Warhammer and Such

[thin ibex]

iirc much like on the ground, the nids tend to have utterly and unbelievably large fleets

with creatures the size of ships that like to take big ol chomps out of space vessels

[uneven ember]

Yeah "big claws" is a Tyranid ship weapon.

[floral herald]

In BFG they weren’t that much more numerous than other fleets

[thin ibex]

iirc i think one of the warhammer tv series showcases a pitched battle against a nid fleet

[floral herald]

But they did have cheap budget cruisers and could take a huge number of escorts

Though I think their escorts were extra-chaff-y

[thin ibex]

i think lore wise they're generally the larger fleet/outnumbering element

though in battlefleet, that kind of asymmetric balance probably feels a bit weird especially when theres balance elements that count action economy

[uneven ember]

The escorts made the difference as far as "flood," yeah.
Everyone else had limits on how many escorts you can have on the table but for the 'nids it was just "go nuts"

[floral herald]

Yeah lore wise they’re very numerous

[uneven ember]

But lore wise, as far as comparing space fleets go
The Gothic Sector, where the base game was set (hence the name) being a kind of 'typical' space war as far as it goes, the Chaos and Imperial fleets are trying to take and hold territory and rule the spaceways while the Orks and Eldar are pirate forces preying on shipping and being a pain in both sides' ass.

[floral herald]

The really unique nid things in battlefleet were “grapple attacks” and iirc they were the best planetary invaders

For that mission type

[uneven ember]

But that's obviously situational, Chaos frequently act as pirates and WAAGH fleets are obviously trying to take over territory.

[floral herald]

You could basically lose a planet defense mission instantly if even 1 cruiser made it through

They had good boarding and stuff but that was less unique

And I think only DE also had grapples

Maybe orks?

[uneven ember]

Orks had some kind of grapples, yeah.

[tired cairn]

Things worked a bit differently in the video game, but all the tyranid ships would start stealthed and had a short range ram. So you wanted to sneak up on your opponents and then literally pounce on them. Which was hilarious and fun

[thin ibex]

im imagining the ork grapples are either just a super sized literal grappling claw,

or just hundreds of normal grappling hooks

[floral herald]

That sounds a lot more engaging than the nids on the tabletop BFG haha

[jaunty dawn]

lore wise world eaters used grapples in the heresy

[floral herald]

It was the former iirc

[jaunty dawn]

and it was the same weapon as is available to the warhound fhdjdb

(ursus claw)

[thin ibex]

imagine if it was like ants, and it was a rope made of orks literally hanging on to the other ship

[uneven ember]

& yeah, so, okay.
For a planetary invasion, the attacking fleet gets free transports that it wants to get into low orbit of the planet to score points for the assault. Capital ships could also get the points, but not as well (transports give 2 points per turn, capital ships give 1, escorts do nothing)
Space Marine capital ships had a special rule that they get 2 points, same as transports, with drop pods and the like.
every nid ship that gets into orbit racks up as many points per turn as they have spores (what they use instead of shields)

[tired cairn]

Didn't they have quite a few spores each?

[pulsar cairn]

[thin ibex]

spores as shields is a bit funny

but makes total sense

[floral herald]

2-4 iirc

[pulsar cairn]

ya think space marines have regular human sized chairs in case they receive a visit from regular important humans?

[floral herald]

Maybe the big hive ships had more

[tired cairn]

That's a lot of ground invasion

[floral herald]

But they were relatively slow and would be intense fire magnets

Tyranids really invade planets with the “bomber gets through” principle

[tired cairn]

Tyranid escort whispering to itself "stay on target"

[thin ibex]

i like the nids v mechanicus match up lore wise cause of the shared "acceptable losses" mentalities

[uneven ember]

Although as far as "good at scenario" goes
Planet Killer and Exterminatus is pretty funny tbh

[tired cairn]

Mechanicus ships are just slightly better imperial Navy ones right? No wild aesthetic like they have on tabletop?

[lofty warren]

look, its abbadons boys

[floral herald]

I did like how Abby’s lads made really good carrier operators

Since normally there’s tension between “the mobile guns and carriers fleet” and “boarding demons” but carriers need all the LD they can get

I really liked Abaddon’s admiral rule

Unlimited leadership rerolls (normally you got either 1,2, or 3 depending on the seniority of the admiral) but if anyone failed with the reroll Abaddon’s ship opens fire on them

I think it was called You Have Failed Me For The Last Time

[uneven ember]

Mechanicus ships are, rules-wise, bought from the same fleet list as Imperial Navy but aesthetically have a whole different kind of look.

[tired cairn]

It was pretty funny

[floral herald]

They had a few unique ships

[tired cairn]

Could you still do the reroll if you were out of range?

[floral herald]

https://rustymagos.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/dscf2517.jpg?w=900

[floral herald]

I think so yeah

[tired cairn]

lol

"Why do all my captain suggest such a spread out formation?"

[floral herald]

In BFG Mechanicus ships were basically just better versions of imperial ones and a few of their own designs

But they tended to shoot WAY better because of mechanicus-grade targeting and fire control

And gasp mechanical autoloaders

[tired cairn]

Is that a fancy name for sevitors?

[floral herald]

No like actual macro-cannon autoloaders

They just… don’t license their best stuff to the wider imperium

[uneven ember]

(A ship that failed an Abaddon reroll but couldn't be targeted can't benefit from a reroll for the rest of the game.)

[tired cairn]

aww, fair

Abbadon probably just closes comms in a huff

[floral herald]

I think there was another one where chaos space marine crewed ships could take damage for a reroll

As the legionaries purge anyone disloyal

Actually that might have been the Inquisition

[thin ibex]

iirc mechanics is on record for keeping the best gear for themselves

including apparently completely reliable plasma?

[tired cairn]

They don't give that to their skitarii lol

[thin ibex]

yeah its a big ?

like maybe they keep it from themselves too

[uneven ember]

But Planet Killer, so
Normally on an Exterminatus mission you pick a ship that trades out its normal prow weapons for a planet-killing shot, and you need to get that planet into low orbit and make a roll to fire it off.
Planet Killer has a gun that, well, kills planets. It takes three turns to charge but if it does instead of bothering with all that nonsense he just shoots a gun and it blows up.

[floral herald]

Aiui the plasma stuff is less that it can’t be reliable and more that the mechanicus has theological reasons to lock the plasma to “hell yeah we want some PLASMA”

[jaunty dawn]

plasma is weird

[uneven ember]

Meanwhile against ships Planet Killer's damage is "you die."

[floral herald]

And no one else knows how to limit the machine spirits to like an 8/10 instead of the 11/10 their furious souls desire

That may have been fan lore though

[thin ibex]

i think one thing i dislike about tau ion is that tau use plasma and they're like "why do yall use guns that'll kill you, hah dumbasses" and then they use their ion gun that will apparently do the exact same thing

[floral herald]

Yeah iirc the planet killing shot could also be used as a “I’m gonna make a nova cannon look like a fun joke” damage wise

[jaunty dawn]

no yeah definitely

and there was no indication of it being a problem when it was just ion cannons haha

[thin ibex]

its one of those things to me that kinda goes against like tau's core ethics/methodology

[floral herald]

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/9/99/Planet_Killer_space.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20120919045758

The Planet Killer also looked cool but was HORRIBLE to assemble

[upper bluff]

The plasma thing is probably volkite

[tired cairn]

Metal model right?

[floral herald]

Yeah

[tired cairn]

So many spindly bits

[upper bluff]

Apparently Cawl is making volkite weapons again but the only unit with "neo volkite" are primaris lieutenants

[thin ibex]

like the tau vigorously test their shit and ensure their weapons arent a hazard to their users, except with their ion guns

[uneven ember]

Yeah the metal BFG minis were...
It was a time

[floral herald]

Horizontal pieces, huge weights off of completely vertical slices

[jaunty dawn]

i mean they do all safe modes

[upper bluff]

Also Volkite guns on the tabletop are kinda sad without enhancements

[jaunty dawn]

you have to actively switch them to the radiation version for extra effect

[thin ibex]

i forget did the planet killer go down at cadia? I know abby dropped a blackstone but his flagship persists right

[upper bluff]

They all have dev wounds and AP 0

[jaunty dawn]

volkite makes a lot more sense when they have their own rule lol

[floral herald]

And to make matters worse it BARELY balances on a flying base and can put enough torque on it to snap it trivially

I have, or at least had a planet killer model but I actually never managed to assemble it

[tired cairn]

Ion cannons are vehicle weapons right? Maybe the crews are disabling the safeties

[thin ibex]

theyre vehicle and battlesuit weapons

[jaunty dawn]

theres infantry ion rifles

used by pathfinders

[thin ibex]

anbd infantry yeah

though they went back to being rare on battlesuits now

[tired cairn]

Time to recast it into resin so it actually can be put together reasonably

[jaunty dawn]

also ones the same size are used by interceptor drones/as a turret on the fighter

[floral herald]

Honestly that probably is the play

[thin ibex]

my own read on the tau is that they'd never had infantry handle weapons that could be dangerously overcharged and kill the user, and would just mount those on drones or on vehicles

that have shielding

[jaunty dawn]

I feel like the ion rifle power source was basically the big thing selling the new ion lore

[tired cairn]

Whu is the power source a lumby crystal lol

[jaunty dawn]

cause the ion cannon and cyclic ion blaster were just regular weapons before, no danger whatsoever

[thin ibex]

so did the votann sell them ion gun designs or big lumpy crystals

[uneven ember]

why not both

[jaunty dawn]

its called mor'tonium apparently

[tired cairn]

Maybe the t'au were like "haha stupid humans" and then they were "ok, fine I get it"

[thin ibex]

i can see that argument but i dont buy it myself

[jaunty dawn]

the thing is fire warriors volunteering danger to themselves for the greater good is perfectly tau

[zinc field]

I feel like there should be plasma weapons that deal damage to everyone around the user every time they're overcharged

[thin ibex]

i also generally dislike the "adopting the ass backwards way of doing things from the deeply archaic and inefficient ways of the imperium" argument for the tau

[jaunty dawn]

exposing the crystal is what superchsrges the weapon

[zinc field]

sort of a "I'm not just a danger to me, I'm also a danger to everyone around me" vibe

[jaunty dawn]

this was an option in the rogue trader rpg. plasma gun vents that make it safer to the user while dumping a bunch of plasma all around them

[tired cairn]

I think Cyan suggested that T'au behave as if they are in a different universe. So adopting certain Imperial ideas makes sense in that context lol

[tired cairn]

... how lol

[floral herald]

Yeah it’s a very Tau thing to be self sacrificing for the… the uh… dang it the greater good

[floral herald]

It reacts with air

[tired cairn]

.>

Sure why not

[thin ibex]

its a pefectly fire warrior thing but not a perfectly earth caste thing imo

[jaunty dawn]

cause the crystal gets supercharged when exposed to atmosphere

but doing so causes said atmosphere in the vicinity to be dangerously dangered

[thin ibex]

earth caste arent in the business of accepting hazardous designs for full production, they'd prolly see it as a flaw, one that they'd want to design out once it came to full production

[tired cairn]

I feel there is a way to contain it and do that, but I am not a 40k engineer

[thin ibex]

(which was what the old ion stuff was, experimental)

[floral herald]

I hadn’t really been following the lore but I had always figured it was fire warriors battleshorting their gear against the advice of the earth caste

The crystal stuff is new to me haha

[thin ibex]

honestly? its new to me too

[jaunty dawn]

the pathfinder ion rifle was like

the new ion gun that came with the overcharge lore

it also technically in testing limbo I think

but it hasnt really been addressed since post third sphere lore etc

[tired cairn]

Earth Caste: "You have to be careful when loading this. The crystal dangerously supercharges when exposed to atmosphere"
Fire Caste: "Expose it to atmosphere to supercharge it. Got it"

[thin ibex]

i know pathfinders get experimental guns kinda cause they're like really close to being spec ops but not also in the heroes mantle or stealth suits

[jaunty dawn]

I mean if it means you compelete your mission and save a village whats some space cancer yknow

[thin ibex]

it is probably notable that regular firewarrirors dont have ion guns

[jaunty dawn]

i meant fire warrior as in members of the fire caste yes

[thin ibex]

and all the other ion is mounted on drones on planes, on tanks, on battlesuit commanders

[floral herald]

Do fire warriors get special weapons now or are they still all rifles?

[jaunty dawn]

they can deploy a turret

[thin ibex]

nah all rifles and a missile turret

that supports them

[jaunty dawn]

but themselves are still all rifles/carbines

[thin ibex]

and up to 2 drones that are just eq for the shas ui now

[jaunty dawn]

the drones are also just carbines offensively tho so

[thin ibex]

i do laugh at the idea of a shas ui holding his long rifle, 2 carbines, and a giant shield generator

[jaunty dawn]

fire warriors do get special drones

wait no

[thin ibex]

tehy get the guardian drone

[jaunty dawn]

that was just me cheesing things in 8th edition

[thin ibex]

but not hte grav, pulse, or recon

[jaunty dawn]

oh yeah they get that

I was thinking of the pathfinder ones though yeah

[thin ibex]

i kiiiinda wish they could get a heavy weapons drone

as like their firesupport thing

[jaunty dawn]

there was a heavy gun drone once

two burst cannons

[thin ibex]

oh yeah i know, i thought it looked cool too

its kinda fun that instead of an infantry based mortar, tau fire caste uses turrets with guided smart missiles

i also wonder who in the squad carries the turret, or if they all carry parts

[jaunty dawn]

tau are kinda based in the doctrine that a markerlight is the only support weapon you need

because theres seeker missiles deployed everywhere

[thin ibex]

well yeah, the doctrine was built around loitering support/overwatch, and let the troops on ground access support at need

so you have like a manta in the AO, and the seekers fire when a marker sends the request and approval

or sky rays

or, honestly, rail guns on hammerheads or broadsides far away

who can narratively shoot from much further

its also descriptive in how the crisis suits work as a reactive/support force

and generally firewarriors are ferried in devilfish, orcas, or mantas

or devilfish AND mantas

they dont do a whole lot of marching, perse

you know one thing im sad about is pulse carbines are still in a sort of weird spot

mechanically

where they're better than pulse rifles within a space of like 6"

[jaunty dawn]

give them back grenade launchers 😤

[thin ibex]

i agree

[jaunty dawn]

but really that was a big part of their designed balance

[thin ibex]

though fire warriors already have the nades keyword right?

[jaunty dawn]

that and you couldnt move and rapid fire

[floral herald]

At the time it gave them Pinning

But I think Pinning is gone

[jaunty dawn]

pinning exists as a like. recurring rule

[thin ibex]

i dont think its a universal rule these days

[jaunty dawn]

not under the name pinning ofc

[thin ibex]

as i cant think of anything that inflicts it

[jaunty dawn]

screamer killer

[uneven ember]

Talking about BFG
In the BFG rules, it's explicit that a Tau Manta squadron is "one Manta"

[thin ibex]

oh neat

[jaunty dawn]

has the equivalent of pinning shell shock (1)

i mean

obv battleshock is different to pinning

[thin ibex]

the first thing i thought of was making pulse carbines also rapid fire 1, so that they shoot 3 times up close

[floral herald]

Oh yeah fair

[jaunty dawn]

its kinda a mix of pinning and morale

but I definitely see it as the descendant mechanic

[thin ibex]

though i do wish the nade launching was somehow represented

[jaunty dawn]

youd probably just have to make separate profiles for the two of them tbh

[thin ibex]

make the shasui always have a carbine that comes with a nade launcher

and keep the firewarriros mono gunned

its also a bit funny that the pf team, thanks to the kt, also comes with a specialist grenade launcher guy

that has multiple nade types

if i was greedy id want the firewarriors to have a special rule that had text callouts for pulse rifle and pulse carbine

[jaunty dawn]

hes funny

[thin ibex]

and helped define different roles

my favorite guy on the KT is the drone dude

out here playing games

I need to remember what i was gonna name em all

i know im running 2 rail rifles

[jaunty dawn]

his grenade launcher is in the same place on the gun he just has a huge magazine for it

[floral herald]

All of the KT for 40K units are so much more interesting than the baseline squads

I love em

[thin ibex]

i love that they take the opportunity to like...

tell a story within the squad

that i imagine would totalyl be a thing for all squads, but just is too granular for hte larger game

[jaunty dawn]

it is kinda funny kill team also ignores the fact that all pathfinders have a grenade launcher

[thin ibex]

(i still paint my firewarriors with like a "designated medic" who has a marking on them)

[floral herald]

That would be pretty fucked up in that game but it’s funny that they have to

[thin ibex]

yeaaaah, photon nades pretty much dont exist

anymore

[jaunty dawn]

actually

[thin ibex]

and tbf, the old nade launchers were like flashbang launchers

[jaunty dawn]

I guess photon grenade doesnt have a maximum range

just takes range penalties

you still have to buy it individually though

2ep

not hit by the indirect restriction

[thin ibex]

its a bit funny taht like

the whole squad can volley fire flashbangs narratively

though presumably they have multiple nade types in the narrative in the same format

[jaunty dawn]

its kinda based on like

[thin ibex]

and you can just load what you want

[jaunty dawn]

what the usa was actually looking into doing at the time

[cunning lintel]

sci-fi T-shirt cannon

just launch shit at em

[thin ibex]

yeah i presume they have like a universal munition design for the carbine nade launcher

just not defined by the game rules these days

[jaunty dawn]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objective_Individual_Combat_Weapon

or a bit before

[thin ibex]

that fits with the ol creator talking about how they were loosely base on like NATO stuff

[cunning lintel]

props to the first pathfinder to figure out you can just chuck a particularly flat rock down the launcher and bean an ork in the face with it

[jaunty dawn]

yup

[thin ibex]

anywho, that was mostly me in my feels about thinking the carbine is cool

but are genrally not worth taking when its them vs another option

[jaunty dawn]

the double barrel thing is also a thing thats been considered irl

[thin ibex]

though honestly in practical terms, taking the carbines on fw and not the rifles isn't going to hurt you too bad in casual games

they'll still generally do what they're supposed to

[jaunty dawn]

ie firing two bullets at once so you double hit probability before the sight picture is affected by recoil

through double barrels. or two bullets in the cartridge xP

[thin ibex]

yeah, thats the thought behind like really tight burst fire too

[jaunty dawn]

blooded made me think of it

[thin ibex]

isn't that the weird pulse scilencer?

[jaunty dawn]

ye

[thin ibex]

i find it amusing

i kinda wish the phobos kt got scilenced bolters

wait did they?

but yeah silenced bolters are a funny idea to me

almost wish i magnetized my fire warriros so i could be indecisive

about carbines

but

alas

i did not

they're riflemen through and through

i DO think i might have given the leader a carbine

i forget

[jaunty dawn]

stalker bolters do have them a lot of the time

or at least some kind of ridiculous muzzle device

[thin ibex]

i always remembered my dad telling me that when he was in the military, the squad leader usually got a submachine gun, and that stuck with me with giving leader guys the smaller weapon

[uneven ember]

There are billions like it but this one is mine.```

[thin ibex]

fuckin raven guard making baby fart sounds as they let loose with their quiet bolters

[pastel rampart]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/YJFzyGzJkxI

[thin ibex]

CLOMP CLOMP CLOMP pfft pfft pfft

"take them out brothers"

of course the bolter still has exploding rounds

so its not at all quiet

maybe the explosion is also quiet

[jaunty dawn]

its more about delaying your position being found than anything

[thin ibex]

yeah thats fair

explosions dont give you a direction

do bolts have rocket trails?

[jaunty dawn]

completely silent kills is why phobos throw knives haha

[thin ibex]

or yeah just assault with knives and do some throat slitting or something

instead of bolter attacks

recently in rogue trader there was a bit where the sw team suggest they go out in advance of hte main assault and do some backline raids to kill leadership

[uneven ember]

I feel like I need to paint something yellow just so I can try doing it with contrast

[thin ibex]

and that got me thinking about reivers

and how they are SO suited for space wolves

but SO hamstrung by rules

[pastel rampart]

Honestly never been easier to paint yellow. So many good options.

[thin ibex]

reivers doing backline terror attacks to clear or soften enemy positions for guard assaults feels like a thing that can happen

i wonder if we'll see any of the new armor types aside from tacticus in space marine 2

like gravis or phobos

would be cool to be an aggressor fighting the nids

[jaunty dawn]

I kinda hope so

curious how the mp will shake out

[thin ibex]

i dont know what phobos would be in an action beat em up/shmup; aside from like the "fast evasive" option

[jaunty dawn]

cause the loadout system in the original was super fun

[thin ibex]

phobos mechanically would be less stealth and more speed/dodge in that kinda gameplay i imagine

oh man i hope the mp is just as good

[jaunty dawn]

orks appear to be updated in bsdata

[thin ibex]

yeee, i can list build with them finally

not tau yet tho

Waiting for tau to see if I can still play at 1k

I think I'm fielding my crisis as star scythe

And my one solitary broadside is staying

Gotta remember to magnetize my ghostkeel though

[cunning lintel]

yknow the convo earlier did make me realize, like, a ton of tau weapons have at least what looks like two barrels, like all the pulse weapons, the broadside railgun, fusion blasters

[lofty warren]

Twin linked

[bright dove]

Awww, I missed talking about 40k and space battles.

[soft willow]

I mean we can talk more about it.

Nobody will be mad.

[bright dove]

To talk about my experience with it, it was decided on a whole Vs. thing i was a part of that the 40k factions had to be measured in conventional warfare, because it just sorta blew most other settings out of the water in terms of space combat because it (in a shocking twist) approached it a bit more realistically.

Like yeah, the Covenant could glass planets. But it took less ships for 40k to do it. That and the whole Exterminatus thing being on the table.

[past sphinx]

40k does have 1 kilometer long ships space fighting at basically arms reach

Witch if nothing else is funny

[floral herald]

This depends a lot on depiction

[past sphinx]

Doing ye olde broadsides in something the size of roade island

Navy void pilots must be some real bugnuts crazy bastards

[brittle salmon]

Yeah that's not in every depiction is the thing

[uneven ember]

Literally my favorite thing about BFG is that half the time it's like "the miniatures are not to scale. Your ships exists as imperceptibly tiny dots in the middle of the flying base stem, and measurements are done from there."
& then they're like "Imperial ships with 6+ front armor may take a Power Ram as an upgrade."

[runic swallow]

Look, it just makes the trajectory calculation a little harder, onward to glory with a protractor

[past sphinx]

Those shells are expensive if you miss

Get close and make the omnissian forge blessed without your weight on its anvil

[runic swallow]

Also, I know it’s not technically the right place but I figure reposting it here might get it seen by people more knowledgeable: Anyone know good (relatively inexpensive) 28mm scale car or truck models to use for wargames (ie transports, convert into technicals, scatter terrain, etc)

Thinking of modern vehicles, not 40k ones

[past sphinx]

Modern or 40k?

Oh

Are you okay with printed stuff?

[runic swallow]

And unfortunately I don’t have a 3D printer (though I could see if my university has one students can use)

[uneven ember]

I get why they didn't do it but I was a bit disappointed that the video game went with the super-short range bump into each other scattered space junk scale, rather than "use the moon to block LoS" like you could do in the tabletip game

[past sphinx]

Etsy has all sorts of folk willing and able for reasonable prices

https://www.wargaming3d.com/product-category/3d-printables/#

I trust these lads scaling for the most part

[floral herald]

Etsy seems like a good resource yeah

[past sphinx]

Its stricter 28mm not 28 heroic

[runic swallow]

That’d scale better with my modern military minis anyhow

[pastel rampart]

Local library might have one too.

[runic swallow]

I’m more thinking that since there’s some industrial/mechanical design programs they might have a nicer one

[past sphinx]

Ya know in workin my way through brutal kunnin and despite nonshocking 3rd faction twist because thats the only other plot gw has im just a touch let down by my personal friend the gargant slayers model

Its a good ork ill tell no lie

But he ain't got that charisma

Quite like the neck details tho

[uneven ember]

One more thing about the Battlefleet Gothic campaign rules I loved
I mentioned above that the campaign has Chaos and Imperial fleets taking and holding territory and spaceways while Ork and Eldar pirates just cause trouble
The games take place in sector maps and every Chaos and Imperial player starts with one aligned planet, with the rest of the systems being neutral.

It then notes that, lore-wise, all the unconquered systems are Imperial worlds, but in general planetary governors drag their feet providing material assistance to the war until they get a cruiser parking in orbit to remind them of their obligations, so they're functionally neutral.

[thin ibex]

Hmm I think I will make ork lists

[mental birch]

Re Battlefleet gothix

I'm an idiot, I wrote a T'au list I call 7:1,

And it's just delivering a kroot sphere to a planet and using it as a distraction to kill everyone

[floral herald]

https://fxtwitter.com/roybattyforever/status/1788979738465206281?s=46&t=RjdIzh2qFuWkjovzBmgCsQ

Many such cases

[tired cairn]

What is that giant box?

[junior robin]

1/350 CV-64 USS Constellation

a model kit of a aircraft carrier

[past sphinx]

Thats how I bought my first brush and models

[valid brook]

What’s really crazy imho is when I drop my phone and accidentally order a bunch of models while trying to catch it

Happens all the time

[floral herald]

damn those new battleforces went fast

[mental birch]

Which one?

[floral herald]

the two CSM ones

[mental birch]

Ahh

[floral herald]

Went out of stock in the time I needed to authorize the transaction with my bank lmfao

[thin ibex]

I'm hoping to snag a kroot box at some point but I doubt soon

[pulsar cairn]

I like kroot

[thin ibex]

me too

its also kinda wil that the kroot army might be kinda strong

not like top meta for tau

but stronk

i also just want some rampagers in my list no matter what

[soft willow]

My FLGS got way under the number they requested in their allocation, I suspect GW underproduced again.

[floral herald]

Yeah probably

I heard that most stores only got 2 of each

I'm gonna have to ask around and see if there's any not accounted for

Or do without

Which would be ok I have a lot of painting to catch up on

[pulsar cairn]

Btw

Do we have any examples of kroot that ate too many space marines?

[jaunty dawn]

krootox

[pulsar cairn]

🐒

[jaunty dawn]

I think the like

Idk how often a kroot kindred manages to dead end themselves nowadays tbh

all the krootmorphs we've seen are fairly ancient

which is of course long before they ever met space marines

but! tyranids made tyrant guard out of space marines in the 4e lore so

they are actually fairly similar to krootox in physiology haha

just with extra arms

[pulsar cairn]

Neat!

[past sphinx]

You may not like it liberal but this is what peak evolution looks like (post approved by real tau'va patriots)

The base model Subaru of life forms

Need to update them vespid sculpts

[junior robin]

alternative 40k timeline idea: what if the kroot ate one of the lost primarchs?

[past sphinx]

Or ate one of the prim-orks

[quaint compass]

The same kroot ate both

[rocky shale]

My LGS was the same. Not terrible considering that I kinda only want to play the vashtorr detachment so having all that infantry wasn't tooooo important.

[floral herald]

I was hoping for that fat stack of termies one

Maybe I’ll get lucky with a local store

[rocky shale]

Same, but the temies don't really fit into the actual lists I want turns out

I might just try to find a cheap old combat patrol for the helbrute and legionairies

[sinful merlin]

Wew the cultist firebrand is being sold for more than the warband set that had him and that came with 7 other minis 😵‍💫

[jaunty dawn]

jesus christ

[pastel rampart]

https://neocoregames.com/en/community/hub/inquisitor-martyr-offline-mode-faq Guess what's finally getting a goddamn offline mode after 6 years

[pastel rampart]

https://fxtwitter.com/Nicta_nova/status/1783644535005823148

[tired cairn]

It's always the female techpriests concerned about keeping the human form. Curious

The gem and spindly fingers is giving me navigator vibes

[quaint compass]

Clearly she should've been a Genetor

[floral herald]

Oh that looks fun

[thin ibex]

It honestly, comp aside, feels like it'd be pretty fun and dynamic on the field

Fall back and charge plays nice with more than a few units, and I realized not every unit needed to be a speed freekz unit for good effect

The real main idea is to play extremely aggressive, try and stuff my opponent into their table side, the b wagon and boys are a gambit for the mid objective, the burna trucks run interference and thin out enemy objective holders

I figure the scrapjets can really lay in a lot of mw if they're not focused

And the bikes do a Lil bit of everything

[remote wharf]

https://fxtwitter.com/PancreasNo/status/1789391880268005605?t=H8DlGbK7wIAIjUNmfRMswg&s=19

[zinc field]

I was thinking “Tyrannocanis” for a name

[thin ibex]

Tau data is in Bscribe now!

I have more than 1k in value now, can't bring my farstalkers or ethereal

Unless I change the squad to be a starscythe squad

For the crisis

But I think this is a pretty versatile list at 1k

And montka let's me be a little aggressive

If I put the fireblads on the strike Team instead, he can use the spotting montka Enhancement though

[upper bluff]

This is so cool. Absolutely fire

Are you gonna use it as a warhound or something else?

Or is it for one page rules?

[zinc field]

I was going to use it as a normal chaos knight war dog tbh

[thin ibex]

Progress

[pulsar cairn]

are there any weapons that are just like

a mega power washer in 40k?

[floral herald]

I don't think so, unless you could stuff like the chemthrowers

[quaint compass]

Nothing is really about the cutting force of pressurized liquids, no.

I was about to say shuriken weaponry, dince its just a long spray of stuff
But that's still projectiles

[runic swallow]

Well, there is that techpriest power wash simulator level pack

[thin ibex]

wwould be a bit grim but on brand for arbites to use water jets that are built to kill ppl

[quaint compass]

Hooked into the waste management system

[pastel rampart]

Death Spinner if you wanna be funny.

[floral herald]

https://x.com/jetblackraider/status/1789808482314838388?s=46&t=RjdIzh2qFuWkjovzBmgCsQ

jetblackraider 🐀 (@jetblackraider) on X

@CaseyExplosion This one got some people very annoyed at me

Twitter · May 13, 2024, 12:02 AM

[thin ibex]

i should get a kroot character to lead my farstalkers

[desert jay]

Longshot synopsis

[thin ibex]

im just being silly with this one

[plucky token]

that single krootox rider is a bit confused, but he's got the spirit

[thin ibex]

honestly just a points thing

but also hes ok for sitting on points or going to table quarters

[plucky token]

mhm, mhm

just an objective monkey for the most part

[junior robin]

really hope this is not for necrumnda

[tepid stratus]

Kind of looks like an enslaver? (Psychic mind control goobers, they show up as wandering mobs in gladius)

[junior robin]

it does look like a baby one based on the newest piece of art we got of them

[thin ibex]

arent enslavors like... big?

makes me think that if that IS one, its gonna be for like the smaller scale game

[quaint compass]

Titanicus Mayhapsbe?

[junior robin]

they are showing off stuff for that on saturday so could be it.

[soft willow]

I would laugh if we get Xenos in LI and they do Enslavers first and not anything from 40k that was asked for.

That said I doubt it's for an Epic scale game.

Unless they do like an Epic scale board game with them or something.

[floral herald]

They’re warp natives their size is poorly defined aiui

[past sphinx]

Gonna bet on delaque

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/pherahgo/status/1783938830879404414

[spice flicker]

Why have I been seeing so many memes about the female primarch designs lately?

[floral herald]

Memes ebb and flow on their own clock

[spice flicker]

Oh I know but when did this whole Primarch SO meme trend start?

[floral herald]

Like a week ago on grimdank

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/theminiaturista/status/1789707494555533718

[white mural]

Same, though I’m certain it is

Id have to find a way to incorporate them into my genestealers as some proxy

[past sphinx]

40k getting cool weird models in current year

[tired cairn]

That's very impressive but also must be so fragile

[junior robin]

looks to be about the size of the tiny GSC familliars

[pastel rampart]

Oh it's definitely a display piece, I wouldn't trust that for regular use.

[past sphinx]

Best guess is an enslaver spore

[pastel rampart]

Well, unless the servoskull had tentacles connecting to the base.

[tired cairn]

I assumed the last shot was the finished piece, which was just the skull

[pastel rampart]

Yeah, I'm just thinking on how I'd do it to make it more playable.

Two contact points means it's a lot more durable.

[tired cairn]

Oh, yeah for sure

[dense sedge]

Necromunda or a new warhammer quest would be my bet

[long void]

Use it as a spore mine 😉

or flying rippers?

[cloud flicker]

Oh nice the Tau stuff is out

I saw that there were three set Crisis suit loadouts.

I’m assuming you can make custom ones but miss out on the cool abilities?

[desert jay]

Nope there's no flexible option

[floral herald]

I think the custom ones have been depreciated

[cloud flicker]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/240196923644968960/897603373874937906/image0.gif?ex=65821148&is=656f9c48&hm=0d374f766037f3ccecc6b5255e1e51bd4fba831a8db7500f08cb1cdeaf08165f&

Damn

That

Sucks

[jaunty dawn]

they got added to the legends doc

...but not to the legends points doc lol

(orks have been)

[thin ibex]

4 crisis profiles would have been funny but i think not good

[cloud flicker]

Probably

But custom suits are fun :(

[thin ibex]

i just kinda figure ill field my one squad

as different patterns

[cloud flicker]

Makes sense

I haven’t been able to even paint 40k as of late so I’m far out of the loop

Is 10th going well?

[thin ibex]

depends on who you ask

[floral herald]

CSM player voice yeah

[thin ibex]

i think so

if you go to a warhammer community space, warhammer peopel will probably just be spilling permanent vitriol about it

[cloud flicker]

I remember liking some of the changes and being disappointed in others.

[thin ibex]

the thing i think i wish i got but didnt get was

a crisis suit intended to let me split fire

which is my favorite way

[floral herald]

Competitively viable but not hater-tier oppressive for 75% of the edition and now we're getting a great codex

[thin ibex]

I enjoy doing burst cannon and fusion gun

[cloud flicker]

At least the Kroot models are great

[thin ibex]

for example

but yeah i think things are going mostly ok

[cloud flicker]

But damn that doesn’t really make me wanna play 10th

If I played again I’d probably play 9th or earlier.

[thin ibex]

you'll just also defintiely find people who who have managed to insist that its the end of times after every update

I wasn't a huge fan of tau in 9th tbh, with a couple exceptions

[cloud flicker]

I understand

[thin ibex]

i did enjoy their dex tho

[cloud flicker]

I liked the melee flamethrower

A LOT

[thin ibex]

and enjoyed how it shifted the playstyle to mobility over castling

[cloud flicker]

It’s awesome yeah

[floral herald]

Yeah that is good

Tau aren't meant to castle up

[cloud flicker]

I wish 10th wasn’t such a mixed bag for me

I love the individual BSs of weapons

[desert jay]

And AIUI the codices so far are like:
Amazing book: Orks, CSM
Yeah it does the job: LSM, Tyranids, Necrons, Tau
GW why?: AdMech, DAngels, Custodes

[floral herald]

Some people we joking around on the comp subreddit about there being 3 teams

[thin ibex]

i do wish there was more... variation in weapon bs/ws to allow for greater power variation

[floral herald]

Team Codex Creep
Team Codex Sleep
Team Codex Weep

I do feel a little bad for some of the books because CSM got 8 detachments and they all seem at least viable

And Stodes got like 4 and one is a joke

[cloud flicker]

Wow they weren’t kidding about trimming the fat

[desert jay]

Chaos Cult is just below viable AIUI

[floral herald]

Chaos Cult and the Night Lord ones are probably the weakest

But the NL one is good its just unrelaible

[thin ibex]

why is chaos cult not viable?

[desert jay]

Oh right that one too, b/c battleshock

[floral herald]

And has a hilariously bad MU into greenwing

[thin ibex]

also meaning comp viable?

[floral herald]

Yeah comp viable

[desert jay]

The detachment has solid perks and strats, but cultists aren't a good enough unit to be the backbone of an army

[floral herald]

Focus on weaker units in the book, Deceptors kinda does its playstyle better

Deceptors is probably top tier though

There are a lot of armies who cannot handle 75 cultists and 30 legionaries spawning 9" away from their DZ

[thin ibex]

between orks, tau, and chaos dexes, i do feel like anti horde/blast is gonna have a a resurrection

[cloud flicker]

Seems fun

I guess I’ll stick to painting for now though

[thin ibex]

the thing i was most surprised by was montka and retaliation cadre both existing

[cloud flicker]

I’m finally in a position where I can do it again :)

[thin ibex]

ive very recently starting building models again, so i feel you

[cloud flicker]

I did like that there were more than just Kau’yon and Mont’Ka

[floral herald]

The wild thing is that the NL one might be good

[thin ibex]

oh for sure

[floral herald]

Just volatile

Since it forces a LOT of Bshock tests with penalties

[thin ibex]

its interesting to me though that the retaliation cadre is the "farsight" vibe, montka is not

[floral herald]

And insane bravery is 1/battle now

[cloud flicker]

Let me check the stuff again

Yeah lmfao

It has all the suit buffs

Neat

[thin ibex]

its very muc hthe "dropzone clear" detach

you can also silly things like hella AP flamer squads

of crisis

[cloud flicker]

Did they update the Vespids yet?

[thin ibex]

nah, effectively n ochange

to vespid, which is sad

[cloud flicker]

:(

[thin ibex]

i hope that they are due/getting a kt to soft update them sometiems

sometime

but i have no idea when

[floral herald]

A vespid KT would be interesting

[desert jay]

BTW, wanna know my pitch for making Chaos Cult jacked?

[floral herald]

I'd say too hard to balance but they did teleports behind u guys and it was fine

[cloud flicker]

I love the flavortext for the retaliation cadre.

[desert jay]

Detachment gives Rhinos, Vinds, and Preds the 'damned' keyword. (You will also need to make a few strats infantry-only to not be turbo busted)

[floral herald]

Ok yeah that'd work

[cloud flicker]

Ok awesome commanders still get customization

[thin ibex]

yup!

[floral herald]

I really want the Damned to get their own codex eventually

[pulsar cairn]

who are those guys again?

[thin ibex]

i kinda want kroot rampagers just as surprise melee frontliners

[pulsar cairn]

kroot tank

[thin ibex]

vespid expansion as a mini faction would be sick, but im not holding my breath

[cloud flicker]

Now I can finish Shas’Nel Nem’Sha

[thin ibex]

i think to really round em out, id personally give em a leader for the squad, a full flier or flying monster, and give the special weapons to the squad of some kind

[pastel rampart]

Hm, hm.

First cast: surprisingly good! Except the juggernaught's head, that failed to cast.

Spikes failed to cast in a few places but that's a consistent problem and one I likely won't solve until I get a new compressor for the casting pot.

I have an old metal chaos chariot I plan to cast next, then some metal bloodletters once I get the last few in the mail.

[thin ibex]

though honestly id just be happy for vespid to have their own special weapon or two, and the grenades keyword probably

[spice flicker]

I think my plan for the guard crusade force has a new idea. Focus on Chimera, sentinels, and hellhounds until I get to 2000 points. Once we go up to 3000 keep the list the same as when it was 2k (for the most part) and just add a warhound titan to the army for 3k games

[thin ibex]

seems fun to me

i always want to include a singular rogal dorn in my list for guard crusade lists

just cause i like the idea of it getting a lot of xp and taking on its own persona

and "legend" perse

[spice flicker]

Think I will go with the plasma and Las options

Also the dorn isn't legends you know that right?

[quaint compass]

I think he meant legend as "story"

Legendary tank doing cool shit in the war and such

[spice flicker]

Ah I understand

[quaint compass]

It would be fucked if the Rogal Dorn was already binned as Legends this early into its existence

[floral herald]

https://x.com/DiceyJune/status/1787496644860334081

Dicey June - comm open (@DiceyJune) on X

thought i should contribute with a 40k version

#yarrick4eva

Twitter · May 6, 2024, 2:56 PM

[uneven ember]

Awww those two ❤️

[thin ibex]

its interesting, comissars are kinda... a non thing atm

[brittle salmon]

?

[thin ibex]

theyre kind of a weaker officer unit curently imo

and we have no lord commissars

or comissar characters in the dex do we?

[zinc field]

Well there's Gaunt, technically

but yeah it's kinda weird how that chunk of lore has been removed from the tabletop

given that the guard's two biggest characters are both commissars

I had a silly brain bug for rules for a chaos knights detachment. Sort of a reverse sororitas miracle dice, where it debuffs the enemy instead of buffing yourself. Just how strong/annoying to play against would this be?

[thin ibex]

More dots, burn em down burn em down

[deft crest]

Hey has anyone heard or know where the rules for Inquisimunda is?

My group got talkin about it and i'm so lost lmao

[solemn gull]

Yeah

What version specifically is your group using

I find each group has their own homebrew

[deft crest]

Uhhh unsure tbh im trying to nail that down >:/ i was loosely following. This might be something i look back in on later with sorry haha

[solemn gull]

No worries

I’m a big inq28 fan

It’s practically all I talk about when it comes to 40k

[cinder wraith]

old world shenanigans

https://tenor.com/view/skeleton-gif-5530475079020271091

[mental birch]

How much of a meme retaliation is this

[ebon forge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yx61xeDV_60 Guilliman teaches every ultramarine how to make soup is canon

[upper bluff]

Dark Mechanicum real?

Oh wait it's probably a wardog

[thin ibex]

I don't see a super heavy so not that much of a meme.

[mental birch]

There are no super heavy battlesuits

yes that super heavy walker with a gun isn't a battlesuit

[thin ibex]

oh dang stormsurge and taunar both dont hae battlesuit?

[mental birch]

Nopeeee

Hahaha

Well stormie

Doesnt

Tuna i dunno

[pastel rampart]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/05/14/the-warhammer-skulls-video-games-festival-is-less-than-two-weeks-away/

[still warren]

oh lord please be actual new darktide content and not some more cosmetics

[thin ibex]

is it worth putting enforcers onto sunforge crisis teams?

they come with 4++

but also getting -1 AP does still improve t heir survivability a bit

its prolly more useful o nthe other 2

[compact gate]

too small for a knight

[thin ibex]

i do like the idea of doing hot drops with stealthsuit rapid ingresses for sunforged

to get access to that melta rule quickly

[compact gate]

im thinking its either necromunda or 30k mechanicum

[past sphinx]

Mundas doing secundus now and is out of the ash waste rules, evil mechboys past or current seems the ball

[spice flicker]

Thoughts on the different types of eldar aspect warriors?

[thin ibex]

just like... in general?

I like dire avengers as choosing shuriken catapults as their one thing

they're decently fun generalists

i think shining spears are a little eclipsed in utility rn, but i think they're super cool

fire dragons do exactly what they say they do on the tin

dark reapers also feel a tad lackluster atm

banshees have a lot of cool stuff going on, but are weirdly weak

in terms of actual ability to kill stuff

scorpions are also fun, but actually have utility effects

i have almost no opinion on the specters

oh and the swooping hawks are just generally quite good

in terms of volume anti infantry fire and board control

[past sphinx]

I like the power rangers vibe

Scorpions and firedrakes go the hardest

[thin ibex]

oh also warp spiders are sick

[past sphinx]

Peak

[thin ibex]

they dont have a phoenix do they?

[past sphinx]

Don't think so

[thin ibex]

i do think im a basic bitch and dire avengers are my favs

i can never decide which set up for the exarch i like best

but the dire sword feels like an overshadowed classic

compared to the glaive

i know the normal strat is just give hi mthe dual catapults

but i vibe with the one dude being a swordsman

[spice flicker]

I think most of the aspect warriors are pretty cool but I find myself struggling to convince myself to take them in a list. Fire dragons with potential leader+Falcon is an exception to that though but the others are cool looking but make me uncertain on if I should take or not.

[floral herald]

AIUI most aspect warriors are kinda overcosted for what you get in 10e

[spice flicker]

Trying to vibe with them on the the tabletop but just can't. Only non-wraith eldar infantry I kinda like on tabletop are the Rangers right now.

I know the clowns are good but not a fan of clowns in any regard

Also I do like the shadow spectres now that I think about it.

[thin ibex]

rangers are pretty good infanty, guardians are a bit fun for their special rule

i think the striking scorpions and swooping hawks are both very well regarded for utility

fire dragons do their job well

i think the biggest lose outs of the aspects are dark reapers, banshees, shining spears and dire avengers

though im personally still a fan of dire avengers

i also like me some shining spears, but theres no denying that they don't have the same heft for the cost that they need

but also, its your army yo, theres no need to use em if you dont want em

theres plenty of non aspect aeldari stuff

i do think swooping hawks or warp spiders are real useful for utility and putting out good harrassment fire

[rocky shale]

Meta: fire dragons, hawks, warp spiders, shadow specters
Off-meta but see competetive play: scorpions, dark reapers
Extremely mid: dire avengers, crimson hunters
Just kinda bad: banshees, shining spears

Dire avengers aren't particularly bad stat-wise, but a squad of fragile shooty infantry that wants to sit on points but also isn't tough enough to survive on points is a wierd role

[thin ibex]

dire avengers have this issue of being armed like guardians, with no additional special weapons, and being more resilient

but their role is effectively fighting other infantry blocks, which so much else can do

they do have a fancy overwatch, which is fun

[rocky shale]

Thier weapons are a fair bit better than guardians but they still can't deal with anything tougher than like MEQ

[thin ibex]

i forget, what does asurmen add to them? lethals?

[rocky shale]

They all have lethal inherently, Asurmen is +1 to hit and a 0cp overwatch

[thin ibex]

the vibe i get from the avengers is their meant to be kind of a do anything unit, but they fall below that measure

i think they're probably decently fun in casuals tho

as like hashtag the normal units

[rocky shale]

They're supposed to be versatile lore-wise but they're just shootier guardians with an overwatch gimmick

[thin ibex]

oh i mean a do anything a bit like intercessors, but intercessors can have a power weapon and a soft AT weapon, and have a objective orientd rule

[rocky shale]

Dumping a brick of them with Asurmen out of a wave serpent is a lot of fun, but they just die the next turn to anything that survives the opening volley and has more than 12" range

[thin ibex]

yeah for sure

i just vibe with their cool head brooms and the "we are masters of our most basic gun"

i almost always give the exarch the dire sword because its on brand

[rocky shale]

I just like getting like 36 shots where half of them will hit in overwatch

[thin ibex]

its a bit funny that like... the dire sword has the soul of like a sibling, but the glaive is just a cool glaive iirc

[rocky shale]

The sword is cool but make absolutely no sense for the unit to have

[thin ibex]

yeah its effectively is a "if you get into melee combat, this one guy might be able to do a thing"

[rocky shale]

As long as you don't get charged because you'll probably get wiped oops

[thin ibex]

yeah

also the glaive is better for that

with the shield too

to try and clapback once

[spice flicker]

Hmmm msu or 10 man striking scorpions?

[thin ibex]

For scorpions? Msu prolly

Even in crusade, I think msu let's you use them as harass and utility

At full size you'd be expecting them to deal with enemy units effectively

Whichever they're fine at with infantry usual of curse

Course

Thus is me being silly but:

The sword wind!!!

More Shurikens! Yells Asurmen

[tired cairn]

Oh, there is a leak that creative assembly is working on Total Warhammer 40k (on the order of years for after the Total Warhammer DLC finishes being made)

[remote wharf]

I love that every one calls it total warhammer instead of its actually name. Its just so much better.

[desert jay]

Total War War Warhammer

[floral herald]

I kinda don’t think 40K would work that well for the format

[thin ibex]

yeah id be curious

how that would work

not to say it wouldnt be sick as hell if executed well

but i dont think 40k necessarily lends itself to it

that being said modeling it off of apocalypse would be kinda sick

[floral herald]

I think something larger scale would be better

HOI4 but it’s a whole sector of space

[thin ibex]

is apocalypse still a thing or what are teh bigger modes now?

[tired cairn]

I think it would be ok for only one planet

[floral herald]

I think… technically yes

[tired cairn]

But yeah, space thing makes more sense.

[remote wharf]

Like Gladius

[floral herald]

I think the battle mode would be awkward

The normal mechanics kind of fall apart by the time most units are ranged

[tired cairn]

Though space with planet mini-maps would be pretty neat

[floral herald]

Like with Napoleon

[tired cairn]

Ah, that's fair

[floral herald]

There’s a lot of melee in 40K but I think there would be some similar issues

[tired cairn]

They are planning to use a new engine

[floral herald]

That might help honestly

[tired cairn]

And the historical version would be WWI

So they might be taking that all into account

[untold swallow]

Weird question

Do Custodes have psykers?

Nevermind, looked it up

[tired cairn]

What's the answer?

[floral herald]

It's a firm "sort of"

There's no notational psykers among them

But they also have limited stode-to-stode telepathy and such with "neurosynergetics" which is a sort of low level psychic capacity they all have

They're also all built to act of directly controllable conduits and puppets for the Emperor's will when needed

But that capability hasn't been that important for 10,000 years

[untold swallow]

A mixture of offical 'meh, probably not's and fan 'that would be a bad idea for x,y,z, a2, b2, etc reasons'

also I've realized that I can play my homebrew chapter fully using Thousand Sons rules, and even have my chapter master show up with her Warp-Serpent

(Rules-wise Ahriman and a Heldrake)

(Sadly Ahriman can't mount a Heldrake, but hey, beggars, choosers etc)

[tired cairn]

He hasn't used it while on the throne (since he is confirmed warp-presence now)

[floral herald]

Is that meant as a question or a statement?

[tired cairn]

A question

[floral herald]

AFAIK no

[thin ibex]

Progress!

[tired cairn]

Would have answered a lot of questions if he just talked thruogh them

But maybe he can't while totally alive in the warp

[floral herald]

The emperor is kinda too far gone to communicate how AIUI

[pastel rampart]

He's basically looking at every direction at once.

[floral herald]

Between his wounds and the need to modulate the astronomicon and prevent the webway from exploding he's really... coherent

[tired cairn]

How'd he talk to Guilliman?

[floral herald]

Esp with the unbalanced golden throne trying to revive and destroy him at the same time

[floral herald]

Badly and with 10,000 years of "recovery"

He's like a decohering cloud of psychic voices when Guilliman talks to him

[tired cairn]

Oh, I didn't realize that from the one excerpt that was posted

[floral herald]

The name [Guilliman] echoed down the wind of eternity, never ceasing, never reaching its intended point. The sensation of many minds reached out to Guilliman, violating his senses as they tried to commune, but then one mind seemed to come from the many, a raw, unbounded power, and gave wordless commands to go out and save what they built together. To destroy what they made. To save his brothers, to kill them. Contradictory impulses, all impossible to disobey, all the same, all different.

[thin ibex]

Isn't the emps like effectively devoid of their humanity after all this time? Being a more raw avatar of order or something

[floral herald]

It's not explicitly stated

But based on the scene in dark imperium

https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/pfjda8/excerpt_dark_imperium_godblight_guilliman_talks/

[uneven ember]

Maybe an avatar of order, maybe just a babbling psychic presence

[floral herald]

My judgement is that the "emperor" as a single entity is dying, and the massive chorus of shamans is falling apart and gaining their own voices, mixed with the Dark King (never born) and other warp echoes of the emperor

[verbal ermine]

galaxy's worst dad talks to his only son available

[floral herald]

Or all the Aspects the emperor wore are leaking out or something

[verbal ermine]

so this is the consequences of being put on psychic life support for 10k years or so

yikes

I almost feel bad for him.

[floral herald]

The Throne wasn't even meant as a life support system!

[uneven ember]

My preference is that on some level it's just nonsense.
But my conception of the IoM rests very hard on the idea that the Emperor isn't actually directing anything. Authoritarianism requires a figure of authority, with the figure's actual authority as incidental.

[floral herald]

Being interred in the throne wasn't even something the emperor said, he wasn't conscious at the time

It was inferred from leftover emperor's tarot cards

Which were probably meaningful because of the intense symbolic and psychic power used there in the Highest Stakes Game of YuGiOh Ever just before

But also were maybe just the Emperor's followers misunderstanding scattered cards

[floral herald]

(Also I want to clarify - this gets memed on a lot but it genuinely fucks imo)

[tired cairn]

I was hoping he was just dead dead. But a not-a-chaos god is pretty funny too. Though it doesn't sound like he is doing terribly well at the directing things part

[floral herald]

The not-a-chaos-god thing seems to have been headed off

Where it was prophecied to end that way in TEaTD but didn't work out that way because of time breaking

But also that the Emperor becomes a warp god ending would have been Very Bad

It's fairly strongly implied that the resulting warp-god-birth would destroy... the galaxy at least?

[verbal ermine]

damn

[pastel rampart]

Way I've read it is that the Dark King is an inevitability but it doesn't necessarily mean Emps will fill that role.

[uneven ember]

Same, tbh, but it seems like they've conclusively ruled out "he's literally dead, everyone's just taking orders from a corpse on a chair" as a possibility.

[floral herald]

I think its pretty clear that the Emperor doesn't really exercise any sort of executive authority over the imperium

[junior summit]

its at most in the form of things like living saints and moments of revelation

but the actual authority is the high lords

or more realistically "whoever the people with guns are currently listening to"

[uneven ember]

Right, because the actual effect of authoritarianism isn't that the authoritarian decides what happens, it's that the people acting are borrowing some of that absolute authority.

[floral herald]

I think that's pretty strongly stated yeah

[pastel rampart]

The Dark King's servants sit in their realm awaiting their master to be born, but who that ends up being is up in the air.

[desert jay]

It'd be funny if he did but it was all mumbly and cryptic and no one could figure out what he was talking about so it's basically just confirmation for their own agendas if they can spin it

And by they I mean the bickering Lords of Terra

[tired cairn]

If he's screaming hal-a-dozen conflicting orders into anyone's mind who asks a question it'd kind of like that

[thin ibex]

What's the dark king lore from?

[floral herald]

Mostly the death and the end

[thin ibex]

I should read that

I heard it was good

[floral herald]

I enjoyed them

[thin ibex]

Test militarum crusade list

Ogryns are too cool for me to not try and incorporate

I feel like it's a decently balanced set up, nice to have relative balance between melee and range

[mental birch]

https://pastebin.com/D9L29Tv4

OKay people who are good at lists

how does this pile of memes look?

[mental birch]

Xenos - T'au Empire - Bird - [995pts]

Army Roster [995pts]

Configuration

Battle Size: Incursion (1000 Point limit)
Detachment: Kroot Hunting Pack
Show/Hide Options: Legends are visible, Unaligned Forces are visible, Unaligned Fortifications are visible

Character [280pts]

Kroot Flesh Shaper [55pts]: Kroot scattergun, Twin ritualistic blades
Kroot Lone-spear [90pts]: Close combat weapon, Kalamandra's bite, Kroot long gun
Kroot Trail Shaper [65pts]: Kroot rifle, Shaper's blade
Kroot War Shaper [70pts]: Kroot pistol, Shaper's blade, Warlord, Kroothawk Flock, Dart-bow and tri-blade

Battleline [300pts]

Kroot Carnivores [150pts]:
• 1x Long-quill: Close combat weapon, Kroot pistol, Kroot rifle
• 19x Kroot Carnivores: Close combat weapon, Kroot rifle
2x Kroot Carnivores [75pts]:
• 1x Long-quill: Close combat weapon, Kroot pistol, Kroot rifle
• 9x Kroot Carnivores: Close combat weapon, Kroot rifle

Infantry [85pts]

Kroot Farstalkers [85pts]:
• 2x Kroot Hounds: Ripping fangs
• 1x Kroot Kill-broker: Kroot pistol, Ritual blade, Farstalker firearm
• 9x Kroot Farstalker: Close combat weapon, Farstalker firearm, Kroot pistol

Mounted [290pts]

Krootox Rampagers [220pts]:
• 6x Krootox Rampagers: Hunting blades, Kroot pistol and hunting javelins, Rampager fists
2x Krootox Riders [35pts]:
• 1x Krootox Rider w/ repeater cannon [35pts]: Close combat weapon, Krootox fists, Repeater cannon

Beast [40pts]

Kroot Hounds [40pts]:
• 5x Kroot Hounds: Ripping fangs

[spice flicker]

Did a test game last night of my 1k Mechanized guard vs 1k of my friend's thousand sons and think I barely squeezed through with the win due to secondaries and the Chimeras' durability. He brought two MVB+ahriman which I attempted to focus fire down on while scoring what secondaries I could. By the bottom of the third round I had more than 30 more points than him and a majority of my infantry while he was down ahriman and an MVB. Had I focused fire the infantry instead of the MVB I think victory would have been more clearly mine rather than a close call.

He consistently got doombolt off which was pretty painful to have to deal with and had I focused fire on his infantry and Sorcerers before the MVB I think things would have gone better.

[thin ibex]

I do think when you can go wide, removing scoring units and playing the angles and blocking get you further than killing the toughest stuff

[spice flicker]

I know the term "distraction carnifex" is used for units that are big, scary, and honestly can be effective but are mostly used to soak up attention and fire is a thing. The MVB definitely feels like one now after both soaked up so many lascannon and HKM shots thrown at it.

[jaunty dawn]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/05/15/prepare-for-matched-play-updates-with-the-next-action-packed-season-of-warhammer-40000/

kinda interesting

actions are returning to being a formal rule

gambits are becoming secret missions that are more hybrid between primary and your new objective

[spice flicker]

Also if the rapier ever goes into legends I'll be sad because for 35 points it's really good.

[spice flicker]

Also it seems that strategic reserves might be limited to 10th your army now if I read things correctly in that article.

[tired cairn]

Oh thank goodness actions are becoming an official thing

It was ridiculous that they weren't when they basically existed

[tired cairn]

I think that's a special mission rule thing and not necessarily a general rule

[spice flicker]

Ah I see

[tired cairn]

Oh, and it's specifically for setting them up in a weird way

[spice flicker]

But yeah actions would be interesting because that means I'll likely want to get out of the transports I take more now so I can actually do the actions.

Do you think this will influence the fixed vs tactical debates any?

[tired cairn]

I think the official actions thing will fix how pistols let you secure objectives but a melee only unit can't. Though maybe it's just for consistency

I think the secondaries will be the main determination of whether tactical or fixed is better. But I'd still bet on tactical being better in general

Also lol at this

You’ll also get six pop-out objective tokens, so all you need to bring along is your army, some terrain, measuring sticks, and dice.

[spice flicker]

Also the special weapons for my infantry I think I will be swapping to either melta guns or flamers. My plasma guns/pistols did more damage to my own forces than the thousand sons.

[tired cairn]

You don't have to overcharge them. But I'm surprised. I MEQ were perfect targets for overcharged plasma?

[jaunty dawn]

that's just rough luck really

happens

[spice flicker]

My plasma gun shots weren't good and my opponent rolled well on the saves that did go through. I lost two plasma gun infantry to hazardous and the one time the commissar in the list decided to overcharge he fell to hazardous as well. First time the commissar used an attack and somehow missed the target while blowing himself up. Kinda funny and fitting since he was partnered with catachans...

[thin ibex]

I'm a big fan of the Grenade launcher personally

Gives them some blast or a high str shot, no need to risk self destruction

[pastel rampart]

https://fixvx.com/IwriteOK/status/1790116636193927446

[quaint compass]

I just need to finish my daemon princes and I'll be Fuckingue

[tired cairn]

The miniature collection joke was what I was thinking of when I first saw that silly original tweet

(her exclusion of married people's weird hobbies was pretty funny too)

[thin ibex]

dang every ambition too?

[pulsar cairn]

[past sphinx]

from 51% to literally not even worth putting on the score board

what a world

[floral herald]

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/s/7dj5nPbJgM

Actual write up not the meme version with no info

[tired cairn]

Space Wolves and Chaos demons have the highest win rates? What

Random thought: Chaos demons implies the existence of imperial demons

[jaunty dawn]

living saints

pretty explicitly by this point

[tired cairn]

You aren't supposed to say it

[jaunty dawn]

not 'seraphon had the daemon keyword in early aos' explicit but

[tired cairn]

oh, amazing

[past sphinx]

Living saints need more flaming skulls legion of the damned style

[jaunty dawn]

they changed it because it was more trouble than it was worth mechanically aiui

[tired cairn]

lol

[jaunty dawn]

plus they introduced coalesced

[floral herald]

Daemons have been strong (not this strong) for a while but I was really blindsided by space wolves going from bottom 2 power armor wearers to number 1 overall

[jaunty dawn]

is it thunderwolf cavalry

[tired cairn]

What even changed for them to get there?

Were Custodes holding them in check lol

[spice flicker]

Poor custodes having a technical win rate of 42% yet practical win rate of about 23%. Woe how far the banana boys have fallen.

[past sphinx]

talons are okay

[spice flicker]

They're the only okay things in the codex

[past sphinx]

and by okay i mean getting a candy bar given to you thats not one of the ones you actually like but hey its a candy bar

[floral herald]

Yes

[spice flicker]

I wonder how GW will support custodes without turning them into a horde army to try and compensate?

[floral herald]

That may have been a factor since they were holding down a LOT of melee armies, but iirc they also got point buffs

[tired cairn]

(They will turn them into a horder army)

[past sphinx]

James has one lever and thats points cuts

[tired cairn]

Oh right. There was a points change recently, duh

Hey, allegedly they are going to make non points changes to admech

[floral herald]

Stodes might just stay in the dumpster for some time, they’re kind of a headache to balance overall this edition I think

[past sphinx]

give all the stodes another wound and another attack

for the hell of it

[tired cairn]

More than knights?

[past sphinx]

or just buff the sisters of silence as they wanted to give half the codex to a unit with 3 2 options

or get another sisters kit out the door

[tired cairn]

That was a bizarre choice

If they got the kroot treatment it would make more sense

[past sphinx]

you cant even use the FW upgrade kit for the akimbo bolt pistol sisters

[floral herald]

Assuming that’s in reply to me yes

[past sphinx]

or their space submarine

[floral herald]

Knights are kind of tricky since they skew heavy, but the custodes have basically been “melee armies go home” since they basically trounced all of them

Which is part of why all the really strong armies recently win with vehicles and shooting and mobile objective play

[past sphinx]

chaos knights are kinda dumpstered right now aint they?

battleshock being what it is

[spice flicker]

Aye they rely on war dog spam and that got disrupted some no?

[past sphinx]

Armigers are just so fucking good

pound for pound

[floral herald]

Yeah they used small bots mostly but their fundamental issue is being a Battleshock Faction and worse yet - not that good at forcing Battleshock

I know some chaos knight players who were like “wow night lords get that?” When we saw the CSM stuff because the CSM fear detachment does it better

It’s still not reliable but they have better tools

Chaos Knights would probably immediately go up a tier if they got a “just fucking kill them” detachment which didn’t care about Battleshock

[junior robin]

the money I would pay for a chaos knight daemon weapon upgrade kit.

[spice flicker]

Honestly I prefer to paint knights in a way that keeps them faction neutral so I can swap some weapons and get IK or CK.

[tired cairn]

I feel like a problem battleshock has is that if it was reliable it would be too strong, so instead all the BS abilities have to rely on what are essentially a small number of coinflips

[jaunty dawn]

the more recent battleshock abilities that have another trigger seem more interesting

like the night lords detach triggering off of half strength as well

[tired cairn]

Ah, yeah I can see that helping

[jaunty dawn]

(they also did it for the sisters of silence detachment but proccing off psyker is much more niche)

Pondering Elysians in kill team and being able to take strafing run/air strike is really tempting even though ik 4 extra guys is just better haha

[floral herald]

Supports are viable at least but 4 dudes is so strong

[thin ibex]

iirc chaos knights are in the 50 ish percent win rate arent they?

[floral herald]

Not rn

They’re at like 43%

[thin ibex]

this being from january, i couldnt find the more recent one

[floral herald]

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/s/BObmwA4lA4

This is what I was talking about

[lofty warren]

Does the meta check look at internal balance?

Im very curious about how the new points schema is encouraging certain picks

[desert jay]

How inclusive is your set of "power armor wearers"?

[floral herald]

MEQs not including deathwatch

(Cause I forgot about em haha)

[desert jay]

So just SM and CSM and GK?

[floral herald]

Including the many many SM sub factions

[desert jay]

Because my "maybe" list was also Custodes (MEQ+), Sisters (MEQ-), and/or Votann (MEQ-)

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/theminiaturista/status/1790446210416795960

[tired cairn]

That was impressive

[cinder wraith]

hello

i played blood bowl today as a beginner

i fielded the Necromatic Horrors

result of the second drive (i somehow caged my opponent)

still lost tho but i am content learning that i managed to pull off an expert move with no knowledge to the game

[past sphinx]

Sqauttorus the annilator has died in vain!

my shoot on death Iron head i had equipped with a mining laser threw themselves off the top of a building to shoot my friends gang boss when i went splat

i failed to notice the wall he would shoot through was tall enough to block squat LoS

Rip madlad

[spice flicker]

Been listening to the forges of mars omnibus and right now I have to just say: Screw you Galatea you truly abominal machine intelligence.

[soft willow]

Let this be a reminder to guard yourselves against tech-heresy.

Omnissiah protect our souls.

[spice flicker]

I think it ranks up there with Erebus and Lijah Cuu as among my least liked 40k characters.

[floral herald]

Me reading up on Galatea’s crimes

[spice flicker]

I will admit that it does have an interesting design and quite the impressive ego.

[upper canopy]

What did Galatea do

[soft willow]

Besides being tech heresy? It kills one of the coolest other tech priests ever.

Any more is spoilers.

[spice flicker]

So far it has hijacked an ark mechanicus, killed countless tech priests over centuries in a trap it laid, lobotimized and turned dozens of orks into servitors, tortured and transplanted multiple tech priests' brains to fuel itself, killed dozens of people in a bloody slaughter, ||stole the brain of one of the more reasonable and cool tech priest right before her father's helpless eyes,|| and is a grade A jerk in general.

[upper canopy]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1161696278640594954/1240406209282965606/image0.jpg

[floral herald]

lol

[thin ibex]

i forget, was it dune or 40k that rephrased ai to mean Abominable Intelligence?

[jaunty dawn]

40k I'm pretty sure, dune just calls them thinking machines

[crisp lance]

https://fxtwitter.com/rdzdoodles/status/1790519023027032496/photo/1

[pastel rampart]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/591429239211950081/1240479331537522890/20240515_213919.jpg?ex=6646b5e7&is=66456467&hm=71854750425a7dabd85de0e452aedee4c7794d4e51005d770ed439eed30306e1&

Sculptin' a lil' gas mask on a plaguebearer.

[verbal tangle]

I know there aren't that many 40k RPG players here, but hey! First draft of vehicle tuning rules for Only War/Dark Heresy!

[uneven ember]

oh cool

[thin ibex]

How much narrative room is there, do you think, for custodes and imperial knights to work together directly, and how often do you think it happens?

Was playing with the idea of custodes/ knights lists

[pastel rampart]

As much narrative room as you like, I'd think.

Custodes can requisition whatever they want so if they decide "we need these knights with us" then the knights just fuckin' do it, what're you going to do, tell them no

[soft willow]

Questor Imperialis motherfuckers straight up probably have oaths for working with them.

Not just they can’t tell em no, but like it’s probably a pretty big honor for your house and family.

[uneven ember]

"Having an Imperial Knight means people say 'please'."

[soft willow]

I worked directly in defense of Terra bitch, now get out of my fancy party.

[thin ibex]

Absolutely silly crusade test list

Hyper elite indeed

8 model crusade