Battletech/Mechwarrior/ATOW

[upper warren]

This might be subjective but I'm looking for the opinions of folks who have played more live games

What's a good turn cap to end on
10 rounds?
20 rounds?
Something in between?

[hexed musk]

10 rounds is nice and solid for an objective based match imo

[indigo hinge]

Count me in.

[indigo hinge]

Time to make my own terrain.

[upper warren]

Is that a laser cutter?

[supple jetty]

looks like it

[upper warren]

Rad!!!!

[indigo hinge]

Yep. One of two at the big workshop. I suppose that makes four lasercutters at my disposal in total. And this one's big.

Some bits failed, gotta double chack my files, but these bigger ones and the greenhouses came out great!

[hexed musk]

I have discovered engineers are extremely vulnerable to Battletech
I have 10 interested coworkers

[summer mulch]

That tracks

[indigo hinge]

Got into battletech the moment I started my engineering degree. Well shit.

[wet nova]

you don't become a Battletech fan by looking at mech, you become one by spending hours at meklab

[indigo hinge]

My trick to get others into BT is very simple:

1. Find people that played Titanfall 2.
2. Paint up a Shadow Hawk to look like BT-7274.
3. They are now interested and immediately highly attached to the Shadow Hawk.

[hexed musk]

This also makes sure they start at low power so they can discover the wonder of new and powerful machines

[indigo hinge]

Yeah, it does. I usually run a Wolverine myself against their Shadow Hawk, though I always give em the option to pick something else and I'll just match it.

But the Wolverine variant with the rotary AC-2 is possibly my favourite 'mech in the entire game. It's solid, works great with the lances I like to play, and has reliably won 1v1 scenarios. There's a reason it's piloted by a Solaris VII fighter in my own bit of lore.

Hell, it's even named after a boxing robot.

[upper warren]

That's really cool

[indigo hinge]

Didn't even get around to finishing the paint job yet, but this is the wolverine piloted by Midas.

Ex fighter for Golden Touch Stables, and probably the 'mech with the highest K/D in my collection. Tied with my Hollander, I reckon.

Taking heavy inspiration from the Real Steel bot it shares its name with.

[sterile sleet]

@indigo hinge @‘ing you because I dont know which part is the coolest to reply to but this is amazing

[indigo hinge]

Well thanks. I had the mohawk laying around and it just fit like a glove.

From there it's all about the games and how they play out. I try to give every pilot in my merc company some lore like that.

[upper warren]

Giving me ideas

I mean... You could. Easily do laser weapons with the chemical lasers, right? Did PPCs ever get a magazine variant?

[hexed musk]

plasma rifle

[upper warren]

40k does those round by round actual plays, is there something similar for BT?

[indigo hinge]

I've come across one channel that does pretty good stuff. Mostly Solaris IIV.

[upper warren]

Oh I keep seeing S7 format mentioned is there a big difference between regular and S7?

[indigo hinge]

It's 1 on 1, that's the main difference.

I found a ruleset online that led into so much bookkeeping I had a blast setting up overcomplicated excel sheets and then never even played a second match.

And it seems to use the Alpha Strike pilot card abilities. They add a fun touch, and thankfully a table was hidden somewhere in MegaMek to reference what they actually do. That was near impossible to find.

[upper warren]

That sounds like an interesting format. I would think using MekHQ would be the best way to manage something like that but damn never thought a whole other system would be involved

[upper warren]

https://youtu.be/4v21vRfsUL8?feature=shared

[hexed musk]

I gave in and got the humble bundle book deal.
Wolves at the Border has been a really good read so far

[upper warren]

I don't remember what happened but I remember really liking it. The bundle is a steal for real

[hexed musk]

My victor blew up when he fell over in a game last night

My opponent brought late era tech against my intro tech list (just miscommunication, no ill feelings) and wow the victor does not age well against assaults that are more manuverable than it

On the bright side, an a/c 20 on a jumper is pretty spooky and demanded respect

[upper warren]

I'm always so scared of losing that ac20 and then... Just having 2 mediums and a srm6 😦

[hexed musk]

you always your hands though
And a 17 damage kick

[upper warren]

That's true! DFA if you're gutsy

[upper warren]

The scaling on this art is wild. I wonder what their style guide looked like back then

[quartz jasper]

Honestly this doesn’t look too off?

…except the ??battlemaster?? In the water is way too tall I think

[wet nova]

think that's the Templar

you can tell by the cross on the shoulder

I browse sarna way too damn much, I can recognize practically any battlemech

[quartz jasper]

Yeah the battlemaster’s head is the same shape but further up I think

Either way that image is honestly pretty solid, Im not sure what the complaint is

[indigo hinge]

I get what they mean, the Awesome does feel somewhat... small.

But that might also be the overhead angle.

[quartz jasper]

Honestly if anything the awesome felt kinda tall

[hexed musk]

Yeah that's a Templar, you can also tell by the torso mounts being so low on the body

[upper warren]

My personal issue is the awesome seems squater than it should be next to the infantry for scale.

Later BT art may have inflated the designs which is why I'm getting thrown me off

The Mech pilot outfits are perfect 10/10 no notes

It's that classic low perspective wide angle look you normally get that might be throwing me off

[upper warren]

This has been me ever since I was scrolling Sarna on Dial Up internet in the 90s. Just about everything pre FCCW is identifiable to me on sight LOL

[indigo hinge]

Who's That Omnimech, a timeless game.

[upper warren]

Oh this is neat

[indigo hinge]

Hmm, I could do that with my own designs.

I have similar plans for transparent bits on some MECHCOM minis. Though in that case, I'll just print the cloaks separately.

[hexed musk]

What king of the hill does to a mfer

[steep crest]

Hey, anyone know the battletech story with the company pretending to be incompetent and everyone but a dude's daughter was in on it?

[upper warren]

I'm very uncertain but was that the 2nd GDL book?

[steep crest]

Shrug

[hexed musk]

New forcepack dropped
https://store.catalystgamelabs.com/products/battletech-star-league-command-lance

T h u n d e r h a w k
...
Price went up. Not sure if that's because the Orion comes painted or just a price hike.

[upper warren]

(breathing in Steiner)

That's really rad

I was in my LGS and took a look at the ilClan source book and holy moly 50$ is a lot for the thin book

[spare parrot]

oooooooooo

[upper warren]

If you have minis and terrain

[hexed musk]

Oh, that's enticing.

[upper warren]

Need some low, wide angle shots on terrain. Makes em look big!

[upper warren]

Damn once I start getting Veteran and Elite pilots, the game really speeds up. Those 4/5 pilots really slow the game down

Also is Sarna down for you folks?

[hexed musk]

Nope.

[upper warren]

New battletech novel? Poor Jade Falcons, whole clan really took the L

[upper warren]

Ok... Maybe it's time to catch up. Everything after a bonfire of worlds. That's.... A lot of novels

[upper warren]

Princess is bullying me with 1v3 missions

[upper warren]

i love this very silly universe

[junior zodiac]

Deepest Lore

also clanners have cartoons?!

[supple jetty]

yup

clan spaniel

[junior zodiac]

i guess i just...

assumed kids just popped out 6ft and angry.

fully trained to kill lmao

[upper warren]

omg

[supple jetty]

they still scored a field goal though

[hexed musk]

Banshee died turn 1

Through armor criticals do be dangerous

[hexed musk]

Ok I oneshot his griffin back it's cool

[sterile sleet]

Which if the catalysm games lances is the best for a new player?

[hexed musk]

I like the IS command lance. Out of stock on the catalyst site but you can get it elsewhere and it should be back eventually.

[sterile sleet]

Gotcha thanks

[upper warren]

So I know it's just megamek, but I am proud of my Awesome's pilot for bagging 3 assaults with cockpit shots. Thank you Called Shot!

[teal crater]

It’s out!

https://prideanthology.itch.io/2024

[upper warren]

Yeeeeesssss

[teal crater]

It’s a beefy one, I’m very excited and still abit surprised to have a story in there. Wrote the sixth one in here in a mad dash this march, but I’m happy how it turned out.

[hexed musk]

Pov: You underestimated the trashcan

[teal crater]

The Atlas pilot probably questioning their life choices down in that creek

[hexed musk]

He took the insult personally. The urban mech later got a little too close and the Atlas put a 20 damage boot through the can's side torso.

The Samsonov Atlas is a frighteningly scary mech in the hands of a 2/4 pilot. 2 PPC's and an AC20 is a very effective set of guns.

In this game the thing killed two urbies, a blackjack, and a thunderbolt.

[upper warren]

Good lord

[upper warren]

Hey Thyla, just fyi

[teal crater]

Yeah; the editor’s are working with Itch to get this sorted. Probably due to chuds’ false reports and/or spike of activity at release. Or the suspicious suspicious Finns behind this like me

[upper warren]

Damn chuds. Glad to hear it's getting taken care of.

[teal crater]

Las year was apparently much worse on that front, so everyone’s dealing well

https://fixupx.com/freyjaerlings/status/1796635013963825284?s=46

[teal crater]

Friend that helped me with the anthology story surprised me today.

These were waiting for me at my office:

It’s the OpFor from my story. And I still don’t know how he pulled this off, living in another country and all

[hexed musk]

That's super neat!

[indigo hinge]

Oh hell yeah. I love the bigger design. Is that something Marauder related?

[hexed musk]

Looks like a nightstar to me. Spooky mech.

[indigo hinge]

Oohh, fair.

[teal crater]

Yeah Nightstar

A horrible beauty of a mech

[upper warren]

You folks ever do something like a set piece fight? Like defend the palace grounds and like half the map is an ever escalatingly large urban map made to look like a castle or something?

Or like... A map obviously inspired by a castle/fortress and it's surrounding landscape?

[hexed musk]

I did with my brother in law, right now while I train up the new community I've started we're staying pretty vanilla

[left dew]

wowie

I haven't played battletech in ten thousand years and never learned it properly but i really like it so i will try tomorrow

[indigo hinge]

Hell yeah. Welcome aboard.

[wet nova]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbOZE3dye24 this looks like it will help

linked by winged over at #video-game-discussion

[sterile sleet]

Alpha strike or battletech

[left dew]

battletech

[hexed musk]

I got to use a Rifleman RFL-3N for the first time.
That thing does cook

[upper warren]

Lol nice

[hexed musk]

The point at which the rifleman can no longer effectively move is a lower heatpoint then when the rifleman can no longer effectively fire its guns

So man, its so tempting to just pour it on

[upper warren]

Pour the gas on the fire

[indigo hinge]

Rifle comes first, man comes second.

[indigo hinge]

Did a little test scheme for my Gouderak Guardians. Still thinking about basing.

Figured that I might as well try to get my company done before my new printer arrives. With the amount of BT stls I found in a bundle, I can whip up new companies within mere hours.

[upper warren]

That's so awesome

[summer mulch]

Rad as hell, looks kinda cosmic.

[indigo hinge]

It's a dark blue undercoat, with panels painted purple. Camera makes it look sort of cosmic, indeed. It's more subtle in person, but still keeps it interesting to look at.

[azure stream]

Trying to think up a siimple emblem design for my mercs.

[indigo hinge]

What's their lore? Perhaps that can provide some inspiration.

[azure stream]

Executioner-B had a long hard day of soaking fire from a Stalker and Longbow and so decided to take a little nap.

[eternal basin]

I'll be honest, learning about the "Unseen" mechs has made me wanna get some Dougram or Macross model kits cause I think it be funny.

[hexed musk]

That poor baby

[azure stream]

She earned a rest while they just kind of dragged the 'mech into the dropship.

[azure stream]

LGS just announced a Solaris VII event. 2000 BV, 70 Ton limit, but I'm having trouble thinking of anything better than the "Fuck It, We Ball" that is a 2/2 Hunchback HBK-5H loaded with precision munitions.
Do I only get 4 AC/20 Shots? Yes. Will they hit? Almost certainly yes. And anything that doesn't kill has 3x20 unguided rockets thrown at it, too.

[supple jetty]

any tech limits?

a hunchie 2C 3 would be pretty solid

septicimia A for similar reasons

you could bring a 0/1 Fire Moth P if you hate your opponent for some reason

alternatively a downgraded septicimia B-Z because iJJ jump pulse tcomp

actually maybe not you'd have to sink piloting pretty low to fit 2k BV

CES-4S packs a HGauss, might be value there

NVA-H for memes

[azure stream]

Well damn I just checked and the cutoff year is 3080 so no Fire Moth P, but an H is fair game.
Backstab when I have initiative, and just leave when I don't.

[supple jetty]

hope to god your opponent dies to 100 damage to the face

shortly before your mech turns into slag

[azure stream]

It's fine, I can still fire 7 lasers while running and only build 1 heat.
The 1 Pilot Skill may be kind of pointless since it just fucking dies to 20 damage, but it does let me freely kick for 4 damage and another PSR.

[supple jetty]

the H imo suffers too much from short range

[supple jetty]

have you seen the TMMs a fire moth can hit?

it's stupid

it will consistently hit +4

though the P is really the good one

ice ferret D...

aww the J is 3120

the ice ferret J is dumb for very similar reasons to the fire moth P

[azure stream]

Yeah I'd prefer P and use it when I can but it's got a rollout date of 3132 so it's not allowed. I'm starting to have second thoughts though, since I'm likely to go up against things that also have Gunnery 0 or 1. So even with a +4 TMM I'm still getting hit by anything in the enemies arm(s) on 6-7s, and one hit is death.

[supple jetty]

well part of the trick with that is that with +4 you're also typically behind your opponent

since you have lol, lmao speed

but yeah you have a point the fire moth is extremely squishy

[azure stream]

Right, which is why I said anything in their arms. When they know I'm coming in they just stand still. If they can flip arms they just do that and, if not, can still bring 1 arm to bear with a torso twist. Assuming even Gunnery 2, they're hitting on 6s against a +4 TMM Moth.

[supple jetty]

true

ENF-6 NAIS

[azure stream]

Oh man, I haven't looked at the specs, but he looks radical as fuck.

[supple jetty]

snubs, LVSPL + tcomp

[hexed musk]

Ive been playing a solaris campaign for a while now
+4 tmm will not save you from pulse+tcomp

But if your opponents dont bring that, yeah you're unstoppable

[indigo hinge]

Goshawk's a bit too expensive, unless you want to give it a bad pilot.

My personal favourite mech is a Hollander BZK-G1. Had some great Solaris matches with that, because it will tear any light 'mech apart once it gets the armour open. Cluster ammo gave a locust four engine crits, two gyros, head damage, a broken leg, and an ammo explosion in one shot.

Needless to say, that pilot now goes by 'Executioner' as a callsign.

Phoenix Hawk LAM 1?

[hexed musk]

What I'm spooked for is that we've progressed to mediums and one player's ride is a custom Vapor Eagle with reflective armor

So I'm dealing with +3 TMM always and pulse TC combo back at me

Now, we can get SPA's including weapon mastery, so my current janky plan is a hunchback with WM, a UAC/20 and TC.

[indigo hinge]

Ooh, SPA's are fun.

That Hollander had sniper to cut his range mods in half.

[hexed musk]

Sniper is gross

The funniest build of the season was an up-engined locust with a heavy large laser and range master

So instead of +0/2/4 he had 4/2/0, and he'd run around at max range zapping people for a billion damage

[indigo hinge]

That is fairly hilarious.

For a little under 2.2K BV you could also get an Ares, maybe dumping the stats on the tactics officer could get it just under 2K. But that's a tad over the weight limit.

[quartz jasper]

I love SPAs

Between them and some of the truly strange melee options you can create a monster

[hexed musk]

I had a pretty boring build that ended up winning the tournament: a raven with set of ER lasers and an xpulse, a TC, and the key piece of the puzzle, reflective armor

I really wanted to do a melee mech for medium bracket but I think with like, 5 people running jumping abominations I wont be able to

[quartz jasper]

I think the trick is a melee mech kinda needs to try and be some kind of TSM jumping abomination, but I do not recall the intro date of TSM so

[hexed musk]

Its available to us
We're in 3067 this league

[quartz jasper]

Oh yknow what you can do

M-pods

[hexed musk]

SHOTGUN KNEES
i do have a build with those, claws, and tsm

[azure stream]

So on my end it's just standard BTech rules. No SPAs, no experimental, and (for some shit reason) no jumping. So I ball with the HBK-5H as planned, or use something like an Incubus and control range bands.

[hexed musk]

My other build plan is going all in with a UAC20

[quartz jasper]

I would personally always go talons, but

I dont think those are around yet

UAC20 would be really fun

[hexed musk]

My idea with the claws is that with a 50 ton mech claws provide a 1 hit kill to the dome once tsm is active, but the +1 to hit against a crowd I know will be evasive is hard to swallow

[cloud otter]

Y'all ever have the problem where you need to roll a random mech, but it has to be a Griffin?

[hexed musk]

Can't say i have...?

[brazen charm]

Hey question is there a discord server for playing battletech on tts

[hexed musk]

I'd be surprised if there was a large tts population for BT. Megamek fulfills pretty much everything you'd want for online play.

[indigo hinge]

I suppose Alpha Strike could be better played on TTS? But CBT is automated on MegaMek.

[azure stream]

Started making theme lists to run, behold:
Horned Owl, Shadow Hawk, Vapor Eagle, Black Hawk, and Raven
Together, they are Bird Force V

[hexed musk]

Conjurers are spooky boys.

[upper warren]

Alpha strike on TTS is good. Lots of figs to use

[cerulean valley]

You can probably check their subreddit for that. I know during the COVID period there were folk on different servers running practice games on TTS and MegaMek.

The main reason to use TTS over MegaMek for CBT is really so that you learn how to play the game without automation.

Or if you're throwing on optional rules which utilise reactions, which MegaMek doesn't support.

[upper warren]

Def learn the game before using the automation

[cerulean valley]

MegaMek makes playing games a lot easier but so much is happening behind the screen that you miss out on learning how to play. May not be a bad thing if you're only ever using MegaMek, but it does mean you might be slower to do your turns and need the rulebook handy at a table.

[upper warren]

https://www.reddit.com/r/battletech/s/lZXhvBCONP

Jesus Christ those missiles

[hexed musk]

Deadly effect studios is very tempting.

[indigo hinge]

I'm fairly certain I have a bunch of their effects in a pack I bought a while ago. Might try them out for shits and giggles after all.

[indigo hinge]

Oh yeah, it appears I do. Oh my.

[indigo hinge]

I... may have not been entirely happy with the effects in the bundle and just decided to make my own. The first test turned out pretty well.

[quartz jasper]

Finally painted a battletech mini!

[hexed musk]

Lets gooo

[indigo hinge]

Nice job. I like how the cockpit is distinctly different, yet still blends into the camo.

[hexed musk]

My banshee punched an ice ferret's head off. I'm so proud of him.

I really need to start tallying kills on the mini. There's so much space on the torso.

[upper warren]

Yes! What variant of the Banshee were you running?

[hexed musk]

3S. They weren't kidding, that thing is a terrifiying engine of destruction.

[upper warren]

The 3S is what I think of when I think about the Banshee, I always forget it was so middling with the 3E

[hexed musk]

I'll give the 3e credit, it is cheap

In matches purely weighed by BV it has its purpose as a punch bot - moment you start doing a chaos campaign or something where tonnage is relevant and it likely ceases to be worth the memes

Back to the 3s though, i straight up can't think of a better assault. It just batters targets at range and mauls them up close with barely a heat issue to think about.

[wet nova]

2 PPC and 1 AC10 are murderous yes

it's like an Awesome but can shoot more but can also explodwe

[supple jetty]

Hellstar maybe?

But a hellstar is an entirely different beast

[cerulean valley]

May I interest you in the Banshee 12S?

Take the 3S, swap to ClanSpec Lasers and XL engine. Swap the AC/10 for Gauss and the PPCs for ER versions and you're basically done.

[copper wind]

if you start looking at all tech levels it's not hard to find something better but for basetech the 3S is a contender for best assault mech out there

[supple jetty]

I like the 8S as far as banshees go

95 tons of TSM fueled rage

[hexed musk]

38 damage on a hatchet hit is extremely funny

There's assaults that'll core out

I think its interesting that in terms of BV playability there are very few bad banshees.

[supple jetty]

You don't pay to be large

[indigo hinge]

I know right? I want to print one up and give it a try in a game so badly.

[hexed musk]

All will be crushed under the unmitigated weight of my lyran girth

(More seriously this tends to be why playing clans into IS is really hard unless the IS player is either running a very fast team or a very skilled one)

A 3/4 timberwolf B has a good chance of 2 v 1'ing IS mechs but its very vulnerable to random chance and it costs enough that it needs to 2 v 1.

[indigo hinge]

You gotta convince the clanner to use zellbrigen and then fuck up their biggest threats with focus fire.

On a serious note, that might actually prove interesting. Introducing some sort of restraint for the clan player.

[hexed musk]

Oh, i was intending to say that in BV games the clanner is at a disadvantage

I think that giving something like free gunnery upgrades to clans in exchange for forced zellbrigan or something could be interesting though.

[indigo hinge]

Ohh, yes.

Cap their power in a different way while showing the difference.

[hexed musk]

I played a 10k game yesterday where I think I outweighed the clanner by a factor of 3: he had 2 lights, 2 mediums, and an assault vs my 2 assaults, a heavy, medium, and light, and 2 60 ton manticores

And I crushed him

[upper warren]

This was the original rule in tournaments back when they introduced them right?

[indigo hinge]

Was it? I have not been in the game for nearly long enough to know.

[hexed musk]

Stories from grognards online say that the zellbrigan rules predate bv

And its how clanners were balanced vs IS when tonnage was still the balancing metric

[indigo hinge]

But I have read parts of 'clanners are always 3/4 as opposed to 4/5', and I've read the Zellbrigen rules in at least one rulebook.

Fairly certain I've even come across bidding rules.

[hexed musk]

The big thing in BV is that you still have to pay for those 3/4 pilots, a x1.5 multiplier

[upper warren]

Batchall as well

Yeah clanners always start at 3/4. They were expected to batchall and abide zell. Or so say the grogs.

[indigo hinge]

So... you come with a bigger list, and bid away however much you think you won't need?

[hexed musk]

I think so. Narratively, cool as hell. My local playgroup started as only pick up games, but we've been shifting to narrative focus slowly, and I'll probably suggest this for the future.

[indigo hinge]

The bidding rules in TW are rather... slim, but they seem like a fun basis.

I'm slowly trying to pull some friends and even my partner into BT. I doubt the latter will have so much as a iota of interest in the narrative aspect, but perhaps others might be more easily convinced.

[upper warren]

Ok, so this has always bothered me. Why is the beginner box a wolverine vs griffin? I never felt like that was a even match up. The griffin feels so inadequate vs the wolverine

[indigo hinge]

The new one's a Griffin versus a Victor, IIRC.

Which, from the sheets, looked a little more balanced.

[upper warren]

A victor????

[hexed musk]

The old beginner box was a griffin vs. a vindicator, which points-wise is pretty uneven. Griffin probably takes that one.

On a limited-size battlefield victor eat's griffin's lunch.

[supple jetty]

In BV games clanners win by fielding fast and optimized mechs that can outmaneuver the lyran wall of steel

Jumpy clan LPL boats can cut even good IS introtech mechs to pieces by leveraging their superior mobility and concentration of force but yeah if you get in a slugging match it favors IS forces

Also a lot of clan mechs are really badly overgunned and therefore overcosted

[hexed musk]

Yeah, clanners must execute defeat in detail to win. I actually really enjoy playing that style, but I can't deny that the amount of steel an IS list can field is easier to manage.

[supple jetty]

alternatively you field things like the hellstar that are just optimized murder machines

[hexed musk]

Weirdly I think clans are a lot better in AS where long range shooting is easier and its faster to decisively remove pieces from the board

[supple jetty]

Or a turkina Z

unironically at 10k BV two turkina Zs and some boggarts is terrifying

[hexed musk]

The warhawk is pretty terrible in a lot of configs in classic but is a terrifying machine of war in every AS game I've seen it fielded.

[supple jetty]

only two actual mechs but their ability to Delete lets them kill a whole lot of IS mechs

[hexed musk]

I have a painted turkina I haven't taken for a spin yet. So tempting to goon out and bring a Z... will be warning my opponent first though

[supple jetty]

It commits crimes

[indigo hinge]

Vindicator, my bad. My brain is operating on 10% capacity.

[upper warren]

It's ok! Their names are similar. Lord knows I've gotten some mixed up when I was not on my A game

[quartz jasper]

The one I have is a griffin v vindicator yeah, but it uses quite modified rules which smoothes out the matchup a lot

[upper warren]

What's up with the rules? They exclude heat, right?

[quartz jasper]

No heat, lower numbers of armour and structure I think

Pretty sure the mechs are also just kinda brought in line

(I’m painting both of them as cappellans though so I can start having a real list lol)

[upper warren]

Wild! QSR that don't quite do the game justice are always a little odd. Like those one wod qs that uses d6 and not d10... So weird

[quartz jasper]

Honestly I think it does do it justice pretty okay

Like, it’s far from the base rules but they’re fun for what they are

(Also the models are just great quality which helps) (and it includes a bunch of printed standees)

IMO it’s an awesome product

But yeah I do see the complaints, no heat is very weird

[hexed musk]

Honestly for me the bigger issue is no minimum ranges, there's no reason for any unit to not facedive a target

[upper warren]

Yeah that's what made me side eye the wolverine Griffin fight, the minimums on lrms and PCs are pretty rough to fight with when your opponent has a ML and SRM

[indigo hinge]

PPCs with no min range is wild.

I gave that set to my friend for her birthday, but I already gave her a different demo with at least the full AGOAC rules and then a little.

She's coming over soon to paint them up, as well as the light and assault I printed to round out a lance for her.

[hexed musk]

If there's no minimum range I think the Griffin actually has that one

Assuming 2n griffin and 6r wolverine, the griffin is doing 20ish damage on a perfect turn vs. 22 on the wolverine, but the griffin has longer range and bigger clusters

[upper warren]

Yeah with a lot of the other mechanics taken out it's a more balanced fight

[hexed musk]

Griffins are funky because most of the snipey ones are just kinda weird to use - theyre expensive for their damage but very, very durable if you use them as intended. At the same time, to use them as intended makes their battlefield presence negligible

Whereas a wolverine is an extremely simple trooper goober

I suspect a griffin would prove much better in a combined arms meta where armored vehicles and light tanks are much more common. It beats all of them in mobility, has the guns to poke holes in medium armor or break tank treads with the LRM, and is very tanky at standoff range.

[upper warren]

Yeah!

[quartz jasper]

oh that is true yeah

honestly it's a pretty good rate for just models standees and maps if nothing else

[hexed musk]

I like the box, it got me into the game.

[supple jetty]

This is the issue with a lot of fast snipers

Also why the best snipers are things like Awesomes and Hellstars that can get into a good position and deliver a lot of damage for a long time

[hexed musk]

The 2N griffin I think is a lot spookier than the 1N
ERPPC, 2 SRM6 racks. A reliable long range hole puncher and some gnarly close in sandblasting.

[wet nova]

ppc and srm is always a good combo, as long as it's not running too hot

[upper warren]

That is a very scary loadout

[cerulean valley]

The QSR/Beginner Box for Battletech is kinda interesting in that you play it once, then get some data about which parts of the game the new player likes, before either simplifying the game and increasing model count for Alpha Strike, or adding depth and complexity to Classic

[upper warren]

Oh that's a great point

[cerulean valley]

Battletech being like five different yet compatible systems is both something it suffers from while also being a selling point.

I'm still hoping they bring back the detailed duelling rules that were in the old Solaris 7 sets.

[upper warren]

I wish they had more straight forward force building rules for Battle Force. Doing lance by lance, company by company, battalion by battalion is a chore!

[indigo hinge]

https://solarisvii.games/rules.html
Perhaps this helps scratch an itch?

[cerulean valley]

Not quite. The older dueling rules had 4 rounds to a standard battletech rounds and included rules for things like weapon cycling rates, targeting specific locations and components, and firing on the more/while jumping.

[indigo hinge]

That does sound rather fun, I'll give you that.

This flying circus style merc company is getting more extravangant by the minute.

[hexed musk]

Gosh, i need another phoenix hawk.

The 3K and 4PL versions have never let me down.

[quartz jasper]

I’ve finished both the mechs from the beginner box!

[indigo hinge]

Good job! That's half a lance already.

[azure stream]

I really need to wrap these boys up.

[wet nova]

niceeeee

[supple jetty]

oh no

[upper warren]

Lol

[junior zodiac]

Clanner in ice

"I'm sure glad we're out here and here's in there and"

[indigo hinge]

"And I would've gotten away with it if it wasn't for you meddling spheroids!"

[hexed musk]

"I knew it! Just Imperalism in an animal mask!"

[indigo hinge]

Damn it, now I want to find a buch of 'mechs for the gang and a leopard as the van.

If pink panther is a cannon merc, then it's not too far-fetched.

[hexed musk]

There's gotta be a panther somewhere that a merc made pink.

[indigo hinge]

There is. It is canon.

https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ace_Darwin's_WhipIts

[azure stream]

Scooby and Shaggy piloting a Celerity CLR-05-X and Fire Moth P, respetively. Can outrun anything and, as an added bonus, the Fire Moth can wave its arms around in terror.

[indigo hinge]

This is... acceptable. Yeah, agreed.

I kind of want to give Velma a cyclops for the glasses.

[indigo hinge]

Ah, PPCs.

[quartz jasper]

vtollls

I'm honestly so jealous of someone playing combined arms battletech in person

[indigo hinge]

Don't get your hopes up, this was against myself, unfortunately.

Figured I'd make fun of MW5's adjudication system when cheating in Arena matches by bringing inappropriate weight class mechs.

As the anchor of our lance, I've developed a tendency to bring assault mechs to a knife fight, so I'd see how well four Warriors versus one King Crab would play out on the tabletop.

The result was even funnier than I expected.

• VTOL #1 got oneshot by a PPC as seen above. Quick turn one.
• VTOL #2 and #3 managed to sidestream right off the edge of the map as they tried to get behind the KCrab. Given its lack of torso twist, it was completely harmless from the back. Two of the three failed miserably and took a long slip off into the sunset.
• VTOL #4 succeeded in getting behind the 'mech, peppering it with some SRMs, including a head hit right away, then slipped away behind cover on turn three, miraculously dodging fire by margins of 1 on several rolls, and was forced to approach again on turn 4 as it became clear that the waiting game was not one it could win. When it approached behind some tree cover, AC-10 shells proved tougher than wood as they tore right through the cockpit.
  40 seconds, and the adjudication was gone. Felt remarkably accurate to MW5.

[hexed musk]

My play group is inching towards combined arms. So far I've broken the ice with bulldogs and manticore tanks. They're frightening fire support pieces. A couple of guys now have their KS kit for other vehicles too. Excited to see those in play.

[indigo hinge]

Sounds fun. And yeah, I hope the kickstarter will be a good starting point for folks.

[hexed musk]

I really want to start seeing vtols and infantry in my games so that mechs like the rifleman and vulcan become more relevanr.

Oh also we use elementals and they're spooky

[indigo hinge]

Still gotta give those a try. They feel like a real good tool to tangle up a 'mech for a relatively low cost while you pepper it.

[quartz jasper]

both 😔 and 😌

[hexed musk]

Absolutely. They're more than capable of devouring mechs by themselves as well - a barrage of 5 small lasers and effectively an SRM 10 will burn down many mechs fast.

I got bodied by a grognard in our group who used 3 elemental groups to poison the best cover on the map before trapping me in the corner.

[indigo hinge]

Outstanding move.

[hexed musk]

Thought i was doing well when my Nova Cat dismembered his scout turn 2, but it had already accomplished its goal of elemental drop.

[indigo hinge]

I'm getting more and more friends infected with BT, even my partner, who is not at all the tabletop kind of nerd, but seems to be enjoying Battletech far more than average. But combined arms... that'll be a while.

[indigo hinge]

Little use shooting down the bomber when the payload is already on it's way, I suppose.

[upper warren]

Was talking to a friend who didn't realize BT was also a combined arms game and is now like... Into the idea of playing

[indigo hinge]

Hell yeah. Time to field orbital sattelites.

[upper warren]

How much BV would it cost to bring a nuke to a battle lol

Just like... 1 stinger and a orbital nuke on the way.

[hexed musk]

I believe there are actually rules for "Davy Crockett" tactical nuclear munitions for arrow 4 systems.

Half kiloton.

There are larger yield bombs as well but they are aerospace and warship sized.

[indigo hinge]

Yeah there's rules for 'em. As well as the repercussions for using 'em.

IIRC, one of the general rules of nukes is "Anything on the same map sheet or two can be considered dead, or worse."

[hexed musk]

There's a reason entire planets can switch hands via the work of John Mercenary and his 12 goons

People rolling out the nukes get really, really big coalitions to form in response.

[indigo hinge]

That sounds like one hell of a jazz band.

[upper warren]

Hahahahaha

[elder ridge]

Yeah Davy Croket A-IV's are a thing you can bring but they don't have extra BV coust as they are just baned/not iavable equment for most forces, though there was the infamious case of a urbine bringing a bunch at a turny at the start of the Jihad era

But that story is more about how the ruls for off/on map artilery wer tightent up after the Urbie was counted as on-map, on a naboring table when it started to launch nukes

[upper warren]

Fantastic

[hexed musk]

Also each one weighs a ton, make that shot count lmao

[zenith raft]

hmm

[indigo hinge]

I'm trying to get some people into ATOW, with a plan to run a little Solaris VII campaign. I think I've just found a great light 'mech to pit against them.

I'll have them fight a pilot known as 'the raccoon', piloting a trashcan... that packs a punch.

Seeing as two of the three potential victims have played MW5 with me, that'll draw some reactions from them for sure.

[upper warren]

How do you feel atow plays? I've looked at it and it's been a hurdle to wrap my head around it

[indigo hinge]

No clue yet, but I'm curious to find out.

[upper warren]

Ok question for people who read the novels. How do you feel about having a lot the characters die off screen? Thinking about Aris Sung and Archer Christifori

Well maybe it's feels like off screen for me who had to dip from BT for like a decade

[indigo hinge]

Character creation took some figuring out, but now that I've run it once, I reckon I can do it again easily enough. It just takes some time. Leaves you with an instant character backstory. Skill checks and such feel easy enough.

[upper warren]

Parts of it I like a lot, such as the life paths

[eternal basin]

https://fixupx.com/emwattnot/status/1845445518178095224?t=fbfD7FRbDCVFRxDU9SqsWQ&s=19

[cerulean valley]

Helps if you have a spreadsheet to track it. It makes the final optimisation step a lot easier.

[cerulean valley]

The clunkiest part of AToW is probably the combat. More specifically how armour and cover works. Different layers that each individually apply a different level of resistance and then deteriorate.

[indigo hinge]

I was planning to run CBT for combat, or did you mean hand-to-hand?

[cerulean valley]

Yeah, infantry/person scale stuff

It's not complicated on its own, but the system handles armour and cover in the same way, using the AP/BD system that tracks damage to your cover, armour, and anything in between.

It also just has a ton of rolls each time you shoot a gun.

[indigo hinge]

Oh that's wild.

[cerulean valley]

Yeah, it's more rolls than firing your mech's AC.
You have an attack roll, (location roll), (wound roll), consciousness check, and bleeding check.

[cerulean valley]

At the least once a couple of bullets connect most fights are over quick

[waxen fulcrum]

There's BT fans here too! Who would have guessed?

[indigo hinge]

I see. Please tell me there's no such thing as hand-held LBXs?

[cerulean valley]

Luckily no, shotguns are just high damage low armour pen and the burst/full auto firemodes add to maximum damage of the attack rather than resolve multiples.

[elder ridge]

yeah multi-attack rolls for handheld wepions was a thing FASA got rid of in both MechWarrior and ShadowRuun back in like 90? and no one has had a common sence fail bad enought to bring them back snece FASA died at the hand of Harmony Giold

[agile jetty]

What’s the best way to start learning modern battletech? Any specific game systems?

[hexed musk]

So you've really got three options

1. grab a starter set and see if you like it. This is a really simplified version of the classic game, but it has the granulaity of movement and target locations that will let you know if you're interested or not.
2. jump right in with A Game of Armored Combat, the full classic game with a limited set of weapons and equipment.
3. Battle Tech Alpha Strike, a newer, much faster playing game for skirmish-esque gameplay or company+sized engagements.

[agile jetty]

I see!

[hexed musk]

I believe you can get the starter sets of both classic and alpha strike for free and the game heavily encourages proxies so you can try those out without spending money

[agile jetty]

Wait free? Free rules?

[hexed musk]

Yeah sorry free rules.
Megamek is an online client that fully automates classic battletech, but in the same vein as Magic The Gathering Online

So its very function over form

[elder ridge]

But yeah you can legaly play BattleTech for free. You can just use a Chit as a proxy and yeah there are free rules

[hexed musk]

The explicit rules of BT is that a unit marker must be

1. distinct from all other minis
2. have a defined front
   Otherwise its all free for your choice

[agile jetty]

😭 damn urbanmech is hated

It does look a little.. silly?

[elder ridge]

Urbies are an Angery Murder Trashcan's that are vary cheep points wise. like you can in some cases birng a lance of them for the points caoust of a Claner Mech. wich is funny to do, btu also borders on Init Sinking

but yes The Urbie is a copntentious mech in part becouse of the memes

[hexed musk]

Let me be very clear that Urbies are horrible in anything that is not urban combat

Something like a panther is only a bit more in BV cost but will eat an urbie's lunch every day of the week

[elder ridge]

They do OK in extreamly hilly or canyon filled areas but yeah they are only good in there nice

[agile jetty]

also I can’t decide between fed suns and canopus both are cool

Are there models for the Legacy? Can I run it without needing to be a part of ComStar?

[elder ridge]

There should be, and it's a WoB Mech and is extenct post Jihad so not not relay

Well there are seperate rules about mech avabilty for doing Solarius stuff VS like normal Btech

But Most WoB mechs are not populare in the fiction of the game post Jihad becosue of all the terrorisem and warcrime the WoB did

[agile jetty]

That’s true ngl

[upper warren]

The celestial line look so spooky

[quartz jasper]

they're not all too good at that either tbh

like they certainly have their advantages in it but...

it's just a bad mech lmao

the charger of light mechs

...kind of an inverse charger actually

[agile jetty]

It looks derpy..

Crab my beloved

[hexed musk]

In any situation they are good, it is purely due to BV.

Now crab is a scrungly boy that works

[quartz jasper]

it is cheap as heck

crabs are great

it also has a big version which is the coolest mech in the game

[hexed musk]

I have a lot of other assaults I prefer but the big Crab is very cool

[quartz jasper]

Mechanically it's only sorta okay but I love the modern design of it

flat fuck

[agile jetty]

I like fast crab

[summer mulch]

I really enjoyed learning that Urbanmechs do have some popularity in-setting, but only on a state military scale where leaders want 'mechs that are cheap to produce and replace. They're less useful in actual games because you're commanding a handful of lances at most that are looking to actually win the fight, not win a war of attrition with someone else's industrial economy.

[hexed musk]

Urbies are cheap shitboxes like real life field guns designed to fit firepower in the most minimal investment. Its a part of the lore I love in BT that lancer sometimes misses.

As my playgroup begins integrating combined arms, i'd like to have an ultra low BV mini campaign where urbies are actually an investment

And something like a wolverine is a major threat

[agile jetty]

Can we use this to talk about the new videogame too?

[elder ridge]

there is a separate thread in the video games forum for the BattleTech vido games

[supple jetty]

the issue with the urbie is that its role is seriously contested by a hetzer and while the urbie is marginally cheaper the hetzer is lowkey actually better which is excruciatingly painful to say

also you can stuff a hetzer full of precision ammo and watch it mulch lights that try to dive the missile boats it's guarding and the R60L just doesn't have the ammo for it

[hexed musk]

Yeah at trashbucket prices mechs really stop having any benefits over vehicles

[cerulean valley]

https://bg.battletech.com/downloads/

Take a look at the Quick Start rules here if you have a printer. Classic Battletech is more granular and uses smaller forces, Alpha Strike uses larger forces and simplified statblocks. Both Quick Start rules are simpler than their full counterparts and use stripped down systems.

[cerulean valley]

That's what Variants are for. I like the 001 and 009 setups.

[agile jetty]

Can I run an all light mech set up?

[hexed musk]

in the tabletop! Yes! I've seen arguments that in the modern era light spam isn't just good, it's optimal

Battletech really isn't competitive though, so run what you want and lights can absolutely be a big part of that

[agile jetty]

Oh okie!

[cerulean valley]

One thing you'll soon come to find if you delve into the optional rules is that the BTech rule writers have peered into the abyss and gone a bit mad, resulting in there being rules for nearly every situation, some of which are very finnicky and hard to actually use at a table.

[hexed musk]

at least once you learn the basics you can pick and choose the forbidden rules of Nylanthrotep as you desire

[supple jetty]

anti-TSM gas

hiding

command consoles

ECM

[supple jetty]

Fire Moth Ps my beloathed

[cerulean valley]

Think of it like an RPG rather than a wargame in terms of rulestructure. Sure there are rules for dehydration, electronic warfare, and dysentry, but you don't need those to play.

[hexed musk]

dear god the Firemoth

Horned Owl is less obnoxious but just as scary, and less difficult to screw up with.

[cerulean valley]

Did someone say heavy lasers on a light mech? shudders

Oh wait that's the Fire Moth G

[supple jetty]

fire moth P is 36 damage of micro pulse lasers

and way too much move

[cerulean valley]

oh geez

I remember the G being a nightmare with 28 damage of Improved Heavy Mediums and a T-Comp.

It runs too fast and always hits.

[supple jetty]

the P has a 25 hex run and 12 micro pulse lasers

[hexed musk]

There's a reason I keep a Phoenix Hawk 3-PL on hand

[supple jetty]

so it pops up behind you, deals 36 damage to the rear then vanishes

oh also it's only 841 BV so you can take a whole pile of the things

[hexed musk]

IS pulses and a Targeting computer lets me keep the fucking lights off me without being oppressive

The IS certainly has the tools to keep lights off their asses but people don't tend to bring enough for pick up games.
Always bring your anti-light protection with you

[cerulean valley]

My favourite anti-light protection is Thunder/FASCAM

With the problem that I tend to accidentally plant mines in places I want to go later, and my Assaults are fat and have trouble finding a new path that doesn't involve taking damage to the legs.

(and that sometimes the lights just jump over my impromptu minefields)

[hexed musk]

If you're playing Clan, elementals are good for making sure that scouts don't get too close, though you're not going to be hunting them down.

Something like a nova cat in a treeline with elemental support is hard to dislodge.

[supple jetty]

AIV/artillery in general is a fairly decent solution

also hetzers with precision ammo

or a fuckload of savannah masters

[hexed musk]

Yeah, lights are by no means untouchable. It's just that people tend not to bring the counters to games until they get fucking smoked at least once

[cerulean valley]

Which is basically the same thing as filling the boards with lights but somehow less sporting.

500 Savannah Masters

Infantry Field Guns with LACs and Precision are pretty great at discouraning flanking attempts as well.

[supple jetty]

yeah if I'm going to bring clan cheese to the table I'm going to do so with units that can at least theoretically be killed

two turkina Zs and some boggarts

[hexed musk]

Get. Out.

[supple jetty]

no

ok fine, alternate bid

it's a republic theme force with the proposal that it's a recon unit forced to adapt its drones for combat due to losses taken by frontline combat units

[hexed musk]

Lmao
I will beat you with bnc-3es

And prayer

[supple jetty]

40 CLR-05-Xs and 1000 BV of random controller mechs

wait sorry forgot the drone rules

20 CLR-05-Xs, 5 diggs drone control tanks, and idk something that costs 1500 BV

[agile jetty]

I can’t decide on my favorite faction being Canopus, Free States or Fed Suns

I don’t feel confident enough to start making my own factions and it’s not the same level of Warhammer grimderp where everyone sucks I kinda like some of these factions ngl

Do factions have special rules?

[supple jetty]

nope

[agile jetty]

Awww

[supple jetty]

ok fine, third bid, it's a stotzing militia force that's just 18 desert scorpions

[hexed musk]

kinda based

the only "rules" is that factions have certain lists of units they can "cannonically" take if you care about that

[supple jetty]

lowkey against most lists the desert scorpions are probably more threatening than the turkinas

[hexed musk]

Draconis Combine gets lots of PPC toters, Fedsuns love their ACs, mercenaries tend to have worse but quirkier machines.

There are also mechs that tend to be exclusively one faction. You don't find grand dragons in the ranks of anyone but kurita for decades.

[cerulean valley]

Kiiind of? In that the Factions have special rules at the Macro scale. If you're playing a campaign at the galactic level then they have stuff to represent their politics, culture, and industry.
At the ground level, some canon units have optional special rules that might affect force deployment and tactics, but that's mostly used in special campaigns and scenarios (like the fast guerilla regiment being able to leave the board and come back on the same side at a later turn).

But for 99% of tabletop games factions aren't differentiated rules wise.

So with the ability to justify fielding just about any unit and no rule differentiation, Faction choice is really about who you like.

[agile jetty]

Canopus sweep

[hexed musk]

Canopus is cool. I need to paint a lance, I just keep getting side tracked

[indigo hinge]

Part of that, for me personally, is to blame on Mechwarrior 5. The Capellans have an AC/20 Urbie. You try seeing one of your lancemates vaporise in a shot or two and not hating them.

Or worse, the Arena Turbie. That thing has some upgrades that make it absurdly fast, instead of the usual slow thing I could overtake on my bicycle.

[hexed musk]

The mw5 yaml mods make the urbies fucking as durable as some heavies too

[indigo hinge]

Yikes.

Yeah we've lost our Locust player on several occasions.

Just pike to Hunchbacks.

Even my second in command's Phoenix Hawk is not safe.

[agile jetty]

Does Canopus pilot a specific mech flavor often

[indigo hinge]

You can check on the Master Unit List which type of mechs they tend to use.

Let me find the right list.

https://www.masterunitlist.info/Faction/Details/33

If you hit one of the time periods, you can open the Battlemech list and look over all the variants that they tend to use. It's a lot of data at once, but picking out names and looking them up on Sarna can work wonders for a start.

[cerulean valley]

None of the factions are as pants shittingly evil as anything in 40k, but they're generally some flavour of facist, authoritarian, monarchist, or imperialist.
And they all have skeletons in the closet.

[agile jetty]

Canopus sweep

(I don’t know what’s bad with Canopus yet)

[cerulean valley]

During the Succession Wars they have domestic production of the Locust, Stinger, and Shadowhawk iirc.

[agile jetty]

I see!

[cerulean valley]

Later on they get a Marauder factory and their own set of Canopus specific designs, along with shared production of Capellan stuff.

[hexed musk]

Canopus tends to get capellan handdowns until the dark age

[cerulean valley]

sexism in their early history, generally lax laws enabling rampant human trafficking in the succession wars periods, later eras they tighten up but get really involved with their Cappellan allies. Incestuously involved even.

[agile jetty]

Ah yeah that’s true

I liked them because overall Canopus, Fed Suns and Free Worlds seem.. alright

Like the Tau in 40k or a modern nation state

Rather than whatever Kurita or the Clans have going on

God the Clans are wild

[cerulean valley]

Lol they are

[supple jetty]

they sure are

[agile jetty]

Me in the first five minutes of Clans: LETS GO BRAINWASHING!!!

[cerulean valley]

I'm a Lyran fan myself. They've got hilarious problems with entitled and argumentative nobles running the place, horrible imperialist rulers, and an intelligence network that isn't so much spies and more three terrorist and counter-terrorist groups in a trenchcoat fighting to be the person on top.

The FedSuns meanwhile love to bring freedom to their neighbours by imposing their monarchic, fuedalist rule then withdrawing all support outside of demands from distant New Avalon. I think they've got some of the biggest wealth/quality of life gaps between low/middle income and higher income.
Meanwhile the Free Worlds League has been in a state of martial law/emergency for most of their existence.

[hexed musk]

Happens to the best of us.

[cerulean valley]

Tex's lore series and general memes have made Taurians out to be the most nuke happy folk in Battletech.
This is a lie. The true answer is the Free Worlds League.
The Taurians have like a defensive perimeter of atomics and use stuff like the five kiloton Alamo or in the case of orbital defence, the specialised one megaton DropBuster.

The FWL were the first to mass produce a 3 Megaton Warhead specifically for saturated bombardments of planets. Do you know what they called it? They called it the "Asset Management Weapon"

There's a reason the Lyran/FWL border is noted to have the biggest number of completely depopulated worlds.

[shrewd plover]

Am trying to figure out how many LRMs

Hahaha

[cerulean valley]

All the LRMs

Full Star of Bane 3s

[shrewd plover]

Was considering 3-4 lrm carriers to sit in the back

[agile jetty]

Damn

I guess the FWL isn't as nice as I thought

Once again canopus sweep (I still dunno if catgirls exist yet)

[cerulean valley]

Oh they're nice.

Just that this is a case of "nice for an interstellar polity that survived this long in a war footing"

[shrewd plover]

3 lrm carriees 6 savannah masters hmmmm

Leaves a lot of points

[elder ridge]

IWRC they exiest as an example of what cosmetci cyberwhare is like in the setting

spookble(🥞) ↩️

[Reply to:](#1161695907255963709 message) Once again canopus sweep (I still dunno if catgirls exist yet)

[cerulean valley]

If the era allows for it may I recommend the DI Morgan and a C3 spotter?

[shrewd plover]

3 demolisher?

[shrewd plover]

Too early sadly

Clan invasion

My narrative ass brain also wants a command vehicle to park nearbyhahaha

[cerulean valley]

Me adding ammo-trucks to my list.

[shrewd plover]

Can we?

[cerulean valley]

Yeah, there's an ordnance transport that costs 47 BV

And sub 1-ton support trucks can be made using the support vehicle rules.

I think there's a record sheet out there for some civilian motorbike

[shrewd plover]

Oooo

Adding 2 ammo carriers for flavour

Hahahaha

[agile jetty]

https://www.reddit.com/r/battletech/s/MxADeIBGFX

[upper warren]

So what does adding vehicles like the salvage trucks, ammo trucks, etc add to a match?

[cerulean valley]

Depends. Some might have a pintle mounted machine gun, or something smaller like a infantry machine gun

You can store cargo on them.

Like coffee, spare uniforms, or ammo.

And there's rules for reloading ammo if it's a full ton of mech/vehicle ammo

[upper warren]

So they are important in campaign

[cerulean valley]

It takes far too many turns to be practical, but if you have an arty park and stack the ammo truck, arty vehicle, and infantry squad on the same hex you can keep firing arty non stop.

For something like the Sniper gun, it'll take em 10 turns to expend a ton of ammo so if you start loading at 5 shells left, they get a new ton loaded just as you finish the last.

[cerulean valley]

Yeah, or as objectives.

[quartz jasper]

Battle tech is honestly incredible as a more narrative-focused wargame (and still pretty okay as a competitive one)

[indigo hinge]

True that. Even your regular games can be described as scenes from the books.

Except the parts where the books do crit fishing in reverse, that still confuses me.

They fire missiles first, then the big hitters.

[quartz jasper]

I think in the fiction it makes some sense even if it is mechanically backwards

Yknow, sandpapering the enemy and then actually getting through the armour with the big guns

But since every crit is equivalent it is very mechanically backwards

[indigo hinge]

Yeah, true that.

[summer mulch]

I like that the FWL has people at least attempting to implement democracy so despite martial law the military still has to worry about budget cuts when they piss representatives off

which is why they like the Awesome so much

[cerulean valley]

It makes a bit more sense when you can aim as well. Like sandblasting to weaken and then popping a heavy hit aimed shot into the bit you know you can penetrate.

[hexed musk]

Its also just a pretty awesome machine

[indigo hinge]

With certain mechs the name just... clicks.

[wet nova]

Awesome really looks like a mech that says 'of course I am' when another mech asks if it can live up to its name

[hexed musk]

I haven't played a ton of true 3025 without any sldf kit, but man I would not want to engage an 8Q without some sort of trick.

Sure, you can get under its guns but there's still some stupid srm light such as a javelin probably lurking at its heels to keep you away.

[upper warren]

Plop a SRM carrier next to it for support

[agile jetty]

Friendship ended with Fire Hawk, now Phoenix Hawk, Wasp, and Locust are best friends

and the catgirls r canon

[hexed musk]

Tough day at the office.

[agile jetty]

Alright!

My intended Canopus list is 1 of every Canopus homegrown mech, and a Maurader

[hexed musk]

Oh yeah that's the good shit

Typically you can rely on a lot of the IS classics to be in Canopus's roster. Orions, Griffins, Phoenix Hawks, Thunderbolts, Trebuchets, and Stalkers are more than capable of drowning your opponent in cheap, proven machines.

[upper warren]

Those are some good mechs

12 shadow hawks shooting ac 5s in a battle line like it's the Napoleonic wars

[hexed musk]

Man, Shadowhawks demonstrate that in mech-on-mech the AC/5 really should have been, like, an AC/8

[supple jetty]

yup

iirc they're like an AC9 in HBS BT, right?

[hexed musk]

I think so?

[cerulean valley]

Shadowhawk is pretty decent against combined arms

At the least.

It's got a tool for everything

AC with flak or precision for VTOLs and Aircraft, SRM with infernoes for Tanks, MGs for infantry

[hexed musk]

True.

[upper warren]

What does AC8 and 9 mean?

[cerulean valley]

Basically in the video games they did the equivalent of 9 point of damage rather than 5

[agile jetty]

Cant find any info on sarna

Is canopus still around today?

It only briefly mentions their current situation during the Clan Invasuin

[upper warren]

Yeah they are around today. Lots of the action is happening elsewhere. Terra, the Hinterlands, New Avalon, Wolf Empire.

Tamar

[agile jetty]

Oh ok! Yippee!

[upper warren]

https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Magistracy_of_Canopus#Gallery

The Maps are up to date up to 3145

It's interesting bc it feels like such a wild outlier for the setting. Here is a functional state where relatively nothing bad is happening. The people are taken care of, who have lots of rights and freedoms, and just about no one wants to attack them. When the question of where would you want to live comes up, it's just like... No brainer.

[agile jetty]

https://www.tumblr.com/bigrock-mdl/708014871296589824/phoenix-nyawk?source=share

[indigo hinge]

Since CBT doesn't have an Atlas with an axe, but I want to use my main machine in MW5 on the tabletop, I figured I might as well model up one and put it on an existing Atlas.

[azure stream]

MoC's best Mechwarrior

[indigo hinge]

AI does not understand how mechs work, thank god. Means I'm not out of a job yet.

[agile jetty]

Slander

I do admit despite the ai I like the slanted torso

[cerulean valley]

Yep, in fact they've expanded/grown as a faction, especially compared to the Taurians who splintered. This does come at a cost of them being very very closely tied with the Capellans.
Like the current Magestrix is the sister of the Chancellor of the Capellan Confederation. The next in line for both their thrones is their daughter suspiciously younger sibling, Danai.
There are hints that Canopus might breakaway from their century long alliance and push the Liao-Centrellas out of leadership.

[agile jetty]

Wait where’s the canopus democracy

[elder ridge]

Any woman can be elected Magistrix, but it's almost always a member of the Centrella famly that get's elected

and IWRC the lower level elected postions are a lot more competative. but also Canopis is one of the more democratic nations in the setting

[upper warren]

https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Magistracy_of_Canopus#Government

The majority of the government is elected

[indigo hinge]

Time to wack some 'mechs on the head.

[summer mulch]

Played a lil 2v1 game where I fielded my Awesome against a Vindicator and Locust, it ended when I wasted all my shots trying to blast the Locust when it rushed into point-blank range and subsequently got flanked and beheaded by the Vindicator. Very fun!

[agile jetty]

Is there a mech called the Sherman?

[hexed musk]

That's battletech, baby!

[agile jetty]

Battle of Tukayyid is so cool

Also

Is it possible to run a ComStar army without being a WoB army?

[elder ridge]

ComStar and the WoB are seperate factions, espicaly in the Jihad era

[hexed musk]

Word of blake only really exists for the 20 year stretch between 3067 and 3090

[agile jetty]

I just REALLY wanna use the legacy

It had the bad reputation modifier but like

It looks so cool

[hexed musk]

Though i believe they started operations in secret earlier and survivors exist after. Regardless, Non-WoB Comstar Exists between the fall of Star League and 3145.

Bad reputation doesn't stop a mech from being used. Plenty of mercs use unsavory machines.

Though, wow, don't often see mechs that are utterly extinct after their primary user falls.

[agile jetty]

I just love the legacy design

I need it..

[elder ridge]

Yeah a lot of C3I stuff was was just scraped by everyone else, but that's inpart them being set up for Level 2's and not lances

[hexed musk]

I wonder if the hard stop a lot of designs see in the jihad and dark age is another sign that CGL is trying to divest from that part of BT's real history.

[elder ridge]

Maybe, IWRC the Jihad rea stuff getting a hard cutoff was a thing in the dark age, but also dark age was ment for the mech clix game and had weird backwords compatibilty

[upper warren]

That happened in high school for me. It was rough going from reading each civil war book as they were coming out, then End Game, then... Nothing. Until Dark Age, and... Well... I was very unhappy with the time skip and changes. Also first person Btech novel was weeeiiirrrddd

[agile jetty]

How was dark age bad? I don’t know how it was bad overall

[upper warren]

Idk if it was bad per se, I would need to go back and read them. And read them I did.

But it's like, all these characters you've seen grow and been through it with were just suddenly wiped out of the narrative and replaced by a bunch of new characters that you don't know anything about. And that the state of the setting apparently was fire bombed to hell and back but is is ok now?

I remember thinking, wow all this cool, dark shit went down (the Jihad) and they decided to write about the telephone lines going down???

[agile jetty]

I was kinda excited about the Federation of the Sphere

And then it just

Stops existing

[upper warren]

It was a bummer, but I really should go back and reread them

[elder ridge]

I will admit that we have a soft spot for the dark age, but we also played the mech-clix game competativly for a while

[upper warren]

I can appreciate that. It might have felt different if I could have found a group to do clickytek

Did you find the novels kinda slow?

[elder ridge]

I think we have read like 1 and 1/2 of the battle tech novles. so we can't speek to that. but we did read some of the short sotrys that got like posted online. and a lot of like three page bio's god's above and below they packed om sp menay three page bios into the hero mechs

[upper warren]

Lol

[hexed musk]

From what I have heard, the lack of information about the Jihad is the big thing. There's some cool stuff in there, some interesting desperate fights against a really villanious enemy, and... Sarna has most of it.

Seems like CGL is more interested in continuing the storyline more than fleshing out the "lost decades" from 3067 to 31XX. I'm personally interested to see where they go, we have the slightest taste of what the new century could bring in the Ryoken III.

Without Question was also apparently a pretty deece book set in the current era in-game.

[agile jetty]

I don’t mind the modern day!

It’s nice knowing my favorite factions have survived to it

[cerulean valley]

I like the Jihad era material myself. Like most Battletech sourcebooks read like in-universe history and engineering books, and the Jihad is framed in a different manner where it's like someone struggling to piece together the evidence of what really happened.

You get the test saying one thing, and then the sidebar raising possible reasons why things played out the way they did or the possibility of a third party involved in the fight.

It's outright mentioned a few times that the Blakists might have been a convenient scapegoat for military actions done for personal/political reasons and that some of the violence might have been the houses trying to get a leg up during the chaos.

[hexed musk]

Certainly a good way to encourage players to envision their own campaigns as canon.

[cerulean valley]

Yeah, its got bits of the Chaos Marches and Hinterlands in it, but writ large.

And some of the coolest (and most unnecessarily complex) tech is from there as well, like the Manei Domini implants

[agile jetty]

I do like that no matter what

It’s not a bleak future

People keep going and even if they try to resurrect the star league, make something new, or try something like democracy, it can be done with enough work and giant robots

[supple jetty]

I'd point out that the track record for star leagues has been pretty bad

[hexed musk]

I think the neural interface stuff is where the top end tech storyline is heading

Proto-mechs->manai domini->clanner neural interfaces has so far been the trend

[elder ridge]

The Star League best run was the time they kicked CSJ's shit in and colapes almost imeadtaly after

[hexed musk]

Also yeah i think we'll see the 5th(?) Starleague shatter in the coming in-universe decade or 2.

[elder ridge]

I think the IllKahn is ruling the thir star leauge

[hexed musk]

Could be 4th?
Og starleague, fuck SJ star league, RoS, Wolf Ilclan

Unless the republic doesn't count

[elder ridge]

I guess it dose, unless we are going by thigns called the star leage

[hexed musk]

Fair

Star leagues: only thing more fragile than Chinese Dynasties

[agile jetty]

I like Canopus and FWL

Bits of alright societies in an ocean of not good

[hexed musk]

I keep telling myself I'll do a canopus lance and then they get pushed down the priority list.
Meanwhile I'm trying to get my 20th Smoke Jaguar done by thanksgiving... i liked them before they were cool!

[cerulean valley]

It kind of is a bleak future imo, at least compared to something like Lancer.
From the 2500 to the 3150s, Humanity has barely expanded past the Inner Sphere and is stuck in a state of neo-fuedalism.
It's not as bleak as 40k or most other directly dystopian settings, and quality of life is generally comparable to modern day if you're not living in a Clan OZ or under the Combine.
But BTech has a running theme of humanity refusing to work together to better itself, of political differences, nationalism, and hatred keeping us at each others throats. Over a thousand years into the future, and Humanity has not changed.

There aren't any hostile aliens or outside context existential threats in Battletech, just your fellow man with too much power and not enough morals.

[agile jetty]

Unfortunately, the Hopeful Human Spirit (pilots a Maurader because why not)

[hexed musk]

On the other hand, we do see humanity keep getting back up. Its a bleak as hell setting, and I like Lancer's themes more, but damn the indomitable human spirit shines

[cerulean valley]

Yep

And it's a setting that despite it's early days cough yellow peril cough has a good track record of nuance and diversity.

Which I appreciate.

[agile jetty]

The Canopus spirit of egalitarian societies and catgirls

Truly, a beacon in the darkness

Also Urbie

Battletech has Urbie.

[cerulean valley]

Like even in the first set of sourcebooks it was pretty clear that none of the five houses were actual monocultures or had dominant ethnicities, absolutely everyone was mixed and multicultural.

The novels didn't play out that way, but they were also a lot more... classic 80s B sci-fi.

[hexed musk]

Yeah. We'll see if the new stuff does the effort to portray the capellans and DC as actual people.

[cerulean valley]

It's done a good job of that from the Capellan PoV so far.

I like Danai Liao-Centrella and the stuff around her. Outside of the rape as drama bits in one stretch of the Dark Age books.

[hexed musk]

I personally enjoy the writing of BT 2017 making BOBBY YAMAGUCHI your most friendly and, often, moral employer

[hexed musk]

Yeah that was a yikes

[agile jetty]

The WHAT

[cerulean valley]

I need more of Chandrasekar Kurita selling TVs to the Clanners.

[cerulean valley]

Danai Liao-Centrella, heir apparent to the Capellan Confederation and Magistracy Of Canopus, gets raped by the First Prince of the Federated Suns, Caleb Davion in one of the novels.

[agile jetty]

Oh my god

But the fedsuns are supposed to have like

Morals?!!!!

[hexed musk]

Fuckin swiping this one lmao

[agile jetty]

Is this fucking character assassination? Last I checked the Davions were considered annoying because they’re so nice

[hexed musk]

Said first prince is kinda supposed to be a counter to the too-perfect Fed suns of days past

[agile jetty]

..oh

[cerulean valley]

It's not handled very well and is basically used as a justification for her "Liao-esque" Paranoia

[agile jetty]

They did that in the worst way possible

[cerulean valley]

At least that's how I feel.

[hexed musk]

He was always a garbage dude and was intended as the failson of the family

[agile jetty]

Is it canon? I stg I hope that’s not canon

[cerulean valley]

As a faction, not as individuals.

[agile jetty]

Oh

[hexed musk]

The writers also needed the davions to lose a lot of wars and so having a literal monster as first prince was their solution.

[cerulean valley]

The FedSuns are kind of hypocritical about it at times too. They wave the banner of "liberty" and talk about morals, but they're pretty neglectful of their own worlds.

[agile jetty]

They are? Aww..

[hexed musk]

I believe a samurai under Kurita's first female coordinator literally crushes him under their boot.

[agile jetty]

I’ll stick with the FWL and Canopus as the resident good person

[supple jetty]

Also despite being an alleged federation one family ends up in charge again and again

Though canopus has the same issue

[cerulean valley]

Like there are worlds in the FedSuns where the populace are starving at the same time that the FedSuns attack their neighbours to bring liberty to them because "the Drac/Cappies are letting their people starve, we have to do something"

[agile jetty]

I just like playing the good guy in the RPGs I play lol

[hexed musk]

Yeah stay with your current factions if you want "better guys", fedsuns have been dubious for a while

[supple jetty]

Hold on FWL?

The FWL were in bed with the blakists

[hexed musk]

I think that, despite the lore's claims to the contrary, the best people in the setting are mercenaries with the grit to survive and do good. They're exceedingly rare, but enough survive that I think its cool for someone to say "these are my blorbos and they fight the good fight"

[agile jetty]

Oh nooo

You ruined it dammit

[hexed musk]

That was just two decades...

[agile jetty]

Oh truee

[cerulean valley]

No one is a saint.

[hexed monolith]

I thought it was more annoying because they're the designated protagonists and thus never allowed to suffer major setbacks. At least early on

Not so much with later writing, obviously

[agile jetty]

Oh

They’re protagonists? I thought clans were protagonists?

[cerulean valley]

FedSuns were the protag of many of the novels.

[hexed monolith]

But yes. The Anglo-American good guys who come out on top of everything through grit and gumption was sort of seen as their hat.

[cerulean valley]

They were the British/French heroes against the Sino-Russo Cappelans, in novels written at the tail end of the cold war.

[agile jetty]

Oooh.. I forgot Battletech is old

[cerulean valley]

And Victor Steiner-Davion was the pov character for a lot of the Clan Invasion era material

[agile jetty]

That’s.. gotta lead to some very outdated novels

[hexed monolith]

Meanwhile Kurita were Imperialist Bastards with a dose of 80s Japanophobia, Steiner is Steiner, and the Free Worlds League is basically that scene from Life of Brian with the People's Front of Judea vs the Judean People's Front

[agile jetty]

Does the fanbase act accordingly? Kinda bash on FedSuns fans?

[agile jetty]

Has Battletech.. adopted? With the times?

[hexed monolith]

Yes

Kurita are still Imperialist Bastards but it's a lot less 'cringey American pop culture idea of Bushido'

[agile jetty]

Oh thank god ngl

That’s good they’ve adopted

[cerulean valley]

Early to mid 90s material fleshed out Kurita in a good way as well, though they backtracked later after they killed off Theodore.

[hexed monolith]

It's pretty explicitly 'this is a military dictatorship that's using the trappings of tradition as a means of control and social cohesion'

[cerulean valley]

You'll see that a lot in Battletech

The Capellans lean into the classic Chinese trappings in later eras explicitly for societal control and cohesion reasons.

[hexed monolith]

Though for a faction that started as an 80's American idea of a communist dictatorship, they don't actually function like one.

[cerulean valley]

And parts of the FedSuns rally around Church-Militants at certain points during wartime.

[agile jetty]

Canopus really is showing their superiority here ngl

Catgirls and egalitarianism

(And light mechs)

[hexed monolith]

Meanwhile the FWL basically comes off a bit like the Holy Roman Empire in space

[cerulean valley]

I'd also say that for the time it was written, BTech was actually already progressive and the core setting books (rather than the novels) was decently fair to everyone except Kurita.

[hexed monolith]

IE every province is doing its own thing, has its own wildly differing system of government, and its' very hard to get the whole League going in one direction

[agile jetty]

Actually how’s the living standard for the FWL?

[cerulean valley]

Varies based on province

[hexed monolith]

Standard for Inner Sphere, by and large

[cerulean valley]

Mostly pretty alright.

[hexed monolith]

Like at worst it's late 20th century Euro/American standard of living

Steiner is "Screw the rules, we have money"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLLHP3icECM

[upper warren]

Kinda late to the party but I am really excited to be back in the fandom for the ilclan era. Really, truly, I can not believe they made it not only to Terra but also conquered it

[hexed monolith]

(You have no idea how happy I am that I finally found that in isolation)

[agile jetty]

They did?

sarna didn’t mention it..

They got Terra! Holy shit!

[hexed monolith]

Yep

[upper warren]

Aye, the wolf made it

[agile jetty]

What books

[hexed monolith]

If Davion is the designated protagonist house

Wolf is the designated protagonist Clan

[upper warren]

Hour of the Wolf and the ilClan source book

[agile jetty]

What books are good for starting but not like.. outdated?

[cerulean valley]

Most of the good starting novels are outdated tbh. The Warrior trilogy runs through the Succession Wars, Grey Death Legion has flat protags and some 80s approach to female characters... I'd recommend Wolves on the Border myself.

Which has a bit of orientalism in its depictions of the Combine, but once you understand that it's specifically a dictatorship using those trappings it feels more acceptable.

[agile jetty]

I’ll take something modern ngl

[cerulean valley]

Like yeah the Kuritans are playing up the Imperial Japan angle. But remember that they're facists who use those trappings to control their society. Takashi Theodore might have some heritage, but he's also got blue eyes and the Kuritan family line includes the surnames McAllister, Sorenson, and Von Rhors.

Hmmm, maybe check out Redemption Rites? It's a current era story about the Wolf's Dragoons post-Terra as they get cast out again by Clan Wolf and exact their revenge.

[agile jetty]

I see!

Is there BT told from an infantry pov?

[cerulean valley]

Same thing with House Liao, who play up the older Chinese "rule mandated from the heavens Celestial Emperor" thing, but don't have much actual mainland Chinese/Han ancestry.
The first Liao to head spacewards was half-English, half-Nepalese, and their family tree contains Latin and Eastern European last names as well.

I think there's some.

Not much, most novels are Mechwarrior action.

Basically all the Houses and peoples of the inner sphere have very multicultural/multi-ethnic background.

(Though there are still some cases of ethnic violence, most notably in the FedSuns against Asians during the Succession Wars)

[cerulean valley]

Older material but Grey Death Legion starts as infantry vs mech before the characters get their mechs.
Dark Age era/early 2000s novel By Temptations, By War has primarily Battle Armour PoV

[hexed monolith]

IS or Clan armor? Because I'd imagine the vibe would be quite different

IS being 'only nominally less squishy than normal infantry'

And Clan being 'holy shit that thing just tanked a Large Laser and now it's punching into my mech's cockpit'

[cerulean valley]

IS BA,specifically the Fa Shih

[cerulean valley]

Eh, IS BA is still pretty tough, they can tank Medium Lasers and then try to punch into your cockpit.

[summer mulch]

I do like how BT has something of a "no good guys" policy not out of grimdarkness but general "this is how militarized states operate"

A lot of the conflicts just come down to "no we should have this land and these resources"

[upper warren]

Same, I like this idea that no state is a monolith. That even within the state you have competing factions with different motivations. And those motivations drive conflicts within and without.

These people want peace, but these weapon manufacturers don't, so they sabotage the peace talks and start a war, and oh look at that weapon sales go up. Free Cappella movement, Free Skye, capellan March and draconis March, black dragon society. Just, all of the FWL

I mean shit, just look what's happened between Yori Kurita and Katana Tomark and the Nova Cats, all their backers really fucked the combine up real bad

Still blows my mind tho that the DCMS and Wolfs Dragoons sacked New Avalon for 4 or 5 years. That's insane

[upper warren]

Oh you know what that reminds me of

The super heavy tripod mechs

[elder ridge]

Fuck that fucking three legged peic of shit.

They were severaly undercousted in teh MechClix game and on the larger point counts that the turnaments used on some matches a viable pick

[upper warren]

Omg ppl used them?

I figured they were just collectable like that dropship

What was the damage output like in terms of the clicktech

[elder ridge]

Yeah they were the points coust of a assassult lance wiht the fire power of about 6 assassault mechs. and yeah rarley one the once every two months of so large mech batle that FanPro sceduled but yeah 1.5x the fire power per point them most mechs

Also they got to brake away from infantery for free

[upper warren]

Omg

This thing is basically a turret

[elder ridge]

Yeah it's the smae speed as an Urbie

[upper warren]

And yet it feels so undergunned

[quartz jasper]

They are quite bad in CBT

The one redeeming quality is being a tripod

The most busted mech config

[indigo hinge]

I will never not laugh at the mental image that I could outrun a 'mech on my bicycle.

And then MW5 gives us the Turbie, the arena urbie with an XL engine and Supercharger and a few toys. The thing can apparently pull 180 km/h.

[hexed musk]

Yeah the tripod SH's have a remarkably low amount of pod space

There's a lot of clan omni assaults that out gun one

[agile jetty]

How do i run a full hovercraft army?

[short rose]

🔮 Take as menay of thease as you can, Run the cnter of your line up first and andlet initsinking alow you to envloop more easlay
https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Savannah_Master

[upper warren]

This is how you make people cry

I can't believe they strapped a fusion engine into those things

[short rose]

🔮 I think it's more they straped it to the fusion engine

[upper warren]

LMAO

Fr

[agile jetty]

Who sells the minis?

I can only find metal ones

[upper warren]

I realllllly want to play Battle Force bc of the idea of a company of those not making people cry

But still I get to do that

Iron wind I think does the metal ones which you are probably looking at. I think catalyst just released a bunch of plastic vehicles but I don't know which bc it was Kickstarter

Anyone know if catalyst is selling the models after the Kickstarter?

Jfc this thing is cute

All the round edges just don't communicate "I am a death machine"

[supple jetty]

Use standees

It's not worth buying and painting an army that you'll only get to use once per friend group

[agile jetty]

Wait what?

Are they that broken op?

[supple jetty]

If you run a full list of Savannah Masters you will either be the reason they are banned going forward or no longer invited to BattleTech, quite possibly both.

[agile jetty]

But.. hovertank!

I know nothing about the game!

It seems so cool to me to take down a giant robot with tanks

[supple jetty]

215 BV, 20 hex move, medium laser

[agile jetty]

What.. does that mean?

Hex is like the movement grid

BV is the value of the unit?

[supple jetty]

BV is cost

[agile jetty]

Oh

Are there any other tanks I can use?

[supple jetty]

So you'll get like a hundred more activations than your opponent and while one medium laser to the rear armor is usually survivable, 30 of them is not.

[agile jetty]

What’s a good tank for… idk beginners?

[hexed musk]

Manticores are very good main battletanks

[upper warren]

I'm a big fan of LRM Carriers. Just lob tons of lrms

[agile jetty]

Oh no I meant like

Good as in not good

Shitty

Actually desirable to play against

[upper warren]

Manitcore very good

[supple jetty]

Most tanks

Savannah Masters are an exception

[hexed musk]

They're durable, have good long ranged weapons to keep themselves useful if detracked, and affordable in BV

[supple jetty]

You only really enter the realm of cheese once you get to either really high movement and or very large numbers of units

[upper warren]

Hetzers are good for a suicide run

[supple jetty]

Patton my beloved

[agile jetty]

I wanna take down the heaviest boy I can find with tanks and the indomitable human spirit

I will prove that Hovertanks are peak fiction

[hexed musk]

A good rule of thumb is to try and not outnumber your opponent by more than 3 minis

[supple jetty]

Most hovercraft are fine, it's just Savannah Masters that are problematic

[hexed musk]

Except in larger games

[upper warren]

Hetzers carry a AC20 so a pack can take down a mech if you're lucky with your rolls

[supple jetty]

In general vehicle heavy lists tend to skew in the same direction as lists full of succession Wars assaults where you're relying on a bunch of armor and okay Firepower to compensate for technological inferiority, which makes them particularly vulnerable to lists that can exploit their lack of Mobility

[agile jetty]

Wait

Technological inferiority is like

A mechanic?

Also are Hovertanks mobile?

[supple jetty]

Just moreso since your units are tougher but brittler

[supple jetty]

Most vehicles dont benefit from high tech stuff like XL engines or endo nearly as much as mechs do

Hovercraft are plenty mobile but they're squishier than tanks

Wait wait do tanks even get endo?

[hexed musk]

No, but they can get better armor

I think the Eurus is currently pound for pound the scariest tank and it rolls with ferrolam

[agile jetty]

My issue atm is lack of minis

[hexed musk]

As Loller kinda described low tech in battletech shows up in 2 key ways:

• shorter ranged weapons
• much lower speeds

Armor, however, is effectively the same regardless of tech. Only in the dark age do you start to see new armor than really means something, and its still rare.

[agile jetty]

Oh

The kickstarter is already done

And I can’t get the plastic tanks

[hexed musk]

The kickstarter minis should begin showing up in stores at the end of november

You can get them then

[agile jetty]

Oh ok

[hexed musk]

The kickstarter funds the creation of the mini lines but after that CGL more or less prints to demand. Thanks, injection mold plastics.

[supple jetty]

Again standees are legal

[agile jetty]

I know I want minis though

[hexed musk]

Understandable

[supple jetty]

while I'm hesitant on any vehicle that costs over 1k BV honestly yeah that's pretty good

though some of that is ferrolam being frankly busted beyond belief

[hexed musk]

Ferrolam could have been "reduce each incoming source of damage by 1" and it would be pretty good

[supple jetty]

esp because it means that LBX no longer gets motive crits which is huge

[cerulean valley]

Not in moderation, but they're dirt cheap and Battletech is alternating activation.
When you show up with 20+ hovercraft and your opponent has 4 mechs one of you is going to take longer.
They're also fast which means they're hard to hit. They won't do much individually, but 5-10x the number of units as your enemy which he might not be able to hit is a pain to play against.

[cerulean valley]

Extremely. Battletech hovertanks aren't anti-grav or sci-fi hovertanks. They're like modern day hovercraft but with more armour and better hoverskirts/fans.

[hexed musk]

I wouldnt be mad if someone brought a savanna master or two as scouts and target spotters
Hell, if they warned me they were bringing the swarm I'd consider it my day to learn how artillery works. Its just cheesing someone out with it from nowhere that sucks

[supple jetty]

Though there's also a difference between bringing one or two and bringing 46

[hexed musk]

Very true. Ultimately, wargames exist on consent.
I saw a dude at a different group I was trying out bring a gyrfalcon prime and a rifleman IIC to a pickup 5k and decided it wasnt the sort of group i wanted to keep playing against

[cerulean valley]

Yeah, it's really an issue when people bring nothing but one cheap spammable unit

[supple jetty]

The gyrfalcon prime looks fine to me?

Partial wing mechs are always suspect but theres no cLPLs or iJJs

[hexed musk]

Shit i forgot the last part
They set up on an utterlly open map, no trees, barely any buildings and all on the edges

[supple jetty]

Oh

[hexed musk]

So i watched the newer playees just get pounded from 10+ tiles

[supple jetty]

yeah that'd do it

In isolation that's not actually that bad but on a favorable map yeah thats a problem

[hexed musk]

Gyrfalcon prime in a vaccum is merely good, i see it compared evenly to timmy dubs

Rifleman iic is dumb though

[supple jetty]

prime?

[upper warren]

Wtf is a laser heat sink

[supple jetty]

Heat sink but laser

[upper warren]

This is the kinda shit I deal with being out of the loop for so long

[supple jetty]

Sorta based in real life physics

[cerulean valley]

Have you checked out the different types of laser?

We've got all sorts these days.

[upper warren]

Finally a reason to use that small laser

[cerulean valley]

Pulse, ER, ER Pulse, X-Pulse, Binary, Variable Speed Pulse, Heavy, Improved Heavy, and Chemical

Oh and Re-Engineered

[upper warren]

The binary and variable speed ones really made me laugh

[supple jetty]

Bombast too

[upper warren]

What if we made a laser double barrel

[supple jetty]

Duct tape knows no bounds

[upper warren]

Have you maybe considered that the light exiting the lens is going too fast?

Slow it down!

[cerulean valley]

We're out of PPCs, just duct tape two large lasers to each other

My favourite is the Re-Engineered, which is an attempt to combine the Heavy and Pulse lasers and resulted in a normal laser.
Except it ignores the special armour types.

[hexed musk]

RISC HYPER LASER