Warhammer and Such

[jaunty dawn]

you dont have to take them as canon either

[pastel rampart]

Yeah.

[bright dove]

Things can be old and forgotten, waiting to be inspiration.

[pastel rampart]

Like there's the macro-level meta of what I said above, where everything published stands unless directly retconned; and then there's the micro-level meta where you can make whatever damn story you want and ignore stuff. Both are valid because 40k is a big place and there's room for practically anything.

[floral herald]

Yeah, and the starchild has been mentioned a bunch lately too

So there’s a chance

I can buy this

Though I don’t know how much to trust it the emperor was apparently Alexander the Great so that might inform stuff

[naive abyss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=662Dq0adlGs

lol me and pete had the same idea

though he went the extra step and added a second head

very clever use of the war hydra though

this very much fucks ngl

and definitely shows me my idea is viable one way or another lol

[pine matrix]

God that is a fucked up dragon

Giving me gaping dragon vibes, a noble creature mutilated (though I'm pretty sure most if not all Warhammer dragons are assholes?)

[pulsar cairn]

sometimes i step away from Warhammer cause too much sad

i feel like the folks from the fan base who complain about "not grimdark enough" are a bunch of dorks but dorks in a bad way

we deserve a lil good as a treat

[naive abyss]

tbh everyone who complains about that shit is usually somewhere on the spectrum of chud and likely a weird as fuck imperium stan lol

[floral herald]

I don't know about that, I generally associate that with people who think the imperium is somehow noble or justified

[upper canopy]

My friends think that it's not grimdark enough because the imperium looks too good

Ones favorite chapter are the Marines Malevolent

"You can't defend them" is his reasoning

[floral herald]

I do think that's a fairly cogent criticism especially when comparing older and more recent space marine art

Lots of conventionally handsome space marines in new art, lots of messed up monstrous warriors in old art

[upper canopy]

Yeah

They're very blanchpilled

[bright dove]

Needs more scrunglos

Though I am always on the side that says "Make the Guard look good"

Poor guys deserve that much at least

[past sphinx]

make em handsome but make em fuckin weird

[pine matrix]

Part of my love for the traitor legions, fucked up freaks who suck before they even got juiced by chaos

Loyalists are handsome freaks, who suck

The art for the guard box was pretty peak Warhammer to me, sci-fi starship troopers with bones and relics tied to their armour, screaming bloody murder

[floral herald]

Which guard box?

I mean a lot of them look like that but I'm curious if there was a specific one you were thinking of haha

[pine matrix]

This one!

[floral herald]

Oh yeah that one is quality

the cover for the 5e codex is also one of the "canonical" guard images for me

I think GW is better about making the guard a little weird looking than the space marines

I really like this one though

[pine matrix]

Yessss get gothic and ornate with it

[pine matrix]

I must have seen that piece more than a few times and I've only just clocked the double headed transport behind them

Truly impeccable

[valid brook]

I think one of the things that makes the guard work for me is the juxtaposition of aesthetics: here’s a bunch of dudes with a very familiar 20th century military aesthetic and then right next to them is a screaming maniac in robes waving a reliquary on a stick

[floral herald]

It's usually hard to see under the "CODEX IMPERIAL GUARD" text

But the double eagle dropship is just

[pine matrix]

The Lord Solar riding a fucking horse is so great for this. Fuck a jeep or even a tank, I'm riding into battle

[valid brook]

Like consider the 3e codex cover piece

[floral herald]

I really like this one as well, the insane baroque background details like the double eagle lectern. The chained bear that's just... here. The confused compositional focus making it hard for the eye to settle. The way it looks like a coup attempt with Cato's sword and death glare (cause it kinda is). The weird looking "get a load of this guy" foreground

For modern space marine art which I don't think has lost "the touch" for 40k

[runic swallow]

That was the art on the army starter box I bought back in the day 😌

[pine matrix]

Also I enjoyed the lore on, I think the Warhammer community article about him, where they say he consults with oracles and soothsayers reading the Emperor's tarot. Truly fantastic, a commander of space fleets and billions of future soldiers consulting divination

[pine matrix]

Fuck yes, fuck yes hell yes

[valid brook]

damn they got a bear

[pine matrix]

The dude in the foreground has an honest to god breast plate, hell yes

[floral herald]

and a fat fuckin cigar

[pine matrix]

Let's go

[runic swallow]

Rogue Trader lookin’ MF

[pine matrix]

Is that art depicting a specific event? Or is it just Cool Art?

I know Gilly had to slap down the High Lords at one point

[floral herald]

I'm not sure - I pulled it from the Warhammerart site

I think it has something to do with Guilliman's Primarch's Scourge of Terra

I only recognize Guilliman, Cato, and Trajann in that piece though

[thin ibex]

Might have past the subject already, but something I liked about the fucked up, scrungly, pockmarked, tube faced, scar ridden countenance of classic space marines is that it made it far more aesthetically obvious that they were not, in fact, the good guys or even that much better than the bad guys

"Bad guys"

And makes it far more believable that a normal person simply could not tell the difference between a space marine or chaos marine without additional context and information

[jaunty dawn]

I wonder if drop regiments need like

specific commissars

at least I imagine they'd be heavily judged by their grab chute ability lol

I was thinking that to a certain extent all commissars would need posting specific training but then they still send ones who fail to avoid getting themselves in accidents to catachan regiments so who knows

[bold halo]

hard to avoid those accidents when you need to do things like sleep

[upper canopy]

If only war is considered Canon then yeah

Every commissar gets advanced training to join their regiment

[thin ibex]

iirc commissars are also effectively given spec ops training from the start

yeah

[upper canopy]

Yeah commissars have stormtroopers level basic training

[bright dove]

You get all the specialized training of a Commissar, then they look at other available units, throw some specifics at you so you don't cause a Problem, then toss you to the place.

And ideally, they can find a gathering you'll click enough with.

[valid brook]

Even if you got your jump wings at the Schola, you probably go through a refresher course if your next duty station is an Elysian regiment and you haven’t jumped in years

[quaint compass]

It would also not be amiss in the decay of Imperial management that a Commissar would not have the correct training or conduct for the regiment they're joining. Either out of haste, carelessness, or the commissar's own head being far up their ass

[bright dove]

Indeed the case

[quaint compass]

"Well yes I am trained in the use of the humble melta-bomb. Do you think your education would concern more facets of warfare than mine?"

Commissar Slag was, unfortunately, not a casualty, but the rest of the squad assigned to his care was
He thanks his training and higher intellect for his survival, something clearly not afforded to the common rabble

[jaunty dawn]

I guess its also a thing of what posting you get if you are in a cadet team

cause thorough training is one thing

experience is another

[upper canopy]

Man

I miss Commissar Sebastian Burnside

[jaunty dawn]

that kinda just gets into the non comm / commissioned divide tho

[pulsar cairn]

btw

people complained a lot sbout that necron blood angel truce

i imagine it was mostly the bad dorks

so i wanted to know if it's good

maybe i could get me an audio book of it

[thin ibex]

i think many factions on the ground can truce to a common temporary goal where they'd never approach on a macro level

[bright dove]

Micro truces happen all the time

[pulsar cairn]

also it has the silent king and i like him a lot

[bright dove]

The galaxy is hostile and there's always something worse

[pulsar cairn]

indeed! and they were fighting nids and the silent king sees them as the highest threat to the galaxy ratger than Chaos

so it makes complete sense that he out of everyone else would prefer to strike a truce to deal with that first

[floral herald]

It was like a paragraph in the BA codex

It was just unpopular because it came out before the 5e Necron codex

So people didn't know about the new lore which was cooking and it didn't make much sense in the context of the 3rd ed fluff

[bold halo]

yeah it just kind of came out of nowhere and made absolutely no sense based on anything that existed at the time

necrons were still straight up silent cryptid terminators

[pulsar cairn]

ooooooooh

i want a book on it

cant have nice things

[floral herald]

or can you?

https://www.blacklibrary.com/all-products/word-of-the-silent-king-ebook.html

I actually didn't know this existed haha

[pulsar cairn]

thank u so much cyan!

[floral herald]

from /u/rapturedone on reddit

[pulsar cairn]

lmao

he's arguably corrupted yeah

but not as much as the other emperor's children i think

did he legit avoid that just by being like "Nuh uh, demons aren't real"?

[bright dove]

The answer is probably yes.

[floral herald]

I think it was more "while you were partying I studied the genes"

Fabius

[pulsar cairn]

i suppose

but when you stop and think how the warp is a reflection of the humans psique .w.

straight up not believing it is a thing probably does help

[floral herald]

they did try that

[pulsar cairn]

didn't unbelieve hard enough

who tho

[floral herald]

That was the whole idea behind the Emperor's Imperial Truth

[pulsar cairn]

oooh

[floral herald]

To weaken the ruinous powers by making everyone a state-backed atheist

[still warren]

Wait did they ever say if the emperor was involved with the Soviet Union then? He's supposed to be various "great men" through out history right

[floral herald]

no

[naive abyss]

now that i can get. most of my experience personally with "not grimdark enough" is people like yelling about tau or votann though ngl

[pulsar cairn]

he was a pro wrestler

[naive abyss]

but imperials being made too heroic looking is a absolutely valid criticism lol

[floral herald]

Though its probably unlikely because the Emperor went into a sort of self imposed planning exile no later than ~300 BC aiui

(Depending on if Horus Ascendant is correct that the Emperor was literally alexander the great)

[pulsar cairn]

i like the TTS version of that

[naive abyss]

considering theres fairly easy to find gw imperial art that almost looks cleaner and etc than similar art for the tau, eldar, or lov

[pulsar cairn]

he stayed hidden and would only come out to scare lil children

[naive abyss]

which feels incorrect imo

tbh i always wish they just made emps space sigmar instead of what he is now

[pulsar cairn]

imma go bed bye

[naive abyss]

id be so here for idiot with a hammer stumbles into gene science because he keeps yelling at nerds to make him stronger companions/progeny

[floral herald]

The Emperor avoiding the WW2 draft, circa 1940

[still warren]

Ah got it they're going the minions defense for modern history, just this time self imposed exile instead of an ice cave

[naive abyss]

like sigmar fighitng chaos just be like

https://tenor.com/view/homeless-nah-id-win-gif-11399565856913576326

[floral herald]

Yeah, GW has absolutely no interest in detailing what the emperor was up to in the 20th or 19th centuries

[naive abyss]

like i know ive said it before but emps not using a hammer is just silly to me lol

[desert jay]

Well daemons think so they're probably real. But a pile of stars and interstellar dust? Nothing more than that

[naive abyss]

shit out here like wartalon 40k

[floral herald]

I think my favorite weapon the Emperor uses is the ||Crown of chaos Horus makes him||

[naive abyss]

but thats in part cuz i love the whole thing of the big important setting dude having a hammer in a setting called warhammer

[desert jay]

Frozen in the same cave as the Minions

[floral herald]

||(Not allegorical hit bashes him in the face with it)||

[naive abyss]

i love fantasy dwarf and sigmars like approach to chaos

aka hit it with a hammer until it goes away

[desert jay]

(Technically the minions were only in the cave 1812-1968)

[still warren]

Alt 40k where the emperor has the minions instead of thunder warriors

[floral herald]

Disconcertingly easy to find

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/10p5a4p/minion_space_marinei_dont_know_why/

https://wh.reactor.cc/post/2015711

image sources

[naive abyss]

also thinking about it this applies to votann too

like votann out here to warp entities like

https://tenor.com/view/get-rotated-get-rotated-idiot-rotate-rotation-shark-gif-24511062

http://tieba.baidu.com/p/8023041299?&share=9105&fr=sharewise&is_video=false&unique=941CB1DCE6EE2439A0C22798F6083E1B&st=1663325276&client_type=1&client_version=12.26.5.0&sfc=copy&share_from=post&source=12_16_sharecard_a

still love this cut away

https://www.reddit.com/r/LeaguesofVotann/comments/1ai04nb/first_prospector_done/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

[pulsar holly]

I'm late for the commissar discussion, but in Warmaster, Gaunt talks about how had he not been "smarter" (for lack of a better word, paraphrasing) he would have wound up a Tempestus Scion, since both Scions and Commissars belong to the Officio Prefectus, and Militarum Tempestus. So I imagine the Commissars get just as much specialized training

[valid brook]

Surely we did not yet have the term ‘Tempestus Scion’ and Gaunt just says “would’ve been a stormtrooper” (I have not read the book)

[upper canopy]

I mean yeah all the Schola graduates get the same training

[solemn gull]

Did they fully replace storm troopers with scions?

[bright dove]

Yes

[solemn gull]

Aww

I think scions are cool but storm troopers were the coolest

[valid brook]

I mean, is there any substantiative difference? It was my understating that it’s just ctrl+f “stormtroopers”—> “Tempestus Scions” because the latter is way more trademarkable, cf. “imperial guard”—> “Astra Militarum”

(the metal 3e stormtroopers were fuckin sick, though)

[solemn gull]

I get that but the lore was awesome

I like the scholas but the idea of an inquisitorial killteam of badasses amongst your guard army is just cooler imo

[upper canopy]

That's still a thing

[naive abyss]

thats more or less whats the scions are

like the scions are near one for one the same lore as the stormtroopers as memory serves lol

[upper canopy]

The only difference is that individual regiments don't have stormtroopers now

[thin ibex]

i have to imagine that specific planets and regiments do have their own special brand of "kasrkins" or otherwise spec ops/stormtrooper types, and that they have a healthy rivalry with the tempestous scions

[naive abyss]

ostensibly allot of regiments have their own equivalents yeah

like krieg had its grenadier if memory serves

[solemn gull]

I thought scions were special forces chosen from schola orphans

[bold halo]

yeah games workshop just went and proper nouned everything after they went after a company producing third party models and calling them space marines etc

court said those names were too generic to copyright

[desert jay]

The funniest bit is that they proper nouned everything except when it comes to Space Marines, they still say Space Marine everywhere

Only 7e and 8e had the words "Adeptus Astartes" even mentioned on the cover of the SM codex

[floral herald]

That’s also what storm Troopers were

Well, are, since it was pretty much just a rename and new models

The inquisition still seconds scions

[runic swallow]

Ah, so they emerged for Henry Kissinger

[torn arrow]

originally (and probably still) it's implied the stormtrooper programs primary purpose is inquisitorial shocktroops, with those who fail the exacting mental/psychic side of things becoming guard

[pulsar holly]

We did, it took a while for Warmaster to come out, and by that time we had the former term instead of stormtrooper.

[ebon forge]

So a meme told me the Crusade: Pariah Nexus has a cool Ad-Mech story on it, it is true?

[cinder wraith]

care to share?

[ebon forge]

Had to change a bit because it makes a joke that is a big nono in this server

[valid brook]

No lie, I had no idea that Gaunt & the Gang had books dropping that recently

[jaunty dawn]

the newest novel was '21 haha

now that he's out of the TEATD mines wouldn't be surprised if more comes out at some point

[pulsar holly]

Yeah, I think there was an idea that The Victory is the final story arc, but I believe at the time Dan Abnett said he intends on writing more (not just novellas or spin-offs), that it wasn’t the final arc for Gaunt and the ghosts

[past sphinx]

Let their bones rest

It's been 20 years

[pulsar holly]

Too bad the crusade isn’t finished yet ||and a certain Sek is kinda back, albeit not exactly the same guy|| (spoilers for Anarch)
I need to read all the spin-offs, like the three books involving the Iron Snakes, Titanicus, and Volpone’s Glory. Since I’ve read Double Eagle

Cause the latter two Iron Snake books actually refers back to plot points from the earlier spin offs

[unreal cosmos]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/02/05/reveal-the-hounds-weve-caught-the-scent-of-new-kroot-hounds/

[jaunty dawn]

boyssss

[pulsar cairn]

kroot dog

[quaint compass]

KROG!

[pastel rampart]

Good dogs.

[pine matrix]

Dogs!!!

[naive abyss]

Ngl I'm super happy for what seems to be shaping up to be a full refresh for kroot

Also cool that an all kroot army may be viable

[jaunty dawn]

the only real question is if knarlocs get brought back or not

all other existing kroot models have been redone now

[naive abyss]

My wager is we shall but as like a centerpiece character model

In fact non greater knarloc is likely what that shadowed kroot is tbh

[jaunty dawn]

I'm not so sure

seems more like a new thing

[naive abyss]

So the question is more if we get the greater knarloc

[jaunty dawn]

monitor lizard-y

[naive abyss]

for ref on the rider variant

https://www.reddit.com/r/Tau40K/s/6SA9M8MIfS

[thin ibex]

im curious as to if we'll get gnarloc riders when we did just also get krootox riders, with a melee variant as well

seems like there'd be some riderly overlap

with such a limited range of models, would be maybe a bit surprising to me to have two sets of riders dedicated to charging and meleeing

rather than a model that fills a different role

[naive abyss]

I mean I think it's some sort of character

[thin ibex]

Could see a character gnarloc rider with lone agent rule and a precision weapon

and yeah character also makes sense

[pastel rampart]

Could be a chance to expand the range and add more units too. Or I hope they do.

[thin ibex]

weirdly i kinda hope kroot get a character who has a similar thing to th elieutenant with combi weapon thing, of being able to designate an objective for some kind of benefit

[jaunty dawn]

so the kroot auxiliary box is 5 units

so approximately 5 units more

hounds are one

that leaves about 4 things left to reveal

I imagine we get at least one new shaper

maybe even a mounted one

since part of the revamp is 'more shapers'

mounted shaper likely wouldn't ride a krootox, since only the young ones like fighting

and they're ridden by young kroot likewise

I honestly would expect we get at least one wholly new kroot beast, and it's the more sneaky lookin guy from the sillhouette

it's limbs look too small comapred to the rider to be a knarloc for one

[thin ibex]

krootviper

[jaunty dawn]

I think like

yeah maybe the mounted sniper role is taken by this new beast and they're all about being sneaky

if knarloc riders return as they are their niche will be that they're a similarly versatile unit to foot carnivores while the new krootox are more dedicated melee

oh hey

obscure ffg kroot beast

with a long tail and toothed beak

go figure

as for the abundance of kroot mounted stuff it's like, for the longest time kroot was six units (other than the kroot mercenary army list) and 3 of them were mounted on 3 different creatures (krootox, gnarloc, greater gnarloc)

[naive abyss]

Tbh I like the idea of a mount heavy army

Weird alien bretonnians

[jaunty dawn]

so it's basically just their faction identity to an extent; they don't have 'just a bigger dude' and they don't have 'vehicle' so cavalry is how they fill those spaces

which also brings in the wider kroot ecosystem which is another big part of their deal

[pastel rampart]

Yeah. The extent of any sort of vehicle is a space ship from BFG so it's outside the scope of 40k.

[jaunty dawn]

I imagine it'll also make for great exodite conversions using all the modern lizardman/seraphon dinos

[thin ibex]

i don't really got an issue with a high volume of cav, i mostly have an issue with high volume of cav that all do the same thing; so if they fill different tactical roles along with the difference in aesthetic we're gucci

noting that the two types of krootox riders are "heavy weapons support with fists" and "high mass shock cav"

[jaunty dawn]

I mean

melee is a very broad tactical role is all

there's plenty of room to do that

[bright dove]

There's a lot of types of melee

Don't send lightning claws for a power fists job

[thin ibex]

For sure, though in the purview of a limited unit selection, it gets a bit weirder when overlap like that exists; like in the votann they have einhyr and they have berserks which works fine; but it'd be weird to have two different units of einhyrs that have basically the same loadouts

[jaunty dawn]

I mean just by being dedicated melee units the new krootox are already very different from knarlocs

who are kinda. mostly chaff

but faster

actually weirdly slow this edition but it seems like their profile is mostly a copy paste of a krootox anyway

[unreal cosmos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQmCMyj_LbI

[thin ibex]

wait we already have stats for gnarlocs?

knarlocs*

[jaunty dawn]

yeah in fw legends

there's some weirdness in knarlocs mechanically cause by the fw time they were mostly designed to be like, part of a scenario rather than something to necessarily take

[sweet solar]

i hope we get like

an actual kroot vehicle

[jaunty dawn]

like you'd build up a knarloc supply caravan and then do a mission where space marines were assaulting it and tau had to swoop in and defend it

[thin ibex]

i don't think kroot actually use vehicles, rather they tend to use pack animals and so on. There is some question on how they land from a warsphere though

which implies some kind of lander

pack animals being some other kind of kroot

[jaunty dawn]

kroot drop ship/hunting yacht is an idea

[sweet solar]

giant aerial kroot morph, fully birdform, with a tau tech oxygen mask and "bird jetpack" to make them orbit capable

[unreal cosmos]

oooh that's a cool one

[sweet solar]

individual kroot can hang on as a transport

like a biological dune ornithopter

crossed with a dragon from Temeraire

[thin ibex]

i do kinda like the idea of a krootmorph thats void or high orbit capable and can handle re-entry

[sweet solar]

given setting tech they could litereally just use shields which would also be a cool gameplay element

really tanky flyer thats your main transport and can hang out over an army section to provide aditional deffense as the melee focused kroot move forwards

[floral herald]

https://vxtwitter.com/meu_317/status/1754513478562492833?s=46&t=RjdIzh2qFuWkjovzBmgCsQ

[thin ibex]

lol

[sweet solar]

im tacking a crack at scetching an orbit/entry capable krootmorph, currently pulling from, like

[naive abyss]

Random but I hope we get a cogfort model for cos in aos

[sweet solar]

the kroot trackers krootbird, valstrax, bearded vultures, nightjars

do we have any example of kroot technology with thrusters?

or just, the bfg warspheres and tau tech

also if anyone has any ideas on how to make an orbitbreaker krootmorph look cool/match setting, am all ears n eyes

[jaunty dawn]

the only kroot tech we know about is warspheres, some of their guns (which were augmented with tau tech), and like. leatherworking

[sweet solar]

yeah

[jaunty dawn]

oh warspheres do land

[sweet solar]

time to extrapolate from this fukin thing

yeah but that cant exactly be a tabletop model lol

[jaunty dawn]

I guess mercenary band tactics is to just warsphere down near a war and then sell their services

while tau auxiliary tactics is to use the air caste vehicles

[sweet solar]

oh damn we also have some other krootmorph art from an ol warcom post

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/8jv5attCfuYEpKUH.jpg

[sweet solar]

i mean my overall thing here is that that really is just a guess, so i wanna try making a different cool guess that lets me draw an orbit capable krootmorph

[thin ibex]

I think they often just hitch a ride with whomever hired them

But I do fully support orbital Kroot

Especially drawing them

[upper canopy]

Nah Kroot have their own ships

There's no way for them to get hired otherwise

[sweet solar]

yes, they have warspheres

[upper canopy]

Also would you trust IMPERIALS witha ride

fuck that

[sweet solar]

as already stated

but they dont currently have smaller ships

[jaunty dawn]

I mean

[thin ibex]

As far as I know, a kill broker would trust an imperial lander if it was getting them where they were going. I don't think they're extremely particular about what they are riding in

[jaunty dawn]

they must've had something to land on the gallowdark

[sweet solar]

they dont

[floral herald]

They’re implied to in BFG - warspheres are carriers and can launch assault boats

[jaunty dawn]

they can land on a planet with a warsphere but I doubt they'd want to dock the whole town with a dangerous space hulk

it's their house

[sweet solar]

like, the game as it exists is its totality

we can make up possibilities

but logic cant be used to make discoveries about fiction

[jaunty dawn]

???

[sweet solar]

thats just making your own fiction, like my currently devloping orbitmorph

[jaunty dawn]

I guess??

[sweet solar]

because i was asking specifically in the context of existing art or models to use to add relation to the exisitng parts of the game

[jaunty dawn]

yeah

[sweet solar]

currently im thinking about either some kind of warsphere derived single device a giant birdmorph could wear or carry, old technology that lets a krootmorph survive vacuume

[jaunty dawn]

fair

[sweet solar]

OR

some kind of jury rigged devilfish/hammerhead cybernetic enginewings

which are very different directions

like, stylistically

[unreal cosmos]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/kByn8l1z4xLHIivR.jpg I wonder how many alternate paintjobs they'll have in the dex

[junior robin]

have there been any units released with a negative objective control stat? 🤔

[upper canopy]

Don't think so

[thin ibex]

Negative no, 0 yes

[jaunty dawn]

I think the commentary probably says it can't be reduced below 0

like other stats

[floral herald]

Oh interesting, warspheres can land

[pastel rampart]

Ah, so it can act as a kind of base of operations on landing then.

[floral herald]

They’re also apparently not carriers in the TT?

[thin ibex]

As a note, it does also say that warspheres are rare and only brought to the most lucrative jobs or something along those lines

[floral herald]

Maybe that was just the video game

[thin ibex]

So either they have some sort of shuttle of their own, pirate then from other factions, or hitch rides provides by the client

[thin ibex]

I do like how the setting has yet to explain how the Kroot sagely navigate the warp and how they can just tell where to go to find a habitable planet

Safely*

[jaunty dawn]

seems like they have like

[tired cairn]

I didn't realize BFG had landing rules

[jaunty dawn]

another source calls it a sixth sense

so they probably have like specific shapers who train and adapt to navigate on instinct

[tired cairn]

Navigators also have a sixth sense

[upper canopy]

It's probably another thing they inherited from eating Orks

[jaunty dawn]

and a tradition that relies on using a inhabited planet's signature to navigate

[quaint compass]

They probably ate navigators :)

[jaunty dawn]

they've probably been doing it since before navigators were a big thing

[quaint compass]

They need to add eldar derived kroot, because I want my crystal kroot with magic powers

[jaunty dawn]

or before humans arrived in their area

[upper canopy]

They had those one time

[jaunty dawn]

anyway

[upper canopy]

They were so scary that the Silver Skulls called for an exterminatus on the planet they were on

[quaint compass]

Aw man

Yet again, the silver skulls ruin it for the rest of us

[thin ibex]

There are also kroot offshoot kindreds, like there was a chaos one that said fuck it we're eating warpflesh

[bright dove]

I can't imagine that went well.

[pastel rampart]

It tends not to go well and other kroot will shun them, if not kill them outright.

[floral herald]

This actually made me look up kroot timeline stuff and while it doesn’t appear to be navigator derived it looks like the kroot haven’t been in space anywhere near as long as humans

There’s a thing in Liber Xenologis which implies via mythology that the Kroot were “poisoned” by eating orks

So I’d imagine that kroot navigation is their take on ork navigation

[jaunty dawn]

oh

[naive abyss]

I dig the horned lizard one

[upper canopy]

Kroot also have some inherent technological knowledge

Which might also be ork-derived

[floral herald]

Which there’s a neat parallelism in the Warsphere rules - it’s basically an ork Rok

[jaunty dawn]

ohh

[floral herald]

https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/s/IqWKsG6UQg

[jaunty dawn]

liber xenologis is a relatively new source

[floral herald]

This was a really neat breakdown

[jaunty dawn]

that explains why I don't know any of this haha

[floral herald]

Yeah I’d actually not heard of it before

[jaunty dawn]

'21

seems kinda like another go at doing a xenology type book

[upper canopy]

The old Liber Xenology is pretty retconned at this point I think

[jaunty dawn]

yuuup

well

idk what has actually been said abt but it's long since been considered like totally uncanon in the community

which is unusual

kinda a shame. I did like the idea of a really old people in relative decline

[junior robin]

looking at their lexikanum page and who could have guessed they tried to eat necrons once

[jaunty dawn]

but at the same time it's not that's been retconned as much as there's less mystery and they went in another direction

[upper canopy]

I think the "Eldar have erogenous zones on their eartips" was clearly someone with a fetish

[pastel rampart]

Xenology is a good read if you go at it from the angle of a xenobiologist who is completely wrong about everything and is in fact, just kind of a moron.

[naive abyss]

I think it's a refrence to lodoss if memory serves

[floral herald]

Xenology is in a tricky spot because it’s about a crazed biologist who’s losing his mind and making up crazy cope to justify is work to the imperial war machine

So most of what he’s saying is like extreme reaches to find relevant weaknesses

[sweet solar]

hah the vage metalic banding design thematic has seen some more use , after the krootsphere

on the krootox wristbands

[floral herald]

Like how fungicides work on cultured ork cells - I bet you can spray orks with them haha yeah my work is for the good of the war machine yeah haha

[sweet solar]

yeah like since then they released actual art of ork kroot too

[jaunty dawn]

ork kroot are a pretty old idea

[upper canopy]

Well this was always a thing

The Kroot homeworld was invaded by Orks until the Tau saved them

[jaunty dawn]

as a like, example of what adaptions could give them

'green kroot' are tough kroot which are green cause they eat so many ork

and this was like right after they came out

[junior robin]

wonder what a primaris kroot would look like

[upper canopy]

Let's find out yumyumyum

[sweet solar]

just as a specifix cannon "contradiction" to the "eating orks poisoned kroot" mythology cyan mentioned

[jaunty dawn]

poisoned is

metaphorical

they weren't poisoned as in they ate them then dropped dead

they ate them and it irreperably changed their culture and ultimately doomed them until they could resurge with the help of the tau

[thin ibex]

i think poisoned implies the race as a whole was forever changed by eating orks. Which I also am not totally on board with

they are a faction that still has secrets

though

as in its implied they have industrial bases within the mountains on pech, and electively stay low tech rather than not having high tech

[junior robin]

worst army conversion idea: having their lore be about feasting on the leagues of votann and make short kroots (skroots)

[thin ibex]

skroots is the cursed name idea

[sweet solar]

voots is better?

[thin ibex]

i do wonder how kroot feel about the votann cloneskein genetics

[jaunty dawn]

this is a really good comprehensive post, interesting how actually a lot of it is consistent over two decades but doesn't really seem to have been compiled and disseminated like this until more recently

[hearty relic]

that's the side-lines of Warhammer, baby!

someone please codify lost and the damned rules, please, I want to play Evil Guards

[jaunty dawn]

like the stuff from index xenos I had no idea about but makes sense cause it's just some random white dwarf excerpt

[hearty relic]

it's been...so long

Oh actually I had been meaning to ask in here since I got reminded of it and I haven't followed 40k in ages: did they do anything with the new machine minor chaos god?

I know they gave him faction stats but, beyond that

[sweet solar]

question for the chat, should a giant flying kroot have true wing feathers, or, fleshy "flap wings" like some dragon designs have (like cameron avatar dragons) to keep 100% to the kroot featherquill aesthetic

[jaunty dawn]

if you want to be true to source vulture kroot are all shown with bat type wings

[junior robin]

yeah

[jaunty dawn]

also the only kroot we've seen with six limbs

[floral herald]

Yeah one of the really good 40klore posts

Comprehensive and detailed

[sweet solar]

do we have any art of that?

[junior robin]

here

[sweet solar]

thats not explicitly an origional kroot, thats a krootmorph

[jaunty dawn]

on the other hand though kroothawks/pech'ra have four limbs, feathers and four eyes

[floral herald]

Tbf kroot can have really different biologies so having feather wings or bat wings or whatever could both happen

[sweet solar]

yeah thats why i was asking for people what their personal opinions were

[floral herald]

The kroothawk has feathers

[thin ibex]

I think feathers

[jaunty dawn]

I think it depends if you want them to be more like a dead end kroot on the level of krootox et al or an ancient revered beast that's more primal

[thin ibex]

Feathers seem more fun

[junior robin]

wow those bird feet are weirdly sculpted.

[jaunty dawn]

like krootox and hounds were once humanoid kroot but became bestial

[sweet solar]

yeah i posted em earlier, talking about how they are in my moodboard for sketches

[jaunty dawn]

kroothawks on the other hand were never a lineage of humanoid kroot, but a like common ancestor type thing

[mental birch]

Dumb idea

For

[sweet solar]

yeah reading about that rn

[mental birch]

Legion of the dammed

[sweet solar]

by the origional article not even a common ancestor

but like, the origin krootmorph that ate the orks, by the imperial xenos theorising

this doesnt mean thats TRUE

but like thats the official writing we have

[jaunty dawn]

the thing is that's kinda like

[sweet solar]

from way back in 2001

[jaunty dawn]

monkeys and humans have a common ancestor

but colloquially you say humans evolved from monkeys

[sweet solar]

half tempted to go pull isse from the boxes in storage

like, by origional lore from that article, krootox, and kroothounds ARENT morphs

and kroothawks are the origional genus, not morph, yeah

but thats been contradicted, so the full body of hte article cant be taken as lore really

media settings! aint they fun

ah tell a lie

[tired cairn]

The Imperium's choice of fungicide probably works on human cell cultures too

[sweet solar]

those werent from the 2001 article, those were from the 1st tau codex in the same year

mlao

[hearty relic]

exceptionally fun army

[mental birch]

Combi weapon veterans

Is the plan for this

[hearty relic]

nice

[mental birch]

Because like they don't exist anumore

I think

[hearty relic]

I really need to play more of the Warhams on tabletop sim just to try new armies

[mental birch]

So veterans with magical surprise were here energy

Hmmmm

[hearty relic]

I think I'm falling off the Necron playstyle of late

[thin ibex]

you can do combi weapon sternguard iirc admiral

[jaunty dawn]

I think that's just what she meant by veterans

and then referring to damned legionairres not being a thing anymore (which is correct)

[thin ibex]

ohhh

gotcha

[jaunty dawn]

lost in 10e

[upper canopy]

"Lmao need a computer to get good genes lol lmao"

Then shotguns one like a beercan

[hearty relic]

that's a vivid ass image

also utterly unrelated sidebar: huh, they added beastmen to 40k!

[upper canopy]

well, killteam

[hearty relic]

ya

[upper canopy]

and well

re-added

[hearty relic]

but that's still introducing them to the lore again which, I didn't expect

[desert jay]

That or “I guess you make do with what you got but it shows you at least care, unlike most people”

[hearty relic]

question to the more recent edition knowers: is it still possible to make a non CSM chaos army using Astra Militarum rules/models?

without having to bend things too much, that is

[upper canopy]

I mean yeah

Just use Guard and put spikes on them

If you want that supported in RULES, no

[hearty relic]

ya that was my main thing

[desert jay]

Now imagining a Kroot shaper sending some genetic samples over to the Votann so that they can integrate the “evolve by eating” too and get a good Red Queen Race going

[hearty relic]

I remembered there was a brief moment in like, 8th edition where Lost and the Damned as a white dwarf army

the idea got stuck in my head from that

[sweet solar]

yes but theres not full support to make it good at all without using SOME csm models unless you want to proxy them as something else

can you still do detachments/allies? like knight or deamons army with some chaos humans, or that also not want you want

[desert jay]

I think if you mix in predators/etc and cultists a traitor guard army is somewhat viable?

[hearty relic]

I'm not married to the idea of it solely being traitor guard but I do like the idea of just a bandit warband with guard gear

[desert jay]

A tank is a tank, sisters use rhino-chassis too

[hearty relic]

Honestly a chaos knight could be the play for that idea come to think of it

[desert jay]

(Also arbites but not on the tabletop)

[upper canopy]

If whoever you were playing was cool with it you could just treat your Guard as having the CHAOS keyword

and then you could have Chaos Knights/Daemons

[hearty relic]

This idea is entirely because I don't like marines and I find daemon designs too goofy to take seriously

but ya that'd definitely be the play for it

chaos metal gear + warband

[hearty relic]

also, this is absurd, now there's two of them

[floral herald]

I think that's most practical atm

Outside of random Blooded in CSM lists

[hearty relic]

Blooded?

[floral herald]

traitor guard KT which CSM can take

[hearty relic]

Interesting

[floral herald]

cool models

[hearty relic]

goofy ass leaders

[tepid stratus]

Yeah for what it's worth it is possible to do CSM lists that are just cultists, traitor guard and beastmen with daemon or knight filler

[pine matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/the-skeleton-appears-gif-24806632

[hearty relic]

ok he's got the energy actually

I'll probably play around with building an army list off that premise (until I inevitably cave and look to Tempetus for a Faceless Goon army)

[still warren]

if you like shields look into the imperial navy kill team, would just need to kitbash some spikes on it

[hearty relic]

I will probably do so

[floral herald]

Would require more changes but the exactio squad can have a lot of shields

[thin ibex]

Quick and dirty 0 astartes chaos army

the 700 point model has the shortest line on the grouping lol

[floral herald]

Oh I guess that's one way to fill points

I missed it lol

[thin ibex]

list really needed some big guns tbh, even riding dark pact lethal hits can only take you so far

it IS a lot o bodies on the table though

[floral herald]

yeah

[jaunty dawn]

yeah the main thing chaos guard/militia is missing is access to tanks

so proxying is just kinda better

either gsc or guard

specially since you don't really even get access to the cool things they used to get like ogryn zerkers

[junior robin]

...would a leman russ without side sponsons be to big to count as a hellbrute?

[floral herald]

Helbrutes are pretty huge

[thin ibex]

i do think just running normal guard with the normal guard detachment and changing imperium to chaos on their keywords would do the trick

though might lack a little bit of the more scrungly chaotic elements

[hearty relic]

I'd probably give it more of a guardsman to cultist ratio for personal aesthetics, but that list does fuck

[hearty relic]

and ya but I'm weird and like the more menacing less scrungly chaos stuff

the knight being the main Guns is something I like though, I need an excuse to use knights

[thin ibex]

the main thing is guardsmen arent battleline so i could only bring 3

wouldve brought more if i couldve

[hearty relic]

Ah

pain

[thin ibex]

but you can also field guardsmen as "cultists"

[hearty relic]

ya I'd probably just distinguish between the "cultist" guardsman chaff and the original Guardsman-Guardsmen elites

I say all this as if I'd be able to afford this full list, but a man can dream

a dream to deploy in the tabletop sim though

[desert jay]

I feel like rhinos and predators and vindicators should be fine

It’s not like you’re talking a helbrute

[jaunty dawn]

I mean mechanically speaking yes

but like

if you had an existing renegade army

you can't field leman russes and malcadors in csm

[past sphinx]

My boy Gor halfhorn erasure

[hearty relic]

look I knew they had vaguely been A Thing I meant more as a fully faction

I've been hearing the "Beastmen in 40k as Mutants Real in [timeframe?]" for several years lol

[past sphinx]

Gods perfect man

[hearty relic]

quite a good beastman

[past sphinx]

Hell we had squats in munda like a decade before votann but people seemed to not think they existed anymore

[hearty relic]

it's because GW really likes, just, hiding shit

[jaunty dawn]

uh

grendl grendlsen only came out in 2020

wait

not 2020

sometime in 18

and then squat ammo jack in 19

as far as n17 is concerned

wait actually hang on

they had a video for it

did they delete it? annoying

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oc0-8BBkkq4

just unlisted

[past sphinx]

Munda 98 sorry

Old ass ass cardboard terrain munda

[jaunty dawn]

fair

but like

that's cause necromunda never got updated to remove them lol

they were still just straight up around back then

[solemn gull]

Munda mentioned

[jaunty dawn]

the last classic munda book was 2003 while the real death knell for squats iirc was 4th edition releasing without them having got a codex, in 2004

and even that book was mostly just a reprint

ah no I did misremember, it was 3rd edition that killed squats

[bold halo]

yeah they got squatted real early

[jaunty dawn]

tbf necromunda 2nd edition might not've mentioned squats either

it didn't seem to get much content

as far as I can tell squats in munda were from a white dwarf for 1st edition (which originally came out '95)

https://files.sigil.biz/data/gw_04_hi_ho_squat_miner_gangs.pdf can't find what wd its from though

maybe not even white dwarf, maybe gang war

sorry if it seems like I'm blowing up at an off hand comment that's not my intention I'm just fixating on finding this weird chronology haha

[floral herald]

nah I get it GW archeology is fun

I started doing the same thing with the Kroot Timeline but someone on reddit had done like literally all the legwork lol

[pastel rampart]

Possibly Fanatic.

[floral herald]

I really dig this oil paint style for the HH books

(Neil Roberts, this is a redux of the false gods cover)

[pine matrix]

Sons of Horus have a real nice colour scheme

[upper canopy]

imagine if this was how they fought in canon

how easy it'd be to inflict mass casualties

[thin ibex]

Just a fucking huge mass of dudes

No spacing, no overwatch

AstartesTide

[floral herald]

I like how they're dropping drop pods behind the line of advance

[bold halo]

all you hear is power armor rattling as they jostle each other like a truck full of bottles

[upper canopy]

trips one guy

massive dominos

[thin ibex]

The short marines just getting carried along by the larger bodies pressing around em

[past sphinx]

I could've sworn they had an option but that very well was likely proxied orlocks it was after all 20 year ago

[brittle salmon]

ironfire moment

:)

[thin ibex]

hmm

im shot for army ideas today to fill my boredoml ol

could try and do another go at a triarch army

but there aren't THAT many triarch units

[jaunty dawn]

have you done a canoptek one?

[thin ibex]

oh no i havent recently no

[jaunty dawn]

or fortification space marines. hammerfall and firestrike turrets

[thin ibex]

i know they're all like... meta, but we know i have no plans to make it meta, so yeah lets do that

cryptek army lesgo

[jaunty dawn]

devastators in trenches

oh I hadnt seen the canoptek detachment. this is pretty cool

[thin ibex]

yeah very similar to the daemonic warp storm thingy

territory control benefits

Boom, first attempt to have like a full counsel of crypteks pushing an automated defense system

psychomancer is riding with the 10 tesla immortals

[jaunty dawn]

nicee

[thin ibex]

i am vibing with the 8 attack per wraith thing with the coils

no ap

and str 5

but its just like

vomiting out volume attacks for benefit

i did realize that a canoptek spider might not be bad in a teleporting monolith list

or a doomsday ark firing line lsit

list*

[thin ibex]

Funniest thing to me still is the image of 6 firestrike servo turrent office chair scooting across the battlefield

i wonder if Defensive Array means i can triple overwatch with all the hammerfalls at the same time

[jaunty dawn]

I believe so yes

[thin ibex]

huhhhh

might be better to run em all as heavy bolters then lol

you know the hammerfalls aren't BAD on their own merit, but definitely overcosted

they hand out cover, they have decent weapons, are T12, have an in built -1 to hit against non-pistol weapons for some reasons, and a free overwatch

[jaunty dawn]

someone was running 3 as a meme but doing fairly alright

[thin ibex]

T12 roadblock is definitely no joke

[dense sedge]

Lost and the damned are cool

[valid brook]

Their old army list was in Codex: Eye of Terror, I think?

I played against a LatD army exactly once back then and it was “literally who?”

[pastel rampart]

Yeah it first cropped up in EoT, then they got a Forgeworld list.

[valid brook]

Imperial Armor Volume Five my beloved

[crisp lance]

https://youtu.be/iKy19OGn6_k

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/IndianaComics/status/1754504427824693740

[untold swallow]

weird question; is a normal human-sized eviscerator i.e. those wielded by Sisters Repentia a normal chainsword for an astartes, or are those separate weapons?

[pastel rampart]

Separate weapons.

[brittle salmon]

Yeah Eviscerators have actual differences in construction

They incorporate a low level power field to saw through armour

[pastel rampart]

They're two-handed chainfists, basically.

[thin ibex]

Oh huh I thought they were just made with better teeth and motors

[upper canopy]

Nope

They're also obviously weightier

A zweihander is still not really a one handed sword for someone really big

[pulsar cairn]

ya know

in some animations/stories

power armor doesn't feel very powery

[jaunty dawn]

imperial guard camo cloak? like some kind of ghillie adjacent thing

[quaint compass]

new ratlings 🥺

[jaunty dawn]

likely!

[unreal cosmos]

that kinda looks like a melta bomb in the corner

[jaunty dawn]

agreed

[pulsar cairn]

i see bellybutton

[thin ibex]

I feel like imp guard might be able to do plasma spam better than DA

Except that they can't bring hellblasters

But they got so many more heavy plasma

[jaunty dawn]

oh for sure

[jaunty dawn]

hehe

[thin ibex]

Man I've always been a fan of the storm blade, but it's current rules do not at all support it being a sub in for a shadowsword

Max str 10 per shot

[jaunty dawn]

ghoost marinees

[mental birch]

Spooky sternguard veterans

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/MeU_317/status/1754706747066134589

[naive abyss]

Ngl if new ratlings come alongside more plastic krieg it'll be hilarious to me lol

And I mean that in the best way possible

[thin ibex]

honestly, a ratling kill team would rock

[jaunty dawn]

abhuman squad

ogryn, ratling

felinids

[thin ibex]

i do wonder how they'd balance such a low survivability team

[pastel rampart]

Sheer numbers, obviously.

30 ratling killteam lets goooo

[thin ibex]

lol

honestly i was thinking conceal interactions and a lot of free movement

like an 8 or 12 man KT with a lot cool conceal interactions and free movement

[pastel rampart]

They gotta have some sort of food/cooking mechanic.

[thin ibex]

would prooobably not have every single one of them with a sniper rifle, diversify their set up a bit

have a guy with two stub pistols

nother ratling with a grenade bandolier

[pastel rampart]

Got one guy with a single shitty, rusty knife and a Rambo headband.

[thin ibex]

i forget do ratlings use longlas or solid shot snipers

[bright dove]

Yes

[thin ibex]

oh both then?

[bright dove]

Depends largely on what's available

[thin ibex]

Blam

thats a lot of ogryn meat

[bright dove]

Abhumans!

[glossy vapor]

maybe better as a reddit post, but i was wondering, how does admech navigate the contradiction of opposing AI and non-human intelligences, while still modifying their own mind heavily with augmentations?

[thin ibex]

probably through philosophically or ideologically dividing the two concepts such that there is no overlap in their view

something something modifying an existing intelligence to be superior is not the same as creating an intelligence externally in a machine

they also find no major issue with the concept of machine spirits despite the blanket opposition to AI

so they have some robust organizational and ideological rationales

[naive abyss]

Random but I wonder how like comprehensive the rumored krieg plastic range is gonna be

[glossy vapor]

that makes sense "the flame of the human mind is meant to be fed and stoked, not extinguished" or something like that.

[floral herald]

So, iirc the prohibition on AI is derived from Abominable Intelligence being an intelligence without a soul

So augmented human intelligence is ensoulled intelligence not Abominable Intelligence

This is also why machine spirits are ok

[tired cairn]

Did they just categorically decide machine spirits have souls or is there another addition here?

Or are they generally not intelligent enough?

[upper canopy]

Machine Spirits fluctuate between being "alive" and not

[floral herald]

Machine spirit covers everything from “we are superstitious” to “there’s a bear’s brain in a jar in here and it handles the drive by wire system”

[jaunty dawn]

ye

a 555 timer circuit hooked up to blink an led would probably be considered as having a machine spirit of blinking

[floral herald]

It’s like a little house for the spirit of timing

[mental birch]

Not sure how to paint the rest of the

Skeleton marines

[soft willow]

Praise the Omnissiah for his regular blinks.

[spice flicker]

Thoughts on this unending swarm tyranid list? I know that US wants to just flood the board with bodies but I also wanted to include some heavier hitting stuff as well since gaunts punch like they're hitting you with wet pool noodles. I also am toying with replacing the neurotyrant with a lictor + 1x11 neurogaunts or some other 105-110 point combination but overall what do you think? (besides jokingly saying i need more gaunts)

https://pastebin.com/hnhWDVEd

[thin ibex]

something i personally think about with US is how they encourage bottling your opponent into their DZ

by aggressively establishing map control

so the main thing is having other stuff to get onto the objectives

its totally sensible to also bring some big nid guns to deal with hard targets

id consider though zoanthropes perhaps

[spice flicker]

I did consider that.

I do plan on having the neurogaunts try and screen the deployment area in case of deepstrike/reserves as well as gamble on them surviving enough hits to flood the home objective with OC1 bodies if an enemy sneaks it from me. If I don't have to worry about that I might use them to chain across the field a synapse area.

Gargoyles will be trying to soar across the field and limit movement if possible.

Replace neurotyrant with zoanthropes or do something else?

[thin ibex]

i think the main reason id consider the zoans over the tyranno, or just having zoans in general is the invuln aura, can make big horde blobs surprisingly annoying to deal with

[jaunty dawn]

thought you were talking about the usa for a second

[spice flicker]

UST means Unending Swarm - Tyranids or United States of Tyranids depending on who you ask.

Also aren't American Tyranids just the Arachnids from Starship Troopers or the Zerg?

[jaunty dawn]

american tyranids are red skin white carapace blue greebles

NO WAIT

white skin with red extremeties, blue carapace with a fading white star pattern

[spice flicker]

Ehh too detailed for me on that 2nd one

But back on topic the tyrannofex might be worth replacing?

[pastel rampart]

https://underthedice.com/2024/02/05/alls-quiet-in-western-mass-post-utd-fest/ In other, wilder news: there was a Mordheim tournament like last week not far from me that had 89 people show up, which is quite frankly insane.

[spice flicker]

With tyrannofex now being 190 points that'll leave 85 remaining if I swap it for one trio of zoans

[floral herald]

That’s wild

[pastel rampart]

https://www.cupboardofshame.com/blog-1/nemo They even got a guy all the way from the UK to show up, which is also kinda wild.

I had no idea this was going on, mind.

[unreal cosmos]

Is Oops All Warhounds OP at the moment? I gotta say I like the flavor factor

[jaunty dawn]

war dogs?

warhound is 1100 pts haha

I think all war dogs in chaos knights is the preferred way of running them competetively but they aren't doing too hot in general? afaik

[thin ibex]

oops all warhounds is a true distillation of trusting your dice

every warhound brings twin turbos

[unreal cosmos]

War dogs yeah lol

[jaunty dawn]

one could do warhound And war dogs tbf

[unreal cosmos]

I think the knight/mini-knight dynamic is cool but as a variation of that, I really like the thought of renegade mini-knights being more willing to run off and do their own thing

[jaunty dawn]

you can go completely mini knights unlike imperial

cause one of them is a character so you can get a warlord

[unreal cosmos]

Yeah, I dig that

It seems like a great formula for some Your Guys energy. Have a dozen or so scrappy pilots

[upper canopy]

Battletech

[thin ibex]

hmm i wonder if a 3k battle with knights and a titan would be doable

or jsut not enough

[jaunty dawn]

points don't really let you fit enhancements cleanly but you can basically do a one of each war dog list in 900 points

[mental birch]

Painful to play against if you don't gave the gun

Ability yo bring them down

[thin ibex]

oops all warhounds in 2k is like.. 1 warhound xD

but yeah full war dogs is the premier way to play for chaos knights in comp i think

sometimes with 1 or 2 bigger knights, but otherwise big mobs of dogs

[past sphinx]

Armigers are yhe perfect chassis for being to big for infantry and to numerous for antitank to knock out fast

[hearty relic]

the name

god

Knights do seem like the most easily Your Dudes'd army type

especially with that roster that thing's Hilarious

[thin ibex]

thats honestly my biggest attraction to knights

not optimizing

but building my own knight house

with my own heroes n shit

that always competes with my general dislike of being a str check on armies kinda

[unreal cosmos]

I hate having a fiddly handful of points left over lol. But yeah I'd be pretty tempted by something like that

[thin ibex]

like i love the idea of knights, i dislike the idea of having my knights be frustrating "did you bring enough AT" check on my opponent

i suppose objectives are the middle ground, but its a bad feels to me in a casual setting

[hearty relic]

ya that's fair

I never had to worry about punching armor, I played Necrons before

I do feel like Knights are a little too "save or suck" as it were in a lot of ways (either the enemy can't punch the armor and they lose, or they can and it's hard to survive)

[thin ibex]

i tried fielding a reaver

but then there was no room for anything

[hearty relic]

god these titles

that's quite good

also what Roster Maker does everyone use

I remember hearing Battlescribe had some Issues a while ago

[thin ibex]

here we go

Oh I use www.newrecruit.eu

[hearty relic]

oh this is Crusty (positive) this fucks

[hearty relic]

I fucking love army builders without bells and whistles this is perfect

[thin ibex]

why does the reaver have a fist? because there are 4 models in this 3k point army

he's gonna get into melee

[hearty relic]

ya lmao

the pain of small armies, EVERYONE must be ready

[thin ibex]

hmm, reaver feet ARE str 12 already

maybe he can ge away with 2 guns

just bring the gatling blaster so he can shoot that in melee

[pastel rampart]

Also because power fists rule.

Just slug a motherfucker with a fist the size of a Buick.

[spice flicker]

I wonder if they ever do one of those boxes where it's two factions going against one another (like the csm vs dark angels or the leviathan box) but for knights and a 2nd faction, what might be a good opponent? I know the obvious choice is IK vs CK but outside that mirror match what do you think could be an interesting pairing?

[thin ibex]

refresh on Aeldari wraithknights to be cool maybe

or orkish stompas/nauts

honestly knights v orks box would be pretty cool

also knights v nids

[floral herald]

GSC is a fun thematic pairing

noble knights vs the "peasant rebellion" faction

[jaunty dawn]

they've done ad mech vs necrons and knight vs knight

[thin ibex]

i wonder who could go for a bit of extra hype that hasnt so far

maybe chaos?

knights v csm

[junior robin]

thats a lot of destroyers.

[desert jay]

Chaos Knight vs Grey Knight box

[thin ibex]

annihilation legion, main idea is to get as many things below half hp as possible, then get really easy big charges in

[hearty relic]

flayed ones flayed ones flayed ones

favourite unit

[junior robin]

finally a way to get rid of all that extra dreadknight stock

[thin ibex]

apparently combo'd with the stratagems in annihilation legion, flayed ones are actually hella scary

[thin ibex]

just melt em down for their plastic, wipe it from the record and release something cooler

[hearty relic]

God Bless

is the Flayed One Necron dynasty still a thing?

[thin ibex]

necron dynasties arent a thing mechanically anymore

[hearty relic]

Oh

Interesting

I'll miss that the lore of the Flayed-One dynasty was kinda cool

[spice flicker]

Have you considered doing hypercrypt with that list so that you can teleport around giving the destroyers easier charges and firing angles potentially?

[junior robin]

that made me realise chances are big we wont get legion specific detatchments for csm

[spice flicker]

I mean SM didnt

[hearty relic]

there is a mysterious push to make legions their own faction so

ya

[thin ibex]

sm got legion themed ones rather than legion specific ones

id expect similar out of csm

i.e. anyone can use, but they're somewhat oriented or themed around a legion

[spice flicker]

I have a feeling the WB themed one will be centered on possessed and/or cultists.

[thin ibex]

see the thing is if i went hypercrypt

id have to ask

where the hell is my monolith

or my monoliths

[spice flicker]

It's off the field providing long range support

[thin ibex]

non negotiable, any necron army i make thats hypercrypt has to have a monolith

too iconic to deny

honestly irl if i ever played necrons

[spice flicker]

You don't need monoliths to take advantage of their pseudo grey knight ability.

[thin ibex]

id consider a monolith mandatory for me

[hearty relic]

ya

Monoliths made me pick Necrons first but then I, didn't buy one

[thin ibex]

oh i know, but you do need monoliths to make use of their monolith only stratagems

[hearty relic]

how much is a monolith in Cash now

it was like a clean 100 bones (Canadian) when I last checked

[junior robin]

$220 canadian now

[hearty relic]

jesus christ

[thin ibex]

the newer monolith is bigger than the old

with more details iirc

[hearty relic]

makes sense I guess

if that's the case

but still Wow

[thin ibex]

i believe dis is what it looks like now

[spice flicker]

I understand and is the reason I grudgingly respect but don't like "dog park" lists as a knights enjoyer. I know mechanically all war dogs is better but I came for the big guys and I plan on using them.

[thin ibex]

oh huh, maybe they aren't bigger

[thin ibex]

see i respect this and is absolutely what id do too, I don't play knights to play only their smallest guys

also though, for necrons, the monolith is apparently competetive with the hypercrypt iirc

[desert jay]

Good news the big boys got their points slashed in the dataslate

[thin ibex]

heck i think the old one might actually be bigger, but less detail

[spice flicker]

I mean I might do a dog park list for a crusade at the start or a small 1k points game but the full knights are where my joy in knights lie.

[desert jay]

A 5-knight list is technically possible, but you’re probably better with like 3-4 and then 2-5 dogs

[spice flicker]

We can potentially do 3/5 now actually

IK list I am toying with at 2000 points:

Atrapos
Errant
Paladin
2x helverin
3x warglaive

Errant only being 5 points more than the gallant is crazy

The list might struggle against infantry blobs but against vehicles I think it wouldn't be half bad.

[thin ibex]

[unreal cosmos]

Yeah 2k dog park would probably get kind of unwieldy to play anyway. 1k suits the underdog vibes, no pun intended

[spice flicker]

How many lists will remain?

[thin ibex]

im not sure, tbh i could prolly wipe all of em

[spice flicker]

Why the purge?

[thin ibex]

havent actually done it

but also its not like im revisiting the lists much

also silly list here, firm gunline vibes

i think it could be refined if i added shadowsun and darktide

with some pathfinders

but i needed some turn 2 strike capability

thats ride

thats right!

tidewalls

4 of em

it a bit of a shame that the fireblade's ability doesn't do anything while they're loaded onto the rig

[spice flicker]

Need more tide walls

[sweet solar]

those fortifications
beautiful
doing dorn proud

the best offense is a wall

[spice flicker]

If only actual imperial fists could use those.

[thin ibex]

the best bit is all those walls have move speeds

[spice flicker]

How does the supremacy railgun compare to the other railguns used by the tau?

[thin ibex]

its a beefy as fuck railgun but uh

shoots at a 5+

with 1 shot

so its proooobably not gonna do anything

but if it does

it does a lot

i just love the image of an entire tau gunline moving 4 inches at a time

forward

[spice flicker]

AP-5 is nothing to sneeze at for certain.

[thin ibex]

minimum 7 damage

[spice flicker]

With devastating wounds

Toughness 8 seems decent but could be better.

[jaunty dawn]

kinda weird

they didn't give it a rule for being manned

but then empty chimeras can shoot lasguns now so

[thin ibex]

Today has turned into fortification day

though i could probably not use the fortress of redemption and instead plop down some bastions

and more aegis lines

[spice flicker]

Don't forget the baneblades provide mobile cover

[crisp lance]

https://fxtwitter.com/Mick19988/status/1754840031427219924

[pulsar holly]

https://youtu.be/BRU37-PHZQE

[naive abyss]

this reminds me that i hope we get at least one of the undivided daemon primarchs in 40k

considering they bot are my fave traitor legions probably lol

[bright dove]

Hey, I need help budgeting for my Slaves of Darkness Army. Any advice? 😛

[crisp lance]

https://fxtwitter.com/Mick19988/status/1754937118709973308/photo/1

[uneven ember]

https://vxtwitter.com/MikeBrooks668/status/1754984867618546065

[ebon forge]

Ah yes, when the Space Wolf turns to Khorne

[crisp lance]

https://fxtwitter.com/Lulu66080475/status/1754993213570478579

[unreal cosmos]

Looking good!

[jaunty dawn]

nice!!!

[untold swallow]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Sigmarxism/comments/1ak71wy/sister_sappho_and_her_admec_friend/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

[jaunty dawn]

too true

[solemn gull]

Is it true they are going to make a show?

[jaunty dawn]

warhammer in general?

yeah henry cavill is producing a show with amazon or something

[solemn gull]

Interesting

Weird to see but I guess it already happened with a few other franchises so it could definitely succeed

[naive abyss]

I mean also shows already exist

Like there's multiple official animated short series/anthologies at this point lol

[jaunty dawn]

mm

[solemn gull]

Well yeah but this just feels more significant

A amazon/netflix show

[pastel rampart]

Live-action too, which aside from commercials and video games hasn't been done.

[solemn gull]

There are a few great examples of this type of transition to tv such as The Expanse or Arcane

[pulsar cairn]

u think Khorne is jealous that the emperor has so many skulls?

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/cnmbwjx/status/1755229691290791991

[solemn gull]

Not really since they aren’t trophies

[pulsar cairn]

tru

it would be really cool to see khorne servo skulls tho

they go around with bunch of saws and cutting stuff to extract your skull

[pastel rampart]

Khorne techmarine is something I don't think I've ever seen, actually.

[thin ibex]

they DO technically have machines so it make some kinda sense

[pulsar cairn]

technology ain't sorcery so it's allowed

[bright dove]

They probably just employ Dark Mechanicus

[thin ibex]

i feel like some level of capacity to manage their own motorpool is a must

[pastel rampart]

Techmarine who falls to chaos, gets pulled into a Khornate cult and still has his wits about him but the dude really really REALLY likes chain weapons and keeps making more elaborately insane designs.

[bright dove]

Some of the warbands probably do

[thin ibex]

you just end up with rhino's with arrays of impaling spikes on the front with barbs on em

and like knives coming the sides

[bright dove]

I have that tank right now