Pathfinder

[warped orbit]

Yep

[rustic cape]

But it does point to a certain sloppiness, I guess?

[warped orbit]

Ultimately very little meaningfully changed for Psychic

Which is a bit disappointing

[rustic cape]

Kinda a lazy update

Thaum seems like it got some buffs to weaker implements, which is good

[warped orbit]

Yeah

[wraith snow]

Shame Bell didn't get anything bc it needed it imo

[warped orbit]

I still think Wand isn't that great, but the buffs do help

I feel like Wand should be able to benefit from Exploit at least

[rustic cape]

Ye

[warped orbit]

Chalice buffs are nice and good

[wraith snow]

Does anyone know if the missing Oracle mysteries are in that book? I heard someone mention a while ago they would be but I haven't heard anything about them over the noise about Psychic.

[warped orbit]

Though that one is fine I think

[rustic cape]

So, Thaum buffs to some weaker stuff, Magus is pretty much the same (fine), Psychic has some kinda jank but is pretty much the same (woe)

Do we know anything about new archetypes?

[warped orbit]

Nothing new, since it was just Remastered Dark Archives so far

There will probably be something in Impossible Magic, but hard to say what

[wraith snow]

I'm curious to see what Mystery of Ash will look like (assuming it ever comes back)

[turbid dagger]

Ash Oracle got reintroduced in Divine Mysteries!

https://2e.aonprd.com/Mysteries.aspx?ID=20

[wraith snow]

Oh, nice

Well, it's missing what I liked about the original

So that kinda blows

But it's nice that it exists, ig

[warped orbit]

many such cases with Remaster Oracle

I believe we got all the Mysteries back after Divine Mysteries?

[surreal basin]

Magus is more than fine imo, it’s sometimes the problem child with the amount of single attack damage it can hit you with

Magus is number one source of boss fight over now

[turbid dagger]

Yeeee, it does one thing very well and has average everything els

[sturdy lagoon]

Magus will probably be fine in the remaster. It is getting reprinted in an entirely different sourcebook from the original.

I think at this point that the "X remastered" format with all page numbers the same was a mistake. There is no possible way to fix outstanding issues with the original classes while restricted to nearly the same layout. Barring Oracle every class that made it into Player Core 1 & 2 got a good chunk of their remaster wishlist.

[warped orbit]

Yeah having to keep to the same page count meant they could do barely any real changes

[sturdy lagoon]

Meanwhile inventor and now psychic are mainly unchanged with a few nice but not comprehensive tweaks. At the very least third party materials will not be under any such restrictions.

[turbid dagger]

Clearly they just make the font half size

Free magnifying glass with every purchase

[sturdy lagoon]

Also on a secondary thing but keeping as much of the same layout as the original as possible means a missed opportunity to present entirely new lore that wasn't present in the original, or present more new gameplay options than the existing layout allowed

I know the remastered thing was an attempt to be nice and not make it feel like every premaster book was now out of date, but they should have just made G&G 2 and DA 2

[errant roost]

get really house of leaves with it. add fold out pages and a labyrinth of footnotes

[carmine oyster]

Hmmm... I should give my players a Bag of Weasels...

[true delta]

Yes, you should.

[tribal steeple]

it turns out today we're doing a gygax dungeon sidequest

[frank crystal]

The fact slow doesn’t have the incapacitate trait is crazy

A boss of mine was just slowed 2 for a minute

[tribal steeple]

https://2e.aonprd.com/Spells.aspx?ID=1650
Repulsion is another neat one. "What do you mean the boss simply can't even approach you if it fails the save?"

[warped orbit]

ah, the fight ender crit fail

tbh though, Slow definitely should not have Incap

the crit fail should just be less severe

[tribal steeple]

the really baffling "how does this not have incapacitate" is Synesthesia

[frank crystal]

One player has both

[frank crystal]

I really wish it was just like, slow 1 for a round on success, slow 2 for a round on failure, slow 3 for a round on crit failure

I’d genuinely prefer that to slow 1 or slow 2 for a minute

[warped orbit]

I'd probably make the crit fail Slowed 2 for a round and then Slowed 1 for the rest of the duration

[tribal steeple]

Yeah, me >:)

occult sorcerers have some messed up spells

Fun tricks such as "Fireball but a Will Save"

[surreal basin]

Hot take: incap should just increase crit fail to fail

[turbid dagger]

Yeah that's what I think also
It makes it so the most a boss can be is 'lightly disabled' but also makes debuffs useful still

[tribal steeple]

I know I'm not a fan of my turn amounting to nothing because the only relevant target around is incapable of failing its saves.

This is why I have Force Barrage as a signature spell.

You WILL be eating 12d4+12 automatic damage, no I will NOT be taking questions.

plus whatever the sorcerer feature adds, I ALWAYS forget to account for the sorcerer bloodline bonus damage

[warped orbit]

that would also be fine

[summer whale]

Good news: my group started playing Kingmaker; it owns
Bad news: in just the second fight, my Ranger took two critical hits from a dagger and was nearly dropped by that alone 🙃

[vocal ember]

I think that's a good idea yeah

[echo briar]

This is fucking wild https://paizo.com/threads/rzs7mz52?Pathfinder-Dark-Archive-Oversold-Some

[fossil dome]

Oh?

[echo briar]

Did they just not print many, or was demand just that high?

[fossil dome]

What happened?

[echo briar]

Dark archive sold out already

Despite preorders not being fully shipped

[fossil dome]

Lol

[echo briar]

It’s not even fully out yet

[fossil dome]

Ooops

[balmy orchid]

Oh, so undead are just Immune to Void damage?

[solar storm]

In general yeah

[echo briar]

Yes. And the living are immune to vitality damage

[balmy orchid]

Oh and Hero Points are just

fate points

[surreal basin]

Reroll currency of your choice yes

[warped orbit]

You can also use them to not die

Which can be very useful

[balmy orchid]

weird how if I did take my Dhampir down the tree of like

sucking people's blood

that it gets worse for people who are higher level

oh wait

Jiangshi cannot Drink Blood, so I wouldn't be able to

[turbid dagger]

Ougghgghhghg
I hope the Guilt Of The Graveworld foundry module comes out soon
I am not opposed to prepping maps but also am willing to pay money to have nicer maps I don't have to prep with enemies pre placed and pre tokened and all that

[turbid dagger]

That said, Starfinder is really fun
There's always this funky feel to running modern/sci fi settings

[balmy orchid]

https://i.imgur.com/7jyNism.png

Fuck you mean we live between the Sea of Ghosts and the Sea of Eels

in the Specterwoods

[turbid dagger]

This sounds about right for Shenmen

[turbid dagger]

The worst part is that you have british people to the north

[balmy orchid]

"Yeah I live in Shitfuck Valley"

"It's not so bad when you get used to it"

[echo briar]

Don’t worry, season of ghosts is quite famous for how much you travel.

||you don’t travel at all, but it’s very famous for that||

[oak pilot]

I'm currently waiting to start a SoG game next month, that is the most clickable spoiler on earth

I must be strong

[turbid dagger]

I would encourage anyone who wants to post something about SoG that goes behind spoilers to instead post nothing at all

[errant roost]

here, have some bubble wrap to divert the instinct: ||💥||||💥||||💥||||💥||

[rustic cape]

SoG is hard to talk about at all without spoiling stuff, but it's very fun

[errant roost]

is it spoilers to ask what the season is? salt? pepper?

[balmy orchid]

What PV posted is not actually spoilers because it's something the Player's Guide explicitly tells you straight up

[balmy orchid]

Well given the name I assume it's this

[turbid dagger]

Yeeeee but like
Err on the side of caution
Don't habituate SoG players to clicking spoilers, it's like feeding bears at parks
It's bad for you and them

[balmy orchid]

Also

My GM suggested

That my dhampir's eidolon is his twin

Because while he was born half-living half-dead, the eidolon was born half-dead half-living

[balmy orchid]

Also i have realized i have made Another Yuta

[frank crystal]

Hell yah

Honestly my main issue with summoner is that unless you’re doing a dual class campaign

You can’t really make a Yuta

(Aka make a character who physically fights alongside their eidolon)

Caster profiencies won’t let you

[turbid dagger]

Summoners+ has a funny archetype for that!

A class archetype that further restricts spellcasting for martial profs and some funny stuff with tandem actions

[frank crystal]

Oh hell yah

[turbid dagger]

It also has a very cool take on Synthesist that I like a ton
And really want to play some time

You can still cast spells while melded into eidolon, but only if they target the eidolon
And when you use Tandem actions instead of performing your half you can cast a focus cantrip
So like, Tandem Strike would be eidolon Strike Summoner Boost Eidolon
Or more likely the reverse

[balmy orchid]

Is this a homebrew?

[turbid dagger]

Yes! Team+ makes a bunch of books giving new options and they're all called like Witch+, Summoner+, etc

[balmy orchid]

Can I get a link to it, I can't find it on google

[turbid dagger]

https://www.pathfinderinfinite.com/en/product/480866/summoners?affiliate_id=1916517

[wary yoke]

Well, third party

[rustic cape]

Even then it doesn’t actually work

There are some very specific niche builds that might kinda sorta work, but Act Together’s specific mechanics are ruinous

[turbid dagger]

If you have actual attacks worth anything tandem strike is fine tbh

[frank crystal]

What’s stopping it?

[rustic cape]

A few things:

• Tandem abilities and act together can’t be used on the same turn
• Almost everything your eidolon actually wants to be doing is a two or three action ability that’s incompatible with tandem strike

The easy fix for summoner is to just give them 4 actions

And require that at least one be spent on the summon and at least one on the summoner, instead of the elaborate bs that Act Together forces

[frank crystal]

Oh that fucking suuuucks

[turbid dagger]

This is wrong, you just can't use Act Together to perform a tandem action
You can use a normal action or actions to use a tandem action, then Act Together your one action left

I'd also argue that Eidolons make a lot of normal one action strikes

It varies by eidolon tho

(I've played a Summoner for multiple years in a Strength Of Thousands campaign)

The primary issue with tandem strike is just that you will never ever want to strike with a Summoner's summoner half

On the topic mentioned earlier, I actually think Champ/Summoner dual class is lovely
Take Devotion Phantom, Tandem Strike together, and if either of you get hit the other reacts

[frank crystal]

Ohhhh sick

[eager mountain]

I assume your playing season of ghosts?

[balmy orchid]

Yarp

[oak pilot]

it's a cool festival the player characters are involved in, kind of like halloween. The designated "victims" are all those chosen to be fake kidnapped by dressed-up to make ghosts think that the town is already being attacked by other ghosts. In reality they're meant to go have a picnic and a cozy overnight camp in the woods

I'm presuming something's going to go wrong while we're away in the woods but idk what lol

[true delta]

Nah, it‘ll be fine.

[balmy orchid]

At least the village cant be razed and everyone killed

[balmy orchid]

I have requested to my GM

That if a Season of Ghost encounter doesnt vibe

Just replace it with Magnamalo

https://youtu.be/Gyf6g2Ysb80?si=y7d7tnzbmMg_inJa

[summer whale]

ah yes, my Fabula Ultima campaign in a nutshell (we're literally fighting MonHun enemies half the time; the train we're on has a pet Rathalos for crying out loud)

staying on topic though, god I can't wait for our Kingmaker game to resume (we've got a week off for the mandatory GM break, during which I'm finishing off our Mothership one-off as GM)

[tribal steeple]

genie wish corruption: it's AT Mizutsune instead

[oak pilot]

AT Mizu and AT Magna arena double hunt, no faints, no seikrets/palamutes

honestly though magna, or most monhun monsters really, would be sick as hell as an encounter

[tribal steeple]

https://bjacobt1.wixsite.com/monstermonday/post/monster-monday-mizutsune

[oak pilot]

haha rad

[balmy orchid]

One of our other players is maybe running another campaign soon

with a late medieval vibe with guns being prominent.

And I must ask how GOOD is the gunblade in PF2e

[turbid dagger]

Nice, if it's high level and you are built around it
Less so if you are startin at 1

The earliest a gunblade build can pop off is 6 iirc

If you go Triggerbrand

[warped orbit]

good for Gunslinger, much more niche for everyone else

and yeah, Stab and Blast is really critical for that kind of build

[balmy orchid]

I was going to probably go Fighter

Since the idea for the build is going to be a Cavalier

[warped orbit]

hmm, it can work potentially

but would be tricky probably

[surreal basin]

Okay so here’s the thing

Do you want to be switch hitting a lot with it or just like

[warped orbit]

one issue with Fighter on a Gunsword or other combination weapon is also that they aren't the same weapon type

[surreal basin]

Using it as a cool melee weapon

With a gun attached

Because it’s actually quite good on fighter for the latter because of the crit spec fusion

[warped orbit]

well the critical fusion spec is basically pick but it unloads your gun

though it's not bad yeah

[balmy orchid]

This

https://tenor.com/view/ffxiv-wolfram-heart-ffxiv-wolfram-heart-gunbreaker-victory-ffxiv-hunklander-hunklander-wolfram-heart-gif-20986682

[warped orbit]

you can mostly do that

[surreal basin]

Oh yeag then probably just use the critspec for flashy combos

It won’t be optimal but it won’t feel bad

[warped orbit]

with the provision that combination weapons are mostly just worse in either mode than comparable single weapons

[surreal basin]

Yeah don’t get me started lol

[warped orbit]

you kinda cap out at d8 2h weapons, with maybe some tags

[surreal basin]

I should make a Better Combo Weapons thing

[balmy orchid]

The other option is halberd

but I'm going to be a Demigryph knight and Demigryph Knight with a Gunblade to me is just

Fuckgkgngningn cool............

[surreal basin]

Halberd is optimal, gunblade is very usable

[warped orbit]

polearms are good

halberd specifically is kinda eh, but still very usable

[balmy orchid]

I didn't see any kind of lance

[warped orbit]

https://2e.aonprd.com/Weapons.aspx?ID=383

main advantage is being onehanded while mounted

[balmy orchid]

Which makes it worse...

[warped orbit]

?
the jousting die is extra damage if you charged, it doesn't change the die size of the weapon

unless you meant that you wanted a 2h weapon specifically

[balmy orchid]

Jousting says it reduces the damage down to the listed die

"In addition, while mounted, you can wield the weapon in one hand, changing the damage die to the listed value."

[warped orbit]

oh it does, huh
misread

wth, why

alright, disregard the lance

anyway the classic polearm is just a guisarme

2h d10 reach, and has Trip

[surreal basin]

Glaive is classic

[balmy orchid]

Guisarme doesn't fit the knightly vibe I think

[surreal basin]

Halberd is still absolutely fine

Not a bad weapon

Notably two handed tho if you are married to shield

But also you can’t reload gunblade with shield anyway

So

[balmy orchid]

I was thinking of just being full plate and no shield

[warped orbit]

halberd is fine, Versatile P is just kind of a nothing trait

[balmy orchid]

Scythes Are A Martial Weapon

hwat

[wraith snow]

There's the bastion plate which lets you entrench (essentially raising a buckler but without a hand)

There's also the buckler itself ig

[wraith snow]

There are a lot of things in this system that are martial that ring strange to me tbf

[novel merlin]

There's also the war lance
https://2e.aonprd.com/Weapons.aspx?ID=534&Redirected=1

Which is a lance that trades reach for parry+shove

[warped orbit]

if you just want a big 2h reach weapon, I recommend either guisarme or fauchard if you're fine with dropping to d8

long hammer also an option at d8

[balmy orchid]

Hrmmm

And if i wanted to go one hand + pistol?

[novel merlin]

A harnessed shield also lets you get the jousting bonus without a mount https://2e.aonprd.com/Traits.aspx?ID=477

[novel merlin]

Outside of gunslinger you're gonna struggle to reload iirc

[turbid dagger]

Very possibly has worse prospects than combination weapons I'm afraid
Especially with fighter
I'm sorry but I'm just saying the unvarnished truth

Pf2e Does Not Like switch hitters

[warped orbit]

you'd probably wanna be Drifter Gunslinger for that

[turbid dagger]

Yeee, that's the most usable option

[novel merlin]

Any class that doesn't have a feat to combine reloading with another action will just sorta struggle with guns

[balmy orchid]

Hrmmmmmgh

Maybe I just get a greatsword

[turbid dagger]

Or like
A thief rogue
But obviously that's not a great pick for Griffin Knight

[balmy orchid]

Yeah

[novel merlin]

Ranger does get running reload

[turbid dagger]

You certainly wouldn't go wrong with a big twohander

[warped orbit]

Greatsword is fine too, not the best tag wise but d12 are nice to have

[balmy orchid]

Maybe a warhammer?

For the knight vibe

Knight against knight

[warped orbit]

long hammer is prett good

or just a maul

[novel merlin]

Or earth breaker with d10 two hand

[surreal basin]

Unfortunately guns are like

Highly specialized

Build wise

[balmy orchid]

Fie

[warped orbit]

guns have a bunch of restrictions, and are mostly pigeonholed into crit fishing

[balmy orchid]

What if I hust have 3 guns

[turbid dagger]

You'd need a special item to share runes, but in theory possible

[novel merlin]

https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=1209

This makes that work if you have quick draw or something like that

[warped orbit]

can't quickdraw Gunner's Bandolier

[novel merlin]

Ohhh yeah

[warped orbit]

it's a special action to draw and transfer runes

[balmy orchid]

Runes aren't gonna be a thing i think

[warped orbit]

oh are you playing ABP?

[novel merlin]

Well it's still a viable option if you just want to shoot 1/2 times then toss it on the ground

[balmy orchid]

APB?

[warped orbit]

Automatic Bonus Progression

if so, that makes multiple weapons more doable

[novel merlin]

Its an optional rule that replaces runes with just getting the effects of runes at specific levels

If you don't use runes or ABP then the game math just sorta breaks by level 5 or so

[surreal basin]

And even ABP needs some common sense tweaking sometimes

[warped orbit]

the better way of doing ABP is IMO just only giving free runes at the normal levels, and leaving other item bonuses alone

so Alchemists don't just explode primarily

and also skill items stay useful

[balmy orchid]

We probably just arent getting to a level where runes are a thing

I think we are getting to maybe like 5 or 6 max

[novel merlin]

They start being a thing at level 2-3 which is why I'm confused.

[warped orbit]

+1 potency comes at level 2
striking at level 4

[carmine oyster]

If you're just looking to have a bit of gun for when you're out of melee reach you could bring a Shield Pistol

Probably only get to use it once per fight

But that's better than 0 times per fight

[wraith snow]

There is at least the Gunslinger Way explicitly intended for switching between range and melee

[novel merlin]

Yeah and losing out on the +1 is manageable but once creatures assume you have striking then things get tricky

[wraith snow]

It's not great but it works

[balmy orchid]

We might be doing two characters

Because of how lethal the game might be

So I am also gravitating towards a Gunslinger Android

Who in this setting would be a clockwork automata made by the templars

But yeah its also really low fantasy

Magic users are rare and magic items arent ubiquitous

[novel merlin]

For low fantasy just using the automatic bonus progression makes the math scaling work out fine

[true delta]

Yo! Where can Monster Hunter craafting be found again? Battlezoo?

[wraith snow]

Beast Guns are in Guns and Gears if that's what you mean? Not sure if Battlezoo has something more specific for it

oop, didn't mean to leave the ping on, sorry

[turbid dagger]

Battlezoo Monsters has parts crafting iirc

[true delta]

Cool

thanks

Moreover, I had not realised you could turn off pings.

[wraith snow]

Oh there's also the grafting system from Howl of the Wild ig

[balmy orchid]

Is there a weapons thats like

Finger claws

[novel merlin]

Not off the top of my head

Spiked gauntlet reflavor maybe?

Or bladed gauntlet

Tekko-kagi maybe

[paper inlet]

There is claw blade, which I think wouldn't be too hard to reflavor either?

[sturdy lagoon]

Back in 1e catfolk used to have claw blades which were exactly that, but there doesn't seem to be anything exactly like that in the 2e weapon tables.

There is also tekko-kagi, which is also similar in concept.

Ah, wait, it already got mentioned, didn't notice

[paper inlet]

https://2e.aonprd.com/Weapons.aspx?ID=470

tekko-kagi is probably better as a source item tho

[sturdy lagoon]

Similar name, not similar concept. 1e claw blades were a set of 5 blades that fit over catfolk claws to let them use them as enhanceable light weapons.

In this case, closest would be just play an ancestry with claws and reflavor fistwraps.

But as far as finger claws go for anyone without natural claws, not really anything direct, you're reflavoring other brawling weapons.

[shrewd bane]

Any way to drop weapon traits as an option in the PF2e builder?

[small meteor]

X-Y problem, Gan.
Better question: Does the Fleshwarp's Living Weapon get Non-Lethal, Unarmed, Agile, and Finesse for a tail strike?

[novel merlin]

Drop them?

[small meteor]

We're trying to figure out if this weapon (from Fleshwarp's Living Weapon) inherits any traits.

a tail unarmed attack that deals 1d6 bludgeoning damage and has the backswing trait. Each of these unarmed attacks is in the brawling weapon group.

[shrewd bane]

Augh didn't word it well

Reason why I'm asking is because on the other hand the claws are labelled as agile and finesse

[novel merlin]

It shouldn't have any other traits if it doesn't say it does. You can have non-finesse unarmed attacks.

[small meteor]

Does it have non-lethal though? Since Pathbuilder treats that as a trait.

I presume it must have the Unarmed trait.

But that could be wrong?

[shrewd bane]

It's counted as Unarmed yes

It does at least specify that earlier

Also all in the brawling group

[novel merlin]

It's prob a mistake that it doesn't have nonlethal but RAW it would not

[tribal steeple]

UNARMED
An unarmed attack uses your body rather than a manufactured weapon. An unarmed attack isn’t a weapon, though has a weapon group and might have weapon traits. An unarmed attack can’t be Disarmed. It also doesn’t take up a hand, though a fist or other grasping appendage generally works like a free-hand weapon.

LIVING WEAPON
When you select this feat, you gain a claws unarmed attack that deals 1d4 slashing damage and has the agile and finesse traits; a horn, jaws, or tusk unarmed attack that deals 1d6 piercing damage and has the versatile S trait; or a tail unarmed attack that deals 1d6 bludgeoning damage and has the backswing trait. Each of these unarmed attacks is in the brawling weapon group.

FIST (WEAPON)
Tags: Agile, Finesse, Nonlethal, Unarmed
The Living Weapon attacks do not implicitly come with nonlethal/agile/finesse but do imply the Unarmed tag.

[small meteor]

Thanks.

[surreal basin]

yeah all unarmed attacks are freehand

[balmy orchid]

Actually question

how hard would it to be a lightly armored Fighter with incredibly high AC from dodging?

[surreal basin]

Not hard at all, although p much everyone except the guys wearing the heaviest armor cap out at the same point

[turbid dagger]

Def not hard, though id have suggestions other than fighter for that
Swashbuckler my beloved......

[balmy orchid]

ALSO question

Would Summoner/Bloodrager be a decent combination?

[tribal steeple]

on one character or two characters working together

oh wait isn't bloodrager an archetype now in 2e

[balmy orchid]

Yea

One character

[tribal steeple]

Prerequisites: You must be a barbarian.

oh i'm mixing it up again I think

Idk, I don't expect it to be a functional pairing tho

[balmy orchid]

Why not?

[tribal steeple]

Summoners have their own action economy to worry about. Glancing over the Bloodrager feats it doesn't look like much (if any) of it includes things a Summoner would be doing in the first place.

Like a few of these feats are triggered by

HARVEST BLOOD - 1 action
Your last action was a successful piercing or slashing melee Strike against a creature that is not immune to bleed
and are themselves actions followed by using that harvest blood action

[light gyro]

cat
https://2e.aonprd.com/Ancestries.aspx?ID=77&Redirected=1

[balmy orchid]

Need weapon not species

Trying to emulate Jiangshi claws

[novel merlin]

Bloodrager is a barbarian class archetype, which means you have to be a barbarian to use it at all. So you'd be picking up summoner archetype which is notoriously pretty useless.

Summoner archetype gives you a somewhat weaker eidolon but not act together, so you get a second body that's a martial character worse at being martial just the base barbarian chassis, and no help in your action economy.

You basically just get a flanking buddy that shares your hp, so an animal companion would kinda get you the same thing but better.

[balmy orchid]

Well what I just got the Bloodrager instinct straight up?

[turbid dagger]

Is this a dual class game or

[balmy orchid]

I think my GM would be fine with me getting Bloodrager straight up as an instinct

Since it's flavorful with my character being a Dhampir

[turbid dagger]

So are you talking about a pure Barbarian now?

[balmy orchid]

A Summoner with the Barbarian dedication whereupon I pick the Bloodrager Instinct

[turbid dagger]

I see

[balmy orchid]

To me the synergy seems to be that Bloodrager does a lot with cantrips and the ability to regain spellslots

[novel merlin]

Your weapon proficiency scaling will still suck but if the game only goes to lvl6 then you'll only feel it at the end

Though typically archetype barbarian doesn't get the instinct abilities

You can use the Rage action. While raging, you take a –1 penalty to AC. Choose an instinct as you would if you were a barbarian. You have that instinct for all purposes, but you don’t gain any of the other abilities it grants. If that instinct has anathema, you’re bound by them.

[balmy orchid]

Hrrmmmmmm

Also this is the Season of Ghost game

not the other game

[novel merlin]

Oh I think that goes longer

You'll be stuck at trained weapon proficiency basically the whole time

[warped orbit]

SoG is 1-12(13)

[carmine oyster]

Update: The Dwarf's Clan Dagger is now a weasel. The Kineticist and the Bard are playing Weasel Gacha. The Druid is trying to prevent them from causing an ecological disaster with the spare weasels.

The party stash of consumables is mostly in a state of Schrodinger's Weasel

The session was thoroughly derailed

Good times all 'round, really

[turbid dagger]

If I were that dwarf I'd be pissed

[tribal steeple]

♫ It's weasel stomping day... ♫

[carmine oyster]

He was Not Pleased! Especially when the Goblin suggested he buy a new one

[tribal steeple]

just go get another one from the family heirloom store

[carmine oyster]

Fortunately they have access to Dispel Magic

[summer whale]

this story reminds me that our Kingmaker GM teased his wife (one of the other players) with this item the other day: https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=1085

honestly every game should have a Bag of Cats, even those that aren't playing Strength of Thousands

[tribal steeple]

Unfortunately the people I play SoT with just aren't the kind of people to get up to shenanigans with a Bag of Cats. 😔

I think the one we got was relegated to "just assume this is used for animal therapy during our downtime"

[rustic cape]

But consider: Clan Weasel!

[wraith snow]

I'm putting together a low level short campaign for some friends which is an adaptation of an old one-pager dungeon crawl. The original version more or less ended with the party being told to run away from the final chamber (unstatted unwinnable encounter) but I wanted to redesign it as more of a setpiece encounter.

Has anyone had any success running something like that in this system, and if so, any suggestions?

Ideally I want to avoid just making it a "do the disarm check 5head" encounter but admittedly I don't have many better ideas.

[errant roost]

are you looking to make it a statted and winnable boss fight, or make a setpiece encounter out of running away?

[wraith snow]

I've been considering both, my first instinct was the former because I wanted to make running away still a valid and present option but given it's for the end of a short 3-4 session romp the latter might be better

Because even in the event of a TPK that's still just the story ending where intended

and it's not months or years of established narrative at stake.

[shrewd bane]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1293743758118092831/1459618490129453156/Screenshot_20260110-134230.Discord.png?ex=698198e6&is=69804766&hm=b05af65d9ec91a28a4416509bd72bf168a7e53950b209f3c1dc668bde698c06e&

I still have this saved lmao

[clever cobalt]

Oh hey thats my post

[shrewd bane]

Also I'm so happy to finally be in a game

[wraith snow]

Thinking on it more I'll probably run it as a chase, though I'll probably stat it out anyways because I'm reasonably sure at least 2 players will take the phrase "supposed-to-lose fight" as a challenge

[shrewd bane]

Not sure if this is a neat idea since I'm not a GM but what if they end up in a deeper part of the dungeon upon losing the fight?

[wraith snow]

I'm not too worried about failure states, I just wanted something a little more engaging than "and then you ran away, the end" which is what the original intended finale is.

If they decide to fight and all die, that's fine, I just wanted to give them an option that feels more like a resolution than pulling a 180 and leaving

[surreal basin]

Man people thinking Paizo is being coy when they say the remastered books like guns and gears and dark archives aren’t gonna be changing much and you probably shouldn’t buy them expecting new content is

Really funny

[turbid dagger]

It's just desperation basically
Inventor needs fixes, Psychic to a lesser extent
They Did Not Get Them
I'm sympathetic unless they get catty on Reddit, and in that case they are already an RPG redditor and likely pretty noxious

[frozen flame]

They did manage to squeeze some fixes in, like to Gunslinger and some of the weaker Thaumaturge options (Wand, I'm looking at you).

[wraith snow]

I'm still Big Sad about Oracle but aside from that I've been mostly neutral or positive on the remaster changes

Oh and Thunderstrike

That is NOT the same spell

[surreal basin]

Inventor and gunslinger would need like

Just an actual new book

Not a remaster

[frozen flame]

Gunslinger really does need a wider rework to how firearms work in PF2e

"They're like bows but worse in every way except maybe when you crit" is... unideal

I wish they had just done a Player Core 3 with full remasters of Gunslinger/Inventor/Psychic/Thaumaturge/Magus/Summoner

Instead of only Magus and Summoner getting "real" reworks because they're in a new book

[turbid dagger]

Me, the post rework Tempest Oracle lover:

[surreal basin]

So like

I’ve said it before

The problem with guns and gears was they were like

[turbid dagger]

(/j to be clear)

[surreal basin]

Really scared of power creep

So everything in is, IMO, intentionally kinda bad

Because they were super conservative with the entire books design

[wraith snow]

I just miss the mysteries being a proper double-edged sword instead of just choosing what pointy object you'd like to inflict upon yourself

[turbid dagger]

That's def fair, even if I personally like Cursebound as the 'upside' a lot

[wraith snow]

I like them mechanically but Oracle was already a class I'd only pick if I wanted the flavour and they took out all of the Flavour Juice in favour of feats

[frozen flame]

Oracle did feel a bit superfluous in 2e, since in 1e it was basically Divine Sorcerer and you can just...

Be a Divine Sorcerer now

So I understand why they might have felt like they needed to do something different with it, at least

[wraith snow]

I get it but imo the answer should've been to lean into the unique aspects more bc what they ended up doing made it feel very close to Sorcerer imo

Even moreso than it was prior

[frozen flame]

Yeah, I definitely think it's too sauceless now

Animist feels like a better version of "divine caster but different"

[surreal basin]

Tbh most of the old curse downsides were like

REALLY bad

In a way that didn’t so much make you play a certain way as much as like

Violently cripple you

Lmao

[fossil dome]

1e Oracle is cool

[frozen flame]

This, or you picked one of the ones that penalized something you didn't do or care about

So it never really mattered to you either way

[surreal basin]

Yeah

Ultimately IMO old oracle was also bad and I don’t blame Paizo for making it like it is because it also was a nigntmare

For balancing

[surreal basin]

It is!

I don’t think it works in 2e as much tho

[fossil dome]

Yeah

[surreal basin]

Oracle in 1e is at its best narratively when you pick the

Really fucking mean curses

That give you crazy shit at higher levels

[fossil dome]

I'm just mad no Metal Oracle non Battlecry

[surreal basin]

Like being JUST ACTUALLY BLIND

[fossil dome]

I have the Powerless Prophesy one, it's mean

[surreal basin]

The meanest ones are the one that freezes potions and shit and the one that just makes all items take longer to draw

[fossil dome]

No actions in surprise rounds is pain

[turbid dagger]

Really enjoying Guilt Of The Graveworld 😌 (spoilers)

[turbid dagger]

Also, for my tuesday game, Abomination Vaults-
Due to at-the-table improv-related developments to the plot, one of the players has very real cause to assume they are getting an adamantine sword soon
Adamantine doesn't, like
Do Enough that actually giving it to them will fuck things up, right
'congrats, you deal with hardness and some very rare resistances better'

Full context: ||As part of the prison level's imp 'informant's' gimmick that some of the stuff they say is misinformed, they told the party that Barcumbuk had recently forged an adamantine blade, when he actually just has an adamatine chunk (him talking about his desire to forge it into a sword is what the imp heard)||
||They found the adamantine as well as a blueprint for the sword the devil intended to make for it, and want to show this to the town smith||
||They hope to get him to forge the sword, and while I could pull the obvious card of 'I don't know how to smith adamantine' I don't want to just tell them to Get Fucked||
||So my idea is that maybe they can jump through some hoops to enable Adamantine Crafting, and he really does forge the sword for them (with the Evil Satan Stuff removed)||

[warped orbit]

it just busts up objects better, yeah

not even sure if it actually applies against constructs either

[turbid dagger]

I think I'll do that, give it as a quest reward basically, and say 'I am asking you OOC never to sell this'
Because,

[surreal basin]

it does

their resists are bypassed by adamantine

[turbid dagger]

I'm so obsessed with this foreshadowing I pulled off and have no release valve because NO ONE ELSE IS RUNNING GOTGW AIEEEEEEEEE
(Or cares about Starfinder lore 😔)

[shrewd bane]

You could just say that nobody would have a use for it so it can't be sold

[wraith snow]

I mean, it's a high quality sword made of rare materials, seems unlikely

[shrewd bane]

Okay but it's also prohibitively expensive and unless you have connections with someone that can afford it, then there's no reason to be lugging it around

[wraith snow]

I mean, generally when you give the martial a fancy sword the expectation is they go and hit things with it

I feel like the GM saying "please do not crash the economy of the low level AP by trying to sell the funny sword" is fair

[shrewd bane]

I know, but like

That's a narrative excuse if it has to come up

[warped orbit]

yeah but you don't need to have a narrative reason at all

especially when right next to Absalom, which will make almost any attempted reasoning kinda flimsy

[true delta]

Have any of you played Murder in Metal City? If so, how is it? And how long does it take?

[turbid dagger]

It is, in essence, the SF2e beginners box
So quite short
I have not played it, but did give it consideration for running (I settled on Nova Rush into Guilt Of The Grave World, instead)

[true delta]

Oh, okay. Thanks for sharing. The Beginner‘s bix was a bit thin in the narrative side for my taste. Perhaps, I‘ll look into Noca Rush, too.

[turbid dagger]

Nova Rush is VERY short, there's a reason I bolted it onto an AP
It's like
6ish rooms, not counting flyover territory that only has loot in it or whatever

[true delta]

Wild thoughts on the Frozen Flame campaign I run: I‘ve been reading too much Delta Green stuff, so Venexus is going to be revealed to carry a fungal (mi-go) infection. This has turned her into an adamantine dragon from eating metal, and will definitely involve elements derived from that fungus which controls some ants.
There may occur Stargate-adjacent pyramid-building.

This involves Elfgates, and much later Aucturn.

The working title for any continuation past level ten is "Ragnarok versus Lovecraft".

I pray I‘ll manage to work out the details.

In my interpretation, Venexus is an isolationist who foresees great peril and turns Lost Mammoth Valley into a walled garden, almost literally.

Secretly, this is to farm humanoids in peace. I‘m thinking of reading The Time Machine, for the later parts with the peaceful vegans who are preyed upon by nocturnal, subterranean engineers.

Random thought at the witching hour: in general (not in my campaign), Yithians could be used to bridge the Gap between PF and SF.

Since time does not bind them the way it binds us.

End of rant. Time to sleep.

[balmy orchid]

Is there an easy way for a Barbarian to wear plate armor?

[warped orbit]

Take the feat at level 6 that gives heavy armour prof

[wraith snow]

Or a dedication

[shrewd bane]

Iirc there's also a general feat that uhhh

Just improves your proficiency for the next armor class whenever you take it

Wow okay it's literally called Armor Proficiency

I think you can straight up take this at level 3 if you really don't wanna grab something else like tough

[balmy orchid]

Hrmmm

That seems expensive if im starting from scratch

[shrewd bane]

Given it's a feat you can just take from the start, it's not horrible I think? Dunno how feasible it is to get plate at that point though

[wraith snow]

Barbs technically have medium to start so it's still only one feat.

[balmy orchid]

Oh I thought they were naked

[warped orbit]

Nah

You gave medium and you're gonna need it

[warped orbit]

Issue with armor prof is it doesn't scale normally, but I forget when Barbs get their armor prof bump so it might still be fine

Though wearing heavy armor will still turn off some of your class features unless you take the Barb feat too

Well mostly just the free Rage on initiative, but that's still very relevant

[warped orbit]

Looks like they also only go up at 13, so it's fine I suppose

[errant roost]

errata! https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder2e/s/SiKxDymmWe

[wraith snow]

ah, darn, Resentment nerf probably needed but unfortunate

[warped orbit]

oh dang, time to take a look

holy shit, they finally clarified how multiple weaknesses is supposed to work

Page 408 (Clarification): The rules on weakness and resistance refer to an “instance” of damage, but that term isn’t defined. The weakness text says:

“If more than one weakness would apply to the same instance of damage, use only the highest applicable weakness value. This usually only happens when a creature is weak to both a type of damage and a material or trait, such as a cold iron axe cutting a monster that has weakness to cold iron and slashing.”

So what happens if a character hits a terotricus with a +2 striking holy flaming cold iron battleaxe and has two different spells that add cold damage to their Strikes? The terotricus has “Weaknesses cold 15, cold iron 15, holy 15, slashing 10; Resistances fire 15.” Let’s say the damage roll results in 4 fire damage from the flaming rune, 7 spirit damage from the holy rune, 16 slashing damage from the cold iron battle axe, 3 cold damage from the first spell, and 6 cold damage from the second cold spell. So we’re starting with a total of 36 damage.

The holy trait adds 15 damage from weakness to holy; the trait applies to the whole Strike, and happens only once. The flaming damage is negated by resistance. The spirit damage doesn’t get any weaknesses or resistances. The cold iron battleaxe is where the “instance of damage” rules apply! It’s both slashing damage and coming from a cold iron weapon, so we apply the 15 weakness from cold iron and not the 10 from slashing. The two instances of cold damage come from different spells, so each sets off cold weakness individually for an additional 30 damage. Now our total is 92 damage!

You’ll notice the example for resistance to all damage found further down the page shows the opposite side, applying resistance multiple times to different instances of damage on one attack.

also clarified what happens if you get stunned during your turn

[rustic cape]

You want the Invulnerable Rager feat at 8th level. Trouble is, it’s at 8th level. We can work around this!

[balmy orchid]

I am hovering around the idea of a knight but I am undecided what form he is to take

Making Guts does appeal though

[warped orbit]

Page 283 (Clarification): If you have an ability that increases the die size of your weapon and your weapon has the two-hand trait, the ability also increases the two-handed die size. For example, if you were a cleric of Nethys with the Deadly Simplicity feat, your staff (which has a d4 damage die and two-hand d8) would have a d6 damage die if you wielded it in one hand or d10 in two hands.

huh

good to know I guess

wonder if that actually really matters for anything

[shrewd bane]

Shields

[rustic cape]

The big opportunity cost with Invulnerable Rager is to ability points

[shrewd bane]

Free hand required feats

Etc

[rustic cape]

Since you want +2 dex for medium armor, until you get invulnerable rager

[warped orbit]

another clarification
using something that sets your die roll to a certain value like Assurance still counts as rolling
so you can Risky Surgery Assurance with Treat Wounds

[warped orbit]

you only need +1 for a Breastplate

[rustic cape]

Ah, okay

[warped orbit]

which should be easy enough to spare until then

[rustic cape]

So that's a pretty low cost

However if we want to obsess about it like I would

[shrewd bane]

But yeah, I think this is regarding feats or whatever else that involves handedness

[warped orbit]

no I meant specifically die increases also applying to two hand

[rustic cape]

And we're willing to eat an action cost to rage in return for +1 AC

[warped orbit]

since die increases are fairly rare

might be relevant for specific Clerics I guess
and maybe Inventor

[balmy orchid]

Giant instinct can just do it by default cant it

[warped orbit]

also this is pretty big for Thaums, and means stacking a bunch of damage types on your Strike is very beneficial for Thaum if the target already has a resistance you can trigger naturally

[warped orbit]

do what?

[rustic cape]

We can take Sentinel Dedication at 2nd, grab Armor Specialization to pad out the eventual raging resistances we'll get, take Invulnerable Rager at 8th, and then get our hot shit prize of Mighty Bulwark at 10th

Because Mighty Bulwark is really good

[balmy orchid]

Making a weapon a size category larger increases its damage dice

Doesn't it

[warped orbit]

it does not

[balmy orchid]

What da hell

[warped orbit]

weapon size has no effect inherently

[balmy orchid]

What da HELL

[rustic cape]

The big weapon is part of them getting to do fuckhuge rage damage

[wraith snow]

Unless you're using something too large for you in which case it's just a penalty

[warped orbit]

Giant Barb gets their extra damage, but that's because it's part of your feature

[warped orbit]

you do get Clumsy 1 for using an oversized weapon, yes

[rustic cape]

Giant, Ligneous, and Decay are the only instincts with +6. Decay is bad, and Ligneous doesn't have any cool feats.

Also Ligneous penalizing speed can be painful, especially before 3rd level

[shrewd bane]

Also not sure why but Shears is such a funny weapon

[warped orbit]

I'd be inclined to just let Ligneous also pick the Giant feats tbh

which can arguably make it better than Giant, but ehh

they should have printed some for it

[rustic cape]

Dragon is almost as good as those, with +4 scaling to +16 instead of +6 scaling to +18

And also the dragon form rage at high levels is probably the best polymorph effect period

[warped orbit]

Page 409: The bleed damage text has been updated to be less absolute. Since bleed immunity appears in creatures' stat blocks more consistently in the remastered rules, refer to a individual creature’s Immunities entry.

“Another special type of physical damage is bleed damage. This is typically persistent damage, and represents loss of blood. Typically nonliving creatures and living ones that don’t need blood to live are immune to bleed. Weaknesses and resistances to physical damage apply. Bleed damage ends automatically if you’re healed to your full Hit Points.”
bleed immunity no longer fully absolute
not super a fan of that, as long as they're gonna keep stuff vague in some cases like players

[wraith snow]

Decay is unfortunately conceptually very neat to me but yeah it's a huge drawback for just slightly more damage AND it comes in a terrible damage type

[rustic cape]

I don't know why animal is so bad

"You get a strong unarmed attack instead of rage damage, except that the unarmed attack isn't all that strong"

[warped orbit]

Animal is good

mostly from feats

even after the Deer nerf

[rustic cape]

But my picks for instinct are Giant, Ligneous, and Dragon, with Elemental getting special mention if you want to play more defensively

[warped orbit]

you get the equivalent of a 2h weapon as unarmed

[balmy orchid]

So does giant just deal like

+2 damage

[warped orbit]

yeah pretty much

[rustic cape]

Well, compared to dragon

Base rage is +2, giant is +6

[warped orbit]

the other benefit of Giant is also easy access to enlarging yourself later

[rustic cape]

And the gap gets bigger with levels for everything other than dragon

Giant feats are pretty nifty, good reach stuff

[warped orbit]

the reach is very strong yeah

[warped orbit]

which is very relevant for other unarmed synergy stuff like Wrestler

also Animal has the easiest time using a shield without compromising damage

along with Animal Skin also giving them heavy armor equivalent AC

Predator's Pounce is also a very flexible feat later
being a 1a Stride and Strike

I'd definitely personally put Animal at the top in terms of Instincts together with Dragon

used to be more crazy, when Deer was still a d12 reach grapple weapon

and Monk dedication wasn't nerfed yet

[rustic cape]

It's not equal to heavy until 13th level

[warped orbit]

true yes

[rustic cape]

I'd say you're basically trading damage for having your hands free. That's not nothing, admittedly.

Oh, and you get piercing and slashing for resistance, which is a solid pair of damage types

[wraith snow]

I miss old Ash Oracle bc you just straight up got full phys resist on a caster

[warped orbit]

old Cosmos Oracle 😌

[rustic cape]

If you get Armor Specialization from Sentinel and take Adamantine Dragon, Dragon Barb can have full phys resistance :D

Crushing and piercing from raging resistance, slashing from plate armor specialization

[wraith snow]

My strategy for the 1st 11 or so levels of Kingmaker was Ash Oracle with a mount companion to get in fast, not fold immediately, and use some nasty touch-ranged debuffs

Plus the mount doubled as a way to mitigate the speed penalty from the curse

[rustic cape]

I'm a big fan of barbarians in general

They're a well-designed damage class who share some strong debuffing metastrikes with fighters and are extremely good meatshields

[wraith snow]

I'm debating doing a barb for when my Kingmaker game ends, I know I'll be doing a martial of some sort but I'm split in 3 directions

[rustic cape]

And giant is great for using the Justice reaction if you dip into Champion

[wraith snow]

Either great pick Barb (lets go gambling), Flurry Ranger with shortbow and jaws weapon, or a Commander built for positioning supremacy

[balmy orchid]

All I know is im probably starting as a Cavalier

With a wingless griffon as a mount

[wraith snow]

Cav is neat, that's what my Kingmaker character is using for their mount

Though admittedly with the Oracle changes the mount is basically just 6 feats spent on flavour

It doesn't really help for much aside from movement anymore, but the free repositioning is still nice

[balmy orchid]

We are getting a free archetype i think

So the goal is

https://tenor.com/view/demigryphs-total-war-warhammer-the-empire-demigryph-knights-warhammer-fantasy-gif-19543191

[light gyro]

was str bonus on bombs a particularly necessary nerf

[wraith snow]

I certainly don't think so

[warped orbit]

It already didn't really apply, because of the splash trait

[light gyro]

there's a little pile of non-splash bombs

[warped orbit]

Cav is useful
The main benefit of having a mount is not having to spend actions moving yourself

And depending on what it's support benefit is

[wraith snow]

Also has a fun interaction with Inner Radiance Torrent, and any other 3 action spells that rely on caster positioning

[dusky barn]

Is the Swarmkeeper dedication actually worth anything? It feels so thematically cool to me

(Ive never played and it's like pulling teeth finding a group)

[wraith snow]

Generally the answer to "is X dedication worth it" is "as a class feat almost never, as a free archetype, sure if you like the flavour"

Unfortunately class feats are where a lot of power is for most builds so it's tough to justify them most of the time without FA

Though there are some exceptions, Magus generally cares about a spell-attacking focus spell more than most of their native feats, Champion, Exemplar, and Guardian can all be quite powerful.

[warped orbit]

It's kinda hard to properly make use of

Due to being very action intensive

[wraith snow]

I do think some classes could probably cope with it alright but yeah it is rough

[surreal basin]

“Exemplar dedication still hasn’t been nerfed” ITS RARE

JUST DONT LET PEOPLE TAKE IT

IF YOURE WORRIED ABOUT IT

[warped orbit]

tbh, I also think Examplar being rare is dumb

[wraith snow]

Ehhh

It definitely has some Flavour Implications

[surreal basin]

It’s pretty campaign warping thematically and is also like

[warped orbit]

but the dedication is too stacked

[surreal basin]

Stronger than other classes

[warped orbit]

no it isn't

[surreal basin]

Okay

Welp that’s that conversation I guess

[warped orbit]

it's not meaningfully above the power curve compared to other classes

the dedication is only an issue because it gives you stuff too fast

the rest of the archetype is also fine, it's just that the dedication gives you a huge power boost for one feat

[balmy orchid]

What ever us exemplar

[wraith snow]

demigod-as-class, effectively

[warped orbit]

class that has you empowered by a divine spark

which mechanically manifests through you bouncing your spark through three different ikons you have, granting you different passive benefits when empowered

and you can use special actions to shift the spark, called Transcendence

[wraith snow]

I do think the flavour as-written justified the rarity of it but I don't think the power is particularly above most of the other martials save the Guns and Gears ones but that's a different issue.

[warped orbit]

they are basically martial with buttons that forces you to switch your passives for a bit

[rustic cape]

Exemplar is fine

[wraith snow]

You can re-fluff it as a punchy-Sorcerer and I don't think it would cause any issues

[warped orbit]

I just don't think Examplar is really that out of scope flavor wise

[turbid dagger]

Exemplar ABSOLUTELY is not stronger than other classes
I see the argument for the dedication tho

[rustic cape]

The dedication is maybe too much, but it's more pronounced because most class dedications suck

[warped orbit]

you can flavor them as a slightly weird Champion and basically nothing changes

[turbid dagger]

As it essentially just gives you Exemplar's class features

[warped orbit]

I can largely agree with that

ironically the dedication is a much bigger issue in non FA games

because the power of it is mostly just taking one feat to give yourself an immanence

you don't want to invest much more

[rustic cape]

Agreed

[turbid dagger]

Well yeah but that's
Flavor
The original flavor is 'you got shot up with god radiation and are now a demigod' which is in universe quite rare and can make someone seem 'more important' than other PCs

[warped orbit]

I just don't see it as that much more important than just being a Champion or Divine Sorc, I don't know

[rustic cape]

The big mitigating factor re: the strength of the dedication is that the transcendence can be hard to use until you take another feat at level 12

[warped orbit]

and if they really were meant to be super world shattering, that's hampered by still being a normal class balance wise

[rustic cape]

But mostly it just gets taken for the immanence, so

[wraith snow]

I feel like there's a pretty notable gap between "I am a devout warrior of faith" and "I, myself, personally, am a divine being"

[warped orbit]

it's a bit hard to be that exceptional when your super special demigod move gets outdone by the Barbarian next to you Striking twice

[rustic cape]

If one were desperate to tone it down, they might require a second feat for the immanence

[warped orbit]

you are a little divine

[wraith snow]

The comparison to Sorc makes a lot of sense to me but Champion is just apples and oranges imo

[warped orbit]

IMO just fold gaining the Immanence into one of the other feats

[tribal steeple]

AIUI Exemplar is divine like Disney's Hercules is divine, you're like capital H Hero type deal

[rustic cape]

I see Exemplar as less a demigod or divine being and more someone touched by just enough divinity that they get to operate on the basis of mythic logic

[warped orbit]

yeah I would agree

which seems like perfect player character material to me

[surreal basin]

Oh hey they made uhhh

They made disappearance not busted as fuck anymore

Thank god

They love giving people disappearance in APs at high levels and it is

Or was

Very frustrating

[rustic cape]

Your superpower is that you can be A Hero, as it were

You have your signature objects, you have your fancy epithet, you have some epic poetry stuff going on

You're not intrinsically a great warrior like a barb or fighter, but you can take a similar idea and make it real

[wary yoke]

The funny thing is that when my PF campaign restarted and we were updating to 2E, Exemplar was a natural conversion for my PC given his powers and abilities before, and his backstory

[turbid dagger]

I do really want to play an Exemplar in a full campaign
It's neat!

[surreal basin]

Yeah

[wary yoke]

And, since it was an in-character change as we were inadvertently shuffled between worlds, he really misses the old version of himself

[rustic cape]

In-setting that's kinda unfair in the same way that someone just happening to be a sorcerer without having to labor for it is unfair, but out-of-setting I think that's actually fine

[turbid dagger]

Guardian dedication on an Aegis exemplar........

[warped orbit]

what was the issue with this one?
just that they couldn't go below Hidden unless you used magic?

[surreal basin]

Except it was implied by the original wording that most magic didn’t work

Like see the unseen

[warped orbit]

I read that as only applying to precise and imprecise senses, but fair

[wary yoke]

It used to be that he was just good at fighting and harnessing his inner power (he was a Warlord with akashic abilities) and now he's slowly being eaten from the inside out by a spark of divinity

[balmy orchid]

If i wanted to do Dragonslayer (the sword) would Giant Instinct be the only way to do so?

[warped orbit]

if you want to mechanically reflect having a stupidly large sword, Giant is probably your best bet yes

[balmy orchid]

And then probably like

The fighter feat that adds reach

[wraith snow]

Technically Amiri does this by just eating the penalty for a large sword for no added value

Depends how much you want to commit to the bit ig

[balmy orchid]

Amiri?

[wraith snow]

The Iconic Barbarian, also a character from Kingmaker

[balmy orchid]

Ah gotcha

Basically my goal whenever I build a character is hone in on the particular aesthetic and f fantasy first

Then optimize for that fantasy as much as possible

Currently i am just kinda torn on weapon choice

Which will inform everything else

Its either regular greatsword, guts sword, or gunblade

[turbid dagger]

Well, she IS a giant barbarian in 2e
So she does get the benefit

Giant Barbarian to an extent exists to better justify Amiri's Gimmick as the barb iconic

[wary yoke]

In 1E she did get a damage bump, because that game actually cared about weapon sizes

[balmy orchid]

Weirdly enough none of the lances seem to appeal

They really feel lackluster

[wraith snow]

If you just want big 1-handed pkey stick there's the Hobgob pike

But yeah the lances do not actually function very well for the intended fantasy imo

[surreal basin]

Yeah just reflavor other weapons

As a polearm enjoyer

You will not be happy with most of them

For anything other than THE PALACE GUARD

[rustic cape]

Anything with reach, d10 damage, and slashing or bludgeoning damage is sorta the polearm gold standard

[surreal basin]

Yeah I guess I should say spears

Is the disappointing category

[warped orbit]

wish we got a reach sword other than the Nodachi

[balmy orchid]

Why is the Nodachi advanced

[turbid dagger]

The Dark Trait Math
Unfortunately they felt obliged to make a new brace weapon and together with reach and deadly d12 dice go down

[rustic cape]

I can't remember if there anything else with deadly d12 and reach

[turbid dagger]

I think Nodachi is, in fact, the only deadly d12 weapon in the game currently

[rustic cape]

Yeah, it looks like reach is otherwise limited to deadly d8

[surreal basin]

Nodachi is one of the few times that getting an advanced weapon is worth it

It’s REALLY GOOD

[rustic cape]

So, it's advanced because it's basically a straight upgrade over the fauchard, naginata, and glaive

[balmy orchid]

A sword with reach does appeal

[rustic cape]

You can get proficiency with an ancestry feat if you take Hungerseed as your heritage https://2e.aonprd.com/Ancestries.aspx?ID=94

[surreal basin]

Also Tengu or human

[rustic cape]

Ye

[surreal basin]

I played a Tengu magus with one once

DD12 Reach magus is vile

[rustic cape]

Sounds like it

[balmy orchid]

Oh shit there was a half oni heritage

I was looking for something like that for Season of Ghosts

But wag past that

Way

[rustic cape]

Also brutal on a fighter for obvious reasons

[balmy orchid]

Also cant humans just start with one

https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=4480

Ye

[turbid dagger]

Yeah! If you are willing to rock a d8 two hander, its a neat weapon
As a Bo Staff fan myself it's a pretty good time

[balmy orchid]

Seems good on foot or on a mount too

[warped orbit]

I just want a d10 reach martial sword

Would be really nice for Examplar too

To get Gleaming Blade with reach

[frozen flame]

You can at least give anything reach on Exemplar via Compliant Gold

[surreal basin]

whatre some fun/good lore skills for a treasure hunter?

I have mercantile/ruins already

[turbid dagger]

Maybe a specific ancient culture in the area where the game is set?
Like, to use a Golarion example, Azlant or Thassilion Lore

[surreal basin]

its a rogue so im very open to more lmao

[fossil dome]

Possibly niche, but Engineering

[frozen flame]

Underworld for selling things illegally

[true delta]

I'm gripped by the notion that the case files from Dark Archive could be used as part of shoehorning Delta Green into Pathfinder. I mean, it's basically there already: An organization meant to look into the paranormal is discontinued but continues its work in secret. It would be kinda silly/funny to also include framing people for crimes and ruining people's lives to hide the existence of the paranormal, lol.

And of course "You're stupefied 3 after seeing the shoggoth."

I've acquired a new stupid thing to be overly excited about.

I'm considering giving ||Venexus|| from QftFF a Mi-Go fungus infection. It has made her eat toxic metals, which has turned her into an adamantine dragon. No, I don't know which purpose this serves in the plot. Yet.

[true delta]

The artwork for the vorpal dragon looks cool AF, too. Of course, the gameplay may prove … grim.

[turbid dagger]

The decapitation they do is usually nonlethal and also pretty rare, so I wouldn't sweat it too much

[true delta]

Thanks. Yeah, and it could prove funny.

I will say it’s questionable for her to be a young dragon, just Large and all. Of course, you can simply make her bigger but I‘m afraid it undersells the might of a dragon.

Despite the obvious utility in presenting a level-appropriate dragon. I suppose a stromger dragon will simply require different solutions.

Crucially, using an adult dragon makes it more feasible to present her little dragonets as adoption bait – if they are to be options for megafauna later.

Which would slap!!!

[turbid dagger]

Id advise caution sending over leveled dragons as their stats are at the highest bracket for their level, BUT you could lean into Vorpal Dragons' predilection to handle intruders nonlethally and rope your party into some Caper to satisfy the dragons annoyance with them

[true delta]

They have such a predilection? I am suprised! But yeah, capers!

[turbid dagger]

Mhm, I forget the exact details but Vorpal Dragons prefer to use their ability to nonlethally decapitate people to disable attackers instead of killing them outright

[true delta]

Huh. That’s material for comedy.

Uhm. It also fits the silly idea about Mi-Go, with a bit of work. Head in a jar?

Futurama-style.

A reflavoured brain cannister.

[true delta]

Further idea: This verdant valley is the Mi-Go‘s little garden/laboratory. I could swap out the undead for fleshwarps and have some high-ranking members of the cult be Mi-Go in disguise. The dragon simply serves to stabilize their rule.

Add a little elfgate to Aucturn, perhaps

Perhaps, the dragon still thinks she‘s doing her best to shepherd and protect the people. The Mi-Go use her to rule, and to do away with specimens gone rogue.

Of course, the horror will need to be adequately contrasted with the beauty of life in the valley.

Even the Chosen could be fleshwarps, with some creative license.

[shrewd bane]

I mean, considering how fleshwarping works it can be kinda like Frankenstein's monster where it's like

Uncanny beauty

It's honestly a pretty versatile ancestry as far as appearances go

Because it definitely runs the range from "John Carrion" to "This is a space marine" or something else

[true delta]

Btw, this here could be a fun soundtrack for fighting a vorpal dragon: https://youtu.be/TblxPu9JB2U?si=qGXJ79JF2E2Piu3q

And this here for an adamantine dragon:

https://youtu.be/Trodb0jlJNQ?si=QDXJhiOdbvqRtjeS

[rustic cape]

Just bear in mind that an adult dragon is going to functionally preclude any sort of combat solution, probably even with the Primordial Flame's curse effect on them

It's a tough boss fight even normally

[true delta]

True, true

If I go with the young vorpal dragon, there may need to be opporunities to acquire adamantine weaponry, to get throughtbthe resistance to physical. I‘m sure Merthig knows how to work that stuff.

I‘m also realising a white or rime dragon may be a little easier than expected on account of tallow bombs acquired.

[rustic cape]

Normally, the win button for the fight is managing to disarm the primordial flame

My group managed to do it but, hilariously, the party member who did it ended up dropping it for reasons I can't quite remember and also spent the rest of the fight cursed

The GM did allow us to uncurse him via a ritual so that a more suitable party member could carry the flame

(And have the curse)

[true delta]

Oh, that makes a lot of sense. If I knew how to teach my players to disarm without it being too on the nose, I‘d do that …

I guess a vorpal dragon can have a little weakness to fire, as a treat. Pokémon‘s type relations agree: Fire is effective against steel.

[rustic cape]

XD

Disarm is a bit funky because you need multiple successes to make it stick, but the enemy has to spend an action to wind back each of those successes

So even if it doesn’t work, the threat of it can mess up enemy action economy

[wary yoke]

Once again we had an encounter that made me angry

We got jumped (or rather, accidentally intercepted) by a pair of high-level assassins when we were coming back from a meeting with a noble backer

I didn't have my armor, nor my weapon ikon

I got a mid-season upgrade by a nearby smith tossing me a Greater Flashblade

https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=3465&NoRedirect=1

Another player was telling me I was yelling too much

[surreal basin]

yelling about it being cool?

[wary yoke]

No

I fucking hated the fight and it felt like the GM was betraying the social contract by springing a super-high level encounter with our pants down

Getting a high-level item to balance things feels like the GM further deviating from the game as expected

[wary yoke]

Is there a remaster equivalent of stinking cloud?

[wary yoke]

Closest we can find is Blister Bomb

[surreal basin]

I’m gonna be real dog you should probably leave this game?

[wary yoke]

Can't, its my only in-person campaign and its with my IRL friends

[heavy fulcrum]

kill him

[warped orbit]

fighting without your armor or weapons is an absolutely massive handicap in PF2
if the fight is then also harder instead of easier than normal, that's basically impossible

[errant roost]

If you'll pardon the obvious question: have you talked to your GM about it, after the yelling settled down?

'cause it does sound like a bad encounter, but it also sucks to get yelled at by a friend

[wary yoke]

We stayed up till 3 talking about it

I've resolved to try to keep things under control and... I don't think the GM made any concessions

[true delta]

oof

[wary yoke]

Besides maybe to require a check if it doesn't seem players are getting something

I pointed out that both players that were wearing the courtier's outfits (which were really dumb) were autistic and were, y'know, trusting him

[errant roost]

What did they expect you to pick up? That you were going to get attacked?

[wary yoke]

That the tailor was an idiot and we should ignore him

This was also happening during our downtime, as well

[wraith snow]

So how exactly does Commander manage to not be torn apart by MAD

[turbid dagger]

Take 4 int, 3 str, 1 dex, either 1 con or 1 Wis
It's pretty dang MAD
you can, however, rock 3 int pretty well if you don't want to do that
I also rec taking an ancestry with an extra int boost

[wraith snow]

Unfortunately the ancestry is locked in but from what I can tell there's no downside to 3-int for the purposes of this party comp

Aside from just passing recalls slightly more often

[steel blade]

reminder that the alternate ancestry boosts(just 2 free boosts) exists and is not an optional rule but just a thing you can choose instead of the default ancestry boosts

[wraith snow]

Yeah that's what I'm doing, it would just probably help to have a flaw for the 3 bonuses given how heavily split things are already

[warped orbit]

That's pretty much what you do yeah

Or Dex if going ranged instead

[wraith snow]

Still not certain, one of the players is undecided on build so that will probably inform it

But unless someone changes their mind there should be a Swash and a Fighter both on melee builds so I was leaning archery at least for the time being

[turbid dagger]

Oooo
Then you can do something like 4 int 3 dex 1 con 1 Wis which is much smoother

[wraith snow]

Unfortunately I will probably need some amount of STR because the campaign pitch itself is very Athletics-coded

But that's not the worst in the world, gets me access to heavier armor, plus a compound

[turbid dagger]

Commander gets Tactics that let you swim and climb with warfare lore while they're equipped!

[wraith snow]

I did see those, yeah

Unfortunately I still think Athletics will be worth investing in just because it has most all of the leap feats locked behind it and that was something he explicitly mentioned to expect

[turbid dagger]

[summer whale]

I'm thinking Athletics will be something that I need to max out in my KM game, even though (or specifically because) I don't have the highest STR score rn with my DEX-built Ranger

Acrobatics will probably be a near-max, though tbh it's probably something I don't need to go higher than Mastery in with full points in DEX, so I'll have a little bit of breathing room for taking other skills (probably the third getting boosted is Survival or Nature)

[wraith snow]

Athletics is just really valuable in this system

[rustic cape]

Taking Acrobatics up to Master opens up Kip Up

Which is a phenomenal feat

(Also a lot of the other Acrobatics feats suddenly become way better at Legendary Acrobatics)

[warped orbit]

Acrobatics is useful to have, yeah

Catfall also makes falling much less of an issue

[summer whale]

Catfall is a given for this build, if only for the part of my character’s backstory where she survived a plunge down a steep ravine intact 😛

(The luck required to hit every single ledge and outcropping on the way down, ending with the cushion of an underground river at the end of it all is also why this character is a Desna worshipper lol. A twisted sort of luck, perhaps, but a lucky break nonetheless)

[rustic cape]

My favorite substitute for Catfall in Unbreakable-er Goblin

Specifically without bouncy goblin

[wraith snow]

It's very funny

[rustic cape]

So the goblin just lands right on their fuckin' face with a thud, and then pops up just fine

Which I think is funnier than bouncing

Also: goblins should attribute their creation to a mysterious god of japes

Japes, jokes, jests, and jibes

[turbid dagger]

I have
Signed up for
A 1e game......
Brawling Blademaster.......

[turbid dagger]

Order of the hammer brawling blademaster
Apply challenge as swift action when you wind up in melee with something that deserves it
Full Attack
Replace fist attack with trip attempt
Slash with Katana
Grapple as a free action
All at full BAB....
Grapple is weird and awkward and strange in 1e but I do still like it

[turbid dagger]

Also-
Wow the 1st level as a PF1e char really gives you fuck all huh
What do you mean my classes primary gimmick (sword and fist combo attacks) only switches on at level 3

Also also- General Susumu irezumi would go so hard
samurai in full black armor riding a pegasus on a storm cloud, you know

[wraith snow]

Yeah it's been several years but I very much remember the first few levels of 1e as a series of rusty shank fights

[heavy fulcrum]

theres a reason im strongly of the opinion that low level characters in PF should not have any history of fighting or adventuring because it just does not make mechanical sense to me

bro you have a +2 to attacks and 6 HP, you are not even a generic NPC soldier

[wary yoke]

... A wizard with 14 strength?

[turbid dagger]

Update, players have been picked and strangeness is going on, I doubt I'll be getting in 😔
I actually managed to get myself excited for it 😔 😔

[wraith snow]

Does anyone have any ideas for things to furnish a dungeon to indicate they're Jistkan ruins? The most obvious is members of the Forsaken Legion which I do plan to include but I want to scatter some more clues around

Mostly bc the Forsaken are in a treasure room that it's entirely possible for the players to miss

[paper inlet]

Longsword would be the closest equivalent to a jian, right?

[rustic cape]

Pretty much

A jian is really not that different from any other double-edged straight sword

[wraith snow]

Yeah, that or short sword, unfortunately no specific representation

[wary yoke]

Im pretty sure it was somewhere for "use this to represent this weapon", at least in 1E

[wraith snow]

Looks like there's a specific magic item Jian that is in fact a longsword

So there's some mechanical basis

I just think a dex-based weapon would be better, personally

[rustic cape]

The dex-based thing is weird because I can make a strong argument that a greatsword should be dex-based

[warped orbit]

That's just a general thing really

Realistically most melee combat would be finesse, but that's just not the balance of things or what people expect

[rustic cape]

It just kinda comes down to vibes

Ability scores are more archetype than simulation

[warped orbit]

Yeah

[turbid dagger]

Oh lord, yeah
'Yes we all know every way of fighting ever is in reality a quality build but come on'
This is why RPGs should be like Warhammer and have Weapon Skill and Ballistic Skill instead of str and dex :p

[warped orbit]

It avoids that particular bit at least yeah

[rustic cape]

You could reasonably do a jian as a rapier or short sword

[wraith snow]

Yeah, for sure

Flavour is free and all that

Plus most of the swords aren't exactly uhhh

Fonts of mechanical specification

[turbid dagger]

Yeahhhh
Honestly the pick that surprises me is that apparently a dadao is a greatsword

[errant roost]

it's a pretty good sword at best

looks like there's a lot of variations, but "greatsword" sized ones still seem to be an outlier https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dao_(Chinese_sword)

[tribal steeple]

The other week another player asked how my Anadi character's diet works, like how food eating works if she changes shape between human/humanoid/spider. I said "it just works, idk it's magic"

[tribal steeple]

session update: we're fighting some kind of flying dinosaur and I passed the fear save, so I said this anadi is descended from Goliath Birdeater spiders, and now she's grappled the dinosaur mid-flight.

[rustic cape]

They were mostly mixed cavalry/infantry swords

And two handed swords are tough to use on horseback

[errant roost]

that tracks with the shape. definitely makes it weirder that PF decided they should be greatswords

[wraith snow]

Especially given there's plenty of other similar curved blades already given explicit stats

[turbid dagger]

The Jiu Huan Dao (listed as bahuandao here) is in the game and basically works as a surrogate for most other types of dao, but I guess the dadao is heavier?
I'd still lean more towards a bastard sword than greatsword tho

[west sky]

the three circled all have "dadao" in its name

[turbid dagger]

The liuyedao is also in the game............. as a d4 weapon,

[west sky]

and look very different in size

[turbid dagger]

Oooo, good to know
Every time I've heard the term used in english circles, it's referred to the second of those 3, but this makes sense

[west sky]

the name dadao itself is vague, cause it just meant "big dao (single-bladed sword)"

[warped orbit]

d4 weapons always feel so sad to me

the extra tags just don't feel like they make up for it

[turbid dagger]

It's a pretty cursed position to be in yes

[wraith snow]

Yeah I played a Dranngvit worshiper and I almost always use favoured weapons for those types of characters

But Light Picks are virtually impossible to justify

[warped orbit]

light pick is actually pretty good

for dual wielding with a regular pick

[wraith snow]

Ehhh, that's still not a great use of a 2nd hand unless you're specifically a Fighter who took Pick as their main weapon type imo.

Like, if you're a Champion (which I was using) or even worse a War Cleric, agile or no you're not getting the 2nd crit without just hitting the 1/20

[warped orbit]

Oh, yeah no I was definitely assuming a Double Slice Fighter here

[wraith snow]

Yeah I was speaking specifically in the context of a religious character's favoured weapon

There maybe could've been something with the Ranger or Rogue archetypes that make you into a diet Cleric

[warped orbit]

Yeah you don't wanna use a light pick by itself

[wraith snow]

I think for a rogue it's like... fine

It's suboptimal crit fishing but a crit sneak attack with a deadly/fatal weapon does Something

[warped orbit]

Probably still rather use a shortsword or dogslicer, or other agile weapon

Or something with reach

[wraith snow]

Oh for sure, it's just a usable option

[rustic cape]

TBH if I want to fight with a dao I will use a scimitar or shortsword's statblock and stay far away from the weird bespoke stat blocks for East Asian weapons

If I want to use a big dao it'll be either nodachi or greatsword

[wraith snow]

and stay far away from the weird bespoke stat blocks for East Asian weapons
it'll be [...] nodachi

I see

[turbid dagger]

I'm not opposed to weapons from other cultures getting statted up at all, I think it only gets weird when they all like
Have the Monk and Finesse Tag because they're from the land of effete mystic kung fu people, yknow

But also yeah, it's also quite easy to take existing weapon groups in the game and apply them to other weapons
I used a greataxe to represent a yuanyedao once
Arguably a glaive would be better but I wanted a weapon that sold how fucking huge this particular example was

[light gyro]

you know what they say nodachi's better than bad dachi

[desert vale]

Do spellcasting dragons only have the spells for their specific age category or do they keep the lower rank spells from previous age categories?

[surreal basin]

The latter

[echo briar]

Apparently the foundry team got secret extra errata from Paizo

[rustic cape]

For the specific purpose of a one-handed dao. Nodachi I'd go for with a two-handed one of sufficient size because it is just sort of the Very Big Sword stat block

But the dao as statted is basically just a worse short sword for the sole reason that it cannot be identical to a short sword or long sword

[wary yoke]

Just realized an Aldori dueling sword might be a good stand-in for a Jian

Bc is basically a longsword with finesse

[wraith snow]

I do want to make an Aldori duelist at some point, unfortunately I missed the layup campaign pitch for it but still

[carmine oyster]

I hate this so much

We had a good thing going for a while with forums and wikis! And now we're back to this shitshow of information in proprietary chat apps being spread by word of mouth

[surreal basin]

Yeah

The forum died sadly

Just as a general concept

[surreal basin]

Oh my god people are overreacting to the weakness stuff hard lmao

Weaknesses are WAY rarer than resistances

So building rainbow is almost always actually harmful lmao

[warped orbit]

it does mean some enemies with weaknesses are gonna get hit much harder

also brings up some issues with effects that can create weaknesses

which there are a few

[surreal basin]

I uust hope they don’t like

Overreact

[warped orbit]

I do think it was a weird thing to introduce

just making it clear you can trigger multiple weaknesses would have been enough

[surreal basin]

Yeah that’s fair

Tbh I think that all that’s needed is “each weakness can only be triggered once per activity”

Or

Action

Idk

Sequence

I’ve just seen a large number of people suggest this is like

A game shattering revelation

And… eh

[warped orbit]

it is a pretty significant damage increase in some cases

[turbid dagger]

I fondly remember finding out a noble branch exemplar with a cod iron weapon can proc weakness on All Demons three times per attack
The Throngler, as my friend puts it

[upbeat ridge]

just saying you can only trigger a given weakness or resistance to a specific damage type once per attack would fix it

was what paizo said recently about damage types how it was meant to be run from the start?

[surreal basin]

Yes

Everything that’s come out has been clarification

[upbeat ridge]

wild

[upbeat ridge]

hasnt everyone ran it like this?

the reddit is like, burning down

[surreal basin]

Yeah like I said people are freaking out way too much lmao

[upbeat ridge]

they keep calling it eratta, which i guess it techincally isnt?

just a clarification

[upbeat ridge]

well, i do feel like it does break the game

proccing single weaknesses multiple times in an attack is by far and away the best way to deal damage now

[surreal basin]

Except again, weaknesses are rare

And this is not the kind of game where you often know what you’re gonna be fighting

If you build for proccing fire damage 16 times you’re gonna do good against…. like 10 enemies total

[warped orbit]

fire weakness is actually one of the more common weaknesses

[upbeat ridge]

arent there ways to give something weakness to fire?

[warped orbit]

Wizards can do it, yes

[surreal basin]

Yeah, not an insane amount tho

[warped orbit]

https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=5042&Redirected=1

[surreal basin]

I just think the panic is v white room-y

[warped orbit]

there's also the Shining Symbol, which can give Spirit weakness

[upbeat ridge]

slightly, and a dm can always say no or rule differently

[surreal basin]

Well yeah but that part shouldn’t be taken into account

[upbeat ridge]

yeah

[surreal basin]

Idk I hope they just say a given weakness can only be proccd once per ability or something

[upbeat ridge]

i always assumed that resistances/weakness to a given damage type and how thier values scaled to enemy hp/level meant they were only meant to be procced once per attack

[surreal basin]

Rather than overreact because people are freaking the fuck out

But if I hit you with a weapon that does like 6 things you are weak to

You should take massive damage

[warped orbit]

I mean that's the only part people are reacting to

triggering a single weakness multiple times

[surreal basin]

Mhm

[warped orbit]

triggering multiple weaknesses was perfectly fine

[surreal basin]

Yeah I wasn’t implying otherwise just that devs have a tendency to overreact to backlash like this

Is all

So I’m a little concerned

[upbeat ridge]

yeah, thats why im saying a given damage type

[warped orbit]

it's interesting to me that they immediately changed the Fireworks Technician thing again, but not this one

[upbeat ridge]

but they clarified that like, a magus with a flaming rune, is in arcane cascade that gives them extra fire damage, and is spellstriking with ignition will proc a weakness to fire 3 times

which seems very powerful if not broken to me

and kinda gamey

[surreal basin]

I mean it depends

For example

If using the thing above

That’s 15 extra damage