairn]

That's fair

[floral herald]

I think the closest thing there is to confirmed is that the Rangdan probably killed one of them and the legion was folded into the Ultramarines

But that's still speculation

[untold swallow]

Who the fuck is Rangda- oh yeah one of the now very extremely dead species

[tired cairn]

Wiat, what codex was teh GSC codex released with?

[rocky shale]

Same general time as sisters

[tired cairn]

They really like folding partially-traitor-legions into the Ultramarines huh?

[jagged dawn]

Hmm, think we’ll do some army building in new recruit

[floral herald]

Apparently Guilliman's big skill is knowing when to shut the fuck up and bury paperwork :p

[granite basin]

there are a couple of loose ideas but one of them was the idea that one of the lost primarchs was a blank and by proxy all of his sons were too, which neoth as a psyker didn't greatly enjoy. that's an idea i'll take regardless of how actually true it is

a useful talent tbh

[jagged dawn]

Namely admech, GSC, Eldar; and maybe SoB which are the armies we’re vaguely thinking we’d like to play eventually

[floral herald]

The wars against the Rangdan were basically the bloodiest conflict the GC had before the Horus Heresy

The first of these campaigns, the assault and destruction of Advex-mors in 839.M31, is most probably the first encounter between the forces of the Emperor and the Rangda, in which the Ist Legion lost some 5,000 battle-brothers in only 4 solar months of combat. Advex-mors would later be discovered to be little more than a small outpost of the Rangdan empire, a minor station at the edge of their extensive interstellar domains.

Also depleted the Dark Angels enough that the Ultramarines became larger than them

[thin ibex]

Isn't leman being somehow involved with the list legions at least somewhat supported by the horus heresy novels? Certainly not confirmed

[floral herald]

It's implied that he whacked someone like he did Magnus before yeah

[tepid stratus]

Yeah I forget which primarch points it out but it was noticed that the wolves where concerningly experienced at fighting other astartes

[jagged dawn]

Random aside though, and entirely our own opinion

Bloodletters just, don’t look good

[remote wharf]

https://fixupx.com/haultrukkz/status/1845877518441554369

[jagged dawn]

The sculpt doesn’t really vibe for us

[tepid stratus]

I don't think there's ever been a good blood letter sculpt IMO

[thin ibex]

That's valid, I think they're fun, they evoke a classic devilish look. I wish it wasn't just swords though

[tepid stratus]

I'll give skulltaker a pass for the drip tho

[jagged dawn]

The skulltaker ain’t bad yeah

[floral herald]

Also the history is so redacted that its not even clear if the Imperium actually annihilated the Rangda

I actually really like the OG Bloodletters

[thin ibex]

I'd have liked more... obviously meant to bleed style weapons, flamberges, serrated weapons, cleavers, etc

[lofty warren]

its facinating how GW seems absolutely cursed to reuse names

[floral herald]

They're dated but they're just so weird I have to like them

From https://chainaxe.net/2018/06/02/bloodletters/

[jagged dawn]

Honestly considering we’re not intending to play in proper tournaments we’d probably just substitute 3rd party sculpts for them or maybe swap in some blood warriors

[thin ibex]

They've got supernatural strength, and supernatural Ruth weapons, so mitigate some of the structural issues of deeply serrated weaponry

[untold swallow]

Hmm

What part should I write about my chapter next?

I've written about basically all of their structure

[jagged dawn]

Because we’re thinking of adding some type of demon to our chaos knight army as a “infantry to blob and capture objectives”

[thin ibex]

I just like how the proportions seem more fucked up and scary

Unnatural loping kinda vibe

Don't look like they'd duel anyone though

[floral herald]

tbf most bloodletters don't

[jagged dawn]

And nurglings while technically the best choice are well, nurglings

And we don’t want to paint nurglings

[floral herald]

They march in perfect synchronization and serried ranks until they get close and then all go "fuck it, I'm not losing this race" and run at people

[brittle salmon]

Standard bloodletters are just murder blenders in an actual fight yeah

[untold swallow]

Wait

[floral herald]

Skulltaker does but that's because Skulltaker has a strongly established history of skulltaking any other bloodletter who interferes

[untold swallow]

Grimnar threw hands with Magnus???

Amazing

[jagged dawn]

Blood for the blood god milk for the Korn flakes

Etc etc

[brittle salmon]

I wish Khorne's duelist/honorable combat thing was emphasized more but alas

[tired cairn]

If a demon dies in realspace it just gets sent back to the warp right? Does this really suck or is it more "awww, drat"

[floral herald]

I like how it's like an actual theological conflict

Among Khorne's followers

[brittle salmon]

I do too but the rampant bloodshed side gets a lot more attention

[tired cairn]

Is there a group of khorne followers that is like "why don't we just bombard the planets"

[tepid stratus]

Idk about that but I do know there's a world eaters warband who just fucking love being on the defensive end of sieges to the point they teleport into strongholds just so they can take them over and hold out for as long as possible against whatever comes at them. Just grinding horde mode until the heavy weapons run dry and the axe chains snap lol

[floral herald]

The closest I'm aware of are the ones who think that the Heavy Bolter is actually the best weapon in Khorne's eyes

[upper canopy]

Dark Angels

[granite basin]

knowing nothing abt dark angels makes this funnier

[untold swallow]

Slander it’s true

[untold swallow]

I mean, the Dark Angels have… issues

[granite basin]

you are narrowing it down so little rhi

[untold swallow]

Khorne’s anger and Tzeentch’s penchant for secret keeping respectively

Asmodai would be an amazing pull for either god, honestly

[thin ibex]

Yeah if I remember correctly this was recent too

[untold swallow]

Amazing

As a TSons lover

I love when they take Ls

[thin ibex]

Logan had a bit of a "I must go to my destined doom" thing going, but then he changed his mind

[granite basin]

i do appreciate the specificity, but i find it funny when you specify that the dark angels have issues, like any of the astartes could be called anything close to well-adjusted lol

[floral herald]

The super short of it is that they're the catholic guilt space marines