Warhammer and Such

[untold swallow]

fairs

'lol you fuckin hate me but can't deny I'm the one who saved you' is a fave thing of mine

[dense sedge]

it's also the link of transition between drukhari and aeldari for some, a way to see if the grass is truly greener on the other side

[untold swallow]

being a corsair?

There are drukhari corsairs?

[dense sedge]

they trade with drukhari and drukhari will often use them as mercenaries

[floral herald]

They're sort of their own society but they take drukhari

[untold swallow]

ah all right

[floral herald]

Eldar can cross between the different groups but generally find it hard because they're so different

[uneven ember]

Although Drukhari are pretty piratical anyway.

[dense sedge]

also, the fact that durkhari and craftworlders historically don't get along, mostly form the drukhari side though tbh

[floral herald]

Yeah they're not that friendly but relatively cool with one another for rival 40k factions

[uneven ember]

I do remember that back when, what, 5th? had its Big Table Of Buddy on it
CEldar and DEldar got to be Battle Brothers, the same level of compatibility as Space Marines and Guard

[floral herald]

I think that was 6th but yeah

Eldar soup was super allowed and iirc fairly strong

[uneven ember]

right 6th

[untold swallow]

oh wow the tau rely on vehicles a lot

[uneven ember]

So, if you were Desperate Allies you'd want to keep your units 6" apart, if you were Allies of Convenience you could move around but couldn't really interact, and if you were Battle Brothers your characters could join each other's squads and you counted as part of the same army for powers and whatnot. Craftworld Eldar and Dark Eldar were Battle Brothers.

[uneven ember]

& really it's not even like there's special animosity there.
Craftworlders aren't like "ABOMINATION," they just don't want to get, y'know, subjected to Drukhari Playtime, which is a perfectly reasonable response to being near a Drukhari

While yeah the Drukhari will kidnap Craftworlders and subject them to torment to leave them broken and begging for swift death that woon't come, but again, that's not any special animosity that's just their Thing

[upper canopy]

Eldar's the only species that has like

regular cross-factional drift

[uneven ember]

tru

[floral herald]

At least in both directions

There is the SM to CSM pipeline :p

[upper canopy]

I said drift not cliff

[uneven ember]

Oldheads see someone run off to be a Corsair and pillage space and just go "give it two or three centuries, she'll be back, but... ah, to be young again"

[runic swallow]

Yeah, the cliff to the Cool Zone

[uneven ember]

"We're gonna lead you down the path that rocks"

[upper canopy]

Meanwhile CW Eldar will be like "Brb heading over to Comorrogh before college to see what the fuss is about"

walks into Webway portal and comes out covered in lipstick marks and stab wounds

[untold swallow]

t'au pirates be like

ignore the size limit, I fucked up

[mental birch]

Their special rule is being able to be a cheaper 5 man unit

Iirc the taudar alliance was duuumb

[pulsar cairn]

ya think Plague Marines make gifts for Nurglins?

[ebon forge]

100%

If you read the Death Guard book you can see they have a special appreciation for Nurglings

[pulsar cairn]

heh, was just imagining a plague marine dressed as Santa Claus but plaguey distributing a bunch of gifts for the Nurglins

[ebon forge]

The other Chaos Gods need to step up their game and make a chibi daemon to follow thier cultists around like the Nurglings does

Tzeench needs to invest in birds of smaller scale

[pulsar cairn]

@indigo wadi

Khornilings are tiny gremlins with knives

[ebon forge]

'Reaching the kitchen he found it deserted, the smell of woodsmoke and the delicious aromas of all his favourite foods rising from the pans simmering on the stove. Roasted xorncob, boiled derna beans, alpaca stew(...)"

Alpacas survived in the 40k Millenium, there is still some happiness

[bitter mortar]

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLWbYF4Di5svjSettgIaDXrSQxdSbbu6z4

sharing a channel I found which does really nicely animated stop motion fights

action figures slapping each other about

platonic 40k

[pine matrix]

Voy now I gotta actually finish the path trilogy, I only read Warrior but I loved it

Honestly made me want more alien pov books because it ruled so hard

[ebon forge]

Oh nice, I started 15 hours.
Been hitting hard so far

[pine matrix]

I totally forgot he becomes a Striking Scorpion because he's mad someone looked at his not-gf

[ebon forge]

WHAT

[pine matrix]

Sorry I just realised Voy was talking about this last night not an hour or two ago lmao

[naive abyss]

Yes imo

And it's rather easily supported in fluff

Considering some kin already do shit like whaling for tyranids lol

[mental birch]

Dumb idea I had

Kroot Devilfish using lile

Well skiff and 'devilfish'

Using deldar stuff

[naive abyss]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/18yqrg7/decided_to_create_a_new_necron_unit_hope_you_like/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

[ebon forge]

sick!

[thin ibex]

I do wonder if tau privateers are a thing.

State mandated harassment and piracy

Their navy is fairly weak when it comes to boarding and 1 to 1 engagement so I imagine probably not

[unreal cosmos]

I bet Kroot do it

[naive abyss]

In theory we sorta know they do with that killteam existing

[jaunty dawn]

there is an xv4 boarding suit

[thin ibex]

Would love to see it, I do wonder what role it could take at the table

Without eclipsing something else

[jaunty dawn]

could have the stealth suit's meq profile

drop the defensive stealth stuff, up gun a bit maybe

[thin ibex]

Maybe an inceptor style stealth suit

[jaunty dawn]

could be like a super breacher almost

upscaled pulse blaster

but without the oc or devilfish synergy

[thin ibex]

That'd be the thing I was concerned about tbh. "Better breachers in Battlesuits" would kinda step in breacher toes a bit no?

[jaunty dawn]

also without fireblade synergy

probably less firepower overall cause it could be like 3x2 pulse blasters vs 10 breachers

obv they shouldn't be better overall

different special ability ofc

maybe deep strike + the inceptor style rule to deep strike 3"

it would be cool though to have some synergy with breachers so they complement each other

40mm base t4 3w is a midpoint between xv2 and xv8

[quaint compass]

breachers for taking objectives, boarding suits for holding objectives

[thin ibex]

Yeah it would be neat if they thematically work closely together

Maybe a similar relationship to the invader and outslriders

Or phobos and invictors

[ebon forge]

(Guardsman gonna land on a place full of Orks)

'Chaff activated. Instruments reading chaff successfully deployed,’ Zil said,
his voice growing suddenly hoarse as he looked at one of the screens before him.
‘Wait. The chaff, it’s not done any good. It’s as though… Holy Emperor! None
of the hostile missiles have guidance systems!’
‘What do you mean?’ the pilot asked as he saw Zil’s face go pale. ‘If that’s
the case we have nothing to worry about. If they’re firing blind there’s not one
chance in a thousand of them being able to hit us.’
‘But that’s exactly it,’ said Zil, his voice frantic. ‘I’m reading a thousand
hostile missiles as airborne already. And hundreds more are being launched
every second. Holy Throne! We’re flying into the biggest shitstorm I’ve ever
seen!’

I love Orks so fucking much

No guiding system?
No problem
Just make your enemy play Touhou against you

[thin ibex]

When I build ork lists I often find myself just saturating with rokkits

[jaunty dawn]

must've not had enough spare grots

[ebon forge]

Grot only army

[mental birch]

Grot revolution

The red gobbo

[ebon forge]

It is on my 'to read' list

[ebon forge]

So many anti-vehicle rokkits you made your opponent regret putting anything mechanical on his army list

[solemn gull]

Guy probably kept a personal diary in the monologues of different characters

[thin ibex]

I just love the mental image of 2 out of 3 rokkits just corkscrewing way off target

And applying that ratio to like 50 rokkits

[jaunty dawn]

battlewagon with 4 rokkit launchas filled with tankbustas 😌

[thin ibex]

i wish i felt like the zzap cannon was a more worthwhile trade compared to the kannons

[bright dove]

It gives you a reason to make zap sound effects

[pastel rampart]

https://tenor.com/view/macross-missiles-itano-circus-missile-barrage-mecha-gif-24987157

[thin ibex]

orkish rokkiteers aim in a direction, not at a target, is my take

[quaint compass]

They work in degrees, such as 90, 180, 360, and so on

Single digits are harder for orkz to work with, because the fingers of their mind are a bit too broad to turn them around without breaking them

[ebon forge]

Ork too great for small numbaz

[quaint compass]

An ork working with small numbers would be like a whale going out of their way to hunt a single krill

Not impossible, but it's just muckin' about

[ebon forge]

A Kangaroo can walk, sure
but is much easier to jump

[thin ibex]

hit big or miss big, lets goooo

[naive abyss]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/01/11/celebrate-warhammer-the-old-world-with-a-limited-edition-box-of-exclusive-merch/

I want that blanket...but not for a 160 bucks...

[thin ibex]

incidentally, I actually think this list could work; though it lacks bodies to hold objectives

though by work i don't mean work well

[naive abyss]

https://www.reddit.com/r/theunforgiven/s/R0pKUCmLpe

I love this

[ebon forge]

The lion sanctionated fae

[naive abyss]

Shadow Watcher Money Gang

-Sponsored by The Lion-

[ebon forge]

Legalize Warp bombs?

[naive abyss]

It'd probably be those time bombs they have lol

[ebon forge]

They have what now

[floral herald]

One of the DA fliers has a stasis bomb for live capture

Oh wait the DA bomb is just a temporal stun grenade

[thin ibex]

Silly RG Air Assault phobos force

wish invictors were "dreadnoughts"

for rules purposes

[untold swallow]

we enjoy air assault forces

[thin ibex]

i wonder if stormravens with wulfen dreads hanging off the back would be cool

blood angels being able to put librarian dreads on the back is cool too

im sure my obsession with self contained stormraven mobile assault forces will wane eventually

but they just seem pretty sick atm

I think my like platonic ideal would be small scale Raptors task teams made up of phobos soldiers loaded up on a stormraven with a dedicated invictor

but otherwise a redemptor or a normal dread to get that reroll aura

or like... a space wolves hunting party

probably just do 2 squads of grey hunters

and maybe a venerable dread

bring a wolf priest and a wolf guard leader

[dense sedge]

Ooh, nice

[thin ibex]

Back to GK roots, surprisingly one of the easiest ways to access a number of lascannons

[thin ibex]

aaand

grey hunters are one of my all time favorite units in general

basic marine with chainswords across the whole squad

so they're no slouch in melee or at range

[jaunty dawn]

they're cool yeah

[quaint compass]

Imperials.png

[jaunty dawn]

used to get counter attack and shoot their bolters like pistols

[pulsar cairn]

have the same ammount of loyalist and traitor primarchs die?
counting Alpharius
so Alphy, Horus and uuuhhhh
konrad

[thin ibex]

I'd actually bought my space wolvs back when pistols were also close combat weapons, so a couple of my blood claws are just dual wielding pistols xD

i also like how grey hunters have built in fall back and shoot, so they can move, shoot, charge, fall back, shoot; giving them a whole lot of potential uptime assuming they don't die in the fight phase

[jaunty dawn]

gonna post this here too cause not everyone is in #1171221956775907408

[wintry mist]

same...

why did I say same

[thin ibex]

eyy briefcase chic

got places to be, get out of the way

[jaunty dawn]

:)

[thin ibex]

honestly i like the apoc biologis a lot

just a cool looking dude

also makes sense to put an apoc in heavy armor

[jaunty dawn]

I like how it adds variety to the apothecarion too

like they're not just the healbots

[thin ibex]

weirdly, space wolves can bring one despite not having apothecaries xD

yeah he's very businesslike

[wintry mist]

on loan from another chapter

[jaunty dawn]

it inspired me to make my sternguard like militant members of the apothercarion to be like these guys don't just shoot special ammo they help make it in the first place

[thin ibex]

gravis apoc be like "aim for the knees"

[wintry mist]

they're like navy corpsmen

[thin ibex]

normal apoc be like "i gotchu bro"

[jaunty dawn]

and cause the white helmet and shoulder trim is too good looking to not do

[ebon forge]

Nicely done! White is not easy to use and you used well

[jaunty dawn]

thank you!!

[thin ibex]

i do find the idea of replacing every instance of Brother with Bro or Bruh for space marines surprisingly amusing

[jaunty dawn]

low gothic translation matrix

[floral herald]

“Buddy” is really funny

[wintry mist]

or the alternative

[thin ibex]

Battle Bruh

[wintry mist]

an apothecary going "I have got you, brother!"

[thin ibex]

Change GK brotherhoods to GK Frat houses

[wintry mist]

increasingly verbose space marines

[thin ibex]

Bro-Captain

[still warren]

Captain Bro-Inidas the codex does not condone your gnarly actions

[thin ibex]

entire chapter of space marines who speak like the hockey players from letterkenny

[naive abyss]

https://vxtwitter.com/JuanGomez_Tahur/status/1688950699135053830?t=tqHb5J-TdVmzOephkGKQ1w&s=19

[jaunty dawn]

spoopy

[ebon forge]

Good spoop

[dense sedge]

What’s the black library in lore again?

[upper canopy]

The greatest repository of knowledge the Eldar have

Hidden in the Webway and guarded by Ceogorach and the Harlequins

[thin ibex]

supposedly it has information on pretty much everything

including loads of stuff the eldar themselves have forgotten

ahriman is convinced it has the key info needed to un-dust his legion iirc, and he's probably right

its wild that two seperate inquisitors have managed to get in

and one even stole from it

theres apparently also, beyond the harlequins, a group of various aeldari fully and totally dedicated to maintaining the place

[bright dove]

Path of the Librarian :p

[soft willow]

Pretty much any time you need a knowledge based mcguffin the Black Library is it.

[rocky shale]

Considering that yvraine is able to undust some rubrics, yeah

[thin ibex]

i think they even got a book of magnus

and apparently a prophecy written by ceogorach was revealed when the maledictum opened up

[upper canopy]

Also apparently Ahriman just broke into the Black Library in a footnote in a book recently

I think it was the last Eldar codex

which is really just kinda dogshit all around if true

[floral herald]

wild

[soft willow]

Least secure secret library in the Webway.

[dense sedge]

Hard to guard it when the guardians aren’t fan favourite money hoses

[thin ibex]

i think in one of the recent dexes or books ahriman had gathered a monumental assault that coincided with the cicatric maledictum going off; mounted a full scale assault on the black library, but was ultimately repelled

i think, possibly, he managed to get in briefl during that fight

also a portion of the library seems to have been lost to chaos with the opening of the maledictum

[dense sedge]

No, not all the knowledge

[floral herald]

Oh my god its real

[dense sedge]

That should’ve been a book

[upper canopy]

It's literally the culmination of his entire storyline

and it's a sentence

[floral herald]

Yeah bizarre

[upper canopy]

If this shit got retconned I don't think anyone would really be upset

[floral herald]

no they wouldn't

[thin ibex]

did he just get "stuff" or did he actually get something he was looking for

[upper canopy]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[thin ibex]

itd be pretty funny if isntead of the secret he wanted, he got like an eldritch and forbidden aeldari cupcake recipe

[upper canopy]

He got the cure for the Butcher's Nails.

And he's like "Well fuck this"

[dense sedge]

honestly knowing Ahriman, he probably didn't get what he actually needed or wanted

[upper canopy]

and tosses it in a hole

[tired cairn]

Huh, kind of weird the Drukhari aren't allowed in

Or are only Harlequins generally allowed admission

[floral herald]

It's mostly just Harlequins

[dense sedge]

would you trust a drukhari in a library?

I'd trust a craftworlder to treat a library with respect and care, but certainly not a cormoragh-ing(? what's the word for someone from cormoragh?)

[thin ibex]

you can be tested and allowed entrance

as a non aeldari

[tired cairn]

Yeah, but they have more of a line to the original elder empire

Though I don't know when the black library was made

[upper canopy]

Commorite I think

or Kabalite

[dense sedge]

kabalite is specfically those in kabals, and wouldn't apply to many in cormoragh such as mercenaries and wych cults

[unreal cosmos]

What would be an interesting angle for new Gravis characters? Thinking about how the Biologus is different from regular Apothecaries and even the Captain has unique loadout options.

[thin ibex]

gravis lieutenant with grav pack would be cool, to be able to join inceptors or suppressors

[pulsar cairn]

@floral herald what's going to be doing if he succeeds in restoring his brothers?

[floral herald]

🤷

[pulsar cairn]

i feel like he haven't thought of that himself

[thin ibex]

Gravis Chaplain... hmm, would be cool if they had a unique crozius

I feel like gravis tech marine would be fun, and would trade repairs for some other effect

like +1 shot or something

Gravis Champion would be kinda sick, bring a big ass gravis sized sword

but also would have very few people to join

[long void]

Go on a new quest after the restoration succeeds catastrophically

[thin ibex]

i wonder what a gravis librarian would do... normal librarian gives invuln and resistance to psychci, phobos librarian gives stealth and no shooty

maybe gravis librarian reduces incoming AP

[pulsar cairn]

i call that a failure

but might be what happens

[thin ibex]

you know, Ahriman did his rubric specifically to avoid the fate of unchecked mutation in his legion

if he undusts them, that problem remains one to be solved

[pulsar cairn]

now that you said that...it might be that he either gets it right or he doesn't get anything at all

[ebon forge]

Ahriman did a Magnus' with the legion, right?

[pulsar cairn]

i don't think he had a lot of options there but i could be wrong

[ebon forge]

Kinda sad for Magnus how Ahriman 'stole' the legion from him XP

[floral herald]

I think he's looking for a fix for that as well

[still warren]

I thought he tried to save the legion from the mutation but wound up dusting them by accident, or am I mistaken?

[floral herald]

Though Yvraine was hard as fuck and fixed one of his legionnaires before killing them in a confrontation

[thin ibex]

the dusting was indeed an accident, but his goal was to stop the mutation

[pulsar cairn]

Yvraine is scary

[thin ibex]

indeed

[ebon forge]

Shame Yvraine's book was canned due to lack of sales

[pulsar cairn]

sad

[dense sedge]

Yvraine is honestly a cool character, it's a shame she's been sidelined so much

her model is sick

[thin ibex]

GW hasn't totally been sure what they want to do with the ynnari in general i think

they're narrative is really cool, but running them is kinda messy

and of course has the unfortunate necessity of needing you to buy and build models from like 3 factions

which really really limits the number of people's ability to like... participate with them

i guess doesn't necessitate, i retract that

but encourages

[tired cairn]

I guess Ahriman can't succeed at undusting because GW models are typically "present day" aiui

Though I guess he could partially succeed

[floral herald]

New kind of primaris chaos space marine just dropped

[dense sedge]

ha, yeah that's a possibility

[tired cairn]

GW should have stuck to 40k being a setting and not having a metaplot

[solemn gull]

Meh

[still warren]

The models remain the same you just have meat inside of them now

[solemn gull]

I’m impartial

[tired cairn]

Ok, touche lol

[solemn gull]

Aren’t allllllll space marine models chaos marine models

[dense sedge]

theres good arguements for and againsy

[jaunty dawn]

I mean

would rubrics really change in appearance if they got undusted

they could take their helmets off but that could be like an upgrade pack

[thin ibex]

honestly no, but as far as like for the game table, it WOULD be an excuse to upscale them to primaris size, for reasons

[jaunty dawn]

they're already fairly close to nuchaos sized

like they fit in next to heresy models n such

[floral herald]

they come back fucken yoked clearly

10,000 years of gains

[thin ibex]

lol

undust and they're fucking swoled out of their power armor

[jaunty dawn]

they're actually like the sleeper best source for mk4 armour

[floral herald]

huh that makes sense

[thin ibex]

turns out ahriman only dusted the gym bro TS, which is almost all the tS

[jaunty dawn]

that isn't too small and bow legged anyway

[thin ibex]

"thanks Ahri-Bro, we're back, time to get back to magicl LIFTING amirite?"

[jaunty dawn]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer30k/comments/174ou6l/these_rubric_marines_do_look_quite_different/

[floral herald]

Huh that does look really good

[pastel rampart]

https://vxtwitter.com/SiegeStudios/status/1745514235109454121

[bright dove]

You know, looking at other AoS battleline units is making me appreciate the humble Gor

[upper canopy]

There's a Rogue Trader thread under the video game forum

especially go there for anything to do with spoiilers PLZ

[pulsar holly]

Will do!

[naive abyss]

Fuck yeah

[thin ibex]

can gotrek be fielded atm in AOS? He's hella strong right?

[upper canopy]

Yeah

[naive abyss]

I think he's still the character blender tm

Just slow

And that's after I think two nerfs?

[thin ibex]

is he tied to a faction or can order generally just field him

[naive abyss]

Uh not sure cuz how that works is looser in generally in aos I think

Cuz same grand faction can just generally soup I think?

But not sure how that works with named characters

[jaunty dawn]

souping isn't in aos anymore

just limited allies

[naive abyss]

Oh it isn't? The more you know lol

[jaunty dawn]

gortrek can join any order army though

like giants do pretty much

[naive abyss]

But I don't think gotrek at the very least is trapped in slayers only

Oh lol

Ah ok

Yeah I just remember giants and gotrek doing it

So I assumed soup lol

Mb

[jaunty dawn]

np

he costs more than you get ally points even at 2000 points hilariously

so his rule is just you can bring him in but you get no other allies

[naive abyss]

worth tbh

but im super biased

[jaunty dawn]

yup

he costs more than giants too

[naive abyss]

https://tenor.com/view/satisfied-satisfied-nod-nod-head-meme-gif-5752378

btw is he like native to any faction or is her pure merc?

lkike id assume if he is native to anything its slayers

but i love the idea with him with KO

cuz then you can just use one of the ships to yeet him

i think

idk how fussy aos is over things in transports ngl

[jaunty dawn]

pure merc I think

[naive abyss]

mm mm

[jaunty dawn]

and ko transports are locked to keyword :(

[naive abyss]

sadge

still in my heart i can do it

and thats all that really matters to me

also hes just a fun contrast to the KO

like sure him being grumpy elitist who is right with the slayers can also be fun but idk visually it does it less lol

[jaunty dawn]

for sure

[naive abyss]

also just the mental image of him jumping off a frigate or some shit at something is peak to me

[jaunty dawn]

it's kinda funny cause the document his rules are in is called cross faction heroes. there's one for each grand alliance

[naive abyss]

like gotrek with the KO is the aos equivalent of the drive me closer i want to hit them with my sword meme

[jaunty dawn]

kragnos, archaon, nagash are the other ones

[naive abyss]

lol

two literal gods, one amounts to a minor god, and one angry as fuck dwarf

[jaunty dawn]

yup

[naive abyss]

as it should be

all shall fear the angy

his model also fucks tbh

i do wish we could get like alternate piles of dead bodies though

cuz id kill for one thats just a pile of dead goblins

cuz im forever a slut for dorf vs gobo

[thin ibex]

bring him on an army that generally has weak high threat melee

boom

[naive abyss]

i mean of the order factions i think more than anyone else thats KO lol

like ironically my fluffy combo is mechanically sound

[thin ibex]

Bring Gotrek surrounded by a skinktide, just because that sounds funny to me

[naive abyss]

snrk

gotrek has become very lost

[jaunty dawn]

its kinda funny cause he has a rule about basically reducing all incoming damage to one and also making it so he can't be teleported by anything. Both are under the same heading, the Avatar of Grimnir

[thin ibex]

"I don't know where I am or who these guys are, but they're fighting those guys, and I hate those guys"

[naive abyss]

gotrek is as of now thinking the blue goblins are ok if a bit annoying

i love the idea of gotrek being so done with the realms that he calls anything the size of a goblin a goblin cuz he cant be arsed to remember what the are

and like anything vaguely elf shaped is just elgi, human shaped umgi, orc shaped i forget the word but you get the idea

[thin ibex]

"No gotrek, those are 'orruks'"
"Sod off, I know an urk when i see one"

[naive abyss]

just like zero attempt to learn faction names or etc

i still want him to show up in the lumineth realms

and like everyone gets so confused as teclis while internally panicking explains not to provoke/ideally avoid contact with the random drunk dwarf

[onyx elm]

New Wrath & Glory Expansion!
https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/305327/warhammer-40-000-wrath-and-glory-aeldari-inheritance-of-embers

[pulsar holly]

Just released today?

o.o

[upper canopy]

Oh it's out?

[pulsar holly]

Looks like it

Also, looking back over W&G's core...I love how there's a background for orks that's just a mad dok looking at their favorite squig and going "I wonder if I could just pop your brain out and shove it in the skull of the nearest git." Just grabs the closest ork, pops open their skull and shoves the squig brain in

https://tenor.com/view/todd-howard-it-just-works-bethesda-this-all-just-works-gif-20598651

[quaint compass]

ELF TIME BABY

[solemn gull]

I was very happy to see the Gorkamorka ref too

[naive abyss]

https://vxtwitter.com/thegraffitisoul/status/1667232623289323520?s=46

sourcing some art i posted earlier today

since i finally am at my desk at home so can reverse search it to double check

[pine matrix]

Shadow Fallen Angels Gang: We Love Using Plasma

[dense sedge]

Needle weapons are cool

What gimmicks do they have in the ttrpgs? I know they’re a toxic and silent exotic weapon.

[upper canopy]

That's usually it.

Really high AP

[dense sedge]

Huh, the prmus’s has 0 ap

[pulsar cairn]

are the Salamanders still the inly chapter that gets to visit their old families?

[brittle salmon]

In canon, yeah, it's part of their unique thing

But no reason you can't make up a chapter that does that too

[unreal cosmos]

I could see it happening in places where recruits are drawn from noble lines

[naive abyss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M60ftJJeeT0&ab_channel=PancreasNoWork

[naive abyss]

man the end of this video just reminds me yet again its wild weve not gotten exodites

such an easy to bring in and likely smash hit faction lol

like im very very glad we got lov but man

also was reminded bonesingers used to exist

and had a nifty model

[dense sedge]

Neat

[unreal cosmos]

that fucks extremely

[thin ibex]

i think its a few issues, one of which being that there are already 3, formerly 4 aeldari factions; it might be difficult to establish a faction identity for exodites beyond dinosaurs; insofar as tactical gimmicks and differentiating aesthetic (not that i thikn GW couldn't pull it off, but its a barrier). I almost wonder if it would make more sense to make some exodite units rather than their own whole faction

[unreal cosmos]

Artel has some good bonesinger proxies but idk if any have such good headgear

[naive abyss]

them being yet another thing shoved into craftworlds would suck

[unreal cosmos]

honestly I think a lot of weaker armies could have stayed as special units

[naive abyss]

also tbh we only have two real eldar factions

ynnari are just a blend so im not inclined to count that

[thin ibex]

i mean i don't think harlequins, for example, should have been their own army or faction tbh

and they tried it

[naive abyss]

that i agree with but they have less going on than exodites imo

[unreal cosmos]

I think dinosaurs would be cool but also they're literally space-Amish, it's hard to justify them showing up to most scenarios

[naive abyss]

they are often attacke and i agree with pancreas

[thin ibex]

i do think GW could easily manufacture a reason in that regard

[naive abyss]

bring isha back

let her be a weird thing for exodites with an avatar and all

its no wilder than ynnead is

and im super here for welves in space tbh

[ebon forge]

Have you ever went "I might be using too much time on a shitpost"?

[naive abyss]

never

and ive spent a whole day on shitpost edits before lol

[ebon forge]

Good so we are on the same level

[naive abyss]

lol

[soft willow]

Couldn't find a source but also this needs to be shared:

[naive abyss]

https://www.tumblr.com/dongnan001/738937594918928384/tried-to-translate-this-one-of-my-favorite-memes-i

found i think

[bold halo]

these didn't exist when I played before and they don't exist now that I'm back and I'm sad I missed my chance

[floral herald]

Harlequins date to a weird era where a ton of minor factions got codexes

[uneven ember]

I think they started out in White Dwarf?

[naive abyss]

i think cyan means when scions (heh), sos, and harles got rules and like at least two of those three had their own dexes

like how skitarria and cult mech were two books

for some reason

[floral herald]

And a ton of random space marine chapters and legions got their own books

I remember when Black Legion got their own codex but it was basically normal except your termies were better

[uneven ember]

hah, yeah, that was weird

[floral herald]

There was some cool fluff

[uneven ember]

Wasn't there one point where Eldar and Craftworld Eldar were different codecies?
Like the main book was still (mostly) Craftworlders, I think the Craftworld codex was slightly different army lists for the big names?

[floral herald]

I wish the Chosen had gotten rules

[brittle salmon]

CSM 4th edition codex
CSM 4th edition codex help
CSM 4th edition codex save me

(all the Legion rules were so cool...)

[uneven ember]

ISTR that Harlequins used to have always-effective Cover saves back when
(When Invulnerable saves were generally a bit rarer)
So it wasn't quite as good as Invuln, but mostly just meant they didn't like flamers.

[thin ibex]

It is a bit neat that gw experimented with more individual identities and less

There were definitely things that did not need to be their own dex

But it's cool they briefly did anyway

[uneven ember]

https://vxtwitter.com/OculusImperia/status/1745637124248875364

[tired cairn]

lmao

[untold swallow]

I think I'm going to make a chaos marines chapter

[solemn gull]

I think Tau are the perfect npcs to fight your party with in the rpgs. They are so fun to use and it feels almost like a chess match.

[ebon forge]

You are right, taus are perfect to fight with RPGs!

[ebon forge]

I almost did a ugly laught at work

[unreal cosmos]

this is consistently my favorite

[solemn gull]

Also I feel less bad making characters for them since they aren’t puppy kickers

[ebon forge]

I mean, you have to remember, they still are the military
If you make a Firecast character , you have to aknowledge that he will kill civvies too, on porpuse or not

I love Vulkan but
we all know what he did
And would do it again

[thin ibex]

If you can convince a tau that kicking a puppy is necessary for the greater good, they will kick a puppy

Or if an ethereal tells them it is necessary

I am curious as to what detachments well get

Montka is obvious

A auxiliary oriented one seems likely

A stealth one seems possible

Maybe a weaker one themed around urban combat, mitigates weaknesses to melee rather than boosting power

Enclaves themed Detachment being seperate from Mont ka could be a thing, but I imagine they'll be one and the same

[solemn gull]

I just find their tactics a joy to play

Like goblins in dnd

Cant take on a squad of space marines or a army of guard head to head so they use some pretty crafty tactics and tech

[solemn gull]

Also that seems much more grey than the outright genocide tactica of the imperium or orks

[bright dove]

Orks aren't trying to kill people

[thin ibex]

I mean, shadowsun burned a whole hive response to genestealer cult presence, and the 4th sphere expansion killed every human within its purview

[bright dove]

They're trying to fight people

[solemn gull]

4th sphere went warp crazy last I remember

[bright dove]

See: Tuska Daemonkilla living their best life

[naive abyss]

No they responded to warp insanity extremely

[solemn gull]

They literally tape people to rockets for fun

[naive abyss]

Also the 4th personnel got punished

[ebon forge]

I mean

[bright dove]

To make people fight them, yes

[solemn gull]

Right they saw all their human compatriots turn into demons like it was deadspace

[ebon forge]

I need to get on his book
IT'S SO MANY DAMN BOOKS TO GET TO

[upper canopy]

Tuska Daemonkilla does not have a book

he's flavor text in a codex

[ebon forge]

I am finishing fifteen hours at least, been fun

[bright dove]

He is a Lore blurb, yeah

[pulsar cairn]

[solemn gull]

Orks are needlessly cruel when bored

[ebon forge]

FRICK

[naive abyss]

Fifteen hours good

Probably one of the best guard books imo

[pulsar cairn]

Orks also make use of slaves dunno if they do it all the time but they do it

[thin ibex]

I do definitely concede that the Tau empire is far less inclined to genocide, mostly because the imperial perspective is that it is wasteful

[bright dove]

Because there's not a fight going on and they want a fight

[naive abyss]

I mean all grots are slaves

[bright dove]

All Ork logic and what they do ties back to Fight

[pulsar cairn]

yes, but also like, people they capture

[dense sedge]

Orks love slaves

[naive abyss]

Sometimes they more often eat them I think

[bright dove]

Slaves mean they can Fight more

[dense sedge]

If they were in mtg they’d be black/red, maybe some green

[pulsar cairn]

they might but the lamenters did loose a buncha people trying to save humans who were ork slaves

[bright dove]

Orks are green, you madman

[naive abyss]

I mean sure but Idk the point you're trying to make mourge

[thin ibex]

Orks are every schoolyard, professional, and personal bully mixed with soccer hooligans, and the movie version of bikers; all embodied with incredible strength and zero empathy

[naive abyss]

With they do all this bad stuff for fight thing

[ebon forge]

I mean, what faction don't?
Eldar?

[bright dove]

My point is that conventional measures of good and evil are kind of pointless to make for Orks

[naive abyss]

Like its true but it doesn't make it less bad

[jaunty dawn]

ork burnaz kill ppl cause they enjoy watching it happen

[pulsar cairn]

craft world eldar sounds about right

[bright dove]

Because they're hard wired to want to fight

[naive abyss]

Eldar, nids, lov

[ebon forge]

I mean
Nids are almost animals

[naive abyss]

I don't really agree with that

[thin ibex]

Neither votann or tau use slaves

[jaunty dawn]

orks have free will

[bright dove]

It's like judging nids for getting biomass

[solemn gull]

Orks are sentient

And like, relatively sapient

[bright dove]

Orks were made to be weapons

[ebon forge]

Yeah is hot wired on their brain to want to fight

[naive abyss]

They are still evil violent enslavers

[jaunty dawn]

like there's orks who don't fight non combatants for example. like whatever that's worth but they're capable of choice. they have moral agency

they're also just like. pointlessly cruel caust it's a laff

that's got nothing to do with fighting

[naive abyss]

They're still a faction in the setting lol

[pulsar cairn]

orks have a thing with a face eater squigg

[jaunty dawn]

nids probably also have moral agency they just don't really have society or much care

[pulsar cairn]

face eating competition

[ebon forge]

Depends on the Ork clan, but ye.
Groffs are easily the worst

[thin ibex]

Do the gsc use slaves or are they in a weird spot?

[jaunty dawn]

gsc are like

[upper canopy]

I mean

[jaunty dawn]

tragic

in a way

[upper canopy]

Yes every gsc is psychically enslaved by the Broodmind

[solemn gull]

So were eldar?

[upper canopy]

Also like

[jaunty dawn]

that's why they sometimes get to be a lot closer to 'good' because they're ultimately being manipulated into dooming worlds

[upper canopy]

The Genestealer kiss is definitely not a free willed thing you undergo

[jaunty dawn]

but also yeah some gsc cults do like mass experimentation and shit

[ebon forge]

I mean, yes
but Orks also devolved from their original design and became more simple minded

[jaunty dawn]

but it varies with cult

[ebon forge]

And kinda the generic evil thing in 40k
And the butt end of the joke, even if the joke is terrifying and
Grimdark

[bright dove]

Eldar are remarkably not good at the non violent tendencies as well

See how they approach Romance

[upper canopy]

Probably makes the Orks look worse tbh

[ebon forge]

And you can argue Orks very rarely make slaves, only in very rare casses we even see that

[upper canopy]

The Eldar RECOGNIZE they have an in-built desire to kill

And strive to work against it

Orks just go hog wild with it

[bright dove]

And murderfucking their society into oblivion

[ebon forge]

And now love to live in an eternal high horse

[jaunty dawn]

yeah but the reason there are any eldar left is that they are capable of making decisions lol

[ebon forge]

"yes I murderfucked a chaos god into existence, but you are still worst, monkey"

[jaunty dawn]

like to become exodites. or craftworlders

[bright dove]

And both of those are hard paths meant to suppress the desire for war

[ebon forge]

In all honesty if we start putting our own morality and be serious/realistic about it, there is no one 'moraly correct' to like in 40k

[jaunty dawn]

the majority of craftworlders are committed to non violence, cause even the militia are put into a battle trance to handle combat

im pretty sure exodites just chill

like. the live comparatively simpler lives but they're just living the only existence a lot of them have known

and like again the whole point is both eldar and orks have free will and therefore moral agency and their actions can be judged

[bright dove]

And yet the violence still comes back easily for Eldar

[jaunty dawn]

what is your point here

that like dark eldar can't be judged on the scale of good and evil cause being a craftworlder is difficult?

or joining the ynnari even

[bright dove]

My point is that Eldar try to put on airs about how they're not just weapons, that they won't inflict incredible violence at the drop of a hat

But consistently choose violence

Even at their most peaceful

[ebon forge]

Just-
Enjoy your favorite faction I guess

Skavens are cool

Like, trying to get into a high horse about other people factions is pointless because
It's grimdark
It's suppose to be a hellhole

[bright dove]

Ye

[thin ibex]

A big thing to toss aside with 40k is trying to ethically justify a faction

[bright dove]

Every faction will choose violence

[upper canopy]

I will sya

[ebon forge]

Yeah, why they don't? because them we won't have a story and toys to sell

the end

[upper canopy]

okay I dislike that

Because basically what you're doing is not actually contributing the conversation you're just stopping it

"It's pointless to engage with the ethics of this setting"

[ebon forge]

Yes
The conversation is pointless and just make people angry at each other

[upper canopy]

If no one's actually arguing and people are being civil there's no point in stopping the convo

If you don't want to engage there is the entire rest of the internet to hang out in.

[bright dove]

But Vooooyyyy, people are being wrong on the internet

[pulsar holly]

Hmm, this sounds like slander

[jaunty dawn]

???

[bright dove]

Oh yeah, Vulcan burned that kid

But yeah, you want to talk faction nuance, we got Fantasy for that

[thin ibex]

I feel like the 40k ethical Olympics is never productive beyond trying to find ever more minute evidence to support the better or worse position on a factions or persons ethics

[pulsar holly]

slanderous lies!
(I have no clue, who did he burn? Was this during the Horus Heresy or Waaaaaagh of the Beast?)

[ebon forge]

Fair enough but sometimes is good to just remind to take a breather and maybe stop.
It's easy to get caught into a debate and lose yourself a bit.

[upper canopy]

Vulkan personally set an Eldar child on fire during the Great Crusade.

And then killed an entire world because Exodites and Humans were living in harmony.

[pulsar holly]

O-Oh

Think I missed that part

Vulcan now added to problematic favorites list

[ebon forge]

That's the entirety of 40k

That's one of the points of 40k

[pulsar holly]

I know

[thin ibex]

And so often the discussion around faction ethics becomes a thinly veiled way to play the "I'm better at ethics" moral high horse game amongst participants

[ebon forge]

Hell, take 15 hours, change "Emperor" with "God" and you can easily see a whole slander and poking fun of religion with "son GAWD said going to the war is fine, you will be fine"

[pulsar holly]

I joke about calling the Leagues of Votann the new good guys of 40k. I’d be worried if someone thought they or the Tau was legit good

[ebon forge]

and the whole debacle of incompetency in the army

[ebon forge]

They destroy whole planets for resources and fuck whoever is there

[ebon forge]

Yeah another reason to want that talk to just
stop

[pulsar holly]

“Ahh you said no to our deal? Well that’s too bad, we want the resources anyways. HEY SVEN CRACK OPEN THE PLANET ANYWAYS!”

[thin ibex]

Lot of folk do hang on strongly to " farsight is the one good guy in the setting" honestly

[bright dove]

Farsight is an ass

[pulsar holly]

Shadowsun is clearly better than Farsight

[upper canopy]

I want actual good guys in 40k and I think the setting would be completely improved by adding them.

[jaunty dawn]

we will never know if farsight has ass

[upper canopy]

At this point.

[ebon forge]

Fartsight* k

[pulsar holly]

He is flat of ass, like Hank Hill

[ebon forge]

Then you would lose the point of the setting

[upper canopy]

Also the setting has objective good guys already in the Ynnari but no one wants to believe that.

[pulsar holly]

I mean I like Arbiter Ian’s approach

[bright dove]

Ynnari are not good

[thin ibex]

We know farsight can independently control his eyes

[naive abyss]

I don't feel that's accurate

[jaunty dawn]

that's why he never leaves his suit because it would expose his greatest secret

[upper canopy]

The entire point of the setting for 40 years has been to sell toys.

[naive abyss]

They're a cult to a death god

[pulsar holly]

Having smaller human factions that are successful on their own, existing outside of the Imperium to exist as a contrast

[naive abyss]

Like 40k would sorta lose its point with a good guys tm

[bright dove]

Ynnari are over here going "if enough of us die, we can be great again"

[upper canopy]

They're a cult to a death god that is not xenophobic in the least and goes out of their way to protect people from the trepedations of Chaos regardless of their species or if it's even pragmatic.

[naive abyss]

Especially if you made it out of an existing faction

[ebon forge]

exactly my point

[upper canopy]

The setting lost it's point for a while.

[pulsar holly]

So ya know….we stop getting people arguing that “No really, the Imperium is totally justified and right. How else do they still exist and keep defeating Chaos?”

[naive abyss]

They also murdered like a whole catchwords afterlife

Like being less bad than others doesn't mean you're not bad

[bright dove]

The Ynarri win state is the genocide of the Eldar

[ebon forge]

Why we even need good guys, live in the grey, is one of the great points of the settings

[naive abyss]

That I'll agree with and too an extent kin do that

[upper canopy]

We GET people thinking the Ultra-Nazis are good because they're treated as unambiguously good because their only contrast is the Super-Ultra-Nazis.

So just say fuck it and add good guys so people stop thinking the Super Fascists are good if you can't write the setting as nuanced as you'd need to.

[naive abyss]

I mean sure but like people misreading 40k is not new

[bright dove]

God no, that's because most of our books are written about humans

[pulsar holly]

Hell we do see in the Gaunt’s Ghosts book functional societies, traitorous Chaos worshipping societies, but successful functional ones nonetheless(clearly they’re not good, they’re a fucking immoral hellhole, but still)

We need more ork books

[ebon forge]

People misreading any media is not new

[naive abyss]

I mean tbh its not a grey setting

[pulsar holly]

And a fucking Kin book. BLACK LIBRARY WHERE IS OUR LEAGUE NOVEL

[thin ibex]

I think a lot of fans have an issue of falling into the trap of "I can't pick my favorite faction unless they're justified or good, or more good than the other options" which then leads to the whole ethical Olympics thing

[bright dove]

Of course the Imperial characters think they're the good guys and justify their actions

[naive abyss]

Wip atm

[bright dove]

They're Imperials

[ebon forge]

Hellhole* sorry

[naive abyss]

Lol

[ebon forge]

And grey I mean
Complex and questionable things happening

Not just "I did the right thing because the god of light and good told me to" and everyone clapped

[thin ibex]

There's also I think a generalized urge to try and polarize the factions of the setting to be more clearly "the good guys" vs "the bad guys"

[upper canopy]

ALSO

WHF was grimdark!

And it had Unambigious Good Guys!

All over the place!

[jaunty dawn]

I don't think 40k has ever really like. not been marine centered

at least since 2nd edition

[naive abyss]

I'd disagree with fantasy being grimdark tbh

[pulsar holly]

Arguably the only morally neutral faction is the Tyranids (they’re still bad, obviously) but that’s assuming the Hive Mind leading all of them is still animalistic on some level and not some evil intelligence

[naive abyss]

Like 40k is literally the origin of that idea

[ebon forge]

Exactly

[jaunty dawn]

I think there's elements that were attempts at satire but i don't think many of them were ever very good

[bright dove]

Fantasy is a different story

[pulsar holly]

Fantasy tends to be a little more humorous compared to 40k

[ebon forge]

"War of the beard"
Super grimdark

great saga tho

[naive abyss]

Like fantasy is grimey high fantasy

[bright dove]

Fantasy is grimy not grim

[naive abyss]

Idk how it's that grim tbh

[ebon forge]

it was sarcastic

[naive abyss]

Fair

But yeah like parts of fantasy are grim

[bright dove]

Until the End times, Fantasy has things going well

[naive abyss]

But like they're the exception not the rule

[upper canopy]

I think GW has proven they can't handle writing their own satire anymore so I just don't think they should make their main focus writing satire.

[pulsar holly]

Chaos Dwarfs da best. -deep inhale of industrial fumes- Rampant industry, big bull god, lots of trade. What’s not to like? ….Ignore the pits, and the noises. Nothing to see down there

[naive abyss]

I mean gw does satire still I think just not in 40k cuz it sells better when they don't do it generally in 40k it seems

[jaunty dawn]

I think it does happen on like a story by story basis

[pulsar holly]

Imagine if the space marines were still as fucked up as they were in the Rogue Trader days. Not sure how well they’d sell now

[naive abyss]

This is not me supporting that strategy to be clear

[bright dove]

I also remember one of my favorite Space Marine novels being Souldrinkers

[pulsar holly]

Another Souldrinker fan, good to see

[jaunty dawn]

I just don't think there was a golden age where everyone was like "I am aware all these factions are bad I want to get these bad guys to fight your bad guys"

[bright dove]

Who are 100% in team Fuck the Imperium

[thin ibex]

scrungly marines are sadly absent i think going forward

[jaunty dawn]

as long as they've been making models its been like buy a cool space man he has a gun and a back banner

[ebon forge]

I like peter turbo, poor turbo
Wish he didn't had gone full turbo in his homeplanet

[thin ibex]

now we tend to have clean shaven noblemarines unless they're meant to ethnically emulate a group

[pulsar holly]

Huh, could have sworn Sarpedon was still loyal. Like they were very much still loyal to the Emperor and helped Imperial citizens where they could. Hence the two internal conflicts in the Chapter

[thin ibex]

though to be fair to that, i tended to like helmet marines more than scrungly face marines

jsut cause i think helmets are sensible

also helmets are cool

[bright dove]

Scrungle style marines are why I play chaos

[thin ibex]

and can be decorated with a lot of their own personality

[ebon forge]

Solaire proved you can be charismatic as hell while having a hellmet all the time on

[pulsar holly]

No helmets, the enemies should see my face before they die. Or half of it anyways, think an Ork blasted part of it off earlier today.

[naive abyss]

I just wish we had less cue ball marines lol

[thin ibex]

lol

or space wolves "I smell and sense better with no helmet on" shtick

[bright dove]

I get hair is hard

But come on

[naive abyss]

Like eighty percent of marine heads are identical

And that includes a bizarre number of the primarchs lol

[thin ibex]

tbf, being hairless is probably fairly practical for a space marine, not that practicality is at all a priority

[naive abyss]

I mean I get the logic

Just that doesn't make it less boring

[ebon forge]

I can still not believe they actually howl

[thin ibex]

oh yeah man

big howls, especially amongst blood claws

[ebon forge]

Fucking furries

[naive abyss]

Like stormcast are allowed hair

[ebon forge]

says the furry

[onyx elm]

Awoos?

[jaunty dawn]

we should get space marines with bald patches

[naive abyss]

Which just makes it look even sillier

[pulsar holly]

OwO Space Wolves

[jaunty dawn]

not fully shaven just a receding hairline

[thin ibex]

i suspect the dark angels could beat space wolves if they just started a howl first; but the timing would need to be right because usually wolves fight good just after the howl

[onyx elm]

Talk about your geneseed issues.

[jaunty dawn]

space wolves are orks yeah

[ebon forge]

Lemowo Rusky

[thin ibex]

"What was your primarch's special trait?"

"Early onset baldness"

[jaunty dawn]

I wonder if chaos marines ever come out of the vortex and see modern marines and are just like what happened to top knots did top knots go out of style or

[thin ibex]

I know often times the top knots are attached to chaos helmets too, but sometimes i like to think they're stupid enough to cut a hole in their helmet to let their top knot poke out

[onyx elm]

"Our chapter endlessly hunts for ancient caches of the substance known as monoxodil."

[ebon forge]

God

[bright dove]

This is the 40k content I live for

[ebon forge]

Just get an hair squig
Problem solved

[thin ibex]

i also wonder if chaos marine horns

are like

super inconvenient

[onyx elm]

When I think of Space Wolves, I've been thinking more of actual historical Vikings. Like how they're were a bit more fastidious about being clean.

[thin ibex]

inside a ship

[bright dove]

I am sure mechanicus can do hair plugs

[thin ibex]

I tend to think that space wolves are resoundingly Movie Vikings, rather than being informed by true norse or scandinavian society

[onyx elm]

Well they do like to do head plugs.

[jaunty dawn]

freebootas come up with a scheme to sell hair squigs to beakies and then train the squigs run back to them. infinite profit

[past sphinx]

The body is the perfect machine if you needed cranial cooling enough to lose hair it is the machine gods will

[onyx elm]

True, but I can't get the image of a Space Wolf always combing his beard.

[bright dove]

A kunnin plan to get more fights

[onyx elm]

Makin dem teefs rain!

[jaunty dawn]

space wolves don't even know what a viking is

they're just following their fenrisian tradition

[onyx elm]

But even wolves will groom themselves.

[jaunty dawn]

you ask a space wolf "vet du vad en viking ar?" and he just like bites your hand off

[soft willow]

There are no wolves on Fenris.

[onyx elm]

I wouldn't be surprised if that's a private point of contention in the chapter. Some Space Wolves thinking bathing isn't proper.

[ebon forge]

But
They ride giant wolves...

[naive abyss]

Well

No but yes

[jaunty dawn]

you know what they say about grandmothers

[naive abyss]

If you know you know lol

[ebon forge]

what

what

[soft willow]

I said what I said.

[naive abyss]

Lol

[ebon forge]

Inst leman's adoptive mom a wolf too

[onyx elm]

Y'know... 40k can be kind of weird sometimes. 🤔

[soft willow]

Only Kinda?

[naive abyss]

Sometimes?

[verbal ermine]

🤔 kind of?

[naive abyss]

40k?

[soft willow]

Clearly y'all haven't read the Inquisition War trilogy.

[naive abyss]

Lol

[ebon forge]

Remember when a lil girl beat Tzeench labyring with her dog? Good times.

[thin ibex]

the big secret is that fenrisian wolves are people, and thundewolves are more like a bear than a wolf iirc

[solemn gull]

House goliath because 80s action movie

[jaunty dawn]

that feels like a metaphor for the burning of prospero

[ebon forge]

WHAT

[upper canopy]

There are no wolves on fenris.

[floral herald]

The wolves aren’t wolves but what that means is kind of open ended

[jaunty dawn]

fenris might've been a viking theme park world from the daot

maybe

[floral herald]

There’s been a persistent fan theory from that that they’re mutated humans

[jaunty dawn]

it's one possibility

[floral herald]

But that’s not confirmed and they might have just been “wolf emulating” genetic custom jobs for Fenris’ winter themed theme park days

[thin ibex]

we do have supporting evidence from Lukas the Trickster (the book) when the dark eldar comments on the gene manipulation of the people on fenris

the wolves on fenris*

[solemn gull]

I like the idea that it’s the failed aspirants who couldnt make it back to the fang

[jaunty dawn]

fenris also has maybe feral tyranids in its oceans

[floral herald]

I think there were wolves before space marines on fenris though

[solemn gull]

The ragnar novel had him kill a fellow aspirant on the way back because he didnt take well to the mutations and turned into a werewolf

[thin ibex]

yeah i current fan theory is that the pre-astartes settlers were also genetically modified to survive the death world of fenris

[jaunty dawn]

but that could also be magos biologis realising that genestealers in the milky way predate hive fleets by millenia and going crazy and thinking everything gribbly is secretely a tyranid tbf

[thin ibex]

using the canis helix or something like it

its a bit funny to think that fenrisian krakens are just early nids left too long to evolve on their own

and fenrisians build their personal sagas by going out and slaying them

[onyx elm]

Speaking of Drukhari, the new W&G Aldari expansion has an extensive list on helmets, because of course it does.

[thin ibex]

and catachan devils are also nids, etc etc

every dangerous xenofauna is just nids

"It's all nids?"
gun cocks "Alwas has been"

[jaunty dawn]

technically speaking there's not much of anything on fenris anymore

thanks grey knights

[thin ibex]

well, thanks grey knights, thanks thousand sons, and thanks dark eldar

they faced a whole lotta shit pre-primaris enforcement

presumably there are still humans on the surface because the space wolves still recruit from there presumably

[jaunty dawn]

I'm under the impression that they're all gone

[pulsar holly]

The impression I've gotten in more recent years is that maybe they're a little less movie Vikings now? Or at least the other parts of Fenrisian society is...maybe

I desire to learn more about the recent Fenrisian Rogue Trader character

[jaunty dawn]

just happened so recently space wolves haven't started declining yet or something

[solemn gull]

Perfect time for the inquisition to try again

[jaunty dawn]

they basically suceeded!

[solemn gull]

They wont be happy until the space wolves are all gone and also erased from history

[naive abyss]

Nah cuz tsons happened after

And that ends with arjac talking to a lady and teasing lady marines

[jaunty dawn]

grey knights were like hey we want to not only kill a population for a dumb reason again but we want to do it to your guys and the swolves were I guess so damaged by the thousand sons attack that logan grimnar okays it

and then the human population is "liquified"

[naive abyss]

Oh it's after the tsons

[jaunty dawn]

idk why they have to be specifically liquified

[naive abyss]

I thought this was that one war

[pulsar holly]

Can we uhh...can we just nuke Luna and the Grey Knights?

[jaunty dawn]

*titan

[pulsar holly]

Just keep the Sisters of Silence around and send them after Daemons with accompanying Custodes

[jaunty dawn]

sos live on the moon I think

[pulsar holly]

Can we nuke Titan?

[jaunty dawn]

it might have nukes in it already?

there's a macguffin

[pulsar holly]

Good, nuke the nukes with the nuke

[jaunty dawn]

mm

[naive abyss]

Wouldn't it be terra?

[jaunty dawn]

I think they inherited facilities from the selenite cults

who were cool moon witches

with advanced gene tech that the emperor wanted

[pastel rampart]

Their biggest customer is Abaddon.

[thin ibex]

abaddon's top knot is actually a technological item, that he can plug and unplug into the cyber socket into his head

[ebon forge]

Does it do anything or is raw drip?

[pastel rampart]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/703185732960911400/1195397700410163301/tt_download_wm_20240112_165635.mp4?ex=65b3d7dd&is=65a162dd&hm=4b3e523b6ca1b6be4755b0b52318b31d42d528b4a5296bf6273866d8845c1649&

[ebon forge]

Now THIS is the new chapter I wanna see

[thin ibex]

anyone got army list themes and factions to throw at me?

[solemn gull]

The most elite stealth tacticool guard list ever

[thin ibex]

stealf.... hmm, i don't think a single unit in the guard even have the stealth trait... but I shall try

wait maybe ratlings do

[solemn gull]

I just mean style

Make a list for Kojima basically

[thin ibex]

lol

[jaunty dawn]

I think there's gaunt's ghosts too?

[solemn gull]

Gaunts ghosts are a light infantry regiment I'm pretty sure

[jaunty dawn]

there's character unit that's a bunch of them

[storm schooner]

Is there a Karskins thing which gives Stealth?

[jaunty dawn]

the regiment is called tanith first and only

[solemn gull]

not what I meant penny

[pulsar holly]

The Tanith First is meant to be a stealth/recon focused infantry unit

[jaunty dawn]

oh sorry. what did you mean

[pulsar holly]

Was looking at the path options in the Aeldari W&G book last night. What exactly is a bonesinger?

[jaunty dawn]

scout sentinels? :(

uh they make stuff from wraithbone. by singing

[thin ibex]

i just figured scout sentinels made no sense when i brought literally no artillery

[jaunty dawn]

yeah I figured

[thin ibex]

teh "artillery" is two avengers coming in turn 2

[jaunty dawn]

can catachan not take hwt

[thin ibex]

the list is VERY "volume of fire"

nah

their only option is flamers, which i may have forgotten to give them

[jaunty dawn]

weird

[thin ibex]

they can take 2

and at 20 catachans, can take 4

[jaunty dawn]

sad there's no castellan creed anymore

infiltrating a tank

[floral herald]

started the death and the end 2

[thin ibex]

his daughter is pretty decent, but not infiltrate a baneblade good

[jaunty dawn]

what edition did creed even have that rule

[floral herald]

5e or 6e

[jaunty dawn]

in 4th he gets to pick the mission if you're using strategy rating (idr what that even was) and then either got to pick table edge or force opponent to reroll first turn roll off

[floral herald]

In 5e I believe he could give any unit Scouts or maybe Infiltrate

So you could outflank with a baneblade

[jaunty dawn]

in 7th he was super good at ordering like his daughter now and got two warlord traits. one of those lets you outflank 3 units

[storm schooner]

Tempestus arent a regiment, they're special forces.

[jaunty dawn]

tempestus have their own regiments

[floral herald]

found it!

[ebon forge]

Finished fifteen hours
I am sad now

[jaunty dawn]

some kind of tactical genius...

[pulsar holly]

Was about to say, I know Tempestus have their own regiments

[floral herald]

(Scouts in 5e was either a free normal move before the game started, or the ability to come off Outflank Reserves)

[jaunty dawn]

nested rules what fun

[thin ibex]

thats how creed went toe to toe with abaddon. He had a baneblade he snuck into the fight

[floral herald]

(Outflank Reserves meant you got to come off of the table side edges)

[pulsar holly]

You know what they need to bring back to the 42nd millennium? Solar Auxilia

[jaunty dawn]

I'm glad I didn't try and get into infinity before n4 for this reason lol

[floral herald]

I'm pretty sure the M41 version of them is navy breachers

Just from how the organization changed

[jaunty dawn]

yeah they're somewhat influenced visually

[floral herald]

And are void-specialist troops with a lot of internal discipline

[pulsar holly]

Visually, but is the tech as good? do they meet the standards set?

[floral herald]

The tech isn't as good cause that's M41

So much tech lost never to be rediscovered etc etc

But they are a pretty elite force

[pulsar holly]

Wasn’t it because the saturnine void armor fell out of use after the Horus Heresy cause the Imperium felt it was unnecessary at that point (clearly they were wrong) not because they lost the tech?

[jaunty dawn]

they have significantly less tanks

[floral herald]

The visual parallel is also there

[jaunty dawn]

they do have pretty good armour though

[pulsar holly]

Hmmm

[jaunty dawn]

carapace equivalent

in 9th edition they reduced ap because they had decided that's what void armour did

so in the sense of having much better armour that guardsman flak yeah

they're pretty alright

[pulsar holly]

They do look cool

[jaunty dawn]

they mainly use shotguns rather than lasrifles though

one of the specialists has a big axe like I think the auxilia melee units do

[ebon forge]

Are they the ones that use shotguns made to kill Astartes and go past ceramite?

[pulsar holly]

Does give me a better idea of what the boarding shields look like by the way. Was wondering what the exact appearance was after reading Salvation’s Reach

[jaunty dawn]

I think they use shotguns cause of the sharp damage fall off to avoid damaging bulkheads

yup big ol power axes

[ebon forge]

Da Gobbo's Revenge is the first in the gobbo series, yes?

[pulsar holly]

Yeah, the way naval combat was described in Salvation’s Reach I’d hate to have most of my squad equipped with las rifles

[jaunty dawn]

basically post heresy there was a big pivot from 'space' 'marines' into land infantry

[thin ibex]

I kind of enjoy just the raw number of shots being poured out by 3 gatling guns and 2 sets of rocket pods, and 2 avenger bolt cannons

[jaunty dawn]

probably partially by militia and cults proving themselves during the heresy?

that an organised large force can hold its own against a better equipped one

[pulsar holly]

Well the Solar Auxilia going out of fashion had more to do with cost, and a shift from a lot of void combat focus or defense to more planetary surface stuff which they thought the Solar Auxilia was unnecessary for

[jaunty dawn]

that and half the mechanicus took it's toys and left

[pulsar holly]

At least it spared Ogryns from being forced to become the monsters the Auxilia made them

[jaunty dawn]

yeah exactly

but you still get these guys kickin around

breaking open walls with chainfists

giving big guns to their biggest members

[thin ibex]

naval breaching seems a VERY frought and unforgiving tactical scenario

its not like you can actively retreat

unless your ship is docked

[jaunty dawn]

in kill team their void armour makes them extra resistant to area weapons

[naive abyss]

https://youtu.be/aWzFnqHNaJM?si=CQnxgFyh-MF7JAcv

[jaunty dawn]

yeah boarding pods have a hard enough time getting to a ship let alone getting away again under fire

[thin ibex]

so usually that fight is a

"you win or you die" situation

especially against some of the worst foes that the imperium faces

[ebon forge]

surprises me is something the navy does and not the astartes

[jaunty dawn]

the astartes do it when they can yeah

[thin ibex]

its just that astartes are rare

[jaunty dawn]

breachers also repel boarders I would assume

[thin ibex]

so humans often times gotta do the work

[ebon forge]

True, in the big scheme of things, astartes are rarer than one might think

[thin ibex]

and so, ultimately you have humans who have training or unasked for experience doing the job, etc

[jaunty dawn]

not breacher teams specifically I guess. but the navy marines in general

[thin ibex]

naval marines are not a thoroughly explored aspect of void fighting an just the fighting personnel of the imperium in general

i have to imagine they're fairly elite by human standards

for the extreme demands of space and ship to ship fighting

but specialized

I do also imagine that ships are so big that generally being an urban combat specialist transfers well

[jaunty dawn]

also stuff like while the astartes are doing a decapitation strike for all the glory someone has to do the grunt work

[floral herald]

My favorite navy breachers thing is the Geistskull

It's basically the 40k version of that RC car with C4 you could get in CoD black ops

[junior robin]

iirc they turn you into one after death as a reward for being a good breacher

[jaunty dawn]

it's kinda funny that the robot that gets the suicide bomb is the one partially made from a dead person yeah

[wintry mist]

https://youtube.com/shorts/fuGRbwqPu6U?si=ucY3ktIMixkrMLkH

I think the worst thing about the LoV is that they gave them bolters

did they have to make toddler marines?

like they could have given them like, gauss rifles or something

[unreal cosmos]

I have a model that I planned to do that with but now I think she just shears her own hair regularly and affixes it to the helmet out of vanity

[wintry mist]

just make them distinct somehow

or even just regular old ballistic weapons

[thin ibex]

mmm, i don't mind it personally. I would usually have preferred them with the ion guns as standard; but the bolter better communicates a sort of chunky/satisfyingly hefty weapon to go hand in hand with the solid feeling of the dorfs

[wintry mist]

yeah but the problem with it is that another faction already uses it for their primary infantry weapon

[thin ibex]

it also helps tie in the shared, distant, relation to pre-imperium

[wintry mist]

and that it is, by and large, very much a staple of that faction

[thin ibex]

yeah, but there are factions that use similar weaponry already tbf

like both votan and tau use rail and ion guns too

[floral herald]

Yeah I think their common tech base is kind of neat as well

[wintry mist]

I just dont think it should have been bolters imo

[thin ibex]

i getcha, and your reasons make sense; but at least for me it doesn't really bother me much at all

Also nice to have them with "stuff other people use but better made" is on brand for dorfs

except that I will never accept any idea that they might make better railguns than the tau

[floral herald]

If nothing else the leagues don't seem to believe in guns that shoot far

[wintry mist]

also I'm not a fan of that either

[alpine quarry]

i think thats like
almost everyone in regards to spacemarines

[junior robin]

oh man, thinking about gauss weapons on LoV makes me want to do a army where they accidentally used a C'tan chard to fix their computer problems

[alpine quarry]

except for necrons who go "nah id win" and tyranids who somehow cut them open with normal claws

[thin ibex]

for now

[wintry mist]

I wont lie I think the leagues would never lose a single engagement that didn't end in warp fuckery or the 'nids (imperium plot armor not withstanding)

[pastel rampart]

Lots of fighting inside asteroids, why would they need them to shoot far

[thin ibex]

eh I disagree, I think many factions have the means and ability to win engagements with them

[floral herald]

I would simply place the objective on top of a high shelf

[thin ibex]

the disrespect of giving LoV a stilt unit would be both immense and hilarious

put them at normal height

[wintry mist]

LoV adapting sentinel walker technology

[thin ibex]

i feel like the fans are asking for a votann walker enough that we're gonna get the Votann Dread Knight treatment, where they put a kin in a giant robotic baby carrier death machine

[pastel rampart]

LoV equip their assault units with the '93 Mario bros movie jump boots, originally used to reach the top shelf.

[thin ibex]

can you fucking imagine, instead of jump pack votann, we got super jump votann?

with like th spring shoes

[pastel rampart]

Deal extra damage by landing directly on top of enemy heads.

https://tenor.com/view/paper-mario-super-mario-jumping-mushroom-gif-17650162

[thin ibex]

give votann subterreanean drill skis

but yeah on the subject of votann superiority, i think a lot of that is just their own dex hyping them the fuck up, which it's entitled to do