Warhammer and Such

[soft willow]

Ah yup, they are.

So that indicates what the correct base is for a model in KT I would guess.

[jaunty dawn]

oh

that would make sense

with the circle

kinda cool actually

[soft willow]

Yup! Especially since the box comes with other base sizes for the squig.

[jaunty dawn]

I wonder if defense is just gonna be always 3 or if they're doing something more funky with it

[soft willow]

Probably more funky?

[floral herald]

Base size on the datasheet fucks actually

[jaunty dawn]

I could see something similar to star wars legion where you just always roll a number of dice equal to the number of hits incoming but it would require changing how ap works n such so...

[floral herald]

Didn't they toss Defense as a stat? I think it was legit always 3 in KT21

[jaunty dawn]

defense is gone in the new edition yeah, there is like

1 or 2 df 2 models

[floral herald]

Oh huh, I guess I missed those

[jaunty dawn]

but it's a stat that especially over time they realised doesn't work to change

all the mini-operatives in gellerpox are df 2

that might be the only example outside compendium

[floral herald]

Oh I forgot about them haha

and I have Gellerpox

[solemn gull]

Gellerpox are so cool

[unreal cosmos]

Oh that's cool

Feels hard to find those sometimes

[soft willow]

I look it up in the shop page description of the contents of the box.

So yes please put that shit in the rules.

Also the assembly instructions have circles for the base sizes so you can check your bases are correct

Do that for all the kits moving forward

[mild glen]

Them: How much Anti-tank do you have?
T'au: Yes

[bright dove]

Well, I was talking with the special needs person I work with the other day. He's immuno-comprimised, has a lot of issues he has to deal with. I basically show up so he has someone to help with small things and socialize with. Decided to see what Age of Sigmar factions would interest him as a side thing.

Maggotkin of Nurgle caught his eye.

[past sphinx]

I drink deeply from the well of corruption

[bright dove]

Nice.

[past sphinx]

So many combiweapons

[bright dove]

Anywho, this is why I'm collecting Maggotkin soon.

[past sphinx]

Maggotkin are excellent meat for the grinder

Having shot gobs of them

[cosmic tulip]

That’s cool as hell ngl

[bright dove]

Indeed!

[mild glen]

I say get that kid a Maggotkin Spearhead. For the Glory of Papa Nurgle. (Money allowing, of course)

[bright dove]

I'm going to do things slower over time.

Some nice Nurglings to start.

[ebon forge]

I did, i printed it all

question
Any good tutorial how to paint a knight or Orc vehicle?

Or a video that shows how to do it well

[jovial berry]

Gamers, what’s the best big Skaven model to paint?

And well assemble

[finite compass]

Do you want a big monster or a war machine?

I'd say Doomwheel, but I'm biased

[jovial berry]

Big monster

Vermin lord looks cool…
But what’s the new big rat called?
Horned Rat Seer-Prophet or something

[bright dove]

Skreech is great by look

[jovial berry]

Oh hell yeah

[dense sedge]

Wow, the new blood angels combat patrol is pretty bad

[past sphinx]

hes da big rat dat makes all da rules

[past sphinx]

we gave you some intercessors and a some gold boys eat up

[mental birch]

seems fine

golden boys going to 3-6 is painful tho yeah

[past sphinx]

its in dire need of a brutalis

[mental birch]

it's in line with most

of the new combat patrols sadly

[past sphinx]

space vampire love a good big melee robot

[mental birch]

Return to tradition

give back start collectings

😦

[jovial berry]

We’re happy we managed to snag the old T’au combat patrol ngl

[mental birch]

I snagged 2

before they went otu of print

ahhha

[jovial berry]

Looking at the new ones it’s like

Damn

The Ghostkiel alone made it worth it for us personally

Ghostkiel at a reasonable price

[bright dove]

As ever, AoS usually gives you a good starting point for an army.

Usually

[mental birch]

BEEEG BOAT

[jovial berry]

Usually…

The thing we’re doing is thought as a gift for someone who loves body horror and rats

[spice flicker]

RIP furioso and librarian dreadnoughts

[paper bluff]

There will always be legends

[jaunty dawn]

wild

[past sphinx]

atleast we got new sang i guess?

big red ultras hours

[jaunty dawn]

interesting

[jovial berry]

Interesting thing we got from the WH store

[floral herald]

Wait new article?

[pulsar cairn]

rat coin?

that sounds like a scam

[unreal cosmos]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/22/kill-team-hivestorm-rules-the-vespids-wings-and-weapons-arent-just-for-show/

[jovial berry]

Well they have to get rid of the gold they mined somehow
:)

[pulsar cairn]

[solemn gull]

skaven economics

[jovial berry]

Skaven stonks

[paper bluff]

Literally in the total war games the reason the skaven make gold coins it to cause problems for other races

[jovial berry]

For every warpstone you buy-take you get 7 gold coins, yes-yes?

[mild glen]

Warhammer brick and mortar stores have collectable coins as part of their "miniature of the month" thing, where you get a collectable coin like that if you spend enough in addition to your purchase. (I forget how much it is? 100 dollars?)
Whereas the mini of the month is designed to get you in the store, that's there to convince you to buy a second box of space Marines.

[floral herald]

Oogh

A whole team of P1 if they move is scary

[jovial berry]

Well we did get a… weird dog (Norn Emissary)

[floral herald]

Also wow Communion Points are really limited

And I wonder how flight works on ITD

[proud wing]

I like Warhammer fantasy's setting a lot more

but goddamn 40k has some amazing models

vespids make me want to buy them just for the sake of having and painting them, even knowing I'd probably never play with them

[junior robin]

speaking of never playing, ended up ordering part 1 of a HH army (the mech box)

now I just got to decide what legion to go with them....

[tired cairn]

Oh no, I hate the "Neutron weapons are any weapon that have the word 'neutron' in their name". Pls just use keywords for this sort of thing GW

d3 + 1 communion points is shockingly limited, wow

Vespid make use of several stimulants dispensed from their armour to sharpen their sense
The vespids are wearing armour?

[mental birch]

Oooh

Sounds like positioning to autoshoot is key

[jaunty dawn]

that's weird, the new vespids specifically removed the armour they used to have

(I wanna add some back, at least to the strain leader. and bring back the pipes on both them and the sneaky boy)

[tired cairn]

Maybe vespids are wearing the equivalent of a bodyglove and that is why they are orange

[cosmic tulip]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/22/kill-team-hivestorm-rules-the-vespids-wings-and-weapons-arent-just-for-show/

[floral herald]

Vespid seem cool

Very mobile with the new fly rules

[tired cairn]

Funny that Kill Team has the simple go through walls fly rules even though 10th ed Warhammer got rid of that

[jaunty dawn]

that is kinda wild

[spice flicker]

Hmmm.... how to best do assimilation swarm and Vanguard Onslaught?

Vanguard is focused around VANGUARD INVADERS (Lictor and Deathleaper, Neurolictor, Genestealers, Leapers, Raveners, Mawloc, Trygon, anything with wings) while assimilation is focused on harvesters (Haruspex, Pyrovore, Psychophage and Rippers)

[tired cairn]

For Assimilation, people like taking tyrant guard because returning models of them is really annoying

Mawlocs and funny in Vanguard Onslaught because you can reuse their mortal wounds

[spice flicker]

With nids I mostly run a neurotyrant as my HQ and forgot they can take tyrant guard as a bodyguard since they have zoantropes now.

Mawlocs were probably one of the main draws to the nids for me tbh. One of my favorite models

[tired cairn]

You'd probably want the tyrant guard on a hive tyrant or swarmlord

Both are really good right now

And yeah, I love the Mawloc/Trygon model

[spice flicker]

How are raveners?

The mini mawlocs/warrior hybrids

[tired cairn]

Uppy-downy is good. But I think people are pretty meh about them?

[spice flicker]

I feel like Vanguard is more focused on fast melee shenanigans, harvester doesn't have much beyond keeping things alive (regen+psychophage FNP), and personally the one I prefer is synaptic nexus (starts looking like a crusher stampede hybrid at higher points) but was curious about the former two.

[remote wharf]

https://fixupx.com/KumratArt/status/1826399117230375411?t=p6emJXA2lTA6Ruamkskqtg&s=19

[tired cairn]

Why was that a popular demand?

[paper bluff]

You know why

[jovial berry]

Good!

[junior summit]

Oh no

[alpine wing]

damn, someone already posted it

[pulsar cairn]

Do we ever see examples of space marines feeling sad about having their life choosen/stolen for them?

Cause ur picked as a kid and i imagine most chapters dont give u the option

[tepid stratus]

A lot of chapters recruiting world's have cultures that encourages kids to sign up for the trials

[soft willow]

Rarely there is brief reflection on it before they go “but without all that I wouldn’t be superhuman”

[tepid stratus]

It's considered an honor to volunteer for the trials

Chapters like the carcharadons seem to be exceptions

And space wolves

[upper bluff]

I'm sure remorse is a concept that could be used in novels

I just couldn't imagine any do

[tepid stratus]

Most space Marines are too brainwashed to even consider what they've lost in their transformation

Their thinking is fundamentally inhuman

[upper bluff]

Yeah, exactly. Like the idea of one who thinks more human is a good topic for a book but isn't the point of reading a 40k novel to see how weird they are

[tepid stratus]

Only chapters like the salamanders retain some sense of human normalcy since their members maintain ties to their families

[upper bluff]

And that's why they're on top

[tepid stratus]

I mean shit it was a whole topic in one of the night lord novels

[pulsar cairn]

i like the salamanders

i like characters who feel somewhat human

[tepid stratus]

Talos debates with one of his brothers over whether it was okay to feel anything when they watched their mother get gunned down by a commissar

[pulsar cairn]

cause i'm human

[pulsar cairn]

a space marine saw that happen to their mother?

i'm surprised he even remembered her

[tepid stratus]

He almost didn't

[pulsar cairn]

wait Talos is a night lord

i'm even more surprised he felt anything

[tepid stratus]

He refused to acknowledge her in the moment and let her get gunned down while she was clinging to his armour begging to see her baby boy

[pulsar cairn]

wow

now i'm sad

[tepid stratus]

And then had a bit of an existential crisis about it later

[pulsar cairn]

good

he deserved to feel much worse

[finite compass]

It's definitely brought up.

Mild spoilers for new series, I guess.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1uS3Wjbggg

It also comes up in the Black Legion novels, with the viewpoint character (Who's a former Thousand Son)

Though it's less feeling sad and more introspection on what became of him and the Astartes relation to humanity at large

Though it amuses me that two of the main discussions on this are both from the viewpoints of Chaos Marines and both by the same author. 😛

But yes. Talos is an Irredeemable Monster in a Legion of Irredeemable Monster, but one who is desperately searching for any excuse or rationalization that will allow them to be more than Irredeemable Monsters.

When the VIIIth being explicitly created as Irredeemable Monsters was the entire goal.

[pulsar cairn]

dang

[pulsar cairn]

this is interesting cause it shows them recognizing that they are indeed inhuman

[finite compass]

Curze even gets called out by his own first captain when he tries to justify himself.

``‘Where is the nobility in any of this?’ Sevatar gestured to the streets of Nostramo Quintus around them. ‘You can claim a savage nobility, father, but this is far more savage than noble.’

Curze’s pale lips peeled back from his filed teeth. ‘There was no other way.’

‘No?’ Sevatar answered his father’s snarl with a grin. ‘What other ways did you try?’

‘Sevatar…’

‘Answer me, father. What politics of peace did you teach? What scientific and social illumination did you bring to this society? In your quest for a human utopia, what other ways did you try beyond eating the flesh of stray dogs and skinning people alive?’

‘It. Was. The. Only. Way.’

Sevatar laughed again. ‘The only way to do what? The only way to bring a population to heel? How then did the other primarchs manage it? How has world upon world managed it, with resorting to butchering children and broadcasting their screams across the planetary vox-net?

‘Their worlds were never as… as serene as mine was.’

‘And the serenity of yours died the first second your back was turned. So tell me again how you succeeded. Tell me again how this all worked perfectly.’``

[pulsar cairn]

oh yeah his captain was pretty ballsy

i remember the adeptus ridiculous episode on the guy

[pine matrix]

Which book is that from?

[finite compass]

Short story, I think

Prince of Crows

[pine matrix]

Ah gotcha!

[pulsar cairn]

i understand what 40k is about but i always enjoy seeing characters feel human

specially when that's uncommond for them

[tepid stratus]

Sevatarion was a baller of a bastard. He knew exactly what he was and refused to sugar coat shit

[pulsar cairn]

at least he didnt give you bullshit i'll say

cause kurze was full of it

[pine matrix]

I've thought for a while a good story thread to follow would be some kid being inducted into a CSM warband and how they indoctrinate them into the whole Long War

[tepid stratus]

I wish we had more space Marines that don't tolerate their primarchs shit

[solemn gull]

the Ragnar book has him going "shit I had a good life and my fellow recruit was one of the raiders that killed my family."

[tepid stratus]

Not a kid but Angron the red angel spends a lot of time with a blood Angels successor who suffers from the red thirst and tries to join the world eaters to justify his flaws

[pine matrix]

I've been meaning to read it, I'm a big World Eaters fan

[tepid stratus]

The grey knights chapters are pretty dull but the rest of the book is fantastic

One of the epilogue chapters is particularly great of a bunch of world eaters in a drop pod talking about being on terra seeing the "red angel" fight. Only for you to realize none of them are world eaters, they're traitor blood Angels experiencing the black rage and misinterpreting sanguinius as angron

[pine matrix]

At least if you're a space marine turning to chaos you've already been turned into a transhuman monster for one side of the war. Being conscripted into a group of long war veterans and basically having to be taught to hate as they hate is a whole shittier angle

I thought it'd be best with some Iron Warriors, the bitterest of bitter bastards. Welcome to the war, kid, now let me tell you how much I hate Imperial Fists

[finite compass]

Isn't that basically Honsou's backstory?

[pulsar cairn]

[mild glen]

I dunno. My favorite chapters are still the Raven Guard and the Blood Magpies

[pulsar cairn]

now im thinking of birds in power armor

[mild glen]

BUT ALSO: give me a story about an Underhive ganger any day

[mild glen]

The Priamarch of the Raven Guard is named the scientific name for the Common Raven. You might be forgiven for thinking it's Crow Crow.
He's currently a giant demon bird going Edgar Allen Poe on one of the Traitor primarchs.

[floral herald]

Ok live arm reaction is great

[runic swallow]

I swear that’s based off a notable anecdote from the Falklands, which would track for British media

[solemn gull]

That crimson fists book was pretty good

[floral herald]

It was

[past sphinx]

my hands are filled with demon prince and my ears are filled with manowar, it shall be metal

for he is willing to die for the metal

to survive for the metal

[past sphinx]

my back however will just die

[jovial berry]

Little goblins :)

[past sphinx]

the mind of a five year old and the violent nature of a 4 year old

[quaint compass]

Real ADHD kings

[pine matrix]

Is it? I'll have to check it out

[solemn gull]

They fly now?

[south axle]

Who flies now?

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/mysticpigeon/status/1824192643322220573

[jaunty dawn]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/23/kill-team-co-op-tackle-intense-joint-ops-missions-in-the-newest-game-mode/

interesting

generic enemy profiles

launch support for volkus and gallowdark

[floral herald]

lol

[cosmic tulip]

Reading the new chalnath lore

I want the imperium to lose but like

It doesn’t seem like it

[jaunty dawn]

the first bit of it is like

"yeah all the cinematic guys died but um, that was actually the plan"

[cosmic tulip]

😦 it’s so stupid

[upper bluff]

The Tau definitely won't have a victory there, unless they're decided to be the villains of 11th (not happening). Like the chalnath expanse is such a big thing in lore right now it would be weird to have the Tau get a big win there

[past sphinx]

king Honsou has chimeric geneseed, partially imperial fists iirc. Real "we made him wrong as a joke" hours

[pine matrix]

Lmao

[cosmic tulip]

My friends are probably gonna do imperial simping again ngl

Idk I just really want the tau auxiliaries to get more wins

It would be cool to have more tau auxiliary wins

[paper bluff]

Still wild that can be done and that cawl made a space marine with all of the geneseed together. And I don't think it's been expanded on

[bright dove]

It's actually not uncommon, and happens for further founding chapters

[junior robin]

now I want to make a SW/BA chapters who are vampire wolfmen.

[jaunty dawn]

flesh eater courts

[cosmic tulip]

Oh that’s delightful

[rocky shale]

The only healthy way to be a xenos player is to be content when you get to beat chaos/other xenos

Anything else is the path of disappointment

[thin ibex]

tbf, tau have beaten imps before

but in general yeah, xenos don't get major wins that last

[pine matrix]

Dark Eldar, ain't never been relevant, ain't never gonna be relevant ✌️

[rocky shale]

Never relevant, always evil, hell yeah

[floral herald]

Gosh I love being a chaos player generally and a black legion liker specifically

Were the faction that broke 20 years of setting stasis

[rocky shale]

And then lost afterwards but we take those wins

5th cronesword please

[thin ibex]

i dont think any character thats ever gone toe to toe with abaddon has won in recent history

in teh fight i mean

techncially marneus won by being a distraction

[solemn gull]

Shadowspear was like 5 years ago oof

Abbadon is by my knowledge the best firstborn melee combatant?

[paper bluff]

Wait as vespids that big?

[paper bluff]

We talking lore or table top because in lore, Kharn exists

[proud wing]

a pretty good video that has a useful look into the economics of tabletop gaming
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrKvud6ZRM0

[upper canopy]

how the fuck is that how it started

[proud wing]

it's how og warhammer fantasy started

[past sphinx]

They had the good chemicals and manowar

Now there's less good chemicals and idk gloryhammer?

[thin ibex]

I'm pretty sure abaddon takes kharn in a one on one tbh, lore wise. Not saying kharn isn't good though

[paper bluff]

1v1 no warp shenanigans?

[thin ibex]

Just that Abby, despite being the galaxies main jobber for decades, is otherwise that threatening

I mean, both characters, as they are, with their iconic war gear. I think Abby takes it

[paper bluff]

Sigismund (the OG) vs. Abbadon of now

[thin ibex]

I think I'd still give it to Abby. I think Abby goes toe to toe with people like Guilliman or the Lion

In the narrative current

Chaos undivided juice is strong

[paper bluff]

How abouts the abbadon of then?

[thin ibex]

Sigi iirc beat Abby at sword fighting as an old guy, just still lost the fight, so it follows that sigi probably eats old Abby for breakfast

[dense sedge]

In fairness deldar internationally avoid protracted wars and longer conflicts in favour of lightning raids which makes them harder for big story beats, and I’m honestly not sure they could hold a protracted conflict with most factions for to the fragmented nature of cormoragh

[paper bluff]

The most major part the dark eldar have had in the 40k narrative is almost getting to clone big e and killing some high lords

The dark eldar have their own story lines going on with black jack and hookers... and hooks

[thin ibex]

kind of by nature of how they persist, DE tend to be silo'd and isolated from the ongoings of the world aroudn them

they really just need a steady supply of slaves

[unreal cosmos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRlSsLgDaZA cool schemes but also some hints of New Lore

[solemn gull]

I think abbadon would beat kharn

[past sphinx]

kharn is an angry man that god likes,

abbadon is the leader of the black legion, inheritor of the title warmaster and the avatar of chaos undivided

love kharn but abby is primarch level

[pine matrix]

Yeah, being a parasite means you don't want to be the protagonist lmao

[dense sedge]

I should get some pykar glacier and flesh testers red

[past sphinx]

you know what looks bitchin on nightlords schemes

pink

goes hard as fuck

[upper canopy]

House of Bolton

[crisp lance]

https://youtu.be/oJN_bq6AZWE

[remote wharf]

https://fixupx.com/idioticsynergy/status/1827071898007511125?t=x7qyWUIBAYbPHBaYBlrd0g&s=19

[tardy wren]

one of my friends spent like two hours trying to sell me on custodes and I think I might actually take the plunge

[verbal ermine]

big men and big women

also gold

[unreal cosmos]

What was the pitch?

[past sphinx]

God loves a maniac

[jaunty dawn]

oooh nice

[past sphinx]

No fucking clue what to do with the horned shoulderpad

[unreal cosmos]

porple

[solemn gull]

Red because it completed the red+blue=purple

[proud wing]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/274426711595024394/1276782065332916265/MylittleWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH.png

[junior robin]

huh, mostly roadmaping on NOVA open next week, hope the HH one got more plastic admech in it 🤔

[past sphinx]

☝️🤓 its midnight actually

Who goes around to paint all the lightning on it

Drama kids the lot of em

[hard whale]

is the lightning paint? I thought their armour just had an electrical fault

[past sphinx]

Sometimes paint sometimes a power field and in the old days their armor had a special thing in it that projected lighting across it

Sometimes warp fuckery

[pastel rampart]

It's reflections off their armor as lightning strikes dramatically whenever they appear.

https://tenor.com/view/batman-gif-4439279616571508647

[hard whale]

whenever they go into battle they first need to move their ship overhead and charge up a massive tesla coil, to make sure it's appropriately dark and stormy

[past sphinx]

Nightlords spend months seeding clouds before invasion

[desert jay]

Night Lords just show up at dusk and finish their decapitation strike before daybreak

Sun rising to heads on pikes

[tired cairn]

Do they remember to also do the metaphorical decapitation?

[finite compass]

According to the HH rulebooks, they literally have holo projectors built into their armor

[runic swallow]

Post-heresy, the night lords supply situation varies wildlyso there’s probably some that broke centuries back and are grumbling every time they have their serf repaint the lightning about the “good old days”

[finite compass]

Before HH was a thing there were a few nods to "It's literal lightning because Warp Fuckery"

And for FUCKSAKE, if I have to wade through more AI bullshit to find the particular piece of art I'm looking for again, I'm flying straigh to California and burning down the fucking Google campus.

[runic swallow]

I know that’s been one-t with the warp talons, and there’s probably some NL bands that are more warpified than others

[pulsar cairn]

demon prince?

[finite compass]

That was a bit I actually really liked in the Trilogy

They constantly grumble about the Black Legion, but Talos straight-up acknowledges that if they actually did bend the knee to Abaddon, they wouldnt' have to scavenge anymore, because he controls actual logistic chains.

[runic swallow]

Yeah

I appreciated how central supplies was to the trilogy

[past sphinx]

Aye phil

"Please god die so I can have your armor" is a bit i love

[desert jay]

Yes, and the "heads on pikes" is also metaphorical b/c nowadays it's a lot of flaying and evisceration and such

(And also no one packs pikes)

[mild glen]

Don't supposed anybody has neat kitbashing tricks to make it look like the Musician Chaos Knight for AoS is wielding Castanets instead of a war horn? The wife is doing a silly idea.

[pastel rampart]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/596197650332778498/1277046686337859605/20240824_192638.jpg?ex=66cbbde8&is=66ca6c68&hm=87c071e2fb0792076964c502414d777a9852ee1609f03dafd211739e4bd39403&

[balmy wave]

That ain't even a chaos knight

Imagine if the sorcerer got a full on Knight

Not just a War Dog

[mild glen]

This is why I made sure to say AoS, yes.

[paper bluff]

I'd love to see a giant fight king brodd

[pastel rampart]

https://x.com/O3_saka/status/1827307981765226977

saka_O3ボドゲ (@O3_saka) on X

ティラニッド塗装！
YouTubeのショートで流れてきたチタン焼けの様な感じの塗装をやってみました！
黒下地に銀でドライブラシをかけて、後ろの塗料で茶•紫•青の順で塗るだけの簡単塗装！
割と良い感じに出来てると思う(^^)

Twitter · Aug 24, 2024, 11:32 AM

[pulsar cairn]

tiny nids

[dense sedge]

That’s a wonderful scheme

[past sphinx]

the chaos chosen kit is extremely good

full of gubbins

and scrungly bits

[mental birch]

Anyone here familiar with gothic?

BFG

[past sphinx]

More than a bit less than a lot

[soft willow]

Why do you ask?

[mental birch]

Trying to figure out lists

For tau commerce protection fleets

[soft willow]

Ah. Unfortunately I have never experienced the Tau in BFG.

[pastel rampart]

https://x.com/DumbRobotStuff/status/1827647746280477051

dumb robot stuff (@DumbRobotStuff) on X

TANKHEAD time

Twitter · Aug 25, 2024, 10:02 AM

[soft willow]

Honestly not too crazy a build too.

Taking advantage of the hollow bottom of the Dorn to fit the Knight's torso is brilliant.

[junior robin]

reminds me of the old knight wardens

[granite basin]

Emerson Tung has his own products? Shit dude, why'd I have to wait till now to learn that?

[junior robin]

this is just the FW one being re-released and not a new plastic one, right? 🤔 (no mention in the article about it)

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/08/25/sunday-preview-machines-wage-civil-war-on-mars-and-chaos-hordes-descend-from-the-north/

[south axle]

It mentions in the opening paragraph "standalone plastic miniatures" so might not be resin

[junior robin]

feels like the standalone part references the stuff that was in the battle group box 🤔. still happy to see that variant back in stock, would make a good centrepiece.

[south axle]

Kinda weird to not mention the materials of the AdMech stuff when they do for each of the WoC stuff. And also mention how many transfers each kit has

[jaunty dawn]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/05/18/warhammer-preview-the-mechanicum-turns-its-love-of-metal-to-plastic/

its plastic

it just wasnt in the battlebox

[junior robin]

[past sphinx]

God just let me take a thallax

[tired cairn]

Yeah, so sad they made it plastic but didn't give it 40k rules

[thin ibex]

would be kind of cool if we got a Sa Kan character model from the pariah nexus show

but we probably wont

[upper canopy]

I can't believe the Khan got impregnated that many times

[thin ibex]

anyone have thoughts on what kind of guardsmen would be best to start with if i wanted to kitbash them into human guevesa run as firewarriors?

I figure id want to give them tau guns

[upper canopy]

Cadians or Scions

[solemn gull]

I don’t think there are official models that would translate well to guevesa

[rocky shale]

Probably just cadians with fire warrior heads/shoulders

[jaunty dawn]

mm

[solemn gull]

Why put fire warrior heads on them that would make tau in human armour?

[bold halo]

helmets

[jaunty dawn]

lol yeah

[solemn gull]

oh

[floral herald]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/16adg7f/guevesa_human_auxiliary_in_service_with_the_tau/
I think this is a curstom sculpt but this guy seems neat

[jaunty dawn]

oh thats pretty neat

thats van saar body, kasrkin head and maybe shoulder pads? breacher gun on van saar gun stock

and fire warrior backpack too

[floral herald]

Oh, I didn't recognize the body

That's cool

[jaunty dawn]

maybe sculpted tau markings?

yeah van saar are from necromunda

theyre very cool and funky

[solemn gull]

They are probably the most high tech gw human bodies

[floral herald]

Probably yeah

Looking at them

[cosmic tulip]

Hmm

Gonna bet 5 bucks that there’ll be another auxiliary kill team soon

Hopefully guevesa

And new rules

[floral herald]

I've stopped betting on what gets released after beastmen haha

That one caught me off guard

[rocky shale]

How soon lol

[mild glen]

Palanintine enforcers from Necromunda are popular kitbashes into Gue'vasa

[cosmic tulip]

I dunno

It would be cool to see the tau annexations of the chalnath region pay off

But maybe GW just wants to forget about guevesa

[rocky shale]

I'd be surprised if we saw them just because it would be hard to differentiate them from pathfinders or fire warriors stats-wise

[thin ibex]

i just dont see guevesa getting their own unique rules tbh

as far as a battlefield niche

a kill team i could see, maybe, but 40k they'd largely just be firewarriors imo

i forget, a warlord titan or reaver titan is considered the most "standard" titan?

[tepid stratus]

Warlord is the stereotypical titan pattern

[floral herald]

Yeah Warlord is the "standard" one

[pastel rampart]

Yeah like, there's not anything they'd really bring to the table unless they radically change how "IG-equivalent infantry in Tau army" plays. As it is, a standard guevesa is just...a unit of humans with some tau weapons and slightly better weapon skill.

It's a potentially interesting design space that I think GW doesn't really know what to do with.

[cosmic tulip]

It would be cool if like

They could be modified with drones or extra tech and stuff that would cost more but allow them to specialize

We know the guevesa are used in everything from tech support to melee frontline

Like instead of just sticking to montka or kayon they could switch every turn or something

And benefit

But you could only take a few auxiliaries at a time

[upper bluff]

I mean honestly just being a melee unit that can still spot would be a niche they could fill

[cosmic tulip]

I feel like GW could think guevesa aren’t grimdark enough ngl

[upper bluff]

Just like rapid fire pulse pistols and their own custom sword

[cosmic tulip]

They seem pretty set on how they want to depict humanity and that’s fine

[upper bluff]

You could make a whole thing about how despite living in T'au space they still feel they need to die sword in hand. All their melee weapons are custom made and not fire caste approved

Like Kroot are cool but they are super separate from the rest of T'au as an army right now

So a Guevasq kill team won't or be neat

Or like maybe the Tau understand how humans like swords and hand out captured power swords as rewards for end of service

[jaunty dawn]

honestly I feel like a lot of gueseva niche interpretations just end up being like

kinda HFY

like the whole idea of 'humans are assault troops' i think is canon but it just kinda rubs me the wrong way. kinda essentialist

idk

[floral herald]

I like the idea of like "greater good fanatics" as a guevesa unit with a niche

[jaunty dawn]

humans should be a long distance sprinting projectile throwing unit (with dogs) 😌

(except kroot already do that better)

idk I think also the last thing tau and xenos in general need is more human models I feel

[thin ibex]

i could also see tauva insurgents as guevesa

infiltrate models with some kind of objective interaction

[jaunty dawn]

...okay insurgents would be pretty cool actually. and now I want to plan to make some

like thats literally the narrative of my tau/kroot army

[floral herald]

IIRC the "human stereotype" in the Tau Empire is that they're dangerous, passionate, ancient, or crooked

[jaunty dawn]

its even mentioned in the codex; water caste insurgency agents smuggled on 'neutral' kroot warspheres to set up insurgencies in the imperium and train humans

plain clothes imperial citizens would be fairly unique

like not even hive scum gear

or gsc boiler suits

[thin ibex]

i kinda like the idea of alternative tau spec ops as guevesa meant to infiltrate other human governments or settlements to spread the greater good as an underground cell

also a bit funny to me, in a given hive you have Tau Va insurgents, gsc insurgents, chaos insurgents, normal malcontent insurgents

who are all also against each other

[cosmic tulip]

Guevesa could be HFY

Like

I love the idea of tau humans being a mirror to imperial humans

Give people something to rally behind that isn’t uberfascism

Like you could do so much with tau humans

[solemn gull]

that's the kroot

[cosmic tulip]

But GW just.. ignores them

There are three reasons

1. Little to no interest, thus dictating financial gain

2. They don’t like the idea of an alternative to the imperium being not in line with tone

3. No rules niche to fill

[jaunty dawn]

my problem with that is its like. its making humans a star in one of the few non-human factions in the game

[cosmic tulip]

But that’s the thing

They’re not stars

They’re one auxiliary among many

That’s the taus whole point

[jaunty dawn]

like the focus is all on how cool humans would be once in the tau army

[solemn gull]

I don't think that's what people are wanting from Gue'vesa

[cosmic tulip]

Ehh most of the folks I know who play tau want them to fill a cool middle of the road niche and that they’ve been in lore for a while and should get recognition

Granted a lot of them are annoyed that the only portrayal of humans in 40k is the imperium but that too

Showing alternatives to the imperium draws people away from like.. the vibe of 40k I guess

And as such it would damage gws imperial poster models and stuff

[solemn gull]

I don't understand how that's the conclusion

[cosmic tulip]

Like GW knows the imperium is their main faction or setting

And as such seeing people be interested in something that’s not as cohesive to the tone as the imperium is would be seen as a bad thing

They’d either have to change their story or marketing or ignore it

[solemn gull]

what's incohesive about auxillaries

[floral herald]

Kroot have a lot of other hats besides assault troops

Like their forward deployment and skirmisher stuff

[cosmic tulip]

guevesa are too nice for 40k humanity

[solemn gull]

If that's the case then tau are also too nice

[cosmic tulip]

Tau are different

As a former friend put it

“Tau are aliens, their niceness is misplaced in 40k because it’ll bite them later. Humans have to act a certain way in 40k because the setting sucks.”

I do not personally agree with this doctrine

But I can see why GW would be reluctant to make guevesa a thing

[solemn gull]

that does seem wrong yeah

Being nice works 99% of the time from what I've read lorewise. It's just that everyone in 40k is an asshole because it's a crapsack world.

[cosmic tulip]

But yeah

I’d love to see guevesa as a middle ground troop

People say the tau with Kroot cover all fields but I mean

More options never hurts

And the Kroot rules wise are ok at melee atm

Certainly not the best

[solemn gull]

it's not really auxillaries if it's just 1 other group

that's a partnership

[cosmic tulip]

All of them together are auxiliaries

[jaunty dawn]

mostly I'd rather see actually new auxiliaries

[cosmic tulip]

Me too

[jaunty dawn]

psychic bear

[cosmic tulip]

But for now I’d just like a refresh of the main three

And then new and wild stuff

[jaunty dawn]

which now that vespids and kroot are fully(ish) refreshed

[upper canopy]

I want the super heavy melee auxilleries

[solemn gull]

I've just used whatever random alien model I have in my bits box and give them a pulse rifle

[jaunty dawn]

psychic bears dont just have a pulse rifle haha

or superheavy organisms that fight titans

[solemn gull]

Battle suit that is just a big alien

[floral herald]

I think a good way to expand it would be a "xenos minoris" book for alien soup

Put Sslyth and Loxotl and so on in it as well

[cosmic tulip]

I mostly just want guevesa because like

Broken Sword is my favorite tau book

It’s great

And there was a non-binary guevesa protagonist in a recent short story

It was really cool

It’s not that I want less aliens

To the tau humans are technically aliens

[solemn gull]

Humanity in 40k isn't a monolith as much as it seems like one because the main group is a fascist empire that hammers anything different

there's dudes everywhere that don't confine themselves to the imperium brand of grimdark

[bright dove]

Turns out there's a huge variety of cultures out there under the Imperial Umbrella, and as long as it doesn't step outside the broad strokes of "Pay your Taxes" and "Worship the Emperor"

You can get away with a lot

[thin ibex]

one of hte things with the tau though, is that not all its auxiliaries are combative either

[cosmic tulip]

Idk I didn’t make a ton of guevesa for nothing

[solemn gull]

hell you can consider the emperor to be anything, a lot of suspicious mutants really like this version with 4 arms

[bright dove]

We're part of that fanbase too.

[cosmic tulip]

I got the last og guard box in my shop for a tau kitbash lol

[cosmic tulip]

The bad part

[solemn gull]

I don't think the fanbase would explode

[bright dove]

It's not like you have to work hard to make Chuds explode either.

[solemn gull]

that is a very small minority you are talking about

[cosmic tulip]

Idk I just really wanna like

See a lot of different auxillaries

And I don’t mind if some of those are humans

[bright dove]

It's just hard to build a cohesive army around that.

[cosmic tulip]

Have them all fill unique roles

[solemn gull]

Infantry army

but with more head options

[thin ibex]

like in my mind, you can generally just kitbash guevesa as any normal tau infantry unit

[cosmic tulip]

Give them unique weapons I guess

[solemn gull]

that would be weird

[cosmic tulip]

Idk im not sure now that I think about it

In a vaccum it makes sense but gameplay wise yeah nah all infantry army would be unfun

Hmm

Now I’m not sure

Maybe psychic auxiliary but those exist too

[solemn gull]

infantry armies are fine?

[thin ibex]

human psycher aux would be fine i think, the nikasaur are generally not combative iirc

[cosmic tulip]

Yeah

We have examples of human psykers in the tau

[upper canopy]

Give them pulse pistols and chainswords

[bright dove]

I'm not going to lie, I like the Tau niche of "We're shooty as all hell, but melee is a struggle"

[thin ibex]

yah i dont think tau need to be good at melee tbh

[cosmic tulip]

Yeah my apologies

I didn’t mean to get so heated

I will say

Tau struggling in melee is fine

But that’s what Kroot are there to fill

[solemn gull]

restricting whole species to 1 task in the army doesn't feel like something the tau would do

[jaunty dawn]

specially now they actually have a dedicated melee unit again lol

[thin ibex]

i still want that kroot box

soooon

just need to build and basecoat all my other models

im almost there

[jaunty dawn]

the whole auxiliary thing is like

inspired by roman auxiliaries

[cosmic tulip]

Yeah I admit I got too excited to defend the idea of human auxiliaries without noting that as is, they don’t really have a distinct place or anything going for them

[jaunty dawn]

cause like romans didn't have cavalry n stuff

[thin ibex]

The the assault krootox's are a cool unit tbh

[jaunty dawn]

they're awesome

[thin ibex]

we cant get em by themselves yet right?

[jaunty dawn]

you can

all the kroot have been out a while

[bright dove]

Side note, I'm planning out a Maggotkin army for over in AoS. Any suggestions for it?

[solemn gull]

a really gross guy

[bright dove]

I'd be hard pressed to have just one.

[rocky shale]

Gloss paint

[jaunty dawn]

although I tried to make a kroot boarding patrol earlier and it's hard. you need like 50 models

[rocky shale]

Or at least gloss paint on anything wet

[jaunty dawn]

like ppl talk about admech but

[bright dove]

Gloss paint would indeed be the thing to use.

[jaunty dawn]

my suggestion is that beasts of nurgle are adorable

[bright dove]

They are!

Incidentally also seem good at tying people up!

[jaunty dawn]

hugs

[bright dove]

Hugs!

[solemn gull]

raid a children's toy store. You will need lots of weird animal bits.

[pastel rampart]

https://www.myminifactory.com/object/3d-print-plague-demons-riding-fly-s-pre-supported-175808 If you have access to a 3D printer and your store/club is cool with it there's a wealth of alternatives.

[cosmic tulip]

Also you might like sylvaneth and FEC bits

[cosmic tulip]

Oh don’t forget greenstuff

That’s your friend for Nurgle

[floral herald]

I don't have a lot of experience with nurgle models but I think they tend to look best when painted with a kind of lurid colorful scheme

More for DG than AoS stuff but I think there's a temptation to just kind of smear them with greens and greys which does the detail a disservice

[cosmic tulip]

Theres pinks and creams and reds and yellows

[thin ibex]

poisonous flowers maybe

[bright dove]

Don't forget the lovely purples of a bruise

[cosmic tulip]

Ourple

[floral herald]

I like this guy as a kind of luridly colorful one

http://www.mengelminiatures.com/2019/10/showcase-oscar-lars-maggotkin-of-nurgle.html

[bold halo]

imo nurgle and death guard especially should lean into 90s mutant ooze colours

[floral herald]

This is maybe even better (cw: really good GOU paintjob)

the whole page slaps but I will try not to spam

[bold halo]

like take the saturation down maybe 20% and you're off to the races

[solemn gull]

I really like Miscast's nurlge scheme which is similar to this

[bold halo]

went looking for brighter nurgle stuff and found this https://sproketsmallworld.blogspot.com/2015/01/project-nurgle-part-6_20.html

[cosmic tulip]

Oh I had an idea

Furby color schemes

For nurgle

Lots of bright colors and shifting textures

[bright dove]

Ooooo

[cosmic tulip]

An idea I’ve heard is like

Do a two tone scheme

Innards one bright color outer skin a different one

[bold halo]

went looking for old eavy metal painted death guard because I could swear I remember something using a much larger range of colours really well and had totally forgotten they used to look like this

the newer chunky WW1 body armor style death guard are just so ingrained in my brain as what they look like that it erased these

anyways if I ever crumble to the urge to start collecting death guard I'll do some real paint crimes to them

I love the nurglings so goddamn much

so many purples and oranges and yellows and pinks and blues you can mix in

[floral herald]

There’s some good parts to these models but I really did not like them much

Which was a shame since they were extremely meta at the time

[bold halo]

yeah they're not especially strong

the fucked up torso of the guy on the right that looks like something's stretching out his armor trying to get out is good tho

[floral herald]

The new ones I’m a little polarized on since I like the sculpts a lot but I think the studio paint job makes them look kinda weird

[bold halo]

gas mask helmet in the back is great too

studio paint job is very clean on them

these guys look upsettingly smooth

[floral herald]

Yeah the studio paint jobs make sense cause they usually use clean/strong colors with a lot of edge highlighting and such to make the sculpt details pop

But some models want a fuzzier more impressionistic paintjob

[bold halo]

nurgle is dying for texture and gradients

[bright dove]

Impressionistic is a good take on Daemons, to show that they don't belong in reality as much.

[floral herald]

I used to think I just didn’t like the new sculpts but then I saw some banger paintjobs for them

[bold halo]

gotta look like the texture folder of a 3d artist working on urban environments

[pastel rampart]

No no, increase the saturation by 20%.

No, 50%!

[bright dove]

Found the Noise Marine

[bold halo]

contrast is important, if everything is bright nothing pops

[floral herald]

Also for sculpts I love how the 1e bloodletters did it

They look SO unnatural

[pastel rampart]

Rubber Bandletters

[bold halo]

hell yeah look at those arms

[floral herald]

I’d love a modernized take on that like “this thing moves like a killer rubber hose cartoon man” style of daemon

[bold halo]

I've got a soft spot for the beefy beastman guys but I get why they went back to something more original

[pastel rampart]

https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/642306-bug headed plague bearers.html If you want a fun plaguebearer color scheme:

[bold halo]

hell yeah

[pastel rampart]

I plan to paint mine like that, just with like...a big nuclear orange shade to it.

https://tgacommunity.s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/monthly_2017_09/15045792959421713675794.jpg.4efc55ff3e29e90aba04bdd2deaadcf5.jpg

Works well for plague marines too.

[solemn gull]

It’s so lame that death guard just get painted a flat uniform green

If I ever fully played death guard I would start with white and keep adding oils, glazes, washes until it looked gross

[pastel rampart]

https://i.etsystatic.com/28964803/r/il/5b9c1d/5122070511/il_fullxfull.5122070511_707x.jpg

[finite compass]

It looks so clean

That's just wrong

Death Guard should not be clean

[dense sedge]

I wonder if we’ll ever see Malerion and the forces of Druchiroth

[mild glen]

Help, Chat. I blacked out and came back home with a new model I didn't need.

[valid brook]

Alas, many such cases

[mild glen]

I also came home with new dice that matches my army scheme.

[past sphinx]

Now thats a scam

[pulsar cairn]

hi Atlas

[thin ibex]

o chat of warhammer, would it be so bad if i violated my own desire to finish building all my models before buying more, to buy the kroot box, or its constituent parts?

[desert jay]

How big is the todo pile, currently?

[thin ibex]

I have... a kasrkin kill team i mean to build and paint up for my bro, I've got my ethereal, my fireblade, the rest of my ghostkeel (nearly done), smattering of drones, and one more stealthsuit team off the top of my head

[jaunty dawn]

depends if its motivating you

and like if you like building in its own right

and are fine with playing with unpainted stuff

[pulsar cairn]

hi penny
hi Tech
hi storm

[jaunty dawn]

hi skullyyyy

really excited for stormcast reveals actually

thunderstrike has been so fun to paint

[thin ibex]

heyo skully

and really i just keep doing other stuff instead of finding time for my models

my sort of plan ive stuck to is no more purchases till my current collection is at least built, based, and base coated

fully painted is not the limitation

but the intent is to fully paint them eventually, maybe to initially just get them blocked out and given a shade wash

[jaunty dawn]

yeah

i think thats a good way to do it

[upper bluff]

When was the last time you worked on any of your models? 1

I think piles are ok if you actually work through it consistently

[thin ibex]

early last month, got the ghostkeel to like 90%, only things left are its drones and all its secondary weapon options

since then ive not put any real time on them

aside from like picking em up in passing and telling myself i need to work on em

[floral herald]

Haha lets NOT talk about mine

[desert jay]

That doesn't sound too bad, that's like 5 kits and misc drones? One kit of which isn't even yours?

[floral herald]

(I got a really good deal on a Skaventide box and a GSC combat patrol)

[thin ibex]

pretty much yeah

i have to learn to paint hte kasrkin jagged camo

cause i wanna gift it to me bro

[soft willow]

Unbuilt models? Not me. camera pans over to three knights and an entire Imperial agents army

[past sphinx]

IVE BEEN SPOTTED

[pulsar cairn]

💀

[past sphinx]

Real heavy metal hours

[thin ibex]

im just like

i want them kroot rampagers

and the kroot warshaper looks cool as heck

[rocky shale]

It doesn't count towards your pile of shame if it was a good deal

[thin ibex]

and i have no carnivores, just a kill team

but i feel like kroot fit really nice

into my septs hive occupation story

i kinda also like the idea that as part of the occupation theres an ongoing relocation effort for many of the humans who live there, due to it being so densely and over populated

[jaunty dawn]

i have almost no unbuilt models cause I love building and have plenty of time haha

its. a growing storage problem

[thin ibex]

i keep prioritizing gaming with buddies after work, really

[jaunty dawn]

very fair!

[thin ibex]

building is usually fun for me, the ghostkeel was challenging in a few spots but not in a bad way, just asked me for more of my headspace

[desert jay]

Find local friends who have a pile they need help painting?

[thin ibex]

ghostkeel has been my biggest/most complicated model thus far; which i know isnt saying a lot in the grand scheme of things

but is pretty cool for me

[jaunty dawn]

my partner lets me build all their stuff and i build a lot of the stuff my dad gets which im happy abt

its cool when preferences synergise like that

[thin ibex]

i think technically the devilfish is bigger, but wasnt really complicated at all

[jaunty dawn]

ghostkeel is pretty fiddly and much more modern

like the unfurling cockpit n stuff

such a great model

[thin ibex]

i love that the cockpit unfurls

[solemn gull]

My to-do pile is like 4 models because I’m broke

It’s good to make every model count though

I find I paint better this way

[jaunty dawn]

I have some possessed to do cause ive been procrastinating on giving two of them plasma guns for heresy for ages

[thin ibex]

i find myself thinkink like... of over all army presentation a bit, so i think about what models i want to stand out or look brighter on the t able compared to others

[unreal cosmos]

cooool

[thin ibex]

so like i might edge highlight my crisis suits on the shoulders n stuff, but wont with my fire warriors

so that the firewarriors are less standout in comparison

i know i planned with my space wolves way back, that the terminators would have a much darker paint job so that their gold and silver trims popped more

[jaunty dawn]

i have a lot of spiteriders to paint but its not my fault gw gave me a second belthanos box lol

[thin ibex]

the other thing I WOULD have done if i remembered, was i would have also had the termies stand a bit higher

like put a small platform under their feet

[jaunty dawn]

mm

especially help with the old ones

[past sphinx]

Tau suit toes suck

Always have

Fucking awful to build

[jaunty dawn]

i remember hating building a crisis suit I had ages ago

and the modern ones didnt really change them that much

but im not planning on having any so bullet dodged

or at least if I did id be printing ones in scale with commander armour cause the scale difference is Dumb

[thin ibex]

I have a single squad

Dying think I plan on getting a bunch more

Don't*

I like em being the elite of the army rather than the whole army

[jaunty dawn]

mm

[pastel rampart]

I vividly remember assembling crisis suits and broadsides when Tau came out.

In 3rd edition.

Absolute clownshoes bullshit mix of metal and plastic for the broadsides which meant they'd snap their ankles if you looked at them wrong.

[valid brook]

Metal feet, metal SMS pods, metal railguns,

Metal head antennae?

It’s been a while

[pastel rampart]

https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTYwMFgxNjAw/z/ooMAAOSwKFVlBEb8/$_57.JPG?set_id=880000500F

[thin ibex]

I have 1 of the newer b sides with the rifle, planning for 1 more

They'll be my primary AT

[valid brook]

Hell yeah love 2 support my entire weight on the smallest, most snap-offable joints imaginable

Classic stuff really

[thin ibex]

The ankles really were troublesome on the crisis suits

Question, why do imperial knights have a power fist option but they don't actually grab anything? Couldn't it have just been a thunderstrike ram or club or whatever?

Do they have actual arm configurations too, with hands that hold stuff?

[tired cairn]

Don't they have a throw strat or something?

Oh, they did in 9th

[tepid stratus]

In 8th it was just something they could do if they got a kill with the gauntlet I believe

[jaunty dawn]

power fist on a titan is just classic pretty much

even warhounds get claw harpoon launchers now

n yeah 7th had it too, so its been a mechanic their entire 40k scale existence at least

the idea of it being a big demolition crane manipulator thing is the main utility, with a side of 'god machine in the image of man'

and 40k visual language of fist == top tier vehicle killer

[jaunty dawn]

no one:

me: so I just think a ghostkeel scale xv9 hazard revamp would be really cool-

even just a head swap has a neat vibe

[finite compass]

Leave it to ADB to actually make the concept of the Black Legion interesting enough that I'm tainted to paint up some

Now that I'm bored and rereading the books

[spice flicker]

Would tempestus Scions in transports give said transports deepstrike?

[jaunty dawn]

nope

the only interaction that exists is scout in dedicated transports specifically

[spice flicker]

Just making sure

[jaunty dawn]

(between occupant keywords, that is)

you can kinda proxy karskin as mechanised scions though, in tauroxes

but yeah no

there are drop sentinels in legends, for crusade n such

[pastel rampart]

https://fixupx.com/Kabooski01/status/1828145163396620718?t=tJ0Uze-QR1NI_1mUsAd9Fg&s=19

[thin ibex]

nah im with you on that, itd be cool to have a ghostkeel sized xv9 with no stealth field and probably two big guns and 1 twin linked small one

I wonder if we'll get a dedicated scion oriented militarum detachment on release

for their dex

it seems obvious that they might do ones dedicated to regiments, but it seems they prefer to go towards specific units from regiments rather than regimental detachments; so we'll probably see tactical detachments like armor, scions, etc

[jaunty dawn]

seems like a sure thing I think

maybe one that'll finally give valkyries an interesting rule

[thin ibex]

man i think they're pretty cool regardless, but would be neat to see them get some love

but also gw hates airplanes atm

[jaunty dawn]

oh for sure

[thin ibex]

so its a toss up

[jaunty dawn]

I think it's just a thing where there's rarely a concrete reason to actually take them when scions already deep strike narratively

natively*

[granite basin]

silly question that's probably been answered... idk somewhere, but as a basic bitch aos understanding goes, where do stormcast fit in... morally ig?

i've been told that age of sigmar is generally a less depressing setting with more room for compassion and heroics, but comparing it to the eternal horror shitshow that is 40k is... not a high bar. are they enforcers with varying degrees of theofascism a la space marines, or are they a bit more noble as a baseline generally?

more just asking bc i wanna know how i'd play one of these guys, since i like the big man what in da big armor

[jaunty dawn]

uhh

noble as a baseline I think yes

sigmar isn't the best guy for sure but he's generally pretty transparent

there are some warhosts which are like, hardline authoritarians but it's more the exception than the rule

mostly they are usually genuine big damn hero reincarnated demigods

[granite basin]

nods nods. just wanted to know. it's not necessarily to say "can i say these are good guys so i can enjoy them", more just a general vibes check. bc i love space marines, but i know they're by and large Enforcers a la SPARTANs with a more explicitly evil bent, so i tend to play them up as such

[jaunty dawn]

they're also like, much more their own people

while space marines are indoctrinated into the facism

stormcast can disagree with sigmar and still participate just cause defending ppl from chaos is a good thing to do

[tepid stratus]

A stormcast knows exactly what they fight for because they've already lived and died for it once before. A space marine doesn't understand what they fight for because they were robbed of everything when they underwent their transformation

[jaunty dawn]

I'm prettyyyyy sure stormcast aren't really ever used against the people of the cities?

[tepid stratus]

Even within the hardline stormhosts like the hallowed knights, there's members who take extremely moral stances

[jaunty dawn]

humans of chaos, yes, and there's the catch that a Lot of humanity under chaos has no choice and is in that position cause sigmar abandoned them in the age of chaos

*human to mean people generally, standard elves and dwarves included

[tepid stratus]

Hallowed knights have deployed squads to wipe out towns just to cleanse potential nurgles rot

[granite basin]

that's a p good comparison actually. that's some nice ambiguity, i enjoy that-

[jaunty dawn]

oh yeah one caveat - they're not used much now. at first, azyr had a whole ass purge

the hallowed knights are the posterboy Asshole Stormcast

now the secret anti-chaos police role is primarily taken up by the mortal Order of Azyr

witch hunters and the like

[tepid stratus]

On the flip side of that coin, one of their lord celestants Gardus Steelsoul is a hardcore "no man left behind" kind of guy to the point he 1v1'd king Brodd to buy civilians and soldiers a chance to escape a siege

[thin ibex]

my like nonsense reason is htat they can bring lascannons xD

[tepid stratus]

It's more that the core trait they recruit for is fanaticism or otherwise strong beliefs and force of will. What they believe varies but the point is believing in it hard enough that the cause is always before the self

[tepid stratus]

It's to get the free rapid ingress from them. Plus they're deceptively tough

[jaunty dawn]

nah it's not wrong

rip vendettas

[tepid stratus]

I pray for a plastic vulture one day

[thin ibex]

they're also good for weird like LoS shenanigans

[tepid stratus]

Scions need more thematic vehicle options

[thin ibex]

bring back the tauros for the scions

[tepid stratus]

I mean more stuff like the deep striking turrets would be cool

Maybe a light tank that straddles the line between taurox and russ

[thin ibex]

i do think the taurox works pretty ok for the scions

a drop sentinel for them as a heavy weapons source would be cool

their whole theme of mobile elite infantry and light armor

[tepid stratus]

I mean shit even some kind of mobile heavy weapons team would be cool

Units of 4 dudes carrying around a couple of heavy weapons and their ammo either by deep striking or using some sort of jetpack system

[jaunty dawn]

so fun fact about the tauros sprues

they are Super future proofed for both the regular tauros being an option and for non-enforcer tauroses

-all the enforcer stuff, even down to the slots in the side panels, are on their own sprue

I don't think this necessarily guarantees more plastic tauroses? But they've at least left the option open for the future

[desert jay]

Yeah, which makes it really funny whenever warcom is like "hey look how cool the Heldrake is, don't you want to get a Heldrake?" (or w/e the aircraft is for the faction they're talking about)

[jaunty dawn]

the enforcer venator was also the Only plastic vehicle in the whole of ash wastes after the initial release (not counting the goliath bikes which are big enough to use vehicle rules)

...which if only one sprue was coming out of the Necromunda budget, cause the regular tauros was already getting ready to go...

makes a lot more sense!

[thin ibex]

yooo what if some sort of helldiver's esque 2 man over the shoulder weapons team deal? Not sure how to differentiate them from the field gun/hvy weapons team dichotomy tho...

maybe even smaller team, no access to lascannon, but they have assault instead of heavy?

assault autocannon teams or advance and shoot missile launchers

or i guess they could have like a shortbarrelled lascannon

[jaunty dawn]

missil loncher...

[thin ibex]

honestly just fold the elysians into the scions

[finite compass]

I mean I think it'd basically be the same thing, just different aesthetics

Or the missile launcher here

'two dudes with big gun on one base' is really the only universal constant you'd need to have

[pastel rampart]

Steel Legion rule and it's so annoying how impossible they are to get.

[finite compass]

It's the Cadian Show now

With a handful of 25-year-old Catachans as a supporting act

[floral herald]

Vraks has that!

[jaunty dawn]

heavy bolter

oh shi

that's cool!!!

[pastel rampart]

https://cults3d.com/en/users/Davik_Designs/3d-models Oh hey this guy's got a bunch of not-Steel Legion STLs.

[jaunty dawn]

but yeah tbf it's not like gw is being inconsistent

[finite compass]

I'm very annoyed you can't get the Vraks renegades anymore

[jaunty dawn]

forge world made all the cool ones and they got kneecapped

[pastel rampart]

https://fbi.cults3d.com/uploaders/14283948/illustration-file/01c384c2-5970-485e-9873-14e8ea5b8423/render_built.jpg

[jaunty dawn]

(also tbf, gw has made kriegers and not!attilans)

[finite compass]

I also miss Vostroyans

[thin ibex]

yeah i was more meaning 2 man carried and mobile

not 2 man setting up a tripod and fixed position

the 2 man steel legion missile launcher is the vibe, not the lascannon

and the vraks gunner for sure

[jaunty dawn]

oh sure

I just think scenic bases are the shit

[past sphinx]

i gotta try to do some snowy trenchs for chaos guard

[mild glen]

One of the Tau planes kinda resembles the P-61 Black Widow.
I love the Black Widow. I would love to field something that looks like it in an army.

I do not want to field the Tau planes.

[floral herald]

Shame the death turkey is rly bad rules wise atm

It’s such a good model

[jaunty dawn]

I have one just cause it came in a battleforce one time haha

do love it tho

i loved vector strike

[floral herald]

It’d honestly be pretty solid if flyers were good

[rocky shale]

Doesn't it at least have hover?

So it can just be a bad flying tank

[floral herald]

It doesn’t have hover

Wait whoops

Yeah it does

A lot of the reason it’s bad isn’t because of it being a flyer - it’s specialized for air superiority and flyers are bad

[jaunty dawn]

mm

baleflamer is fun but not worth the whole chassis

[rocky shale]

Just dunk on your local tau player and nothing else

[jaunty dawn]

ap 3 torrent flamer with soul blaze

those were the days

[past sphinx]

heldrakes have been so bad over the years someone just straight up gave me one a few years ago

[jaunty dawn]

pffff

[floral herald]

Yeah I’d like to like it but also a Forgefiend is 15 points cheaper and an absolutely wonderful shooting platform

[jaunty dawn]

mhmmm

[past sphinx]

i really wanna talk to gw's scaling department in reguard to skulls

[rocky shale]

Fliers are overcosted because theoretically the flyer move thing is strong if it works perfectly which it never does

[past sphinx]

sometimes they vary wildly on the same dang model

[rocky shale]

But nobody likes the flyer move so they're just bad hover tanks

[floral herald]

And also they were busted until the enforced reserves and late join stuff

[mild glen]

I dunno. It looks like it's within Railgun range.

[past sphinx]

just smacking a demon out of the air with modern AA strikes me funny as hell

[mild glen]

'Tis a very silly setting

[desert jay]

GW gonna make a mission pack that changes the flyer reserve rules to make sure all the competitive players have a few for just a few months

[past sphinx]

i believe that every imperial AA vehicle is based on the Sgt York

[wintry mist]

We already do a thing where we run a lot and attack things at range idk if u heard of it it's called war...

And clearly humans in the warhammer universe are the best at it because we are good at running

It would be very interesting to explore violent, societal conflict resolution in other species in scifi

Humans have like, not amazing but pretty decent eyesight and great endurance so all our wars have long marches but a species that is an ambush predator might have all wars essentially be what we would consider unconventional

[wintry mist]

This is generally a take I "have a problem with" (I could not care less in the grand scheme of things its plastic men) but like... of course people want to see humans in the T'au, and to see humans cooperative with xenos. They like those xenos and are humans in real life. They want to be represented as existing within that space.

Humans are the main characters in most scifi because I don't care about aliens, I care about human relations with aliens

That came out wrong

But anyway the fun of all the alien factions in warhammer is how they relate and interact with the imperium and by extension humanity

On a sort of fundamental level, I think. Not quite objective I'm mostly just yapping out my arse

[uneven ember]

counterpoint: both DEldar and Orks can be extremely entertaining entirely in their own context

[past sphinx]

Orks go hard no matter whats going on

[wintry mist]

They never escape that context though

[past sphinx]

Necrons have their own whole things going on

[wintry mist]

That is the context of their existence

The first thing explained about the deldar is that they kidnap and torture humans to keep themselves from being eaten by the sex god

Thats most people's introduction

The Orks yea they're just fun

Eldar created afformentioned sex god and thus started the age of strife, of which is an entirely human concept

Though im sure the eldar weren't doing so hot either

The Tau exist as a contrast to the imperium

[uneven ember]

Bitchy Gay Skeletons Bicker Across Millions Of Years, Billions Dead

[wintry mist]

Necrons have their own thing going on but their major contribution to the setting is fucking with the imperium

Same with the orks

Contemporary setting

I know they did the whole war in heaven thing but

That exists to contextualize them fucking with humanity

Ork and Tyranid lore too

Right I'm done ranting sorry

[past sphinx]

well contextualize them to orks eldar and monke

humans are just around

[wintry mist]

Idk

That will never be popular or imo very compelling

[past sphinx]

thats a very limited view of things

[wintry mist]

Like I do enjoy their standalone stuff

But standalone stuff contextualizes them fucking with the imperium

"Why do they fuck with the imperium? Because this is what they're like."

It's about idk projection

Its a lot harder to project yourself onto non human characters, especially non human characters that act very different from humans

Its why fantasy is easier at it

Fantasy races usually act like "humans, but x"

[past sphinx]

i think a broader enguagement with fiction would ease that mindset

The Books of the Raksura alone countermand that

The Raven Tower also notable in this reguard

[wintry mist]

I'm not saying its impossible or like, bad

[past sphinx]

but you are saying it isnt compelling

or will be popular

[wintry mist]

Maybe uncompelling was a bad choice of words

Or uh

Word

Xenofiction is a very real and compelling genre and it's super cool

Uncompelling wasn't the right word but I'm not sure what else to use

It's just...

Idk I'm sleep deprived and probably very wrong

And just trying to justify myself without saying anything

But my main point still stands: most fiction has humans in it because humans are relatable

[past sphinx]

we are as a collective mankind

we havent found a good way to be anything else

[wintry mist]

Which is a no brainer but people want to relate to things more so they want humans in all the xenos factions

Well not all but they latch onto humans working with or in relation to the xenos factions

The humans who dress up as orks are pretty popular

Despite being a throwaway gag

[past sphinx]

we seek to contextualize the unknown in comparison to us

to contrast the known to the alien

its why the gods took the shape of man over time

[bright dove]

Are we talking about the Necrons and how they have the best 40k novel?

[past sphinx]

ooo im gonna start that tomorrow

[wild fog]

Infinite and the Divine is one of the best 40k novels from a purely enjoyment standpoint.

[past sphinx]

death or glory is up there for me

top 6 probably

[wild fog]

Cain's always a good read, though those books definitely have a formula after a while.

"Cain encounters (X), just wants to go home, discovers that the real villain is (Y), accidentally does a big hero."

Charming as hell though

oh also, Ghazghull, Prophert of the Waagh, another Xenos book that is better than it has any right to be.

'Rashamon, but about an Ork' is the funniest pitch and it works on way too many levels

[past sphinx]

shocking death or glory is one of the few warhammer books where its just orks

no 3rd twist of secret chaos or secret gsc, just good old orks all the way through. Its refreshing

Local veteran hasnt respected the plasma gun manual in 12 thousand years and wont start now

[runic swallow]

Well, it does set up for ||spooky chaos stuff ||

[past sphinx]

true but it goes no where witch i found funny

Cain avoiding yet another 3rd act twist

[runic swallow]

Does it count if it’s another book’s twist?

[past sphinx]

Technical foul but he still plays through

[jaunty dawn]

no i mean literally throwing things

its actually quite a rare ability

in the animal kingdom

even among primates

[wintry mist]

We throw things in war too...

Grenades mostly

Im just being snarky and silly

[jaunty dawn]

grenades are kinda awkward its weird

and ofc dont really make use of like

think about what a good baseball pitcher can do